if you are curious how we are saving the costs, again, we are not spending our health care money wisely. for example, you go to a hospital or you gho to the doctor, you may take five tests quh it turns out if you just took one test, you wouldn't be paying $500 per test. we're trying to save money across the system, and all together our cost-cu cutting measures would reduce most people's premiums, and here is the bonus -- it brings down our deficit by more than $1 trillion over the next two decades. [applause] so you've got a whole bunch of opponents of this bill saying,

we can't afford this. we're fiscal conservatives. these are the same guys that passed prescription drug bill without paying for it. oh, we can't afford this. this bill, according to the congressional budget office, which is the referee, the score keeping for how much things cost, says we'll save us $1 trillion. only can we afford to do this, we can't afford not to do this! [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2009] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute] [applause] so here's the bottom line. that's our proposal. toughest insurance reforms in history. one of the biggest deficit reduction plans in history, and the opportunity to give millions of people, some of them in your own family, some of them the

people who are in this auditorium today, an opportunity for the first time in a very long time to get affordable health care. that's it. that's what we're trying to do. [applause] that's what the congress of the united states is about to vote on this weekend. now it would be nice if we were examining substance, we were walking through the details of the plan, what it means to you, but that's not what the cable stations like to talk about. what they like to talk about is the politics of the vote. what does this mean to november? what does this mean to the poll numbers? is this more of an advantage for democrats or republicans? what's it it going to mean for obama? will his presidency be crippled

or will he be the comeback kid? [applause] that's what they like to talk about. that's what they like to talk about. i understand. a lot of reporting in washington is just like sports center. who is keeping score, you have the teams going at it, rock-em -sock-em robot. let me say this, george mason. i don't know how this plays politically. nobody really does. there has been so much misinformation and so much confusion. the climate at times during the course of this year has been so toxic. and people are anxious because

the economy is going through a tough time. i don't know what's going to happen with the politics on this thing. i don't know whether my poll numbers go down, they go up, i don't know what happens in terms of democrats versus republicans. but here is what i do know -- i do know that this bill, this legislation, is going to be enormously important to the american future. [applause] i do know the impact it will have on the millions of americans who need or help and the millions who may need help five years from now if they have bad luck, or if they get sick or they have a preexisting condition, if they lose their job, if they want to start a company. i know the impact it will have

on them. [applause] i know what this reform will mean for people like a single mom i met in pennsylvania. she's trying to put her daughter through college, just like some of your moms and dads are trying to put you through college. her insurance company sent her a letter saying thre plan to double her premium this year, have it go up 100%. she can't afford it. now she is trying to figure ute, am i going to keep any insurance or keep my daughter in college? leslie banks needs to pass this reform bill. force

[applause] >> i know what reform will mean for laura clinton. she thought she had beaten breast cancer and then it spread to her bones. she and her husband were lucky enough to have medical insurance, but medical bills landed them in debt. now she is worried about the debt when she just wants to spend time with her two kids. laura needs us to pass this reform bill. [applause] i though what reform will mean for people like takoma canfield. when her insurance coverage raised her rates, she had to give up her coverage, even though she had beaten cancer 11 years earlier. they kept jacking up her rates.

finally she thought she would lose her home. she was scared a sudden illness would leave to financial ruin. now she is lying in a hospital faced for paying for such an illness. she is praying she may get well. she knows it is time for reform. george mason, when you hear people saying, why don't we do this imcreemently? why don't we help the folks easiest to help? my ser is, the time for reform is now. we have rated long enough. [applause] >> we have waited long enough. and in just a few days a century-long struggle will culminate in an historic vote. plays

we've had historic votes before. we have had historic votes in place to make sure our elderly did not live out their golden years in poverty. we had a historic bill in civil rights to make sure everybody was equal under the law. [applause] as messy as this process is, as frustrating as this process is, as ugly as this process can be, when we have faced such decisions in our past, this nation time and time again has chosen to expand its promise to more of its people. nay sayers said social security would lead to socialism, but the

men and women of congress stood fast and created that problem that lifted millions out of poverty. [applause] there were cynics that worried this would lead to a takeover of our health care system. it didn't have much support in the polls but democrats and republicans refused to back down and they made sure our seniors had the health care they needed for decent money. [applause] so the previous generation, those that came before us, made the decision that our seniors and our poor should not be forced to go out medicaid just because they couldn't afford it. today it falls to this generation to decide whether we will make that same promise, the

hard-working middle class families and small businesses across america and the young americans like yourselves who are just starting out. so here is my bottom line. i know this has been a difficult journey. i know this will be a tough vote . i know that everybody is cow counting votes right now in washington, but i also remember a plaque i saw on the white house. it is hanging in the same room -- that written, all those years ago, and it said, aggressively fighting for the right is the knight nobleest sport in the war of words.

i don't know how passing health care will play politically, but i know it is right. roosevelt, truman, and kennedy knew it was prite, and if you believe it was right, you have to help us win this fight. you have to stand with me like you did three years ago and meak some phone calls, knock son some doors, talk to your parents, talk to your friends. do not quit. do not give up! keep on going! we are going to get this done! we are going to make history! god bless you! and god bless the united states of america! [applause]

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♪ >> lawmakers are heading toward a final decision in the house. you can follow the latest on the only network that covers washington gavel to gavel un edited. take us everywhere you go online for teches of bills and links and see what huse and senate members are saying villa twitter. >> the house rules committee meets today at 10:00 a.m. eastern to set parameters for the health care debate. the house gavels in at 9:00 a.m. eastern. they are in on sunday at 1:00 p.m. eastern. live house coverage on c-span.

house speaker nancy pelosi's weekly briefing was devoted to health care legislation. she believes they have the votes for package this weekend and is confident from the assurances the she has from the senate to pass the bill. she speaks for about 15 mens. >> today is the feast of st.

joseph the worker, particularly significant to italian americans, and it is a day where we remember and pray to st. joseph to benefit the workers of america. and that's exactly what our health care bill will do. i'm very excited about the momentum that is developing about the bill. i know some of you were present during the week when we started with little schirn babies as young as six weeks old to talk about what it means to them. moving on to young people a couple days ago, seniors, small businesses, very important legislation. so again, as i say to you every time i see you, one day closer to passing this historic legislation which will make history of course but progress for the american people. you see behind me an array of

organizations, significant organizations who are supporting health care reform. that list grows by the moment. since it was presented the afl-cio has given its firm endorsement. catholic hospital associations has endorsed the legislation. i am pleased that we got a letter representing 16 leaders of religious orders, sisters. i'm pleased to say that sisters of notre dame, two sister that is taught me in my life are on the list. about every order you can think of was there saying they wanted us to pass there life-affirming legislation. that -- so that list goes on.

with the c.b.o. figures, people have seen the bills, have seen the score. the list of supporters grows. let me get back to it for a moment. 32 million americans insured. over $1.3 trillion in deficit reduction and savings to the american people. accountability for the insurance company. affordability for the middle class. accessability for many, many more people. it is all of those things. it is also a liberating legislation to free americans to live their aspirations without being job locked because they haven't had health care, especially if they have someone in their family with a

preexisting condition. this is about jobs for millions to new jobs created. 700,000. four million in life of the bill. 700,000 almost immediately. this is pretty exciting for us. within six months of enactment no child in america can be denied coverage because of a preexisting condition. >> as i said, when the bill comes in effect there will be no caps on what you receive but in will be caps on what you pay in. the health insurance reforms in the bill are very significant. we talk about money in the bank. when we talk about the deficit savings, we talk about $1.3 trillion in savings. but we have a story bank with tw millions of stories of americans families twho have suffered

because of the unfair treatment they have received from insurance companies. the american people have played on the turf of the insurance companies for far too long. our members know that. they are committed to a heaver america and a healthier america that has achieved also by making us more fiscally sound as we reduce the deficit as we improve quality, expand coverage, and hold the insurance companies accountable. i would be pleased to -- >> as you know, the night before the vote, your side went to rules committee. mr. stew pack had -- stupak had an order. will pewe expect to see a similar effort in the next 24 to 48 hours as abortion and the pro-life and democrats on your side of the aisle try to work something out.

i have heard something about a corrections bill. can you elaborate on that? i haven't heard any of that. what i have heard is that this bill is about health care, not about abortion. we agree there should be no federal funding of abortion, that is the law of the land, and there should be no expansion of abortion. one way or another. to diminish or expand that right. so if you don't want federal funding and you want status quo, this is it. there are members who may be talking, and i know -- as you renged, mr. stupak has talked about something, but right now, we're just getting votes to pass a bill. >> i'm trying not to do the same people every day. so if i look over you, that is why. if you spoke yesterday, you are

probably not going to speak today. >> well, i didn't get a chance yesterday. >> i know. >> there were corrections to medicare disparities in the health care bill that have been taken out. mr. defazio from oregon said his state is getting nothing. right now he is a no unless that is corrected. are there any other states that feel they are being short-changed on, on medicare money? >> without being suscribed to, a representative member of our congress made their significant ways to address the disparity issue in the bill. but we do want the language to be closer to what we had in the house bill because that represented a compromise between those who have a lilingt concern -- have a legitimate concern about the reimbursement to their

state being unfair, and also the issue of wanting quality not quantity of procedures. these sort of go together, but they can be dealt with separately. and those that say, yes, but we're dealing with plarge populations of poor people and cultural tie versity and the rest. in other words, both sides of that discussion, which had the same common interest, which was to have a fair reimbursement so that doctors would be available in all of the states. we're working on that language. the point is, this is a big coalition. we had a meeting in my office yesterday that it was -- that was maybe 50 members, one side or the other. but we have reached agreement before on this, and that was the language in the house bill, and i feel comfortable about where

we are heading, but we're working on that. >> on the medicare question, can you speak to why [unintelligible] was not included in the legislation? >> we have been including this in legislation for a long time. it is not about a doctor fix, it is about our seniors or anyone who relies upon medicare to have access to doctors and physicians, that they be in their region and in their program. and so this is, again, we call it a doctor fix, but it is really about access to health care for americans. it is not in this bill, but we will have it stoon. and we have made a commitment to do this. it is very important.

>> does it add to the deficit? if you address this problem later, you go negative. >> last year when we did our budget we had a number of issues that were not part of pay as you go. they were s.g.r., the standard growth rate, over a middle class tax cuts and the a.m.t., and that's what we are -- that's what we have addressed as we go forward, and it will be soon, that we will address that. because it is necessary mostly for our seniors, but anyone who has access to medicare. >> back to the issue of abortion -- are you worried this is going

to become a last-minute issue like it did with the volvo? >> we have what we call the regional disparity issue. we have a couple technical changes we now know we need to make. but as we go forward, we will have minimal changes. there will be minimal changes in the bill. >> [unintelligible] >> well, we will have a managers amendment. it is not going to address too many issues. it will be brief. we tried to have a bird scrub to say, you know what this means is

that under reb reconciliation, we are governed by the reconciliation act. anything in the bill must be central to the budget. not incidental, central to the budget. so you have to meet that budget reconciliation test and that c.b.o. test, as you know. the senate has an additional overlay, which are the byrd rules which have strict requirements, not to get too far into the weeds of if, and we have tried to scrub the bill of any dird -- and we'll hear today what the final part of that is. a manager's amendment. >> we think we are in pretty good shape going n we are not trying to challenge them on something that is vertical. we're trying to foresee what that could be. but we have some -- the parm --

parlimentarian would not necessarily give us definance tiffs, so we will to calibrate it. >> what sort of assurances do you have from the senate that they have from the senate to pass that reconciliation package? >> i believe when our nebs go to vote, they will have all the assurance that they need that this bill will be taken up by the senate and passed by the senate and i feel confident about that. remember, i talked to our members about their place in history mple john lewis spoke so eloquently about this. he said, we may not have chosen this time, but this time chose us. health care for all americans. recognize your role in all of that, too, that you will be present at this historic owe indication again that makes history but also makes progress

for the american people. thank you all very much. >> following speaker pelosi, house republican john boehner also devoted his news conference to the bill. he warned democrats that the bill will not become more popular with voters after passage and criticized democratic leadership for continuing use of procedures that could avoid a straight up or down vote on the house. this is about 10 minutes. >> well, it is clear that now is the crunch time. it is clear that the vote is tight, and that's why it is important for the american people to stay engaged in this process.

american families and small businesses can't afford the premium increase yerks the tax care hikes, the job-killing mandates all contained in this massive government take-over of our health care system. it is true that this new health care bill isn't the same as the old one. it is actually worse. it contains 523 billion dollars worth of medicare cuts, $570 billion of new taxes, both significant increases from the senate bill. it nearly triples the job diling killing employer mandate to $2 trillion at a time when americans are asking, where are the jobs? we're going to make it more expensive to employ someone at a time when we're asking ememployers to begin putting people back on the payroll. it flies in the face of prealt.

it system has is 160 boards, bureaus, commissions, mandates, including a quhole new army of i.r.s. staff, and it still forces taxpayers to fund elective abortions. all of these new taxes, medicare cuts, new mandates take effect immediately while there are no new benefits coming to the american people for at least four years. some of the sweetheart deals are still in this deal. like the louisiana purchase. we have wlr discovered new ones, like the bismarck bank job. this is not counting whatever 11th-hour items may show up in this bill. democratic leaders are trying to assure their colleagues if this bill passes, it will become more

popular. i think they are wrong. it is normal in washington that once a vote occurs on a big bill like this, people move onto the next bill. i can assure you that we will be talking about this for months and months to come. the american people are going to hear about every sweetheard deal that comes down. the depems really do use the slaughter solution to pass this bill without voting on it, that vote in and of itself will be just as controversial as the bill. the president is doing the hard sell on this. this vote isn't about saving the presidency or saving a politician. this is about doing the right thing for the american people. so americans are jamming the phone lines on capitol hill.

they are screaming at the top of their lungs to say stop, republicans are standing with sthem. -- them. i have never seen a bill pass in the american congress that the american people have known about and already decided no. republicans can't beat this bill, but the american people can. question? [unintelligible] >> i'm going to do everything i can to keep this bill from becoming law. [unintelligible] >> we'll see what we depet there.

[unintelligible] >> however this bill gets through the house, there is no way any member will be able to hide from the vote. on this whole idea that you can move this by without voting on it makes no sense to me. if they attempt one of these gimmicks, ige sure constitutional scholars will be all over it. [unintelligible] i would think so. [unintelligible] you must lead a very boring life. >> i have to bring my members in from time to time and have serious conversations with them. were you referring to particular

members and what were you discussing? >> listen, there have been questions raised about some of my deleags colleagues in the past. all of these situations are different. on several occasions that have been noted by your colleagues in the press i have asked members to step aside until questions were answered and resolved. i told members we can do this the easy way or the hard way. fortunately they decided they would do it the easy way. >> a moment ago i heard that you plan to introduce another manager on top of the reconciliation census. >> we know there will be another amendment or self-executing amendment to cover all the deals

that are being cut as we stand here. [unintelligible] >> i thought we would have 72 hours to see what it was that we were voting on. it is pretty clear they will violate that 72-hour rule because while the second bill, the reconciliation bill may be out there they are clearly going to make changes to it. i'm interested to see what kind of deals are contained in this amendment. >> [unintelligible] >> nothing bigger than let's kill the bill, start over with a clean sheet of paper, and address the number one issue that merneds are telling us when it comes to health care.

help me lower the cost of health care. >> are you convinced if republicans take over the house [unintelligible] >> to attempt to deem a bill passed that is 22 pages long with another 107 pages behind it is an abuse of the process and should not occur. period. [unintelligible] >> the c.b.o. can only score what they are given in the way it is given to them. it is clear, when you look at the c.b.o., the $250 billion to $300 billion cost of the doctor fix is not included in this

bill. it is also clear that the class act, the new long-term care program, is -- that started in this bill, that they take the premiums that are supposed to be saved for benefits down the road. they are going to use those premiums to pay for the new health care title premium. then, they are going to take about $70 billion worth of social security increases and not use them for social security, they are going to use it to pay for this new entitlement program. if that isn't enough, they take the $67 billion in savings from the government take-over of the student loan industry and all -- in all 49 states, except one, and they use that savings from the student loan program to offset the cost of this program. there is not one american that thinks we're going to save money

with this. they all know we're going to spend a trillion dollars in the first 10 years to provide benefits for 6-10 while the tax increases will come in over the 10-year period. the american people do not want any part of that. if anyone thinks the american people are going to forget this vote, just watch. >> now to the u.s. capitol where a group of u.s. republican leaders held a news conference to dispute the c.b.o. health

estimate. they argue deficit reduction for the democrat's health care bill is invalid since it does not include a bill to slow medicaid payments to doctors. you will hear ranking member paul ryan and ways and means committee member eric cantor. >> we wanted to come before you and the american people to show what kind of shell game is going on around here. while so the democrats are claiming cuts to pay their this, they are ignoring all this they

plan to passing in separate legislation this year. i would say that hiding spending does not reduce spending. ignoring this piece of legislation today does not take it off the backs of taxpayers. so for all of the bells and whistles and all the hooplah about this being an act of fiscal responsibility about this bending the curve, we know it is completely false. this bill is a budget frank stein. it is a house of cards. it is going to give us a huge deficit now and a larger deficit in the future. we can clearly map this out using c.b.o. numbers. with that i would like to turn this over to our leader, the whill, mr. cantor. >> clearly paul has laid out for weeks and days the budget trickery involved with this bill. c.b.o.'s estimate is just not accurate. listen. if they can about, and the

democratic majority can go with -- about assuming this kind of fiscal state, one really has to question how it is we're going to see the course of our future charted in any responsibility way. and this kind of trickery that is involved with this, really, i think has now manifested itself in their difficulty in getting the votes. i mean, we are here right now and we know they don't have the votes for this bill. you know, listen, it is very straight forward. we know that we need 38 democrat no votes in order to defeat this bill. publicly right now there are 33 stated no votes on the democrat's side. we also know there are 12 members of the so-called stupak group that are standing firm against the attempt to allow for government funding of abortion. we also know if you add that dwelf to the already 33 democratic no votes, there is no

way they can pass this bill. bhu we also know there are many other swing districts on the democratic side of the aisle in play, so we are fighting hard to make sure we are doing everything we can to fight this bill. again, this type of fiscal chicanery does not give the public a lot of confidence in what the democrats are about. >> thank you. they are hide -- hiding the true cost of this bill. they are hiding the impact this legislation will have on the deficit. as the speaker this morning promised this morning they would do. they also include the class act, which is long-term care insurance and say that reduces the deficit. that entitlement is something kent conrad called a ponzi scheme. and everyone knows that will increase the size of the

deficit. if you simply take those two things, the so-called doc fix and long-term care ainsurance entitlement and put those in the bill as we know they are going to do, the bill increases the deficit by $150 billion. they are hiding the cost of this bill. they are hiding the fact this bill will increase payments for all americans. >> i want to clarify. i know that [unintelligible] said that all the republicans are going to vet against this bill. but there has been talk recently about the stupak 12 coming up with some sort of concurrent resolution. are you sure joseph gall is going to vote against you? >> yes, he is a firm no against this bill.

>> i heard your staff asking about how you get asked about the authenticity of this memo, but i'm going to ask it anyway. the memo that went out fwr boehner's office earlier, democrats are saying that was a hoax and a dirty trick. can you vouch for the awe then activity -- authenticity of the memo? >> the reporter that's alleging that it is a hoax. i know nothing more than what i read in "politico." i think you should ask about the hoax of the budget assumptions on this bill. >> who goes to the subject of a memo. the point is, the speaker is telling us, she is going to do the doc fix. that means it is part of health care spending this year. that means all of this claim of deficit reduction is false. that means this effort will increase the deficit. you can't count a raid of $r522 billion from medicare to pay for

this and not count $210 billion of spending in medicare for the doc fix. so the numbers don't add up. all these claims that they have fiscal responsibility ring hallow when you look at reality and the facts. there are different numbers. the administration is $371. the house bill was $210 billion. either you choose wipes out the claim of deficit reduction. >> is this the people at c.b.o.? >> no, let me be clear. the people at c.b.o. are good people working hard to do their jobs. c.b.o. has no choice but to score what you put in front of them. if you put in front of them a bill that double counts money, that discounts spending, that's what they score. if you put them in front of a bill that doesn't have the dock umet fix, they don't score it.

so they don't have a choice but to score what you put in front of them. if you manipulate what you put in front of them, you will get a manipulated score. >> it reminds me of my high school physics class where in physics they tell you, first assume there is no gravity. they first assume soom -- assume they will not do a dock fix. which we know they will do. if you add those two together this bill increases the deficit. so what we're saying is, givent frame work c.b.o. was asked to work in, we are not questioning what they came up with, but we have to look at the realistic frame work, the reality that is going to face the american taxpayer, and the reality, the

deficit is going to go up. >> i wonder if you can speak to the bill excluding dock umet fix could reduce the deficit by the number they stated $138, and yet add to the debt through borrowing? >> yes, even using their number it will add to the dead daws it is about the trajectory. you are running up big deficits in the first years and then you don't turn the corner on debt until the end. you will have deficits occur under this law, interest compounding on that, and that gives you a bigger debt number even though they have reductions. that's true. so when you strip off the double countercounting, add in dock umet fix, it is a massive debt burden incurred under this. >> they would argue that they are going to come closer to paying for it than you guys did in 2004 with part d.

is that a comparable question? >> that is big compared to an entire cake-over of the health care system. look what was done in part d -- introduce free-market competition. that billion came under 40% cost projections. name me another program that has ever done that. this is an entirely different situation where they are having a take-over of our entire health care center, 17% of our economy. >> and let's remember the context back then. their part d cost 2.58 times what it eventually would have enacted into congress. so had they had their way, it would have been without the private sector components. they also man dated -- mandated preemyumsyums higher than they are today. >> obviously the democrats didn't create the problems that the document would fix, so i wondering if you would address

concerns that it is perhaps not fair to lump that in with the health care overhaul. also, they have gone to great lengths to try to [unintelligible] what are some things that might remain subject to challenge? >> i'm not sure i'm going to apply for the parlimentarian job of the senate, but we addressed this problem in a responsible way. it was fully paid for, and they didn't let it come forward. i think it is correct to bring this issue into play in health care reform. we all know we need to do it. it is going to happen and it will impact medicare spending. >> the latest version was something president clinton signed into law. if we want to say who did what,

that doesn't matter. the cut is coming. they are going to prevent the cut. that's medicare spending. i would accept that argument if they wouldn't take $22 million outside of medicare for this legislation to pay for that entitlement. they can't have this argue many both ways. [unintelligible] >> i think probably the most troubling part of that is that for the first time ever, they will have a tax on investments rvings a-- a tax on investments, annuities. this is an increase in the medicare cax. it is going to cost the american taxpayer about $2 hookup hundred billion. about $200 billion. that is an expensive part. when i mentioned those two

things, long-term care and the documents, i didn't mention the $10 billion that c.b.o. says they are going to have to give to the i.r.s. to enforce this individual mandate test to make sure every american has qualified health care coverage for any month of the year, and if you are out of it for any month, will you pay that mandate tax. confidential information will be shared with health and human services. so the tenets of the i.r.s. are going to be all over the american people and it is estimated by the report the means committee issued yesterday they are going to have to hire as many as 16,000 new i.r.s. agents in order to go after the taxes that are imposed in this bill. >> specifically, a $562 billion tax increase? that's the largest we have ever

had. 6 -- >> congressman cantor, can you show us -- give us your feeling about where this is going. >> i know a lot of you have been writing stories about this in a moment yum here on the hill. i think it is false momentum. this is bayed on some false ashumshumations that just don't pan out. that is indicative of why they are having difficulty getting the votes. the votes still aren't there. the note that we are going to see the text in the morning to incover-up rate more changes reflects the fact they are having to go dauthdut more deals. where i start in all this, when you look at where the senate gil billion began, there are troubling positions in that bill, as you all know.

we have commented on them. if that bill goes to the white house and is signed into law, the uncertainty whether this reconciliation measure will pass the senate is huge. that coupled with all of this confusion now, has, i think, had such a taint on this attempt to reform health care that no wonder the american are so upset. no wonder they are so confused. that all feeds into what is going on on the other side of the aisle right now. >> thank you.

>> this weekend lawmakers are heading toward a final vote in the house, and you can follow the latest on the white house and capitol hill on the only network that covers washington gavel to gavel, c-span. take us wherever you go online c-span's health care hub to see what house and senate members are saying via twitter. get the latest with the c-span radiophone app.

>> up next, your calls and comments on "washington journal." then the u.s. house of representatives begins the saturday session with general speeches. >> 31 years ago america's cable coverage created c-span as a matter of public service. today we expanded your access to public affairs, nonfiction books, and american history through multiple platforms, television, radio, and online and cable television's latest gift, a free video archive, c-span's video library. >> this morning we will take a look at the health care bill in congress from various perspectives. phil