house. we want the energize our population across this country so that once the senate process is finished, a process which will need to then continue here in the house, then senator flake and others like him who i know want to bring about can be brought to the table. >> when it comes to the substance of the legislation, what does everyone agree on? is there a large section of it that you could have wide bipartisan support and then what do you think are the toughest that's to get done? i mean, what sit that you're going to be talking about behind closed doors that final day trying to get the legislation finished? >> i think, look, first of all, we have come a long way from the first introduction of the first bill in 2000 when senator kennedy and introduced it together. we have come a long way. border security, important. and just how it is we maximize

those understanding those who leave and come into our country and protect ourselves, important. some kind of id card, biometric or other. my grand father was the first one in the gutierrez family to have a social security card. then my dad had one, i got one. my daughter had one. and now my grand son has one. the same technology 70 years? i think we can do some -- make some improvement. we need to have a verification system so that we know who is eligible and ineligible to work in america. i think that's important. so once we take care of those kinds of security things where there's going to be wide support for a verification system for putting more security. i mean, we should take criminals and those who enter into our country and engage in criminal activity. we should have a seamless process for their deportation and expulsion from the united states. those are issues we are working

on closely. we need more agents, more jail cells. let's do it. let's make sure that our immigration system is one that has those kinds of things. the difficult part is always the part of how do you reunify families? how do you make sure that those long waits of decades for your brother -- these are american citizens, waiting for their mom, waiting for their brother, their sister, to be reunited? how do we get rid of those long waits? that's something. and lastly, it's always going to be how do we take the millions of agriculture workers, which it is already stated that about 70% of our agricultural workers are undocumented. how do we bring them and incorporate them into our labor system in a full and meaningful way? how do we take the other millions? what are the tests? what's the punishment? what are the things they are going to have to do? english classes? we agree. civics classes? we agree. pay a fine? we agree. put them at the end of the

line? we agree. put them in a program to, how many years does it take before they graduate from the program to say the past is the past and that they paid for their infractions and now we're going to embraze them fully. but look, you can't have comprehensive immigration reform until you take those 12 million people and bring them out of the shadows. you can say they have to learn english, you can say what kind of penalty they are going to have to pay. you can incur extra taxes on them. we can do all those things, we can discuss those. what we can't have a discussion about is allieuing them to remain in the shadows. they do depress the wages of other workers. we want to bring them so all american workers working standards can be improved. >> robert gibbs was asked about the president's priorities in the wake of health care. what comes next. and he mention ds the economy, he mention ds jobs, he mentioned energy. but immigration didn't seem to

be a first order priority. did you feel you've successfully made the case to the white house and president obama that this needs to rank as high as some of those other issues? it doesn't seem like that message has resonated. >> you are absolutely right. i can't disagree but. i was very taken aback and very saddened when he didn't mention it. maybe he hasn't got the memo yet. but when i and others engaged the white house on this issue, we said -- i know i said, you've got my vote on the health care proposal today. now let's begin to resolve, because the people are still coming sunday, tens of thousands are coming today. i'm going to address them at about 2:30 today. and they haven't -- i don't think, and it is pretty important. you know, i thought about it. gibbs has been with the -- before he was president, when he was the senator in the

campaign, they shared so many days and hours and months together. certainly he must know what's on the president's agenda. and for him to fail to mention it i think was -- tells us that we still have work to do. and that the people on that mall today are going to have to raise their voices in a much more resounding fashion than we've been able to do thus far to make sure that it's a priority, that never again can a press secretary speak about what the priorities of this administration are and not mention this. that's why people are coming to the mall. they're coming to the maul to seek that kind of redress and see if government will finally be on their side as others have in the past. >> you have the democrats saying that the health care bill will pass. any prediction on what the final vote total will be? >> you know, let's look at the last vote total. it was 220-2 16? so there are fewer people. a couple of fewer people. what, 218, 2 16. it's going to be close.

i don't think people are going to vote for it -- this is one of those votes that i learned in congress where if there are enough votes to pass it, it isn't though people are going to try to double down. let's make it 225. let's make it at o 230. look, a win is a win. and i think that's what the democratic whip operation is looking forward to. i think it's going to pass. i know it. i mean, i have ever confidence that it's going to pass today. i've talked to my colleagues. the president has done a mar veluss job this week. he has engaged us as he has never done before. i really see him as a president that isn't as argumentative, isn't as defensive, that is listening to us, that is incorporating people's ideas and building momentum that is really given our party by going outside of washington, d.c. d.c. and inside of washington, d.c., giving us a lot of direction. and i congratulate the president on the kind of energy and the kind of enthusiasm and

vigor he has brought to this campaign. and i think in the end the pundits are going to have to give him a lot of credit for putting this package together and for leading us to a success ful form of health care in this country. which i think is going to be very, very beneficial. >> congressman lewis gut rezz from illinois thank for being with us. we should point out also we will be covering the rally today and you will be able to see it on line. thanks for being with us. peter, let me ask you the time line that you heard that he said that the bill could be presented by late april and a vote maybe in may or june. is that realistic? >> well it's going to be a tough haul. there's lots of other priorities. the administration is desperate to shift to jobs and the economy having taken up so much time on the health care bill. so, but i think the congressman is right. for this bill to move, it's

going to have to happen quickly. because the longer this bleeds into this spring and summer and fall, the closer we get to mid-term elections and there's going to be no appetite on capitol hill to deal with an issue as controversial as this. so he is correct that this is when it has to move. i just think the odds of it are long at this point. >> and rick, this town has seen a lot of ralingeas over the years. will thai -- ralies over the years. will take make a difference? >> i don't think it will make a difference in the broad scope of public perception of this issue because the television coverage is going to be so dominate by health care today. but i do think that senators with latino populations, significantly latino populations will be affected. i think a wild card in this whole debate is senator harry reid who is facing a tough race and latino voters are a key if harry reid is going to get to

51% in november. so even if just harry reid listens and they keep it on his front burner, then it serves a purpose. >> did either of you learn anything new with the congressman? >> i was surprised to see the congressman was so disenchanted with the obama administration's leadership on the immigration issue. and it struck me that the president has real problems with his liberal and progressive base. and i'm -- he has already lost -- he his support among independent voters have dropped. it shows you the cost of the health care debate and that he has lost, his popularity is down across the board. but he needs to recapture among his liberal base for him to do well in 12i and also in the mid terms -- 2012 in november. >> this indicates disenchantment with the white house staff. and congressman gutierrez knows some of them very well from senator obama's time on capitol hill and i do think that he was

sending a very clear message to them that when they speak about issues to make sure they mention this issue, because if it drops off of their tongues, if they're not talking about it, it hurts the chance of the pressure being on capitol hill. >> rick and peter, and to congressman lewis gutierrez, our thanks for joining us on c-span's "newsmakers." enjoy the rest of your day. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> mr. speaker, on this historic day, the house of representatives opens its proceedings for the first time to televised coverage. >> 31 years ago, america's cable companies created c-span

as a public service. today, we have expanded your access to politics and public affairs, nonfiction books and american history through multinel platforms, television, radio, and on line. and on cable television's latest gift, an extensive free video archive. >> following their meeting, house republican leaders came outside to speak more about the health care legislation. this is about 10 minutes. >> the house republicans just completed our special meeting of our conference.

and house republicans are determined to stand with the american people and oppose this government takeover of health care with everything we have got. [cheers and applause] it's important as this administration and speaker try to take over this health care with hundreds of billions of dollars in higher taxes, mandates and bureaucracy through the congress, it's important that they understand that it's not the president's house, that it's not the speaker's house, that it's the people's house. and this weekend, house republicans will stand with the american people and do everything in our power to defend their freedom and bring about health care reform that gives them more freedom and not more government. [cheers and applause]

house republicans remain committed to do everything we possibly can to defeat this health care bill. we will work hard every hour until this vote is taken to ensure that we can produce 38 no votes on the other side of the aisle. i thank all the americans that have come here to join us in this fight. the fight is nearing an end. but if we continue to work hard and listen to the american people, we can defeat this bill. [cheers and applause] >> the real question is, are representatives listening to america? we are elected to represent people across this country, and yet we see poll after poll where americans all across this country say we don't want this

bill. we don't like gove-run health care. and the question that's going to be answered tomorrow is whether or not people are listen -- whether or not representatives are listening. we're here to stand with the the american people and we thank everyone for coming and standing with us. [cheers and applause] >> yesterday, the speaker nancy pelosi had a press conference where she touted how great this new cbo score was. in that conference she said she showed the bill to them and they gave a bill back. if you can manipulate the bill, you can manipulate the score. what she also said is she is going to pass what we call the dock fix. cbo gave us a letter yesterday and they said if that's true, then madam speaker your bill has a huge deficit. just adding the dock fix makes this a $58 billion deficit. if you look at what they say also, look at all the double counting in this bill. this number is based upon

analysis from the congressional budget office. we're double counting $70 billion from class act premiums, $53 from social security taxes. they're not counting $71 billion in appropriations that are necessary to run this new government-run health care. $10 billion of that goes to the i.r.s. to hire about 16,000 agents to police this new mandate on all americans. 398 billion just from medicare part a. you add all of that up, and this bill has a $454 billion deficit. you add everything up, the dock fix all the medicare raids, this bill has a $787 billion deficit. the point is this. the math is correct. we know how to add. we know how to subtract. and when you look at what cbo says in to talt, this bill gives us a massive deficit. we are creating an open-ended entitlement on top of the fact

that the entitlements we already have are unaffordable. we are can creating a new government spending program when we are are already $76 trillion in the hole. it's uncontionionable. they don't now have the votes for it and i sure hope they won't. [cheers and applause] [chanting] kill the bill. kill the bill. kill the bill. kill the bill. >> wow. i'm shelly moore cap to. i represent west virginia. health care is on the minds of everybody standing here. this is a missed opportunity for all of us in this country. but i'll tell you another thing that's on everybody's mind. that's jobs. jobs for our families, communities, jobs to raise our families with.

in this bill, there are taxes toteling $569 billion. job-killing taxes. at a time when we can least afford losing one single job across this country. and i think americans here and across this country, small business owners, job creators, those who are looking to hire and want to hire and keep america working, are going to be sadly disappointed if we are unsuccessful in killing this bill because of the $569 billion in additional taxes on each and every one of us, on small businesses, and on people across this country. [applause] >> democrat leaders are telling their members after this passes it's going to become much more popular. well, they're dead wrong.

and how about the seniors out there? they're going to have $500 billion in medicare cuts. and amongst those seniors, you are going to see a lot of them, a couple million of them lose their medicare advantage plans. are they going to be happier about that? how about the small business owner who is going to see higher taxes, more mandates and higher fees. do you think it's going to become more popular with them? i don't think so. or how about investors in america? at a time when america is asking where are the jobs? we're going to put this new tax on every investment income that there is. listen, this is not the way to go. the american people know it. >> yesterday, i sent a let tore the speaker asking her to have a call of the house. a roll call vote on this bill, straight up or down vote. calling one member's name at a time and having these men and women here in the congress stand up before god, their country, and their constituents, and announce their vote.

i think it's time -- [cheers and applause] it's time to have real accountability here in washington. no deem and pass, no scheme and deem, none of the tricks. it's time to have a straight up or down vote and let's just have it done one at a time. this fight is not over. this fight is continuing. they do not have the votes yet. we've got to keep working to make sure that they never, ever, ever, ever get the votes to pass this bill. thanks. [cheers and applause] >> trying to persuade them? >> our members are talking to their undecided members. our members are doing telephone town hall meetings and to undecided democrat driction. there are more activities going on that you would see in a

normal campaign. [inaudible] >> this time tomorrow, how many will you turn? >> we don't know. every vote is going to count. because when it's all said and done, this is going to be a very, very close vote. this health care bill will ruin our country. it's time to stop them. [cheers and applause] chanting] kill the bill. kill the bill. kill the bill. kill the bill. kill the bill.

>> president obama went to capitol hill yesterday rallying his fellow party members ahead of today's expected health care vote in the house. before the president's remark, we will hear from house speaker nancy pelosi, leader steny hoyer and senate leader harry reid. this lasts about 50 minutes. [applause]

>> the caucus will come to order. mr. president, majority leader reid, welcome. to the caucus. america's caucus. madam speaker, while the body was waiting outside to bring the president in, i was informing our caucus that it didn't happen under speaker cannon nor did it happen under speaker ray born or mccormick. it didn't happen under speaker

o'neal. but urns f under speaker nancy pelosi we are going to pass health care for the american people. [applause] to introduce the president of the united states, the speaker of the house, thansy pelosi. [applause] >> thank you very much. i received your kind words on behalf of all of our courageous members of the house of representatives who want the best for the american people. and what we can do that is best for them in the next 24 hours is to pass affordable accessible health care for all

americans. [applause] the best for americans is to have 32 million more people to have health insurance in our country. the best for our country is to have 1.3 trillion in deficit reduction so that we are not leaving mountains of debt. best for our country is to hold the insurance companies accountable and not let them come between patients and their doctors. we are on the verge of making great history for the american people. and in doing so, we will make great progress. for them as well. the president has said over and over we will measure our own success on the progress that has been made by america's working families. that is our responsibility and we will honor it when we vote on health care reform. we would not be here, mr.

president, without the courage of my colleagues here that have fought this fight. they've understood the issues. they have brought great exuberance to the debate. this will be about wellness and prevention and innovation as well as reducing our deficit and making america healthier. and we certainly would not be here, mr. president, without your inspiration, without your leadership, without your fresh thinking on this subject. and we thank you for that leadership. [applause] it is now my privilege to introduce my friend, a great leader of the united states senate, a man who understands also how important this issue is, an issue that has hit home for him very closely very recently. he has said at the time of his

wife's accident that even made him further aware of why we must pass this bill because it is so important for all americans to have the same access that she has. but to watch him on aday to day basis is to see a master at work. and understanding of the issues, a dedication to the values, a vision for america, and a knowledge of the procedures. i am very, very pleased to thank him for what he has done to bring us to this point and to introduce to you my colleague, the great democratic leader of the united states senate, harry reid. [applause] >> one of the joys of my life

has been my friendship, my partnership with the greatest speaker the house of representatives ever had, nancy pelosi. [applause] we have spent the last year discussing, debating, and drafting and redrafting. there is no longer a question of whether reform of our health care system is necessary, it's no question of whether this bill is an enormous step in the right direction. with the lives and lielyhoods of millions on the line, the question is whether senators and congressmen will choose to stand on the side of the american people or with the insurance industry responsible for this crisis. it's about whether you will fight for the insurance companies' profits, or for the families' peace of mind. the question is whether you

want to raise health care costs , or whether you want to lower health care costs and the deficit. and whether you want to pretend the this is about senate procedure or admit it's about struggling people. the question is whether you want to protect our broken health care system or fix it. for most sweeping changes to americans health care will be law in a matter of days. we need a simple majority to make the good law even better. so i'm happy to announce i have the commitment of a significant majority of the united states senate to make that good law even better. [applause]

our great country has needed health reform for generations. this congress has been focused on it for the entire past year. history will show it will be one of the most important years in our history. ending with one of the most historic achievements congress has ever produced. mr. president, you have asked us to send you a bill. that will improve the health of millions of americans and the health of our economy. we are going to do that. [applause] mr. president, i know you know basketball. you're a big fan. i know many are fix yated on the national cliegeyat basketball tournament going on now. so, mr. president, we're in the last minute of play. the shot clock is turned off. the other side knows what the

outcome will be. so they're trying to foul us and foul us and foul us and foul us again just to keep the clock from reading zero. they're not just delaying the inevitable, they're delaying the imperative. every time they foul, we'll keep hitting our shots. we'll overcome every obstacle they throw in our way just as we have for the past year. and soon, when the buzzer finally sounds, there will be a clear winner. that winner will be the american people. [applause] . . .

>> thank you very much. however, not the most humble.

mr. president, welcome. we are pleased to have you here. senate majority leader harry reid, little did you when i realized when you order capital, and i was working in the basement of the russell building that we would be on the stage with president obama. he said he had a good job. [laughter] in that office in which i worked, there was a young lady who also worked there. her name was nancy. this was pre-paul wedding. and a little did we realize that you and i would be here at this historic time to participate with our colleagues in this extraordinary effort. america is watching us. some would say this is a partisan effort. they are wrong. this is an effort on behalf of all americans george w. bush -0- -- george w. bush said all

americans should be able to and have a health care plan that meets their needs. the oakland -- george h.w. bush said in 1992 set a universal health insurance program is one of the major unfinished items on america's social agenda. the american people, he said in 1992, have waited too long. gerald ford in 1974 said, let us a firm that this national legislation is only the beginning of our effort to upgrade and perpetuate this part of our total health care system so no individual in this country will let help whenever or wherever he needs it. john f. kennedy said in 1962,

whenever the miracles of modern medicine are beyond the reach of groups of americans, for whatever reasons, economic, geographic, occupational or other, we must find a way to meet their needs and fulfill their hopes. dwight david eisenhower in 1955 said, clearly, our nation must do more to reduce the impact of accident indices. two fundamental problems confront us -- first, high and rising costs of health services. second, serious gaps in shortages in those services. and in 1945, harry truman said, millions of our citizens do not now have a full measure of opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health the time has arrived for action to help them obtain that opportunity and

protection. another president said this, comprehensive health insurance is an idea whose time has come. there has long been a need to ensure every american financial access to high-quality health care. as medical costs go up, that need grows more pressing. for the first time, this president said, and now we have not just the need but the will to get this job done. he went on to say there is widespread support in the congress and the nation for some form of comprehensive health insurance. he urged us to act sensibly. indeed, he urged us to let us act now. in 1974, to assure all americans financial access to high-quality medical care. our president talks about the fact that theodore roosevelt put this on america's agenda over a century ago.

barack obama went to the people of this country and reached out and said, if you elect me, this is what i will do. there was no illusions of what he would do it. there was no trying to hide it. it was transparent. indeed, in the debate in october of 2008, he said what he was going to do and john mccain stood on that same stage and said, yes, i believe every american it should have access to affordable health care. all the president's i just quoted tried to get something done and it was not done. on sunday, tomorrow, we will do it. [applause] led by our president who said to

the american public, this is our moment. ladies and gentlemen, the president of the united states barack obama. [applause] >> thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you. thank you, everybody. thank you. thank you very much. thank you. everybody, please have a seat. to a leader harry reid, to steny hoyer, john larson, javier, jim

clyburn, chris van hollen, to an extraordinary leader, an extraordinary speaker of the house, nancy pelosi, and to all the members here today, thank you very much for having me. thanks for your tireless efforts wages on behalf of health insurance reform in this country. i have the great pleasure of having a nice library at the white house. and i was tooling through some writings of previous presidents. i came upon this quote by abraham lincoln. i am not bound to win it, but i am bound to be true. i am not bound to succeed, but i am bound to live up to what light i have.

in this debate -- this debate has been a difficult debate. this process has been a difficult process. and this year has been a difficult year for the american people. when i was sworn in, we were in the midst of the worst recession since the great depression. 800,000 per month were losing their jobs. millions of people were losing their health insurance. and the financial system was on the verge of collapse. in this body -- and this body has taken on some of the toughest votes and decisions in the history of congress. not because you're bound to win,

but because you were bound to be true. because each and every one of you made a decision that, at a moment of such urgency, it was less important to measure what the polls said than to measure what was right. now, a year later, we are in different circumstances. because of the actions you of taken, the financial system -- system has stabilized. the stock market has stabilized. businesses are starting to invest again. the economy is growing again. there are signs that people are going to start hiring again. still, tremendous hardship across the country, but there is a sense that we are making progress, because of you.

but, even before this crisis, each and every one of us in new there were millions of people all across america who were living at their own quiet crises. maybe because they had a child with a pre-existing condition and no matter how desperate they worked, no matter what insurance company they called, they could not get coverage for that child. maybe it was somebody who had been forced into early retirement, in their 50's, not yet eligible for medicare. they could not find a job, and they could not find help insurance despite the fact that they had some sort of a chronic condition that had to be attended to. every single one of you at some point, before you arrived in congress and after, have met constituents with heartbreaking

stories, and you have looked them in the eye and said, we are going to do something about it appeared that is what i want to go to congress. -- that is why i want to go to congress. now we are on the threshold of doing something about it. we are today way. -- away. after a year of debate, every argument has been made by just about everybody, we are 24 hours away. i am not somebody who spends a lot of time surfing cable channels, but i am not completely in a bubble. i have a sense of what the coverage has been. mostly, it is an obsession with what will this mean for the democratic party? what will this mean for the president's polls? how will this play out in november?

is this a good or is this bad for the democratic majority? what does it mean for swing districts? and i noticed there has been a lot of friendly advice offered across town. mitch mcconnell, john boehner, karl rove, they are warning you of the horrendous impact if you support this legislation. now, it could be they are suddenly having a change of heart and they are deeply concerned about their democratic friends. [laughter] they are giving you the best possible advice in order to ensure that nancy pelosi remains speaker and harry reid remains a leader in all of you keep your seats.

that is a possibility. but it may also be possible that they realize, after health reform passes and i sign that legislation into law, that it will be harder to miss characterize what this effort has been about. because this year, small businesses will start getting tax credits so they can offer help insurance to employees who currently do not have it. [applause] because this year, those parents or read about in coverage for their children with pre-existing conditions -- who were worried about covered for their children with pre-existing conditions, are assured they will get coverage this year because this year, insurance companies will not be able to

drop your coverage when you get sick or impose lifetime limits, restrictive limits on the coverage you have. maybe they know that this year, for the first time, young people will be able to stay on their parents' health insurance until they are 26, and they are thinking that might just be popular across the country. and what they also know is what will not happen. they know that, after this legislation passes and after i sign this bill, lo and behold, nobody is pulling the plug on granite. ny. it turns out, in fact, people like their health insurance, are going to be able to keep their health insurance. there is no government takeover.

if they like their doctor, they will keep their doctor. they are more likely to keep their doctor because of a stronger system. it will turn out that this piece of historic legislation is built on the private insurance system we have now and runs straight down the center of american political thought. turns out this is a bill that tracks the recommendation, not just of democrat tom daschle but also republicans bob dole and howard baker. that this a middle of the road bill that is designed to help the american people in an area of their lives were they urgently need help. there are some of a wanted a

single payer, government run system. that is not this bill. the republicans wanted what i called the hen house approach in which we further deregulate the insurance companies and let them run wild. the notion being that they were lower costs for the american people. i do not know a serious health care economist who buys that idea, but that was their concept and we rejected that, because we said we wanted to create a system in which healthcare is working not for insurance companies but for the american people. it is working for middle-class families. so, what did we do? what is the essence of this legislation? number one, this is the toughest insurance reforms in history. we are making sure that the

system of private insurance works for ordinary families. this is a patient's bill of rights on steroids. so many of you individually have worked on these insurance reforms. they are in this package to make sure families are getting a fair deal, that if they are paying a premium, they are getting a good service in return. making sure that employers, if they are paying premiums for employees, their employees are getting coverage they expect. that insurance companies will not game at the system with fine print in and recisions and dropping people when they need it most, but instead, will have to abide by basic rules of the road that exemplify a sense of fairness and good values. that's number one. the second thing this does is it

creates a pool, a marketplace where individuals and small businesses who right now are having a terrible time out there getting health insurance, are going to be able to purchase health insurance as part of it big group. just like federal employees, just like members of congress, they will be part of a pool that can negotiate for better rates, more competition. that is why the congressional budget office says this will lower people's rates for comparable plans by 14% to 20%. that is not my numbers. that is the congressional budget office's numbers. so that people will have a choice and competition, just like members of congress. number three, if people still cannot afford it, we will provide them some tax breaks.

the biggest tax cut for small businesses and working families when it comes to health care in history. [applause] number four, this is the biggest reduction in our deficit since the budget balancing act, is one of the biggest deficit reduction activities in history, that will put us on the path of fiscal responsibility. that is before we count all the game changing measures that are going to ensure that instead of having five tests when you go to the doctor, you just get one. that the delivery system is working for patients, not just for billings. and everybody who looked at it says every single good idea to ban the cost curve and reduce health care costs are in this

bill. that's what this effort is all about. toughest insurance reforms in his string, -- in history, a market place so people have choice and competition, reductions in the cost of health care for millions of american families, including those of a will have felt insurance. the business roundtable did their own at study and said this would potentially save an employer's $3,000 per employee on health care, because of the measures in this legislation. by the way, not only does it reduce the deficit, we pay for it responsibly in ways that the other side of the autisle, that talks about his responsibility but does not seem to be able to walk the walk, cannot claim when

it comes to their prescription drug bill, we are actually doing this is paid for and will not add ed diamond to three deficit. it will reduce the deficit. -- not add a dime to the deficit. is this bill perfect? of course not. will this solve every problem in our health care system right away? no. there are all kinds of ideas that many of you have that are not included in this legislation. i know there has been discussion of how we are going to deal with regional disparities. i know there was a meeting with secretary sebelius to assure we could continue to make sure we have a system that gives people the best bang for their buck. so this is not -- [applause] there are all kinds of things

that many of you would like to see that is not in this legislation there are things i would like to see -- there are things i would like to see that is not in this legislation. but is this the single, most important step we have taken on health care since medicare? absolutely. is this the most important piece of domestic legislation, and in terms of giving a break to hard- working middle-class families out there, since medicare? absolutely. is this a vast improvement over the status quo? absolutely. now, i still know this is a tough vote, though. i have talked to many of you individually.

and i have to say that, if you honestly believe, in your heart of hearts, in your conscience, that this is not an improvement over the status quo, if despite the information that is out what there that says that without serious reforms, people's premiums will double over the next five or 10 years, that folks will keep on getting letters from insurance companies saying their premiums went up 50%, if you think that somehow it is o.k. there we have millions of hard-working americans who cannot get health care and that is all right in the wealthiest nation on earth that their children with chronic illnesses that cannot get the care they need, if you think the system is working for ordinary americans rather than the insurance companies, then you

should vote no on this bill. if you can honestly say that, you should not support it. you are here to represent your constituencies, and if you think it would not be held, you should not vote for this. if you agree that this system is not working for ordinary families, if you have heard the same stories i have heard, everywhere, all across the country, then help us fix this system. do not do it for me. do not do it for nancy pelosi or harry reid. do it for all those people out there for struggling. i get 10 letters a day that i read, out of the 40,000 we receive. i started reading some of the ones i got this morning. dear president obama, my

daughter, a wonderful person, lost her job. she has no health insurance. she had a blood clot in her brain. she is disabled. cannot get care. dear president obama, i do not qualify for medicare. i am desperate and do not know what to do. do it for them. do it for people who are really scared right now, through no fault of their own, who played by the rules and have done all the right things. they have suddenly found out that, because of an accident, because of an ailment, they are about to lose their house or they cannot provide the help to their kids they need or they are a small business who has always taken pride in providing care for their workers and it turns out they cannot afford to do it anymore and they have to make a decision of, and to keep providing health insurance for

my workers or do i drop their coverage or do why not hire some people, because i can simply not afford it? it is being gobbled up by the insurance companies. do not do it for me. but do not do it for the democratic party. do it for the american people. they are the ones looking for action right now. [applause] i know this is a tough vote. and i am actually confident that it will end up being the smart thing to do politically. because i believe that good policy is good politics. [applause] i am convinced that when you go out there and you are standing

tall and you are saying, i believe this is the right thing for my constituents and the right thing for america, that ultimately the truth will out. i had a wonderful conversation with betsy. there she is. she is in a tough district. the biggest newspaper is a somewhat conservative. they were not happy with health care reform. there were opposed to it. betsy, despite the pressure, announced she was in favor of this bill. the next day, that's a newspaper ran an editorial saying, which have considered this, we looked at the legislation, and we actually are pleased that our congresswoman is supporting the legislation. [applause]

[cheers and applause] when i see john stand up -- and is proud, with a bunch of his constituency -- [applause] in as tough a district as there is a, and stand up with a bunch of his folks from his district with pre-existing conditions and say, i do not know what is going

on in washington, but i know what is going on with these families. i looked at him with pride. now, i cannot guarantee that this is good politics. every one of you know your districts better than i. you talk to folks, your under enormous pressure, you are getting phone calls and e-mails. i do not pressure -- i get a few comments made about me. -- i get pressure. i have been in your shoes. i know what it is like to take a tough vote. but what did lincoln say? "i am not bound to win, but i am bound to be true." two generations ago, folks who

were sitting in your position. they made a decision, we are going to make sure seniors and the poor have health care coverage that they can count on. they did the right thing. i am sure at that time, they were not sure how the politics worked, anymore than the people who made the decision to make sure social security was in place of politics would play out, or folks who passed the civil rights act knew how the politics were going to play out. there were not bound to win, but there were bound to be true. and now we have got middle class americans who do not have medicare, do not have medicaid, watching the employer-based system fray along the edges, who

are being caught in terrible situations, and the question is, are we going to be true to them? sometimes i think about how i got involved in politics. i didn't think of myself as a potential politician when i got out of college. i went to work in neighborhoods, working with catholic churches in poor neighborhoods in chicago, trying to figure out how people could get a little bit of help. i was skeptical about politics and politicians, just like a lot of americans are right now. because my working assumption was, when push comes to shove, all too often, folks in elected office are looking out for themselves and not looking out for the folks who put them there. there are too many compromises. that special interests have too much power. they have too much clout. there is too much big money

washing around. and i decided, finally, to get involved because i realized, if i was not willing to step up and be true to the things i believed in, then the system would not change. every single one of you had that same kind of moment at the beginning of your careers. maybe it was listening to stories in your neighborhood about what was happening to people who had been laid off. maybe it was your own family experience, somebody got sick and did not have health care into said, something should change. something inspired you to get involved. something inspired you to be a democrat, instead of running as a republican, because somewhere deep in your heart you said, i believe in america - an america

in which we do not just look out for ourselves. we do not just tell people you are are your own. we are proud of our liberty, but we have a sense of community and we are willing to look out for one another and help people who are vulnerable and help people who are down on the airlock and give them of half way to success -- and who are down on their luck. that is why you decided to run. -- to give them a pathway to success. [applause] and now a lot of us have been here awhile. and everybody here has taken their lumps and bruises. it turns out people have had to make compromises. you have been away from families for a long time.

you have missed special events for your kids, sometimes. and maybe there have been times where you ask yourself, why did i get involved in politics and the first place? and maybe things cannot change after all. and when you do something courageous, it turns out sometimes you may be attacked. and sometimes the very people you thought you were trying to help may be angry at you. and you say to yourself, maybe that think i started with has been lost. -- that thing i started with has been lost. you know what? every once in awhile, a moment comes where you have a chance to

vindicate all those best hopes you had about yourself, about this country, where you have a chance to make good on all those promises you made in all those town meetings, and all those constituency breakfasts, and traveling to the district, all those people you looked in the eye and said, you are right. the system is not working for you. i am going to make it a little bit better. and this is one of those moments. this is one of those times where you can honestly say to yourself, doggone it, this is exactly why i came here. this is why i got into politics. this is why i got into public service. this is why i made those sacrifices, because i believe so deeply in this country, and i believe so deeply in this

democracy and i am willing to stand up, even when it is hard. even when it is tough. every single one of you have made it that promise, not just to your constituents, but yourself. into this is the time to make sure on that promise. -- make true on that promise. we are not bound to win, but we are bound to be true. we are not bound to succeed, but we are bound to lead whatever like we have shine. -- let whatever light we have shine. we have been debating health care for decades. it has been debated for a year. it is in your hands. it is time to pass health care reform for america, and i am confident you are going to do it tomorrow. thank you very much, house of

representatives. let's get this done. [applause] thank you, everybody. this was fun. [shouts] [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> the u.s. house gavels in at

1:00 p.m. eastern for debate on the healthcare reconciliation bill. a final vote is expected later in the day. the senate could take up the reconciliation bill this week. the coverage of the senate on c- span-2. today, the house of representatives is poised for a possible final health care votes. saturday, during or rules committee meeting, democratic leadership dropped plans to pass the bill by using the deem and pass rule, also known as the slaughter rule after the congressman. >> we have heard almost universally across the house that people say they want to avoid discrimination based on pre-existing conditions.

it is hard to find a member who says he or she is not for that. in order to accomplish that and not spike premiums, you have to have a larger pool of people that are covered. you want to have a competitive -- competitive marketplace the kids the best deal for people. people say, why do you have to have subsidies? -- competitive marketplace that gets the best deals for people. they cannot buy in without the subsidies. people say, why do have to have the spending restraint? you cannot have the subsidies without the spending restraint and revenue. i would say to you, gentlelady, that this easy answer, which is

so clearly stated by people, let's just take care of the pre- existing condition problem. it does not tick -- it does not fit together if you do not take the next step toward the people of the country deserves more than a half baked solution. >> the gentlewoman yield? >> i yield. >> i want to share with our colleagues and see if there is any response that is just come out from "the washington post" that says house democratic leaders say they will take a separate vote on the senate health care bill, rejecting an earlier, much criticized strategy that would have permitted them to deem that the measure passed without an explicit vote. i wonder if this is a decision made by the house democratic leadership. mr. cardoza raised concerns earlier.

>> as you know, we are having this hearing and we have not put the world together. at the end of this hearing, -- we have not put the rule together. >> reclaiming my time -- >> will the gentleman yield? >> yes. >> i want to thank the house leadership for indicating that that is in fact what is going to happen. it is not that it was not constant -- unconstitutional or illegal, but it was something we should have done in the light of day, straight up. >> reclaiming my time. did you want to say something? >> the bill with congressman andrews said, we have been incrementally tinkering with this distant -- system for 50 years at a minimum.

when you want to make the kinds of changes that brings about the deficiencies in the system, the expansion of the system and controls the utilization in terms of getting value as opposed to activity, if you do not put everybody in, it does not work. that is from the insurance companies, from the medical practitioners, please say over and over again, that this is what you are going to have to do. you are moving the right pieces around here. they will argue over bits and pieces of this. what we have to date is a history where all the adverse indicators are tumbling down hill. businesses, large and small, are shedding the coverage. small businesses are shutting the coverage. one of the premier insurance providers in our state is putting a surcharge on spouses

and children. they are offloading and they have been for a decade. -- the cost for the enterprise on to the employees. if you are in an organized union, what you see is more and more, it is going to health care and less is going to people's pockets. the trends are in the wrong direction, and they are accelerating. -- in terms of dramatic increases in the uninsured today, in our state, "los angeles times tell us is one in four. you have to bring people into the system. you have to drive efficiencies and savings. you have to drive the value of the engagements to take place. the fact of the matter is, with medical i.t., with changes, you get a dramatic change in behavior. at kaiser permanente, now patients are able, without

getting a doctor's office visit, can ask their doctors questions and get immediate replies with in a few minutes. they can check their blood pressure, cholesterol, all at home and it can be monitored back-and-forth. and the data systems of what works for people under or over 45 and there is a matchup that is taking place. there is a report saying that kaiser permanente it was not available, they could not provide health insurance. that is a dramatic change on behalf of businesses, on behalf of businesses and our economy. those changes in the system, whether the business roundtable, the chamber of commerce, family groups, all the indicators are getting worse with the status quo in and with the constant incremental fooling around with the system. that is where we are today. you cannot get to do this without being comprehensive, if you want the savings into the

efficiencies and the expansion of service to people of quality care. >> thank you. 30 seconds. >> as a member of the energy and commerce committee, what is being left unsaid is that the health care systems we operate, medicaid pays 60 cents on the dollar, medicare pays 70 cents on the dollar. you are discounted the impact of cost escalation. we are developing the new government system that will underpaid. that is our concern about it, instead of the private marketplace. >> if anything, we are doing the opposite. >> i think what we are saying is that in order to have this kind of reform, the better care, lowering the cost, covering more people, making it more affordable is that you have to have a comprehensive system to

have it in balance. i yield back my time. >> dr. fox? >> that's ok. >> [inaudible] >> buckle your seatbelts. bumpry ride. >> how many people are out of the vote? >> thank you, mr. chairman. i liked what mr. sessions said earlier in his characterization of what we are dealing with here. we are dealing with a bill that you will say is very bad, that is the senate bill, but you liked the reconciliation bill. i think it is important to clarify this again for the american people, once the senate bill passes and it goes

to the president to be signed, it becomes law. you are passing a bad bill, a build most of you say you do not like, a bill the chairman of this committee said she did not like, so you will vote on that and pass that bill in the hopes that you will be able to pass what is in the reconciliation bill to fix the bad things. i think it is real important we go over that occasionally in this debate or in this discussion, clarify that. >> would the gentleman yield on that? >> no. >> i will like to respond. >> i need to set the stage. we have been told over and over again that everything is boring to be out there for 72 hours -- everything is going to be out there for 72 hours, and some of you have seen at the managers'

amendment, but we have not. just saying. we will not have 72 hours to be able to consider the manager's amendment before we vote on the rule and on this. i just want to pionoint out tha that things that have been told was are not accurate in terms of what the rules were going to be. and i want to say, to put it in plain terms, that things that mr. ryan was saying earlier about spending money two times or saving and spending it, the folks in my district would say you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. i think most people in this country understand that kind of language. i have several questions i want to ask. i will start, if i can, with mr. camp. again, would you talk a little

bit about the expanded role of the irs in this legislation? >> in the senate bill, there is an unprecedented expansion of the irs's authority. i would say to my friends on the other side, they have given a very articulate description of central planning and health care. this is central planning will be enforced by the irs. the irs, under the bill, will regulate the economic and financial decisions about how and when health care is paid for and what health insurance is purchased. there will be an individual mandate tax which will be phased in over a period of years, which will go fully into effect in 2016, which is the greater of $750 up to $2250 per household, or 2% of household income, which

ever is greater. >> go back and read the definition of the irs. >> the irs will regulate the economic and financial decisions about how and when health care is paid for and when how insurance is purchased. it would be responsible for enforcing the individual mandate tax. that means the irs would bought it and assess interest and penalties on taxpayers who the irs determines did not purchase a government approved health insurance or pay the individual mandate tax. according to the cbo, and november 20 in dallas and the joint -- november 20 at the analysis, more than half of the tax collected by the irs would be paid by households earning less than $66,150 for a family of four. >> what is the president's

promise about people not paying extra taxes? >> the president pledge was not to raise taxes on families earning less than $250,000 per year. the bill would require that ever w-- that everyone who has health insurance would send a return, like a 1099, to the irs, and if it is an employer, they would send it to the individual and the irs as well. they would be charged with tracking the status of 300 million americans. if you are out of compliance, do not have health insurance for one month, you would pay 1/12 of the general penalties i went through earlier. the congressional budget analysis assumed that the irs budget would have to grow by $10

billion. this is not my number. this is cbo. >> that is not included in the cost of this bill. >> that is not included in the analysis. we had a big discussion on the cbo analysis, i agree with it as far as it go. the analysis does not include the $10 billion that cbo says that in order to fulfil these new obligations in the legislation they would need. if you look at an estimate -- let me say we did have testimony before the ways and means committee this last week, from the national taxpayer advocate. they are very concerned that the irs will be able to offset people's refunds. here you have been struggling to make ends meet. you finally get to april 15. you think you will receive a cash refund. and the irs can offset that, if you and any period of that year have gone without health

insurance for any portion of time. >> has there been any analysis of how much this will cost employers in this country to send these statements out to the employees? >> i have not seen an analysis of what the private sector obligations will be. the congressional budget office only tracks what the government expands or the impact on the federal government will be. there is no comparative analysis on the private sector or on jobs. the legislation would exempt two groups from the individual mandate tax. one is incarcerated individuals because they get health care. secondly, illegal aliens. those two groups of people are exempt. i guess i would conclude that -- >> if illegal aliens are

exempted from this, that assumes something different from what mr. anders said earlier, was that illegal aliens would not be allowed to be covered under this bill. >> i will say this. they do not allow them into the exchange. there is an issue dear or whether they do or do not. -- an issue whether they do or do not. if an average american does not have health insurance, the concern is that -- and the reason they have to pay this individual mandate tax is the cost of them going to the emergency room without health insurance, then why does that not apply to illegal aliens, who will also be availing themselves of an emergency room services when they need help? i guess i would say, to summarize, illegal aliens will be able to continue to go to emergency rooms, not

irresponsible for the individual mandate tax, while the uninsured american must pay that tax. i would close by saying there is an unprecedented level of involvement by the irs, a dramatic increase in their role and function under this legislation, that will add tens of billions of dollars to the cost of implementing this and that is not included in the cbo report. >> the me see if i can summarize because i want to get this clear. illegal aliens will not have to pay a tax for not having insurance. they can continue to go to the emergency room or get their care in free clinics. they do not have to pay a tax, right? >> right. that's correct. >> but we will still be paying for their health care. >> to illegal aliens pay taxes? -- do illegal aliens pay taxes?

is that something we are collecting right now? >> some do. they are working and paying taxes. >> they are obligated to pay taxes. whether they file is another issue. >> some are paying taxes and some are not. ok. >> will the gentlelady yield for another question? i think what you're saying is that they are not allowed to buy insurance through the exchange. i do not see how you could penalize them for not buying into the marketplace. are you suggesting we should allow our on documented part -- populist to purchase it? >> i am trying to clarify what you are allowing and not allowing. >> under the house bill, we did allow are undocumented population to buy insurance through the exchanges or the marketplace mechanism. there were several amendments offered a bribe members of your

party -- several members of your party that would allow them to buy insurance through the exchange. i asked how they intended to pay for that, because we do not allow them to buy insurance, we are then forcing others to pay for uncompensated care. the senate bill does not have this provision. the gentlelady is correct by it and not allowing undocumented immigrants, we are forcing those it who would have insurance to pay for. >> we also want to remember that, because the on documented were left out of the exchange and cannot participate in the health program, their only access would be through the emergency room. they cannot use the emergency room at the way you use your doctor visit or regular hospital visit. when you go to an emergency

room, you get care based on the urgency of your condition. for folks coming to the emergency room, it is because they have an emergency. if they do not, they go to the back of the line and may or may not get treatment. for example, contagious disease. i do not believe we would want to say we want to exclude anyone who happens to be in this country if they have a contagious disease, the bird flu or swine flu, you would not want to exclude people if they truly have an emergency condition. that is what we leave the undocumented population with. >> [inaudible] >> adjourned.

[captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> good afternoon. from capitol whill and washington, d.c. . .

host: we are live right now from one of the house office buildings. it is the cannon office building, named after speaker

joe cannon. our guest is steven dennis, who has been immersed in health care legislation for how long now? guest: certainly over a year. it seems like this is never going to end, but it looks like it's going to end today. it is going to be an exciting historic day one way or the other. host: walk us through what is going to happen and the particularly interesting things to watch? guest: the first part of the day you are going to watch unrelated votes that don't have much bearing on this bill at all. they are opportunities for leadership to go out and make their last wood checks, make sure people who say they are going to vote for the bill will actually vote, making sure that everybody is going to show up. there was concern about lorta sanchez, who wasn't here yesterday.

they are making sure they work out the last deals that some members are demanding before they vote for it. abortion is that key last issue . it has been sort of a part of this debate from the beginning. everybody knew it was going to come down to abortion, and it looks like that is the last little bit they have to negotiate, some kind of compromise with the folks on the democratic side who don't want any federal funding going for abortions. host: party leaders and house leaders have been making the round of the sunday morning shows to make their last case, and also on the democratic leadership time to assure they have all the votes lined up. let's listen to a clip from "meet the press" with denny hoyer and john boener. >> we are going to get those 216 votes because we believe they understand that americans

want the health care reform. >> do you have a majority? >> yes. >> but not nailed down? >> there are still members looking at it and trying to make up their minds. but we think there are going to be 216-plus votes at the final roll vote. >> why are you so confident? >> for over 100 years, both parties have been saying we need to make sure that all americans have access to affordable health care. george bush said that. his father said that. richard nixon said it in 1974. so that this is the time to do it. we have come the furthest we have ever come to getting this done, and we are going to get it done today in the house of representatives. >> fair to say there will not be a vote called if you don't have the 216? >> we are going to have a vote. we are going to have 216. >> either way you will have a vote? >> we are going to pass this bill, david. >> do they have a vote? >> well, it is clear from listening to steny that they don't have the votes yet.

you have to think about this. 54 teaches by the president of the united states over the last year. a year's conversation with the american people, and they have been heavily engaged in this conversation for nine months. the senate bill has been out there for three months. yet after all of this hand-wringing and debate, we are about to make this historic change on a purely partisan vote. i think if the american people stay engaged in this fight for the next few hours, this fight is not lost yet. this fight for having real health care reform on a step by step basis to make the system work better really can happen. but first we have to stop this bill, which will ruin our economy, ruin our health care system, the best health care system in the world. host: the democratic and republican leaders this morning a couple of hours ago on "meet the press" here in washington,

d.c. steven dennis of role call with me. you have been watching the horse trading and came geology going on to get the final votes. came can you tell the people around the country about how it works? guest: well, there are so many piece toss this bill. the total package is well over 2,000 pages. things got worked out with negotiations between the white house and certain members. defazio is going to vote for this bill, a liberal member who threatened to vote no. others voted against the first bill, but ultimately the president was able to get them on board. luis gutierrez, a prominent member of the hispanic caucus voted for this bill ultimately. there are details about this bill, things like the tax. there are also these various

taxes that pay for the bill. one is on medical divides -- device manufacturers. those kinds of little things are what makes congress tick. while we hear about the big issues, sometimes some of these little issues, get a vote here and there, can have a big impact. and then the issues that control a block of votes like abortion, which are really hard to deal with. it is hard to come up with a compromise with people so die met trickally opposed. those have taken a lot of time, and we are still waiting to see exactly what this abortion compromise is going to look like. one representative has come out in favor of the bill, but we are still waiting to hear from some of the other pro life democrats and whether they are going to vote for this or not.

host: let's take a look at another piece of video. this is from the network morning shows, abc's this week. in this case you hear the person responsible for keeping track of the votes on the republican side, eric cantor of virginia, and congressman larsen, here is what they had to say about the process. >> we have the votes. we are going to make history today. in that sense, president roosevelt passed social security, lyndon johnson passed america. and today, barack obama will pass health care reform, demonstrating whose side we are on. >> let me pin you down. >> go ahead. >> if you have the votes now, >> we have the votes. >> you have 216 committed now? >> yes. >> do you believe him? >> jonathan, let me tell you something. the american people don't want this to pass. the republicans don't want this to pass.

there will be no republican votes for this bill. and frankly, if it does pass, it is because they are using everything in their political power and even things some things they shouldn't have in their political power to cut political deals to denver the votes. host: what was he referring to there in things that they shouldn't have in their political power? guest: well, there have been all kinds of process complaints about this bill. there have been all kinds of side deals that have not necessarily to do with health care. there have been issues where members had other things that they wanted. we are going to hear more about this going forward. there have been a lot of agoizations on the part of republicans that certain democrats have been promised things, whether it be appointment or other things. the democrats have denied that. they said there haven't been

those kinds of promises. it's going to be an issue where republicans are going to try and charge some members got a deal on some unrelated projects in exchange for their votes. host: let's turn to our calls. this one from zelda. good day to you. why do you support this legislation? caller: i support it because i am a 13-year survivor of breast cancer. i was the beneficiary of excellent care. during my treatment, i met many people who did not have. i am willing to contribute my share. host: what do you expect to be your sure? caller: if it were to result in higher premiums for those who make larger incomes, i am prepared to do that. host: are you still on private insurance? caller: yes, i am.

host: and you had no problems with preexisting conditions? caller: i did because i couldn't change my insurance or my job, and i recented that, but i stuck with this. i love this country, but i think they can do better for more of us. host: thank you, under preexisting conditions. what can the legislation do? guest: in six months of this bill passing, any child with preexisting conditions are occurred covered. that is something democrats are trying to point out, that some of this bill's benefits take effect quickly. other things you have to wait until 2014 when the bulk of the bill takes effect. that is when the new mandate for people buying insurance or they pay a penalty of $700. that is when you are going to start seeing large numbers of people getting covered. that is when all the preexisting conditions for all people are banned. between now and them somebody

with preexisting conditions might have access to a national high-risk pool. that might h.i.v. again an option to get some coverage. host: this is jenella who is still undecided. can you tell us what would tip you one way or the other? caller: i don't think there is anything that will tip me one way or the other because there are so many points on both sides. but i just heard heptive -- congressman john boener. he said we have the greatest health care system in the world. is he crazy? yes, if you are him, you have the greatest health care system in the world. but there are so many people like me. i am a college student. i no longer qualify to be on my parents' health insurance. i have no health insurance.

i have no job. i am undecided because i would love for somebody to do something to turn the country's attention back to help getting people back to work. i'm not one way or another because i think there are good points on both sides, but i just need someone to do something to get the country's attention back to helping people get people who want to work back in good-paying jobs. i wouldn't mind paying higher taxes, but i can't pay taxes if i don't have a job. host: thanks for your call. steven, this is not job legislation because this is health care. we heard republicans making the argument that this bill could be a jobs killer, and the democrats are saying the opposite. what aspects are they debating when they talk about that? guest: the republicans look at this and say there is going to be all this new ridge slation and federal bureaucracy, and

there are going to be these new taxes, particularly on the wealthy. they say that is going to hurt small business, et cetera. the democrats look at this and say one of the reasons why small businesses are having a hard time hiring new people is health care costs so much. so they are going to have tax credits to provide health insurance starting this year. they are going to point out that people are losing their insurance, that under the existing system, a lot of small businesses are losing insurance because they can't afford it. they are saying if we can bring costs down for the small businesses, if we can change the system so more people are involved so that people are aren't being subsidized by people with insurance, bringing those costs down, if you can do some of those things, you might be able to help the economy. there is a raging debate right now between folks on the left and folks on the right on whether this is going to help

the economy or not. it is probably going to help some folks and hurt others. if you make more than $200,000 a year, you are definitely going to get hurt. right now you probably have pretty good health insurance, and you are going to have a new significant payroll tax on that income over $200,000. if you are somebody who doesn't have health insurance right now, close to 50 million people, by 2014 there is a good chance you're going to have it, and it is going to be more affordable and available to you, especially if you have a preexisting condition. there are definitely winners and losers. host: mr. dennis and i are on the cannon house building balcony. there are three major buildings across the street from the capitol itself. these buildings are closest to the house of representatives chambers. members have an easy underground package or across the street on this beautiful spring day in washington, d.c. lots of citizens are gathering today.

you can see pictures of some of that on the screen here. let's take our next telephone call. this viewer opposes the legislation. this is sigh from florida. you're on the air. caller: yes. i couldn't afford health care last year. i make less money this year, certainly can't afford it again this year. and then to be penalized because i can't afford it and to have to pay a fine? that is absurd. guest: here is the argument the democrats make on that. if you ban preexisting conditions and you don't require people to get insurance, they will wait until they get sick. what that means is premiums would skyrocket. that is what has happened in states that tried to ban preexisting conditions previously. the premiums skyrocketed and they had to get rid of this ban on barry existing conditions. unless you have a pool that has

healthy people and preexisting condition, there is not a way to do it. the argument democrats make is why would you allow somebody to buy insurance if they have already had an accident. that is the rash name. the other thing is if you're going to have this mandate for people to buy insurance, you need to make it affordable, and you need subsidies, and to provide the subsidies, you need tax increases to fund it. it is a complicated three-legged stool. that is why it is hard for democrats to explain to folks. what people hear is i am going to get a fine if i don't get health insurance. it is hard for conditions to break through that. host: the early part of the

legislative action on the floor, which against in about 40 minutes, is the rule under which the legislation be considered. why is that important? guest: that rule vote is critical because it sets the rules for debate. you get a sense everywhere the votes are on the final ridge slation. if you have the votes on the rule, you would start feeling confident you are going to have the votes for the final bill. that is not necessarily as true as it would have been if they would have done this controversial pass strategy, which would have made the vote on the senate bill. that wive a diceyer proposition. they will have a better time on this bill because they are not using the demon pass strategy. there will be a separate vote on the reconciliation bill which goes to the senate next week. host: well, demons has become quite the buzz word across the country.

yesterday, cameras were in the house rules committee where as that process god under way, it was very much in the state of play. as the day progressed, we learned that the house leadership was moving away from it. there was one moment with congressman cardoza where this became clear. >> we listened to mr. barton talk about how this process has been used in the past, and he is right. it has been used in the past. as i count, nearly 200 times we have used this process in the past. i don't think mr. barton votes for things that are unconstitutional. i don't think the other members here who have voted that way, or mr. boehner, our ourselves, have voted for anything illegal. but having said all of that, i don't believe it is smart for us to pass a bill this

momentous with that rule. i think it is perfectly legal and appropriate because we have done it before. and the house, under the articles of the constitution, makes its own internal rules. however, i don't support us doing it, and i will not vote for a rule that deems as we have been talking about. host: how significant was that announcement by congressman car dozea. guest: it was very important. there was a 9-4 split. you are talking about a very close vote. they could have lost the rule in committee. so it was an important thing. i talked to cardoza at length yesterday, late last night, and he said he was opposing it strongly for the past week. keep in mind that the reason

for the demon pass rule in the first place was really about political cover. it didn't affect the outcome. it was about how can we not have to vote on a senate bill so that we don't have to go book home and say we voted on a senate bill that a number of our constituents don't like because it has special things for nebraska and other states. there is a giant spotlight on this bill. people are paying a lot of attention, and it became a net political negative over the course of a week. there is no political cover if there is a bright spotlight on it. host: we have about 37 minutes until the house of representatives goes into session. if you're going to be with us through the day, the important votes are the vote on the roll and the vote on final package is expected late afternoon, possibly early evening. so it is not coming to session and then all over. there is a lot of discussion on

the floor, a chance for opponents and supporters to make their final say. another point. it's noisy here. we know that. we are trading off perfection in the studio with audio so you can have a real sense of what it is like on capitol hill tonight. there are protestors and supporters over our shoulder right now in the west front of the capitol. there are about eight television crews here. a lot of things are going on. it's a little noisy, but we hope you. maureen, you're on, and she supports this bill. caller: i just wanted to remind people of something that has not been mentioned. i heard one congressman mention it saturday. he decided to support the ball because he was a veteran and a

democrat. he said the reason being is he remembered being on the plane with second rumsfeld going to iraq and giving them a big check for their health care system. if they can get their health care from us, our congress people should surely cover us. i think he said it, i think, better than anybody recently i have heard say it. his mother had taught him if you don't do something -- don't say something, do something, and then come and tell me about it. it was in his mind and no one can say it didn't happen. he was with secretary rumsfeld when it happened. i just wanted to make that clear. i have not heard that from anyone. ok, we pay for it, and the man -- and he is also from an ohio district where that poor woman is in a coma that has been in the headlines, from her

district. he said he wanted to get that out to her and the others out there. i wanted to let her know that. host: thank you. in a story in the "new york times" today, there is a suggestion about how important the symbol of natoma became in the process of today's vote. guest: i think it was very important. the trip by the president to ohio was very important. he got one to switch his vote, and another ohio democrat. i think she may have been talking about him. he is a veteran of the iraq war, a freshman democrat from ohio. he came out and gave a very impassioned speech right out here a couple of days ago. he talked about his mother who had cancer, who had insurance and was able to survive. he also talked about natoma from ohio, somebody who had cancer and didn't have health insurance and is going through a lot of angst over that, and

difficulty. those kind of personal stories are actually winning some votes here. it is not just about political gamesmanship. some of these folks know that they are making their lives more difficult politically, but they have personal stories of people who have come to them in their districts who have been bankrupt because of health insurance costs, or seen a loved one go bankrupt. john showed up with a 10-year-old boy at his press conference who has autism, who is 10 years old and hasn't been able to get health insurance because no health insurance company wants to ensure him. that kid, as he pointed out at the press conference, within six months will be insured if this bill passes. some of these personal stories are sort of breaking through to some of these members and getting their votes. host: i am going to ask you to briefly explain how will it happen this child will be

insured in six months. what does the legislation do? guest: the legislation requires insurance companies to cover children who have preexisting conditions. right now there is something called underwriting. you apply for insurance. it states on the form, do you have any preexisting conditions, and you have to write them down, whether acne, or autism. the insurance company looks at that, and they either give you a rate or say we are not going to cover you. so six months from now, those insurance companies who have been denying this boy coverage won't be able to do that any more. host: but it does not suggest what the rates will be? they will be able to charge higher premiums? host: i don't think they are going to be able to charge higher. that is part of the overall thing. you can't discriminate. you can't say well give you insurance for $200,000. host: back to calls. this is david from concord, new

hampshire, who is still undecided. what do you need to know about the legislation? caller: i tell you, it's a cuff call. every one of those 50 million people that don't have insurance, my heart is out to them. i'm more concerned with the price tag. if some of these 50 million are going to doctors several times a week, or we run out of money early, what is going to happen? cash for klunkers, they way under estimated how many people were going to want the program. any ideas on what is going to happen if estimates on how much it is going to cost are way off? that is my question. guest: that is a really good question. we have seen a lot of estimates from the congressional budget office which says it is going to cost about $940 billion to cover all these people the next

10 years. more than that in the following 10 years. those are estimates. they are partly based on whether or not health care costs keep rising as fast as they have or not. that is going to be the ultimate driver. whether some of these reforms in this bill, including free preventive care. is that going to cut health care costs or increase them? maybe they are going to actually get their diabetes or their dialyses on time, and they are not going to be going to the emergency room, and maybe they can save money that way. some of this is going to be an experiment. we are going to find out, and that is going to be a choice for the country down the line. one of the things that happened with the america prescription drug benefit passed in 2003 by republicans, there were estimates all over the map. some people thought it was going to be 400 billion, some there are 600 bill.

but there was no way to pay for that bill. it was just on the deficit. this bill, whether you like it or not, is different in that threes in this bill they have tried to pay for it. the congressional budget office says it will reduce the deficit in their best guess. but it is still a best guess. that is something the country is going to have to determine in the years down the road. hope you are talking as if the package of it is certain. we still have to move on to the senate. are the chances of that passing certain? host: well, this is the senate bill. if that happens, thousands of pages of the bill will be inacted. the democrats wanted to delay this cadillac tax and the high cost plan for 1018. it has various components to it, but it is less than 200

pages. that is going to the senate. more than 50 senators have signed a letter promising to pass this bill without changes. we will have to see how long it takes the senate to get that done or if they can get it done. but that bill is protected from filibuster. republicans cannot block it. so given that, there is a pretty good chance that that ends up passing as well. that is if they both pass today. it is still a dicey proposition. it is still going to come down to a very narrow number of votes who are undeclared. they may not be undecided, but they are undeclared. host: we have gotten word from the white house that the white house is likely to plan a statement from the president tonight if the measure is passed. one of the things we heard about yesterday is that some of these protestors, just a few of the demonstrators, i call them protestors, but they are pro and con on legislation -- took

their feelings about this bill to an extreme. some african-american members of congress reported that as they crossed the street here, there were racial epithets cast pop them, and one member said someone spat upon him. michael was asked about that. let's listen to what he had to say. >> i asked the leaders about this. some of the racial epithets, anti-gay epithets among tea party ackvis, is there a danger to be associated with the tea party move? >> it is not a danger to be associated with thtie party movement. as the leader said, that is reprehensible. we do not support that. you can have this debate without attacking a member of congress personally. >> would about some of your own

rhetoric? that slide vilifying the speaker and the president talking about the bill? >> it is inappropriate and should not have happened. there's a fine line between engaging your donors and activists to get them fired up to go out and do for you, to raise money, et cetera, and the things we heard yesterday that are racial epithets and anti-gay language. there is a very bright line there for us to not cross. nothing we have done or said on either side, democrat or republican, in the hot rhetoric of this comes to that. what you had out there yesterday were a handful of people who just got stupid and said very ignorant things. neither party, i believe should be associated with that.

host: and those are protestors who are over our shoulder here on this sunday afternoon as we await the house of representatives coming into session for its final debate and vote on health care legislation. we are pleased to have leading us into that house debate today, steven dennis of "role call" who is very immersed and up to speed on the legislation, taking your telephone calls. our next call comes from jeff in richmond, virginia, and jeff supports the legislation. tell us why? caller: i just think it is about time this country did something for the total citizens of the country than just the wealthy. and for the republican party to sit there and insulate themselves and claim the american people don't want this bill is a lie. they quote these polls they are

taken. who are they polling? i've never gotten a poll from many of these people. they are just protecting the insurance companies so they can get their pay-offs in the back rooms. that is all i have to say. thank you. host: mr. dennis, that is a good jumping off point to talk about the party politics in november on today's vote. guest: well, it overshadows this debate. president clinton had majorities in both chambers. he was unable to get health care done, and the democrats lost congress in november when you had the republican revolution. there are republican leaders today who were around back then and were part of the republican revolution, and they are hoping the same thing happens. they are hoping this bill goes down, and they are hoping -- regardless of whether it goes down or not, that they can use this as a jumping-off point to take back the congress.

you have others in the leadership who saw that as a huge missed opportunity. you saw president clinton come and speak to the members here and tell them that they need to pass this bill because the same thing will happen again. if they don't pass it, they will lose the congress. so you have folks really looking at this as a pivotal moment not just on health care, but for the parties, for the country, for the presidency, and they are telling members if you vote against this, this is going to be incredibly damaging for democrats and the president. we are not going to be able to get all these other things on the agenda done. it is going to be crippling. that is a powerful message because people do remember 1993 at 1994. host: the next telephone call is from jane, who opposes the bill from wisconsin. caller: i opposed this on several things. one is that the i.r.s. is

getting far too powerful. people who just get out of prison would -- won't have a job. how do this get taken care of? they can stop people who have appointments on back child support, and they wouldn't be taken care of even in an emergency. this bill also prevents people from being on social security and s.s.i. because they are on solo income from being able to pay a premium. i am on these things because the premiums got so high that i went broke. i am currently on medicaid. came happens to medicaid? i have permanent disabilities and preexisting conditions. how is this going to cover that? it is just throwing everything up in the air, and it is

totally ridiculous in my estimation, as well as the cost coming across to everybody is crazy. thank you for taking my call. host: worried about the cost and also concerned about medicaid. guest: well, medicaid will be expanded by this bill by, i believe, about $-- about 15 million of the 32 people are going to be covered. the federal government is going to reimburse states for the cost for several years, and ultimately will be providing 90% of the cost for expanding medicaid eligibility. the democrats say there are a number of improvements to medicaid under this bill. they say there is going to be higher reimbursements for primary care doctors so that they can get more people who are willing to take medicaid. right now there is a big problem for medicaid recipients right now. a lot of doctors don't want to take the low reimbursement,

particularly primary care. so they have done a lot of of tweaking of the bill. there are certainly governors out there, particularly republican gfers in general, and a few democratic governors, who are worried about expanding the medicaid system because so many state budgets are under a lot of trouble riot now. host: march 25 is speaker nancy pelosi's 70th birthday. a lot of people have talked about how important this bill is to president obama's presidency. talk about the speaker's role in coming to this moment and what it means in terms of her speakership? >> i think it is fair to say we wouldn't be at this moment if speaker pelosi had not put as much time and effort into this game. symptoms she first got into

congress, her history was she was the daughter of the mayor of baltimore. she was born into politics. she has really been bearing down and trying to get this done, and it has been very interesting to watch. every moment you see her, she is walking to a meeting, from a moment, in an interview, 100% of the time trying to get this done. if she gets it done, it will be an historic achievement. right now she has already made history as the first woman speaker of the house. this will be a landmark achievement that would be the cap stone of her career. i am sure she wants to keep going a number of years as speaker. there are a lot of democrats right now who, even if they lose the house in november, want this moment. i think speaker pelosi would be willing to trade that. this is such an important goal for the party, her and others.

they want this so badly. ultimately that is why they are going to get the vote. there are enough democrats who are facing difficult elections, who know how important this is for the party and ultimately are going to vote for it. that is what seems is going to happen. host: about 0 minutes until the house galveston else into session. we will have complete coverage on c-span. we will take more of your telephone calls. let's go back to calls right now. susan supports the legislation in dallas. your on, susan. caller: yes. i support the legislation, and here's why. i am a newly minuted nurse who just finished nursing school. before that i was a stay at home mom. during the time that i was not working in order to watch our kids and go to nursing school, we had insurance through my

husband's employer, who is a small company. and because they were small, we were paying premiums that were $900 a month, which was more than half the cost of our mortgage. we scraped it together and paid for it, but we have done it. now that i have a job and i am with a larger employer, our premiums are under $300 a month. there is something wrong with a system that works that way. even if my premium were to go up balls of this legislation, i would still support it because insurance should be affordable to everyone. host: your response? guest: there are a lot of folks who have very -- depending on what job you have or what job your spouse has, or which state you are living in, it has a huge impact on how much you are paying. one of the things that people have talked about it trying to get some kind of national system where, if you are in a

small business, on you are self--employed, right now you don't have a lot of clout with the insurance company to get a low rate. one of the things this will create in 2014 are these insurance exchange where you're in a big pool, and presumably you can get a better rate. that is not just a democratic idea. republicans have similar ideas, and it is something that currently really doesn't exist. it is really hard for somebody who is self-employed to go out and find an after theable insurance play. speaker pelosi makes the point that that causes problems in the economy. people are reluctant to try out something new if they are worried about losing health insurance. host: next up is dine from delaware. she is opposed to the legislation. you're on. caller: how are you? host: good. tell us why you are opposed? caller: i am actually disabled, and i am on maradona, and my

husband is also disabled, and he hasn't gotten his maradona yet. he had to actually refile to get it, and he finally got it. as far as medicaid goes, they cut him off. he had it for a while. i'm sorry, but i'm sick of hearing about the democrats. democrats, democrats, democrats. what about the republicans? i don't like the fact that president obama stepped up there and said you wanted this done because that is why you are a democrat. that was rude. guest: why are you against the plan? caller: i am against the plan because it is going to raise everybody's premium and people are going to lose their jobs. we don't need government-run health care. host: they are using maradona and medicare.

caller: we are only getting medicare, and we pay every month. we go to the hospital, and we have over a $1,000 deductible just to be accepted into an emergency. caller: i am trying to get a sense of how this is going to affect your situation. if you're on maradona, it may depend on whether you are on maradona advantage, a private plan. some of those are going to get touched. but if you are on the maradona -- medicare prescription drug plan, it will be a better plan. i am trying to get a chance of why you are worried about. host: she is now off the line, so we won't know that. you saw congressman peter king crossing the street. members have the option of going underground.

it likes like they are running the gauntlet with some of the people on capitol hill, but they have a choice. they have other ways. guest: they do. there is a tunnel or a train. if they are going outside, it is by choice. they want to enjoy this beautiful day in washington. host: and connect with the public, which is why they are in the business in the first place. guest: absolutely. host: let's take a call from kathy in washington. she is undecided. tell us why, kathy? caller: well, i hear conflicting information. yesterday i heard president obama say in his speech that some people want to open it up to competition. he didn't allow if that was a good thing. from my experience my whole life, competition brings down

prices. my big concern is my insurance premium is almost as much as my rent, and nobody has said how much it is going to go down, what percentage. i know you can't tell me if you are paying $400 it's going to go down to $200, but can't somebody tell me the percentage? host: thanks for your call. guest: nobody can tell you the percentage for your particular situation. part of it is going to depend on some of these other reforms, whether they can bring down health care costs, whether keeping people out of the emergency room is going to make the whole system more efficient or not. a lot of it is going to depend on things like your income level. in 2014 when these insurance subsidies take effect. up until about $80,000 a year, families will get some kind of subsidies. so it really depends on what your situation is. there is a percentage.

under this proposal, they cap this percentage that you have to pay out of pocket. that is something we don't have now. right now the insurance company can charge you a huge premium. maybe it is a third of your income. under the plan the way it is supposed to work is less than 10% of your income is going to go to this insurance. so if you make $50,000 a year, you wouldn't pay more than about 9% of your income, maybe $4,500 a year for a family plan, and the rest of it would be paid for by the federal government. it really depends on your personal situation. if you make a lot less than $50,000, the subsidies would be higher. if you make a lot more than $50,000, subsidies would be less. host: next up are two members of congress that have been very visible for those of you who watch application -- politics

for the past couple of weeks. debbie, a breast cancer survivor, and carl ryan, a point person for the republican leadership on budget issues related to health care. they were on foxx news this morning. let's listen to their discussion. >> there is talk, and i want to pick up on what i was discussing with major garrett, about the president signing an executive order reaffirming that no taxpayer fund will be used for abortion to try to pick up some of these pro life democrats that voted yet last time and talking about voting no now. is the president going to do that? >> as far as i understand there has been no decision to do that right now. we have been underscoring to my colleagues who are concerned about that language, this bill does not provide federal government funds for abortion at all, does not change curn law. this bill is status quo when it comes to abortion coverage. >> have some said that would

make it easier for me? >> there are some who would like some more comfort, for the emphasis to be underscored about that federal funding. >> congressman ryan? >> i would say i couldn't disagree more. it does fund abortions, but on executive order. one man can sign an executive order and one man can repeal it, and that is the president of the united states. for my democrat friends who are pro life, that doesn't cut it. executive order is not negligence that is permanent law. we don't see that something as sufficient to permanently prohibit taxpayer funding of abortion. host: they were on foxx. this is a live picture of some of the demonstrators on capitol hill. it is always challenging to judge the size of the crowd. if you look over our shoulders, there are a couple of hundred people. i want to give you that perspective because you are up

close there and it is hard to judge what is really going on. let's go back to the abortion debate. you told us earlier that that block of votes has been key. what presidential executive all about. guest: the executive order, which we have not seen a copy of, but various copies have been distributed over the course of the last day -- even as i was walking here, i ran into george miller, one of the key chairmen writing the bill, and he said there are still negotiations going on with that block of anti-abortion rights democrats. those votes are incredibly critical. host: but the number was 20 at one point, and it has gotten smaller and smaller. host: bart stupak has been the leader of this block. they have never put out a list of names, but you can tell who they are because they are

people who haven't declared yet. there are about 10 of them left who haven't declared their vote. several of them appear to be likely to roll off with some kind of executive order. it is possible even that they could negotiate something with congressman stupak. it seems unlikely, but they are not giving up hope. he will ultimately support this bill. he has a long relationship with john dingelle, who is fighting for this legislation and has been for 60 years. it will be interesting to see if they can come up with an executive order that says no federal funding for abortion and see if that resolves some of the concerns. it didn't resolve the concerns of marsy. she came out this morning. congressman stupak said his group is down to about six members who are solidly wanting

this legislation changed. host: how critical are six votes? guest: six votes is huge. they can't afford to have slippage among any other democrats, people like lorta sanchez. they need those people to show up. if they do come up with some kind of final compromise, which seems unlikely, this bill could pass fairly easily, but it doesn't seem like that is in the cards. host: next is a telephone call from greg. greg opposes the legislation, watching in robertsville, alabama. you're on. caller: the whole problem is there are two many people who want something for nothing, and it is a large step for socialism. health care is not a right, it's a privilege. longevity of life is not a part of the constitution. i don't have health care.

my wife doesn't have health care. we both want it, and we hope one day we can afford it, but i don't want it from my government. host: that was john of arizona making his way over to the capitol for the legislation. there are about seven minutes during the session begins. what would you say to the caller? caller: that is a fascinating caller. i have heard similar statements from a number of folks. there is a real ideological divide in this country. there are people who don't have health insurance who are suspicious that the government is going to come in and make things worse. it is sort of fascinating. if you don't have health insurance, and he says he doesn't, there is a pretty good chance he would get it with this bill, and you would think that would be something that might make him more at ease, that if he or his wife got sick, they wouldn't lose their house or wouldn't go bankrupt.

but there's a fundamental distrust of government of a lot of folks in this country. host: if this legislation passes the house today and is signed by the president, what opportunities do the republicans who are so strongly opposed to it have with regard to implementation? guest: well, a lot of this doesn't take effect until 2014. there is an effort to sign letters saying they will repeal the legislation if they take back the house. the reality is if they take back the house and senate next year, president obama could repeal any veto legislation. it will be fought out in the next presidential election if it passes. it will probably be a significant part of the next presidential election, whether this is going to be implemented as written or changing it. it is going to be hard for republicans to really roll back

a lot of the things in the bill. some of the things individually are popular. if you say i am going to restore preexisting conditions, that is going to be a hard sell to folks. if you say hey, i am going to get rid of these tax increases, that might be an easier sell. host: we have five minutes left. we have time for another call. there is maureen from park city, utah supporting the ledge slace. you're on. caller: hi. i just wanted to say that i hope our representatives vote for the people instead of for themselves on this bill. that is just what i hope. host: thanks. while we were listening to that caller, i have gotten a note from our producer who says that msnbc is now reporting that bart stupak is a yes vote for the legislation. guest: if that is true, that is game, set and match. they are going to get the vote. i talked to jorning miller on

the way in, and he held out hope that stew pack would vote for the -- stupak would video for the legislation. john dingelle has been one of his mentors, the dean of the house, strongly supporting this legislation. and you know, even when stupak -- when this whole stupak wing emerged late last year, he initially wanted a vote on the house floor. he wasn't necessarily demanding it be part of the legislation. it just became more and more of a deissue. but stupak has always wanted to get health care reform passed, and it is very hard to say at the very end, i am going to be the one to kill it. host: down to the wire here for our live production. let's go to paul, undecided caller in north carolina. hello, paul? you're on. caller: hi. i'm not sure.

i have been watching c-span, and they were talking about about this being deficit neutral, and they are talking about you can't $500 billion for medicare and have the subsidies and have the same money and put it into the obama trust fund. the other thing, the doctor fix, that is not in the bill, and that is going to cost between $210 billion to $371 billion for the doctor fix. host: let me jump in because our time is short. help him understand what the bill does. guest: they came out with a score last night that says over

the first 10 years, this legislation the one they are going to be voting on today, boast pieces examined, will cut the deficit by $143 billion. that is significant. they said that over the following 10 years, it will reduce the deficit about by $1 trillion. that is significant. what the republicans have said is that the democrats plan on making sure the doctors don't get a scheduled 21% cut in their salaries. that separate piece of legislation would cost about $210 over the next 10 years. now, the democrats put that aside to just focus on this piece of legislation, but the republicans have said if you really include that, you are going to be increasing the deficit. they say when it comes down to it, some of these cuts will be repealed and folks won't have

it, and ultimately the deficit will be nkeds. but the reality on this one piece of legislation, the c.b.o. says it will significantly cut the deficit over the next 10 years. host: with our time winding down, emily is opposed. quick comment. caller: i would like to give three quick unique points of view. first of all, i do not believe that the government should prohibit abortion, but they should not make it to where who don't believe in it should have to pay for it. that rips the fabric of our republic. another thing is they do not include cross state line competition. this is going to create monopolies for insurance companies. they have something in there for big pharm cutting out competition. that is going to keep prices up, and that is not going to help us at all. that is going to cause prices to go up. host: last point. we are out of time. caller: and i