the chairman of the postal regulation committee will discuss the u.s. postal service budget problems. and we will have a look at the changes to the federal student loan program. this is "washington journal." . .

 thost: we are particularly interested in hearing from those of you in coastal states. mr. pittman is on the phone with us from the st. petersburg times. i'm wondering what you have heard about the official reaction from state officials in florida, and specifically, the tampa bay area. guest: for a long this time, offshore drilling has been kind of the third rail, but when you don't touch. it unifies opposition to it, both parties, because of the concern about what a single spill might do to the tourism industry here, tainting the beaches. but that summer we had for dollar gasoline, for dollar a gallon gasoline, certainly

changed the lot of minds and the economy has opened up a lot more people to the possibility of allowing drilling closer to shore. our governor charlie crist, particularly when john mccain came out in favor of offshore drilling said very famously, well, ok, if it could be made environmentally safe, i'm for it. probably the florida officials who has been the staunchest opponents of offshore drilling, senator bill nelson, said in reference to the president's proposal, well, he thinks he is ok with it. they are staking out positions that are more open to this proposal than any we have seen so far. host: if the president's plan enacted, would affect two, how and when? guest: currently what is in

place is something senator nelson pushed forward in 2006 that kept drilling 250 miles away from tampa bay area. this would bring in a lot closer than previously. so that has been -- the tampa bay area in particular, the beach areas, really depend on tourism. so there is a lot of concern, a lot of strong resistance even from this proposal from faults in the tourism industry. there was a protest outside of new to gingrich's speech last night who drew people who work on the beaches, people in the business catering to tourism, as well as folks who consider themselves environmentalists. 300 faults, many of them dressed in black and one woman dressed yourself and hershey's chocolate start to show how she would look like cover and boil. i do not know how she dealt with the dance.

it is certainly a concern a lot of folks have but weighing it against what is going on in the economy. host: speaking of gingrich, at the republican convention, drilled, baby, drill, was a frequent sign. what did newt gingrich have to say? guest: he said he thinks it is a step in the right direction but he would come up as a slogan says, he would like to see him drill now. in other words, don't make this a plan for four years from now or eight years from now. he wants to open up the lease is right away because he is convinced not only will it help with us from foreign oil but also it would help boost jobs at a time we desperately needed. host: thank you for giving us a second a perspective from the tampa bay area. we showed some of your headlines. if people are interested in finding out more of your reporting, you can find it on tampa bay.com website. we want to show you, as we are listening for calls, newspapers

from all over the country and all kinds of headlines. as the program continues we will also introduce you to some of the editorial opinions. let us listen to some calls, beginning from louisville, ky. jenny on the democrats' line. caller: good morning, how are you? anyway, my opinion is, we've got to do something because of the price of the gas, and we can't keep going on like this. but if it were for a short period of time and if it was in an area on where it would not hurt the environment or the beaches or everything, then i would go for it. i think it would be a good idea for a period of time. but we still need to work on our own energy, coming up with our own energy. i still like everybody else have

passed us of any way, ok? host: when you say coming up with our own energy, this is tapping our reserves. what are you saying? caller: like the -- what you call them? turbos or whatever -- host: wind turbine and solar? host: -- caller: there has to be a better way. we've got to stop depending on other countries for once and if we do this offshore drilling, i think it should be done in a safe place. host: our next comment comes from baron, independent in baltimore. you are all on. caller: thank you for having me. i agree with the last caller a little bit. i think it is a good idea. i live in maryland. i have never seen an oil rig.

it would probably weird if you went off the coast of maryland. but like the president said, we have to% of the world's or reserves and we use 20% of the world's oil. so this is just a small step. but we really need to work on the nobles. and keeping up with china, because they are investing more than us right now one renewable s. it is a good step but people will have resistance because it is in their back yard. i was listening to one section about tampa. people don't want stopped in their own backyard. it is ok to take oil from oil fields 6,000 miles away in iraq, but not on my clothes line. but thank you. host: next is a call from lynne,

republican in new castle, pennsylvania. what you think about the announcement? caller: i think it is wonderful. that bill was signed in before president bush left office. had we gone through with that we would not have needed that stimulus package because that would have created millions of jobs throughout the best united states, from the steel mills creating the pipes, tubes of -- companies installing these, and the drilling itself, we would have had millions of jobs created. we would have never needed the stimulus package, bailing all of these companies out and then the health care. i am not saying everyone would have had jobs, but there would have been millions of jobs. people would be able to take care of their own problems and they would not need the government to take over with all of this mortgage and banking and auto and now health care. we would have been able to --

the other thing is, we would have our own oil. we don't need the foreign countries. host: a statistic, though, the last caller just mentioned, is we have to% of the energy reserves and we use 20% -- we have 2% of the energy reserves and we use 20%. caller: if it is done properly -- a year and a half ago it should have been started when it was signed in. host: "the washington post" suggests that there is a political connection to this what the senate energy bill coming up, and drilling decision a political maneuver is the story. obama's move to open new offshore areas may help the climate bill. splitting the difference on the most contentious energy issues cannot secure bipartisan climate deal this year. here is more on that from "the financial times." here is what he writes --

 

host: let's go back to phone calls. the next up is lubbock, texas. tim on the democrats' line that caller: good morning. i think it is a good initial step, but i think more and -- more of a substantive step is to reduce consumption. i think that is a good start as far as closing the gap. right now operating in good faith with the president's party in the private sector. i do suspect that the industrial complex is kind of working in collusion with politics once again. but i think the previous caller that was talking, i think she was a little far-fetched in terms of some of her assertions on what we have to spend in the stimulus package and the troubled asset relief and all the various other things. but having said that, i live here in texas. for the lack of better terms, we

call them drinking donkeys and we see them everywhere out here. host: those of the oil and gas drills? caller: yes -- the punt jacks, basuto language when we talk to the oil industry. but i have to say this, if the president is doing this to anticipate some cooperation with republicans on his energy bill -- and i really say him, but he is not writing it, of course -- i think it will end up a futile effort because they decided they will dig in their heels and they will oppose everything. host: what do you say about the fact that lindsey graham has been at the table on this? caller: lindsey graham has had positive rhetoric in the past especially regarding the health care bill, for a long time be pledged he would work with us and do that and then you have the various other senators like our side like evan by -- evan

bayh, against the public option, which did not surprise me because his wife is in the corporate structure with health insurance industry. so, republicans promised cooperation in the past before. i am not too optimistic on the following three. they have seemed to tap into this and they will revive their contract with america in 2010. host: milton, independent line. arnot -- vernon dean of beach, florida -- fernandina beach, florida. caller: thank you for taking my call. i think the democrat or republican or the independence or however, if they had just a few seconds to think about this, they will know that the reason this is coming about now --

democrats -- i am talking about kerry, talking about lieberman, and even the republican senator lindsey graham, they were pushing this 10 years ago and the democrats said no, no, no, it will take 10 years to realize any benefit. it has been 10 years ago and they did not drill 10 years ago, so we don't have the oil now. 10 years from now, we won't have any drilling whatsoever. whether you objected to it or you accepted this fact, the method, as the last gentleman said, was to try to get some helps for the cap-and-trade -- anyone in their right mind.

i am not an activist, but i do have my own opinions. offering a carrot in one hand but a stick in the other. host: what is the matter with that, milton? isn't that how politics works? caller: it is good politics but bad for the public because obama -- i am not speaking for obama, i don't know him personally -- but if kerry were in the president's office, it would be the same thing. it is a sales ploy. but they don't have a very good product is the cell. host: milton in florida. i mentioned i will show editorial reaction from news sources. here is "the baltimore sun." it's just the drilling is prohibited north of delaware

some maryland is a state where it would be prohibited if it goes through. even if we open a of the coast with no restrictions whatsoever. if we consider the risk posed b our question for you, the discussion topic is, offshore drilling, risks versus the benefits for the nation. arlington, virginia. jason, republican line. caller: thank you for having me. my only point, like you just

read in the article, what is the benefit? we are going to go ahead and we are going to go and try and however open ended this search for the 2% is going to be, you don't think that the people -- like the gentleman from texas -- texas, will people -- the oil people, if they figure out whether already oil like that, they would be taxing it already. like touched on, it would not go past delaware -- where joe biden on -- joe biden is, john carey -- but virginia is a go. i don't like it. host: your state officials seem enthusiastic. caller: i don't understand where the enthusiasm comes from. what is it going to exactly do for virginia? how long will it take and what will this take independence from?

host: arlington, virginia. near washington. next is a call from virginia, this is a town of zero would -- william, democrats. caller: i think this would be a good thing. when i was being raised that i was told we were a superpower and we had all the natural resources to last us and the end of time so i think it is about time to open up and use some of the resources. but i would still say that this would make a good relationship between the democrats and republicans as far as bipartisan passing. host: interesting, you are a democrat, virginia, you like the idea but a republican of virginia does not like it. caller: everybody has their own idea, you know. but anything, another thing there is, i still do is say, though, we need to use our resources like oil, coal, and

natural gas, but we also need to explore alternative fuels also because really in the long run, china has already got there, germany already got there, no reason for us to be behind in anything because as i said, i was raised with us being a superpower with a natural resources of our own and it just, that one day we need to use them that we might as well start now. host: where is oakwood, virginia. caller: from as well county -- you can get to bluefield or west virginia. also you can go below grundy and that will take you to kentucky. host: you are in the interior part of the state so it is not an immediate issue for you. caller: i would like to make one more statement. we had a republican -- he did

not run on windows, he said, but i still say he did. he is for coal and obama is for coal, too, but he was trying to get past for them to get a windmill farm started their, you know, to build a company building to produce at least 500 when mills per year and for some reason or another the county turned it down because they did not want the red line uglified, and other words, so they signed papers to put it in the newspapers to go against the windmills'. that would give people jobs. host: next is another virginia caller, interestingly one of the headlines in the virginia newspaper said the governor sees virginia becoming an energy capital. mark is an independent. what do you think about is

watching in north of? caller: as many of your callers already hit it on, this is strictly political. the numbers just don't line up for the listeners who believe that we will see relief at the gas pump or heating oil. it is not going to happen. host: let me ask you a question, though. if it is not going to happen, it is not worth the risk? caller: i am like anyone else. this is strictly just a political maneuver i guess to make an effort to get what i think may not ever come here, the next couple of congressional cycles, and that is bipartisanship. it is not going to happen. he already got pushed back from the majority representative of the house john boehner, who is already saying this is way not enough, so what is going to happen is he tried to marry up all the smart energy and a green energy things into this climate bill. he will get massive push back

that will make them try to do more. as far as the state of virginia is concerned, the benefits we may get -- again, we will not see it on the consumer level. we may be able to get funds from either the government may be bundled together with some of the oil companies to come into virginia. but i certainly don't think it is worth the risk. and the amount of reserves, talking about 67 billion barrels and some like that over the period of 10 years that one may last as a year. it just does not make too much sense. host: "the new york times" editorial page supports the president's announcement. they're right -- -- they write --

host: back to phone calls, joe is watching us from pennsylvania. pennsylvania used to be a big energy state. what is your reaction to the president's plan? caller: what i wanted to say is that we should have been exploring alternative fuels long ago. some of these other countries have been, and they are getting ahead of the game way before us. and as a superpower, "a superpower," we are showing our ignorance in this country. we always have to wait until we have our backs up against a wall before we danything. the last thing i wanted to say

is that the people in the leadership in this country -- and i am talking about the congressmen and representatives -- we have a lot of dumb congressmen and all those that need to be out. a they are not helping this country at all and it is just putting us further down the tubes as time goes on. that is all i have to say. host: the next phone call from florida. port st. lucie, stored on the democrats' line. caller: i just wanted to say i have recently been looking for a job opportunity selling solar panels, and really disgusting about a limited number of opportunities that are out there. the fact that if companies like exxon or bp actually get into solar panels, which would never happen because they cannot patent the sun, this country could move forward quickly. it is really a shame that obama had not invested at all this energy in infrastructure and solar energy rather going

through carbon footprint and increasing our carbon footprint for future generations and their children. if we got on the ball right now on solar energy and put resources in technology the country could move ahead and we could become energy independent in half the time we would take now what this drilling, and again, something more political than to benefit this country. it is going to take a whole lot of time before it even has any impact on the price of gasoline, which really will not because the commodities market drives the price of gasoline and not the amount. host: let me share an article which you, when you mention the commodity market. "the washington post" as a story that the u.s. may decide to curb energy market trading. stay on the line and let me hear your reaction.

host: what do you think? caller: i think you're absolutely correct. there are a limited number of people -- like with goldman sachs and trading, there is the regular lane for most of the public and the express lane for large corporations. as long as they control the commodities -- they always keep the price hike. you'll never see to dollar, $1.50 a gallon again. i remember in the 1950's, a gas shortage -- there was such a glut of oil in this world that we will never be able to use in the next 20 years. my thing for future generations

we have to eliminate the carbon footprint. annexing solar energy -- and i am really disgusted about the limited opportunities to sell solar equipment and that is where the money should be going, it improving the efficiency. i think people, once they see they have free electricity, it will catch on like wildfire. slowly but surely we are getting there but not fast enough. host: doug has this twitter comment -- a related article in "the washington post" this morning, the government set to buy 6300 hybrid vehicles.

host: back to calls. chapel hill, tennessee. tony on the independent line. caller: thank goodness for c- span. i m in chapel hill, tennessee, but i am from south louisiana. i just want to say two things about the ills of this. in louisiana they have drilled the last 30 or 40 years and have not prompt a drop out and it polluted tremendous amounts of shrimp estuaries, and on top of all that, they had to cut canals and order to get their barges and rates in the location. to be able to work on monday

were working on drilling offshore. that is the ills of that all and it is definitely not worth it. on the energy problem we have -- no one is interested in a real energy solution, because you can build a car that is run by electricity and has a win turban on the front -- as you are moving the machine, the wind you are creating by going forward will also charge the battery. do you know no one is even interested in that now? one more thing, susan. royal dutch shell and i think it is, they are now trying to buy companies that are trying to build wind generators and solar power and the guy said they will

not get into but what i absolutely on it. they will all our politicians and all of the energy in our country. host: we had a caller a couple of calls back frustrated with all members of congress and his view is reflected in a big ball and "usa today." susan page is the right here -- writer.

that is "usa today." there are many more details on the web site. susie, a republican line. we are talking of offshore drilling bit caller: i can't even believe the term drilling has been raised to the level of dialogue. for president, lies about everything -- but that is another story. he said he would drill when he was running for president, which he very quickly refused to talk about anymore, now he is going to drill because he once boats -- votes. but it does not say drill -- his exploration of exploration is not what we need and a small area he deemed available. what we need, where we know where the oil is, to go after the oil, where there is plenty of it. everything he is doing, this president, is basically -- like if you read sol olisky, the playbook for radicals, which is

his guma, as we say in italian -- he is doing all of the things that he blames the tea party is doing, that is what he says to do. you can get the book. a lot of us on the right it for -- are reading this book. everything he does is a lie. it says in the book to lie, and that is what he is doing. host: suzie from california. today is census day. although you can continue to send in the forms, when we had the head of the senses, he said if you send it and it costs the government 43 cents for postage, but if they have to send someone to your door, the cost goes up into 50 or $60 range per visit. quite an economy if you mail in. from "usa today" is the sense is return rate. only a few states over the 60% mark --

you can continue to send them in for the rest of the month. alabama, a call on our independent line. this is robert. caller: i just wanted to say is we don't have a supply issue with oil. that can be manipulated by commodity traders. what we have is a capacity issue. with oil companies shutting down refineries, there have been like 20 refineries shut down in the past 10 years or so or something like that. that is what is driving up the price of gasoline. because we don't have the capacity anymore to produce the gasoline that the country needs. host: refineries not operating or new ones not been built? why is that? caller: because the oil companies know there is no

economic reasoning for them to do this when they know they can drive up the price of gasoline by shutting down refineries. host: what do you propose as a sound energy policy? caller: there will have to be some mandated stuff -- regulations and stuff like that. we need to get the justice department involved, we need to get the congress involved. because this is just simply -- i don't know the word for it right off hand. but anyway, thank you very much. host: you did well. we understand and we get the gist of your argument. democrat, lake charles, louisiana. caller: don't cut me off, ok? host: head into it, you are on the air. caller: don't cut me off. host: i can promise. caller: we have been drilling it

off the coast of louisiana. we ain't got nothing but refineries and big oil companies down here. our coastline -- like the guy was talking about -- it just destroyed the coast. the shrimping industry is deleted. these people will call in and say, not in my back yard. a but the revenues we get from these oil companies, wheat -- we have to share it with all the 50 states and they don't mind getting back money that they are getting from our back yard. we are not like a welfare state like alaska that gets all the revenues from their oil. that is why the coastline is destroyed. that is where the hurricanes came in here. we don't have the swamp margins like we used to. and off the topic, about the tea

party -- i'm a democrat and i think today they are going to be carrying guns or something? what were they like if me and my friends don't go up with signs calling them a hypocrite. they don't talk for me. thank you. host: next is another virginia called. leesburg area. patrick, republican line. caller: with all due respect to the fellow from louisiana, people are going to decide if they are going to complain -- complain about high gas and oil, you have to explore everywhere but i don't care if there is a wind turbine or refinery setting off the coast as long as a gas prices are low but the hypocritical nature of democrats and liberal is startling. if george bush would have done this, the environmentalist would be jumping up and down and being all wachtel along the coastline. i don't understand why folks are not be more vocal about that.

this guy can get away with anything but does not matter what says. turn on everything he campaigned on, but he gets a free pass. host: thanks, patrick from leesburg. >> is a call from chop. democrat from new mexico. -- next is a call from chuck. caller: for me in new mexico it is not much of a concern but i wanted to relate a story about this. i am sorry -- i am a little nervous. this is only the second time i have gotten on. i worked at a manufacturing plant in pensacola, florida, in the 1970's. during that time we fired our boilers with natural gas -- the pipeline, and it ran right through the property there. during this oil embargo, they

shut the plant down for a week and converted the burners to oil. and for all of this time we were supposed to be in an energy crisis with a shortage of oil, we burned truckload and tanker carloads of that oil to a fire our boilers. and we were told at the time that it was because there was a shortage of natural gas. and that was not true. i later new a ship's captain -- knew a ship's captains and he told us a story and he's laughed and said there is no shortage of oil, the tankers are ioffshore waiting to be unloaded because the storage facilities are all full. that is just my little story. i think we are being

manipulated by markets. so, that is my story. host:chuck, thanks for your phone call from the mexico. a twistwitter -- well, yesterday we did not have been beaten out of the announcement and we are digging into it a little more now that we know the president's plan and in anticipation of the senate debate. terry on the independent line. caller: has and environmental of the noisiest, i want to say this is an absolutely appalling -- as and environmental enthusiast, i would say this is absolutely appalling. it is literally a job -- drop in the bucket. not a year's worth. for anyone to say that this is a

bridge to the future is saying we ought to use whale oil for our lands. what we need to do is we need to go ahead with the energy grid for the country so we cannot solar power in the southwestern part of the country that can supply most of the electricity. we need to drive electric cars. we need to drill for natural gas as long as we can do it without wrecking the supply. money and politics, as usual. as long as you are applying the same game you will get the same results. you either have to change the game or get out. here is a thought for you -- the public owns the rights to the airwaves. why doesn't the fcc mandate that political campaigns will get a certain amount of free time on the airwaves based on some level of support out there in the country and then not allow any paid political ads. that would do wonders for the

intelligence and accuracy of what is actually put out there on the air for people to consume. that is all i have to say. host: terry, another virginia caller. the lead story in "the new york times" today is about the federal wiretaps.

i would also show you, speaking of terrorist attacks -- from russia. i wanted to read this quote from the separatist -- that is a follow-up to the events in moscow. houston is next. dick is on the republican line. go ahead. caller: thank you, president obama. if you were buried masterful in what you had put in the bill for the students and stuff -- on

this oil thing, i know you will not abate able to do something but america must wake up. we have about 100 years of oil in america. how long will you listen to this foolishness? all of the shale oil and the ground and wyoming, stock trading. mr. obama, this is what we need to do. you all nationalized -- privatize the banks, card companies and all of this. we need to nationalize those refineries down here in our region and we need to put the american people to work. the refineries should not belong to any corporations. not the federal government, but the american people. in return, when we start refining this oil we will open our own gas stations and -- in

turn, we can lead to jobs, we can fix our jobs and next week and go back making shoes and clothes for our workers and this would be the first step in the recovery of america coming back to greatness that god intended us to be. host: all right, a caller from houston. next is darnell, democrats line, waldorf, maryland. caller: thank you. while i do not agree with offshore drilling, it is going to happen. obama likes to go down the middle. that is politics. but like the last caller said, the shale oil and everything -- i know it is dirty and expensive but it will probably happen also. i do want to say other callers talking about solar and how hard it is to get in that business -- there should be solar panel sells all across america. every home should have it. i live near a solar panel supplier in maryland, and they

won't give you any information. it is like they don't even want to sell you a solar panel. i think the prices are artificially inflated. but yes, solar is definitely the way to go and i don't understand why it is not being done -- even if it has to be subsidized by the government. host: before we close out, this program has been taking a thumping cents monday -- a caller from north carolina -- a caller from north carolina said we dared to many black collars and a response by the person sitting in the table is unfortunate in that it may sound like we concurred with the caller. bring it on, we would like to hear what all of you. we will be right back. robert samuelsson from newsweek and the washington post is next.

>> one week from today in prague, president obama signs a new nuclear arms reduction treaty in russia. on c-span, and look at u.s.- russia relations. we will hear from a member of the international commission on nuclear non-proliferation and disarmament. live after "washington journal" on c-span. also this morning, a discussion hosted by arizona state university and new america foundation asks the question, is energy independence possible in our lifetime. among those participating, the head of duke energy and the co- founder of the clean energy network. live at 9:00 a.m. eastern on c- span2. >> this weekend on c-span2's "book tv," from burgundy --

virginia festival of the book, the best selling of "the a mortal life of henriette." and president reagan's ambassador to the ussr on mchale gorbachev's role in bringing down the empire. princeton university professor on inventing the idea of a white race -- in "history of white people." find the entire schedule at book tv.org and follow us on twitter. >> all this month, see the winners of c-span's studentcam video documentary competition. a middle and high school students from 45 states submitted videos on one of this country's greatest strengths or a challenge the country is facing. whats the top winning videos every morning on c-span at 6:50 a.m. eastern just before "washington journal." at 8:30 a.m. during the program, meet the students who made them and for a preview of all the winners visit studentcam.org.

>> "washington journal" continues. host: robert samuelson is our first guest this thursday morning. a columnist for a long time at "newsweek" and "the washington post." what does a nation like greece with 11 million people, and once supported by the european common market, has to tell us about the perils of a financial market? guest: @ think the message is sort of a mixed political and financial message. that is, that if the government, if a society continues to overspend year after year, decade after decade, at some point there is a reckoning. and greece, like many other modern advanced democracies basically spent more than it is taxed. huge deficits and huge debt and now the financial markets are

increasingly skeptical and less willing to lend to greece. so greece now is put in a position that they have to cut back either on spending or raise taxes and do both, and these are not small adjustments -- they are wrenching social adjustments. and the same thing may await us if we did not bring the commitment to the government has made, and our willingness to pay taxes to pay for the commitments, into better balance. we have been hearing a song for decades. we have done very little about it. but the message from greece is sooner or later the reckoning does come. host: what is your assessment of how washington has been responding officially? the president who has occupied the seat on pennsylvania avenue in this building behind me, this increasing concern? we seem to continue to spend, although we keep hearing about the perils of building up our debt. so what is happening politically that the response has been what it has? guest: the response has been

entirely consistent -- which is, let us put it off. it is republicans, it is democrats. the republicans like to cut taxes but they don't want to cut spending. the democrats would increase spending but they don't want to increase taxes. you basically have a consensus even though there is an awful lot of rhetoric, but a consensus among practical politicians that they don't want to do anything unpleasant for their constituencies. it is understandable but the point is sooner or later, if you do so -- to much of that, evade these problems too long, there will be a reckoning and it will be imposed by the financial markets that become less willing to lend to you so your interest rates go up and the budget situation deteriorates even more. host: staying with politics, other than a reckoning, what could change the balance politically? would it take a particular strong later -- legal or public asking for change? guest: the public and very asks

for change but they really don't want it. they want the deficit reduced but they don't want spending cuts of the taxes. i think the politics on both parties reflect the underlying public opinion. my on have a conclusion after rating for this for a long time, as he puts it, is that it probably will take a genuine crisis to force major changes but in the midst of a genuine crisis, the changes will not be pleasant and they will have to be fairly abrupt. host: we welcome your telephone calls, e-mail and tweakets for a columnist robert samuelson, about what is in store for our nation in terms of financial status of its -- status and lifestyle. his book is called "the great inflation & its aftermath." what is your thesis? guest: in the last 50 years, the most important economic event is the rise and fall of double- digit inflation. for those of you listeners who do not remember, we went from a

society who basically had no inflation in the early 1960's and by the end of the 1970's we had double-digit -- 12, 13, 14, 15%. at the beginning of the 1980's, paul volcker, then chairman of the federal reserve board under president reagan, essentially put this country through a crushing recession, unemployment got to 10.8% but it did purge of the society from inflationary psychology and you had a gradual decline of inflation and gradual decline of interest rates that triggered a boom in the stock market and triggered really two decades of prolonged prosperity. and most of that, in my view, stemmed from the triumph over double digit inflation, which stabilized the economy and, like a set, led to much higher stock prices and home prices, but ultimately that prolonged and -- that prolonged prosperity gave rise to the plan into a crisis

that broke in 2007 because people got complacent and careless. host: you continued this theme in a recent column march 22 in "the washington post." alan greenspan potts a flawed analysis of the financial crisis. guest: greenspan is an interesting figure because when he retired in our early 2006, he was praised lavishly across the political spectrum by most professional eat communist, by milton friedman, who is a conservative who has been a longstanding critic of the fed, alan blinder, a liberal at princeton who has been vice- chairman of the federal reserve board -- really having been the most successful unreserve leader in the history of the federal reserve system. now flash forward three years

and greenspan is made to be one of the fall guys for the financial crisis, for keeping credit to easy for too long. you really can't blame greenspan, you can't blame the bankers by themselves in isolation. all of these people were conditioned by the experience in the last two decades, when it became conventional wisdom that we had gone into a kind of new era of, is not perfect prosperity, but a kind of underlying indestructible prosperity. we only had two minor recessions in the 1990's and this decade. the recession of 1990-1991, 2001, mild increase in unemployment, 7.8%, the economists call the great moderation. a if you think you live and in less risky world, which that is the conclusion, you begin taking more risk because you are not

times. that is the underlying assumption. so, banks started making stallone's, people borrowed more than they could. the regulators were blinded to the dangers. greenspan probably kept monetary policy to lose for two long parrot but all of this contributed and these things that on each other and the underlying cause was the great past -- prosperity that was created. i think the conclusion i draw from is and maybe others will draw ultimately, is that the view that we had, that we outlawed sort of the boom and bust cycles of the 19th century -- well, we haven't. we are not as smart as we thought we were and not as much control over the economy as we thought we did. host: not surprising the phones are off the hook. before we do, speaking of the current fed, it seems bent on a low -- keeping interest rates

low. they have been signaling that will be their policy for the foreseeable future. what do you think of that? guest: it is going to end at some point. we don't know when. there really is a division of opinion among economists whether it will end this year or next year. i think that given this a very weak state of the economy, it is certainly justified right now. a what they do face a dilemma if they keep it in place to long -- but they do face a dilemma, if they keep in place to long they do face inflation. it is not an imminent problem but it is a problem down the road. they are aware of it. i think they are doing the right thing now but i would not want to be in their shoes to decide when to stop doing what they're doing now. host: what about the nation's seniors who are so affected because so many people have money and money markets and other safe instruments, that their own income has been crimped by the low rate system?

-- well, they would be in worse shape, it seems to me, if the economy would be declining because the stock market would be recline it -- declining, the stock market would be going down more. you have kind of a trade off between low interest rates and a weaker economy. it is worth pointing out that although people who have the money in money-market funds or short-term deposits are earning hardly anything at all, inflation is very low, so the prices are not going up so much. so they are not losing that much in real value. >host: related to this, it seems as though the nation is saving more. is that a good thing? guest: one of the problems of the valuation -- prosperity that began in the 1980's was, people felt well clear because the stock market was going up, housing prices going up -- and they borrowed. up to a point it was okay but

now we are well beyond the point. up to -- going to the budget deficits, we are having a reckoning with what their own balance sheets. americans collectively decided they borrowed too much, lenders are less willing to lend on easy terms so there is a kind of retrenchment where they are borrowing less, prepaying the borrowing and saving more out of the current incomes. that is a drag on the economy and will continue for some time. it is one reason the fed is keeping interest rates low. host: if this is pessimism and this is optimism about the economic future, where are you? guest: i am more pessimistic than we used -- i used to be. because it seems the problems we had could have been salt and address, but we continue to procrastinate and put it off. that is what makes me pessimistic. host: baltimore. republican line. caller: good morning, mr. samuelson. how are you? i just bought a question on

government spending. you get a sense anecdotally from listening that it is not as effective as you might hope. it occurred to me that the act of spending is a two-part deal. the person who spend and purchases goods or services benefits from the receipt of those goods or services, where the person who is paid for them also benefits. and when the government does the spending, it seems like it cuts that equation in half at least. you have any thoughts on that? guest: in theory, the equation you put forward ought to apply to government spending as well. if the political process is working right or correctly, the things that the government wants to spend money on art to be the things people want the government to spend money on. .

would you say may be true. host: mike is on the independent line. caller: i just happened to finish an article entitled "america under martial law." it basically goes on to state the central banks are counting

on a popular uprising against the banks in order to enact martial law in this country. it goes on to state that an entrepreneur said u.s. citizens will be enslaved by the fiscal overlords, starting with the health care bill. it has more to do with controlling every aspect of the americans' lives than it does with american treatment. host: let me interrupt. we understand the direction of your article. does it reflect your point of view? caller: yes, i believe central

bank's barclay, all of criminals that need to bring down the middle class in order to run the government. as this man says, you cannot have a government after government -- whether it is a democrat or republican -- things keep getting worse. guest: basically, i do not agree with you. we have been a democracy over 200 years. we have had disagreements. with the exception of the civil war, we have resolved those conflicts within the democratic system. across the political spectrum, people were a mere freedom and liberty. we are going to argue about it. that is part of it. but believe me, the government is not full of a bunch of militants.

that is the last place in the world where you look for the origins of military takeover. host: you are critical of the health care bill. guest: yes, i have been. i do not think, given the state of the country's finances, that it was the right time. it makes an already bad situation worse. just to give you a few figures. looking at 2009, looking at the deficits that have been incurred, that are projected by the congressional budget office, $13 trillion. that is a lot of money, even for washington. our debt to gdp ratio rises from about 40% at the end of 2008 to

an estimated 90% in 2020, according to the calculations from the cbo. that is almost over the figures were at the end of world war ii. for the president to make his first priority a program that increases spending, even though in a technical sense, it pays for itself through other spending cuts and tax increases, seems to be irresponsible. those spending cuts and tax increases that are projected to cover the deficit, the cost of the program will not, in reality, occur. they will be repealed or modified by congress. the second issue is we are facing nearly $13 trillion of debt in that time.

if they can of hot $13 trillion in spending cuts and tax increases, let us apply that to the existing debt before we have new spending. that was my fundamental problem. host: lafayette, louisiana. dexter on the democrat line. caller: i agree with one thing, people are not ready for change when change comes i am optimistic about the economy, however. i want to say, what mr. obama is doing, in terms of going back and drilling, that is going to put people back to work. less people on unemployment. getting rid of our dependence on

foreign oil, that money will be reinvested into the clean energy act. now i hear that this is 10 years of drilling for one year of oil. but that is 10 years of the jobs that people will have. all of this money could be reinvested. people need to stop compared to the government to their everyday jobs. the corporation can make a change in one day. government is a process. when the healthcare bill takes effect in four years, more people will be covered. we will not have to pick up the cost of the people that go to the emergency room without insurance. the real deficit is in entitlement spending. guest: i agree with you, up to

the point. i did not mean to imply an earlier that i was pessimistic, that the economy was not going to recover. it is in recovery, it is slow, but we could be making the situation worse than it needs to be. but i do think the economy is recovering. i happen to support the president's announcement yesterday of increased oil and gas drilling off the coast. i wish it had come earlier. in will be some years before this pays dividends, but it will reduce -- not eliminate -- our dependence on foreign oil. it will create some jobs, perhaps tens of thousands. it will, to some extent, reduce our trade deficit and stimulate investment in the country.

all of that is good. host: "stocks scored best quarter in 12 years." this is the headline in the " wall street journal." -- "usa today." guest: i would say that most people agree with that comment. it is great when the stock market goes up. certainly better to have it go up and then go down. but if you try to come under the future of the markets based on past movement, -- it is an economic barometer, but it is also psychological. it tends to be moved by the emotions. you have large declines, substantial rebound. we had a bubble at the end of

the 1990's. even in 2008, when the current financial crisis was beginning to unfold, the stock market was reasonably optimistic about the future. it was not until the collapse of lehman brothers that the market really plunged. the market, i would say, is not a great forecaster for the future. host: so what are some of the good predictors? guest: in is a cliche, but it is very hard to predict. back in the 1960's, when i started reporting, the economists had all these economic models and they felt like they could put in any statistic to run these databases to see what happened in the past

and then match up to what was happening in the present to predict the future. well, it turned out that the models were good if nothing changed, but they are terrible when there is a change. host: next phone call. caller: first of all, i am an admirer of yours for many years. i think you are a great columnist. i have been reading your column for about 30 years. i just want to say -- hello? guest: we are here. i appreciate it. caller: i wanted your opinion about the health care bill and the promises that were made over and over again about the fact that this will help the deficit. and i never believed those

numbers. i do not think anyone else does. why does the news media accept this as fact when everyone knows that they were just lies? guest: i am skeptical that this legislation will pay for itself. on the other hand, the cbo did score it with enough tax revenues and spending cuts to cover the increased cost of legislation. by law, the cbo must make their estimates based on what is in the bill, whether or not it thinks the provisions in the bill are realistic. the skepticism arises, not because the bill does not pay for itself on paper, the

skepticism arises because we wonder whether or not these provisions will actually occur in practice. cbo has, in its own to crack way, expressed a certain amount of -- technocratic way, expressed a certain amount of uncertainty. my question is whether or not this pays for itself internally. the government was facing massive deficits as far as the eye could see, escalating deabt -- roughly $13 trillion. rather than enacting new spending measures, which is what this bill is, it seems to me in the government's first obligation would be to pay for some of the spending that it already enacted in the past. that is something that the administration has not done. that is my fundamental objection.

host: indiana. tony on the independent line. caller: i have a couple of comments. i would like your input and opinion on something that quite frankly scares me. i would have never thought that, two years ago, i would be discussing economics, but it really affects the future of my son. you know we are absolutely in the a hole. we have an unfunded liabilities for seniors. our debt is owned by china and japan. so my question to you is, how does that affect policy, how bad do you think inflation will be? host: how old is your son? caller: he is flied.

guest: five. guest: i have children -- caller: five. guest: i have children who are in their 20's. i am not too optimistic about their economic situation. the government had promised people more benefits than people are willing to pay for in taxes. that is the fundamental source of our deficit. at some point, taxes will have to go up and benefits will have to go down. the prime candidate for benefits going down our seniors and retirees. if you take social security, medicare, and medicaid, providing income support to those over 63, medicare provides health insurance, medicare provide long-term care -- those three programs themselves represent more than 40% of the

budget, taking on some special items. those items are growing because the baby boomers are about to retire and health costs, so far, are not controlled. either we are going to bring those costs down, more taxes will have to go up. taxes were primarily paid by the working population, my children and your children. just because i am reasonably pessimistic about that situation does not believe -- mean that i believe we are going to become a poor society. whether or not living standards or disposable income of future generations will continue to go up as they have in the past, seems to me, to be an open question. host: in our discussion about what is a healthy economy, this

viwer tweets -- guest: certainly, as a society, we should be prudent. if everybody did nothing but state, there would be no economy at all. we have to spend to create jobs and what not. you want to have a healthy balance. i think the balance became unhealthy when the americans borrowed so much and let their savings go solo. we are trying to get back to a healthier balance. i do not want to see americans do in the chinese do where they save more than half of their income. that seems to me to be in the city for economic failure. host: hyattsville, maryland.

democratic line. caller: i have been reading your articles in the newspaper, and i have been impressed. recently, he said that you were against the health care debate. of was disappointed. my question is, how come you are not willing to give up your health care? you have a job, health care, but you want to deny someone else health care? host: what is your own health care situation? caller: i do not have any. i am self-employed.

what are all of these republicans fighting health care? they have had so many years to do something. they do not want to give anything to the people. guest: i am not against universal coverage, but we do that lived in a perfect world. the fundamental problem, in my view, of the health care system, is that cost in spending is of of control. that is one of the reasons why it is hard for many businesses to cover their workers, because health care has become unaffordable. and it has also become difficult for individuals to buy individual coverage. once we have that problem under control, then they can begin talking about expanding coverage. it is not that i am against

coverage. but in the real world, we have to make choices. i think the administration made the popular choice here, but on policy grounds, and in the long term interest of the country, was not the right choice. in my view, this health care plan will increase spending and costs more difficult to control. there are a number of provisions in there that alleged to control cost, but when you look at them, they are tokens, essentially. i hope i am wrong. host: vincent on the republican line. north carolina. caller: a lot of the bloated hyperbole coming from washington is due to the lack of people paying attention. i am not a conspiracy theorist, but the way i see this country,

it is on its knees. i believe in taking care of the people who cannot help themselves, but this country wants to give itself away. if you look at the pace that the administration is walking, it will fundamentally change in the country. a constitution is in the trends. everything that built this country -- we are moving in the opposite direction. we are going toward a socialist democracy. if you do not believe that, look at everything this government takes care of. medicare, medicaid, the postal service. everything is in the red. it is small business, independent people who have built this country. the middle class will be stumped -- stomped because of

this. people talk about running on repealed and replaced. i do not disagree that the health care system is in trouble, but in need to be addressed in incremental steps. if this country stays in the direction that we are in, we can say that we will be a european country. guest: i share some of your concerns, but i do not share where you end up, that we are somehow going to some of public -- apocalyptic collapse. we used to have a mixed economy -- perhaps once again -- where we had shared responsibility between the public and private sector. i do not think we are going to become a socialist slight -- society in the sense that the government owns the means of

production. often, the result in the political practice are not good, sometimes they are good. but i do not think we are about to sacrifice our freedom and liberty, even though, as a practical matter, there is a shared responsibility between the government and private sector. looking back, historically, -- perhaps more pessimistic than i feel -- looking back to the 1920's, the government was very small. spend less than 3% of our gross domestic product. after world war ii, the great depression, we emerged with a government that was much more larger with more

responsibilities. in some ways, but i agree, it is over-expanded, and we are being irresponsible by not paying for the promises that we made. however, despite the increase of government power and size, the american economy has generally performed well. we have been in times where we have not performed well, but the larger side of government has not yet been a huge drag on economic growth prosperity. maybe it will be in the future, it is hard to say. but we are very flexible and adaptable, as a society. there are underlying strengths in the economy and society that we tend to underestimate. host: he reference to the postal system. our next guest is the chairman of the postal regulatory

commission, talking about cutbacks to ensure a better economic future. pensacola, florida. john on the independent line. caller: i completely agree with the previous caller. last week, we've received some tremendous insight into the motivation of the health care bill. there was a comment made by representative john dingell who stated after the legislation was passed, -- the legislation needed to be passed in order to control the people. no one is picking up on this and i want to know why. guest: i did not see that comment, i do not know what he meant by it, or the context. i really cannot comment on it. all i can say is, there are an awful lot of people in washington who have a lot to say all the time.

it news channels and cable channels tried to report in all, it would be impossible. if i knew the context of that comment, i might be able to reach a judgment on whether it is worth reporting on or not, but i am not aware of it. host: you worked at the "washington post" in 1970. are members of the public well served by reporting, and generally, in this country? guest: there is always room for improvement. when i started at "the washington post" the business page was a small shadow of what the economic and business coverage is today. we had only about 10 people.

lately, i checked, they had 80 people. perhaps a less because of the economy. is the public well served? they are as well serve as you could be in a world where you can say today what will happen tomorrow. newspapers, magazines, cable tv, radio, blogosphere, we all exaggerate, we all miss stories. but the quantity and quality of business and economics coverage is much better than when i started. host: port huron, michigan. dennis on the democrat line. caller: i am pretty exasperated. i wonder why in the t beggars, and obama haters are treating

the president differently. president bush ran in a "recession." he then initiated two wars and tax cuts for the rich. there were no t bed protesters anywhere -- teabag protesters anywhere. i wonder why the media outlets, these conservative people talking about socialism, when most of them lived in the south which depend on government contracts and do not pay their fair share of the taxes in the country because they are subsidized states. all you have to do is go on line. virginia, georgia, alabama -- all these places where the people are denigrating everything that president obama

is trying to do. $9 billion trigger a money in baghdad this appears. there were no teabag protests about that. guest: regardless of how you feel about the president, it seems to me there was an awful lot of critical coverage of president bush when he was president, just as there is of president obama to date. that is the nature of our system. i would not want in any other way. i am not an expert on the tea party movement, but one difference between president bush and now is we are just coming out of an awful recession. you are bound to get a reaction

from the public when times are this bad. i would put part of that down to the severity of the economic decline. host: last phone call from washington, d.c. richard. caller: i wonder if you could segue from diplomatic to domestic and national security implications. what do you think about us zero wings so much to the chinese -- us owing so much to the chinese? also, our great debt to the oil- producing states of the world. will this not have serious national security implications in the future? guest: i am more worried about the under-evaluation of the

chinese currency which gives them rise in their currency in the trade process. in part, their exports are competitively-advantage by their artificially low currency, and they have to invest that in something. that just increases the amount of american dollars that they buy. that is the fundamental source of economic stability in the world, it seems to me, and we ought to be looking at that, not the sheer amount of debt that the chinese have to. what are they going to do with him? if they try to destabilize the world economy by selling all their debt, it would hurt them perhaps as much, if not more, then it would hurt us. host: thank you.

always nice to have you at the table. we will be right back. we are going to get a news update. then we will be speaking to ruth goldway, the chairman of the postal regulatory commission. >> let us meet another winner in the studentcam competition. we asked students to tell us about one of the country's greatest strengths or challenges the country is facing. today we speak to this bill, and eighth grader in california. isabel, good to see you. >> thank you for having me. >> what made you want to choose unemployment as the topic for your documentary? >> the unemployment right now is one of the biggest challenges, not only in america, but worldwide. i see how people are losing

their jobs, and i think to myself, do people know how big of an issue this is? i wanted to send a message to say that this is huge, it is getting worse, and it is time to start doing something about it. >> how has unemployment affected your community? >> it has been pretty bad here. our school district had budget cuts last year. we have been getting things cut off, have been seeing limits. also, my mother works in a hotel. they are laying people off every day. i just thought, this is big. >> you talk about a lot of different job industries. where did you see job losses, where did you see creation? >> construction -- they have

been laying off all of people. the same thing for the auto industry. on a brighter note, restaurants, medical care, they have been adding jobs. >> unemployment, has it affected anyone you know personally? >> yes, my aunt was laid off for awhile. i saw how much of a struggle that was for her. another one of my family members was having trouble, and he has family to support. >> what did you learn from working on this documentary? >> i learned this is a big issue. i learned things that i did not know before about unemployment.

i thought it was bad before, but i did not know how big. when i was looking through my information, i was so surprised. i cannot believe how big this is. i thought it was time to refocus our situation. >> what advice do you have for anyone struggling with unemployment right now? >> start looking at your options, see how long your financial resources will last. contact an employment office and see if you qualify for unemployment benefit. most importantly, keep a positive attitude. i know it is a struggle, you are angry, but if you get depressed, really mad, it will only make things worse. >> thank you for talking to us today. congratulations. >> thank you very much.

>> now let's watch a portion of her video. >> construction lost 52,000 jobs. job losses were focused on non- residential, specialty, trade, and heavy construction. manufacturers lost 61,000 jobs. professional and business services shed 61,000 jobs. but some continue to employ. >> we are seasonal, so we are just hiring people for the season. >> on a brighter note, healthcare added 2900 jobs in october. >> you can watch her and the rest of the winning entries at studentcam.org. host: let me introduce you to ruth goldway, chairman of the postal regulatory system. thank you for being here.

explain to us, what is the authority of the postal regulatory commission? >> it is the oversight regulatory agency that oversees the postal service. the postal service is a wholly owned government enterprise, but it functions independently of the government, so when the law was established to create its independence, law also created a regulatory oversight commission. our job is to ensure the postal service, while that operates, also provides a universal service at a fair and efficient rate for everyone in the country. host: i would imagine that everyone watching now has heard the news that the postal service is anticipating ending saturday delivery in order to cut costs. it has been described as one of the most far reaching decisions that the postal service has had to make.

could you explain why? guest: it is not a decision, the public needs to understand this. the postal service is requesting a change in its service. under the law, the postal service now have to provide service six days a week. in order to change that, i have to come to the postal regulatory commission to see if it still needs the universal standards obligation and then we will give them an opinion on whether or not it is the right thing to do. in addition, they have to make their case to congress, to see if they agree that it will be okay to reduce their service. what is happening now is beginning the process of considering this proposal, then the german bank if the postal service should reduce service. it is not a done deal. host: how will the decision be made, and by whom?

guest: it is a multipronged process. the postal regulatory commission will hold a series of meetings across the country, do research and analysis, and we will make our proposal to the postal service on the best way we believe the best way for them to proceed is. in addition, congress will be looking at our analysis as it talks to the postal service, and the two of us -- perhaps at different times but in court nation -- will make the decision on whether or not they should proceed with reducing service, and to what degree. they have come forward with a specific plan to reduce service on saturdays throughout the year. there are some kind of people who are saying, just reduce it 12 days a year. other people wonder, why not wednesday? we will be looking at different options and impacts on the

postal service and on the economy, community that the postal service serves. if we think they should not cut saturday service, then the postal service will have to look at other ways. host: we will be hearing from many people through the phone lines, e-mail, and twitter. guest: i appreciate that. host: a wanted to show this headline in "the washington post" -- it's just hearing that the postmaster general told employees --

does the headline shows the problems of the full-service is facing today? guest: no question, the function of the mail is changing. digital communication has become very important all of us, but it is true that the role of the hard copy mail is essential in some areas. when it comes to things like packages, pharmaceutical and drugs that have to be delivered to senior citizens in a timely fashion, high-tech, high touch communication, hard copy is important. i believe there is a role for it, and it may be hindered if we remove saturday service. one of the reasons it is difficult to communicate among government agencies is because

of the anthrax scare that occurred some many years ago, which we continue to try to prevent by delaying mail within the government system. host: i want to tell you a bit about her biography first. she has been distinguished position of being the longest holding position in her commission. she was twice reappointed by president bush in her permission. guest: you can see how much i like the postal world. host: let us begin with a phone call from the bronx. dee on the democrat line. caller: good morning. god bless you all. i have a comment. she is right on the money in

terms of saturday delivery. a lot of senior citizens do not have access to the internet and are not computer aware. it would be detrimental to them and the rest of the country, i believe, especially in rural areas. guest: i think you have some arguments. polls seem to indicate, in general, if people are willing to give up saturday service, they seem to be willing to do that. in fact, that was also true back in 1977. the public is basically flexible about delivery, but there are segments of society who really depend on it. one thing that we will have to

parse out in this process is how dependent senior citizens are, people who do not have access to the internet, people who work all week and need saturday service. what is the size of the impact on them before we balance the needs of the postal service? host: tucson. this is fritz. guest: imf letter carrier here in tucson. people do not realize that the male moves 24 hours a day, seven days a week. if you canceled saturday delivery, every monday would be like the day after a holiday, in terms of volume. over time for monday, tuesday, wednesday, probably for the carriers. host: before you go, since you are in a career professional in the postal service, you know

there are economic challenges. what would your answer be? guest: well, if we address the pre funding for retirement benefits, which no other government agency has to do, according to literature i have read, that could pay for all of our debts and then some. guest: yes, letter carrier -- the major problem that the service is facing is not the cost for saturday delivery. it is the burden of providing a prepaid health care fund of $5.5 billion each year. in legislation passed in 2006, the post service is required to refund its health-care retiree benefits. no other government agency does that and very few private sector

companies do. for the past three years, they have been putting $5.5 billion into a fund, and while they are doing that, they are reducing their own ability to function. if congress can work with the postal sector to eliminate or alleviate that health care retiree benefit fund, that would go a long way to help the postal service in its difficulties. i think all of us in the community think that that is the first area in which we should hope -- help the postal service. with regard to the savings for saturday delivery, that is one of the things we are going to investigate carefully will of

the postal service save the $3 billion that it says it will by eliminating saturday service? if they wind up having extra costs on monday to deliver the mail that they would have on time today, maybe the bill not save as much money as they think they would have. if people choose not to mail at all because saturday is less important, they will lose money because they will not have as much volume, in terms of revenue. there are impacts potentially to savings at the postal regulatory commission will be looking at, and we will report back to congress to say that yes, they can save $3 billion, maybe they cannot. maybe they can say only $1 billion. is it worth it to disrupt the pattern of services that we have had over the last past century? host: next is atlanta.

sam on the republican line. caller: i think we have two problems. a lot of the mailers are targeted for the weekend, so that would cut down on business. the other problem is union contracts, retirees. whether they are pre funded or not, it does not matter. you are obligated. you are going to have to declare bankruptcy and give less generous benefits. otherwise, you are going to continue to lose money. you are in a declining industry. guest: well, the postal service has already pre funded its retirement benefits. the question is whether or not

they have over-funded the benefits. the question is the health care returning benefit. you are right, the postal service, because these are government employees, the government is obligated to pay for that. at the moment, the fund is estimated to cover about 35% of the cost of health care retiree benefits. that is as much as most private companies carry, the few that do carry return the benefits. so is not as if the postal service is being irresponsible about the future of its health care regarding benefits, but it does need some relief, provisions when the economy has really gone down, for it to be able to make some belief, in order to survive. yes, it is an industry that is changing. likely, volume will decline, but

as we saw with the innovations with netflix, a product that had not existed 10 years ago, there will be products and services that require hard copy delivery. we want to make sure that that system is in place for everyone who needs it. host: raleigh, north carolina. john . caller: i work for a corporation that is heavily unionized can we make quite a bit of profit competing against a non-union company and we are not often done by the government. why is the postal service competing against two private enterprise businesses that make profits? guest: the postal service is a

government agency that was enshrined in the constitution. it was one of the major responsibilities of government to provide post offices. the postal service has been providing service, in one form on not -- or another, since the founding of the country. the package services that came up that has competed with the postal service -- and they have done a good job -- but the faithful -- postal service provides a basic service for every day services and other deliveries. sure, the private sector should be delivering things, doing it really well, but there is a basic service that need to be provided by government think of it as a communications network. you have to make sure that in some way or another, they are

provided, and the postal service is that measure of provision, but it does not interfere with the private sector. fedex and ups work with the postal service and they have figured out that it is more efficient for the postal service to deliver smaller packages to peoples' home, and that last mile of delivery. they do this to expand fast delivery around the country with lots of business cargo. products have grown together. in this day of the internet, where more and more people are ordering online, the coordination of these companies to deliver packages cooperatively is something that everyone believes is going to grow. that is the growth part of the talking about. host: does the postal service commission approve of the operating budget? guest: no, we operate on our

own. in the old days, we used to specifically regulate their rates to ensure that they cover their costs. now we look at it after the fact. after every fiscal year, we make sure that its operations are sound and the rates that they are changing our fair -- are fair. this past week, unfortunately, we have found that the situation for the postal service is grim. without relief in regards to the health care retirement that of the funds, some adjustments in the way that it set rates and develops products, the postal service is in trouble, no question. host: austin, texas. vince on the republican line.

caller: good morning. host: please turn down the volume on your television set. caller: i was wondering if you were going to do more internet sales, train and mentor new people to the postal service? guest: that is a good question. the postal service has announced that it will try hybrid mail, which is creating a product of digital communication and hard copy connecting with one another. i think there is a great deal of promise in that, and i believe they probably need to bring some people in from the outside to do that, to help them develop those products.

with all the complaints that people have, you have to understand the largest postal service in the world, half of the world's mail, is delivered in this country. it is still a 170 billion peace industry. it is enormously efficient. -- 170-billion-ps industrpiece . host: is this sort of an idea like their western union telegram, we're there would be an electronic message but hand deliver? guest: it might be something that you can trace. it might be something where you can print a flyer or pamphlet at one end. there are many different ways in which technology could work with

hard copy. the postal service is trying to develop some unique products in that regard. host: illinois. go on the democratic line. caller: good morning. while working for the u.s. postal service in 1986, i came up with a suggestion that was turned down that would have dropped postage in half. i was a temporary postmaster for two cities that have populations of less than 700. in four weeks, both postal services had only one customer. i was getting paid $47,000 a year basically to raise and lower applied. we take account of all of the post office is in areas with less than 4000 people, and you

figure out the cost of operating those services, paying those postmasters, as well as the benefits, you could reduce the cost of postage to 10 cents. one of a congressman responded to my idea and said that it is the only medium of communication that these places have. that is ridiculous. get rid of these post offices. both of these post offices or within 10 miles of populated cities of 14 belsen or more. why is the postal service subsidizing these post offices in the small cities that do not have any customers? it is ridiculous. guest: i think you raise a good point about the role of the postal service in america.

the constitution says we should have post offices. that is part of what the government should do. where they are located and what their service is is the question. not only deliver the mail, they create an identity for the community, a meeting point, a sense that there is a government that cares about me, no matter how far i am from urban areas of the country. the postal service is obligated, under its universal service obligation, to make sure that every part of the country is serviced. how expensive that is is up to the base. it is not dead nearly as expensive to maintain as you say, but it is a financial burden. the postal service has talked about reducing the number of those post offices.

it has, over time, reduced them somewhat. there are down to about 35,000 locations. there were closer to 37,000 a few years ago. congress specifically tells the postal service that it cannot close an office just for economic reasons. there has to be other reasons. congress has told the postal service at these offices, especially in rural areas, are important to maintain. if this was a private company, it would not have to provide those services, and probably, those people would feel isolated and not as much a part of the country as they would otherwise. the postal service gets a monopoly. no one else puts their letter in the mailbox.

so it gets in monopoly and some benefits in exchange for the obligation it has to provide those services in far-out lane places in the country. our job and congress's job is to balance those two requirements that the postal service functions under. try to help them be efficient, over all. our recommendations to the postal service board to help them to do their job better. we do not feel as if this is punitive, in any way.

guest: the economy is turning

around and some of these other losses, some of the efficiencies that the postal service is implementing out can be balanced out so that the postal service has a long and vibrant future. host: from michigan, doug on the independent line. caller: i would like to know why -- or maybe you could get rid of some of this drug mail. i've got three times as much junk mail as i get regular mail. a lot of the people, all they do is rabbit out of the mailbox and throw it in the trash. -- grab it out of the mailbox and throw it in the trash. guest: some of that mail does contribute to the operating bottom line of the postal service. some of it does quite substantially.

the problem that all of us have is your junk mail may not be my junk mail. i loved some of my catalogs, but others are do not care about. some people love their saturday flyers i tell them about the neighborhood bargains in the neighborhood stores. other people of the coupons they get in the mail. we cannot really distinguish. it does seem from the marketer's point of view -- what they tell us is that direct mail is the most effective way to advertise, in spite of the internet and in spite of the television or radio. when you get a hard copy piece of mail your response is going to be more positive than all of the other kinds of advertising. so, it works. as long as it works i think the businesses in the united states are born to want to use the mail.

most citizens in the united states are going to want to get it. it is a question and i think you will find the catalogs are very particular in reducing the number of catalogs that you get in the last couple of years. there is not as much waste in the system as there used to be. the recession is making everybody a bit more effective and efficient in what they put in the mail or how they use it. advertising is " -- still quite powerful and you will still see if in the industry. host: how many people work for the postal service? guest: there are about 600,000 employees and 10 years ago there were over 800,000. host: and the reduction by one day, whatever date it is, whether also be a reduction in force? guest: yes, and that is taken --

a controversial issue. the postal service thinks there will be at least 13,000 part- time positions, and i have heard of to 40,000 positions that will be lost. i think at the postal regulatory commission is going to look at this issue of the impact of job losses because when you lay people off on one side, or reduce the employment, the government has cross on the other side from that as well. a -- has cost on the other side from that as well. we're going to look at the trade-off between saving jobs and lower in the number of employees in the postal service so that they can save money. i wish that these issues were simpler, but they're always complicated and interdependent host: ruth goldway joins us and

we're pleased to have her on our show this morning. caller: i ran a direct mail business, mainly political. the best rate but i could get if i package everything correctly, marked everything to record, had absolutely correct addresses, it was not nearly close to the raid that a nonprofit could get for doing none of the preparation. mailing packages, i could take a 20 pound package and mail it to los angeles for $37. i could also mail it to samoa, guam, alaska, hawaii for $37. i could mail it to florida for a

given price. i could also naille to puerto rico or the caribbean -- i could also mailed it to puerto rico or the caribbean. host: mike, let's jump in here. ms. goldway? guest: i think you have raised a good point about the postal service, which is that it provides a uniform service and a uniform rate across the country. that is to by everyone together and to make sure that everyone has access. people live at the bottom of the grand canyon or in why your alaska or pr and we all want to be able to -- in hawaii or alaska or puerto rico and we all want to be able to access e-bay. the country has benefited from the postal service providing these uniform rates. the economy has benefited.

even if the postal service itself has not benefited from those rates that are available. i think the questions that the postal regulatory commission deal 1/4s -- deals with are not just the dollars a a and sense of whether it is going to break even, but whether postal service is meeting the country's social needs as well as its need to break even. it is not easy. with regard to your first question as far as presorting and bar coding and getting it into the system and my guess, you get discounts for it, but if you are a nonprofit agency, botox says you only have to pay 60% that a for-profit agency has to pay when you are mailing a doubt standard mail. that is something that congress decided was important.

-- when your mailing something standard mail. that is something that congress decided was important. what they do, these non-profit agencies, is so important in our society. it is up to congress to change that, but it is true that the postal service has to subsidize those rates. they also subsidize periodicals, newspapers and magazines, because it is important to have a free flow of ideas and for the mdot -- for the postal service to ensure that that happens. ben franklin was the father of the postal service and he was there to make sure the dog was written -- to make sure that was written. it is a vital role that the postal service plays in our

democracy. host: how many members does the postal service have? guest: we have five members, all appointed by the president and on staggered terms? host: and what are the terms? guest: 60 years. -- six years. we have our own web page for more information about consumer access and we have a particular link to this issue of changing service from six to five days. and if people have comments or questions or information to share with us, we would rely to have it. we want to make the most aggressive effort we have made today to reach out to the public to get their input on this very important change that the postal service is proposing. we want all of the information we can get before we give them

our recommendation as to how we will proceed. host: and how is the commission funded? the commission guest: is funded -- gets its -- guest: the commission gets our operating funds, which are minuscule, through the postal service, but they are voted on by the congress. the congress could change the financial system if it wanted to. we have about 70 employees. and we have a budget of about $14 million. i think we work really hard to try to make every one of those dollars worth while to the american public. host: field, connecticut is next, tony, democrats line. caller: i like the post office. i would hate to see you eliminate saturday services. my checks usually come on friday

and sometimes it does not come on friday. it would be terrible to wait until monday, especially with the economy the way it is nowadays. i've got pretty of high phone bills. -- pretty high phone bills. i just want to say that you have a lot of traditions and you have been around since the 1800's. i would hate to see you go bankrupt or anything like that. also, if you have to -- i guess you guys will have to if you have to privatize and have contracts. some of the post offices are rural areas and maybe only one customer per day. maybe you could do that through

a private company and save some money that way. host: thanks. guest: we all have to be flexible. the world is changing faster than i certainly thought it would. we want to be flexible, but we want to walk on to our values. host: next call on the independent line. caller: my grandfather carried mail for 40 miles one way and he came back on horseback. this was in the 1920's on the navajo reservation. i would like to ask, please do not do away with those small post offices or small

communities because that is the only way to get their mail. mail is not delivered to their momhomes. the people come to get their mail and my family has to go a 30 mile trip one way to get their mail. i surely hope you keep that in mind. my love and blessings to the troops. thank you very much. host: a snapshot of a kind of commentary that you are going to be hearing as you set up public opinion on the postal service plans. guest: i think so. host: if people are interested, how much time is the comment section open? guest: we have opened it as of yesterday and on april 27 we will have an announcement of what the full agenda of the hearing process will be. there will be an opportunity for

people to participate in formally -- informally or formally as participants through the internet. we will accept comments on april 27. we will tell you exactly what the format will be. we expect the process to last about six months, maybe longer. we will also be travelling to cities around the country. so far, chicago, dallas, las vegas are on our list. maybe sacramento and we will be building up others. people can come and meet us and present their firsthand experiences about the postal service and how important saturday delivery is, or how willing they are to live without saturday. we'll be hearing both sides of that story and i am sure all along the way we will be hearing the kind of testimony that we heard from the last malar about

how important postal service is to the country -- the last mailer about arm for the postal service is to the country. -- how important the postal service is to the country. host: thank you for being a part of the process. i'm sure our callers appreciate it. we appreciate ruth goldway being with us. and we will move to our next topic. the we will be learning about the $2 billion that president obama has promised to community colleges as a way to help people retrain in the economy. we will be back with david baime. >> it is 9:16 a.m. here in washington. president obama travel to maine today, the second in a serious -- in a series of health care events. the first was in iowa last week.

the events will be held regularly through the end of the year. tonight, the president stops in boston for two democratic national committee fund-raisers before returning to washington. timothy geithner was speaking earlier today on nbc's a a "today show." setzer -- secretary geithner said he does believe things are turning up, buand that the econy is going to start creating jobs again. jenna nepolitano also on the road to -- janet nepolitano is also on the road this week. the president has already declared most of world violent a disaster area, which makes it of jiabao for -- most of rhode island a disaster area, which makes it eligible for assistance. and the pentagon is spending

millions of dollars on equipment and training for its smaller partner nations in the afghan war. this in the hopes of encouraging some countries not to abandon the conflict. it is part of a $350 million program designed to improve counter-terrorism operations of u.s. allies. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> this weekend, john dean is our besguest. we will take your phone calls, e-mails and tweet sunday live at noon eastern on c-span2's book tv. >> "washington journal" continues. host: david baime is the senior vice president of the american association of community colleges. we want to learn more about president obama's planned to

give $2 billion to community colleges in the coming years. how will it work? guest: good morning, and thank you for having me on c-span, susan. the program does, as you say, provide $2 billion to community colleges for the training of workers who are qualified under the assistance act for our training assistance. it will develop and enhance programs that will help the people who are most at a disadvantage right now -- most disadvantaged right now. host: a lot of people want to know how well the money will be spent. guest: the administration has been tough on us in asking us to be very transparent about our use of federal funds, the department of labor in particular. it is a competitive grant

program. institutions will have to compete to show that they can use that money in a way that will make a difference in people's lives. there will be extensive reporting requirements and all of the information that colleges have to provide will be open and available to the public. host: how many community colleges are there in the country? there are guest: about 1200 community colleges. -- guest: about 1200 community colleges. most are private, but there are some public community colleges as well. host: how is it seen that community colleges can help with retraining american workers with the changes in the economy? guest: let me back up a little bit to say that the funding that was provided in the legislation signed by the president on tuesday is an outgrowth of an initiative called the american graduation initiative that

president obama proposed last july. it was designed to provide a large amount of funding to community colleges to get more students graduating. there is thought to be a great need across all of higher education, but particularly community colleges, to get more students receiving those diplomas and credentials. the funding that was provided in this legislation is a component, or an aspect, of the american graduation. this money specifically is designed, again, to help people who have taken in? because of the economy, people who are out of work or -- to have taken a knock because of the economy, or out of work and looking for jobs. it will target the jobs and skills that employers most need. it will insure that there is a

direct connection between the program offerings and the opportunities for employment in local communities. dr. host: jill biden teaches at a community college -- host: dr. joe biden teaches at a community college. but listen to her comments. >> by buttu lee trolled about this for trinity colleges across the country so that more students can get the skills and technology that they need to succeed. i have seen firsthand the power of community colleges to change lives and serve as a gateway to opportunity for students in all stages of their lives and careers. this bill increases investment in community colleges around the country to help these institutions do what they do best. they prepare our students for the work force of today and

tomorrow. host: david baime represents a community colleges. is there agreement on what those technical skills the quite -- look like it or does it change from region to region? guest: remark it does vary quite a bit from region to region, and it is one of the challenges -- the labor market doesn't vary quite a bit from region to region, and it is one of the challenge -- does vary from region to region. one of the sad aspects of the economy right now is for all of the real hardships that people are suffering in being out of work, it is that even at this time employers cannot find skilled work force. the community colleges are scanning their environment to figure are exactly at the moment what business most needs.

one thing is to say to an employer that is thinking of locating in the area that we will provide training of the workers free of charge to you. north carolina has done this most famously. south carolina has done this as well. an employer can be sure to get the kind of workers they need to produce whatever it is that their businesses. host: the partnership would be with the governor's office. located in this state would be the message to the company. -- locate in this state would be the message to the company. we want to hear from you, particularly those that have at a community college experience -- that have had a committee college experience. those that are unemployed right now, do you see this as a way to retrain?

that's begin with jeffrey from the legs go on the republican line. caller: do you think besthis shd have been in the health care bill at all? i do not see what this has to do with health care. and number two, there are a couple of things that i do not like about it, like the racist policy of the tanning beds and demanding that we have to purchase something the first time. are there strings attached to the money to the community colleges, do you have to be a liberal in order to get these funds? guest: what he is asking about this -- and referring to -- is the fact that despite the fact that the health care bill, and of course, there were two health care bills passed into law. despite the fact that the health care bill got a great deal of attention to students will be

helped tremendously by this bill. the biggest investment of this legislation makes is in the pell grant funding and helping the neediest students. that is the important thing that was done in this education bill. congress often times packages legislation to gather in all sorts of ways that might not make a lot of sense -- to gather in a lot of ways that might not make a lot of sense. -- together in a way that might not make a lot of sense. there was this piece that the caller was referring to. there is no policy connection. there is no substantive connection. there is no real relationship other than the bundling that was done of the health care bill to the education bill. we know that people have different opinions about the health care legislation. my organization does not have a

physician overawe on that bill. the education aspect of the -- does not have a position overall on that bill. the education aspect is what we focus on. it has helped a of hispanic serving institutions. and there's certainly no strings attached. the grant program is a competitive grant program. our colleges are going to have to prove to the federal government that the programs for which they receive funding are valuable ones. host: our students at community colleges able to receive pell grants? guest: yes, in fact, almost 3 million students next year will receive federal pell grants. the maximum that will start in july will be $5,550 and the average trichology commission is less than that, so it goes a long way to pay not just tuition and books and related expenses, but a little bit of

transportation and other expenses. host: 4 year colleges have had challenges with tuition increases. what is the record for community colleges regarding tuition increases? guest: in the last 10 years i am pleased to report the committee colleges have had the lowest tuition increases of any sector of higher education. of course, the highest increases have been the public for your colleges. let me add to that that -- four- year colleges. let me add to that, out what drives these costs is not how well the institution is doing but how much financing the received. almost 60% of their revenue is from state and local resources. state colleges receive over 50% from state sources. when that funding goes down, institutions can cut funding,

layoff faculty, not provide various student services, but eventually they will be forced to raise tuition. in this environment where institutions, have seen their budgets reduced. -- where institutions, i have seen their budgets reduced, just about everyone has had to raise tuition rates. host: next call at is from louisville. caller: i am a graduate of a community college in los angeles. i'm 43 years old now, so that was over 20 years ago. i'm in health care, and that has been my career ever since. it has been a wonderful experience. my experience at community college was extraordinary. i think community colleges -- i know community colleges are extraordinarily important to this country. i would even say that $2 billion is not enough. but you know, it is absolutely better than nothing.

as far as the last caller was saying, how does this have anything to do with health care, most people do not realize that health-care workers get their education at trinity college -- community colleges, paramedics and others who work at hospitals. if there were not committee colleges, many of the people who take care of you when you are sick and dying would not be there. as far as health care is concerned, community colleges are absolutely important. guest: first call i'm glad you had a positive experience at the committee -- first, i'm glad you had a positive experience at the community college and i've glad you raised the point about health care. one thing that many people do not understand is that many of the health occupations, the people who receive those jobs

receive their education at trinity colleges, even if that was just the first portion of their a ticket -- community colleges, even if that was just the first portion of their education. as many of the viewers know, we have a nursing shortage, a severe one in this country. our colleges play a critical role in providing those nurses for the health care work force. host: david baime of the american association of community colleges. plymouth, occurred on the line. what is your question about -- kurt on the line. the orders your question about community colleges? caller: the problem i have with it is that this money is not coming from the federal government. it is coming from saudi arabia or china. and it will also be paid back by

the taxpayer with interest. what i do not understand is that this congress, this administration has no idea what "we are broke" means. time for fiscal responsibility. time to get our people back to work and stop throwing money away. host: david baime? guest: i think all the viewers know that this government has a very large debt and it has a deficit that has reached historic proportions. it is a problem that we all know needs to be addressed. it is my personal opinion that it needs to be addressed by republicans and democrats and independents and each of these parties are born to have to sacrifice a little bit in terms of their historic -- going to have to sacrifice a little bit in terms of their historic interest that they have championed. having said that, when you look at the return that students get

by obtaining the college degree -- and that is one of the reasons the president obama propose the american graduation in initiative -- when you look at the economic return when a person graduates, you get $7,000 more every year than if you just had a high school diploma. from our point of view, we can be reducing the deficit rather than expanding or adding to it. host: next is a call from hamilton, ohio, ryan on the democrats line. caller: good morning to both of you. i want to stay small comment and then ask you a question. first, after the great depression america went into debt and as a fifth generation grandson, help pay that debt off every day. the government is a social

entity of this country even though we are not a socialist country. therefore, i feel -- and i'm wondering if he would concur -- that the government should not be allowed to randomly cut domestic spending. if they are going to cut, it should be from overseas spending or other forms. if our taxpayer money that we're supposed to pay back and our grandchildren are supposed to pay back should be put toward investment toward our grandchildren. it is alright to pay it back if they get something out of it. just like my grandfather went into debt to make sure that my family could go to college when he knew that he would never go to college. he went into debt and bought land and worked so his next generation could pay that back, and prosper. i hope people to get the message. we need to move forward.

our next generation is supposed to take care of what we do for them now. that is all i have really got to say. host: will move on to a call from bettendorf, iowa. this is helen on the republican line. caller: good morning, i look at these children coming out of the educational system and they come out with up to $40,000 in debt and sometimes higher. i cannot see that it is beneficial to america. we are putting billions of dollars into the school system and we speak about pell grants, but who is getting them? if we have pell grants, why are they in the debt up to $40,000 by the time they get out of college? host: is talking about four-year colleges. -- she is talking about four-

year colleges. can you talk about your own experience? guest: what she brings up is of enormous concern to campuses across the country. the caller is also right that the pell grant funding, as much as it has been increased and as generous as it is, it does not pay a person's entire way and, particularly through a four-year colleges. one of the things that the government has tried to do to -- is to make it easier for graduates to pay their debts. on tuesday, the president signed legislation to limit the debt and individual has after they graduate from college if they are repaying their loans. there also a variety of

repayment options -- there are also a variety of repayment options designed to make it a little bit easier. the answer has to be, in part, called the community colleges and four-year colleges as well, we have tuition, but we have to do everything in our power to keep those tuition's down. host: can you tell us about the first community colleges? guest: the first one was created in 1901. most of those colleges at that point or two-year private colleges, not the public colleges we talk about when we think of community colleges. the modern community college movement really began after world war ii and the commission created by president truman called the truman commission. it issued a report about the need for america to educate far more of its population than it

had previously done. this was out of the second world war and men and women needed to get an education in order to get on with their lives. this truman commission report, which is a bellwether for the community colleges was the beginning of the concept of the community college where not only was there talk about opening access to a broader base of the population that we had ever done before, but ensuring that these institutions were locally controlled. they had a responsiveness to their economy, their local cultures, their communities and meeting their workforce needs and some of their other social needs. it really grew out of that. what you saw a succeeding that, really not until the 1960's, community colleges absolutely taking off, growing by -- the

biggest decade of expansion with the 1960's, but we went from just a couple of comedic colleges after the second world war two now -- a couple of hundred community colleges -- just a couple of community colleges after the seven world war two now 1200. -- after the second world war to now 1200. host: next call from ohio. caller: i'm really excited to see that the president is moving forward with this type of initiative. i come from corporate america. it is always exciting to see people that are trying to retrain and get their lives back on track. i applaud you for your efforts and what you do with your association. my question is, will there be any type of monitoring of the competitive grants related to

the curriculum that will be developed in these colleges? host: what are you teaching? caller: i teach international business and i teach management courses. host: this is the first time you have taught? caller: i have taught before -- you mean talked on c-span? host: the first time you have taught in a classroom. caller: i have talked for over 14 years. host: at jug professors, when they have come to the classroom -- you have a lot of experience now, but how are they taught to teach? caller: that is a good question. you actually have to spend time with your chair and uridine, who will actually walk you through your -- and your dean, who will walk you through your lesson

plans. they will teach you ways to encourage your students to actually think. you know, for them to actually be a plot -- to apply the teaching -- to apply the teaching methodologies that they can use. guest: first, let me say that the caller is one of many who have either worked in a business or currently employed by business who teach on our campuses. that relates to the comment i made earlier about the fact that the community colleges strive to make sure that the technical programs that they offer an career programs that the offer are relevant and provide students with the latest, said of the art curriculum and equipment for their programs -- state of the art curriculum and equipment for their programs. he is someone who knows what he is talking about when he do --

when he educates people about international business. in terms of the grants that would be provided through the legislation that the president just signed, they would be competitive grants and there would be guidelines that will be published in the coming months by the department of labor. host: what is the point of it coming out of the labor department has opposed to the education department? guest: that is a good question because originally, it was designed to be a department of education program as well as a department of labour program, jointly administered. that is this american graduation asia -- initiative that i mentioned. there were some complicated politics and policy issues the resulted in the funding of community colleges trudi committee -- through the community colleges and career training program. the original vision of the president was for both the labor

department and the agitation apartment to be administering this -- and the education department to be administering this program jointly. we don't expect that the department of education will expecforget about us. the interest that this administration has shown in our institutions will probably be continuing. of course, i will be reflected in programmatic support for our members. host: from texas, george of the democrats line. caller: i have a question for your guests, and a comment. i will start out with the comic relief quickly. i started out at a committee college and now i am a graduate student. from programs and government aid, it has helped me. -- pell grants and government aid, it has helped me. people keep complaining about the debt load that obama is

putting on my generation and my children's generationf]p. where were they during reagan? where were they during h.w? the only president in my whole lifetime that ever came close to balancing the budget is clinton. i do not understand what these people are talking about. my question for your guest is that you said 50% of nurses go to community college. i guess i could look it up on the internet, but could you tell me -- i thoughand bought it lv's went to community college and nurses went to four stars year colleges. -- a a four-year colleges. guest: registered nurses -- the

state's examination that is required for them to be able to practice as a nurse in a clinical setting a season pass rates that are even better by security college graduates than by a four-year programs. let me offer an anecdote about that. there have been some differences of opinion on this nursing issue on whether or not commune the college graduates should receive the -- community college graduates should receive the rn status when they leave. i asked a friend about knowing where they are educated. he said he knew that some were educated at a community college and some were at a a four-year college, but as far as he was

concerned, there was no difference in how they do their jobs. host: illinois, on the republican line. caller: my question is, and i've asked several people about this but i do not get an answer -- maybe toregas knows the answer. -- maybe your guest knows the answer. i wonder where abraham lincoln got his college degree and his law school degree. does anyone know the answer? host: do you know the answer? i do if you do not. abraham lincoln? -- did not go to college. nor did he go to law school. he had to climb through the window of the school to get to the platform and made a quick, now i've gone through college -- and made the quip, now

i've gone through college. apache junction, ariz., bill, independent line. we're moving from history to community colleges. hello, bill? let's move on to flint, mich., chris, democrats line. caller: my question for you and for the general public, and you think the greatest generation, the world war ii generation, would have been as great how did not been for the gi bill and community colleges -- had it not been for the gi bill and community colleges in educating them to make our entire society more productive? i myself am a graduate from community college and i went

there in cooperation with a trade union for trade school. that is my question, thank you. guest: i think the way i would answer that is to say that america did a wonderful thing in provided the g. daigle. -- the gi bill. and community colleges have been associated with veterans and offering veterans programs and serving them for many years. the gi bill was one of the things that made american the most educated done -- country in the world. of course, we had the strongest economy in the world and we were the largest economy in the world. one of the things that excite committee colleges about the attention the president is giving them -- and let me also say that president clinton and president bush, the last president bush, both havhad

contributions to community colleges. but what president obama is focusing on and has challenged our colleges to participate in is making america the most educated country once again. we are about 11 or 12 internationally in terms of the percentage of our population that has obtained an education. these investments in our colleges and the pell grant program and other student aid programs are designed to help us retain -- regained about number one position. -- regain the no. 1 position. host: next call from arizona. caller: i came out of the service in 1978 after vietnam and i went to college on the gi

bill in buffalo, new york. i sent two stepdaughters through college. basically, on the same thing. one thing nobody is talking about is community colleges, i guess, are considered the lower end of colleges, but it is also the easiest place to change over a profession. i had to go from being a sailor for 10 years to a federal police officer. when i got into my program, i found out that i was the only one that actually had a degree because i went to a two-year community college. some the i would also like to explain that i heard from another caller -- something i would also like to explain that i heard from another caller, my stepdaughter is a registered nurseçñçwm/>jçkç+n. yes, they can graduate from a community college as an lbo and,

but after have two more years -- and lvn, they have to have two more years to be registered nurse. guest: opposed 9/11 iraq and afghanistan veterans bill -- the post-9/11 iraq and afghanistan veterans bill that was past three years ago is in the process of providing a much higher level of benefits for veterans of these conflicts, as well as reserve members who were called up. it also enables them to transfer their benefits to their children so that their children have an opportunity if they, themselves cannot use or do not want to use their educational benefits. many colleges, community colleges, but four-year colleges as well, have positioned

themselves to help the veterans to use these benefits. host: tennessee, republican line. caller: obama has cut 30,000 fingers out of business. he has put 11,000 sallie mae employees out of business by nationalizing student loans. you had a seminar around the first of the year of the historic black colleges, and the woman said, do not forget to thank administration for giving us the pell grant money. and these kids who thought it was the cool thing to vote for obama, they're going to be the ones who are paying because the interest rates are going to go up. host: thank you, and let's get a response on the changeover and the student loan program. guest: what the caller is referring to is that the safra

legislation that the president has signed into law removes banks and other lenders from the student loan program. after this legislation takes effect, there will only be the direct loan program in which the federal government provides loan capital and the schools make loans to students rather than having banks do that. in the process of doing that, the government saves money because the government and access capital cheaper than the banks can. banks also have to make a profit. by ending the private-based program, the congress was able to use those savings to fund the programs -- the programs, money for community colleges, funding for hispanic institutions. but we have seen a change from the private sector having an involvement. but keep in mind, the private

sector was being paid by the government to make those loans. they can still make any loan they want to any college student. they just will not get a subsidy or a federal guarantee to do it. the last thing i want to say about that is for the students who may be listening, the terms and conditions for these loans, the interest rate that you pay, the length of time that you have to repay your loan, nothing will change by this legislation. your basic financing options will be exactly what they were before this bill was passed. host: mississippi, independent line. caller: i recently applied to go to community college and i found there were a lot of people ahead of me, like to get into the nursing program there even though i had a good act score. and there are people that graduate from those programs, they do not have the ability to keep up with the jobs.

how're you were to be sure that more money is going to actually -- how are you going to be sure that more money is one to actually create jobs instead of just long lines for the money? and our we going to be sure that it will not hurt people that are qualified but will be at back at the -- will be at the back of the line now? guest: nursing programs, probably above all others because they provide such wonderful career opportunities for individuals, do tend to have long lines, if you will, for people to get into those programs. but the -- because the options after receiving the education is so good. -- are so good. there are issues attracting instructors in committee

colleges, and also with clinical facilities in order to give students hands-on exposure to the actual practice of nursing. for all of those reasons, they are difficult programs to expand. we typically do have lines for those programs and it is an unfortunate thing, but it is primarily because of financing and some other things i touched upon. host: is this bill from connecticut? caller: yes, good morning. i would like to talk about textbooks. i went to a local community college and took an intermediate spanish course to brush up in anticipation of a triple. after i got -- in anticipation of a trip. after a drawback from the triboro as i really needed to take the course and -- after i got back from the trip, i realized i needed to take the course again. in looking at it, it was just a

rearrangement of chapters. the vocabulary was the same. all of the exercises, everything was the same. i asked some of the kids if they were able to use the books and they said, no, there were so many cosmetic changes from one year to the next that they could not use the books. people are going to hundreds of dollars a year if they have a reasonable load just for books. it is hard for me to believe that we are still reassuring new editions of books year after year. -- read issuing new editions of books a year after year. guest: the caller has touched upon a real problem at colleges across the nation. students spend close to $1,000 a year on their textbooks. and we are acutely aware of this problem. something that legislatures are

where -- aware of and interested in as well. we try to make used books available to our students and enter the and it is not just the latest edition that can be used in the classroom. but also, the materials, wherever possible, our shared an online. technology is making it much easier for those things do happen. we're looking at cooperative arrangements among institutions to get better prices from the textbook publishers. it is also, without going into details, congress passed a higher education bill a couple of years ago requiring the bundling of textbooks. publishers have historically package merit-materials together, changed a little bit, and then -- publishers have historically packaged materials together, change a little bit, and then repackaged.

host: orlando, john on the republican line. caller: this gentleman is government relations, which is another way of saying lobbyist. i'm curious to know what he makes, and i'm sure it's well over six figures. number two, the methodology that obama and democrats went about to get this passed in the health care bill is still a bit shaky in itself. as a former student who was eligible for a co grant, one thing -- for a pell grant, one thing i can tell you is that for the majority of students that get these plants and government assistance, yes, they may pay for the books and whatever the overage is, and in many cases, they take that stuff -- and at that age you are spending money on everything but what you are supposed to. everybody that you can bring on here can always say how they need help.