america's -- emeritus. fred. and our current chairman of the board. howard. i would also like to recognize the more than 130 members of the institute's board of trustees, who have traveled from every corner of our nation to be here today. .

the litany of challenges is well known. two wars, the specter of nuclear proliferation, the ever- present threat of terrorism, and the skirts of radical extremism. the deficit of democracy and human rights, the unfulfilled promise of reconciliation, and peace between arabs and and israelis, and the list goes on, but we are not without tools for change, and the tool is the impressive human capital brought to address these challenges. our guest is a prime example of this. in and out of uniform, general

james jones has dedicated a lifetime of service to our nation. as a marine, he sought combat in vietnam. he rose through the ranks to serve as, of the marine corps. -- commandant of the marine corps. almost immediately after his retirement, he decided to take on an easy job. he was appointed by secretary of state condoleezza rice as the special envoy for middle eastern regional security. in this capacity, he worked with israeli and palestinian officials and furthering the peace process. then in 2009, he was named by president obama to be his assistant for national security

affairs. the new president's top advisor on all aspects of national security. we have a history of moving mountains to get our job done, but we did not realize it would take the icelandic volcano to make it possible for you to be here today, so let me thank you and welcome you to deliver this year's lecture on u.s.-middle east policies. ladies and gentlemen, general james jones carian -- jones. [applause] >> thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for your kind introduction and your leadership as the institutional president. you have 25 years of institute history to live up to end 22 years of the president's

watching to make sure you get it right. in order to set the stage for my remarks, i would like to tell you a story i think is true. it happened recently in southern afghanistan. a member of the television and was separated from his fighting party -- the taliban was separated from his fighting party and wound up wandering the desert out of food and water, and he saw what looked like a little shack, and he walked towards it, and as he got to it, it turned out it was a little store owned by a jewish merchant, and the taliban warrior went up to him and said, i need water. give me some water, and the merchant said, i do not have water, of but would you like to buy a tie. we have a nice sale on its ties today.

the taliban let loose a stream of language about israel, about the jewish people, about the man himself, his family. he said, i need water, and you've tried to sell me a tie, and possibly, the merchant and sat there until the taliban was through, and he said, i am sorry. i do not have water, and i forgive you for the all the -- for all the insults you have levied against me, my family, and my country, but i will help you out. if you go over that hill and what about 2 miles, they have a restaurant with all the water you need, and the taliban disappears over the hill, only to come back an hour later, and walking over to the merchants says -- to the merchant says, your brother told me i needed a tie to get into the restaurant.

[laughter] rob, i would like to thank you also for this welcome, and ladies and gentlemen, on your 25th anniversary, let me commend all those who made this a respected institution is today, a vital institution. i also want to thank the distinguished trusties and board of advisors, which has one empty chair because of the loss of a public servant, a true statesman and diplomat, and one of my predecessors, the supreme allied commander of europe, and we all remember alexander haig. [applause] thank you very good for a

quarter century, through five different administrations -- thank you. for a quarter-century, through five different administrations, this institution has provided a valuable service for the american people. instead of recycling old arguments, you have given fresh an objective analysis, so i want to thank rob and your entire staff for your insights and contributions. may you continue for another 25 years and 25 years beyond that. thank you. i have seen this firsthand myself. as was mentioned, in 2007, i accepted to serve as an envoy for middle eastern security. the work was strengthened with the advice of new -- with my advisers. we benefited from the advice of other institute follows, and

president obama's administration was all too happy to still dennis away, and he is leading the efforts of the national security council, and i believe dennis is here tonight. would you please stand and be recognized? [applause] i especially want to thank the institute for your work on behalf of the offender -- the effort the president obama called for, that is greater understanding of muslim communities around the world. the president called for a sustained effort to listen to each other, to learn for each other, to respect one another, and to seek common ground. in that spirit, you have been promoting ritual of the region mutual understanding for many years, whether it is welcoming -- you have been promoting mutual understanding for years, whether it is the reason documentary recounting a little-

known story of how arabs' saved jews from the holocaust. thank you for your analysis that sustain national security and for promoting understanding that can lead to a more secure world for us all, and i wish you continued success, because our nation and the world needs institutions like yours now more than ever. since taking office, president obama has made it clear that his first and foremost priority is safety of the american people. he has pursued a new era of american leadership and comprehensive engagement based on mutual interests and mutual respect. in the coming weeks, we will be releasing a new national security strategy that formalizes the president's approach, and a protracted in and guided by national security interests. -- an approach rooted in and guided by national security interests. we have a sink -- an enduring

interest in the security of the united states, citizens common and u.s. allies and partners. -- citizens, and u.s. allies and partners. prosperity, we have an interest in a system that promotes prosperity. values -- we have ended during interesting -- interest in values at home and around the world, and finally, international order. we have an enduring interest in international order advance for u.s. leadership that promotes peace and opportunity to meet local challenges. these are the interests of the president and his administration, that they are working on to advance every day, including the middle east. to strengthen our security, we

are responsibly ending the war in iraq. as evidence of the success of this weekend pause military advances against al qaeda in iraq, the united states will end our combat mission by august as planned. in accordance to the u.s.-iraqi security agreement, all u.s. forces will be out of iraq by the end of next year. the most immediate challenge now is for iraqi political leaders to form an inclusive and representative government. as they face longer-term challenges of expanding prosperity and opportunity, the iraqi people will continue to have a strong and reliable partner in the united states. in afghanistan and beyond, we have refocused the fight against al qaeda and its extremist allies. we have struck major blows against their leaders, who are now hunkered down in the travel regions along the border between afghanistan and pakistan. at the same time, we are forging partnerships with isolated

extremists and promote development, all of which improves the daily lives of ordinary people and undermines the forces the fuel violent extremism, and to confront the greatest director claude -- greatest threat to global security, the president hosted last week's historic nuclear security summit, where 46 nations joined the goal of securing vulnerable nuclear materials within four years. to advance our prosperity, president obama has worked with allies and partners to expand the global economic recovery, pursue growth that is balanced and sustained, launch a national export initiative to double american exports, and support 2 million american jobs, and reform the international architecture so the g-20 is now the premier forum for international cooperation, and

as he promised in cairo, next week the president will host a summit with business leaders and entrepreneurs from more than 50 nations, including many muslim- majority countries and israel, to promote our common prosperity. two events values that are universal, the president -- to advance values that are universal, the president has made clear he will uphold our ideals at home and abroad, including the right of people do of a say in how they are governed. the u.s. is committed to supporting governments that reflect the will of the people, because history shows these governments are more stable, more successful, and more secure, as a political reform and effective and accountable governments will remain core elements of our vision for the future in the middle east and around the world, and to advance a just and sustainable international order, the united states is working to insure that

both rights and responsibilities of all nations are withheld. the new treaty with russia is part of our comprehensive agenda to pursue a world without nuclear weapons, an agenda that reflects the three pillars of the nuclear non-proliferation treaty. nations with nuclear weapons will produce region will reduce them. nations without nuclear weapons will force -- nations with nuclear weapons will reduce them. nations without nuclear weapons will avoid them. how this is of help will in great measure determine how and coming decades we see part -- prosperity for americans and around the world, and perhaps nowhere do we see this more in evidence than in the middle east, where we see two defining challenges. preventing iran from acquiring nuclear weapons, forging a

lasting peace between israelis and palestinians as part of a comprehensive peace in region. now president obama took office, and iran had already assimilative thousands of centrifuges. iran was in active violation of five united nations security council resolutions. moreover, iran's sponsorship of terrorist acts in ira also signg -- and gaza signaled a continuing determination to so violence through the middle east. clearly, a policy of not engaging iran did not work, and this is why we made a clear commitment to engage iran on the basis of mutual respect on the full range of issues that divide our countries. as the president repeatedly said, he was under no illusions.

he knew it would not be easy to overcome decades of distrust, suspicion, and even open hostility between our countries, but he also knew engagement was necessary to present iran with a clear choice and to unite the international community around the need for around the region need for iran to meet its -- the need for iran to meet its international obligations, so the president extended his hand for dialogue. american and iranian diplomats met in october. the ieaaea put together a plan o produce enriched uranium. it would ensure iran would meet its stated need for medical isotopes.

it gave around the opportunity to show its nuclear program was indeed for peaceful purposes, as it claims. it would have killed confidence from both sides and possibility of future agreements. the united states went to great lengths to demonstrate our commitment and to establish assurances for iran. sadly, to date, we have seen no indication that iran's leaders want to resolve these issues constructively. after initially accepting the offer, they rejected the tehran research reactor proposal. they have refused to discuss their nuclear program with the p 5 plus one. the covert in richmond site which further violated their obligations -- enrichments side which further violated their obligations said further suspicions. the previously enriched to 20%. all the while, iran continues

to suppress their citizens and prohibit their rights to express themselves freely and choose their own future. these are not the behavior of a responsible international actor, and they are not the actions of a government committed to peaceful diplomacy in a new relationship with a willing and ready partner. indeed, iran's continued defiance of international obligations on its nuclear program and its support of terrorism represents a significant regional and global threat. a nuclear-arms iran could not translate the landscape of the middle east, precipitating a nuclear arms race, dramatically increasing the danger of local conflicts, fatally wound the global non-proliferation regime, and emboldened the extremists who threaten the united states and her allies. we are now working actively with

allies and partners to increase the cost of iran's continued failure to live up to its international obligations. this includes the un security resolution -- sanction resolution. arlin proposition still stands, -- our proposition still stands. iran has rights, but with those rights, responsibilities. if iran's leaders choose do not fulfill their responsibilities, they will face ever-deepening isolation. iran's government must face real consequences for its continued defiance of the international community. we do hope iraq will make the right choice and act to restore the confidence of the international community in the exclusive -- in the exclusive the peaceful nature of its

program. should its leaders refuse to make the jurors, president obama has been very clear, on -- to make the choice, president obama has been very clear. the united states is determined to prevent iran from developing nuclear weapons. [applause] in so doing, we will avoid a nuclear arms race in the region and the proliferation of nuclear technology to terrorist organizations one of the ways iran exerts influence in the middle east is by exploiting the arab-israeli conflict. iran uses the conflict to keep others in the region on the offensive and to try to limit its own isolation. ending this conflict, achieving peace between israelis and palestinians, and establishing a sovereign palestinian state would therefore take such an evocative issue away from iran, has a law -- hezbollah and

hamas. it would allow the leaders to focus on building their institutions, and peace between israel and syria could have a transformative affect on the region. since taking office, president obama has pursued a two-state solution, a secured to a state of israel living side by side with a viable and independent palestinian state. this is in the united states interest. it is in israel's interest. it is in the palestinians in trust, and it is in the interest of the arab countries and the whole -- it is in the palestinians'interest, and it is an interest of the whole world . since there has been a lot of distortion and misrepresentation of our policy recently, let me take this opportunity to address our relationship with our ally, israel. like any two nations, we will

have disagreements, but we will always resolve them as allies and friends, and we will never forget but since the first minutes of israeli independence -- never forget that since the first minutes of is really independent of the united states have be -- has had a special relationship with israel, and that will not change. it will not change, because this is not a commitment of democrats or republicans. it is a national commitment based on shared values, deep connections, and mutual interest. as president obama declared in cairo, america pause strong bonds with israel are well known. this bond is -- america's strong bonds with israel are well known. this bond is unbreakable. there the bonds of two people, bound together by shared values of freedom and individual opportunity. fear the bonds of two

democracies, where -- they are the bonds of to the beer democracies, where power lies with the people. they are the bonds of science and technology. they are the bonds of friendship, including ties of so many family and friends. this week marked the 62nd anniversary of israeli independence. a nation and the people who have survived in the face of overwhelming odds common -- overwhelming odds, but even now, israel continues to reside in a hostile neighborhood with adversaries who cling to the false hope that denying israel's legitimacy will ultimately make it disappear. those adversaries are wrong. as the president said in cairo for the entire world to hear, the state of israel will not go away. as he said at the united nations, nations to the

palestinians no favors when they choose vitriolic attacks against israel over recognizing its legitimacy and its right to exist in peace and security, so america's commitment to israel will endure, and everyone must know there is no space between the united states and israel when it comes to security. [applause] our commitment to israel's security is unshakeable, and it is as strong as ever. this administration understands very well when the environment in which israel and the united states must operate. we understand very well that for peace and stability in the middle east, israel must be secure. the united states will never waver in defense of israel's

security, and that is why we provide billions of dollars annually and security assistance to israel, and why we reiterated our consultations to make sure -- are consultations, and why we embark on exercises -- military exercises that involve more than 1000 american men and women. many of the same forces that threaten israel also threaten the united states. icahn also say from long term -- i can also say from long personal experience that our security relationship with israel is important to america. military benefits from israel and technology from shared that -- shared intelligence and the joint training that enhances our capabilities and from lessons learned in israel's own battle against terrorism. over the years, like so many

other americans, i have spent a great deal of time with my israeli partners, including my friends in the israeli defense force. these partnerships are lifelong partnerships. they are deep, and they are abiding. they are personal relationships and friendships based on mutual trust and respect and shared values. every day across the whole range of our bilateral relationship, we are working together for our share of security and shared prosperity, and our partnership will they be -- for our shared security and shared prosperity, and are a partnership will only be strengthened. we recognize peacenik -- peace can only be made by the partisan cannot be imposed from the outside. we also understand the status quo is not sustainable. it is not sustainable for israel's identity as a secure jewish and democratic state, because the demographic clock keeps ticking and will not be

reversed. the status quo is not sustainable for palestinians who have legitimate aspirations for sovereignty and statehood. the status quo is not sustainable for the region because there is a struggle between those who reject israel's existence and those prepared to coexist with israel, and the status quo strengthens the rejectionists and weakens those who would live in peace. we are disappointed that the parties have not begun direct negotiations. the united states stands ready to do whatever is necessary to tell -- to help the parties bridge their differences and to help make compromises on behalf of peace. we will also support the palestinian authorities and their efforts to develop their own institutions from the ground up and called on other states, particularly in the region, to do their part to support the palestinian authority as well. we will also continue to call on all sides to avoid provocative

actions, including israeli actions in east jerusalem and palestinian incitement of fuels suspicion rather than trust . as secretary clinton said, we believe we can support a separate state of israel's goal of a jewish state that meets israel's security requirements. it is time to begin those negotiations and to put an end to excuses. it is time for all leaders in the region to support efforts for peace. it is time for today's leaders to demonstrate the courage and leadership, so i want to

conclude tonight by returning to some simple words the president spoke. this is a moment of challenge, and when it comes to the middle east, it is a moment of many challenges. it is the challenge of transitioning to full iraqi responsibility for of the future. in afghanistan, it is the challenge of threatening -- challenging -- it is the challenge of violent extremism. it is the challenge of forging a lasting peace between israelis and palestinians as part of a comprehensive peace in the region, and it is the challenge of realizing greater prosperity and opportunity for all who called the middle east of. alone, any one of these would demand extraordinary patience. together, they will require a comprehensive and coordinated

approach. this is the work president obama has undertaken, and this is the work we will continue to pursue in months and years ahead, not only for the sake of america's security, but for the world's security. thank you very much. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> on monday, the senate has the key vote on moving forward with the financial regulations bill. the legislation aims to close regulatory gaps, increase in consumer lending oversight, an increase supervision of the derivatives market. here is a quick look at president obama and mitch mcconnell speaking about the measure this week. >> here is the good news. a comprehensive plan to achieve these reforms has already passed the house of representatives. [applause] a senate version is currently

being debated, drawing on ideas from democrats and republicans. both bills represent significant improvement on the flawed rules we have in place today, despite the serious effort of industry lobbyists to shape this legislation to their special interests. for those of you in the financial sector, i am sure some of these lobbyists work for you, and now they are doing what they are being paid to do, but i am here today specifically when i speak to the titans of industry, because i want to urge you to join us instead of fighting us. >> the administration says it wants to end bailouts. i say to them, approve it. some of us have pointed out concerns this bill would give the administration the authority to use taxpayer funds to support financial institutions at a time of crisis.

the bill says taxpayers get the money back later, but that sounds awfully familiar. isn't that exactly what we did with the first bailout fund, a bill of five americans were promised would be repaid, but which democrats are now trying to raid in order to pay for everything else under the sun. >> to begin debating the financial regulations bill, senate democrats need one republican vote to move forward. watch live coverage monday at 5:00 p.m. eastern on c-span 2 and at c-span.org. meanwhile, the house's black monday at 5:00 p.m. eastern. on wednesday, they will -- meanwhile, the house is by monday at 5:00 p.m., eastern. live house coverage is always on c-span. a senate hearing on nasa's annual budget. the president has us for $19

billion for fiscal year 2011. the plan eliminates the rocket program and instead relies on private contractors to take a chennault's to the international space station. the maryland senator chairs the -- contractors to take astronauts to the international space station. the maryland senator chairs this meeting. >> including are good senator from utah, senator hatch -- including our good senator from utah, senator hatch, for the fiscal year 2011 budget. i would like to make my opening remarks, turned to my colleagues, and then, senator hatch, to you. we are going to be welcoming senator hatch and then john

frost, who will be speaking to the committee to ensure no matter what we decide, we ensure the safety of the astronauts. the 2011 nasa budget is $19 billion, $276 million more than the 2010 budget. the top highlights of this budget include major investments in science. this focuses especially on earth science. we will focus on that in a minute. the other thing is extending the length of the international -- the life of the international space station, to continue until 2020 and possibly beyond, meaning better value for a dollar and better value for our astronauts efforts. we spent a lot of time building

the space stations. now we have to spend time using the space station. it is time to retire the space shuttle, and the president provide for that at the end of 2010. only three more flights to go after 30 years of exceptional and honorable service. the president's budget also increases funding for aeronautic research, $72 million for 2010, and must do to keep america competitive. there are extremely dramatic changes to the consolation program, and that will be subject to a great deal of focus. in the area of the consolation program, we want to be sure to clarify, is the president talking about restructuring the

program? it will be a major source of discussion for this committee. i want to come back to the science budget, which i think, while we are going to focus a lot on consolation, we must focus on other aspects of nasa. there is a strong emphasis on earth science, and the budget also includes $1.5 billion for planetary science, research on times, mars, saturn, and beyond -- research on asteroids, mars, saturn and beyond. there is also money for cosmic or regions. -- origins. the committee also supports the hubble space telescope, celebrating its 20th anniversary in space and also the building of the james webb telescope. we will look a field of how the

sun's solar flares affect our lives, including the solar probe. now we know how important that is, because solar flares could take down our power grid, and all we need to know about public warnings is there. as i said, the president retires the shuttle. let's go directly to an area of human space flight. the area of controversy is huge. nasa request $2.4 billion for exploration. it is below the 2010 level by $1.4 billion. that is big.

the president clarified he is not recommending the canceling of consolation, but the restructuring. this is of very keen interest to this committee. constellation was to be a way to go to the moon and mars. a crew vehicle made up of a rocket and a capsule. the cargo vehicle and also the crew moon lander. let me just say what my position is. i need to know more, and that is the purpose of this hearing, and if we need to have more, we are going to do it. congress needs to know more. we owe it to the american people. we owe it to the taxpayer than astronauts to be very clear about what we're going to do and how we are going to do it. -- we owe it to the taxpayers and astronauts to be very clear about what we are going to do and how we are going to do it berrigan -- to do it.

every new president cannot have a new nasa agenda. that is the focus of today's hearings. we are here to get the facts. it is not about finger-pointing. it is about pinpointing. i have been in contact with the leaders in the space field, including their colleague, senator shelby as well as the commerce committee of the riser. i outlined a basic set of principles that will guide may -- commerce committee of riser -- authorizer. i outlined a basic set of principles that will guide my decision. i want to be sure we are applying the same safety standard for deepexploration.

we want to be sure the astronauts know that we have cared for them and want to protect them. second, we need a destination. nasa has been a mission-driven agencies since its creation. having a clear direction and destination tends to keep us focused on what we need to do and the budget in which we need to adhere to a and the involvement of our international partners. -- to adhered to and the involvement of our international partners. we need a balanced program that includes human exploration, are reliable and safe transportation system for those in deep space, robust science to explore our universe, and aeronautics research to keep our country competitive. the key purpose of the space exploration must always include

science and missions. we also need a plan for whatever we decide for work-force transition. our retirement of the space shuttle is anticipated as planned -- to proceed as planned. we would not want to be dismissive. this is really a big transition. then if we're going to cancel consolation or restructure it, it causes major dislocation in a variety of states, all of whom i know will articulate their concerns. in protecting the astronauts, we also need to protect the taxpayers. this new plan has significant issues with contract termination, so we need to be sure we are not paying for closing john -- closing down --

paying one set of contracts to close them down and paying to start new contracts. it is very complex, and i am puzzled about how we are going to do it. we also need to be sure, no matter what the transition is, that we do not lose our technology and we do not lose our base, so we look forward to hearing where we are going to go, how we are going to get there, how you're going to protect the astronauts and the taxpayers. we have a lot of questions as we launch these hearings. i would like to now turn to my colleague, senator shelby. >> thank you, madam chairman, for having this critical hearing to examine the administration fought continually changing plans for the future of -- administration is continually changing plans for the future of space flight. -- administration's continually

changing plans for the future of space flight. the new plan still ends this country cause human spaceflight program. mr. -- this country's human space flight program. the president's own commission highlighted what we all believe, that our human spaceflight program must be worthy of a great nation. i have read mesopause budget, and i find it to be anything but great -- i have rented nasa's -- read nasa's budget, and i find it anything but great. we will rely on other countries for access to space. future generations will learn how the chinese, russian, and even indians took the reins of space exploration away from the united states. this request abandon our nation's own chance to remain a leader in space, and instead, it

chooses to set up a welfare program for the commercial space industry. it is a plan where i believe taxpayers subsidies subsidizes millionaires to build rockets that will one day allow millionaires and our own astronauts to travel to space. the demonstration says if we build up the commercial rocket industry, the private sector market will magically materialize to produce more expenditure of launches at a lower cost earlier than the scheduled consolation. what nasa and this administration have failed to disclose is that nasa has no verifiable data to support their claims. the head of the office of science and technology policy as well as you have testified that nasa did not conduct independent market research to show this private launch market even exists. let me repeat that. the white house adviser on

science and technology policy testified there was no real research or verification done on the viability of the administration's approach to sustain america's space future. instead, this administration is relying on information provided by the very people who stand to receive billions in tax payer subsidies to promote their unproven products. the primary service the administration can side is the 2002 study that has proven to -- can cite is the 2002 study that has proven to be overly optimistic. this predicted 33 commercial passengers would have flown between 2002 and 2010. today, eight tourists have gone beyond suborbital space. thomas young testified before congress that the air force in the 1990's tried to commercialize their space

program. they're forced is proposing top level management of the space program under contract approach called "a total system performance responsibility." it required air force project managers to stand back and let industry have total responsibility of the space system they created for the u.s. government. he stated that the results were devastating and the adverse impact is still with us today. this misguided program ended up costing the taxpayers billions to correct. also in the 1990's, a commercial company very significant investment in expenditure vehicles based on a commercial market that never materialized to support their vehicles. in the end, the government had to keep this domestic launch provider alive with billions of taxpayer dollars. we made these mistakes before.

albert einstein said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. i believe that is the case here. with this past experience in mind, where are the truly independent market analyses of the booming commercial sector delivering people to a lower orbit and back? we should make those public and let there be a real debate about whether taxpayers should shoulder the cost of building space rides for millionaires. the truth is, when troubles mount and a commercial rocket market again fails to materialize, the taxpayers will be called on to bail out these companies and their investors, a recurring theme with this administration. other than the commission's cursory examination of safety, there is no excreting no evidence nasa has done any in- depth analysis -- there is no evidence nasa has done in the in

depth analysis. i remain steadfast in insisting on safety in the space program. nothing less susceptible. and contrary to nafta's position on reaching nasa's position on safety, -- contrary to nasa's position on safety, they stated in a 2009 report that no commercial manufacturer is currently qualified, despite some claims to the contrary. this is after the 2008 report, written in part by you, mr. administrator, declaring that commercial vehicles are not proven to be appropriate to transport nasa personnel. i will ask some questions about how you could in 2008 states this industry was incapable of stiffly transporting astronauts, and yet today, say just -- when capable of safely transporting

astronauts, and yet today, using just the opposite. nasa's safety experts agree current vehicles are untested and unworthy of carrying our most valuable assets -- are nascent's astronauts. -- our nation's astronauts berrigan -- astronauts. the advisory panel reaffirmed what has been known for some time. to abandon verio 1 as a baseline vehicle without demonstrating -- to abandon as a baseline vehicle is an unwise and probably not cost-effective. the ability to close the gap or even provide an equivalent degree of safety, switching from a demonstrated, well-designed, saved system to one based on nothing more than unsubstantiated claims would seem a poor choice.

before the change is made, the inherent safety of that approach must be assessed to make sure it offers the level of safety equal to or greater than the program. a year ago, i have strong criticism of the program, and those are just as valid today as they were then. this request represents nothing more than a commercially-led space program. today the commercial providers nasa has contracted with cannot even carry the trash by from the space station, much less carry humans to or from space safely. these have yet to live up to the promises they have already made to the taxpayer. not a single rocket or ounce of cargo has been launched since we met last year. instead of acquiring redo requiring accountability, the president's budget -- instead of requiring accountability, the president's budget promises to reward those people. the president's budget was rolled out in the shell -- the

shadow of the rocket that is the basis for the vision of the future of commercial space flight, yet this was for years the late in launching a successful rocket, after three failures and an escalation. it finally got a rocket off the ground. the fog and nine -- falcon 9 is two years behind schedule and counting, yet the president awards the space industry with an additional bailout to deliver on the contract with the hope they will be able to deliver something some day. does it was a 60% cost overrun for an -- this equals a 60% cost overrun for a commodity. given the continued delays and now the cost overrun, i believe the president canceled the wrong

rocket program. this plan lacks vision is unrealistic, and jeopardize as our entire -- this plan lacks vision, is unrealistic, and jeopardize our entire space program. -- jeopardizes our entire space program. congress has the responsibility. however common -- however, to us, they are people who have already been devoting and maintaining leadership of 50 years of space flight. the jobs promised to be created will hardly materialized before the pink slips begin to arrive. once those highly skilled workers leave, they will likely never come back. given the way they have been treated so far this year, i would hardly blame them. now you are attempting to undermine the spirit of the law.

your destructive actions towards the program will only ensure members cannot trust you. mr. administrator, you are creating an atmosphere where you and your leadership team have become a major impediment to moving forward. under the plan, nasa will never be the same. today, nasa is immediately associated with success in spite of insurmountable odds. there is a deeply ingrained respect for what nasa insisted and is doing -- nasa did and is doing today. we do not deserve the rich heritage of human space flight as prue -- the previous generation sacrificed for to make the program what it is today. the proposed budget will devastate enable the united states has in exploring -- will devastate any effort the united

states has in exploring. it is clear the administration and you do not believe american leadership and human space flight is a priority worth fighting for. no matter how many summits, press releases, or praise, hope is not a strategy. this plan will destroy decades of u.s. space supremacy by pinning our hopes on commercial companies. this budget is not a proposal for space exploration worthy of this great nation. thank you. >> senator hatch? >> thank you, madame chair, senator shelby. it is a privilege to be with you. i am puzzled by the administration's request.

this proposal calls for the determination of project constellation and its rocket systems. >> we want to hear every word. is the microphone on? >> senator feinstein always says, with mumbling. i have got to speak a little louder. this calls for the determination of profit consolation. as a result, if ratified, our nation could capitulate our position as the world leader in space exploration as well as forego the technological harvest. if project consolation is canceled, our nation will not be able to travel beyond low orbit. this is ironic, considering the president's recent statements that the ultimate objective of our space program is martha.

to be fair, the president that -- is mars. to be fair, the president has talked about a live system by 2015, yet we cannot afford to throw with the $10 billion the country has invested into project consolation and then spend billions more to research new technologies. this point is especially germane because the other have the lift technology is contemplated may or may not match the possibilities of solid rocket motors. i believe neil armstrong and the commander of apollo 13 and the commander of apollo 17 said it does. if we follow the plan, we will have lost the many years required. this conclusion was echoed by the aerospace safety advisory panel, which in 2009 stated, to

abandon for an alternative without proven superiority is unwise and probably not cost- effective. in other words, an alternative will take years of additional time and cost billions of dollars more. some opponents argue part consolation is a troubled endeavour. the truth is to the contrary. last fall, the world witnessed the launch of a rocket from the kennedy space center in a stunning and successful test. in addition, area 5 is used in area 1. one can surmise there will be overall savings using this approach. together the system of rockets provides our nation and astronauts with the most reliable and affordable and safest means of reaching a lower

orbit and beyond. let me emphasize that point. this is a safe system. nothing else comes close. the 2005 nasa systems architecture studiey concluded this system is 10 times safer than the current space shuttle. this was reaffirmed by the aerospace safety advisory panel, which stated, the ability of any current cost designed to close the gap or provide an equivalent degree of safety is speculative. the panel also concluded, switching from a well-designed system to one based on nothing more than unsubstantiated claims would seem a poor choice. this only underscores the in ministration's proposal relies on -- the administration's proposal relies on using on proven private businesses as a means to exchange -- transport our astronauts to the space

station. many of these companies are start-ups. these start-ups do not have any experience carrying human or cargo into space. even under these corporations most optimistic near term proposals, their systems will not be able to travel beyond low earth orbit. some have argued in this difficult fiscal environment, the project is too expensive and should fall victim to the budget act. this is not the case. the demonstration's proposed plan actually increases the budget by more than $6 million over the next five fiscal years. in addition, canceling the system will cost the taxpayer an additional $2.5 billion because of contractual obligations. on top of these costs, since private businesses have never previously developed a low earth orbit system to transmit -- transport astronauts or a heavy lift system to explore deeper in the cosmos, one could naturally

hypothesize lengthy delays and overruns for this venture. .

.

for to this understand, christ died and lived and rose again that he might be the lord for both the dead and the living. tragedy and grief, yes, bring us here today, but just as certainly hope and faith in our commitment to seeing some true good will come to this unspeakable loss will see us through the tomorrows to come. on behalf of my colleagues, representative mullahan and capiteau, it is our hope that god will bless these loving families and caring friends and his strength may abide with them all. god bless you all and god bless

our rescuers. >> at this time we will sing "amazing grace," sinth first and last stanza and then once again the first stanza in the conclusion. let's stand together as we sing. >> ♪ amazing grace how sweet the sound that saved a wretch o like me i once was lost but now am found was blind

but now i see when we've been there 10,000 years bright shining as the sun we've no less days to sing god's praise than when we've first begun amazing grace how sweet the sound that saved a wretch like me

i once was lost but now am found was blind but now i see ♪ >> a reading from the holly gospel according to john. jesus said to his zpoims, do not fear your heart be troubled. you have faith in god. have faith also in me. in my father's house, there are

many dwelling places. if there were not, would i have told you that i am going to prepare a place for you, and if i go and prepare a place for you, i will come back again and take you to myself. so that where i am, you will be. where i am going, you know the way. thomas said to him, we do not know where you are going, how can we know the way? jesus said to him, i am the way and the truth and the light. no one comes to the father except through me. the gospel of the lord.

>> good afternoon. it is indeed an honor to stand before the family members today . of our 29 miners who were tragically taken from us 20 years ago. you are without a doubt some of the most wonderful people that i've been blessed to meet, and i'm thankful to call you my friends. i also stand here today in honor of the 29 miners themselves, whom i feel i know through each and every one of you, through the hundred hours that we spent together at the family site and the precious moments that 24 of the 29 viewings and funerals i was

blessed to attend. you shared with me the stories of your loved ones. these were stories that illustrated the solid character , sense of humor, love for god and country, family, and friends and love for life itself. and woven into each of their stories was the essence of a west virginia coal miner, things like courage and strength and brotherhood and family devotion and helplessness. it has been their memory. it is for your support, and it has been your honor that i stand here today. monday, april 5, in the evening hours, i arrived at the family center and started talking with each of you who were present. i can hear the eagerness in your voice longing to know the status of your loved ones.

seven families were informed that very evening of their loss , and 22 others clung to that hope, that four who were unaccounted for for their loved ones. and as you remember well, that monday night was a night that was full of tremendous hurt and pain. after the governor addressed us, something happened that changed the rest of that week. we all joined hands and prayed to our heavenly father for what he alone could provide, things like peace in the midst of perplexity, things like calmness in the midst of calamity, and strength in the midst of suffering. and when a man was spoken, many of you repeated with a resounding amen and amen. many of you shared with me that

week is what you looked forward to was our times we would spend together in prayer. i understand how we are comforted when we pray to the lord, for we know and remember what the scripture teaches us about him. in the gospel of math urek the scripture says he was moved with compassion for them because they were weary and scattered like sheep having no shepherd. and in the gospel of luke, as he approached the town gates, a dead person was carried out. the only son of a mother, and she was a widow, and when the lord saw her, his heart went out to her, and he said don't cry, but let us not forget the compassion demonstrated in the book of romans, but god commended or demonstrated his love toward us and that while we were yet sinners, christ

died for us. yes, i agree with the family. he is a compassionate god. 10 years ago this fall, i lost my father to cancer. he was my father, my counselor, and my friend. about a month before his death, he asked me to take him for a ride in the truck. upon our return, we said in the truck as the sun burst through the windshield on to his very serious demeanor, i looked over and i said, dad, what are you thinking about? he replied, son, everything changes, nothing ever stays the same forever. and you know, in a temporal sense, my father was correct. in an eternal sernings i'm strengthened to know that almighty god never changes. my almighty god, he never fails. and he is never defeated and has never succumbed to

anything. amen. i drew strength from that very truth and drawn it today. i still miss him, miss him greatly, as you will. but the lord has given necessity grace and strength to survive. my friends, i leaf you with this thought these words from the gospel of john. when the disciples were grieving over their soon to come separation from gee surks he told them, let not your heart be troubled. you know, he understood they were grieving, and he did not criticize their grief, but instead, he gave them a remedy for their grief. first of all, he said -- he told them to have faith. he said you believe in god, believe also in me. secondly, he told them that he was their friend. he said in my father's house or many mansions, many dwelling

places, if that were not so, i would have told you. you seerk the lord jesus never tells us a lisme he always tells the truth. he told us i am the way, the truth, and the life. yes, he is indeed a true friend, and third, i would leave with you this, that he told them to remember he was their future. he said, i go to prepare a place for you, and i will come again and receive you unto myself, that where i am, there you may be also. those who believe in jesus believe that this is not the end. oh, no, this is only the beginning. this is the commencement. and in the words of a pastor from san diego, california, in a sermon he preached entitled, that's my king, he stated these words -- my king is the only

one whom there are no means of measure that can define his limitless love. he's the center savior. he's the centerpiece of civilization. he's the only one able to supply all of our needs. he supplies strength to the weak. he's available for the tempted and the tried. he sympathizes and he saves. he heals the sick. he cleanses the lepers. he discharged the debtors. he delivers the captive. he defends the feeble. he blesses the young. he serves the unfortunate. he regards the age. he rewards the diligent and he beautifies. his mercy is everlasting, and his love never changes. his word is enough. his grace is sufficient. his reign is righteous. his yolk is easy, and his burden is life. you can't get him off of your minds. count get him off of your heads. you can't outlive him, and you can't live without him.

death couldn't handle him, and the grave couldn't hold him. amen. and the people here today said amen. and amen. may god bless our miners. and families, may god bless each and every one of, and may god bless the state of west virginia. thank you

>> governor, families of miners we lost, the president and i had the pleasure to meet, i learned about courage and valor and gumption from miners sitting around my grandfather's kitchen table in scranton, pennsylvania, hearing stories, stories of men they knew, lives that were lost. but i actually learned more from robert c. byrd, who is here, serving with him so many years. his incredible pride in his state and his miners is only

matched by his loyalty. . the men we remember today went into the darkness so that we could have light. they embraced a life of hard work and a career full of peril. it was dangerous. it was dangerous work, and they knew it, but they never flinched. what amazed me is how they saddled up every day, squeezed in side by said for a cramped journey into the heart of darkness. many of them loved it. some of them dreaded it. but all of them, all of them approached it with dignity, resolve, and strength. they went into the mines, as was referenced earlier, not only top provide for themselves and their families, but in a very direct way for all of us. and though this work dwoins

them, it did not describe them. they were fathers, grandfathers, sons, nephews, husbands and fiancees. they loved hunting and fishing, ride wheelers. they hated the way coach rodriguez left west virginia for michigan. they rebuilt cars, they loved motorcycles, and they practiced random acts of kindness. they had their given names, but as we all learn today, they answered to cuz and pee wee and smiley. some had been in mining for decades, some for months. one was planning a wedding, one was planning for retirement.

as individuals, these men were strong. they were proud. they were providers. collectively, they represent what i believe is the heart and soul of the spine of this nation. and ladies and gentlemen -- a nation mourns. so every member of every family that has been touched by this tragedy, i can say that i know what it's like to lose a spouse or child, and i also know, when the tributes are done and the flags are once again flying at full staff, once the miners you see today go back to work, that's when it will be the hardest for you all. when life has moved on around

us but has yet to stir within you, that's when you're most going to need one another. because for other people, for the lucky ones, life gets to go on. but as a community and as a nation, we would compound tragedy if we let life go on unscathed. certainly nobody should have to sacrifice their life for their livelihood. but ads the governor and senator rockefeller said, we'll have that conversation later. but before that, the rest of us bear responsibility as well, and that responsibility is to be aware of, to recognize, to respect, to honor those who

risk their lives so that we can live ours. those who will continue to do this hard and dangerous work. so often when we're met with this kind of sorrow and pain, we search, as the clrgey can tell you, for meaning and purpose where there seems to be none. we look for answers to questions that are literally hard to add, and even when answered, at this moment they provide little relief. i have a wish for all of you, all of your families. may he raise you up on eagles' wings and bury you on the breath of dawn and make the sun to shine upon you, and until you're reunited with those you

lost, may god hold you in the palm of his hand hands, for you know this band of 29 rough-neck angels watching over you are doing that just now as they sit at the right hand of the lord today, and they're wondering, is all that fuss about me? you know, folks -- there is a famous headstone in an irish cemetery in ireland, and it reads this, it says -- death leads to heartache no one can heal. love leads to memory no one can steal. i can tell you from my own personal experience that event we'll the painful heartache you feel will be replaced by the

joyful memories of ones you loved so dearly. my prayer for you is that that day will come sooner than later. may god bless you all and may god protect all miners. [applause] >> to all the families who loved so deeply the miners we lost, all the friends who worked alongside them in the

mines or new -- knew them as neighbors, coal river valley, cross west virginia, let me begin by saying that we have been mourning with you throughout these difficult days . our hearts have been aching with you. we keep our thoughts with the survivors who were recovering and resting at the hospitals and at the homes. we are thankful to the rescue team, but our heart aches alongside you. we're here to memorialize 29 americans.

nothing i or the vice president or the governor or the speakers here today, nothing we say could fill the hole they leave in your hearts. or the absence that they leave in your lives. if any comfort can be found, it can perhaps be found by speaking to the face of god who quiets our troubled minds, a god who mends our broken hearts , a god who eases our mourning soul. even as we mourn 29 lives lost, we also remember 29 lives lived . up at 4:30, 5:00 in the morning at the latest, they began their day as they worked in darkness,

cover jowls -- coveralls, boots, hard hats, they sit quietly for their hour-long john i, five miles into a mountain. the only lights, the lamp on their caps, or the glow from the trip they rode in on. day after day, they would burrow into the coal, the fruits of their labor. so often we take for granted the electricity that lights up the convention center, that lights up our church or our homes, our schools, our offices , the energy that powers our country, the energy that powers the world. in most days, they'd emerge from the dark mines squinting in the light. most days they'd emerge sweaty

and dirty and dusted from coal. most days they'd come home. but not that day. these men, these husband, fathers, grand fears, brothers, sons, uncles, nephews, they did not take on their jobs unaware of the peril. some of them had already been injured, some of them had seen a friend get hurt, so they understood there were risks. the families did too. they knew their kids would say a prayer at night before they left. they knew their wives would wait for a call when their shift ended and say everything was ok. they knew their parents felt pain of fear every time a news alert came on or the radio cut

in. but they left for the mines anyway, some having waited all their lives to be miners, if longing to follow in the footsteps of their fathers and their grandfathers, and yet none of them did it for themselves alone. all that hard work, all that hardship, all the time spent underground, it was all for the families, it was all for you. for a car in the driveway, roof overheads, for a chance to give their kids opportunities that they would never know, the joy of retirement with spouses, it's all the hopes of something better. so these miners lived as they died in pursuit of the american dream. there in the mines for their families, they became a family

themselves, sharing birthdays, relaxing together, watching mountaineers football or basketball together, spending days off together hunting or fishing. them may not have always loved what they did, but they loved doing it together. they loved doing it as a family. they loved doing it as a community. that spirit is reflected in the song that almost every american knows. but it's the song most people would be surprised was actually written by a coal miner's son, about the people of west virginia. the song "lean on me," anthem of friendship but also an anthem of community, of coming together, friends keeping porch lights on in a nightly vigil, hanging up home made signs that

read "pray or our miners and their families," neighboring consoling each other, supporting each other, leaning on one another. i've seen it. the days that followed the disaster, emails and letters poured into the white house, postmarked from different places across the country. they often began the same way, i am proud to be from a family of miners, i am the son of a coal miner, i am proud to be a coal miner's daughter. they were always proud. they asked me to keep our miners and my thoughts and my prayers, never forget, they say, miners keep america's lights on.

and then in these letters they make a simple plea. don't let this happen again. don't let this happen again. how can we fail them? how can a nation that relies on its miners not do everything in its power to protect them? how can we let anyone in this country put their lives at risk by simply showing up to work, by simply pursuing the american dream? we cannot bring back 29 men we lost. they are with the lord. our task here on earth saves lives from being lost in another such tragedy. do what we must do individually

and correctively to ensure conditions underground, to treat our miners like they treat each other like a family, because we are all family, and we are all americans. and we have to lean on one another and look out for one another. and love one another and pray for one another. the song that comes to mind today, the song we often turn to in times of heartache. even though i walked through the valley of the shadow of death, i will fear no evil, for you are with me. god bless our miners. god bless their families. god bless west virginia. and god bless the united states of america.

>> ♪ i know your life on earth was troubled only you can know the pain you

were no stranger to the rain so go rest high on that mountain son, your work on earth is done and go to heaven a-shouting love for the father and the son so go rest high on that mountain because son, your work on earth is done

and go to heaven a-shouting love for the father and the son ♪

♪ so go rest high on that mountain because son, your work on earth is done and go to heaven a-shouting love for the father and the son

and go to heaven a-shouting love for the father and the son ♪ >> let me say on behalf of the great state of west virginia and all of our wonderful sisters of our state, i want to thank each and every person who participated today. i want to thank all of who you came out to honor our miners, our miners' families, and all the miners that are working today that have worked so hard for so long for all of us. to the families, i want to say this, i hope that we gave you

some comfort today, that we were able to start this healing process. we know that we love you, we'll be with you forever. when people have to go back to their jobs and back wherever they came from, we're going to be here with you, and i think you know that. you're the greatest people. i'm the luckiest person in the world to be able to represent you. and i feel so blessed to get to know you the way i have. i wish it wasn't under the conditions that we do, but we grew pretty close over five days, and i still see so many of the mothers and wives and sisters and all of you. and when i would ask you, i would say why don't you go home and get some rest, i knew that wasn't going to happen. i knew t. but i had to go ahead and say it anyway. and if you recall, we met about every two or three hours. i went through a personal tragedy, as so many of you all have too, and sometimes the minute seems like an hour, an hour seems like a day, and a day seems like an eternity when you're waiting to hear

something. we knew the odds were long against us. we all knew that. but boy, we had faith and we had hope. we were praying so much. and we'd come together, and chaplain mitchell did such a wonderful job. i appreciate you so much. he would always end with a prayer. well, you can imagine over five days, we had a lot of prayers. and we'd come together, and mr. president, mr. vice president, about wednesday, i started getting handed these prayers, the miners prayers, and we would end with a miners' prayer. on friday evening, 8:30 was our last prayer. 8:30 was the last pray that we had, the last briefing that we had before we knew the fate of all of our beloved miners, and i thought it was only befitting that i read that prayer that we

read at 8:30 with all the families present that night. bright white lights illuminate their day so far removed from the light of day. 100 tests they face each week down in the mines, the coldest seat. trained to live beneath the slow, in dark and damp they had to toil. to rest the minerals from the land by strength of mine and back of hand. courage is a must, they say, to work as a miner day by day. so far removed from child and wife and face the rigors of a miners' life. and now high above in the light of sun, a child of play enjoys his fun. fun at times, concealing fear, that the mines will claim his dead so dear. and as they work beneath the clay with heads bowed down,

these miners pray that god will hear them up above and send them safely to the ones they love. now as this cannot come to pass , and he must pay the price at last, the miner leaves his last demand, keep my child safe above the land. in front of the stage, there are 29 miners tasked symbolizing the men we love. on each half there is a light symbolizing life. while they are gone, there are many, many memories that will shine on forever. these men will not be forgotten. these are the lights that light the world.

>> ♪ this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine let it shine let it shine this little light of mine i'm going let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine

this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine

this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine ♪

♪ this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine i'm going to let it shine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine let it shine let it shine everywhere i go i'm going to let it shine i'm going to let it shine everywhere i go

i'm going let it shine everywhere i go i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine all the way down the road i'm going to let it shine all down the road i'm going to let it shine all down the road i'm going let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine

i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine everywhere i go i'm going to let it shine everywhere i go i'm going to let it shine everywhere i go i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine jesus gave me the light i'm going to let it shine jesus gave me the light

i'm going to let it shine jesus gave me the light i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine all down the road i'm going to let it shine all the way down the road

evenly going to let it shine all down the road i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine i'm going to let it shine i'm going to let it shine

this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine this little light of mine i'm going to let it shine let it shine, let it shine, let it shine ♪ >> snowed senator richard shelby, ranking republican on the banking committee, political analyst charlie cook, and michael barr, assistant

treasury secretary for financial institutions, a conference on the independent community bankers of america. live coverage starts at 9:00 a.m. eastern on c-span2. . >> this week, two historians discuss their lives. richard norton smith teaches at george mason university. he's currently working on a biography of nelson rockefeller. douglas brinkley teaches at rice university. he's completing a book on alaska and the fight to save the wilderness there. he's also working on a biography of walter cronkite. .

if it weren't for library purchases their sales might be measured in the dozens. most people it seems," says gordon wood, "are not interested in reading history, at least not the history written by academic historians." start with that.

>> i would say part of the problem is that there are not more gordon woods, distinguished academics who are held in high regard by their peers who are interested in writing for more than their peers. if you think of people in the past, arthur schlesinger, henry steele commager, you know, if you looked at the "new york times" bestseller list 40 years ago you would have found distinguished academics who were interested in reaching what used to be called the general educated reader. i think we live in a niche society. certainly academics, i think, have become ever more specialized. and the interesting thing is who are we reading? we're reading david mccullough. you know, we read stephen ambrose, doris kearns goodwin, doug brinkley, and there are some academics out there who are writing for a general audience. people like h.w. brands and others. but clearly the trend has been toward specialization. and it's -- mr. lowell, the president of harvard early in the 20th century who was a humanist and a political scientist, back in the day when political scientists talked about politics, said, "the graduate student who came to harvard, the mythical graduate student who arrived to study the left hind leg of the paleozoic cockroach," so academic specialization was a problem a century ago. it's become, i think even greater today. >>doug brinkley? >> well, i'm going to dissent slightly from gordon wood because i think these academic books have a huge amount of

importance. so first off, the university presses represent a state. i'm writing right now on alaska. i don't know how i could write my book if there hasn't been a university of alaska press that did a book about the pipeline, that did a book about charles sheldon at mount mckinley, that did a book about the aleutian islands in world war ii. not a lot of readers are going to read about attu being, you know, invaded by the japanese, so a university press can offer a kind of information that i need to write a more popular book. so i think the problem is money and that these university presses need to be subsidized, and they're not getting subsidized. there are all these cuts going on and i'd like to see all of -- i'm a huge fan of the university press world and i think academic writing is essential to popular writing because we're footnoting those books all the time. >> our guests for this hour are doug brinkley and richard norton smith. they're not newcomers to the set. we've talked many times and we do this periodically. but in order for those who might have never seen either one of you here on this network, we're going to go back to the year that i met both of you on

the program we used to do called "booknotes," which was in this same time slot. let's pick up doug brinkley, april 1993 and just see what he looks like and what he had to say. graceland. why graceland? >> well, why graceland? "going to graceland," graceland, got to go to graceland. it's the second most -- second most visited home in the united states after the white house. elvis presley's not a joke. and i personally am a great admirer of elvis presley. i mean i'm a guy -- i think that people that mock elvis and make jokes about elvis don't understand elvis presley and don't know anything about him. his role -- and i wanted the students to try to deal with some of the issues that elvis raises. i mean, elvis presley's a great figure to look at american social history in the 50s, 60s and 70s \[inaudible] and in the 1950s elvis was an unconscious revolutionary, that by doing this -- i've started a chapter by elvis saying, "ah, just do what you want to do." elvis was able to not listen to

what people told him and play race records, as they were called back then, absorb black music, absorb blues, absorb gospel music, perry como, country western. he sponged up all of the american musical forms -- >> that was 17 years ago. elvis is the centerpiece of a big event at the museum drawing people in today. >> yes, i'm staying here at hotel george and the whole lobby is elvis for the news museum. well, look, when i was talking back then about elvis it's about popular culture in general. i think a lot of times in the united states academics feel like they can't deal with what's around them as being important. something like bob dylan, 50, 100 years from now, so there are going to be a hundred university press books about dylan's lyrics and what they mean. but when you're very close to it it seems like something that you read in the tabloids more.

you know, an actor like marlon brando, today there's a lot of serious work being done on his method acting. you know, painters who are considered, you know, a sign of frivolous in the 60s somewhat, andy warhol for example. there's now museums towards andy warhol. we have a lot of geniuses in our midst right now in america that we just don't pay that much kind of academic scholarly attention to because they seem too close for us. >> mr. smith -- >> yes, what today is popular culture is tomorrow's history. >> are you as interested in pop culture as -- >> no. no, i'm not as interested. i mean i have -- i have great regard for doug's work and i think he's right, that pop culture is a legitimate, you know, source of history in the making. in many ways it's a mirror in a lot of ways held up to us. i would be, i suppose, more nostalgic in the sense that i was going to say remember the day elvis died was the day journalism changed in america because that evening, famously, walter cronkite did not lead on

the evening news with the death of elvis presley. i believe the other networks did. i think he -- cronkite was the only one, a purist who took the traditional view that this isn't news. clearly the trend since suggests otherwise. i'm not altogether comfortable with the trend, but i acknowledge the historical significance of it. >> back then you were at hofstra. you had a magic bus, a bus that went around the united states with kids in it and taking them to historical spots. where have you been since 1993? >> well, from hofstra i went to the university of new orleans there in the eisenhower center, continued the magic bus programs. in fact, used natural gas buses and went about 17,000 miles taking students on these semesters across america where we'd go read willa cather in nebraska or steinbeck in california or walk martin luther king's, you know, atlanta or truman's missouri. and so i continued that program

and i started doing civil rights bus tours, taking kids on civil rights tours. interestingly enough, i participated in two of somebody else's this year. i went with john lewis on a pilgrimage, a faith and politics pilgrimage where we went. i spoke on rosa parks in montgomery. i went to the selma bridge with john lewis. and then julian bond out of university of virginia runs a civil rights tour and i became the guest speaker of it in new orleans about new orleans and the civil rights movement. the landrieu family, mary landrieu and mitch landrieu who's now mayor and the morials, dutch morial, the first black mayor and mark morial who's the head of the urban league today. so it's reflecting on race and families in new orleans for julian bond. i then went and taught at tulane university and i'm now a professor of history at rice university in houston. i live in austin so i divide my time between austin-houston and i have three kids, which takes up a lot of my time. and i'm able to take them now to historic sites and parks that my parents took me to when i was young.