campaigning here in t 2008 primary and 2008 presidential election. was able to win this state with a large majority of the vote for the first time in decades for a democrat to do that. so, reid hopes bringing the president and his wife to the state will infuse his base with much needed enthusiasm. talking to t crowds, miclle obama was able to do that last week. >> finally, which candidate, which republican candidate wld reid like to run against? >> well, harryeid himself dodges that queion since he doesn't vote republican so he hasn't studied up on the candidates. however, wheyou look at his campaign activities they have spent a tremendous amount of money, time and resourc in weaken weakening sue lowden and it has worked. sharon angle is seen by some as more of a fringe candidate and has not been able to rse a

substantial amount of money or build a sophisticated campaign struc stcture. so, when you look at those activities of trying to weak en sue lowden i would say he aimed at sharon angle. >> tune in f the june 8 primartuesday. >> wheat take you live to the pentagon the for a briefing from a rock commander general ray odierno who will be talking about the security situation there. the drawdown of u.s. forces with an august deadline looming. >> welcome. thank you for joining us. it is always my pleasure to welcome back to the briefing room, general re your dinero. he is the commander of u.s. forces in iraq.

he has been there since september of 2008. i am sure he will ask him about that, to. -- too. true to his promise, he is back in town. he will take your questions. general, to apply for joining us today. -- thank you for joining us today. >> i have a fancy prepared statement. i just wanted to start out by saying the election results were certified on the first of june, which in my mind, is an extremely important step in the political process in iraq. it has taken longer than we would have liked. frankly, they went through the

process the way their constitution dictates. in my mind, that is positive. there was a recount in baghdad. the recount was3 0.1% was the potential difference -- was the difference, which clearly labels it legitimate. i think it is important that they went through that process. there was a challenge. they went through that. they believe the election is right. we're starting to move forward. only about 20% of the incumbents are coming back to the new parliament. it is a total of 64 out of 325. we have a lot of new members, new parties. new people will be involved in the government. we think that is extremely important as we move forward. in terms of security, it

continues to move forward at a good pace. i judge security and the feel that i get as i go around, and also, the statistics. i look at high-profile attacks. all of those statistics for the first five months of 2010 are the lowest we have had on record. there has been some violence. there has been some bad days. every statistic continues to go in the right direction. that is especially important as the iraqi security forces have taken more and more security, and are in the lead across the country and they have been for the past couple of months. in addition to that, over the last 90 days or so, we have either picked up or killed 34 out of the top 42 al qaeda

leaders in iraq. they are attempting to reorganize the have struggled a little bit. -- reorganize. they have struggled a little bit. they will attempt to regenerate. they are finding it difficult. these operations, going after the leaders, has been a truly partnered effort between the u.s. security forces and iraqi forces. they continue to develop their abilities to collect intelligence, and action that intelligence. day. the other point that i would like to talk about, which i have been impressed with, has been an iraqi military leaders during this time of waldo ability, as we are getting ready to cede -- this time of vulnerability. as we are ready to seat the government, the leaders have stayed neutral, they have shown

their professionalism in enforcing the constitution, not showing favoritism, and they have continued to execute their operations across the country to the syrian border. i think it has proven a lot to us that they are getting more and more ready to take over full control of security. today, we are at 88,000 boots on the ground. we are on track to be at 50,000 by the first of september. we are on our plan. so far, we have moved over 18,000 wheeled vehicles out of the country. we have moved over 600,000 containerized items out of the country.

they are ahead of schedule. we started a year ago at 500 basis. today, we have 126 bases. we will be at 94 by the start of september. we are ahead of schedule. many are ready to turn over. we have already done most of the work. we remained ahead of schedule. the next three to four wants are important to the government of iraq. we all believe this will set the tone for the next four years in what direction iraq goes. we are encouraged by the talk that they all agree that they need to have a government that has the full participation oo all political parties that participate in elections. they are talking about establishing institutional

reform, as they look at forming the government. i think all of those things are extremely positive signs as we move forward. there will still be bad days. there are still violent elements that operate inside of iraq. their violence is less than it was before, but it is still violence we will continue to work with the iraqi security forces to continue to improve their capacity to deal with the violence, and continued to increase stability, and the capability of the government as we move forward. those are the main points i wanted to talk about. i look forward to your questions. >> the withdraw members. its start -- it sounds like you'll be withdrawing about 12,000 troops every month for the next couple of months. you have any flexibility with that? >> baidu -- i do.

we are doing different numbers in different months. i have flexibility. if i decide to do more in august than in june, i can do that. we have done several different exercises that show me what flexibility and i have. i feel confident that we have not stressed the system that i believe would cause problems. we have alternate methods of getting out, if we have to do more in august than in june. we have walked through all of that. >> where do you stand on meeting barack's request for f- 16 fighter aircraft? f-16raq's request for fighter aircraft? >> they have done an assessment. it was given to the government of iraq.

it talked about the need for air defense, and the need to develop air capability moving forward. they have submitted to us a letter saying that they're interested in purchasing f-16's. we are going through our own process. this will be evolving. >> will there be something to be there by the time u.s. combat troops complete their withdrawal? are you saying that the u.s. will not be able to meet that request at this akes years? >> they will have some air force capability. they continue to build some capability, not fighter aircraft. that will come sometime after 2011, likely do in many other countries as we sell them aircraft. >> will they be new ones? >> we are working on that, but i

think they will be nil. we have to go through congress. there are many states that have to be gone through yet before we come to a final decision. >> the 50,000, but does that include troops that will be in the process of redeploying as of september 1? >> my goal is that we will be at 50,000 in side of iraq by september 1. could there be a few over? maybe. my goal is that we will be at 50,000 by the first of september. >> you said the next three months are critical for the government of iraq and it will take where it goes. at the same time, you have to pull out 40,000 troops. in your meeting with obama, did you reassess that deadline, and say that this is something that could be pushed?

>> i do not think they equate to each other. the governmental formation process will be very important over the next few months. i think the security situation will be sustained even as we withdraw forces because of the improvement we continue to see in the iraqi security forces. with 50,000 u.s. troops along with the iraqi army and of iraqi police, i believe we will be able to provide the security necessary. what is different today than one year revco is that the iraqis are in the lead. we are not -- is back the -- one year-ago, is that the iraqis are in the lead. we conduct partnered counter- terrorism operations. that is what we do today, and that is what we will do after september 1. they are there. i think it is the right time to

go to 50,000. it is my assessment that they can provide the security necessary for the government to formation to be completed. >> is there a danger in doing it so quickly? you are talking about stressing the army. pulling out 24,000 in four weeks, is that the way you want to do it? is it not say for over a longer time? >> i have been looking at this for a very long time. we have done a lot of work. i feel very comfortable with what we are doing. i would argue, initially, we might want to take more out in april in may, but because of the elections were not certified, we pushed some out. we have done that. i feel comfortable. >> how many contractors thus the u.s. maintained in iraq, and what would be the number after

september 1? >> we are down to around 90,000 contractors, at a high of 170,000 almost a year ago. i believe that by the first of september, we will be somewhere around 60,000 to 65,000 contractors. we will go down further as we continue to reduce our size. they will be behind us one or two months. i think they will come down further. a lot of the contractors, we are turning them more into the iraqis. it is helping to develop the economy, and they are also helping us to do what we need to do to sustain our force. the 50,000 the number is a lot what we call traders and visors. it is lighter oo comex -- advisers. it is lighter on combat support.

that number comes down with the number of soldiers coming down. >> you gave statistics on the attrition of al qaeda. what is your assessment of their resiliency? as you prepare to handoff come and, what would use it to the next general are the major security risks looking ahead? >> they will obviously attempt to reconstitute. the issue is they have lost a lot of top leadership very quickly. they will have to develop new leadership. they have named some names. we're not sure if there are people behind those names. they are very common names in the arabic world. we're not sure there are actually people behind those names. we believe they will attempt to reconstitute. it will take some of bit longer, if they are able to. we continue to put pressure on

them to make it more difficult for them to come back. as time goes on, most of the security issues will come from what sponsor out of the political realm. that is why it is important to have a unity government. we do not want to see a group that feels it's been disenfranchised, and contemplates moving back to an insurgency. we did not want to see the insurgency come back or extremists come back because they feel like they're not part of the government. all of the politicians in iraq realize that. they're working closely to make sure everyone is involved in the government going forward. that is what we have to be careful of. i will never take my eyes off of al qaeda. we will always watch them. we are helping to build the capacity in iraqi special operations forces, that when we

leave, they will have a robust capability to continue to go after the extremist elements. we're working that very hard as we work for. >> are you keeping your qrf somewhere handy? >> it depends on the timing. with 50,000 soldiers, i feel that is enough to do quite a bit. again, i cannot over-emphasize enough the iraqi security forces -- how much they improved, how much better they are and what they do. that is what is different between now, 2006, 2007, and 2008. there are ready forces we can tap into. >> there will not be u.s. combat troops there after september 1? >> our mission is to train and

device. -- advise. we will be in that role. we'll continue to do counter- terrorism operations. there will be some combat capability. >> you talked repeatedly about how comfortable you are with the 50,000 number. do you believe that maybe you should even be lower? >> it is about assessing risk. because of the formation of the government, because of us moving to the certifications of the election, i believe the structure we have developed allows me to cover and train and advise in the key areas of iraq. it is the the capability to continue to keep in contact, and work with iraqi security forces.

for now, to go into that, we would have to break contact somehow. i am not ready to do that yet. that is a decision that i will leave for the end of this year, the beginning of next year. as we reduce, and turn it over to civilian control, the state department has to ramp up. we have to do it in sync with the security situation and the state department. we are working that now. they will be ready to do that in the middle of 2011, toward the end of 2011. >> i will ask you a 30,000-foot question. you are approaching what is assumed to be your last command in iraq. as you look back on your tenure, can you talk about the surprises on the upside? what has gone easier or better

than you thought, and also on the downside? any mistakes you would advise to avoid in the future? >> the implementation of the security agreement that started in january of 2009 -- i think that has gone extremely well. it has gone better than anyone expected. the cooperation would have had with the iraqi government, the civilian and military leaders in executing this, it has gone very well. i am confident that we and maintained a strong partnership, which has enabled us to continu+ to go after the threat. i think that juggling has gone very well. in terms of things that i would say we could have done better, infrastructure.

i think the iraqi people, the economic development and infrastructure, we have not brought that along as fast as i would have liked to have seen. the government has a huge responsibility. our help and 10th do the i think that continued -- our helping them do that, i think that continues to be important. we have not had true reconciliation in the arrest. we still have issues that need to be worked through. >> -- >> it is the issues in the disputed areas. it is still some areas with the

old army. we are still working our way through that. that is not done. we are headed in the right direction, but not where i would like to be. >> general, a couple of things. what are your plans -- when will the transition happen to joined forces command and when you get there, what lessons will you bring from the rock that you think are important to transform -- from iraq that you think are important to transform? what are you telling your colleague, general mcchrystal about what you find to be the keys in iraq, that could be found in afghanistan? you think he can do it in a more difficult environment, in a shorter time frame? -- do you think he can do it in a more difficult environment, in a shorter time frame? >> that will be determined by the secretary of defense, the

transition. i expect it will be sometime in the next three or five months or so. as i looked to go into joint forces command, i have honestly not thought about it a lot. in general, what i would say is that we have a current -- we have learned an awful lot of lessons. we have learned the importance foot of understanding your in client -- the importance of understanding your environment, and getting the entire government approach of understanding your mission. there's a lot we do that is not military. how do we integrate that? what we have learned about the intelligence collection. what we have learned about forces working together. it is about looking ahead on how we get the maximum use out of the capabilities we have in our

armed forces, and how we continue to improve our ability to maximize each other's capabilities. how do we manage to force in order to meet all of these needs? those are the kind of things i will think about. general mcchrystal and i are close friends. i have an incredible respect for him. we pass lessons on. i sent teams to afghanistan when asked. i think they understand what has gone well in the tarmac, -- in .oiraq it is not easy. the environment in iraq is different than in afghanistan. the economic environment, the tribal environment, it is so much different.

there are some basic lessons said to have taken over -- protecting the population, holding ground once you get it, having afghan forces be a part of everything they do, but we started doing with the iraqi security forces. i think they are taking that, and working that. the environment, again, i'm not an expert in afghanistan. the challenges of economic peace make it a different flight. i have the utmost confidence that the team over there will make this work. they now have the resources they have asked for, or are getting the resources that have asked for. >> went -- what evidence do you have that al qaeda will maintain its interest in stirring up

trouble once the u.s. forces are out? >> al qaeda in iraq is about -- it has not changed. they want complete failure of the government in iraq. it is a tall task for them now, as compared to maybe 2005 or 2006. they still sustain that thought process. it has nothing to do with the united states. they continue to look for safe havens. they look for territory set are not governed. they want to form a territory inside of iraq that they can take it and to channel. that is what they will continue to look for. i believe that they will have a difficult time in an iraq, but they will certainly continue to try. trucks the counter-terrorism -- >> the counter-terrorism commission, what do you see as the u.s.'s role in that going

forward? >> every counter-terrorism target that is executed inside of iraq, is approved by their government. we do independent -- we do know independent operations in our rock. every counter-terrorism mission we do is a combined mission to fix some, are iraqi-only. what we are helping them to develop between now and the end of 2011 is about how you go after a network. it is not just individuals. it is about targeting the entire network, and having ways to go after that network. they are very good at establishing human intelligence. we are helping them to use that as well as some of the tactical intelligence that is available,

and how they put that -- technical intelligence that is available, and how they put that together. how they go to the process of developing target approval, execution is not the issue. that is whht we are working with them on. we want them to be very precise. they're getting better. i feel confident we will be able to transition in theenext 18 months or so. >> those numbers to used -- 34 of the top 42 al qaeda leaders -- that is dramatic. did something happen? >> we have been whittled away at this for a very long time. -- we have whittled away at this for a very long time. in the december-february time frame, we made significant inroads with their headquarters was.

we picked up several of their leaders that did the financing, that did the planning, that did recruiting, that did reject some of their lawyers that worked on bringing -- some of their lawyers that work on the detainees. over time, through hard work, we were able to get inside the organization, finally leaving -- leading to the killing about a month ago. we have not stopped. since then, we have picked up two or threeemore. we'll continue with our security force partners to go after them. there are still some very dangerous people out there. there are some low-level leaders that we do not want them to develop. that is what we're working toward. >> you said that al qaeda is looking like it is attempting to reorganize even still. how is that manifesting?

are you seeing any influence from iran? >> first, al qaeda -- what they are attempting to do now -- what they want to do is keep attention on themselves inside of iraq. i think you will see a lot of announcements made about things do.y did, or did not new - i think they will go after softer targets just to make we are working very hard with our security force partners to insure that does not happen. i think they are struggling. i think it will be difficult for them to recruit. for the last six or eight months, they have had trouble recruiting. the iraqi people have rejected the ideology -- the large

majority, 99.9% have rejected it. we want to sustain the pressure on them. it is their life style. i am not so sure that all of al qaeda is ideologically tide. there is money and power and bulk. some might be ideologues, many are what i would call opportunists. in terms of the iran, they continue to be very much involved in side of the iraq. we understand they are a neighbor. we want to have a positive influence, not one we believe to be-. -- we believe to be negative. the guerrillas to the u.s. have a long-term relationship with iraq -- de do not want to see the u.s. have a long-term relationship with iraq.

they will continue to fund surrogates and others who will attack u.s. forces and iraqi security forces. just yesterday, there was a rocket attack in southern iraq, were they killed three iraqi security forces. these were iranian surrogates. they are not just attacking u.s. forces. they continue to infiltrate some of their security architecture into iraq. iraqis are stepping up their work at the borders. they're trying to infiltrate so that they can influence outcomes. they make of the positive3 they want a legitimate government, but behind the scenes, they continue to interfere in my mind, from the political, military, and economic perspective.

>> can you quantify the iran in involvement? is it more, less, or about the same that it was a year raquel? specifically on -- a year ago? andcifically on the eft's technology? >> it is different. from 2007 and 2008, they have moved away from a heavy lethal strategy to one that involves some lethal, and some non- legal, -- non-lethal, trying to gain monopolies in economic areas and have a heavy diplomatic influence inside of iraq. that were still 30 efp's

went off in the iraq. rockets made in iran are still being shot off. there is still trading going on inside of iran. there are still doing it, but at a lower level than they were before. >> the assumption coming into the drawdown has long been dead you will need to wrote -- has long been that you will need to rely on things that are in the high-demand, low density areas like helicopters. there's a huge demand for that in afghanistan. can you talk about that tension? how will you hold on to those assets?? >> again, commanders and never tell you they have enough. they always ant more. -- will never tell you they have enough. they always want more. we have a good process where we review needs and we determine

where we think those assets are needed. i have significant input into that process. i felt comfortable with how the process is working. we have an awful lot of helicopters. we have gone from what i did 75,000, -- we have gone from 175,000 to 80,000. we have enough. route clarence is another one. we will continue to work that. i feel comffrtable with the system.3 into the force. that has made it easier for us. as fast as we get it, it gets dedicated to afghanistan or correct. i'm thankful for that. -- or iraq. i'm thankful for that. i could argue that we could use

more than i have today. i feel the risk has been mitigated on isr. >> there is an e-mail scam going on. a guy cannot decide whether he is a major or sergeant major. some people might take it seriously. will you put out any guidance sign not to trust it? >> yes, we do. people have been scanning my name for money as well. i have had several scam artists on facebook use my facebook page. we are constantly going after the scam artists. we are very aware of all of these. we have a very robust capability. it is more about notifying people who get these e-mails.

i have this facebook thing that says do not believe that -- believed it if they ask for money. it is a problem. since you brought that subject up, one of the things that we have to continue to work hard is the change that has occurred in terms of global communications. access to global convocations, the impact on asymmetric warfare, the impact on future warfare -- it is significant. we have stood up sever command. i think it is this cyber come and. i think it is extremely important -- cyber command. i think it is extremely important. we look at how we deal with these issues. it is difficult to deal with

these issues and sustain the rise that we want of freedom of expression and information? it is a tough issue that we have to work through. what has frustrated me inside of iraq is we are doing exactly what we need to do, but if you look on their web site, what they are telling their people is completely different than what is happening on the ground. they have videos that are years and years old, replaying them, saying that we have killed over 1000 americans. they're saying they're successful, they need them to contribute money for -- these have the kind of things that go on. those are real challenges that we have to get after as well and scams. -- as well as cancer and other things that go on -- as well as

scams and other things that goal on. we have a force that is helping to train iraqi navy forces and police forces that will continue post-september 1. >> i want to thank everyone, but securely ray odierno for doing this. -- most important, ray odierno for doing this. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> pulitzer prize winners on booktv prime-time. we look at the first tightening. a history winter on how world bankers attempted to rebuild the global economy following world war one, that instead lead to

economic collapse and the great depression. >> new british prime minister and conservative party leader david cameron fields questions in this first prime minister's questions, sunday night, and o'clock p.m. on c-span. >> i said, all might not, this president will be impeached -- i said, oh, my god, this president hu the impeach. we could not use that word around the use -- the newsroom. the all of that moment stays with me. >> search for a watergate in the c-span video library. see what key players have said about the break in. the library is free, on-line. >> next, a destruction -- a

disccssion on reconstruction in humanitarian efforts in haiti. the january earthquake resulted in more than 500,000 people killed or injured. this event starts with the lieutenant general, ken keen. this is just over two hours. m th 80 we will take a couple mths off for the summer and reconvene in e fall. it's a very fitting that topic of today's dscussion s a look ahead at haiti's future over the coming mon certainly we hope after the traumatic event of the recent past thaiti could ook forward to a bright future bu unfortunately that isn't completely clear.

as "the w york times" reported on sunday, graffiti and treet protests are beginning as haians express frustration with the pace of rconstruction and job creation. according to the time of the slan ha appeared on the walls of rt-au-prince as a kind of shorthand for the general sense of frustration fet by many haitians. at the same time, the rain and huicane seans have arrived withundreds of thousands of haitiansill living in makeshift camps without proper shelter, food, sanitation or prospect for moving to improved conditions. despite the llions of dollrs pledged and the good work of many in the inernational community and the haitian government, much remains to be accolished. looking ahead, but is haiti' future in the short and ithe long-term? we have a articully stguished group of experts to help answer that question this morning. my role was to introduce the future speake genral ken

keendeputy commander of u.s. southern command. after genel keenspeaks, we will take a few questions and then we will turn the meetng over to the chairman ofthe haiti working group, pofessor robert maguire, wh will introduce the rest of the panel. you have general keen's by yo, so will just know he was an haiti of the day of th earthquake on a prearanged visit and mediately began to organize the response. he stayed on to command the rest of the three joint task force that provided security and humanitarian assistance in the aftermath of the disaster. atits height, the operation united response had more than 22,000 american military personnel, ncluding a ombat brigade team in the 82nd airborne and two marine battalions from an aircraft carrier, the uss cool and the hospital ship. this week, th last 300 troops of the operation left haiti, leaving behind the record of accomplishment.

among its achievements was e u.s. ilitary role in a rapidly recovering the port-au-prin airport and getting it up and running and operating it throughout the entire eerency phase without a major accint or incident. quite an accomplishment. carried out his duties, general keen worked with thebraillian commander of the u.n. military. the world is probably facilitated by the fact that he's a graduate former student of the brazilian stuff college and has a long careeworking in south america. so, i would like to introduce general keen and we will get started. general? >> thank you, sir. i did what we will try to do first is show a short video, which is looking to the past, and then i will address a few remarks and follow o that. so if we could show the vido. >> i am lieutenant general ken

keen and was he commander of joint task force haiti. of generate wealth, 2010, a 7.0 magnitude arthquake shook the tiny island nation of haiti. the result of that earthquake was over 0,000 ill. over 1 million have been displaced and many more have been injured. the results of the earthquake have brought together a partnership from around the world of internaonal organizations and n-gornmental organizations to include forces from the united nations. the edges of which you are about to see tell the story. it tellshe storyf heartbreak but it also tells a story of hope and a story of power and it brings together the partnerships which we see here today. ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ ♪ ♪ >> well, i will certnly be prared wn we do te questions and answers to talk about our military respon and joint taskforce haiti. as mentioned, we disestablised joint task force haiti on tuesday as majogeneral took

command, commander of u.s. army's command tothe task rce haiti as i left on t 18th f april departed to go back to sa antonio. and as i am told, joi task force haiti reprented the largest and the longest u.s. militaryespoe to a foreign disaster tht we have embarked upon in our history. appropriatel so given the magnitude and the scope of the devastation of the earthquake that struck haiti. i would like to just make se remarks about while we have this established joint task force haiti it does not represent the end of ouru.s. military involvement inhaiti. in fact, as mentioned, at the 12th of januy i was in haiti talk with the to listen to --

the u.s. embassy as well as the haitn ministries about projects in the u.s. southn ommand was embarking upon this year in haiti and als had just sat down for an our or so ith representatives of usaid to talk out hurricane preparedness for the hurricane eason and what we could learn from 2008 and how we should be prepared this year. and of course we were reminded as tropical storm agatha hit this weekend u.s. southern command once agn was asked to respond by the government of guatemala, and in fact we hve a militaryersonnel for helicopters in guatemala. since i arrived at the u.s. soutrn command in tender this is the frh icide or disaster tat struck countries in latin america that our military has been aedo respond to. so i think it's appropriate we look at he the to determine how

we can best be postured to support usaid and the office of foreign disaster assistance as needed based upon the needs of a particular nation has we are not even week intthe hurricane seas and we have already had our first troical stm. i left haiti yesterday, and of thelast two days, i had the opportunity afr having been gone for six weeks to look to see where we have progress. somemes it is har to find that progress, but it happens ttle by little but it's probably much too slow for many ofus who would like to se progress much quicker,but this is a tremendous challenge. i had an opportunity to speak brfly with the prime minister ambassad martin, chris mcinn

who leads our sid efortsto visit three idp campus. the old airporthat is the second largest one of the new settlement sites that we work with t government of haiti and united nations to open to moe me of the most at ris displaced persons. as i did every day from the time the earthquakestruck to the time i let i walked through the displaced perss camp because i foun was in those camps that i could get the est eel for what was the needs of the peop, what the work what i call the soldiers and skills of humanitarian assistance, the ngos or do we get the challenges they were facing day today to meet the needs of the people it to move it forward and

haiti still is in a very risky position. the estimates now when we shot th video we were using 1 million displaced people. now it is somewhere between 1.5 and 2 million depending upon which organitionhas made the latest estimates. so we havea lot of peopletill very much at risk as we enter into the hurricane season at risk from flods andthe elements of the wther but also the challenges of hosing. our military remains engaged through the presence of nw horizons exercise which is led by the louisianan national guard and appropriately so since doubt therare many national guard in theility more experienced at doi this type ofork and helping people

prepare r rricanes but the work they're doing in haiti now has a part of t new horizons exercise revolves arounseveral tys of projects that wehave worked over starting back in february looking to the future saying what should we do in our engement in haiti as they recover from the earthquake and as the organization's move to the recovery and reconstruction and what we determined that we cod best contribud a small way was to work in som parts of the country that ouide port-au-prince that had received a great number of displaced persons that have moved out of port-au-prince andthese were [inaudible] and the projects tt we are doing er the next three of this through sptember are increasingapacities for educatioschools.

we are building some schools and we are building rooms on two schools because the increased number of children have lived in these areas. we are digging wells and building medical clinics. we are doing a number medical reiness exercises where we bring in bout 40 health care providers and they treat aout 500 people a day in these local communities and remote areas that otherwise would not hav access to medical care. looking to obviously address the population that has recently moved into these comunities with te jective that hopefully they will feel compelled to mo back to port-au-prince because the last thing port-au-prce needs is more people. and there is a drawback to port-au-ince today because a you build, to rebuildof coure you are creatinjobs andthat is the one thing stations meet

today's jobs, so there is a need to address population of port-au-prince so are trying to do that rking with usaid and the united natons. the dynamic since thearthquake we did not wk a lot with the united nations orces in the things that we hae oe. we mentioned the general d i have knownach other 46 years d we found ourselves othe 13th of januaryworking side by side like we haddone in 1984 d we recognized that no oe group could do this alone even to gatherit was an insurmountable challenge, so we determined immediately we must work side by side on verything we di that has translated to mean today we are continuing to work with the new -- manusta and

products i entioned which is a great thinto see if we go out and work together because we relied upon -- iowa relied on a joint task fce relid upon hun forces o provide a safe and secure environnt for us to do humanitia assistance. and think as a suprise to many, securityemains stable through th course of the opatn at a time when many ought that he would revert ck to its violent ways from the gangs who conolled most of the city it did not happen. i submit it did t happen because the leadership of the united nations military. the foes there and the actis that they took in the days following the arthquake. and obviously, all the other military that showed upto provide help to the hatian people responded appropriately so. i found them to be resilient,

every patient an vey gracious for all of the sport, and we have benefited from that relationship. as we go forward, one o the arease're looking to provide from the u.ssouthern comman is to be preparedfor the next disast that wuld strikehaiti cause if history is any indicator, there ll be anther dister whether it is heavy rain. we really do not need a hurricane as all of you know to create a disaster in aiti. all ofou need is about 5 inches of rain and about eight of our period and you have disaster of potential immense proportions. more so today than prior to the earthquakes because the situation that they find thsels inwith these displaced persons. so we are preparing to be able to react quickly come as quickly as psibl to rpon at the request of the government and our ambassador to rturn if

necessary to provid life-saving support. so that's what we are doing today. i believed in there and be prepared to address questions you might have. thank you. >> we can take two or three questions that anyone has them. over here? this is all being taken recorded. we want to capture every one. we will let people come in and get their seats in. let's take thefirst question. please identify yourself by name and organization. >> kim from inernational developed. thank you for a much for your presentation. que opened by talking about deteriorated situation in port-au-prince with increased numbers of demonstratons. and the end of your military

presence in haiti yesterday. what come to know, what comes next? what is mansa in the position to this to? the last time we saw demonstrations like this was in the lead up in the january 04 in e lead up to they were received from office. community allowing theawional enforcement office the monstration continue. what happens? who is a way tguarante the security of the country? >> i tnk he best way to do this thave all of the questions answered now and then we will stop and the general will respond andwe will go on with the pgram. >> good mrnin my name is [inaudible] and i am from the haiti renewed alliance. the question-- i want to thank you for the good work thatyou have doneo my country because i'm from haiti. the question i would like to ask is always for a long time there has been a back-and-forth. every time e is a disaster

that the internationa community ers' there a plan for haitians especially to wordsnd emergency preparedness because it seems to me we've never really had that and we always rely on th internional sort of community to come and help, and is there such a plan to transition in situation like that could occur? ..

what is in place right now seri wise and how strong do you see that minustah force a other as kind of in a longer-term plane,etting the basis for longer-term economic security? >> okay. there are no softball questions here, that is for sur. with respect to the poential for unrest and political

violence tt has long plagued hai over the years, i think minustah, my personal assessment is that minuah is in the best position they have ever en and to work with the government of haiti, the haiti national police andthers obviously, to continue to provide a safe and secure environment. worst-case obviously being able to react to demonstrations et.. he even witha lot of dire predictions of violent demonstrations, we haven't seen materialize, but nevertheless, my relationship

with the u.n. forces there and minustah reassured me that the mmanders there a doing everything they can to maintain a secure environment. they are paying attention to all the things that wewould expect them to pay attentioto. they have buil up a number of forces there, but given the fact that the haitian national police are still very much in a stage of trying to establish sufficnt capacity that you would need fora policeorce and much less a national police force to secure the streets of port-au-prince let alone the rest of theountry, they need a lot of help and they ar going to need to continue to get this help for years to comebecause in my view, that long-rm

solution to security andaiti is the establishment of professional police force that respects te rule of la, that respects human rhts with the dici system of course to go g with it that can sport that, but that is a long way off and wiltake a lot of work. the abilitin the short-teri thk for minustah, the united nations along with the governnt of haiti to adress potential insecurity i think is as good as it has been,and they are prepared to addressit accordingly i think as they go forward here through the political season if yo will if thelections take place, as they desire to do so. but, again, we haen't seen any indicators that would lead us to believ that the violent nature of litical insbility-- the

haian people enjoy the rights of all democratic people, to protest and they have done it very peaceably over the last few months, so i thi hopefully they will continue to respect the rule of law as they express their views as they go through the political process, and not resort to violence as they go forward. so, i think that is the best i can offer in terms of that, but i doelieve tt they are focused on this minustah. at thelan to buid the capacity to react natural disasters, e answer to yr question is yes, w are- we being through usaid and the . government as well as the u.n., look to build cacity in the

government of haiti and when i talko our ng partners an haiti, i asked them t look and see how we can build capacity in the government of haiti in all these areas, because truly, the solution in the long term, in terms of ability is w do you build capacity in th institutions in the local mmunity as well as the naonal goverent. it has been severely affected by the earthquake itself but even before the rthquake it was very minimum to say the least. it doesn't exi adequately today. we building a sum these programs as i mentioned with u. southern command engagents emergency operation centers for example wth local mayors so that they can have some cacy to react to local emergencies as best as possible but they have no national syem in place that is needed to do this, so they will be subject to

the ability of the international community to provide thethe critical ssistance. as you know, it is unfortunate that it is very susceptible to flooding and it is a disaster waiting to happen subject to nature, quie frankly cause just the geography. itas an area where they are going to need tremendous internatiol response if they have a hurricane comes through that region. again this year as they did n 2008, the vernment ohaiti nor the local caacy does not exist to appropriately respond and i would suit that regardless of how good the government o hai and he lol communities woul have had in the ability to respond to a disaer, it would ave not been sufficient. at this earthquake had struck in a community and the united

states it would notave been sufficient. they would have needed outside help and the entire orld to reond, because it was just of that magnitude and in fact it destroyed most of eir capacity that they did have, so, but nevertheless we do need to work very hard to rebuild our capacity. i hik it is too early to really say. i in in terms of your last question about providing a basi element of security in order to allow the economy to flourish and to build and create jobs appropriately is going to take obviously a lot of time and a lot of international effort and investment. there are lots of programs going to cree jobs, whether it be wk for cash programs through the relief organizations they are, but those are just to

provide emergency work for work programs. the longer-term job creation and the elements ofsecurity goes to i think what i taedbout earlier, is how do you bld a haitian security force being their national police that can provide basic security on the streets, where entrepreneurshi and microeconomies can start to take root andflourish and providan environment where they can be viable. that is a question that i think is yet to benswered, bui think investing in the haitian national police to increase their capacity to the lev it nes to be to provide a basic level of security is fundamental to many of the things that need

to be done, whether it is creating the economy, to getting their education systo the level it needso be and i would put education-- mentned jobs but in my view, you could argue that edution is fundamental to creating jobs as well, so i think we have got alot of challenges in all thoseareas. >> thank you genal keen for respding to those questions. my name is b maguire. i'm the chair f his hai working grp and will now move us forward the rest of our program, looking forward from some perspectives that are complementary to those presented general keen and some that are slightly different. we have three speakers. one isepresentative of the international organization. one is the representative of an internationalngo that works o human ghts a devopment

ises and one is a haitian american scholar, who works on macroeconomic issues, so this is the blenthat we havefor you. are representative of an international organization is dr. augustkouame. he is the lead economt and sector leader for povert duction and economic nagement for the caribbean and the latin america andabbean region vice presidency of the world bank. he joined the world bank in 1996. from the perspectiveof an international ngo working on hun rights and development issues, we have subfive, who is the director of the robert f kennedy memorial center for human rights, and sheeveloped an overss rfk center program for day-to-day operationsand longerm strategies and was due go to haiti moow but is postponing the trip. of course she is actuallyoing to the gulf coast tomorrow. and are haitian americans dollar

and someone who works on macroeconomic issues is dr. ren aubourg. he is the assistant professor at the school of public affairs and director of international programs at the center for blic finance researcat american university and it is worthwhile mentioni that in that capacity he manages a cooperation program betwn american university and the centra bank of haiti. dr. o'berg has been in haiti fairly recently. he has t to hav20 goats there. he is overseeing the reconstruction of his family's residence and he conties his work with the central bank and other economic authoties in haiti. we will begin wi dr. kouame moved to monika karla varma and then ren aubourg. i would ask each of our speakers to try to keep it within 15 minutes.

>> good morning. it is a pleasure toe here. i will ty to kee it within 10 or 15 minutes so we can have time for questions. i will first say a few words on howe saw haiti after e quake , and how we see haii going forward and then if you allow me i will say a few words about what we have been doing to respond. we all know the quakeo january 12 was a very powerl one. it caused 120%, destroyed 120% of haiti's gdp. it cause growth to decline to a prected 8.5% this year compared to an expected 2.5% so

the quake has caused a loss of growth of about 1. thiss very significant in a country where gdp per capita or income is already one of the lowest in theorld and the lowest in the western hemisphere the government in hait has traditionally been very small in terms of financial capacity. government reven represented on average about 10%of gdp compared to 20 o 30% for other developing countries and beause of the earthquake d damage to government ability to collect revenue, the government submitted 7% of gdp this year so this will leave a big gap, essentially because there is a need for reconstruction. there is a need for government to have a population meet the bac needs.

as we just heard, there are lot of people-- close to million. is significant the government will spen20% of gdp this year to meet those and other needs, so if youare-- there is a gap of 20% of gdp that the government needs to find somewhere and it is going to me mostly from the international community. i say that because it is a challenge that we want to discuss later on. there is also a big gap in government in the whole country's ability to mobilize over our economi it vividly and that is a factorin the large payment deficits for the country. the good news is that because of the earthquake, we have seean increasing- but other payments

are under stress. infrastructure, we are very limited, as we know when there has been serious at with the earthquake, escially rds and other means of transportation. no ts is a picture-- i am t trying to present you with the big picre but this is the reality on which we have to work, and from whi we have to try and improve. what are the challenges from th? in the short-term, we think there wre three in challenges. first, there is the challenge of dealing with the population. the population has been used to livi in a criis pron economy

, but this is probably the biggest that many living haitians have experienced in their lives, and and they hope the government will respond and they have heard the international immunity will respond. we have heard demonstrations in one of the questions. the second challenge is to deal with the iernaonal community the international community is an important partner of haiti, has been in the past. it i hopefully to be less son th future when haiti become self-sufficient but for now it is an important partner in reilding haiti, and there are other pressures on the international community. resources. be heard some partners will b

traveling to t north of mexico and there are events happening quite a mullah, happening in chile. theris the global economy crisis. the international community expectto see action in haiti. the third challenge is to deal with the invasion of t econom , the private sector both international and doestic. the good newafter the quake is that the private sector stayed in haiti and in fact seied the opportunity from the quake, but have to be protected.

otherwise its very possible that some t economic activities that were and should take place in haiti may go as well. how to deal with these short-term challenges. the governmentuickly moved to reestablish basic and key economic function, key economic and financial function. we do not see a collase of financial systems in haiti. vernme payrolls will move very quickly, buin fact revenue collection h revealed somewhat. so the short-term prospects are good if the population and the international community and the private sector take the time to study very carefully what is going on. i think there will be less impatience, but unftunately people don tke the time to analyzthings and we can't expect tt seeing results.

in addition to improving or esblishing key economic and finaial functions, the government will need to move very quckly to take advantage the low-hanging fruit and show visible results. now, in e loer term, the big question for the long-term is whether haiti can move from a crisisroneeconomy to a desirable economy. the wish of everybody is that we hope this will happen, but it won't happe-- it will take a lot ofwork. the conditio for this to tae place are there, but there is no guarantee for results. there are a number of things that we need to be done for the

next decade to be the decade of iti if i may put it that way. first, the potential of the economy to be transform into unfortunately agriculture has been a great potential but has never really at least in the recent history, thtapped. the private sector has tried to operate despite business environment that is at last conducive in neighboring countries. if this were to improve, it would seek more investment. accesses been quite limited. only 0.6% of fate finance has-- countr has access to microfinance in haiti. you may see more peoplewith axes to microfinance because this is what many people will actual use for their small

businesses. they list is long and i hopefully will have time to come back to some of them during the questions and answers. reading sme of the documents the governmentut forward in new yk on march 31, as the dominating-- it is quite encouraging to see the government. if you have time i would encourage you to look at i. it is very wellprepared, very good vision and there is a document also prpared by the haitian private sector, which is a very good document. said so e vision is there and the intention is there. i think the reltis, if w go the amount pledged, there is hope and we are as a partner of haiti repaired to contribute to that.

now, what has been done and wha are we doing going forward? the day after the quake our president announced that haiti would the provided with 100 llion to help respond to the quake and we have started a project are ready to transfer a good part of these resources on h 18. to have the government repair infrastructure and had some of the ministries again. we have increased the size of some of our existing projects. r example in education, community development and we are in the process of developing support to hav government meet the final-- that i mentioned earlier. going forward, we pe that we will get more resources from o

ne round oforgnizations for the i., which will be our-- and with the expected payment we hope to have a lot more resources for the reconstruction in haiti. i think i have used my time and i woud happy to answer questions. thanks. >> thank you to youfor hosting today's meeting and for having me here toy. just to give you aittle bit of background on the robert f. kennedy center's involvement in haiti, we have bn working in haitisince 2002. weive an annual human rights award to courageous leaders on

the gound who have met with the human righ struggle and in 2002 that went to our partners in health which i believe most people are now familiar with. she was a voice for her work on the right to health. not only was she dog grndbreaking hiv/aids treatment at a time when it was considered difficult to do so in resource poosettings butshe was doing so from a human rights pepective andreally over e years what that has meant is working in partnership with the ministry of health to build its capacity to do a ob. haiti has a constitutionally recognized right tohealth. the rfk award begins a partnership,a longerm partnership and the take on the social change goals of our rtners and engage from washin. over t years we have looked at the international community, the u.s. government, the international financial institutions role in haiti at times when there was no money

gog to the government and really looking at what the impact of the international community interventions re on economic a social rights, specifically how water and food inhe last year we have been looking at the impact of u.s. foodaid. all of this is done really with a human rights space framework, rely looking at the issues of development of food, health and water and education as human rits and not charity. since the earthquake, we have taken lesons learned from these interventions. we have ao followed th last two donors conferences as well to really look at how these lessons can help towardshe goal of building back better. i want to take a moment to go back a little bit intohe history of assistance to haiti, not too far back with the recent history and as i entioned for a number of years the international community has really, with help money going

directly to the haitian government and what that meant was that went through o's. being from an ngo myself in parting with many ngo's, ngo's and haiti doing valuae work however what has happeover time partilarly when you are looking at the publisector is that a parallel structure, rallel structures have been created and therefore weakening the public infrastructure. the other thing that we have looked at over time also as i ntioned are the donor conferences and i think is important to look back and note that in $2,048,000,000,000 was edged to haiti. we tried to rack tht money. we had a team of 20 people at nyu with different institutions trying to track where that money went. we could not track it. last ar in 2009, after the big hurricane hit haiti, a little over $350 milliowas pledged. that money was eventually tracked by the special envoy's office nd at the dons

confence in march, the number that was put out is that only 30% of that money was actually fulfilled. only 3 of the pledge money ever got to haiti. this has beenhat we have been hearing from the haitian government now, why is ts important? obvisly now the needis greater than ever and we need to make sure th that moy is fulfilled. yesterday inhe dominican republic there was a meeting to follow up on the donor's conference and president preval said since the donor's nference they had only received moey ad $55 million. there are uances and a lot of reasons for that but i think it is important t highlight that we as the international commity need to lfill our obligations,and being human rights attorney i just want to clarify there is nobligation to intervene in haiti. there's no obligation to go in d pride assistance but once we make that ctment we do have an obligation to do no harm. what does that mean for the haitian people, when you hear in

2004, remember right after the donors conference being in haiti and people weresaying we hear a billion dollars is cing buwe don't know what projects it is supposed to go toward. we don't knowwhat the plans are. similarly, i 2009, it took us several weeks to find out which countries had pledged what money that was going to haiti. this year things are a little bit different. there is a real effort for transparency there is a web site that is up to tracks and list the pledges hours after the donors nference and there is an effort to make that information publ. t me step back for just a moment and explain why we are very focused on transparency and accountability by talkg a little bit about what i mentioned ealier, human rights-based approach and i think this is critical as we are moving forward. it is something that is an importt piece, there is a large amount of money going into

haiti. a real effort, a real good will. support every cornerf the world, how do we make su that that money is sent in the right way and supports the human rights of the haitian people? huma rights,rights-based approach includes several different components the keys participation, putting patnts at the center of all of the work that we do. that means consulting with communities en projects are designed, monitoring and giving information when projects are being implemented. ..

recently since the earthquake to really push but that's going to be critical. often difficult conversations with the donor nations, but as support. whatoes that mean? our government is talking about ving about $100 billion in support, the brazilian vernme gave $15 million very recently in budgetary suport. so these are things that are going to be critical if we are serious bout actually resulting and building the capacity of th government and transparency. again, this is critica. it's not just transparency for all of us inhis room who are followg and the website is a great way todo that. the idea behind the website which is being hostd by the ministry of planning and th

u.n. tipi is to be able to plaque to the contract pledged with feedbacfrom the ground upso that's sort of the hope. we are not quite there yet ad have to motor to insure at is actually plemented he full eent. but how does the information get down to the local community? that's not, you know, a web site is not going to be that answer. 's going to have to be committee meetings. it's going to have to be through the text message or there are lots of creative ways to rao to get that information out to the local comunities that are waiting for th money. accountability. we talked about building up gorlka hicwe have seen as does need a lot strengthening but also accouability for inrnational ana government level projects. a roject ispromised but not delivered or is not delivered properly or is never at all what is the redres complete

mechanism which we argue should be built into the capacity of the governmen there hasbeen -- there are probably experts in this room familiar with the complaint mechanism, but really in haiti is critical that that be built into the gvernment capacity. the final element of the rihts sed approaches nondiscrimition which is fairly self-planatory. there has been some really incredible rhetoric post earthqua. we went with a meber number of donors psychiatry clinton, administrator shaw, a lot of fos in the government are talking about partnerships, and transparency, caaity building toead the question is what is the machinery to do that, and i think that we need to - i knw that we have had some gd conversations with folksa usaid recognizing there is a lack of transparency. what are we actually going to do about it? i woud argue a similar sit is

needed at usaid smilar to the recory.gov or what has been planned throug the undp and haitian government and haiti could be a pilot proje. we shouldbe able to trak if we are giving money to ducation we should be able to track it down to the floor not just to see the building but to actally see the school was functioning with their teachers and students are attending schools. accountability as i mentioned is critical that we investn that sort of accontability mechanism. there are some positive development. the interim coission i thnk they have their first informal meeting yesterday. the formal meeting will happen on june 14th and that is basically a body that is to set policies for and coordinate the aid. a friend of mine from e inspector general's office and i'm sorry for calling about, but

there are lessons we need to ta very seriously about it's not just coordination but what are the nitty gritty mechanics we talked about. there will be other disasts but unfortunately may fall upon haiti whether it is hurricanes or what n to read how are we going to retool and eadjust our plans and comtment when that happens? also the muti donne fund the world bank is hosting. this is something a lot of oups of been calling for for years to pl the donor funds into a centralized place where there'scoordination and there's oversight of these projects. the fund has been established thworld bank put some mony and to establish it, the brazilian government gave $55 million recently to it. however, the amoun of moy that we expect to see in that fund is only about half a million dollars of the

10 billion we have seen pledged so although the mechanism is there and th are going to be -- there are always technical challenges ned to be utilizing that futher. i st want to go back a little bit because we're talkingto a colleague from usaid so iill take this moment to talk about some of the work that we have done free arthquakes looking at the u.s. aid and i think this is critical as we are talking as the rhetoric has changeas th machinery is changg how are we going to actively catchp and one o the places there is a lot of talk is te reform that is moving forwardut i just want to give yo a snpshot of u.s. food aid and atudy we did last aust in the central plateau. we openethe right approach persctive looking at the right to food basicay quality of food, acceptable the, how culturally appropriate it is and

what we found is that of thoe who had received food aid for those resurveyed 60% didn'tnow how to prepare the food they had received. 40% was a type of food they hadn't eaten. more than half the surveys spent over four hours in line to ge the food primarily women. 10% of the trip was spoiled or not a double an 10% said the food made them ill. this was bore the earthquake. a bigger problem we need to talk about this the machinery that we have to deliver the food. 15% of our food is multistate meaning food that must besold to fund a project. what does that mean in practical terms? if you he to sll food on t locamarket to build a road or a development project you have to sell that most of the time across lower than cal producers. you are undercutting the agricultural community by doing that and we have very strong

conversations with people off the record who say thi is hamperng agricultural depmentin haiti. the other thing is laws around local pocurement. our fod aid comes from the united states to haiti and what does that mean? this is why we are seeng things like culturally inappropriate food. we talked about the need to strengen t agricultural sector. part of that is clean to be we are brnging in a lot of food from the reunited states. there's a lot of momentum ight now d i think for those of us on haiti to not consid to work on he, hose of us who have had involvement in the gears are involved in a strong way and i think if we look at photographs that we saw in the video it's hard to see those every time we look at them and i think the fact this room is packed is

encouraging. therare a lot of people focused on this in the international community and i think everybody has the good ll and good intentions but i think we really nd o make a long-term commitment to oviding we talked abut the patient peopleand the international counity private-sector. a lot of an official at the level of the haitian government as well and there are going to be very difficult times ahead as we reached towards elections of the administrationincrease in how are we going to a right to the moments and stayommitted so we can get to the point where ultimately the haiian people are respected and realize that we are all there to support that i would be happy to take questions.

>> i would like to thank usaid for being part of tis pal. i would ke tostructure my position o these points. first, an overview of the situation prior to the eahquake and then i will talk a little about the chalenges the haitian economy faces and finally i will express some of my preoccupation with respec to the upcming messagein flux of aid to haiti. let me stop the the custard with the economy. for once a long time if you look at the data on haiti prior to the art critic, there was some positive to the element i the economy. for the fifth consecutive time they had a per capita growth

that rahed 2.9in 2009 which is quite considerable given th fact that the country was stroke with to huricanes. yet theydeclined from that number to single-digit numbers. they were more in the range of 1 dollar for 40 u.s. goods. international reserves were around three months. the government had implemented preventing military policy and also the poli with leaders financing the creation. so as a result of som of positive performance, june 2009 the untry went from 1.2 billion debt csolidaon which would be about 60% of its national debt and which put

eight init sort of became the country to reach the comprehension.4 the initiativ it seems only one aspect of the situation. the other thing to keep in mind that the same time is that all of this occurred on the backdr of poverty and income inequality. inact if you look at it shows he's not only the poorest country inhe atmosphere it is al the most inequitable one the plot from the house consumption service fro 2008 shows 56% of the population lives on less than 1 dollar per day. the reason why i talked about household living conditions because i don't have more recent data on the slassume the same

trend has continued over time. s56of the population lives on 1 dollar per day via 76 on $2 per day. haiti hasthe highest coefficient at 2.65 making it the most of the highe income disparity in the orl the second highest with coefficientof 1.55. so what is iteresting to note is the top 20% of the poulation 69% of the country as wll and the other hand the 20% of the population gts only 1.4% of th world. so the remaining part about the 60% portion ofhe population which we present more like the middle class we ee 29% of th country's wealh.

to realize that during that time we have had massive drain of the edated population of the country. it went first to the countries with population about 5 million people and among a countries in the world in terms of the migration of educated labor. as of 200083.6% of its labor has and agree to than always surprised when i go to haiti as a part of the program tat only amine with the american university'm alws shocked to e that when i asked x or y is the because they may have migrated to canada or to the u.s.. so this is a serious problem. let me talk quickly about some of the challenges. and the reason why i mentioned to you the snapshot is becse

of the fact that if the aid is not managed properly, the situation that you have in terms of the income disparity can exact and crete tension wih respect to the economy so that we say quickly a few wrds of the challenges from the earthquake. many reports have identifed the challenges that are important so i will not go too much into this. what i would like to focus on primarily is the challnges as they relte to my own experience 's important to note it has en the most affected the earthquake has been in the sector with about 40 of the damage. in ter of the challenges it's

important to note there is a possiblefinancial loss steve to be vindicated. the description of th earthquake is possible that there may be the capitalization of the banking sector asset increase to thinkg system portfolio of non-performing loans. andfurthermore, the baking system in haiti is very concentrated. the three largest bank accounts for more than 80% of the banking seornd have referred the financial. another problem s to do with the increase in terms of short-term. it's important that something like this occur. there isn't really a supply problem in haiti with this concern. if you look at the issue it is only about 3% which is ch lower thanhe average in the

region whh is about 55 to 60 persons so the main issue there is traditionally most of the goalsaout 10% of individual dollars and in fact the same person ge about 80% of the loan so we have to show something like this ut there are so many people from the lower class and middle class that ha lost their house so they will be finding some form of financing. it is lso important for productive actvities. what is interesting to note is on behalf of the credit extended to the service actvities only 1% of agriculture in the transportation sector. let me talk also about some of

the preoccupation that i have with respect o foreign aid. and the reason why i want to mention that is that report has t insisted on some of the potential problems. if you look at the literature, basicly the emeing consensus is that no country can left ot of povertyust based on foreign aid and this is about half of the century has experiend in the development work sort so the aid to be effective certain conditions have to be aligned and i am going to talkut a few of them. so massive foreign aid can either be a curse or a blessing it all dpends on certain things d what we talk about the irst point.

you have to hve important complementaries betwn foreign aid and policies and look at the institution in terms of whih affects. so the literature doesn't show there' a strong and positive relationship between aid and growth. however it sws wat matters isn't aid is crinally the type of aid that is given. humanitarian aid has a letl effe on the growth. however other types of aid such as the aid to agriculture or social ector projects do hav an impact on the economy. however that impact has time-life and iteems to be shorter to the agricultural prodts tha to social

projects. this is a needt is given to the education that tends to be more short term in terms of impact. the second thing also is that aid tends to b very fungible in the sense tat the government or national government can locate their resources in response to the flow so it may be difficult if you try to channelaid to e public sctor of what can be hampered by the composition of the public expenditure that is favored by he local or te national government. another point is thatow it is perceptive andfftive nate of anticipating and reventing potental rults of apital inflow and also become cruial.

one of the problems with foreign aid coming to a country is tht if it just goes into the international reserved what happens is it will nd to lead to an incree of te monetar supply. and pressur and his will aect the role that you have insi the country and this will tend to hurt the competitivess of experts due to heir position of the loal currency. so it is efficientike this there be a need to accept liquidity. no in the case of the central bank of haiti, one of th preferd way is to stabilize the liidity is b the elling of what is called the bond which

are basically issued by the central bank. thproblith somhing like this is tat tese bonds have high interest rates anin a situatio whre you alreadyhave se type of bottleneck and people are ot secure of where to go in terms of the future dependency will be fo the local bank to ines in the b nd therefore they have their mon there and they are not interested to give money to the private sector. another prlem is that the relative capacity consensus of the beneficial impact. what s imprtant speech to the

capacity with the sanction and wh's important here. before pouring money into the sector beaverve to ask yourself wther or not the money that was already in the sector was used properly and effectively in the first ce. if not, just pulling money into the sector because it has been identified as a priority may and up just creating additional risk. furthermore, what shows often and it exacerbates the assumption of the problem is at you ook at the donor organization, ngos and government often there is a lack of coordination between the various urgency's and often for skild local resources and you

end up with serious bottleneck in any type of aid. and finally, they brought up the issue of how flexible policy makers are in addressing the trade-off between the capitol resources f financing and comforting of aid. one thing i saw at the convention earlier is that the relationship betweeaid and economicrowth tend to beore pronounced in countries where you have somepolitical institutios than in countries where the institutio tend to be weaker so to go back to the point about the flexibility, in terms of trade offs. what is importt to realize here is that the research shws that grants tend to be more appropriate for i called the need based projects, whereas the

loans tend to be more appropriate so the type of project. so therefore those are some of the types of things that will need to be taken into account. and this is more of an analytical evidence bad on what i have seen in my trips to haitis the housing market is becoming more and more segmented in the sense thpart of the housing market of u.s. currency. d i have a situation where many of haitans i know out of their llmark of the market because they can't afford payin rent that are extremely

expensive. so inhe ed, i would like to colude by saying that i welcome the aid that is given to haiti, but i think that is what will in practice be the test and whether the aid if works and how thisis managed because my fear is if i i not managedproperly you may end up with a situation where overall tensionecome even bgger in the society in the sense that there is no effect on the west segment of haitia society. thank you. [applause] >> thank you to all o our speakers forctually keeping well within the timeframe.

it enables me to have a few minutes for commentand then we will go into our q&a. i think one of the hings we have been hearing a lot today is ejuxtaposition betwen patients and inpatient or frustration. it's going to be i think a dichotomy that hopefully will not grow it will be somehow managed. but i thought it was interesting what it edmondson digest r. dee and the dominican republicnd i would like to read a quote from him. he of curse is the second three general special representative for haiti of the u.n.. he said yesterday that tangible chge must be solved by the men, women andhildren living in desperate conditions in camps in order to avoid this discontent, these demonstrations we heard about, being transformed io socialnd political instability than he added the international

community must support polical stabily in he country witho political stability the efforts deployed by the haiian government or the international community will notbearfruit. so it is somewh of a assessment from mr. malai who is on the top of the scene. i'd le to share w you briefly three kind of barometer's i will befollowing as this process goeforward in terms of haiti monika lra's pote founitself and move forrd and ild that better. one barometer i will be looking at is how it works with these subconacting were outsourcing of the aide to haiti. in this fairly realistic to see the patterns that were esblished in the past where much of the intertional systems will go to externals investors, private sector,

non-governmental lectors o for-profit contractors will remain the order of te day. but we ave bee there and we have done that and i think som the statistics that renee showed in the inequits in the society suggest this approh toward aid has not really accomplished any kind of a broad equitae development in hati. sweating get willie very important to see whawould b the otcome of this subcontrting of haiti monika kalra's to the limit outside interests particularly againwith the juxtaposition of rhetoric we've en hearingf the nors' conference of panership and cooperation and so on. i am sometimes reminded of appare that the manifestation of insanity is doing the same day over and over again and expecting differenttresults. we have got to do things differently.

both national, reonal and local manifestations in th recovery. .. the state is absent in the lives of its people. for this recovery and for stability to take root in haiti, people expect their government to produce and reform -- produce and perform for them, and is in all of our interests to help them achieve all of those expectations. remember that the government of paiti lost almost 25% of its civil servants at the time of the earthquake, and i would add

these will probably some of the better people who were still at their desks at 5-something in the afternoon. as we have heard also from previous speakers, the state needs financial resources and it needs human-resources. my third barometer will be looking at the role of ordinary haitians in the refunding of their country, particularly the use -- youth. where are ordinary haitians in the rebuilding process? has the population then effectively mobilized? i have seen reports from the haitian press of frustration of population is not being mobilized and not being included. idleness continues an idle hands and idle minds -- we know what that can result in. this is an important opportunity to mobilize ordinary haitians to

help rebuild their country, held one skills to engage their talents and to gain a greater stake in the country and their role in it. as a subset of this barometer, i would be watching carefully the success or failure of attempts to decentralize the country, and we heard reference to the populations in the countryside. those of you who know me -- i will be watching very carefully as well an idea that i have been working on for three or four years with haitian authorities, and that is the mobilization of haitians, young and old, in some sort of national civic service corps as facilitated by the constitution of haiti. with that final comment, we open it to questions and answers. if you would please come to the microphone, to facilitate your voice being heard in the recording of this. you can either address your

question to a specific speaker or to the panel. please identify yourself when you address your questions. we will group the questions in groups of three for the panel, and then we will take it that way. >> is, i want to thank the speakers for the very interesting panel again. i'm from the brookings institution, and i have two quick questions. first, the question of inflation. we have seen and massive influx of inflation with the reconstruction. prices were almost doubling in the year. so are there any kind of -- is anyone taking charge to make sure that the same thing will not happen in haiti? is the world organization coordinating with authorities and the reconstruction authority on making sure that those are avoided?

the second thing, what i'm quite worried about, is i feel very strongly, everybody is talking about building government capacity, but often, ngo's pay more money for a driver who can speak a bit of english then the government pays for people, so how are you going to build capacity, if it is easier and more beneficial for the individuals to work for ngo's? >> thank you very much. next question. >> i am an economist. i'm talking for myself. i would like more than a question, to make a comment. one particular aspect, which i would like to thank them is i was very pleased to see on this panel, there is a haitian national, which has not been the

case in a lot of the forms i have been at, and i think it is assured for doing what you are saying, and i welcome robert mcguire's conclusions in what he will be watching out for, seeing how haitians will be allowed to participate in the rebuilding of their countries. there are haitian professionals that i know who not only know the country but also have the capacity to intervene in some cases, but they are never invited to talk about the country, and i think that is very important. i would like to also comment on the brain drain has the frustration and discontent.

the person before me has mentioned the disparity in wages between ngo's and the government sector competing for resources, and everybody's talking about enhancing capacity, but i think a lot of us need to think about how to keep capacity, not just in the government sector, but also in haiti because the frustrations -- robert mcguire talked about ordinary people. when i went to haiti last few times, the frustrations i heard were about professionals not being used. how are you going to keep professionals? a lot of them have migrated now. it is true there is a difference in living, but a lot of haitians would have liked to stay in the country, but little by little, after the earthquake, they are discouraged because they are not being used. thank you. >> thank you. our third question, and then we will have a response.

>> i was wondering, especially working on a story this week, in dr. mcguire's first barometer he said he was going to monitor and watch was the subcontracting and so on of companies who would be coming into the market. looking at particularly the seat distribution that has been going on recently by one of the largest companies in the world, i work on a story that was published yesterday that was treated to usaid with basically little accommodation for the haitian peasant farmers, so i was wondering what guidelines would be putting in place for companies coming in for wherever they are apt to not only make sure that the work is being accomplished but to accommodate beyond what the government might do with the local people for the companies as well to accommodate

the needs tradition of the haitian people. >> ok, who on the panel wants to address any of these points? we will make sure they all get address one way or the other. the issue of inflation and building capacity of the government to level the playing field. >> with respect to the issue of inflation, i came across perhaps one month ago, i came across a document that was prepared where the -- discussing the potential effects in terms of thing he could have in the haitian economy, so i think that they are very concerned about it, especially since one

of the things that is being used in monetary policy in haiti partly is an indirect form of inflation targeting. it would seem to me that the central bank will follow the situation. >> on inflation and the government capacity, we have been in discussion with the central bank and warning them about the disease. in the case of haiti, the risk is lower because there is the world economy and haiti in particular was on a very sharply declining path as far as inflation is concerned.

inflation was expected to be very low in haiti in 2010. because of the expected reconstruction activity, we predict inflation at about 8.5% this year. it could be slightly higher. it could be close to 10%, but we do not expect the kind of inflation that we saw in haiti two years ago. however, it is important that in addition to the monetary policy instrument, it is also important that domestic supply resumes quickly in haiti, and that is one of the things that we are watching and working on in our project to insure that as money comes in, if meat supply of food and services, that is not only generic work, but also to quell

inflationary pressures, but there is no magic bullet. with the expected influx of foreign aid, you have got to have some inflation. we hope it will not be in double digits. in terms of government capacity, you are absolutely right that with all our ngos and international organizations, we want to do good work in haiti. you need labor and therefore, you pay salaries, and use international comparison, and it so happened that those are high in government, so you compete for good quality workers. i do not know whether there is a short-term solution to that because the uncertainty would be not to do anything.

we cannot encourage government to increase salaries vary significantly in the subject sector now. we know the financial constraints. what we do in situations like that, it is not perfect, but it is a stock that measure. in addition to maintaining their jobs and having some salary increases, learning by doing, and in doing so, hopefully when the economic situation improves, they get high salaries, but again, this is a very difficult situation, and it is not particular to haiti. you find it in every developing country. >> i would like to address something very quickly. earlier, i think all this had mentioned that there is a

capital of 20% gdp, and one of the things is that you think that there is what is called an aide saturation point, which at one point, we start to show that saturation point is around 8% or 9%. if you are giving aid to things like agriculture, industry, and so forth, the saturation point at 16% to 90% of gdp when you are looking at all eight, so that is also one of my concerns in the sense that all of that money will be coming to the country, but you have very serious absorptive capacity from constraints. >> in terms of our second question, i accept with great pleasure your complements to the haiti working group, and we will

be asking you in the fall to join us on the panel. are there any comments from the panel on this issue of brain drain more broadly than just within the government? >> what if kathleen have mentioned is correct. i think the government has tried to put some effort in trying to started, ann that is one of the reasons why they contacted american university, to try to come up with a program that would be done in haiti. so rather than sending -- because it happens that i was at the central bank of haiti in the 1990's, and at that time, i was part of a technical assistance program, so i was one among 20 haitians that went back to haiti for five years to work at this republic, and at that time, the

governor had put in place a program where he had sent about 25 patients to get master's degrees in u.s. universities. what happened is that once the program ended, they came back to haiti, but once the situation started to deteriorate, those who got their degree from north american universities are among the first to leave and get jobs elsewhere, so therefore, the new governor, when he became in power, decided to try something a little bit different. rather than sending students abroad, he decided to have them be trained in haiti, said the program at the american university we have with haiti is one where we provide credit certificates to 20 government officials there, and therefore, the courses they are getting are exactly the same ones they would

be getting here, said the degree they are getting is a degree from american university. the only difference is that we are providing in there and as a result, we can reach more people. we go to haiti to deliver these courses. >> we have to move a little faster because we have a long line of questioners, but are there any comments on our third question on the seed distribution issue and guidelines for companies coming into haiti? or shall we learn more by reading the story? i think you have stumped the panel on that. can we get three more questions please? >> i would like to thank the panel for their presentation. my question is around the

political implication with the donors and how that impacts the construction because the issue that i hear is the win a country gives money -- when a country gives money to haiti, they insist on a company from that country to go to haiti and actually do a project. that is why the government exercises flexibility with who they want to hire to do a project in haiti. for instance, there is an effort that was supposed to be built, and the government got some money from the building. one of the conditions was that a company from that country would

go to a different airport. it has been nearly five years. the air force has not been billed yet. how does that impact the reconstruction effort? first of all, is that a problem? second, how does that impact the construction aid? >> thank you, panelists. you have all touched on the immigration -- i'm from the neck. i would like to take up this immigration dead but look at it more broadly and not simply from the more elite levels. this is concerning not only to patients but also to the u.s., and that is, given what you have all said in terms of the current and continuing dislocation and some of the frustrations experienced by the haitians,

what's kept haitians in haiti? i would like your assessment on whether you think the effort has been put forward, the sort of haitian character issue, their patients, their resilience, or do you think that had to do more with the u.s. immigration policy? and given some of the projections that you all have made about potential future disasters, whether they are political or climatic, what do you think the prospects are for haitians somehow reaching a red line and deciding they have had enough? >> thank you very much. >> time from a small company based in north carolina. i have two questions related to economic activities. i think all of the panelists are unanimous thinking that the

private sector is important in the reconstruction. however, i wanted to know specifically what is the world bank and a lot of organizations doing to help improve the environment for businesses? in haiti, one of the problems is that it is very difficult to start a business. it takes a long time to start with you call a corporation. you do not have structures like limited liability corporations, so i think this is where -- this is simple in terms oo the changing the rules that would be inviting to business investors. secondly, i would like to ask what is being done so that asian-americans who are here who have established companies, who are proven to be good government

contractors so that their skills are being used as well, so that they are being considered as part of the procurement strategy? >> thank you very much. your questions could be, of course, the subject of one or two panels. i asked our panelists to comment very briefly on these questions, and then, we have time for four more right after this. and guess what is it that keeps people in haiti, what would be the tipping point of haiti, and then, the last question about engagement of diaspora and world bank and others improving the business environment. who wants to start? >> ok. shall i speak on the last question? >> go ahead. >> i will make it quick. i will start with the last question.

thank you for the question. this is a very important question, at issue for us. as you know, at the world bank, we have an institution called the international finance corp., which is mostly focused on private sector activities, and they have been very busy since january 22, planning to see ow the business environment can be improved. we start from a very low point where he rents 180 out of 186 countries and criteria for starting a business. starting a business in haiti is known to be very difficult. in other areas of doing business, haiti does plenty better starting a business -- then starting a business in paying taxes or access to financial aid, but the business environment is difficult. you mentioned one thing that makes it difficult to start a business is property rights, especially when you need to have

access to land as part of your asset. so what we're doing -- we have engaged with the government in trying to say the low hanging fruit that can be gotten in the short term to improve that, and i learned last week -- actually this week that the prime minister has decided, for example, that having a business register in haiti have been shortened. right now, it is much quicker to start a business in haiti. to register, it is quicker than it was before the earthquake. you have less agencies to go through. they are also trying to improve the presence for paying taxes. we are working with the central bank to create a partial guaranteed credit fund that would allow banks to provide

loans more quickly. we are also in the longer term trying to work with world bank to improve access to my for financing, which is also very important for a good number of business people in haiti. this is a long-term agenda, and i believe unless you address this agenda, you will not have sustained growth in haiti because the government cannot create growth without a private sector. in terms of involving haitian americans in procurement, on the world bank side, we are not doing anything specific -- specifically related to that, by i will take note and see what we can do. what i will say in the short term is that the haitian american businesses should get involved in the management of usaid to haiti.

being american, they can play a big role in how u.s. foreign aid is deployed. >> in respect to the question, that is definitely something many of us our faults -- are following. we have all seen the implications of different companies coming in with an idb project we track for many years. it is a much longer story, but one of the issues that came about at a point where the loans were supposed to be implemented in the project was supposed to come in if you have this project coming in, but which did not know how to work in haiti. these companies did not know how to actually implement in that setting, but i think on a broader level, with respect to the international ngos and the others working in haiti, i think it highlights the need to add minimum coordinate with the government and ideally partner

with the government. >> any comments on the immigration question? >> i will just mention that obviously, this is something that we watch very closely, and we saw no indication that increases directly or indirectly related to immigration through the course of the last five months post- earthquake, and if you look at the history of immigration, which is what has caused the most frequently -- it has not been natural disasters. it has been political instability and violence, but nevertheless, obviously, this is much different than previous natural disasters. what i found by just interacting with the populace over the time that i was there is their expectations are not very high. as long as you were making some basic needs in what they were

looking for -- they were not looking to make their way to the north coast to get on a boat. they were looking to survive and some measure of hope. i think it was addressed already that hope still exists, but their patience is wearing thin, so i think it is something we should pay very close attention to in the months ahead. >> we have much limited time, so if you all could keep your question to just one, please, and make it as quickly as you can. >> great, many thanks to the haiti working group for pulling together this forum. in the country program manager for world vision for haiti, and i am interested in this whole question of around ngos and government capacity building. i will give two examples of what i have seen, quick examples, in terms of ngos and capacity building. the first is working closely with the line ministry.

the other one i have seen is actually groups during specific education at a veey local level in which they all pulled in. i'm interested in what are some best practices, what have you seen, what are we learning out there about ngos and capacity building of the government? thanks. >> good morning. as we know, in haiti, we do not only have poverty, but we have a percentage of people in extreme poverty. i would like to know if the world bank is going to address specifically the fraction of people living in extreme poverty. because much of the time, they do say that growth addresses the problem of extreme poverty, but if we think that's the people in

haiti, would that be enough necessarily to address specifically the problem of these people who are completely outside, and would it be fair to children -- often, we address the problem because it is part of the security problem, part o+ the political problem, the fraction of people that we have to think particularly of. thank you. >> i'm with the embassy of canada here in washington. i think the panel asked itself a question, and i like to answer it. it was put more directly by saying it would be interesting to see how this international aid framework will do, and you also identified a couple of barometers, which are very much related to that, so i would be curious to know what your initial assessment is. maybe it is a little bit earlier -- a little bit early to

say our progress, but what the trend is. >> thank you. last question. >> i'm with the council on hemispheric affairs. i just want to ask you a question in light of the recent demonstrations and frustrations with political agitation. what are the prospects for a successful election in november and the installment of a new government and its capacity to be a true partner with the international community in the reconstruction ppocess? >> ok, i thank those question is for keeping a tight, so now, let's have some tight answers, keeping an eye on the clock please. go ahead. >> with respect to the best practices of partnerships, we have partnered with partners in health, so that is one example that i can speak to in much more detail. partners in health works at

every level with the ministry of health. the takeover old state-run clinics that are no longer functioning, work with the ministry to be staffed them, and get them up and running -- to restaff them. the day the earthquake hit, they were working doing a lot of work to build the education system. there is a real -- every step of the way, there is a real active partnership with the goal of capacity building. >> thank you, monica. we still have three questions that need to be addressed. one specific to world bank. >> on the extreme poverty? ok. extreme poverty is defined as people living below $1 a day.

there are also a large number of haitians who live in poverty, too, below $2 aaday. the short answer to the question is yes, most of our portfolio, our projects do address extreme poverty because that is our mandate. most of our projects -- we do not have products that aren't incentives to reach, so by definition, when we have a project, the intention is to benefit the four or the extreme for. let me give you some specific examples of projects in our extreme for. it is a big part of our portfolio.

prodep benefits the poor in rural areas. the other one gives micro ground to communities to find their own projects. the preferred project can be just building a well for the community in the village. it can be building an extra classroom for the school. it can be anything that will improve their lives. it can also be income- generating. it could be a small irrigation plan for the group of farmers in the village. they prefer the project compared to the program, and they get the final thing in the form of grants, so there is no need to be paid. they are generating income, and they can use it to send their children tt school. this is a very successful project. if you have time to look at it, i suggest you do. we learned to add additional financing to that project, so we

did the very important part of our portfolio. we also have a school program that benefits children from low- income families who cannot afford to have a meal at home, and that also benefits the extreme for. i know many people do not believe that the world bank for pays attention to the extreme for -- poor, but this is exactly what we do. >> if i could follow up really quickly on this -- in other parts of the world, the world bank is supporting traditional cash transfer programs -- brazil, one major example. >> this is something that we discussed regularly. conditional cash transfer can take various forms.

i talked about the school feeding program. it is not a cash transfer as such, but it gives incentives for families to send their children to school. the benefit from the program on conditions that their children go to school, so there are various forms of conditional trap -- cash transfer that you can implement in haiti. the city that i mentioned is also conditional. the community has gotten together building social capital. if an individual in the community comes with their on individual projects, there will not be finalized by the city, but if they work together with the community, they will benefit from the program, said the condition is that you want to use the program to build social capital so you can bring the level of violence or people leaving the community, taking the programs financing projects outside the community. so we have all these conditions, but i think the answer you were expecting as if you were going

to provide cash to families on the condition that they do something. we can envisage that, but in haiti, the conditions are not the same as in brazil. if we were to do that in haiti, which we might, the size of the beneficiary would be so large that you will create injustice if you select some group as opposed to others. in brazil, you can do it because the group of beneficiaries is quite limited, identifiable. in haiti, my assumption is if we were to do it, we would have to do it for 78% of the population, basically everybody living below $2 a day. i'm not saying we are not going to do it, but in haiti, we are looking for alternative forms that were better for the conditions in haiti. >> thank you. monica, perhaps i could ask you to comment onnhow you see the trends so far on the international aid framework that

we have heard about. >> as i said, there are some very positive things that we are seeing. most of the donors that we met with understand and accept the various principles and a new level of voter accountability. -- is being accepted. there is a lot of support for the idea of partnering with the government. i think that we have yet to see what that is going to look like once the money starts coming in, whether we are able to get the information necessary to make it transparent. just to take an example of technically how difficult that is, bob mentioned that going to the gulf coast mar, we have been working there for a number of years, to track our money post- katrina, we have over one dozen agencies with reporting requirements.

it is difficult to see where that money went. take that if you look at the different ministries, different governments, different agencies. it is going to be very tricky to make that transparent, but i think there is a real effort behind that. i think that there are going to be some very difficult times ahead in whether we are going to stay engaged and deliver on the assistance going in. i think there are some very positive signs, but we are very cautious in what we are looking at and whether there is going to be enough coordination on the ground to mechanically ensure that all of these different implementing agencies are working in conjunction and meeting with people. one of the things that we have not touched on enough in today's recession is this little society participation.

they have positions for civil societies, but they are not voting members, and we have to find a way to support and to strengthen still society participation moving forward. i do not know if that answerr your question, but it is an overwhelming amount of challenges that we face. >> we will end by having lieutenant-general keen make a couple of comments on the last question that was asked. >> with respect to the election coming up or hopefully coming up, i think there is a great opportunity here with the government international community to see these elections carried off in a transparent, safe, and secure environment. i think we can look at it and see the course of the

government. we have a relatively long stability we have not enjoyed that in some time, so we have an historical opportunity here to see him pass off his administration to the ext administration, whoever ttat might be, in a peaceful, safe, democratic manner. again, i think the conditions in haiti are such that they are very -- sitting on a nice edge in many respects, so how the international community is able to move forward quickly enough to provide humanitarian assistance over the course of the coming months to address some of the issues raised with respect to impatience and to deliver and truly deliver aid appropriately, fast enough to address some of these issues, i think to a large degree will

determine how the elections are going to be carried out and if the mechanisms are in place to do that, and hopefully, that will prove to be true. if we do not have some catastrophic event by hurricane interrupt this in the process and we are unable to respond quickly, i think if a disaster the strike, the international community must respond quickly and robustly to address it to minimize the loss of life to demonstrate that we were prepared to do that and do it in a manner that will enable to move forward because i think it will test everyone's patience, as mentioned, so i like to look at the glass is half full year and see if we have a great opportunity to see a smooth transfer of power from this government to the next to provide a historic opportunity for haiti to build back better,

as i think has been often said. >> with those comments, this brings our very informative, i think, and provocative meeting to an end. we will see you again in the fall. please thank our speakers. [applause] >> thank you very much, sir. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >>: surprise winners today on "booktv" prime time. the final decade of the cold war. the first tycoon, the life and times of cornelius vanderbilt. and history winner on how world bankers attended to rebuild the global economy following world war i that instead lead to economic collapse and the great

depression. today on "booktv" prime time on c-span2. >> new british prime minister and conservative party leader david cameron fields questions from members of parliament in his first prime minister's questions as the head of the coalition government sunday night at 9:00 on c-span. >> president obama spoke at carnegie-mellon university earlier this week. he noted that economic recovery act's impact on the economy, citing an estimated 720,000 clean energy jobs that will be created by 2012 from tax credits and loan guarantees in the economic stimulus law. allan meltzer responded to the president's speech, saying that the huge stimulus spending has done little to reduce unemployment, long-term unemployment has never been higher in the past six years. watch the president's remarks and read meltzer pose a response as well as a statement by house

minority leader boehner on our stimulus website at c-span.org /stimulus. a discussion now on education with speakers representing universities, state education departments, the federal parkman -- the federal government partner, and private sector. arizona state university hosted the event this morning. it is about 90 minutes. >> good morning everyone. i'm president of arizona state university, and i would like to welcome you to this panel on getting back in the race:

american education's future and fixing it. i do not know that the question is one of fixing because i generally think that it is not about failures. it is about seizing opportunities. so we now live in a very rapidly expanding and growing democracy the senses will probably report between 310 million or 312 million people growing to 400 million people. powerful forces of change, social change, economic change, economic challenge, competitiveness, powerful forces, positive forces of diversification in our culture, which means if you are going to move forward on to a democracy of a size we are now within and what will be in the future, and educational performance has got to be constantly enhaaced. we have to look to innovation. we have to look to finding new ways to do things because it is clear from the numbers -- i'm not going to believe the numbers -- our performance has picked up

to this point, and now, it is time to look at the step function we have attained, the achievements we have made in the past and to say we need more. we need to gain additional ways for educational outcomes to be enhanced. we need to enhance the teaching process, the learning process. pe need to use technology, all kinds of things. we're not going to spend time on introductions. we're going to spend time on answering questions and delivering new kinds of ideas. i'm going to ask a question to each of the panelists initially and use that as their introduction, basically. i'm going to start with heather harding, vice president for research and public policy at teach for america. teach for america has been working to find new models and new ways to move forward in terms of teacher production, a teacher performance, a teacher success, student outcomes, community success, and so forth. teacher training -- what do we need to do? >> we need to open up for

innovation, and we need to stay on the path of teacher accountability for effectiveness and student learning. we have to be careful about that because measuring student learning is a complex task, but we need to open up multiple pathways into the profession. we need to hold high standards for the profession. and we need to work on collaborating across both institutions as well as into from pre service into in service, said the job of preparing and supporting teachers and working on teacher development does not end once they graduate our programs or leave our training. we have to be able to reach into the process. we know that teaching is a learning on the job role, so we need to figure out ways to push that learning -- adult learning into the space working with kids. >> you are basically saying it is about the people, finding the right people to be teaccers, educating them in the right way,

in powering them as they move out? mostly what we hear about is money. >> well, is and it ought -- i'm going to put the money question aside -- isn't it odd that for decades we have had a profession that has been disconnected from student learning in terms oo the accountability system? that is not to say that we need to be focusing on a single test measure as the only way of considering student learning, but i think teachers in their individual practice value when kids learn, so we have to figure out a better system to bring the two together. obviously, we want to attract the best and brightest in the profession, but it is a big profession, so we need to attract as many folks who are deeply committed and well- prepared, and then, we have to support them throughout the process. whether it is an alternate route, whether it is a program like teach for america, whether it is a traditional school of education, i think that does not matter. i think we need to look at what

the practices should be to support the candidates that are coming to us, and we have to ensure that they do a good job once they are the teacher of record. >> you are the dean of a 5000- student teachers college at a university and that emerged from a teachers' college as a teacher's college tradition. you are producing many new teachers per year. colleges of education around the country have been subject to serious criticism, justifiable criticism for our inability to adjust and adapt quickly enough to the changing demographics and the changing challenges. what do you do? how do you improve? how do colleges of education improve? them a first of all, we take ourselves seriously and hold ourselves accountable for our graduates, which means we follow them through their careers to see if the good ones are retained in teaching. we talked a lot about retention.

we do not want to retain the ones who are not good, so we want to be ure we retain the ones who are good and also that they have an impact on the community, an impact on k-12, and that we know what we are doing that is a direct correlation or causation of their doing a good job, so this is not just selection. we know that already. what in selection matters? gpa? is there a correlation between getting a 2.5 or 2.7 and you achieving as a third-grade teacher? probably i would guess not. is it disposition? is there persistence? we know that persistence is an important quality, and yet, we do not screen for persistence. can they assess what they are doing so they can make classrooms better? and do they think that every kid in that room can learn? because right now, there is a wildly big difference where your

child goes to school and where other children go to school. the one constant is the teacher who is in that classroom with them, so we want performanne, not pay for performance. that is a small slice we're taking out. either you perform or you do not teach. and the same holds for us. either we perform for colleges of education will be a relic. >> what is an example of an innovation you're putting in place? >> not one size fits all. we are beginning to understand who comes into our programs make a difference in terms of what program we will have. our graduate program, for example, of people who are career changers, if you have never been in your class and i know program than if you are in a classroom full time. you take different courses. you're clinical experience in the classroom has to have different supervision because you are the teacher of record. you are accountable for those children the next day.

we have to be sure what we teach you the night before in the class is directly applicable to the achievement and the happiness. we also talked about how kids should actually be happy in school, not just little robot. they should be happy achieving and happy just being kids in school, so that we now have divided our graduate programs in terms of who is coming in, with the selection process is, what the intervention is so we get to the same outcome. >> you are the president and ceo of public broadcasting system, and it turns that you are probably educating more children through the public by casting children -- public broadcasting system. your networks have an educational purpose and a created excitement purpose. media, new technologies, where are we going. again, what i'm interested in

focusing our conversation on here is what are the innovations we can put in place? not what did we do in the 1960's, but what can we do now, what should we do now, what can media and technology do? >> we are thinking about this on many levels. obviously, one place where we put enormous investment is for the youngest children and all the statistics show that if you reach a child at the earliest ages, the chances of that child achieving in school increase tremendously, said the effort to reach children where they are, in the home, to the television program we create, the work that we're doing increasingly online but streaming video and games that are all educationally based, and in the content we are creating in the classroom for teachers. kids are surrounded by media, and often they go into a classroom and i taught the same way that i was taught, with

desks lined up in a row and the teacher standing up in front of a blackboard. this is not the way kids today are thinking and not how they are living. there is a disconnect between the life and what they experience in the classrooms. i think that part of the way of thinking about education is to really think about the opportunities that technology offers and how that can be incorporated into the school's largest user of public television content, both broadcast and online our teachers. 20% of people who come on to pbs.org identify themselves as teachers, so we try to put tools in their hands so they feel comfortable with the technology. it is shocking how many teachers go through education, teachers college, training, and have no concept of having use technology in the classroom. they are intimidated because kids often no more about the technology than they do, and the resources and opportunity and access to material that could

really bring the entire education experience to live is right within the grasp of any teacher, so being able to help teachers crossed that threshold is tremendously important. the last area where i think technology offers great potential is in online courses and teacher certification. we run a program which we referred to as pajama compatible where teachers can continue to get their continuing education credits in a way that is easy and effective and that reaches across the country. our public television stations, which in every community, many of whom began as educational institutions, have connections, so we have booked on the ground as well as all of their resources through technology, and i think the combination of all of that makes us an active participant in improving the

education work in this country. >> just listening to you, it sounds like the teachers of the future would have o be fundamentally differentiated from those of the past in the sense that they could even be seen as not only teachers but navigators of complex learning environments that they are helping students to engage with. i saw a lecture -- i was on campus a couple of weeks ago, and he presented data about this game that millions of kids are playing, for which they have not been studying the game outcomes, but they have been studying the learning outcomes. what they found from the students and others that are part of the game as it is the fastest rate of learning advancement ever recorded from self-guided guilds that form around this game, learning from each other and learning from interacting with the game and the use of constant metrics in terms of knowing exactly where you are in the learning process. .

---for many years of the early word of sesame street, kids' show a great emperors in their ability for the recognition, four basic math skills and as 1/4 point once you entered as dams, it jumped off rigid rigid

that jumped off the charts punta >> larger than canada in terms of population. that fit our six largest population in the country. booms and busts and stresses and strains. in this era of unpredictable public investment, in education, you are a regent of the university of california. this era of unpredictable resources, how can innovation

help schools and universities, how can innovation helpless even out those resources that are up and down? i do not see that necessarily changing. >> you have heard a number of the panelists talking about innovation. not only will they be the rescuer of k through 12 education budget it will always rescue our economy because so far innovative abilities as a people. and we could spend days discussing the complexity of public education and we would all talk about important, technical reports, but the bottom line is everybody in education knows that if you focus on having an effective teacher in every classroom and and effected principal and a finance system that follows that and maximizes the dollar in the classroom, that is the most

significant aspect of achieving student results. we have heard how we are not connecting peeformance to outcomes. meaning student achievement. that is the goal of all public education. we are seeing a movement afoot, largely led by race to the top, which says it is time to start evaluating teachers and principals. that is a part of the evaluation. from that, everything flows. when i think maximizing the dollars, not only innovation but we have to make sure we have the finest system that is the maximum amount of dollars into the classroom and follows outcomes. some of those issues include, we talk about professionalizing the teacher profession. does that mean we should start looking on the table, in california, we have some 6

districts. 30%, english is a second language. we need to start looking at whether in states like california with collective bargaining, some diitricts have teachers for seven years, they have lifetime health benefits for their families. they can then leave the classroom and leave the profession and that district will still be spending its precious dollars paying for the health benefits. the honest discussion needs to be are we better off operate much higher salaries to teachers so those dollars stay in the classroom? in addition to nnovation, which we hear is online learning and interactive learning, that is the future. there is such a disconnect between what is going on in public schools and what happens in the life of those kids when they leave the public schools and the ability to learn. in california, the governor signed a digital textbook

initiative. we are working with apple on pilot programs because digital text books can be kindle like but they could be interactive learning to games. any of us with young kids, there are private companies making a fortune doing this because kids love it and they learn. but they're learning to read and write. that is the future. in the short term, we have to keep our eyes on the prize and that is effective teachers and principals. once you have measurements that evaluate effective teachers, you focus on low performing schools and high poverty schools. you are able to say for all the teacher prep we offered, after two years whether you are a principal or teacher, you are ineffective, you cannot stay in the classroom. those are the simple elements we need to keep focused on in the short term. >> what is the most exciting

innovation that you have seen since you have been secretary in california? >> i think the most exciting innovation is the future is definitely going to be interactive learning and computers and internet-based. when we see what innovation comes out of california in terms of silicone valley -- silicon valley, we see innovation in the private sector and what it can produce in the business world and being everywhere but most public schools, that is believed the exciting innovation. companies like apple are excited about working with our largest publishers and figuring out how to use standard curriculum and books and turn that into an interactive opportunity to learn. i think that is the most exciting thing because we are looking at the future. >> i was at dinner a few nights

ago and one of the people at the dinner was talking about this topic. he said the state and public universities will have to go to all computers. all of the rich kids get to be taught by humans at colleges and all of the kids with less money to be taught by machines. i said i think there could be some social outcomes from that that would be less than significantly positive so this notion of some help, one of the things one has to do is find a way where it is not a replacement but enhancement of. how do you learned faster and more broadly across languages and cultures and how the use technology to do all that. it seems to be this mechanism wwere we do this technology platform so we to lower costs. at the anniversary level, it does not necessarily lower costs.

anybody, what about the use of technology? freeman hrabowski, president of university of maryland baltimore county, technology? >> first of all, it is important to think about how teachers are prepared to deal with children who are not happy. large numbers of america's children are not happy. quite frankly, that come from families that are going through hell. we are working to help teachers, using technology and innovation, to connect to children who are not prepared to learn. the two things i think about, the teacher needs to know something. they have to have a good grasp of a concept. elementary teachers need to know math. they need to understand the challenges the children face and have ways of connecting. whether it is pbs, teach for america, it can be very helpful with productive learning.

it seems to me we are using technology to build group support for each other. i think it is innovative to think about people helping each other in class. we tend to think about cutthroat. if i help you, it will change the curve and i will get an a and -- you will get in a and i will get a b. in my estimation, it is very innovative. proactive learning, group study, supporting the idea of expanding concepts. technology helps kids you can be much more interactive in the process. we are using it with these realizations in chemistry. a combination of technology coupled with thinking differently about how people learn, understanding they learn in different ways, and taking into account the context of the family.

this can be extremely important in terms of performance. >> other comments on technology? " on behalf of secretary obama, i am glad you're reminded me of that. [laughter] let me take it from it different angle besides k through 12. the president has staked out a very clear goal of in 2020 for us to return to the number one nation in terms of degrees that american citizens would hold. until the early or mid 80's, america's unprecedented prosperity was clearly connected to that high degree of percentages of americans holding degrees. in 1983, 1984, a ccuple things happen that we did not notice quickly. countries like canada, japan, korea, began to slip by us.

australia, finland, and the percentage of people with knowledge degrees. the president believes that is a serious issue and one that will significantly limmt our long- term economic growth. his focus, we heard a lot about responses from people across the country, his focus is to look at that base of the pipeline which is our community college pipeline, are technical system, because that is the place for those individuals that are the maybe population. will i go on to higher education or will i not? one of the major problems is in those three for ompletion rates for committed to colleges, we have an 80% fall down rate for first time, full-time students. after three years, you are only seeing about 20% of american students actually graduating from those glasses. one of the major places that fall down happens is in developmental and remedial courses. no surprise.

everything we just heard is the students will get into those courses and it looks a lot like the high school courses they did not particularly enjoy or too well in. about 65 percent of them do not even complete their full remedial classes. that is a disaster for us because we are not getting people into that pipeline and keeping them. one of the things we are looking at is how you use technology. one example came out of the chronicle of higher education of a community college in tennessee, the math adviser had walked into the office of the president and said i really think i have filled the. the president asked why. he set for 20 years, only one- third of my math students completed those clauses in the remedial courses. he said let me try something. let me create some computer labs that are easily accessible. we will have to people in them

at all times nd have people come in and work through those math courses basically online but with a person in the room. two years, they turned that to a two-thirds success rate and lower their costs in terms of having to hire at junks. >> lipstick and -- let's take an innovation like that. math performance which is a critical step function+ trajectory delimiter. how do you take an innovation like that? every committee college has its own board and dynamic and oversight group and so forth. how did you take an innovation like that and how does it spread? >> secretary duncan's theory of action comes out of this idea of at this point, how do we have competitive grants to make the field move toward achievement of

particular educational goals for students? our theory is to put forward competitiveness for those tracking race to the top, for example. we put out competitive grants to move people along in certain directions. our goal in secondary and post secondary education is to use the american graduation initiative which was not fully funded. this fall, we will go back to a summit of community colleges and hopefully revitalize that conversation. that is the goal of the president. what we need now is to see how models like the ones we are reducing and the ones that we saw and move forward by exemplifying those particular pieces that are effective. some resources that are connected to that we think will help, as well. >> we will come back to innovation. one thing i have always wondered about is what the university is

allowed to have high failure rates when many students are subsidized by federal dollars with no incentives to the purveyors of the educational content to be more successful if they would like to continue to receive those types of dollars. let's come back to that as innovation. dewayne matthews is vice president of policy at the foundation for education. you are crazy about change. >> we love it. >> you are funding grants all of the country. how do you get innovation and move it forward? >> our focus at the foundation is we believe that all of this conversation is that a much larger proportion of americans need to not just to go to college but complete college successfully. we stated this in terms of a goal. our goal is very consistent with that of the president's, 60% of

americans should have a high quality post secondary degree by 2025. we are at about 39% rate. the rate is more or less constant for all age groups. as has been stated, other countries are doing a much better job. there are well above 50%, particularly for young aduuts. in the u.s., we are stuck. we think 40% attainment rate is about right. it is some sort of natural limit. that is simply not good enough. it is not good enough in the world we live in today and we need to change that. we need to get a larger proporrion of people to go to college to be successful in college, to get the degree credential. it is interesting how this conversation has gone. it has gone inappropriate way because it is the learning that those degrees represent that matters. we know that this is the case.

there is going to be a session in this room one week from tuesday it representative from the georgetown university has done analysis on the changing nature of jobs in the united states. it is showing that in fact, 60% of jobs in the u.s. will require post secondary education by 2018. this is a fact. this change is a fact. it is the learning that these degrees represent which is actually what is being demanded. it is the learning that is really important. the innovation you talked about, it seems to be it is about technology. it is technology to the service of learning, though. it is much easier to talk about learning outcomes indicator " system than it is and the higher education system. it is an unfortunate fact we

have to bring that into higher education, s well. we have to know what the degrees represent and we have to be transparent about the expectations on students in terms of learning so that they will know what they are expected to do at each stage of the process through the education system. there is a famous line of higher education which is an american higher education, time is the constant and learning is the variable. we need to make learning the constant and time the variable. >> time in the sense that we live on an agrarian educational summers off and things like that? >> not just that. the degrees, the definition is a four-year degree. two-year degree. >> i was recently involved in a public debate with an ivy league president. i was arguing that we need

innovation to enhance outcomes. we need to do away with the notion of time as a constant and move to a measurement of what the student has actually attained. he and i did not agree because he thought that it would completely destroy the entire process of learning. this notion of this push back the people who are trying to innovate and trying to move in new directions deal from what is considered the norm, i would like to hear from anybody about this notion. why is this notion of change in education so hard? >> it means we will do things differently. we may not know how to do them differently. people are accustomed to do with the things the way to have done. people consider a university as

good as students don't do well because it is rigorous. to think high-quality should make you good an excellent education and high standards but a standard that says we believe that it is our responsibility to make sure students succeed. it is a very different attitude. it students do not succeed, it means we failed, too. we should be holding ourselves accountable. we have 54 million americans over the age of 25 who began college and never triid to with it. think about that. we need to talk with specificity about different groups who can profit from getting an education. what i say to returning adults, if you raise kids, you can do anything. we have to help adults understand that. they can come back. they have life experience. you have young people who are in college because the parents said they have to come and they are

not ready. you have specific types of activities and strategies that can be used for every group. for adults, it could be child care or finance and helping them get the time they need. i would argue that change can be intimidating but as a country, we must say to ourselves and universities, we have a responsibility to make sure we changed so these people can succeed. >> this prevailing ideology that we share as an american public that the failure of our public education system exists within kids and families when it is a system failure. one of the things that you want to do, everybody goes to school. there is this large notion that we know what school is and resistant to change is not just within our profession but it is widespread. i know what school is.

do you mean you would not be in a row and a classroom? we have -- we need to go out there and say we could fix this if we increased public wealth and wheat innovated our system change. >> we will come back to this why is this so hard? lorenzo esters represents the association of public and land grant is universities which is a massive university and college association representing hundreds of thousands of faculty and millions of students to put it into perspective. i will ask you a very hard question. president obama has outlined this objective, every kid through high-school and half of those kids on to some sort of post-secondary level of education to get to the social

outcomes, 60% educated at a certain level. how many new colleges were today? the answer is very few if any. and to educate at the level we are talking about, we do not have the physical infrastructure or organizational infrastructure or the means. what are colleges and universities thinking about in terms of dealing with this sheer number? it is not just technology. >> it is a simple answer. >> i will write it down then. [laughter] >> if we look at what is happening, we can achieve this goal if we did nothing else but graduate the people who are already in the pipeline. the greatest challenge for higher education is how do we

fix our plumbing problem if you would. >> the leakage. >> as we see more and more minorities and low-income students pursuing a higher education degree, the challenge is to get the students to move through the pipeline. it is an issue of creating great expectations and a system of support for these populations. particularly as we look at low income and minority students and closing those gaps in terms of race and income but that exist in terms of gender. the challenge for higher education, i believe, is to optimize the effective interventions. there are several examples that exist. there are several of around the country. what we focus on is creating new programs.

what do we know that already exists and what works and that is research-based and has a record of success? back to you, bonnie reiss. the debate seems to e mostly about money. we are not investing enough in teacher salaries. we are not doing this or that. we are giving benefits for seven years of service. that seems surprising to me. why is the debate about money, how do you shift the debate to another topic? >> by saying it is about money but how we spend the money. we have so many studies that look at how it is not just money but how it is spent that achieves student results. i want to address in coonection with that, two topics. the percentage needs, 60% will

need a college degree for the work force. we just had a study that 2025, 50% will need college degrees to meet our workforce needs. whether it is 50% or 60%. the other topic is career technical education. 40 or 50% may not require college degrees and we have to change the way we think about career technical education, as well. it is not some kids just cannot go to college. career technical education means we should be focusing from early childhood right on through high- schooll what is the dream of that child? we need to be delivering kids to graduate high school either ready to go to college or able to get the job they want to get that may nnt need a college degree. that is how we have to look at cover technical education.

the community colleges play a large role in that.. it is important for us to make sure we understand the career technical education, how we look at it, the rigor of that, and as something that would look as bridget looked at as part of the entire education and how do we get more completion degrees? we have to look at community colleges and working closely and our state, but we have some new leaders. they are working hand in hand and more transfer degrees. the other thing that helps us a student diversity at the university of california. you get the more bang for your buck with your focus on getting the kids focused on community college, transferring degrees or what ever innovations we can

look at and we are looking at different ways to work on that and making sure that those kids, more of them transferring into our four year colleges in completing them there. one innovative and new idea is we have an urban teacher fellowships program in california that is working in three school districts. collaboration is a bbg part of this. we have one of the leading funding systems in the country. we have our after-school program grants working with our community college kids that might want to become teachers. they go into the after-school program, from the afterschool grants whether it is the 21st century or state grant, they can get $10 per hour. there is federal money coming in for anti violence coupled with that to get these young people a $25 per hour incentive to work in an after-school program

and high property schools. they get teaching experience with kids in a classroom and they transfer and some of that time is recognized as credit. they go on to get a teaching degree. that is how we combined collaboration, community%+ college, career technology. >> at the higher education level, the national rankings that are out there, you gain points for the more money you you get points to spend more money. you are held down if you are more efficient and spend less money. you gain points if you exclude more students. i am coming back to this notion of money. we live in a culture where you gain points for spending more yet we have to find ways to spend less and be more efficient. part of the discussion is may be because that is how people measure success, based on investment, as opposed to outcomes. >> in maryland, we have been

very fortunate. we had a system of higher education that focused on effectiveness and efficiency. it is different for two reasons. we are using money well and the legislature and the governor have appreciated that. we have done better than most places during this difficult time because people believe we are investing well. we have done that. whaa i will say is i am encouraged by the race to the top initiative for being brought in its vision. most people to not realize 55% of degrees, there are all kinds of degrees. people may not like the word liberal but everybody on this panel has a liberal arts education. everybody is not ready to sit in the classroom instead history. they need other options. the money can be used wisely to help all kinds of students depending on where they are in

their preparation and interests at this point. a part of an ovation when talking about use of money involved finding ways to give incentives to institutions and the human factor to increase the number of students. i will call something iinovative old-fashioned -- hard work. we need to teach students and everybody else. you did not make it unless you work hard. the best news on my campus is one the student says this is really hard. i say great. anything worth having kids a lot of hard work. one specific example of technology being used in golf course management systems. the idea is this -- you give students the chance to say that to the extent that they really do the work and focus on the homework, they will see progress in their graves. we show them through the technology that the students

doing more work and spending more hours are doing better. they can measure their success against others based on how hard they are working. i will throw out the idea to america, hard work is very innovative. we never say that. give me a hand for that. [applause] >> related to that, asu, we have dramatically enhanced the diversification of our student we tried to pretend that -- 2000 latin american students last year. talk about this notion of hard work. the kids that come here come up retention is our most significant issue. they are qualified or unqualified to do university- level work. math engines exams. they are ready to go. they have a good high school

preparation and took the right courses. they enter and they dissolve. we believe it is largely a result of the learning environment we have created and certain aspects of it. one of the things you are focused on is access and pipeline issues. it is not about -- it is about hard work, but we have a lot of hard-wwrking kids that do not make it. >> you have to have hard working professionals, also. show me a campus that is defective and i will show you a placc that cares for their students and expects the most and gives him the support they need. it is the connection that keeps the student on that campus. >> what puts the holes in the pipeline? >> i would have to echo what freeman hrabowski said. it is not enough for the ssudents to work hard. leadership and faculty to work hard and supported the students once they come to the

university. one of the things we know from those programs that are successful in graduating minority and low-income students is they are very intentional. from the leadership, the faculty, beans, and so one. it is important to create an effective system of support for these students. there are many things we know work from mentoring, not advisers but mentors, who are concerned about their success ooce they get to the institution. >> michael crow -- michael crow, -- mari koerner, how you get faculty to act in different ways? >> we have a very high retention rate. a 88%. people that come to this

university are often first generation college. people have no idea that i should or would go to college. i entered to arts and science but our kids and to professional school because they see a goal and job at the end. we make sure that everyone of our students at a large university knows if the kid is there or not there and mrs. class. -- misses class. kids drop out. they did not learn. it takes four or five years. but not kid ourselves. there is somebody that is benefiting from the system the way it is working. for those of us that feel we have responsibility to take leadership in this, we have to mobilize to change the culture as it happens of pre-k through 20 school system.

>> how do we do that? >> one thing in teaching, because that is a piece of the pie that i am come up is to create an excellent and teachin+ where people think you deserve more money. i think and what our colllge is doing, the more excellent the more disciplined. the more you understand you cannot be an elementary school teacher and as you know math. it is not a way to avoid math. you are going to have to know math. the more we will attract excellent students. i think the opposite is what is happening. the system sends -- says -- you can really slide by. we need to say this is a career of choice. if you are not good enough, you cannot be in it. it will attract increasingly excellent people that the public will be thrilled to pay a lot of

money because they do not want to lose them to another profession. as we raise standards, in fact i think, we will raise demand to get into our school. >> dewayne matthews you wander around the country and make investments. you and your board and president focused on stimulating change. what do you see out there that makes your choice is so difficult? >> the attitude change is a big piece of this. higher education placed a mythic role in american society. we have a belief in what it looks like. so many people here have talked about changing some very core assumptions about higher education. those assumptions do have to change. quality and higher education,

that american education is unique in defining quality in terms of the exclusivity of access and resource. what is equality? ask ourselves. what do we think quality higher education is? we usually come up with a picture of nobel prize faculty, extremely high test scores among the students, beautiful facilities, small glasses, all of these things which we think of as the evidence of quality. i am sure everybody on this panel has had the counseling sessions with family members and kids saying how to what get my kids into college? negotiating that system. i was talking to a cousin last week about this. i cannot tell you how many

times that people say this university must be better because it costs more. how will i pay for it? that simply has to change. the only thing that matters to go that is the thing about jaguars, too. [laughter] >> that is -- this is not a very glamorous innovation. it is the one that came to mind. the number of states this year that have passed changes to the higher education funding formulas to fund universities more on completion and graduates rather than just enrollment. that is a real innovation. in one state that i know of which was faced with making mid- year budget cuts, used to that formula to allocate the cuts. it does not sound like a

glamorous innovation to some of us but to me, that is glamorous. that is a real shift of thinking about how you approach the incentives under which higher education operates. how do you make change course to back the challenge for us at the foundation is something we are all facing is not so much that we do not know what needs to happen, it is that we do not know how to change it on a large scale and make changes at the rate and speed at which we need to make it. >> 15,000 school districts, thousands of higher educational systems, it is extremely decentralized. >> we have to look aa policy. we have to look at funding systems, not just funding levels, incentive structures, and some of those core elements of the system. that structure in which it operates.

you change some of those and change can happen. course i want to ask each of you -- >> i want to ask each of you, what is the hardest thing you are presently working on trying to bring about some sort of innovation repair or fixed? what is the hardest thing? you go home and tell your partner or spouse or kids or dog, this is just beating the heck out of me. what is it? >> the challenge of actually getting to the president's 2020 goal is extremely difficult. even if we had hit the highest level of high -- of high school completion, maryland is one of the top, if all of the 49 states hit that level of completion and go on to college rates, if we would do that, we would still be 5 million degrees behind or the president needs to be.

that means we have to bring adults back into a pipeline which the culture is not particularly welcome to. when i think about what keeps me up at night, what will bring people like my mother who has worked at places like target her entire life because she was told in the 1950's that she was not qualified to be a college applicant. as a result, what will get people like my mother to reenter that pipeline, have a co-worker, have the support, and do the hard work? >> york artist not you are working on? it's for me, how we have the effective intervention around this 2020 goal. i am reading -- leading an initiative of how close the gender gap specifically between minority males and their

counterparts. african american, hispanic, and if american males, in particular. that is the greatest challenge we are facing. >> as you worry about that challenge, meeting with college presidents and education leaders and so forth, when you come back, what is it that makes this heart? >> i think the hardest thing for men or position all standpoint is there are so many things the individual institutions are doing. how do we take those common attributes out there and still them up or down based on that pndividual institution's resources, size, and so forth? >> what surprised you the most? innovations did not translate easily among schools. all of these things are happening. what are you not done? [laughter]

>> that is a really good question. i ttink the challenge is the answers come back to a resource issue. >> if the choppers come in with money, we are done? >> that cannot be the only money. >> building student and teacher development and learning. i think we know a lot about how teachers develop in the beginning and we have a lot of descriptive data and qualitative data. with the train of accountability with this path around quantitative and practicing teachers understand that you need more information than that.

>> that is hard but what makes you sweat? >> that does make a sweat. >> why does it make you sweat? >> everybody wants a quick fix. this is complicated work. we need to build a system that reflects the complexity of human learning. >> getting people to grasp that or do it? >> why do they not want to do what? >> i think there are major challenges around the perception of our profession. for a long time, we had not thought that teaching was complicated work. >> the little house on the prairie? >> the payment equation. we do not vacations -- we do not pay teachers or reward them. we find the most talented and brightest and most educated people.

because that stigma is out there, we have not a public message. that is what we would settle because we think it is easy. it is not. >> both our strength and our challenge. we have bbcome a model for innovation in education, particularly in science and engineering. some departments have done really well. we are now trying to replicate across disciplines these ideas. the challenge is in some areas, people are interested in change. other areas, they think things might be ok. >> between disciplines? >> yes. we are making progress but it does take changing attitudes. the best part is we have other campuses looking at our model. the reason the model is so interesting is because we have been able to find a way to help students of alllraces. not just white kids, asian kids,

black kids, hispanic kids. we are the largest producer of african americans who did science ph these -- ph.d.'s. we are now working with other campuses. what i see is a major challenge is to work with other institutions think through how you get more students of all types. more women in education. more blacks in biochemistry. it is not happening. what is it going to take? it takes a change in attitudes. it takes a believe that all children can succeed to believe that a young woman can be a ph.d. in biochemical engineering. we have not seen it so we do not believe it. that is a major challenge. why campus is working to be that

model. >> to agree with you on that, we just is amended our 11 traditional departments -- eliminated our 11 departments of engineering because to students, they're pouring in being wisconsin. we agree organized grand challenge schools around themes that sustainability and health. that is changing the demographics of everything. paul, you are running this massive organization, other than to gog money to run ait that is the thing thht makes me sweat. putting together the resources. we are in the midst of the mortgage -- enormous change because media is changing so rapidly. for us, the real challenge is to stay in front of the change in media entered to win in a responsible way. you want to be experimenting and

enervating which is the hallmark of public broadcasting throughout its history but you do not want to be so far ahead of everybody else you are sending resources -- spending resources you do not have. in terms of education, the thing that keeps me up at night is we obviously spent a lot of effort focusing on kids. three-quarters of the american children are in head start for%+ some sort of preschool program. that means 25% are not. how are we reaching those kids? how are we reaching them with material and content that will help them in school? for us, that is probably the most significant work we are doing. not every home has a computer but every home has a television set. we are talking about innovation and technology and we are now talking about broadcast television. >> every computer is now a television.

>> every computer is increasingly used for moving image. how do we really take that and use it? the other part of my frustration is for more than 40 years, we have been creating educational content based in the classroom and not just the purpose in programs like nova but also creating purpose-built video models and so forth and so we're in the midst of building an infrastructure, the digital learning library that any teacher or any home schoolers or any parent can access pieces of contents from their computer. my frustration is really figuring out this landscape and how to build a partnership that we can scale together. think about a kid sitting in a

class from studying the civil war and working off of a busted textbook. if you think about ken burns' series, and i do not meat sitting a kid in front of the television and watching a whole series, but two or three minutes to make a huge difference. we are living in a world that we are surrounded by media and we are not using that. the thing that keeps me up at night is figuring out how we will have the expertise in creating video and stories can put the tools in the hands of teachers and how we can get teachers comfortable with using that content so that it becomes an inherent part of the learning process in school. earlier on, you had made the comment about computer and technology replacement and obviously, that is the wrong way to look at it. the weight to look at it is how do we get teachers excited and comfortable about using which should be an extraordinarily powerful tool back to open the hearts and minds of kids up?

that is what keeps me up at night. figuring out how to do that. we are sitting on an archive of work and the potential to create additional work that we think can make a big difference in the classroom. how do we get that done? mari koerner? >> a place where you have a lot of really smart people, research universities. my challenge is to take the research faculty who have the intellectual capacity, the ability to do research, and talk them into moving over, incentivize, hire people, who will focus their research on the direct improvement of education so that we know more about the connections between professional development and construction. we know more about policy and measurement. that we can then be partners,

not just the people that produce -- the people that helped informed legislators and ourselves about how to improve what we're doing. >> dewayne matthews? >> when i will put on the table is how are we going to count stuff? the entire system is built around counting contact hours. that is what they are called. the number of hours a student is in front of a professor. degrees are built around that. critics are built around that. financial aid is built around that. everything. what are you going to replace that with? >> learning outcome?

what that is right. this has ramifications across the entire system. that is a tough technical not to crack but it is one we have to. >> bonnie reiss i know you have no worries. >> public education it is easy. for the governor, myself and the state, the biggest challenge we have is changing current state law that makes seniority the only thing that can be considered and layoffs, assignments, of teachers. we cannot allow locally elected schhol boards to consider the effectiveness of teachers, the effectiveness of principles, and the needs of their schools. this is not just bad for education and generable but disproportionately impacts our high poverty schools where most of our brown and black children are being educated or not being

educated. because of our budget cuts, a giant spotlight has been put on what this policy yells. the aclu filed a lawsuit because they named three middle schools where 75% of their teachers got pink slips and they compared it to a few other schools in the same school districts where no teachers got pink slips. seniority only approach means some of the best motivated teachers who want to be in those type of the schools and having great schools are getting laid out because they cannot be considered. that is our greatest challenge. >> i am starting to sweat listening to you. >> it is our greatest challenge because in california, the california teachers association which is the most powerful union, i had conversations with the president, he said he would like to do the right thing on this but i also need to keep my

job. that is the reality of what we are facing. that is what might be a confluence of events. president obama playing this out as being so critical in terms of evaluation might create the momentum we need to get this done. i lose sleep over when i visited these schools and i see that these kids are perpetually being left behind. some kids are doing well but the kids that are not doing well, year after year after year, they will be lost. why do we have a high-school dropout rate of 50% there? we are losing them in middle school. for me and the governor, it is changing a seniority-only approach to personnel. >> let's go to a lightning ground answer round before we go to questions from the audience. i am interested in your quick

analysis of what you think is a principle root cause for these issues and challenges we are confronting and how would you get at that brute? >> when you look at the leakage issue, telegrams and things like that. a lot of that matters. -- pell grants and things like that matter. with 50% of committed the college students working at least 30 hours and trying to go full time, you are going to get low completion rates. getting some sort of financial support and cohort support thinking about learning communities. when you moved to that pipeline, you have a group of people around here. cubans are social creatures. they do better with those

connections -- humans are social creatures. they do better with those connections. >> the most important factor is a teacher effectiveness. the effectiveness of the leadership, also. the greatest challenge is how we train teachers in this country. innovating the way we train teachers, if you think about a pilot. pilots have to have 250 hours of various maneuvers of flying before they can take a person on an aircraft. think about teaching. we assume that once they walk across the stage and they get a diploma that they are qualified. it is said best, the way we train teachers in this country

is essentially unethical. we expect that when teachers graduate that they are highly qualified without significant experience. teaching is not a career choice and that we have to make it the career choice for smart, hard- working people. the response is it takes a university to train a teacher. it is not just in the college they are enrolled. they are all working with us along with partner districts to make sure that we indeed fully educate a teacher. >> we need to support teachers. we do not say that enough. teachers work hard. when they are not doing a good job, we have to give them a chance to improve. we have to find ways of supporting teachers. few of us understand the

challenges they face in that classroom. we have to find ways of supporting families for what they need to do to prepare their children to come to school and take advantage of what the school has to offer. .. it is setting support the family to understand that there is role for them to play. >> maybe that is an idea for pbs. you can educate about education. >> it is important to understand what graduation and retention rates mean. i do kids from a certain background to at that institution we need to educate them as did -- we need to educate families. >> we need to focus on all of a policy makers that impact

eduuation -- all of the policy- makers that impacts education. they can undermine principal effectiveness. there is so much on intentional harm. -- and intentional -- un- intentional harm. the ceo of each school is profoundly important. there are many studies that demonstrate that if there is one single factor in the success of the school, it is that principlal. there have been pilot programs that have been really successful in giving the principles that training to help them be successful. it would have a huge impact. i am in favor of all efforts to improve teacher effectiveness. it is tremendously important, but we need to make sure that the training and preparation of the administrators goes hand in glove with that. the combination is what will really make the pivotal

difference in the kids' lives. >> i like to talk about root cause of a problem in higher education. it is the lack of any sort of useful information on the results of higher education in terms of students. we o not have usable graduation rates. we do not know how many students graduate from college. we know thh raw numbers, but we do not know how many begin in a given year, when they will finish -- we have almost no useful information. we know very little about the success of students in community colleges. there's some very important work underway around that. we have a tendency define all -- to ddfine all students as successful. we have very little useful information on learning in higher education. the solution is better assistance -- and better systems -- better data and information systems.

>> we do know that the average public university in the united states has a graduation decree -- as a graduation rate that is declining rapidly. it is presently under 40%. one issue that we as is significant lack of cultural understanding of the fact that universities have to perform in certain ways to produce certain types of outcomes. it is sort of messed up right now. >> when we talk about graduation rates, people are talking about first time, full-time freshmen and what happens. we have to find ways to understand how different groups perform and to get that information into the hands of those who make policy. legislatures are asking about our retention and graduation rates. that is very good. you have to explain why you are doing well or what you are not. is important for the public policy people to understand. >> >whether it is k through 12 r

higher education, it is accountability. we should hold everyone accountable. whether it is principles, faculty, students -- accountability based on outcomes. within that, i want to say that this is about supporting teachers. if the teacher is ineffective, they should not be in the classroom. if they get all the support they need and all the development they need and they're still in effect of, they should not be in the classroom. i was lucky enough to know jaime escalante. we were there at his funeral. i was very moved when teachers said that, we could blame our governor, are legislator, our mayor, but we know ultimately that we are in the classroom, it is us and we can make the difference. it is adult accountability taught to outcomes, but let us not lose sight that, no matter what else, a great teacher will

succeed in a classroom. >> let's go to the audience for questions. we would ask that whenever you say is actually a question. please identify yourself. >> this is a great discussion. i would like to throw on a couple of quick challenges to the framinn of the question -- quick challenges. i wonder if the framing of that attainable as no. 1 in the world -- i think many of you got free copies of my book today, which suggest you should not view this as zero sum game. people can fail and you can be no. 1 tier the contrast is extractive -- #one. the contrast is instructive. we're in this race where everybody can not improve. it seems to me it would not matter if we were no. 8 or no.

10 in the world if everybody was getting better. that is what you need to build human capital. not to be too defensive about my former u.s. news job, but is research spending really an important? if you want to create innovation and economic growth, building a great university requiree raising money. there are perverse incentives about productivity. it is very important. if you're trying to become great, you are trying to simultaneously become -- to get money, because that is your weapon to become better. the question is, is that not true? [applause] [laughter] >> glenn and freeman. >> i will start with the beginning part of the question. it is a good question. it makes a big difference whether you are no. 8 or no. 1. this is an exceptionally competitive world. just in numbers alone, the chinese are claiming that they are getting over 300,000

engineering, i.t., a mathematics major at the be a level -- mathematics majors, at the ba level each year. we want to be second to none, but you're comfortable being first among many. >> obviously, we're not going to be number one in the numbers, given china and india as populations. we can talk about the percentage of our population will do well. in terms of the research, as president of research university, it is critical to innovation. whether in health care or energy, we need more research. we now have 50 companies on campus. we're hiring people. we have students working there to build the economy and the training. research is tied to the education and it is critical. you're absoluteey right. >> other questions? >> i am a teacher here in d.c. and i have two questions.

you talk about other measures of teacher effectiveness beside his test scores. -- syed task force. i see many of those -- besides test scores. why could not one member of success be the measure of college graduates several years out of high school? many of them are not completing college. >> i teach -- we are not all local educational agencies and we have no control of data. one thing we believe is that we should measure teacher performance based on student learning. we've gone out into the market, purchased lots of different assessments, worked with teachers to develop those come and build the system around those, gained access to data from states and districts, and develop systems that give feedback along the course of the years that they are in our program.

it is one way of doing it. we do not own that stuff. it is a challenge. more and more, districts and states are figuring out cooperative ways to use that. that is one system. we then get into the complex problem of trying to figure out all of the other soft measures of success in our society about college going about social capital, about confidence, about hard work kamal on all of those things that are injured readers to success -- , about all of those things that are indicators of success. what can we feed into the system. what can we learn from our top performers? what can we share it? we are still looking now. >> i was recently inspired by a working group of superintendents in california that are leading superintendent to put together our race to the top application and lan. they feel that part of teacher evaluation should be tied to

student growth -- multiple measures of that, not just a statewide standardized exam, and that the rest of the things like parents surveys, pure review, professional development hours that the teachers are taking -- they will tell you who the good teachers and that teachers are. >> we are also using something where you train peers to observe each other in teacher assessment performance. individual teacher assessment is important, but we're also beginning to find that the most effective is also a group and collaborative assessment. it is not just how you do so that i can cut your throat to get my stick it is better than yours and get more money and performance pay to become -- my students to be better than yours and get more money and performance pay so that i can become the head of foundation, but it is also part of what the school does. your contribution has to make the school better.

how do your cans in the graduating from that high school? -- your kids and up graduating from high school? and the superintendent did not want to do individual merit pay. -- >> these superintendents do not want to do individual merit pay. it is not pitting teacher against teacher, but collaborative work at the school site. >> i am a retired professor from the uuiversity of maryland in college park. a guess we are competitors -- i'd guess we are competitors. from our perspective, the situation is not static. freshmen are arriving knowing considerably less arithmetic than they did a decade ago. it is no accident. there has been tremendous change in the elementary schools and

high schools over the past 15 years. the question. the question is, would you be willing to support a public letter that calls for the following innovation? that the states have a licensing exam in the arithmetic for elementary school teachers and for middle school teachers? currently, massachusetts is the only state that has a licensing test in the arithmetic for elementary schoolteachers. >> who would be in favor of that? [laughter] >> i am in favor of elementary school teachers no arithmetic. i think that is the bottom line. we are trying -- knowing arithmetic. i think that is the bottom line. we are trying to make that the

assumption. in terms of testing, i am not sure that is necessarily -- i do not know. i was in the massachusetts and i cannot say that teachers necessarily -- >> i would say, yes. i think teachers should be certified in the everything they teach. >> they are now. >> perhaps the need enhanced -- the they need enhanced certification. >> [unintelligible] we need professional development to help our teachers when they're in the classroom. >> [unintelligible] >> first of all, thank you for gathering this really great group. he must have a great staff.

>> they are everywhere. >> i am an old arizona state university graduate from teacher education. i have a question q >> do you have a name? question.a >> do you have a name? >> yes, pamela. i have been a teacher and now i am a sociologist. there was a report that a new study has come out to show that university students, at this moment, are ranked, in terms of attitude, our ranking considerably lower on empathy. that really shocked me. i think that says a lot. the second question is, i did not hear any of you say, except -- some of you

mentioned the words about connection and collaboration, but you did not mention how groups learn, how communities learn, how societies learn. to me, that is connected with empathy. i just wanted to throw out that question to anyone that is interested. >> i talked about the need to help young people and not so young people work in groups because you learn so much from each other. i did not disagree. our success on our campus across disciplines has come because we work to help communities help each other, which involves understanding how to explain concept and ask good questions, as well as giving support to each other. i think the movement on all of our campuses involving community service are very important. the students to go out to serve, whether with senior citizens or children, are much better people and prepared to live their lives

more richly as a result of giving back. >> we have time for one more question. the gentleman in the back. >> [unintelligible] >> we do not have to give you zero minutes for comment. >> it was said about the secretary of state, he thought ukraine was a musical instrument. it is very praiseworthy whenever freshener -- whenever a professor tries to repair his students to be successful -- to prepare his students to be successful in life. it is praiseworthy. i would mention the minority we have been almost every class, and the students who are not worried about having, but about being.

i would submit to the members of the panel this question -- how successful are you or how worried are cute about identifying those minorities -- or how worried are you about identifying those minorities who want to know about chopin, schopenhauer, einstein, greece, rome -- even if they are not in those fields? what are you doing about that? >> liberal education. you want students to study history, literature, philosophy, and to ask the big questions about life and what kind of empathy they have appeared the best education has to be abroad. but it is not about training. >> it task to be broad. -- . >> it is not about training. >> it has to be broad.

>> we have to have our students take more courses in the arts and sciences. >> let's thank our panel. [applause] i hope everyone sees that there are some fantastic agents or changed sitting here. being the optimist that i am, i think we can expect a tremendous improvement as we move forward in this very technically complicated business of education. thank you for being here. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010]

>> pulitzer prize winners today on prime time. he talks about the final decade of the cold war. we also look at the first tycoon -- the life and times of cornelius vanderbilt. also, a look at how the world bankers attended to rebuild the global economy following the first world war, which instead lead to economic collapse and the first depression. that is today on c-span2. >> the new british prime minister and conservative party leader david cameron fields questions from members of parliament in his first prime minister's questions as the head of the coalition government. that is a night at 9:00 p.m. on c-span.

-- that is sunday night at 9:00 p.m. on c-span. am i said, this president is going to be impeached. -- >> i said, this president is going to be impeached. he said, we can never use the word and peach in this newsroom, lest something we have an agenda. -- the word impeachment in this newsroom, lest someone think we have an agenda. >> watch this and see wwat other people have said about the break-in and cover-up. explore washington your way. the c-span video library is free, an online. nline.e and o the defense department announced new strategies. the deputy defense secretary briefed reporters on the changes for just over half an hour.

>> how are you? [laughter] i did not want to interrupt your conversation. thank you for coming to this briefing. i know that it is a little earlier than perhaps most of our briefings. i want to welcome you back to the briefing room with deputy secretary bill lynn. his colleagues are also here, including the director of cost analysis and program evaluation, and our undersecretary of defense comptroller. thee here to talk about efficiencies initiatives and reduction of overhead that is being undertaken. deputy secretary lew is goin to explai a little bit about -- the deputy secretary is going to

explain a little bit about it. welcome back. >> thank you. i thought i would make a few opening comments and then spend most of the time taking your questions. i will ask my colleagues to come up to answer the hard questions. as he said, what i want to do today is try and lay out a bit more detail about the process pnd the approach we're going to take to implement the secretary's initiative to reduce overhead and support. the reason for the timing, just so you know, is that we will be putting guidance out in the next day or so, to the services into the defense components, and the combat command, about what kind of expectations the secretary has. you'll start to see those. they will not be classified

documents. this will help you put some of that in context. let me start by saying that the way to look at this is that this is not one process but three. there aren't least three lines in the process. the first of which -- there are at least three lines in the process. the first of which got some notice in the abilene speech. we are seeking to reduce nonessential programs, the overhead programs that the defense business board has calculated approximate about 40% of our budget. we're trying to reduce that and shift the resources into the force structure and modernization accounts. we want to increase those force structure and modern nation accounts at the rate of 3% beyond inflation, 3% real growth. currently, the actual top line of those accounts closed up at

about 1%. we're looking for an additional 2% from the transfer of the overhead accounts into those force structure and modernization accounts. that is the first line and the first process. we can talk more in detail about how we implement that in a second. the second line is within the force structure and modernization account, where we are looking to develop efficiencies in side -- inside those accounts. this is the track in which we are the furthest along. last year, the ending of the production of the f-22 and the cancellation of the a71, the end of the alternate engine -- all of this will be part of that track. we're trying to eliminate overhead in programs, to reduce redundancies, stop programs are we think we have enough

capability, -- stop programs where we think we have enough capability -- that is the second track. although we are the furthest along on that track, we still have ground to be gained on that which will be part of that initiative. you'll see how it fits into the process in a second. the third track in the process is to improve the operating efficiency of the department itself. we want to improve the agility of how the department operates, how the forces operate. we're talking about a flatter organization, smaller staff, generally more efficiency. the secretary gave the example of the team going to afghanistan and how many corps -- headquarters had to sign off on that.

that would be the example of that kind of third track. on the money, the first and second of those tracks are clearly about money. we're talking about developing -- transferring money from the overhead accounts into this force structure and modification accounts and talking about efficiencies within those. within the third track, money and baby a by product, whether it is reducing staff or eliminating -- money may be a byproduct, whether it is reducing staff or eliminating headquarters, but the primary goal is better operation. it is not all just about the money, although the money is very important. i want is it one more thing about the money, just to be clear. this is not an effort to reduce the defense budget. it is an effort to operate within the defense budget that we have been given, which is at about one prison -- 1% real

growth. we are -- it is very difficult to alter or reduced or structure what we are in conflict. we need to% to 3% growth to maintain the capability of the force into continued to dance in those capabilities to give the troops what they got to continue -- capability of the -pforce and to continue to advae in those capabilities to prove -- to give the troops what they need. we need to get enough resources into the fighting and operating agility. overall, i think we're going to give you a hand out with these numbers, but we're talking about -- in terms of the process, we're going to be sending out, as i said, guidance to all the military departments as well as all the other defense components, who will get targets

-- specific targets to hit in this budget cycle. the targets -- everybody wants the numbers. there will be a number on the sheet. it will be the total over five years -- the total will be just over $500 million aaross the whole department. 2/3 of that number, we're trying to get through a direct transfer from the overhead accounts. you'll see this in the guidance when you see it. 2/3 will be a direct transfer from the overhead accounts into the force structure and modernization account. once last three will be developing efficiencies within 's 1/3 will be developing efficiencies within those. it is the initial step, but it is important to set. these are ambitious targets. we must at those in order to accomplish the direction that the secretary -- we must set

those in order to accomplish the direction that the secretary wants us to achieve. the military departments will be keeping the savings they generate. that is an important incentive in the system. they themselves will redirect the savings from the overhead account into the force structure and modernization accounts. that will be how that is done. in terms of timing, this will be part of the budget program process. we're due july 31. that is when we'll have the initial service efforts in this regard. in addition to that process -- all the defense components will be part of that, too. they get target as well. in addition, there are a couple of the things we will be doing. we will be developing operating

efficiencies. it are not being given a budget targets, because they do not have large but it's -- they are not being given budget targets, because they do not have large budget. -- large budgets. we want to improve over had staff functions -- overhead staff functions. there will be a cost-cutting process to look for efficiencies. this will be in the nature of a front-end assessment, of which we have eight going on. this will be the ninth and it will be focused on -- there are six or seven groups looking at things like personnel policy, including medical costs, try care, as a secretary mentioned, organizational restructuring,

logistical efficiencies, and so on. we are going to -- the defense component, starting with the services, is looking for a initiattves and savings, then combatant command, looking for efficiencies, and then we have another set of groups that are looking at broad, department- wide issues. this will be led by the osd staff. i have covered the main points of how we're going to do this. if you want to come up, we will go to your questions. >> many critics will argue that this is the time that 2% or 3% real growth in defense spending in for structure and modernization is not enough to meet the challenges that face the united states. is that tte number that you

embrace as appropriate for the force modernization and force structure needs? are you compromising because of the fiscal realities? >> our assessment is that we need the force structure we have and we have increased, particularly the ground force, to meet those needs. there had been an increase in the army. there will be another increase. we hope that the previously proposed reductions in the navy and air force -- we think we have the force structure that we need to meet the nation's national security needs. is,ink what you're saying if you are holding your force structure constant, generally, what you think you need over time is 2% to 3% real growth in order to service that for

structure, refresh the technology, recapitalize the forced to modernize the force, and that judgment has been proven over history. it is generally right. what we're trying to do here is to get that 2% to 3% in the accounts were is needed -- for structure and modernization -- where is needed -- force structurr and modernization -- without having to increase the top line. we want to shift it to the force structure and modernization accounts. we want to do what we need to do in technology, refresh,ization, quality of life, and all of those factors. -- refresh, modernization, quality of life, and all those factors. >> is 1% over the next five years your current understanding? >> the plan that we expect to have is with the 2% increase

from fiscal 2010 to 2011, 1.8%. the five-year number over the plan, starting in 2012, it is about 01% increase. those are the numbers we're building the budget on. generally, you think that over time, not in any given year, you need to% to 3% -- this is an effort to develop that with these internal changes and efficiencies, these reductions in overhead and the structure. not every secretary of defense has attempted -- >> every secretary of defense has attempted this. they have all been distracted by higher priorities or run out of time. why will it be any different? >> we heard exactly that same thing last year when we proposed to and several major programs, starting with the f- 22.

everybody tries, and nobody succeeds. we succeeded. you have that example. this effort -- the history tells you this will be very hard, and i agree with that. what makes -- distinguishes this effort is the leadership of secretary gates. he and i are personally engage in leading this effort and we will continue to through the developing and execution of the budget. in particular, the secretary had shown the ability and the leadership to take the tough choices. ultimately, you are not going to get savings like what we are proposing here with simply the easing moves. you will find some savings. by pure savings, i mean you can find things, but you do the same thing more efficiently. i do not think we will find $100

billion of those. to get $100 billion, you have to identify lower-priority programs that will not be part of the future budget. the secretary has shown the ability to make those tough choices. secondly, there is necessity. we're in a fiscal situation where it is difficult to shift additional resources to any budget, including defense, and we feel it is our responsibility, before we would consider asking for additional resources, to go through this drill as strongly and as comprehensively as we can. thirdly, the difference here is the comprehensiveness of this effort. it exceeds most of the past efforts that i am aware of. we're engaging all the different aspects of the department, all the components, all the military departments, the combatant commanders.

i think the incentives structure is important. the services are keeping their savings so they have every incentive to find them. finally, it is the context that we're in. we're in an era where we have had almost 10 years of substantial increases in the defense budget. in that kind of era, you will tend to find that you have developed in efficiencies in the way you have operated. indeficiencies in the way you have operated. -- inefficienties in the way you have operated. >> we do not tend to get credit for it, but there are examples of deficiencies that past we have tended to save $4

billion to $10 billion per year when this program is implemented. you would have found a couple of million dollars of cash lying around and people handling that. we now use travel cards and there is almost no cash at our bases. 20 years ago, if you bought a can of paint, you had to do a purchase order. you can just hand the card over. it is a few examples of the efficiencies we have achieved. we need to keep pushing. the secretary is absolutely right to try to finish this. >> this hinges on the ability of the secretary of defense to make tough choices. why are not the people who have a stake in business as usual going to look at how long he has committed to serve and then sit back to wait him out? >> the secretary is committed to

serve -- i do not think he has set a date on when he is leaving. >> [unintelligible] >> i do not think he has said that. i think this will be more than just the secretary. he has discussed this with the president and the president is behind this. he has discussed this with the office of budget management and the director is fully supportive. what we need to do with this progress -- the incentives are with the services to find the savings. we have a very strong start on this process. >> mr. secretary, what guarantees are there that the funds are going to shift were the biggest gap are, since they will stay within -- where the

biggest gaps are, since they will stay within the services to find them? >> most of the force structure and modernization accounts are within the services, and that is where you would shift them to. the service decisions will be reviewed in the normal course of the process. the secretary always reserves the right to shift the resources to the priorities as he sees them. we will still have that process. the initial step -- let me put it differently. in other efforts, sometimes what has happened is the savings are gathered up and brought into a central account, then decided how they are spent. the service is the initial input on deciding. the change would be by exception. it does not rob the secretary of the final decision on where it goes. >> the 1/3 from 4 structure and modernization -- will that be

split evenly -- from force structure and modernization -- will not be split evenly? -- will back be split evenly? -- will that be split evenly? >> you make adjustments as you see that strategy. >> they will have the authority to choose where to put the money? will there be any guidance or language scripting this capability area over any other as they shift the money around? >> in the guidance we're putting out on the overhead efficiencies, no. we have just completed a qdr. there is defense planning and programming guidance. the services will be expected to follow that. there will be more resources put into support of the wars

we're fighting. that kind of guidance still exists and we expect it to be followed. that is the qdr, the overall lines of the qdr are still in place. >> secretary gates [inaudible] it cuts across the services. is there any realistic chance that you can somehow control health care costs? it is outside the department control. >> some of it is outside. some of it is within the department's control while working with congress. we intend to work with congress. i talked about the cost-cutting groups. one of those obie for best -- focused on personnel policy. a simple part of that group will be looking at tricare and costs. they mentioned the eisenhower

speech. we cannot change copiague, premium, it deductible -- copays, premiums, and deductibles since the program started in the 1990's. we need to treat our troops fairly. does that mean we cannot change medical benefits ever? i think it does not mean that. this is not something that the department is going to be able to do unilaterally. we have to work closely with congress. >> we have had some success. for example, we were allowed to use the va drug pricing scheme. medicarelementing the rates for inpatient -- outpatient services. there have been some efficiencies. is the struggle that we need to

continue. we need do -- it is a struggle that we need to continue. we need to continue to reduce costs while improving services. >> you talked about the deficiencies in joint strike fighter. are you confident about that? >> the secretary and the president have said in the strongest possible terms that they will not accept a bill with the alternative engine in it. >> i want to clarify. i think as a department, it will undergo the change and review. we would essentially see -- the third track dimension -- personal savings, a purging of people within osd. >> yes. osd is clearly part of this.

you will see changes in the office of the secretary of defense and reductions in the size of the staff as well as other changes. >> we expect to see the results of what each of the departments and the services come up with. >> we will see the initial effort. i do not know whether you will see it. we will see it on july 31. you may see it, the old. we will see it on july 31, when they submit their programs. we will then take the rest of the year to shake that into a budget submission -- to shape that into a budget submission for 2012. he wants to start that early in and establish some momentum. id'd will see decisions over the course of the summer and fall -- i think you will see decisions over the course of the summer and fall where we will start

down the path of overhead reductions and efficiency savings. >> thank you. i assume that the services could take a knife to their own size and potentially, we could see, if they reduce the size of their services, you do not expect to see that? >> i did not say you cannot make any adjustment at all. we think the combat force structure we have right now is what we need, at least to meet the threats in the current environment. i would not expect to see major force structure changes in this. >> you said you have to identify programs that aren't going to survive. let me ask you about the biggest single acquisition program, the f-35. the latest estimates have it

going potentially as high as $382 billion through 2036. that compares with an estimated price tag of only three and a $20 billion just two months ago -- $320 billion just two months ago. might it be scaled back? >> i do not think that will be the focus. will the joint strike fighter be a candidate in terms of trying to find efficiencies? can we do the program more efficiently and more effectively? that will certainly be a possibility. i think -- nothing is off the table. we are not looking at the fundamental changes in the joint strike fighter program. >> what about the numbers? could you elaborate a bit on how did it happen that the estimated

price tag rose so much from just two months ago, after you implemented these changes designed to put the program back on track in time for development money and test aircraft? >> let me try to answer that. i know you are referring to that review that was just released. at the time that we talked about the cost of the program, as the budget was submitted in february, and dr. carter and i testified, we presented our range of values for the unit costs, with procurement included. the numbers are in that range. they are at the high end of the range, which is not pleasing to the department or to anyone, but nevertheless, they are within the range. it is not that our estimate is off from what is now. that is why we gave the range two months ago. we knew we would be doing the work to refine the numbers. that does not mean we are

satisfied, just because it is in the range of the estimate. it is not what we had in mind for this program, as you understand. we're looking for efficiencies to try to bring those numbers down, not changing the numbers that we are procuring -- we need those jets, but to try to reduce the inefficiencies that your looking for -- we are looking for. we're looking across all programs for those. it applies to jsf. >> to say that that was presented in february, if i recall correctly, the $328 was the upper end of the range. that has been superceded and >> i have the numbers in my head from baseline dollars. we were looking at a range of

$79 to $95, and it came in at $92. i do not have the big numbers in my head. similarly, for the number with the preferment cost, we give the range and the number is within the range -- the procurement costs, we gave the range and the number is within the range. the numbers are staggering. i am not arguing that they are not. as i said, we understood, when we submitted the budget, that there was uncertainty in the number that we put into the report that we give to the congress. we knew that we were going to be completing the numbers through review. now that it is complete, we know where we are on the cost. we have more information and we

will target whatever we can to get the cost of the program down. >> let's try to keep it on this topic. do you recall the savings targets for fiscal year 2012 with certainty? >> i have those in front of me -- $7 billion. >> what about the acquisition workforce? how will this affect the size of the acquisition workforce? >> a substantial part of the increase in -- it was actually insourcing. more than half of it was. that should save some money by bringing people on the government payroll. the other part, where we are adding acquisitions, we think that is going to make the department a better buyer. we think that we oversteered in the 1990's, essentially, in the

last decade, in terms of taking too much expertise out of the acquisition workforce. in order to get the kinds of efficiencies and the overhead savings that we want on the acquisition and investment side, we are going to need those people. they're going to be in the investment. we will get a many-fold return on that. >> there has been a separate reporting requirement with this initiative. is a part of a standard budget process? >> yes. we will ask for them to identify -- for example, you asked about the $2 billion in savings -- we wwll ask them to identify specifically what they have done, so that that will be part of their program and budget submission. >> how are you going to involve

congress? will you give them an early presentation on the budget? >> we'll do all of that. we need to continually engaged congress each step of the way -- engage congress each step of the way. it is congress, the white house, the omb. there are many groups within the apartment -- the department. it has to be a transparent process to succeed. >> did you hear anything back from congress on that abilene speech? >> i think the general reaction has been very positive. i saw comments from senator levin. i think that the general reaction has been very positive. >> thank you, ladies and

gentlemen. >> thank you. >> president obama spoke at carnegie mellon university this week. he noted the economic recovery tax impact on the economy, citing an estimated 720,000 clean energy jobs that will be greeted by 2012 from tax credits and guarantees -- created by 2012 from tax credits and guarantees. allan meltzer responded saying, "the huge stimulus spending has done little to reduce unemployment, and long-term unemployment has never been higher than the last couple of years." watched the president's remarks and read the response, as well

as a statement by the house minority leader john boehner, and our stimulus website at c- span.org/stimulus. >> pulitzer prize winners today on book tv prime time. we have a discussion on the final decade of the cold war. we have a look at the first tycoon -- the life and times of cornelius vanderbilt. we also have a discussion of how world bankers attended to rebuild the world economy following the first world war, and instead led to the first economic collapse and great depression. that is today on c-span2. >> everyone has an agenda. as long as you know what their agenda is, you can write about that story. >> over the past year, he has written a series on lawmakers overseas trips, funded by taxpayers. he is our guest sunday on c-

span's "q&a." >> next, all look at the justiie department's office on violence against women. the head of that department joined us on "washington journal" for about 40 minutes. host: we want to introduce you to the director of the office on violence against women at the department of justice. against women. what does that office do? guest: good morning, and thank u for invitg me here today. is e component ofhe department of justice. was created 15 years provide national e issue of of th against women, onticularly focusin violence, sexual dating violence, and although weak cover e whole range of the violence against women. we cover the whole range of

the violence against women. we are here to provide n the issue of again women, d we so with stat governments and local governments and forth,ries and have ofthe mechanism we administering grant funds. year congrs aropriates funds for our office to distribute to ates, local collisions, community groups, to implement a variety of different help establish polici at the localevel. host: what was the office found it? how big is your budget? guest: the office was founded in passed in the act was 1994. each year, our office administers $430 milli, funds., in grant past years, we have

over $4 billion in grant funds. host: is it important that there department of office for violence against women? guest: i believe so. congress' intent we did not identify domestic violence as a crime. it is probably the single stamps -- single-biggest issue facing the country. we used to never identified domestic violence as an issue. we did not understand it to be an issue until we began to understand and hear from victims about their experiences, and hearing from advocates about the need to have an office to address these issues. the advocates behind the original movement -- were behind the original movement to address a federal response, because there was not enough happening at the state level. congress determined, after many

years of hearings, led by at that time senator biden, the importance of establishing an office to direct its attention to crimes against women. after many years of failed attempts, a loss of national support came together. with a bipartisan effort, senator hatch especially, they brought democrats and republicans together to recognize that we truly do need to address this on a very comprehensive basis. host: are there any statistics on domestic violence? guest: we have government statistics, private foundations statistics, i hesitate to focus just on statistics. host: just a snapshot. guest: roughly one in four women are but tons of domestic violence. we have over half a million reported sexual assaults. . sexual assaults, and i stres

because rape and sexual assaults are to this day under-poed crimes america. to reportwant sexual violence. it is a very difficult thing to report. the responses are not very positive responses. women are victimized, women are blamed for the assault. ofassi cases are reporting the asslt and the ingrate turns to the victim, not a perpetrato inquiry turns to the victim, the perpetrator. it is very difficult f bn sexuallyhave assaulted to go through the physical, and emotional trauma tn reported but thene accused of being the source of -- but then be accused of being the source of t having theanno if it is not pperlyed.

investigated and prosecuted, because of all the investigation, or if it is jurycuted and t culture, cause of a the blood this, wen will not come woman would be this, women will not comeward. teen dating violence, for example, was not part of the original of violence against women act. n theears ago, a 2005, i the act, itn of was dating violence included so that we could focus attention and pubc awareness and resources on addressing teen dating of violence. host: when did you become direor? guest: two months ago. host: i have been calling you judge. calling you judge? guest: for 20 years i was the

judge ad my docket was the family court docket. -- for 20 years i was a judge. primaly the family cot docket -- might dockt was primarily a family courtocket. i've learned abo domestic violence and the trauma it cost day innd children every america. focusing my extracurricular, if yo know, a career around violence, trying to decides cases on the bench, how to have address this prlem. i have spent years in the state country a the around the world dealing with domestic vionc host: you did not want to focus on statistics, but as a judge, you would be at theic level, you would see the actual

-- what kind of help is the doj 's office on violence against r to a woman who has domesticallabused, and et? guest: what we do is set policy the administration bus unns that are prorated -- throughngress, the administration's grant funds that are appropriated to us by congress. kantor discretionary grants -- and through discretionary exale, a urt system, or a collaborative group, law enforcement, y leaders, could come together to apply for funds to their own community response. host: what about ngo's? guest: they can as wel host: for example, a shelter? .uest: mm-hmm

host: what oth kinds of grants do you provide? guest: we have grants for prosecutors, law enforcement, we have transitional housing, and in rural jisdictions in a a more unique and potentially more dangerous situatio being in one time wyoming, and it has the largest county in the country. have a few law enforcement officers who need to cover the territory and provide resources safety and is very hard for rural setting, provide for safety needs that they may have. we do programs to deal with awareness we have our rae programs that deal with issues.f

it is just a very wide scope of progms. when programs now to address -- we haveand programs now to address is culturally and linguistically situations. programs for troubled collisions. it was not until recently upset coalitions. it was notntil rectly that recognize that we have unponsibities that were fulfilled. administration and attorn-general are deeply addressing the previous administrations. host: it was signed by a democratic president, bill clinto and tune out a president, president obama. -- you now have a mocratic president, president

obam was psident bush's support of this? guest: every administration and of this.was supportive n have our renewed for this -- renewed focus. ortly, a month or two after office, president obama cted a white house --el for women and girls counsela white house for women and girls. the needs have not been addressed. akes a look atll actions are not the federal governnto make sure that we oe addressing the needs -- around thes federal govement to make sure that we are addressing the nee women and girls. another thing was to place speciaadviser in the white e, who had formerly been the r of the network violence, appointed presi -- appointed

oba.esident obama and vice president biden have been working very closelyn this to importance of sexual assault, and brought in this adviser. she has been a visa on -- a liaison and leaderip force in the white house that we've never before. the attorney-generalaseen active, perhaps the active o we have er seen on these issues. ,ost: judge susan carbon the office on violence against women. in oklahoma, republican up., you are first caller: good morning. ho: i'm going to have to put hold. tow the rule, you have down pretty will come back to you valerie imaryland.

,aller: i want to know comp men who commit violence against women register as sex offenders? one more time? caller: i think a man who commit women should like sex offenders. guest: the queion of registration as sex offenders is something that congress has p and looking into as to what guidelines qualify for registration. knowledge, they don't discrimina between men and be sexho would offenders. thate or one reporting, they would be included. host: is this a state or federal issue? guest: it is both. have sex offenders crossing state lines, you have sure you have the collateral connection between different jurisdiions.

s on whererestriction go, once theyn eleased or imprisoned or incarcerated. make sure that there connection and safety for community. as well in local safety issue. host: next call, mary in oklahoma. caller: well, let me tell you story don't cut me off, because i will make it brief. i'm 86ears old. when i married back in the i told my husband then -- said, i am just as good as you are. supposed to walk by your side. respect me, orot hurt me, i kill you. them.s what i told he left that he thought it was funny. was that he respected me all these years,

in, andy time he come something,ss about a .said, don't go away from me women he rights, but they don't enforce tm that is th problem with many women. walk alongside their husband. they should talk their problems out. as we raise our family, our table was the place to problems. problems, his problems, and he wld ask each f our four children, what t to tell me today? we did say, "oh, he is to blame --" host marid you have any friends or know any women who abused?haps

caller: yes. talking to them is like talking to the win, because they would the.ee them or standeave them. i had a sister, and so help me could not figure out why took that. he would have respected her. guest: i would love to respo that. barry, i am very happyhat you were safe in your religion -- mary, i am very happy that you safe in your relationship that your husband respected you. many have that same experienc in a happy marriage and their also safe.e but for women trying to leave a it canus relationship, be more dangerous. leaving it is a more dangerous for them. inre are risks inherent that.

not services in place, and 40 years ago, i dare say there were fewer resources place --hat landscape has dramatically now. but it can b very dangeus for n to leave unless they have safe place and resources. of data fort research on domesticiolence in particular on mosttic homicide that common sit secure following depture from the danger is -- most homicides occur following the departure from the dangerous relationship. host: being in family court for years, ds anything surprise you? guest: i was very shocked. still -- noti am shocked, but deeply, deeply saddened, what i hear stories. there are days when i hear that i cannot believe people, that an endureual would have to

or emotionalse miliation and devastation in r lives. trying to cope with that is not an easy task. host: i saw a story yesterday baltire sun," i think was, or a 17-month old girl gonorrhea. something your office on?ld wk guest: tre are horrific of children,rape -rew some physical acts phicalcts. ochildren, we d well.stic view as we will be looking at a comprehensive assessnt of to alln who a exposed of of violence, being one of the most horrific forms of a violent -- perhaps being one of the

horrific forms of violence a child could experience. host: st.ouis, good mning. caller: susan, thank you for ork and all that you do agree i communicatelast week because i work ithe community, and the against womens increasing throughout the especially among refugees and immigrants. beyond t grants,ow do you address funding disparities for smaller communities? last we discussed this week, but a larger scale, how you addressed nationally defunding disparities? the funding disparities? guest: we have program cald culturally and linguistically specic pgrams to underserved counities. is one of my personal

priorities in theffice, to that we are reaching populations. know that statistics are much for african-american forand even higher .women and an to all to reach out thatnities to make sure e available for everybody. host: are there differences in cultural attitude among recent immigrants as opposed to u.s.?me residents of the guest: all cultus have b i don'tviews, endures orulture endorses violence. cannot in any form at all. host: said lewis, go ahead. -- st.is, go ahead. caller: i'm a victim of mental

abuse, at the age of 14. be 51 in november. i am in a work forceere i was a settlement agreement new assistanto in overnight that personnel and tried to write me up for productivity, upper survives where i know as a survivor i choices. the paperwork. elite -- they started threatening my job. i started crying, and they said needed to call the crisihot line, and i sd, "no, ion't." you need toaid, call resources for living. don't.", i up andmmediely got room and left me with male manager and clo the

door with personnel. with the situation of being in in, i felti am were uncomfortable --. in the positn i'm in, were uncomfortable. know, i am in picking up cardboard, up, and two policem .re walking through the door evidently she had called 911 and going to kills myself. ho: thank you for sharing your story. what is your resnse to her? guest: i cannot address the , but ourcircumstances n looking into on workplace violence, to have an appropriate private and public sexualr response to assault. l help individual employers learn how to deal with these issues,

but sexual assault and sexual violent both-- and -- both sexual sexual harassment d violence. st: next call. caller: thank you for it c-span. it just does not see to be working. it seems like it isomething jail now, o prison. people who commit violence, and igainst the victim's -- sisters and a daughter, athingould not want li that to happen anyway ap. we just get more crime and more crime, the politicians do nothing. guest: let me try to respond to that. on ourthe major focus

have a good public of the problem itself. when we changed the dynamic and how vlence is perpetrated in o families and stres and music and sports, we the dynamic and oknge what we now accept as to something where we recognize violence cannot and will tolerated. one of our initiatives is to more heavily on prevention. much luck with that with at belts and drunk driving and - much of this nature had with seat belts of drunk driving and things the center, we need people to realize that you need to be .afe people will uerstand and no longer tolerate violence. we have me in my view, schizophrenia around which may be why we tolerate it and do not section violent -- do n sanction of violent behavior.

we have a lot of a violent music, misogynistic images. we'reot makg a recognition that this is flat out wrong and cannot be tolerated. we have to have a holistic, comprehensive approach to saying that violence isot right and nobody should be subjected to violence. no man,oman, where a child should be subjected to violence -- no man, woman, or child should be subjected to violence. host: doesome of your grant money go to research of men who commit violence against women? guest: there is ather part of the department of justice, at the national institute of justice, which conducts a lotf research, and we have some research through a programming as well. we try to looat all areas of the violence. there are issues raise of whether men or women commit violence. we want to make sure whave a violence-free environment. host: tim, independent line.

caller: actually, i have a background in counselin will we know i that violence does not happen -- that what we know is that violence does not happen in a vacuum, domestic violence, especially. you sort opre-emptive meet a bit, as it relateso -- preempted me a bit, as it relates to men who perpetrate violent acts as copi mechanisms, in terms of the they are orwhelmed with the life and they cled by committing the most of violence. obviously, that is not ok, but what is being done to help aling with that? guest: tt is a great question. being under strs and losing a job is not an excuse for violence, and if people respond to that by committing violence

against an intimate paner or friend or whatever, they have a very distinctroblem. we do need to address that problem. it is important as well to understand that there are resources available for men who batter. we have court sanctioned programming for batterers so that they can change the behavior and learn why those responses are not appropriate. i do want to make it absolutely clear that our callers and or loss of a job is no -- excuse for that alcohol -- i want to ma absolutely clear that alcoholism or loss of a jobs no excuse for committing violence against a partner. host: nancy, you with us? caller: yes. since i bought a home in 2005, i noticed that it aggravated me a lot, but in society as a general rule, that women are second-

class in our attitudes. i am not complaining about it, i'm just noticing that, because i want to accept it. law enforcement -- here in fort lauderdale, if they have a problem but some guy- about five years ago, when he assaulted me, they did not do anything. i come to the conclion that things have not changed that much, i am sorry to say. the attitude isot correct. it is not modern. if law enforcement is not going to take you seriously -- if i own a home and i got hom invasion, they just brushed you off. if you are a man, you get treated differently. a friend said, "you are all women, and that is the way it is." -- you are a woman, and that is the way it is." guest: i am sorry you had this

experience. are around the country, law enforcement has been making great strides in cnging behavior and training. that does not mean that every circumstances and in the most appropriate nner. -- that does not mean that every circumstance is handled in the most appropriate manner. but there are programs so that we can make sure that people are up-to-date on the curren understanding of the issue and the appropriate responses as well. there is turned over all the time in community organizations, and law enforcement is no different. but we do need to make sure that law enforcement response appropriately. i recommend th you contact the chief of the department, or th local chapter of coalition receiving the funds to see what they do aut this. host: how often you get those reports, that police he acted inappropriatel

guest: it is not just police but there may be some system breakdown. we get the reports probably every week. it is not unusual. we try to respond by directing them to a local organization that can help them. we do not have a perfect society, but we're making huge strides. for people where they can turn to for help. host: in your view, our loss strict enough against domestic violence, -- are lstrict enough against domestic violence,een violence, stalking? are the penalties strong enough? guest: i think the penalties are strong enough. it is our awareness and tolerance it, whether we are going too is up about it. -- whether we are going to do something about it. we want to chge the behavior in the fst instance, and far

better to change the behavior from a prentive the standpoint rather than how we are going to punish somebody in the end. we have more vtims in the process if you wait for the punishment side of this. we want to improve the prevention side of the work so that we do not have the victims like this waitingor the appropriate respoe, or looking towards whether we are goi to incarcerate somebody. our attention on how we prevent this in the first instance. host: when you work in the family court in new hampshire, did you know of strong penalties fodomestic aburs? guest: in my case, i was on the family court docket, so we did not hear of the criminal court docket most of the cases we heard at any way would have a one-year

incarceration. strangulation was just made a felony offense, so the dynamic is changing around the country host: why wouldn't it be? guest: that is part of the cultural shift we are facing. people talked of it as choking. choking does not seem like a serious cme. what you think about putting off the blood supply -- the brain when you think about cutting off a -- what you think about cutting off the blood supply to the b, changes the court response and the public response. these other kinds of things we need to ok for -- these are in the kinds of things that we need to be looking for. there are lots of things that determine our response in with the behavior actually is. host: texas, alison, hi.

caller: i does wanted to say that -- i just wanted to say that i got out of our relationship like this years ago, and i'm from a long line of abused women and somabuse demand. -- som abused men. it is not possible get out of it. if that happens to you, you have got to get out of the housend file criminal charges. it is not always the easiest thing to do. but i found that the blogger i called myself a victim, that is all -- the lger i called myself a victim, that was all i was. often the victim back out if it -- but what do thi did know what to do that, they -- do not they don't want to dohis, they do not want to do that, they do not want the ladies to grow up without a father or whatever.