the constitution and forced and having respect for the congress that the judges to enforce the constitution understand what the constitution means and are prepared to defer to congress when appropriate and to overturn congress or state legislatures when it is not. >> thank you very much. [applause] >> you are watching c-span, created by america's cable companies. up next, campaign 2010 coverage continues with the debates between candidates running for the senate democratic nomination in north carolina and another debate in the south carolina governor's race between to be zero republicans running in next tuesday's car run of -- between two republicans running in next tuesday's runoff. that the conference on women and leadership.

next, a debate between candidates running for the democratic nomination in north carolina. elaine marshall and cal cunningham took place at a debate in raleigh. the candidates are running in a primary runoff election this, coming tuesday. this is about an hour. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> this question will give us insight into your priorities. if you win the fall general election, what will be your first priority? the first bill he will co- sponsor when the session begins in anuary? >> that is a great question. let me begin by thanking the league of women voters for the opportunity to stand before you and answer questions. it is an honor to run for this job. if elected, and given an

opportunity to serve in the u.s. senate, i would put six hardworking years into rebuilding the foundation of our economy, working to get jobs are growing. it will not be one specific legislation, but a series of policies i will pursue that will provide tax credits for small businesses and provide targeted middle-class cuts for families, and restore fairness to the trade roles and treaties that have created an unfair playing field. i want to invest in schools and education. i will talk about how we break our dependence on foreign oil and invest in alternative energy for our future. >> elaine marshall, question to you? the top priority or the first legislation you would like to be involved in? >> it is a great to be here. thank you to the league of women voters and the folks out there listening. i believe my first bill will be

something related to jobs appear. we are hurting. we need jobs. i think people can wait -- think we can recruit small business, but we have to grow small business. my first bill would be something in the nature of spurring financial literacy, entrepreneurship, and something that will help jobs stay in north carolina towards a sustainable economy and a strong small business. >> we move on. before the gulf oil spill, president obama wanted to allow drilling off the coast. he said -- he has since put a moratorium on new drilling, but before that, we talked about -- about youraboyou talked opposition. >> example numberone is the gulf coast. i was clear that i was opposed to offshore drilling for north carolina. what this bill is brought to the

forefront is the critical need for of for thinking energy policy for this country. the second thing is to examine the coziness between corporate america and government. senator burr did nothing to make the mms more efficient and promoted deep sea or oil drilling. mr. burr has done their bidding and accepted contributions from them. he is the senator from big oil. i would like to be the senator from north carolina. >> cal cunningham, your take on the opposition you have expressed to offshore drilling. >> offshore drilling and raises a question of what our energy future will look like. how do we balance our priorities? how we make sure we protect north carolina's unique nature? and we have a wonderful travel and tourism. our beaches are a splendid

destination. that is important to the economy. as we think about protecting our environment, there is not enough oil or natural gas off the coast to be a meaningful part of an energy solution for america. it is why in this campaign i have talked about ending tax credits and tax favored status for big oil companies. it is why in this campaign we talked about over $400,000 senator burr has taken from big oil companies. even today, he is defending what has happened with bp. i want to use the power of the government to create incentives for alternative forms of energy, wind, solar, biodiesel. that is the future. >> any rebuttal on that issue? we will move onto a follow-up from of your. willmington.

-- wilmington. >> what we see is there has been a very cozy relationship between the regulators and the regulated. something that i'm disappointed that the president was not more aggressive about before he started talking about changing the policy. we have to make sure we do not just have a band-aid solution. but that we get serious about making sure this industry is investing in technologies for how to mitigate spills. it is a very clear that government was not doing its part. industry has not been doing its part. bp has not been doing its part to make sure the risks are mitigated. i think it is an appropriate role for a u.s. senator to call those into account in front of congress and make sure we have a much stronger regulatory framework.

>> elaine marshall, your take on the current regulations. >> clearly, the regulations have not been adequate. i am a state regulator and i have had to crack the whip over regulators to make sure the job gets done. that needs to happen in washington. we need to make sure we have the right regulations on the books, that the relationships are not overly cozy, and that we give the tools to the regulators to do the job. we need the asset of being able to charge folks criminally if they make serious misrepresentations. we need to evaluate any disaster scenario, not just something written on a piece of paper. as to be substantiated and tested. we clearly, clearly need to do more in this area to protect our valuable coast. >> the video is so disturbing. and rebuttals? we might be able to return to that later in the debate.

let's move on to the economy. our economic recovery is slow going. over the past 1.5 years, our state unemployment line has swollen by 120,000 out of work. since small businesses create the majority of jobs, we want to know what you would do to help small business owners in north carolina. >> i have already touched on that a little bit. i have then a small business owner myself. i have made payroll, i have had to do marketing. a lot of folks just do not understand it they can make a business out of the next best idea, as long as they do not infringe on upon anything proprietary. we have to stimulate entrepreneurship. we have to provide tax incentives. in north carolina, we have the great research universities with lots of ideas and training lots

of people. we have a wonderful community college system that is putting workers out there. we need a proper infrastructure, tax credits, a proper stimulation, appropriate exposure to promote these partnerships were possible. there is a raft of things we can do. as i said, you do not recruit small business. you grow small business. we need to put more emphasis on those avenues to assist those folks who would be willing to do this and open up credit for them. >> credit. that is something that has been struggling. cal cunningham, your way to help small business. >> thank you for that question. i have met people who i think typifies some of the challenges we face and created a video series. i invite the viewer is to look at it -- it is called "the voices of north carolina." identified a man who was trying

to grow his small business. he used to be in the furniture business. now he is changing out tires on cars. he is on the normal main street in north carolina. he needs to get over the confidence curdle he is facing, to get folks back on his payroll. he is having a hard time with the banks. i think it is important that we pass financial regulatory reform, create a new framework for the banking industry, and help begin lending again. it is a very important as i talk to small business owners. we also bolster the role of community colleges and incubate new businesses from our research triangle institutions, how our universities -- extend research and development into a manufacturing taa credit. provide new tools to help stimulate innovation and make sure small business owners can grow their payrolls and at the end of the day, private sector job growth drives the economy.

>> thank you. any rebuttals on the subject? let's move on. the projected deficit for the current federal deficit -- $1.30 trillion. just below the record of $1.40 trillion from a year ago. here is of your asking what you would do to eliminate the federal -- here is of you were asking what you would do to eliminate the federal o deficit? >> the rising debt is a very important, because as we grow again, interest rates will take off and that will stifle growth again. it is important that it is a burden that gets passed from one generation to the next. one of the touchstones of this campaign is a leading our country in a better place for our children and grandchildren. very, very straight and to the point. we had a $2.80 million federal contract under the bush administration. if we cut 25% of those, we would

save money over a 10-year period of time. there are important tax loopholes that we can close or -- that outsource jobs. were formed a contract in business. $45 a billion should be collected by the federal government. congress has to live by the pay- as-you-go rules. if it spends a dollar, it has to explain where it comes from. the most important way that we get our fiscal house in order is to restore growth. >> thank you. elaine marshall? >> that is a great question. when americans look at washington, they see their priorities are out of order. they could not run their household the way that washington runs their house. i am the one on sunday that checks out the coupons and the paper to see if there is anything of benefit to me that i

need. that is the kind of epic i will take to washington. we need to understand where this deficit came from. when bill clinton left office, we were in a surplus. george bush, with the help of has taken us to two wars without any way to pay for it and given as a prescription drug program without paying for. at the same time, giving tax breaks to the ultra-wealthy. our priorities are out of order. the very first thing we have got to do is to let those tax breaks expire. then we have to stimulate the economy and create jobs. we have to build that tax base. we talked about small businesses. we need to grow our way out of the problems that we are in with the deficit. it is a serious problem, and we need to address it. hard question, but we have to address it. >> it will certainly not be

solved overnight any rebutta. any rebuttals? arizona made national headlines for beefing up its illegal immigration law at the state level. president obama ordered 1200 national guard troops to arizona and is calling for $500 million to beef up border patrols. what are your thoughts on this new state law for arizona and the federal government's latest move? >> i understand where arizona is coming from. the federal government heretofore has not been doing what they need to do to shore up the border. the new federal law is a horrible law. it will prevent people from seeking to help of law enforcement when they are the victims of a crime. as a domestic violence advocates, we have tried to build up a confidence in law

enforcement. this one simple act will take this confidence away. it is a wrong-headed policy. i very much appreciate the president beefing up the border, because that is what has to happen. if you came home tonight and saw water in your kitchen, you would not just mop it up. we cannot support our way out of this problem. you would find the source of the problem before you did cleanup. we have to shore up the borders, whether the physical borders of north and south, our ports, seaports, airports, and we have to strengthen our fizeau program so we know who is interested, who is coming to america -- programhen our a vis thsa so we know who was interested. we have to enforce the laws on the books. that is a key portion appeared >> your take on that question? >> i think arizonas policy is

wrongheaded. it emphasizes again that the congress needs to step forward and act on comprehensive immigration reform. i have personal experience in dealing with challenges raised by a failed system. when i was at fort bragg in 2005 as a federal prosecutor, everyday people showed up at the gates with false identification. they were looking for work. there were not here legally. we had a hard time getting immigration and customs enforcement involved. had a hard time selling together a proper law- enforcement response -- sewing together proper law enforcement response. we have to step 4. congress needs to get tough on employers abusing the system -- we have to step forward. they need to be tough on border security. i applaud the president for strengthening the border. it has to be fair to taxpayers. right now time part 5 million --

10.5 million folks here illegally. we cannot deport everybody, but we are a nation of laws. thanks for the question. >> any rebuttals on that arizona topic? let's move on. this is a follow up, but goes more into your policies. the nation's immigration law is a constant source of debate. what do you consider the most important component of comprehensive immigration reform? >> that is a good question. i really think there are three important components. i do not want to put one in front of the other. let's lay them out. have to be tough on the borders, tough on employers and is using the system. we have to make sure it is practical and fair to taxpayers, who are paying their fair share.

folks who are here without documentation are not. those are the principles i'd bring it to this discussion. comprehensive immigration reform has to accomplish those. >> we talked about this subject many times. what would you consider the most important component for immigration reform? >> we have to stop the influx. you do that to strengthening borders, but you also enforce the law on the books regarding employers, because they are simply looking for cheap labor. folks that are coming here are seeking economic our virginity, and you cannot fault anybody for that. -- they are seeking economic opportunity. most came for that. the other factor is we need to reform the immigration bureau itself. i have personal experiences with employees. they make mistakes, delay and obstruct, and do not follow the guidelines. and they are not very user- friendly.

more customer service is possible. -- while enforcing the law. we do not want everybody to feel like a criminal who comes up to their door. that is not america. that is not right. >> a bottle? -- rebuttal? coming up, we will hear more from the candidates about issues you told us are important to you. we will have follow-up questions from our panel of journalists. you are watching the democratic debate live on nbc 17. welcome back to the democratic senate runoff debate. we are entering segment two, which consists of of your questions, the league of women voters and journalists. the order of the question is determined by a coin toss.

cal cunningham gets the first question. the most as -- recent estimates put social security as being unable to make full payout between 200037 and 2041. how would you address the issue of solvency concerning the future of social security? >> it is a terrific question. i laid out some important principles with respect to social security, because as i have travelled north carolina, more seniors have been asking questions. there was not a cost-of-living increase this year. the senate failed to take action on the supplement to help seniors with rising costs. i laid out in this campaign and a handful of important points. not to go for risky privatization schemes. second, let's get to solvency -- we have to pay back the social security trust fund. $2.60 trillion was borrowed against the trust fund to pay for the ongoing operations of

this country. third, i laid out that i do not think we need to change in benefits or raise the retirement age. if we let the bush tax cuts expire, which i would substitute some targeted middle-class tax cuts and a small business tax breaks, and continue that revenue into the future, it would extend the life of social security by 75 years. that will make sure is a strong for the future. it is a promise for our seniors. i wanted to make sure it is there for the next generation. >> elaine marshall, solvency and social security's future? >> it has been a wonderful safety net for seniors, women, in particular, who tended to live longer. we have to protect the solvency of the program, and one key way is not to continue to use tricks and games and gimmicks like washington has done with the social security trust fund. as a financial regulator, one

who put crooks in jail for scanning the elderly, i am absolutely opposed to any privatization. when you put that kind of money out there, it is a magnet for crooks. we see over -- all the time. today, we announced a partnership to protect seniors that i cannot talk about in this moment. i want to be clear. i oppose raising the age limit in social security, notwithstanding innuendo's made in this race. i believe we could work to the solvency. there are the things we can do, but we have to make sure we do not continue to play tricks and games and tried to scare senior citizens with misrepresentation. >> a bottle? >> if i may, because i think the director -- a reference to innuendo is directed becky. she suggested raising the retirement age several weeks ago. then she talked about keeping and raising the retirement age. i do not think it shouud be on

the table. it makes the most vulnerable among us does, it puts them at high risk. it is something i very clearly said should not be done and should not be on the table. >> rebuttal? >> yes. i have been clear. my mother came to my rescue on this. she lives on social security. that is what is wrong with washington. you tried to enter an intelligent debate about the various aspects of things that could and should happen. i never said i supported it. i strongly stand in favor of not raising the age for social security. thank you. >> we will move on it to another topic that might make your blood boil. we will talk campaign fund raising. this is a direct question, individually, ok? we will begin with elaine marshall. yes. elaine marshall, six lobbyists you regulate have given you individual donations totaling

less than $5,000. is it ethical for you to accept this donation? >> i will have to tell you that i am offended that folks think i can be bought and sold with a lobbyist contributions. i have state bar reputation and my career as secretary of state by calling things as i see them. i have been associated with lobbyists the whole time i was in government. that is a natural factor. i have proposed statutes, made decisions, enacted policies based upon what i felt was right for north carolina. i have acted on my gut instinct in starting a lobbying reform. i did not know exactly what was going on, but i have had a gut instinct to do what is right. i am not be told and it to anyone, certainly not any small -- i am not beholden to anyone. i am not hustling from lobbyist.

i cannot be bought and sold. >> thank you for the clarification. this is a separate question for you. we will allow we bottles -- rebuttals. you received more than $80,000 from the democratic senatorial campaign committee. explain why you accepted these funds? >> i am very proud of the support i have across the state and from the democratic senatorial campaign committee. they are committed as i am committed to replacing richard burr in this campaign. this will go the distance this fall, replacing in the u.s. senate, and make sure that our voice is being heard in the national debate we are having. i am committed to winning this race. >> rebuttals? very good. we will move on to military. cal cunningham, this question going to.

both chambers of congress are considering legislation to repeal of don't ask don't tell. polling asked voters if they supported allowing gay and lesbian soldiers to serve openly in the military. according to the poll, 54% said yes. 37% said no. 8% had no opinion. this viewer asks where you stand on repealing don't ask don't tell? >> thank you for your question. this is a policy that is inconsistent with america's values and the military's values. i know this. i have been a military prosecutor in iraq and have seen that this policy does not work. it takes folks out of service. 13,000 american men and women out of service at a time when we need them the most and for nothing related to the quality of service and they can provide our country. i am heartened to see efforts

moving for. the president should give the order. this policy should end. >> elaine marshall? >> i am opposed to discrimination of anytime, anyplace, anywhere. in my private practice of law, in my personnel policies as secretary of state, we are opposed to that. i have represented people who have been sorely oppressed because of discrimination. i think don't ask don't tell needs to be repealed. these are fine young men and women who are committed to the military. they are willing to go into foreign places and maybe even give their lives for the freedoms we have here. the freedom to be free from discrimination. it is just not right to ask them to lie about who they are, to be able to fulfil their military career and losing all that valuable talent. >> rebuttal? will move on to the war on

terror, the focus in afghanistan. a surge of 30,000 troops began early this year at early cost projections of $40 billion and growing. but drawdown is tentatively scheduled to begin in july of next year. will you voteks, and go on any spending bill that will send more service men to afghanistan? >> i took issue with the president in proposing this search. it is the war against terrorists. when we put all our eggs in one basket and concentrate on afghanistan, a one geographical place, that means we have taken our eye off the ball. terrorists are lots of places. they are in somalia, in the yemen. when we concentrate on afghanistan, we have lost sight of that. we have invested tremendously in

afghanistan, and unstable, inhospitable place. an example of policing -- we spend over $6 billion in policing and have nothing to show. we cannot find the trained people or the weapons. we cannot find the ammunition. without a long range present, we cannot build this country. if we are going to build a country, it needs to be america. americans are hurting. we need to invest here, not in afghanistan. >> thank you. cal cunningham? >> i will make that commitment not to vote. we are not putting all our eggs in one basket. we are pursuing terrorists wherever they are. we cannot leave afghanistan a failed state. if we do, we are right back where we were prior to 9/11, a day where we lost over 3000 americans. we have to make sure we are successful there, that we win back the momentum, that we transition security to the

afghan forces. it is not just about afghanistan. it is about pakistan. the chief challenge is from the taliban in pakistan. we have to work across borders and make sure we do not leave afghanistan of failed states. we also have to pursue terrorists in somalia, in yemen, other parts of the world where they are. the efforts in afghanistan are clearly not exclusive, and i want to make sure we protect the national security of this country, make sure. my experience here is colored by the fact that i landed in iraq at the peak of the search. i saw counterinsurgency work. in afghanistan, they found mineral deposits that could help drive the economy forward. >> thank you. rebuttal? all right, cal cunningham, the oil

pollution act of 1990 passed shortly after the exxon valdez spill. it limit corporate liability to $75 million for economic damages. in north carolina, state lawmakers are considering lifting that cap. as a federal lawmaker, there is discussion of this. would you lift the cap? why or why not? >> yes. there should not be a liability cap. if bp caused the pollution, caused the damage, it should pay for. i think we will hear tonight the president talking about setting up an escrow fund that would be funded by bp. it should be administered by a third party, so that bp does not control who is getting payments and when. i also want to make sure that we deal with the fact that the oil and gas industry is heavily subsidized. they have not done what they should do to develop technologies for mitigation of spills. we have a lot of work to do. it starts with lifting that cap. it includes ending tax breaks

for the oral and gas industry. frankly, bp surefire its ceo over what has happened. to give him his life back by firing him. we absolutely need to lift the cap. when the wrong door does damage, they need to be held responsible. we have to quit the finger- pointing between various parties. the responsibility belongs to all of them. we have to make sure the people of louisiana, who make their living out of the water, out of recreation and tourism, if i compare that to the folks i know on the coast of north carolina, if it were happening here, i would be up in arms. i am up in arms about what is going on in the louisiana. those are folks who have made a living out of a passion or a hobby. i think it is the best of all things when you can get up and love the work you are in. we need to reform the minerals

management office, because it has been too cozy. we have to make sure they are fully funded to do the job they are proposed to do. senator burr has taken tremendous amount of money from big or oil and gas, a huge amount from bp. it is no surprise that he has no criticism of how bp is handling the affair and the gulf. >> any rebuttal? elaine marshall, this next question to you. in the wake of the gulf oil disaster, there has been a lot of talk about increasing alternative energy. as a u.s. senator, how would you promote the use of alternative energy in north carolina? >> that is a super-great question. it is a dialogue we ought to carry on every day. north carolina it is incredibly well-poised, the best in the country. we had wind and solar available. we have a robust agricultural community. we have the research

universities that have created people doing research. things they can turn into jobs and a better life, jobs that will stay right here. i've visited a formally shuttered plan in north carolina that today, is creating biodiesels. they are getting the chicken fat and using fryer oil in turning it into biodiesel. those jobs stay right here. we have community college that will train the workers, if there is something specific about a particular industry. we have got it. we have all the right infrastructure for us to be of leader in america and reduce our reliance upon carbon emissions and oil. and that's the right thing to do for the next generation and for ourselves right now. >> alternative energy? >> it has to be and should be a

part of our energy future. we have to look over the rise in and see what the opportunities are. federal government has an important role in vesting, and north carolina can and should lead and we are leading. i mentioned my video series. people should go to calfor nc.com. jim started his career in the oil business. he worked in the nuclear business. now he is an alternative energy. because north carolina was fourth thinking about alternative energy -- forward- thinking about alternative energy, his company can turn hog waste into electricity. 3 megawatts this year. it can be as high as 36 within a year. 30 employees now. could go to 720.

the ideas came out of research laboratories right here. private capital coming together with a renewable energy standard. north carolina is poised to lead. we have to make sure we take this and run with this. biodiesel, wind, solar -- that is our future. >> thank you. rebuttal? very good. the discussion continues as my fellow journalists get to ask questions. yanda the candidates get their final chance to earn your vote -- and the kids get their final chance to earn your vote during a closing statement -- and that candidates get their final chance to earn your vote during a closing statement. welcome back to the debate. we are now entering the third and final segment of this debate. it gives our panel of journalists and opportunity to ask a great follow up questions. each reporter will ask each candidate one question. we are beginning with mark from

the "greensboro news and record." >> there have been bills drafted in congress that would allow corestates to collectively bargain with their public safety mployees as well as in paroppoe legislation for their collective bargaining. would you support those measures and why or why not? >> good question. first and foremost, i have indicated my support for a your cooperation act, which would have north carolina set a policy which would be satisfied by the act the governor has it taken, that public safety employees meet and confer. i have indicated a couple of principles. it need not be an unfunded mandate. it needs to make sure it preserves and north carolina's unique right to work laws. it needs to make sure that north

carolina's meet and confer at satisfies the requirements of that act. second, with respect to card check, i have been clear that i support the employees a free choice act. the national labor relations act needs to be modernized. it needs to be brought forward to the 21st century. it needs to make sure the workplace is fair. abusive employers are fighting and there is an opportunity for arbitration and mediation. what i have also indicated it is with respect to card check, i support the card check compromise, which will preserve the role of elections and get this legislation moving in the u.s. senate. >> elaine marshall, you said during the debate is supported a pathway to citizenship without aay amnesty, which seemed to be a contradiction. how would that work? >> there are plenty of folks

here that have come here seeking opportunities. they need to move to the back of the line. we have plenty of employers are willing, legitimate employers who are willing to go to bat for their character, to have them earn their way through working here, but get the appropriate -- pay fines, and penalties, a corporate waiting periods, but the in the queue to become a citizen. if they continue to be productive folks, and there would be forgiveness. that is not right. i am talking about doing the provision before you get penalized in court. it is like a probationary period to work your way into citizenship. one of the ways is through the united states military. that appears to be a fast track. i am glad to see a lot of young people with the resurgence of rotc programs, a way to work their way here. >> scott, you are up next.

thank you for being with us tonight. your question going to cal cunningham. >> the senate is set to take up medicaid assistance funding this week. the house stripped out an extension through mid 2011 that many states counted on for federal assistance money. if the decision were yours as part of the senate, would you act. that extension back, even if it meant an increase in the federal deficit? >> i have not looked at what it is you are talking about. i would be glad to take a close look at it. we need to make sure there is supplemental assistance for medicaid for north carolina. but what i have called for first and foremost is protection for teachers' jobs. there is also pending in i endorsed $23 billion allocated to the states. north carolina needs those

funds. city two kids in this to e school system. there is a lot of poverty there. they are having a debate whether to lay off teachers. washington should step forward and make sure we protect those teachers. >> elaine marshall, we are seeing a growing amount of union activity in our state up to and including unions backing opponents of north carolina congressmen who voted against health care reform and even the state employees association affiliating with the union. what do think about this growing trend of union activity? >> they are certainly free to exercise their right under the law. recruiting candidates, seeking third-party status, or building a petition drive -- they are within their rights. they have made it clear that they are unhappy with certain votes that were taken. i would support their efforts to exercise their rights.

i am not sure they achieved their goal, but people collectively together have the right to do things, the right to make up their mind. that is the american way. that is one of the freedoms we have. from everything that i have been understanding, they have been following the law as best they can carry some of their signatures may not work, but i think they have gotten all larger amount is a cushion there. they are just exercising their right in this great country, where is we found out and the last couple weeks, just about anything can happen in politics and always does. >> you are right. nbc 17 is wrapping up the fall. >> you criticized senator burr from taking money from big wall. recent reports show that democrats are taking money from big oil, too. >> let me make clear that i am a strong proponent of campaign finance reform.

it called for in this campaign, moving forward with a fair elections act which has bipartisan sponsorship. in the state senate, the first bill i co-sponsored was a ban on soft money contributions, . i would like to see money come out of politics. that is not realistic today, though, but i would like to move us toward a day where it does not have an influence. the public always has a question -- did that money influence your decision? the world that oil is playing in this debate and the money flowing -- the role that oil is playing in the money flowing raises questions about judgment. i would be reluctant to take it. i have said before that anything congress does it need to pay for. if we need to move forward on medicaid support for the states, it should follow pay as you go. we explain how that will be paid for, just as i propose to pay

for that teacher supplement. >> elaine marshall, another oil- related question. you supported raising the cap -- currently $75 million per it wouldn't that discourage wouldn't get discouraged small businesses? >> i do not think small businesses are out there drilling. it is the big corporations that have tremendous subsidies. you and i are paying for that drilling out there. they need to pay for the damage they cause and lifting the cap is a very good start, and having an independent, a third-party arbitrer to set up the rules, evaluate claims, make prompt payment will be vital to restoring the vitality to the gulf area. >> very good. thank you for those great follow ups. we do have time to fit in one ewer question.uestivi

in previous senate races, we have seen a big deal about how much time an incumbent spent in washington versus time in north carolina. if you go to washington, how will you stay connected to your constituents? >> it is a terrific question. i was a believer when i served in the state's senate of keeping my door open all the time. i would make sure i was meeting with folks from back home. i was one of the first state senators to do an email newsletter. i am a firm believer in town hall meetings. i believe in traversing north carolina, inviting folks into the dialogue. i like to make sure we are putting out information to all sorts of media about how to stay connected and be informed. it is paramount that those in washington get back home, connect with folks, actively invite them into the political process. and it would be a particular charge, a special challenge to make sure we are connecting with folks all over this great state.

>> elaine marshall, how would you stay connected? >> you know what, that is a great question for me, because i absolutely love retail campaigning. that has been written up many times over. i get my energy from sitting down at coffee shops and breakfast places and talking to people. i will be home. i will be out. i have friends and all 100 counties to listen to. folks that know how to get a hold of me to get the proper feedback. we will be doing newsletters' and social networking, in particular, where folks can have input. we have things that can happen nowadays for good or bad and great communication tools. i am committed to doing that for the people of north carolina. >> i will give you one last challenge. we are almost to the close. we will tackle health care reform in 30 seconds, which is not quite fair. i know you both expressed disappointment that the public

option was not part of the new law. other than the public option, were do you want to see health care reform go next? >> 30 seconds. it is a challenge to talk about health care. there are three principal areas where i think health care is still front and center perry first and foremost, making sure the promise of the legislation that is past is carried out. part of that is about the patient's experience, implementing new technologies. i still believe the question of cost is one of crowding out of pay raises. i think we have experimented with some of the state-based exchanges before. we will have to revisit the public option. medicare, perhaps ending the antitrust exemption. i think medicare should be able to negotiate for prescription drug prices. >> elaine marshall? >> my three principals were expanded access, affordability, and eliminating the gotcha. we have to be vigilant on pre-

existing conditions. we have to make sure that that pricing is competitive. we do not have that yet. in north carolina, i am hopeful that will come. we have to be very aggressive. i truly think we need more emphasis on integrative medicines, preventive medicine, so that we prevent the illness and the chronic problems away before they become the cost factor that they can be at the end. >> thank you. now the show closes. each u.s. senate hopeful will offer a one minute closing statement. cal cunningham keeps winning the coin toss. you get to close first. >> thank you. thanks to those at home listening. this campaign is not about me or elaine marshall. it is about you and the future we are trying to build as a state in the country. it has been a great honor to have been all across this state

over the last six months. i am a new guy, a fresh face, a person who has not been in office for many years. and i responded to in part that north carolinians are looking for a new narrative. i am the first iraq war veteran. i led the prosecution and defense contractors. i will take the same determination to washington, to make sure that your voice is heard. i am not only offering leadership for an hour or the next couple years. i want us to look over the horizon and think about the state we want for our future, the quality of schools and opportunities, and ask, what kind of leadership do we have to have to get there? i would be honored to have your vote. >> elaine marshall, your closing comments? >> i want to thank the viewers out there, the league of women

voters for this informative evening. what this race is really about is fixing a broken system in washington. we have got to reward hard work, not the quick fix. we have to fight for p eople, not for profits. policies have been pushed to benefit a few at the expense of many. it is time we changed that system. i have taken on wall street and restored over $500 million for north carolina families and investors. i have taken on the health care industry to make them cover mammograms and pap smears and provide coverage in rural areas. i have taken on special interest in government to reform lobbying and take the influence of money out of politics. those are the same forces we need to rein in in washington. i ask for your help in this race to do that. >> thank you.

as we mentioned, the runoff election is in a few days -- tuesday, june 22. early voting is already going on. r timeline is showing at one stop voting ends this saturday june 19. the deadline for absentee ballots has already passed. the primary date is tuesday. polls will open at 6:30 in the morning until 7:30 tuesday night. you can get your latest collection information anytime online at mync.com. we have been streaming this entire debate as it happened. type the keyword debate to see the highlights, as well as news stories on this race and plenty of others, the latest polling information, plus political analysis which you can expect always from us. thank you to our viewers, the candidates, and all of you at home for joining us. now go vote. thank you.

campaign coverage

continues with the debate with two republicans in south carolina. nikki haley faces gresham barrett. this is about one hour. >> this is a special presentation -- "the race for governor." >> good evening. welcome to the 2010 gubernatorial runoff debate. >> glad to have you with us this evening. participating tonight, rep nikki haley and gresham barrett. tonight's debate is co-sponsored by the league of women voters and aarp. the candidates have one minute to answer each question. rebuttals will have a time limit of 30 seconds. we are streaming live on-line as well.

we welcome you to go to the website and a live chat during the debate to take part in our live, interactive blog. >> we received an email to a from a man named ron, a registered republican of over 45 years and a retired army infantry officer. he is upset about one of your commercials that identified you as the u.s. army retired and referred to as a military man when you served on active 3duty 4.5 years and resigned york commission. -- your permission. >> it was an honest mistake. we put the advertisement up. we were running 100 miles per hour. as soon as we caught it, we took it down. i am proud of my military service. i have never hidden the fact that i served in it -- 4.5

years. i graduated with honors. it was a mistake. it has been corrected. >> how long did that advertisement run? >> i could not tell you. but i know as soon as we caught it, we fixed it, and i apologize because it was an honest mistake. >> voters are tired of double talk. leading up to the primary, you criticized henry mcmaster in this advertisement garrard >> a bailout, career politicians, south carolina can do better. >> this week, when henry mcmaster endorsed your campaign, you said this. >> i think the attorney general was probably the person i knew the least. as we got on to the campaign trail and the one i became the biggest fan of by the time we finished the campaign trail. this was the one endorsement i could not be more proud to have. >> in light of your endorsement with mitt romney and sarah

palin, now one of your competitors is one of the endorsements you are most proud to have. what do you say to voters who say that they do not understand how you could flip the script and a matter of days? >> the commercial showed the differences between us. the difference i showed was that he had been in office for a long time. what i've always said about my opponent is they have done this all their life. henry mcmastera that, and of themselves with incredible respect to run the campaign. i got to know him very well. he handle themselves respectfully and nicely to route the campaign. i was thrilled to have him. i look forward to having him campaigning with us on a campaign trip. >> as a follow up, what you say to the voters who are so disenfranchised and feel as though that candidates change they're talking. as a matter of convenience? >> i did not change my talking

points. he has been it in public office since 1986. i can very much appreciate his support. great supporters. he had a loyal following it was appreciate id what he did as attorney general. he has been in office since 1986. i think south eurcaroline is moving in a new direction. >> we have one more advertising question. let's look at a clip from your most recent ad that is still running. >> gresham, you make me-- want to vote for you. >> i would be honored. >> some critics believe the staff sergeant saying that he wants to vote for you implies a military endorsement. how you answer that concern? >> it was a funny way to approach an issue. listen, i have been so stiff

for the last 18 months. i have friends and colleagues saying, loosen up a little bit. it kind of broke through. when we put up the first thing, it said political campaign headquarters or boot camp. it was kind of a spoof. i am very proud of my military record. it certainly did not mean to be a military endorsement.3 present who i am and what i am. into the budget. there is a $1 billion budget shortfall expected next year. the state budget will have to replace millions in one time stimulus money. agencies that serve the poor and schools have already taken huge cuts. the question -- what will you do to generate revenue quickly? >> it is not about generating revenue. and it is not about what you

spend. it is how you spend. we are going into a tough budget times. as an accountant, we have to stretch dollars. we need to see this as an opportunity. the first thing i will do is audit all the agencies. i will propose a budget to the general assembly that will help them make hard decisions, so that we are not just handling this year but thinking about years 3, 5 and 1/7. it's time for us to take a look at state government as a business plan and understand that everything we do in the budget affects everything else. we have to start making good decisions. we saw government growing by $1 billion per year. we have nothing to show for it. this is a great opportunity to learn lessons and cover our core services and not turning round and hurting the things we do not need to purge >> despite the current budget crisis, you do not believe there is any need to generate new at revenue? >> we had the most vetoes sustained in history yesterday. we spent 20 hours of the house

floor, 51 out of 107 vetoes were sustained. that showed the legislatures' willingness to understand the value of the dollar. we cannot keep spending the ways we always have. >> same question. you've heard your opponents say that generating revenue is not as important as other things. how do you tackle that issue? >> we have to get back to basics. we have to understand what the government's responsibility is. there are four core issues. it citizens safe and secure with law-enforcement, with the judicial system and prison system, with our infrastructure. that is also economic development. also, education and medicaid. those are two mandates we need to have. once we cut that down and focus on core issues, it is important to grow the economy and grow jobs. i would do three things total

tax reform, comprehensive tax reform. a system that is fair and flatter. that helps businesses that are here and businesses coming into south carolina. focus of the department of commerce, having a first-run, first-class department of commerce in a government that quote -- a governor that will roll up his sleeves and bring jobs. we need to make sure we have skilled workers. . . >> are these material early raising taxes on those in south carolina? given the choice, which would you choose? >> i take the no new taxes' pledge. we have to come up with a system that is a more stable system, putting all of the

options on the table. we also have to go back and look at the core issues. what is government's main responsibility? in good times, everything is a priority. when everything is a priority, nothing is a priority. we have to set the priorities and look at how we spend. we have to have a total up and down look at our agencies to make sure we are not duplicating our services and that that money goes to exactly where we wanted to go. >> representative at haley, many have said if you are elected, we'll have another four years of mark sanford and a toxic relationship with state gridlock. if elected governor, please differentiate your approach when working with our legislative approach compared with that of gov. stamford. it -- governor stanford. >> we are different people. at first of all, have been in the legislature long enough to

know the problems are, but not long enough to be part of the fraternity. the key to leading the legislature and being governor is to put forward a plan that tells where we want to go as a state and educate the people and legislature on how we get there. second is being predictable, what we are going to do before we do it, consequences before they happen. typical of to have is the first year in office to give south carolina a win. what the legislature to feel what it is like to feel what it's like to win and i want people to return and have the power of the government. this takes a governor who can show an agenda of where we need to go, how we need to get there, with looking at years 3, 5, 7. i think people will be pleasantly surprised >> in order to get anything done, don't you have to drink from the fraternity keg, so to speak, to get anything done? >> i actually don't have to. when i was chairman of the freshman class, i was majority

whip, subcommittee chair. i can get along with the legislature and lead. when i saw something wrong, when i saw boats being passed on voice vote, i sat there and said we have to start voting on the record. the legislature opposed me to a half years, but i knew until we got a government, we cannot get a working government. >> if you missed any of this debate, we plan on rearing it tomorrow. >> when they arrive, my goal is to side with the people of the state, to educate and make sure people know what we are doing, while we are doing it. i will also go into the district when they vote against good government reforms and hold their hands to the fire. i think i owe that to the people of the state's. >> a brief question and fallout. congressman barrett mentioned he

is committed to it no new taxe'' pledge. are you willing to make that same pledge? >> i think it is a piece of paper, a signature that says you are making a promise. i have never increased taxes, because i think what you spend is important. as an accountant and a family that runs a small business, we know how to stretch a dollar. yes, i have signed the tax pledge, but i will focus on how we spend. >> south carolina emergency rooms are becoming holding areas for the mentally ill essentially because patients have nowhere else to turn. given the state budget crisis and a drastic reductions in the department of mental health they have absorbed through across- the-board cuts, what would you do to address this problem? >> taking care of people who cannot take care of themselves is extremely important, and mandate that the government has. we have to look at the core issues. there are some things that government does that should do

in good times, but when they are not good times, we need to think outside the box. can we do a public/private partnership, different ways to fund it. is it something that we can outsource or privatize? i think are so many things that we always think government has to do. >> is mental health one of those things? >> absolutely. >> how would you address the emergency room problem? >> have to talk to hospitals and get them involved. we have to address these major issues because we will have to cut major spending, focus on core issues and how we find these. >> before we go to break, we want each of you to prioritize each of these different issues. illegal immigration, jobs, education. hot topics, how would you rank those if you become governor? rep haley first.

>> jobs first, education second, illegal immigration third. >> congressman barrett? >> i think she is right, but i would go with jobs first, education second, illegal immigration. . >> we will tackle those subjects after we come back from this short break. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] >> welcome back. before we went to break, we asked the candidates to list their priorities. it jobs came out at the top. we will tackle that now. rep haley you are first. your plan for economic prosperity is to eliminate the small business income tax. how much money does that represent and how would you replace that loss of revenue in the state? >> first of all, as an

accountant, we have a band-aid structure. we need to look at every tax, every exemption, and faced. the first thing we need to do is eliminate small business income tax. right now it is about 3% of our budget. in 2005 through 2007, nobody asked what we would cut. at this point, talking about eliminating small business income tax, everybody wants to know how you will replace it. the key is when you give them profit margins, the first thing they do is hire people, invest into the state. it is the number-one thing to spur the economy and get people back to work quickly and help the economy grow and a way that would really make it strengthened. the 3% of our budget. i know there are things we can cut. the education oversight committee, which advises, looking at education and how expensive is on the overhead as opposed to the classroom, and also looking at the budget control board.

>> thank you. >> congressman barrett, on your website you will take immediate action to fill job openings. explain that and how it is different from the newly formed department? >> there are roughly 30,000, 40,000 jobs unfilled and south carolina because we do not have trained workers. what we would do is linked up unemployed people with those workers, hired him on the spot so they get off the unemployment rolls. but the employer employ them and give them on-the-job training. we have two work force developments of funds -- workforce development funds in south carolina. we need to streamline budgeting. education, we have four education budget in south carolina. as a former business person, it makes sense when you are stretching every dollar, when

you are trying to get the money into the classroom -- and by the way, out of sixty-five cents national average going into the classroom, only forty-four cents makes it to the classroom and south carolina -- but when you're trying to stretch those, it makes sense to streamline the process and be as effective as you can. >> rep haley, you say we should take advantage of the technical schools. the leaders of our technical system, a technical college system, they say that is what they're doing now. can you be more specific, at and explain what needs to be done differently? >> absolutely. spending $12,000 per year to educate a child in the state. that is going to 85 school districts before never hits the classroom. we're on the graduating want out of every two kids in four years. we are losing them in ninth grade.

we need to look at eighth grade, vocational programs and ninth grade, and we need to strengthen technical symbols. technical schools. we need to hold institutions of higher learning accountable. right now, funding for higher education is based on the lobbyists in the state house. that is not how we need to be funding. if you look at the funding that comes in gets compared with all 16 technical schools, it is not balanced. we need to strengthen those so there helping small businesses and help recruit new companies to the state. >> you talk about technical schools not being funded correctly. we know their budgets have been cut by nearly 50%. you were part of the legislature that brought that on, that allow that to happen. do you bear some of that responsibility? >> as governor, i will show the importance of why we have to strengthen technical schools. as a legislature, those are three vigo's i over road because

we do not need to pull money from the technical schools -- those are three vetoes that i over-rode. >> robert has served on a technical college board 16 years. he says -- >> one of the things we have to do is give our colleges and universities, the committee colleges -- the community colleges, give them flexibility. if we are going to find them at the levels we say we are going to, we need to hold their feet to the fire and say this is how we need to work. but give them flexibility, let's give the ability ability to go outside the box to keep tuition low, how there can be a better

dollar value for the average person struggling to go to college, to me that daily budget. my son went to his first year at try county technical school and as all self assuredness and self assuredness for my son that i have never seen before. they are vital parts of the committee -- of the community. i think it is vital to our funding needs. >> the next question involves an issue brought up by aarp. this question is for you, representative haley. your opponents job plan includes a improving infrastructure. what specific improvements to you have in your plan you would like to make? with a billion dollar budget shortfall next year, where will we find the money? >> when we are looking at economic development, when companies come to the state, they don't need to come because we stop and take them to dinner, they come because with a good business climate. but they're looking at the tax

structure that allows them to be successful. that is something i will work on as an accountant right away. second is the skilled workforce. it is the reason we to pay attention to l-12. the third thing is infrastructure. it is roadways, air fares, so we actually have that in the state. it is our ports, making sure there are strong second come in and out. it is a very simple process of making sure the environment for economic development is strong and the state. the we also want to make sure we are not looking at just burning and large quantities and to the state but also the quality of companies so they help small businesses we are have. >> building infrastructure, improving infrastructure, is that out of the question the next fiscal year because of much money has been cut out, or are there other ways to fund this? >> it is all about priorities. what we have is a tight budget year.

we have to prioritize. we have to turn around and decide, is infrastructure an issue, or spending on this education oversight committee, which does not do anything, is an issue? it is about cutting things that maybe are not working right now for more important things that would work right now. as an accountant and legislature that knows the budget, we will jump in and make those hard decisions, but they affect people immediately. >> congressman barrett, your plan also includes promoting tourism. could you explain how you do that and put a price tag on it? >> every dollar you spend either triples or doubles. weber, south carolina is a wonderful place to visit. >> how much would you want to spend on doing that? >> we will look at it. i don't know that could put a specific dollar amount on it. we are open to suggestions. bringing people into south

carolina, to the beautiful mountains where i live, is a wonderful way to not only showcase that area but to get the money and. when we're talking about bringing in tourism, we have infrastructure, too. interstate 73, public/private partnerships, working with the congressional delegation, local delegations on the infrastructure. south carolina, as you know, is a donor state when it comes to road tax money. let's keep our own road tax money and solve these problems in south carolina because we could do it better than any other federal agency. >> think it. >> -- thank you. >> would you support any of these ideas to support funding for a sufficient highway system, increasing fuel taxes, rep haley? >> no. >> adding sales tax to feel? >> no. >> no. >> toll highways?

>> no. >> yes. on new construction. if it is new construction, if it is an additional lane, that is something with the gulf. >> you are also talking about been dating the structure. we need comprehensive tax reform. some things go up and down. that does not mean cut everything. it is about a plan. that is the problem in south carolina. we have to have a complete plan of where the money is coming from and where it goes. >> it is also thinking outside the box. we are in uncharted territory. we have never had a downturn in my lifetime. we have never had a downturn like this. i think that is one solution. also, i am a big proponent of the natural gas reserves off the coast of south carolina, using those four jobs and economic growth. it could be $250 million, at a

minimum, according to the petroleum institute, that we could use however we see fit. >> thank you very much. rep haley, you said you want to revamp the tax code, look at every fee an exemption. give voters a realistic time line on how long that will take. >> i would say six months into the administration, we have something that would pull out and put together so after the first year we have something in place. i want to really show what will happen in the first year, your 3, 5, 7, and make sure it creates a competitive business environment. >> congressmen barrett, what is your evaluation of missed haley's plan? is it a viable plan to bring more jobs to south carolina? >> i have not actually seen a plan. i have a plan, called putting

south carolina back to work. that is an eight-step, common- sense plan. we have worked on it for over a year with people across the state. we have worked with economic developers, senators, legislatures -- legislators, heads of academia. we have put plans together, and that is how you have to govern. even though i love to see the hand of the governor, it is still a legislative state. when you propose something, you need people buy into it. when you propose it, it is not my idea, it is our idea. >> rep haley? >> there is a plan, it is not about what you say, it is a what you do. that is what i talk about reform, tort reform, putting an economic development director in place that i work with every single day to compete to get good quality companies and the state. >> your opportunity to pose a question to congressman barrett.

>> any question? we've been on the campaign trail so long, i think i know when he will say. i will give the same question, do you regret passing the $800 billion tarp bailout that will literally cost south carolina family and everybody else across the country 6000 hours per family? >> i will say it again, rep haley, did not have six months to wait before i made a decision. george w. bush came to us and said we are in a crisis, a global crisis. also vice-president cheney, many women across the state, big business, small business. i think we were at a point where people were going to reach into the back pocket, pulled out their atm card, stick it in, and nothing would come out. i had to make a decision based on the information i had because we cannot late -- we cannot wait. did it avert a major crisis, global meltdown?

i believe it did. has been implemented the way it was supposed to be? absolutely not. nobody has fought harder to make sure every dollar is repaid to the american taxpayer. >> when we come back, we'll talk about education. we'll be right back to the gubernatorial debate. >> will come back to the gubernatorial gop debate. -- welcome back to the gubernatorial gop debate. we're coming back and talking about education in south carolina. let's specifically address hacked 388. it took effect in 2007, and an example owner occupied homes from property taxes that pay for schools that this bust replace the revenue, but the recession hit, people stopped spending,

and school districts say cost them millions. the bottom line, what used to be a very reliable and predictable source of income has become volatile based on the mood of the economy. first, rep haley, your position? >> i think needs to be studied and we have to look at it. if we do a comprehensive tax reform, we have to look at everything. >> you are willing to consider changing it? >> absolutely. the plan was initially meant to help primary homeowners, but the result was that hurt businesses and investment people. what we need to make sure of is the legislature takes care of it. there is never a next year. do it right the first year or do not do it at all. >> you know a lot about running business. you could not effectively plan a budget if you do not know how

much money you are working with. and a lot of these school systems look at the current funding at the beginning of the year, and because of this it changes and have to do cuts at different points during the year. looking at education as a business, is that sound business? >> what is sound business is reforming the funding formula. i lived in orangeburg where they spent more time and discipline than teaching. now live in lexington county. you go into my schools, there is a smart board and every classroom. we need to educate children because they deserve a good quality education and that is to feature work force, not based on where they happen to be born and waste. born and raised. when we add merit based pay, reward to those teachers. then turn around and give

teachers bonuses for improving educational standards that separate the good teachers from the port teachers in terms of performance. it makes a huge difference in the educational standards. >> a quick follow up, yes or no, you are willing to consider changing act 388 even though many legislators view that as a tax increase? them absolute, that is tax reform. it is important. -- >> absolutely, that is a tax reform, it is important. >> the problem in the past is we have taken a rifle shot approach, so to speak, to the texas. act 388, the grocery tax, the cigarette tax. we have to look at the texas simplistically, how we can come up with a system that is fair and more flat, that is more sustainable and accountable. i have also talked with a dear

friend of mine who is the budget forecaster. we need to look at how we budget and south carolina. but what about doing something totally outside the box? have a budget freeze one year and totally do something different where we know how much money is in the bank before we allocate it? that may be a different way of looking at something, but at least we don't have to go back in the middle of the year three times and say we have to cut the budget again. >> as it relates specifically to act 388, you willing to change or repeal it? >> we have to look at everything holistic play, and that includes all the taxes. >> would teachers' salaries being cut and the national school board being slammed down, what would you do to keep the best and brightest teachers in our state? >> in business, when we see

revenue fall, we always cut from the top. you never cut the core of people who need it most. it was not be talking about teacher furloughs. we should not be talking about teacher layoffs. we have 1000 people working at the department of education, 85 school districts. if that money is not going to the teacher, stooping, and technology in the classroom, is not going to the right place -- teacher, student, and technology in the classroom, it is not going to the right place. until we realize we are too top heavy, we have to do merit based pay for teachers. we need to reward them. we need to give them bonuses dislike business because we will separate the good teachers from those who are not performing. government needs to get out of the way of the teacher. they need to let the teacher teach, and we have to look at how we pay them based on performance and not throw tons of things at them and expect them to produce. >> congressman barrett, your

idea of keeping good teachers in south carolina? >> i agree with mayor based pay. it -- i agree with merit-based pay. it is like the front line, soldiers to not have the resources they need. my wife is a first grade school teacher, she has school supplies that we have bought for her classroom. the fact of the matter is for every dollar we spend in south carolina, only forty-four cents makes it to the classroom. i think it is actually lower than that. the national average is sixty- five cents. that money needs to go into instructional classroom needs, where they're most needed. our teachers on the front line. we can streamline the process. we have 46 counties, 85 school districts, 64 different funding sources going into that plate of spaghetti. we can streamline the process. we have four educational budgets and south carolina. the business person in me says,

you know what, one makes more sense than four. >> next question, this is a story that got a lot of attention when we covered it, the state recently purchased a used school buses from another state, kentucky, with the aging fleet of school buses that become more unreliable as the miles are added on and cost more to maintain, what is your solution to make sure our children are transported safely and on time? >> we are the only state and country that does not privatize our school bus system. the government should not be in the business of maintaining and having school buses. every other state and country factors that out to some other company as to what happens. so they have good quality of school buses with air- conditioning, somebody repairs them, there are brand new. that is the problem with south carolina is they're trying to be all things to all people.

the government does not need to be in the school bus business. the private sector has to be involved and privatize the school bus system. >> you have been in the house some time. why hasn't it happened? >> it has come up a couple of times. representative smith has proposed it and has not been passed. it as governor, i will show them how much we are losing by try to make a school bus fleet and what it would mean to privatize it. >> congressman barrett, same question. >> i think it is a great idea. i don't know that 49 days wrong and one is right, but it is thinking outside the box. to put children on a substandard mode of transportation, when they're the most precious thing in our lives, is unconscionable and we need to think outside the box. >> you mentioned the number of school districts. why do we have 46 counties, 85 school districts? can that be changed, it should

be changed? >> can it be changed, absolutely, should it be, i think so. we would not mandate it. we'll talk about the federal government coming in and telling us what to do, the state coming in and telling the locals what to do. that needs to be a local decision. but let's work a deal, i will give you some flexibility in your school district if you show me accountability, if you saw me -- if you show me prince -- if you show me accountability. when we do that, the school we cants will saiy, figure out better than columbia. we need to streamline the process. i don't need somebody telling me how to do it, but i think the working to deal with accountability and transparency and flexibility is a great solution. >> representative haley, one

viewer is looking more specifics on merit-based pay for public school teachers. >> i don't know the specifics. i know it works in business, and if it does, it also work in education. you cannot expect a teacher to go into a challenge area would have to be the parent and counselor and guidance and pastorate and pay the same thing to a teacher or they don't have the cultural issues. a merit-based pay needs to happen. that is the only way we get the strong workforce into the challenged areas. we need to reward teachers for doing well on the classroom. we have to improve the morale of the teachers. that is something i think it is important and we look at how the other states do it and how to implement it. >> and follow-up on this concept, congressman barrett suggests that is great idea to run the commerce department, where there is a reward.

is that a good idea? babbitt is already happening now. -- >> it is already happening now. >> i think it is a great idea. >> not a new idea? >> we talked about it and long time. i am glad they implemented it. if it works in the private sector, it should work in the public sector. >> it is now your turn to ask representative haley a question. >> fantastic. representative haley, i applaud you for putting all your documents out there. i just want to know, and i want you to tell the viewers, are all of your disclosures public? have you left anything out? i understand there might be something with wilbur smith that was omitted. >> everything was in there. we have always said we would put everything out there. we have published tax returns and reduced our funding disclosures, and i have no problem doing that.

everything is out there, thinking it. >> on that -- everything is out there, thank you. >> on that note, we'll take a short break and be right back. >> welcome back to the debate. we return to congressman barrett, talking about illegal immigration. you have put it in the forefront of your campaign. you estimate 60,000 to 85,000 illegal immigrants are in south carolina. how is there any possible way to know exactly how many illegal immigrants are in the state since they fly under the radar? >> it is a best guess. the fact of the matter is illegal immigration, with illegal immigration, every state is a border state. you are taking jobs away, costing tax payer dollars.

we need to do several different things. i applaud jan brweer -- brewer in arizona because she is trying to take her state back. in south carolina, which can hold employers accountable, make sure that who they hire is who they say they're hiring. second, and hence the immigration laws with common- sense additional things like what they did it in arizona. third, we can implement of 287-g where we trained local and state law-enforcement officers on how to enforce immigration law. i have talked to the sheriff in charleston county and is actually working. we can be masters of our own destiny. >> you say these workers earn at $186 million per year in south carolina. illegaly we deport the immigrants.

to fill these jobs? a lot of them are hard labor jobs. >> i would hope it would be south carolinian is. last time i looked, our unemployment was 11.6%. we are looking at putting people back to work in south carolina. listen, if they are here legally, god bless them. this nation is a nation of immigrants, and we have laws to do that. if you want to comment legally, god bless you. if you are here illegally, if you are breaking the law, we will do what needs to be done, and that is enforce that law, enforce immigration laws. >> representative haley, of it like to get you to weigh in on the illegal immigration issue. >> i am a co-sponsor of the arizona-style illegal immigration reform. as the daughter of immigrants who came here legally, we are a

country of immigrants but we are a country of laws. when you give that up, you are giving up everything your founded on. a >> do you have concerns about enforcement? >> absolutely. there is not a verifying system that small business owners have to go through. the problem is they cannot put the first money into the prosecution found until we start looking at the stimulus package and we saw there was not the first dollar here. that is why government needs to be accountable. they cannot just pass it, we have to make sure it works. we need reports in place to say how many illegal immigrants are here, how many businesses are being fined, and what to do about it. the question about what we would do for these jobs would not fill, we need to expand our worker visa programs. we need to make sure those farmers and contractors and all those people cannot fill those jobs, there is a way to do that legally. it has to be done legally, no

amnesty. i>> a hot topic on the live chat, the national media has asked about your faith. we have one question from lexington. he said at the end of your campaign commercial all things through got are possible. are you a christian, where do you attend? >> i am very proud of my parents. i am proud of the way they raise desperate they taught us work ethic, they taught us everything i know i am today. i'll never apologize that and will continue to be proud of everything accomplished in this country because they remind us every day of how blessed we were to be here. i chose to become a christian woman. my husband is a christian man. we have a christian family. when my parents asked us to visit their church, absolutely i do. the bottom line is, yes, i chose the christian faith. what i know about christianity is they are all accepting and

try to bring more people in. they don't judge people. i attend methodist church in lexington, as does my family. >> to you mind explaining to people a little bit about the sikh faith, and what led to your conversion? >> we all have decisions to make. we decided to go with the christian faith because it worked for us and it was something we decided to do. i don't talk about anything about the sikh faith because i am very proud of the way i was raised. i am proud of those who raised me who were within that church. the decision i made is the decision that works for our family, and we work every day trying to be better people, working and strengthening our relationship with the war -- with the lord. that is something we will continue to do. i am very proud of my parents and the way they're raised me and i don't want to say anything against them or that faith. >> congressman barrett, how do

your religious beliefs player role in your decisions every day? if you are elected governor, would your religious beliefs influence a court decisions? >> it is who i am and what i am a sick person. it dry -- and what i am as a person. at drives the way i am and the way i bring up my family. i serve a living god who is jesus christ, and he is in my heart every day. when i talk to schools, i say things are not shades of gray. there are absolutes and our life. there are 10 of them if you want to be exact and i try to live by those every day. my children were saying during this campaign, win or lose, that is important. the big thing is my children have been saved. that is a good day any day. >> another sensitive subject, we

hear so much about needing to be more inclusive and south carolina. if elected governor, you would be working for all people in the state. as we look at the television ads on the republican side, we shall see a lot of ethnic diversity. why not, representative haley? >> you are looking at a minority female. >> looking at the other people pictured in the ads. you represent women, but why not more diversity? abouton't know as much commercials as the state. as we go across the state, as people talk about the tea party and as i talked about joining the movement, the tea parties are republicans, democrats, and independents who have had enough of government and are going to take it back. those are men and women, all faiths, all minorities. it is one of the things that has made south carolina come together and say we want to take government back. you could talk about commercials, but i will talk

about the campaign trail. as i go across the state, have never seen more people series about their government and elected officials so scared. it is beautiful and we want to work for all people. >> your advertisements and ms. representative haley's ads, when you play these on the air, you are hoping to show your reaching out to. under the republican party is trying to be more diversified. where decisions like that being made when you are coming up with a campaign plan and ads? >> we can all be more sensitive and we should be. that is something we will look at. as a congressman, i have diversity on my staff, in my district. it is my job to serve everybody in the third congressional district. i don't care if they are rich or poor, black, white, male, female. if they walk in my door, they

know my heart and staff, and care if your even in my district, we help everybody in our district. in south carolina, until we pick up the bottom vote -- boat and raise that level, we will all suffer. you are right, we'll need to be more sensitive of that. >> representative haley, mitt romney who will be and south carolina to campaign with a view endorsed your campaign. if asked to be his running mate or to serve in his administration, which consider it? >> no, right now i am running for governor because i think i can bring true change. i have always talked about joining the movement. i don't want it to be about a person, and wanted to be about the people of the state and reminding elected officials who they work for. these positive distractions, while flattering, is not we are thinking about. we're trying to make a true difference to the people of the state and walking away.

>> that is a thatno? >> yes. >> voters are looking for results. please name three of the most significant accomplishments since been elected in 2003 to represent the third district. >> i thought you were going to ask me about fred thompson. i am scratching and clawing to make this. getting serious, being part of this, the bush tax cuts was huge. making sure people can keep their own tax money is good. it being a strong nuclear proponent at the national lab, getting national lab status in is firstk of the wordods and foremost in my mind, especially when it comes to my district. and my legislative career, hands down, state or federal, it is helping lead the fight on partial birth abortion. it was a crowning moment in my

life. i now think anything i could do it in my political career could come close to that. >> same question, framing it differently, representative haley, you talk about fighting for the state legislature. you mentioned earlier that in terms of voting on the record and other issues that you fault as it battles. if elected, since you have been elected to represent looking county since 2004, please name+ your three most significant accomplishments during your service. >> absolutely, by 2.5 year brutal battle to get legislators to vote on the record. now we have rules in the house and senate that require them to vote on the record. we're looking to make that permanent law. it passes the house, looking to push it past the senate. that is one of the hardest times i have gone through, but most rewarding because i know people

could see how their legislators vote. i was very involved in a workers' comp reform. coastal insurance reform, when people were losing their homes and giving up businesses, as very involved in that. i also worked on port reform which up small businesses and kept the quality of health care good in south carolina -- i also worked on tort reform. >> the wrong office five days from now. we wish you both the best of luck. -- the runoff is five days from now. we wish you both the best of luck. >> to let us know how you think the candidates did and what you thought about their answers, we will have much more coverage tonight on wis-tv at 11:00. the winner of the runoff will go up against state senator, the this comingtion is jus tuesday. >> you have time to vote absentee. exercise your right to vote.

you probably need to go in person to do that. much more on wis-tv.com. thank you for watching. good night. >> in case you missed any of this debate, we will rewrite tomorrow at 6:30 p.m. eastern on c-span. south carolina's primary runoff election for governor is held tuesday. >> tomorrow on c-span2's "book tv," the novel that took 30 years to publish. following soldiers through vietnam. a sunday, july 4, your questions, live on "book tv." the former education secretary and first drug czar is the author of books for adults and children. and join us on twitter. more than 30,000 viewers already

have. >> coming up, remarks from michelle bachmann and former virginia governor george allen on women and leadership. later, a hearing on the proposed merger between united and continental. then, legal experts and law professors look at the wall between congress and the supreme court -- look at the role between congress and the supreme court. >> he was a very complicated, depressive young man. very adventuress. he was having a venture. >> a new look at tocqueville. that is sunday. >> now the clare boothe luce policy institute holds their seminar. we will hear remarks from michelle bachmann and former

virginia governor and senator george allen. at the clare boothe luce organization is a self-described conservative group that matures and trains women for leadership programs. -- that mentors and tradeswoman for leadership programs. >> hello, i am from mclean, va., and 2010 summer intern. i next speaker as former senator and governor of virginia george allen. he has served the commonwealth of virginia over 20 years. these years of public service are marked by the distinctive dedication to the common-sense conservative values of personal liberty, educational excellence, economic up kennedy, and freedom. freedom. he describes himself as a common sense conservative and that h under his leadership from 1994 to 2000, introduced fund the reform of state program, particularly welfare, the

criminal justice system, and the education system. personal accountability, fiscal restraint and common sense standards of excellence. three these brilliant achievements of mr. allen have a will to virginia to the forefront of the nation in terms of economic development. he continues to promote public policy and making virginia and america a leader in innovation and technology. governor allen as president of george rollin llc whose mission is to advocate positive ideas for american jobs, economic prosperity and increase freedom opportunity in competition and the development of america's vast resources. what many may not know is that mr. allen is an avid sports fan has politician. his new book what washington can learn from the world of sports from the perspective of sports. he became a huge fan of your

father. george allen hall of fame to the washington redskins. i've gone to support the redskins and now it's true sports to represents hard work, selflessness and fair play on and off the field. the same idea governor allen displayed through the country. ladies and gentlemen, george allen. [applause] >> thank you so much for the kind introduction. i'm glad your father is a redskins fan and it's great to be with so many great folks here on capitol hill and many of you i know there's some from michigan and new york and virginia and maryland and i know many other states. thank you for your service working here on capitol hill with members in a variety of fronts and endeavors.

let me -- what i would like to do is first thank the clare boothe luce organization. where is michelle? mashaal was one of the leaders in the education reform and i will mention that and i do mention that in my book. on the importance of education which is personal empowerment. thank you for all of your leadership and inspiring young people to be informed and knowledgeable and many of you all will someday run for office yourself if you so desire. you will be leaders in a variety of endeavors in our country. the reason i wrote this book what washington can learn from the world of sports is that last year and my wife susan is the one who encouraged me to right next to bob goodlatte, good to see you, congressman, good to see both of you. when you speak of sports, people of their sports teams. what it is the high school team,

kaput team, protein, they really like them. they are enthused about them and for a positive. you see the motion when people are talking about washington. i love what they're doing up there in washington, gosh, isn't it great what they're doing in washington? , you never hear that. growing up in a football family as the middle of the country and being on the sidelines and training camp and playing sports myself i realized the reason people like sports are a variety of characteristics and attributes that i figured maybe there is a way to translate ideas from the lessons that after eight or characteristics of sports which very much apply to government and that is what my book endeavors to do. ..

when you look at washington, they're not so concerned that at equal opportunity as equal resslts. in sports, you get the opportunity to compete and succeed based on preparation, timor, innovative leadership, hard work. all of those are rewarded and sports. when your team wins, you celebrate. in washington, it would be like, gosh, the port detroit lions, they have never been to the super bowl. but the pittsburgh steelers, they have all these -- i know we have some michigan folks. i dunno if we have any steelers

fans, but the steelers have however many super bowl trophies. if it were washington, they would redistribute to the poor detroit lions. that would be airport in the world of sports. there are a lot of things we can learn. said, as most of you all are too young to remember but he always talks about the future is now, and that is the way we ought to look at it because we can't afford to continue kicking the can down the road because that can is turning into a barrel and what you find with what is going on in washington is everything from the health care monstrosity and experimented telling us what kind of energy we use and then telling us how much income we can have and how to increase taxes on capital gains and income and dividends and debts and even talking about value-added taxes. i have all the confidence in the world and the ability of americans and america to compete and succeed and i have heard from many folks for the last year while writing this book,

folks who are really dismayed and are losing confidence in the ability of america to compete and most importantly, the worry of the potential of their children to achieve the american dream. today in the face of the many challenges we are facing here in our country, what is coming out of washington and not necessarily the members you are working for by the way, but what we are finding is a nightmare scenario coming out of washington. so, i believe it is time for an american comeback in there needs to be an urgency to it. i like to use another football analogy. we need to be like a team that is six points down, with less than two minutes to play and no timeouts. you really have to have that urgency because my friends we are in competition with other countries. as i write in my book, you can learn from sports in our government should be like a good sports team, soberly focused on

specific responsibilities, primarily of course national security, not manipulating and meddling in people's affairs in spending on somebody else's credit card like it drunken man he. that is my view of this. i was speaking at st. paul's college a few months ago on energy, and there was a foot tall player they are and a few coaches and i asked one of the coaches. i said hey coach, do you all ever pond on a first down? the coach said you never pond on a first down. i said perfect, that is the title of one of the chapters of my book. our country has been punting on first downs on so many issues from reining in government spending and debt which of course has skyrocketed in the last couple of years and then you look at energy policy. we have been punting on energy policy since the 1970s when opec started manipulating reduction in prices and we are becoming more dependent on hostile dictators, oligarchs and

-- when you go to stadiums, doesn't matter if the team is kind of halfway decent team. the fans are going, we are number one. those hands, we are number one. well, guess what? the united states when it comes to energy resources, we are truly number one nd that is from the congressional resource -- research service and thanks primarily to our plentiful coal resources as well as the gas and oil we have. russia's number wo in saudi arabia's number three. any other country would look at these resources we have in america as a blessing. unfortunately the way the prevailing parties in washington look at it is that it is a curse. what we need to do is utilize these resources in the best resources are not just the natural resources but the creative resources of american people and unleashed them and whether it it is for affordable electricity, and that means it needs to have our electricity.

if you want affordable electricity for competition and i know this as a governor, when we recruit businesses from connecticut and new jersey and new york we compare our electricity rates in virginia to what they pay up there and hours are half the price that they pay. that matters a lot to technology companies that use a lot of electricity. the demand for electricity is outpacing new generations by nearly three-to-one. so if you want to have the portable electricity, there were two sources that provide the most affordable electricity, hydroelectric and coal. hydroelectric is pretty much limited to the pacific northwest where they have the terrain and typography. coal is american and provides jobs, it is affordable and we need to cleanly and creatively use our coal. they are also great ideas, new renovations, commonsense conservation, battery technologies we need to be adopting, advanced nuclear needs to be part of the mix as well. i write in my book how-- i know

this is blasphemous but we can learn from the french. the french recycle. they reprocess their spent fuel. it is a much safer less dangerous approach. they encase it in class and the only reason we don't do that is because of jimmy carter era policies that were put in way before most of you all were born and in my view the bottom line is i know darned well with the french can do it, so can americans american so we have to allow that that her approach and we also ought to allow for the safe production of oil and gas on our land and off our coasts as well. what you see out of washington though is all counterproductive when it comes to energy. this cap-and-trade scheme is just absurd. phony manipulative market that the government would create, and then you saw last week a vote in the senate on epa, where the

draconian co2 regulations that would increase the cost of electricity in our country, the cost of food, the cost of fuel, throw people out of work whether they are manufacturing jobs, coal related jobs. the bottom line, if you think of what people do in sports teams, you care about having an advantage and never wanting to do something that is going to harm your own feasibility to compete. whether it is the co2 regulations by epa and the congress punting or abdicating their responsibility and giving it to unelected judges and to unelected bureaucrats rather than handling their own constitutional responsibility, or this cap-and-trade scheme, they are in effect economic unilateral disarmament. all of this is supposed to exchange-- change the temperature of the earth 40 years are now by a fraction of 1 degree. i'm glad you laughed at it. they can't predict the weather

10 days out accurately much less 40 years but all of these burdens will be put onto team america and no other country is going to impose it on their citizens. china is not going to do it, and he is not going to do it, indonesia, russia brazil, no country is going to impose it so that is why economic unilateral disarmament. as i write my book, what washington can learn from the world of sports, in the days of ronald reagan who is my hero and i have pictures of ronald reagan when he was governor and came to practices and that is what got me interested in politics. here is a great governor. he knows what is important, football. i liked his ideas as well but in the days of ronald reagan when he turned our country around, our competition for america, for a few western european countries and japan. our competition now is all of the countries of europe, japan, south korea, china, malaysia,

india, singapore, australia, brazil. the rest of the world. if we can have a government as i write in this book, while other countries are going pedal to the metal and starting to lap us so we need to have that competitive spirit and they do have a winning energy game plan in here. another thing about sports, no one ever goes to a game, no one pays to watch officials officiate. you don't go there to say gosh i hope that zebras figure out to-- who will win this game but too often in washington may come up with manipulations and burdens and nanny government regulations that impede the flow and whether it is our complicated tax code or this most recent health care monstrosity that-- what we want is not people to be dependent on the government. we want folks to be responsible for themselves and have more affordable personalized importable health care options, which i talk about in here, in my book.

another chapter is defense wins championships. everyone talks about defense runs-- wins championships. defenses the top responsibility of the government and we do need to have a strong agile national defense. for the layer of missile defense system you have analogies are they, here is your first defensive lineman, then you need a linebacker for the long-range. you need fast defensive backs and you have to have a mobility to it all because you never know sometimes in sports you are running against a steve young or a randall cunningham who is a mobile quarterback, so you need to be able to move your defense around, your missile defense system to either israel or the taiwan straits are the korean peninsula. been the key thing we need to have his technological advances, the airborne laser, the abl.

it is like a speed rusher who can't be blocked and it hits the backfield as soon as it gets the ball. that is what we need for our national defense. another thing that needs to be understood as the home-field advantage of sports. the homer hankies of minnesota, who doubt new orleans or mile high stadium in denver. there is a whole bill that damage and there is a chapter in my book called there is no place like home. that is respecting the states, the people in the states, to experiment, who reflect the challenges that are unique to a particular state and reflect the values of the people. michelle easton when i was governor, was president of the board of education and we put in high academic standards and accountability in schools for making sure our young people can k-12 are learning how to read, write, speak the english language, higher levels of math, science and economics and

history. there is a chapter on that. we put in measurement for virginia and you have that measurement. no one watches a basketball game wondering i wonder what the score of this game is. there is a scoreboard. there is accountability. players on teams, just like students, earned self-esteem. you don't give it to them. you don't have social promotion and what we did in virginia has been emulated in many other states. by the way we did this in virginia and not because of no child left behind a the race to the top, the latest meddling from federal bureaucrats. the people in the states care about their children. parents care about their children more than anybody in washington are anybody else in government. you do have to have that measurement. those are the sort of things we did in virginia, welfare reform two years before the federal government finally pass something that was not as strong as what we passed, our economic development was fantastic for a

renaissance of opportunity in virginia and we also abolished lenience, dishonest parole system and allowed law-abiding citizens to get conceal and carry permits. going through my book all of these benefits for virginians, making us a better place to learn, learn and raise families in you compared to d.c. and many of these areas and what they spend in education or law-abiding citizens to protect themselves. the same with maryland. our crime rates are much less than theirs. we have way more jobs in virginia. are wary to work laws which are our individual freedom, our great competitive advantage but we decided that. you take all sorts of initiatives across the country. if it is a good one other states will follow it. if it is a bad idea they want. we need to trust the people in the states rather than having officials on the banks of the potomac dictating do we the people in the states. finally, there is a lot of other

chapters but there is one, when umpires can't be trusted, everyone loses. that has to do with judges. if you have judges who are imposing their officials of-- imposing their own views contrary to the rules, everyone loses. no one goes to a football game expecting a fumble on the field to be reversed by somebody up in a skybox in calling it a talk. if that happened, i'm glad you recognize that awful call. if that happened game after game people would wonder about the integrity and the legitimacy of the games they are paying good money to watch. they think is maybe like pro-wrestling or something. the point is the judges at the federal level are to be constrained to the rules, and the rules are to be made not by judges, not by officials, not making up rules in the middle of the game but by the legislative branch, folks like congressman

goodlatte and other members of congress and signed by the president or state legislatures and governors. so that is a very important principle that is forgotten in washington, where you have too many judges, who ignore what the proper role is, which is love. i do maintain in my book, it is so alien to sports that you actually have that the federal level supreme court justices who are appointed for life. could you ever imagine anyone in any sport team getting a lifetime contract? no way. a ten-year contract would be really long and i think supreme court justices are to have long-term's. they get appointed and consent from the senate but it should be maybe a 12 year or 16 years but there should always be accountability. there is accountability in sports, there is accountability in business. why in the heck should somebody get appointed for life?

that is some of the ways to be sure empires can be trusted. those are some of the areas i believe washington can learn from the world of sports. this book is i think unique or a fresh way to present to the american people ideas that folds understand from the world of sports and see how-- gosh, that makes sense to improve people's lives and then put people, the people of team america, in a position to compete, succeed and achieve their dreams. i thank you all for your attention and i would be happy to take any questions you may have her go thank you all. [applause] >> and the comments, questions, cheers for your favorite teams? yes, maam. >> are putting limits on how many points you can win by. competition is important.

>> well, you know it gets to a certain point. my youngest daughter plays lacrosse, and if one team gets ahead by more than four goals, you don't have to have a face-off. the other team gets the ball. to me, that is fine but to say you can't win -- make you never want players on the field that you don't want them trying as hard as they can and not trying to, say it is a basketball game or whatever the game may be, you want them to be trying their best. if you have a coach that has been a sportsmanship or sportswoman shipped to them if you are way ahead you can put in more players that normally don't start. they can get more playing time. they can be on the field and you don't want those players on the field saying alright all right we have the to ball. let's just brought out of bonds every time. you want them to be learning that experience to say if you win by too many points, you forfeit the game, i think it is sending all the wrong messages.

i think there should be sportsmanship. if you were beating a team, trouncing them, you are to find ways-- he don't have to be running long bonds. you could be running the ball and so forth but make sure the players that are playing are trying their best because it may be their only chance to score april goal or to make a basket and you don't want to deprive your team of that just because you play so well. what the other team needs to do is practice harder and play better and make fewer mistakes. to me that doesn't make a great deal of sense and i think send the wrong message. i think people on their own, the coaches ought to recognize when it gets to that point. you just need a matter of sportsmanship as opposed to a rule. >> can you give us your opinion on how the obama administration is handling the bp oil spill in what you think they could've done differently?

>> well, the question was, what do i think of the way-- what could the obama administration done differently in what do i think of how they are handling the bp oil spill? first of all this is a real tragedy and a catastrophe for jobs, likelihood and our ecology along the gulf coast. bp is ultimately of course primarily responsible for it. if you want to see how leadership should have been exerted on this, you don't have to look too far from baton rouge, and that is governor bobby jindal. bobby jindal on day one says alright, all hands on deck four what can we do? he understood what was at stake and helping and protecting the people and the livelihoods and environment of louisiana. if you look at the federal response, and i guess we will hear from the president tomorrow , so i can coach in between the third and fourth quarters saying this game has been going on for a while.

here's what we need to do. i think he should have had all hands on deck. for example when there is an emergency you can remove regulations. people i've talked about his jones act which may make some sense from time to time and in ordinary times in an emergency, if there are ships from the netherlands who want to come in and help out on the gulf coast, you should spin the regulations. let the ships and resources and equipment, and from the netherlands to help our country. bobby jindal as governor was asking for more of whom to protect. he was asking to build sand berms. they still haven't really approved of the more than a few of them and here it has been gosh, well over a month. when there is an emergency you make quick decisions. other than uninformed decisions. it doesn't need to be a panic but my goodness the whole reason you suspend emergency is to have quick responses, and that is

probably exhibit a of dilatory delaying and lack of proper activity that we have seen out of this white house, not allowing louisiana, the folks in louisiana or permitting them, to put in the sand booms that would keep the sand berms to keep the oil from getting into the marshes which are particularly difficult to clean up. they just haven't had all hands on deck. they haven't moved quickly. they think there is no shot clock i guess, or there is no warning at all. just keep dawdling. so, my view is, whatever governor general and barber mack and rightly and others, they ought to act quickly to get that done to prevent any more harm to people and the environment. yes maam. >> i go to orlando and you came once to her school to talk about

energy. i am an avid fisher. i don't like how a lot of liberals are-- it is sad what happened in the state, but we can't just stop drilling for more oil. what would you think is the best response to combating the argument they are using because of this bill we now have to no longer drill anywhere else offshore? >> good for you and your understanding of it. you are not saying it just me. you are from west florida, and what needs to be done, just like in any other activity, if there has been a mistake made, you have an after action review. you determine what caused this. was it human error?

was that a mechanical failure? are there better technological devices that are available for practices and inspections, and adopt those better approaches because we want to safeguard against this ever happening again. the idea that we are just not going to explore off our coast anymore is really a foolish approach. what they are doing now with this moratorium is exacerbating the economic disaster aspect of this because it is going to be throwing just tens if not hundreds of thousands of people out of work who are involved in the oil and gas industries from texas to louisiana and alabama and mississippi, so that ought to be done but done in a safe way. for those who say gosh, we don't want any exploration off our gulf coast, guess what? even if it were all shut down, the castro brothers 50 miles off the coast of florida along with russia and maybe china, will be drilling for oil and gas off the coast of florida, 50 miles off.

what we need to do is learn and for example, in canada they require relief wells, which are now trying to get drilled by bp at this moment. maybe that will be an approach that needs to be taken. in norway they have acoustic devices or acoustic sensors on these blowout preventers. maybe we ought to be using that technological improvement. the point is this is our energy. i would rather be getting it from the gulf for anywhere in america, even off the coast of virginia and share the revenues with the states. i would much rather be getting it from our land and our waters than giving tankers coming in from hugo chavez in venezuela. let's do it cleanly with the best safeguards and that is the approach you take for american energy security, our drops and also our balance of trade as well. this is the last question. yes, sir.

>> i'm just kind of curious--. >> you have a good super bowl quarterback out of byu. >> different personalities. i appreciate knowing your comparison, the common sense approach and competition being applied to our government and it seems very office-- obvious we should compete to the maximum ability we have. what is kind of comical what is being done at the moment. there is obviously enough poll that has got us to this point but what is the commonsense reason for being in this mess i guess? we keep moving in this direction of regulating and why is that? >> well, you know representative democracy does not run on automatic pilot. there is a requirement of the citizenry, the people who are the owners of the government to

be informed and educated. the claire booth luce group clearly does that, and this is such a forum. a lot of people don't necessarily follow the intricacies and the process that is worshiped in washington. they are leading their own lives. they are trying to make ends meet. save up money for their children to be able to go to college and they are going through their own lives. the key for us i think for commonsense conservatives, and this is what i try to do in this book, is take what people do know-- people read the sports section and they know what is in the sports section is accurate. it is about the only section in the newspaper you know what is printed in there is true. here is the score, here's the ad that's, here are the touchdowns in here are the records. there may be a misprint but the goal is to be accurate. the rest of the paper you don't know whether that is true or false. people like sports and the

meritocracy of sports. people expect results. people win and lose. there is measurement, there is accountability. there is teamwork and those are the attributes that are important for a state and for a government so what i tried to dig in this book is take why people like sports and say all right if we actually operated team america like this, look how much better it would be for you and your children and our future, the competitiveness of people in our country, the respect for the constitutional rights and the tenth amendment is still part of the bill of rights in respecting the states. so i think i see people motivated. they are riled up, they are stirred up. you sought in virginia last year and the governor's race and i think you are going to see them the 2010 elections where people who pay taxes, work for living and care about their children are not going to sit back and take it. it is actually very encouraging to see people wanting to take back their government and they

want their country to not need to sending. they don't want our country making nice beaches and apologizing for the united states. they want this country to be number one and number one not just for any braggadocio but number one because this needs to be the land of opportunity. each and every one of you in the counties, cities, communities and states you all live in, you have pretty good fertile home field for conservative principle that we need to make sure the owners, the folks that own the sky boxes and pay for the sky boxes and all the seats are riled up, informed and what i think is most important, not just play tenacious defense, which is important that we need positive, constructive ideas that motivate and inspire people and unite them and they say this is what we need done from our government and those who are for it, we want them starting for us and those who want, get them off the field because we want to put a man or woman in there, whether

it is bob goodlatte or michelle bachmann, people who trust free enterprise and make sure america is not just number one economically but number one positively impacting people throughout the world. thank you all. [applause] >> thank you so much for those remarks governor allen. we are so honored to have you here with us today. just as a quick announcement, if you purchased his book earlier at intermission please see laura immediately following the seminar. she has to go over some things with you. i'm honored to introduce to your next speaker, congressman bob goodlatte from the sixth district of virginia. congressman goodlatte phobos wasn't sure mental in helping this event by securing this room and we are so delighted to be able to have him here today to share brief remarks. congressman goodlatte has been serving basics district of virginia for 30 years beginning

at the district to congressman butler in 1977 and onto congress himself when he was elected in 1981. congressman goodlatte has been a stalwart conservative leader in congress, is chairman of the house agriculture committee and vice ranking member of the house judiciary committee, protecting constitutional rights including private property, and second amendment rights, securing our borders dermott ration reform, strengthening our criminal laws, decreasing health care costs for medical malpractice reform and oversight of the judicial branch. during his time in congress, congressman goodlatte has made a name for himself as a leader on internet and high-tech issues. he is cochair of the congressional internet cod-- caucus in high technology working group. his work to foster innovation in the technology sector will lead to job creation and contribute to our nation's economic recovery. he is it graduate of washington university law school and earned his undergraduate degree in

government at ace college in maine. he currently lives in roanoke with his wife and two children. please join me in welcoming congressman bob goodlatte. [applause] >> thank you alyssa for that very kind introduction. i am very interested in technology issues. my son, the raj waited from college two years ago works for facebook, so i had to make sure as i was waiting here to come up and speak, that i tweeted that i was here before the claire booth luce policy institute to talk about your conservative leadership program and it is a pleasure to be here with governor george allen and our great first lady of virginia, susan allen. they have been a great team for virginia and will be again in the future, and is a pleasure for me to have the opportunity to talk to you. when i think about those

technology issues i have to laugh. years ago yahoo! name me the most internet friendly member of congress. i went home and told my son, it was 10 years ago and he was 14 at the time. i said bobby, guess what? yahoo! just named me the internet friendly member of congress. he was sitting at his computer screen and he looked at me and said gee dad, that is said. if you are the most internet friendly member of congress, congress has a long way to go. congresses, lung ways particularly on the republican side of the aisle where we are proud of the fact that we have been engaged in using new media and a whole host of different ways. that is the first thing i want to mention to you. we have now launched the most advanced interactive, new media outreach to american citizens to talk about what the agenda of our country should be, not just in the future after future elections but right now in this congress. there is no need to wait until

there is a change. there is always a need for good ideas here in washington. some of you may recall or have heard about the contract with america, which we launched when the republicans became the majority in congress back in 1995 and passed many, many pieces of legislation, in fact 27 of the 28 tills offered were passed into law. at this time we think we should do a different approach. we think that we should be reaching out to the american people and listening to them. so if you haven't already heard about it, write it down. one of the most interesting web sites you'll find on the internet, america speaking out.com. america speaking out, all one word.com. check it out and you'll find there is a tremendous opportunity for you to interact with members of congress to offer your ideas about what the future of our country and what this congress should be doing with regard to legislation and i

hope you'll check it out. i also wanted to talk to you today about what i think is the number one concern facing our country today, and that is the enormous debt that we are leaving to you, our young people, in this country. i hope you are having a great experience here in washington. i hope you will take what you are learning here back to your college campuses, back to your communities, back to the people who need to know what you are learning about here because we really rely upon you to spread the word. this is the word i want to impart upon you. the greatest success that president obama has had from his standpoint, to a great failure in my opinion but the greatest success from a standpoint is the passage of the health care reform legislation. there are many many reasons in my opinion why that is bad legislation. it sets up more than 150 new government agencies and programs. it mandates things that i think

are unconstitutional that american citizens would have to buy health insurance from a private health insurance company and have to buy insurance that the government will essentially dictate what that insurance is going to look like. i have joined in with the number of members of the house in signing onto an amicus brief, that is a brief that supports the efforts of the virginia attorney attorney general, ken pooch in l.a., to try to have a provision in the health care bill struck down as unconstitutional. the number one reason that i think this legislation is bad is we simply cannot afford to make additional promises to the american people that the federal government simply cannot keep. we have right now many, many programs here that benefit many american citizens that are on automatic pilot that they are going to cost far more than the government has the ability to raise revenues to pay for. when i talk to young people i

ask them to questions. one, who is going to have to pay for this and invariably they know the answer. they know it is going to be on their shoulders. what they often do not know is how much money we are talking about. the economic stimulus package that i voted against cost close to $1 trillion by the time you add in the money in the budget to pay the interest on it. it is about a trillion dollars. the health care bill of the president claimed would cost $1 trillion, most people now is all the figures are coming out and we are seeing very many underestimates of the cost in many ways that they cooked the books, and is going to cost between two and 2.5 chilean dollars over the next 10 years. the budget deficit for last year was $1.4 trillion it is going to be about that amount again this year. the president offered a budget earlier this year for next year. next year in washington starts on october 1 of this year but the federal budget deficits for

next years are projected to be $1.6 trillion. expected to take in $2.2 trillion in revenue since been $3.8 billion, to spend 70% more money than we take in and all of that additional money will have to be arra been added to our national debt, which already totals more than $13 trillion it is borrowed from japan and china and the saudi shakes and a whole lot of other people. the creditworthiness of the united states is very much being called into question. the question i ask young people is, we talk about all these trillions of dollars, how much is a trillion dollars? about 45 years ago governor allen recalls there was a republican leader in congress by the name of everett dirksen, and he was widely reported to have said a billion dollars here, a billion dollars there, pretty soon you are talking about real money. actually that is not what he

said. he actually said 45 years ago, a million dollars here and a million dollars there, pretty soon you are taught in about real money. so in just four and a decade we progress from talking about millions of dollars being a lot of money to billions of dollars a lot of money and now trillions of dollars. how much is a trillion dollars? i asked some of the students, if you had a stack of thousand dollar bills 4 inches high how much money without the? nice freshly printed, tightly packed thousand dollar bills. most people have never seen a thousand dollar bill, 4 inches high, that would be a million dollars. i said how high would that stack of thousand dollar bills have to be to total just $1 trillion, not the 13 trillion we owe that just $1 trillion? one young lady raised her hand and she said it would be about 12 inches. a fellow in the back of the room laughed and he said no, no it

couldn't be more like 20 feet. those of you who understand mathematics a little better now that a billion is 1000 times 1 million a trillion is 1000 times a billion or a million times a million dollars. that is $1 trillion of that stack of 1000-dollar bills would be 4 inches high for $1 million would have to be 4 million for $1 trillion. 4 million inches divided in 2 miles is 63 miles high. imagine a stack of not 1 dollar bills but thousand dollar bills stacked up 63 miles high. that reaches all the way up into outer space mack, and that is what this administration is doing. that is why we are working very hard to get the support here in the congress to cut back on government spending, not increase it, not set up a new

entitlement programs like the health care bill that come up with a vote so we can try to repeal that legislation and replace it with commonsense reforms that aren't even in that bill like medical liability reform to cut down on the amount of defensive medicine that doctors and hospitals spend, order up each year that cost tens of billions of dollars and ed sherman does lead to the health insurance premiums that they have. those are the kinds of things that we need to be doing here and we need to be forming a new framework here in washington in which government can operate. instead of this out of control situation where, when the economy looks better there is a great program out there, people in washington simply pass those pieces of legislation. they are kicking the can down the road right at you and people who have not even been born yet in terms of the burden that is going to fall on your shoulders. i like what former majority leader dick armey said to me

recently. he said i am tired of people saying, let's think more outside the box. he said it is time we started thinking inside the box, inside the limitations our government has on what our constitution says, our federal government should be doing and in terms the amount of money available to us to spend. so that is why in each of the last two congresses i have introduce balanced budget amendments that have very wide bipartisan support and which actually passed the house of representatives, getting the two-thirds required on a number of occasions and which have also come within one vote of passing in the united states senate. had that occurred, and been sent to our states for ratification, by now we would have a balanced budget requirement and argued too constitution and we would need doing much, much better. i know we have a thought other great speakers art coming so i hope you are having a great experience here. i see that michelle lachman, my

great friend, is here and i hope she will be participating in this as well and that she will take back our message that there are great conservative ideas here in washington but we also need more great conservative ideas from you, so go to america speaking out.com, get into the participatory mode. tell your friends about it as well and let's was taken aback america and have a government founded on our constitution and limited in its scope. thank you so much and god bless each and everyone of you you. [applause] >> thank you so much congressman for helping us get the rams a 97 million americans can watch this on c-span and thank you or your informative thoughts. i michelle easton, the president of the claire booth luce policy institute. one thing we like to do at the institute is take a moment to to recognize effective leaders who speak up boldly as claire boothe

luce did on behalf of conservative principles and traditional values. before congressman bachmann speaks to you i'm going to give you her our leadership award for the year. each year we select a woman for this award who has shown exceptional leadership in promoting conservative values and this year there was no russian that congresswoman michelle bought in with the right choice for this award. we have been promoting her work for years and congresswoman bachmann has quickly become one of the most prominent conservative leaders to boldly speak out against the policy failures of the obama administration and his liberal allies in washington. congresswoman bachmann was elected in 2006, the first woman republican from minnesota to be elected to the minnesota house and in her first term she developed a reputation for a principle reformer who stays true to her conservative beliefs. she is a leading advocate for bipartisan earmark reform and tax relief and a staunch

opponent of wasteful government spending. despite being targeted by the left her constituents reelected her to a second term in 2008. prior to serving in the u.s. congress she was in a minnesota state senate where she championed the taxpayer bill of rights or cauchy is also an attorney and spends five years as a federal tax litigation attorney, working on hundreds of civil and criminal cases. that experience solidifies her strong support for ethics to simplify the tax code and reduce tax burdens on american families and small business budgets. she currently sits on the financial services committee tasked with the oversight of numerous financial sectors, giving her a keen insight into the housing crisis and credit crunch leading her to be a staunch opponent of the taxpayer-funded bailout of wall street. she lives in stillwater, minnesota with her husband where they own a small business that employs 42 people. the bachmann's have five children and have opened their home to 23 foster children.

she is one of congress's leaving advocates for fostered and adopted children. you won't find conservative women my congresswoman bachmann raised in most of the mainstream media or by a feminist women's groups. in fact, many liberals in the media and on college campuses wish they could silence conservative people like this congresswoman. at the claire booth luce institute we are eager to honor leaders i congresswoman michelle bachmann who speaks to students at so many events, to claire boothe luce and other conservative groups. we want to recognize congresswoman bachmann and thank you for your courage and determination in promoting our shared conservative values and for speaking out against a less big government socialist policies. the truth is that you inspire all conservatives to be more courageous and feisty and to speak up in the expanding and

promoting our conservative beliefs. it is our honor to now present you with our 2010 claire booth luce policy institute conservative leadership award. [applause] >> michelle thank you so much for that high honor and that award, specially to be honored by claire boothe luce foundation. that is especially an honor position so i am extremely grateful because, as your statement said, inspiring women, which you do, discovering leaders and changing lives. that is what the claire booth luce foundation is all about and it's a tremendous honor for me to be able to be here with you this afternoon. i just heard from my great

friend, bob goodlatte. bob goodlatte was the first member of congress to campaign for me when i was reading the very first time for congress. it was a tumultuous race that year, as bob recalls. it was a third most highly targeted race out of the 435 for congress. if i recall, i think the democrats spent 9.6 million to defeat me. this was the state of minnesota so a midwestern state with 5 million population to spend 9.6 million is a lot of money in a race like that and we were able to win with the help of great colleagues they came out, but i have been a perennial target of the left and they remained that much as well this year. so it is especially an honor to be honored by the claire booth luce foundation and also it isn't every day that a 54-year-old woman is a pinup girl and a calendar so i just want you to no, that is really an honor for me as well and i appreciate that. in talking about conservatism, you have heard from some of the

best and brightest members of congress today and i don't want to repeat all of the great words they have said. only to tell you this. i think there is something that we need to run on this fall for all conservatives and it is that we need to repeal the government takeover of health care with obamacare. it is a must do on the list for conservatism. we cannot negotiate with obamacare, because it cannot be negotiated with. it needs to be 100% repealed and until we can get to the point of having a new president, we have to be committed to d. funding obamacare, to make sure that it doesn't get instituted in this country. why do i say this? why is it such an important part of what we need to do? socialized medicine or the government takeover of health care really is the lynchpin of socialism in every nation. that is what the threat of obamacare is for america because a completely retools the way we

do business in this country and here is the dramatic story. we were created 234 years ago as a free nation with a free-market -based economy. that is a privilege and a gift, unlike many other nations that they have known over history but that is something we have been given. because of that foundation stone of freedom, freedom of thought, freedom of speech, freedom of expression whether it is religious or assembly and the freedom to be able to develop our economy, that has allowed our economy to grow and thrive from literally a backwoods primitives rudimentary country to the point where we have become the most prosperous the world has ever seen. in the last 18 months something extraordinary occurred and it is this. we went from 100% of a private economy being owned and controlled and directed privately to the united states government effectively owning or

controlling 51% of the private economy. how did that happen? unfortunately it began under republican president and a democrat-controlled congress, when we passed the 700 billion-dollar bailout. what was the bailout used for? it was used by the federal government to purchase private businesses. the federal government to purchase the largest banks in the united states. citibank, bank of america. the taxpayer still on the equity shares of those banks as well as other banks. we also purchased the largest insurance company in the united states, aig. we put well over $150 billion into aig. we still on that private is this. we aren't in the process of untangling it. than the federal government decided to buy the largest car company in the united states, gm and chrysler. they subsequently declared bankruptcy at the united states still owns them.

we also owned freddie and fannie. does or not someone's relatives. what they are, they are the largest secondary mortgage companies in the united states which means today uncle sam, the federal government today, effectively owns well over half of all the private mortgages in the united states. consider that. over half of all the private homes in this country that have mortgages on them which are the overwhelming majority, those mortgages are owned not by a private bank anymore but by the federal government and if america goes in and purchases a mortgage today on a property and it is a great time to buy a home, nine times out of 10 you will getting-- begetting our mortgage from the federal government. this is completely what we were doing 18 months ago. act about the government had taken over control of the private student loan industry, so you don't get private loans from private banks. now you have to go to the

federal government to get a student loan and the government takeover of health care. icons from-- calculated if you add all those purchases or takeovers together, you will come up with 51% of the private economy. that is stunning. that is nothing short of stunning. that isn't just in my lifetime or your lifetime. that is in the last 18 months. then consider that right now i see when i are speaking, the financial services conference committee is contrary essentially the federal government takeover, true console of the financial services industry. some experts estimate that is 15% of our economy. that would take us up to 66% of the private economy and the president this evening will go on television and he will be talking about the bp response and what has been anticipated as the president will call for a

measure of the federal government takeover of the energy industry with a cap-and-trade system. if that is the case that would be approximately another 8% of the private economy that the federal government will control or we will be up to three fourths of the american economy. consider that. consider that the federal government could have direct ownership or effectual control of almost three fourths of the private economy, and you will see the most stunning concentration of power in the federal government's hands than anytime in the last 234 years of our history. that is something that we cannot continue, and lay claim in any way with a straight face, that we remain free. as a matter of fact if you look at heritage foundation site, they have a list of leading economic indicators, and we have always been considered for a but now the united states has fallen

out of the three categories into mostly free as an economic nation. that should give all of you who are young people on the cusp of your future pots as you look forward, especially if you consider the debt load. i am sure you have been hearing about that for many previous speakers today. consider where we are at right now in terms of the nations timeclock. we are well within a 10 year window of opportunity, probably more like five years, of being within the same level as greece when you look at debt-to-gdp ratio. i was preparing a speech last week and at the beginning of last week, the united states debt to gross domestic product ratio was 89% at the beginning of the week. by the end of the week, as i return to my speech to work on it a little bit more the information i.c.e. on the internet was that we were at 90%

debt-to-gdp ratio. i thought i must have found different web sites or it must be the economist don't agree with each other. we actually had gone from 89 to 90% debt-to-gdp ratio. that is how quickly the debt is accumulating. within a five-day period. the following week we were at 93% debt-to-gdp ratio. right now, the united states level of debt is literally falling off a cliff. when we see the united states go an exponential way of gravitating and accumulating debt, we need to very seriously consider. if you look at the course of history, whether it is ancient rome or the bourbon house in france or the ming dynasty or various societies throughout time, the decline in the society actually occurred very quickly, often within a decade and what was the precipitating event?

it was the fact that revenue outlays increased dramatically and yet even geometrically over revenue input. that is what you see occurring in the united states today. everyone thinks we are too big, we are too powerful, we are diversifying. that can never happen under the united states. i didn't come here and this black outfit because i am debbie downer here today but it is called to say we need to very seriously consider what is occurring and what is transpired in the last 18 months or so is not business as usual. this is a very different course than america has been on, one that is very serious and one that pretends-- pro-tends a real difference for your future. i am a tax lawyer. i have a law degree but i also have a post law school degree and tax law from the college of william and mary. probably before all of you were born in 1987, i participated in a study at that time in the

trajectory of taxation. those who are now about age 23 would have to pay in their peak earning years just for social security. that is what i was nervous about back in 1987. what would my second baby that was born in 87 have to pay in terms of the social security debt? to cut to the quick, it is essentially about 25% of the thing, and of that of that generation's income that would be needed just to pay social security. one thing that we know is medicare is far more expensive than social security, and that will cost conceivably well above another 25% of your income, so just those two programs alone would encompass over 50% of your income going forward in the future. that doesn't take into account the federal income tax portion of your income. nor does it take into account the state income tax portion of your future or local property

taxes or fail taxes or gas taxes or any time we turn around tax. in other words, you could find yourself waking up as adults in your peak earning years and find out that well over three fourths of your day would be spent working for uncle sam or some other taxing unit and maybe you take home two hours of your labor. i don't know too many people who are going to get out of bed in the morning to work that much for someone else and keep so little for themselves. it is a very serious equation we are on, and one that we have to consider, so the decisions that will be made post-november's election are ones that we need to keep in mind and should motivate us very highly for all of the elections that we will be seeing this fall. again i want to thank the claire booth luce foundation for this wonderful award. i really appreciate it and i most of all want to thank all of you as young people for being here, to get yourself educated on the issues and i hope highly

motivated to go forward and influenced many, many more people to get to the polls and to work actively to reclaim our country for the great heritage that we were given 234 years ago. thank you for that and with that wideout i open it up and if you have questions, i will be happy to answer them. [applause] >> all of these other institutions. >> the question was, is there a better way to deal with financial-services reform? there absolutely is. one thing that we saw that was completely absent from this bill was the reform of fannie and freddie. all roads lead to fannie and freddie when we looked at this economic meltdown that we are

still in the middle of. it is a very serious matter. it is not that we should not have the regulation of the financial-services industry, but one economist said that there is no other industry other than the nuclear industry that is as highly regulated today as financial-services. it was really pretty and fannie in the community reinvestment act and the policy of artificially keeping interest rates down low. i like low interest rates, but it helped fuel the housing bubble that we are in today. this is currently being put before us and it will only institutionalize the very bad factors that got us here in the first place. it will continue the ongoing

bailout strategy that has gotten us even worse in debt than we are now. yes? >> we try to promote leaders in college and beyond. we face the challenges with the feminist response. do you ever faced anything like that? how do you deal with that even as a congressman surrounded by ? >> the best response to winning is to be the best prepared person in the room. if you are the most prepared, you know what the response will be, no matter what had your

opponent takes. there is no substitute for hard work. know your subject and no your opponent's arguments and guess where they are going to come from. you need to know more your opponent is coming from. you need to be open to trying to understand the other side and understand the opponent's position because they may have positions that are worth taking and are worth conceding. ultimately, our ultimate goal for all of us, no matter what the issue, is to get to the point of truth. what is the truth about a situation? what is the best solution or alternative to a situation? none of us have complete control over the truth. we should try to understand our opponents point of view. ultimately, we need to get to the point of truth. what a great question. >> at the rate that the

government has been taking over in such a short time, if the current administration was reelected in 2012, d you think that america could ever totally be free again? >> well, first of all, i truly believe that this administration is a one-term administration. [applause] i absolutely believe that. i do not see that they will have two terms. i think that we have some very strong gains on the conservative decided this fall. we worked extremely hard, there is a chance that the house could go republican and the senate to go republican. it is not a done deal. it is not a certainty. we should be highly motivated to make sure that we make as many games as we possibly can. i do think that the american people have been very turned off

by what they have seen coming out of the administration. they have been upset by the economic downturn and the way that the administration has handled that. they have seen how the war and terror has played out and the response to bp in the gulf region. they do not like to see the government takeover of health care. if we do see a second term in the administration, it will be very difficult to unwind the goe economy.

greece is one of the tiniest economies in all of europe. that economy that is over extended, about one little economy is bringing down all of the eu. it has put our money on the line for greece. consider that the u.k. is right behind greece. portugal is right behind them. ireland is behind them and italy is behind them and spain is behind them. there are many nations that are in precarious financial stability. there is a tremendous responsibility in the united states. if we will get our house in order and drastically cut spending and have written tunnel reforms of social security and welfare and if we create a growth environment by dramatically cutting taxes for

five years and making permanent killing of the death tax and getting rid of the alternative minimum tax, 34% corporate business tax is insane. we need to lower that to about a 9% level. i do not believe that anyone should be paying more than 21% of their income in tax to the federal government and have 100% expenses if someone buys a business item. maybe that will take a long weekend. you would not even wait 1/4 and you would see absolute robust growth here and the united states economy. you would see job increases. if you would just consider, and we, rather than spend one trillion dollars because that is the cost of s