as well as to monitor natural disasters for example, be it floods and on the northern border or hurricanes in the gulf. this is a very important additional asset that is available for homeland security, to provide situational awareness. there has been no agreements are reached to date regarding the use a u of aav within mexico for that purpose. . .

assets, so it is not as though

they come and are depriving another sector of a particular asset >> does that imply the guards will be armed? you talked about them at manning teams. what exactly does such a team do? do they patrol physically on the border? >> yes, self protection means some typethat and senunder of danger they're able to extricate themselves, will be taking leave from law- enforcement. entry edification teams will fill a variety of roles depending on the situation, but they certainly will be deployed on the u.s.-side of the border

as set forth by rules of engagement. we have done this before, and it is common practice for soldiers and airmen to take the leads, to only take action necessary to extricate themselves, and not be provocative. >> the entreat identification teams will be assisting the commissioner and the criminal intelligence analyst, assisting with investigations of the criminal networks. >> the team is there on the border physically? what do they do? >> the work with border control engines to provide additional eyes and ears for the border, so they are at pre-determined places along the border, to be able to assist and identify

attempted entries, and communicating to border patrol agents that would then take efforts at apprehension. >> in an observation tower or radar? >> you would have them at certain positions that again would have been pre-determined by the border patrol leadership and expertise in the particular sector. and from the particular thepoin t would be in a position to provide situational awareness over a particular portion of the border. >> they will be armed? >> yes. >> a question for the general. with the u.s. fighting two wars, are you worried about the

government's coming back, getting back into the guard for this mission? is it having any effect on troop readiness of the number of troops available for duty in afghanistan and iraq? >> they supply troops for the air force and army. we are about 54,000 now currently serving. i asked before i came down here about the size of the national guard forces in these four states -- california, over 19,000, ariz. nearly seven dozen, it new mexico 3000, and taxes, 20,000. even though those states are providing forces to efforts overseas, there is a sizable number of national guardsmen and women available to perform the duty. i rely on the general and governor's part of the council of governors who advise

secretary robert gates and secretary janet napolitano to tell me where the need is. i cannot see a case where we would be over extending the national guard in this effort. >> were there any of the troops who had a change of deployment overseas? >> no, none of them have had to change. >> to follow up, the weather in california announced [unintelligible] are the part of this or separate? [unintelligible] drug smugglers. on what basis -- >> i think the commissioner can answer your second question, but in terms of what governors are

requesting, they made a request to the president of the u.s., and the department of only a security has identified the needs of those in those specific states. i won't go into specifics of how many guardsmen went to each state, but gov. schwarzenegger has the capability to put additional resources out there. these are supplied and paid for by the federal government. >> secretary martin indicated what has become accepted knowledge based on the data we gathered of recording seizures of narcotics. half of the marijuana seizures made at the u.s./mexican border were done at the tucson sector. with regard to illegal immigration, half of the illegal migrants who have been apprehended this fiscal year have been apprehended in the tucson sector. the number is down significantly

from previous years. the fact is, there are still 171,000 people apprehended there this year, and that represents under 50% of the total, apprehension along the entire border from brownsville to san diego. >> congress is back in session today. the house will double in and about 20 minutes with general speeches. it will begin legislative work. they're expected to take up unemployment benefits, and

measures dealing with oil drilling. live coverage beginning at 12:30 p.m. the senate begins the week at 2:00 p.m. eastern, taking up the swearing in of the replacement for the late senator robert byrd, followed by a vote on extending unemployment benefits. that will be live on c-span2. >> they have to register these things. >> live on c-span3 from the woodrow wilson center, a day- long discussion on u.s. relations with china. right now it is a media topic. this is live now on our companion network. >> last week the second court of appeals struck down the federal communications commission's indecency policy. we will speak with carter philips from fox news and

patrick trueman the file the case on behalf of "focus on the family." >> the senate judiciary committee will vote on the elena kagan on tuesday. watch live coverage on c-span3. learn more and c-span is latest book -- candid conversations with all the justices of the active and retired, providing unique insight. it is available in both hardcover and as an e-book. >> we will have the u.s. house live at 12:30 p.m. eastern. host: has become so large, so unwieldy, and so secretive that

no one knows how much money it costs, how many people it employs, how many people exist within it, or how many agencies do the same work. the reporters call it a top- secret america hidden from public view and lacking over said. d today top-secret america hidden from public view and lacking in thorough oversight. after nine years of precedented oversight. 1900 private companies work on counter-terrorism. some 10,000 locations across the united states. an estimated four under and 54,000 people old top-secret

security clearances. 33 building complexes, top- secret, they have been built since 911, 2001, 51 federal organizations and military commands operating in 15 u.s. cities track the flow of money to end from terrorist networks. analysts that makes sense of documents foreign and domestic share their judgment by sharing intelligence reports every year. the volume is so large that many are routinely given more. michael, republican line, houston, texas, good morning.

caller: the size of the government is overthrown. the second point i would make about the topic, after the 1980 the growth of the intelgence community leading into the 1990's for the democratic party was quite happy about it. host: "lack of focus, not lack

of resources was at the heart of the fort hood shooting, as well as the christmas day bombing attempt. an alert airline passenger saw smoke coming from his seatmate. the are issues that really concern the people in charge of national security. but not just for the director of national intelligence, but any individual. defense secretary robert gates. only super users have the ability to assess defense department activities, there is no way he could keep up with the nation's sensitive work. scott joins us from pennlvania, democratic line.

caller: this is my first time getting through. good morning. it seems that most of the work done by the intelligence industry is not done for protection. it is done for subversion around the world. is that a fair assessment or not? host: will ask our callers. david, an independent line, texas. caller: as long as we are fighting these wars over there they will keep trying to come up with an end to us. if you think about it, the times square bomber, the fort hood shooting, the christmas bomber, it is all a result of our various military interventions. especially over the middle east.

as long as we are making their lives miserable over there, the national security situation says they can do it. host: "addional records, hundreds of interviews with intelligence, military, and corporate officials, most requesting anonymity, either because they are prohibited from speaking publicly for fear retaliation at work. today's article describes the government's role in this expanding enterprise. tuesday's peace describes their dependence on government contractors. on the web, an extensive

database built by the post about top-secret america is available. let's go to milton, florida. caller: why did bill clinton changehe law in 1993 where medicare is primary payer overall insuranc george bush got blamed for medicare going broke. this year, everyone on disability, everyone on medicare host: right --

medicare. host: right now we are focusing on this piece from "the washington post." our question is -- is the government giving us safe? this is the breakdown of all the different agencies within the united states govement that deals with various things, including he intelligence, counterintelligence, and of the post breaks it down saying that 39 agencies to intel analysis. "262 technical intelligence. 25 to counter financing. two dozen workers encounter information. 18 do psychological ops. 16 work on special ops." they point out one, "they shifted their overseas post- 9/11 focus to fighting against terrorist leaders and networks. looking at how the state department works on this issue.

there are otr graphics, let's check back in with the article. "elisse 20% of the government organizations that exist to fend off terrorist threats were established or refashioned in e wake of 9/11. many that existed before the attacks grew to historic proportions." carbondale, illinois. democrats line. caller: i do feel safer. if it was not for 9/11, those people died in vain but if it was not for them we would not have programs that existed.

how quick they are to gain their background and financial information, case. they were able to get informatio about him so quickly. that is why we need programs like this. ... programs about keep a single. o host: "the ciairector, was also interviewed by the post last week, said that he has begun mapping out a five-year plan for his agency because the levels of spending since 9/11 are not sustainable. retired admiral dennis blair said that he did not believe that there was overlap in redundancy in the intelligence world. much of what appears to be

redundancy is providing tailored intelligence for multiple customers, there are presses in place to make her the different intelligence capabilities are wking the other where they need to. news about the post's findings. -- he mused about the post's findings, saying that the attitude seemed to be that if it was worth doing is wth overdoing. joseph the morning. caller: they are keeping a safe.

vietnam, you say that it is antiquated or obsolete, you say that now is a technology issue and the human element is what makes this work. host: tennessee, kentucky hearing-impaired -- pounded k -- kentucky. caller: wneed to be better than what we should be doing. host: ok, let's go to twitter. doug rights thatf taxpayer dollars are wasted, too much, national security and intelligence of the best things to waste themn.

manhattan, democratic line. caller: i would like to say that everything is alright until something happens. after 9/11 it was supposed to be the end of this note piping of everything. host: looking at the shooting in fort ho, texas, last fall, when an army major attacked people there, "the washington post," writes that "information about him did not get to where it needed to go. just 25 miles the road from walter reed, their 102nd military intelligence script that had been doing little to search for potential threats. instead the commander turned the unit attention to assessing general terrorist ability in the u.s..

one of six of the joint terrorism tax forces were already doing that work. secrecy was in the intelligence world and hampered protectiveness other wayin the defense department, the problem going bk to an ultra secret group of programs for which access is extremely limited and monitored by specially trained security officers. the pentagon list of code names for them runs 300 pages." minnesota, evelyn, hello. caller: i was just calling to say that i think that our government waste too much money on everything. defense, national security, so much so that i think it has all become corrupt. the people, when they talk about taking back our government, one

of them should be that they should stop our government from spying on us and that kind of stuff, which they legally do not have a right to do, it is unconstitutional. there for her all the money that they spend is not going to stop a terrorist attack if a terrorist really wants to get through and americans should understand that. thank you and have a day. host: edward, stockton, good morning. caller: good morning. like you sa, i am calling from stockton, california. i completely disagree with the caller who felt that we should spend more and more money on fighting terrorism.

most of them are likely not even working, getting all sorts of state fding and u.s.. fighting a war over in afghanistan and all of that, it is all just trying to get money and take over the oil. also that we should be worried about iran and their nuclear capabilities, focusing on just protecting our borders. hos in this top secret america washington post investigation they show 67 different centers monitoring overlapping bits of intelligence to keep an eye on military government activities 24/7.

this cluster in blue is military, at the top is intelligence, on the right is homeland security, in the bottom in think it is civil. they also clued an entire glossary of all of the different agencies, what they're called, and how to remember them. quite complex. let's go to denton, texas, william undemocratic line. caller: thank you for having me. this is a great subjects. actually question the efficacy and the intent. i know that terrorism is being used as atalking point and a selling issue for this massive expenditure, but i wonder and question, are these agencies not more involved in finding out

information about americans in general? a thing it has been a huge invasion of our privacy to a certain extent and i kind of believe that many of the things that they published, we have more transparency and i think that americans need to be more aware of the information and notice their true purpose. host: ok. we're looking at this piece called "the hidden world, don't -- growing beyond control." it was a two year investigation. the team that looked into what they're looking into a top secret america hidden from public view and cking from oversight. checking on twitter, joe writes

"the government is giving us safe and not free, that has failed." our next call is from baltimore, maryland. david, are you with us? caller: hello? host: welcome. i see that you are calling on the democratic line. go right ahead. do you think that national security and intelligence security are keeping us safe? caller: know. if it was about the bloated budget that we have, what about one week ago? but why would like to say to all of the chicken hawk republicans, if you would like to balance the budget >> we will leave "washington journal" at this time as the

u.s. house's gaveling in. this week the members are expected to take up unemployment benefits and additional war spending, and measures dealing with oil drilling.

the speaker pro tempore: the house will be in order. the chair lays before the house a communication from the speaker. the clerk: the speaker's rooms, washington, d.c. july 19, 2010.

i hereby appoint the honorable donna f. edwards to act as speaker pro tempore on this day. signed, nancy pelosi, speaker of the house of representatives. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the order of the house of january 6, 2009, the chair would now recognize members from lists submitted by the majority and minority leaders for morning hour debate. pursuant to clause 12-a of rule 1, the chair declares the house in recess until 2:00 p.m. today .

committee will vote on tuesday on the nomination of elena kagan. watch the live coverage on c- span 3 and at c-span.org and lend more about the nation's highest court. the latest book -- "the supreme court" -- providing unique in said. -- providing unique insight. >> now a town hall meeting on

the bp oil spill fund. ken feinberg spoke to residents in houma, louisiana about the claims process, and answers their questions. it is just over one hour. it is from last tuesday. >> good morning. my name is michel claudet, and i am very pleased to introduce this gentleman who has had a long history of working with people to resolve certain problems. he worked with agent orange people, with the 9/11 people,

has been a mediator, and is a very impressive individual. i have heard him speak now twice. the first time was when the senior senator from louisiana, senator landrieu brought him down, and we had the good fortune to meet at that time. after that, we begged him to please come to houma where we have so many people would be claims information and how-to knowledge for the future. it is my pleasure to introduce the man known as a $20 billion man-to-man selected to handle that fund, mr. kenneth feinberg. [applause] [applause] >> thank you very, very much. that is a nice introduction, and i appreciate it. i want to thank everybody for being here. i particularly want to thank the

governor who i have been working with to try to get this program up and running. the governor helped to arrange this entire day. i'm traveling throughout louisiana today, mississippi tomorrow, alabama next week, florida on the 29th. i will be coming back here as often as is necessary to answer questions, and to help you understand what this program is all about. in the next few minutes before i take questions, let me try to give all of you a thorough understanding of what is going on. first, the program that i am administering is a private program. i am not working for the government of the united states,

or the peoplgovernment of louis. i'm working for the people of louisiana. an agreement was entered into between the obama administration and bp to set aside $20 billion to pay any and all claims arising out of the spill. if the $20 billion is not enough, bp has agreed that it will honor any and all of its financial obligations above $20 billion so the money is there. working for bp or the administration. they chose me to run an independent facility, company, claims programs. if it works, i get the credit.

if it does not work, only i get the blame. nobody else. this is not about politics. this is about helping people in the gulf. that is what this is about. not for bp.for you, next, i believe that bp deserves some credit for the program is has already set up. darrel is right here, behind bp on this. they have paid out a certain amount already on bp claims -- that has not even come out of the $20 billion. it is separate. so, what bp has already beg doni

commend them. but in about six weeks, bp is done. they are out of the claims business, and i will be responsible. i will be responsible for processing of claims from individuals and businesses. i do not have jurisdiction over two types of claims, i want you to understand. right now have no authority to process government claims, either of the counties, or parishes, or other -- those government claims go to be be. i also do not yet have jurisdiction over moratorium claims. now bp set aside $100 million,

now part of the $20 billion -- an additional $100 million set aside just asiderig workers, out of work because of the moratorium. that $100 million is for rig workers only, not rig-lated businesses. just for the workers. unlike the $20 billion, it will not be added to. that is it for those rig-worker moratorium claims. right now the $100 million is not part of the $20 billion, or part of my program. it is over here somewhere. bp is currently trying to

decide how to distribute that $100 million. so, keep in mind that i am not here today to talk about government claims. i am not here today to distribute $100 million in the moratorium clams. i am here with a $20 billion fund for individuals and businesses, private. that is what i'm doing. now, keep in mind that this program, this $20 billion, is not just limited to my -- the government claims come out of the $20 billion, even though it is not part of my watch. the government claims do. the moratorium claims are separate.

cleanup costs come out of the $20 billion. so, i do not control this $20 billion. i control whenever i need to process individual and business claims out of that fund. if it is not enough, bp has stated it will pay additional claims as needed. now, i want to urge everybody to file a claim in this program. i believe, and i have told all of the louisiana government officials that were listening that is a mistake for people not to file a claim. here is why. if you file a claim with me, and

the claim is eligible, and is corroborated, you will be paid forewith 24, 48 hours, immediately. immediately you will be paid emergency payments totaling why you need for six months. now bp to its credit has been paying emergency payments one month at a time. you come in four months, get a check, come back next month, get a check, come back a third month, get a check. forget it. when the gulf coast claims facility is up and running in the next few weeks, come in, file a claim, six months

advanced emergency payments. you may not want six months. you may like coming back every month. that is all right. but if you want six months of front, no obligation. you do not waive any rights. if you need an emergency payment, and you are eligible, and you corroborate the claim, you will get a check for six months without any requirement that you sign away any legal rights she may have. but if you do not file a claim, i cannot pay you. i have to look of the claim, make sure it is backed up with facts, six months'emergency

payment. stops, andl stockps -- you want more money, you can come in, and i will examine your claim for all of your loss both now and in the future. mr. ken feinberg, i think will not be able to finish for 18 months. it will take 18 months for me to be up and running again. i will examine that. i will look at the claim. i will turn to you and say, i agree with you, or i do not agree with you. if i do agree with you, here is a check for 18 months -- lost pay, lost in cocome. but think long and hard, because then, in order to get that big

check, llump sum, full payment, you have to release bp. you must sign a piece of paper that says you will not sue bp. in return, if you like the amount of that check here -- now keep in mind, this program is entirely, 100% voluntary. nobody has to come into the program. if you think this is a trick, if you think this is a trap, it is not. but if you think that, do not do it. you can go file a lawsuit. but my friends, i'm telling you, that lawsuit you will litigate for years. you may not win, you have to pay

a lawyer. i suggest to you that the program i am setting up here in louisiana is absolutely, i am convinced, the way to go. whatkif let's walk through happens if you file a claim. mr. ken feinberg, i am here, and i want emergency payments. i cannot work. ok. filiform. by the way, and a couple more weeks if you want, fell at the form on line. you do not even have to go to an office. you can fill out the forms electronically -- i don't care. we have 35 claims offices that darrel and bp said up all of the gulf. you can go there to one of those offices, called a 1-800 number,

make an appointment, or you can do it all in your own living room on the internet. in out of work, the fishing boat dry-docked. all right, philip the form. corroboree your claim. here is a check for six months. you do not have to sign anything. take the money. it is later on, you don't to participate anymore, you still keep the six months. it is a gift. wait a minute, mr. ken feinberg, it's as i have to corroborate the claiming of i have been all-cash business. nothing illegal about an all- cash business. that is fine with me. how are you able to show me that you are losing $6,000 per month, or whatever amount? you have to show me something.

you cannot just walk in and tell me to give you the money. you have to show me your tax return. well, i don't know -- i lost. all right, you lost your tax return. show me a profit/loss statement, a checkbook , a astub, thing. well, i don't know. tell the captain. or tell your priest. or your sheriff. or your mayor. come on then, vouch for you. that is good enough. i have to have something to avoid fraud. i have to have something that verifies your claim. but i'm not looking to get fancy here. i want to get the toout to people when needed -- i want to get the money out to people. let's get creative as to what you offer in the way of corroboration. i will bend over backwards to

corroborate these emergency payments, but i have to have some corroboration. so i will know how much to give you per month for six months. no obligation. well, mr. ken feinberg, losing $7,000 per month, but bp put me to work on a vessel skimming, and the mix of $6,000, so i'm only about 1000 else. all right, so i will give you $1,000. you have mitigated, reduced what you are out of work because you have gotten another job. emergency payments -- when the oil stops and we all have a better handle on where it is going and how it is spreading, then you come in and say, ok,

now i want to lump sum payment. i am a shrimper. and i think that shrimping -- i'm not a lot for three years. luck for three years. well, that is what you say. i'm looking at this, asking the experts down in the parish -- you are not out for three years, but for two years. i will give you 100,000 lawyers if you will release bp. you can sue someone else, but in return for $143, here's the check. use on a way that you will not sue bp. you decide yes, give me the check. you're gone. release, you name. or, you're not to me fairly.

i think it is not enough. i don't know about the future. i don't want the money. do not take it. do not take it. go, file a lawsuit. wait, come back one year later. this program will be up and running for i think three years. no rush, if you want to wait and see. that is up to you. that is how the program is going to work. that is not how the moratorium will work. the $100 million is different. that is altogether different. it is not part of my program. but you asked questions about it. i want you to know it will happen. with the $100 million moratorium rig workers, not businesses -- this is wage loss only because

of a moratorium on the irgs. will happen is some on wall add them all up and buy them into though $100 million. that is what you get, and that is all you will get. there will be no more money in the moratorium. bp will not add to that $100 million. that is a one-shot contribution. keep in mind, i cannot help anybody here if you do not file a claim. i am worried that there will be too many people who for whatever their reason, motivation, will

not file a claim. if you do not file a claim with the gulf coast claims facility, i cannot help you. if you've already filed a claim with bp, that is good enough. you do not have to re-file. when i take over from darrel, who think and this is not going anywhere, when i took over from bp, you don't have to start all over. not i takeover, we're reinventing the wheel here. it is already in place. we already have a bp program. i want the program made better. i think that the bp program is not swift enough, especially with small businesses that are waiting. it is not fast enough. we have to accelerate the process, make it more efficient. we have to get the money out quicker. i realize that.

but i am coming here to louisiana with my boston accent. ,'m coming here to louisiana urging the citizens of louisiana to take advantage of this program. do i need a lawyer, mr. ken feinberg? you do not need a lawyer to file. we will help you fill out the claims. i'm not adversarial to the people here. i tried to get the money out. you don't need a lawyer. well, i want a lawyer. that is finding a bring your lawyer, you're counting, you please, your wife -- -- your accountant, your priest, your wife -- bring whoever you want. but you do not need a lawyer to fill out these forms. in the next few weeks, i suspect, just as with my 9/11 compensation fund, we will have lawyers, if you want one, to

help you for free. if you think that you need one. so, that is how the program will work. it is not just wages. if you have a business, and you are losing revenue -- mr. ken feinberg, we cannot shrimp, we cannot oyster-harvest, we cannot fish, we cannot use sightsee boats. we used to take people out. file a claim. lost profits from the business are compensible. well, i don't know if my business is eligible because there is no oil on theeach. there does not have to be oil on the beach -- you cannot fish. you cannot shrimp. you cannot process shrimp.

you are food processor. you are a wholesaler. file a claim. you will be eligible. the amazing thing to me are the number of people who so far have not filed a claim even for emergency payments. well, you're not giving up any rights whatsoever. so, the main reason i'm here today, at the request of gov. jindal and the local parish, is to promote this program, and to urge everybody to take advantage of the program. if you are not eligible, so you

are not eligible -- you still have all your other rights. my goal is to make sure that you could get in court after years of litigation with lawyers i will do better and i will do quicker. so, that is the overview of the program, and i welcome the opportunity to respond to questions from this audience. yes, sir.

>> kenneth, i'm glad you're working for me. i have 20 vessels -- [inaudible] [unintelligible] i tried almost everything. [inaudible] [echo] i'm also an oyster fishermen.

>> you asked two questions. let's make sure that i understand your questions. the first question is you're not getting any response from bp to your questions? >> yes, sir. >> there is a guy right here rightdarrel, and you are about to get a response after we break. or he will take down your name, and get right back to you with responses. >> [unintelligible] [echo] . .

>> file a claim. i am not going to require that

the oysters actually be harmed by the oil. that is not required. if you can demonstrate that the market forester's has dried up because of the oil even though the oil has never reached your oysters, we will ted care of you. -- take care of you. >> i live [unintelligible] and we had all that came into the bayou. so, we had all on our releases. >> i do not understand the question. >> it all came out on the leases. >> you mean the oil has harmed the beds? >> well, we could not go out and fish. >> file a claim. the fish do not have to be swimming in the oil. you could not get to the fish. we will take care of this, as long as you file a claim.

>> so far we will talk about our income and it affecting the revenue. should we be hit with a hurricane and our community be flooded and our homes and properties be covered with oil, what happens then? because i know insurance is not going to cover all damage to our properties. >> i will look at that problem, but it's a hurricane comes along and damages your home this summer with oil caused by the spill because of that natural disaster you have got a claim. >> i was employed [inaudible]

am i entitled to file a claim for lost wages? >> you have been laid off as a direct result of the oil spill and if it was not for the oil spill, you would still be working? i will take a look at that. these questions come up. i think you are eligible. i think you are. you have been laid off directly as a result of the spill. you have the right to a claim. >> sir, is your criteria going to be any different in your program as opposed to the bp program? >> our program will pick up where the t.a.r.p. program left off. i'm hoping, and i believe, that

-- where the bp program left off. i'm hoping, and i believe, that we will find more eligibility programs. we will process the claims faster. right now, thanks tedero, and bp -- thanks to beryl, and bp, bp has done a good job of processing claims of loss. they have not been as effective as they should be in processing business claims, lost business profits. if we have got to do better on that. i think it is okay to say, you do not have to refile. we will pick up where bp left off, accelerating not only the business claims, but business interruption and lost profit claims as well. >> my husband owns part of a crowd? , but he is also a fishermen.

-- part of a crowd? -- crab dock, but he is also a fisher man. now they have stopped concert -- compensating as for his fishing losses since he owns part of a business. how do we handle that? >> file 1 claim. the claim will say, lost wages for business, b, fishing or shrimp. in one claim he will file both claims and we will process them together. >> i own the biggest soft shell crab company in that state. i just doubled to an halftimes my side. -- my size. i want to know if bp and the government is going to come eat them grabs.

-- crabs. >> i'm not sure i understood the question. you own a soft shell crab business. >> it is the biggest one in the state. [inaudible] bp has only got 10% or 15% of that oil flow at the bottom of the gulf and at the day. are you going to be any of them grabcrabs? you gotta eat the whole crowcra. >> i do not know if i'm going to read the whole thing or not. [laughter] but when you file your claim, you need to file in your claim that you need to be compensated for the entire crab.

in other words, your loss is because you cannot ship that crab around the country. >> i'm not selling that to the public. how are they going to get that off the bottom of the gulf of mexico? >> i can only help you with the claim. i cannot help you with the technical of getting it off of the bottom of the gulf. let me ask you a question. you are an expert. how long do you think it will be before you will be able to harvest those crabs again in the bottom of the gulf? >> over 30 years. >> then you have a total loss. >> i used to work in the oil business for many years. i am a jack of all trades. i used to do these deep water wells. they call me to go testify on

these wells as they go into the -- test the pipa on these wells as they go into the hole. i called vp. i could not get an appointment. i talked to bp on the phone and is that engineering was the problem. no one ever called me. [unintelligible] [applause] >> i am not here to stop the leak. i am here to urge you to try to get compensated for your loss. that is what i'm here for. >> i am trying to save my company. it is destroyed now. >> i have a couple of questions. despite bp's assertions in their press releases that losses are being paid on average nine days from claim made to claim paid, all of my loss claims on behalf

of my clients, none of them have been paid. i am running on average, 53 days since submitted. will claims that have been sitting there for 53 days give any priority once you take over? >> yes, we will immediately prioritize claims that are already in the inventory. >> secondly, will there be put forth a standard set of data required? we have been sending in p.f.e. format and -- in .pdf format and then they come back and what bnl's and then they want the year before pianos and then they want -- the year before's p & l's and then they want checking ccount information. it is a shambles. >> i agree with you that we need to setup a standardized

centralized system. when we set up this centralized system on line with these claims offices, we will have systematically, consistently what we want. you will know what we want and that is all that we want. it will not change from claims office to claims office. >> the next question, is the third-party administrator going to remain the same? are those same people going to be in place or are you bringing in new people? >> they have done a decent job, but they need more direction. and they are a the we see in a company and i like that. esis is out. if we're going to set up a new infrastructure. -- we are going to set up a new infrastructure that is systematically, consistently going to make it easier to file, find out where your claim is, and process that claim. >> almost lastly, are you going to make the competition process

public? -- computation process public? i will ask, how did you come up with that ount. i sent you $100,000 worth of shrimp tickets. they will not tell us. >> transparency. the methodology i am going to use to calculate the claims will be public. you can challenge it if you think is wrong. it will be made available to anyone who wants it. that is first. secondly, if governor jindal has complained to me about anything, it is the absence of reliable data as to where the claims are. homeland security in washington, very, very concerned about the lack of really transparent, good data. the we're going to get that data. we will make it available. not personal information. that is private. but we will get the type of data

that everybody needs to see how the program is working. >> and mr. feinberg, i have been pulling my hair out the last 50 to 60 days dealing with this as an attorney with a few skill sets. it is a complicated process. i would appreciate it if you would take it a little easy on us, unless you really do intend to bring in an entire legion of free orders -- free lawyers. and i hope those folks have my clients best interest at heart the way i do. >> let me say, if they do not, they would -- they will not be there long, quite frankly. [applause] >> there are thousands of us who

are independent contractors. therefore, we cannot file unemployment. i am sure that no one is going to want those numbers. i am not sure those businesses under the moratorium can go to get anything from bp. next week, there are 20,000 attendees are already registered. this ought to tell you the scope of the people affected that have no where to go. i do not know where we fall as businesses because we cannot -- right now, we are at 85% loss in business and most of the vendors that we service are at 85% and 90%. some are moving out of the area and trying to send their people to texas, two divisions there. it has greatly affected us and i want to know where we can go. >> man, you are exactly in no man's land. let me tell you, i want you to

know. i want you to understand the dilemma here. if you are -- if your business has been adversely impacted by the moratorium, not the spill, the moratorium, i think it fair to say you are not eligible for any of the $100 million moratorium. you are not eligible under the program i am administering. you are not. right now, your only hope is a lawsuit. and i've not advising that, because i'm not sure you can win it. all i can say to you is, of all the questions i have heard here today, the one that is the most distressing is yours because i can only do what i can do. i can help fishermen and trappers and the oyster harvesters, and boats -- fishermen and shrimpers and

oyster harvesters and boats. those people i can help. i can direct workers who are harmed by the moratorium to go to the $100 million fund. business is impacted by the moratorium, i do not have -- business is impacted by the moratorium, i do not have a satisfactory answer right now. i'm sorry, i do not. >> my husband is a charter captain, but an inland cacharter captain. he works in montana in the summer and usually comes back in october and works the winter here. he has got a claim he is working on. i have been told not to turn a the no, and i've been told to turn it in now and get him in the system. my first question is, when do i turn it in? >> turn in now.

>> ok, my second question is, " -- do i save for this year and hopefully next year we do not need it, because customers will be able to come back and fish? or do i go for two years? >> come in and get six months of pay without waiting any rights. later on, when the oil is stopped six months from now -- we hope -- then you will sit down and you will come in and you will seek what you believe you need to make yourself whole year, the hereafter, the hereafter, depending on how long you think the spill is going to adversely impact your husband's business. >> file the claim. >> that is right. >> i may shrimper -- i am a shrimper from right here in

louisiana. we work product, sold product, and sold off inventory. consequently, in the month of may, in the month of june, we may need your profit. bp is basing their claims -- their claims of profit and loss. we talked to them and said, let's take a look at production figures, which are way off from last year. and inventory figures, which right now, i am about 15% had inventory of what i had last year at this time. an hour before we came to this meeting, we got denied a claim. is your system going to take care of me, that has no inventory now no possibility of finding too much more? >> i am surprised that you set an hour ago you were actually denied a claim. you actually got word from bp, a

claim denied? >> excuse me, let me rephrase that. it is not a denied claim. they said we were not eligible from -- for any funds in the month of may and june, but maybe by august or so timber when we start showing losses, then maybe we will be -- by august or september when we start showing losses, then maybe we will have a chance. >> you are already suffering losses. you have nothing to sell. because there is nothing in your warehouse. >> if you do not understand it, you are a lot smarter man than need. i do not understand it. >> i think you have a valid claim and we ought to talk before i leave here today and we better make sure that i have the right information for how to contact you. >> my name is charles hart. we are in a joint venture with bp and age to go -- h to lo2o

prevention system. we are looking at how to bring up 1,000 gallons per minute at 800 feet deep. we're looking at how to put out enough votes to have that volume seven days a week, 24 hours a day. i would also like to talk to you afterwards. >> [inaudible] >> thank you, sir. >> my whole life i was a fisherman. this storm is going to lock me of. this storm is going to put me

out of business for a while. [unintelligible] >> are you asking whether you have to refile for a claim, what? you better give him the microphone. [inaudible] and now you are asking whether or not you have to file. >> the claim was denied. >> it was denied or they have not decided? >> [unintelligible] >> again, if you have filed a claim with bp and the claim has not been decided, you do not know what happened, it is sitting there, it has not been resolved, we will resolve those claims in the next few weeks. i cannot do it now. we are setting up a new system. but you do not have to refile it. we will resolve that claim in the next few weeks.

>> thank you. >> my question is about cash. you know, people that have been working for cash. how will you handle that? a lot of people would probably be afraid to put a claim with bp because, of course, they have been working for cash and the irs and taxes and all of the other stuff in between. >> listen to me carefully about cash. you would be amazed how many times i get questions about cash. there is nothing illegal in getting paid in cash. it is not illegal. there are plenty of people that get paid in cash and that is perfectly ok. nobody says that is illegal. now, when you file your claim whitnewith me and you say you at

of pocket, you have lost wages that you have only received in cash, i need you to help me prove the amount. i've got to know the amount. there are various ways you can show me the amount. you can show me a tax return. you can show a profit and loss statement from your company. you can show me checks or check stubs. you can even come to me and say, mr. feinberg, here is my captain who i work for. he will vouch for me that it is $5,000 per month or whatever. i do not care. but i have got to corroborate it somehow. now, listen carefully. let's say you are able to corroborate the cash, i will give you six months worth of cash.

but you are going to get a 1099 from me. you are going to get the irs -- i have got to send you a form from the internal revenue service. i cannot violate the law. i have got to send that 1099. then it is up to you. but i am not looking. ladies and gentlemen, i do not need a tax return to corroborate your cash. what i need is something. i will be as generous as i can, but i cannot violate the law. i cannot accept the claim from an undocumented worker. he does not have to be a citizen. he's got to be a have a green card. i cannot violate the immigration law or the irs. i will work with you guys. i will work with you to try to

make this program work. but understand, there are legal limitations. one other thing, very important, very important -- mr. feinberg, if i come to you with a cash corroborated, i can corroborate it, are you going to send my file to the government? absolutely not. this is a confidential submission. you are not going to send it to any government. state, local, irs, immigration -- i want to know, mr. feinberg, when you get this information, is it confidential and is it sealed away? the answer is, yes. we will provide some important data to governor jindal and others to ensure that they understand the overall program, how it is working.

general statistics, we will not disclose to anybody your private file. >> i would like to know how long it will be before the workers get paid. >> how long before the moratorium rig workers get paid? well, not on my watch, at least, not yet. i will try to get an answer to that question. i do not know the status of where that $100 million is. as soon as i can find out, i mean, you are not the only person asking that question. public officials right here in the parish are asking that question. it is at the top of the agenda. i will try to get an answer for you as soon as i can, but again, that is not part of my program yet. i am hoping it will be and i will let you know as soon as i can.

>> [unintelligible] that you are going to get the money [unintelligible] the guys that work for bp say they're waiting on your final word to issue out the money. >> the question is, this gentleman says when he tried to file a claim, bp said, no, you have got to wait until ken feinberg takes over. no, that is not what you said? >> they are saying that they cannot issue out any money until you give the final word. >> just as bad. you are able to file the claim with bp, but they say they will not pay the claim because they're waiting for mr. feinberg. let me tell you, daryl willis is here from bp.

they had paid out about $150 million in claims before i ever showed up. i think you ought to talk to him about getting that claim process. it is a tough case, it is a problem area, i will take a look at it. i will be running -- up and running in the next two to three weeks, not months. i will try to get to that claim as soon as i can. >> i am the principal chief of the united nomination, state of louisiana and largest recognize indigenous mid-american try. those along the louisiana coast have been hit hardest. nearly 6000 families have been affected as a result of the infiltration of the surface oil.

we would like to be with you personally to explore the unique situation. commercial fishing is the single largest industry of our tribe. we have been fishing here since before it was a french colony and since before this country existed. our very existence is being threatened. i would like to have a private meeting. we are a sovereign nation with our own constitution. >> if i understand this correctly, your concern on behalf of indian tribes is not simply loss of fishing rights or whatever. it is the natural habitat, the whole area ohas been adversely

impacted by the spill. and natural resources are threatened. absolutely, you have a claim. you absolutely have a claim. and the individual members who are each adversely impacted by the wiloil running seen a glandd fishing rights and swampland -- the physical injury to the land is absolutely compensable and you should file a claim. >> and also our burial grounds and indian mounds have been adversely affected also. to the lady earlier about being a lawyer and going through the process, we filed for federal recognition 30 years ago, which was only supposed to be an 18- month process and here it is 30

years later. >> i cannot compensate for physical injury before the spill years ago, but to the extent that the spill has adversely impacted your land and the fishing rights and the marshes and whatever else, that is absolutely compensable. i do not know if you have filed a claim yet, but you should and we will help you file that claim because it is compensable. >> that is what the meeting is for, to sit down and talk with you. and i have this folder, if you would accept. >> yes.

>> mr. feinberg, you mentioned that you will be in operation in three to four weeks. will you have it -- an office? view and is a vague the same offices that bp presently has? 0 yes, we will maintain the 5 offices that bp has set up around the gulf. we may add some. i got a call from the attorney general of texas saying that galveston needs an office. we may supplement with additional offices and additional staff. but we want to make it as convenient as possible, including electronic on-line filing. you do not even have to go to an office. we will do what we can to make sure it is accessible. >> second question, you managed the 9/11 disaster from start to finish, is that correct?

first, what time frame did it cannotake to complete that management? and our view -- how do you expect to fulfill this disaster as compared to 9/11? >> 9/11, we resolved the 7300 claims for death and physical injury in 33 months, less than three years. this program that i am setting up will be, in effect -- will be in effect for about three years. now, you imply an interesting question. mr. feinberg, my you are around for three years, but we are not sure how long the effects of this bill -- spill, we might not

be able to fish for seven years, eight years, 30 years -- the crab guy. how will we solve this problem? we will sit down with you, or the crabber, and say, how long you think it will take to restore your business? he says never come all right. we will have experts from around the area. we think it will probably be around three years. here is a check for three years. you do not need to take -- need to take a check for three years because if you take the check for three years, you are releasing bp. but we think three years, and if

you do not want it, you do not have to take it. >> i assume you communicate with the residents on a fairly regular basis, and since you are touring the -- with the president on a fairly regular basis, and since you are touring the gulf, and he is also, i would ask you if you would from time to time -- and that the president would show some sympathy for the people here and realize that some of the actions that his administration has taken is tending to possibly exacerbate the economic disaster. i wish you would voice those opinions to him whenever you have a chance. >> let me say a couple of things about that. i do not speak to the president

at all. and that is because i am not working for the administration for bp. i am an independent -- i am setting up an independent process. it is not political. i am working for you. fortunately, your message, there are people in this audience who do work for the administration, so, i'm sure your words will get back to him. [inaudible] >> last year i made $8,000 or so fishing. this year i lost $50,000 because

i bought a different boat. i'm wondering, how my going to german my losses on my claim? >> [inaudible] >> [inaudible] and i had a lot of problems with the boat, so i only made at 8000 or so dollars -- $8,000 or so. >> last year you had a small boat and made $8,000 and this year you had a bigger boat and would have made $50,000. show us you would have made $50,000. explain it come on corroborate it, and we will pay it. if you cannot corroborated, it is $8,000, or something in between. >> how can i do that? >> you have got to sit down and explain to my people, here is my plan. here is how i would have made

$50,000. if it is real. if it is not speculative, then we will pay it. if it is speculative, then maybe we will pay it. maybe, maybe not. ;r>> when i filed with bp and gt the $5,000 per month, is that still the same claim? >> if you filed with bp, would you do not have to file again. we will inherit that claim and process it as soon as we can. two more questions. >> once you take over in a couple of weeks and someone files a claim, how long before you get a check in your hand? >> if it is an emergency payment, we go to process the claim within 24 hours and pay

within two or three days thereafter. >> also, does the business have 4oc>to be directly affected? for instance, if it is a restaurant, and sales have dig -- have decrease in the last two months or three months, can they file a claim for that? >> it will depend on how it is eligible. how close is it to the coast? how dependent on fishing is it? i cannot pay restaurant in boston who says they cannot get shrek. but i am certainly willing to pay restaurant -- who says they cannot get shrimp. but i'm certainly willing to pay restaurant on the coast. >> if somebody goes to work for bp, will that affect our emergency payments? >> it will not, except in one way.

it will deduct, obviously, the amount that you are getting from bp as a substitute for your being out of work. if you're going to get $5,000 unemployed per month, now you are getting $3,000 a month from bp. that is a $2,000 wayne that you will get. you will not be ineligible. >> if you were able to troll for the season, will that affect your final payment? >> will seasonable variations have an impact on your opinion? sure, we would want to know what those are and how they factor into the final calculation. >> one more question. we have one claim that we filed for the shrimp. but the family has 10 oyster beds.

do we need to file separately before that? >> if it is a business, then file one claim. if it is 10 different siblings and day have their own individual share, then file it separately. >> we can file the oyster on the shrimp plame also if it is a business? issure. let me just -- >> sure. let me just say this before i turn it over to our leader here, i will come back as often as necessary. my frustration is if people do not file a claim. i want to try to help. i have got this money to distribute, but i can only help if the claim is filed. i am acting independently. i am enormously grateful to

governor jindal, who helped set up this entire day of meetings. i will do everything i can to help you folks and i wish you well. i cannot imagine what you are going through. i hope to be able to help you in some way. thank you very much. [applause] >> i think everybody agrees to thank mr. feinberg for being here. we obviously want him down in the future. mr. feinberg will be meeting right here with the media come out so if you want to start accumulating right here -- with the media, so if you want to start accumulating right here that will be fine. i want to start introducing some of our elected officials. we have representatives and our councilman, a number of people from all boards and agencies.

anybody else? >> one question i wanted to ask mr. feinberg, but i want the public to ask the questions first is that we have a number of people because their claims have been so delayed, that we need a moratorium with the banks and loan institutions from -- to stop them from possibly foreclosing on businesses, homes, and all of the people's assets. we need a lot of that -- a lot of help in that area to protect people that are going to the situation right now. -- going through that situation right now.

[captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> last week, the u.s. second circuit court of appeals struck down the fcc's indecency policy. we will talk with carter phillips and patrick trueman, who filed the brief on behalf of the american research uncil. and now, remarks from karen mills, the head of the small business administration. she spoke -- spoke last week.

we will show you as much as we can of this before the house at 2:00 p.m. eastern. >> i particularly want to thank chairman bernanke and the whole staff of the fed for the partnership that we have built that you just heard described. several months ago the fed approach to the sba about holding 40 roundtable. i guess john has been busy traveling. all around the country with small businesses and lenders. we were very happy to be part of this. if we were able to attend. we were able to help organize. we were able to hold conference calls with bankers and bank examiners in the field to explain what all of you know, which is how the sba products work, and how they can help in

this particular situation and help provide the loan guarantees that we provide, which do not go against some of the ballot sheets. that was a very important piece of information and understanding in the last year for banks around the country. it is a great partnership and we very much hope this partnership will continue to grow. the reason this partnership is so important is because small businesses create 60% of the net jobs in this country. half of the people who work in this country own or work for a small business. if we are going to be competitive, if this economy is going to grow, it is going to be because we provide small

businesses the tools they need to go out and compete in the global economy and create jobs. what is the big challenge right now? one big challenge, may be the biggest, but certainly among the biggest is that there is still an issue of access to capital for small businesses. we made a lot of strides. things are better than they were in october, 2008, but there is still a gap. according to unfib 2003-2006, up 61% of all businesses have their needs met. now the number is 40%. big businesses are less affected. they can tap into other sources of capital. small businesses, it is really about their bank and their bank credit. that is allowing them to start, sustain and grow their businesses.

in october, 2008 when the credit crunch hit, that is why they were stopped in their tracks. today's goal, and i will quote chairman bernanke. he put it quite well last month at a round table in detroit. he said, meeting the needs of the creditworthy borrowers is "good for the bar work, good for the lender, and good for the economy -- "good for these counter -- for the borrower, good for the lender, and good for the economy." if i could not agree with him more. for the first time lenders have stopped tightening their standards. and a number of banks the ceos, some of them are here represented.

you have heard others talking about the commitment they are making an jpmorgan chase. they are reinvigorating small business lending. very, very aggressive in some cases in regional banks and in some of our main banks. but once again, we still have a gap. when i travel around, which i do a lot -- as many of you do -- 27 million small businesses are still saying that they cannot get access to credit. this is not businesses who are going to fail. two years ago, i kept hearing i need a loan or i'm going to go out of business. now you are hearing i need a loan so that i can have the sustaining capital so that i can

move forward. that is despite the current economy. many, many firms -- and that is how our economy goegrows is the small business. many sectors are growing and taking customers and hiring more workers. they need our support. if these credits were the small businesses cannot get loans -- creditworthy small businesses cannot get loans, then we need to fix that. what is the sba doing to fix that? -- to help? i was in seattle a couple of weeks ago and i went into a pet food store. how many of you have a cat or a dog? well, i don't. my husband is allergic. [laughter] but let me tell you, you would love this story. they specialize in natural foods for cats and dogs. and they will even give you samples to try until you find

we work with tens of thousands of banks every year and as you know, we guarantee portion of the loan and we share a risk with the lender so that the lender can reach out and make a loan that they would not otherwise make. if you are a bank and you will not give someone a loan and the market says the person should get that tax credit, then there is no reason to subsidize. but if it is a great small business still and there is no reason not to give a little

extra support, then that is where we come in. their most recent sba loan, the pet store, was made possible with the recovery act alone. it allowed us to raise our guarantees to 90% and reduce or eliminate our fees. that was hugely important to so many small businesses. they got $200,000 in working capital from columbia bank and hired about 10 more workers. thousands of stories in the last 16 months. there are 70,000 of these loans like that out there. we have turned to at 30 billion -- turned out $30 billion in recovering act -- recovery act

loans. for us to put $3 billion in the hands of small business, it costs about $680 million in subsidy. $680 million for $30 billion. that is the good news. here is the bad news. if we ran out of money. in fact, we ran out of money a few times. we ran out of money in november and congress gave us more. this time we have not gotten the funding and to be honest with you caught our loan volume is down over 50%. we have over 500 businesses in the queue. it looks like everybody is on a standby list at the airport and they call your name up. we have a portal that you can look at in the queue and people are in the queue waiting for that recovery act funding to be extended.

it has gone before the house a couple of times and is still before the senate. we're hopeful because now is not the time to pull back. we have a program that we know works. we know that it drives volume. we needed to be driven right into the hands of those businesses that are creditworthy. we have in addition to the recovery act something i'm very happy with. we have gotten over 1300 lenders back into the sba program who had not made a loan since 2007. 1300 lenders and also about more than 100 credit unions. all kinds of banks on main street in their communities ready to provide sba loans in this recovery.

but that is only one of the steps. even if we get that back, we have more gaps to fill. that is why we have the president's small business jobs bill right now before congress. in that jobs bill, we have many toys -- tools that small businesses need right now. the me give you an example. one is working capital. how many of you have heard that from a small business, my credit got cold? we have that -- got pulled. we have that before congress. it is not enough. we have a lot of businesses you are owner occupied commercial real estate. that is the dentist who owns the dentist's office. that is the manufacturing company that owns the warehouse.

we want to use our 504 program that many of you participated in, that in order to refinance. right now it can only be used for expansion. temporarily, we think that-those from 2005, 2006 are going to come due. those who have never missed a payment of war to come to the bank and say, i need to reduce my portfolio -- who never missed a payment are going to come to the bank and say, i need to reduce my portfolio. we have some permanent changes that we have asked for. we very much see that our programs cap and $2 million is too low. we have franchisees who want to

buy the franchise. we have a small equipment. we have exporters who have asked to increase those exports. and our micro loan limit, i know there are some micro-loan financing is out there -- finance jurors out there. we want to raise up from $35,000 to $50,000. we need the conventional mortgagmarket to be fully opera. this is for main street community banks who do not have the capital. they are out there, as you know,

looking to lend more money to small businesses. and if they do, if they increase their small-business lending, the small-business lending fund could be available to them at a cost of 30%. we definitely see this as a one- two event. there will be more capital into community banks. we hope that will ease some of what is going on out there. our principle is to build upon what works, like the recovery act, do it quickly and efficiently and give the taxpayers a pretty big bang for their about. -- for their buck. we have talked about credit. i want to talk about data. as we have continued to monitor the situation, we have

recognized -- and i think everybody and our partners in this room have recognized that there is a gap in time lead to more meaningful, and accurate data. i know that everybody is recognizing it because there is a panel on it this afternoon. [laughter] you are going to talk about it. but we have reports that show loans that are only outstanding. we do not have information on origination. lots of things to balance of and down in between then and we only have data once a year right now. we need data every quarter. as you all know, what gets measured gets done. we have to be able to make a sound policy based on good information. that is what we are hoping to do, and to think about together. we need on the demand side better information about loan interest -- alone applications

-- >> we will leave this now to go live to the u.s. house, members returning from recess for legislative business this afternoon. suspension bills today. this week, members may also take up unemployment benefits come out measures for more spending and oil drilling. live coverage now in the u.s. house cure on c-span. -- you're on c-span.

the speaker pro tempore: the thousands will be in order. the prayer will be offered -- the house will be in order. the prayer will be offered by our chaplain, father coughlin. chaplain coughlin: lord our time is cosmic set. the sun rises or seems to rise from the earth. yet in truth it is the earth that moves. each morning gives rise to this mistaken perception. lord god, during the rest of this day let us not be deceived by half truths. which reshape to the desires into felt needs. do not allow our past experiences so cloud the mind

there was no openness for surprises. rather, lord, give us the strength to meet the truth with all its demands to change and accept. once again by your power the truth will set us free. to act as your children both now and forever. amen. the speaker pro tempore: the chair has examined the journal of the last day's proceedings and announces to the house her approval thereof. pursuant to clause 1 of rule 1, the journal stands approved. the pledge of allegiance will be led by the gentleman from iowa, congressman loebsack. mr. loebsack: i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under god, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

the speaker pro tempore: the chair will entertain requests for one-minute speeches. for what purpose does the gentlewoman from north carolina rise? ms. foxx: to address the house for one minute, madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. ms. foxx: thank you, madam speaker. there's an interesting new development on the obamacare front. remember the penalties on families that do not purchase health insurance? the ones that will top $2,000 for many families? remember what president obama said about this individual mandate penalty? he said, it was absolutely not a tax increase. well, i guess times have changed. now the obama administration's justice department is defending this penalty in court as part of the government's, quote, power to lay and collect taxes, unquote. at least the truth about this $4 billion a year tax cut is now out.

too bad washington democrats didn't come clean until months after obamacare became law. madam speaker, the american people deserve better. i yield back. the speaker pro tempore: the gentlewoman yields. the chair recognizes the gentleman from south carolina for one minute. >> unanimous consent to address the house for one minute. revise and extend my remarks. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. wilson: madam speaker, this weekend the administration bizarrely claimed there was overwhelming consensus we are not losing jobs and are instead creating them. if this is the case, i encourage the administration to release the data to back up this overwhelming consensus to constituents who want to know where are the jobs? the website created to monitor the stimulus money is even a failure. at one time recovery.gov was nothing more than a website filled with misinformation, fake job numbers, and fake congressional districts. when unemployment numbers hovered around 10% and when the stimulus dollars are not reported accurately, it's no

wonder that the opinion of most americans the stimulus spending is not working. this summer is highlighted by a recent cbs poll showing that 74% of americans believe the stimulus had no impact or made things worse. it is time for an audit of this failed policy and it is clearly time to stop spending time and taxpayer money promoting a failed program and instead focus on implementing policies that will actually create long-term private sector jobs. in conclusion, god bless our troops, we will never forget september 11 and the global war on terrorism. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired. for what purpose does the gentleman from arkansas rise? >> to address the house for one minute. revise and extend. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. boozman: thank you, madam speaker. i rise today to congratulate the northwest arkansas council for its vision and leadership in addressing regional challenges and providing solutions. making northwest arkansas

enticing for families to live and businesses to thrive. for 20 years the northwest arkansas council has met the growing demands of a quickly developing area. with this support, the northwest arkansas regional airport was designed and wilt, -- built, creating a universal hub for a growing area. projects like interstate 540, the establishment of a water utilities commission, and the creation of the northwest arkansas regional mobility authority helped provide infrastructure upgrades crucial to meeting the needs of the region. i commend the leaders of northwest arkansas council as well as business and community leaders for their actions and insight into helping shape the region. 20 years of service is a great accomplishment and i look forward to its continued efforts and support of northwest arkansas. i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. for what purpose does the

gentleman from texas rise? >> unanimous consent to address the house for one minute. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. smith: madam speaker, the obama administration is suing arizona for wanting to enforce our nation's immigration laws but they won't sue cities that violate our immigration laws by enacting sanctuary policies. sanctuary states and cities prohibit their law enforcement officers from cooperating with the department of homeland security to report illegal immigration. with the administration also ignored individuals who fail to pay their income taxes, for compferings? of course not. the administration's policies endanger american lives. in san francisco, anyone with a past violent crime conviction savagedly murd aerodynamic family. in los angeles an illegal immigrant murdered a man. and three students why shot in

newark, new jersey, execution style. all these took place in sanctuary cities where they might have been prevented. the obama administration needs to enforce immigration laws not ignore them. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired. pursuant to clause 8 of rule 20, the chair will postpone further proceedings today on motions to suspend the rules on which a recorded vote or the yeas and nays are ordered or on which the vote incurs objection under clause 6 of rule 20. record votes on postponed questions will be taken after 6:00 p.m. today. for what purpose does the gentleman from iowa seek recognition? mr. loebsack: i move the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1472. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title of the resolution. the clerk: house resolution 1472, resolution expressing support for the designation of the week of september 13, 2010,

as national adult education and family literacy week. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from iowa, mr. loebsack, and the gentleman from kentucky, mr. guthrie, each will coal 20 minutes. the chair recognize -- control 20 minutes. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: i request five legislative days during which members may revise and extend and insert extraneous material on house resolution 1472 into the record. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. loebsack: i rise today in support of house resolution 1472 which supports the designation of the week of september 13 as adult education family literacy week. this week recognizes the importance of adult education and family literacy programs to the success and well-being of those who strive to improve their and their children's education. adult education and literacy programs provide millions of americans with the skills

needed to lead productive and self-sufficient lives. boost for academic achievements and engage in our 21st century work force. these programs emphasize basic skills such as reading, writing, and math, prepare adult learners to take g.e.d. tests, and assist nonnative speakers in gaining english proficiency. according to the 2003 national assessment of adult literacy, the literacy skills of 90 million adults in the u.s. are currently considered basic or below basic. adult learn--literacy programs address this national need for improved literacy. these programs also help participants obtain the skills they need to re-enter the education pipeline and transition to college. a critical part of creating an internationally competitive work force and meeting the president's goal of a nation with the highest proportion of college graduates by 2020. family literacy programs work

with entire families to offer education opportunities to improve lifekills and improve literacy. these programs help break cycles of poverty and illiteracy that affect some of our nation's most vulnerable families. most importantly family literacy programs provide parents with the knowledge and skills they need to be full participants in their child's education and development. for children, family literacy programs help ensure that children start school ready to learn and on an equal footing with their peers. adult education and family literacy week is an opportunity for educate vors, advocates, and participants in these important programs to elevate adult education. and family literacy nationwide with policymakers, the media, and community. states, localities, schools, libraries, nonprofit organizations, community-based organizations, consumer advocate, interconstitutions of higher education, labor unions, and businesses to all work

together to support increased access to these adult education and family literacy programs. the outreach which occurs during this week is critical to reaching many of those who would benefit from these programs. madam speaker, i want to thank representative polis for introducing this resolution and once again express my support for the designation of the week of september 13 as adult education and family literacy week. i urge my colleagues to support this resolution and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: thank you, madam speaker. i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. guthrie: i rise today in support of house resolution 1472, expressing support for designation of the week of september 13, 2010, as national adult education and family literacy week. illiteracy is a nationwide problem. according to a recrept report nearly one out of two adults is illiterate without the minimum skills required in today's society.

unfortunately, many adults in this country cannot read a newspaper or fill out a job application. the board of education estimates that 7 million u.s. adults have basic and below basic literacy skills. department of education studies have also found adults living in poverty were more likely to have lower than average literacy scores than adults with higher incomes. half of the adults who do not have the high school diploma performed in the below basic levels. elderly over age 65 has the lowest average literacy scores with 64% perform in the basic and below basic levels. and the more than one million incarcerated adults in the nation had lower average literacy scores than adults in households on nearly every comparable scale. literacy skills impact every aspect of adult life. adults who are more literate are more likely to ride to their children and discuss school topics. they receive a higher income,

use the internet, email, and vote. unfortunately, only a fraction of low literate adults seek literacy service from community providers. many people with low literacy do not perceive their skills as a problem until the crisis such as the loss of a job or child's need for school help them -- may help them make them aware of their needs. national adult education and family literacy week highlights the importance of efforts to ensure each and every citizen has the necessary literacy skills to succeed at home and work and society and encouragings people across the united states to support programs to assist those in need of adult education and family literacy programs. i support this resolution and ask my colleagues to do the same. i reserve the balance of my time. . the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. lobiondo: does -- lb mr.

lobe -- mr. loebsack: does the gentleman have more speakers? mr. guthrie: i don't. i yield back the balance of my time. mr. loebsack: i urge support of this legislation and i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the question is will the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1472. those in favor say aye. those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, 2/3 having responded in the affirmative, the rules are -- mr. loebsack: madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa. mr. sobe sack: i -- mr. loebsack: i ask for the yeas and nays. the speaker pro tempore: the yeas and nays are requested. all those in favor of taking this vote by the yeas and nays will rise and remain standing until counted. a sufficient number having arisen, the yeas and nays are ordered. pursuant to clause 8 of rule 20 and the chair's prior announcement, further proceedings on this motion will

be postponed. for what purpose does the gentleman from iowa seek recognition? mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i ask that the house suspend the rules and agree to house concurrent resolution 126, as amended. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title of the concurrent resolution. the clerk: house concurrent resolution 126. concurrent resolution recognizing the 50th anniversary of title 11 international education programs within the department of education -- title 6 international education programs within the department of education. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from iowa, mr. loebsack, and the gentleman from kentucky, mr. guthrie, will each control 20 minutes. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: mr. speaker, i ask unanimous consent that all members may have five legislative days to revise and extend their remarks. and insert extraneous material into the record. the speaker pro tempore: without objection, so ordered. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: without objection, so ordered. mr. loebsack: this recognizes the title 6 international programs within the department of education. under the office of

postsecondary education, the international education program services, i.e., p.e.s., mansion a total of 14 -- manages a total of 14 such programs. this provides grants to individuals, institutions of higher education and nonprofit organizations to build and strengthen international cooperation and enrich our students' cultural experiences. international education has long been an important part of strengthening the capability and performance of american educational programs in foreign languages and in area and international studies. international education programs also help our nation's students, teachers and researchers interact with other cultures and languages, train our specialists and inform general understanding of people's of other countries. on the 50th anniversary of the title 6 programs, we honor the contributions and benefits of international education programs to science, culture, government and business.

international education programs were originally authorized as title 6 of the national defense education act of 1958 in part as a response to the launch of sputnik and with the recognition that a stronger and broader engagement with foreign language and area studies would strengthen american national security. title 6 was later incorporated into the higher education act of 1965 and has continued to evolve to meet the needs of today's students. a well-rounded education is also critically important to a globally competitive work force. title 6 program grants help address business needs for international expertise, strengthen undergraduate education and research at national research centers and improve foreign language training and assessment at language resource centers. in the academic setting, the institutions have used title 6 grants to establish or operate overseas research centers,

support more than 800 graduate fellowships and foreign languages in area studies and improve business curriculum, especially as it concerns u.s. trade and global competitiveness. madam speaker, i want to thank representative watson for introducing this resolution and once again express support for house concurrent resolution 126, which recognizes the 50th anniversary of title 6 international education programs within the department of education. i urge my colleagues to support this resolution, and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves the balance of his time. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. guthrie: i want to support house concurrent resolution 126, which recognizes the 50th anniversary of the title 6 international education programs within the department of education. this was in response to the launch of sputnik and the u.s.

government's recognition that a stronger and broader capacity in foreign language and area studies was needed to create a body of experts competent in foreign language. especially our intelligence agencies in the foreign service. three programs that were included in the original 1958 legislation continued today -- continue today as the national resource centers program, the foreign language and area studies fellowship program and the international research and studies program. these programs support language areas expansion of postsecondary instruction in languages that are less commonly taught as well as foreign language fellowships, research supporting language learning midwestology and language institutes to provide advanced language and training. over time, additional programs have been added to title 6 in order to address the nation's growing interest in international education. title 6 programs also help to address business needs for international expertise,

strengthening undergraduate education, international as well as area studies, advancement of technology use and overall improvement of fleerning, training and assessment. -- foreign language, training and assessment. this ensures federal involvement and ensure a supply of citizens with sbert national expertise. title 6 programs help to support american experts and in citizens' knowledge about world regions, foreign languages and international affairs as well as those with the strong research based in these areas. madam speaker, i urge my colleagues to support this resolution and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves. the gentleman from iowa is recognized. mr. loebsack: does the gentleman from kentucky have further speakers? mr. guthrie: i have no further speakers and if there are none on the other side i yield my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields,. the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: i want to urge my

colleagues to support house concurrent resolution 126, which recognizes the 50th anniversary of the title 6 international education programs within the department of education. i want to thank my colleagues on the other side of the aisle and i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the question is will the house suspend the rules and agree to house concurrent resolution 126 as amended. those in favor say aye. those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, 2/3 having responded in the affirmative, the rules -- mr. loebsack: madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, on that i request the yeas and nays. the speaker pro tempore: the yeas and nays are requested. all those in favor of taking this vote by the yeas and nays will rise and remain standing until counted. a sufficient number having arisen, the yeas and nays are ordered. pursuant to clause 8 of rule 20 and the chair's prior announcement, further proceedings on this motion will be postponed. for what purpose does the gentleman from iowa seek recognition? mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i

move that the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1219. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title of the resolution. the clerk: house resolution 1219, resolution expressing support for designation of september as national child awareness month. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from iowa, mr. loebsack, and the gentleman from kentucky, mr. guthrie, each will control 20 minutes. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i request five legislative days during which members may revise and extend and insert extraneous material on house resolution 1219 into the record. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. loebsack: i rise today in support of house resolution 1219 which supports the designation of the month of september as child awareness month and encourages us to focus on children and youth nationwide as the school year begins. there are over 75 million children in the united states today and they represent the hopes and future of our

country. throughout america, thousands of individuals, organizations and schools are working to enrirch our lives, the -- enrich our lives and the lives of our youth. this bill provides health care, social services, education, the art, sports and other services for our kids. we know how our child's early years are truly critical to their development as adults and how important it is to ensure that our children have access to quality health care, positive educational experiences, opportunities to participate in sports and healthy activities and safe and nurturing home environments. our nation's child and youth serving organizations link children to the arts, encourage them to set new fitness goals, engage in school activities and teach them to care for their communities. during child awareness month, corporations and businesses will join with national and

local nonprofit groups to focus on children and youth returning to school. some will provide free back-to-schools supplies while others will support fall athletic programs. while this nationwide focus is just one-month long, it reminds us of our year-round commitment to build a better future for our children. madam speaker, once again i express my support for child awareness month and i thank representative calvert for bringing this bill forward. i ask my colleagues to join me in supporting this resolution. i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves the balance of his time. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: thank you, madam speaker. i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. guthrie: i rise today in support of house resolution 1219, expressing support for the designation of september as national child awareness month. national child awareness month is an opportunity to recognize the individuals and charitable organizations who work so diligently to improve the lives of children every day. most young americans are raising healthy families and

they grow up to be responsible and productive citizens. however, there are children who do not have a healthy environment in which they can thrive and who's daily realities make their dreams seem forever out of reach. charitable children organizations and youth organizations play a significant role in helping to make up for those daily deficits for millions of disadvantage youth. charitable organizations that serve our nation's children provide invaluable services that enrich the lives of children and their families and our nation as a whole. the work me do every day in communities across the country, including after-school tutoring, counseling services for at-risk youth, camps and the like should be praised, particularly in these tough economic times. i am pleased to recognize the organizations that work tirelessly every day in the interest of our children. i ask my colleagues to support this resolution, and i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the gentleman from iowa is recognized. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, again, i express my support for

child awareness month. i ask my colleagues to support this resolution. i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa yields. the question is will the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1219. their. -- those in favor say aye. those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, 2/3 having responded in the affirmative -- mr. loebsack: madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: the rules are suspended. mr. loebsack: madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: on that i request the yeas and nays. the speaker pro tempore: the yeas and nays are requested. all those in favor of taking this vote by the yeas and nays will rise and remain standing until counted. a sufficient number having arisen, the yeas and nays are ordered. pursuant to clause 8 of rule 20 and the chair's prior announcement, further proceedings on this motion will be postponed. for what purpose does the gentleman from iowa seek recognition? mr. loebsack: i ask that the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1491. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title of the resolution. the clerk: house resolution 1491, resolution congratulating the university of south carolina gamecocks on winning

the 2010 ncaa division i college world series. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from iowa, loebsack, and the gentleman from kentucky, mr. guthrie, each will control 20 minutes. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i request five legislative days during which members may revise and extend and insert extraneous material on house resolution 1491 into the record. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. loebsack: i rise today in support of house resolution 1491, which congratulates the university of south carolina's gamecocks for winning the 2010 ncaa division i college world series. their very such such title. on june 29, 2010, the game cogs played a tough game against the ucla bruins in omaha, nebraska. tied at the top of the ninth,

the gamecocks hit their final run. at the bottom of the 11th inning and secured their win. although the team had sustained a first-round loss in the college world series, they went on to win six consecutive games and secure their first national title. for head coach ray tanner it was his 14th season with the university of south carolina and his fourth as the college -- and his fourth at the college world series. during his season, coach tanner recorded his 1,000th win of his career and became the 44th division i coach to reach this milestone. he was named 2010 national coach of the year by collegiate baseball and we congratulate coach tanner on his impressive record. the entire gamecocks' lineup demonstrated excellence this is i'd like to especially recognize whit merrifield. over 40,000 fans greeted the gamecocks at their victory

parade in south carolina and we join them in their celebration. madam speaker, once again, i express my support for house resolution 1491 and congratulate the university of south carolina gamecocks on their 2010 ncaa division i college world series victory. i urge my colleagues to suppor this resolution. and i reserve the balance of my time. . the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves the balance of his time. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. guthrie: i rise today in support of house resolution 1491, congratulating the university of south carolina gamecocks on winning the 2010 ncaa division i college world series. the university of south carolina located in columbia, south carolina, was founded in south carolina college in 1801. the university offers more than 350 programs of study, from 14 colleges and schools. has an enrollment of over 28,000 students. the gamecocks have 19 athletic programs and won seven national championships, including the 2010 college world series. since 1970, south carolina

gamecocks baseball has been considered an elite program in college baseball, appeared in 26 ncaa tournaments and noncollege world series. the team played their first intercollegiate game in 1895. ted turner has 10 -56 in ncaa tournament play. 2010 south carolina gamecocks baseball team was led to national victory by the head coach. in 14 seeps in south carolina, coach tanner has 634-282 record with four college world series appearances this. year in 2010 coach tanner and the gamecocks won the ncaa championship at the college world series in omaha, backing the first team -- becoming the first team to win and the third team to win the college world series after losing their first game. they won the world series in the final game against ucla on june 30, 2010.

i'm honored to congratulate and recognize the significant achievement of the players, coaches, and students whose dedication and hard work have leded to success of the university of south carolina baseball program as the 2010 ncaa division i college world series national champions. i ask my colleagues to support this resolution and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves. the gentleman from iowa is recognized. mr. loebsack: i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa reserves. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: madam speaker, i would like to yield as much time as he may consume to the gentleman from south carolina, mr. wilson. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from south carolina is recognized. mr. wilson: madam speaker, it's with great gratitude that i rise today in support of house resolution 1491, to formally congratulate the university of south carolina's baseball team for its impressive success at the college world series. today's resolution endorsed by all six members of the south carolina delegation to congratulate the university of south carolina gamecocks on winning the 2010 ncaa division

i college world series this particularly special to me as i am able to honor my alma mater and that of my mother and father and that of many of the second congressional district staff. the journey to this point hasn't been the easiest for the gamecocks and history has not been on our side as this is the first time in the school's history that the baseball team earned this great achievement despite going to the college world series nine times. during the ncaa tournament, the team faced an opening loss to oklahoma and as a result had to do the unthinkable. win four consecutive games that included back-to-back wins against in-state arch riveral clemson university. the last stop on the journey was ucla, a highly respected and talented team in the championship series. the gamecocks had impressive consecutive victories over the bruins to finish the season

with a 54-16 overall record and earned the title of college world series national champions. i'm proud of the way these student athletes represented our university and great state. none of this would have been possible without the u.s.c. coach, ray tanner, whose leadership and determination has led to over 600 victories, 11 consecutive postseason appearances, and now a national title for the gamecocks. tanner's coaching success is complimented by associate head coach chad holbrook and assistant coach mark calvey. the team is led by whit merrifield, the first cousin of second congressional district staff member melissa of burma, south carolina, who width stood a hard collision in south carolina's victory over clemson but stayed in the game and drove in the winning run at the bottom of the 1 isth inning the next night to claim the

national title for the gamecocks. defying all odds and refusing to give in, jackie bradley jr. delivered a clutch hit which scored the tying run in the bottom of the 12th inning against oklahoma in the june 24th elimination game. without bradley's hit, the gamecocks' run at winning the national title would have come to a sudden halt. second district residents, blake cooper, was the most valuable player of the first game of the championship series with an outstanding pitching performance against the ucla bruins. freshman pitcher matt price held the bruins scoreless for the last three innings of the college world series and earned freshman all-american honors from baseball america. i want to offer a big congratulations to austin ashmore of south carolina, parker of north carolina, nolan of augusta, georgia, jackie

bradley jr. of price -- prince george, virginia. jay brown of brunswick, georgia. alex of south carolina. ethan carter of newport news, virginia. bryson of charlotter charleston, south carolina. blake cooper of south carolina. tim dyson of tampa, florida. nick of ocala, florida. kyle of greer, south carolina, bobby of smithtown, new york. greg of hilton head island, south carolina. kolbe holmes of conway, south carolina. anthony of cross river new york, jeffrey jones of fort worth, texas. jose of miami lakes, florida. adam of lexington, south carolina. whit merrifield of north carolina. a constituent of congresswoman

virginia foxx. adrian of florida. logan of columbia, south carolina. steven of lancaster, south carolina. matt price of sumter, south carolina. jordan of gaffney, south carolina. jimmy of chess knee, south carolina. michael roth of greer, south carolina. richard royal of fayetteville, north carolina. pat trirk sullivan of columbia, south carolina. john of florence, south carolina. brady thomas of anderson, south carolina. christian walker of limerick, pennsylvania. tyler web of virginia. adam westmoreland of casey, south carolina. jake williams of greer, south carolina. and scott wingo of greenville, south carolina. in conclusion, i urge my colleagues to join in supporting house resolution 1491. go gamecocks. i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the chair will receive a

message. the messenger: madam speaker, a message from the president of the united states. the secretary: madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: mr. secretary. the secretary: i am directed by the president of the united states to deliver to the house of representatives a message in writing. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, at this time i'd like to yield to my colleague, mr. spratt from south carolina, as much time as he may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from south carolina is recognized. mr. spratt: madam speaker, i join other members of the south carolina delegation in cheering the university of south carolina baseball team and coach tanner for winning the 2010 college world series. i extend special congratulations to coach tanner for being named college coach of the year by baseball america. coach tanner's completing his 14th season at the university of south carolina. i also take particular pride in the accomplishments of the four players from my district, fifth congressional district, including matt price, the pitcher who earned the win in

his relief effort in the championship clinching victory. the college world series is a tribute to the impact of baseball on our state. five public universities from south carolina made the final field of 64. during the semifinals a great in-state rivalry was played out on the national stage as the carolina gamecocks defeated the clemson tigers to advance to the finals. 7 this was the university's first championship in any men's sport. the impact was profound. it's hard to believe the gamecocks prevailed when they were one strike away from elimination in the quarterfinal game. these young athletes are a tribute to athletic ability but also the power of hard work, and commitment. they have our gratitude and admiration. i congratulate and salute them. thank you very much, madam speaker. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: madam speaker, i yield back the balance of my

time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i once again support house resolution 1491 and particular my support and congratulations to our two south carolina colleagues who are here today as well. i know it's a very happy day for them. i want to congratulate the university of south carolina gamecocks on their 2010 ncaa division i college world series victory. i urge my colleagues to support this resolution. i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the question is, will the house suspend the rules and agree to house resolution 1491. so many as are in favor say aye. those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, 2/3 of those voting having responded in the affirmative -- the gentleman from south carolina. mr. wilson: i move that we have a recorded vote with the yeas and nays. the speaker pro tempore: the yeas and nays are requested. all those in favor of taking this vote by the yeas and nays will rise and remain standing until counted. a sufficient number having

arisen, the yeas and nays are ordered. pursuant to clause 8 of rule 20 and the chair's prior announcement, further proceedings on this motion will be postponed. for what purpose does the gentleman from iowa seek recognition? mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i move that the house suspend the rules and agree to h.r. 1855 as amended. the speaker pro tempore: the clerk will report the title of the bill. the clerk: h.r. 1855, a bill to promote industry growth and competitiveness and to improve worker training, retention, and advancement, and for other purposes. the speaker pro tempore: pursuant to the rule, the gentleman from iowa, mr. loebsack, and the gentleman from south carolina -- kentucky, mr. guthrie, each will control 20 minutes. the chair recognizes the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i request five legislative days during which members may revise and extend and insert extraneous material on h.r. 1855 into the record. the speaker pro tempore: without objection. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, i yield myself such time as i may

consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. loebsack: i rise today in strong support of h.r. 1855, the strengthening employment clusters to organize regional success act, or the sectors act. legislation that i introduced in the house along with my colleague from the other side of the aisle, congressman todd platts. i want to thank congressman platts for his work on this legislation and for recognizing the worthiness of this effort. the sectors act was introduced as bipartisan legislation and i am pleased that we have gained additional bipartisan co-sponsors as well. i also want to thank chairman miller and ranking member klein of the education and labor committee, as well as the committee staff for working with me to move this legislation to the floor of the house. no matter what party you are from, i think, we can all agree we should be supportive of innovative and collaborative strategies that increase the success of american business and approve the pliment outlook

of our work force. as our country continues to recover from the economic downturn, we should work toward long-term improvements in our work force training and resource systems and look at how we can better utilize the infrastructure in place. given our current commig situation and the fact that we have seen a steep decrease in federal investment in employment and training over the past 20 years, this effort is all the more needed. recently "the new york times" ran a story detailing a significant mismatch between the skilled workers needed for many industries and the skill sets of many of the currently unemployed. the story also referenced a survey done last year of 779 industrial companies by the national association of manufacturers. the manufacturing i.n.s. --institute which found 32% of companies reported moderate to serious skills shortages. 63% of science companies and 45% of energy firm cited such

shortages. through the sectors act we are taking serious action to help address these issues and ensure that we build things in america again. in fact, just yesterday "the new york times" had another story entitled after training still scrambling for employment. that detailed the struggles the work force is having finding training to pursue careers in existing and growing fields. it also highlighted some successfully existing efforts with sector partnership. some of our industries that are poised for continued growth and expansion and would be strong contributors to economic recovery such as advanced manufacturing, clean energy technology, and health care information technology are struggling. . by the nature of the problem, it means our work force are continuing to finding trouble finding work because of the mismatch of the skill sets. the sectors act facilitates nationwide one of the key

elements of successful state and local partnerships. sectors partnerships organized stakeholders to a crucial industry like manufacturing, for example, and will include multiple firms and businesses, employees, unions, education and training providers and local work force and education systems, among others, to develop and implement plans for growing or saving that industry. there's a particular focus on building new work force pipelines where skilled workers' shortages exist and improving the ways existing workers areuality liesed, retrained and paid. the sectors act will put in place partnerships that lead to alignment of educational institutions, training institutions, apprenticeship programs and you will other training programs to meet industry demand, particularly for higher skill, high-priority occupations. regularly convening, industry players on an ongoing basis to plan and implement strategies to save or expand their

industry will help to strengthen connections and aggregate training and education needs of multiple employers. sector partnerships will also help businesses recruit new workers, retrain dislocated workers, develop and strengthen career ladders across companies and improve overall job quality. these types of strategies have been highly successful in states locally and renal national, including in my state, iowa. the national skills coalition, which has been a strong advocate for sometime, has organized a broad-based nationwide work force, manufacturing associations, colleges and universities, chambers of commerce, and training and human services organizations that support this legislation and these partnerships. the sectors act is about helping industries access the trained employees they need to expand and thrive, helping employees access education and training they require to be

competitive in the 21st century economy and find quality jobs and helping work force development and education providers train employees in the demand of today's industries. in so doing, this bill had help ensure our nation and the -- will help ensure our nation will stand at the forefront of the 21st century economy. i'd also like to thank representative miller, chairman of the education and labor committee, for his support of and work on this bill. i'd ask unanimous consent that a statement from chairman miller in support of this bill be included in the record. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's request will be covered by general leave. mr. loebsack: i urge support for this bipartisan legislation, madam speaker, which also has bipartisan support in the senate, and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves the balance of his time. the gentleman from kentucky is recognized. mr. guthrie: thank you, madam speaker. i yield myself such time as i may consume. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized. mr. guthrie: thank you, madam speaker. i rise today in support of h.r.

1855, strengthening improvement clusters to organized regional success, or the sectors act, and i appreciate mr. loebsack in the bipartisan way this has moved forward. h.r. 1855 creates new grants to help create or increase targeted industry capacity and partnerships within specific regions. this is an idea that's already been done in some places across the country with success. for example, philadelphia has created a regional program to train nurses for their hospitals and health care industry needs. i believe federal policies should also encourage regional business development, improve worker training, retention and advancement opportunities. that's why i strongly support not only this bill but strongly support the re-authorization of the work force investment act. madam speaker, the work force investment act is eight years overdue in its re-authorization, and i'm disappointed we're not engaging in a larger work force re--- reinvestment act. there's never been cratecal time to make sure our work force has the opportunity to

find new jobs or receive additional training. we need better systems of training and skills -- and better skills development to help them move into new industries. i come from a small business manufacturing background, and i have seen firsthand that unemployed workers who receive additional training for new skills can obtain a higher paying job which can radcally transform their way of life. we cannot afford to approach the work force and job needs of this country in a piecemeal way. the american people deserve a real comprehensive training bill. i introduced h.r. 4271, the work force investment act of 2009, to begin the process of re-authorization of weea. but unfortunately my bill has not been taken up by the education and labor committee. i do support this bill today. but i believe it's a disservice for the american people to not have an updated, comprehensive work force development bill, and i ask this congress to take full action on weea as soon as

possible. i do ask my colleagues to support this bill before us, however, and i reserve the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman reserves. the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: does the gentleman from kentucky have any further speakers? mr. guthrie: i have no further speakers, madam speaker. i yield back my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the gentleman from iowa. mr. loebsack: madam speaker, in closing, i do want to thank the gentleman from kentucky for his spoorned members from the other side of the aisle for support for this bill. it's been a true bipartisan effort, and i really do appreciate that. in closing, i do want to say that according to a multi-year study, participants in sector-based training programs earned an average of 18.3% or about $.500 more than a controlled -- $4,500 more than a controlled group. and parmings in sectors programs worked in jobs with benefits including health insurance and paid time off and were more likely to find consistent work. about 1.3 additional months of period over the two-year period than the controlled group

average. this legislation would put in place additional sector partnerships, as i said before, between business, employees and education and training providers that lead to collaborative planning, resource alignment and training efforts for current and potential workers to improve our nation's business manufacturing and industry outlook. it is supported by a broad based nationwide coalition of work force and vocational organizations, manufacturing associations, colleges and universities, chambers of commerce, training and human services organizations nationwide and it does have the dual benefits of helping businesses and employees and it has strong support in the house of representatives. i urge support for this legislation and i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields. the question is will the house suspend the rules and pass h.r. 1855 as amended. those in favor say aye. those opposed, no. in the opinion of the chair, 2/3 having responded in the affirmative, the rules are suspended, the bill is passed, and without objection the

motion to reconsider is laid on the table. the chair lays before the house a communication. the clerk will read the message. the clerk: to the congress of the united states, section 202-d of the national emergencies act provides for the automatic termination of a national emergency unless prior to the anniversary of its declaration the president transmits to the congress a notice stating that the emergency is to continue in effect beyond the anniversary date. in accordance with this provision, i have sent the enclosed notice to the federal register for publication stating that the national emergency and related measures dealing with the former

liberian regime of charles taylor is to continue beyond effect of july 22, 2010. the actions and policies of former liberian president, charles taylor, and other persons in particular the depletion of liberian resources and the removal from liberia and the secrecy of liberian moneys and properties continue to undermine democracy and the orderly development of its political, administrative and economic institutions and resources. these actions and policies continue to pose unusual and extraordinary threat to the foreign policy of the united states. for this reason i have determined that it is necessary to continue the national emergency with respect to the former liberian regime of charles taylor. signed, barack obama, the white house. the speaker pro tempore: referred to the committee on foreign affairs and ordered printed.

pursuant to clause 12-a of rule 1, the chair declares the house

>> watch live coverage on c- span3, and on c-span.org. candid conversations with all the justices, both active and retired. available both in hardcover, and as an e-book. we you show a conversation with ken feinberg. first, a reminder that we have a special page for the oil spill coverage. you can watch it live and access dozens of other hearings related to the oil spill, all at c- span.org/oilspill. now to the economic club of

washington where mr. ken feinberg it talks about the cash settlement process, and takes questions. this is just under one hour. >> may i have your attention please? [inaudible] [inaudible] ken feinberg is a native of massachusetts, graduate of nyu

law school. he set up the washington office. he was appointed by a judge, to help the special master for the agent orange litigation, and he did such a good job that he was subsequently appointed for number of other special litigation matters. subsequent to that, he began his own firm, and was us to do a number of other things in the alternative resolution and the speed area. he was also special master in the 9/11 compensation fund, did

that pro bono. he distributed $7 billion to more than five dozen members -- 5000 members. subsequent to that he was appointed a special master of the virginia tech funs. ds. most recently, he has been doing two things -- one is serving as the special master relating to compensation for those who receive compensation under the tarp funds, and also was recently appointed by bp and the administration to help administer and served as the administrator to the bp $20 million fund. in that context, i think he will make some remarks about what he is doing in that regard. i am pleased that he is able to be here today.

we also worked together on one other matter. in my capacity at the kennedy center i have worked with him. he has a love of classical music and opera. thank you very much for being here, ken. [applause] >> i want to thank david for the introduction. whatever we do, whatever david does, what ever i do, nothing is as difficult as chairing the kennedy center and the president of the opera. i assure you there is nothing quite like that. david is correct when he says that i have been a special master in some tough assignments. that is a legal term, special master. i once said to my wife, you

know, i am the special master for the 9/11 fund. [laughter] and she said, that is fine with me, but if anybody calls me the special mistress, there is going to be trouble. [laughter] you might wonder how can we, in a few minutes, blend the work that i am doing with secretary geithner as the special master for top executive pay and bp -- how do you blend those two villages 20 minutes? but you can. because if you look at both of those assignments, there is a common denominator. everyone's in a while. fortunately, not that often. but everyone's in a while, there is a public policy dilemma.

that requires public policy makers to think out of the box. now put aside the issue of whether or not you agree with the resolution of the public policy. put aside the merits of whether or not a special master for pay is a good idea or a bp $20 billion fund is a good idea. put that aside for just a minute. but understand that what is unique about these assignments -- agent orange was another one, the 9/11 victim compensation fund, virginia tech are other examples. the conventional way of resolving these dilemmas will not work. and whether it is government or the private sector, a decision is made that we better go off and try something new. it may not work. but conventional resolution will

not get the job done. when it comes to treasury and pay? my job there was made easier. congress said that for those seven companies that received the most taxpayer assistance, and just those seven, somebody at treasury should set up their pay for the top people. for the top people. congress delegated that assignment to the secretary, who delegated it to me. for those seven companies come at aig, citigroup, bank of america, chrysler, chrysler financial, gm, and gmac, congress said -- treasury, ken

feinberg, set the pay of the top 100 officials in each of those seven companies until they repay the taxpayer. once they repaid the taxpayer, they are out from under your thumb. so in 2009, i, at the request of the secretary, i determined and calculated the actual dollars to each of the top 25 officials in those companies, and we established a regiment of pay for officials 26 to 100 in each of those seven companies and only those seven companies. i did that in 2009. citigroup and bank of america, for reasons you can ask them -- one big to get out from under my thumb, borrowed money to repay the taxpayer so they could get out from under my jurisdiction, and they did.

so in 2010, there were five companies. chrysler financial, which is in the runoff -- they are out from under my thumb. so today, there are only four companies left. but as to those four companies, until they repaid the taxpayer, their pay will be established by the treasury officials. congress has spoken. now i would have thought, as to that assignment, there would have been a great deal of criticism. government regulation of private pay is none of the government's business. who would have thought that? who would have thought that would have been a big issue? it turned out to be a non-issue. it turned out to be a non issue, i think, i have concluded for two reasons. first, feinberg is only dealing with 100-some-odd officials. it is a side show. it is a rather very committed

role that i am playing, and if you really want to see impact on pay, do not look to what i am doing, which is relatively modest. look to the other initiatives that are out there being promoted by this administration. the regulatory reform bill is about to become law. corporate governance reform. secretary geithner has taken the lead on the g-20 in trying to make sure that competitive pay in the u.s. is not disadvantaged by foreign pay. the sec and commissioner of shapiro with her transparency rules. sheila bair at the fdic, the federal reserve. there's a lot more going on than executive pay than my limited role. that is one reason. the other reason there has not been much criticism at all is because, after all, these companies survive because of the american taxpayer. so when you talk to other corporate officials, their basic

approach to me is -- i have no problem with you are doing. those companies only maintain their financial stability because the taxpayer came to the risky. why should they not be able to say do not touch my pay? but in terms of the seven companies, why not? the taxpayer is the creditor of those companies. why should there not be some say in what these companies get paid? now, because of that, there has not been a great deal of criticism. i am somewhat surprised at the degree of interest in what i am doing. why, if i am only establishing pay for a very small number of people, is this such interest? well, i think there is a reason. again, two reasons. first, at a time of great economic uncertainty, populist

fervor is very high. people are upset. unemployment rates are high. people want to know, what are those wall street guys getting? it is a historical thing. it was no different in the gilded age of jpmorgan or whatever. if you look at american history, there's always tension between wall street and main street. what you find at this time in america because of economic uncertainty, people are focused on pay more than they might otherwise be. the second reason is a very practical one. i am the only fellow in government who takes rather bonilla predictions about pay and actually calculates to the penny what somebody should make. from that, i think it allows people to hone in on things other than experience are compensation being tied to

performance. you know. what else is new? that means that this person should make $800,000 or $1 million or $3 million or $600,000. for that reason, this tends to be a good deal of focus. the one remaining issue i still have to deal with in the next week or so under the statute, i have got to look back at what 419 companies received in terms of part assistance. how much bonus money did they give out? and should there be an effort under the statute to try and recoup some of those funds? and that project has been under way now for about three months in those 419 companies, not just the seven. this is a purely voluntary program. i cannot force it. the question is, shall i tried

to get any of it back from two years ago? we're finishing that look back, and those decisions will be rendered by me sometime i think within the next week or so. there has been some interest among 419 companies as to whether there will be an effort to recoup any of those dollars or impose any other or voluntarily suggest any other remedial steps to prevent excessive bonuses going forward. so that his pay. what makes the pay assignments so interesting is its uniqueness. the assignment from the secretary who hasn't been unbelievably supportive of my rope -- who has been unbelievably supportive of my role while the president has said we're not micromanaging these companies. this is a very narrow, limited role that i am engaged in. so that is one assignment that i juggle these days with a second

assignment, which is quite different in scope, magnitude, and sauce. but similar in that conventional thinking will not work. bp -- now it is altogether different from pay. the administration and bp, on their own -- i had nothing, nothing, to do with it, decided to set up an alternative mechanism for resolving bp claims. bp agreed, voluntarily -- no legislation. this is a voluntary compact. bp agreed to put $20 billion to pay claims arising out of the spill. and bp said, if $20 billion is insufficient, and that hope is sufficient, but if it is insufficient, bp will honor all

supplementary financial obligations in the gulf. so now i have this assignment of designing, implementing, and administering a $20 billion escrow fund designed to pay eligible claims. and that fund will, i believe, i am recommending, will be a fund that will last for three years. during that three year time span, i will evaluate, analyzed to determine independently what individuals, businesses, small businesses, large businesses in the gulf impacted by the spill should receive. now i am totally independent. i do not answer to the administration ignored to bp. it is very, very clear when i spoke and accepted this assignment from the

administration and from bp said i am an independent actor. this is a program that every but the voluntarily can enter into. they do not have to. any fisherman, any businessman, any real estate owner, any motel, any crabber, oyster harvester, a food processor, anybody can decide i want nothing to do with this. i would rather go to court order to implement my other legal rights. go ahead. you are crazy to do so. go ahead if you want. because under this program, you will receive, if you are eligible, you will receive compensation without having to go to court for years, without the uncertainty of going to court, since i will be much more generous than any court would

be, and at the same time, you will need to pay lawyers and costs. so you ought to come into this program, and until you know exactly what you'll get to the penny, you are under no obligation to waive any right you might have to litigate against bp. in fact, as i have announced, anybody who needs money immediately who is eligible can come in and immediately received a check for six months emergency payment. you have to prove it, but you'll get six months payment without any release. if you decide after that to litigate, you still keep the check. i mean, who would not come into this program? and take that which is offered with no obligation, and then at

the end of the day, when you are offered a lump-sum payment for all present and future injury, calculated by the administrator, only then when you know that amount do you decide whether or not you want to take it in lieu of going to court. it is in my way of thinking an easy call. do not underestimate the problems associated with human nature. i have seen it over and over again. do not assume everybody sees these funds. 9/11, virginia tech, and jet -- agent orange, this one. do not assume that people automatically will opt into these programs. people are skeptical, angry, disspirited, worried about their financial sunday, their financial future. human nature being what it is,

you have to sell these programs, and that is why i have been spending so much time in the gulf. you cannot do this program from washington. impossible. you have got to go down there to louisiana, alabama, florida, mississippi. i have received tremendous support from the governors of those states. i have received support from the attorneys general. i was on the phone the other day with the attorney general in florida. very helpful. a plan to meet with the attorneys general this week or next, to meet with them to talk about their concerns. i am not adversarial to the people in the gulf. i am trying to distribute the money. at the same time, i am trying to corral the claims, you see. so the question i get inundated with cases. -- so the courts do not get inundated with cases. there's certain tragedy's in american life where public

policy seeks a creative alternative to conventional thinking, and that is what page is about, and that is what bp is about. now with bp, let me just give you two hurdles to success, substantive hurdles. one, how attenuated will you allow the claims? mr. feinberg, i own a restaurant in the north end of boston. i have the best shrimp scampi in the city. i cannot get gulf shrimp. where's my money? highly unlikely. at some point, you have to say as a matter of public policy and law, claims are so attenuated, they cannot be compensated two mr. feinberg, i own a hotel on the beach. there is oil there and i have lost customers. ok, pay the claim. i own a golf course 50 miles from the gulf. i am down 30%.

people are not coming to play golf. dubious. but we're here to draw that line. that is a judgment call, and you look to the law. but the law only helps you so much. at some point, you have to make a call. so one challenge i have got, these claims are eligible. these claims are not eligible. judgment. i could be wrong. people could draw the line somewhere else. that is one problem. problem #two is a corroboration problem, a problem of proof. mr. feinberg, i was making $5,000 a month as the fishermen. now i cannot fish. pay me $5,000. ok. what do you have to corroborate it? what do you mean? proof. well, it was a cash business. nothing illegal about a cash business. what is your proof you're making $5,000? if you have a tax return?

>> i lost it. >> ok. do you have a profit loss statement, a checkbook, check stubs, the? no. will be ship captain vouch for the front of the dollars a month? i mean, i cannot just pay claims. you've got to prove your claim. i can be very lenient as to the proof. there's nothing illegal about a cash business, but you have to have proof. and you know, fishermen, you get the 1099, the law requires it. but you create barriers to participation, which is unfortunate. and you have got to try to work the people. that is a challenge, to get people to come into a fund like this. so that is sort of just a brief summary. we could spend a seminar on both pay and bp.

what is important about both of these and agent orange and virginia tech and the 9/11 of victim compensation fund, which was an absolute horror to administer 11 weeks after the tragedy. what the common denominator is of all of these programs is out of the box thinking. do not be circumscribed by traditional ways of resolution. do not assume that that there is only a linear, 1-way to do these things. that is not true. with these assignments, it is creativity. it is practicality. it is coming up with an incentive-based alternatives that will voluntarily channel people into a better way, win- win, and resolving this public

policy dramas that, . i believe that, thanks to the secretary and the help of the people at the treasury, i think they can -- the executive compensation approach, in a very narrow realm, worked. it really did. and i think also that the bp program, once it is up and running next month, it will work. it will work because you create creative ways to voluntarily entice people to participate with very, very little downside risk. and that is the challenge. so i want to thank all love you. you do not say in no to my friend david, who has been a friend and ally for many, many years. i jumped at the chance to be here. this is a very, very distinguished group. i think substantively understand better than most what i am trying to do.

and i welcome at the opportunity under david's approach -- i follow his lead for q&a. thank you very much. [applause] >> very good. now, ken, when he first read into the business of alternative resolution decision making, you are appointed by judge weinstein in new york. how did you know him, and how did he know of you? and the ever thought had he not appointed you, what you would be doing now? >> i knew him because we had both clerked for the same judge 35 years apart. so he is still sitting, judge weinstein. he is 88. he is in the eastern district of brooklyn. he appointed me because he knew of my work under senator kennedy and thought this would be the right assignment for me in dealing with vietnam veterans

and with the veterans administration. if he had not appointed me, what i have been just a lawyer or done other things? i assume i would have to like all of you, like everybody in life, you can plan a little bit, but you never know the twists and turns and what will happen in your professional and personal lives. it worked out fine. >> you did 9/11. i assume that was very emotionally grueling because you're dealing with an enormous amount of deaths. how long did it take you to ultimately come up with the procedures, and when people got paid their, was a publicly known whether each person got paid? >> it to me about six months to come up with the procedures to pay almost 3000 deaths claims, world trade center, aerospace, a pentagon, and about 23 hitter physical injury claims, mostly respiratory claims. there were not many traumatic

injuries. you either got out of those planes are buildings or you did not. so it took us about six months to set up the procedures. the program ran about statute for 33 months. all but 94 people came into the program. and you normally have legislation that guide you about how do these kinds of things, but you had no legislation in the bp situation. did you need legislation or did you get guidance from other authorities? >> guidance? guidance, i welcome. we do not need legislation. this is a purely private contract, compact between the legislators. with the goal of delegating through an administrator, me, set it up, run it, pay it. i have asked for and received a good deal of input, suggestions as to how best to do this, but ultimately it is my call.

>> and you're not taking over a procedure that bp had already implemented. can you explain what they were doing before? how many people do you have working for you? >> i give bp some credit here. bp has paid out, on its own, about $200 million in claims. mostly, but not completely, wage loss claims. if you business plans as well. bp, which is not generally in the claims processing business, has tried its best. if it retained contractors. there are roughly 1600 people working in 35 offices throughout the gulf, processing claims, receiving claims. all of that will transition in the next few weeks to the gulf coast claims facility, which i will administer, and we will continue to accelerate claims,

hopefully emergency claims will be paid within a couple of days of requesting emergency funds. and thereafter over the next three years, we will process claims. the challenge is going to be long-term injury. fishermen. you have a fishing boat. i think you'll be unable to fish for a year, so here's a lump sum check. no, no. i think i will not be about to fish for five years. take the check. but your business and litigate or do what you do. >> supposedly does take a check. do you think -- you think it will be out of business or harm for year and it turns out it will be more than a year. will they have to come back or do they only get one check? >> i do not come back. if you sign this release, you are releasing your right to come back. but, a, if you do not think the

time is recovering in this check is worthwhile, do not take it. b, come back next year. the fund will be in existence for three years. so come back next year. you have a better feel for this. or c, take the check. i think this is a generous check. i have looked around. i have asked people if they think they will be able to fish or what have you. it is entirely voluntary, and it is said to you. >> in 9/11, did you review every single payment and will you hear? >> i signed off, and i will do so here. now when you sign off on these payments, that does not mean that every single individual or every single business crosses my desk. you come up with a methodology. loss, lost profits, business interruption claims. you come up with a methodology for shrimpers, for chowder

boats, for motels, and for restaurants. that methodology must be consistent. you have to apply the same methodology. once you start streamlining this process, it becomes relatively easy to resolve these claims because basically you have a process in place that is systematic and consistent. the other problem to worry about this fraud. nothing undercuts the credibility of these programs more than fraud. in 9/11, we had some the 300 applications. 35 were fraudulent. we had checks. we watched it. internal and external auditing. with bp, i have the help of the criminal division of the department of justice. very important. and we will have internal auditing and investigatory procedures. in the final part of that question is, will everybody in

the public know, in the 9/11 or in the bp, is all of this information public? of course not. of course not. if i disclosed to government, state, local, federal, the names of every individual, their address, how much the received, nobody would sign up for these programs. this is private, individual, proprietary information. i will provide some general statistics about the claims, how long it takes, how much money has been distributed, for what types of claims. but the individual information must remain private and confidential, otherwise people will not say you me to tell me that my information is going to washington? to the internal revenue service? absolutely not. it would be a huge barrier to a voluntary participation.

>> how many people will it take to administer the bp program? you have hundreds of people to help process these claims? >> well, we said contract out. right now, as i said, bp hired 16 under people and in the gulf. i do not think we need that many people. he will be able to file a bp claim entirely in line -- entirely on line. we will streamline and systematize the process. bp did not do that. bp was putting band-aids on the problem, as you would expect in an emergency situation. the best news for my purposes in the last week is that the oil stopped. until the oil stocks, it is hard to corral the claims. you do not know how many claims, whether the oil reached a certain area. now that the oil has apparently been stopped or the leak has stopped, it will make a lot

easier and quicker to get a handle and universal claims. on the 9/11 situation, you did that pro bono, and how were you able to spend that much time pro bono? you have to make a living. did you give that as a gift to the country? >> i gave it as a gift to the country, but let's be more pragmatic. when i did the 9/11 fund, i was a special government employee, as i am now, with tarp. so i am not an official government employee. i am allowed, in the both 9/11, pro bono, and tar, pro bono, to maintain a private practice while at the same time working in these public policy areas. so i was allowed to benefit from my law firm practice. i did not practice very much, but to benefit from my law firm practice. >> in bp, if somebody has

insurance, it is a business or an individual with insurance, and they come to for a plate -- a claim many pay them, can they still get insurance? or do you cannot care? >> i certainly do care. it is an offset. if they receive state assistance from their ensure, and a plymouth compensation, to use that as an example. mr. feinberg, a was earning $5,000 a month, received $800 a month from the state of alabama. how much can i get? you get $4,200. we will offset the tender dollars you have already received from your ensure. the insurance as a segregation claim to recoup, and we will deal with that. >> so that -- if somebody comes to for a claim and file for insurance a year later, you would not know. >> it is too late. you have been paid. if you got your insurance letter, well, again like to you. >> of all the assignments in this area, what would you say is the most difficult to get your

hands around and was the most emotionally grueling? >> oh, they are all emotionally growing. the 9/11 fund was a hard one because congress passed that law 11 days, days, after 9/11. so you're dealing with people distraught. mr. jones, i am here to give you $2 million. >> they have not recovered my husband's body? the world trade center, and you are here to offer me money? how dare you offer me money? i want my husband back. 9/11. pp. do not underestimate when you go down there. mr. feinberg, i do not know what i am going to do. i am a sixth generation oyster harvester, and might oyster harvesting days are over.

what are you going to do for me? how can money possibly replace the heritage that my family built up here in the gulf? this job, all of these assignments, require, emotional perspective, on what people are going through. and no matter how creative you may be in the coming up with the program that reasonable people would claim is very reasonable and makes a lot of sense, you still have to sell it to people who are emotionally distraught. and that is a big part of what i have to do here. >> when you were the most famous person who came from your area in massachusetts -- rocky marciano also lived down there. does everybody else have that same [laughter] ]

less than -- >> last week in the gulf i told somebody in biloxi, mississippi that i sound like a southern south bostoner. i think most people that live in that area and in massachusetts, we sort of cultivate it. so it comes in handy. >> or did you get your love of classical music and opera? >> there is really an interesting story about my love of classical music. when i was 9 years old, i began studying for my bar mitzvah, and the candor -- >> four years early. >> well, i was a slow learner. and the cantor in my synagogue was from indiana and was a world-class expert in opera and classical music. and again, he got me interested

as a youngster -- >> the house taking a break now. earlier, they consider five bills including one about adult education and another for a national child care were in this month. back at 6:00 p.m. eastern for a recorded vote and special orders. among the issues member has to deal with this week, unemployment benefits, additional war spending, and a couple of deals dealing with oil. more house coverages 6:00 p.m. eastern here on c-span. >> i mean, some people read. some people go play softball. go to the movies. you do what works best for you in terms of trying. but 9/11, i must have gone to the kennedy center or to carnegie hall or the metropolitan opera three nights a week. otherwise you go mad doing these assignments. you have to find some outlet. >> have you ever considered going on to the opera as a performer?

not yet? >> well, now that you're the head of the kennedy center, david -- july >> we can make arrangements. >> you will see. we have some time for some questions from our guests. i do not have any cards, but if you have questions, raise your hands. here is one right here. >> i am from george mason university. what did you learn from the victims compensation fund and compared to what is going on in bp? >> what you learned from all of these assignments, including bp, is how diverse human nature is. the reaction of people is as diverse as semen nature itself. some people are angry. some are skeptical. some people are uncertain. some people are incredibly hopeful. thank goodness you are here to

help. one size does not fit all, and he better be prepared for a wide range of emotional reactions to what you're trying to accomplish. >> other questions? there's the question right here. >> do you think that $20 billion will be adequate? >> well, and of $20 billion will be adequate. the good news is that bp has publicly stated that if it is inadequate, they will continue to honor all of additional financial obligations that confront them. i hope it is adequate, but remember, the $20 billion is not just for me and the private program. out of the $20 billion comes government claims.

so depending on the size, eligibility, scope of this government claims as well as clean up -- >> the house taking a break. the members considered five bills earlier. >> over the next few months, we will get a much better handle of the leak. we will get a better handle on the claims. a lot of it will depend on where a define the eligibility criteria. we will have to play it out. >> you said i think 54 people chose not to go to your process with 9/11. >> 94. >> how did they fare in the litigation system? >> 94 people opted out of the program. 3% opted out of the program, and all of their cases were settled. >> so you do not know whether they did financially better or worse? >> no one knows, but i am sure they did not do as well, not after the winter of the trouble, we did that many years, paid their lawyer, loss of

litigation. >> did they hire lawyers when they came into your system, and will people who come into that bp prices need lawyers or not? >> they do not need lawyers. they're more than welcome to have lawyers. i am is a lawyer. if you want to have a lawyer, by all means, have a lawyer. really. but in the 9/11 fund, the american association of trial lawyers stepped up and provide a pro bono lawyers for 1500 people. i think we will have some sort of pro bono program in bp as well as you want a lawyer. >> can you describe the infrastructure or the team need to build to the minister the bp fun? when you get these people? >> i received a fair number. i am very popular guy these days. you have to hire people locally. really. i got a letter from a senator the other day from louisiana, sang a hope the $20 billion will go in the local banks in the gulf.

you hire local people who are trusted by the community in terms of receiving claims, sitting with them, helping process a claim, evaluate it. we have hired -- bp hired a claims adjuster firm from hammond, louisiana that is spread out over the gulf. so as we're setting up the infrastructure now, our hope is primarily, not exclusively, but primarily local. i met with the mayor of new orleans a couple weeks ago. he is great. we're sure you're going to do a good job. we want headquarters here in new orleans. and the senator and governors are all very, very helpful, but all urging to hire local. >> in your tarp role, how did

you find executives when there were pleading for additional compensation or not to be cut back? were they effective generally or not in there please? >> they were effective. they were not pleased. i did that deal with too many ceo's. some. but he was pretty effective, when i worked with. mostly you dealt with the vice- president, a human-resources be dealt with general counsels. you dealt with consultants. we worked it out. it was difficult. but i think it was fairly collegial. people read the statute. they saw what i had to do. and i think it worked out ok. treasury was particularly helpful. the deputy secretary of the treasury was sort of, at my request -- i would go and see him. and neil and the secretary were

very, very helpful. >> is the $20 billion as growth fund, is that safe from claims from other bp creditors? and what you do with the $20 billion while you wait to pay the claims -- is a sitting there or invested in anything? >> is this the carlyle group asking this question [laughter] >> i am sure we could get a good return for it. >> not on my watch. the escrow fund of $20 billion, i am just drawing on it. i do not know, as we sit here today, i think the administration and bp is still not finalized the escrow. so i cannot really give you the answers to those questions because that is beyond my jurisdiction. i will draw on those funds. i am not a custodian of those funds. i do not really have much of a say right now in the terms and conditions. >> there were some views and not

just bp might have been involved, some of the people who constructed the rigs and so forth. but that is less of the you're worried about. other companies may have to contribute to this $20 billion? or will they deal with bp separately? >> i have nothing to do with anybody but bp. clearly, those companies do not have to contribute. they want to a some time. not on my watch because of the bill comes into this voluntary program and did check from the fund is not releasing anybody but bp and ultimate check. remember, the emergency money you do not even have to release bp. an incentive to get into the program and carell the claims. so we will see what others do. right now, i am focus on setting up the program, trying to get as many people as possible to participate, give them emergency payments without any obligation at all. and only downstream when you file for a lump-sum check will

you then make a decision whether you want that check in return for releasing bp only or whether you want to reject the czech and litigate. >> were you approached first bite bp and almost simultaneously by the administration? how did that come together? >> bp, twice. two meetings with bp. and then rather suddenly, within all of two weeks some that the administration through the justice department -- the justice has been fabulous year. the have been great trying to set this up. those are the people i have dealt with. i have not dealt with anybody at the white house. it has been tom, justice, and bp in houston. >> can you describe your role earlier when you're working for

senator kennedy? you are now head of the kennedy library. >> that is my day job. >> your day job. in that role, you're doing what with the kennedy library? it is the 50th anniversary president kennedy's inauguration coming up. >> that is right. the jfk library foundation, i am the chairman of the board of the foundation. the library is a national found -- library funded by the taxpayer. but i chair probably got 16 members of the board and we are designed to perpetuate the legacy of president kennedy, and the 50th anniversary is coming up. there varies projects under way. this will be a great event, thanks to you and others at the kennedy center, celebrating the 50th anniversary of the election of president kennedy. and our charge there is to sort of perpetrate the legacy and the memory of what president kennedy stood for. >> my last question will become a de you ever have any self doubt?

[laughter] using to be a very confident person. >> in these assignments, you better have a great deal of self doubt. i mean, you are up at 3:00 a.m. trying to figure these things out. self doubt and criticism, public criticism, goes with the territory. because it i am right, you have to think out of the box, and you got to be a little bit different in the way you approach these problems. so you do not have a whole lot of precedent to guide you. very, very important that you have the self doubt. very important that you reach out to as many people as the need to to get ideas, bounce ideas off people. that is why, with 9/11 and john ashcroft, the attorney general, fabulous help. virginia tech, the president of the virginia tech.

pay, secretary geithner and neil bounced ideals. and now bp, a justice department, bp, the attorneys general, the governor's. one person give me some advice. get the money now. time is the enemy. time is the enemy. very, very sound advice. so self doubt goes with the territory. it is a good thing. just make sure does not paralyze you. you might make a decision. others make it differently. you make that decision and move on. >> on behalf of other americans -- i did not speak for the whole country, but i want to thank you for what you have been doing in our country and in helping on this resolution and the 9/11 matter. i want to thank you very much for coming today. >> thank you. [applause]

>> the house taking a break now. earlier members considered five bills, including one support adult education and another for national child awareness month back at 6:00 p.m. eastern for in the recorded votes and special order speeches. among the issues members have to deal with, unemployment benefits, war spending, and a couple bills dealing with oil drilling. more like house coverage as 6:00 p.m. eastern here on c-span. >> last week, the u.s. second circuit court of appeals struck down the federal communications commission's indecency policy. we will talk about the decision with attorneys carter philips

from fox news and patrick truman who filed a brief in the case for focus on the family in the family research council. tonight on "the communicators" on c-span2. >> c-span2, one of c-span's public affairs offerings the live coverage of the u.s. senate and on weekdays but on weekends, "book tv." connect with us on this -- on twitter, facebook, and youtube. sign up for schedule a large e- mails at c-span.org. >> next, a debate between four democratic candidates running in the rhode island first house district place. they're seeking to replace retiring congressman patrick kennedy. the providence mayor, a businessman, former state democratic party chairman, and state representative david segal participated in this 90-minute debate last tuesday the performing arts center in the

providence, rhode island. hosted by wpri-tv. this is about 90 minutes. >> the following program is a special presentation by eyewitness news. >> eyewitness news brings you live coverage now of campaign 2010 debate, u.s. house district 1, democrats for congressional candidate facing off in a prime- time debate, live right now on wpri 12 and wpri.com. >> you're looking live now into the providence performing arts center. it is the first live televised debate for the democrats in the first congressional district. each of these men is 76 feet representative patrick kennedy in the washington. for each one, it is his first one for u.s. congress. good evening. tonight, we're going to be talking about some very important issues that affect all families in the state of rhode island. first, we want to thank all the

participating in tonight's debate and we want to remind you that this is live on wpri-12 and it is also live on our web sites wpri.com. after a televised portion, the debate will continue on wpri.com with even more questions, including thoseubmitted by eyewitness news viewers. be sure to log on to that beginning at 8:00 p.m.. begin with opening remarks for each of the canvas. the order was determined by a growing. up first is mr. gemma. he is the founder of a marketing firm. this is mr. gemma's first run for office. >> thank you very much. i want to thank channel 12 for hosting this event this evening. i want to thank patrick kennedy for his years of service for the people of rhode island. i want tthank you, the

viewers, for taking time out of your schedule to hear whate have to say this evening. . . in a single tenant home to growing a company in maintaining over two hundred jobs. to growing a foundation in helping thousands of men and women beat and fight breast cancer. they have prepared me for this day. and that date is one of being a public servant, and the best way an honor to be a public servant is to run for congressional office in a way that i can help. with that, we need your help to reinvigorate and reinvent public-service. and tonight, " starts with you. thank you very much. >> now david segal.

he works as a policy researcher and paralegal. >> thank you. my name is david segal. i'm running because the people of ryland want and deserve the congress member who will stand up a powerful interest and when real victories for families. we need washington to do more to address our serious challenges. the big corporations, big banks, big insurance companies have far too much power and influence. the hard-working families in our communities have too little. i want to be a voice for those working families. as a providence city council member and now as this decrepit the -- the state rep, i have stood up to loans that were making predatory loans and for closing in homes and our neighborhood. i have stood up against developers who took millions of dollars and refused to hire sidents to work on their

projects. i pushed back against national grid to bring grain jobs and renewabl energy to rhode island for the first time. i worked to reform political corruption in campaign finance. -- and cpaign finance. that is why i am asking for your vote. >> thank you. david cicilline has been the mayor of providence since 2002. he served four terms as a state representative. before being in politics, he was an attorney in criminal defense and civil rights. your opening remarks. >> thank you for organizing this debate. our state is facing some enormous challenges, as is our country. --re worried about future the future, the ability to support themselves, paying bills. rhode island has the fourth highest unemployment rate in the country. we see oil gushing io our

oceans in the gulf. parents are disappointed when their children have to leave for thailand to find work. it cannot watch their grandchildren grow up here. i want to -- have to leave ryland to find work. they cannot watch their grandchildren grow up here. i know what works and what does not. i know how to get things do. we need leadership which will fight for working families, putting them first, and deliver rhode island. i will work hard every single day for theamilies of our state. >> thank you. >> and now, bill lynch. he is former chairman of the state democratic party. he served as the city councilor for six years. your opening remarks. >> thank you to all of you for

being here tonight. most of all, thank you to the people at home who have taken the time to watch us tonight. it is pretty obvious to most everybody here in rhode island that washington does not work for working people. our friends, families, and neighbors are out of work, out of hope, and out of patience with washington. i am running for congress to do what i have done my whole life here in rhode island -- fight for our families. i announced my support for term limits for membersf congress yesterday. if elected, i pledge to you that i would only serve 12 years in the congress. we need to change washington from the bottom up with significant and real change. term limits will do that. washington is broken. it is time to make profound changes. there is no time to waste. too many politiciansre looking

out for themselves. tonight, i look forward to talking about fixing those problems. i respectfully ask for support and your vote in september. thank you. >> we actually have another debate scheduled before the general election. each of the candidates has agreed to appear on that debat should they win the democratic primary in september. let's start on the issues that are vital to families in rhode island. . >> thank you. good evening. it is safe to say many voters know little about each of you. we hope to change that. there is no strict format to this debate. however, we want to cover a lot of ground. if i feel you are going to -- and not answering the question, i will jump in. mr. lynch, it being your

birthday, might give to you is the first question. -- my gif to you is the first question. >> i told my wife we were going out for my birthday. i do not think this is what she had in mind your >> the economic recovery -- in mind. >> the economic recovery has been slow to take hold. the last thing many people here want to see is more taxes. in 2011, the bush tax cuts are scheduled to expire. which of those tax cutsould you allowed to expire? >> as a country, the last thing we can do is tax our way out of this economic crisis. as someone who has run all law office for almost 25 years now and represented many small businesses, and here every day that they areaxed to the hilt. there is no more money to pay.

as a priority, we need to, in order to ensure and grow jobs here, reduce the tax pressure on these businesses. one way to do that is to look at the bush tax cuts -- the consequence of the bush tax cuts. they saved the wealthiest, to the detriment of the middle class. >> if at all possible, we need to look at protecting and preserving the middle class families in ryland -- rhode island. >> according to the congressional budget office, the bush tax cuts only favored 25% of the rich -- those households over $250,000. what about the death tax, the marriage tax, low-income families who will see their income tax rate jumped five percentage points? >> we have to address these

issues in a way that benefits average, hard-working families, not the wealthiest among us. if there has to be a decision made as to who has to pay more, frankly, i think it has to fall more on those that hav done better and continue to make enormous amounts of money. >> mr. gemma, which of the bush tax cuts should go? >> we are facing a $1.4 million deficit in -- $1.40 trillion deficit in our count. the real problems about creating jobs. we're working on creating a jobs plan to bring real jobs to the people of our state and our nation. we want to lessen the burden and the pressure. i do believe that the middle class is the one that is really

suffering. we have to help them. >> you started that answer by citing the deficit. are you saying that the bush tax cuts are taking a heavy hand in the deaths at? >> the real issue with the books-cuts -- the bush tax cuts is that they probably need to be repealed. >> all of them? even the child tax credit, the marriage tax, the death tax? >> all of them. $1.4 facing a deficit of million -- hard decisions will need to be made. i believe the tax cuts should be allowed to expire. >> according to the gornment site, $266 million in stimulus money has been spent on grants, loans, and contracts in rhode island, in the first

congressional district alone, which netted about 213 jobs. are you ok with those numbers? >> that number is a wall full return on investment. -- a wall full -- woeful return on investment. we need to keep businesses ving. we need to visit the state future commerce and tax revenues. -- we need to facilitate future commerce and tax revenues. as a state representative, it has been apparent to me that rhode island would have been suffering much more without the stimulus. there would of been further cuts to schools, municipalities , and increases in property taxes. >> would you support a second stimulus? >> i would support the stimulus

that focuses on jobs, infrastructure, green jobs, in for structure that helps facilitate commerce down the line, and kickstart our economy in the long term. >> he is looking for a bigger stimulus. >> this is the example -- an example where the perspective of a mayor would have been very beneficial. we argued for real investment in infrastructure. rebuild bridges, roads, water systems, technology. get people working right away to create a national infrastructure bank with a public-private partnership. we have over 300 structurally- deficient bridges in the first district alone. we nd to invest in infrastructure. it helps create a plaque for rick -- platform for rebuilding

the economy. only a small portion of the recovery package went to infrastructure. it was not a failure, but we have not seen the kind of job creation that we should have. most of it went to this day. we have unfortunate and aggressive. we competed for grants. we brought tens of millions of dollars into our state. we were competitive. we examined every opportunity. we created jobs. if there is going to be additional investment, it has to be targeted and very smart. >> you are talking about additional investment. >> one answer is raising the retirement age. do you support that? >> no.

i think there are ways to generate revenue without raising the retirement age. >> what are those ways? among you continue to make the right investments that will rebuild our economy. invest in our manufacturing. understand that manufacturing in the first district is the backbone of our economy. many generations of families made a good ling in manufacturing. we need to have a national manufacturing policy, trade policies to allow us to compete globally, tax policies to support american businesses. we need to make things again. we need to rebuild our economy. we need to understand that budgets are about setting the right priorities. we have sufficient resources to do the things we need to do. i believe it is time to bring our troops home from afghanistan. >> i do not want to get off subject. the cost of entitlements an

entitlement programs have been going through the roof. is this not an area you would look at? >> you have to look at everything. you asked if i would support raising the retirement age. i was at a boat building facility a few days ago. it is hard work. at the time that they are ready to retire, they ought to be ready to retire. we should keep our commitment. we created the social security trust fund in anticipation of the baby boom. what is happening now is exactly what was predicted. we need to understand that we made a commitment to the american people and we need to keep that commitment. >> you have said everything is on the table for you. you would not rule out some sort of privatisation. can you clarify? >> we should prioritize -- not

prioritize social security. we should maintain our promise. >> when i asked you your views on social security, you said everything was on the table. >> we met to two weeks ago. i have done my research and my homework. i do not believe that is the way we shall go. we have a promise to our seniors and we should deliver on that promise. not for someone that is in the workforce, relying, to their detriment, on our poor planning. >> what about entitlement programs? he was reluctant to approach the costly entitlement programs. are there any you would be willing to look at? >> i do not believe that is where the cuts should come from. my dad used to say you fail to

plan, plan to fail. we have failed to plant as a state and a nation. that is why we are in this predicament. if you think aut the question you asked previously about jobs, we have created 209, 213 jobs -- $1.2 million per job. it is not the return on investment we're looking for. that is poor planning. >> this bipartisan commission is looking to raise the retirement age. >> i would not support that. we have one of the highest percentages of seniors and people approaching that age in the country. we have made a commitment and i will keep that commitment. we need to prioritize our spending in washington. that is where the problem lies.

that is where we have gotten completely off track. people are beginning to recognize that. the easiest way is to stop spending $910 billion in afghanistan and iraq. we should not have a bridge between providence and put it that we have to wait six or seven years repaired, when we are spending $40 billion fixing roads and bridges in iraq. add this point in time, we are a generous country. we're very generous people here in our state. we need to tighten our belts and so does congress. we need to look at where we are spending hard-earned tax money, particularly around the world. is it being spent appropriately? should it be reduced? it shoulhelp people who need help here. >> can you answer the social

security question -- raising the retirement age to 70 years old -- would you support that? >> i would not support such anges. looking at adjustment for people who are younger, living longer, that might be reasonable, but social security is not in the crisis that the right wing wants us to believe it is in. paul krugman have made clear that the amount of revenue that is necessary to make up the projected gap years down the line is equal to about 1/4 of the cost of the bush tax cut it is less than the cost of the wars in afghanistan and iraq right now. there are other options to look at. >> paul krugman can ignore $1.40 trillion deficit. how would you shrink it? >> some of them have been spoken to already. a job-inducing stimulus will pay for some of itself, because it will facilitate commerce down the line, while keeping people

employed, and increasing tax revenues. ending the bush tax cuts where people are makingver $250,000 per year is a reasonable measure to take. we need to rein in spending on the war. >> can you answer how to shrink the deficit? >> the first and most important way is to bring our troops home as responsibly and quickly as we can. we have spent more in afghanistan and iraq -- $4 billion per month. that is a little bit less than the entire community development block grant for the entire country. we're rebuilding schools, bridges, roads havlawyer around the world, but we have them here in our own country that are crumbling. we have to be strong direct home and make the right investments in america. the second way is to repeal the $3 billion in subsidies that go to the big oil companies and

shift that to investments in renewable energy. >> $3 billion? is that not a dp in the fiscal budget? >> it is an important investment and the way to repeal interests that are undermining us. >> i will move onto a rapid-fire session. i will ask you a yes or no question. i'm looking for just a yes or no. we will start left to right. >> what happens if we do not say yes or no? >> it is up to you if you want to give the people at home the question -- the perception that you cannot answer a yes or no question. would you vote to repeal the military policy don't ask, don't tell? >> yes. >> yes. >> yes. but i guess. -- >> absolutely.

>> from right to left, would you vote to approve money to close guantanamo bay? >> i believe so. >> no. >>o. >> it would depend what would be done with the prisoners there. [laughter] >> one of the proposals is to move the detainees to an underused prison in illinois. that is one proposal. >> if i were satisfied they would be in a secure facility, yes. >> yes. for the people that answered yes, the proposal was to move it

to an underused prison in illinois. we happen to have an underused prison here in rhode island. would you be willing to allow those detainees to be moved to there? >> i have full faith and our law enforcement officers to protect our country and ourselves, so yes. >> no. it is not a question of a lack of confidence in the facility or personnel. this facility in illinois is a very high level security. >> i agree with david cicilline. it is a rural area of illinois. >> at this moment, would you vote to retain nancy pelosi as speaker of the house? >> yes. >> depending on what she promised for my state. >> is that yes? is she doing a good job?

>> i think she is doing a good job. i would want to secure as much as i could for rhode island. >> i do not think she really cares. if i were elected and she were the leader of the party, i would vote to support her and my party in congress. >> i believe so. yes. >> next question. right to left. if in congress at the time, would you have voted to pass a national health care reform act? >> i would have, but i would have pushed hard for a public option. >> i would have reluctantly, but i would plan on revisiting at for an amending. >> yes, but i would have pressed hard for a public option. i understand this is just the first step. we hav a lot more to do. >> yes.

following the rules. >> good for you. the top priority of labor is to get the legislation passed. would you vote to do away with secret ballot in union legislation? >> it is in the senate right now. secret ballots would not be included. i would not vote for the house version. >> our entire delegation supports the version you are talking about and i would as well. >> i agree with the mayor. people should be able to vote without the fear of facing intimidation. >> i am proud to support that. ledproud to have delegations of representatives into the masonic temple hotel where 85% of workers --

>> your answer is yes. >> my answer is yes. >> final question -- i will allow you to explain this one more if you need to. do you support a woman' right to choose? >> yes. but absolutely, i always have. >> yes. >> i am pro-life with the inception -- with the exception incest.and >> there was a very public fight between patrick kennedy and congressman. should someone be allowed to take communion if they support the policy the contradicts their faith? >> yes. that whole issue could have been better handled as a private matter between them. i feel that the bishop has an absolute right topeak out and criticize whe he feels appropriate if there is someone belonging to his church who does

not adhere to the teachings of the church. i have long said and will continue to say that there are some issues, frankly, that i am not in lockstep with the orthodox part of the catholic church. that is an issue between myself and my god. someday we will meet, i hope, and discuss is. in the meantime, i will continue to follow my conscience on those issues. >> do you agree wh tha you will not be in opposition to the church, but you think politicians who are should be allowed to take communion? >> yes, i do. i do not believe that those differences should have been aired in a public forum. i believe that elected offials should be able to receive communion. been a few became a democrat in may of this year. -- >> you became a democrat in may of this year.

you have been the work -- a contributor to republican. those were looking to make the decision, how do you reconcile your record? >> i reconcile it like this. like overset -- like over 60% of the population i and disconnected. -- we are disconnected and unaffiliated. i would say that -- >> be specific with the governor. >> i did donate to that governor. i did donate to seven democrats at the same time. i donated for one specific issue. i supported how hard he pushed for the separation of powers.

it was a single-issue donation. >> your donation was in 2006, $1,000. separation of powers was passed in 2004, two years before your donation. >> if you follow my focus plan, i have a 23-page focus plan to get citizens back involved with their government, the core comes from the separation of powers. what happened was this -- when it was pushed to the voters, 73% voted in favor of separation of powers, which became a political mandate for elected officials to vote for it. that includes the governor's implementation. that is the core my plan. we need to get citizens involved with the government so they can make decisions and tell us how they feel and how we should vote on a specific issue. >> the political question to you

as well -- for the past 12 years as chairman of the state democratic party, you have been -- >> i am proud of the job i did. that was my job. i do not hold elective office. i have never served in the house or senate. i took on the responsibility because i believe thathe democratic party has been party of working families, particularly here in rhode island. i am proud to have played even a very small part of that tradition. .

>> i was never afraid to stand up and speak my mind. frankly, i think that is something the people of rhode island want and need them. i think they need it now in washington. >> mr. segal, you were once a progressive democrat. you are now a green party member. our liberal views opening your to greater risk of defeat in a general election? >> i would disagree strongly with that. i think my views right now are almost non-ideological. a bleak corporate power in washington has run amok and we need to push back against the banks, insurance companies, and utility companies, to do right

by americans. i think that is something most non-conservatives believe as well. >> there are pretty nasty polls that came up today, the abc washington poll. it showed that most aricans woul like to see a republican- controlled congress as opposed to a democratic-controlled congress. why should people vote for you? >> that is a pool of most americans, not most rhode island doors. the reason that are fed up with congress is it is to contingent upon the will of all the campaign contributors and corporate interests that have rammed through the bailout of banks and the lack of a public option as part of the insurance reform package. i have always stood in stark opposition to such corporate control of our elections. >> mr. cicilline, you have a record people can scrutinize a little more than others. you came in as mayor promising reform for a clock -- a corrupt city hall.

your administration had a share of blemishes. two police officers are charged in a drug ring. how can we trust you to be a refoer in washington, when many question whether you were able to do it right here in providence? >> i am proud of the work we have done in the city of providence to restore honesty and integrity. i am proud of the results in terms of new investment to the city, the lowest crime rate in three decades, creation of a high-quality national model of an after-school programs, improvements in our schools. providence ctinues to be a ple where businesses are coming. it gives us a knowledge economy. i am proud of our work and of my team. i work for city government. with respect to how does that position before washington, what we need is someone who is going to stand up and fight for hard- working middle-class families, something i have done every day as mayor of this city, somhing i have seen every day toughout

my city. we stood up to banks. a proposed an ordinance to require banks to give people a mediation process before it forecloses on them. deutsche bank and wells fargo sydney. i won. we issue processes of contingency to keep people in their homes. i took on all the institutions and brought honor and integrity to government. i will fight in washington. >> i want to move on to immigration. lynch, mr. you support a pass to citizenship for illegal immigrants. what do you want to sit for this to happen? specifically, do you think as part of the pack to citizenship illegal immigrants should have to learn english and pay back taxes? >> absolutely. it is frustrating for me and others to see what is happening around the country because of the complete failure of the congress to deal with immigration comprehensively on a federal basis. that is what you see the problems we have in arizona. that is where you see the

problems in rhode island. they a all the same issue. they are a direct result of the congress's failure to act on a critical issue that has been before them for several years. back in 2004-2005, there was a bipartisan bill in congress that such a clear framework to resolve these isss, incding securing our borders, using the national guard as appropriate, a press which is citizenship for the 12 million people we know are here, learning english, paying taxes, paying a fine, and not in favored treatment. the congress should have done that. they should be asham to work away from that issue. now they, like arizona, are suffering the consequences. we need to fix that nationally, and now, not when they feel like getting around for it. >> gem, any bill that came on

abortion to e1/2ver andify -- and a bill that came out of washington would like ely have an e-verify component. as a businessman, what do you think of that? until it is as reliable as it needs to be, i would not support it until we know it is accurate. >> many people entered the country legally and overstay a be so like a tourist visa. hearty chuckle the statistic if you do not -- how do you tackle this statistic if you do not crack down on the employers? >> whinney to hold them accountable for hiring them. here is a bigger problem. there is 11 million undocumented workers in the united states now. they have over 4 million children. these are now american citizens. the problem is bigger.

their status brings -- it would take $300 billion to deport them. the answer is looking down the borders. it does not make any sense. >> should they have to learn english and payback taxes? >> they should. they should have to pay fine as well. the budget is about $66 billion over 10 years. >> for mr. cicilline, the proped unaggressive withdrawal from afghanist, earlier than the president has called for. some cgressmen are voting against additional funding for the war. how serious are you about getting out of that country? i am very serious about getting out. i think we have to do it as quickly and responsibly as we can. i am arguing for a smaller footprint, a mor strategic

presence. >> would you vote against funding? >> no. i believe so long as there are men and women in afghanistan which have an obligation to support them with the resources they need. a decision has to be made by the civilian leadership, not be the military leadehip. i believe the time has come to bring our troops home, to reduce the size of that book front, to be more counterinsurgency and strategic. that will allow the afghanis to stand up with their own political institutions and military, which is the best way to stabilize that region. when need to do that in a responsible and expeditious way. we are responsible for giving the men and women there the resources they need. >> would be declaring victory in afghanistan donne's >> victory will be declared when there is a stable government in afghanistan and the evgeny people are supporting their own civil institutions.

there has to ba political solution, not a military solution. we are spending $4 billion and month of taxpayer money. studies nclude that 40% to 70% of that money is going to corrupt officials. taxpayer money is in the hands of corrupt officials. that is a disrespect to america. we need to do what we can to protect our long-term national security. that can be done by ensuring that afghan military and civilian institutions exist and we support that. that is not the presence we have. >> mr. segal, on defense spending, do you support scheme in but the guards if so, what do you say to people and district 1 who rely on defense spending for work? >> i would vote against the spending bill before the congress right now.

i believe we should support the troops that are there. i think we support them best by funding their stake -- their safe return home. i do not think there is a clear path to resolution. i would vote against spending. >> he would vote to return them home but not for their -- >> yes. exactly. the other question -- i believe that we should convert some of our spending away from military spending and toward other things that also serve a productive purpose. in rhode island we have lots of people who are working for raytheon. those companies do more than more for the military. we should do more than encourage them to skew their technology toward the domestic economy, green technology.

i think we could vastly improve public transit and infrastructure in rhode island. i think all those workers are smart engineers. those firms have an important role to play in an effort. >> are you saying stop making -- stop doing business for the military, and convert them to other types of workark squawks not stop. we have the best military in the world. i think that is a good thing. we should be able to defend our borders. i think we can skew our government spending is commensurate with those mandates and federal priorities. weekends do that toward things that help build domestic infrastructure. >> president obama supported education commissioner deborah gives money teachers were laid off at the city's underperforming press cools. did you support the move to fire the teachers? >> i believe there should have

been a little more dialogue and a little more diplomacy. i believe deborah gibbs had to eventually fire them. i hoped it would not come down to that, but unfortunately it did. i believe as far as education is concerned we are not embracing some of the best and brightest in the country. undeour plan, we will focus on a financial transparency and accountability. i see a citizen-drin government. i see schools driving educational excellence. there are great institutions throughout our country that we can emulate. we are not solving some of the best and brightest and bringing that information obest practice. >> what specifically can you do from washington to improve on that performance? >> under my plan, and would create work groups for specific

areas. one would be for education. when people are disengaged with their government in the state of rhode island and nationally, which would bring them io the work group to form policy. what has happened is a lot of people are disconnected. the best and brightest have this information. we can filter out and get to the best information possible. >> mr. segal, those who want federal money it must base hiring and firing on student performance. do you support merit pay for teachers? >> i do not. it has been demonstrated to be costly and ineffective. it undermines the from work. as it relates, i believe that every student in the state deserves a high-quality education.

that is what i support the firing of bad teachers. it sends a message to bad teachers that they should avoid central -- it's a message to good teachers that they should avoid central falls, because they can be fired even if they did nothing. i think evaluation systems should take student performance into account, but take into account professional development and less-quantifiable and outputs. i think there should be teacher evaluations, to use the test: does not do right by teachers and servants. >> i have a specific question for you. he pledged to address the providence public school system when he took office, cicilline mr.. but the worst performing schools are in your city.

>> about the central falls issue -- i am proud o what we are doing. it is a stark contrast with what happened in central falls. i believe it is the collective responsibility of the community. parents, teachers, and students have to work together to achieve success for our kids. in provenance we have led the nation with san francisco on extended learning opportunities, crediting after- school programs and a new school day from early in the morning to late at night. we have a districtwide curriculum. we are in the middle of a teacher evaluation that will be a national model. providence is one of only two districts in the state that signed on to "race to the top." that happened because of collaborative partnership. we are all working together. i believe what happened in central falls is bad for kids and bad for teachers,ut we have to change the results. we all the kids in the state and

our country access to the best quality of public education. we are not just competing with the next town and state. we are competing with india, china, and germany. to give them the opportunity to succeed, which have to raise student achievement. that means investing in facilities, like in providence. we are building a modern, safe building for education. it has the best technical academy in the northeast. we have school funding. we have fairness in funding public education. >> on the central falls issue, are you saying you are against the firing? >> what i am saying is the approach we used in providence, to work in partnership. we are the first district in the state where teachers are not hired based on seniority. we have merit-based tire. >> you are not giving me the answer to that question. >> i do not believe the wholesale firing of teachers was good for the sdents, the

community, or the teachers. there is a better way to do it. the way we did it was by real partnership. at the end of the day, we are accountable to our kids for the quality of their education. >> mr. lynch, should twitter's be held accountable? >> ahsha course they should be held accountable. it was never shown to me that the mass firing of all the teachers in central falls was a solution to the problem. it clearly was not. they have not been able to mediate their differences to move forward. i take issue with the mayor on a few things he says about problems. unlike every other town in rhode island, the mayor of providence controls the school system. the superintendent serves at the pleasure of the mayor. providence has had and still has, unfortunately, some of the lowest performing schools in this area. and for the last seven years,

prior to president obama and secretary duncan taking the lead in getting communities like providence involved in waste to the top, which i also support -- seven years of inaction with in the providence school system. those children are lost. something should have been done. i believe the mayor should have done it sooner. >> the work that has been done began the day i took office, both in terms of work on a cordial one, work and professional development, work to identify new superintendents, work on a new model of an after-school program, the extended morning, new investment in facilities, new teacher evaluation tools -- all that preceded race to the top. umag to complent the school board. this was all done when the state was reducing and $20 million in its investment in education.

the worst that was done was done in the context of making the right investment. >> we are running out of time. 30 seconds, if we could. this weeke, attorney general eric holder said he is concerned that the mastermind of the 9-11 attacks may not face the dth penalty if he pleads guilty in a military court rather than being tried in the civilian proceeding where the death penalty applies. i am a jury is for you feel about it personally. should he be put to death? >> i am not in favor of the death penalty under any circumstance. i am not in favor of the death penalty. i am like every other american mortified at someone that sinister. i am not in favor of the death penalty. >> i oppose the death penalty, but i hope that his punishment is harsh and along. i think you can argue that life

imprisonment without any option of parole is a very severe penalty. >> i want to be very clear. i have consistently said i differ with some of the other people on the stage. any terrorist whose goal is to hurt innocent americans who is captured should be tried, convicted if appropriate, and the death penalty is appropriate. i do not believe -- i disagree with some people here and also with the president of the united states. i do not believe that terrorists, when captured, should bafforded all of the rights of citizens to civil trials. >> i bieve in the use of our criminal courts. in hundreds of cases before september 11 and after september 11, terrorists were tried in criminal courts and published -- and punish. in military courts, only three

it were tried. in two cases, the sentence was less than a year. >> mr. gemma, if you could, president obama is in a legal battle to contain all -- to to continue the temporary ban on deepwater oil drilling. do you support the ban? >> i do. >> a cicilline mr.? >> yes. this is important as they try to ram things through our waters. i strongly support the president. >> i am a lng. about for months i have been outspoken. this is one of the worst proposals ever to come before the state of rhode island. with regard to the moratorium, there has been no enforcement or oversight othat industry. that has become clear. i will not support a long-term plan debt moratorium for the

simple reason that it will bankrupt multiple businesses in that area. i think it needs to be done expeditiously to be sure those wells are safe, but that businesses all over the country are not part in further trouble. i strongly support the moratorium. i can't support renewable energy in the ste. i have worked on the wind turbines to see popping up in portsmouth and along highway, where re solar panels. i think congress should start showing for the oil companies and promote renewable energy in earnest. >> we will be back briefly. we are out of time for the first hour. >> we are talking about some very important issues facing all of rhode island. this is going to continue r another 30 minutes. righ now, we want to give the candidates an opportunity to deliver their closing statements. we want to remind you that the debate is not over. it will continue from 8:00

until 8:30, right after the candidates make some brief remarks. the order of statements was determined by a drawing. after that, the candidates will give the audience an opportunity to applaud. >> this election is about one thing -- who is on your side? but the corporations and special interests, we stand with you, working families of rhode island. i first ran for office eight years ago to be able is for people who did not have much. and every chores, i have made the people of our state first -- not the corporations, not the developers, not the lobbyists, but you. indeed a congressman who is not afid to stand strong for our values not just when it is easy and popular, but every time in matters for working families. that is the kind of congressmen are one to be in washington.

>> thank you again for doing this debate. this is a time in our country when we need new thinking, new ideas, and aense of commitment to share american values. we need to let people go to congress and fight for working families -- someone who has a record of delivering results, who understands what we need to do to fix our state. i have a record as mayor of the city of providence the last eight years. i know what works. i can deliver for our state. >> mr. gemma? >> i want to thank everyone for listening. i also want to remind you of our mission. i want to reinvigorate public service for the 21st century. it is about listening to our government. it is about listening to our people. u.s. seen it yes or no questions.

it is about listening. it is about me endangering ree re-engaging. >> a lynch mr. -- mr. lyn? >> tonight you have had a lot of talk about who can best stand up for you. if you are happy with the course the state is on in providence and you want to see more of the same, you have options to vote for other candidates. but if like me you are fed up with washington and looking for someone who will call it as it is, if you believe it is time for term limits in congress, i ask for your support and will advocate for you on a daily basis. >> thank you to the candidates. thank you for a wonderful audience. they have been waiting to applaud the candidates. here is your opportunity to applaud the four candidates.

[applause] we are not done yet. we have more coming up. but before we go off the air, i want to thank the providence performing arts center for hosting our debate tonight. we have tackled a lot of questions and issues so far. we have mh more coming up on our website. we will be doing that from a clock until endicott 30. will have a complete wrapup coming up tonight falling the all-star game. once again, thanks for watching. we are still on w onpri.com- a wpri.com.stillo on

[captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 20] clark's welcome back to the campaign 2010 debate, continuing live. let us head right to our viewer questions. what you think is most important to focus on right now? not a year from now, but right now? job creation or deficit reduction? >> job creation, definitely. if we get our people back to

work it will help the economy. that will help the deficit on the other side. job creation without doubt. >> how as a congressman at do you get people back to work? >> i am the only candidate year that has created jobs in the business sector. i am probably the strongest suited to do that. i going to look at it as a leg of a stall. one of those legs is aligning our government with what it is strong at. rhode island is most strong in education, and health care, in the construction sector. the other leg of the stool is having rhode island become the health and wellness capital of america. that is a multi dollar industry we can bring to our ate. that would allow us to create jobs. it would not only create jobs for consulting, it would create

manufacturing jobs to make exercise bikes. it is an industry that if we commit tax credits we could stretch. that is approach to getting people back to work. >> we will go down to the wind. it is job creation or deficit reduction. i am anticipating job creation to be your answer, but the par to is -- what about mr. gemma's charge? he is a businessman. is he the only one who can create jobs? >> i have done so in the city. this is something i can talk about. i recently talked to a young man who had been out of work for two years. he had been back to work. he said, "i could pay my first bill this week."

the most important thing is to create conditions for job creation. we have the fourth highest unemployment rate in the country. we have to invest in infrastructure, andevelop a manufacturing prowess in -- manufacturing policy. we have to provide incentives to companies to make goods here. we have to spend in a responsible, targeted way. smart and effective. at the same time, we have to have a balanced budget and responsible with taxpayer money. judge kristian is critical to rebuild our economy. -- job creation is critical to rebuild our economy. before we began at the court in providence, most people did not know whave $47 million allocated. now there are jobs. the point is there are effective

strategies to create jobs. >> mr. lynch, job creation or deficit reduction? >> we cannot fix anything in this country until we put people back to work. i have been involved and represented thousands of people over the years,mall business people who i see on a regular basis, whose maicomplaint is they do not have access to capital. they can barely stay afloat. i would never have supported giving $800 billion to big banks and wall street and than $15 billion to be spread across the country for job creation. that is when talk about priorities in washington being wrong. that is what i am talking about. we have to put pressure for making any stimulus money available to get that money into the lending community so people can get access, including here in rhode island. it is incomprehensible to me to hear the mayor talked about responsible budgeting.

providence has over a $ million deficit this year, and more in unfunded pensi liabilities. it i important that people look not just at what candidates say but look at their history and what they have done. >> i want mr. segal to jump in on this question. >> jobs are the comparative right now. in my capacity as a legislator, i have helped create jobs. one is the green jobs work i have done, legislation passed under my name three times in a row which says that the cure the proprietor of solar panels or wind turbines if youet paid for the electricity that you generate but do not use yourself. i think that is a great thank ting a great -- i think that is

a great thing. but also pushed for an ordinance that says that if you get money from the city of providence that you are supposed to hire local residents to do the work of your project. that push came to fruition for a lawsuit by helped organize against the executive office. now the ordinance is imrts and higher rate than before, getting employment for people in hotels and other projects that were built for tax breaks by the city of providence. >> i cannot control the way that some candidates run their campaign. i understand why they think attacking me is one of the only ways they can win this race. i do not have control over the way they run their campaign. i control the way i run mind. i will continue to talk about the important issues -- high unemployment, crumbling

infrastructure, oil gushing into our oceans com up our military in afghanistan. i am very proud of the work we have done in providence. we have eight ridings from all of our rating agencies. -- we have a-ratings from all of our rating agencies. we worked very hard this year. we did not raise the car talks are the property tax. we worked closer with a lot of communities. in a recession, the last thing we should do is raise taxes. so we put together a budget that responsibly manages our services and manages our deficit. for seven years, we have had seven balanced budgets. for this year, we are retiring $70 million of debt in the next two years. we are actually reducing our debt. this is really about hard work as a city.

we protect residents from a tax increase. we would not have been able to do that except for very responsible fiscal policies for the last seven years. >> mr. segal made a reference to an ordinance passed 23 yea before he took office no one spoke about it. no one implemented it. when i took office, we implemented that for the first time in 23 years. i am happy to report hundreds of people have been fired. the suggestion -- she had a birthday party for the 20 year anniversary for his wife. while he was having cake, i was busy implementing. [applause] >> we have a birthday party to draw attention to the fact it was 20 years old and not yet implemented. but organized a lawsu that went before judge fortunado.

he decide what the plaintiff that organized -- that argued the ordinance was not being sufficiently enforced. more people are at work today in providenceecause of thos efforts. [applause] >> mr. lynch, we are going to start with you on this one. do you believe there should be term limits in congress? obviously, we know you shouldn't -- you figure they should be. what women do you think there should? >> i understand what the mayor would want to talk about national issues and not providence. i do not think that is the proper way to handle this campaign. i will continue talking about the real problems. on your question, i think i am the only one who has said i believe in term limits.

i am the only candidate who has said that we need term limits in congress. if we are going to clean up washington and stop depolluting power of money, special interests, and lbyists, we have to do something significant, not a level around the edges. the only way we are going to change from washington works is to put term limits in place so people go down there for a set time to do public service and to do not become public politicians that surround themselves with corrupt influences. the answer to the last part of your question is a thing 12 years is ample time for someone to go to washington, do some public service, and go back to their state and do something else. iave said that even if it does not pass, which i believe it will -- 12ears is six years -- is to terms in the senate