c-span.org/lcv. >> in a few moments, last night's debate between the u.s. senate candidates in illinois. democrat alexi june juned republican congressman mark kirk. .

♪ >> good evening and welcome. it is great to be in chicago for the senate race and the race could not be tighter.

we want to get right to it tonight. we will star with opening statements and each candidate will have one minute each. >> people are struggling to make things me. the decisions over the last decade in washington have made things worse. exploding deficits, shipping jobs overseas, killion to address our environmental issues.

congressman kirk has been the architect of some of these decisions of the last decade. why we keep sending the same people back to washington, d.c.? you deserve a senator who will tell you the truth and fight for you every day. and will stand up to the special interests that role washington, d.c. you may not agree with me but you'll always know where i stand. i cannot fix these problems overnight but i promise you that no one will fight harder or work harder to make sure you and your family have a shot at the american dream. >> thank you, i want to thank the league and channel 7 for having us here today. i ask for your vote to grow this economy. our country used to number our debts and billions and now it is in trillions. america was a creditor nation and is now one of the top debtors to many foreign interests. how do we preserve the american dream when the average american today when he or she is bored,

already owes the government $42,000? in this race, i am the candidate that will vote to spend less, far less, and tax less to help save our economy. i'm a fiscal conservative, a social moderate, and a national security hawk, a centrist who will bring thought fully independent leadership to illinois and the united states senate. >> thank you very much. >> this campaign has featured an abundance of attack ads, character assaults, and mud slinging and a notable lack of high level of discourse on the important issues facing the next illinois senator. to what extent should you be held accountable by the voters of illinois for the negative tone of the campaign which has been disappointing to virtually everyone? >> i think this campaign has been about resume and background. when we vote on november 2, it will be about economic philosophy. if you are happy with the

direction of the government right now up trillions in debt, of the increasingly accelerating the spending of the congress, and the growing of the government into our national life, then my opponent is your candidate. there is a growing voice in illinois that once a check and balance that does not think we should raise taxes in springfield like my opponent or in washington, d.c. we need a new small business bill of rights, attend new policies to help out the real number what employers, small businesses. 80% of the job losses, half of the jobs. we know congress has hurt them and we don't know how they have been held about this has been a brutal campaign. it is brutal out there for many families. >> we tried to talk about our campaign and investing in early childhood education and turn the economy around and change the way things are done in washington, d.c., congressman

kikrk and karl rove have a different agenda. that is politics. to hear. kirk say that he spends less is an irony. no one in this race has spent more or borrowed more and congressman, you can call yourself a fiscal conservative but we went for a record budget surpluses to deficits. you voted for every one of the george bush budgets that has been a part of the overspending, overtaxing come over borrowing ethos in washington, d.c. if you are thrilled the way washington, d.c. works and you like politics as usual, with congressman kirk and karl rove, he is your man. i would be honored to have your vote. >> let me confront the elephant in the room, the character issue. congressman kirk, what you tell

voters to embellish a resume attacks what you say about someone who makes banks to unsavory characters and to student loan program virtually collapsed? >> i misstated part of my military record. it is a painful process. i learned a big lesson from that. i apologize to the people of illinois. the national security of the united states has been a life work of my. >> i am proud of the community bank my father started 30 years ago. no one has ever suggested that the bank has done anything improper difference between myself and congressman kirk is that i have always told the

truth and values matter. you may not always agree with me but what you will always know where i stead. people are sick and tired of washington, d.c. politics as usual. congressman kirk has to answer to voters. >> each of your campaigns has been dogged by personal stories from the past. looking back at how you responded to those revelations coming out into the open, do you feel you should have done anything differently? do you feel any of your statements ultimately discourage the voters? >> when i ran for state treasurer, i should have done a better job explaining the way that community banks decide how to approve a loan.

they look at whether that individual can pay a loan but we need to be clear. no one has ever accused my father's business of being anything -- doing anything illicit or improper. congressman kirk and karl rove have said many things that are untrue. i am very proud of my father's business. i am proud that he came to this country and has helped thousands of people achieve the american dream by helping them buy their first home. it is easy to cherry pick a few individuals out of thousands and make a nasty bulova ad, but any business owner will tell you that running a business is not a straight line. mistakes are made and there are people you wish you wouldn't have done business with. if we talk about who is right for moving this country forward and who will fight for middle- class families, there is a stark choice for this race. congressman kirk wants to fight

for big corporations and wealthy americans. >> there is a big difference here. i made a mistake and i corrected it and took ownership. naval officers were trained to take command and be accountable and i am and that is why i corrected the record. the difference between me and my opponent is he made a number of mistakes, betting his bank's future on a risky real estate loans. they did loans to well-known convicted mobsters and felons. even a mystery trip to florida. when we saw the broadway bank collapse, you took no responsibility whatsoever. when we saw the bright star program lose $70 million in college savings, that was not your fault the there? the difference is in accountability. i am not perfect but i toned up to them and corrected them. my opponent said nothing is his

fault tha. >> typical washington, d.c. sleight of hand. i have seen the congressman's reports and they are impressive. nowhere in the reports does it answer the questions that have plagued him throughout this campaign. he keeps pointing to these reports to provide answers to these questions but i looked at these reports and nowhere does it say he served in iraq. it does not say he was shot at by peacekeepers. nowhere does it say that he was shot at at all. >> the question was about how you handle your own situation and if you felt you should have done things differently. >> when i ran for state treasury, i should have explained how community banks work. the congressman said he is holding himself accountable and that is not true. he was asked whether he was shot at and the cars and never answered the question.

the question is, why it with this record would you not tell the truth? why would you make this stuff up? were you shot at or not? >> the ultimate irony of a man who spends most of his time campaigning for the senate criticizing the military record and never served a day in uniform and when you see this and i took my life on the line for the united states as many of my fellow veterans have done. your entire campaign is about a military record in which i served. i put it on the line. you worked in the rear with the gear and you made that decision. when we look at these bank loans to felons and mobsters, the people that were your business associates and on national tv you admitted that you did not know the extent of the criminal activity of the people that you lent money to, from a federally licensed institution that then collapsed and you transferred a $390 million bill on to the back of the federal deposit insurance

corp., i think you should have some apologizing to do. >> nor answer to the question. have made fiscal responsibility a centerpiece of your campaign, citing your opposition to the obama administration's economic stimulus because of its costs. what different course or courses of action which you have supported in 2009 to stimulate the economy and get unemployed americans back to work? >> if we had a much smaller bill with a larger amount of money for infrastructure, it could have gained bipartisan support for it is surprising amount of the stimulus spend money on social programs that had been rejected by the congress for many years. the failure of the stimulus -- we were promised that unemployment would top out at 8% by the administration. in illinois, it is 10%.

we have seen a raft of wasteful spending stories about what the stimulus tried to spend money on and a failure of its record. we could have built a bipartisan record on that bill but instead, the lasting legacy of the stimulus will be a near $1 trillion debt level on the financial future of our kids and much of that money borrowed from creditors who gave it to uncle sam expecting to be repaid with interest by our kids. >> again, facts and records matter. congressman kirk voted for every one of the bush budget which took us to deficits. more was added to our national debt and all the administrations in the history of the united states combined. president obama was handed a $1 trillion deficit when he was voted in and congressman kirk

voted for the bush way of doing things. the recovery act helped stem the second great depression. >> congressman kirk, can you be more specific about what you would have supported in terms of getting the economy corrected? >> one of the tragedies of the stimulus was that limited projects to shovel-ready project which means that the big payoff projects which in illinois would have been fully funding the o'hare modernization project or a new lock and dam project for the masses of their river -- >> you believe that should have been funded? >> we would have had a long economic payoff had that been funded. the house appropriations committee which wrote most of the legislation was told to spend nearly $1 trillion and take nearly every discarded social spending program off the table.

remember, every dollar by this congress, 40% is borrowed. most of it is from abroad. one thing i did after the stimulus is i went to the bureau of public debt and i asked to borrow money on behalf of -- i ask them how much we have to bar per week and they said between servicing old and new debt, we have to borrow $160 billion per week to make sure the treasury does not run out of money. that is irresponsible in my view. a growing chorus of people think that is completely unsustainable. >> will you go to washington to be a rubber-stamp for the obama administration? >> no, of course not. i have said repeatedly that i am going to vote my conscience and that means i disagree with harry reid or the administration, i will say so. i will help the people of illinois not to be a typical washington, d.c..

i believe in a job creation tax credit for small businesses that hire right now. i believe in a tax holiday for low to moderate income citizens. there is $1.50 trillion that is sitting on the sidelines in the private-sector and we need to encourage the private sector to start hiring, grow the economy, invest in infrastructure, create jobs right now because people are hurting in a real way. unfortunately, congress has forgotten how tough it is out there on main street. the unemployment rate is just under 10% in illinois and we need to create jobs now. >> you are probably closer to the president than any other candidate. you are one of the few candidates who is advertising your relationship with the president. the matter what happens on election day, there will be fewer democrats in the senate and of the house. as a friend of the president,

what mid course corrections would you advise him to take? give me two specifics. >> it is important to point out that we are dealing with enormous challenges when the president took office. there was the spending bill that had thousands of earmarks. i would have voted against it. i think president obama should have vetoed it. >> what about going forward? >> we need to come to a clean energy future. it is a priority for moral and national security perspective3 . we need to incentivize the private sector to start hiring. that means making it a better business environment and increasing access to capital. the biggest complaint in the biggest community is how tough it is out there to get a loan and get a line of credit. there is a bill that would provide $30 billion to community

banks, $12 billion in tax breaks to middle and small businesses. the congressman voted against that. that was a bill that was completely deficit-neutral. we need to increase access to capital. $1.80 trillion dollars from wall street, that as 18 trillion dollars in lending. we need to grease the wheels of the private sector. >> sarah palin yesterday said that the republican party is through if they do not follow the dictates of the tea party. what does the tea party get right and what do they get run? >> we should spend less and tax less to help the economy out. we are facing a $900 billion tax increase. i think a double-dip recession is threatened. we need to look at spending. we need to cut spending across the board including the department of defense. i voted to not have a second

engine for the f-35 fighter. i supported the plan of the secretary gates to cut -- to shut down joint command. we may have a line item veto proposal from the plaza the very -- from the president. anyway we reduce spending will help out the economy and the long-term future of the united states so that we don't become such a debtor nation in hock to every other country. >> i will try one more time. on the president's basic approach, what kind of midcourse correction does he have to make? >> as i mentioned, learn from mistakes in the past, i think there was a focus on health care reform which i support and for the long-term economic stability of this country it is an important step. we should have had a laser-like

focus on creating jobs. the people are not working, they cannot pay their mortgages or have a -- or supported market collapse. their kids can go to college. losing a job is more than losing a paycheck. it affects morale and image as a less secure nation. we need to do everything we can to stimulate the private sector. >> what did the tea party get wrong? >> the tea party focus on being a fiscal conservative is good. i have been very independent and backed stem cell research. i have backed be s-chip program for low-income kids having health insurance. they hate crimes bill was the conyers-kirk bill. for voted to cut subsidies big oil companies. i have one of the most independent voting records in the house of representatives. when i was in doors, one

newspaper said i was mr. independent. >> gentleman, illinois is the fiscal basket case, virtually bankrupt with a $13 billion budget deficit to $6 billion in unpaid bills, and on pension the -- on unfunded pension liabilities. the plan to bail out big banks and wall street and the auto companies, to what extent of this federal government responsible for bailing out virtually bankrupt states like illinois and under what conditions would you support some sort of bailout said there is not a governmental armageddon in states like illinois? >> the illinois economic situation for our state is terrible. my opponent is the state treasurer who has presided over much of desperate on pay bills by the state of illinois has gone from $1 billion-$5 billion this year. all three credit ratings have

been downgraded in the state of illinois. recently, the state of illinois even went to european creditors and asked to borrow money. they had to pay higher interest rate than mexico, a country whose economy and currency collapsed in 1982. i don't think the federal government should further bail out such fiscal irresponsibility by the states. i think we should roll back much of the spending decisions made vich.vernor blagov >> we have enormous challenges and illinois. i have been screaming from the rooftops as state treasurer. i don't have a voice on this issue but i have a voice. congressman occurred as doubled

our national debt we have streamlined services in the state treasurer's office. to hear congressman curt rail against the bailout, this is someone who voted twice probably for bailouts of the biggest wall street banks and voted against recovery act which provides emergency stimulus and funding to state municipalities that have been devastated. the state of illinois, this is a 25-year problem. going forward, states provide emergency services to families. the federal government needs to be a responsible partner. my biggest problem with recovery act was that when money was given to state municipalities, there was no requirements that there was some sort of budget constraints or accountability to make sure that if you get this money you will make corrections.

>> you don't think that's a good idea? some have suggested a race to the top approach to bailouts in other words, prove to make you can cut and you can raise revenues and streamline and we will talk about some line of credit. does that make sense? >> i think that makes sense. when money was given to states and municipalities, that was an opportune time to use the federal government's leverage to make sure there is accountability. this is to make sure that states and municipalities live within their means. >> congressman curt, are there conditions under which you would support federal conditions even only in the form of a line of credit? would you support a credit line that would keep government running without decimating education and services? >> certainly, i voted for an amendment this summer that cut

federal programs and provided assistance to the states. it was completely revenue- neutral and it was a surprising set of decisions by speaker nancy pelosi to identify many stimulus programs which were a complete waste and cut funding and provide key programs. my opponent just criticize me for a voting for tarp program and yet during the endorsement session of the newspaper, he admitted that he would have voted for it as well and yet he criticizes me for that the vote started also in that session, he was asked to name one spending bill you could identify and could not name one. it was painful to watch which is part of the reason why they endorsed me over my opponent for this office. >> the dream act to help children in this country become citizens as they come part of the issue of illegal

immigration. do you support or oppose the measure? >> my position is clear of the p that our seniors sat as circuit -- senator hatch and on this issue. people want leaders. they ask congressman kirk a few weeks ago on where he stands on this. he said he has not seen it yet. that is not leadership. we cannot afford to tear these families apart. these are young men and women who want a shot at the american dream. >> i think we have to restore the trust of the american people and the ability to administer our own borders. right now that trust is completely broken. there are two candidates in this race and i and the spanish- speaking candidate and went to school in mexico and i care about that country. residents calderon is in a death

struggle with drug cartels that does not have full control of the 32 states of mexico. we have seen that phoenix has become one of the kidnap capital of the western hemisphere. we don't want that kind of violence spreading across our side. our status and illinois is the state with the highest number of per capita gang members in this state. if we restore that trust and we close down the border and we make sure that for the homeland security of the united states that we accomplished a fundamental mission of understanding of who was coming in the country, we reward illegal immigrants who have played by the rules and we open up the space for the rest of the debate. until you open up -- and to restore the trust, we cannot move forward and we should restore the trust that if this came up for a vote, what will you do? how will you vote? >> this is not the time to do this. we have a decisive bipartisan majority for board control. this is for making sure that the

united states can defend itself and make sure that illegal entries to the united states is not possible and that all the other problems that could come with that are secured from the american people we have a set of leaders in washington who are out of touch with the american people. the rank-and-file members of both parties that i work with are ready for a border control measure. they are ready to establish trust. once we do that, the rest of the debate can happen. until that time, we have a set of leaders who are not interested in border control. they want a different agenda and i think we will have new leaders soon and we can step by step work on this problem by restoring the border control trust. >> are you saying that if this came up in the next few months, you no? >> we need to get border control first. there is a decisive bipartisan majority of democrats and republicans that want to get that done first. >> this is what people are sick

of tired of in washington, the say u.s. tennis simple question and refused to state his position -- you stated a simple question and he refused to state his position. we need to secure the borders but give them an answer. tell them the truth. tell the more you spend so they can make a decision on election day. you may not always agree with me, but i -- but you'll always know where i stand. congressman kirk votes for cap and trade and says he does a for national security and runs to the right as a senate candidate and says he would never vote that way again. on a monday afternoon, he says he wants to protect 6000 teachers from losing their jobs and 18 hours later goes to washington, d.c. and votes against them. that is not leadership.

let's hear where you stand on these issues. >> border control first and then later on the rest. >> congressman carr, earlier this month, you describe your campaign's voter integrity program say it will focus on the south and west side of chicago, rockford and the metro east where your pa j myigger the votes somewhat. it includes african american and normally vote democratic. can you explain whether this program is or is not targeted african-americans? >> it is not. metro east is 84% non-african- american. rs is that a poll watcher is across illinois make sure that we have a fair election. with the last two chief executives of the state of

illinois convicted felons, we have a problem in our state. we are the six most corrupt state in america. we have become a punch line on late-night television my opponent said he would launch his own voter integrity operation and he was quite surprised when i said that is good. if we have a republican in a democratic poll watcher in precincts across illinois, we have a shot at a free and far -- fair election. in a state known as the most corrupt in america, that is a good thing. >> i think it is clear what happened here. congressman kirk cox caught on tape saying he wanted put voter integrity programs on the south side and the west side of chicago and other areas. these are goons and thugs that

operate in florida. there has never been an accusation of fraud on the south and west side of chicago. we should encourage people to vote and you are trying to suppress the african-american ovote and that is unacceptable. >> we had a conviction just in chicago recently -- >> on the south and west side of chicago? >> you of all people should know that there is corruption in the state of illinois. that is an amazing contention that there is no corruption in illinois. >> one of the was going to represent illinois in an all- white senate. are you going to do anything extraordinary to represent african-americans once you get there given the fact that there

will not be any other is there? >> obviously, this is an historic seat. i spoke to president obama about this and i work hard to make sure he became president. i talked about what kind of senator we want for the african- american community. he said there has not been a true fighter for middle-class families. >> will you taken extraordinary steps to make sure that that voice is heard? >> certainly, want to work with president obama and focus on promised neighborhoods. i want to make sure we fully fund cease-fire and the the huge promise act. i want to get guns off our streets. and that is my struggle. >> i think we need an entrepreneur orial renaissance invade african-american community so people have a job,

dignity, and real power. one idea would bring to the senate would be taken a vacant property, commercially a vacant for two years, certified by the mayor and subject to no federal tax for the next 10 years if an investor cavemen and build jobs and made the inner cities of america and exciting to build a business again. we need to work with the communities to dry up the supply of records -- recruits for the dead. gangs.. we need an effort to take out the big gang leadership itself. they prey on kids in junior high school. >> this question came from facebook. this is from a 23-year-old college graduate. i am part of a generation of people who are becoming known as

the lost generation suffering from unemployment. this campaign has been more about making the other guy look back rather than telling us what you want to do to improve the situation. we need to hear more than a great jobs, cut spending, or the typical political talk. he is asking you to throw away the script and bring something new. >> my answer would be that we need to focus on education. a decade ago, we were the number 1 country when it became to the number 1 -- two the number of college students with a college education. we need to incentivize local school districts and states to work together. we need a more integrated approach. we need a focus and after-school programs and mentor ship and i believe we need to increase the of pell grants.

until we turn this generation around and invest in clean energy and invest in infrastructure, those changes will not take place. that is the fundamental difference in this race. >> i worry that the next generation has been called ninja generation, no jobs or assets. we should focus on education and we need a national dialogue and not allowing kids to drop out after two years of high school. we need four years of high school and prepare kids to join the ranks of a college-educated america. one of the key ideas i would like to bring to the senate is reigniting public/private partnerships for infrastructure development. we have forgotten our on economic history. the lincoln administration we

know. the third biggest thing they did was the 1862 transcontinental railway act that was the ultimate public-private partnership in getting infrastructure going. in indiana, we have seen this thing -- this kind of thing ignite the economy where governor daniels has had growth while illinois has fallen behind. it is the kind of new thinking we would bring to the senate. >> what does washington have to do that they are not doing now? >> i voted to lower the cost of student loans and to increase the amount for pell grants. i don't think we should adopt legislation with a complete government takeover of student laws for that limited options that are needed for students.

we have to look east as well as west.

>> should you revealed to illinois voters who is actually

behind these negative ads? >> there is a difference in what i call but paul harvey rest of the story. my opponent says he does not take money from federal lobbyist but it takes tens of thousands of dollars from state lobbyists who have direct business before your office. he says he does not take money from corporate interest but he is allied with the unions, he would not raise money from corporate tax body does take money from union tax. it is the rest of the story. the bright star losses, the bank loans, the federal lobbyists, you take a ton of money from union pacs. >> the congressman is a great

politician and did not come close to entering the question. karl rove is coming here with the exorbitant sums of money to determine for the people of illinois who their next senator will be in washington, d.c. there was a citizens united supreme court decision which i am against. it is a step backwards. there is a step that would put rudimentary safeguards in place. say who funds it and don't let foreign corporations decide who senator will be. will bake the congressman is bought and paid for by wall street firms which is why he voted for the bailout for the biggest banks in the words -- in the world twice and voted against suspending executive pay bonuses 6 tons and voted against wall street reform. he is owned by the health insurance companies.

this is typical washington, d.c. politics. people are sick and tired of it. >> if elected and serving in the united states senate and a constitutional amendments to nullify the effects of the citizens united decision should come up, how would you vote? would you vote for a constitutional amendment? to nullify citizens united? >> first of all, i would not. the key issue is disclosure. we need reforms that have every candidate looking to seek elections disclose their donors. we should do it within 24 hours on the internet. there you go again. you just criticize me a second time for voting for the tarp legislation when you're caught on tape that you would have voted for it as well. are you flip-floping on that?

>> we are getting off the subject. please answer the question about the constitutional amendment. >> i would be in favor of a constitutional amendment. i think this is a dangerous decision by the supreme court. mark kirk helped karl rove destroy the economy and karl rove is repaying him with millions of dollars. that is not what democracy should be about. it comes to a constitutional amendment, i would be in favor of it. >> which ever one of the wins this race has a chance to vote for a supreme court. probably the most controversial nomination of the last generation is back in the headlines today. jenny thomas, the wife of clarence thomas and asked anita hill to apologize.

did anita hill oak clarence thomas and a policy? >> i think that is long ago and far away. my philosophy on judges is that they should make decisions based on the interpretation of block not making new laws. the genius of our systems is that laws should be made by elected representatives of the american people could then stand accountable in the very next election before their constituents of their congressional district for their state. in the consideration of the judges we had with justice sotomayor, i felt she was too forward-leaning on a new laws. i would have opposed air. with justice kagan i applied the alexander hamilton federal standard will who says it is not up to individual senators make the appointment. it is up to them to make sure that the president's appointment is appropriate and not subject to family favre or corruption and to see it if it is the best

appointment as president at this time would make. i announced i would favor justice kagan. i would hope that we would have federal judges that were largely conservative in nature that always deferred as much as possible to the elected representatives of the american people to make laws and the justices interpret them. >> would you have voted for justice thomas? >> i mckee is this good supreme court justice but i would tell to that i'm looking forward the nominations that president obama as their president would make. with one, i felt he erred with one justice and the other, i felt that justice kagan was careful and considered. it was because she was careful and considered pretty it was his

choice to make. i thought was a pretty good one. >> let me give you the follow- up. is there any member of the supreme court appointed by republican presidents on the court now that you would have supported? >> i would like to agree with congressman kirk, that is in the past. the constitution is a living document. we need folks who are practical and fair minded and understand their decisions have a tangible impact on everyday lives. the biggest and example is the citizens united decision which is having a devastating impact on our decisions and the future of this democracy. these decisions have a real impact on our laws. >> every member of the majority was appointed by republicans. is there any supporting court justice appointed by republicans on the supreme court today that

you would have to agree with? >> i cannot think of any. the activist-leaving court is doing damage to our democracy. >> it is time for closing statements. you each get one minute. >> thank you for having us. let me just say that tonight we saw a stark difference between myself and congressman kirk. ultimately, it is not about me or congressman curt, it is about real people who are dealing with real problems. two days ago, i had a chance to meet a young lady. she lost her job last summer. she was seven-months pregnant and lives in your district, congressman. she has not been able to find a job. hundreds of interviews, hundreds of resumes sent out. she is scared and concerned about the future and is not sure what will happen to her family.

she does not know what will happen to her and her daughter may only. she doesn't expect the federal government to fix every problem in our library she does not want a bailout. to wants to know that someone is fighting for her part of to wants to know someone is taking her struggle to washington, d.c. kelly, your struggle is my struggle. your flight is my fight. your anger is my anger. i will make it very proud as your next united states senator and i will always fight for people who do not want a handout or bailout, they just want a shot at the american dream away my parents did the. >> this could be the most important election for the united states senate in america today because due to a federal court ruling, you'll have the opportunity to vote twice for united states senate for a first to elect a senator for six years starting in january and secondly to elect a senator for 60 days starting right away after the election.

you may have heard the congressional leaders are planning on a lame duck session of congress. it is a new round of huge spending and taxing bills that i think will hurt the economy and threaten a double-dip recession. their agenda could include $1 trillion spending bill, a bill to take away your right to a secret ballot in a union election and the beginning of a debate on a new national sales tax called a value added tax to drain the u.s. economy of money and make sure that the government is as large as the one in european states. i see to be the fiscally conservative, socially moderate voice that would defend your right to a secret ballot and oppose a national sales tax and rain back spending in washington. >> gentlemen, thank you both i want to thank my fellow panelists. and thanks to the league of women voters of illinois.

thank you for watching. please get out and vote on november 2. have a good night. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> today's headlines and phone calls are coming up in a few moments live on c-span. the brookings institution host a forum on u.s.-pakistan relations. that is at 6:30 p.m. eastern. >> we have reid wilson reid wilson from the hot line. then tennessee gov. phil then tennessee gov. phil