you are a young person who cannot afford to go to college? pull yourself up by your own bootstraps. you are on your own. this is an idea, this notion of theirs, that turned our record surplus into record deficits. you hear this talk about how they are going to cut debt and deficits. these are the folks who ran up the deficit. these are the folks that allow wall street to run wild. these are folks that nearly destroyed our economy. i bring this up because i don't want to relive the past. we have been there before. we have tried what they are selling. we are not going back. we are not going back. cleveland, imagine the

republicans were driving the economy like a car, and they drove into the ditch, and this is a very deep, steep ditch. joe and i and ted had to put on our boots and it was muddy and deep. we call them down to help, and they say no, that is all right. they are fanning themselves and saying you are not pushing hard enough. sometimes they are kicking dirt down into the ditch. making it a little harder for us.

but that is ok. we kept on pushing. we kept on pushing. we kept on pushing. and finally, finally we got that car back on level ground. it is pointing in the right direction. it is a little banged up. it needs to go to the body shop. needs a tuneup, but it is pointing in the right direction. and just as we are about to go, someone puts at on our shoulder. we look back and is the republicans. they say they want the keys back. gillon, we cannot give them the keys back. they don't know how to drive -- cleveland, you cannot give them the keys back. they can ride with us, but we

don't want to go back in the ditch. when you want to go forward, what do you do with your car? you put it in d. when you want to go backwards, you put it in r. that is not a coincidence. i don't know about you, but i want to move forward. look, because of the steps we have taken, we no longer face the possibility of a second depression. the economy is growing again. the private sector has created jobs for nine months in a row. you heard ted describe his track record here in the state of ohio. massively expanding access to education. seeing job growth, month after month. building infrastructure to put

people back to work. that is ted's record and that is lee's record. so at the federal level and the state level, we have been working hard, but we understand we have a long way to go. we have a lot of work to do. i know there are a lot of people out there who are still hurting. i know there are families, some of them still hanging by a thread. it takes me up at night. keep joe up at night. it keeps tech up at night. that is what we are -- it keeps ted of that night. the way to fix it is not to go back to what got us here. it is to move forward with the policies that are getting us out. 10 at anne lee -- tied and lee and joe and i have a different

idea about what the next two years should look like. we did not come from wealth. we did not come from fame. but our families understood, in america, if you work hard, if you are responsible, if you do the right thing, you have a chance. our families taught us that government does not have all the answers to our problems. government should be lean and efficient. we cannot waste taxpayer dollars, especially at a time as tuffets this, but in the words of the first republican president, abraham lincoln, we also believe that government should do for the people what they cannot do better for themselves. we believe in an america that

rewards hard work and responsibility and individual initiative, that believes in the free market, but we also believe in a country where we look after one another, where i am my brother's keeper, where i am i sister's keeper. that is the america i know. that is the mayor could joe knows. that is the america ted knows, that is the america you know, an america that invest in his future and in its people. an america that is built to compete in the 21st century. we know that the jobs and businesses of tomorrow will in up in countries that educate their workers best, that built the best infrastructure, that have the strongest commitment to research and technology. i want that nation to be the united states of america. i want that taking place right

here in ohio, right here in cleveland. that is how we are going to rebuild. there is absolutely no reason that china should have faster railroad, that singapore should have newer airports. we are the nation that build the transcontinental railroad. we are the nation that build the interstate highway system. right now we are seeing thousands of people working to rebuild our roads and railways right here in ohio and all across the country, trying to start to rebuild and infrastructure for the 21st century, putting people to work, doing the work american needs done. we have seen an america where we invest in home run innovation and ingenuity, where we export more than the import, where we make it easier to start a business or patent and

invention. we don't want to keep giving tax breaks to companies that are shipping work overseas. american manufacturing is coming back, and then clean energy companies. i don't want solar panels and wind turbines built in asia or europe. i want to make right here in the united states of america with american workers. -- i want them made right here in the united states of america. that is the choice in this election. we see an america where every citizen has the skills and training to compete with any worker in the world. we cannot allow other countries to outpace as when it comes to education. we have to be number one in the rate of college graduations.

we used to be at the top in math or science. now we or ninth in the proportion of college graduates. that is unacceptable. we made historic investments in education. just like tech has done here in ohio, we have set a goal that by 2020 we will be number one again in the proportion of college graduates. remember i said it is a choice, this election. the main idea of the other side is to provide $700 billion worth of tax cuts to the top 2% of earners, the 2% a wealthiest americans. an average of $100,000 for millionaires and billionaires. i want people to succeed. i think it is wonderful if folks

get rich. i want everybody to have a chance to get rich. you do, too. i think that is great. that is part of the american dream. but the way they want to pay for these tax cuts is to cut education by 20%. that me tell you, do you think china is cutting education spending by 20%? is germany cutting education by 20%? they are not, because they are not playing for second place. they are playing for first place. you know what? the united states of america does not play for second place. we do not place -- play for ninth place or 21st place. we play for number one. that is what we have to do in education.

that is wine we committed tens of billions it -- that is why we committed tens of billions of dollars and send the money to where it needs to be going, to students come right here and all across the country. increasing college scholarships and grants. we want to make permanent a tax credit were $10,000 in tuition relief for each young person who is going to college. that is the choice in this election. that is what america is about. that is what we believe in. we see an america where corporations are thriving and responsible, and play by the same rules as everybody else. that is why we make sure

insurance companies could not jack up premiums for no reason. or deny you coverage just because you are sick. that is why we major credit companies cannot hit you with hidden fees or taxes. that is what we make sure taxpayers are never again on the hook for the irresponsibility of wall street banks. we see in america where we do not pass on a mountain of debt for the next generation. we have to go after this trillion dollar deficit that i inherited when i took office. so in a responsible way, not by cutting education by 20%, not by cutting our children, seniors, veterans, or middle-class families. we will not do it by borrowing another $700 billion to give tax cuts to people who do not need them. we will do it by asking this o all americans. th is the america we believe in.

we had a lot of work to do over the next few years. ted has a lot of work to do here and in ohio. lee has a lot to do in washington. we need to work together. democrats and republicans and independents toet this all done. you know what? so far we are not seeing that from the other party i guess they are feeling cocky. the republican leader of the house says, "this is not a time for compromise. the republican leader of the senate said his and main goal -- his main goal is to win the next election and beat me. [crowd boos] ink about this. his priority is not to create jobs and get the economy moving or reduce the deficit. his top priority is to win the next election and we have not even finished this one. [applause]

you know, that is the mentality we are fighting against, cleveland. that is the kind of politics we have to change. those are the politics that puts scoring points ahead of solving problems. that is where all of you come in, each and every one of the. the only way to fight that kind of politics, the only way to manage the millions of dollars of negative advertisements that have been pouring down your throats using these fund groups, of millions of dollars worth of advertisements -- the only way to fight that is millions of voices warning to finish restarted in 2008. [applause] we need to get cleveland out to vote. we need to get everyone in ohio out to vote. in ohio, you can vote early.

there is early voting just a few blocks from here. you can go right after this rally. if everyone whoought for change in 2008 shows up to vote in 2010, we will win this election. i am confident in that. [applause] but a lot of you got involved in 2008 because you believe we were in a defining moment in our history. th is what joe believes. that is what i believe. you believe that we were in a time where the decisions we make do not just affect us, but will affect our children, our grandchildren for decades to co. that is the reason so many of you knocked on doors, made phone calls, and some of you cast your vote for the very first time. as i said at the time, changes not easy.

power concedes nothing without a fit. throughout the past 20 months, we have been pushing, working, and i have had a great partner in joe biden. i could not have had it any better. [applause] i have had a great partner in ted strickland. you could not have a better governor than him. [applause] we have made progress, but i know that sometimes as we are grinding out with a change and adsre is all the negative and pundits and there is still a lot of unemployment says sometimes people feel discouraged. i know the bill -- the

excitement of election night with beyonce and bono. that was fine, but now it seems like work all the time. then you guys see me on tv and you think, "he is getting really gray. he is starting to look old." [laughter] [applause] look. [applause] cleveland, i want you to remember this. do not let anybody tell you this fight is not worth it. do not let anybody tell you that you do not make a difference. because of you there is a woman somewhere in ohio who no longer has to choose between losing her home and treating cancer. because of view, somewhe in ohio there is a parent who can

look their child in the eye and say, "yes, you are going to college. we can afford it." because of you, somewhere in ohio there is a small-business owner who kt their doors open in the depths of the recession. because of you, there are nearly00,000 brave men and women who are no longer at war in iraq. [alause] do not let them tell you that change is not possible. here is what i know. it has always been hard to bring about change in america. think about it. this country was founded on heart. we started off as 13 colonies had been to battle the most

powerful empire. a lot of people said we could not do that. then they decided that we would try a new form of government. it was by and for the people. they said, "we hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal and out by our creator withertain inalienable rights and among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." that idea had not been tried before. there was the uncertainty of this -- of success. they knew it was worth trying. over decades they had to work to make that idea real. they had to abolish slavery, and get women the right to vote, give workers the right to organize. [applause] all of that change was hard.

imagine if our parents, grandparents, great grandparents had said, "this is just too hard. i am discouraged." what if they had given up? what if people had called them names or worse and they said they could not do it? they said, "yes, we can." they understood that the only thing that prevents us here in america from achieving our dreams, the only thing that might prevent us is if we do not try. the only reason we are here is because past generations have been unafraid to push forward even in the face of difficulty, even in the face of uncertainty. that is how we came for war. that is how we came through the depression. at is why we have civil rights, workers' rights, women's rights. that is the spirit we need today. [applause]

cleveland, the journey we began to gather was never about just putting -- putting a president in the white house. it was about building a movement for change that indoors. it was about realizing that in the u.s.a. if we are willing to fight for, work for, and believe in it that anything is possible. clevand, i need you to keep on fighting. i need you to keep on believing. i need you to knock on some doors. i need you to talk to your neighbors. i need you to talk to your friends. i need you to go and vote early. i need you to get your friends to vote. if you are willing to step up to the plate, ted will win this election. lee will win this election. we will rebuild our middleclass.

we will reclaim the american dream for future generations. god bless you. god bless the united states of america. [cheers and applause] ♪ ♪ sun coming up over new york city school bus driver in a traffic jam starin' at the faces in the rea rview mirror loin' at the promise of the promise land ♪ and kids dreams of fam fortune one kids helps pay the rent ♪

one could end up going to prison one just might be president ♪ only in america dream in red, white, and blue only in america where we dream as big as we want to we all get a chance everybody gets to dance only in america ♪ sun going down an l.a. freeway newlyweds in the back of a

limousine welders son and a banker's daughter all they want is everything she came out here to be an actress ♪ she was the singer in a band they just might go back to oklahoma ♪ and talk about the stars they could have been ♪ only in america we dream in red, white, and blue only in america where we dream as big as we want to if we all get a chance

everybody gets to dance only in america ♪ ♪ ♪ only in america ♪ where we ddream in red, white, and blue only in america where we dream as big as we want to we all get a chance everybody

♪

♪ ♪ ♪

♪ your love keeps on lifting mean higher and higher ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ your love keeps on lifting me

higher and higher ♪ ♪ >> in addition to all of this season's campaign coverage and archive debate, there is lots more at the c-span video library including nonfiction authors, the american story from american history tv, and everything we have iron -- everything we have aired since 1987 that the c-span video library. >> next, "q&a" with historians

and richard norton smith and douglas brinkley. then prime minister's questions with david cameron. after that, the final debate in the georgia governor's race. ♪ >> this week on q&a, to historians look at the upcoming elections. our guests are richard norton smith and douglas brinkley. >> presidential historian richard norton smith, how should one look historically at this midterm election? >> well, obviously, many will see a as a referendum on the obama presidency. many people will be looking for aspects of the election that tell you if the republican party

is going. we are a conservative movement. -- where the conservative movement is going in america. in some ways, there are unique aspects about this election, but it boils down to the tried and true peace and prosperity. >> can you pick another election that resembles that at all? >> no. [laughter] not offhand. we do have very unusual combination of circumstances. we have a war. we have to worse, let's not forget. we have to wars that are not popular among the president's own base which has contributed to this much talked-about phenomenon of the enthusiasm gap. the anchor doubt on the bride is

larger than the enthusiasm presence on the left. you have this age-old problem of an economy that people do not blame on obama. they tend to attribute responsibility for the weakness in the economy to the bush presidency. but they do not give barack obama credit for avoiding something much worse and they do not feel in their own lives that the economy is getting better or that the future of the country is inherently better. that is an article of faith for americans. if you lose that, the odds are you will not do very well at the polls. >> presidential historian douglas brinkley, same question. >> i think it reminds me of 1994. new gingrich and his contract

with america and bill clinton came in and they thought that this progressive era would occur. bill clinton got hit hard by newt gingrich in that particular movement and it has forced the clinton and administration to move to the middle. to me, the narrative of this to party midterm, there is no -- just like newt gingrich's track with america was historic, the question will be if the democrats can hold on to the senate. if harry reid and barbara boxer can hang onto their seats, it will not be seen as a slaughter. if a hold on to congress, the democrats could hold off the tee party wave. there is a book coming out with harpercollins and i guarantee it

will be number one. there is a reality show coming out called sarah pailin's alaska. she is possibly running for the republican nomination using the tea party. >> was there any other election? >> just the one in 1994 that newt gingrich wonder that as the one that is the closest to. it is a democrat that comes in with a feel of a mandate. clinton did not have a mandate. he have the ross perot factor. this time, obama was able to win states like indiana, north carolina and virginia. i do nothing that he can win those states anymore. we are being told that we are still living in the age of reagan, that america it is a center or center-right country. obama will probably have to do what clinton did and try and

delay. >> there are a lot of parallels with 1994. there are a couple of differences the weekend and coming out. republicans have not controlled congress for 40 years at that point. whatever you say about newt gingrich, one had a sense that they had crudely put together a semblance of an alternative program. this republican congress has really been more obstructionist. they have been late to come to the idea that we have to put something forward. the other thing that i think is different is that bill clinton, master politician, who had been a new democrat, who had been in the forefront of those moving the democratic party to the middle of the road anyway.

he was comfortable in triangulation. he had welfare reform. bill clinton masterfully quoted conservative themes and made them his own. but he also have republicans who were willing to work with him. i do not think that the left wing of the democratic party would let barack obama move as far to the right as bill clinton did. also, even if he did, he could not find willing partners who wanted to govern responsibly in a bipartisan way because they see blood in the water in 2012. >> i agree with that. i think you could argue that president obama has already moved away from his progressive base. he did a lot of compromising on health care.

he did not please some people on the left. more to the point, he did not close guantanamo, like he said. we are still in iraq and afghanistan although he is trying to get out of both. he seems to be torn. he is angry. he is angry at his base. he is angry that they do not get that he has to move to the center or center-right to get things done. most tellingly, and i think that the moment was when senator bennett of utah went down. obama was close to senator bennett. they could do business together. after senator bennett left, nobody wanted to do business with obama. the difference between 1994 is that the power of fox news has moved this political agenda. i think that the tea party movement has formed there.

glenn beck has been pushing as a spokesperson for the tea party movement. newt gingrich did not have that. there was cnn. he did not have that. tea party and fox working together helped to start this turn back of obamaism. i think that obama did a good job out of the gate. he did the right thing by bailing out general motors. over that first summer, he did not take the right seriously. when they started those town hall meetings in the tea party movement started, it was laughed at by the east coast deletes and they are not laughing anymore. i think that he needed to have done health care quicker. the fact that it ate up the entire first year of his presidency and a up a lot of capital within the democratic party is not doing well for the

president. democrats do not want to be in a photo opportunity with obama right now. that is not good. >> it appears to me that barack obama is a great tradition. democratic presidents always have problems with the left wing of the party. bill clinton certainly did. jimmy carter certainly did. ted kennedy's challenge. as we go back in time, one president said that the problem with the no. liberals is that act like kids all the time. truman talked about liberals. the ultimate liberal icon was pushed to the left in his first term. i do not know if it is quite the same corresponding pressure from the right. i think that there probably is

on republican presidents. obama is carrying on a tradition that he would probably just as soon not be. >> it might be that people make a mistake by thinking that democrat and republican liberals and conservatives are angry and dissatisfied people. a lot of that has to do with the lobbyists. it has gotten out of control. it is a very ripe time for a third-party movement in this country. i am surprised it has not truly started yet. it has -- it will be 2012 when it is exactly 100 years since the bull moose party. the very same circumstances were that people did not feel like, they were being answered to buy the right or left. really, there is more of a centrist america out there and nobody knows who that spokesperson is. if ross perot can get 18% back

in 1992, any decent canada can walk in with 20% right out of the gate. >> walk-what is the nature of the revolt? is it anger or classics and centrism? >> i live in austin and i have very conservative neighbors we do not sit around in austin picking our friends by their political party. i think that the split screen culture of arguing, and if you want to have high ratings, you have to have a food fight on television. i think that that is exhausting people. french ships are not based on politics. people just want somebody to get in there that is confident and that gets the job done and has america's best interest at heart

and it is a feeling that whether it is the left or some of these extreme -- 25% of the people think that obama is muslim. who are those people? it is kind of ugly out there. when it gets that ugly, people start looking for a third way, hopefully a constructive one. ross perot was an odd duck and he did that well in 1992. i think we are at that moment now. if you get someone, this could be a three-way presidential race. >> the obvious one it would be mayor bloomberg. the question -- the deck is stacked against a kind of civil, thoughtful, substantive, in some

ways non-theological, pragmatic consensus that we might all that here to. it is very difficult to imagine in this political climate. the present change, the '60s were not full of good feelings. the fact is that the prevailing mood on capitol hill was that you fought all day and you were civil with each other at night. at the end of the day, you try to find common ground. you were politically rewarded for making something happen. today, it seems the exact opposite. the political process exists, beginning with gerrymandered districts, for the internet. it keeps things from happening. >> there is a lot of blood on the tracks. the clarence thomas hearings.

bill clinton, when you start talking about monocle wednesday, it is embarrassing. -- monica lewinski, it is embarrassing. the left is ugly. i do think that people are tired of that. i think that the right has captured the tiredness of federal spending and being taxed and the economy. there is something about our media culture now that people are rejecting in a fundamental way. they just do not have a voice to let people hear that frustration. >> it is revealing, when you talk about this president's. george w. bush was polarizing. bill clinton was polarizing ronald reagan was polarizing.

they have all been characterized as polarizing. what is it about the last 30 years of american politics and popular culture that has produced the result? you have to believe that the media, including the internet, played a significant role in that. >> if you have asked me a president we would like to see right now, i would say to my eisenhower. i think that we need somebody who has a kind of stature. i caddis thatcher of being a supreme commander. -- ike had a stature of being a supreme commander. eisenhower build the interstate highway system and the seaway and put a lot of this infrastructure in the country. we need somebody that focuses on that. it is not just -- it seems that we are tormenting ourselves too much in this country and not finding a way to unify. i wrapped in a pianist -- iraq and afghanistan could of been a

unifier. some people think that iraq was a terrible mistake. >> i have an aberration for dwight eisenhower. but white eisenhower was a product of the time. so center had to write a book. there was a consensus being forced not only by the cold war, but we have been through a generation that had been known for ike. collectively, through the great depression and world war two, they would enter collectively be in the civil rights revolution. it was a water cooler nation. we spoke the same language. 40 or 50 years later, it feels exactly the opposite. it is a terribly fragmented country. what is that the media purports

bring up customer lindsey lohan going to jail. the trivialization of america is worse. >> what do you think it would feel like if you were back in the white house when fdr had just been elected in 1932. depression was upon them. factor in the media, how would it look differently if you were fdr? >> he inherited a great depression. we have been in a mini- recession. we had to deal with hooverville. 25% unemployment back then. it was a much rougher games. our wars such as vietnam and korea. we have to be careful about

thinking that our times are uniquely oppressive. people have had it rough before us. fdr was able to use media. he was able to use the radio and connect the country through his voice. to have a man in a wheelchair struck with polio to say that we have nothing to fear but fear itself and to look at his undaunted bravery in fighting his own personal illness and applying it to the nation and showing innovation. that was an era that believed that government was the answer. today, it is a bold black. -- a rollback. we are in debt and we have to start rolling back. is a totally different energy we are dealing with. everything is better in america right now from the average person that was in the 1930's. we have electricity. we have more people with medical access. jim crow has been smashed.

women have equal rights. our country has come a long way. we should never lose sight of this because we are troubled right now. we are still -- as reagan said, better days are coming. somebody has got to say to cut out all the noise and let's get some kind of leadership. let's try to work a consensus. maybe it is a general petraeus figure out of the military. it is not working right now. >> franklin roosevelt controlled the nation's agenda to a degree that modern audiences would find it astonishing. he decided what was news. he decided what was on the record and what was off the record. he enforced that. he have the nation's press corps in washington sit inside the oval office.

that is where he had his press conferences. he had the morning newspapers and he have them for the afternoon newspapers. he controlled the flow of inflammation in a way that any modern president would envy. again, if you look closely, the current and the last president. opposite sides of the political spectrum and different agendas, but both are producing polarization. i think cable tv, which enshrines conflict. consensus does not sell dog food. cable tv is all about people screaming at each other and at the very least, it is about reducing arguments to an absurd level of simplicity. >> didn't you have come back and, all of this competition among newspapers where you were

getting yellow journalism and people screaming at each other? >> it was a different culture. everything doug says is true. you cannot overestimate the emotional bond of that franklin roosevelt built almost overnight. when he took office and said that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself, it is easy to sentimentalize. the reality, after frozen unconcern on the part of an administration, the nation spiraled ever deeper. suddenly, this board at, optimistic, convincingly optimistic man with a flair for action tried something else. roosevelt bank capital that he could draw upon on letter tons.

he learned one lesson. great presidents do not manage crises, they use them. they exploit them. to build this a -- this exceptional bond. that is an acid test of leadership. i am not sure that we have seen that from recent presidents. >> one thing that is heartening right now is that one unifying factor is the armed forces. people love the troops. people of our soldiers. it is a feeling that the army and navy and marines and air force and coast guard are by and large doing an incredible job. i think there is some unity there. i had an opportunity to talk to president obama not long ago and we were talking about what surprised him and how many things can be broken, but not the military. it gets the job done.

is that old kent inspirit in the military. that is a big part of american life. if i have a trend that i do not like to see happening as a historian, i see that the federal government has been herculean in the 20th and 21st century. when i eat my food, i know it is inspected. i know they are checking what drugs are safe and are not safe. we have clean air and water standards and i can fly out of washington d.c. and have a sense that there is some sort of regulation. i do not believe that it is good to be anti-regulatory. look what it gets you. a bp oil spill. i am an american historian. i love my country. i like buildings were american flags fly. this constant tearing down of the federal government, i think that is not historical and i

think that it is playing on people's fears and emotions. >> a historical parallel. it is reminiscent of the 1960's and the rise of the cold water movement on the right. people tend to forget that barry goldwater became everyone's favorite conservative. . -- he became everyone's favorite. but the fact is, many in the goldwater movement were racist. that is simple reality. they were extremists in the early 1960's. they were extremists in the early 1930's. one of the things that i think is contributing to the ferocity of this anti-government phenomenon, i think it is too simple to say that it is race. i think that raises an element without a doubt. there is a substance on the part of many people that the rug is

being taken out from under them. we live in a society that they do not recognize. or that their parents would not recognize. i'm not talking about the issue of race. they see marriage being redefined before their eyes. they see the family under assault in their view. sometimes from government policies. they worry that the federal government has the best of intentions but can produce the worst of results. i think it is that vague but intensely felt discomfort with the course of history that is a significant part of what is going on right now. >> the federal government has wasted a lot of tax dollars. you can find it by thousand dollar hammers -- $5,000 hammers

and housing projects that never should have been built. we can go on, but if your just want to look at mistakes that the federal government has made and not recognize that we live in this incredible country. you travel all the way around, and you see vibrant communities and how lucky we are to be alive in the united states in the 21st century and how protected we are and privileged we are to be here. you can't take that privilege and turn it on the government to help them to get where we are apt to force issues like immigration on us. they have been able to do the right things most of the time. when i teach history, in the end, the government gets pushed into doing the right thing. have mistakes been made? sure. but this constant body of the federal government, i do not find it helpful. >> if you listen to the conservative talk shows, they

both talk about, all the right, the way the government spends the money. the way the government intrude in their life. the things that they like -- that you like about the government, that is what they don't like. >> this will sound odd. part of the dynamic is that this president -- frankly, his predecessor, averted a second depression. there are all sorts of studies out right now with economist right and left who will tell you that if the hated bailouts and the stimulus, which were so mismanaged politically, i do not think you will hear a politician

calling for a stimulus in a long time. that is not to say that it is not necessary for us successful. -- for successful. >how many people out there is no that part of this was tax cuts? another factor, people understand building things. people rallied around a new deal-ish program. they know that the country has been neglected. they know that the pipes in the street are not breaking any bridges are in danger of falling down to it that could have been a national unifying almost program thate would have addressed the immediate crisis. the impression that i think that a lot of those people have is that the president, for whatever

reason, outsourced much of the stimulus program to his allies on capitol hill. i think that they mismanaged it. >> that becomes politics. i agree. i think that the obama administration needs to do something to get the people going. people are complaining now. d. atkinson used to say that complaining is a nuisance to all. we have to endure. our country has a lot worse times the amount recessionary times. at the 9.5% unemployment is not acceptable. there are a lot of positive things going on in the private sector. what about companies that have an outsourcing? companies will say that it was the labor unions' fault and were forced to outsource. the blame is there to go around.

what we need is some leader, and maybe obama could not do it because there is a lot of racism. maybe there is 25% of the people that think he is muslim and there are a lot more racist than we thought. george wallace could win the south in 1968, but for whatever reason, and it may be his own shortcomings. we seem to be at a stalemate right now. the rhetoric is getting fierce and ugly and i am not seeing where our country is headed in a positive way. >> two quick things. there is the reason they were called the greatest generation. they dealt with enormous crises. crises that threatened to the survival of the country. they destroyed extraordinary character in the process in a

boomer -- in the process. in a boomer. i am not proud of the attitude of a lot of boomers who are at 9.5% unemployment. to put it in context with earlier economic threats to the survival of the country, imagine how things might have been different if barack obama, in his first week of presidency, imply that that he was a different kind of liberal and that he knows that we are spending money to meet the emergency. we cannot sustain this. we all know that. i am going to appoint a hoover commission. i would say the jimmy carter and h. w. bush.

maybe jimmy carter and colin powell, to figures that are of enormous public respect. they're going to come back to me in 18 months. a hard one to look at every government program and we are bottom, f, from top to look at the rationale for spending for it. it would have bought him some time. it might have inoculated him against some of the more extreme and frankly would have sent a message to his allies on capitol hill that we are going to sink or swim as 24 -- 21st century liberals. >> this january will be the 50th anniversary of eisenhower's farewell address. we talk about the military industrial complex. i was looking carefully at the whole bp oil spill. if you look at the oil companies, you cannot even be too punitive on bp because it is

a british company that is intertwined with the government. the corporations and the government are so linked through money that i think part of the frustration with the tea party people is that we are tired -- what has happened to the individualism? where are minority rights and individual rights added in this? people, all the time, there is identity theft. i do not think that we have learned to control it properly. obama -- everybody wants their thing. we are the facebook generation. everyone wants you to look at their facebook. let's go work. let's put in 12 hour days. >> yes, more worked, lest twitter.

let's get rid of the mirrors, electronic or otherwise. there is a sense that we are all in this together. the overriding model of what is in it for me might somehow be superseded by what is in this for us? >> you are really saying that fdr had it better and the country had it better because he could control the media? >> no. he controlled the media, but he was handled -- ended a crisis that he did not have to explain critically, three years in which the american people got rid of wall street and were prepared to accept a radical expansion of the role of government because they were desperate. what did not happen in this crisis, we did not go over the

cliff. in a curious way, what i continue to find astonishing, is that with all the rage in and getting from me tea party is that so much of it is directed at washington and relatively, so little of it is directed at wall street. >> when did we have the greatest individualism in the country? >> back when theodore roosevelt was president. i think that that generation, it was a really amazing time in american history where people judge you on your individual activities and your behavior is. we have lost some of that. i think that his work ethic. you try to work and everybody is off on three day weekends. there are no more to week vacations, people are going on six week vacations. people do half days and three hour lunches and we are not

making things in this country anymore. there is this inherent thing from our success of the united states that has made us a nation of very high expectations. i am hoping that the students now and get these dark warnings that there are no jobs for humanity students. they are getting much more civic minded. they are looking at how we can ism.s extreme humanitarian som how can i work in a national park? maybe this post-baby boom generation will be less preferential. they are even getting tired of facebook already. the 20 and 21 year-old are starting to say that that is becoming old. there is something in the air with the people in their early 20s'.

>> it is true. brought up -- boss there the -- prosperity is better than adversity. it is extreme enough and inherently shared. there has to be a shared response. obviously, the great aspect of american history is that over and over again, you throw the worst at us and we respond with the best. extended periods of prosperity do not challenge us in that sense. one thing that i would say, if i could wave a magic wand and and do something -- undo something, we have this distinction between fame and celebrity. teddy roosevelt was famous because he accomplished things. he became an environmentalist.

the astronauts became famous because the rest of their lives exploring the heavens. certainly, today, to get fame for 15 minutes, we have been drenched in celebrity and so a celebrity -- and faux-celebrity. .t is a malignancy > >> i think we are at a point where we are not working on a collective issue with infrastructure. what about the war on cancer?

why doesn't our country put all of our resources -- who would not want to pay a few extra tax dollars for a real war on cancer. we are getting close. if everybody that is listening is affected by cancer, let's do something big together as a country. unfortunately, the post 9/11 reaction going into iraq did not do it. i still think that president obama needs to find something like that that we can do. johnson tried it with the war on poverty. he got a little success with vietnam and the real it. maybe the time is right to pick a medical thinker that the doctors asked me if i would rather be alive in 1933 or today, but with modern medicine, i would much rather be alive today. think of dentistry and how it has changed.

we take it for granted. sitting here in air- conditioning all over the country, we have it easier now. let's get our fight back into something that unifies us. border issues with mexico are not going to unify us. if we have wars unify people, we say that we are all in it together. i think that we need to pick something like a war on cancer and really go after it because our medical facilities are the best in the world. >> i cannot agree with you more. i think that the practical difficulties of implementing such a policy, and i do not mean to single out this president, any modern president, i think it confronts so many obstacles in the way that the old belief pulpit -- the notion that a president would be involved in moral authority, there are so

many instant critics. there are so many people making a living off of tearing down what ever the president may say. >> that is why something like a war on cancer -- who would not join that? i do not care if your new gingrich, sarah pailin, or joe biden. i think that we have to constantly push these parties apart. we need to start bringing these politicians back together. i do not think that he can be done on all issues right now. i do think that we can pick something big and get everybody involved with it. >> one idea about fundamental reform of the political process. if you could waive the and takeal magic wand

the redistricting process away from the politicians and turn it over to a computer, as is currently done in a couple of states, imagine how, overnight, that could change the political landscape. if you have competitive districts that were not decided in the political primaries, driving both parties to the extremes, if you redistrict the country. wouldn't that be an enormous step in the right direction? >> it would be. in these midterms, i think that

president obama will be the democratic nominee and the republicans are going to have to -- i do not think the pledge to americans will get it. i think they have done a marvelous job with the tea party movement. expressing dissatisfaction with the way things are going in washington. i think that -- i used to love being in washington d.c.. every time i am with lobbyists here, you just start feeling like you to get out of the nation's capital. i do not feel like that one in denver or houston or seattle. i feel good. you feel like a lot of money is being mismanaged. a lot of this is with nonprofits. the clairaut annual banquet dinners. but they are not spending the money for nonprofits. we have a fundamental problem and we do not have the leader that is the unifier. president obama has a historic

-- is a historic figure, but i am not sure that he has been able to unify the country for a number of reasons. >> i wonder, because we do not know what is to happen on tuesday, but i wonder if there are people in the obama white house who are, in some ways, consoling themselves? goldwater was seen as an extreme, albeit personal conservative -- personable conservative. i wonder if the obama administration rush limbaugh and glenn beck as the face of the republican party. obviously, the black to run against the most vulnerable, most extreme republican candidate. the real test will be whether the republicans will fall for that or if there is a

conservative candidate who may not set their hearts pounding but is acceptable because they want to win badly enough. >> i agree. it is easy right now to talk about president obama's failures. but he has not sought below 45% and it is not hard for him to give back to 50% after the midterms. then you have the republican party having to beat him with somebody. right now, you get sarah palin, and she runs, and you have how to be an the gingrich, she will win. they are all want to go off the deep end. if she goes to iowa, may be mitt romney will be heard.

it may be that this strategy, as bad as it is, it makes the republican party -- it is costing the democrats right now in the mid term, but in 2012, it may be that the only thing that saves the obama administration is that they don't have anyone more center to represent the party. >> i think that if republicans make big gains on tuesday, what you will see over the next two years is not bill clinton, i think you will see harry truman. he brilliantly exploited the opposition. he had the inclination to go to four and try to roll back the new deal. -- too far and try to roll back the new deal. >> i will make a prediction. historians are not forced to do that. but suppose to do that.

obama will put hillary clinton in as vice president. joe biden will go to secretary of state. no one knows more about afghanistan than joe biden. that would be the first woman in american history. obama-clinton would be hard to beat if unemployment drops down to 8.9% and they are showing a little bit of movement. >> it is interesting that you ispalin-romney in the same breath. my question is, a lot of people would view that -- it may make a lot of sense, but a lot of people would see it as an act of desperation. is it necessary to do if palin

is the senate, is it more necessary to do that if romney is? >> hillary clinton deserves it. she has done a great job as secretary of state and they need somebody who will run as president. joe biden will not run in 2016. it would unify. clinton would still have inroads in the blue-collar places like pennsylvania and ohio. he has done a marvelous job for democrats in the last couple of years. he did not make the mistake of bringing hillary into the administration. he was told to do that. i think the unifies the obama brand and the clinton brand. the republican party that has the tea party angry at mitt romney, all i am suggesting is

that the midterm results -- is easy for them to score points with republicans, but obama still has an excellent chance of a second term. >> i would go further out on a limb and say that palin will not run for president. that is the big question. if she decides not to run and is just a cheerleader on the side and keeps her job at fox news, i think that mitt romney has handled himself very well in the past couple of years. if he gets out in the medium can get somebody who can get the day's excited, maybe huckaby that would bring in the evangelicals. they could be competitive. it will come down to five or six

states. who can win ohio? one candidate is looking at a real future with the republican party. >> there republicans are classically portrayed as a more hierarchal party. the question is, what will the fine 2012. as people -- are people willing to take a retrace or do they want something fresh? the dark horse for 2012 is the senator from south dakota. >> before we wrap this up, i want to show you an interview that we have with the president that leads you into the discussion of historians. >> you quietly snuck in a but of historians -- a bunch of historians. what is your relationship with

history? tell us about that. >> when you octopi this office -- occupied as office, you are constantly reminded that you are a series of people that have dedicated their lives to protecting the country and making democracy function. it is a humbling experience. i spend a lot of time reading history. just to remind myself of the standards that i have to live up to. also, mistakes that have been made in the past by the occupants of this office. then, having the chance to talk personally to some of these historians ends up being helpful to provide some perspective. particularly, in this 24-hour news cycle that we live in here in washington, so much attention is on the daily ups

and downs of politics. my job is to constantly remember that what i do here is on behalf of the next generation. >> in u.s. news, after the first meeting, ken walsh is the only one that i can find out that reported this, he said that those attending were -- did you attend that one? i heard there has been a summit. >> i attended both of them. i was very proud to be there. michelle and barack obama were hosting a book club with some historians. we got to talk about john adams and jefferson.

they always like to talk about the john kennedy and lincoln. i do not think that we influenced the president. readsk that he presidential history as a hobby. it is off the record what we talked about we talk a lot about theodore roosevelt. i think that he uses it as a form of relaxation and it helps to remember what other presidents would do. i think it is important that the president does this. >> let me ask richard to respond to this. this is from gary wills who wrote this in the new york review.

gary wills was not invited back to the second dinner, or if he was he did not attend. what was your idea of the president meeting like this with historians? >> i think it is a wonderful idea. quite frankly, far be it for me to judge gary wills for his conduct and standards, but i am old fashioned and up to look upon it as a guest.

if you are a guest in someone's house, including the people's house, you probably it here to your hosts expectations -- adhere to your host expectations. i once wrote a piece for life magazine where i compared barack obama to stevenson. perhaps, this has come back to haunt them. i am not sure. i think that it is a great idea for any president, inside the bubble, to try to get outside the bubble. to work for the perspective of history. >> gary wills went on to write --

>> well, richard kind of mailed it. -- nailed it. when people tell you that it is a dinner and you just want to talk about history and it is off the record, it seemed to me that it is not proper. i would promise you that none of us got into a huge deal with president obama on anything. it was anecdotal stories about the past did it would be no different than a wonderful segment here on c-span were we talked about past presidents. i do not think we have any influence on the president on afghanistan policy. we did talk about afghanistan, vietnam, korea in a historical way. i would not say that any of us

were being policy advisers were telling him what he should do in afghanistan. there was none of that tone or tenor. it was all like historical fair. >> i do not think we can talk about restoring stability to washington if we do not practice it ourselves. that includes being lucky enough to be invited to dinner at the white house. >> which president in history had a historian the closest to him? >> there were many. i think john kennedy with orders schlesinger jr. was probably the model. you can see a lot of memos that he wrote. he weighed in on the bay of pigs and the missile crisis and vietnam. >> edward morris with ronald

reagan. there were one believes that that did not turn out so well. he was designated to ride the authorized account of the reagan presidency. >> taylor branch with bill clinton had a very interesting relationship. i think what president obama has decided was to have a group of eight or so of us. >> we have to go. >> it was dinner. it was conversation. it was nice to know that he cared enough to talk to historians. >> it is little known, but president ford gave the author of "hiroshima" access to the oval office early in his presidency.

richard norton smith, douglas brinkley, thank you. >> you bet. >> for a dvd copy of this program call 1-877-662-7726. for free transcripts or to give us your comments about this program, visit us at q&a.org. q&a programs are also available as he spent on cass. -- as c-span broadcasts. .- pot casdcasts >> later, at a georgia's >> later, at a georgia's governor