had three trick or treaters shot and syracuse -- 14 and 15 year old, by probably children who were not in school, in -- in the gang life. with a look at education of kids in school and out of school. thank you. guest: thank you for that question. i am so sorry to hear that. that is an awful tragedy. .

campaign and is a former high school teacher. as a teacher and mom what perspective do you bring to the election that is unique? guest: i see what my kids go through and educators are on the front line. i see what happens in my son's school where he gets help from the principal, guidance counselor and teachers who are wonderful. as a parent you definitely understand how kids are so critically linked with their public school system. and, frankly, the more parents are involve the better it will be. you have to be there for the homework with and after-school activities. host: at the same time, budget times are tough around the whole country.

washington has had to step in to prevent teacher firings and layoffs. talk to us about the pressure put on the system because of budget matters. guest: this economy has been terrible. it has been the biggest recession since the great depression and we have to focus on what are the priorities as a nation. i believe the voters and know that parents of public school children know this, we cannot balance the budgets on the backs of children. when you have a child in the third grade and by the time the recession comes around he is in the seventh grade. we can't expect them to pay the price because we can't make the right decisions. host: what is the most interesting or encouraging thing you have heard from any candidate about education and the budget part of it? guest: listening to senator patty murray, she's been a champion of education.

she talks about the importance of furnish funding education. if we don't continue to fund it, it won't help us improve the economy. host: madison, illinois, keshia, on the democrat line. caller: happy to be on this morning. i wanted to say one comment first that i think the republicans are talking about obama's education idea of all. i think education is so important. i was late in graduating from college but i did and i'm proud that i did. i have a mall child in -- small child in school. how do you process the teachers that you know are going to care and work with the children? that is very important. guest: thank you, keshia. that is a great question and i couldn't agree more especially as the mother of a small child.

we know how important the early education is. i couldn't agree more. if we were to abolish the department of education, over 20 200,000 children would be cut from head start and others would not get student loans for college. so we have to look at this and make sure we make the right choices. there is nothing more important than a great teacher and one of the n.e.a.'s mission is to make sure we give the teachers what they need in the classroom, the education support professionals what they need in the classroom and buildings to make sure we have the most talented, qualified and caring class of educators. host: what do you make of all of this abolish the department of education stuff? it is nothing new. what is your sense of why folks say that and what they are trying to say really? guest: i think it has been a big conversation in the tea party and it is nothing new.

we have heard it for decades and it hasn't happened. the department has been established since 1976 and continues to provide very important services. i think people are looking at places to cut the budget. i hope they look elsewhere because i believe the voters, regardless of what they do tuesday, on wednesday morning they won't want to cut educators. they don't want class sizes to balloon and after-school class the be cut and they want them to have healthcare. so i don't believe that the voters in this country will want to cut education. i think it is rhetoric. host: huntington, indiana, martha, republican. caller: hi. it bothers me. why don't you take some of the money you are paying politicians and buy equipment and stuff for kids in school? guest: thank you, martha:n.e.a. does focus on helping bring

resources into the schools. but we do need to make sure educators have an opportunity to be involved in the electoral process. they are engaged in voting. i just spoke to a woman this morning an education support professional in amherst, massachusetts, and she was waking up getting ready to deliver signs to people who are doing sine waves in massachusetts. there is also a ballot initiative similar to washington state to cut funding for education and all front line services by $2.5 billion and we do not need class sizes to increase. we need school construction. i agree with your priorities and the n.e.a. does that. host: what is the n.e.a.'s budget these days? guest: overall budget? that is a good question. i'm the political director. i would have to check with our c.f.o. on that. host: back to the figure of $1.4 million in the colorado senate race, we can put the slide on the screen, the

"washington post" says about $5.2 million spent by the n.e.a., the "denver post" says recount looms large. what is it about that colorado race that has gotten so much attention guest: it is a critical state for us up and down the ballot. there are three measures there that would harm public education. senator bennett is in a tight re-election. he has been a champion for keeping educators in the classroom and he's also been an advocate for the stimulus where the president actually invested a huge amount of money in education when he first bail president. -- became president. the governor race is also important. host: how about arizona? you are spending $650,000 in the sixth district. guest: the person there has a

good understanding of what teachers need to make sure they are making students successful. he has been supportive of early childhood education, preschool programs and we want to make sure he has a chance to be back voting for them. host: support why, ill, valdez, independent, for karen white. good morning. caller: thank you for being certificative. you are one of the few voices where people will speak utah for teachers. -- speak out for teachers. my brother is a teacher with 30-plus years as an elementary school teacher. i'm tired of people consistently dumping on teachers for getting five years of education to go and average $30,000 a year and even friends say we have to be able to get rid the bad ones and my question is how many bad ones do you know and they hear the slogans and repeat them as if they know and it is a way to create the pressure at the lowest levels. being a police officer,

firefighters, teachers, nurses, same story. they are always the east cress to go -- easiest to go after. so if you don't want teachers put them in classrooms and figure out what they are needing. that is my statement. i hope you continue with what you are saying. thank you very much. guest: thank you. i appreciate that. your service as well. any time we have public employees -- teachers, educators, nurses, firefighters, police officers -- those are the things that in tight budget years folks try to go after the cuts. we know they are critical services to everybody in every state. educators have an honorable job but it is difficult. we need to make sure we do everything we can to give them the schools to improve and make sure every child has a great teacher. host: from twitter here is a

question. guest: we support a lot of different opportunities for paying teachers. we believe they are underpaid and we need to make sure we continue to raise the profession because it is a difficult job. teachers performance is difficult to oversee and you have to look at multiple measures of how to evaluate the teacher. the principal is involved. sometimes there is peer review involved. sometimes there is testing involved. we do not believe a single test on a single day is the best way to evaluate a teacher. that could be part of a multiple measure but a child is way more than a test score on one day and we need to understand that. host: denver now, ena, democrat, for karen white. caller: good morning. i'm glad someone brought in the amount of money paid to teachers because i have a daughter who

was a c.e.o. head in this and sent me an article of april 6, 1998 and steven wiggins of oxford health plan took $111,900 from oxford health plan. three subordinates had another $100 million. william mcguire had $2 million and lots of that was stock options and steve wiggins resigned right after that. the average h. phfpm.o. had abo four years in there and i don't know of anyone in the teaching industry or service that has ever made that kind of money. no one deserves that kind of money and you cannot take that out fof an organization of any kind. that was back in, based on 1996 salaries and compensation.

you just can't do that. it has gotten far worse since then. there were two reps, john dingell of michigan and charles norwood of georgia that fought against this executive compensation. since that time it has gotten terribly bad. i'm in my 80's. i lived through the great depression. we have seen nothing like what will happen if these republicans get back in again, nothing. i mean that. i lived through the soup lines and i lived through all the wars. this under george bush and dick cheney. this was the only time we ever financed a war without everybody sharing the cost and they borrowed and blew it all. i hope everyone watched "60 minutes" last night where the top 5% of americans in 1998 the same day or time this article

came out in the health magazine, h.m. "o" magazine, the top fi5% owned $8 trillion. half of that would reduce the deficit enormously. last year the top 5% owned $40 trillion. more than all the wealth of the rest of the world's people. host: any thoughts? guest: you are very educated and i'm impressed. you are up early calling from denver. my grandmother, she is 96, and tells me stories about the great depression and i tell the stories to my children because i don't think people know that you couldn't buy fruit in a store and you had to can it and grow it. to the teacher salaries, they deserve to earn a good living. they work very hard. they are usually in the classrooms between 6:00 and 8:00 a.m. professionals wake up early and get the buss to make sure kids

get to school safely. we have custody criminal workers making sure the schools are clean and evening so the students can be in a healthy environment. then they put money in school supplies and anything else they think the students need and work late in the evening grading papers and teaching after school and giving up lunch thundershowers make sure the students -- make sure the students have what they need. host: back to some of the n.e.a. expenditures, guest: another member of the n.e.a. has been very involved and understands the importance of what is needed in the classroom. he was a big supporter of making sure the class size reduction didn't happen with the education jobs legislation that passed earlier. he has been a big supporter of

early childhood education and children's health insurance program. when you have people like larry kissell who understands what is needed you want them to return to make the tough votes. host: why go to the state of washington, frank, republican. caller: good morning. host: another guy up early. caller: yeah. this is a three-part question. one was asked, what is the budget of the n.e.a.? and what are the number of staff positions currently funded in washingt washington, d.c.? and what are the sources of all of your money? host: we touched on point one the overall figure which you didn't have at your fingertips. what can you tell us about the size of staff and sources? guest: what i can tell you, i'm the political director so i work

in one small department. we have 3.2 million members that is joined because they want to make sure we are working together to provide a great public school for every student and give teachers what they need to be successful in the classroom. so i don't have specific figures on overall budget or number of staff positions. i do know that 3.2 million are very proud to be part of an organization that is taking the lead on turning around schools because we know the status quo is not acceptable and we want to make sure every student gets what they deserve. host: a call from vermont, kay. independent line. caller: i have a point to make. in your discussion some have called in about eliminating the department of education. in our small town people, parents who went to orientation at the school, were mailed gas

cards from the parents involvement. now, i called several offices and department of education and i got a bureacratic run-around. but this indicates where our taxpayer money is going. i don't think that is a place to be spending money is on gas cards for parents to go to orie orientation. host: what do you think? guest: i can't speak to your specific example because i don't have all the details. it could be a parent teacher organization or p.t.a. that raised money voluntarily from the parents and the school. that happens in a lot of schools. that happens in my school. we do fun fairs and fund-raisers and auctions to raise more money so they can have either technology or other events to get the parents involved. i would say the most important thing that p.t.o.'s and p.t.a.'s

and every parent is be involved in their child's education. in some situations where you may have a lower income community and you need assistance you want to give them every opportunity to meet the events to meet the principal and educator and see the environment. host: another house race, ohio's 13th district spending $550,000 on that race. guest: betty sutton, we chose these based on their record of support for public education an students. in this particular race betty sutton has been a big champion of keeping class size low, early childhood programs, pre-k programs, an joke for educate source -- advocate for educators. host: how would you describe the president's education skwraepbd moving forward? guest: i see a huge priority.

i see president obama making education one of his biggest domestic policy initiatives. we welcome that. obviously he knows the status quo is not acceptable. we know it is not acceptable either. but a lot of things have to happen. we have school buildings falling apart. he has supported increasing school construction. we have green buildings needed to help them learn new green energy to be ready for jobs in the 21st century. we welcome the partnership with the administration and look forward to continuing it. host: fairfax, virginia, julie, democrat line. caller: first, i would like to tell karen good morning and thank her for all she and her organization does for the country and bringing issues forward to be discussed lying this. listening to you explain the n. n.e.a. involvement in the political election process, why do educators need to be involved in elections?

guest: it is a critical time for our nation's children. we need to make sure educators will partner with elected officials at every level of government. federal, state and local level to make sure we offer every child the opportunity he or she deserves. when educators are involved there is a much better outlook. we have educate oors across the country. in california they hosted the largest phone bank and people making phone calls about a critical governor's race and ballot initiative and senate race there. we have huge workers lined up in maryland tomorrow where schools are closed on election day and they will hand out the apple ballots at the polls because they want to make sure voters understand who they believe are the most education friendly members of their local, state or federal elections. thank you for the question and we look forward to continuing to wo work. host: a call from california,

marie for republicans. caller: i want america to listen to what is being said. she doesn't have any figures or numbers of tkhradollars but the bottom line here is we have a new administrator with a high title putting signs on lawns in massachusetts. i would like to know what her salary but this woman won't know. she talks about money, what i'm talking about is the bloated pension. what n.e.a. is trying to protect are the pensions for teachers. they are unbelievable. and the percentile in english and math comprehension are 18%. we are at the bottom and what our schools have turned into are indoctrination centers to make sure students are singing songs of praise to obama. the american people know this is up side down. the home schooling the percentiles of math and everything they have, everybody here who is listening has a

story of some administrator in the n.e.a. who has to buy a new car because even though their car is a lincoln town car they have to buy a cadillac because they are told by the n.e. afpa. will lose this money if you don't buy a new car. everything she talks about is a better school for our children. our schools the more powerful the n.e.a. becomes the more money they have and the poor, the poorer the education we are getting. guest: there is a lot there. i don't defend it but i will tell but the salary of the person in amherst because she started as an education support professional 13 years ago at a small school. she is a paraprofessional and works in the kindergarten classroom with the teachers to make sure students get help. she started at $14 an hour and she currently makes $16.45 an hour. she told me she has to work an extra job and typically works

seven days a week between her and her husband to be able to pay the mortgage and make ends meet but she is so dedicated to the students and classroom and knows she has the skill to give additional reading help that the teacher can't afford for every student because there are so many students. she is engaged in this election because she knows how important the role of educators are in the classroom and she told this story to me today and he was touched by it because i feel like she is working so hard for $16.45 after being on the job 13 years and has to have a second job to pay her mortgage. so i respect so much people like jean and i hope we continue to work with them. host: to pennsylvania and the senate race. n.e.a. spending about a half million on that race between the representative sestak and pat too maniy.

guest: this will be a very chose race as many are. we listen to the national polls and we hear will is a big tidal wave coming and there might be but there are so many districts and gubernatorial races that in those areas they are going to colonel down to what happens -- come down to what happens there. so it is hard to look at the national polls when you look at the individual districts. in pennsylvania we had workers out knocking on doors with some other members of the labor coalition. we had phone banks running every night last week. i was getting in phone reports from members who were so excited to be calling other medicals to remind them members. i think this will be a close election in pennsylvania. host: we have talked house and senate. what about governor races? frpblgt they are critical to the n.e. afp n.e.a. in maryland we have governor o'malley who has been a huge champion for public education, students and teachers. in ohio we have governor strickland another big advocate

for public education. governors races across the country from california to colorado to florida and texas. these races are going to be critical. education is funded 93% at state and local level so whoever is in the state house will have a huge amount of decision making. host: is there an approach or idea among the governors running for re-election or the new candidates that excites the n.e.a. particularly? guest: when we look at the ones that we are supporting, we know that they understand class size. we may hear from people at the local level and they are under tremendous pressure with state budgets falling and federal government not being able to fund some of the programs they are under pressure to fund them. they talk about early childhood education. i hear governor o'malley talk about green schools and teaching students the skills they ned for 21st century jobs. we have to do it now so when

they graduate we are giving them the tools they need. host: milford, connecticut. independent line. caller: i want to thank you for being there. i have never called c-span before or anything like that. a couple of things you have brought up or other people. parent involvement. very, very, very, very important. half of the problems in schools today could go back to parents who do not teach their children that school, starting from continge kindergart kindergarten, that is their job. they are to learn social skills, respect for teachers and to listen to their teachers because that is what the teachers' job is, to make them balanced people in this society, in this place where we are trying to have

civilization. so, parents' help. i have done many newsletters for p.t.a.'s. i have a column for parents. when you are going to use it at home depot when you are buying floor tile to find out which is the better buy. when i go to sleep in is like home depot and those people who are maybe 19 years old can't even measure the wood because she doesn't know how much inches are in a ruler. that is number 43. the other thing i never hear about is teachers in public schools do not have yet social securi security. private schools, i believe, are different. but when you hear about high pensions for teachers or

something, they will not get social security. guest: thank you for this question. parental involvement is absolutely critical to the success of every child. we want to focus on the whole child to make sure they learn not only the social skills but the critical reading and math and additional skills. you are right about the social security. there are many states we have a provision called the g.p. ofpo. government pension offset and it is a problem for many educators where they will not receive social security and there are many members of congress working to make sure that is corrected. host: one last call, fort lauderdale. franc frances. democratic line. caller: good morning. at the start of the presentation you gave us the impression that republicans are in favor of abolishing the at the present time of education. i know of only one candidate,

and she has given a false impression and i would like to correct that. also, i have a negative impression of her organization. i just get the view that her group is more concerned about teachers than students and the fact that she used to work for emily's list which is the largest pro-preborn child killing group in the country is like the fox is in charge of the hen house. host: final thought? guest: thank you for that call. there is absolutely no question that education is an important issue and we have seen on the record multiple candidates running for office this year, many from the tea party trying to abolish the department of skwraelgs. i -- education. i don't believe it will happy because i believe the public understands we have to fund the special education programs and early childhood programs. host: karen white is the

political director for the n.e.a. national political association. nea.org is the web address. in a couple of minutes we will talk with the executive director of the club for growth of the talk will be conservatives and campaign 2010. we will do more expenditures in this case from the club for growth to the campaign. in the meantime, some news from c-span radio. >> are it is 8:30al eastern. more on politics this hour. democratic party chair tim kane and michael steele appearing jointly on "good morning america" offer opposing views on the elections. kane credits democrats with doing the heavy lifting to get the economy become to health and create jobs. steele says he thinks the g.o.p. will do well in the elections because, as he says, it has shown that it is prepared to listen to the people. the chairman of the republican

governors association in an appearance today on cbs's "the early show" says he is confident republicans will take control of the house tomorrow but recapturing control of the senate would be a long shot. he went on to say the election is not about the public saying hey, republicans, we love you. he said it is a manifestation of voter anger over outrageous spending by the current administration. an update on the bombs last week, the head of the t.s. afa. tells cbs's "early show" his agency has sent a team of experts to yemen to help with screening and training and upgrade the inspection equipment. the goal is to make sure cargo coming out of yemen after the current ban is lifted will be safe. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> in addition to all of the campaign coverage there is more

at the c-span video library including nonfiction authors and everything we have aired since 1987 free and indexed online at the c-span video library. >> this weekend on book tv's "in-depth" the best selling author of national review online discusses the election results and conservative movement and the next wave of leaders on the right. online our three-hour conversation with your calls, e-mails and tweets sunday at noon eastern on c-span 2. >> this year's student cam documentary competition is in full swingment make a five to eight money video and it should include more than one point of view along with c-span programming. upload the video before the deadline of january 20 for your chance to win the grand prize of

$5,000. there are $50,of total prizes. for all the rules on how to upload the video go to studentcamp.org. >> "washington journal" continues. host: at the table now is the executive director of the club for growth. thing to here is conservatives and this campaign 2010. we will go right to pennsylvania. $2.1 million you are spending on that senate race. tell us more about your approach. guest: the approach that we have taken in this particular race every race is a little different but we set up the new expenditure group after we got that opinion and we are trying to educate path voters about joe sestak's voting record. he voted for the stimulus and the bailouts and all this sort of thing, healthcare bill. and these are the things we talk

about. some oth some other groups like to assassinate character. we like to talk about issues. we talk about the economic issues is the name of our group is club for growth. host: what do you see in pat taou taoply. guest: weity he would make a terrific senator. in congress he served three terms. he said he would only serve for three terms. he was a strong fiscal conservative who was willing to say no not only to the democratic party but the republican leaders when he thought they were wrong. he is the kind of guy we would like to see in the congress. host: is he conservative enough? guest: he is right in the mainstream i think of the republican party and someone with real strong principles.

he is very articulate. he will be a great leader if elected. host: he say he would have voted for sotomayor for the supreme court? guest: i believe he did. host: what feels your reaction and did that affect your thinking? frpblgt no, it didn't. i'm not a supporter of hers but what he said was that elections have consequences and he thinks that unless a judicial nominee is clearly unqualified for the position the president should be able to pick who he wants and he thinks that should go both ways. so if there is a republican president or a democratic senate they should generally confer. that is his approach. host: certainly broadened this discussion nationally and any specific races that folks want to bring up. david keating the executive director of the club for growth. the phone numbers are on the bottom of the screen. democrats 202-737-0002,

republicans 202-737-0001 and independents 0205. club for growth spent roughly $6.1 million in campaign 2010. beyond that amount in pennsylvania you spent about $750,000 in the big nevada senate race. who knows which way that go. the question for you is would harry reid, defeating him be a trophy for you? guest: a lot of peel had a huge -- people had a huge role in that so it would be a huge victory to see shaerpb angle in the -- sharon angle in the senate. our pac endorsed her during the primary. we ran a good number of ads to help push her over the top and it has been close. host: what do you see in her? guest: she is another woman who has had a long record in the state legislature there and

another person who is willing to say no to the party leadership of her own party when she thinks they are going astray from the republican mainstream message. there was a huge tax increase a number of years ago that the governor is pushing and she led the opposition to that. then there was this court decision overturning a tax limitation in the state constitution and she kept the fight going until they got a victory. host: harry reid said over the weekend he would schedule a vote quickly over immigration after he gets in. guest: really? i didn't see that. host: we go to brooklyn, new york, for the first call. mark on the independent line. stpwhr caller: good morning. i have always been a big proponent of club for growth candidates and issues but this time it seems like the tax cuts that are being promoted really

won't do such a good job. i have been doing a lot of reading and listening to folks and saying all this stuff about small business is not really true, you know. very few small businesses that are truly small like the grocery store on my corner or the dry cleaner, very few of them won't be getting the tax cuts. it is really large companies that will be getting the bulk of the so-called small business tax cuts. i'm wondering if you have some statistics on that. they said only about 3% of small businesses would receive these tax cuts. is there something you could tell us about that? guest: well, the tax cuts go basically across the board. obviously there is a difference in how much the tax relief is. the important part right now is we have a lot of economic uncertainty and one huge factor is what is my tax rate going to be.

we don't know what the tax rate will be two months from now much less two years from now. so i think a big plus that congress and the president could do is just take the current tax system and extend it hopefully permanently but at least for a couple of years to try to get past this economic uncertainty. the other part of the question, small businesses and sizes, obviously the small corner grocery may not get as much a tax break from extending the cuts. but if there is a larger small business that may have dozens or hundreds of employees. so, it is a combination of things. host: call from ohio, republican, bill. caller: good morning, david. i would like to know when will congress and the house of representatives get back to the business at happened about getting rid of the illegals and another question i have is what will they do about minimum wage?

because minimum wage people that have lesser education deserve to make a good living and a good hourly wage. and also these companies like k-mart and big lots and so fo h forth, why isn't it the concern of congress and the senate that they see that their employees are guaranteed 40 hours a week? guest: well, i guess a couple of questions there. what is congress going to do something about the illegal immigration problem. that is a good question. it is not really clear to me. they have appropriated more money for border patrols. i'm not really sure we are going to see much change if the republicans take over the house at least on this issue for the next couple of years. probably will take the presidential election and even then may not change. the other question is what is going to happen with the minimum

wage. i really don't see any change there either. host: we have the harry reid story saying he promises vote on illegals. over the weekend he promised to force the senate to vote on an immigration bill in a lame duck session. he is in a desperate battle to keep his seat. he told the show he has the right to choose what reaches the floor. guest: i think this is harry reid who is trying to turn out the hispanic vote in nevada and this is a last tkaditch attempt do that. he can bring something to the floor but can't make people vote for it. host: doris from abilene, texas, on the phone. caller: first i would like to say i think president obama is doing a great job. this country can't stop on an dime and fix itself. we are working with the right

direction. another thing that i would like to say is the independent candidates, some of the things they are talking about in eliminating are very extreme. i don't think that they are very educated on how the money is being spent in congress. also, the comments they are making as far as taking action by picking up weapons and overthrowing the government. at what point do we not see this as terrorist threats? if the average person were to say that they would be arrested or even investigated. but these people are clearly making terrorist threats. guest: well, i mean first i don't know of any independent candidate who is running for congress right now that has a chance of winning. the only one that is remotely

close is lisa murkowski but she is a republican. so i don't hear that. as far as picking up weapons and taking over the government. i don't hear any candidates saying that as part of their campaign or any other time. host: call from pennsylvania, desmond, india. caller: good morning. mr. keaton, the republicans said the tax break expired in three years. we tried them for three years. it didn't work. why should we stepped th -- why should we extend them? guest: actually, they were passed in 2001 and 2003 and they were to expire at the end of 2010. this was done because the budget act and the negotiations they had politically at the time, they couldn't pass something that was permanent. that is why they did that that

way. why they should extend it? one key thing, in the economy we have a lot of uncertainty. people don't know what the tax rates are going to be in a couple of month or a year from now or a couple of years from now. they don't know what the spending is going to be. there is a lot of uncertainty about regulation and uncertainty about the money supply. a lot of uncertainty about the trade policy. when you look at the key factors of what makes for a healthy economy is a currency you can count on in terms of of its value, reasonable rules on spending and tax policy meaning controlled spending and some predictability on tax policy and low rates hopefully. and trade and regulations that are both where people can count on rules as well with a lot of uncertainty we can extend the t taxes, the tax system the way if is and gives people a couple of

years of planning. host: back to continue to follow the money, mr. keating, to colorado $613,000 that your group is spending on that big and very close senate race. what has your game been in colorado? guest: it was a similar approach that we have been doing in the other states where we talk about the key issues that we think are the big issues concerning the voters. the healthcare bill votes, out of control spending, bailouts. it has been there 18 months but we have a clock spinning showing all the votes. he hasn't shown any independence from the regular democratic party line and we want people there to know that. so, that is going to be one of the close races to the end. host: you mentioned healthcare. is this talk of repeal something

real or just in the campaign? guest: i think it is definitely real. you look at the polls, people are -- they like it less now than when it was passed. and i think there is a consensus in the country to repeal it and start over. if the losses are big enough tomorrow, maybe president obama will take another look at it. i hope so. host: nashville, tennessee, j.d. on the line for republicans for david keating. caller: good morning. i wouldn't hold my breath as far as obama cooperating with the new republican congress because he's objects continue nate, arrogant and he is not going to cooperate. he is going to throw a fit like all the democrats are going to throw a fit because we took away their toys. what i would like to say is a comment of the idiocy of heard from the american people on c-span. if it were up to me right now i

would pull all public funding for c-span and npr. there is nothing but indoctrination and propaganda being spewed over c-span and npr and the american public, i'm sick of them being taken advantage of and being fleeced by you phony bastards. host: there is no public funding here in our shop but anything more broadly? guest: that was the first comment i was going to say i thought c-span was funded by the cable industry. host: we are, yes. guest: so, no public funding there so i don't know what objection there is to that. host: we now go to ohio, eric, democrat. caller: hi. i would like to ask the guest about free trade. i know you pretty much represent big business, so while you lay

out your plan on eliminating that from free trade deals what is your opinion on that? guest: we actually like free trade. both for economic issues but also for moral issues and consumer issues. if we eliminate free trade or just trade in means we are telling you that you can't buy certain things or you can only buy things made in the united states. one reason why the united states is one of the richest countries in the world is we have a free trade zone here in the united states. it means people in pennsylvania can buy things from people in wisconsin or california or colorado and that state can't limit the import into pennsylvania. likewise, those states can't tax other states' products. that is leading to an economic boom in the united states over the centuries. the same principle if you apply around the world is something

that leads to gains for everyone. basically, everyone will do, around the world as we do in the united states everyone will do what he do best and if you do that you will do a better job. that will lead to more wealth or income and things like that. it also leads to lower prices for consumers. i think it is a win-win. have some lost jobs? yes, they are easy to see when they are lost. it is harder to see when jobs are gained from trade because it is not like a politician has a ribbon cutting for the caterpillar factory that is shipping more earth-moving equipment to south america. so, definitely trade is helpful. we benefit a lot from lower prices and we benefit from shipping our products overseas. host: your group has poured more than $400,000 in the south carolina fifth district race. very, very tight one.

a long-time member could lose. guest: well, it is first of all, nick mulvaney we think is a great candidates another candidate we look for, willing to stand up for fiscal and economic conservative principles and another person who has worked against his own party leadership. they threatened to rewrite his district lines if he didn't toe the line and we think he would be a great independent voice in the congress. and it would be a big symbolic win if he were able to defeat the chairman of the budget committee. he was the driving force behind these spending budgets that president obama proposed. host: you mentioned the party. "time" magazine has party crashers, several republicans. meg whitman, mr. rubio, mr. paul, christine o'donnell.

can they govern if what is your answer to that? guest: they can definitely govern. some of them obviously have never been elected before. meg whitman has run a huge company successfully. i think rubio has the most experience the former speaker of the house of representatives. you don't do that unless can you govern and you have to get the bills through the house of representatives and get them signed by the government. host: let me get your reaction to a comment from general bush in "new york times" today. john harwood is the byline the looming victories for republican candidates is not a validation of the republican party at all. he argued they would reflect a repudiation of the massive overreach by mr. obama and democrats and disgust with the political class for its failure to cooperate and deliver results. it could create a middle ground he concluded or it could create a dismemberment of our political

parties. any thoughts? guest: i think he is right on target. the democrats got elected and overreached and we are seeing a massive reaction. to me, the question about the gains republicans will make is how far back you have to go to see a larger loss of seats by the president's party during a mid term. and it may be something you would have to go back over 70 years. on the other hand, there is a risk for republicans. if they go back to the way they were before they lost the majority, then the american people are going to be looking for new alternatives. if there is ever a time for an independent party to spring up now might be the time if the republicans don't deliver. host: an opinion piece in the "wall street journal" by a person we quote all the time it is a vote against democrats, not

for the g.o.p. how about that? guest: i think that he is right. i think that voters are dissatisfied with where the congress and president obama has taken the country. clearly, to me this is one of the more amazing political things. when senator kennedy died there was this special election and a republican got elected in massachusetts. that was a very powerful message being sent. yet, they ignored it and ran with the healthcare bill through without any significant changes. so, the public has been trying to send a message for a while and it is like they haven't heard it. and so i think scott is right. this is a vote for -- against the democrats and hopefully they will get the message. host: carson city, nevada, gene, independent. caller: hi, david.

you are advocating endorsing a candidate for senate. and it has been duly noted is her vilification of social security, medicare and other important programs that have been in place for quite a while. the other thing that is duly noted is that she appears to be more immersed in these taxpayer entitlement programs like the simple service retirement system and her own tenure as a teacher has placed her in the public employee retirement system. if social security were to implode there is talk taxpayers state by state utilizing ballot initiatives to force open the public employee retirement systems to themselves as it w e were. the talk is the only thing wrong with public retirement systems is the public can't be in them. the other thing, too, would you support a ballot initiative to opening the systems to every tax

pa pair. with trade agreements, aren't they really a euphemism for job exportation bills? guest: i guess the first question was, would we support ballot initiatives to open the public employee pension systems to taxpayers and i would say no, we wouldn't. because in virtually every -- well, in many states these retirement systems are not well funded. they are unsound. so it you were to open it up to more people you would probably just make it worse. what they need to do is put the programs on a sound financial footing. that is one reason california is in such desperate straits as well as new jersey. the second question about trade is just a job exporting scheme, the easiest way to think of this is remember the united states of america is a free trade zone. the founding fathers when they wrote the constitution wrote it

that way because they didn't want a trade war between the states. they didn't want the states having trade wars and it served us well. people who talk about jobs being exported from new york to massachusetts or vice versa. our country has prospered. the same thinking can happen if we trade with our neighbors around the world. we all do what we do best and we will be better off and we will also -- if we are trading with each other this is one thing people don't talk about too much but it is hard to go to war or make an enemy out of a trading partner. so, i think that there is social security and peace aspects of this that people don't think about. host: let's take a couple of calls back to back. bronx, new york, tony, up first republican. tony, are you there? tony in the bronx. can't hear tony. we will try miles from memphis,

tennessee. yes. host: go ahead, miles. caller: how are you today? how are you, mr. keating? i would like to respond to the gentleman that was saying the platform of c-span was basically a bad platform but you give us a platform to speak our voice. i appreciate it and you are doing a great job. caller: thanks. -- host: thanks. anything for our guest? caller: with the new type of regulations that we have on healthcare an education do you see a chance for development of growth in the american economy? guest: actually, i think that the healthcare bill is something that is very bad for creating jobs in the economy here. one of the -- the whole world has been free-loading off the

united states in the healthcare sector in both drugs and medical devices. with the new regulations in the healthcare bill, i think we will see less innovation and fewer jobs because of it. it is something that frightens me for three issues. one fiscally i think if it stays in effect it will be a long-term fiscal disaster for the country. two, job-wise i think it will crush innovation in the united states. so, it is not only bad for jobs but, three, it makes me worry about my kids and their future medically. if they become sick in the future, there may be some new device or drug not invented by the time they get the disease where they can get healthy again. so i'm worried on three fronts. host: mclean, virginia, peter, republican. caller: could you speak to the issue of corporate tax rates in

the united states and how they compare to corporate tax rates in the rest of the word? and also ultimately how this impacts the ability of american corporations to generate jobs. guest: we are definitely becoming less competitive over time. we have one of the higher corporate tax rates around the world and it is -- this is where i always get a chuckle that we are so bad politically. i see so many ads where the condem democrats talk about the republican being in favor of tax breaks for shipping jobs overseas. they have it backwards. what you have is the democrats in congress wanting to keep high tax rates here in the united stat states, which makes corporations want to stay overseas. in fact, if you are an american company and you have operations all over the world, you have definitely a disincentive not to bring the money back to the united states where it will be

taxed immediately at 35%. so our tax system is keeping jobs overseas rather than bringing them here to the united states. host: goose agreeing, south carolina, michael, an independent caller. caller: i would like to ask you this is two times you referred to free trade with the founding fathers.

and i think part of the concern is that states would try to limit other states. we have a free-trade zone here in the united states and my simple point was if people not only here, but in other

countries to do with they do best we will all be better off for it. as i said earlier, there are also other potential benefits from trading with other people of on the world. we are less likely to see wars from the world if people are trading with each other peacefully. i understand you are saying, but i do not think the means you have no trade agreements. you come up with a trade agreement for -- with some other standards. i think we need to talk about it as opposed to saying no trade at all. if we will all be worse off if that happens. host: how is the club growth? guest: have other 50,000 members around the country. people set their own use. the average member gives about $50 per year.

host: of that money has gone to the florida senate race that we touched on briefly earlier. ud-dawa is at stake for the club in florida? guest: i think rubio -- host: what is at stake for the club in florida? guest: i think rubio is going to win that race. charlie crist, when he became independent, all of his opinions changed, so we do not know what he would do. kendrick meek, he votes party- line democrat. i think marco rubio will be good for the senate. host: jon wiener is featured herein "the national journal," a lengthy piece. what kind of speaker would he make? guest: that is a good question.

i think you will see some differences, but i really do not know. i think he will be a fresh approach on a lot of issues, and one is, spending. i think he has gotten the message that republicans have to do what they say they are going to do and not just talk about it. republicans cannot be a pork- barrel type party. they have to reduce spending. host: this is a short little piece in "the wall street journal." what is your reaction to that? guest: not surprised that he wants to run again. i do not know if he will win. enough forgged in the people who vote for this post. when he ran the first time it was a hotly contested race.

my guess is that it will be again. host: let me ask you about sarah palin. a viable candidate? guest: she was in the primary. we will have to see how she will do when she does run. host: back to the calls, jeff, good morning. caller: this is a an organization that i consider a scam organization that pretends to be conservative. i have to point it out. i also want to talk about trade organizations. why have you said nothing about someone like mitt romney who raised taxes maryland by a billion dollars? host: why don't you respond to that since we talked a lot the other issue already. guest: we published a whole series of white papers on each of the candidates president and

we definitely talked about mitt romney's plaze paul -- flaws. we put the facts out there and the voters made up their own mind. host: wisconsin now, roger, democrat for david keating. good morning. caller: good morning. if they extend the bush tax cuts, i would still like to hear specifics on how they would find that. takeda -- thank you. guest: that is a great question. what you have to look at is how much money the federal government would get under the bush tax cuts. like the tax system today in a couple months would change. you get anywhere from 18% to 19% of gross domestic product.

can you run the government on that amount of money and, the answer is, yes you can. host: a lot more folks want to get in. canyon lake, texas, good morning on the republican line. caller: good morning. common sense. it is good to know. the hatred of obama and these liberal progressives, especially the black democrats have, these rich corporations pay for everything obama and all of them have endeavor will have because we know how alesi they are. he does not even read his bills before assigns them. npr, they spend all morning, telling ribordy what they think. host: that was stolen from texas. john is on the line now from new

york city. caller: i am really interested in corporate taxes. you hear a lot of folks out there be moaning really high tax rates. many large corporations, ge specifically, pay zero taxes. is that true, to the best of your knowledge? guest: clearly, there are many corporations that pay zero taxes because they do not earn any money, or they lose money for years. and it is based on how much you earn and how much they put into the system. but it is still very important what the tax rate is. over time, if you do make money, that is a tax rate that the corporation is going to be paying. that leads to its own problems as well.

investment will follow what the tax code says it is as opposed to what the consumers are demanding and with the economy really needs. either way, you'll get distortions from a high tax rates that make it difficult to invest and make money, both here in the u.s. compared to other countries that may have lower corporate tax rates, and secondly, if congress is making a higher tax rates for certain industries verses are those -- reverses others, it will follow in the economy. host: what will the next six months to be like under republican leadership? guest: guess is that they will try to get spending under control, try to repeal health care legislation. whittlesea of that is possible.

i remember back in the 1980's, congress passed this catastrophic health care fo legislation for senior citizens and everybody said it could not be repealed, and it was. it was repealed in the house, and reagan had supported the bill as well. fromhere is enough demand fo the american public, anything can be done. host: athens, ga., good morning. caller: i would like to ask a question about why i always see a ribordy talking about tax cuts. everybody is so worried about health care -- why i always need everybody talking about tax cut. the body is a word about health care. what are their plans?

are people going to keep getting sick and dying? are people going to keep being greedy about their money? what are their plans about it? host: anything else you would like to say that you have not said? guest: the key plan that congress should adopt -- should adopt as soon as possible is benefiting knows what the tax rate is going to be in a few months. the tax cuts to date, hopefully we extended for the next couple of years so that we can see what the president and congress might want to do after the 2012 system. host: on the republican line, jack, good morning. caller: could we not set up a fund that will allow people who

think we are not paying enough taxes to just contribute to that fund what they think our actual taxes should be to fund the government? host: 1 idea out there. and a final call from trenton, new jersey. caller: it seems that he is being disingenuous on a couple of points. to start off with, the lady who was talking about the terrorist threats, i think he was referring to sharon angle second amendment remedies. and as far as jobs going overseas, it sounds like you're saying we're in a recession because we do not make cars

anymore. host: a final fogh on the las galt -- a final thoughts on that last call, or conservatives in general and the campaign. guest: if we stop trade between the u.s. and the rest of the world tomorrow, we would see an economic catastrophe here in the united states that would be unparalleled. if people are concerned about the economy, we should not be setting up a wall around this country. prices would go up, selection would go down, and jobs would fall right off the table. host: david keating, director of the club for growth. thank you. it will take one more brief time out and spend the last 45 minutes of the journal talking about some specific house races

to watch. in the meantime, more news from c-span radio. >> it is 9:13 a.m. eastern time. numbers were released today by the commerce department that showed americans love their september and -- they're spending is the timber -- in september. the growth underscored how fragile the economy remains. lawyers for gambert and the u.s. justice department presented oral arguments today to the ninth circuit court in san francisco. today, a door -- a panel will be in stated to decide if the case should be cut down.

you can hear the world argument at noon eastern time. and in texas open court today, arguments scheduled concerning tom delay. he is accused of illegally financing texas house races in 2002. if convicted, he could face up to life in prison. and finally, more on tomorrow's elections. the general manager of four katv in alaska disputes allegations by joe miller pose a campaign that the staff were creating or making up stories about miller. one person is saying chaos at the rally, like miller getting punched, could be alerted on facebook or twitter. sarah palin, in miller supporter, claims it is a media

plot against miller. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> the c-span networks provide coverage of politics, public affairs, nonfiction books and american history. it is available on television, radio, online and social media networking sites. and we take c-span on the road with our discussion digital bus and local content vehicles. it is washington your way. on the eve of this year's elections, what might a republican controlled house mean for the telecommunications and technology industries? we will talk to the former advisers of the telecom committee tonight on "the communicators" on c-span2.

>> every weekend experience in american history tv, starting on saturday at 8:00 a.m. eastern. here historic seat -- historic speeches by national leaders and witness accounts that shape our naturnation. american history tv all weekend, every weekend on c-span3. >> "washington journal" continues. host: john mcardle, a staff writer of the world call it here to watch special races. tell us what the polls are saying in this race? guest: it looks like the governor election is stabilizing. it really got a lot of people by

surprise. there was the governor's seat to lose. it is still one of the most popular governors in the country. there was a poll out there that had raese ahead by several points and because the cover -- republicans were able to make a good case, a smart case, that because -- you may like your governor, but you do not want him on capitol hill. it was an argument for a long time. his whole florida home situation was a big issue in their race that democrats continue to hammer him on. should he be west redding is senator or florida's senator? they pounded him -- west virginia's senator or florida's

senator? the account of him on that. i would not be surprised if this is a tidal wave of an election. republicans can pick up was for dena early in the night. there is still a path to a takeover. the smart money is that they -- they will get six to eight, but they probably will not be able to take over the senate. host: we will discuss anything you want to bring upon, but we want to put the phone numbers on the bottom of the screen. these are the top senate and house races to watch. guest: there are probably about 110 to watch. host: yes, but let's go to kentucky, though. here is rand paul labeled the populist in time magazine this week. tell us more about what is happening. guest: it seems that rand paul is actually pulling away in this one.

over the weekend, a poll was put out that have rand paul up by 15 points. this was the seed that democrats were excited about possibly taking over. jim bunn and decided to step down. he had a very unpopular numbers and decided to retire. the democrats had an opportunity here, especially with rand paul. he was a guy that they painted as an outsider. he has a strange views. but there has been so much emphasis on defense and it sort of fizzled out of the end. specifically jack conway, the attorney general that is running year, his numbers just really tanked. many people attributed it to one of the ads that he is running bringing up some things about rand paul during his college years. ... the democratic pols have

this down by 15 and that is not a good sign for democrats. host: the denver post said today that it is so close. are they neck and neck? guest: it is either way at this point. this is a place where a outside groups have a lot of influence in this race. the latest is something like $25 million in third-party spending in this district. ken bode and michael hammaren have been hammering at each other. they have very competitive primaries. this is one question -- would it be so close if not jane norman, she was seen as much more established and less controversial as can buck.

-- ken buck. you cannot be looking in the past to much, but would it be more favorable if they had a less controversial candidate in there? host: what can you say about these three races so far? guest: $25 million in outside groups, just outside party groups. all of them have this cycle, especially kentucky. both major parties decided to draw a lot of money at it early on. all over the map, i think we go to nevada next, and if you want to talk about candidates, i angle's spendingol

alone in that race, i think it will be $50 million. she was seen as an outsider when she won the nomination, but money has been pouring in from around the country because of taking out the majority leader would be huge. host: ohio, first call, henry, independent, good morning. caller: good morning. this is my first time getting through in years. host: we're glad you did. caller: thank you. i have generated a couple of books, but i cannot get through to you guys. [laughter] i'm really appalled, and i am 68. the for the state is protected by the first amendment, i think. i do not understand why we

object of the create the opinion that today, we spend so much time discussing polls and discussing who is going to win rather than discussing the people who may be winning, some of the tea party people that may be winning, some of the quality people that are running. it is unbelievably appalling. i have never seen so much polarization and i've never seen so many idiots run for office. host: your observations? guest: i think it is the state of politics. a lot of the issues that these candidates talk about a on the campaign trail are based on what their polls say people want to hear. the they're not just head-to- head polls. they craft their campaign media message are around it. it is the way it is practiced, for better or worse. host: montana, good morning. caller: i want to say a couple of things here today and i can shut up about it for this cycle. i am 57 years old.

this will be the first time in my voting life that i am just going to skip it because i do not see why it makes any difference. the american people get bent out of shape of the government -- at the government and now we're going to do what? if we will switch over to the party that draws off the cliff. the tax breaks for these wealthy people have been in there. and they tell us they have to have these breaks for the wealthy, but it did not seem to help us much. the american people don't realize that what we started to do the supply side economics -- ronald reagan, when he came in, ever since then it has fed the the upper crust at the cost of the middle class. guest: one of the things he was making a comment on is the party

that draws of the ditch is now going to get the keys again. it is an argument that the democrats were trying to make on the campaign trail. i read this morning that bill clinton and said, you gave republicans eight years to dig us into this whole, at least give us for years to get us out. maybe it helped them keep the senate, as many people are predicting they will keep the senate, but it looks like it will be hard for the democrats to keep the house. host: on the line for john mcardle, good morning. caller: good morning. we have the fifth congressional district here with the chairman of the house committee, john spratt. we have some folks here that

johnson -- the believe john's prep has brought some indignity to congress, so i hope we do not throw the baby -- has brought some dignity to congress, we do not throw the baby out with the bathwater. guest: the house committee chairman, this is one of her cardinals for a while. they have been amped up to go after john spratt for a while. i asked congressman spratt last week, you do not run away from nancy pelosi, right? your the house budget committee chairman, is it fair to say that you are part of the establishment? and he said, no, you want me appear because of a good influence and in a good position to bring things home for the fifth congressional district. it is an argument that

resonates. i was asking the opponent to john spratt down there and his comment was, if he is so great for our district, the unemployment is higher than the national rate. every county in the fifth in district has a higher unemployment rate than the state average. it is a good argument, but it shows that every issue in this election is jobs and the economy, jobs and the economy. host: you mentioned the money earlier, but tell us what you think will make the difference for either candidate in this two-day. -- two-day time frame? guest: our democrats going to

turner for harry reid? from what i have seen, he is ahead in the early voting, but polling shows that he is down in the of what they predict will turn out tomorrow. harry reid is a fighter. he came out as soon as sharon angle won the nomination and hit her from day one. the other interesting thing on this race is that there are a lot of ways you can vote against her. tomorrow in nevada there are nine places on the ballot, including "none of the above." sharon angle will need everyone to vote for her, and not just against kerry reid. host: how big a deal will it be?

guest: it will be a knocking off of a giant. it will be a good night, especially for republicans and what they are anticipating, this will be knocking off the cherry. next host: phone call, good morning. -- host: next phone call, good morning. caller: i am sick and tired of having the polls try to announce the elections before we have had them. i think we should all lie to pollsters. guest: [laughter] it would make their job tougher, and there is already a lot to do that. these auto dial polls were you do not actually have a live kolster on the other and asking you questions. a lot of people say they need to rethink the polling industry.

the other interesting this, i only have a cell phone, and i do not have a land mine anymore. how pollsters reach people who do not have a traditional phone in their house -- where no, they're going to allow of rethinking about how they do their job. there will be more on tuesday, after these results, out. host: lot of polling industry -- after these results come out. host: lot of polling information out there. was interesting here is the chart where they talk about the other issues here. what other issues are driving

people this year? guest: well, jobs and the economy is number one. i think some people were wondering about the incident on friday with the bombs on the airplane. it is terror going to come back of and national security? the war in afghanistan. in every poll that we see, those are down way low. people want to be able to go to work and put food on the table. if the economy comes back, unless something you haven't, it is going to continue to be jobs and the economy. host: on the democrats line, good morning. caller: this is my first time calling. they say that there are not a lot of jobs and a lot of people are not getting higher, but i believe a lot of times when people go get the job and stuff,

if they are getting unemployment, they're not worried about getting a job and no more and some people just say, if i'm getting unemployment, and actually making a living off of this. i did not graduate culinary school, but i went long enough to know the basics. and i'm really smart educated home cooking and i cannot even get a job at burger king and. some people will not go to a lower place and get a job. did not want to go down the ladder. they want to go up. -- some people do not want to go down the ladder. they want to go up. guest: john marshall in his race against austin scott, i was sitting with john marshall and

someone was complaining that he has jobs that you would love to give to people. and people were worried that he was staying on unemployment benefits for too long. and there was a lady in the room who said kayaleh who is this person because i would -- who said, who is this person who is offering jobs because i have a lot of people who would like to get jobs. it is a very complicated issue and it is on a lot of people's minds. host: here is a comment on twitchell. -- on twitter. about alaskask you as well, this three-way race. even was the latest? guest: the latest poll numbers -- bendix we do not want to talk about poll numbers too much, but

the latest has miller being more murkowski.etwating the democratic senatorial campaign committee is there this weekend. isador hard place to pull. and it is a place where you could -- it is such a hard place to poll. and it is a place where you could be critical of the polling there. there is a big question mark about alaska, i think. miller is definitely in the driver's seat there. sarah palin did a big rally for him. she was very critical of mainstream media. that will be a very late one to

watch tomorrow, or i guess, early wednesday morning. host: tell us about what she said over the weekend. she guest: was critical of the media because the miller campaign released an audio tape from alaska where the phone was left on and they talked about the kind of people that would join for a miller rally and she blasted on twitter, calling them probiotic. -- calling them corrupt. host: next call, good morning. caller: i think many people do not understand what emigration is. my problem is that mexico is a very rich country.

and they are sending their poor people here for us to take care of. they have over half of the section 8 housing. they get free medical, free dental, free food, free medication. and once they become citizens, they will be able to bring all their relatives here and their relatives will get all of these benefits, and it is going to break us. i would like mexico to take care of their own people. they are nice people. take care of your own country, if i asked this one lady who was running for school board what her stance was on immigration and she said she was for a comprehensive immigration, thinking i would not know what it meant, and i said, well, you are not getting my vote. i wish you the best.

so many people are hungry in this country, and i do not know what we have to do, but we have to do something good. host: immigration, in these close bellwether races, how much impact does immigration half? guest: i believe sharon angle had an ad that was highly criticized for being racist and talking about some of the immigration images she was showing. in louisiana, it has been a big issue down there. think about the primaries, some of these republican primaries that were almost defined by immigration issues. arizona, john mccain verses hayworth. hayworth look like he was closing the gap. it was a very big issue in some of those republican primaries.

when you were asking about other issues that were important to people, depending on the state you are in, immigration will be very high up on that list. host: john mcardle which will call, how long have you been working there? >guest: about seven years. host: covering many aspects of the legislative branch. delaware, ed, independent collar. caller: greetings from the great state of witches and marxists. i just had to get that out. i am an independent voter. i'm getting confused in this election cycle, particularly when i watched c-span. kalla here is -- all i hear is that the democrats were denied

in 2006. the democrats have a filibuster- proof majority in the last two years. this is crazy. this whole thing has gotten crazy. there was a call this morning about how a guy was supposed to be a liberal. i think the man was mistaken. even though you have liberal guests and read a lot of liberal newspapers, i do not think you are a liberal station. host: we appreciate the phone call. anything you want to respond to? guest: no, it seemed more of a call for you. host: i think we will let that stand as a comment. robert byrd, which race is he in and why is it so hot? -- robert heard, which race is

cnn white is it so hot? guest: from day one, they're going after tom perry. it is such a close race. and yet, despite a very good republican environment, a great year for the gop national income material is still in this race. -- for the gop nationally, periello is still in the race. democrats did a big boost and went down to charlotte and did a big rally for him. this is a very conservative district. it starts in charlottesville,

but has a lot of stops of virginia. and yet, perriello not run away from the nomination. and he has also not run away from his vote, which is an interesting tech that he has taken. i think he did more town halls during the august recess of 2009 than anyone else. he took every question then did not hide from voters that were upset with, and he explained his position. and i think the white house is very interested in this race and that is why obama went down there to help him out. i think they want to show there is someone who can stand with the president and even in a conservative district, can still win. both sides have spent a lot of money in this race. perriello could very well pull it out. he could be one of the democratic surprises.

host: elizabeth, democrat, good morning. caller: i want to say two quick things. the first thing is that i do not like to pull the plane card. -- blame card. but i would like to say that president bush is the pretty -- is pretty much the person who put this country in the position that it is. i would like to us, what could be done to turn that around? and the other thing, do you think that nancy pelosi is in danger of losing her seat? host: her actual seat? guest: i do not think that she is in danger of losing her actual seat. a lot of people do not see a path for her to keep her speakership. there have been several

democratic congressmen who have come out and said they will not vote for her again as speaker. she is too divisive. and if she is up again, they will not vote for her. she would need an even larger majority to become speaker again. she asked it what republicans would do differently for how they control congress, their message this entire cycle has been to rein in spending. this is what it did not like the stimulus bill. this is why they did not like the health care bill. they think the government is not ordaz -- is spending too much money and not developing the private sector. they think the stimulus bill brought a few jobs, but not lasting jobs. they think democrats are not allowing the private sector to grow. they want to continue the bush era tax cut. they have been very consistent on this message of reining in spending and cutting taxes.

host: back to the issue of sproat -- voting for speaker, gene taylor is one that is up. he is being hammered by his opponents. this is another bellwether race. he could potentially lose. guest: it is interesting because this was a late breaking race. gene taylor was not rely on anyone's map and suddenly, mid october, the national congressional committee starts pumping money into this race. they saw an opportunity here. the question was, were the republicans really seeing an opportunity in the fourth district, or was this a head game to try to get the democrats to spread out their money? were they trying to make this a

late breaking race, or work they trying to get the democrats, who had a funding advantage, to spread their money here and there? it is a chess game. we will see tomorrow, finally. all questions will be answered. host: memphis, tennessee, good morning. caller: address the question -- i would like to ask a question. i would like to see americans protest against these countries that do not pay their people wages, the ones that pay like $1 per day and things like that, i would like to see americans protest that, as a human rights

issue. what do you think about that? guest: wages have become a bigger issue for folks around the country, and they have difficulty getting that around the country. host: this is carlton. carlton, are you there? carlton, from brooklyn new york. caller: you seem to have a lot of energy when you were talking about republicans. it seems to me that you are republican. i'm confident as a black man, spanish, black, muslim, altogether.

i have news for you. we are the majority, we know that. but we are very silent. but all of the folks were saying that mccain was going to beat obama. remember that? you pollsters are wrong. and you are a republican and you are coming over here and giving people information. host: what do you have to say to that? guest: would be hard to do my job on capitol to new one way or the other. mccall is a non-partisan paper. host: john mcardle which will call. he will be with us for about 10 more minutes.

caller: a lot of people are blaming obama for the stuff that was left over from the bush era. people a word about the economy, taxes, health care, but we need a health care system that takes care of people without making them go broke. once they are getting sick, you know, and they are spending their whole life savings on stuff. we need a lot of stuff that the government does not take care of, like immigration and stuff. host: let me jump in with some "usa today" polling information. here is the front page. it says that the gop -- that the gop has the lead. that is not surprising, but they go on to ask some other questions in the poll.

two-thirds of democrats say that the highest priority should be to pass a new stimulus bill. rankin any further insight on that? guest: it certainly does not seem like it's going to be over. it looks like it will still be on the agenda in 2011 and in 2012. host: next call, good morning. caller: i would like to understand how can the republicans simultaneously -- and i'm concerned as well about spending, but how can they simultaneously cut taxes, reduce spending, as well as deal with

the war effort and the unemployment rate, and so many people losing their homes? is there a plan? is there a way to do this all at one time? these are all immediate concerns. guest: i think that is a very good question for john boehner, who looks like he is on target for the next speaker. he will lay out his agenda in the house and what he wants to move forward. republicans are going to be in the spotlight a little bit more if they do want control of the house after tuesday. they will have to deliver on some of these arguments they are talking about. it will be interesting to see what the issues are in 2012 and if people think there is blame to go around. host: where will the pressure points be for john vader within his own republican conference?

-- for john boehner within his own republican conference? guest: many are talking about the tea party. is there going to be a tea party caucus? are they pushing back against boehner? do they see him as too much establishment? that will be interesting to watch. and i think the pressure from will weigh on manyo republicans going into 2012. there are a lot of folks who lost in primaries this year. i think there will be a lot of key republicans that will be afraid of their shuttle because they may be in saved districts, but not safe from a primary challenger or safe from what 80

party challenger has shown they can do. -- what a tea party challenger has shown they can do. this is a place where democrats had not one for a very long time and democrats coat -- pick it up in the special election. it would be symbolic of republicans could take it back. doug owens and dropped out of the -- as doug collins dropped out of the race and i think that is good for democrats because his name will not be on the ballot. host: how about louisiana's second? guest: no matter how bad it got four democrats, it always seems like they always have

louisiana's second. this is the district the was one in the unusual low turnout in 2008 against congressman bill jefferson. he had to the $100,000 in the freezer. this was a scandal. republicans kind of stole this seat in 2008. they are on track to take back the new orleans-based second district. how widely loss to the special election -- hawaii is one, they lost the special election. illinois, congressman curt is running for the senate. florida 25, mario diaz moved

over to run for his brother's sea, leaving the 25th district open. democrats think they can play off there. there is a tea party candidate in the race that democrats hope he will split the vote. this is going to be a very defensive night. host: down to our last couple of callers hear and will be on the air tomorrow night at 7:00 p.m. with results and dialogue from guests. punxsutawney, pa., richard, republican line. caller: good morning. and what i was able to get through. i have been listening to politicians since the 1940's. they will say anything to get elected. arlen specter is a good example. and once they get elected they

do what they want. in the service, when i came upon a patient who is pleading, causing them to believe more does not help them. -- who is bleeding, causing them to bleed more is not helping them. these politicians are living high on the hog. you've got the politicians living on the top, a big house, beautiful car. poor and some ofor them are so poor that they are to sleep [unintelligible]

guest: the florida senate race, down there has been a lot of criticism which republicans against charlie crist. he was running as a republican and dropped out to run as an independent. now republicans say he is cozying up to much to democratic donors. i think that has kept him down in the polls, this image that he opportunist.al opportunitie mercurio, you were talking about that when earlier. i agree -- marco rubio, you were talking about? one earlier. i agree with mr. keating, that he is positioned in the polls to do well. host: democrats line, good morning. caller: i will try to be brief. i am a retiree from congressional security.

i sat in the chamber for 16 years and observed legislative -- legislation being debated and taking place. a few things i would like to say -- and i may reside some scripture. a few things that you have not made the public aware of. we are blaming obama in less than two years of being president. if you will back up and check our history, for the last 56 years, the republicans have held the executive branch 36 out of 56 to only 20 years for the democrats. most of the progress of legislation has taken place under the democrats, the same as civil-rights, the same as the military under truman and a lot of other things.

i will not go into a lot of detail. republicans have been reactionary to a lot of the progressive things that have taken place. i'm afraid that we are in a position now -- we are in the position we are because we are reaping what we have sown. none of the people on capitol hill in your to their position. we, the people, put them there. host: we will make that our last call and with that history lesson, moving to tonight and beyond. guest: the overall picture seems to be republicans are poised to take back the house, and it may be a long shot for the senate. a lot of predictions these days have republicans in the low to mid 50's in terms of house

pickups. they only need 39 to take back the house. democrats need a lot to go their way if they will hold onto power on capitol hill. or we will cease split, shared chambers on -- we will see split, shared chambers on capitol hill. host: john mcardle from roll- call. thanks for being with us. we would back tomorrow morning and also look for us tomorrow night at 7:00 p.m. at enjoy the rest of your day. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010]

>> coming up and a half hour, live remarks from homeland security secretary tom ridge. he will talk about existing and emerging terror threat, including the discovery of explosive materials on board a cargo plane bound for yemen. live coverage begins at about 10:30 this morning. also today, the ninth circuit court of appeals hears oral arguments on whether to hold up a lower-court decision on whether to strike down parts of arizona's immigration flaw. -- law. a lower court ruled arizona. did the federal government's

authority to set an immigration law. you can see the argument from san francisco today starting at noon eastern. tomorrow is election day. on this day before the americans had to the polls, we continue our campaign 2010 coverage with a number of debates. coming up, the debate between patty murray and tino rossi. later on, the candidates vying for the illinois governor debate. and finally, russ feingold and republican ron johnson explain why they feel they are best for the wisconsin senate. you can watch all of the debate today, right here on c-span. in addition to the season coverage of the campaign and debate, there is much more at the c-span library. the american story from american

history tv, and everything we have bared. -- aired, all on line at c- span.org. this weekend, and jonah goldberg discusses the election results, the conservative movement, and the next wave of leaders on the right. join us for the conversation on sunday at noon eastern. >> up next, candidates for the washington senate meet for a debate held last month. patty murray is running for a fourth term. she is joined by dino rossi. they spoke about a number of issues, including immigration, water rights, and college tuition. the race has been labeled a tossup. this is about one hour.

good evening. this debate is being seen locally and we are also being heard on news radio 1920. i want to begin by introducing the candidates to you. patty murray is seeking her fourth term. she is challenged in the race by

republican dino rossi. each candidate will answer questions submitted by the viewers. from the "spokesman review" -- we are joined tonight by a studio audience. thanks to all of you for coming. we want to get to as many questions in the next hour as we can, so we would ask that you hold your applause until the end. a coin flip before the debate determined that mr. rossi would go first. >> america is in trouble. that is why i am running for u.s. senate. if we do not have a course correction, we are going to wake up 20 years from now in a country that we do not recognize. we are moving down a path that is very dangerous.

the problem with washington, d.c., many people believe, people cannot admit when they are wrong and cannot change course. so we are going to have a spirited debate tonight between two candidates. i have a lot of respect for senator murray. this is not percival. i believe she is heading in the wrong direction. -- this is not personal. the course we have taken in washington, d.c. is taking us down the wrong path. i want to thank the organizers for putting on this debate, as well as senator marie for joining me in the debate. >> think the to our hosts and all of you for joining us for an import discussion about who will be your voice and advocate in the u.s. senate. so many families are struggling today, not through anything they did, but because of the mistakes

and agreed on wall street. this state is my family, and my family is hurting, and that is why i am working hard to get the country back on track again. i will take on even the most powerful to make sure that you have a voice at the table when the decisions are made. i grew up in a small town in washington. my dad ran a store on main street. i learned those values of hard work and fighting for what you believe in. those are the values that i will take back as your voice as your representative in the senate. i believe we can solve the problems in front of us if we have courage and take responsibility. >> our first question comes from jim camden. mr. rossi, you are first. >> the war in afghanistan has become one of the longest wars

this country has waged. the casually account is rising. senator murray's timetable to withdraw from afghanistan, you do not have one. how long should we be willing to stay in afghanistan, under what conditions should we be willing to leave? >> first of all, i want to say thank you to the military families, the men and women serving. let's take a step back and take a look at pre-9/11. you had terrorist training camps, you had people killing americans. we cannot let that happen again. they cannot come back into power. you have seen what has happened with the troop surge. it has taken six months for all of the troops to show up.

i believe -- i agree with president obama and his agreement with general petraeus, let's see how this works. i do not agree on a date certain on when to withdraw our troops. i think they would just hide in a cave when that happens and come back after we leave. we could end up with more terrorist training camps. we cannot allow that to happen. we have to give our military every tool possible so they can achieve their objectives and can come home as soon as possible but i want to give general petraeus the chance to make this work. >> senator murray? >> i happened to be looking out the window in washington on 9/11. even though it was a tough, divisive time, we came together

and went to war against terrorists, wherever they exist. we have a number of military families who sacrificed so much for our nation. we owe it to them to know when and how long they will be there and how much more sacrifice they have to give. we have been in afghanistan for nine years now. i am one of the few senators who voted to tell the president that he needs to tell the american people how we can show we are winning a war on terror. i do not believe we have a willing partner in president karzai right now that we can count on. so at this time in our nation's history, when we are struggling with our economy and precious resources, we owe it to the men and women who have been fighting for us, to ask those tough

questions, about whether or not a war against terror exists and whether we need food on the ground in afghanistan, whether it that is the right policy. >> we just read in the wall street journal president karzai was meeting the as canny taliban and they were meeting to discuss some sort of reconciliation. i am not sure how that is going to work. when karzai fired his interior minister, people were concerned about that. they installed a new minister who brought in 27 new police chiefs. we need progress on the ground if we want any lasting effort in

afghanistan. >> senator murray? >> one important question that was not answered was how we would pay for this. one of the reasons we are in trouble today is because we went to two wars without paying for it. mr. bossy supports tax cuts to the wealthiest of americans. how can you tell our men and women who have flocked, that we are going to pay and be responsible for the decisions we make? we have to fight a war on terror where it exists. if we are going to do that, we have to say where we are going to pay for it. >> here is our next question from a viewer. >> my name is robert. my question to the candidates is what will you do to create more jobs for washington state? >> senator murray. >> thank you for the question.

it is a very important one, one that i talk about all the time because so many families are hurting because they have lost their jobs, homes, mortgages, and we need to make sure they are back on the job. i come home every weekend to talk to community leaders about the needs in their communities. then i go back in washington to fight so that we can get people back on the job. here in spokane, i spoke to community leaders about the university district, creating a river point campus, so that we can start creating jobs in health care. it is a very important sector here in spokane. we need to give them the investment ticket back off the ground. we have students studying right now in the health-care industry. mr. rossi will not be fighting for those targeted investments. i believe it is my job to fight for them and get the community

working again. it is why i fought so many mainstream businesses who said they did not have the capital to keep goods on their shelves. we passed the main street lending fell. the president signed it into law so that we can have capital flowing into those businesses, so that they can keep their doors open. mr. rossi does not support that. my job is to make sure that you are secure. >> we have an implant rate of 17.4%. -- unemployment rate of 17.4%. we have some serious problems. i have been talking to a lot of small business owners. i am a small business owner myself. i am on a board of small business owners in washington, and i know what we need.

small businesses say they will not expand, why? they do not know what the government will do to them next week. they do not know what health care will cost, they do not know about the tax cuts that should have been reauthorized. this uncertainty is leaving them in limbo. since senator mary decided to adjourn before reauthorize and the 2003 tax cuts, we are going to have the biggest tax increase in american history. business owners will have to decide who to let off in order to do this. senator murray's answer to a lack of jobs was more money to china, they said that the stimulus was going to help keep unemployment under 8%. that did not happen.

the federal government can create federal, temporary jobs, but we need an entrepreneur's creating jobs. >> i did not hear anything about job creation in your answer. i work with community leaders to ask where you need jobs and work with them to get the investment so that we can get you back to work. i work to make sure our main street businesses have the credit they need to be able to expand. it is why i fought so hard to make sure that those tankers have a contract through an american contract, and that we base those jobs in america. this is one of my priorities. >> and for small business owners to create jobs, what they need is stability and certainty so they can invest. right now, they do not have that. they need predictable

regulation. let them case the american dream. her government solution has failed. that much is clear. but she wants to do more of it. we cannot do that. >> mr. rossi, this is your question. if you were to vote to increase spending for nuclear waste cleanup, as officials have suggested would be necessary to meet a target in a five-year plan, would you cut other parts of the budget to reduce overall spending, and if so, what would you cut? >> we need to make reductions in the budget. i was chairman of the ways and means committee in the state senate. i worked across party lines to balance the biggest deficit in state history without raising

taxes. we went line by line through the budget. there are things -- i have done it here in the state of washington. there is not much bipartisan effort going on in washington, d.c. there are a number of things that can be done. in the stimulus, $275 billion that is available. why should federal employees have a better deal than the people footing the bill? reduce the federal work force to active pre-obama levels. that could be $35 billion. having written the state budget, i know that you cannot just make reductions. when i wrote the budget, i said i would do everything i could to protect the most vulnerable people in society.

that is why i received the liberty award from an organization. the senior star award was also given to me from aarp for protecting seniors. you can be fiscally conservative and still be socially conscious. >> senator murray? >> what i did not hear in all of that is an answer to cleaning up nuclear waste. i have to tell you, my grandfather was here in 1968. he was in the tri-cities when the reservation was built. i know we have a moral and legal obligation in the country to clean up the nuclear waste that is seeping into the groundwater into the columbia river today. i have thought republican and

democratic presidents and numerous secretaries of energy to make sure we meet that obligation. today we have tremendous challenges with our budget and the president has told us he is going to reduce our budget over all by 5% next year, and we have to hold him to that. i have told him that the nuclear reservation is part of our defense. he has told us he will not be cutting defense. i want to make sure if that is the case, the nuclear reservation does not get cut. we cannot afford to have that waste seeking toward the river. i heard in mr. rossi's answer that he would reduce stimulus money. maybe he does not know there are 3000 people employed by that stimulus money cleaning up the reservation. he would just give them a pink slip and allow that waste to

continue toward the river. >> what senator marie is not telling you, though, is that when president obama was a candidate, he said he would shut down yucca mountain in nevada, where the nuclear waste was supposed to go. we are turning this stuff into glass blocks and send it over to yucca mountain. she remains silent on that. our nuclear waste will be all dressed up with nowhere to go. quite frankly, we have to get nuclear waste out of washington state. it seems senator byrd is more concerned about reelecting harry reid. >> i did not hear an answer about the priority to make sure that we clean up the site. this is one of the most important things i do.

i take this issue on. i have fought to make sure that young mountain -- yucca mountain stays on our nuclear waste focus. right now the most serious threat to the reservation is a funding cut. >> the next question comes from dan. given that it seems social security and other weapons of the programs are underfunded, how would you recommend these issues be resolved for those already retired and for those eligible to retire in the next 20 years? senator murray? >> social security and medicare are two of the most important programs we have for seniors and many disabled. we know from the meltdown in the markets and what happened to

many people, that making sure social security is never privatized is absolutely critical. i have fought hard against the previous administration who tried to privatize it. medicare is an extremely important program. within the health care reform that mr. rossi wants to repeal, we made some important provisions that will extend the life of medicare, making sure that we cut fraud and abuse, making sure that our senior citizens do not hold the bill. this is the bill that he wants to repeal. we need to make sure these programs are there for the future. we need to do it within the budget. the president has a commission that is going to make recommendations to us by the end of the year. everything is on the table and we have to be responsible and look at every area of the budget, but i know -- because my own parents lived with medicare.

i know how important it was that medicare was there for them when they turn 65. i want to make sure it is there for you, too. in order to do that, we may have to make some tough decisions, and i will make sure that any decisions are good for you. >> we need to make sure that we come through on what we promised for seniors. unfortunately, senator murray and others in washington have used this as their keybanc. the biggest threat will be the debt. but right now, we are borrowing money rather cheaply. when interest rates go up, and they will go up, you're talking about $0.80 on every dollar that you spend a in taxes going back

to washington. senator murray voted to raise taxes on social security when she was first elected. i do not think that is the right way to go. what we have is a senator that does one thing in washington state but does another in washington, d.c.. senator murray voted to cut medicare by $500 million in a bill. half the people involved with medicare advantage will lose because of senator marie's vote on that legislation. we have some serious issues to deal with. we have to make sure that we come through with what we promised to seniors. >> again, i did not hear an answer. if mr. ross and gets his way and we extend the bush tax cuts to the top 2% of the wealthiest in the country, there is no way we

can sustain the programs that are so important in front of us. i want to make sure we cut our budget. i am a tough mother when it comes to the budget but i want to make sure we preserve the programs that provide stability for those families in our community. i am going to make sure medicare and social security are there for you. >> once again, senator murray voted to raise taxes on social security. with the health care vote, senator murray voted to reduce spending on medicare by $500 billion. this is going to impair all the programs we have four seniors when it comes to medicare. i do not think her spending is going to help us preserve social security. >> our next question comes to us from nadine when word. >> staying on the subject of

health care, my question has two parts. mr. rossi, republicans want to repeal health care reform. what would you replace the current plan with? >> let's talk about the current plan that senator marie voted for. you have a $695 fine if you do not purchase the health care. we are talking about a $500 billion cut to medicare to partially pay for new entitlements when medicare is already in trouble. a $500 billion tax increase. that increase is going to cost the boeing company $700 million. you are talking about tens of thousands of jobs in the state that could be lost because of senator murray's loading. it is really a problem, this health care bill. you are losing your freedoms, you are losing your choices.

there are things you can do. there are a number of things you can do. you can allow individuals to buy health insurance across state lines. you could have lawsuit reform to reduce costs. you have helped savings accounts. allow individuals and small groups to band together and by individual -- by a group program, like the big boys do. this will not add $2 trillion to the deficit. there are answers here. unfortunately, senator murray is marching down the wrong path. this could potentially bankrupt america and impair medicare. >> senator murray, how much of the legislation did you read before voting? are you concerned about the cost, pushing up the

expectations? >> not only did i read it, i helped to write it. the only people health care was working for was our health insurance companies. every family, business, every community was struggling with double-digit increases. i believe you should be able to pick a health care plan that works for you and your family, and you should be able to choose your doctor. i want to make sure that we control costs and increase access and put the decisions of your health care back in your hands and not into the hands of insurance companies. i spoke to a woman who came to me with a stack of papers this high and told me that that was the correspondence she had to go back and forth through with her insurance company in the past year. her husband was diagnosed with cancer. every procedure and bill she

got, she had to fight back. i believe that our health care bill will move us to a place where you have control once again, and your insurance company cannot discriminate against you for the coverage you deserve. i believe is important we move forward to deal with the cost. businesses were going under, they could not compete, we were not competitive globally. although this plan is not perfect, it is a step in the right direction. it will give you control of your health care instead of an insurance company. >> we have some serious problems. we were sold a plan that would somehow reduce cost and increase access. clearly, most businesses i talk to, they say it is as much as

80% increase because of the legislation that passed. we were also told we could keep our health care. certainly, that is not the case. once again, saying one thing in washington state and doing another in washington, d.c. the question is which washington she represents. >> i just heard some talking points from the insurance industry. tell this to the woman who can come up for the first time in months, sleep at night because her daughter with cystic fibrosis will be covered. tell that to the senior citizen who will not fall into that doughnut hole in medicare and will have prescription coverage. tell that to the thousands of people who are in bankruptcy today because their insurance denied them coverage. >> our next question is an e-

mail question from a adam -- >> this is an important question for eastern washington, one that i have faced many times. our river system is extremely important to the economy, this region, and to the entire state. we need to make sure our farmers can ship their wheat to market overseas. we need to make sure that barges can go up and down the river. we need to make sure fish have passage through the columbia river out to the ocean. we need to make sure those people who rely on the hydropower system have that securely in place. i have been consistent in saying we will not remove the dams in eastern washington. we have to make sure this -- works for everyone. that means we have to work hard

to make sure fish have passage, that our farmers have irrigation. we need to make sure everyone comes together to solve the tough problems in the future. as someone who's dad grew up in the tri city, i know the importance of the columbia river. >> i actually flew over when they had that rally. i was on that bridge that very cold night. we had a number of elected officials in the city of seattle that but it would be a good idea to breach the dance. it would have been one of the worse things you could have done for eastern washington and for the state. hydroelectric power is a blessing. it is a blessing for the state. it is low-cost power, it is a renewable energy, as far as i know. it will keep on reading. that is the good news.

we have to make sure we protect these dams. these are vital to our economy, vital to eastern washington, and to the entire state. i have been through this battle. i was a western washington state senator when i came over here. i am here with you today. >> senator murray? >> there are more issues than just dam removal. there are the issues to make sure that we have resources in place to fix the dams and work with communities up and down the river to make sure that we maintain them. mr. rossi wants to give away a huge tax increase, but we will not have the resources to do that, if he gets his way. >> i should talk about this tax increase. senator murray is talking about giving us the biggest tax increase in history because she

decided to vote to return before the real other -- reauthorization of the 2003 tax cuts. we are talking about small business owners that would take money and invest to hire people. that is how we are going to get out of this problem. we have to help small business be successful. unfortunately, senator murray does not understand that. >> our next question is to mr. rossi. >> a federal judge reinstated a nurse back into her group after she was discharged from don't ask, don't tell. she was not disruptive to her unit. her discharge was. if these standards are to be applied across the military, the military will have to show an

individual shall -- soldier discharge is better for the union, the entire brand. should congress repealed don't ask don't tell, or should it stand in the face of this standard? >> up until now, it appears to have been working but there will be a report coming out. i want to see what that says. i want to hear from the commanders and the military men and women. what will this mean to the military, how will it work? i am going to listen to what they have to say. i will thoroughly investigate this before making a decision. the way i look at this thing, my three r's of public service. reasonable, rational, responsible. those are the three things that

i will look at. >> i am not only going to completely respect major which and tell you that i am a sponsor ask don'tng don't tell. i speak to so many women who return from iraq and afghanistan who have served their country honorably. these men and women know that everyone who wants to give back to the country by serving in the military ought to be able to do it. major which is a hero. i hope that she and many other gay and lesbians are able to serve our military, just like everyone else. i spoke to a young woman here who is a senior in high school who told me her dream when she graduates is to serve our country in the military. she told me the honor code she hasted take -- she has to take, that is keeping her from joining

the military. i think that is wrong. i think we should repeal don't ask don't tell. >> we will see what report has to say. we have to make sure it actually works and makes sense. i will look at the report and make a decision based upon that and also further investigations, talking to men and women in the military. they will be the ones affected. all this needs to be done in a rational way. >> i do not know how you look someone in the eye and tell them after you have served for our country, they have done a remarkable work, and all the sudden, they are a second-class citizen. >> here is another tape question from a local college student. >> i am a senior at washington university. my question has to do with college tuition. i am going to school full time and working part time.

i am in the process of getting a second job. i just got a second job to help pay my loans. my question is what each candidate would do to help bring relief to middle-class families like mine who are not poor enough to receive assistance from the government, but not rich enough to pay for everything either? >> thank you for the question. i know exactly how you feel. i grew up in a family with seven kids. my father got sick right before i graduated from high school. all of a sudden, we did not know if we would be able to go on to college. my family struggled but they made the decision they would work hard to make sure all of us were able to go to college. because we had a country at our back, all seven of us were able to go through college, through pell grants and student loans. that is why i voted to make sure

banks got out of the business of providing student loans and put the money back into student loans, so that students like you can go to college. we are now increasing the number of students to get federal help because of that decision. it is imperative we work in every way we can to help our young people get through college. i know our state legislatures are struggling because of budget cuts, tuition is rising. it is the government's responsibility to make sure that any student, wherever they come from, has the ability to go to college. it is so important for our country and future and competitiveness. i will continue to do everything i can to make sure that you and anyone like you can go to college. >> mr. rossi? >> i am the youngest of seven kids raised on a seattle teacher's salary. i wanted to go to college, so i

worked a number of jobs to make that happen. i also received threats -- grants and student loans. when we had the biggest deficit in state history, i made sure that we had grants available to students. i wanted to lay down the railroad tracks to make sure that scholarships were available for kids like me. i ended up receiving the stanley mcnaughton award from a group of independent colleges. our oldest is a sophomore in college. i know exactly how expensive this is. we need to make sure that there are loans available.

we need to make sure that there are grants available for kids who cannot afford college. education is the key to their future. >> what i did not hear in that answer is whether or not you would agree with me that we should not be giving banks the responsibility of student loans, so that they profit from them. i have consistently voted that the money should go directly to students so that the banks do not get a profit. >> part of the takeover of government has been student loans. now you have to go to the government. having more options makes sense. students should have options. parents need to have options. unfortunately, options are being

limited because of government control. >> our next question comes from the "tri-city herald." >> would you support legislation supporting undocumented workers? how would you give amnesty? if not, how would you address seasonal and agricultural labor? >> this is a bigger issue. a complete failure on the government's part to control our borders. i do not support amnesty, number one. we have to take control of the borders. we have people that have come across and be deported, even committing violent crimes. we need to make sure that we have a tall fence with a high gate. we need a physical barrier so that people cannot just come across. we need to know who is coming. why do i say a high gate?

it has been a failure by the american government to allow people to chase the american dream. my parents came here from italy because they believed it could be a better place for them and their children. we want people to come here to chase that american dream but we want to know who they are, if they have a criminal background, and we also want people to be able to come and work temporarily. but we have to know who they are so that they can be here illegally. we have a serious challenge ahead of us. unfortunately, the government has failed us. something needs to be done about this. the agricultural community needs help. >> i believe we need comprehensive immigration reform.

this is something that affects our economy, our way of life, and it affects our competitiveness. i talked to some farmers recently who told me because we do not have clear laws in the country, they do not know if they can pick the crops on their trees right now. their businesses are in jeopardy. that is why i support this being a part of -- comprehensive immigration reform. we need to make sure the people who come here come here legally. that includes the illegal border. i have bought the administration after administration to make sure that our northern border is just as protected. we also need to make sure those young people who have come through our schools, that get good grades, that they have a place to go to school once they graduate. i spoke to a woman who lived in the shadows because she did not

know how to go to school. now we have a pathway, which includes a fine, includes learning english, and i have voted for comprehensive reform. what i did not hear from mr. rossi is what he would include in a package which he has said has failed so far. senator mary approves of amnesty. what needs to happen is the first thing we have to do is secure the border. all these arguments are academic if we do not secure the border. we have to know who is coming, their background, and we need a system in place. we need to be able to bring people here temporarily if they want to work here, and if they really want to come here, they

can chase the american dream. >> senator rossi forgot what he did in the legislature previously. he called for a form of amnesty. i believe we need a comprehensive immigration reform system that includes jobs. we need to make sure high-tech companies can come here. we need to provide a clear path to citizenship. we need to make sure they have a secure work force and we need to secure our borders. that is the kind of program i voted for. i will work with anybody to come to a compromise on this. >> next question comes from nadine. >> the next question is inspired from one of our viewers. clearly, frustrated with the mudslinging that has been going on in the race. both of you are running ads that depict your component -- opponent as someone who has

made poor decisions in the past. is there anything your opponent has done for the state of washington that you approve of? >> senator murray? >> that is a great question. i really do admire mr. rossi for getting into the race. i know how difficult it is, how difficult it can be on your family. i know that you did ask your family because of the huge sacrifice. i know he comes with heart and passion, and i respect that, but one of the things that i am concerned about is the supreme court ruling on a 5-4 decision which now allows these ads to come into our state. you do not know who has paid for them, it could be a national -- multinational corporation. i voted to at least have them tell you in the discos act who is paying for it.

that i do not disagree with. -- in the disclose act who is paying for it. >> i believe senator marie had done good work for veterans. i will do great work for veterans as well. also, you talk about that ads, like there is some sort of a equivalency here. we are both running ads, mind this happen to be the truth. -- mine just happen to be the truth. that is the problem with what is going on right now with politics. you are seeing things taken out of context and put on tv. you have an incumbent who is desperate for six more years. that is what this is about.

she does not want to talk about the stimulus, the bailout she voted for. she is trying to change the subject. that is what is going on here. you are seeing it in ad after ad. newspapers are calling it falls, grossly malicious, does not pass the smell test. those are all things the newspapers are saying. this is a problem. we have come a long way from the good intentions that senator mary had when she started 18 years ago. >> senator murray, you have the chance to rebut. >> i appreciate the endorsements of those newspapers. i am proud of that. i am proud of the work that i do for washington state veterans. i want to make sure that our veterans have what they need

when they return to this economy. i think it is important that we discuss the disclose act which has to say -- which says, you have to say who pays for your ads. i do not understand why he wants these hedge fund managers -- >> we are out of time. mr. rossi? >> after the bailout of the big banks, senator murray had half a million dollars in contributions from these banks. millions of dollars in contributions. i guess that is part of disclosure, too. you have a senator who does one thing in washington state, another in washington, d.c.. which washington do you represent? is anothert question was

videotape question. >> my questions for the candidates are, with politics becoming more and more partisan, what are your plans to bridge that gap, even if it means going against party leadership? are you willing to risk your party is the alien ship -- your party's loyalty to serve your constituents? the shaft that is one of the hallmarks that i had -- >> that is one of the hallmarks of my governorship. i put together a bipartisan budget that balanced the budget deficit in history without raising taxes. putting together the budget, it was not just the budget. there were 51 bill is necessary to implement the measure.

not a single one of those bills or the budget passed on a party- line partisan vote. why? the way i looked at it, the problem was too big for one party to salt. that is the way i see it in washington. unfortunately, senator murray has been working with a majority. she is no. 4 in leadership. she had been ramping through legislation after legislation, such as the health care bill, the finance reform bill. she has been at the epicenter of partisanship. this has to end. the problem that we have are too big for one party to solve but you have to open yourself up to do that. i drove around and met with moderate senators in their home towns. i said, i need your help. i cannot do this by myself. many of them came forward to help me.

two years later we ended up with the state's biggest surplus. >> always start with the premise that my state, the communities that i represent will come first. i will take on anyone to make sure we take care of our state. when president bush tried to close three veterans hospitals in the state, i went after it to and nail to keep them open. when president obama made a proposal to cut veterans' health care, i went after him. when it comes to the nuclear reservation, i have taken on democratic and republican presidents, and will continue to do so, because my state comes first. i will work with anyone who will sit down and fixed tough problems. susan collins and i worked together to tough -- past the tough port security act to make

sure those containers coming and in and out of our ports did not have a terrorist attack. it is why i work with john mccain when three young kids lost their lives in a pipeline accident in washington 10 years ago to pass the pipeline safety laws. when it comes to immigration or health care for the challenge of creating jobs, i will work with our community leaders and anyone to try to solve the problem that are before this nation. >> mr. rossi? >> you did not hear anything about how health care was a bipartisan effort. it was a very partisan piece of legislation. senator murray with 18 years of experience, clearly did not reach across the aisle to bring republicans in the room. we have a serious problem here

with a partisan u.s. senator. one issue after another. you go through all the issues. it has been highly partisan. i will work with anyone who wants to work in good faith to turn the country around. we need to do this. >> what i did not hear was how mr. rossi will work on the challenges in front of us. our debt, making sure people get jobs, making sure our veterans are taking care of. these are bipartisan issues. i have a history of working on investments so that young people have the skills they need to work in their community. i have worked with senators across the aisle many times. i find the rhetoric right now is troubling. i hope that after the election we can come to an agreement on taxes.

it is important that middle- class families have tax cuts. >> we are at the last question of the debate. we will have to keep our answers to 30 seconds. >> there has been talk about replacing the air force tanker. both of you say you support building that tanker. you also say illegal subsidies for airbus should be taken into account, but not boeing. if airbus can demonstrate they can build a better plane, why shouldn't pentagon give them the bid and allow them to start replacing those tankers? >> that is what i have been fighting for. if we have a level playing field and those illegal subsidies are taken into account so that airbus does not have a lower price, i believe we will win

that contract and boeing workers will be building that airplane which our military will be flying. it is also important to remember this is a security issue for the country. i believe those tankers should be built by americans, paid for by american tax dollars. >> where the aerospace industry has cost us 50 million jobs. we need to take that into account. i believe the employees would be willing to put a better product out there. i have had a family member for thecontinuous wly boeing company's 1992. this issue is near and dear to my heart. under senator murray, headquarters moved to chicago. the new plant moved to south

carolina. >> i take a backseat to no one and i make sure that people in our community have jobs. boeing is an important employer. here in spokane, the aerospace industry is very important. i want to make sure that we do for our aerospace industry what we did not do for the auto industry. we need to talk about getting the work force going, making sure that defense contracts are there, making sure that we have the right policy to create a strong aerospace industry in the future. >> which need to make sure that boeing is healthy but we also need to make sure that all businesses in the state of washington are healthy. we need to go in a different direction than we are going right now. the boeing company does not like the $150 million tax