kaptur. then we will speak to joe wilson, a member of the armed services committee joining as at 8:30 to talk about don't ask, don't tell. then we will look at aid pandemic with donald blanchon. this is "washington journal." . .

when the deficit panel was created people are not imagining there would be a transfer of power, but here it is happening. i think that so far, the republican leader john boehner has not made a commitment to vote on the recommendations of the commission. it is the president's commission, after all. it is not the republicans commission. i think that in the minds of many commission members has raised a question of, if they stick out their necks and endorsed a difficult and painful deficit reduction measures, what is the point if it is not even going to get a vote? host: many of the members of the commission being sitting members of congress. another headline that you wrote

recently -- deficit panel doomed from the start. what were you trying to say about the panel? guest: there was a question mark at the end of the headline. i was just raising the question that a lot of people have raised, which is, if you really wanted this thing to succeed, whwhy did you require such a lae majority, which would be the equivalent of 78 votes in the senate to pass. some members have openly questioned whether the president himself was really serious about this, or whether he just wanted it to take up space and take the issue off of the agenda for the 2010 elections. he will ultimately have to decide whether to pick up any of the recommendations in his budget that he will present in february, and i guess that is when we will know how serious he was about the process. host: we know there are a bunch

of high profile significant recommendations. some having to do with entitlements and other areas of spending, taxation. there is a month -- another headline in "the wall street journal" that i wanted to get your take on it. the mortgage tax break, likely to be part of the recommendation. that is a biggie, isn't it? guest: they are talking about limiting it for people above a certain income levels, as i understand, and limiting it for second homes. the idea being, it is a huge subsidy for real estate. you could argue that in fact the subsidy was one of the things that led to the housing bubble, a subsidy that increase over the last couple of decades. it would make sense if you are looking for places to gain revenue and remove special interest subsidies, that is the

biggest single one, and limiting it -- it would be the smart thing to do according to the argument. host: what else should we know about the panel's work as we prepare to hear from them friday? guest: the most important thing, i guess, is the sitting lawmakers to make of 12 members of 18 members have been bitterly, bitterly divided over the approach to deficit reduction. republicans resisted the idea of raising taxes in most forms. the democrats have resisted the idea of limiting future benefits for social security. there has always been a substantial amount of doubt that you could get past those differences. i think the extra two days you mentioned of the outset are an effort by the chairmen to try to convince them, change the package in some way, but it is probably true that the version we will get out this morning will be the final version and ultimately it may not be too much persuading between now and

friday. host: that is the final question as we wrap up. if they can't get agreement on the package, what is the bigger picture in washington? guest: there will still be a report. it will be a report that does not get the 14 votes that arguably would have or perhaps would not have led to a direct vote in congress, but there will still be a report the president can look at, congressional leaders, look at, and decide whether they will pick up any of the ideas and the serious about deficit reduction in 2010 or do we just kicked the can down the road. there is a substantial chance that is exactly what will happen. host: thank you for your update. we will have their meeting today live at 9:30 a.m. eastern time over on c-span 3. the national commission on fiscal responsibility and reform, the final commission

proposal. there will be a vote on friday. live today and, 9:30 a.m., c- span 3. to our topic to the -- for the first part of the journal, jobless benefits have expired. one of the many headlines, the money section of "usa today." millions to lose jobless checks. the longer-term impact at the end of the month, about 2 million people. they point out that a motion by senator jack reed, democrat from long island, fell short. here is a short back and forth from the floor of the senate on all of this. >> the effectiveness of the various techniques to provide assistance and stimulate demand in the economy. and they found that unemployment insurance is far away the most

effective form. much more effective than tax cuts to the wealthiest. the estimate, the cbo, that for every dollar of unemployment compensation benefits that we in jack in the economy, we get $1.90 of economic activity. >> we have to provide that certain to do businesses and small mom and pop businesses, all the way to the biggest corporations, they need to know what is up. they need to know that they can actually rely on us to set policy so they can plan for the future, so they can get those nine-plus percent people off of unemployment. do you think we will just keep creating more and more government jobs, that is it? just printing money and there is no consequence? there is plenty of consequence. host: nothing moves in congress last night. we will see if it does happen today on the federal jobless

issue. the benefits expire midnight. "new york daily news" story, and a peak right up -- an ap write up. the first call, a youngstown, ohio. mike on the line for democrats. what should congress do, if anything? caller: they should definitely extend the benefits. they do everything for big business. they give them every option. the working man, part of my expression, peed on constantly. this state of there is no respect for the working man has to stop. -- stop. these politicians are on the take. both sides, democrats and

republicans. and it sickens me to even watch the news, to listen to them talk because 90% are anti-american. they don't care about the american citizens. they care about special interests. host: let me jump in, because the push back from many on the other side is how to pay for this, yet again. caller: take some of the money from the wars, the war in iraq and the war and i ran -- afghanistan. -- in afghanistan. all of these military contractors, let them take less money. i am sick of it. i am sick of the whole thing. and they are all on the take. host: youngstown, ohio, appreciate the call. chris on the line for republicans. brentwood, california. what do you think? caller: the war in afghanistan is obama's war, according to bob

woodward, obama escalated that war. the democrats still control the senate by a plurality of 16, i think. they control the house still by a plurality of more than 50. why did they put it off until now? they have known for months that this day was coming. to rely on a lame duck is lame. the same thing with the bush tax cut. it is completely inexcusable for leadership to have punted to get to this point at this late date. the appropriations need to be re-upped by the third of december. the bush tax cuts are to expire by the first of january. on unemployment benefits are done today. what is our leadership doing in this lame duck?

they are talking about cheap political stunts like the dream act and don't ask-don't tell. they are important, but they are politics. host: independent from connecticut. those jobless benefits have expired. it happens midnight. should congress be acting now? caller: i would like to agree to the first caller, the democrat, with a number of points. but let me give a little context. i am about 50 with a baby on the way, the first one. i have been out of work since january of 2009. i was a six-figure earner and i scaled back to a 1-bed room -- 1-bedroom condo, went from bmw to a hyundai. sent thousands of resumes. there are no jobs. if the republicans, first of

all, stop obfuscating with ridiculous misdirections that they constantly do and get to the facts and stop trying to blame people for being out of work like we are some kind of sponge of society -- i am sick of that. these people should be pointed out and called out any time they make a statement like that. there is a lot of anger out in the country. i tell you, it will come to bloodshed if they don't do something. host: we will point out the house did attend to pass an extension prior to the x -- did attempt to pass an extension before the thanksgiving break. we do expect something will be attended this week. we are not sure how it will play out what we will let you know as soon as we know. we are asking you, should congress act and for what length of time? speaker pelosi suggest 1-year extension for jobless benefits. back to this "daily news" story, here is a quote.

this is from a chief economist from a financial firm. upper marlboro, maryland. democrat. caller: thank you for the opportunity. all i can say is, the republicans are making the grinch that stole christmas look like a christmas angel. our president and democrats just saved us from the worst recession since the great depression. i am 60 years old and i can remember a time when the republicans were not in power and they got into power when

gingrich came out with this contract on america. a lot of people forget that the republicans up until that time had not been in power for 40 years. and there was a reason for that. and we are seeing it now. my heart goes out to all of those families that are facing this so-called christian holiday which is christmas. not being able to provide just the small boys. you look across the board, charitable donations are way down. the salvation army here in the washington area is a reporting -- because people just don't have it. one last thing. this is just the tip of the iceberg with these republicans because as soon as the gavel

goes down in january, they are going to come after our president with reckless abandon. host: let us hear from a republican from new york city. john, go ahead, please. caller: good morning. basically what is going to happen is people are going to lose their jobs. and the federal government does not want to pay. well, who do you think is going to pay? people are going to have to go to welfare. that is provided by the state or the city. so it will come out of the state's money, city's money. it will create crime. people would not have money to buy food. stores will get robbed. why pick a date, november 28? why don't they keep it until the end of the year to get through the christmas holiday? why that date? i think they are just selfish. none of them had ever been in the situation like a lot of

people have been in. who wants to stay home and do nothing? it is a boring life not to work. host: "the washington times" focuses on the holidays in this issue, the front-page story. economists urge a lame-duck congress to tread carefully. as we pointed out, formal discussions start today on the tax cuts. "politico" writes about this. here are the players -- treasury secretary 10 geithner and budget director jack lew will open talks with representatives from each congressional caucus --

of course, this follows the meeting of the white house yesterday between the president and a bipartisan, bicameral group. maryland. perry, independent. caller: i agree with most of what has been said. one thing that has not been mentioned is, what has caused all of this unemployment? in other words, when there is only one job for every five people looking. it was caused by washington failure of regulation and wall street's greed and manipulation and playing the money game, the paper money game. they caused the worst recession since the 1930's. they caused it.

so they should take care of this. the people are innocent -- innocent, for the most part. the ones without jobs, they got laid off. the idea that the democrats are not going to go -- you would result -- would result in $700 billion over 10 years on the people -- families, household over $250,000, you can't believe. host: let's go to jeff on the line from -- for democrats from illinois. should congress act, and how? caller: i hope you'll let me make two points. the first point is on extending the benefits. in my younger years i've worked for the employment security department. i will tell you that extended benefits does not help people, because when employers go to hire somebody, they are more likely to hire somebody who has

an employment history than somebody who has been drawing extended unemployment benefits because it scares them in this economy that they are going to have to make up that difference. because employers pay 100% of employment security. employees do not contribute to that fund. the other point i would like to make, i am one of these employers who makes over $250,000 a year. and if this tax extension is not extended, i will look to lay off employees to make up the difference or i will move my company -- i will look to move my company to a foreign country where i can make up the difference. i am not going to eat this. host: more on this issue by the numbers. the ap telling us in the first week of 2010, just over 12 million people were receiving unemployment benefits, the most on record dating back to 1986. to respond to what that caller said --

something that was brought up on the senate floor. trenton, new jersey. david, republican. good morning. caller: how are you? in 2009 when quite a few hundred thousand people every month were losing their jobs, it was in our paper some mons ago, obama met in 1.2 billion -- issued a 1.2 billion pieces, including 800,000 unskilled, and mostly of course these are third world immigrants and that is just legal, not to mention illegal. which is insane when you have a great recession or a depression. we did not allow millions to come in from germany or mexico during the great depression when

people were standing in the bread lines pretty you halt migration when you have 25 million unemployed or underemployed, but we will not do it because we are addicted to immigration that happens in perpetuity for ever -- forever. i have been on unemployment for three months. i already have a part-time job. allowed to make an extra close to 100 on the books. i do everything by the book. gaining back about what i was making. but i went from $25 an hour to $9.50 an hour, because of illegal immigration, which took my trade. my brother is about to lose his house. most of the contractors have no work. but the mexicans brought in from philadelphia in these huge trucks to our little town, they are smiling from ear to ear, they are working everywhere -- landscapers, and the american guys, the tractors said idol and the roofers go out of business. we seem to have more compassion

for third world immigrants. one more thing i want to say. somebody says to wants to stay home and collect? i could tell you from personal experience, you do get lazy. you do have a tendency to drink beer and watch reality shows. there is not going to be a chicken little, sky is falling, scenario. you will see several million people find work magically. they will hit the bricks and find something because most people wait until the last month to get something, a job. it is just something about human nature. by the way, our great, great grandfather, if they could see as bitching about not being able to get a job and sitting around for two years, they will come out from the grave and kicked our ass. host: federal jobless benefits usually pick up where the state benefits drop off. they expired at midnight. speaker pelosi suggested a one- year extension.

republicans and a lot of places are pushing back, saying, how will this be paid for? let me get your thoughts on the whole issue. ben bernanke, the fed share, in "the new york times." here is a headline -- he emphasized in a discussion with business leaders yesterday that there is a high toll for families on this jobless bill. the article goes on to talk more about the impact of all of this. new york, gary, independent. yes, sir. you are on the air, sir.

go ahead, please. turn the sound down on your set, if you could. caller: i would like to know, if they should take the federal government pay, that makes more money than most people and put it toward, like, extended unemployment and stuff like that and put it on social security which they are trying to cut. host: what do you make of the president possible poles of for a two-year pay freeze for federal employees. i doubt he will -- caller: i doubt he will freeze his paycheck. host: indiana. democrat. caller: very sad news. i expected this from the republicans, number one, because it is just a standard republican believe, more for me, none for you.

my brother has been unemployed for probably a year and a half, two years. he is a union member, but he has not been able to find any work. i know a lot of people who have been laid off. my husband, thank god, has not been. unemployment benefits run about $300 a week. i can imagine eric cantor certification, mitch mcconnell, john boehner and the rest of the high for looting republican leaders probably spend more than that on a pair of shoes or suits that they wear. they don't have any idea what it is like out here for people -- there is no talking to them. they don't care of that average people are living hand to mouth and will lose their benefits here at christmas, and those

nice, cushy multimillion their republican leaders in the house and senate will go home to their big homes like mike pence in indiana, who is a pig, they will go home and have a nice holiday dinner and regular person is going -- every time i go to the grocery store, i give money to the food bank, i give to charities to help the less advantaged than me, especially at the holidays. i will do it. i will give up what i need to to help. but the multi millionaires, eric cantor judy eric cantor, john boehner, will pay more -- but the multimillionaires, eric cantor, john boehner, will pay more for shoes. host: we will do this for another 50 minutes or 20 minutes. if you are looking for more in from -- we will do this for another 15 minutes or 20 minutes. if you are looking for more

information, there is a seven- step guide. one of items they point out, number five, is an unemployment benefits. they point out, it is another looming deadline. it actually passed now. they point out republicans voiced concerns about the high " because then they tell us the middle of last month the house failed to improve a plan to extend them. all but 11 democrats voted for the extension and all but 21 voted against it. a little bit of sound yesterday. a short clip of the president on the idea of divided government after he met with congressional leaders yesterday. >> i just wrapped up a meeting with leaders from both parties. it was our first chance to get together face-to-face since the election to talk about how we

can best work together to move the country forward. is no secret that we have had differences that have led us to part ways on many issues in the past. but we are americans first, and we share responsibility for the stewardship of our nation. the american people did not vote for gridlock. they did not vote for unyielding partisanship. they are demanding cooperation and they are demanding progress, and they will hold all of us -- i mean, all of us -- accountable. i was very encouraged by the fact that there was broad recognition of that fact in the room. host: one of you were -- one viewer writes this -- and the tab, republican. caller: hello?

north carolina. these people who claim they can find a job, it is just because they can't find a job making the money that they used to make. too bad, maybe they need to go get a job making $7.50 an hour at taco bell. i'm sorry. i am aggressive, i know it. god bless you. i pray for all of you every day. host: all right, and needed, from north carolina. sondra, independent, massachusetts. caller: we should get all of these crooks who turned around and ripped off the government. one of them is the republican who turned around and took $900 million from the fund that was set aside for our veterans. two, we should turn around and taxed china -- tax china. 3, march on washington. smarten up, people.

host: mitch mcconnell, republican senator -- senator, current minority leader. also yesterday on the topic of divided government after meeting the present. >> americans have preferred divided government more often than not since world war ii. it is not unusual to find ourselves in the position. it is also important to remember that some of these periods when you have divided government, they were quite productive. i think of the second clinton administration with welfare reform, balanced budget, trade agreements. we all agree there is no particular reason why we can't find in -- agreement and due important things for the american people over the next two years. host: on the jobless issue, should congress act to extend benefits? missouri. bill on the line for democrats. caller: i think they ought to. in this war that we have with the bush, every time they needed more money for the war, whether

$70 billion or $80 billion, the republicans stood up and they did not say one word about how they would fund this money. they just provided it for george bush. even though we knew the war was based on a lie. host: let me ask you, how long should the extension be and how would it be paid for? caller: i think we ought to cut the wars off. we know we went based on a lie. why are we still in iraq? $10 billion a month. why are we still in iraq? host: let us move on to the republican line. caller: a couple of faxes that nobody seems to want to deal with. obama claims and democrats claim that if we extended to the wealthy people in america it will cost us $750 billion. that is over 10 years. this unemployment benefit is $260 billion every six months. and mr. obama comes out that he

will freeze the federal income. if you look at what he will do, he is not touching any new jobs, and everybody knows he is pushing everybody into government jobs. the new government jobs, they will not be frozen. and the steps in the government jobs -- meaning, they canove somebody up to another step and they will get more money. the other thing that really drives me crazy are these people calling in and talking about pence -- we have not been in control since 2006. the purse strings have been held by the democrats. and they are the ones who've got a sweetheart deals from countrywide, barney frank said there is no problem with freddie mac and fannie mae. when bush tried to stop them from doing what they were doing the holding. -- housing. this whole thing can be laid at the door of this ideologue in the white house.

he got $1 billion in earmarks the last year he was in the senate. just facts, not gimme, gimme. send these people back to work. when they get hungry enough, they will go to work. host: a twitter message responding to an earlier caller from north carolina. in case you missed it, the senate did take a couple of key votes yesterday and "the washington post" has this as a lead story. the largest overhaul of the nation's food safety law in decades.

mixed signals is this headline in "the washington times." they noted eight senate republicans voted against the ban. here are the republicans voting no on the band -- ban. you can read this in "the washington times" and elsewhere. south carolina. william, independent.

are you there? go ahead, sir. caller: about the unemployment, right? if the government really wanted to do something, i remember back in the 1970's, right, they started taking out federal income tax on them. making people pay federal income tax on them. host: glenn is calling from herndon, virginia, not far from washington. democratic caller. good morning. are you there? let's try berkeley springs, west virginia. carl, are you there? caller: you folks like to portray the republicans as non- caring, would like to watch little kids go hungry. it is not true. but, on the other hand, you have to look back in history to the old soviet union.

when the government tries to take care of everyone, takes care of all of your needs, you lose the incentive to get out of bed and tried to find a job. now, i want to see these people get unemployment. they have gotten unemployment for 99 weeks or so. if the government tries to take care of everybody, then we are in trouble because the money has got to come from somewhere. the only way they can do it is redistribution of wealth. and that is just not what this country is about. host: a little more economic stories in the papers today. a couple in "the wall street journal." states lifting spending after a spell of cuts.

this is from the governors' association. they also write this morning that holding is sliding again, and this could further slow the economy. the risk of falling deeper into a slump. economic issues in some of the state's and cities out there. here is the front page of "the boston globe." they talk about the senate wrangling over the extension of jobless benefits. here is the front page. 60,000 folks in massachusetts will be without benefits of this month, right before christmas, according to "the globe." if you check out "the philadelphia inquirer," camden,

new jersey, could lose half of its police force. just across the river from philadelphia. north carolina. beverly on the jobless benefits. should congress be acting now? caller: this is america. government is supposedly for the people, not against the people. and these republicans who are calling in now, i don't know what to say about them except that i talked to many of them and most of their talk is about what the bible says and these people are always -- will always be among you. they are a bunch of crazies. i think these unemployed people should take to the streets and do what you have to do. host: west palm beach, florida. jim, independent. caller: i just wanted to say that unemployment insurance was

not started because people were sympathetic for people who were out of jobs. that might have been part of it. but the reason why it started, it was a keynesian economic idea where you would lessen the impact of a recession in an area. the idea is that recessions and depressions are getting worse because people stop spending money because they don't have it or they think they should save it. what you are trying to do is increase economic activity, so that you have unemployment insurance so when people do lose jobs, they still have money to spend. if you go to germany, where they understand this idea clearly, you can have unemployment insurance at one point with 9% of your prevailing wage -- 90% of your prevailing wage. in this country where you have so many idiots, that won't happen.

that is what it is. host: a little more news from the senate especially on the start treaty. "the new york times" reports that two republicans are hinting with -- at hope for the arms pact with russia. here is the front page of "the hartford correct -- currant." he gave his farewell speech yesterday.

>> in the end, at the difference between a partisan brawl and a passionate but ultimately productive debate rests on the personal relationship between those of us who serve here. the legislative body that operates on unanimous consent as we do cannot function unless the members of this body talk to each other -- trust each other implicitly. the way of building that trust in -- unless there is a will to treat each other with respect and civility and invest the time to create that trust and strengthen the personal bonds. no matter how obnoxious and -- obnoxious you find rhetoric or how old you believe -- find their beliefs, you need them, and in spite of what some insist, you do know and just as when you seek out common ground, no injustice to your political beliefs when you take time to get to know those who do not share them. it's got a long run for senator dodd --

host: a long run for senator dodd in the senate. another line from his speech. one of the right helps -- write- ups of his speech. he suggested lawmakers to avoid changing rules that would tarnish the chamber's reputation -- keeping the filibuster is one of his thought. one last call on federal jobless benefits. what should happen? surely, republican. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. here is how i feel about it. i think they should extend these benefits for these poor people -- here we are at christmas, entering into winter, and these people have heat bills, and more than likely most of them have children they need to worry about. they better extend the benefits

for these people. i just want to say this much. i am a republican. i work very, very hard here in pennsylvania to get the republicans into office here as we as the republicans going to washington, d.c. but i will say this -- i used to try to go to every tea party there is whenever they have a meeting because i want to keep up with that. they better start working together in washington. we are going to keep our eyes open and watch every move and every vote. and john boehner and the whole bunch of them, including obama and a whole bunch of democrats, they better go to washington now, the better start working together and they better realize that we, though voters, sent them there. host: more of your calls coming up on economic matters facing congress. we will take a short time out and talk with representatives marcy kaptur, democrat from ohio. member of the appropriations and budget committee. we will be right back.

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>> "washington journal" continues. host: joining us is representative marcy kaptur, a democrat from ohio, resenting toledo and other areas. what about these jobless benefits? they expired last night. can you give us a sense of what congress might be doing with this issue? guest: the house and attempted to pass an extension a couple of weeks ago but it was not successful on a procedure that was used, that needed 270 boats. we are trying. i want to apologize to the american people, the millions of people affected by this, for expeditiousck of action. there is a recent book written called "winner-take-all politics," and it talks about how washington turned its back on the middle-class and

basically has been making the rich richer. this is just another example of it. people who have a work ethic and who helped build this country, now when the economy has soured, their own governments can't extend benefits, particularly at the holiday season. i know what it is like to live in a family where your dad gets an unemployment check. i remember as a little girl figuring out how much was spent on food, what are property tax is, do we have a car payment. i remember trying to add that up and our father coming over and saying, it's ok, we will get through this. so, i want the families who are affected of around the country to know that i believe congress will do this before the end of the year, but it shouldn't have been this last moment grandstand. i did not agree with senator mcconnell. he wants to give more tax breaks to the rich, people who

earn more than $250,000, which will cost us more than $670 billion over 10 years. extending unemployment benefits will cost about $12 billion over 10 years if you really look at the long term cost of that. 50 times more will be spent on extending tax benefits to the wealthy than taking care of the people who are trying to hold house and home together at the local level in a down economy. again, congress appears, and in fact, does reward those in the high end. i will say something controversial. all of those hedge fund managers and wall street and the people who got bonuses, i have a bill to take 100% of the bonuses that the american people paid for, back. that would pay for the total cost of this unemployment compensation, more than pay for it. host: our guest was elected to a 15th term in the u.s. house of representatives, marcy kaptur, a

member of the budget committee and appropriations committee. the phone numbers are on the bottom of the screen. we will get to your calls in just a moment. there is a lot to talk about beyond the jobless benefits. let us check in with this debt commission, this deficit commission, that is supposed to be voting, we hear, by the end of the week, but is having some demint problems reaching the majority to pass their recommendations. what do you make of their work and what it will mean to your work moving forward? guest: i am glad we have a group focusing on the deficit and trying to make america independent from a financial standpoint here at home rather than being so dependent on foreign borrowing. but think about this. we have a deficit commission, but we don't have a jobs commission. because we have a deficit because the economy is not growing fast enough. we don't have any commission investigating what wall street did to this country. the largest transfer of wealth

in american history. congress has failed the american people to do the kind of investigation, and frankly, the justice department, the kind of prosecution, to go after wrongdoers. we focus on the deficit and say we will cut this and that and we will have to do all of that, but we don't focus on how to make the economy grow. the focus is in the wrong place. we have deficits because the economy has not been growing for over a decade at the rate it needs to to produce the jobs so people can go to work and help pave the way of the republic. we have the telescope turned around in the wrong direction they're we should be talking about how to make the economy -- in the wrong direction. we should be talking about how to make the economy grow. call" says house democrats are raising doubts about leadership plans to hold a vote to extend only the middle-

class tax cuts, saying this strategy within your party is designed to bolster its election prospects and it could backfire. what do you make of that approach and the overall tax cut issue? guest: first of all, we have to keep the economy growing. we had five consecutive quarters of growth. it is not great growth, but it is better than a negative condition that was true when the bush administration left office. we were losing 780,000 jobs a month. so, we are all in our way back but with the huge trade deficits we have an all of the imports, that's quashes domestic growth. if you are going to extend tax benefits into the future, where do you get the greatest bang for the buck -- you don't want to kill demand, to keep that growing, and you get it in the middle class. at the high and there is no

guarantee those dollars will be investigated -- invested and the united states. we have a bill that if anything is being done to extend benefits, that if investment involves, it occurs here. i support the extension of benefits up to the $250,000 level because that is the middle-class. those are the people who are struggling. and above that, you know what, they are doing quite well. host: let us get to calls for our guests. charles, republican. you are up first. good morning. caller: good morning. we are borrowing 36 cents on each dollar that you spend. the government is spending money and we have to borrow 36 cents. i think you should apologize to the people for you people putting us in debt in the first place. did it, and we are in this problem because the free money is that you gave out to people who could not buy homes. and this has gone on for years. host: laying the blame at your

feet and members of congress. guest: there is a lot of blame to pass around, that is for sure. i have been fortunate and privilege to be here for a while and was part of the group back in the 1990's when we balanced the budget, and it was the most wonderful moment. just like a family taken the mortgage and ripping it up because it is paid for. i thought, we are positioning america for the 21st century to be debt free. the bush administration came to the office, there was a republican congress, two wars began and they were not paid for. and all of a sudden this borrowing happens, and it has gotten out of control again give look at the numbers. go back to the submissions of the presidents of the united states, and look at the bush administration budget, and look at what happened. in terms of the holding market, we probably share a point of view. i opposed the deregulation of

the finance and industry back during the 1990's that led to this cowboy behavior where the mortgage instrument was turned into a security and prudent lending and oversight was abandoned at the local level. we have now yielded this financial meltdown because of the lack of rules and the kind of abandoned and moral hazards that entered our financial system. both parties are to blame for that. you have to go back and look at individual voting records during the 1990's and how people voted to basically take the handcuffs off of wall street, and look at what they did to us. every member has to account for themselves there. but we can put our accounts back in order but the most important thing is to put people back to work. host: what is the situation in your state and your district?

guest: in terms of unemployment benefits, the fact that they expired means over 100,000 people -- families -- will be harmed immediately in this season. i know they are out there were ringing. all i want to say is, don't worry, i hope that congress can enact this retroactively. i am not in charge of the senate, that is for sure. but the house is trying. call your members of congress, call your senators. we are here in washington now. you don't have to call washington. you can call the district office. in my own district there were 4000 families affected by this lack of extension, so i am very sensitive. this is people -- these are people who want to work. this is where the work ethic lives and -- this is where the work ethic lies in this country. they earned these benefits. they do go to work. i think the value of work is

extraordinarily important. and when you don't acknowledge that you end up eroding the value of work in this country and the work ethic itself. host: new jersey. don, democrat. caller: my question is, the last two years the cola increase has been stopped for social security people and president obama mentioned a month ago he was going to try to get a $250 check for people. i am wondering if you heard anything about it in congress. thank you. guest: thank you very much for calling in. no one supports social security and its improvement more than i do. and i was very, very disappointed to see that the particular formula that was used has resulted in the fact that at a very difficult time of rising food and energy prices,

that the formula did not include the increase for seniors. the president has not submitted his new budget, obviously, for the new year. in this past budget cycle he did allow, and congress passed, the $250 additional funds for seniors. i don't know what will happen. there is no leadership in the house. i don't know what they will do, what the president will propose, but there is no senior in this country that should go hungry or should be concerned about the cost of their medicine and heating bills this winter. and i think congress will do what is responsible. but right now that transfer of funds to seniors has not been approved. . .

here ot at home. the hundreds of dollars hurt us everyday. in this current recession wasn't

just industryingored by the housing crisis, it was triggered by with the increase in oil in 2007-20089. it went over $4 a gallon, whenever that happens, we go into deep recession. that means we are not concerned here at home. the last three major recessions we had have been triggered by rising oil prices. joot north part of the state. our guest was an urban planner for 1r5 year brz running for congress. you sit on appropriate operations and budget committees. this change over, what is this going to mean to you. what do you see happening in the first half year next year.

guest: the president will come up in january and deliver his state address. we have deviced government. you have a house that is in republican control and the senate what is minimally dem tick control. i hope what the president said yesterday and the new speak for be, i hope they will be americans first and not partisan's first.

>> whether it is overwhelm hand security or department of transportation. they have to operate within certain budget structures because the new budgets for the bills have not locked in for next year, 2011, we have to have some operating baseline.

they use last years, in a sense, it's a cap on last year's levels ifrment r guest: to say to the department of agriculture at a time when food banks are struggling, that you are going back to 2008 levels i would personally fight you can't let people in this country go hungry if you come to washington, d.c., you wouldn't realize there is unemployment

but go to youngs town or toledo. the state of michigan, las vegas, florida. you have to help the bhoel country, not just one region ranton: a lot more calls here. baltimore. republican call. caller: i happen to be a republican that is a staufrj admirer for you. you were a strong opponent. you believe we are the only way we will attract jobs is to remove the trade agreement the

middle class in this country who was the n voi of the world. the only way to create the middle class economies to fwring the jobs back. what are you gooding to put pressure on the president to do this? >> that is something you talk about for years on this program. it's over $1 trillion in the red. that means more income coming in

an exporter going out. i agree that we need a coalition of democrats. this is something wrong with what is happening out there in our country that country sends over 700,000 cars to this country.

jo we could have turned that back unfortunately that didn't happen. you mentioned cars. how is the industry doing in ohio right now? >> right now, the industry is ramping up again jo they paid back the funds loaned it them by the government. car sales are up, manufacture sales are up corporate profits are up. what isn't up is employment and wanls there's three shifts

working out at the wrangler line right now ranton: the lafrj of the volt as they point out this is a lot riding on the big hope. can you speak to tho whole

notion as some have critiqued them. >> i think this is a lot of pent um anxiety because the banking situation wasn't fixed the right way. six institutions, six. companies like j. p. morgan control 2/3 of the capital of this country. we've had more bank failures and

mergers. local capital has been tlod throttled as these large companies really have too much control. it is too much in the hands of too few. >> john, you've been patient on the line. good morning. >> back in 1992. ross per oat made a comment and said you'll hear a big sucking soubd when nafta came into play. >> a lot of people here. those people are middle class people. people are people. wall street bush.

you just said it, too few people control all the money. nothing is gonna change. all the money given on the campaign bin lad incould have given money and we won't know it. the most important action they could take is to refinance the money. our republic is at risk bhauz of what is happening with unlimited amounts of money there are also

two new movies that have come out. the movies reduce it to a way that ordinary pement can understand. i remember those. when the person women really understand, thinks will happen year. we won with 59.5 perts. how did you combat a 3-1 percentage from your opponent? it was very hard. we had about eight different joint appearances and formats we did a lot of mailings a lot of

retail projects. we tried very hard to help our community >> gh morning. what is causing it is inflower illegal immigrants. they pay less for health and staff you stood here and bee lay

this point little win pen passed the point to keep housing separate. democrats caused a lot of this problem. making it look like they are all on wall street. guest: you are correct about that. you can go back and hold each member of congress account able. i agree with you on that point.

we are not suffering by any means. it has hurt our republic grave ly the banks wanted to get into loans i'm a city planner by trining. tle decided to gain the system and hoier inflated the housing market and we all experienced this great crash. it was totally irresponsible and washington still not. think fw the signal that sends

to that industry. do it again. do it ghen. in terms of the immigration issue, do it again. a lot of people are lured into this countrynd work under those circumstances. neither party has addressed that issue effectively. there isn't time to go no a lot of details there but i agree with you that people working here should be here legally.

i did that for a couple reasons. to give our party a chance to think about what had just happened we had a resolution. we offered it. we were given a full chance. we got 58 votes. we were pretty proud of that. our party has to focus on the economy and healing what's wrong. there wasn't enough focus on that in our opinion and also to get structures that would be more focus $on economic issue

even until today is speaker pelosi the right leader? >> where she and i have different agreements, on what should come host. she represents a coastal community. those of us who come from the heartland have a different type of economic base. we want to be able to have mechanisms to bring the concerns of those regions for formally to

the market. you look at the new speaker, he's from our state he and i represent different sections of our state. i say to my own party, what does that tell you? in the way we formally deal with issues. that's what our efforts were all about. >> good morning. i've been on hold for 15 minutes. my husband is disabled. i'm 62 years old and work three jobs. i don't appreciate the host asking all the questions. this is costing me money. the first question is the rich and tax cuts.

use? details when you tash about >> the average american got $1,000 tax break which amounted to $100,000, amounting to $92,000 in their bobbing we node to get a spien and stand for what we believe. not because the palestinians are so strong but dem catses are so weak. if you are a palestinian

guest: you should run for congress. thank you for calling in and thank you for being a good spouse to your husband. i can only imagine what it is like to work three jobs your type of voice needs to be heard inside the capital. that is becoming harder and harder. in louisiana, it caller: i got a couple of questions. she's always saying about how wonderful it was whether clinton

was in. they had to get clinton kicking and screaming to sign all this stuff. the reason george bush had these tax cuts guest: thank you for calling in. i believe the reason we were

able to balance out the budget is because of the legislate we passed in 19 the 3. one of the most important figures because of his placement, he headed the budget committee in the house he did a phenomenal job. there were many choices made in congress bill clinton's name. we were able to see the kind of

growth that lead us to a better economy we are paying a very serious price for that caller: there's a lot of things i wanted to ask. i want to throw in a couple of interesting skwes. it was kind of thrown eamon can i wrench with the prime lender

mechanism basically deciding he could not carry the solar financing felt it was a complete competition for them to offer the special type of financing we offer where the homeowner doesn't actually pay despite the power. they interfeared with leg slaigs slags i think it was thoms would

was working to try to salvage. guest: i will talk to him. i don't have detailed knowledge of that. i will check with the congressman ranton: are you expecting any changes in the way the process works? caller: no. i have heard on the budget committees in different periods. the primary job is to produce the magic number i think the new leadership of the house will

have a major responsibility they don't have to agree. it doesn't have to be signed by the president. they'll probably different priorities between the house and senate ranton: heartford, connecticut, good morning. caller: my issue is that the government passes all these laws.

they are p poluting. it would come put people back to work. guest: thank you for calling in. you have put your finger on the issue on the raid arena in a remains unresolved if you look around all the country even

though it is costing billions. 10% of the tree cover will be gone. the importer won't have to pay for it. we need trade agreements that don't allow that to happen. that's why we need to renegotiate. you can go to mexico and see dumping intohe water ways there that would never be allowed into the country. we let those goods in here. that's why we need a time out to renegotiate.

caller: i have a question as far as balancing the public. they seem to be taking it out on the elderly my social security check last year was $1029. then they come up with two years in 2008-2009 that i did not pay enough taxes to cover my medicare payments ranton: what would you say to that caller? guest: thank you for calling in.

i place a higher priority on senior citizens than i 0 do on foreign aid. in you think about the collapse of the soefent union, we can't do that. >> call your member of congress. no senior citizen in this country should have to worry you've earned your right.

>> one last issue before we let you go. one of your colleagues, how will you vote and when are your thoughts? one member that wants to be a judge combi the way of the standards committee. every member will have to listen to what is said never a man, they were never interested in money. i feel if the committee comes forward and there was sloppy record keeping and things

weren't done proper lishgs if he pays a heavy price for that we will have to do what is legally required of the congress it is very uncomfortable to have to vote relating to their colleague when you know someone personally, the member of appropriate operations and the budget. thank you for your time.

talking about ending don't ask, don't tell. your calls in the meantime news now in the meantime. >> co-chairs of the fiscal position have delayed a vote the pan al begins the report. you can read it on our website c-span.org. look for it in two places in the news box and featured link is. making appearances on several morning television programs talking about several issues. some taf changes will be made. remarks on the today show, he

quotes the president as saying the american didn't vote in november for grid lock and somewhere in all of this, we can find common ground. on the cbs early show, he strongly believes president obama will be able to win senate rad if i indication to the new start with russia before christmas. more when he briefs reporters from the white house. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> listen to landmark supreme court cases. >> these are stat turs to continue the state's use of race

based marriage restrictions. >> the education program specialist this year's theme is washington, d.c. through my lense. how the federal government has affected the line. the goal is that you canfully develop and research your topic, provide photos to support your theme. for more information, submit your website at c-span.org.

go get started. we can't wait to see what you can do. >> talking about this debate. this report. one of the headline saying that gay troops are not a problem. what's your take? guest: i appreciate you referencing this. i represent fort jackson and the marine corpse air station. i have extraordinary military facilities. i served 31 years. i have four sons who are currently serving in the military, two who served in iraq. one for a year and one for three months with the sales and rangers.

as i hear that headline, special operations all have great reservations >> front line fighters wary. >> what we should do we didn't receive the report. two copies. i'll commend the outgoing chairman for the armed services committee boevenlg us sent out a release indicating the lame duck

is not the time to submit the steps that is my main interest. where you don't need to change the system. nearly 60%. to protect herself and the orderly process. the senate hearings on the way later this week. we will cover them live on the gnat side. lines here for republicans.

don't ask don't tell. specifically to this department and report. an expensive study as they put it. by the numbers, the affect of don't ask don't tell, to repeal it up to 20% of folks i'm so grateful that the chairman of california of the armed services committee to really go over the issues. the focus in this lame duck should be on creating jobs and stopping the tax increase what

the tax increase will be. this needs to be addressed. we need to do this first. what will you be looking for >> there is a difference in our combat service report. in the marines and special services that would be mostly impacted. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. i served in the military. it's a completely unique beast. it's designed for killing and

unity. it is designed for one pourp. as soon as you add distraction, you have a break in command. the moral fiber of our soldiers and what we stand for. if you go to church on sunday and the pastor reads from the bible that a man who lays next to another man is an a bonn bomb ination ranton: let me ask you that 92% of troops who served with someone they believed to be gay worked together very good, good or neither good nor poor. caller: my answer is that

sometimes people will take a survey and answer what is politically correct. my opinion is that homosexuals should not be allowed in the service in the beginning. guest: i respkt his woint of view the system is working and does not need to be changed. guest: good morning. i was going to make a statement about somebody else. i wanted to make a statement one sin is not worse than another

when you go to what jesus said that those who are without the first sin should cast the first stone. it's something for god to judge. but when these people are allowed to enter the military guest: this indicates how diverse the view are. a discussion over what really divides substantially. the people in the military and

getting diverse views ranton: they say if this were an election, the results would be a land slide. guest: 20% have indicate it had would not be a problem, 30% indicate it wouldn't be a problem. 50% don't want to be involved they want to focus on truly protecting the american people.

marines and special operations. there are the figures again per the study, positive impact >> all the potential changes. dealing with the gorj benefits the majority of concern. dealing with sexual conduct, marital and survival benefits could be governed by existing

laws and regulations. existing policies can and should be applied equally. the repeal would be required, the key to success is training, dedication and strong leadership up and down the change of command. >> this are so many different issues that really should be considered. this were so many issues he discussed. he will appear before the senate

armed services. we know of his devotion to the military. senator lindsay graham still serving with the airport reserve ranton: we'll follow that on c-span 3, a full committee hearing we'll have for you tomorrow. secretary gate also be there he is one of the reports there. john, independent caller. >> congressman, i'm a restiered sargent in the marine corps. i've been from vietnam to the phoenix program all the way up. i don't know where you've got your facts from, we've had gays in the military all that i know

of. in the marine corps, we trust each other. once a marine, always a marine. why can't you raise enough money to pay your own salaries. guest: i hear what you are saying. you are right. gays andles bee ans can serve. we are talking about people openly stating their lifestyle. we have a system that works now and respects privacy.

we need to have hearings so all points of view are shared. jo don't rush to repeal. the retired arnly of appeal host: to california on the republican line. good morning. caller: i never heard you apologize to the american people for your out burst in the calm ber. guest: i'm glad you brought that

up. of course i apologize to the president within an hour without being asked to because i am a gentleman. i'm the dad of four eagle scouts. i know honor and integrity and responsibility. i apologize one time. there was an effort by people on the far left to put me on a propet you'll apologize tour. i'm not going to do it. i know i'm a gentleman, he accepted my apologize. the vice president accepted the apologize and pointed out he snows senate you are joe wilson. the apologize was made. one apologize, one time. that's the way it should be. >> that was the "you lie" comment. guest: as my oldest son told me,

he has bhn appointmented attorney general now. he said, i know what happened, it was a town hall moment, which it was. the a. apologize immediately. the agreement was to discussion the issues civilly. i've done it over a year now. i'm happy for that issue to come up. i was vindicated by the people i represent. they know i'm a gentleman. i received an overwhelming vote and in the primary in june. rye inspect the president. he knows that and accepted my apologize. from my understanding, it is the lowest level of activity and it

was a politic cat stunt. i appreciate the incoming speaker of the house pointing out it was a political stunt intended to muscle me. i'm not going to be muscled on any issue in congress. i'm going to say what i think and stand up for the people i represent in south carolina ranton: back to the phone. on the line with democrats talking about don't ask, don't tell. caller: hi paul, i never talked to you before. i appreciate how you handled things. let me have my say here. congressman wilson. about don't ask, don't tell. i'm a het row sexual, 72 christian woman. married to the same mai man for 40 years. i know no one who is gay.

i must speak up to you. you say it works if you roo inspect people's privacy. are you familiar with the the name of the loot col. 19 years of experience as a fighter pilot. some person outed him about a year ago. no one asked him, he did not tell of as of october, we lost him. they had been warning him for a year they were investigating him. they put him out of the military with his 19 years of experience. i hope you hav some way to see him on television. you've never seen such a gentleman a in your life. are you aware of danny choi. number one in his class at west pointed, a doored by his troops.

never asked, never told until he found somebody he really wanted to spend his life with. we lost him in october, they put him out. what kind of respect for his privacy. guest: my view sthat current law we have is working i respect the privacy of the two people you oitd tied. i believe their activities should have been private i respect the current law we have. it's working. caller: good morning. i pressure opening remarks on the floor.

i thank god swef somebody who stood up to the leaders in washington. we are talking about people who are 1% of the population. why are we so concerned? none are great, none are number one. all can be replaced. thank you, from a third generation union member in detroit michigan. thank you. guest: thank you for your comments. i truly believe the system we have is working. we need to have hearings. i'm happy to have hearings on any issue we raise this morning. i appreciate the information

we've had. we can go over the issues. this should not be done in a lame duck session. we should be working on stopping the tax increase coming january 1. >> "new york times" talks about process. they passed the version of the appeal. pros smekts remain uncertain. mr. gates, mr. johnson and general ham are set to testify on the senate side thursday as we pointed out. a more important section will comm commony to hear from the chiefs of the army, navy, air force. guest: the secretary is appointed by the represent. the joint chiefs which common friday are independent.

i would look at that as being independent. i respect the president's view. he had said this should be handled by congress. it should not be say done by a court discussion. it should be a judicial effort. the president has made it by a sleg slative effort an made it clear ranton: is it correct that the house passage of this will not hold? guest: it would have to come back up just like all other legislation f. it were carried over it would come back up in the new congress and consider it about new leadership. . .

anything that a gay might do is handled by the uniform code of military justice. it is really funny to me that when we were in iraq, democrats were trying to have hearings on what generals should be doing, whether we should go in with more troops.

you people were saying no, let's listen to the generals in the field. now the same thing is occurring with gays in the military and you will not have hearings. the statement by mr. bush, we do not need 435 generals. why do we need to have hearings now on something about the military? all the generals in the field and the secretary of defense has stated that this should be implemented. they should be able to surf. we are losing people. you say it is working. how is it working when we are losing linguists because they are gay? guest: it is a combination of paying attention to the military and hearings. that is why the military findings are so important. the joint chiefs will be reflecting their view. it will be top-down directed. it should be a combination of

both. texas.et's hear from will on the line for republicans. >> i retired from the military. i'm really concerned with this issue. i believe we should keep the policy. when i was in, we did not have the policy. it came into effect while i was there. like the congressman said, is working fine. nobody cares what anybody does behind closed doors and on their own. for good cohesiveness, a change in the policy -- where does it stop? do we now have navy or army celebrations where two guys in uniform are dancing and kissing? that sounds strange, but these are questions that have to be answered. guest: i served, just like you. i was 31 years in the army guard reserve.

i saw the system working. i was a jag officer. i believe the system is working. we do need to have hearings. i respect the co-chairmen of the commission. i know they are honorable persons. i'm joined by the chairman for hearings next year. host: there is a gentleman from madison, wisconsin, a former green beret officer, gay and one of the very first to legally challenge the ban on gays in 1976. this the were says it is absurd -- this the were says it is absurd -- this viewer says it is upsurge. guest: hearings are not what

congress should be doing -- are what congress should be doing. i respect the request that we would have hearings. getting the input, listening to the american people -- one reason there was changed on november 2 is because i believe congress did not listen to the american people. american people are concerned about jobs. we need to stop the tax increase, which is coming on january 1. we need to be addressing that and not addressing this at this time. we need to have hearings in the spring. host: on don't ask, don't tell, christian science monitor asked how other countries handle it. guest: this is where we need to

have hearings that address this. we find out from other militaries on how they handle this issue. that is why a hearing would be helpful. host: 16 countries including pakistan, syria, and venezuela bar open homosexuals from serving in the military. across africa, 37 countries consider homosexuality is illegal inside the military or not. wyoming, minn., now. caller: good morning. congressman, with all due respect, like the man said, hearings for this thing is absurd. we've been having hearings for years and years on this subject. like he said, the president is

going to get this done during the lame-duck congress. i'm glad that he is. you are just trying to avoid it when it is a bigoted situation. the last thing i have to say, everyone is so religious about this. god says that those that have judgment on other people, they will not make it to heaven before the people they cast judgment on. guest: i believe that hearings are helpful. we can hear from people like you, people who disagree with you. we can hear from military families. i'm so proud of military families, their commitment. we need to be hearing from service members, military families, veterans, and we need to hear from the veteran service organizations. all of this is very legitimate.

i defend chairman mckeon and his request for hearings. this will be positive for the american people. host: pat, welcome. caller: thank you for taking my call. i am an older person. i remember when gays and lesbians were still in the closet. and then i remember when it was real popular to come out of the closet and we saw big caucuses on gays and lesbians and gay parade. i do not care one way or another if you are gay or not. what i wanted to ask is, do you think now it is going to be yes, ask, yes, tell? is that going to open up a can of worms for lawsuits, harassment, because i am gay, i'm proud i'm gay, -- i mean,

you have a lot of macho guys in the service. are they going to want to shower with these people, sleep next to the gay men? if they do make comments or something, is this going to give the gay person a right to sue in some way. i'll hang up and listen to the comments. host: rep wilson? guest: your question is very legitimate. that is what would come up at hearings. that is why we would have service members and military families, and expressed their support or opposition to changing the policy. i truly believe this and i will say this again. respecting privacy, i believe low law should be maintained as it is. -- the law should be maintained as it is. host: omaha, nebraska. susan, good morning.

i do not think we have susan. let's try florida. michael, a democrat, hello to you. caller: good morning. isn't the guy in charge of the military -- isn't he a republican? host: you're talking about defense secretary robert gates? host: he has served in republican administrations as well as this one. why do you ask? caller: i think the people of the opinion -- of the people in the military, i think that is what it should be. host: the congressman has said he wants to hear from a broader perspective of people. guest: i will give credit to the commission. they did interview military families. they did not include veteran service organizations, and they

have a real role in representing veterans. host: what is the difference between the veteran service organizations and the actual military? guest: they are independent. you always have to be politically correct. that's the feeling. you cannot express our point of view if you're in the military. members of the military are reticent to talk about politics. they do not like to talk about religion. we are really respectful of the privacy and rights of everyone, and the same would apply to sexual orientation. host: phoenix, roger, independent. caller: thank you for taking my call. i really enjoy listening to c- span. i served in the navy in the 1960's. i was on a submarine. we had a confined area. he talked about a confined area.

people would not be comfortable with that. we had a gay and we accepted him. we knew he was gay. everybody knew he was gay and that was acceptable. a confined area -- i'm sorry. the system does not work. he says the system works. it does not work as it is right now. you have personal -- you have personnel who were kicked out of the service because they are gay. they could be in a service held in this country out. they want to help this country out. we have a system that takes them out when we need them. host: you've mentioned several times that the system works. can you articulate that again? what exactly do you mean? guest: it works because people who are gay and lesbian can serve, but they are not to tell. that is what don't ask, don't

tell means. you do not ask and you do not tell. i believe the system is working. as the gentleman indicates, a person he served with in the military -- they can serve. it is becoming openly identified, which is the problem. i believe the system works. i believe, as we can see from the information -- there is a real challenge to people who are in combat roles. nearly 60% see this as a challenge to their ability to be combat ready. host: you've mentioned that the house should hold hearings. explain moving forward when the gop takes over leadership. how is your role changing? guest: i'm hoping to be the chairman of the military personnel subcommittee, which would have jurisdiction on this issue. the chairman of the committee will be buck mckeon of

california. i'm very proud. the arms services committee is largely bipartisan. chairman skelton has done a great job. i've enjoyed working with him, even if we disagree with the current chairwoman of the military personnel committee, susan davis of california. we have a good working relationship. when we do -- when the republicans come to power on january 5, that is the time that we should then begin the process of planning hearings. host: time for a last call or two. christian,ity, a christi democrat. caller: good morning. with the standing up there and calling our president a liar, will you call george bush a liar because he lied about weapons of mass destruction? host: let me stop you there. guest: absolutely not. president bush was not a liar.

president bush was standing up for the people of our country, for the security of the american people, and so i have faith in what george bush did to protect the american people. he has been proven correct in our efforts and success in victory. caller: i'm going to read revelations 13-16. i believe this man is a racist. let me read this out of the bible. "aunt in the midst of the seven candlesticks, one light unto the son of man, a garment down to the foot. his head and his hair were white flight wool. his eyes were like a flame onto fighter. his feet onto fine brass as if they burned in a furnace."

host: you did make a charge against the congressman? you called him a racist. caller: that is right. when you have the head of the republicans say that our agenda is to make sure that this man fails -- the whole reason they are doing that is because this is a black man. host: let me give you a chance to respond. guest: i disagree. i cannot wait for you to get to meet congressman tim scott. he's the first african-american elected from our state and over 100 years to congress. a good, conservative republican. i cannot wait for you to get to see tim scott. i hope you see him every day. i'm also very grateful for colonel alan west, who has been elected. he is a prominent military person himself. we have two african-americans now in the republican conference. i will tell you that you are

wrong. even better, i cannot wait for you to get no tim scott -- get to know tim scott. caller: thank you for taking my call. it's an honor to talk with you, representative wilson, and i applaud you for what you have done on the senate floor. thank you so much. i would like to see for all the distractions to be gone from the debate right now and get to the important issues. as well as the fact that the previous caller is calling you and republicans racist. shame on him. the fact of the matter is that history shows that is an absolute lie about republicans. maybe you should have some debate on that. thank you, again. host: final thoughts on don't ask, don't tell. guest: we have a policy that is working. it respects privacy. we need to have hearings.

i join with mckeon to have hearings. host: our guest has been congressman joe wilson. we appreciate your time. guest: an honor to be host:: we have 40 minutes left in this wednesday edition of the "washington journal." when we come back, we will take a look world look aids day. today our guest is donald blanchon, executive director of the whitman-walker clinic. in the meantime, some news from c-span radio. >> the labor department says productivity grew at an annual rate of two 0.3% in the july deal september quarter. that's an improvement over the initial estimate of 1.9%. a food safety bill appears headed back to the senate because democrats violated a constitutional provision requiring that tax provisions originate in the u.s. house.

the senate passed the bill yesterday, sending it to the house. house democrats are expected to use a procedure known as blue slipping to block the bill. the chairman of the federal communications commission outlined his proposal for network neutrality rules in a speech today. this is despite republican opposition in congress. the plan would provide the phone and cable companies from blocking or discriminating against internet traffic flowing over there broadband networks. the chairman plans to bring his proposal to a vote by the full commission by the end of the year. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> best known for his novels, he will discuss his lesser-known nonfiction works.

join our 3 our conversation sunday at noon eastern on c- span2. >> listen to landmark supreme court cases saturdays on c-span radio. >> these are racial statutes to perpetuate his slavery. that is not a permissible state action. >> this week, the commonwealth of virginia v loving. listen to the arguments saturday at 6:00 p.m. eastern on c-span radio. >> find great holiday gifts at are c-span stored. -- our c-span store.

>> "washington journal" continues. st: our guest now on this world aids day, donald blanchon, executive director of the whitman-walker clinic. on this world aids day, give us the latest news about the number of cases and treatment of them. guest: sure, and i'm glad to be here today. this is reflecting a sobering day for all of us, but it is also a day of optimism. we have a tremendous amount of treatment options available across the globe. the big challenge has been getting medications to people in all types of communities all over the globe. more than 33 million people living with hiv on the planet and more infected every day. in this country, 56,000 per year. in the district, 18,000 per year. the real challenge is the long term. what are we going to do in terms of treatment? we know that medications work.

how're we going to fund those over the life of many millions of people across the planet? host: where are the trends? guest: unfortunately, the trends are on a community by community basis. there is some startling information in communities of color. black americans have seen a rise over the 20-year period. the latino community in our country has seen an uptick. a group that does not get a lot of coverage, but seniors. there's a fair number of seniors. we pretend that seniors are not sexually active, but they are, and they are at risk if they do not know their status and get tested. if they are hiv positive, take their medications. host: our guest will be with us for the next 40 minutes. describe the work of your operation. guest: we have a wonderful

operation of about 130 employees. our mission is to be a high quality health center serving this diverse community with special expertise in lgbt and hiv care. host: phone number urs on the bottom of the screen for our guest on this world aids day. we want to present some additional numbers. usa diagnoses by age. you touched on aging little bit. just so you know what is out there, through 2008, according to the cdc, those under 25 -- 58,000 people diagnosed. 25 to 49, that age group, close to 900,000 people. 50 and over, as you touched on, 142,000 plus. we also have information from the cdc about states. the top states for aids cases.

new york is first. california is second. florida has over 100,000 aids cases. any more perspective on those numbers? guest: we have a concentration of where individuals with hiv are. we have nine states and pr making up 70% of the known cases of hiv in this country. in those states and in the urban areas within those states, there's a tremendous amount of work that needs to go on around prevention, education, and keeping people in treatment. host: 33 million people globally, as you touched on, but here are the top countries. south africa, 5.6 million aids cases. nigeria, second. india, kenya, mozambique, and tanzania. a lot of africa there. guest: we've had great successes, regardless of your political view.

what we are coming up with is a crossroads in this country and sub-saharan africa. we're going to keep people alive for 30-plus years. what that means for the person from a health perspective, but also what means from the perspective of the society to pay for those medications. most of the medications are not cheap. they can cost up to $1,000 per month per person. this is going to be a long-term challenge for all of us. host: a big part of this conversation is how to fund this. speak about the treatments themselves. what has been the biggest positive development in the last couple of years? guest: the easiest one to point to is the one a day type skills. instead of having to take a combination of medications, you are taking one pill per day and you're fighting the virus that way. that has been the simplest and

easiest for patients. host: let's take our first call for donald blanchon from pittsburgh. jackie on the line for republicans. hi. caller: hello. i'm from pittsburgh, pennsylvania and i'm a democrat. in pittsburgh on world aids day , we have a place that anybody can go get tested, and then they come back and two weeks later they find out if they are positive or negative. i am a lesbian. two years ago, i went because i wanted to get checked because i was rate in the beginning of my life and realized that -- i was straight in the beginning of my life, and realized i am gay and i'm married. my wife was married for 24

years. we both got tested. it is free in pittsburgh, pa.. the university of pittsburgh. host: pretreatment. guest: caller: -- guest: yes, it's wonderful. world aids day is a great day for people to get tested. there are test sites all over the country. free testing is available at many of a local health centers, local city and state health departments, and what is wonderful about it is the test is the oral test. you can find out your preliminary results in 20 minutes. it's not a really long test. it is something you can do as part of your routine day. if you are diagnosed as a preliminary positive on that test, there are blood tests to do for confirmation. you can do this in a short

period of time. . host: opens the door to the discussion of finding itself. how does this work? begin with the person in the locality and take it to the federal government and beyond. guest: the reality is that our health care system is pretty complicated. we would love to have something more simple. we have multiple funding sources. a lot of our hiv education, prevention, and dream comes from the ryan white care act. it funds a lot of primary medical care, mental health, substance abuse, testing and counseling, case management, and other supportive services. that's a big component. in increasing size of funding for clinics like whitman walker and other hiv organizations has been medicaid. more people are on medicaid. more people on medicaid are hiv- positive. more of their treatment is

covered by the source. sources,st of funding not dissimilar from what health care does now. what goes on in hiv care that a little bit different is that we rely on a lot of fund raising. we do a lot of support of service work, whether in the food banks, housing, peer support groups -- those types of things that help people stay in treatment. doing that requires additional funds. that's where a lot of our organizations raise money. host: does the new health-care law address aids specifically? guest: it has some opportunities for us to do things better. one of the best opportunities is for us to think of how the ryan white care act fits with post health care reform. more of the individuals we care for are going to have some type of coverage. host: ohio, john, republican.

good morning. caller: good morning. why don't we set up something like we did with tb, sanitariums, and deal with these people that way. get them out of the population and treat them humanely. get them where they cannot infect the rest of the country. host ofhere's a whole concerns that i would raise. the first one would be human dignity. the transmission modes for hiv is different from tb. there are different treatment modalities for people living with hiv. i would not want to discriminate against any individual based on the condition. i personally would not want to live in a society that does that to any individual. host: north carolina, sam on the line for republicandemocrats.

good morning. caller: good morning. when you said it cost $800 to $1,000 per month, and that blew me away. it cannot cost that much money to make a little pills. host: let me stop you there. eight hundred dollars to $1,000, how does that figure, about? explain why it cost that kind of money. guest: those are the great questions you can talk to pharmaceutical manufacturers about. there's a fair amount of up- front capital invested in making any new drug. with the hiv, one of the unique things is that it is a very difficult virus to isolate its behavior on. we've had challenges in clinical research in really getting our arms around that. that's why there's not a vaccine yet.

we do have great medications. they do cost money. that will be our significant long-term challenge. host: any other point you want to make? caller: no. i was surprised by that. guest: there's a lot of hope that over time, the pricing of these medications would come down paid one would hope that the manufacturers could get to the place where they could do more from a generic perspective and lower the cost of the ingredient. and there's always hope that there will be a new medication that comes along, or a vaccine that will help us. there is ongoing research. the federal government is a tremendous thunder in the united states of hiv research. host: new york, philip, republican. good morning. caller: good morning.

in the interest of full disclosure, i've not voted republican since 2002, but that's another phone call. i was surprised to see the past year, especially in metropolitan areas. president obama, wherever he spoke, the speeches were usually interrupted by aids protesters. if you look at the number as a whole, funding for aids has increased somewhat. a couple months later, i read an article in "the new york times" on page 17 or somewhere that said that we now have a waiting lists in america for people who have been infected with hiv aids because the federal government has not extended the drug program for the uninsured known as adap. i telephoned the people in san francisco gore in charge of that. -- in san francisco who are in

charge of that. i was told that nancy pelosi and president obama had decided that they were not going to go into debt any more or cause any more red ink for this project and we would have to wait. the decisions are on a state-by- state basis. as of today, 3500 people who were receiving medications to keep them alive no longer do. there are waiting lists. i do not need to take all this time. i have to finish. and then we come to find out who in the congress is fighting for this. it turns out senator coburn of oklahoma and senator burr of north carolina and these are hardly a liberal senators. they have been fighting -- and i called their office. they all tell me the same thing. they do not know why the speaker

and the democrats have not made an issue out of this. for those of you who are confused why there are protesters for the president, they have a good reason. if we can bail out chevy and cadillac, we need to help these individuals. one gentleman has died so far in south carolina. it is time for america to wake up and start dealing with these main street issues. host: what would you like to add to that, if anything? guest: i think he is spot on with a couple of things. unfortunately, the medications program which is a state based program with some federal wor support is in the cross hairs of state budget pressures. wthe states with a high number f hiv cases, a number of the states are facing budget pressures and an end up with waitlists. if it's not addressed in the

short term, it will be a life and death matter for people living with hiv. this will be the global challenge. we've seen locally in our country -- how do we do this long-term when we have more and more people infected? and we're going to do this for 30 plus years. i think we are obliged to find a short-term solution in our country in the next six months to 12 months on how to do adap, but there are long-term issues in some countries where 40% of the population is living with hiv. host: a reminder of these states that have the highest aids number highest cases. new york is the top. that's followed by california. we will take a call from new orleans. ron on the line for independents. our guest is donald blanchon, executive director of the whitman-walker clinic. caller: i think the people in the hiv industry are doing a

poor job at the top level. i think they need to coordinate. one person is tested, they are tested for herpes, gonorrhea, and syphilis. the hiv people need to make testing a one-stop type of deal. when you get tested for hiv, you are also tested for gonorrhea, d's.ilis, and other s st it seems like hiv has become an industry. people who are doing their jobs. host: the people on the top. . guest: first and foremost, it's good public health for someone who is sexually active to be

tested for hiv as well as other std's. at our clinic, we run free evening programs for std testing. people get tested for both. i could not be more behind that comment. the second perspective i give is that whether you look at hiv as separate and apart from health care in our society -- if you remember where we came from, we have no solutions 30 years ago. people died within 18 months of a diagnosis. a lot of things were done on the fly with compassion and love, but with the intent of doing the best we can with little or no knowledge. over time, we've made hiv care almost a separate system of care away from routine primary care. that's the area where these two systems are starting to meet. hopefully in five years you can

look back post health care reform and say that the hiv people finally got it right and got together with primary-care. host: "the financial times" has a whole section today related to world aids day. they talk about austerity measures around the world and what that means to aids care. guest: this is going to be one of the hardest things we deal with. i shared this with you before we started today. what is our societal responsibility? in many of these communities, we need individuals to lead productive lives over many years. the idea that any society across this " is going to take austerity measures -- any society is going to take austerity measures and put people at risk to die and not step in -- at some point in

time, we're one to have to make those hard choices -- we are going to have to make those hard choices. . ho host: there is an ad, "fighting aids should be a corporate policy. we agree, says chevron." tell us about corporate funding. guest: the corporate folks do not get enough publicity from my side. looking at this, they've done a great job through the global business council to be ablactive participants in the community. we have a number of corporate sponsors that help the whitman walker clinic. they do not get enough contra grats.

it is in their best interests at the end of the day to make sure that's a healthy population. host: florence, ky, democratic choleraller. caller: i was an intensive care nurse in the 1980's when aids was devastating communities. there was only one drug on the market at the time that was used for fighting aids. what bothered me most about all of that was a lot of these people died alone. the hospital policy at the time would not allow their significant others to be with them. that might jump back to the last topic, don't ask, don't tell. you have these soldiers and wounded in battle and because of don't ask, don't tell their loved ones are not allowed to be

with them. thank you. guest: i think there's a reality around this. our society is slow to change. as humans, we do not like to change. we have struggled around issues around the aids epidemic. we had all kinds of policies. if you look back 30 years ago, you scratch your head and say, i know why we did that, because we were scared and afraid and did not have enough information. we would not put those policies in place now. host: you did point out there's no vaccine quite yet. one viewer wants to know how close we are to a preventive vaccine? guest: it's a great question. i do not want to sound negative, but i think we're a good 15 years or 20 years away. the virus is a lot more complicated in its behavior and how it lives in humans. the doctor has been on the show and he has been all over

different events talking about how complicated it is to isolate what this virus does on a regular basis and how to stop it. we're going to put a lot of time and energy into that. it's a worthwhile cause. i think that is 15 years away. host: is the u.s. the leader in this? what other countries are prominent in try to find a vaccine? guest: there's research going on across the globe. we have a fair amount of work being done in this country through a number of trials, which is wonderful. a number of the european countries look at this as an area where they need to do that. there are some institutions in southeast asia who are looking at it also. host: there's a lot written about this today on world aids day, including former president bush in "the washington post" today. what did you make of the last

president's approach to aids and current president? guest: thank you for the question. i think we had an either/or dynamic with the last president. we took things that we knew worked well here in this country and other places and we brought it to sub-saharan africa and we save lives. there's no debating that. the challenge here in the u.s., especially the hiv aids community and the advocacy community felt like our nation and individuals living with hiv were left behind. there is a pendulum swinging back. we need to do more on the domestic front. one of the previous callers mentioned that some of the comments made in these public speeches that the president has done is really an expression -- expression what are we going to do here? what are the third act in fighting hiv? host: africa has many millions

of cases. president bush writes about why it is america's fight in his view. host: neil, republican, the morning -- good morning. caller: yes, i would like to know why you do not address the real problem aids problem, which is passing feces from one homosexual to another. they have anal sex and then they have oral sex. aids will never be cured because of this. guest: the caller makes a number

of comments that factually, the clinical research will tell you that the virus is not transmitted that way. the bigger issue for me in this community and other communities is that adults are sexually active. adults that live in communities that have a lot of hiv need to take preventive measures as individuals for themselves and for their partner. that means wearing a condom on a regular basis, not taking risks, and making sure you know your status at all times. we spend a fair amount of time talking to people who are hiv- positive to make sure they stay in treatment. from our perspective, treatment is a prevention measure. if we can take someone -- keep someone on the medication, they are at less risk of infecting their next partner. wearing a condom and keeping people in treatment is one of the best combined packages for prevention. host: you also mentioned older

people in this country. here is a story out of "the daily news." they show a gentleman, 61 years old, living with hiv aids. explain the most recent issues with this and what else we should know about older americans. guest: we are learning lessons for the first time. this group of individuals in the 60 and older category is the first wave of survivors. they've been on medications for a number of years. we're learning about the long- term side effects of some of the medications. we've seen issues with kidney and liver conditions being impacted. and other complications around heart disease. we do not have a full understanding of what it means to be on these medications for 15 plus years. this group is starting to help

us learn about that. the second group is interesting. a set of survivors that have been affected. the next group is those were 60 or older and using viagra or some other medication has become sexually active and does not believe they are at risk for hiv when they have sexual encounters. that's a group we are very surprised by. the information is out there. using a condom is still the best strategy. yet we still see people not doing that and then there's a price later on that they become infected. host: you talked about medicate earlier. how about medicare? guest: it has aortion of it, but it inot as great. people living with aids on supplemental security disability income and an end up qualifying for medicare. the bulk of the expenses are through medicaid on the public's eye, or through the ryan white care act.

host: how much money was set aside from the ryan white care act? guest: i do not have the number of the top of my head. in the district of columbia, over $30 million goes to hiv care -- $13 million goes to hiv care. it is in the hundreds of millions, if not billions, in terms of what we've done in this country. host: let's hear from roy. down to 10 minutes in the program. independent challer. caller: what i cannot understand, this aids epidemic. in the 1960's when my cousins got hepatitis, they quarantined everyone and that disease did not kill. it was not a permanent thing. i cannot understand why they did

not with this in the bud way back then and quarantine all these people. i do not understand all this political correctness. you do not even have the right to know who has it. guest: the issue is almost a societal criminalization of this condition or any other condition, which i struggle with. should we quarantine someone who has a public health condition? i think the government's role is to keep track, to study the epidemiology of a particular condition, but i'm not someone in a society that values freedom wanting to quarantine somebody. it's not something i. caller: want to be part. good morning. thank you for c-span. i'm a nurse practitioner and i work with pregnant ladies. i'm in favor integrating this into a primary care setting. hiv is one of many std's that

are affecting people. the equation should become as a person comes in, the primary prevention should be two and struck them not to engage in behavior that -- should be to instruct them not to engage in behavior. you did not mention anything about teaching youth how to avoid hiv and all of the std's. that would be the abstinence directive that is working in places like uganda. they are promoting abstinence. you did not see them on that list. it's a preventable disease. the lady called in earlier and you said it was not the way. we know the homosexual and heterosexual uncommitted sex is the number one way to transmit this disease. using condoms will reduce the

risk, but it will not completely protect. host: what else can you tell us about education and prevention? guest: bringing education into schools on hiv has obviously been difficult at a political level for parents to give permission to school administrators to bring in curriculum or to bring in outside experts. in a community like washington, d.c. with 3% prevalence rate right now -- i want them to learn about human sexuality and sexual health. i want them to be taught about condom use. i want them to be taught about relationships. we spent a lot of time in communities in this country saying there's one solution over another. there's really no one solution to hiv other than individuals being responsible, knowing their status, using a condom. if they are hiv-positive, they need to stay in treatment. if they stay in treatment, the

risk of infecting someone else is decreased. is this package of activity. there's no magic bullet. there's no one thing that will stop this. host: speaking of young people, "the new york times" has an article on what is happening on college campuses. they make the point that some of the activists are not people who have hiv or even lost anybody, but they are public policy people who are studying at colleges. college campuses are producing activists -- and the photo that goes with this. it was part of a group of students who heckled the president in october. they are making the point that unlike the first generation of patient activists, the latest are budding public health scholars.

they are often heterosexuals and rare is the one that has lost somebody to the disease. what does this group of people mean to the fight? guest: it widens our circle. the community had been based on people who were infected or people who have lost. . -- or people who have lost someone. this makes the circle larger. it makes the voice stronger in our community and across the country. it is making this a routine part of daily living. it's introducing hiv into conversations that probably never took place. in the 1980's, these conversations were in smaller places. they were not in middle america. the practical thing is that hiv is a part of our community now. cannot deny that or ignore that.

it's better to talk about that and raise awareness. host: let's hear from gerald on the line for democrats. you are on with donald blanchon. caller: good morning. host: good morning. caller: i wanted to call in on several points. i'm 68 years old. i tested positive in 1989. the good news is that the medication, if you take it properly, it is a lifesaver. i've been undetectable since september 1, 1999. over 10 years, and it is because i've been sticking to the regimen. there is hope out there. i would recommend that to anyone. guest: i would love to say that

yours is a wonderful story. you can be an advocate for treatment, but you can also be an advocate for why it makes sense for society to make sure individuals living with hiv get their medications. host: panama city, fla., ruby, republican. caller: yes, i am also a licensed practical nurse in the state of florida. i have to renew my license every year, even at the age of 77. i'm required to take at least a two-hour course in aids. i believe they've now changed it to every other renewable period. the lady who called in about the oral sex in homosexuals, that seems to be one of the number one in all of these manuals that i have here. that seems to be the number one transmission course.

for someone to say that is a myth is erroneous. that's your erroneous. -- that is the erroneous. until we get to the cause -- we can treat. yes, pharmaceuticals is a big business. the cost of these drugs to treat one individual per month -- is that why we're having the new type of health-care revisions? where is our persons who have every day treatment for everyday things that come along related to our age or our condition? i'm also a survivor of multiple sclerosis, and have been a survivor since i was diagnosed in 1978. that's a long time. host: i did not mean to cut her off. she did make a couple of other points. guest: the transmission modes

between men having sex with men is a little more complicated than having oral sex. it's not something we are going to be able to cover in this time. i'd be willing to help any of your callers go through that. transmission modality is not solely with men having sex with men. one of the fastest-growing transmission areas is heterosexual contact where individuals in either areas of poverty or high rates of hiv have unprotected sex with their partner and they become infected. it is not all gay men. it is not all one group or one place. that has been the challenge of this. it's not isolated in a way that we can say change this particular behavior and for the rest of your life you will be protected. host: sacramento, calif., richard, democrat. good morning.

caller: good morning. this is more of a political view. we are now treating aids education and making it more of a medical concern that we address collectively as opposed to political. it should be done -- everybody, together. that seems to be the battle. host: i think that we'll make that our last call. guest: it's a great observation. in some respects, hiv ended up separate from so much of society in the '80s and the 1990's because we did not know so much and we were researching and doing things quickly. society as a whole did not come to grips with the fact that this would be here for a long time. the second point i would make is that when we have a problem, particularly a