thing is actually coming in and doing the work to change the law. if congress wants to come back and changed the rules, that is certainly their prerogative, and >> not to regulate the internet but to make certain everybody has access. >> do you expect changes before the meeting? >> did we were disappointed with where we started in some respects and i do not believe that the changes will be enough to make this a strong as we would like for this could be. and this is up for the commissioners to negotiate. that will be there for a number of weeks until the sun shine period. >> matthew wood is this as a director of the media access project. as this issue plays out we will follow this. thank you.

[captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> salman rushdie will speak about his nonfiction work on sunday, and watch "indepth' at booktv.org, where you can see the entire weekend schedule. next, remarks from energy chu.tary stepheven on energy, technology, and climate change. this is about an hour. >> please welcome to the national press club, energy secretary chu. >> thank you. i have to say a few things.

nk you. i have to say a few things. i am delighted to be here. i will ride my bike during the weekend and i always climb up the eight flights of stairs. i virtually always walk up the eight flights of stairs, much to the chagrin of my security who have to follow. [laughter] what i want to talk to you today about is something that i feel very passionate about. unfortunately, there was a little miscommunication and i spent thanksgiving holiday preparing a powerpoint. i was told that was not here, so you will not see a powerpoint. but i will walk you through it. i should just say that most types of our points are boring, bullet point in speaking points and they take away from the context of the audience. i would hope that, in the future, power plant could be used because they can be used to show images and they can be used to show data.

i know data is maybe a new concept here in washington, but i think it is a good one. [laughter] but anyway -- sorry. [laughter] let me start. i titled this talk "the energy race, our new sputnik moment." let me suggest that this is perhaps something that should be taken seriously. just to remind you, on october 4, 1957, the soviet union launched a satellite, sputnik. it was about the size of a basketball, 184 pounds, and it went into orbit and it passed over the united states several times. this was a bit shocking. on november 13, president

eisenhower responded to this by delivering a speech, a major speech. he said "the soviet union now has the combined category of scientists and engineers in greater number than the united states. it is producing graduates in these fields at a much faster rate. this trend is disturbing. indeed, according to my scientific advisers, this is, for the american people, the most critical problem of all. my scientific advisers place this problem well above all other immediate tasks, over producing missiles, of producing techniques in the armed services. we need scientists for the 10 years ahead. -- ed." said he took a long view of this moment of crisis -- ahead." so, he took a long view of this moment of crisis. i was the beneficiary of that. in high school, i went to science programs during the

summer. when i went to college, there was money being poured into investments for universities. i got a fellowship when i went to graduate school. i got a post doctorate scholarship. many of my scientific colleagues were trained in a similar sort of way. the united states will cut. i want to make several points in my talk today. first, i believe innovation adds to the wealth of society. second, science and technology are indeed the heart of innovation. thirdly, leadership, which we still own common innovation -- in which we still own,

innovation cannot be taken lightly. an economist at mit got a nobel prize for his work that show that increases in society productivity were the direct result of technology development. he started with a premise that it was the investment of capital and investment in society can make to do more stuff and produce more things and that ultimately would be tied to labor. and in the long run, labor and capital would increase together.

in the absence of any technology development -- as your work force grows, you can produce more stuff, but that really means that your standard of living person will remain fundamentally the same. so he pointed out, yes, that is true. but if you have technology innovation, everything can change. in fact, what he showed was that additional wealth other than population increases would be caused by technological innovation. for that, he got a nobel prize. this theme has been picked up a number of times. the fact that innovation is key to prosperity and progress has been reactivated a number of times. a committee was tasked with how will the united states compete in a flat world of the 21st century? the committee has made a number of recommendations. but investing capital will give you more wealth creation. anyone in 2010 is entitled "rising above the gathering storm revisited, approaching category five." this talks about the collective society of america, the government, congress, administration, everybody, and the long term united states competitive outlook having further deteriorated since the initial gathering storm report five years ago.

so what are other countries doing? while it did not invent the automobile, it took the invention and process it into something that had not been seen in the world before, especially in the ford model t assembly line. it took over the leadership for automobile manufacturing for pretty much three-quarters of a century. the first airplane was discovered in america. the first transistor, the first integrated circuit, optical and satellite communications, gps, the internet, they all came from the united states. they all did wonderful things in terms of wealth creation for the united states. and so, i say that today this leadership is at risk. we are no longer leaders in manufacturing. more startling, we are no longer the leaders in high-

technology manufacturing. in terms of global high-tech -- the first integrated circuits, optical and satellite communications, gps, it all came from the united states. so, i say that today, this leadership is at risk. we are no longer leaders in manufacturing. more startling, we're no longer the leaders and high technology manufacturing. in terms of global high-tech exports, we hit a peak in 1998. the captured about 29% of the

market. it has been declining steadily and so it is about 13% of the world market. europe remained the most constant during this time. that is a fact. in fact, china says, quite candidly, and i am quoting from premier winter about any talks he gave -- from premier win jaobao in a talk he gave at a world summit. in innovation to gain worldhe

is basically taking it out of a playbook from the united states. china decided to use governmentsector into playing the leading launched on a long- term plan to for another five- year plan. -- they decided to do this and the first five-year plan falls in a soon-to-be other five-year plan. so what is the evidence that your technological leadership is at risk. in the united states, most of the patents were originated in the united states. but in 2009, for the first time, 51% of u.s. patents were

awarded to non-u.s. companies. to fifth place in international patents during that time. the world is some form rank 48 in mathematics and education. chinese universities are leading in the '80s. china has moved from 14th place to second place in published research articles, now just behind the united states. eight of the 10 global companies with the largest r&d budgets in the world are established r&d facilities in china and theythese are facts from the gathering storm report. an american company, applied materials, recently opened the world's largest private solar r&d facility in china.

there is other evidence of chinese innovation, particularly in the energy field. china has installed the largest high-voltage capacity lowest loss d.c. line and high-voltage ec lines in the world now. it has plans to integrate back down. it has broken ground on 30 nuclear reactors of roughly 50 being built in the world. the united states is building two nuclear reactors. it just past the united states with the world's fastest supercomputer. it now has the record for the highest high-speed rail in the world. but the scandal speed is 220 m.p.h. it has plans for more models of high-speed rail. by comparison, japan has 1,500 miles. france has 1,200 miles.

the u.s. has zero. according to the vice chairman of china's national investment and reform, the r&d and china, it will probably get 20% by 2020, renewable energy in china. let me take you through examples of what china is doing. take the coal industry in china. china has a lot of old inefficient plants. they said, this is polluting our atmosphere. we will close them down. in 1992, they bought two 600 megawatt generators better called ultra supercritical. they're working at the highest temperatures possible, commercially.

they bought them from abb, a european committee, and g. they started operating them. in 1995, it established a research centers, and said, okay, this is the best of the world has to offer. this. can we make it better? between 2000 and 2004, began to build and install and operate the first indigenous supercritical plant in china. by two thousand five, it did its first export -- by 2005, it did its first export. it holds the record for the highest efficiency coal plants now. when they started doing this, the president of the china hunan group, the largest power

generating company in china said they should look at this from a purely financial perspective to represent the future. having said that, now they can build these power plants and cost per amount of megawatts, for example, is now we will to this super critical plant that the united states is building, and it is cheaper than the common cold plants that used to be made and are still being made in other parts of the world. the cost has come down and is now competitive in terms of power per unit investment. you get a lot more power per unit coal. there is a common myth, for example, that china manufacturers because it is the low-cost and cheap manufacturing and that is how it competes with the united states and the rest of the world. if you look at the largest solar portable company in china, is and not followed by the myth.

chinese heritage, but he got his ph.d. in australia and he is a citizen of australia. they did not have the right environment to develop this, so he went back to china. but this chief technology officer who is a professor at the university of new south wales, he is now in china. i toured the plant. this company, it was 100 meters by 400 meters and 4 stories per it was a high-tech modern flat

that imports its raw materials from the united states. its energy is cheaper. it as the technology is, all the things that make it in china, and an it sends a terrible world to assemble it. what is wrong with this picture? it is not succeeding because of cheap labor. not only that, it's focused on driving down the manufacturing cost, but it also set the world record for solar efficiency as measured by a german scientific institute. it is low cost and it is actually good technology. now, rest easy that the united states still has the record of

crystallization in the world. this is the threat that i see. america still has the opportunity to lead in a world where that will need a new industrial revolution to give it the energy that we want inexpensively but carbon freed. it is a way to secure our future prosperity as noted by the premier of china. i think that time is running out. i think that we should not lose sight of this and federal support for science is going to be critical for our economic pegasus. i mentioned the wright brothers. they made the first plane. very quickly after that, the airplane technology migrated to europe. by world war one, europe have the dominating airplane technology and all of our world war one aces flew planes made in france. the u.s. government established

a department for aeronautics to conduct cutting edge research and encourage the avionics industry in the west. that led to a resurgence back to the united states of recapturing the lead and now many aircraft companies, commercially, it is boeing and they are in a race with airbus. other countries think they can get into this game, including china. china has made forays into the aerospace industry. a report that came out with very recently was called a business plan for america's energy future. it was comprised of the committee of lockheed martin. bill gates, chad holiday, who is

now the chair of bank of america but the former chair of dupont. this small community of seven people said, what is the plan for america's future? they noted a couple of things. if you look at the fraction of sales and an industry and how much actually gets put back into r&d in the public and private sector, it is shocking. in pharmaceuticals, it is close to 19%. in aerospace and defense, and 11.5%. computers and electronics, 8%. what about energy? 0.02%. -- 0.03%. the budget is 6.3 trillion dollars. how much is on energy research and development?

0.14%, $5.10 billion. the trend is even more alarming. peaking in 1979, there were a few bumps and jewels going downhill ever since then. although the stimulus funding offered a huge down payment in r&d, the question is, are we going to return to this downward trend or are we going to do something about it? this report goes on to say that government must play a key role in accelerating energy innovation. it says that innovations in energy technology can generate significant qualifiable public benefits. i am quoting from the report. these benefits include cleaner air, improved public health, enhanced national security, international diplomacy, and protection from shocks related

to economic disruption. currently, these benefits are neither recognized nor rewarded by the free-market. this also went on to say that the energy business requires investment of capital on a scale that is beyond the risk threshold of most private sector investors this high level of risk -- sector investors. this high level of risk causes this behavior. in this report, i urge you to look at it. there are little snippets from the industrial leaders. one of my favorite is from norman r. augustine. based on his own research, which faced with and major challenge content, youology wil need are in deep.

-- are in the -- r &d. there is a report on the president's council of advisers in science and technology that was released this morning. it says many similar things about the need to take energy investment very seriously. what can investments do? what we see and what the department of energy is investing is are very exciting technologies, a vehicle battery could go around a 500 mile range. a new approach at making biofuels and that could lower the cost. a program that could produce abundant domestic fuel directly from sunlight. we have a road map that says,

how can we get solar energy down? that is the magic number. we are now developing plans. at what point do not need subsidies? can you get there? if you can, we will design programs to do that. we need to dramatically reduce storage costs. we need to use supercomputers and supercomputer simulations to skip very expensive design steps. the department of energy laboratories actually designed, for the first time, a diesel engine on the computer, a simulated it, and built it and they did not need another prototype.

people were skeptical that could happen. it reduced costs by 50%. we can do this in many other areas. we have introduced to innovative research funding programs. one is called advanced research project agency for energy. what this is is a research program that is short-term. you have to get a private funder to do. it is a high risk, high reward. we're not interested in funding incremental work, we're interested in game changing work. an example that i gave you before, an electric battery that would be three to five times lower in cost than today's lithium battery to it is a takeoff from what is called a dink air battery of that is used

in hearing aids today. can you make one that is rechargeable that lasts longer and we think that it has a very distinct possibility of giving cars that have a 100 mile range of 500 mile range at a third of the cost. there is a really good shot at this. another thing that we are doing his energy innovation hubs. these are the same high risk, high reward. then we have to recognize that some research can be done in two or three years. it needs a bigger group of scientists working under one roof. in much the same spirit as what we did in the manhattan project. i like to call them little bell lablets. they are good at public affairs and so they spot that their name

was a better name. as another example, you look at it with a plant makes chemical energy. you take some like, you take the water, and the uses sunlight and energy to split the water into hydrogen and oxygen and it takes carbon dioxide and reduces the carbon dioxide and builds a carbohydrate. we can then turn it into a sugar which we can then turn into a fuel or we can eat it. the question is, can we design, using nanotechnology, something that can replicate what the plant does, but we have the advantage. we have what the biological world has access to, therefore we can design something better, just as when we learned to fly, we started by looking how birds flew. the rights -- the right brothers were just like large

soaring birds, but they used a gasoline engine instead of muscle power. today's engines use material that nature cannot produce. single crystals of metal in the turban blades. can we do this and our officials photosynthesis and skip the hydrocarbon and go from water to oxygen, hydrogen, carbon dioxide to hydrocarbon fuel? it has been around for awhile. in the last couple of years, there have been enough advances in a technology and science that we have a shot that this can happen in a cost-effective way in five years. and innovation how it has been started to find that type of research. we face falling behind. we need to seize this

opportunity and we really cannot afford not to. in closing, let me say that there are some differences between this sputnik prevent and sputnik the event of 1957. as was noted in the introduction, while we are competing, there is an opportunity to also collaborate. we have much to collaborate with china, india and other countries. china is going to be building buildings, cities, roads, transmission lines equivalent to the entire infrastructure of the united states. into with the 30, what india will look like they and does not exist -- 80% of what it will have a into thousand 30 does not exist today. -- 80% of what it will have it end to thousand 30 does not

exist today. -- 2030 does not exist today. our infrastructure has largely grown as a replacement of our population, although it is not growing the way india and the mass migration of chinese people from the farmland into cities is not occurring. there is an opportunity to work with china and india. and so when this sputnik moment of today, i urge that we do two things. we should formulate long range energy policies that have bipartisan support to guide the private sector in the united states. china is doing it and it seems to be working. we should do this. long range policies. what about increasing the support of energy research and development? private investments do not

usually recoup the full value of the benefit. companies are reluctant to do some of the early stage research and development, and quite frankly a lot of the new technologies could be met with resistance. the government passed to say this is the path we should be going in for long term future prosperity and we have to do that. but me emphasize that wealth creation is driven by innovation. if we collaborate with china and india, we both come out better for it. with that, i will stop and take questions. [applause] >> we have some high-quality questions here. our first question, during the

2008 presidential campaign, now- president obama referred to a new energy economy as "my number one priority." congress has passed health care reform, financial reform, the stimulus bill, and an energy bill didn't pass. are you disappointed? >> of course i am disappointed. i think the thing is that we are here now. i do not think that there is a lot of good coming from visiting i am disappointed. therefore you stop trying? no, i am hoping united states can recognize the economic opportunities that virtually all of europe and western europe has recognized and developed countries in asia have welcomed -- recognized. i think it is so important.

america, i am optimistic, will wake up and sees the opportunity and it still has the greatest innovation machine in the world. >> much of your strategy for solving the climate change problems such as the economic stage for the embrace of nuclear and carbon capture storage, is based for price on carbon. now that it is looking almost impossible for congress to pass something like that, are you concerned the economics for fixing the climate are now impossible? >> i think the price will be paid on carbon worldwide and we would go forward with what we can do now. having said that, it is certainly true that carbon capture and storage, if you have a stationary emitter like a coal plant or gas plant or cement plant, the immediate micro costs of those industries, it will always cost more to capture that

carbon and storage. that is the equivalent of saying eat you are a city -- and we're not trying to debate to treat the sewage or just put it in the river -- the immediate costs of dumping in the river, it is cheaper for you but not for the fish downstream. the total integrated cost of doing this are much much cheaper. it's better to treated at the source and eliminate that. this is why there should be a price on carbon. nuclear, i think, it can be cost-effective and show that it can be built on time and on schedule, it can hold its own. but you also remember that one of the drivers we're trying in wind and solar and all these other technologies is we think it can be cheaper than fossil fuels. >> what is the role of the climate change conference in

cancun? >> i think -- excuse me. the answer is yes, of course we can meet copenhagen. it requires bipartisan will and support to do it. as pointed out, my task and the department of energy is to develop and nurture the technologies to help industries go in the right direction, to help them nurture those technologies. in the end, when push comes to shove, when the rubber meets the road, this will allow us to do iwhat we have to do. >> the internet describes you as a self as -- self-described geek? are you sticking with that was marred >> yes. >> scientist and universities

have drawn of a large number of students. changes to u.s. immigration policy post-9/11 and rising opportunities and home countries lead students to return home after earning their degrees. what can the u.s. do to offset this trend and its consequences for u.s. innovation was a margin in many reports, when a student comes to the united states and its a ph.d. in science and engineering and does well, there's a green card next to the diploma. in actual fact, what happens in graduates grants paid for. the united states is investing in these people. if they do well, you do not want to encourage that investment to go back. you're quite right. things are changing. they come to the united states to get an education, why?

because the research universities in the united states still are the best in the world, bar none, and that is recognized. but they come here to get an education and get a ph.d. and to oppose dr. and then go back as a young person, then we in the united states have lost a great deal. out in the "rising storm," that the number of people getting a ph.d. is in science and engineering are now foreign-born. there is always good news in this. as i look across the country in the last three or four years, especially, the young people are waking up to the energy and climate change problem. that is drawing them into science, just as in my day, this little 184 pound thing going across the united states, made us say, maybe i should go into

science and engineering. the young people now want to go back into this. this is a good sign. it's important to the government, the federal government and state governments, recognize that this is a good sign and take advantage of it. this will be a cornerstone for our economic prosperity. >> just before this program began, was on news reports that obama may announce a pay freeze for federal employees. one of the issues in attracting top-notch scientific talent -- are you aware of such a freeze and how will this affect your average to recruit quality scientists? >> we will see how that unfolds. it ultimately has to be approved by congress. but in terms of the ability to attract quality people in to the doe, surprisingly and number have been willing to take cuts in pay.

to live in a fishbowl, if you will, because they feel it is that important. one election member -- one member is still in his 40's. he had to resign from you t- berkeley to come work for the government. he gave up but tenured position. it is not as though he were -- losing his gas. no, he was entering into his incredible words of high productivity and we've got a bunch of others like that. it is tough and you have to be a little bit crazy and a whole lot patriotic, but we can still get some good people. to some republicans in congress have intimated that they may

rescind some recovery act funds. well would that mean for the energy department in your efforts? >> i hope that they do not. i think that this recovery at funds that the department of energy are important down payments to what we have to do. and the real question i pose in my talks was, certainly after the recovery act, we are looking hard at how we can use our precious resources into the future in order to go forward. i think this fundamentally as a bipartisan/non-partisan issue. it is all about economic prosperity. >> on note -- among the new majority in the house are fairly vocal climate change skeptics. given the increasingly vocal voices on climate change debate, do you anticipate that you'll be going back to fighting that climate change debate itself rather than pushing for

solutions to it? >> i hope not. if anything over the last six years, the evidence is got more compelling. but sometimes you get sideways on this debate if you say, have you proven with 100% certainty that this is happening and some bad things are happening? and maintain you do not need 100% certainty. 89% and maybe 90% certainty is enough to say, ok, how should you want to plan your personal life? let me use this as an analogy. you just bought a home, the electricity comes in, the wiring a shot. you have to replace the wiring. this is how much it will cost. the teen thousand dollars. you are strapped.

-- $15,000. how can you do that? you get another restaurant. i do not know, but the sec alleges in says you have to do it. it will be bad if you did not. you shop around for the one in the thousand electricians to say it is ok? not really. do you actually go and say, well, ok, i think it is more cost effective by major my fire insurance is up to date? your family is in the rigid living in a home that could burn down while they are asleep. -- your family is living in a home that could burn down while they are asleep. what i'm trying to tell the american public is that this is an economic opportunity. it is not as a you are -- you have to make this tax expenditure. you're making an expenditure because in the long run, for the

future economic health of the country, and that future is not 20 years in the future, we're talking three years, you have to make these investments. >> you would trust china and its own alternative energy development in your remarks. -- you addressed china and its own alternative energy developments in your remarks. what research and development is the energy department's pursuing to develop u.s. capacity to develop alternatives? >> i think that was a wake-up call, and if you depend on the producing 95% or more of this around well, and you have a single supplier that you run the risk. there has been a mine in california that has been shut down, and we are in discussions with that mind to help start up

again. there are a number of employees -- it is not that rare. what is at stake you have to be very careful in an environmentally responsible way and we're working that. many other countries have gotten concerned and looking at other places for supplies. we're look going deeper and that. we're looking at ways to use the more efficiently but also technological ways to get the same benefit. it depends on using electronics for paris high efficiency motors, or and displays for flat screen tvs and a number of things, looking at alternative substitutes. what has happened in some of these rares, the prices gone up tenfold. that has worried them and we're doing a lot in terms of what you

say, looking for substitutes. >> on the topic of energy independence, if you do a lot of work with the usda, especially on the s&l -- ethanol produce. -- at tunnel project. this december 31, there is a tariff and subsidies for corn- based ethanol of 4 expiration. this question as, to accord ethanol subsidies still need to occur -- do. ethanol subsidies still need to -- corn at an all subsidies still need to occur? >> this is a complicated economic issue as well. is -- ite focusing on is a good way of getting it going, knowing that americans drive their vehicles using

agricultural-based fuels. but we're primarily focused on developing the new technologies that can supersede ethanol made from starches and sugars like corn, but we're also focusing on ways to go beyond ethanol. it is not an ideal transportation fuel. gasoline, kerosene, jet fuel, and diesel fuels are much better things to use. they did not require changing the infrastructure. one of the things we are focusing very much on is how to take biofuels the make direct substitutes for these tools that can be blended into the gas tank? let me add that because of this, we started some -- four years ago, before my time -- three energy centers under the same

rubric says these energy hubs. we have smart people that go, come up with dramatically new technologies, and within six months, one of these centers bacteria that you find that the of your stomach and put in a new metabolic pathway. when you bet it sugars, they produce correct -- direct substitutes for gasoline and diesel fuels. when they reported this discovery and "nature," i called up the director, a friend of mine, and said, jake, that is great. what you need to make it commercially viable? pick a price. any price. $80 a barrel? he said, it has to be within 80% of all we think is what we can produce and we are not there yet. it has to be this price.

but by then, but atomic up publish, a private company had already picked it up. the scientist that to the basic research, saying that this could actually work, let's do a little bench top prototype production think to see what other things we need to figure out. so again, the idea that you get really smart people trying to solve a problem, not to publish a paper, is the way the we have got to go. we see a lot of that evidence of that coming along. didn't this is a matchup of two questions which is always dangerous. both questions from the audience. the administration has indicated a desire to pursue development of nuclear. but also opposition against dumping spent fuel at yucca mountain. how off the table is the get the project, and assuming that it is, how does the administration

plan to deal with and lingering issue of nuclear wastes and advocating billions of dollars in nuclear produce? >> we believe that it is the right and proper thing to do to start the american nuclear industry. we believe this is not only good for going through -- increasing up -- decreasing our carbon emissions, but it is good for us economically. the analysis used to be the leader in this. this is one of those things that we have lost. the leadership is now in france and japan and south korea. and now china is going in such a big way, it has plans to build four new nuclear powers. i think the problem of the nuclear waste is the problem

fundamentally can be solved. it is but the scientific and political problem. the political problem is in beijing early and making the people in the area wanting it to happen. how can that be? we actually have that. there is a low-level waste repository that we run in new mexico. initially the people were worried about this because they were worried -- you stick this stuff on the ground in the formation. once you go down to the solow formation, it's been proven to be stable for tens of millions of years. even during the time the continents had been drifting around, this is ok. so the downside is, have used a kitten, it encapsulated and you can i get back at it.

that was not the original requirement at the amount. you wanted to not move around and not get at it. there have been no accidents. it is been done very safely. it's been the economic generators for the area around it. so the story has two parts to it. there may be better strategies, better ways of approaching, and that is why there is this new commission looking into this. the nuclear regulatory agency has already said that we can keep the storage where it is now, storage for 50 or even 100 years, so the commission's task is to tell us technically what we should be doing, what are the best options, what kind of storage you want? it could lead to will, it to be

permanent disposal, it could be lots of things. but knowing that you have 60 years, that we are not in a crisis situation, we can do much better job this time. that is the task of the commission. there's a realization that it is solvable. would you say, let's not do anything for the next 50 years until we prove it? not really. if we think about it, this is when the war, we know it is going to work, let's move ahead and restart our nuclear industry. again, it is important also to restart not only for economic issues but for the nobler version issues. -- not poor preparation -- nonpolar operation -- non-

proliferation issues. there are a lot of reasons why we should be team players. to do one topic that has not been discussed in great detail -- energy efficiency. what you see is some of the most promising initiatives in that area that you may be risk -- you may be pursuing? >> estimate energy efficiency. i'm glad you raised this. as you know, i am fond of saying it is the lowest hanging fruit. it is actually something that we are pushing very strongly. this is a secretary for energy efficiency, now acting undersecretary for the department of energy, we're pushing very hard to show that

energy efficiency means saving money. if it really means saving money, then this is something that should be happen by itself. it is not happening by itself. why is it not happening? whether capital and initial investments, whether ignorance, whether a lot of thing -- habits -- can change that. we firmly believe that energy efficiency is the fastest, quickest way to make us more competitive, save money that will go back into the economy, many things. and it ultimately will be saving lots of dollars and lots of carbon. this energy efficiency is something very basic, especially when you think of cars. we can do better there. buildings are a very big deal.

we think you can build a building or decrease the energy consumption of the building by a factor of four in a way that would pay for itself in a quarter of a lifetime of the building. and we started in innovation up to show that you can do this with computer-aided design, it can be built, especially retrofits may abet factor to, and demonstrate that if you do this you actually save money. once you begin to demonstrate this, we hope it takes off by itself. however, there are some things that you have to be very conscious of. you have to be willing -- for a factor of two, a better design. know the current technologies that exist today. the next factor for additional

investment, are you willing to invest in a lifetime of a 50- year building to get payback time in 10 years? if you say no, then you can i do some of those things. that is something -- and you cannot do some of those things. that is long term, one of the issues that we have to overcome in our thinking of investments. >> we're almost out of time. before the last question, we have important matters to take care. to remind our members and guests of future speakers. we have booked the chairman and ceo of the coca-cola company. our first luncheon will be on january 12, and someone from the red cross will talk about one year after the haiti earthquake. i like to present our speaker and into murmuration with the national press club mud. -- commemoration of the stay with the national press club

mug. for our audience and to get a better sense of the man, we have one final question. you have a ph.d. -- excuse me, if you have a ph.d., you of your nobel prize in physics, a lot of people come with the assumption that you're pretty smart. [laughter] as many of us know, having lived and worked in washington, we know there are people in washington aren't -- who are not so says mark. present company excepted, please, how was the secretary of energy and a nobel laureate deal with people who do not get it in washington? [laughter] >> please tell my mother that i am smarter than she thinks. i do not think that you go into any job with an attitude like that. i was a professor for many years.

my attitude always -- when i was working at bell labs, sometimes i would have an idea and i would go and talk to management. i want to do this. that would say, no. my reaction was, ok, not that i am smarter than they, but ok, i went back and said, what did i not explain right? and then i would go back. this is what i think. once i went back three times and might then boss -- and might then-boss at said that i have the better things to do, he ended up actually letting me do it. he was not thrilled. but i always come in with the attitude that if you do not succeed the first time, try again. or they can try to convince you that they are right. that they are right.