it was say that' somewhere close to 200,000 total. but not all of them were members. they were the extended families and those people came there, many of them joined lashkar. there were at least allowing their children to join it. after 9/11, there was only one or two conventions because of the security situation in pakistan. they abandoned it, but they still recruit people for their

own people. every lashkar member is a recruiter. this is the primary member -- job of every member. they set up to camps taken over by the taliban when they came into power. and they set up full camp in pakistani kashmir and another place. the word that they used means that you do not get militant training only when you remember

of the group. it is a lifestyle that you have to adopt. when they get up, went to sleep, what to eat, what not to eight -- it is a lifestyle for them. in the beginning, you undergo a 21-day training. islamic training. why you should follow this rather than others. when they joined, they do not convert to that faith. it is the belief that muslims should only follow the koran and

the hadiths. all members have to go through this 21-day training, but when they're selected to wage jihad in kashmir, they undergo special training for three months to six months. and that is very intensive training. for example, one part of their training is that you have to exist in a jumble for 22 hours -- in a jungle for 22 hours.

there is nothing to eat. you have to survive on grass and leaves. but you are allowed to come back to the kitchens of lucky should cut -- lashkar-e-taiba and snatch food. that is part of the training. unless you go through that, you are not allowed to go wage jihad. throughout this training, the emphasis is on your knowledge of islam. most of the people described jihadis as killers. i do not because that is not the primary motive of jihadis.

the primary motive of jihadis is to become a martyr. before becoming a mortar, -- a moderate, they kill a lot of people and that is collateral damage. you carry out attacks because they carried the explosive and they are bound to die in those attacks. but lashkar people have not carried out those attacks. all of the attacks lashkar

people have carried out there was always a chance of their surviving, as in the mumbai attacks, there is a chance of them dying. but they had to make every effort during those operations to survive. at the end, i would talk about a little about the possible cooperation between jama'at-ud- da'wah and al qaeda. a lot of people have read things, that there is some sort of organizational link between da'wah.a and jama'at-ud-

work in groups did afghanistan together. they were inspiration to each other. but because hafiz saeed worked in very difficult decision -- conditions in afghanistan. still, some cooperation does continue. but i do not see them collaborating in the future. would not likewah to share it with osama bin laden. i do not see them collaborating

in pakistan or internationally. i think my time is up. maybe there are some questions which i will answer. >> thank you. i like to bring up sebastian parotella. he does investigative projects for major media. before that, it was at the los angeles times for over 20 years. most recently as a national security correspondent in washington. he has served as a foreign correspondent and his book was named a new york times book in 2008. many of you will ever read his recent article about david headley in the washington post

or perhaps that propublica. he knows a lot about lashkar's western operations, in particular its recent involvement in those attacks and it is a pleasure to have him speak about that today. >> thank you and it is a pleasure to be here. as was mentioned during the month-long period in november. i wrote a series called lashkar- e-taiba. i'm going to talk about the reporting, what i found, but i think it means. all summarize the finding of the articles for those who may not have read all or any of them. the series centered on two figures, david headley, the confessed american terrorists who did reconnaissance at mumbai, and the project's chief

who was allegedly the head of the operation. the historic -- a concluded that the u.s. intelligence community was slow to see lashkar as a threat. they're increasing determination to strike the west in 2000 left and the impunity with which pak -- lashkar operated in pakistan. the reporting uncovered something that had been kept secret. they had looked into half a dozen warnings about headley's extremist activities while he trained with lashkar and scouted targets to route 01 between 2001 and 2009. failure to pursue those leads was because of a workload and i think about the lawyers to see lashkar as a priority. -- the failure to see lashkar as a priority.

they undertook a review of headley's contacts. after that, it was very aggressive and produced evidence of his suspected role and pakistani intelligence officials and directing lashkar. half a dozen accused heads, including one i s i officer still a large, the trial, and this ramp and into hamas' -- grim panorama. u.s. officials told me they cannot push too hard for justice in this case because of the potential damage to the fight against al qaeda and its allies. that lashkar seems increasingly as dangerous and professional as al qaeda. to give you background highlight

came to this project, i was a foreign correspondent for many years. i covered many of the major attacks in the past decade by al qaeda. i found myself covering lashkar directly and indirectly as it came up. i participated in the coverage of mumbai and headley case, which i found interesting. it was from an narrative i found myself writing in different forms in recent years. many ways about the decline of al qaeda, bumbling recruits, portrayed craft, and it al qaeda weakened by a lack of funds. lashkar, one had the impression that it was on the rise, professional, paramilitary, plenty of money, advanced in political and popularity, clothes closet -- close ties to the security forces. it pulled off one of the most devastating terror attacks since

9/11. when i moved to my current newspaper, i tried to give the topic the attention it deserves. we do in-depth stories that try to go past the headlines and look issues of abuse of power, accountability in the public interest. i think this project that the bill in a number of ways. there were questions about the role of the pakistani government, about u.s. policy in pakistan, and political obstacles to pursue justice in the murders of americans in mumbai. there were questions about what the west to done about a lashkar threat. here was a terrorist group that had gone away in a public, spectacular way with mass murder. most of you have seen the hbo documentary about mumbai. it's one of the most impressive documents about terror that i had seen. what struck me was the remarkable aspect -- aspect of those in real-time conversation between handlers and pakistan and the gunman and even victims

and none by. -- in mumbai. is it possible but people do not know who where they are? i thought was appropriate for story. i need to frame research different for people writing for academics are specialists. it had to be clear and sensible to newspaper readers. good characters make good stories. i've focused on david headley and the other. headley was american. he had pleaded guilty. it was a bonafide, colorful, all will lure the character. -- almost lurid character. he had been a globetrotting, hard partying businessman who had a knack for acquiring wives and girlfriends and then

anchoring them to the point that they reported into authorities. it was a lashkar militant that ended up doing operations for pakistan. he was at home in many worlds. he knew people in high and low places. he was more interestingly and more of a danger that we have seen and other cases, and he opened their rare an extraordinary window into a secret war. it seemed as though there had been a lot disclosed about him in u.s. court documents and media reports, it seemed there has -- there was a lot not exposed. there were gaps and contradictions in the official version. especially regarding his contact with the u.s.-pakistani governments and how investigators and known about him and win. the other central figure became saji -- not even the no. 3, but an up-and-coming jr. chief, a skilled case officer. he had popped up in the past

decades. sources tell me that he was the dominant voice in those intercepted phone conversations, talking to the gunman and even to the victims. he had been heavily's handler. he could help trace the threat against the west, and its ability to act with impunity. he was also of remarkably mysterious person. basic facts remain unclear. and there was debate among the sources about his military affiliation. most of the top u.s. and european anti-terrorism officials thought that he was a high-ranking officer in the military or the isi of pakistan, but several frontline investigators disagreed, including stephen. it was hard to find people who knew the case well and find a subset of people willing to talk.

it seemed that everyone does not talk because of the pending court cases, the enormous diplomatic sensitivity the reporting of conversation from the u.s., india, pakistan, france, israel, and other countries, and it involves looking at case file report records, some of which had not been disclosed before. there was a lot of material that had to be followed up and expanded on. sajid appeared in court documents since 2001, sometimes under alias, and you needed multiple conformations a major was the same person. also the reporting so that mir had been at the forefront of an effort to expand the group's

reached, assist al qaeda and strike western targets dating back to 2001. but sources agreed that the u.s., continued to view it as a threat to india. the case files gave detailed on his training camps in 2001 and a vital role of trainings and handlers supplied by the pakistani military. there was a double game talked about earlier. . after the 911 attacks, they took interest in the lashkar attempts looking for foreign jihadi to might be a threat to the west. there were many nationalities, but the fact that security forces bombarded the military trainers in those camps ahead time. before each of the inspections, they -- the foreign trainees

were evacuated from the camps and hidden in the mountains. they returned want the american -- once the americans left. the case also showed a recurring pattern in which mir and others were spotting talent for overseas operations in the past decade. there was testimony about surveillance of a chemical plant in maryland. fund raising logistics in europe and the u.s., and a bomb plot foiled by authorities in australia in 2003. sajid mir coordinated. it left little doubt about lashkar's determination to strike the western nearly part of the decade. butmir had to have approval to undertake such an attack. mir had an arrest warrant in

2006, and he was convicted in absentia in 2007. but nothing was done on the pakistani side. if theoretically mir could have been behind bars in 2009 -- in 2008 rather than being the project manager of the mumbai attacks. it's important to emphasize that mir was just one of half a dozen masterminds of the mumbai attacks. he played a central because of his international experience, his skill as a handler, and his close relationship with headley, the reconnaissance operatives. headley had an unusual and out of profile. he was older than most jihadi, he had a u.s. passport, he had trained extensively with lashkar, but the testimony showed that he trains separately with the isi in classics intelligence training.

he became essential to the plots, and pakistani intelligence helped direct, train, and fun that reconnaissance. they were in contact with each other. major iqbal was clearly involved in a support role, providing advice on tactical issues. it was also kept apprised of target selection. lashkar goes out of its way to select five targets where it will ensure that americans use and that the major was happy to hear that -- about one of the targets. momentss a pivotal when i came across information that seem to be a big deal and a bonafide secret, which in 2005, three years before the mumbai attacks and four years before his arrest, there had been an

fbi investigation into headley. he had been arrested in a domestic dispute related to all warning. this raised fundamental questions about the official version. it narrowed the focus of the reporting on to the u.s. counter-terrorism apparatus. ultimately the reporting showed that federal investigators had interviewed his wife three times in 2005, he had details -- she had details of his involvement with lashkar, and that he was still an informer for the dea when he trained at the lashkar camps. but they decided he was not a threat and he kept traveling. the exact nature, extent, and duration as is u.s. and former remained unclear. but it was important because of his allegation that he had become a trained agent of pakistani intelligence as well. it raises the specter that he was a double agent. and there were officials convinced that u.s. agencies monitored headley intermittently

all the way to 2008. that may have played a role in the increasingly urgent and specific warnings from the u.s. to the indians before the mumbai attacks in 2008. that has not been proven. what was known about headley and when remains a mystery. but the review of by the dna showed a more troubling time line. -- but the review by the dni turned up other warnings from spouses and girlfriends over several years. i know a lot of investigators and intelligence officials and i appreciate the difficulty of their work. i know how superficial it can be for journalists to second-guess after fat. advance warning -- if you know about these attacks, in each of those cases, there was some information about the people who ended up being involved ahead of time.

but i do think that as time went on, but warns accumulated and became more serious. it does appear that there was a breakdown in the system. soon after, we published the series in the "washington. -- in the washington post. i will highlight a couple of main points. the central conclusion was that the u.s. government was slow to focus on lashkar and detect the extent of its threat to the west. that is in nuanced and complicated issue. is not that the entire community ignored last car. there were voices of concern, pressing and investigations that raise warnings, but the overwhelming consensus was that there was not enough effort directed at lashkar before 2008. the striking example of that was expressed by the u.s. investigators your rush to mumbai after the attacks, they're running into a problem. they found that the basic lack

of the kind of intelligence on lashkar, photos, profiles, organizational charts, an in- depth analysis, that to the affected -- expected to counter- terrorism community to have gathered about such a important group after 9/11. the investigation is still going and the story is trying to be very prudent to examine the known evidence. one extreme that we've heard earlier today coming up pakistani officials continuing to insist there was no official link whatsoever to the attacks or to lashkar. in the middle, the most common u.s. assessment is that mid- level pakistani officials were likely involved or aware of the plot but that there was no high level institutional decision to attack mumbai. at the other end of the spectrum, many indian investigators and some western ones to feel there was extensive

of official involvement. i want to be circumspect, but the lack of progress in the case two years later does deepen the mystery in that trial that is going on in pakistan. there are too important figures among the seven suspects. prosecution seems to have stalled hopelessly. in contrast, there is stronger evidence against half a dozen alleged masterminds who remain at large. they include sajid mir, and major iqbal. their phone numbers, their faces are known to the authority. they are thought to be doing business as usual, the authorities are unable to catch them. moreover the investigation, with a lot of work to corroborate headley's account, paints a picture of a close relationship between the isi and lashkar

despite occasional tensions. adlai alleged that the isi support included funding in tactical it buys from several sources until questions are answered. it would be legitimate to ask whether involvement was limited to one or two rover officials. i think the mumbai case and what happens with that is a test of the rule of law, india and pakistan's relationship, and the repercussions continue. the resurgent threat from up tight and pakistan can be traced to mumbai and to the follow-up plot that headley embarked on against denmark. headley dull lot of reconnaissance for someone we heard about earlier today, and most western investigators describe him as the emerging operational chief of al qaeda. headley uses training to look good targets around the world.

the increasing significance of dynamic individual kingpins who federate operatives of cross the lines of groups. he has done that with proper dose of lashkar, former, to target your. lashkar remains a source of threats, whether tax from the group's, or jihadis who reached their training camps and then branched out on the run. their own. these threats of attacks showed that the influence of lashkar and al qaeda and the way the groups are boring together in the jihadi cauldron that is pakistan today. that you very much. >> thank you, and i think we

have time for at least one round of questions. we don't we take -- i think will take two or three questions and then respond in the interest of time. >> my question is for arif. if one goal is to discredit social and he shouldn't, then pakistan is at risk of losing its moderate muslim identity. [unintelligible]

>> i am not sure i understood the question. >> i think your question was, given the manner in which l.e.t. has tried to discredit the muslims in pakistan, how this and dangers of moderate islam as help to stabilize pakistan at various points, and how the u.s. can help to empower moderate muslims in the face of the threat from l.e.t.? if you do not mind, in the interest of time, we will bundle them. we will take two more. >> hi monica robins.

i read their risley entrusting assertion yesterday, that lashkar has begun to extend its hand to the maoists that operate in the red corridor in india. what you think the long-term implications for the region would be? >> should we take one more? we will take two more. and we have one here. do we have time for that? ok. professor of george mason school of public policy. this is a question for sebastian. andtalked about heavdley his role in drug trafficking. did you find other connections in this attack?

they were very profound in the previous mumbai attacks. did you find any links in this latest attack of that? >> we will take these three. arif, go ahead with the question about the degree to which l.e.t. is threatening moderate muslims today and what the u.s. could do to empower as a counterbalance? >> i think lashkar is threatening india. they want to break up india all the valley. -- ultimately and make an

islamic state there. lashkar is not a threat for global jihad in the imminent future. they're very pragmatic. in the last 10 years, they have kept their relation with the establishment intact. they have not gone against the pakistani state. i am sure everybody must have noted in the morning how angry the general was when somebody asked him and engine lashkar -- and mentioned lashkar. it is a group for the military establishment. i do not see that the pakistani

military in the immediate future. for several reasons. the military is not ready to abandon the policy of using jihad as an instrument of its defense policy. to the worldhreat from last car in the immediate future. however, it will be different in five or 10 years. >> if i can ask a follow-up question, given that the threat of lashkar's of violence is currently directed and externally, and there is always a threat that this could boomerang back and threaten

pakistan long term, leaving that aside, to what degree do you sense that l.e.t. is having success in terms of drawing people to its interpretation of islam, converting to its interpretation of jihad? is this something that we should be concerned about in terms of stability within pakistan, and is there anything we might be able to do about that? >> i think they have been successful in that lashkar has committed violence only in india. not in pakistan, very little in afghanistan. the people are being attracted to lashkar very much. the last time i counted the number of their members, it was

more than 300,000. on been trained. -- armed and trained. which is very threatening, and it is growing. i was undercounting when i did 300,000. my sense is that the pakistani military is training the lashkar, to replace the taliban in afghanistan, but the pakistani military is really india-centric. they have lost trust in the global jihadis, because after the fall of the taliban, they turn to the pakistani military. i think in 10 to 15 years, they

like to see lashkar and kabul. in kabul.r an >> i did not see a lot of connections to crime in the attacks themselves, particularly compared to the latest attack and mumbai. there was a moment when headley, showing the level of connections he had, he introduced his lashkar people to smugglers for smuggling weapons across the border into india. one of the reasons was that the conception of the mumbai attacks is different in that you have this excellent undercover reconnaissance operative who was american, and reliance on him. he does a lot of the work projected from the outside. to maintain operational secrecy.

there were other people involved in response -- reconnaissance and we do not know about all of them. there may have been peripheral roles, but i am not aware of anything in depth. >> on the connections to the international, i have seen -- this is been reported for at least a year and a half now -- some l.e.t. might be trying to assist maoists in india as a way of the stabilizing other parts of india, or getting a foothold. it is something i have been seeking to verify and have not been able to do so. i do not know of others on the panel have dug into that. but i can attest to that that it is something that has been knocking around for well. it would speak to the degree to which l.e.t. tactics have

drifted and expanded even further, and the degree to which the group is willing to make alliances outside of a circle in terms of accomplishing his objectives -- its objectives. i want the second sebastian's point. it was believed that the indian criminal underworld would come to light at some point, and no evidence suggests up to this point that that has been the case. but the criminal networks in india were intrinsic to lashkar's ability to build its own presence there. one last card-supported network came together in large part -- lashkar-supported network came together in large part because of the members of the criminal underworld. and i will quickly talk about not arif's point, and the

question about the threat within pakistan. to a large degree, lashkar's appeal within pakistan is threefold. when it fights, it is against india. the country's main enemy. it has not turned its guns on the state. three, it is providing a host of services that in many parts of the country the state is not -- education, welfare, health care, it has one of the largest services. the degree to which the u.s. can affect -- pressure pakistanis to actually take over this infrastructure and run it themselves, and the degree to which we can help support that and the growth of educational development in the country, but those will be very important. but the case remains that even

though one person has been banned by the un, it had not been banned without -- within pakistan. this hole in destructive that he was talking about remains extent. something needs to change in that regard. they're going to need to be carrots and sticks. do we have enough time -- i think we will have to leave it there. thank you all very much. [captioning performed by national captio>> we're going tf 20-minute break for lunch. there are lunchboxes immediately to your left. they're three different kinds of lines. bring your food back in and then we will resume with our keynote speaker, amrullah saleh. >> there was one assumption, that pakistan is an ally, so that when we push the taliban

and out of the afghan borders, they will be taken care of on the other side of the border. then we will start phase 2. as you all know we had a constitutional lawyers that began the democratic process. things were going very well. pakistan was keeping the taliban and hibernation and they were not unleashed. re-unleased. that continued until late 2005. institution building starts in afghanistan, and i call it phase three. in phase 3, a mistake was made. the approach -- every donor

nation building capacity, the united states takes the responsibility for building the afghan national army, germany the national afghan police, the united kingdom takes the responsibility for narcotics eradication, italy takes the responsibility for the judiciary fund. they soon find out after a eurozone that this stovepipe strategy is not going to lead to a cohesive state. now everyone regrets why we wasted the money here in that approach, because the result was not the result we all desired in light. -- and liked. it was during this approach of nations that something emerged.

the hot already come back, but they were in the remotest parts of the country. in the villages, exploiting the lack of an presence of the government, and they were able to establish small bases. an area which was not significant. by being there, at the taliban did not pose any significance state.to the afghanistan everyone was of the opinion that they are gone, they are defeated, if they are in the villages, they will not be able to become a strategic threat. and people believed musharraf was not the threat, a double game player.

they all thought that he was an honest the strategic ally of the united states. a lot of the things i wanted to say, one distinguished journalists said, the game that pakistan played. it is 2006. middle of 2006. the attention of the united states -- i want to say it is diverted. it is a split between iraq and afghanistan, and iraq takes the bulk of the u.s. attention. taliban reemergence as a strategic threat. what do i mean by strategic threat? they are able to make the highway is unsecured, they are able to attack centers, they are able to attack fob's, and the

intelligence picture becomes more clear that they have established bases in afghanistan. at this point in time, the commander of nato in afghanistan was general richard. he lost his famous operation medusa. it was to approve the taliban from their known vases -- of bases. they were out of the crude from three districts, but general richards did not have sufficient resources or manpower to pursue them further. because he did not have enough soldiers, and of resources, he came to the afghan government and said, "let us have a change

in strategy, let us have afghan development zones, what we call adz's." we only developed certain parts of afghanistan and by developing certain parts of afghanistan, we created these small areas so that those outside these areas, they see a better life and they will volunteer to say no to the taliban. the afghan government rejected this approach. but by then the taliban had become a strategic threat. furthero elaborate where we are now, but in 2001- 2002, the taliban are not entirely defeated. they were pushed out of afghanistan. they have lost territory. they lost command-and-control.

they have lost their fighting machine, but as far as the leadership of the taliban was concerned, they had gone to pakistan, and in pakistan that were protected -- they were protected by the pakistani military in the tribal area. now we all realize in 2007-2008 that the taliban has re- emerged, but the big attention is not on afghanistan. we see signs of the blame game, megaphone diplomacy starts, afghans complain about lack of resources, the international community complains about lack of competence and lack of a strong political will on the side of the afghan to do something meaningful, but there is no prescription as how do you deal with this process. there is a review in washington

, far from meat could see what reviews you can find. some of them talk about barack obama as war. then comes the most fresh and latest description as to what do you do with the enemy who has reemerged. if you say surge, more u.s. troops, while more u.s. troops? they have for such a long time neglected to create of viable afghan force. now the taliban has come in such a big number and development of the afghan national security forces would take more time, the easiest way to counter them is more u.s. troops. parallel to bringing more u.s. troops in afghanistan, they say we have to in large the size of

the afghan national forces as well. that is the place where we are. but what is the problem of this phase? there are a number of problems this strategy. in the current strategy, the united states still believes pakistan is honest. or at least more than 50% honest. [laughter] you hear these words, rogue elements in pakistan. not very confident and certain whether we remained in that part of the region, so therefore they have to keep their boys for a rainy day. you do not remain in that part of the world forever. that does not justify pakistan

to grow and create these militant groups? i think not. the other problem with the current strategy is this. let me, but for elaborating the problems of the current strategy, i have to say every single u.s. soldier in afghanistan is fighting with dignity and honor. i am not saying this because i am here in the united states. my views are very well known. the fiat -- they fight for the u.s. national interest with dignity and honor. without them, we would face massacre and disaster, and god knows what type of a future afghanistan would have. that said, what i explained as a problem is not mistake for the

honorable mission they have in my country. general petreaus is trying to solve the problem by going to the villages. expanding and spreading the afghan government. but there is that fundamental problem in kabul, the problem of political theater in afghanistan. the kabul theater is detached from reality. they're not fully in line with a military mission you have political kabul not fully buying the military mission, and the soldiers going out to the villages. which one is the priority? special forces doing night

operations, or a consistent policy to solve some of the outstanding issues with kabul and make it a viable partner? we have to have a common and unified narrative. without that narrative, without that strategic messaging, we will not be able to carry on the public either in afghanistan or in the united states this mission. i gave an interview in afghanistan to national public radio. by coincidence, i opened a website of in pr and i read the opinion of the americans about what i had said. i saw the narrative about this war has blurred. it is not as clear as it was

september 12, 2001. some of the americans who have commented on my interview, they said this guy does not make sense. he talks about this. why should we go into those mountains and fight for him? what does he mean when he says whether americans are here or not, we will fight to defend our malaise? what do i mean? before 9/11, we were fighting the taliban. and we were fighting for a political afghanistan. -- a pluralistic afghanistan. we were not fighting for power meant of the factions. we were fighting for a day where and afghan woman is seen as a human being and not as animals

put in cages. what i meant, if the united states leaves us, up and says -- abandons us, through the excuses that this is no longer viable, it does not mean that we will give up. we will continue because we have not reached the stage with the enemy is defeated. the united states came to our country for three distinct objectives. defeat al qaeda, make the taliban irrelevant, and create a viable government for afghanistan. the question is, which one of those three have been achieved? in my opinion, we have managed or achieved the third, but not in a perfect manner. there are flaws in problems with that.

hawkeye is not defeated. the taliban is not defeated. what bothers everyone in afghanistan and what has blurred the narrative for the war is the talk of reconciliation. we could reconcile with al qaeda and taliban on september 14, 2001? what was the need for the billions and billions of dollars to be spent? it is the same enemy. of course, if we hear the speeches of major western politicians saying, failure is not an option -- now it seems as if failure is an option. and my key message, coming to washington, is this -- it is a valuable war. the nature of our enemy has not

changed. the fundamentals are the same. people tell me that after the surge, things have improved. i say yes, things have improved. there are no bombs in kabul. i hope there will be no bomb s in kabul. but as the surge brought basic change in the fundamentals? has something changed in pakistan? no. have recaptured, killed, or brought into the negotiation table the taliban leadership? no. have we defeated al qaeda? no. so the search is brought a temporary effect. -- the surge has brought a temporary effect.

the one reason i emphasize time and again, the narrative of this mission is not as it was six years ago, four years ago. people try to create a reductionist agenda. the basics are the same. the same al qaeda, the same taliban, the same deceptive pakistan, the same agenda for the jihadist groups. the taliban taking back part of afghanistan, will they be able to threaten our key and national interest? when they did helped al qaeda to do 9/11, they had the same weapons. think of it from another perspective.

they are creating a perception of defeat. by resolved and sticking to an ideology and converting fertilizer to i e d s, and having sanctuary in the trouble there is a pakistan, you can bring it down. -- in the tribal areas of pakistan, you can bring it down. this is a narrative -- and what is the solution? after resignation, people called me anti-reconciliation and anti- peace. that's not true. my family is in afghanistan. i have nobody living outside afghanistan. i'm purely local.

so what is the alternative if we don't reconciliation from a position of weakness, where the narrative of continuation of mission is fragmented, where political kabul is not fully partnering with the idea for what ever reason -- and institutions dealing with take their headquarters out of the pakistan the intelligence base met -- basement. allow them a chance to govern.

but they will die in democracy. they will die in a country where the wall is a ruling. not a spread of fear and intimidation. the resistance in afghanistan, they were ddr'd. they surrendered to the rule of law. a lot of them were marginalized politicians, but they gave up their weapons. you can travel in the areas they were controlling with ease. i have been warning and i want to reissue that warning -- which fell -- without ddring the taliban, without pushing them to

declare to there -- to their commanders are, a deal with -- will be a disaster for afghanistan and for the united states. i want to very briefly say what i mean by disaster. let's say tomorrow we have a deal with the taliban. it is a period of fake and deceptive stability. that gives an excuse to reduce the number of troops significantly. the enemy remains as mysterious and as i know today without going to their roots. the fighting starts again. it would be very easy for the western media to say, "they

fight." we will be, once again, distracted from the attention until you face another disaster and come back. "we did not know. let's redo it." a deal may bring a deception of stable listen, but it will not bring -- lasting stability where all foreigners will have confidence and afghanistan can rebuild their economy. that is an alternative. we are proposing it, not from

the position where we work -- i am out that the government as a political activist. you may say, "nobody is talking about a deal." all of you know about mullah mansour. we are so desperate for a deal that date taken to the president of the city and say, "here is the taliban, talk to them." this desperation for a deal -- why mansour was brought to the presidential palace of afghanistan? everyone is desperate for a deal.

what was the entrusted with the task of negotiation? [unintelligible] that is what i have said to the media. it was a very lengthy process. i was told when i asked some of the organizers of this conference what the expectations were for me to talk about. i was trained to listen. that is why i told you if you found it boring, bear with me. thank you. [applause] >> thank you very much.

we will open for a couple of questions. where is the microphone? ok. first question. we are going to call on someone who has not asked a question today. is there anyone on this side of the room? in the back on the left. >> kimberly dozier with the associated press. are you saying you can see a time where it would be right to open up peace talks to the taliban and? what conditions on the ground do you need to see before you believe they can have success? >> this is a very good question and a fundamental matter. just to quote the speakers who

spoke before me -- sometimes i will be accused [unintelligible] 3 of them said, " [unintelligible] kashmiri is becoming an important opportunity for al qaeda. we talk about all of these proxies', but not the master of proxies. what does the pakistan army want to achieve by saying to washington, "we are back to

being the masters of all of these proxy operations. "they may tell you to look at the suffering of the people. people are suffering in the tribal areas and the expendable parts of pakistan. you hear the news about the suffering of people in tribal areas. one bomb blast they take very seriously. pakistan believes that by promoting these groups, even if there is a spill over, it would be like fire in the servant's quarter. it will not affect the main palace. that is their duty.

for them, it is like some kind of squatter. what we do not see clearly is a consistent u.s. policy towards the fundamental issue -- pakistan. it is a country which, despite the threat of sanctions, they promised believers. 9/11 has changed us. they say they have not changed. they are the same pakistan. but he believed in them. the united states believes that by giving more money and more

resources to pakistan you can convert their behavior from bad to good. it is rewarding bad behavior which keeps them continuing to have that bad behavior. i say let's start negotiations today. have we changed some of the very basics? if not, you sit with the enemy around the negotiations table and demand of them what? they are not under pressure. two is under pressure? the u.s. military and the afghan villages. they go and they kill the middle circle of the talent, but not the inner circle of the taliban. the outer circle or the opportunists.

the middle circle or those commanders who go to pakistan, receive training and resources, combat, and lead a small group. the inner circle is so protected that a grocer can claim to be one of them and start negotiations. that is where we need to put pressure. put pressure on the inner circle, on the leadership so they see the heat and come to the talks and to terms. demographically, in the next 20 or 30 years, afghanistan will be around 70 million people. pakistan will be over 300 million people. they are estimating -- they are

stagnating in education, government, and economy. for them generating these proxy groups and sending them to afghanistan is there to promote the agenda or be killed there. in either case, it is a win-win situation for pakistan. so, i am not anti-negotiations or anti-peace. i say we have not changed the basics to call for a desperate negotiation with them. if we do, what is plan b? what if we keep asking for reconciliation and the american public opinion is exhausted with this and then we say what?

i do not see plan b. because we do not see plan b, people like me to see the future of afghanistan hanging on a cliff, we say we have no influence over the taliban. if nato decides to leave and the taliban continues to fight, it will be the victim? the civil society, the women, those who wish to live in a pluralistic government. you may ask why afghans are not organized enough to do part of the job themselves. it is very simple. as i said, political kabul has to partner with you for the sake

of afghanistan. curating a narrative that can carry the afghan and american policy towards victory. >> question in the back? >> good afternoon. i am at a news correspondent with voice of america just back from pakistan. we all know that this strategic review is coming up next week. we presume it will be released by the white house. we heard some relatively positive remarks from secretary gates yesterday and early in the weeks from general petraeus in terms of al progress is going in afghanistan. we are hearing a different

message from you. if you could make one or two points in that strategic review, what would they be? >> again, a very good question. let us contrast this for the afghan government and let us revolution allies the development of the afghan security forces and relevant institutions that are involved in good government. those are two points. pakistan from september 12, 2011, has [unintelligible] you have not earned the wholesale cooperation from that country. this individual or that individual, this al qaeda guy or

that al qaeda died -- pakistan has not provided you with a wholesale operation. the tribal areas seem today, both to you add to us, [unintelligible] -- you the pakistan ni should say to the pakastinis, we will do the job for you. those will be my three points.

without these tests, everybody will measure progress as it suits their interests. it will not change the fundamentals. remember, i am not contradicting the assessment of secretary gates or anybody else, i am saying, "how do we change the fundamentals?" the fundamentals have not changed. we cannot adjust ourselves by the mood of the enemy. we must adjust ourselves by the intention of the enemy. it is as clear and dishes as it was on september 10, 2011. their mood swings. one day they manage to do a

bombing, the other day they cannot. they are giving a deceptive perception that things are improving. get your troops out of afghanistan. >> this gentleman right here. please identify yourself. >> i am from emory. you describe yourself as a political activist. my question will be about the ideological -- the ideology of the mujahedeen. they want to fight and go to paradise. from the last sentence you said, that is why local people

do not stand up and fight the taliban. i am saying that because mullah omar has declared [unintelligible] for all of the al qaeda branches. in somalia, they do not fight for shabbat. why is that? this ideology is not a factor? >> there is no verse in the koran to say get one to happen.

i wonder why everyone who wishes to go to heaven > [unintelligib] i cannot find adverse. -- i cannot find that first. -- i cannot find that verse. why we always opt for the second jihad? there is something that works there. it is a very complicated discussion and debate. coming back to your point, if omar has a point, i am sure they

would not say the precondition would be for you to remove your message. he has no message. he knows nothing except killing. i find it insulting to say the messages of two -- of truth muslims is only killing. there is no vision for this world. we wait in desperation to go to the other world. that is not the message i get from the koran. the taliban is a group. they do not represent the majority. i was fighting the taliban before the intervention of the

united states because of my beliefs. we will fight again. >> question here in the front. >> thank you. i am from fox news. i am on the board of the jamestown foundation. if you talk about political kabul and the united states being on a different states. what would be your plan to replace the political kabul which one that might be on the same pace as the united states? >> i do not have the temptation, the plan, or the proposal to curate another front for the international community to handle.

this is not necessarily even a political plan. we should bring meaningful reform to make the political ckabul part of the mission. they should stick to the common matters. -- the, narrative. what is that, narrative? from september 12, 2001, until today -- at the base exchange? you would still have that problem with extremist groups. they were based in tribal areas. they were based in afghanistan. they are attacking afghanistan on a day-to-day basis. what does it take to make political kabul stick to the narrative?

there are plenty of contrasting tests that are subsidized by your assistance to do their jobs better. we should not wait. i totally disagree that the afghans will start taking responsibility in 2014. no. there should be a deadline for the completion of handover. my message is i do not believe the afghan national army is a protective force. they should be allowed to do operations by themselves. it is a matter of casualties. their political leaders must promote the cause. we should not be motivated through an op-ed.

that is not our media. we have our own media. meaningful reform is strategic messaging and, also, the start of handing over responsibility -- it should have started from yesterday. what do i mean by handing over responsibility quickly? if you watch one of the documentaries on afghanistan which was made two years ago, there is an episode that says "now you see nato strategy connecting kabul with the masses." why should nato flight around villages? beiges say to our ministers, "tomorrow i am going to be

somewhere and i want you to be there as well." what does it take to secure that road? it should not be a purely nato mission. i just 81 of the test. there are -- i just gave you one of the test. there are more. if we fail at our mission, this failure will mean something. you should not believe the afghan officials because they speak english, or because they impress americans. they must be able to impress the villages. >> we have time for one more question. there is a question in the very back of the room. please wait for the microphone.

>> thank you very much. i had a quick question on what you call the theater of kabul. what is the purpose of that if he couldn't elaborate -- what is the purpose of that if you could elaborate? regarding the reconstruction -- reconciliation efforts, is there any ethical issues that are influenced them and was there any influence from islamabad that led to your resignation? thank you. >> the definition of political kabul is a segment of the society which is involved with occupying big positions, big

businesses, big media, and are very active in civil society. they are benefiting from the security of nato, but they have a different narrative. that is my definition of kabul theatre. it must be aligned with the mission. your second question is about the reconciliation. sometimes it is being said that the taliban are pashtuns and the stronghold is kandahar. people should know that the taliban are against music. four weeks ago, one of our rock singers went to have a concert.

30,000 people came to the concert. they knew there could be suicide bombers. there could be taliban snipers. there could be every other type of threat. when i watched the concert, it was live on our national tv, i had heard the songs and was crying for half an hour. i was crying to see how desperate people are for a normal life. 30,000 people coming for a concert. that means that if you have an alternative and it is meaningful and visible and acceptable and accessible, people will say no to the taliban.

they keep st. the taliban are the sons of the soil. where are they? people get confused. the taliban are pashtuns, but pashtuns are not taliban. that is my message. i do not want to live in the history. i have a new life. >> on that note, we are going to end our discussion. thank you very much. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010] >> thursday on washington journal, the co-founders of the

note illegals a movement. davod fri, amd wo;;oaid frum anm galston are our guests. tracy fox will discuss a childhood nutrition at schools. washington journal take your calls and e-mail's live every morning starting at 7:00 a.m. eastern here on c-span. monday, january 3, a debate among the candidates for the republican national committee chairmanship. this event is presented by americans for tax reform. the current chairman will debate five opponents. that is live on monday starting at 1:00 p.m. eastern here on c- span. after this,phyllis bennis on

booktv. join our 3 our conversation with your phone calls, in elemails, and tweets. what's previous programs bond book -- watch previous programs on booktv.org.

[unintelligible] in a world where we increasingly pay attention to the institutions that are less than five years old, we are very pleased to help honor and celebrate the urban league's 100th anniversary. i did a quick search of 100-year old institutions. there are not many of them that are as vibrant and long-lasting as the urban league. there are not as many who had the same name recognition and prominence as this organization. the national urban league is one of the oldest organizations in the country, working to raise the standard of living in urban communities. there are more than 100 and local affiliates in 38 cities -- 38 states and the district of columbia.

they have improved the lives of over 2 million people nationwide. today's talk is empowering african-americans in the age of obama. i think this is the crown jewel of the series. it is a virtual who's who of the urban league. monique miles-cartwell, hugh price, the bill when sax and company visiting professor at the woodrow wilson school. today's form will begin with a presentation by the three speakers. i will moderate the discussion afterward. please help me welcome our speakers. thank you for coming. [applause] >> first of all, let me say good

afternoon. let me express a great deal of appreciation and thanks to the woodrow wilson school, especially to professor price. he was my predecessor of the ardently. let me also express a great affection for a graduate of the university of pennsylvania. [laughter] i spent some time out here when i was at the university of pennsylvania for a football game in which i was a participant. i do not remember the results of the game, but i remember that i met a young woman who attended here who became a girlfriend of mine while i was in college. let me also express a great deal of appreciation to the woodrow wilson school for focusing on the 100th anniversary of the

national urban league. i will talk about that in a bit, but i think it is important that you mark this anniversary milestone. it says something important about the 20th century. the 20th century was essentially institution building. institution building in the sense of many great institutions including many voluntary institutions or institutions that serve the public. you can think of many that were built in the 20 a century. in the civil rights community, both the national urban league and the naacp were built, founded, created, and nurtured in the 20th century. organizations like the salvation

army and the ymca, even if they were founded before the beginning of the 20th century, they felt their birth and their legs and their momentum in the 20th century. the 20th century was certainly a century of industrial institution growth and development. the automobile institution, the automobile industries, general motors, ford, many of the great banking institutions were built in the 20th century. we note and we moc -- and i like to think of the 100th anniversary of the national urban league as a time when we reflect, not only on the first to end years of the 20th century, but on that 100 year period known as the 20th century. i think it would be helpful to

talk for a minute about the 100th anniversary of the national urban league in the context of if we look at our 100th anniversary, we look at it as a time to look back and a time to look forward. a time to look back and reflect and learn, celebrate and understand, but also a time to chart a new course. great institutions must innovate, must recreate, must experiment, must continue to strive for relevance. relevance comes because you meet the needs of the time and you create a vision for the future. we were founded in 1910 in new york city by those forces, those historic forces which were sweeping the country in the

early 20th century. it was a time when there was the beginning of the great migration. that great migration was the migration of african americans from rural, southern states as other communities to the great cities of the north. it coincided, very interestingly, with the time of the great immigration. those from europe fleeing famine and persecution to find their way to ellis island to the united states of america. there is much more written about the great immigration then there has been on the great migration, but the great migration, along with the great immigration, our forces which shaped 20th- century america and shake the urban communities of america. that great migration began to take place in the early 1900's

and it really beginning after the 1896 decision of the united states supreme court in plessey versus ferguson. this was an act of betrayal of the great constitution during reconstruction. it was in the early 20th century when the klan rose. the economy of the south began to collapse and change. neck mechanization change the economy. -- mechanization changed the economy. separate but equal but, in reality, separate but unequal became the law of the land. a system of american apartheid and was born. african-americans reacted to that and left for baltimore, for

philadelphia, 40 york city, for chicago, for detroit -- cities all over the midwest and the northeast. it was against that backdrop that in 1910 a white woman -- progressive white woman by the name of ruth baldwin, the rights of late railroad magnate, a woman whose ancestors came here on the mayflower, teamed up with an african american and collectively brought three fledgling organizations together to create the national urban league. they were struck by the conditions that african- americans who had just arrived in new york city faced. unhealthy conditions, joblessness, homelessness,

malnutrition among its youth -- they wanted to respond to it. had found his way to new york city from plying -- from pine bluff, arkansas. they came together and founded the national urban league. in that time, it was an organization of social workers at a time where the social work profession was gaining momentum. in the early days, it was about providing social work to african americans in urban communities throughout the north. like so many of the earliest 20th century people, -- 20 century institutions, they created a network of affiliates.

they were separately incorporated -- they separately incorporated. there are 98 of these affiliate's. they serve 300 communities in 36 states and the district of columbia, including places like anchorage, alaska, tallahassee, fla., smaller communities like peoria, illinois. we have held true to the system of affiliate growth and true to the system of being a service organization. we had been involved throughout the years i get very important undertakings, tried to open the doors to the unions that controlled jobs in the industrial sector, trying to open the doors to jobs in the

war sector. working with presidents roosevelt, truman, and eisenhower on a range of very important initiatives. it was i in 1960 that i believe one of the historic proponents -- historic times took place. whitney young became president of the urban league. he had been at atlanta university. he was a friend of dr. martin luther king. scott king. coretta he did not leak -- did not believe the our league should be

a organization that directly served african-americans, but should be an organization that was part of the voice of the new civil rights movement. whitney young joined with dr. king and became what was then known as the "big six" of civil rights leaders. whitney young was in selma in 1965. he was there when there was an effort to push president johnson on civil rights. it was whitney young who carved out a unique role for the national urban league in the 1960's. that was a role where whitney young began to, in a diplomatic

fashion, work with the captains of american industry. american business had a stake and a role in post-civil rights america. they had a role in rebuilding the nation and the nation's cities after the riots in 1965, 1966, 1967, and 1968. it was whitney young to work with president kennedy in 1962 on one of the earliest components of urban policy in the united states. president kennedy assembled his cabinet officers to meet with whitney young and about 40 or 50 national urban league affiliates leaders from around the country. whitney young was followed by the legendary vernon jordan to

continued on this path. he was followed by john jacob there was followed by the man price. today, few phugh he helped to position be organization. he was in the streets and in the suite's talking about the achievement gap as a threat to economic growth and development in the united states. i had a chance in 2003 to him.eed the the and urban league has had eight presidents. the united states had had 18 presidents. where we are today in this very unique time in american

history, a time i believe is in many respects both the best of times and the worst of times, is someone who heads said in 1968, the year of dr. king's untimely death -- and african americans serving as president of the united states. there has been no less than half a dozen african-american, and now a woman, who served in top positions in corporate america. people at that time would not have believed that. in 1968, by the time 2008,

nine, and 10 rolled around that african americans would lag far behind -- african-american boys would lag far behind american girls in graduation and matriculation rates -- they probably would not have believed that either. these are the best of times, and these are indeed the worst of times. our current work is framed around the four important goals. we launched in 2010 a new campaign that we call "i am empower. "that sets forth for big goals for the nation at large for the year 2025. those goals seek to incorporate

where we think this nation should go if we are serious about the issues of economic and social equality. here are the goals. the first goal is that every child is ready for college work -- college, worked, and life. as university students, you may not think it is a radical notion for us to set as a goal for this nation by 2025 that every child to graduate from high school and is proficient in the basics of reading, math, and science. if we could do that, it would change the 21st century. so our first goal is that every american child should be met -- should be ready for college, work, and life. the second goal is the crucial issue of jobs. every american should have access, not a guarantee, but access to decent jobs that pay a

living wage with good benefits. it is very important as people allies -- allies -- i had an interesting conversation with a leader from china to talk to me about the increases in disposable income over the last few years in china for the people of china. he said something that you take is quite obvious. he said that bite disposable income, if workers do not increase, there will be no internal consumption of the goods and services they are now producing. they cannot build an economy as quickly by exporting goods, they have to build an internal investment economy. in this country, the idea of people earning a living wage is not only something that is just fair, but something that makes

economic sense. if we are going to drive the economy into the 21st century. the second goal is every american has access to a decent job that pays a living wage and good benefits. the third goal is about housing. housing is integral to the quality of life. that goal is that every american lives in safe, decent, affordable, and energy-efficient housing on fair terms. while we believe that homeownership is a linchpin of the american dream, we think we should affirm the idea that people have the right to live in safe, affordable, and energy- inefficient, because the green revolution is nothing but a notion if we do not integrate it

into help people live their everyday lives. that includes how they lived in their homes. we have seen predatory lending and the excesses of the subprime crisis which nearly crippled the united states and the global economy. the fourth goal is that every american has access to affordable health care solutions. when we articulated this goal, it was before the passage of the health care bill. the health care bill banned its passage is probably one of the most important features that sets the nation on a course towards this goal. we deliberately chose healthcare solutions because a healthier nation is more -- is more than about access to a doctor. it is also about healthy living.

it is about eating. it is about awareness. it is about the fundamental notion that a healthy nation is a stronger nation. we have outlined these goals. this campaign is a campaign that we invite everyone to go on- line, finding -- sign a pledge to commit to work toward these goals. if our own work at the national urban league, we do not say that the national urban league cannot bring the nation alone toward these goals. what we say is that the national urban league is going to devote its work, is programmatic work, its policy work, its leadership towards pushing people in this nation towards those very important goals. i want to begin to close by saying that today at 100 years

old, we are an organization that serves 2.1 million people a year. we are an organization that has an impact of $1 billion across the nation. we are an organization that has had some 30,000 volunteers and serve the people in very important ways. you can ask, how do you serve people? i would give you a simple point. in 2009 we held 11,000 people connect to jobs that paid an average wage-rate of $21,000 per year. part of our 100th anniversary is also to create great clarity about the work we do. we are a voice on public policy. 6-pointwe released 86a

jobs program. the only component we were able to get embraced was those provisions related to small business, which were passed by the congress and signed by the president in the fall of this year. we still believe there is much more that needs to be done to create jobs. we are going to continue to do our work. i am excited about where we are. within the national urban league movement today, we are a youth movement under way. you are going to hear from someone who is a member of the national urban league young professionals. i give hugh price great credit for giving birth to the national urban league young professionals. right now, 50% of the 98 local

affiliate leaders have been with the urban league less than five years. the last two classis of affiliate's leaders numbering about -- numbering slightly less than 20 had an average age of less than 40. when whitney young build -- movement in the 1960's, one of the things that was noteworthy was that so many of the local affiliate leaders were young men at that time. all of our new leaders are young men and young women who are dynamic, who are exciting, who are committed, who are well- educated. what i would say to students that are here, it is an admirable way to do public service, which the woodrow

wilson school is all about. this is looking at the non- governmental organization committee. looking at the voluntary sector. i can tell you as wine to has been in the private sector, i had been in the public sector, when a large enterprise -- the city of new orleans -- this work is as challenging as that work because you have to be chief, cook, bottle washer, sprinter, and juggler to do this work and do it effectively. you do not always have all the resources you need at your fingertips. i would encourage you in your careers to take about the community, think about service

in nonprofits. we need you for this. great intelligent, -- i would ask you to think about and consider the national urban league and its affiliates as a way for you to give back to your community and as a way to work to change the nation. at 100 years of age, we are proud about our past, prowl about our legacy -- but it the first century was about helping people transition -- and we say african-americans, but to date we serve white americans, we serve latinos, we serve agents, -- we serve asians -- if that first 100 years was to tell people transition to an urban

economy, perhaps what the 21st century is about is helping people transition from an industrial economy to an information economy. helping people transition from an urban economy to a global economy. we are helping the nation transition at an exciting time. thank you for listening to me. go to iamempowered.com right now. if you had your text in your hand, you can tax empowered to 69866, you can become part of our global community, you can follow was on twitter and facebook. you can be part of who we are. we appreciate everyone here at

princeton university, and happy birthday to the woodrow wilson school. happy 75th. >> it is always tough falling mr. morrell. good evening. i wanted to start by saying i am delighted to be here. thank you for having me. i would like to say thank you to the woodrow wilson school, primarily professor hugh price for having me with this discussion along with you. if you do not know, i'm here representing the new york urban league of young professionals. i will not speak long. othert to get to conversations. just to give you a brief

background about the new york urban league, national urban league of young professionals, of group of 21-40 year olds, we range in age from 21 to 40. going from washington, d.c., to chicago, to anchorage, alaska. we have over 50 chapters of specific engagements that the mission support. one area is education, economics, housing, so on and so forth. i serve as the vice president and through my position, we hope to help dynamic programs on a monthly basis. this is work we're doing throughout the country. we just had the privilege of serving as the host chapter for the national urban league day of empowerment to fight world hunger.

we were at a community center in harlem and packed bags for the feud and distributed them for the community. this is great and good endeavor, but part of the mission is to give people the tools so that they are self sustaining. when we talk about giving back, we have to create actual centers where people can help themselves. another initiative of the new york urban league is the technology and education center where people of the community and the students, it is all free, open access to computer labs, to actual programs. the run from 3:00 in the afternoon. you can sign up for class is for reseau the stone, you can learn a language -- rosetta stone, and in princeton, they're people who do not and -- opening checking account or an e-mail account.

forget wikileaks. they do not know what a week the -- a wiki is. they are challenged on the fundamentals. we as young professionals along with the help of our predecessors who set the foundation, and i must commend them, because not every day you see people who are young at the forefront. mr. morial and mr. price made sure that we were at the front of the meetings with the microphones, having a voice, having a say, and leading the work, not sitting in the background. in addition to that, in my real life, i work for a magazine. it is a business publication which prepares for people for financial literacy and provides tools and resources to vote, hunter and yours, and public

professionals. we want to run a contest for $200 to help people get out of debt -- $2,000 to help people get out of date -- debt. you can ask what this has to do with economics. it all comes back to economics. i am a marketer and it is not easy making financial literatures -- financial literacy sexy. it is the last thing people want to talk about. african-americans in particular have a tough time discussing money. we will go a details about everything else in our lives except for money. for me, i have the unique position in trying to find ways to make finance exciting, to provide this in a place where you would not know the name of someone like ursula burns. we have to turn these people into the rock stars and

celebrities, and all the others are great businessmen in the run right, they're a lot of people doing things in corporate america, ngos, who do as much if not more. in addition to this, i wanted to say -- wanted to tell a little story. a lot of people may not know the great story that the national urban league has made in this 100-year history. people ask me how i was introduced to it. i received a scholarship when i was in high school from the chicago urban league. when i came to new york, the first thing i did was to look at the new york urban league. they gave me an opportunity to get affiliated with the networks the was so much greater than mine, that had people from a cross-section of industries. i'm a marketer, someone else is a social worker or a teacher or an entrepreneur.

someone is in the sorority or fraternity, and it brings all of these people together and makes us one combined united front. he closes the disparities in the economic gaps and the -- it closes the disparities and the economic perhaps -- economic gaps. just the other day i was speaking to a former college and business partner about transitioning from her current job. in consulting her mother and mother-in-law, they were both outraged that she would consider a good job. when people are fighting to find work, they just didn't understand that she was miserable, that she was being underutilized, and she called me to say, what you think they should do? i do not necessarily consider myself -- whatever, a generation

you want to call herself, you have to follow your heart and your passion. opportunity is right at our back door. as a marketer, i pay close attention to media attend -- media issues, like they leave gaijins go forth campaign. -- levi jeans the fourth campaign. it's not necessarily the wild west anymore. as a young professional we have opportunities to create and sustain ourselves so we can be a zuckerberg. it is a very hard thing to talk about when you're in school right now. the first thing you want to do is to get a job as an is a

graduate. but you can create your own job. you can create a job for somebody else. there are many needs out there for some website building to graphics design where you can create a high different strain of incumbent, in addition to your outdoor work. that is a lot of where the law at. >> professionals come from. did joggling was helping us to our own businesses and also employed in corporate organizations. and lastly, just to go into the subject we're here to speak about, empowering african- americans in the age of obama, our biggest goals right now are economics and education. and behind that is building the infrastructure. you have to give people the tools to actually maintain and sustain themselves. we have a lot of support

programs in place within these five boroughs. in terms of my generation and what we are doing to help tackle the challenges, a lot of that involves intern's. i am in the position i am in because of help from someone else. a lot of people to not understand mentoring in totality. some people think you have to join big brothers, six sisters, you have to go roller skating once a week, and you have to take them to go get ice cream. that is not the heart of mentoring. i talk about this a lot. a lot of us have family members who are either our cousins or a little sister who after major i am a role model for. -- i have to make sure i am a

role model for. you just walk past the ministry, though not say hi, you don't ask them how their day was, what they did in class, to their teacher is -- just a little nuances. people take that for granted. in addition to mentoring in a structured format, so there are plenty of programs that people can get involved in. one of the things that we do with the new york urban league young professionals, we have a memorial fund. we give up scholarships, we raise the money, but in addition, we also prepare the person who receives the scholarship. it builds upon the foundation that the national urban league asset for us. with that said, thank you and i'm looking for to the rest of the conversation. [applause] >> thank you very much. it is a real pleasure to serve

on this panel with marc who is taken the national urban league to new heights. i am also delighted that money is with us. the embodiment of an exciting new generation in the urban league movement. it is an honor did teacher of the woodrow wilson school, and it is great that i am collecting a healthy dividend. clinical trials showed that prolong interaction with princeton students helps the war of the alzheimer's disease. the topic is empowering african- americans in the age of obama. we could have titled this, and powering african americans in the age of austerity. we have a very austere period ahead of us for the foreseeable future. we see a lot of exciting breakthroughs in the african- american community of the last

couple of decades. we of witnessed our climb to the pinnacle of power and influence in this country. as a freshly minted college student in 1963, i stood on the mall of a couple of other hundred thousand other people listening to the salt stirring speech by martin luther king that echoes in inspires to the state. it is as though martin luther king foresaw the election in 2008 when he uttered those words heard round the world, "i have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character." two years ago, which may seem like eons ago, the dream that my generation never thought would materialize in our lifetime came true with the election and inauguration of barack obama as president of the united states and leader of the free world. for me, it is the political

equivalent of c. neal armstrong climbed down from apollo 11 to be the first human being to step on the surface of the moon. that is how extraordinary that event was. if this war. no, we would live happily ever after. -- if this were a fairy tale, we would live happily ever ever. but this is a work in progress. there is much unfinished business that must be done in order to move african-americans into the american mainstream. we know that millions of black americans have forced to head into the middle class and way beyond. since the urban league founding 100 years ago, we concentrated on and power in american -- african-americans to into the mainstream. we had a speech on campus just a couple of days ago. in her moving and much acclaim but, she chronicled the great migration during the 20's -- and the sentry of 6 million black

people from the south to the north. as he indicated, affiliate's were created all of the country to greed and help them when they arrived to find jobs, housing, and to fight the discrimination that impeded their injury -- entry into the mainstream. when i headed the national urban league, we were accused of being a middle class organization. i used to say, if you are accusing us to try and help low- income and working-class folks get into the middle class, we plead guilty. that is what we do. in that recession after americans were struggling like everyone else, only once as documented by the annual publication, the state of black america, despite our historic leap forward, more than one out of four african americans are mired in poverty. that is twice the national average. their projections it will get worse, as high as over 30% by 2012. last month the unemployment rate for african americans stood at

16% versus the national average of 9.8%. barack obama ran as president of all the people. he is facing a grim recession that obliges him to rejuvenate the economy for the sake of all of the people. if he succeeds in improving public schools and extending health care to the uninsured also been in the cost curve, a double benefit african-americans enormously along with all the people. he faces daunting global challenges like terrorism and nuclear proliferation, energy independence, and climate change that threatens all americans. the president has made it painfully clear that he does not have a black agenda, and he will not initiate new programs aimed primarily at improving the well- being of black folks are of any particular ethnic group. there are other stark realities did. we occasionally your calls for

comprehensive multiple plans to help force the urban poor out poverty. the country cried that -- tried that in the 1960's with a bore on poverty. the track record was not that impressive when it comes to reducing poverty. that may have been -- and maybe a hard sell in this day and age. the national commission on fiscal responsibility and reform has terrified everyone about the staggering federal deficit over the horizon. the federal government must scale back spending going forward, not increase it, and major initiatives like the marshall plan may not be in the cards. the economic pain in this country is endemic, evidence but the fact that 40% of american people and more than 25% of america's children are now on food stamps. congress is unlikely to pass that initiative aimed at any specific ethnic group. the bottom line may well be that

the federal gravity -- the federal cavalry is not coming to the rescue of black votes, even with rather president as the commander-in-chief. i may be wrong, i hope i am wrong, but what if i am right? the question is, what is the backup plan? i share the euphoria of the election of barack obama. euphoria is not an agenda for lifting black folks and children out of poverty and empowering them to climb the ladder toward the mainstream. of course we should call us with other organizations and like- minded groups to push our federal policies and investments that promises to lift all boats. but we must not be giddy about the game plan that is required even on president obama is watch. i think we have to summon the iron will and resilience that compelled the 6 million migrants for in the 20th-century. we have to mobilize our own communities, our families, our

churches, our organizations to do what is within our control to empower our people and our children to get ahead. that is the essence for me about what empowerment means. marc has spoken eloquently about it, and for me that our five core components. just a focus on five. one is responsibility, the second is well on this, the third is education, the fourth is political clout, and the last as economic power. the start with personal responsibility, which to me is the essence of seoul. the key to empowerment is not a government program. that empowerment starts with the assertion of personal responsibility. we have to preach loud and clear to our teenagers until they get the point that they should not have children until they earn a high school diploma, turned 21, and get married. if they did these three things first, the chances are if their children will never experience poverty.

but if they do not, the overwhelming odds are that their parents will be poor at some point in their lives. it is important that male parents shoulder the full responsibility fatherhood from financial support to being there in earnest for their mothers and their offspring. my dictionary defines fatherhood as lifelong responsibility, not a fleeting moment of ecstasy. we need for the rappers to promote family values instead of gangster life house. i want to see commercials with rappers in business and selling literacy and writing, adding and subtracting, undressing right for work. a second -- and addressing right forward. chronically poor health impedes our progress. i teach a course you're the woodrow wilson school on

combating top of the city. the stark reality is that african-americans are disproportionately overweight and obese, especially our children. nearly 30% of black girls are obese. obesity triggers debilitating diseases like diabetes, high blood pressure, and heart disease. beyond the health problems, over well and the obesity cause collateral damage. did you know that obies and overweight kids are more likely than their non-obese appears to repeat a grade in school and miss a couple of weeks of class is? did you know the women who are is obeses adolescents are more prone to have lower earnings, higher odds of poverty, and lower odds of ever getting married? yes, overweight in obesity is called by environmental impact and by genetics, but overeating and insufficient exercise also contribute. there are practical steps we can take in our lives, in our homes, and in our communities to improve our own health, starting with better eating and exercise

habits in greater utilization of preventing service like screenings in keeping chronic dies and check. the third component of empowerment from my view is that we must have zero tolerance for low achievement and lousy schools. education is a proven pathway to the american mainstream. it is not a sure thing, but it is our best shot. achievement matters as never before. in this era of accountability and k-12 education, it means youngsters today must be mint -- meet stiffer economic -- academic requirements in order to stop being held back. today's jobs have a tougher skill requirements due to high productivity equitation's. in a sluggish labor market, the competitors for jobs are better educated than ever before because they're coming down the job ladder in search of gaining in the position they can get. for all this competition and these realities, as recently as

last year, only 16% of black fourth graders were proficient in reading. 52% of them read below basic. the low -- all basic is to gripe -- two notches above low grade level. for all the reform efforts, it has taken 15 years to cut that below basic rate among our ports graders from 70% to 52%. at this pace, it will be 2025 before that ratio is under 33%. that is intolerable. spike lee was produced at home "mo better blues." we need mo better education. people who do not have a high school degree based 15 1/7% --

15.7% of people without high school diplomas were unemployed. 10 percent of people with high school diplomas were unemployed. 8.7% with some college were unemployed. 5% of those with college degrees were employed. -- unemployed, excuse me. the correlation is very clear. it is also like -- is also clear that educators cannot do this job along. communities must not play hooky from the education of our children. i once wrote a book called achievement matters which provided concrete examples of the kind of constructive steps that parents and caregivers can take as per their children's interest in education. communities also need to get into that by encouraging people to achieve and rewarding them when they do. the fourth ingredient of empowerment in my estimation is exerting political clout. we flex their political muscle

by voting overwhelmingly for barack obama and helping to propel him into the presidency. we must not rest on our laurels. it is an unending process. midterm elections, state and local elections, they are also critically important and we have to play the political power game at the grass-roots level in between elections. i speak of the legislative and regulatory hearings, the local school board elections, and other venues where policies are set that profoundly affects our folks. i think we need them monitor and contract negotiations between school boards and unions that represent teachers and principals. after all, who was at the bargaining table representing the interest of the children? lastly, economic power is the coin of the realm in a capitalist society, and both employment and entrepreneurship are important for remaining in the mainstream. while we celebrate high profile

on to been yours, we should take advantage of revitalization happening in our own back yard, and not be hesitant about establishing businesses downtown and in the suburbs. in the 21st centuries, customers would judge businesses by the quality of their products and services, not by the color of the entrepreneur's scan. -- skin. we must ascenders by rigid primary responsibility for our own progress in this era of austerity. we need to get on with the business of getting ahead. according to the film a year african proverb, it takes an entire village to raise a child. progress in the 21st century requires that the village insist -- the villagers in list for active duty. we must not allow our progress to hinge on prayers. oil isabel wilkerson said the

other night that there was no black moses to shepherd the 6 million black migrants out of the south. they embarked on a perilous and uncertain journey one by one, family by family, propelled by grit and determination to seek a better life for themselves and most importantly for their children. empowerment is not about blaming the victim. there is plenty of blame for black poverty and estrangement to go around, from the industrial causation and segregation to lousy schools, poor parenting and others. empowerment is about devising a clear right vision about which way is up, creating a pragmatic strategy for moving forward and grinding out the progress day in and day out. charismatic types are not the only species of leader who will help advance the empowerment. the heads of grass-roots organizations and sororities and fraternities need to get into this because they have the influence they have over their members. also it is critically and one

for the black church. just imagine if the pastors and priests whose churches serve the african-american community decided that each and every child in their flight was going to read the good book and to understand a good book? a low basic reading rates would evaporate like do one a summer's day. i believe that if millions of our ancestors could successfully withstand the monstrous oppresses of slavery and segregation and make that trek north toward opportunity, surely the villagers of farce generation can rally to propel the rest of our people into the american mainstream. if we could create universities and medical schools and businesses under jim crow laws knows, surely we can motivate our kids to achieve in the schools they attend. those 6 million migrants that isabel wilkerson runabout left alabama, louisiana, mississippi, georgia, and the carolinas by

bus, train and automobiles, and headed for chicago, detroit, new york, and l.a. and other destinations. in the 21st century, that journey is shorter but it may take longer. it is still fraught with uncertainty because of the recession. but this i know, when you chat map quest for directions from parliament poverty to the american mainstream, it is crystal clear that regardless of your station in life, where you start out and where you are headed, all routes go through education. thank you very much. [applause] >> do we have any questions? do not shy. well, i have some questions.

oh, we do. speak right into the microphone. >> [unintelligible] professors price recently spoke about barack obama [unintelligible] policies that promote african americans. and curious about this, because in terms of by people, particularly how african- americans and other people of color in the united states and the only thing that is promoted is the actual vote as opposed to holding leaders accountable. and this is for all of the

parents, what can the urban league to and whole political -- leaders accountable so that when black people want barack obama to promote specific policies target -- targeted for their communities, that they actually had some type of mechanism to do that to hold them accountable. [unintelligible] >> i thought i said and i certainly believe that the agenda if it is successful, if they can restart this economy that helps the african- americans. the m1 and rates and others. if the most muscular school reform efforts that the federal reform rigid federal government

has undertaken is successful, it will impact and benefit large numbers of black kids in urban schools. it is not a black agenda. extending health care to those who are not insured directly affects and benefits our folks. i think the key for african- americans politically is to understand how you benefit regarding what the label on the program is. bill clinton never had a black agenda. the last president who had -- if i am not mistaken, the last who had an explicitly named black agenda was richard nixon. colleges let that sit there for a minute. [laughter] >> my thinking and had expressed to the president and every member of his leadership team directly, i believe that every president has a responsibility to shape policies for the most vulnerable americans, period. every president has that

obligation the health care bill. and the bank reform bill are very important pieces of legislation. in the case of the health-care bill, that will help to reduce health disparities in very significant ways. the biggest challenge that the health care bill faces is that no coherent, articulate message has been advanced to explain it to the people in this nation. therefore, it is easy for people to not understand it, although there are numerous provisions in it that it designed to address health disparities, numerous provisions in it that are focused on women's health. the package will increase eligibility for medicaid, which is a health insurance program or health coverage program for

people who are economically disadvantaged and pour. it expands medicaid so now men are eligible. to a certain extent, what has been lacking around health care has been the legislation passed, but the voices in opposition to it have been louder, more coherent, more focused, and more understandable than the voices in favor of it. that is number one. on bank reform, bank reform has within it the ability for the new consumer protection bureau to eliminate and regulate predatory lending, which had it as one of its bases discriminatory features, the targeting of african-american communities. again, the problem with bank

reform, and we have been and were intimately involved in both of these is that the voices in opposition to it have been louder, more coherent, and much stronger than the voices in favor of it. having said that, i think what the president, what i encourage the president to do, is to develop economic policies that focus on all parts of this nation where unemployment is highest. it just so happens that most of those areas our urban communities that have high populations of people of color, but they are not the only communities. you have a role communities in america where the unemployment rate is very high. you have some suburban communities which have been buffeted by the closure and downsizing in the automobile industry, where the unemployment rate is much higher than the national average.

to some extent, some of this is shaping all policy that is target in some way, shape, or form, to create certain incentives and beneficiaries. let me give you an example. this is a great example, something that is being played out today. the extension of the bush era tax cuts. the way that it is explained, you would think that they were across the board, proportional cuts. the fact of the matter is they were disproportionately greater cuts for people at the highest income levels. so if you are down in the lower tax brackets, the tax cuts increase your disposable income by 1%. if you are in the middle brackets, the tax cuts of 2001 it increase the disposable income by 4%.

if you are in the highest tax brackets, the tax cuts increase your disposal income by 7%. what puzzles me in the entire debate is that detail has been lost. that is an important detail, because we are discussing this. but i have argued publicly -- go on facebook to see it -- is taking the tax plan that was negotiated between president bush and congress in 2001 and basically chalking it, tearing it up, and building it. you say let us create a tax plan that will produce jobs, i will concede benefits for higher income americans. but i would like to see greater benefits for working class americans and middle-class americans, at least proportional to the benefits for

higher income americans. where accountability and public policy comes light and sometimes heat. light means, for example, with health care reform and bank reform, highlighting the fact that the president passed two very significant pieces of legislation that will have benefits for the public but will have a fairly significant benefits for communities of color, disadvantaged, and vulnerable americans. what has been missed is a good old-fashioned that explanation, coherent, simple, and understandable. so that people say i got that and i understand it and i know what it does. that is what has been missing,

on bank reform and on health reform. you cannot start a conversation about public policy without sang, let me tell you, it is complex. the tea party articulated a message in opposition to the direction of the country, around three, four simple points. the government is too big, right, spending is too high, and they got on those two horses and ran and ran, rode the horses in the control of the house of representatives and a pickup of seats in congress. i believe that this president and every president has a responsibility to develop policies and to target policies that are for the most vulnerable americans, particularly at a time when the

economic recession has been at across the board, but disproportionately high in communities of color. my argument is always a rising tide will lift all boats, if you have a boat to ride in. if you don't have a boat, the rising tide will drown you. from the national urban league's perspective, my view is we have a responsibility that is both too vigorously and passionately support the president's policies where we think there are in the right direction and to help the public understand them greater. toalso have a responsibility promote, suggest, and to hold the president accountable in areas where we think policy should go further. economic policy, when it comes

to jobs policy, is an area where i think much more could and should be done. the momentum has to be created, and i think if people understood tax cuts, if they understood the more clearly that the extension of the cuts, the extension creates greater benefits for higher income americans and middle income americans and lower income americans, my argument is why not create a new package that creates benefits for all classes of americans? but let them be a little more proportional and equal? i am giving an example. when people talked about targeting, they always think that you mean special benefits for people of a race. here we have a tax plan that was in fact target.

it was targeted to create greater benefits for higher income americans. and that is a point, that u.s. students, had a great school that teaches public policy analysis -- i spent 10 years of my life as a public policy maker, as a mayor and legislator, and learned very much that how you design public policies, that there was a lot of discretion, a lot of flexibility. all of that, it is a long way, but importantly to answer your question, which is there has to be on one hand responsibility to support the president vigorously, and on the other hand irresponsibility to hold the president accountable. we have a dual responsibility.

let me make this last point. in the economic space where we are very involved, we have offered and will continue to offer alternatives, suggested ideas. if you go to our facebook page, go to our website, look at what was said about the tax cuts, a look at the jobs plan, we even demonstrated that are six. job plan was revenue neutral. if you put all of these people to work and they pay taxes, taxpayers paying taxes helps reduce the deficit. a long way to answer, but a very important question. >> but there any other questions?

>> i have a question about this idea of the united press, particularly in the african- american community becoming more diverse. is that a goal you are pursuing, and if so, what are the ways in which you plan to achieve that? >> we have been uniting a consensus around big issues. that is what we should pursue. i also think that united front does not stop at the african- american community. it is a broader united front around policies, which are designed to create greater economic equality in this nation. that means supporters are not

just african-americans. they are from all backgrounds and races who believe is important in the 21st century to do something about this achievement gap, the high- school graduate asian right. it is important because it is important the economy of the future that continued economic inequality creates a great deal of social problems in the country and will continue. we also have to be mindful of the fact that black america is much more diverse than it has ever been. where the unity shows out is that the ballot box. the unity shows up mainly in national elections. but that unity does not necessarily show up in the local races because you have a whole degree of competition. the new order in a lot of communities is black candidates competing against each other, white candidates competing

against each other, black candidates competing against latino candidates. there is a new political order in a lot of communities. it is not the classic distinction, the classic competition. i think the idea is you are stronger when it is a consensus around a large issues, but we have to understand that the community has changed. we are no longer only a community that lives in inner- city, urban communities. we also live in suburban communities, smaller communities across the nation. we are a community with increasing numbers of people of african descent, black people from the caribbean, who are of african descent, who may be of mixed parentage. it is a different community in some respects. but let me tell you what has not changed, unfortunately, in 40 years, and that is the economic gap between black and white americans and the economic gap between those who have and

those who have not. that has been a very intractable sort of thing, but it is not impossible to see, as you have seen more african- americans become middle-class over the last 40 years, and more white americans have become middle-class over the last 40 years, and more people in the middle class. but the divide between the two remains similar to what it was 40 years ago. >> i think there are bridges within the african-american community that are partly used, but could be used more. i think of the civic organizations that are engaged in activities, tutoring, mentoring. there is much more that could be developed.

it is not the total solution, but i think there is some cohesion and opportunities to make more out of that and get some of the lesson gaged organizations involved. eugene robinson, washington post, just read a book called it disintegration, about the african american community and he is skeptical about the possibilities of reconnecting. i am not quite a skeptical, but it is hard work, no question. >> you have a question? this will be the last one. >> this issue of personal responsibility that he spoke about, in terms of how you foster it. how you in power african- americans to take responsibility and veer away from problems that may have private-sector or philanthropic or non-governmental issues.

how do you create a young professional who is willing to be jay-z, but who is willing to invest in education or green technology or creating a new political dynamic? how can you do that? i am one of those people here who want to be that person, but are looking for examples. >> i think they do in a number of ways. starting with young professionals, across the country, getting connected into that network, you'd be introduced to an array of people united under one front. a lot of those individuals appear in black enterprise magazine. you'll see that we have a list

of what we call the be-100, where we basically point out each and every individual who is doing $1 million-plus in revenue in their industry in every city of the country. all you have to do, you know the power of the internet, look them up and say, hey, this is what i want to do, would be interested? did you attend the national urban league conference and you meet a million more people like yourself. it is not hard to get engaged around the core passion, the self motivation. i don't find a lack of it, i am sorry. >> i think this is a fruitful area for research. one of the very interesting real-world examples of change in behavior, if i'm not mistaken, and, elizabeth, you may know better than i, there is a noticeable decline in and out of wedlock births among black teenagers. going back up?

but it went down. >> it did. >> but it was going down, if it did, and i think it was noticeable. it would be interesting for somebody to find out what happened. was that an accident? or was that deliberate? and what were the forces that influenced the the behavior of both the young men and women in that? because we don't really know why that happened. i remember serving on the commission, and while they were getting their facts together, the rate started to climb. but there is little understanding, very few people who talk to the young people who understand why it may have gone it down and why it may have resumed. that is something that people in public policy research could focus on. >> there are two people, one is wendell pierce. wendell pierce, the actor, he was on "the wire," a native of my home town.

he has been dedicated for five years now on katrina of rebuilding the neighborhood that we both grew up been called pontchartrain park. he has invested a lot of his own money. he has assembled and put together an entire strategy to rebuild this historic neighborhood in new orleans. wendell pierce. he has not sought aggressively attention for his work, but he is a prominent actor, he is a very smart, intelligent, caring man. you should bring him here and listen to him talk. he is an example of somebody who has used the power of his celebrity and his passion to do something significant. the second one is magic johnson, who has been involved in the national urban league, which just honored him this past summer, but to some extent the celebrity effort, the efforts to give back to the

committee of many prominent, public personalities. they don't get the love and they don't get the attention and don't get the recognition. one of the things that you could do here on this campus is to identify and invite those sorts of people. for example, in my hometown, both wendell pierce and brad pitt. brad has come something incredible. he has a lot more attention, right, then when bill has. what they have done from the standpoint of the committee is equally important. they have put their time, their money to rebuild neighborhoods that others wanted to forget. and you can see the results. i think it is important, sometimes, not to follow up the hype. i think what you mentioned, i

have black enterprise in my bag and i carry it with me all the time. there are incredible examples of people out there who are prominent before doing great things, making substantial contributions, that don't get highlighted enough. we know george clooney's work. we know bono's work. they have also been very skillful in making sure, because they have understood that part of the value proposition for the issues that they work on is bringing public attention, getting on "the today show," the front page of "the new york time," " good morning america," because that is the value proposition, but they're not the only prominent personalities doing important things.

i think sometimes that we may not seek them to lift them. the urban league, we are a lot of public personalities and celebrities, and we honor magic, angela bassett, layla ali alfriast summer, also woodward. but we did not honor them simply for their professional pursuits but because they're highly involved and engaged in the community. right now, one of things we're working on, quiet discussions going with some nfl people, the nfl players association, the national football league, and a handful of players about trying to encourage this to get more active and involved and use their prominence around important issues. but i think where you can play a role is when you recognize people, give them a platform to speak, you get a chance to hear

them. it sends a message to others that you will get recognized for your community endeavors and pursuits. so i hope that you all will consider that here at the wilson school. >> just as an aside, being that we are all technologically savvy, there are a lot of online communities that you can interact with some of the people, particularly name communities. if you do research, is very easy to get connected with like- minded people. >> let's thank our speakers, and we hope that magic johnson will be the one who is here next. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2010]

>> parris thursday, the foundersf the and no labelment. our guests are david frum and william coulson. after that, our series on food policy continues with tracy fox, who will discuss childhood legislation's effect on schools. we take your calls and e-mail live every morning starting at 7:00 a.m. eastern here on c-

span. >> this weekend on american history tv, the manager at monocacy battlefield. unbearable for televised oral history by the congresswoman on her behalf of working women. richard and steven ford steer their member to share their memories about the only person to be vice-president and vice- president -- and president without being elected. you can also press the c-span the alert button and have our schedule e-mailed to you. >> the one thing we absolutely learned of the past 30 years is that economists and other sages of the economy are not very good at predicting what actually happened. in his column for newsweek and

the washington post, robert samos and has written about politics, the economy, and social issues for over three decades. he would join us sunday night on c-span's "q&a." >> next, an interview with matthew parris, columnist for the times of london. in 2010 there was a major change in the british government. if the new prime minister, a conservative david cameron, leads the country in coalition with the liberal democrats. of the riding of austerity moves were announced. some have resulted in a backlash by the british people. in 2011, there will be of a rise in the value-added tax. goods and services except for food will be taxed at 20% instead of the previous 17.5%. all the served as the backdrop for interviews in london th