columnist with charles hurt and george zornick. then karen elzey. ♪ guest: budget talks resume on capitol hill when congress returns on monday. in the meantime, school is out throughout most of the united states. with that in mind, we will start the "washington journal" this morning with a discussion based on sunday's "new york times," waivers on node child

walk requirements. do you think it is time for waivers to be granted regarding no child left behind? it is an article by sam dillon. he writes, the main federal law on public education, arne duncan signaled that he would use his executive authority to free stage from a lot centerpiece requirement that all students be proficient in reading and math by 2014. that is what we will be talking about for the first 45 minutes. this edition of the "washington journal," if you want to get involved with the conversation, at the numbers are on the screen. we have a special line for teachers and administrators. we would like to hear from you this morning.

if you want to get in touch with us, our meet reggie our e- mail, or if you are following us on twitter, the address is there. more from the article in this " --ing's "new york times the obama administration has been hearing on mounting clamor from state school officials to weigh substantial parts of the lot --

we want to get your thoughts on that. is it time for waivers regarding no child left behind? again, the numbers. teachers and administrators, your number as well. more from the sam dillon article. we will not sit here and do nothing, mr. duncan told reporters on friday in a conference call that was embargoed until midnight saturday.

while the secretary said it was premature to lay out specific plans for potential waivers, his aides said that 100 percent side proficiency would be the main target. we will get back to more of that article in this morning's "new york times." our first call comes from miami, florida. billy, on the line for independents, welcome to the "washington journal."

caller: i am tired of the country trying to do everything for everybody. we need to get rid of these programs like special interest in events, when children cannot read. we are teaching people to dance at school. they are not necessary. thank you and have a great morning. host: lenora on our line for republicans in baltimore. caller: i would like to say that they are being misunderstood. at teacher may think that the student -- the teacher is not paying attention to the students issues as well as [unintelligible] the teacher cannot speak true

english. host: do you think it is time for waivers for no job left behind, to allow some room for the states to do some maneuvering? caller: yes, they need to do some maneuvering, there really do. that children are our future. host: in brentwood, california, brandt -- clip is a teacher. go-ahead. caller: imi 20-year veteran of high school math here in northern california. i have seen what goes on in schools. no child left behind, in my opinion, completely changed public education in that it change the emphasis of what is going on in public schools. both ford, schools have an emphasis every year, a school district will have an emphasis. since no top left behind, it has been getting on those test

scores of. funding is tied to task force. host: tell me how it is affected your ability to teach math in high school in brentwood? caller: that is what i was doing. teachers spend a lot of time in meetings. a meeting will have an emphasis. and the last 10 years, they have tended to look like this -- literacy, teaching kids how to read their textbooks. as a science teacher, how -- a science textbook. another emphasis will be test- taking strategies to eliminate the wrong answers to give yourself -- all for, it would look like this. rain forests. in one year, the number one emphasis for my entire school district was gay toleration issues. 20 staff meetings a year or curriculum meetings. we will discuss attendance

issues, grading policies, assemblies, scheduling. logistics. but the largest emphasis for the year in 1996 and 1997 in my school district was a toleration issues at time when kids were not reading well. they still are not. host: cents no child left behind, have they given you specific targets that you have to reaching your math class is? had they told you how to teach math to your students? caller: very much so. as far as the grading of each math teacher, that is done very indirectly, it is done but it is not talked about. host: susan on the line for democrats, you are on "washington journal." caller: i think that teacher expressed what i wanted to say

beautiful. they are focusing on everything but teaching in public education today. i think there is just too much bureaucratic overhead and not enough focus on actual teaching time. host: do you have children in the public education system? what kind of changes at the scene in their academic performance since the inception of the top left behind? caller: unfortunately, i do not. but the quality of the public education that i have witnessed has been pretty poor. long ago, i thought, because i benefited from both private and public education, and the difference between the experiences i had in my private schools and the public schools they attended, even a very good public school, was that the teachers were not necessarily

recipients of education degrees, and in the private schools that were experts in their fields. teaching methodology, it was really secondary to having a solid knowledge. then they were much more passionate and inspiring. i think that translated to the children they were teaching. i think the focus on teachers having had education degrees, i do not know whether it serves children well. host: in florida, we have danielle on a line for independents. caller: i am waiting for my statement. host: let's move on to mike in los angeles. welcome to the program. caller: how was it going? host: what do you think about no child left behind? is it time for waivers?

caller: it is taking away from the whole experience of education for our students. i agree with the caller just talking about private school teacher is not having, not having the educational degree and yet they are more impassions, and that is where education begins. getting them focused and caring about the process of education and learning for themselves. host: was subject to you teach and on what grade level? in this year degree from college? caller: you graduate from a four-year college in the new in tough two more years of education to get the certificate to teach. then you end up making close to

$38,000 a year to begin with. host: what subject to you teach? caller: i teach government and history. my degree was in history. the university of california in berkeley. host: how has your style of teaching change since no child left behind? caller: it because much more focused on the test-taking skills and students with low test scores will be removed from my classroom. in that affects the curriculum. they will be removed from the class so that they are no longer in the flow of what is going on in the class. everything is focused on actually the test. host: does it feel like this did is that you teach our proficient in reading? -- the students that you teach are proficient in reading? caller: it does, and a lot of that has to help and at home.

people pushing their kids toward that. but at a later stage, kids need did the where they can go out into the world and want to learn and educate themselves. host: that teacher and los angeles, california. more from the "new york times" article.

back to the phones. new hampshire on a line for republicans. jim, you are on the "washington journal." caller: i think that no top left behind refocused education to the subject area had a time when the world is becoming increasingly competitive. we need to get the schools to be able to compete with the other countries who are starting to play -- raise the bar. host: this call from our line from democrats. caller: i am on zero local school board, and i think it has been atrocious for education. none of them -- no children know

how ride and read into basic math. because of our lives on a task force that we have to follow, huge amounts of lines -- of times are going to pass a task that takes away from us being able to do more standard offerings with technology and other parts of education, and specific math skills. and because there are some many districts and some tools that do not make proficiency, often because of special groups that we have. i was really surprised about that call are saying that children were taken out of his classroom because they did not pass the test. host: tell me about the experience from a school board member's perspective on things out -- on how things have changed because of no child left

behind. caller: primarily there is and expectation that they want people to excel in community. we are a community that is supportive of education. we are totally reliant in new hampshire on property taxes. he creates friction when people read that certain schools do not make that test -- cut. that assumes that they do not know how children -- they do not know how to read or write. many times it is children in special education, and you do not want ostracize them but that is where the shortfall has been. and people are surprised that we're not able to offer science or social studies every day. people want more emphasis on their education but there are some many hours that have to be done for tests. last year we had five elementary schools. one did not make the cut.

they had to intensify their efforts for literally weeks. they shut down and just worked on focusing on passing the test that intense effort was not on the regular programming. they had to do that to make the cut but at all loss of all that time in the classroom just to take a standardized test. they achieved that, but at what cost? i think united states prides itself on being an innovator in education and technology. it is pushing teachers to teach to the test. and i find that education, people who are dedicated professionals have lost their enthusiasm for teaching. it has been a huge distraction. and because their schools that have excellent students and curriculum, but because part of the group weighs everything

down, it has caused a morale problem because people expect more. and you do not want to ostracize people in special-education programs, but they will not be -- there are some that will not be very proficient. host: we have to move on to tanya in new york, new york. an administrator there. caller: i want to comment and say that i think that no child left behind created a climate that failing is not an option. especially in high poverty areas. even the previous caller was saying that it was some kids dragging the rest of us down. they are entitled to an education. it makes sure that schools address their needs. host: adi seen a significant increase in the proficiency of reading and math in the state is that to administer in new york?

caller: absolutely. we are much more focused. everyone from enrichment teachers to others are expected to participate. you cannot buy out a child -- write off a child. america needs -- our kids are falling behind and we will not be ready to compete globally. the only thing i would tweak one no child left behind was more time to get yourselves together. but all children are expected to learn, that expectation is necessary. host: how would you compare no child left behind to the obama administration's race to the top program? caller: no child left behind does not give you enough flexibility.

in new york city, we have letter grades. this is an a school, this is a b school. and so many parents do not realize that their children are not getting an education. host: more from the sam dillon article. the article goes on to say that 40 states have agreed to adopt a new, and academic standards and several had formally asked the department of education --

new tests are being written to align with them. back to the phones. on a line for independents in hillside, new jersey, you're on the "washington journal." go ahead, john. caller: i think that no child left behind is probably the worst thing ever, in my opinion. what i think they are doing is putting children out there to graduate eventually who are not proficient in some of the basic areas that you need to navigate through our society. secondly, i don't know if you are familiar with the politics of chris christie in the state of new jersey, allie is putting a lot of emphasis on reforming

the schools. there are a lot of charter schools in new jersey and they have piggyback that on a documentary called "waiting for superman" based out of harlem. it is turn the school systems around in harlem and in new york. the same thing is going on in new jersey. let me tell you, i personally do not agree with public schools and the way that they did things. i think the public school system is failing. if your child or children are in the public schools, you need to get them out of there. if you have to pay for education, you have got to do that. they're putting dysfunctional kids, giving them graduate degrees, and the kids do not know much. ultimately they are doomed to fail. i looked at a poll in the world. i think united states was no. 35

overall. host: we will leave it there. we have got a twitter message this morning. you can send your twitter messages to us, @cspanwj. gail, a teacher in california. caller: it does not matter if the democrats are doing it for the republicans. the democrats do not make any difference. politicians should not be running our schools. teachers and administrators should. host: what do you teach out there? caller: i teach fourth grade and i had been doing it for over 40

years. the reality is that somewhere along the line, the politicians decided that they and big business should get involved in schools. the reality is, no child left behind leaves lots of children behind. race to the top, the same thing. it is a nice name. we have to stop letting education of our children being of a political football work teams try to make points. it is about the kids. the teachers understand that. one of politicians try that passed vouchers years and years ago, and the public said, our public teachers are better than doctors. we should not be using them. they came up with his back door way of taking control of public schools than breaking them down. this back door way is to say, ok, all of these schools are failing. they created a task. i don't think many viewers think that kindergartners to be tested

on past, future, and tenses of verbs. host: are your kids for fish and on a fourth grade level of math and reading? -- proficient on a fourth level of math and reading? hostcaller: it used to be that u could buy curriculum for fourth graders. now they are buying it for a fifth grader or higher. when we first part attesting children on no child left behind, but the kids who got the highest scores are not scoring lower if you compare those to the kids who had the lowest scores now. but most of the public does not understand is that over the years, they keep raising the bar on those tests so they can say the kids are failing. host: we will move on to jean

and shelton, connecticut on our line for republicans. caller: no child left behind law should be removed. get back to basics like the very first caller indicated. and this last person, how beautifully can you explain the situation going on in the school system? host: to you have kids in the school system? caller: not anymore. the first graduate -- the last graduated in 2006. host: that was during the original inception of no child left behind. what kind of change you see in his performance? did you think that he was proficient in math and reading? caller: he was before no child left behind. they need to get back to

basics, take out the bureaucracy, and focus more resources to teaching. and they need to kick the conclusion readjusted, -- get the inclusion readjusted. some kids can be disrupted. so the teachers do not have disruptions within a class. they need to get back to basics. host: we have this twitter message. we have some other news to look at this morning as we continue our discussion on whether or not there should be waivers for no child left behind. this comes to us from the ap in phoenix. the first photos of gabrielle giffords sensuous shot in the

head in a mass shooting in tucson. they were released early sunday. they appeared on her facebook page. those pictures show the congresswoman outside. in one she is alone and smiling. her hair is trimmed short. no clear sign of any scarring. the other, she is sitting with a woman. we are showing the close-up picture right now on c-span. deferreds had been in a houston at rehabilitation facility. the only time the public was able to glimpse her was april 27 as she boarded a plane to florida to watch her husband launched into space. the grainy footage showed her slowly but purposefully walking up the planes stairs. back to the phones. we will be talking now with

jonathan alter of "politico" who wrote an article this weekend entitled "abandoned, that financed weiner seeks treatment, house leave." jonathan allen is with us now. tallis, what is the latest with the situation regarding congressman weiner? guest: there was a flurry of news yesterday. his democratic party leaders tried to get him to resign privately. house minority leader nancy pelosi and representative steve israel had called anthony weiner yesterday, both urging him to resign. he said he would not do so. within a few minutes of each other, that two of them put out statements calling on him to resign as did the democratic national committee chairwoman,

debbie wasserman schultz. within an hour of that, there were another set of people who called on him to resign. weiner said that he would not resign, but rather seek a leave of absence from the house while he sought treatment for whatever is causing this sex scandal he has been involved in. host: all of these calls for him to resign come from the house side. but you write in your article that chuck schumer, the no. 3 democrat in the senate, and kirsten gillibrand both approved of his decision to seek for treatment. what is the significance of that? guest: a couple of things to work there. chuck schumer has been very close to anthony weiner. weiner used to work for him. children take syracuses the junior senator from chuck schumer. -- gillibrand take her cues as

the junior senator from chuck schumer. the sex scandal did not involve actual sex, as far as we know. it also did not involve any public malfeasance, as far as we know, or abuse of office in terms of taxpayer funds or anything illegal that we know of. and his constituents are the constituents of the two new york senators. one of them came out with a lifeline. clyburn said that the democratic caucus should have a chance to meet on this before everyone passes judgment.

host: you also write, there is nothing in the house rules or ethics manual that prevents weiner from taking time off to get treatment, even if the leadership wants to see him step down. but they could take action against him and other ways. they could move to expel him from the house democratic caucus or could strip his committee assignments. this was done against james traficant of ohio following his conviction on truck -- corruption but before he was expelled from congress in 2002. if the democratic leaders and to expel him from the democratic caucus, what would be his purpose? how could he continue to serve the members of the constituents in his district? guest: it would still be able the vote. they could not strip him of his ability to vote. the idea that he would be kicked out of the democratic caucus is such a strong concept.

the last person was jim traficant, convicted of serious corruption and and didn't anthony weiner's case, he has not even been charged with a crime. this is a feeding frenzy going on around him because of the nature of what is going on and their revulsion with them, that is the only thing that could explain the idea that they could read -- that they want to get rid of the scandal because it is unpalatable. but what anthony weiner has done it is not something that he has been charged with anything, not corruption. if they kicked him out of that caucus, that would be setting quite a precedent for themselves about getting members -- writ of members of congress or punishing them.

that would probably be a bad few others that would be kicked out. host: the state of new york is scheduled to lose two seats in congress because of redistricting from the latest census. tell us what the machinations are as far as this process and were rather representative weiner's district is in the cross hairs because of this controversy he is involved in? guest: there is talk that if he does not leave on his own, his district would be a target in redistricting, to be one of the two seats that eventually get added to other districts that exists. that was already under discussion. it was already possible that his district would be one that went away. if that happens, he might be

able to run in a primary with one of his colleagues. it sounds like new yorkers are not calling for him -- the majority of them think he should not resign. if i was a member of the new york delegation, i am not sure i would want a primary from anthony weiner, who if nothing else has shown himself to be a very energetic campaigner over the years. also able to raise a lot of money from progressives after being a star on television, and ironically, twitter. host: jonathan allen, the house is coming back from a break. what you expect to see in terms of concrete action from leadership as they deal with this controversy? guest: speaker boehner has been silent on this. it is possible that the ethics committee might launch an investigation.

if congressman weiner takes a leave of action, -- of absence, democrats could hope that there would be less pressure on this. a couple of things are working. republicans are watching the democrats stumble without getting in their way. number two, it allows for the contrast as republicans try to shift into a summer jobs agenda, to be able to talk about serious issues while democrats are talking about the foibles of one of the rhone members. -- of one of their own members. they are increasingly talking about jobs. many bills are old ideas but they will concentrate on sending the message that they care about jobs. host: finally, if congressman

weiner should decide to resign before the end of his current term, what is the process for putting someone in there to replace him? guest: there is a special election process, generally speaking. there have been a bunch of special elections over the last three years, but i have not seen what the time window is for that. there should be a special election to replace him. the two parties of very familiar with running special elections in new york. there have been a large series of them over the last four or five years. host: jonathan allen has been on the phone with us from "politico." you can read his article on their websites politico.com.

we will continue our discussion regarding an article in this morning's "new york times," talking about waivers to the no child left behind requirements. it is written by sam dillon. john non-aligned for independence -- on our line for independents. to say thatwrong we're not going to apply this law to you are to you. i think they need to no child left behind do away left an old department of education. return it back to the states. i don't see where the federal government has contributed much to education overall. i think it has been the attraction. that has detracted from the quality of education.

we are also sending money to washington and having had just come back to the states. just send it to the states or the local school districts and let them do their job. host: how would you characterize the purposes the -- the proficiency of the children in your school district? caller: i don't think it has changed that much. i agree with tanya, the administrator from york. the testing is good. i think that it is just inappropriate for the central government to impose these standards. i understand charlotte, n.c. greatly improve their education and their outcomes a few years ago by very rigorous testing, much more than no child left behind. they were almost like an

industrial setting, something like that, where you are doing quality control checks daily or weekly as opposed to eight ended the year test. host: we will leave it there. in the "baltimore sun," how kind of operative behind 1998 embassy bombings killed. al qaeda's longest serving the most senior operative in east africa has been confirmed dead in somalia. cleveland, ohio on a line for

democrats. jacqueline, are you there? let's move on to orne's, massachusetts on our line for democrats as well. caller: this is kathleen. i am a teacher and we need to test the children to find how much they are learning but the problem with no child left behind is the adequate yearly progress. each school has to increase the percentage of students who pass the test. the goal of no child left behind from the beginning was that one of every child in america -- they wanted every child in america to achieve a 66% in math and reading. is this what we really want to aim at? that glorious day when every child in america is mediocre?

it varies some time from test test and district to district. sometimes the passing bar is as low as 63%. we need schools to meet their federal requirements, and in massachusetts were the children did pretty well to begin with over 10 years ago. every year to increase that, they have to continually [unintelligible] over that magical 66% line, even kids who are making progress so little that they cannot get the levels because they are new immigrants and have learning disabilities and they are making progress, but the government is not honest. host: we will leave it there. in the "washington examiner,"

allen and came have a washington problem. landover, md. on a line for democrats. caller: privatizing things as our problem. we spend at $3,500 a month they keep for federal in mainz on a child, then we wouldn't have some many inmates. like with the military, we privatize the military. we pay more for a private soldier then for a regular

soldier. this should be called profit ize. it discriminates against people because a lot of people are being left out. if they wanted to crack think is the privatizing of things, then we need to take a good look at that. if we are spending more to house a child in prison than to educate one, or spending more to it at a person in prison than paying a soldier. host: indeed "new york times," texas gov. draws criticism on rare event. when governor rick perry confided fellow governors to join him on august 6 for a day of prayer --

cleveland, ohio, at jacqueline non-aligned for democrats. caller: i am for the no waiver of no child left behind. children are eating more and they were trying very hard and they needed. host: thank you for your call. thanks to all the callers who participated in this segment. later on the "washington journal," job-training in the u.s. and the future of opec. coming up after this break, a discussion of 2012 presidential politics. >> c-span radio rears five tv news shows. topics include presidential politics, the economy, and the situation in the middle is. we begin at noon eastern time with her "meet the press."

the first debate between debbie wasserman schultz and reince priebus. also rick santorum. at 1:00 p.m., it is abc's "this week." richard shelby and former new jersey gov. jon corzine and robert reiss. then tim pawlenty on fox news. union, callsof the " a preview of tomorrow night's new hampshire debate. a former new hampshire governor. "face the nation," steny hoyer and paul ryan.

five network television talk shows brought u.s. a public service by the networks in c- span. meet the press, this week come boxed is sunday, stated the union, face the nation. listen to them all on c-span radio in the washington d.c. area, on xm satellite radio, downloadable as a app. >> connect with c-span online with the latest video on twitter, continuing conversations on facebook, political places in washington and beyond with foursquare, and programming highlights on our youtube channel. c-span and social media -- connect today. >> this weekend on american history to become more than 20 years after the end of the cold

the civil rights movement, and restoring civil war photographs. get the complete we can schedule at c-span.org/history or press that c-span alert button to get our schedules e-mailed directly to you. >> "washington journal" continues. host: for the next hour, we will talk 2012 presidential politics with charles hurt, political columnist for the " washington times," and george zornick from "the nation." give us your preview for tomorrow night's new hampshire republican presidential debate. guest: it should be the madhouse that the first debate we saw down in south carolina was, or

the field is so flat, and you do not even have all the nominees that i expect will end up there. and a number of the candidates stayed out last time because they thought it was lessening their standing in the field. i think there is some truth to that. being up on the stage, some junior slugfest, it probably does not help them. host: george zornick, dec it as a slug fest? what are your predictions? guest: no doubt it will be a slugfest. if you where rick santorum for others, you get a bite out of mitt romney. he is doing the best in the polls. the best way to make your name is to take some hard punches at hand.

host: on the cover of "the national journal,"it has characters, mitt romney, newt gingrich, and representative bachmann as well as others in the field. if you go with the presumption that former governor romney is the front runner so far, then who has to do the most to get closest to him during the debate? guest: an interesting question. the way that i look at it is right now the people that are in there, they will be mixing it up, but the field is so unfinished. we're looking at the possibility of rick perry, a very likely possibility that the texas governor will get in.

what we have seen in the last couple of months or the last couple of weeks with the way that sarah palin has been behaving, there is a very good chance that she could wind up getting in. if either of those things happen, it as such a complete game changer for the field, that these debates that we're looking at -- they are perfectly interesting to look at if you like to watch ron paul takes center stage. but i do not think it is a realistic feel right now. host: george zornick, same question to you. guest: the most that tim pawlenty can do to raise his name, the better for him. he is suffering from a lack of name recognition. the more sound bites that he can provide, the better it will

be. republican talking politics 2012. other items in the political news for the next hour. if you want to get involved comic give us a call. -- if you want to get involved, give us a call. the numbers are on your screen. you can also send us e-mail messages and messages on twitter. going forward, after this debate in new hampshire, lay out for us what you expect to see the candidates doing as far as making a name for themselves and iowa. guest: we have seen a lot of activity with the people who are announced nominees.

i think a big thing we will see in the next couple of weeks will be sarah palin, a new movie out very favorable of her. it is not an authorize biopic, but done by someone very enthusiastic about her. they are releasing it in iowa and the next couple of weeks. it will be interesting to see how much attention that gets. i think this whole process she has been through in the last couple of weeks where this movie has trickled out, in screening for a lot of reporters, if that movie gets attention, i think it could -- we could see a fair amount of her out there. the same goes for rick perry.

it will be interesting to see how newt gingrich carries on in the next couple of weeks. host: george zornick, how much of the release of the e-mails last week and the attention sarah palin is getting, how much will that play whether she gets into the race, and when she gets in, what position she is in? the front, the middle, or the back of the pack? guest: i do not think the e- mails to deter it altered there was concern for people on the right and hope from people on the left that damaging information would come out. they were largely under interesting. that fueled support that they pay undue attention to her every day brings. -- doings. makes it more likely that she would get in. as charlie said, this movie will be playing there.

you will see her make a couple of visits. host: our first call regarding our discussion on presidential politics comes from agusta, georgia. our line for democrats. caller: i want to make one comment. i do not think that sarah palin is going to run for president. host: this would work a lot easier if you turn down the sound and your television. caller: ok it is down. i do not think that sarah palin will run for president. why would you do that when you have a cash cow now? she is a very smart woman when it came down to that. there is a reason why she quit the governorship. she saw that she could make money. therefore, she is not going to

take a chance on that. in my opinion, she is not really qualified to become the president of the united states. host: charles hurt. guest: that is an excellent point. maybe she is not going to run. we will see that in the coming year. but whether she wants to continue to write books, make money, and expand her private political base, or she wants to run for president, everything she is doing right now helps in both of those. she is being very smart about keeping her options open. if this whole process we're seeing right now benefits which ever decision she makes. host: robert on a line from republicans in maryland. caller: thank you for taking my

calls and thank you for c-span. congressman ron paul who blew it in 2008, he was the man. he would have fixed this thing. he is a libertarian. but he had to run under the republican label. he goes back to the history of person i admire, malcolm x. he said that quality is having the freedom to develop one's self. that is what congressman ron paul is trying to do. he is the best friend in the black community. half of these brothers in jail right now on trumped up charges for drugs and stuff like that. if we can get congressman ron paul in office to deregulate drugs, half of these brothers would be out of jail. i think he is the answer. and questioning the federal

reserve, i read all of his books. guest: ron paul is an interesting candidate. he will be the only guy on either side to would be advocating for a rapid withdrawal from afghanistan. that is a valuable voice to add to the debate. i see a lot of other ideas which are unpalatable not only to the electorate, but even republican voters like eliminating the federal reserve and returning to a gold standard. i don't think those things will fly. he has a very viable boys. host: shelton, connecticut, you are on the line for "washington journal." are you there? caller: i would like to know about bp. host: we will leave it there. charles hurt.

guest: ron paul is the one candidate that draws equally from both sides. it is amazing. and i did not get what the last caller said. host: the possibility of secretary clinton being added to the democratic ticket as vice president. guest: president obama has done a good job, but what will be interesting is a report last week by reuters that she is angling for job at the world bank. that has sent the clinton people, they are very upset about this league. and the white house is having it down. but that is a far more likely scenario. host: back to our discussion on republican presidential politics.

donald online for democrats. caller: one quick question. dot in anybody's right mind they think that rick perry is qualified to be president of the united states? come on. i know that you have heard this before, but we have already had eight tax and -- a texan eight years in the white house. look at what a shaking as he left the country in. and to nominate another but texan did the president, a few people are crazy. if you think someone from texas is going to do something hut mess up this country like the last one did. host: are you still with me? is there anything specifically about governor. beside the facts that he is from texas?

caller: the fact that he wanted to secede from the united states. if texas wanted to secede, i could not give a dam, excuse me, but we need to put an adult and there. huntsman i would probably support. maybe pawlenty, i have to do research on him. i might even consider mitt romney. but my goodness, please, do not even think about nominating. . -- nominating perry. guest: he does not have an affirmative case for being president of the united states. he favors repealing the 16th amendment and 17th amendment, which creates the federal income tax and the direct election of senators. he has floated the idea of texas seceding from the union. that is a difficult case for him to make.

all but a lot -- paul begala had a good quote. if you thought george bush was to surrender girl, then rick perry is your guy. -- was too cerebral, then rick perry is your guide. host: i should have mentioned. guest: christie is a list of candidates that is not in, but would make a big splash at the guy in and completely change the dynamics. i think he has problems on the social side of things with the republican primary voters. but his standing in all other respects is sterling.

i would argue that while he has said that he is not running and he has made every indication that he did not intend to run, he has not said anything that completely closes off doors to him. so with a draft christie movement picked up steam, he could wiggle his way into going along with them. host: when would he have to get into the race in order to make a substantial showing in iowa, new hampshire, and south carolina? guest: being from new jersey where you have a lot of money, he will probably be able the raise money very quickly. the rule of thumb would be for a late entrant like that, in the early fall, he could still probably pull it together. host: next, louisiana, you're on

the line for "washington journal." caller: what makes them think that they are qualified to be president? and i will let the guests to comment on this. what makes them think obama is qualified to be president? host: bill, are you still with us? bill is gone. george zornick. guest: obama is the president. i would say that makes him qualified to be the president. palin was governor of alaska, but she left it half way through. that does not immediately disqualify her but she needs to explain her exit from governing. i think they will be a problem for her. 2012 we're talking republican presidential politics with charles hurt and george zornick. i would draw your attention to

this article in the "new york times." on paper, the sweeping gain republicans enjoyed last year in statehouses across the country -- george zornick, based on what you have seen so far, might there be a significant shift based on the redistricting? guest: i do not think there will. you will see some tinkering around the edges. but a large this story here, the increasing number of hispanic voters, increasing economic strain on the white middle

class, these trends will determine which party gains and loses strength of the next 20 years. host: charles hurt, if there are fewer gains for republicans in the house, will this have a long-term effect on the outcome of the 2012 presidential election? guest: it is actually not -- we have this debate every couple of years. it is a good problem to have that you made so many games that there is not a lot of running room to further those gains. but i do not think it has a tremendous impact on the presidential, just because, for most voters they still think congress is run by democrats. because of the outcome of that puts the wind that the republicans back going for the white house.

but the challenges of incumbency that the democrats and joy, it probably balances that out. host: back to the phones. we're particularly focusing on the republican party. our next call comes from oklahoma on our democratic line. caller: i think the republicans have an uphill battle here. i know the economy is bad, but that is the only thing -- and the only thing they come up with solving it is cutting taxes. come on. we tried that for eight years. if that word, there should be jobs coming out of our ears. i do not see anybody -- mary trichet may be romney, but any other person that they have got, i do not see them putting up a race. guest: the idea that is just the economy, there is nothing else

that matters. elections for many years ago in are won and lost on the economy and the economy alone. the argument that the republicans are making is not just cutting taxes, but also removing a lot of the stumbling blocks such as epa regulations and things like that that they argue have put a damper on job creation, so that more jobs are created. if president obama does not do something about the lackluster jobs report, and it appears that they are going to continue for the next 18 months, he will have a real hard time winning reelection. host: george zornick, you wrote in a "the nation" last week. tell us about this article and

what kind of player ralph reed will be in the republicans choosing their republican candidates. guest: most know that he was heavily disgraced in the jack abrams of scandal. he was using that money to be ginned up evangelical support in alabama against casinos. this exposed him as someone who had shady financial dealings but also someone who was using his evangelical base for his own narrow and greedy purposes. but he is back. he held this conference last week in which every single republican contender for the presidency attended except for newt gingrich, i believe. he will be a power player. this conference was as much religious as a tea party gathering. this was really the pace of the party. he is clearly making a play to be a kingmaker again.

host: back to the funds. you are on the "washington journal." caller: i keep hearing these reporters saying that so and so is not qualified to be president. i would like another idea of who is qualified since they know so much about it. host: before we let you go, who you think is? caller: i think any of them are. all of them are. host: no one in particular? caller: sarah palin. i do not know if i will vote for her or not. host: what you like about governor palin? caller: her experience before. it is crazy that they rule out some many people who are not qualified. -- who are qualified. host: we will move on to ken etiquette.

-- connecticutt. charlotte,on to the n.c. on our line for republicans. caller: i think that ron paul is the man. it will take us 20 more years to get the public off the breast milk of government handouts. i believe he is the man that can do it. and i will get off the line the listen to you talk. host: among the people that you talk to, how much real support is there for ron paul candidacy? caller: not enough. [laughter] host: we will leave it there. charles hurt. guest: ron paul and his supporters, they are dreamers, and i mean that in a very good sense. they have very high ideals of

felt what they would like to see the government returned to. and i personally agree with a whole lot of them. they go in the right direction. but as george was pointing out earlier, unfortunately this town is based on -- you have to cobble together your actions and groups of support. the animal that on paul makes up is not an animal we normally see the successful in this town. host: later on today, newt gingrich will be addressing the republican jewish coalition out in beverly hills. it is a foreign-policy address, his first public event since the mass resignation of his senior campaign staff. one of the headlines from last week, this one from "the hill."

senior staff walks out but candidate vows to soldier on. how long can former representative newt gingrich keep soldiering on before his candidacy is taken seriously or he decides to get out? guest: he can go on. it is always been clear that this is a vanity campaign for him. it is not really conceivable that a man that has not served in government for the past 10 years will take over for an incumbent president. he can keep up as long as he wants. it depends on how much he is willing to let his reputation and dignity to take a battering when he literally cannot pay people to support him. host: in the "washington ichael barone.baron

tell us some of his gifts and some of his flaws. guest: clearly newt gingrich is a thinker. he likes to try out his thinking. but that usually makes a terrible presidential candidate for you cannot think allied -- you cannot think of loud on the president of trevor you cannot get into jousting matches against -- about policy because everything is clobbered very closely. your words are taken literally. i think he is getting out, whether he likes aeronaut, much the way that he got in, a role in disaster. host: on that note, we go back to the phones. on a line for independents,

you're on the "washington journal." caller: i do not think that there are any candidates that the american people really want. they want to get rid of these trade deals that ship jobs overseas. we want the financial institutions to quit running our country. i think we want illegal aliens removed and sent back to their country. what better way to export americanism that to send these people back? no one in the two parties cares anymore. it's all about special interest in the money. host: george zornick. guest: that is right and away. you see this balkanization where everyone has their pet issues. it's harder to find a candidate that checks every single bloc said they had. and the economy is in terrible shape. it is hard to find a candidate that has offered a convincing plan for creating more jobs and getting us back on track.

guest: sounds like eight ron paul letter right there. host: 1 "newsmakers" this week, lamar alexander is our guest. he talks about democrats and republicans coming to terms on debt and taxing and spending. also about developments in the presidential race. take a look at what he said on whether newt gingrich can continue with his campaign for the presidency, and given that masse resignation of his aides and other recent blows. >> i do not know. newt is one of our most durable idea man in our party. he is filled with ideas but presidential campaigns are difficult undertaking. there is a lot of turmoil on the campaign. we will have to see. host: you can see the entire interview with lamar alexander

at 10:00 a.m. following this broadcast. also 6:00 p.m. later this evening on c-span. it is also available online at c-span.org. our next call for charles hurt and george zornick comes from florida. john online for republicans. caller: retired military, tea party, and i notice that the professional republicans are missing the that. eventually herman cain will keep the field because this is a break up the high be leading mafia year. when people are casting aspersions as to he/she is not qualified to be president, that is a ideally, mafia, wall street journal trek. eventually to avoid charges of racism, everyone with my persuasion will have to be

behind herman cain. host: but persuasion is that? caller: my son is a first sergeant in the army. he has done two tours in iraq. i did desert storm. i just think that these wars of adventure, the whole thing is out of control. $14 trillion in debt. hal well as the i believe mafia run our country up to now? -- how well has the ivy league mafia run our country up to now? guest: they hate people inside the beltway. god bless them for them. i happen to recite here but i understand the sentiments.

there's nothing they love more than a guy like cain who has built the business, done very well in the private sector, and the idea of him coming in and crashing the party, bringing some sensible solutions to problems that should not be problems except that you have politicians dealing with them, it is an understandable and a breath of fresh air. i am delighted by that turn of events. host: charles hurt is not a member of the ivy league mafia. neither is george zornick. there is an article on herman cain calling him the cain-do candidate.

back to the phones. fort bragg, north carolina on a line for democrats. caller: i am sorry to say, but republicans have no choice. herman cain really has no choice. romney is the choice. i wish that donald trump would have stayed in. with the economy staying in, who wants to hear someone talk about how much money they make when they want to be president? he had ample time and he will be back. host: we want to remind our listeners and viewers that when

you start talking, make sure that you turn down the volume on your television or radio. george zornick, are you starting to get a feel from the obama administration and campaign as to who they would like to run against? guest: they have not telegraphed it very clearly. i assumed they would like to run against michele bachmann or someone unpalatable to many voters. what they are most scared of, you hear people saying he is boring, he is bland. but if you look at the polls, the candidate that does the best is generic republican. obama has been hot in office and owns a very bad economy. that is what they are most worried about. host: next is frank in north carolina on a line for democrats. caller: everyone from north carolina must be calling you

today. i am a career military person myself, working in washington. this next campaign will be the most negative campaign in history. what you do with $1 million when all you can do is run on it? i firmly believe that the nominee of the republican party has probably not announced yet. it would not be surprised to see governor huckabee get back and for senator demint or governor barbour perry. -- gov. perry. if the republicans are going to win, they will have to take the negative, and either taxes, regulation, and energy

dependence and the negative side of the obama administration, identify czars, his background, and a $1 billion negative campaign. host: of the folks that have not declared yet, whispered about being possible gop candidates, who do you see as being the front runner? guest: i would probably say rick perry because he has something of an operation. is the longest serving governor in the u.s. today. he comes from a big state. a lot of big time donors and organizers would almost instantly get behind him. after that, i think sarah palin.

i guarantee you that the very smart people iran president obama's campaign last time and will be running at this time, they do not dismiss sarah palin as quickly as a lot of people here in washington do. host: george zornick, same question to you. of the people yet to declare, who do you think is the front runner? guest: i would agree with what ross said. rick perry has fund-raising ability and organization. he has a tea party swagger that no one else, no serious candidate possesses. tim pawlenty tries with his over-produced videos, but rick perry can walk that walk. host: a tweet from jimmy.

charles hurt, your thoughts. guest: we had to. five years of democrats in washington. almost peer control in congress. hanging this on either side is absurd. host: florida, our line for republicans. you're on the "washington journal." caller: not only am i democrat, i showed -- shook john f. kennedy's hand. i am a union person. i am 53. it looks like they want to privatize all highways and

hospitals. they want to privatize law enforcement, anything that is public is something they want to get their hands on. for all the right wingers, they think social security is going away. if it was going away, they would not be trying to privatize it. the gentleman in the black coach is trying to look liberal. the one on the right is actually a true democrat. rep. -- rick perry wanted to secede from the union. sarah palin did not know the warning went to the americans and of the british. it is astounding to me we live in a country that has lost its way. it shows the corporate controlled media and that ignorance is knowledge.

host: we are going to leave it there and get a response from george zornick. he is right. with the larger debates, it is a debate alone about the role of government. should we have more taxes to provide a wider safety net in tough times? the conservative vision is to strip it back and let people be whim of the market. caller guest: republicans have done a poor job of governing in the last couple of years. the original idea of decentralizing and getting the government out of things is that the government does not do a

good job at a lot of these things. i would be interested to know how pleased the caller is with how well the government runs all of the things it does run. host: 1 potential candidate we've not talked about much is jon huntsman. the conference chairman is our guest later on "newsmakers. " this is what he had to say. >> i had dinner with one of the candidates last night. it was governor huntsman and his wife. governorhe and

pawlenty and governor romney and maybe some others have strong chances. >> did you give him advice? >> no, it was so smart, i would be in the white house. host: what about the potential candidacy of john huntsman? guest: he has literally been in china for two years. he started here in the beltway with reporters looking at the republican field and saying there is no field or fight whatsoever. people got to talking about it. buzz outll generated do of the beltway with reporters trying to find the perfect candidate to go up against barack obama.

he is a non-starter. he worked in the obama administration. he thought the stimulus package was not big enough. those to the things alone. well. two out of the running. -- those two things alone will put you out of the running. host: disappointed to the ambassadorship in china by the obama administration. with that the big drawback to running? -- he was appointed to the airbus to ship in china. with that be a big drawback to running? -- he was appointed to the ambassadorship in china. could he seldom self us some of the able to work with competitors across the aisle to get things moving in washington?

guest: that might be a fairly persuasive case in the general election. he would never make it past the republican base to get there. host: we're discussing who would run for the presidency on the gop side. adrian, you are on "washington journal." caller: i recall many times. this is my second time getting in. i really enjoy the program. i think herman cain is delectable -- electable. is credentials are impressive. host: what is it that you find so attractive about him? what would make him the most

qualified candidate? caller: he graduated from morehouse, an historical black college. guest: this is another one of these voters who loves the idea of somebody from the outside coming in and clean house. the problem with it is it is a big, intrenched town. you have a lot of entrenched special interests. coming in from the outside and making -- turning the place upside down always sounds of a really good idea, but is less often successful. host: previous to the obama administration, the last two

president saw themselves as outsiders. one was governor bush and the other was arkansas governor bill clinton. is it possible for somebody with the outsider label like herman cain to be able to sell himself and moved to the front of the pot? guest: 50 people were so unhappy that an outsider has a chance. i am not sure there's someone like herman cain has not held office has a chance. -- i think people are so unhappy that no outsider has a chance. a couple of weeks ago, herman cain said he would not sign any bill over three pages long. it is nice to have an outsider's take on things, but if you only signed bills that were three pages long, nothing would give down. -- it done.

caller: i think he is a competent man. erry.o like p i made a mistake last time and voted for mr. obama. that will never happen again. we've got to do something. this country is going towards bankruptcy. there is no two ways about it. anybody who thinks it is not should take a course in the last month -- mathematics. this country is choking. the first in obama does pass a health care bill. he puts the three men responsible for the demise in charge of it. we have to their boards. has anybody on wall street gone to jail yet? give me a break. host: we're going to leave it

there. we have this twitter message from hunter. what are your thoughts? guest: the last caller makes a good point. it is a cautionary reminder that politicians might want to think about. in 2008, president obama ran a brilliant campaign, but he made a lot of promises. he was so effective in reaching so many people that everybody hung on him what they wanted to hang on him. everyone believed he was their guy. a lot of people are disappointed he has not turned out to be what they thought he would be.

it is a good thing for any realistic person running for office to keep that in mind. do not make promises that you are not going to be able to carry out on. host: with regard to promises, the obama administration said they were going to get unemployment down to about 7%. the numbers out last week have this back up to 9.1%. the number of unemployed is 13.9 million, essentially unchanged since may. there are continuing housing market was. mean for thehis obama administration and how they will take on the republican challenger? guest: on employment may be the biggest issue in the race. what will matter is the rate at which jobs are added up to the race. if he can show progress, i think he will win.

there are a lot of democrats in the senate suggesting it is time for another smaller stimulus bill. they are suggested a $100 billion in infrastructure bill that would close loopholes and put money back into the economy. it will be interesting to see if the administration goes toward spending and job creation. host: the next call is on the line for democrats. caller: i have a question with regard to the republican candidates running. i know when the new house republicans and in the senate during 2010,d sworn in they said they would never raise taxes under any circumstances. for all the nominees on the republican side, i want to know

if each one of them have signed the grover norquist pledged not to raise any taxes under no circumstances? guest: i would be surprised if any of the republicans would balk at that. it is a pretty low standard for republicans to agree that if you are going to spend new money, you find some place to take it from. that is what we do it home and our own finances. it is not that big of a request to ask of congress, especially among gopers. host: the next call is from long island. caller: i wonder what they would think of the chris christie

ticket. i am in tim bishop's district. i do not like him because i think he is too liberal. guest: i think that would be a pretty heavy new york ticket. i am not sure how well that would play. i do think crisscrossed the is a creation of the pundits -- chris is something of the creation of the pundits. if you want a balanced budget, he is your guide. outside of that, i do not think he has much of an appeal. i am not too bullish on his candidacy. guest: he has a way of being very combative with his opponents. i think people have loved seeing him go off to the teachers' -- unions.

it is hard to do that without coming off as nasty or ugly. another thing people genuinely like about him is that he would be nice foil to obama and present himself as being a thoughtful, mature adult -- much like the president obama presented himself during the 2008 election. host: iowa is on the line for democrats. mark, you are on "washington journal." caller: good morning. in general, political reporters

remind me of mosquitoes attracted to the porch light of political celebrity. they like to look at newt gingriches, sarah palins, and mitt romney barbie dolls. i agree with mr. paul on many more issues at this point than the guy i voted for in 2008 which was barack obama. i think if the republican party to have the common sense to nominate him as president, people like me would cross over and vote. host: if the republicans do not nominate mr. paul, would you go back to supporting mr. obama? caller: i would hold my nose and do so. host: talk about potential crossovers. guest: i think you would see a

lot of the support obama had the last time begin to erode. it will depend on whether republicans can have a candidate that will appeal to them and have a cross over to vote for the other side. host: your thoughts on the cross over? guest: i am not optimistic about that. i do not see it as realistic. host: here is a headline about anthony weiner. is this going to have a long- term effect on the presidential campaign? is this strictly local? guest: i do not think it will have much impact on the presidential. it does add to the fury that so many voters have that you have a member of congress -- it is just

predatory behavior. -- that you would be a member of congress, a representative in congress, and have people who have reached out to your in your public capacity. for him to rturn around and behave like this, you not accept this from your teachers and school, your neighbors. to have discipline on in washington is too much for a lot of voters. guest: i do not necessarily disagree with that. i am not sure he should immediately resign and has immediately disqualified himself from serving. there is a lot of credence to the argument. if the voters decide his benefits as a congressman do not outweigh his transgressions, they will vote him out. i did not seek the need for him to get out right away. host: the next call is from michigan on the line for independents..

"washingtonre on co journal." caller: i voted for obama. i am disappointed he did not prosecute some of the bush family. the democrats are reverse robin hooders. a still from the rich to give to the poor. sarah palin seems like she could not make it on who is smarter than a fifth grader. mitt romney made his money doing leveraged buyouts. he borrowed money using the company's assets. the other candidate fired a bunch of people. his claim about creating jobs is ridiculous. guest: i love detroit. i lived out there for about seven years.

it is a fine town. wealthy and successful people in this country pay enormous taxes. i do not know how they are robbing from poor people, but that sounds like detroit. caller: richard is on the line for republicans from hoboken, new jersey. -- host: richard is on the line for republicans from hoboken, new jersey. caller: the former president could connect with average americans. john kerry got more votes than any of the democrat in the history of the presidential race and still lost. the issue with mitt romney has been two things. he is too polished and cannot connect and the ambiguity about his religious beliefs.

guest: i think it is a lot to that. and not think it is bad in politics to change your mind or reconsider your position. if you think mitt romney has done soul-searching and decided he does not like his own health care plan and other things, fine. i think a lot of people see political calculation. at the faith and freedom conference two weeks ago, he showed up and was supposedly going to appeal to the base. tim pawlenty gave a speech a melodic tea party themes. party on typical pete harvtea themes. mitt romney came in and almost give the exact same speech.

he is like this guy that you just pull a string and he spouts out speeches. that is a problem. host: you can follow george zornick on twitter @g zornick. later, we will be talking about the future of opec. coming up, and a discussion on the expansion of job training and initiatives. you are watching "washington journal" on june 12. we will be right back.

the author,month, activist, and her book focusing on native american issues and the environment. also, her latest book. join the three-hour conversation taking your phone calls, emails, and tweets for linda hogan. >> you can find the latest schedule updates online and on twitter. we have programming highlights on our youtube channel. c-span and social media, connect today.

>> this weekend on c-span3, with 20 years after the end of the cold war, a panel reflects on ronald reagan and mikhail gorbachev. professorhopkins t discusses "the promise of suburbia." get the complete weekend schedule at c-span.org/history or have our schedules emailed directly to you. >> "washington journal" continues. guest: karen elzey is here to talk to us about the president's expanding of the job-training initiatives. tell us what is skills for america's future? guest: it is an initiative of the action institute. it focuses on a strengthening

relationships between employers and community colleges. students come out with skills and valued by employers and have opportunities for careers and advancement. host: last week, the president announced an expansion of job training initiatives. tell us what was in the announcement in helmand might help more kids to have -- how that might help more kids to have jobs coming out of college. guest: skills for america's future announced a partnership with nonprofit affiliate of the institute of manufacturers. they're looking at the credentials the manufacturing institute has put together that will allow students to identify and obtain skills necessary to get jobs in advanced manufacturing. we still have 200,000 manufacturing jobs not build this country. we have a skilled miss much. we need to help students

identify what they need to be successful. host: how is this different from what used to be identified as vocational education? guest: we are looking to help community colleges better understand skills that employers will value if you come to them with your present day. -- with your qualifications. this is more from our perspective of how to strengthen those relationships and get employers to talk to the community colleges, help them with their curriculum, help them identify what needs to be taught. they want to get employers to provide more training opportunities to give training theyhe scree

need to be successful. this is an employer-lead focus. that is what is different. about thee talking president's announcement about the expansion of job training initiatives. if you would like to get involved in the conversation, give us a call. if you are looking for a job, have just graduated from junior college and are out there in the job market, give us a call and let us know how things are going. if you are an instructor at a junior college, and definitely give us a call and let us know what is happening in your community. what skills particularly are the students lacking when they come out of junior colleges that is keeping them from getting jobs these days? guest: what we hear for

employers is a variety of things. they do not have enough technical skills or the right technical skills. that is where we need to focus. we have a skills mismatch. we have too many americans unemployed and yet we have 3 million job openings in the united states. somehow we are not getting the right skills necessary that the employers want. but in a couple of interesting things. there is a new job site called jobstart101 looking at the soft skills like conflict resolution, how to create your brand with an appropriate facebook page, dealing with career advancement. that is a self-paced computer program anyone can access for free online. the technical skills around manufacturing, health care, transportation, energy are real areas where we can continue to see high numbers of job

availability and not a big pool of labor willing to apply for those jobs. host: our first call comes from los angeles, california, on the line for republicans. you are on the "washington journal." caller: i think skills for america will not be successful. i.t. to the commune ecology -- i.t. cit a community college. -- i teach at a committee college. the classes have been fooled. -- full. if they decide to exchange an english class for manufacturing have people skilled in manufacturing that can not read well. our jobs have changed. manufacturing has changed.

there are a lot of jobs that require highly skilled people. they pay a lot. the pavement more. lawyers, dentists. -- they pay much more. those of the jobs we should advocate. we should not just go back to manufacturing. they sure look at what jobs create people with the greatest standard of living instead of just saying to keep manufacturing here. guest: that is a great point. we want to focus on a wide variety of career opportunities and look at where we actually have job openings currently in the country. manufacturing happens to be one of them. we also have a large number of health care opportunities available. energy, nuclear power, coal, gas, oil, utilities as a whole have a lot of people retiring. we do not have enough young people or people out of work

changing their skill sets to take advantage of the opportunities. we absolutely do not want people who are just focused on technical skills. we want people who are complete in terms of technical skills and english, history, and other subject. host: debra is up next on the line for democrats. caller: i am graduating from a community college class of 2011. i am a co-op program with a to provide you with an employment opportunity. i feel like once i am on the job, they want me to know everything. they're really just want to give you a bathroom key and used for the job. i think employers need to be more willing to train people. you cannot learn everything in school. host: what is your major? tell us more about the co-op. caller: i am in graphics.

i went back to school to help my daughter pay off personal loans and mind. they have what is considered a good coop. it is $12 an hour for a really good branding firm. i love what i do and where i work. there is not a lot of training. it is kind of sink or swim. you have to ask questions. it is up to me to network. there is not really a path to definite employment after this co-op. i can decide to stay here but that is putting all of my eggs in one basket or i can try to go somewhere else and see what happens there and hope it leads to employment. it is kind of a crapshoot even if you go back into the training. employers need to be more willing to train people for what

they want them to do instead of just saying that you do not have the skills they want walking in the door. it is a co-op internship. those terms are pretty much interchangeable. guest: congratulations on furthering your education. you are right. we want to help employers identify the models of success where employers are very engaged in providing training and giving information about the skills to students of all ages so the students are getting the appropriate information. we're focused on identifying what companies are currently doing and how we can celebrate their work to make sure other companies can replicate the success is to provide more opportunities to individuals across the country. host: in his radio address yesterday, the president talked about the work force initiative.

>> one thing government can do is partner with the private sector to make sure every worker has the necessary skills for the jobs they are applying for. on wednesday, i announced things that will make it possible for 500,000 community college students to get in manufacturing credential that has the industry stamp of approval. if you are a company hiring, you will know that anyone who has a degree has the skills you are looking for. if you are a student considering community college, you know that your diploma will give you a leg up in the job market. on monday, i will travel to north carolina where i will meet with my job skills and talk about additional steps we can take to spur private sector hiring in the short term and ensure our workers have the skills and training they need in this economy. host: karen elzey of skills for america's future, your thoughts? guest: we really need to focus

on public-private partnerships. it is critical to make sure employers have a relationship and working with community colleges and other educational providers to move forward. we just need more of that. host: francis is calling from selma, alabama, on the line for independents. caller: i think it was an effort to make people earlier prepared and well exposed to the variety of career opportunities at the right age. unfortunately, here in my hometown of selma, alabama, the politics of community college and the community at large seemed to affect employers. it has quite a bearing on the

failure of america, selma, and every other place. republicans feel that they can dispose of anybody, at any one, and people are not to be -- i would like to appeal to america as the home of the voters' rights march, the passage of the voters right back. -- act. host: francis, we'll leave it there. karen elzey. guest: we want to make sure all students have opportunity, whether we are talking about high school students, whether we are talking about workers who need retraining, or those who have experienced unemployment. we need everyone to have and it an agitation have that will allow them to take advantage of the opportunities that exist -- an education that will allow them to take advantage of the opportunities

that exist. host: larry, go ahead. caller: the thing that we must really start -- the skills, these kids need to have skills. an indication -- you must be able to do something. our schools have been filling our kids and our parents. kids go to school and it is like day care. if you cannot do something, if you do not have a skill to do something, you will not be compensated. the model of our schools needs to be revamped. it needs to come down to, what can you do? if you are not being skilled or educated to do something, he will not be compensated -- you will not be compensated. host: larry, will leave it there. i wanted to add on to that this piece that was published last

week, talking about skills. "want a better economy? fill skills gap." our economy's fastest-growing sectors include high-tech manufacturing, health care, and new energy, yet many in the skilled trades either lack these skills or retiring without a younger generation trained to fulfill their open slots. guest: we have an incredible possibility for a number of people to be retiring from these industries moving forward. the fact is we do not have enough individuals coming to replace them. we have to look at some of these jobs and utilities, linesmen -- people who are climbing the

utility poles, making sure our air-conditioning is running from a power generator operators -- these are areas where there are openings. we need to get people more aware about the fact that these jobs exist and how you can get there. in the energy, there is a great web sites -- website to look at your energy skills, called getintoenergy.com. host: next up, havre de grace, maryland, go ahead. caller: thank you for the show. it is ironic that c-span has spent more time on job training and many members of the house. i think skills for america does a great job. the community college initiative is important. the fact that when jobs exist for every five workers looking for jobs -- my work ticks me across the country to michigan, oregon, -- takes me across the country to michigan, oregon,

california. i run into people who have the skills, but there are just not jobs. can we talk about filling the jobs, but also, at that time when so many people are on the bench, we clearly need more than what is being done. host: karen elzey? guest: you're absolutely right -- we are not creating jobs fast enough in this country. we also are facing the skills gap. we're graduating individuals who may not have the right skills. they have to do something to better align what is needed in the job market and what people are getting in education and training. host: larry on our line for republicans. caller: thank you for taking my call. i understand what the young lady is saying and i understand what the government is trying to do as far as job creation. i remember back in the 1960's,

when i worked for boeing, and they had a program through colleges and vocational schools. we still have that. the thing that we should look at and bring the congress is, let's bring back our manufacturers, let's lower the tax base to incite them to come back. stop outsourcing american jobs. this is the strongest country with manufacturers. now, we are the weakest country because we do not have that strong manufacturing base. i will listen for comment. guest: thank you for comments regarding manufacturing. i think that why there was an event last week to focus on manufacturing and how the jobs have changed. you are not seeing incredibly large plants anymore. you're seeing smaller facilities with more highly-skilled workers that do require education beyond high school, maybe less than a four-year degree, but a community college

degree or industry-recognized certification. we have to get young people to be aware of what opportunities are so that they can follow the right career path. host: this article talks about the need to create jobs at home and the republicans' plan for job creators. >> the road to refueling our economy and rebuilding jobs means tackling our debt head-on, simplifying the tax code, reining in washington's red tape factory, passing trade agreements, and increasing domestic energy production, making our nation more energy secure, which will help lower costs at the pump and create jobs here at home. these are some of the steps we need to take to get government out of the way and let our economy grow and get back to producing jobs. all of these solutions are in a job-creation plan that republicans put forward not too

long ago. this is what we're calling "a plan for america's job creators," and it builds on the agenda that republicans in the house have been working to implement since americans entrusted us with the majority. host: karen elzey, your thoughts? guest: one of the nice things about skills training is that it is a non-partisan issue. the country, as a whole, believes we need to ensure that individuals have the right skills. the work that skills for america is doing is one part of that. it is not a silver-bullet solution. one aspect is bringing together education providers and companies in the way that is going to help define and better understand what is actually needed. host: our next call comes from providence, rhode island. karen online for independent -- on our line for independents.

caller: good morning. i remember that president clinton created jobs programs to educate people for the new jobs that are going to come, but never came. so many people got degrees in engineering computer science, and they were not employable because they were being displaced, whether through outsourcing or the placement of foreign workers. we have a glut. if we were in desperate need of engineers and i.t. professionals, etc., we would not have so many unemployed. the same thing with nursing. i have read the work of dr. borjas, who has proven that we do not have a worker shortage of any kind. in china, we see that most of these high-tech manufacturing jobs are because of automation not requiring degrees. so much of the work is repetitive.

there are new advances that were made. people were trained on the job. we need apprenticeships. from experience, i have to say that these initiatives only tend to provide jobs for people providemiss elzey -- jobs for people like miss elzey. guest: there has been a lot of research to show that we have a skills shortage -- not a worker shortage. when we talk to industry associations, they say that their members are unable to find the right people at the right time with the right skills to fill their jobs. we really need to make sure that we help individuals understand what those jobs are going to be and not the jobs in the future, but what is available now and how people get the skills now to build upon as they increase their skill attainment to attain

jobs that might be available in the future. host: this is one of the twitter messages. "job training is a way to pretend there are fewer unemployed by creating more debt paying teachers. it is a scam." karen elzey? guest: we're looking at more people going into post-secondary education, trying to identify what their career path is going to be. instead, we're talking about identifying what are the skills, the certifications that employers will require, and then, how did individuals get there. that is through a variety of pathways. host: you are on the "washington journal," with karen elzey of skills for america's future. turn your television down. caller: yes. i would like to say there are a lot of jobs over at the boston

convention center that a lot of these people -- americans can do -- that do not require training. what is going on is they are bringing these farmers in because they can get the tax -- the money back at the end of the year for these people. it's like a front of the house job where somebody is pushing food. that does not require no high school degree or nothing. then people like me, call the congressman, you get no results. i am on the wrong side of the tracks here. host: jerome in boston, mass achusetts. karen elzey? guest: it is important to understand what skills are being required and what employers want. there is an interesting website called myskillsmyfuture.org,

which can help you do that. there is some good information about open jobs. host: if you're looking for more information about the skills for america's future, you can go to the aspen institute web site -- website. georgia, liz, you are on "washington journal." caller: good morning. we have a series of colleges that offer associate's degrees as well as lower credit bearing the potentials of -- credit- bearing credentials. they promised that anybody who comes to their doors will get a job. my question is the same as what rob asked karen. give me an example of a segment of manufacturing and what skills they say are missing. because i am kind of wondering

what specific wins need that they cannot seem to get -- things they need that they cannot seem to get or train people into. here in georgia, we have something called work ready, where everybody is evaluated to see whether literacy level and mathematical level is. then you are certified as work ready. host: liz, we'll leave it there. guest: what we're hearing from employers as a whole, not just manufacturers, being able to read, do basic math -- not oculus, but the ability to actually -- calculus, but the ability to actually learn math and apply it to the current situation, being able to solve problems. a lot of employers have described information in a way that the individual who comes to work needs to be able to assess problems, explain what they have

done to their supervisor, both in oral and written communication, in addition to being able to work in teams, being able to be self- sufficient, showing up on time. some of these skills are also an issue for many employers in terms of work ethics. it is a combination of both. that is why we need employers to be much more specific in terms of what are the skills they are looking for in different types of jobs within their organization. host: carl from san antonio sent us this e-mail. guest: right. i think we have to be really clear. ceta obviously is a federal program. what we're doing is under the auspices of the work force federal investment act.

what we're doing now is a much more specific and targeted effort where we are bringing together, specifically, employers and community colleges in and non-partisan, employer- led initiative. this is a very different approach than being driven by bringing -- training providers. this is have an employer's work with community colleges in such a way that -- having employers work with community colleges in such a way that ups is doing, which really helps. host: las vegas, nevada. go ahead. caller: everything that he mentioned -- it is a very hard task -- you mentioned, it is a very hard task. i graduated with the four-year business administration. through college, i worked at the pizza place and i learned more there than i did a business

school. after college, i did not do much. now, i am attending nursing school at the local community college. i'm almost completed with that. that seems to be working out. what i think america should do now -- not everybody should go to college. not everybody should do that. when i first started, my freshman year, there were -- 90% of the students were all made during in psychology or this, that, and the other -- majoring in psychology or this, that, and the other. they need to figure out what they want to do, set a goal, and then go from there. host: we're running out of time. given what you know now, with hindsight 20/20, would you have skipped the ivy league education and gone straight into nursing training? do you still feel like the ivy league education had some value? caller: i've played golf through

my college career, so i would not have treated it. i got to experience the east coast. i would encourage people nowadays getting out of high school to go ahead and look into that before and, -- before hand, instead of doing any kind of post-high school anything. guest: he raises some good points. we want to be able to identify where the open jobs. what are the skills that are necessary to get advantage of those jobs? how do we connect individual to those skills, old and only to employers, to ensure that people have jobs -- ultimately to employers, to ensure that people have jobs and opportunities to events? that is where we are moving. host: karen elzey is the director of skills for america's future. you can find out for permission about the program on their website, aspeninstitute.org. thank you for being on the

program this morning. when we come back, we'll talk about the future of opec. first, this news update. >> sunday afternoon, c-span radio rears five network talk shows. today, it includes conversations about the middle east. we begin at noon, on nbc's "meet the press," with the debate between debbie wasserman schultz and reince priebus. also on the program, rick santorum. at 1:00 p.m., on abc's "this week," chrysanthemum for talks with the ranking republican member of the senate banking committee, richard shelby, former new jersey governor jon corzine, and former clinton labor secretary robert reich. at 2:00 p.m., on "fox news sunday," hear tim pawlenty. at 3:00 p.m., on cnn "state of the union," a review of tomorrow

night's new hampshire debate with senator kelly ayotte, congressman charles bass, and former new hampshire governor john sununu. finally, at 4:00 p.m., on cbs "face the nation," representative steny hoyer and paul ryan, and senator lindsey graham. it begins at noon with "meet the press," 1:00, "this week," 2:00 , "fox news sunday," 3:00, "state of the union," and, finally, 4:00, "face the nation." >> the ayes are 72, the nays are

16. the nomination is confirmed. >> he was confirmed to succeed justice elena kagan as solicitor general. he is one of more than 100,000 people you can search and watch for free any time on line and are c-span video library. it is washington coming your way -- online at our c-span video library. it is washington, your way. >> on "indepth," linda hogan. her books include -- her latest is "rounding the human corners." sunday, july 3, noon est. on c-span2.

"washington journal" continues. host: kevin book is a co-founder of clear view energy partners. he is here to talk with us about opec and how the current situation in north africa is affecting oil prices. what to the letters stand for? why was it founded? by whom? guest: the oil exporting countries. it was founded in 1960 in a meeting in baghdad. it was formed in emulation of a u.s. organization called the texas railroad commission. the texas railroad commission took over control of oil production in texas because they were worried about producing too much and cratering the price. you have an organization that discovered, in the world thursday for overseas oil, new

import restrictions -- thirsty for overseas oil, new import restrictions. the idea was to maintain revenues. they have a more complete understanding of supply and demand, which means you have to care more about the customer, too. it is about maximizing money to the countries that are producing. host: how was opec government? do the members have an equal say in the governing? guest: the board of governors is open to anyone who was a member. there is one vote for each member. there are 12 full members. it is a simple vote, a simple majority to get things done in opec. it is not a total democracy. he may have one vote, but you may not have the same number of barrels -- you may have one vote, but you may not have the same number of barrels a saudi arabia. there is a non-chartered fact. if opec as seriously astray, --

goes seriously astray, saudi arabia does have the ability to flood the market. it may be about to happen again. host: we have a chart that shows the 12 members of opec and the oil production for 2010. saudi arabia is at the top with 10 million barrels per day, followed by iran, 4.2 million. united arab emirates, just under 3 million barrels per day. kuwait, venezuela, iraq, and major, and paula -- nigeria, angola, algeria, libya, qatar, and ecuador, at the lowest point with .5 barre -- .5 million barrels. they do not seem to be preventing the unnecessary fluctuations. why is that?

guest: i would say that they are not entirely unnecessary. opec's role is one of stabilizing the market. their view -- their mission has broadened to making sure that the buyers never stop. they want to eliminate price the volatility by buffering supply. opec provides a key role in preventing prices from going too high. what is different from 10 years ago is that the energy-demand growth in some nations is so rapid and brisk that it does not necessarily matter what the primary buyers in the world -- we're still the biggest buyer in the world in the u.s., but we are not the biggest grower. world demand will grow, even if we have a significant contraction. what that means is their ability to play the best and manage price in that fashion -- placate us and manage price in that fashion is considerably less as a result.

host: we're talking with kevin book, " founder and managing director of clearview -- co- founder and managing director of clearview. you can send us e-mails or messages via twitter. if you're in the oil business, we would love to hear from you. tell us about the effect of the fluctuation of oil by players outside of opec, particularly canada, russia, in china, i guess. guest: the first two have one of fact, that another. canada became a significant producer in the last five years to 10 years. it was never going to be in the money at $40 per barrel. suddenly, it looks really good at $60.

they are ramping up and continuing to do so. russia has succeeded as an export nation and is still ahead right now. the recent russian oil production is a threat to opec is because russia and other former soviet states are essentially after the otc -- oedc coun -- essentially, after the oedc countries, the third- largest producer. china is actually declining. there significant importers. they have to continue ramping up imports. russia could, at any given time, be called upon and deliver oil that opec might wish to withhold from the market. on the other hand, if russia does not deliver and opec does, china will buy from whoever is. it is a three-way balancing act. opec does not want to retrace

too much, because russia could capture that opportunity. host: is the impact from china and russia and canada so big that it would not allow them to be members of opec, or have they just not been allowed an invitation to join the club? guest: the club has a 1960 charter which says you have to be sympathetic to the missions of the member countries, your net exporter of petroleum. you want to be part of the club. russia -- there have been moments where we have been close to what i call "ropec" -- russia eye.opec, eye-to0- the canadian market is delighted to have the oil. they have the refineries that can use it. they have no reason to join opec at this time. they would probably have a very tough time meeting the second

test, being simpatico with the missions of the organization. host: our first call for kevin book comes from st. petersburg, florida. michael. caller: thank you for taking my call. we focus so much on oil in this country. when are we going to start really focusing on hunkering down on going to green technologies, renewables? there was a wonderful documentary on going grain. -- green. they have algae that turns plant matter into usable fuels. they have cards that they can use that will synthesize energy. when are we going to start doing this in this country and really

focusing on the things that are important? host: kevin book? guest: it is a great question. we have been looking at alternatives. effectively, 1973, the embargo, and efforts -- serious efforts began that started to make a difference. we wanted to be safe. we put together the strategic petroleum reserve. we wanted to become more efficient. the first national mandate for fuel economy came out, and it did make a big difference to consumption. fast forward to where we are now. we have had a number of significant initiatives. increase in the ethanol from essentially 88 million gallons per year in 1980 to 13 billion gallons per year in our fuel supply. most of that happened in the last few years. not everyone thinks of ethanol as a green fuel, but that is someone that you can debate, with facts on your side.

are making some modest increases. problem is that you need a big solution to tackle supply of this bill. host: next up -- this scale. host: next up, robert, go ahead. caller: i am wondering why we do not have our own hard shale, such as canada, mexico, the united states -- maybe some sympathetic countries -- and they would put the opec people back quite a bit, bring forth cheaper prices throughout the entire world. thank you. guest: it is a great question, because we do have one. it is called the international energy agency. it is comprised of the oedc nations to put together strategic reserves. -- who put together strategic reserves. one thing you will hear is, why don't we draw down our strategic

reserves? it is a powerful tool. we have 700 million barrels. globally, more than 2.5 billion barrels that we can source. cannot run the world on our safety blanket, but we can make things difficult. it is a powerful negotiating tool. the notion that we can be a demand cartel has also been discussed. that is not so possible anymore. we're not the largest demand growth. there have been efforts to talk about what if we could make enough oil or substitutes on our own to make opec less relevant? the problem again is one of volume. we have an organization that works. it has its own board of governors and works in a similar fashion. it is what i would call "and inconvenient truce -- "an inconvenient truce."

host: was that preserve most recently tapped -- when was that reserve most recently tapped? guest: there have been small swap exchanges happening all the time. there have been about 17 draws since it was created, 34 overtly political budget-reducing reasons, one as a test, flexing -- 3 for overtly political budget-reducing reasons, one as a test, flexing our muscles in negotiating. they have refined products in their reserves. when something happens in the u.s., there is the opportunity for them to read these reserves to help us. we just have crude oil, the per -- to release those reserves to help us. we just have crude-oil.

interestingly, we did not have any response to the loss of capacity from libya. host: what is the response from opec when we do draw on the strategic reserve? guest: air is a difference between -- there is a difference between when they can draw on the reserve easily, like now, and a difference between when they cannot. if they can rise to the occasion, they are generally responsive -- anecdotally. they have responded to the gentle or perhaps not so gentle jawboning and ramped up supply, either through saudi arabia, or as an -- saudi arabia or as an aggregate group. there is a potential significant loss of revenue.

they aren't happy about it. host: you are on the "washington journal" with kevin book of clearview energy partners. caller: opec's suppose a reserve numbers went crazy between 1985 and -- supposed reserve numbers went crazy between 1985 and 1990. saudi arabia has reported 216 billion barrels of oil from 1990. for 20 years, they have never changed their supposed reserves. iraq is sort of the same thing. 110 million barrels. they have fought two wars over the last 20 years. they have very little increase exploration and drilling because of sanctions, yet their numbers never, ever change. have this implicit assumption that these numbers -- every

year, sort of like, i am taking oil or money out, but my balance never changes. it does not make any logical sense. i do not really believe saudi arabia has the oil -- or the other opec members, for that matter, for the last 20 years they have been reporting. i second quick question -- i would like to comment on that. it is about people i have been studying. -- peak oil. i have been studying. iran reached peak oil in 1974. the united kingdom in 1999. there are a lot of people, geologists, veterans, folks who know the industry, who believe that by 2008 or 2012 or 2015 -- there is a consensus. when can we expect it?

thank you. guest: two common questions. i am happy to answer them both. on the reserve numbers -- there are a couple of ways to think about how price works in the world. traders think about what could be produced to versus what is being produced. there is also global spare capacity, not what is reserved, but what could be produced and introduced into supply and price. spare capacity and price are the numbers that matter more than reserves. reserve members tend to be a bit of a comparison between men in an unflattering way in the back room somewhere. -- in a bathroom somewhere. you do not want to find more reserves and introduced fear of supply in the traders' equations. you would rather stand pat at 216 million barrels and let

others say 116 million. you woul probablyd lose if you told -- you would probably lose if you told the traders that there was more supply. the actual molecular peak is a long way off. we are still well below half of the oil resources in the earth's crust. what is changing is the definition. the conventional definition -- we stop using the conventional techniques. things that were on dimensional one first on a by the government are now common -- things that were unconventional at first are now commonplace. there is no peak.

in the u.s., we are rising again in production, but it is not conventional oil. there is a bit of an intellectual, but not a practical people that we have reached -- peak that we have reached. we're still a long way off from the real, practical peak. host: 7 book is the co-founder and managing director of clear -- kevin book is the co-founder and managing director of clearview energy partners. our next call comes from fayetteville, n.c., ronald. you are on the air. caller: i have a couple of questions for mr. book. i find it funny how the gas prices just went up during the bush administration, when you have and will family in the white house -- an oil family in the white house and the price president who is heavily

invested -- vice president who is heavily invested in oil. you do not think it may have something to do with us going around the world, flexing our muscles, and causing other nations to just not play ball with the united states of america? i will take your answer offline. thank you. guest: thank you, ronald. the easy thing to do is say this is simple and there is only one explanation. if there were only one explanation, i would have a lot more time at home. there are better explanations and worst explanations. on september 11, 2001, something happened that created new geopolitical risks. it destabilized the supply side, at least a little bit, and changed world prices in the with the people thought about it -- oil prices in the way that

people thought about it. you would not have introduced a significant alternative to the gas supply. we went from 2% ethanol to 9.5% ethanol during the bush years, by his own design. host: is there a line that can be drawn between the fluctuation in the price of a barrel of oil and the price that people pay at the gas pump? and what is that connection, if there is such? guest: there is not really a line. there are a lot of weird connection that the people on capitol hill very can see -- very antsy. simple math, 42 gallons per barrel. take a barrel price of about $100 and divide that by 42. add in a little bit for shipping.

18.4 since for federal tax. the state averages about 20 cents. then the sometimes small -- not so small -- refining margin. it explains it very simply on the website. the relationship of how they move can be very different. the oil that is of the highest quality turns into gasoline at the lowest price. if there are easy ways to make that, refiners will take them to get the most money out. the high-quality oil, the price to priced, they tend well above, sometimes $20 from $30, $40, above the lower- quality -- sometimes $20, sometimes $30, sometimes $40 above the lower-quality oil. as we see prices rise, does the refinery fleet of the world refined -- rise in complexity so

it can process the lower-quality oil we have a lot of? there is a bit of a disconnect because of the refinery quality. it takes two weeks to four weeks for news applied it to the u.s., whether it is gasoline or crude -- for new supply go get to the u.s., whether it is gasoline or crude. no one likes to see a $4 or $5 decline in the oil price on tv, then go to the pump and to the same damn price day after day. the person who runs the service station has to make a choice -- and do i have the money to buy the next cargo? he is trying to manage his capital to run his business. it does not make a lot of money at the margins. if the prices down, he runs the risk of not having enough money for the next cargo or he is grabbing market share from the next guy and prices will fall.

the term is "rises like a rocket, falls like a feather." moverices do not always at the same time in the same direction. host: where is the quality between the high-quality that you explained and the lower- quality -- where is the quality of the guelleh come from the middle east and north africa -- of the oil that comes from the middle east and north africa? guest: there are very different. africa sells mostly what would be called -- their are two skills -- there are two scales. api gravity. the standard in the u.s. is 39 api gravity. and the question is how much sulfur or contaminants it has. ours tends to be sweeter.

what you have in north africa, algeria, libya, a very high- quality oil. that is what your password -- what europe has relied on, because they have lower-quality for refineries. our economy is not doing so hot. there is an increasing disconnect between the faster- growing economies using the higher-quality oil and the slower-growing economies using lower-quality oil. host: art, you are on the "washington journal" with kevin book of clearview energy partners. caller: the future of nuclear energy -- we have been using this for 55 years. we have had three incidents, three mile island -- no one got killed.

fukushima daiichi -- where no one has gotten killed. and chernobyl, a communist country at the time. why are we not using more of that? that is my first question. second, it is saudi arabia -- if iran arebaia and such bitter enemies, why aren't the saudis pumping up production to influence behavior of iran? guest: two great questions. we did not use oil anymore in the u.s. to make power. the easy answer to why aren't we more excited and of nuclear power is priced. -- more excited about nuclear power is price. prices can be high. there is a big risk.

more centralized government that can source funds on a non- private bases using public money will see more nuclear power construction. the arrests have been very low, generally. the soviet -- the risks have been very low, generally. this is recognized as an -- an outlier.n = people get scared by something that can contaminate large swaths of land. if you own it for long enough, very cheap, expensive up front, scary to people who do not understand it. as for the iran-saudi conflict, they are conflicts -- iran has the titular, rotating presidency for opec.

it is typical in the oil- exporting nations that the president will say something not so favorable to the united states very publicly. in the petroleum minister will say, quietly, it is ok, we're still your friend. we are still a buyer. ahmadinejad decided he would try to be both people at once and he attended the opec meeting. iran has taken warships to the mediterranean. they sent soccer players to a world cup qualifying match -- the male soccer players -- female soccer players, not in the approved headdresses. iran has to manage a budget and slowing oil to the exclusion of profitability could hurt their economy at a time when the arabs bring has made things a little -- arab spring has made things a

little tender for them. host: how many of these decisions are made by ahmadinejad? how much of it comes from the religious leaders? guest: you could ask that about every physician in iran -- a decision in iran. there was a time when that presidency was relatively symbolic. since ahmadinejad rose to power, it has been changing rather dramatically. there are several public-private enterprises in iran that are called -- oh, gosh, i forgot the names. they will coem back to m -- come back to me. they are effectively running for the islamic republic as an ecclesiastical state-leadership entity. they do a lot of the business.

the national oil company of iran is still, essentially, under sovereign control come increasingly of the president's, less, as it used to be, in control of the mullahs. host: the arab spring has cauwsed -- caused a disruption to libya's oil production. because libya is ninth on the list of 12 of the oil-producing nations in opec, why is there such a focus on the oil that is not coming out of libya right now? the 2010 production level, 1.7 million barrels per day, as opposed to the 10 million barrels per day out of saudi arabia and all the countries in between. it seems almost negligible. guest: it goes back to the quality discussion. libya has got the good stuff. theirs is a high-quality oil. it is relatively sweet.

it works well in the refineries. it was a huge export product italy -- to italy for their national consumption. a change the balance of oil in the world in terms of the quality -- it changed the balance of oil in the world in the terms of quality spectrum. that does a lot to inflate the price. host: our next call comes from richmond, virginia. don on our line for democrats. don? let's move on to jackson, mississippi. james, go ahead. caller: in the news media, tv, paper, i keep hearing -- i am not -- not oil produced --

chevron filed a permit to build a reserve, yet they were turned down by the energy department because of carbon emission problems. we can't fill in the national park. when you look at it, it's nothing but wasteland. we can't go off the coast of florida. yet the chinese are drilling less than 90 miles away for cuba. we do not have an energy policy in the country. host: kevin book? guest: the conflict between energy policy and environmental policy is significant in this country. we have a lot of resources that we could potentially exploit. as a nation, for a variety of

reasons of the years, we have decided not to. you might say and i would agree that it sounds weird that we would keep that oil for the care of blue in -- the caribou in alaska. when you look at the size of the resource, the gulf of mexico is many times the size of the anwar resource and a lot closer to the refineries that might use it. as to the unconventional supply, the shale oil was utilize significantly by the -- utilized significantly by the 2005 act. it is not necessarily competitive. you will see more of it. there is a lot of interest from our investor clients in doing it. the carbon footprint is not flattering. a lot of hydrocarbons, right in

the center of the country -- they need a lot of water for production. water is not always the easiest thing to get there. host: next up, alison, you are on the "washington journal." caller: thank you for taking my call. do you think it would be a wake- up call if we created a mass- transit system, saving a significant amount of vehicles off of the road? more people would be able to venture out from their residence to seek employment opportunities. thank you. guest: that is another perennial question. you are asking about a societal change for america, a company -- country where we idolize the open road. it is a place -- is it a place

where we can live as they do in japan and continental europe using a heavy reliance on public transit? price issues, right away issues, quality of life issues -- right- of-way issues, quality of life issues. there is no surety that it would say be that much. the cato institute argues that it is more expensive and does not promote significant will security for the price. whether or not we will do it is a different question and has to do with how much money we will spend. things are looking very tight and tightly contested. whether or not it would be a good solution, we might have to wait years to find out. host: tim on our line for republicans. caller: thank you for answering my call. host: yeah, go ahead, tim.

caller: my question is, i just want to note, the diesel fuel -- to know, the diesel fuel. why is diesel so high? that has an effect on our economy. host: all right, tim, we'll leave it there. guest: great question. that goes to the question of what happens when you turn oil into refined products. you have a very dense compound, oil. you heat it up and subjected to chemical processes. one of the process -- products is diesel, a middle distillate. we use diesel for jets -- for

freight. we export a lot of diesel. diesel and middle distillates are much more sought-after. there is greater demand for those. kerosine-type jet fuel. heating oiols. -- oils. that is where the prices higher globally -- why the prices are higher globally. host: the opec meeting is being written up as one of the most acrimonious and least productive meetings in recent history. why is that? guest: i think a lot of people expected opec to say, we care about the customer, we will increase production. there is a lot happening. you can blame speculators. i am sure you will see that before the summer is out. people are betting on next

year's scarcity. there is a problem of intractable demand in the growing nations and recovery of demand in the u.s. and western europe. when you make more oil and put it on to of a market -- out onto the market -- you need a simple majority, 7-5 would have been enough. you got a 6-6 tie. a number of nations would have been expected to say no -- iran, venezuela. algeria is making a lot of money selling into the absence of libyan oil. their self-interest is well understood. it did not reach the outcome that the biggest player in the opec wanted. that is essentially the notion that the saudis wanted -- to sell into this market and try to give the assurance of supply now

to protect against fear of scarcity later. host: we have been talking with kevin book about the future of opec. if you want to find out more, you can look up their organization, clearview and the partners. thank you for being on the program. we'll have a discussion tomorrow with dr. anthony fauci about the challenges of trying to control and end the hiv/aids epidemic. we will talk with peter pantuso. some members of congress have called for increased safety standards for a tour bus operators in the wake of recent crashes in new york, virginia, and washington. we will finish up today with robert