fact that there are indeed millions of peace-loving arabs who resent the brutal oppression of their leaders' dictatorships and long for a future of freedom and peace. these uprisings are tremendous opportunities for the advancement of freedom and democracy in the middle east. at the same time these developments are fraught with danger, and bring with them the possibility that radical islamist factions will capitalize on the upheaval and take control. our commitment to condemning and confronting terrorism in the world must be matched by an equal commitment to affirm the efforts of oppressed arab citizens who are taking extraordinary risks to seek true peace, freedom, and democracy. both in the cases of the iranian and syrian popular uprisings, the obama administration's glaring silence has undermined the strength of our commitment to freedom and solidarity with those peoples who are yearning to breathe free. and every terrorist group in the

world takes note of that silence whether hamas, hezbollah, or terrorist regimes like iran. there are nine specific policy proposals i would like to leave with you tonight. first, as a demonstration of this new resolve, the united states should move the american embassy in israel to jerusalem. [applause] [cheers and applause] israel has every right as a sovereign free nation to choose

its own capitol and we should respect that choice. [applause] as president, on my first day in office, i would issue an executive order directing the u.s. embassy in israel to be moved to jerusalem as provided for in the legislation i introduced in congress in 1995. [applause] , the united states must also refuse to participate in any talks involving terrorist organizations and cut off all direct and indirect aid to

terrorists and their front groups. this must include the palestinian authority, so long as it includes hamas and continues to produce propaganda lionizing suicide bombers and promoting the destruction of israel. [applause] we should also call on other nations who are ostensibly committed to true peace between israel and the palestinians to do the same. 3, the united states should also explicitly reject the concept of a "right of return" for palestinian refugees. [applause] the so-called right of return is a historically impossible demand that would be a demographic disaster and mean the end of a jewish state of israel. we are for a right to prosperity, a right to freedom, a right to the rule of law, and a right to private property.

we must be totally opposed to a right of return. [applause] this means that the palestinian refugee problem must be resolved outside the borders of israel by the palestinian government afte the united nations camp system must be replaced with a system of earned income and property rights to restore dignity and hope to every palestinian. the current, failed camp system of socialism and unearned charity has been a disaster. it has led to poverty, vast unemployment, deep bitterness and a society which produces entrepreneurs of terrorism rather than entrepreneurs of wealth creation. [applause] more money in the form of international aid will not solve this problem. a new approach will bring a

better standard of living and greater freedom and security for palestinians than all the terrorist efforts and dictatorships have been able to achieve. [applause] that, -- fifth, we must also re-establish the united states information agency as a robustly funded worldwide anti-terrorism and pro-freedom communications and advocacy system. the usia fought for our side in the war of ideas during the cold war and helped us win. in 1999, this agency was dismantled because we thought the war of ideas was over. we discovered on 9/11 that it was not. israel is reminded of this on almost a daily basis. earlier this year, terrorists of the al aqsa martyr's brigade broke into the west bank home of udi and ruth fogel in itamar. the terrorists stabbed this

husband and wife to death. they murdered three of their children. not even the youngest of these children, a three-month-old baby girl named hadas, was spared. they slit the child's throat, and severed her head from her body. in gaza, crowds handed out candy and celebrated. this sickening display of jubilation at the gruesome murder of a three-month-old child is the result of decades upon decades of brainwashing palestinian children. it is an example of the kind of barbaric acts of terror that must be rejected by all palestinians in any peace negotiation with israel. [applause] the usia helped america win the cold war and it can help us win

the war against evil terrorist organizations and dictatorships. but to do this we must ensure that the usia once again has independent board of governors reporting to the president and coordinating with the state department but not controlled by the diplomats. [applause] never again should a three- month-old baby be killed without the entire world being repulsed and joining together in condemning such terrorists and their supporters. [applause] sixth, we must aggressively confront the growing threat of a nuclear-armed iran. the existence of the iranian regime pursuing nuclear weapons and financing terrorism across the globe is a primary threat to the security of the united

states, israel and our allies in the world. the united states must lead the world in an all-out effort to replace the iranian dictatorship using the diplomatic, economic, information, political, and covert tools president reagan used to defeat and dismantle the soviet empire. [applause] seventh, the united states must also establish an aggressive new strategy of taking back the united nations from the forces of terrorism and dictatorship. [applause] totally discrediting and, if possible, stopping the durban 3 conference on racism later this year the previous two sessions of which have been used as a vehicle for anti-semitism --

should be an early goal of this new worldwide campaign. furthermore, the united states must be prepared to suspend all funding to the united nations if the general assembly moves to -- [laughter] [applause] [cheers and applause] let me repeat this, but this was secretary of state jim baker's @ bayh steve george h.w. bush in 1999 in a similar situation. the united states must be prepared to suspend all funding

to the united nations if the general assembly moves to recognize a palestinian state under the control of hamas. eighth, all of this will require a restructured state department, a new level of training and management for ambassadors, a new promotion system, and a profound shift in the culture of the foreign service. [applause] the quickest way to change the culture at the state department is to inject new blood into the system. we must engage in fundamental reform of the overly slow and bureaucratic security clearance system to raise the level of applicants to the foreign service. change on this scale will be bitterly fought by the old guard at state and their media allies. it will require a strong, experienced, and knowledgeable secretary of state and a deeply

committed team around him. my campaign website newt.org contains a detailed document outlining the other changes that will be necessary to transform the state department's historic aversion to moral clarity about the difference between terrorism and civilization, which have weakened both the united states and israel. [applause] finally, the united states must establish an american energy policy designed to strengthen our national economy and weaken our opponents in the middle east. by keeping in the united states the hundreds of billions of dollars we now spend on foreign oil supplies. we must dramatically increase

american energy supplies so we can lower the marginal cost of energy worldwide. nothing will do more to alter the strategic balance of power away from dictatorships and state sponsors of terror than a successful american energy policy. [applause] in closing, if it were possible to say a word directly to the israeli people, it would be this -- we believe together with you that peace is possible, and that peace ultimately will come to israel. the never-ending tendency to blame israel first is just another variation of blame america first, and it springs from the same weakness. it is far easier to ignore an unpleasant reality and try instead to impose your will on somebody you think you can control, rather than deal with

the unpleasant reality that you are too timid to confront. if israel disarmed today, there would be no israel tomorrow. but if iran, hamas, hezbollah and other terrorist groups disarmed today, then tomorrow we would have peace in the middle east. while our challenge today will likely not meet with such a simple solution, our commitment to israel's protection remains as staunch as it has been from the moment of israel's birth. and i would also say this to the brave people of israel -- never, ever underestimate the hold that israel has on the american heart. [applause]

the american people have always believed in israel, and we believe in israel still. together, we will renew our mutual commitment to freedom and justice, and we will work to achieve a peace in which war and bloodshed and violence are no longer a common feature of life for you and your children. on june 30, 1936, when abyssinia was being invaded by italy, emporer haile selassie appealed to the league of nations assembly for assistance. he said -- "it is us today. it will be you tomorrow." we know that if the forces of terrorism could eliminate israel today, they would turn toward america tomorrow. that is why we must reverse the obama administration's dangerous policies of incoherence and accommodation and implement instead a foreign

policy that is clear about the evil that we face and committed to the actions necessary to overcome it. america is still the last best hope of mankind on earth. i believe like ronald reagan did that the goal of u.s. foreign policy must be the promotion of peace. but that it must be a real peace where freedom can flourish and justice can prevail, not a false peace that emboldens terrorists, tyrants and murderous ideologies to extend their evil throughout the world. it is toward this possibility of real peace that america must commit itself. no other nation in the history of the world has been so inexorably tied to the fate of freedom throughout the world. the time has come to reaffirm america's commitment to freedom

and the rule of law, to stand firmly and courageously against terrorism and evil organizations and dictatorships. it is time to stand firmly with our friends. together those of us who believe in freedom will defeat tyranny for the fourth time in a century. together we will earn for our children and grandchildren a freer and safer world. this is our duty. this is our generation's rendezvous with destiny. thank you. god bless you. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2011] thank you very much.

thank you very much. >> little blocker andrew breitbart also spoke for 15 minutes. >> anyone under 18 must leave the room based on current events that need to be discussed. i will wait for 10 seconds. please leave the room. i want to thank the republican jewish coalition. i have been to events held here, not in the steam rooms, but in the bart downstairs. i get this date to describe for free, but a lucrative alliance we have created. [laughter] why is this night different?

[laughter] from all other nights? well, on this night the american political agenda is held hostage by a schmuck. [applause] i see that the press left. they are afraid of me. for those last holdouts, you may not know who i am. [laughter] i am that gentleman who packed the congressman's computer two weeks ago. not particularly good at pr, as congressman weiner. i'm a lot more apathetic than he

actually thinks. if he had come to me, i could have given him advice because i started to feel sorry for him. everything you're doing is exactly wrong. one, the could have said this is just another example of jew on jew crime. [laughter] i what that had to apologize for the cycle of violence. i think the best pr advice i could give him, given the circumstances in san francisco, is that u.s. tried to demonstrate the virtues of circumcision against the anti- circumcision lot there. [applause] i am not going to blow blew all night. i come here with that purpose.

i was far mets lead -- bar mit zvahed 20 years ago. i was kicked out of hebrew school. i kid you not. iraq feeling -- by rabbi for healing. i think that is the battle -- that is where the battle with me started with the liberal jewish community. [applause] i am so glad i spoke out of turn in hebrew school. and i remember my father, gerald breitbart, around the same era, the last time we went to university, senator dodd, i remember him calling me we are getting the out of here. and that is when rabbi freeling

supported jesse jackson after calling new york hymietown. i think my father for having that common sense that i use today instead of the stupid to agree i got from tulane, which was basically moral relativism, and that somehow the jews were the oppressors and the arab- israeli crisis. i said, this does not make sense to me. this does not make sense to me. i like to see that videotape. i just do not understand how those inherently be sent and free people could be the bad guys. never made sense to me. never made sense to me. i am glad i became a journalist because i want to fight on the behalf of the israeli people. i have been there and the israeli people, i adore and i

love. for those in journalism schools that teach neutrality and objectivity, that is on par with the moral relativism that they teach in the humanities department. you cannot be objective when it comes to right and wrong. israel is in the right. [applause] i am a biased journalist and i have a great time doing it. i think that we are starting to win. i think that the mainstream media no longer all -- no longer has the potential to hijack the american narrative. my goal is to create a web site called big jerusalem, so that what israel has to deal with is actually worse than what conservatives in america have to deal with when it comes to media bias. not only did they have to deal

with the inherent media bayh's against the americans, they have to deal with the inherent media bayh's of the international media. when israel is in the right, when something is transpiring in the media, they are immediately called the hacker, just like i was two weeks ago. then they have to undo the damage done by the mainstream media. that is why i have created a media enterprise, the sole goal is not just to tell the truth. i take stores that are politically incorrect, that the mainstream media does not want to hear, and i do not just been them against the objects, whether acorn or congressman wiener, or hamas. i aimed it at the mainstream media. if you're not going to cover this truth every second that you do not, you will look more

stupid and you will lose more viewers and more subscribers. and that business model has worked quite well. [applause] so i am a biased journalist. hopefully, more people will join the fray, because this is a citizen movement, to take on abc, cbc, and nbc, and bbc, and in new york times and the mainstream media. i call up the democratic media alliance, the liberal interest risk groups. it is the matrix. i think that the matrix will go down within the next five years. all fully something more fair and equitable will come as a result of it. i want to give you some advice. i am constantly under attack and i love it. etishize it.

i do not take pictures of my untenable and send them to teenagers. i'd fight the media. that is my fetish. [laughter] over the last two years, i'd join something in in berkeley -- not in a bird life. i was asked to go to the first tea party on april 15 down in orange county. i went down there, not because -- i do not have a paul revere out that at home. or ben franklin garb. what am i going to talk about? that day, the mainstream media after eight years of supporting any anti-bush get together, whether they supported the anti-

too stuff in seattle where people would break and through trash cans into starbucks, there was not an act by a protester that was not offended by the mainstream india as patriotic. for eight years, that is all that we got. and after 9/11 -- i mean, after the election of president obama, people who had a patriotic bumper stickers, who basically turned treason and sedition into something hit and rolling stone-y, this group of people said let's return to our founding principles, the constitution and fiscal responsibility, values that everyone in this room, i hope, hold dear. and the bold, bold, bald people decided to go out there. and the first thing that the evil democrat media complex did was accused them of being

racist, sexist, homophobic, and janet napolitano of -- no crotch shot, madam secretary -- she said that this was a potentially violent group. i said it now. i stood by them and the mainstream media has waged a jihad against the tea party. there would not have been a 2010 election without the -- without we the people standing up and saying enough is enough. [applause] that outside of the beltway spirit is what has helped save the republican party, it has saved the conservative movement, and i am demanding that you join this movement in order to change it, to make it more representative of the whole

of the american people. these people love you, they loved israel. this is the american people. do not allow the mainstream media to destroy that which is good about the american experience. these people deserve your support. please join the tea party movement. [applause] and this is not an endorsement of former gov. sarah palin. but i remember the first time i caught wind of this gal, this heroic, heroic governor to have an 88% approval rating because she took on the corrupt republican party of alaska and the big oil sitting on those oil reserves that there were leasing, and they wanted to sit on them until oil went up to one hour to $20, and she took on the establishment. that is what the american people want. i remember the first picture i

saw of her. she boldly displayed a for a lack of israel. -- flag of israel. she is willing to stand by israel and by you. would you support her for the presidency, you should stand by her when the evil democrat media complex goes out and tries to destroy her. they blamed her for tucson. as they were kicking her while she was on the ground, she shrieked, this is a blood libel, and they attacked her for that. that is precisely what a blood libel is. thank god for alan dershowitz in me said lead to a vast immediately standing beside her despite the fact that he was a liberal democrat. we have a long road to hoe, i seriously mean that. i am willing to have -- to live

half of my year in israel to say if israel goes, so goes america. this is cynicism journalism. schoolot have j- types working for me. i have salt of the earth working for me. i actors and comedians writing for me. i have got researchers from god knows where that i have never met whose passion it is to do what is right, to save this country, the same freedom, liberty, and to do that is saving freedom and liberty in israel. i am not just asking you to join the tea party. i am asking you to join this new media revolution. that is what is going to save this country. it is what saved israel, because at the end of the day, the

reason we're in this peril it because we allow the american narrative and the israeli narrative to be hijacked by the media. and this is the end of their time right now. we are the solution to the problem. thank you very much. [applause] >> in a few moments come ahead of the national institute of allergy and infectious diseases on the treatment of hiv/aids in the 30 years is the first reported cases. and about 45 minutes, a hearing on improving bus safety. after that, we will re-air the comments of newt gingrich and andrew breitbart. one of our guests on tomorrow

morning's "washington journal," falcon representative jason chaffetz. he will take your questions about military actions in libya and troop withdrawal from afghanistan. audrey singer of the brookings institution will outline a new report on a highly skilled in mint -- immigrant population. it will focus on the national labor relations board with charles craver from george washington university. "washington journal" is live on c-span every day at 7:00 a.m. eastern. >> the supreme court is now available as a standard and enhanced e-book, and tells the story of the court from the eyes of the justices themselves. 11 interviews with current and retired justices. with the enhanced e-book, at your expense by watching multimedia clips from all the justices. "the supreme court" available

wherever e-books are sold. >> now the head of the national institute of allergies and infectious diseases. on efforts to treat hiv/aids in the 30 years is the first reported cases. this is 45 minutes. as a public service. >> "washington journal" continues. host: joining us is a anthony fauci dr. of the national institute of infectious disease. 30 years since the first reported case of hiv aids. where are we today? guest: we have made progress, but historically the profile has been devastating. just short of 70 million people infected. about 30 million people have died. 34 million people are living with hiv throughout the world. 2.6 -- 2.6 million infections each

year. it is still a very important public gold -- public global healthcare problem. when i was taking care of hiv patients in the early 1980's, if someone came into a hospital people had median survival rate -- people had median survival rates that were measured in months. you could predict that they would live an additional 50 years. the problem is that in many parts of the world, it is still out of control. host: that is worldwide? caller: in the united states we have 56,000 new cases each year. 1.1 million americans are infected. one of the real issues is that about 20% do not know it. those are the ones who are

disproportionately infecting other people. they do not even realize it. currently one of the real pushes is to be very aggressive in seeking out and voluntarily testing people. host: why are more people not getting tested? caller: -- guest: people feel they are essentially not at risk. that they have other problems in the life. they are part of the disenfranchised group of individuals. it is the reason we need to keep pushing to get people tested. host: how does the number track over the last 30 years? caller: in europe -- guest: in the early days we were having a very concentrated and uncontrolled outbreaks. we are down to 56,000 per year, but it is still a high number.

very bad. we have got to get that curve back down. host: where is the government's role in the research and treatment? guest: huge. if you look at the fundamental research that has been done but has been primarily funded by the national institute of health, over the last 30 years they have spent cumulatively about a co love $5 billion in research on hiv. host: our guest with us this morning, if you want to ask him questions, for republicans, 202- 624-1115. for democrats, 202-624-1111. for independents, 202-624-0760. journal@c-span.org is the e- mail. you can send us a twitter

twitter.com/c-spanwj. what are the cities with the highest rates? guest: we are sitting right in the middle of the city with the highest rate. washington, d.c. it is extraordinary. about 6% of african-american males are infected. it really varies greatly. the bigger cities have more. particularly cities that have higher concentrations of men that have sex with men. host: yuri, pa., go ahead. caller: good morning, gentlemen. i am a nurse practitioner. i am glad you have said would to have said.

the majority of the people in -- of the people infected in 2009 were male to male. very few from drug use. the second category, heterosexual, there were more women than men. if you look at the race, sadly, half were african-american. until you start addressing the fact that this is a preventable disease that is largely fit -- due to uncommitted heterosexual and homosexual relationships, we will not have any progress. can you address how much we pay for each person per year on these drugs? it is devastating that we are not getting to the point where we need to encourage people to

engage in committed sexual relationships and get back to funding education. guest: the caller makes a great point. there is a great disparity in this country. 12% of the u.s. population is african-american and close to 50% of the new infections are in the community. there are a variety of reasons. economic conditions. the real lack of acceptance, or stigma, against men that have sex with men in the african- american community. much more generally a accepted by caucasians. there is a great deal less stigma and they do none allow themselves to have the same discussions that go on in other sections of the community.

i was just in new york last week. commemorating the anniversary of the first anniversary of aids, it became clear that we could not treat our way out of the epidemic. treatment had to be a major modality. strikingly, it was shown about one month ago that if you treat an individual who is infected early in the course of their disease, not only is it beneficial for the individual but it remarkably decreases the likelihood that that person will transmit the infection to their uninfected sexual partner in a heterosexual setting. treatment becomes a part of upper setting. fundamental modalities to get people under treatment who are

infected. host: then how do you deliver that message? guest: you get out in the community with targeted messages. we know the higher risk categories. you have got to target your message to those individuals to make it seem homogeneous. it helps it to look politically correct, but it is not really the case. you have got to get community workers out in the community and get them tested in council. that is what we are doing in washington, d.c. we are working with a study that is linked to the south bronx, which has a similar demographic profile. close call -- host: manhattan, damien, independent mind.

caller: but the last caller said it is not realistic. i have been diagnosed since 1993. i have been self-destructive. my count went down the 160. my doctor -- new medication -- healthy as i can be. i agree that the infection rate -- chances -- host: color, you are breaking up. anything you can take from that? guest: that treating -- preaching abstinence only has been proven to be ineffective. if you just teach abstinence without teaching the other way is to avoid infection, that is when you get a serious issue.

host: talking about those that were affected, what are the symptoms? what should they look for democrats call lurk -- guest: you should not worry about symptoms -- what should they look for? guest: you should not worry about symptoms, because if you wait for them, it is too late. many people need therapy even if they feel well. the earlier the to get the therapy, the better. the other advantage is if they are not infected you get them into this system on counseling them about what they need to do to continue to prevent themselves from being infected. host: as far as symptoms? guest: it really varies. advanced disease, pneumonia, very unusual types of pneumonia.

people generally feel very sick and if there is a risk category -- that is the reason you go into a doctor's office and give them symptoms. we have people in an hour of hospitals that are doing perfectly well, feeling a bit tired, all of a sudden presenting with what we would call an aids defining illness. when you examine the profile and you find out that they were likely infected for least 10 years or more. which is unacceptable. if someone is practicing risky behavior, they should be tested right away. so that they can get appropriate therapy earlier rather than later. host: what do you mean by central nervous system? guest: you can get strange

infections in the brain. things that well people would never get. another problem that we have seen, certain types of tumors, lymphoma in the central nervous system. the brain can be a target for a secondary from hiv. caller: hello. my question for you is sort of a multifaceted. i sit on the prevention group in massachusetts. i have been hiv-positive for over 20 years. i was diagnosed with an aids diagnosis in 1995. -- 1985. i want to ask you about your cr5 work andhe c

any talk on that. host: we want to know what ccr5. caller: it is a kinetic mutation. they say people with two of these do not get hiv. they have done studies where they were able to wipe out his hiv. host: thank you. guest: what the calller is referring to is the issue of possibly sharing a person with hiv. if you do -- if you get on the drugs find, you will do fine. there are millions of people walking around well because the drugs are so affected. this issue of the chair comes up, and this means you can take someone off the drug and it does not bounce back. currently as good as the drugs are, as soon as to stop them, the virus comes back here yet

there was a very unusual case that people are making a lot out of in this sense of saying it is a proof of concept for a cure. you have to be careful about that. it was someone who had hiv infection and developed a complication of a certain type of leukemia and required a some spell transplant. they got this themself from someone who had a genetic defect that would prevent that person cell from getting infected with hiv. they did that in the person who was hiv infected, and they gave him all the eminent suppression that you need, and it turns out the person which the transplant helped or cured their leukemia, but now the person is no longer requiring the anti-hiv drugs because the cells and their body are not susceptible to hiv. that is an interesting phenomenon, but it is not practical on a wide scale.

it is completely impractical to be thinking of that, because you have to suppress the persons marrow, which can kill you. you need a transplant, which is extremely expensive, and then you have to be immunosuppressed and drugs for the rest of your life. even though the idea of a cure is alive and well, and we are striving very aggressively to find a cure, the idea of giving someone else and still transplant and all that goes with it is frankly not feasible. caller: i wanted to ask the doctor the same thing he just discussed. i wanted to know if there was any potential learning that could be utilized? even though you could not stem cells, is there another potential lesson that could be derived?

i know you have to spend huge amounts of man hours on this, but is that giving another perspective, or was that something that was considered even before it was actually found to be true? >> the thing about this themself transplant and what we call it a truth -- approve of transplant. that is somehow by mechanism you can block the virus on an individual. in this case it was done by transplanting cells that did not have the expression of the receptive. if you can do it some way or another with gene therapy or another approach, which has a high likelihood of failure but not impossible, and we're trying very hard to do that that we can consider the individual patient, though and practical from the widespread standpoint, it does actually represents what we

called a proof of concept, and that is what people are working on right now. various molecular ideas to tone down the expression of this receptor which allows someone to get infected. >> what is the difference in the course of treatment today versus 30 years ago? guest: huge. 30 years ago we did not know what the virus was. when it was isolated in 1983 in 1984, the first drug was a blip of hope because people did well for awhile, and in the virus became resistant to the drug. it was not until the mid-1990s when the triple combination of what we call a cocktail of drugs was available that we began to be able to effectively bring down the level of virus to below detectable levels. if you look at what we have now, a person can come in with one killed that has three drugs in it and take it once a day, that person can successfully suppressed the fire risk.

even when we have multiple drugs, people were taking 15 or 20 bills per day, and it was very difficult for a person to keep up with a regimen. -- 15 or 20 pills per day. host: what is the cost? guest: it varies. the cost of the types of drugs sold in the non-generic way, mainly just over the counter from the manufacturer, they range anywhere from 12,000 to $14,000 per year. right now in the developing world using generics are much less expensive. in fact, they can be measured in a few hundred dollars per year. host: what about insurance? guest: most of the inferences cover the therapy for hiv infected. host: 33 million people living

with hiv, 20% higher than 2000. 3 million infected with hiv. 30% less than the peak of the epidemic. 90% of the people are low and middle income countries. 56,000 new infections each year in the united states. what are survival rates looking like? guest: if you do not have treatment, it is like it was in the 1980's. some people die within a few years, but the median survival from the time you get infected is somewhere around 10 or 11 years. you for start getting to -- the serious disease. if someone comes in to my clinic or any clinic for the hacker facilities in this newly diagnosed, and let's say the person is 20 years old, newly infected and you put them on appropriate therapy, you could predict they could live another 15 years -- 50 years.

the life span is approaching if someone gets under appropriate therapy. host: our republican line. brandon from pennsylvania. i was wondering about the status of an aids vaccine. guest: a year-and-a-half ago there was a trial that we conducted with the united states government and they country of thailand with a vaccine that was found to be moderately effective. it is of being deployed, but it was the proof of concept that a vaccine actually can work. there is a lot of work going on for hour -- for the development of the vaccine, but it is not a year away. it will likely be several years. host: what is the scope of the

current research being done? guest: incentives. we spend about $650 million per year for an aids vaccine. a number of candidates, which we're turning our the write components to inject into an individual to reduce response that you hope will be protected. there is a lot of work going on throughout the country and the world, supported by a number of groups, but particularly the nih. host: this letter as how we're doing on keeping out of 84 -- blood out of transfusions and therapy? >> that is prettguest: that is h settled. the blood supply is really quite safe. the chances of getting an infection from a blood transfusion is vanishingly small. host: harlem, new york. steve on the democrat line. caller: i do research also.

i am going to be in dc next week because of the aids clinical trial. my question is you said something about the ccr5. the researchers looking at that is not to the bone marrow but the procedure to try to eradicate it. they're also looking at the sleeping cells. i guess they're trying to stir the sleeping sells better in the body, to wake them up so that and try-retro by rolls -- so retro viralsti- will eliminate them. guest: what the calller is referring to is the lately-

infected pool. he is using the terminology sleeping cells. it is where the cells are infected but they are not actively making virus, so they are late and. it is very difficult to eradicate that pool of cells. as part of the push to develop a cure, there are proposals and experiments going on to activate the pool and hopefully not have the virus spread to other cells, but to kill the cells once they start spitting out the virus. thus far that approach has been unsuccessful, but that is ok. people are continuing to try to find new ways of doing that he is talking about a leighton reservoir of hiv. atent reservoir of hiv. caller: thank you for everything you have done. my partner and i are both hiv-

positive. i was bearing this in the military back in 1987. i received great benefit from the va system. my partner received social security, the upper end of social security which is around $1,500. due to the fact that he received the upper end, his cost of his medication are almost like 1000 to $1,200, which is practically impossible for him to pay. is there any political thing where they're trying to cover this up for people? he is not eligible for medicare advantage. unfortunately it has forced him and me both to come up with a solution ourselves. one calller earlier started -- stated about starting and stopping medication. two years ago we stopped and started medications.

i take a very extreme regiment, and i would take it for four months in stop and give it to my partner. i know this is practicing medicine without a license, but we do what we do to survive. we have both stayed undetectable for over two years by the grace of god. we do not want to do this. we are not active physically in the gay community. we are in texas basically to other people. -- we are basically infectious to other people. the doctor tot respond. guest: it is really unfortunate that the availability of health care is not able to get the resources to treat their infection, which is the drug he is getting is life-saving. the calller is really lucky

that by stopping the medication not coming back. s that is not recommended. very dangerous to do that for a number of reasons, one of which is then you could reduce insistence of your virus to the drug you are using. when you start and stop you give the virus the opportunity to generate resistance to the drugs that are being used. although he says when he goes off is by role load, which means the level of virus in his blood remains undetectable, he is very lucky and unusual that is the case, so although it may work for him, that is not something you at all recommend for people to go on their drug performance and off for four months. it is really unfortunate that the resources are not made available to him to be able to stay on these life-saving drugs

continually. host: what is the recommended as far as how often you should test? guest: you mean an uninfected person? if an uninfected -- an infected person is having risky behavior, at least once a pair year. those with the virus, you do not need to test them. you want to test the viral load a couple of times per year, but you do not need to retest them for the virus. host: hartford, conn. david on the democrat line. foraller: things you giving your professional life to this kind of research. i am wondering if you can tell me. a friend of mine i played cards with tested positive in 1988. he is been on nearly every drug they have. he is healthy. he showed me a receipt for a

year's worth of medications from his insurance companies with over $36,000. he makes copays, he works and is perfectly healthy, but he is getting near to retirement in scared to death what will happen. how is it that foreign countries can have generics that do not exist in this country and our drug costs are so high? is there anything that can be done about this? guest: that is an excellent question, and something of this country is struggling with. it is not in my area of influence to have anything to do with that, but i can certainly emphasis -- empathize with the concerns being expressed. other countries not only have the ability to use generics, but those countries also, many of them have universal health care, which means that individuals are infected and had total accessibility to drugs. if you look in south america,

brazil is a classic example that if you are infected, you will get treatment from the health plans free as part of the health care delivery system. there are people who are not only not able to get drugs because of the lack of health care system that fits them, but it is true the drugs are very expensive. host: republican line. good morning. caller: thank you. thank you for c-span. i want to say that i believe in celibacy for all people, and i have been completely celibate for nine years. i believe that is the way to go. guest: for the individual call, that is the way to go.

in the real world of what goes on out there, celibacy, though it works for those were celibate, it does not work when you're talking about those with hiv, because most people are not celibate. so we have to have prevention measures for hiv that are risk reduction, because people are going to have sexual relationships the matter what we say, so although celibacy and very unusual circumstances, people like to be celibate, but in the broad global situation of hiv, that just does not happen. host: are there strains of the virus? guest: there are. they do not vary with respect to drug treatment. c and a.a it is see and

the treatment is not different. they are just a little bit different molecular weight. host: cincinnati, ohio. democrat line. caller: doctor, thank you again for your help with the virus. and my question is i was diagnosed in 1980 s6. my question is does your body goes through a noticeable change when you are infected? in 1984 i had a bout with flu- like symptoms over the weekend in happened, and two days later i was fine. i was never found anybody that can answer my question. does your body goes through a noticeable change when you are infected at the initial infection of the virus? guest: there is no doubt your

body goes under a notable change, mostly for the worst in the sense that when the virus replicates, it destroys components of your immune system, and we know now after many years of experience that the replicating virus, hiv as it reproduces itself, creates a degree of what we call very abnormal activation of the body system, which has a number of effects. the answer to your question, the short answer is certainly the virus does have an effect on your body, and quite about effect actually appear yet ho. host: san francisco next on the independent line. caller: thank you, a doctor, and for c-span. my question is i was married for quite a long time. i am now divorced.

i have cancer now, and so far i have tested negative for aids, but my x, i am not sure at the time when we parted whether his sexual activity could have exposed me. i have had real current lymphoma, which means i have had to first stage battles, which they say i am currently in remission. the diagnosis was found, the pass a law which said it is remarkable -- the pathologist said it is remarkable to have this stage of cancer with the white count. the way they found it was biopsy. i was wondering the relationship between the two, and also the post-treatment side effects, and

do i have the sleeping sell or could i have the sleeping sell ♪ cell? guest: the college is mentioned she is not hiv-positive. if that is the case, the diagnostic tests for hiv positivity are very sensitive. so i am sure her physician no doubt has of her for hiv, particularly if she said she had an arrest with her sexual partner. if she is negative, which it sounds like she is, this far after having exposure to a person who would be infected, and she clearly is negative, and the lymphoma as something that is unrelated to hiv. she is asking could she have these reservoir, but hebert in tried the test is positive -- excuse me,-, she does not have this.

if she did, her agency would be clearly positive, and it is not. host: there are stories about this e. coli break out, especially in germany. what is the message for those in the united states? guest: it is not here in the united states. ot worryage is, do not rea about it. practice good hygiene no matter the situation. the situation in germany was quite tragic. there was contamination now out sprouts that got contaminated with a very common bacteria called the coli. the reason this particular bacteria is so dangerous is that it produces a toxin, which

happens to be called sugar toxin. they named the bacteria stec. it has been extremely dangerous and sickened a few thousand people in germany and the european union. they have a secondary complications, which means the red cells get destroyed by this toxin, and they then go into kidney failure. there have been 23 deaths associated with that particular syndrome, and another 12 or 13 deaths associated with this typical type of an e coli abdominal issues. it is a serious situation there. there have been a couple of cases who people of in germany and came back to the united states. one clearly diagnosed and a possible diagnoses.

the issue is not in the united states right now. host: how open are we to a break out of that kind of magnitude? guest: there is always the possibility of food outbreaks. that is why we have to be very careful with the inspection of food. we occasionally get outbreaks of e. coli, a different type. the one that is in germany is a different type. they are different categories of the different type of bacteria. we have not seen this here in the united states. host: ron, republican line. caller: i was encouraged earlier in your discussion appear did you talk about the prevalence of aids in the black community and your desire to target high-risk groups. i worked for a number of year in corrections, and it seems to me

if you dig deeper into the numbers, you will find the prevalence in the black community, you could extend that to the inmate population and the people who are infected when they get out of corrections. given that, inmates lose a number of their rights on going into corrections. if you do periodic testing, mandatory testing of the inmate population, you should be able to segregate them, and as a condition of parole, have them talk to their loved one when they get out of prison. guest: i cannot be making policy with regard to the

correction system, but the calller does make a very good point. one of the thing that happens is when people are in the system and hiv positive, if they are recognized to be hiv-positive, if the system is working right, they should be getting therapy when they get out. as often happens, when they get out they may not tell their sexual partner they are infected and wind up infecting their underwear sexual partner. that does not happen frequently in the sense of people deliberately trying to infect people, but when you go into one system and out of the general society, there is often the lack of continuity of medicare or the kind of counseling that the calller is talking about. that is a problem, because there is a reasonably high percentage of people, particularly to have been injection drug users will get into the system who are positive. host: dallas, texas. david on the democrat line. and caller: thank you for all

you have done for humanity. wasow thseveral years there an attempt of heating the blood to kill the virus. i know it was not successful. do you know if research has been done in the other direction, lowering the body temperature? i know we have been able to work the body temperature significantly without harming the person. guest: the answer is not formally when you're talking about cooling the body, because it is very clear from what we know about the virus that environmental changes will kill the cells in the person long before the kill the virus. the idea of heating or chilling the virus, we have such a effective anti-viral drugs right now, it does not make sense to

do the dramatic manipulations to suppress the virus when you can do it easily with a single pill that contains three drugs. host: san diego, california. you are last call. norris on the independent line. caller: i like the question about the medicines that is generated to bite this hiv. what kind of raw material -- where does this medicine come from? what kind of plant? why do -- why can't americans grow that plant? guest: most of the medicines do not come from a plant. they are synthesized and created in a way many medicines are by synthetic processes, and that is

the reason why pharmaceutical companies, when they make them coming you see the pictures of how it is done. the make asepsis and put it in a tablet or capsule. host: looking at the future, what is ahead? guest: 1 we are relatively optimistic at the 30th anniversary, because a lot of scientific validated tools to prevent hiv infection. we still have some scientific doubts. we need a safe and effective vaccine we do not have yet. even absence of a vaccine, if we implement properly the prevention things we have had available, there is a strong feeling we could turn this

pandemic around. we have more of an implementation gap then we'd have a scientific out, and that is what a lot >> in a few moments, a hearing on improving bus safety. in a few hours, newt gingrich and andrew breitbart speak to the republican jewish coalition in los angeles. several live events to tell you about tomorrow. the house energy subcommittee will hear an inspector general's report on how the chairman of the nuclear regulatory commission dealt with the yucca mountain nuclear repository application. that is on c-span 3 at 10:00 a.m. eastern. on c-span 2 at 1:00 a.m. eastern, but scowcroft talks

about foreign policy following the annual gerald ford foundation journalism awards. also tomorrow, the senate commerce committee looked at threats to real security as members here from the heads of the transportation security administration and the amtrak police. that is on c-span 3 at 2:30 p.m. eastern. now, a hearing on improving bus safety that comes following recent accidents in the northeast and northern virginia that resulted in the deaths of several passengers. witnesses include the head of the motor carrier safety administration, safety advocates, and industry representatives. this is two hours. >> good afternoon.

i would like to call this hearing of the house transportation and infrastructure committee to order. today's hearing is entitled how to best improve bus safety on our nation's highways. the order of business today will be opening statements by members, and then we have a panel of witnesses a symbol that will testify about the subject -- assembled that will testify about the subject at hand. the order of business to proceed is i will begin with my opening statement. the order of business to proceed is i will begin with mopening statement and will yield the other members, and then we will try to expedite hearing from our witnesses of which we will hear from all them and then take questions afterwards. we are pleasedto be with you this afternoon, and i will begin by trying to lay the ground will put my own living statement. i welcome our witnesses and

never stick. thank you for coming back. the house is in session until a little bit -- it is in session but not voting until later tonight. the reason -- the reason for thisearing is very important. in a few weeks we hope to roll out the lead -- legislation that dramatally reestablishes, sets the policy for various modes of transportation. as some of you may know, we plan to roll out the new transportation legislation in two phases. starting on wednesday, we will have a rollout, a draft of a passenger rail reform bill. we are going to hit it is a separate piece of legislation dealing with that particular provision.

we have some provisions that are rather dramatic change the way things are currently conducted with our major passenger rail provider, amtrak. we want full opportunity for again, a new direction in passenger rail to be fully aired a also included in a separate bill, which we will see if we have adequate support and e house and senate to move forward as part of a larger measure. the balance of the multi-modal bill will be rolled out in a few weeks after word. we are doing it in a different faion. we started hearing testimony from around united states and started in mr. rayhall's district in beckley west virginia. we went as far as the pacific

ocean, probably, two or three dozen carries to try to craft and assemble the best ideas for any reforms necessary or that people could provide the committee with. we ended up in this room. we had a little libation and pizza where members discussed some of the basic parameters for the legislation. during the past few weeks, our staff have been working on incorporating provisions for both the passenger rail segment and also for the balance of the in a legislative illegal. we can hope to have that rolled out, but as they complete that work, we wanted to make shoes -- make certain that we have the best provisions possible for us

safety. mr. defazio, i hope to thank him, and i thank you for bringing this hearing together. mr. defazio had done hearings previously on passenger bus safety, and i think it is vitally important that we have the latest, most up-to-date input from some of those involved with this matter before us as we conclude and finalize the drafting and provisions for our larger bill. this has been highlighted unfortunately by some very tragic, dramatic accidents that have taken place with some of our buses, passenger buses. we had that horrible accident

march, 2011, on the new jersey turnpike. we had another horrendous accident in new york with 15 fatalities, injuries in the incidents. we have unfortunately had in north carolina another horrible accident in the greensboro, north carolina, area, where four passengers were killed and 53 others were injured. the purpose of the hearing is to look at our current laws, regulations, and the administration, those provisions we currently have in statutes or rules and make certain we have the very best measures in the bill the we are drafting. we have taken ideas from both sides of the aisle in our preliminary work, and hopefully we will have some additional

input today, because again, one fatality is far too many. let me say that as i conclude that the industry overall does have a very excellent safety record. bus operations, transport between 750,000,800 million passengers -- 750,000,800 million passengers per year. we have had very few fatalities. we have great safety records, particularly among the well- known and legacy passenger companies. unfortunately, that is not the case with many of the other operators, and wdo not have an

exact number. i asked for the number of operators, but that oubles me that we did not have that data. how can we monitor if we do not have the exact the death? the federal motor carrier safety administration will hear from representatives of that agency's, responsible for some of the federal eorcement and adminiration of loss, and our states are vital players and need to make certain that they also have in place the very best safety provisions so that any and all accidents can be prevented. it may be impossible, but it should be our goal. unfortunately, we are brought here by a series of bus tragedy's that have -- --

that havees captured the attention of the nation. i notice that even over the weekend i am told that federal motor carrier safety administration has closed down couple of operators, marginal at best, operators. i am glad to hear that, when -- and i understand they were aually transporting people under the bus. i do not know if that was in the luggage area or what takoma -- what, but that is not an acceptable mode of operation. we will provide inlet all, again working with our state partners, whatever measures are necessary to make sure that people are transported on buses safely throughout the united states. that is our reason for this hearing. we appreciate our witnesses and

hopefully we will come out of this hearing a little bit more knowledgeable, were preped to finalize the import legislation we are about the craft and submit. i will say as we go forward with this process, in closing, whether the passenger rail segment or the bill, not only that do i want the democrat minority members that have full opportunity for purses of asian, but also other members -- opportunity for participation, but other members and other industry people who are affected by the law and any organizations that again support safety and good transportation for the and i did sit of america. we will have a full opportunity to participate on wednesday. we will be wet casting at 11:00

and people can go to our website at participate in the rollout of the first section of the bill, and in several wks, the same procedure will be followed. we will have a number you can call. we will have the ability -- you will have the ability also asked qutions as we roll out these new provisions in law. we want full participation, and please, members, are able to be with us. with that, i would like to deal to the ranking member of the committee -- subcommittee, mr. defazio, and this is a full committee hearing. i thought it was important to bring it to a full committee level, and i am so pleased that he would come back. and continue his hard work to make certain that bus passenger safety is a priority. >> thank you for bringing this

important issue forward. it is timely before we move forward with authorization because some new authority is needed and perhaps some mandates, but when we deregulated interstate commerce we had absurd regulations where they had to define -- had to file their rates for different seats or whatever and difference get chills. the intention of the regulation was to bring about competition, but not to kill people. that is where a total deregulatory envonment fails us.

i am pleased see they have stepped up the number of inspections and enforcement, but given what we are told, the level of new entrants, it seems an impossible task, and ever- changi group of characters carry only a small percentage are those who would put people in the baggage compartment, had incompeten or exhausted drivers, drive buses with bald tires, failed breaks, causing fires and other problems. it is a very small problem in the industry, but those who are industry -- those who are legitimate should draw together to to figure how to keep these people out. when they kill people, people just disassociate with the tire industry. it is a few bad actors. that is what i hope comes out of this hearing, that we figure out

a way to keep these people out if they are and, to get them out, and to vigorously prosecute them when they have committed violations the law. i think a number of our state partners have failed us in this. some states just allow these gypsies, these fly by night folks toresent a certificate saying they have inspected their own bosses and their bosses are ok, and the state says their bosses are ok. other states are more rigorous. we may need to set a higher bar in authorization for the state's before we can have a carrot-stick approach, too. many states have diverted their money into truck inspection safety. that is a problem, too. maybe we need to look at the

levels of funding, and the proposed levels of funding under the ryan budget would be a dramatic reduction in funding for the federal government and federal pass-throughs to the states. then there is ts whole thing of morphing, which the agency tries to deal with, but more authority needs to be there, with people are morphing in this case. in virginia, they morphed quickly into another company. we need to figure a way to get at that so they cannot continue to operate under anyuise, th people who are responsible for the substandard operations for killing people. that is the ball line here. this of the be all heaven,, and

i would welcome industry representatives as well as the regular fares to give us a vision as to how we can get there. we are not going to regulate every route. no ones proposing that. how in a regulated environment we get the level of safety security want and a legitimate operators. i welcome the testimony from the panel. >> thank you for your excellent comments and for your strong advocacy on behalf -- on behalf of bus safety. the gentleman from north carolina. >> i wl be very brief. i know of no issue that is more significantly important that promoting safety on our nation's i ways. that is the purpose of this hearing. thank you all for being here. i think he and the ranking member for having schedule

this, and i yield back. good to see back, and you are looking pretty good, fighting a little bit of that skin cancer. >> i have not yet reached the threshold of hollywood hinson, but i am working on it. handsome, but ind am working on it. >> in this committee, city is a top priority. we have to strive to make it secure because this is critical. i want to say to those folks who have lost loved ones, families of those who have been a injured, youave our deepest sympathy, but it is important to note that the inner city motorcoach industry is an

extremely safe mode of transportation. the nation has about 35,000 motor coaches that provide 750 million passenger trips annually. it is the safest way for passengers to move around this country. they have had a record that has been saved. we have had fatalities recently, and we got to make sure as the ranking member said to get this bad actors off the road. there is room for us to improve. the recent accidents have highlighted the issues regarding enforcement. we need to make sure the best trained drivers are out there transporting our citizens safely around the country. i am interested in hearing from our witnesses regarding how we can keep unsafe as operators of

the nation's highways. a bus crash near frederick virginia killed 53 others. an operator has had seen the numerous -- numerous safety violations. they had that accident, but today are operatg under a different name. we have got to figure out a way to keep those rogue operators who consistently violate safe standards make sure they're off the highway the whole .

we must evaluate the effects of the standards as we go for it. i want to make sure that the u.s. dot as the appropriate authorities to ensure safety and look forward to the testimony today. i want to point out that the industry is largely a small business industry. 95% of motorcoach companies operate fewer tha 25 motor coaches. we must ensure we take a balanced approach to this. we want to make sure there is the highest level of safety. this is a small business, family-owned industry that we cannot take a broad brush and paint them all, because they are committed to making sure they

are transporting passengers in a safe manner. we have to focus on that and make sure we do it in a way that is not going to hurt them in this already weak economy. i want to mention the legislation that i have proposed, the bus uniform standards and safety act, which focuses on increasing oversight and enforcement, ensuring the most well trained drivers, and improving standards based on sound scientific research, testing and analysis, not on the motion. we got tmake sure we make sure this makes sense scientifically. i look forward to heang testony today for your ideas and i appreciate the chairman holding this hearing today. thank you. >> i am pleased to yield to the gentleman from indiana. >> they give, and thank you for

holding this very important hearing today, and i think the ranking member. i took advantage of the motorcoach system when i was in college. and i know how important it is to the people in indiana since i am in a fairly rural state, and people take advantage of the motorcoach system. it is also important to continue to look at the safety, realizing we have bad actors out there that compromise the system which for the most part is an extremely safe way for people to travel, even in light of the recent tragic crashes that resulted in loss of life. thank you for holding this hearing. i am looking forward to hearing the testimony so we can connue to make this mode of travel very safe for our

>> thank the gentleman. mr. harris, recognized. >> my colleague from north carolina. my district will depend upon bus transportation. we do want to keep it safe. i would just ask that we do not do what has been trendy in the past which is when something like this happens become up with a new series of regulations that punish the good actors almost more than the bad actors. a lot of the bus companies are in fact small bus companies. they are the small businesses that can thrive. two of my daughters to interstate bus trips over the past month. the air-conditioning ran out on one. it is not a safety issue -- certainly it is not comfortable.

but they both felt saved taking that mode of transportation. they trusted the carriers. creating a said ofegulations that paint -- a set o regulationf is that have an of safety d overall. >> we will proceed with our panel of witnesses. again, i thank them for coming in on short notice. i feel this will be a very important hearing, as we try to craft and finalize provisions beforehe new six-year authorization. our witnesses start out with ann ferro. major david palmer, texas

department of public safety. thank you for being with us. mr. peter pantuso. president and ceo of american bus association. mr. vicotr perra, president and ceo of united motor coach association. queline gillan.eln thank of the witnesses for being with us. we were the like to try to limit your testimony to five minutes. could submit a request through the chair. additional information, documentation, or information that you would like to be made part of the record, we will do that.

>> thank you for the opportunity to speak today. this has been the worst time in recent history for motor coach safety, with six crashes resulting in 25 deaths and numerous injuries just since january. my condolences go to the families who have lost loved ones in these crashes. i join employees and state enforcement partners in taking these losses to heart. it is frustrating that despite safety standards and increases in inspections and enforcement actions, the risk to passengers continues from a few bad actors. our sick the mission is our

number one priority -- our safety mission is our number one priority and we are cracking down on illegal passenger carriers. we have a comprehensive investigation under way, specifically in the sky expression crash --illegal pass. when we found out the sky express was attempting to operate and sell tickets after we have shut them down, we issued a cease and desist order. on the same day, we subpoenaed the rord of 3 internet web sites that sell tickets for sky express and other bus companies. the leasing practices of some motorcars compani allows them to skirt safety rules, moving equipment and drivers among companies. and unregulated websites sell tickets with no transparency to the public. we are shutting down on save carriers as quickly as are authity permits. since january, we declared 18

bus company's unsatisfactory. issued an out a service order for those 18. we have another 15 pending. that means they must stop operating. if a carrier opresent a severe risk, we do not wait for the 45- day appeal period that is allowed for motor coach carriers. we shut them down immediately. this past week, we used are imminent hazard authority to shut down three companies, including one in michigan that had put passengers and cgo hold. we have got to stop that. transportation secretary ray lahood has had his eye and motor coach safety since 2009 when he charged fmcsa and ntsa to develop a plan. the actions within its plan to

address many ntsb regulations, including on board reg ting, anda ban on texsti stronger oversight of drivers medical and alcohol test results. fmcsa has proposed rules or programs in all of those areas. we need additional authority. we provided technical assistance to the committee with regard to several recommendations that would strengthen our authority over these bad actors. first is to allow us to conduct en route inspections at the state level. not just restrict us to inspections on motor coach companies at origin and destination. second is to develop a successor liility standard to enable us up to more surely shut down reincarnated carriers. third is a requirement for

safety audits. the fourth is to raise the penalty for violations by bus companies that attempt to operate illegally to $25,000 per violation. it is currently $2,000. lastly, allow us to regulate passenger ticket sellers. we refer t tm as brokers. we currently regulate hsehold could brokers. we have no authorities over passenger bus brokers. our commitment has never been higher. i look forward to answering any questions you may have. >> thank you 3 testimony. we will hear from major david palmer -- thank you for your testimony. he is with the texas department of public safety and testifying on behalf of commercial safety vehicle alight. welcome and you are recognized. >> members of the committee,

thank you for holding this hearing. let me say at the outset th on behalf of my members we pledged renewed emphasis on bus safety, a step we can take it no additional cost is to lift the current restriction l that prohibits en route bus inspections. we commit to you that if this restriction is lifted, we will encourage our state companies to take an aggressive enforcement actions when warranted. this step will provide an infusion of enforcement activity and enhance boston highway -- bus and highway safety. this has resulted in a significant number of buses and drivers ing placed out of service for mechanical or driver violations.

these strike forcesncluded safety inspections at origin or destination. we are believers that many more lives could be saved if en route inspections for once again permitted to allow states to conduct these inspections when and where necessary. since the so-called kerbside operators such as sky express do not operate at a fixed place of business, the most effective way to inspect them is through random en route programs. is this past week, they stopped four buses operating on the capital beltway. although they were not _ i express's -- under sky express's authority, two did not have driver's licenses and all four did not have log books. this is one of many examples like en route inspection is necessary. how many more are out there?

enforcement is a major component of bus safety but not the only one. when it is necessary to close down the passenger carrier operating illegal, theull force and authority of fmcsa is necessary. state enforcement and oversight is necessary to the inspection and audit process is to uncover potential passenger carrier drivers and equipment problems. when it comes to crashworthiness, and it's a must aggressively -- ntsa must implement safety system requirements. vetting process has been an important tool to take action on carriers that are changing their stripes. fmcsa working with the states must be given authority to

transfer pass safety performance authority for one carrier to another one discovered it is the same operation. we must also be given more authority over brokers, companies that purchase transportation for customers need to be held accountable for not conducting a proper due diligence for safety. brokers discovered not doing so when hiring unsafe operators must use shut down. -- must be shut down. another is bus fires. a bus or market is lost to a fire every two days in the united states. we can conduct more roadside inspections were reinspect brakes, tires, and wheels, which are the origin of many fires. we support provisions in the house and senate bus safety bills that require a safety audit compliance review of all interstate passenger carriers. each statements also have a bus safety enforcement program that is appropriate for the needs of that state.

as you might expect, by directing more of the efforts toward bus safety, states face the potential need for additional resources and funding. what we do not want to happen is by focusing on safety and inspection, it comes at the expense of other programs. unlike trucking companies, intercity passenger carriers have been exempt from any hours of service changes in recent years. since driver fatigue seems to have an attention getting factor in bus cresses, we recommend -- bus crashes we recommend if studying the roles of for driver hours are adequate. if congress chooses to once again to enable en route bus inspections, we will commit to assisting the state's by immediately conducting bus inspections as well and continues strike forces and other enforcement activities throughout the country. we believe this is the most

appropriate and effective response to impact bus safety. mr. chairman, this concludesy remarks. i will be happy to answer any questions. >> next we will hear from peter pantuso. welcome and you are recognized. >> aba is the trade association for the bus industry and for the tour and travel industry, all of whom have a deep interest in safety. our motor coach members operate 60% of the coaches on the road today. we share this committee's concerns and frustrations over unsafe motor coach companies. mr. chairman, i cannot over emphasize the concern or discussed that we have over the manner in which illegal companies continue to operate. these companies are not part of the american bus association. more important, we are encouraged by the work of administrator ferro that they have done to seek out and save companies. making bus travel safer is

at the top of our agenda. it ctinues to be one of the safest notes even -- however, even one fatality is too many. we ask for more regulations and more enforcement. we were an early supporter of secretary lahood's motorcar safety action plan. we believe in strengthening state bus inspection programs, and forcing medical qualifications for drivers, and using technology to enhance safety. the lack of dedicated federal and state funding for bus inspections leads to is consistent enforcement, making it too easy for carriers to reopen after they have been put out of business, too easy for financially marginal companies to obtain authori and too easy for individuals to obtain a commercial driver's license with a psenger endorsement. the lack of consistent and adequate enforcement of current federal regulations must be addressed today. when secretary lahood issued the action plan he declared, "a

robust compliance and enforcement program is critical to ensuring that motor coach carriers operate safely." we applaud the stepped-up enforcement over the last couple months and a near-record number of motor coach companies being put out of company -- put out of siness, putting on qualified drivers of service and dearing some of hazard. certainly, they have done an excellent job of better vatting new entrants into the system. we welcome the new york department of -- the police unsrtment's twoinowing of afe buses. it's consisted, and effective best.orcement that is 54% of fatalities from 1999-2009 were accident caused by unsafe or illegal companies. fmcsa needs additional staffing

and money to inspect bus operations. funding for commercial motor vehicle inspections is largely via the mixat program. a certain percentage of the funds should be allocated for bus inspections. if states are unwilling or incapable of managing bus inspection programs that meet federal standards, we believe that some of that money should be used to hire third-party inspectors. as it stands now, eight or 10 states have very good, effective inspection programs. this and equity must end. bus inspection programs must be uniform so as not to create safe havens for illegal operators. we must raise the safety bar. while fmcsa has made gains, we would certainly like to see a query into the fitness of an operator before the passenger boards the bus. we believe that congress should ruire an applicant's

background check for drivers, especially those with a passenger endorsement on their cdl. when fmcsa has determined an eminent safety danger, they need congressional authority to not only closed the operation but make sure the facilities are locked up and make sure the vehicles are impounded. aba recommes that they undertake more consumer awareness, as was begun on may 5 with the secretary's consumer checklist. we also believe a more friendly database, a safer system is appropriate for consumers. finally, regarding seat belts in coaches, aba supports seat belts in new buses, following the testing that was done by the department of transportation that they underok to determine what type of belt, the seat design and anchorage that would be appropriate. we are supporters of h.r.

1390. our industry continues to grow. we will provide the safest and most cost-effective and environmentally efficient mode of transportation, but we can only do it if current regulations are enforced equally and all carriers. i.t. why, mr. chairman. i will answer any questions you might have -- i thank you, mr. chairman. >> now we will hear from mr. victor perra, president and ceo of the motor coach association. welcome. you are recognized. >> i appreciate your calling the hearg today and the opportunity to appear bore it. the committee has a long and distinguished record of promoting safety. it is my goal to provide the committee with our perspective on the factors that contribute to o industries noble safety record but our goal of improving on that record. founded in 1971, the association represents the full spectrum of

us and motor coach operations from small family charter and tour to nationwide commuter service operations. the united states small business administration estimates that over 90% of the motor coach operators are in fact small businesses. we were deeply saddened by the recent accidents and we extend our deepest sympathies to the victims and their families. whe it is a fact that our industry as the safest record -- one fatality is one fatality too many. one of our objectives is to promote safety and compliance in this industry. we do this for several initiatives. first, we have our bus and motor coach academy which is a credit to the college of southern maryland. we do training for drivers as well as motoroach companies to instill safety cultures and their organizations. we a safety management seminars that we hold that the ntsb's

training center. of course, our annual conference and regional state meetings are also laden with the safety training programs. we routinely volunteered to assist national transportation safety board in any of their investigations, as we did following the accident involving worldwide tourist. uma has long advocated for stronger enforcement of existing federal and state motor carrier safety regulations for our vehicles and drivers. initially, we have long supported initiatives based on sound science and research that truly improve safety, many of which are included in mr. schuster's bill, which is co- sponsored by members of this committee. as well as other members of

congress. the bill contains obtainable guidelines that enhance the national transportation safety administration's efforts to promulgate rules that will improve medical its occupant protection. in addition to the bill, in august, 2007, ntsa announced a series of the valuations including window glazings, emergency egress, stability control, roof strength and flammability. they conducted the first ever motor coach crash test. subsequent, they promulgate regulations for seat belts on all the coaches. uma supports that initiative. in december, 2010, fmcsa launched its long-awaited safety analysis. fmcsa now have the capability to readily identify noncompliant carriers with the goal of

preventing accidents before they occur. just once and implementation, uma concludes that csa is producing results. we are satisfied this program will serve the long-term needs of the enforcement community. uma has reservations regarding legislative efforts that could intentionally harm small entrepreneurs and new carriers. while some of use the terms of the legal road carriers and new entrants in the same reference, there are no direct parallels that would signify new entrants before a disproportional risk to the travelling public. having said that, we supports the secreta's efforts to establish minimal requirements for companies to seek to transport passengers. we recommend plaster an exam requirements falling by compliance audits within 45 days after operating authority is granted. while uma continues to support

limited driver and vehicle inspections to locations that do not interfere with schedules, we do not support aowing drivers or vehicles to continue operating safely. we remain concerned that roadside inspections. 76-year-old woman from minnesota died when her car that she was driving hit the back end of a motor coach that was stopped alonide i95 by a state trooper. fortunately, no passengers on the coach rick engine. congress has wisely protected motor coach passengers. in conclusion, we appreciate the opportunity to submit testimony and stand ready to contribute to ongoing efforts to enhance safety of bus and motor coach operations. thank you. >> we will now hear from jace gillan. she is vice president of the

advocates for highway and auto safety. weome and you are recognized. >> good afternoon. thank you for the opportunity to testify. i first testified in 2006 about motor coach safet problems. again in 2007, i testified after a crash in georgia. both hearings highlighted the need for congress to take action to improve federal oversight of the industry as well direct dot. five years later, after those hearings, there have been more an 100 crashes resulting in 136 deaths and thousands of injuries. it's time for congress to act and passed the motor coach enhancement safety act sponsored by representative john lewis and others. the legislation will directed d.o.t. to implement life-saving recommendations of the ntsb that have languished for over four

years. does that trouble by motor coach rather than aired tonight expect to be treated as second-class citizens when it comes to safety, and ey do not -- they do not expect the motor coach to be a death trap in the event of a crash. h.r. 873 is supported by consumer health and safety groups and the families of those killed and injured in motor coach crashes. why is this legislation needed? further excuses can no longer be tolerated and have contributed to needless deaths and injuries. this is not just advocates opinion, but the opinion of the ntsbs well. congress must act now and insure the safety improments that ntsb has recommended are implemented. hr 873 will protect consumers before they buy a ticket and after they take this seat in the trip begins. for example, there are no training ruirements and federal regulations for entry- level commercial drivers, including motor coach drivers.

compare that to a recent proposed faa role issued at the direction of congress that requires at least 1500 hours of flight time before a pilot can operate a commercial flight. also, safety ratings for motor coach companies are incomplete, out of date, or simply not available. in my testimony, a reference efforts by advocates staff to find out about the safety of ford motor cars companies. there are 143 companies headquartered in florida. 36 have no safety ratings at all. five companies are operating with conditional ratings, indicating there are safety deficiencies. among the 100 companies with satisfactory safety ratings, only to have ratings in categories. h.r. 873 would require that every motor coach company receives a safety rating within three years. driver fatigue and violation of

federahours of service rules are common. is time that we revise the hours of service role for motor coach drivers and get tough on companies that pushed drivers to exceed driving limits and falsify their logbooks. theirginia crash that occurred last week has also revealed a dirty little secret that safety advocates have warned about for years. giving motor cars companies an unsatisfactory sety rating 45 days or longer to continue carrying passengers is simply unacceptable. passengers boarding sky express had absolutely no idea dangerous risks they faced choosing a carrier. in the 48 days during which sky express operated with an unsatisfactory rating, the company may have exposed as many as 100,000 passengers to dangerous and deadly operating conditions. the ntsb has been loudoun clear -- loud and clear, that motor

coach operations -- passengers need better protection in a crash. motor coach crushers are violent and cause passengers toe thrown around and frequently ejected. this is why the national highway safety traffic administration needs to be directed to issue basic safety standards in the next two years that will result in our japan's having the safety protections that we now have -- will result in occupants having safety protections we have in cars. i am talking about seat belts, anti ejection window glazings and rollover protection. the motor coach industry gold- plated cost figures secret waiting around for safety improvements required in h.r. 873 are inflated and undocumented. the cost of equipping new motor coaches with the safety improvements required in the motor coach enhance safety act will cost less than a dime per passenger.

who in this hearing room today would not pay an extra dime to protect their child or parent or spouse in a crash? >> in closing, i urge you to pass the motor coach enhanced safety act and thank you for the opportunity to testify. >> we will see with the missing pieces are to making certain that we have the very best legislation in place, best regulation where we are going to regulate, best cooperation from the states and the private industry. federalfrisirst from our motor carrier safety

administrator a list of recommendations that have been suggested, and we heard other recommendations from other panelists. there are issues with just about all of these. for example, if we start with the end route inspections, and i think there were restrictions put under the last six-year authorization that to inhibit some of the en route inspections. i think the thought there was that we inspect the bus before people get on it or at the end. and not unless there was a serious indication there was some problem en route. it would n shut down the servic we probably could tighten that uppe some. part of the problem starts even before that. mr. defazio spoke about it. getting a hand on rogue

operators. changing thname of the operation over the internet. we have seen that in other industries, where bad players -- to try to build a mouse trap to catch the rats and they find some other way to get to the cheese, whether it is in a passenger bus operations or in other endeavors. i guess i would go back to the very basic involvemnt of the the federal motor carrier safety administration in reviewing these folks and the time also that we have. what is it, 18 months they can actually start operations before they get somef that inspection? is that correct? correct.s

it is 18 months for new entrants. for motor coach passengers we set a standard of inspection it within nine months of their first receiving that authority for motor coach operators. >> so your recommendation is that before the start service they should have that certification. someone else was talking about a review of their capability. if it could be done by -- you have 1080 employees with fte's. i believe the division is about 800 in the field and maybe 200 in waington. >> that is correct. >> approximate. most of the inspections are done or enforcement is done at the state level. is that correct? >> that is correct. >> i know the administration

recommended additional positions in washington. sometimes, though from a practical standpoint,t is better to empower the state folks who are closer as far as enforcement and regulation. what would you think of -- you are recommending more federal employees. any pre-revi or audit tt could be done you think that could enhance the performance? the other thing, too, is the bad actors. i've heard of games and other industries, they go through inspections. the good times come off and put them on another vehicle. the drivers the list are not the drivers that drives. keeping up with that. how do we get the best enforcement, other than just adding -- the second tough question for you, maybe i should ask other than just what the

fed. other other things we can require on the spot that would do a good job, too. >> in other words, multi- fold.

some carriers will not necessarily comply. carrier rogue carriers are not gonna comply with the standardf origin and destination. >> when you are carrying passengers, it is unique. we do not inspect planes and route -- en route, pull them over, or parachute passengers out what we do an faa inspection. that plan should be inspected beforet takes off and carries a passenger. the same thing with amtrak and others. they do not meet safety standards. we are not pulli the train over with everybody disembarking on the side for a quick fta inspection. again, the you want a practical solution. i'm trying to stop them.

from getting in business in the first place. when i ask the staff how many operators to we have? they said that the federal motor carrier safety administration cannot tell us because it is a revolving number of the way things are set up now. peop get into business by various means. again, they are circumventing the provisions we have. how do we get a handle on that from the very beginning? >> perhaps the most efficient model is to combine the roadside inspection activity that is underway, where we have 12,000 state law enforcement across the country that are trained, complemented by the new entrant grant program that is in existence today. within the context of a pre- authorities safety audit by a cadre of state and federal inspectors. fy2012 request, we

include additional grants. it is utilizing what we already have and boots on the ground. -- in boots on the ground. >> but tough enforcement of the $25,000 fine compared to $2,000. what is the best -- american buses use asian feel about that? >> when it comes to more enforcement, i do not think anything can be second. we are in favor of anything that gets the bad actors of their road. are in favor of more inspections. one of the ways that we can talk which it we have talked about -- what we have talked about is increasing their budget and taking the companies that are undergoing department of defense inspections, about 500 of them, and taking them off to the side.

they are being inspected. inspections are almost the same, some would say it is more rigorous. why have themre- inspected a month or year later. , when they have beelooked at very rigorously? >> i think will never forget the testimony we have in one of our field hearings were a small family operator, a husband and wife, a trucking firm in this case, and the wife gave testimony. was that in arkansas? might have been. we did number of hearings. at the wife had compliled list of all of the agencies that their little two-person firm had to comply with. and she read that thing. most of taking her five minutes to read all of the agencies and regulations she had to deal with.

after she got through with that, then she cited all of the taxes, all the fees they had to pay. it was quite an eye opener. the problem we have in dividin congressmmiic pie in is how much regulation, taxation, law in physicians do you put on businesses. i know it is easier for a big player may be that is on the stock exchange to stay in business. we want everyone to comply is far as safety. we have to balance the small operator and give them some shots. sometimes folks are trying to eliminate some of the competition. through over regulation of industry. we do have that balance to keep in mind. thank you, again, jackie, for

your testimony. a number of your recommendations we are considering. and i hope that through better inspections and better de fined authorities, requirements and safety and equipment in that sort of thing, that we can have and betters anuses passenger bus safety. we appreciate your advocacy. let me yield if i may to the ranking member, mr. defazio. >> thank you. to ms. ferro and major palmmer you were emphatic about en route. how would you solve this problem, inconvenience? how could we solve the en route problem. it seems that is critical for these gipsy operator. s.

they have a post office box somewhere. how would you do it? >> i would think major paul miller will pvide more detail. we set it clear guidelines in terms of where and when, what conditions the to exist in order for the bus to be pulled over. the is a suggestion to consider something like business continuity insurance said they would be required to provide another bus to come to the location and move passengers away if that does is put out of seice. there are provisions like that to insure that safety and safe passage of passengers. in terms of process, i defer to major polymer. >> yes, sir. that is absolutely correct. i really do not know the numbers, but i can tell you in taxes, we have policies and procedures in place already, so even under current regulation if you stop and en route bus for a serious safety violation, we

have procedures in place that the utmost importance when we stop a bus is the safety of the passenger and the driver. and also our enforcement officer. we do not want to put them in harm's way. so, for example, depending on where it was an forever reason that boss was spped, if it was deemed inappropriate -- unsafe, then we would escort that bus to a safe location and inspect it there to ensure that passengers are well taken care of. typically, a very quick screening or even a driver inspection, you are talking maybe 10-15 minutes to be able to do that typically. an we would focus on those efforts. it has been the late 1990's since i inspected a bus. when i would stop a bus roadside back then, one of the first things i would do after making

contact with the driver is i would address the passengers, because the passengers are like, what is going on? what i found historically is that the passengers were very appreciative when we did take the time, when you tell them what you're looking for and about the safety aspects, they encouraged that. so we would have specific procedures iplace. that is something that fmcsa can provide leadership on. cbsa would be able to provide that. we have operational policies that all of the states agreed to. and we could enhance that enforcement that way. >> if a bus were speing, you could stop them. we did have this elderly person that drove into the back of a bus, clearly not good driving on that person's part. so to say, we should not have any capability of pulling people over because every once in a while someone who is asleep, under cell phone, or competent

is going to drive into it, this is a problem. in my state, if your patrol car is here and the boss is there, and it is a two or three lane highway, you're required to leave alain montana and move to the left. there are ways -- you are required to leave a lane and move to the left. it only favors the people that do not have a sixth operation. where are you going to get them? i think opposing this entirely is not reanable and would urge the association in saying that there should be no capability. think about how we can get at it again. again, how we did at the bad actors who are not in your association? this is the key. it was from law enforcement and from the administrator. i think we need to modify that provision of the law. the other thing would be state

inspections. i see here in the aba testimony that you say state inspection programs muste strengthened. fewer than a dozen states have effective s inspection ograms and less than half have any program at all. >> that is correct. we do not think there are enough states focusing on buses. they are focusing on trucks and commercial vehicle inspections. they are doing an admirable job with the resources they have. they're not focused on buses. we saw the accident that happened in new jersey two months ago. that company was based in pennsylvania, but nobody saw them in pennsylvania. the company that had the accident in virginia was based in north carolina and a housing development. there was no sign of that bus at the facility or that house whatsoever. we are concerned. we are concerned about the way some of these companies operate,

as you are. we are also concerned, talking about en route inspections, abou the safety of passengers carried most are seniors or children. we have passengers with disabilities on the coach. we need to make sure whatever change there is allows for accommodation of those passengers. >> and on, basically, operating out of the housing or a postlopment office box, requiring an annual inspection by each state of these -- of each vehicle every year, would that be an unreasonable burden? >> it would not be unreasonable. >> ok. and that would also get at some of these people. could the kind of like, this is different, but with the coast guard, i live on a boat, they can certify your boat. it is improbable they will do a random boarding to do a safety inspection if you have a current sticker showing you are

inspected. if we do and inspections, and people had some sort of decal, although those things could be counterfeit, then that would be someone at that the police would be much less likely to look as someone who needs in en route inspection, seems to me. some way of getting states to do this, incenting them to do it, and requiring them to do read and some sort of a pross. then, perhaps, and take it one step further, what if you had annually, $300 good forever. on an annual basis, you have to show your vehicle has been inspected or we will suspend that authority. mr. panuso? tuso? >> as we look at the new entry

program, we think $300 is not enough. costs $350 to g a hot dog vendor license on the streets. we think there should be a higher bar of entry. and that amount could be used to fund the pre-inspetions as well. it could be $1,00 or $2,000. has to be reasonable. we cannot create a barrier to entry. it is a mom and pop small business. we want to encourage that. but at the same time, we want to make sure that people have the wherewithal to maintain their equipment. if they do not have more than $300, i question how they could do that down the road. >> what do you think of that? >> we do not have any objection to raising the bar. we want to make sure that the bar is reasonable. if it is $500,000, that is

reasonable. we want to make sure it is not a barrier,ecause these companies create jobs. they are good for the economic base wherever they are. >> i get that. i am glad you agree. to the administrator, do you have the authority is that statutory? >> it is statutory. we would propose increasing the limit. keeping in mind, it is a one time fee. >> we have some consensus on that. that is something we can put in the bill. requirements on states for inspections, a higher one time fee for registration which could help fund some of the safety and doing the pre-inspections. i will see if i can get one step further. the chairman reference airlines. when we do airlines, we require that the operator actually be certified. and i've been here long enough that i remember when we threw frank lorenzo out of the industry. so, the question would be, -- we

talk about background checks for medical's and all that -- could we have background checks for operators because that way we could get at thishantom problem because we know this person, they had a comny that violated, they are not qualified operator to start another company with a different name and run those buses. could we have something like that, yes? >> yes, indeed, we could. in terms of liability and responsibility for principles identified as unsafe and reincarnated, that they could be barred from operating. >> can you do that administratively? in the statutory authority. i hope we can provide that. it would be used only in extreme cases. but some of these people are bad, repeat offeers. we want to stamp them out. we want to provide more business for the good operators. with that, thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you. mr. kobel.

>> thank you, all, for your testimony. the private over the road bus industry provides 750million passenger trips annually. how safe is the motor coach industry compared to other modes of transportation? >> disir, is that question for me? we agree wh many of the other speakers that it is among the safest. we are somewhat limited in our data and the industry writ large bite virtue of the inspection -- by virture of the inspection it is under. in terms of the number of crashes, they are very low. >> i realize that accidents are inevitable, but do you attribute anything specificallto the short -- a shortcoming to the recent market accidents? >> let me just clarify. the vast majority of the

industry is operating effectively. these are small operators. those individual owner-operators small-business owners. in regard to the recent crash, again, we are in the midst of the investigation, but at the outset, we can see that the facility with which some of the bad actors movie critic and drivers -- move drivers. tos within our authority proceed, as well as stronger tools to prohibit reincarnation on a more effective level than we can today. add to kobel, can i that? motor coach crashes that increased dramatically. we have many, many more people taking them. unfortunately, our safety

systems are not adequate. so, well, yes, it is a relatively safe mode of transportation, we have zero tolerance for aviation crashes, even though we now have as many people using motor coaches. and we have hundreds of people dying. already this year, 24 people have been killed and hundreds injured in 11 motor coach crashes. >> i thank you for that. major palmer distinguish for me the difference between en route bus inspections and strike force operations. in terms of time and money, which of the twoserve us better? >> they're both unique in their n right. they accomplish inspections, but they do it any differently. the en route inspection is something -- it is a surprise. it is not something that you can prepare for. i mean, the good carries out there do not have an issue.

the ones that do not, they do not have time to prepare or changeup some equipment or make some quick fixes to get by for a day. most of the strike forces that are done now are related, they are going to be some type of m&a hazardan -- imminent involved. >> strike force inspections, do they give advanc notice? are they surprised? >> they can be both. they are surprised at the beginning, but once the first group of buses gets there to the location and we start inspecting them, then the surprise is gone. so then other folks can find out, that is where we are at. but they both to have their benefit. it is just that -- they both have their benefit. you are also at the mercy of a

business, whether it be somebody like seawolrrld of some other venue, or the actual passenger carrier company, whether they would let us come to the facility to do inspections. that is one of the downside to the origin and destination. >> thank you, gain, for your testimony. >> i have one quick question for the administrator. it is my understanding that you grant the operating authority for all of these buses. it is my understanding that d.o.t. gave operating authority to sky express worldwide travel and super luxury tours operating authority. you did that little number that they put on the side. you get all of those, right? those were the ones involved. then after the incident, you with true that authority. >> that is correct. althree of those carriers had

passenger carrier authority prior to are betting programs and all three have been shut down. >-- prior to our vetng programs and all three have been shut down. >> ms. richardson. >> thank you. ms. ferro, in your testimony, your reference a new program -- think safety every trip every time. youay this is available on- line. what other processed you have in place for consumers to know about this? this seems a little unrealistic. i s recently in new york. i bought a ticket for the lip trip. -- the loop trip. i did not go on line. what else are you doing besides this to communicate? >> we have several strategies. one is to just make sure people know that there is safety information available on our website about carriers. some of the trade associations

also provide links to individual carriers, safety data so the customers themselves can link in and understand they can think safety every trip every time. >> other than websites, what process do you have for the average consumer? in testimony, you are talking about seniors people not going on website. do you have nebraska process, people call a number, is there something available -- do you have any process, people call in number, what other aggressive things have you done? >> to areas in particular. there are van operators and the whole population of the faith based community that utilize the 16 passenger vans. with regard to motor coach operations, is through our web site, it is through this particular campaign it that the secretary launched recently. i would add, very important, it

is the proposal to our technical assistance who allow us to regulate brokers of passenger tickets. that is those who sell tickets online and to parker's and travel services. >> i do not >> i do not think you understand my question. i go to buy a ticket for a motor coach and i walk up, how do i know what to look for to know that it is safe or they are approved by the department of transportation? is there any system to communicate to the average nsumer who walks up, do we have any communication emplaced? >> we do not today. >> i have to keep going. you mentioned in your testimony that you think there should be

some sort of inquiry into the fitness of an erator prior to the individual being able to begin operations? can you describe what you meant by that? >> right now, there is an 18 month window. before the first passenger gets on board, somebody needs to look at that carrier and asked them where they're getting the maintenance done. what kind ofquipment are they going to operate? what kind of training today have for their driver? those kinds of questions before the trip ever takes place. >> if there i no objection, would you mind submitting some of those helpful questions that you think shoulde considered? >> i will, absolutely. >> i am not done yet. there was talk that the states

used the same pool of funding for truck inspections as they do for bus inspections. coming from a port community, i find that to be very problematic. are you opposed to identifying a specific percentage? >> we are pleased to work with committee on the recommendation. through the annual safety plan process, we require states to develop and include the identification of a region or a state appropriate bus safety plan driven by what their data is sing, their bus population. it is incorporated into every plan. it is less formal and some the states. i would be happy to work with the committee on that. >> my last question, in this

statement, he said that dozens of states do not even have programs at all. how -- is this your understanding? >> to clarify, we do not see good bus inspection programs in some states. we see programs that are very vigorous. michigan, california does a great job. massachusetts does a great job. there are others that do very good jobs. at the same time, we see a lot of places that do not put an assist on a bus inspections. >> we work closely with all of our stakeholders in this regard to identify the best strategies. >> you are familiar with the ones that are not appropriate? >> we are familiar with that concern. it has been part and parcel over the last four years by the

agency has inc. and expectation of an action plan without each -- wou then each commercial vehicle. is an evolving process. >> thank you. >> i grant unanimous consent that to the recommendation requesd be made a part of the record. information or response to questions. without objection, so ordered. let me recognize the gentleman from pennsylvania. i apologize for the delay. i know you have to get all by 4:00. >> i am a little confused. i will direct the question to roadside inspections.

are we allowed to do -- it is not prohibited to do roadside inspections? >> roadside inspections are authorized for high risk operator behavior. if that dryer it is -- if that driver is showing on safe operating behavior, that could take action. >> what about targeting a bus company that has shown -- that has violated operations safety rules? that would not be a reason to target. >> that is not currently authorized. >> your view on that? >> are concerned goes back to the safety of the passengers. as long as the passengers are protected, as long a the seniors, the students, those

passengers with disabilities are taken care of, we are fine with modifications to the existing law. >> the bill i hav proposed, if we put in there that -- allowing those bus operations that do not have a home base, is that something that you would support? to be able to inspect them on the roads? obviously, most of your operators have a home base. it is easy to get in there. >> that is a good question. companies that operate from the curb may not have a terminal where people go, but they have a home base. there is an owner of that company. hopefully, they have a garage, training. they all take passengers to the same place. they all go to the same destinations.

if it is a scheduled service operation, they are doing other point to point service. there is a destination, and origin. if there as an opportunity to do and enrapt and take care of the passengers, the passengers are first and foremost. >> i would hope that if a company does have a marginal safety record, they would be stopped before they got on the road. whether it be closing down or -- the program right now red flags those companies that may not have had an accident, but because of one of the five categories, they are considered a risk. we will intercede at that point and hopefully, when the carrier has enough alerts on their

listing, at bay would be stopped, prevented from operating. that is the best way to catch them as opposed to trying to get them on the road. >> i appreciate the point. the challenge is that these operators are the very ones that would never have been inspected because we do not always know where their origin or destination is. large parking lots, at various that are no fixed terminal in terms of a destination or a casino. this is the vy population that we do not have inspection data on. >> they start somewhere. they have some sort of home base. >> i can give you an example in texas in the houston area, we have operators that literally the only way we can sometimes figure out where they are out or were they will pick up or come out of is we go to certain areas

and we look for fliers. the flyers tell them where to pick them up at. that is one of the major challenges and that is happening in houston, texas. in relationship to specific legal language about who the inspection would be applied to would be very difficult. from a state perspective, that is more of a policy issue. at the very least, you would see the states, what they wld implement certain policies to ensure the safety of the passengers. that is the bottom line. >> if you cannot get them en route, you can inspect them at both places. >> that is right. that is correct. >> thank you very much. i yield back. >> the gentleman from indiana.

>> thank you, mr. chairman. i had a couple of questions related to the budgetary process. do you know what your budget was in 2008? >> i do. >> can you tell me? >> we had $300 million in grant of 40 and $220 million in operating revenue. -- in grant authority and $220 million in operating revenue. >> 2010? >> we were at $310 million in grants and 2$50 million in operating. it is about 560. >> the request for the 2012

budget? >> for our 2012 budget, the request is $50 million more, a 20 million of that for state grants. predominately system's investment. it is about 100 positions. >> anytime when we are expanding spending at the federal level exponentially, compared to 2008 and this year, i am trying to figure out exactly why it seemed like what you were doing was adequate, but every year, it seems like every agey continues to ask for more money. we recently had bus crashes in 2011, which did not seem like the increased amount of money

really made any difference in my own mind, i am trying to justify exactly why that would be. it seems to me that it might be more or a better thing to do to transfer me of the money that he was allocated over to the state so that we can have a more pointed inspection program rather than continuing to increase our budget at the federal level. what the think about that idea? >> i

are we getting to our thorough inspections of the high-risk carriers simply not? that is always a resource issue. >> we try to control the running budget. nding somewhat to the unfair characterization of trying to control the budget. it seems that a lot of folks want to say that if we go back to a spending level that we had a few years ago, these are draconian dramaticuts that will intent on our ability to run your organization and others. i would argue that is not true. i want to clarify exactly what you are plaing to do.

how many people do you have working for you? >> we have 1090. >> what's -- what is the breakdown? are they all year in washington? >> 800 of them are in the field. we have division offices in every state. we have a division administrator and safety investigators. how many administrators obverses investigators? >> there is one division administrator for each state. investigators are driven by the size of the motor carrier population in that state. out of that 800, roughly 500 are dedicated to investigation and inspection activity. we also have four regiona service centers which process each investigation, has the risk of prompting a legal action by the carrier. it may be related to the results of the inspection or investigation itself.

there is a mission critical support associated with our work, which has to do with lawyers as well as litigation attorneys as well as our system support. out of the numbers i cited, up 400 investigators and 250 inspectors along our southern border. at about 800. there are additional support personnel and auditors. >> thank you. i yelled back. >> -- i yield back. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. i do not intend to ask any questions because i was just able to get your a few minutes ago. i have read key portions of the testimony. i want to say that the organization has 800 members.

mr. perry's organization has called hundred members. what that says to us is that this is an industry would mostly very small and medium- sized businesses. in almost every industry that becomes very rd to regulated or overly regulated, it ends up in the hands of a few big giants. i hope that we do not go overboard in reaction to a couple of bad operators. i do not have any problems with coming down hard on be very bad operators. when i was in law practice, i represented -- one of my clients was a small bus company. they had three drivers. the owner of the company had driven 2 million miles at the

time i represented him. the other to driver's side driven over a million miles without an accident. as far as i know, they never ha any kind of accident that was their fault at all. that was a good company. it was a very small business. i appreciate the work that these companies do. they provide a very important service to the people of this nation and to lower and middle income people. let's be very careful in what we do what wes work to need to do and be careful that we do not run out a little guys are making it hard for new people to come into the business because of two or three companies that have messed up. thank you very much.

>> i think that a comment from tennessee. let's go back now -- i thank you the gentleman from tennessee. >> thank you, mr. chairman. i am pleased tt chairman duncan was able to have an opportunity to review the testimony. i agree with this sentiment, which is we do not want -- we are not proposing to regulate those who are doing a good job. we have had some consensusn fees that are charged for entry from both the associations, the possibility of raising those fees, that would not bar entry, but would also help better find the inspection certification program. we had discussion of certifying operators so when you get a bad operator, it sticks with them,

even though they might come up with a new corporate entity or a new name on the website for their curb to curb service. that could be helpful. we had some discussion on what you do en route versus people who do not have a fixed place of operations. i do not understand -- it says, revised current law to ensure driverdcdl can be revoked. i thought that was already alwed.

>> right now, most of those offenses -- i saw that same point. that is a misprint because i agree. for serious offenses, we have the authority for states to disqualify. to clarify the particular provision, when the issue and out of service order on a driver, and there is no connection between our action and the state cdl. and feel there needs to be an action. another employer may hire that driver. >> ok. right now, even though he may suspend or -- you may suspend or bar them, the states and are required to follow suit. >> that is correct. >> i think we talked about this with trucking were you have people who hop states when they

have had serious problems. we talked about having a unified data base to keep track of people. is there a requirement on the trucking side? >> only for state convictions. for sufficient serious violations, a state is required to disqualify that a driver from holding their cdl. and out of service order is not necessarily in that list. >> i would appreciate seeing someanguage on bad. >> if i could just clarified the drug and alcohol peace. there is no link to the individual cdl. that randomized process for testing, should a driver test positive,