simonson from the national association for business economics. .

host: president obama yesterday at the white house in a statement following the death of gaddafi in libya. nato is set to meet today to likely officially end the mission, the bombing mission that it has been conducting there. in our first 45 minutes, we will talk about the president's approach to the libya operation. there's a number of analysis pieces this morning that suggested could be a template for future u.s. missions. the concept of libya -- a new model for? -- a new model for war? our question, again, libya, a new model for war? good morning. to set the stage about the u.s.

approach under the leadership of president obama to the libya mission, let me show you some of the headlines today. for example, "the wall street journal" today. "the wall street journal" today. in "the new york times," an analysis for obama. and, "the financial times." the front page of "the washington post" today. that front-page piece looks at the leadership style. on the line with us is mark landler, who wrote the article for "the new york times." thank you for being with us. guest: good morning. glad to be here. host: give us the essence of

what you explored in your piece. guest: i was exploring the way president obama has begin to set out a discernible foreign policy. as you said, it contrasts quite clearly with the bush administration and many presidents before him. it is one that emphasizes surgical strikes over massive troop deployment. it focuses on building a coalition and collective action. all of the elements of that were on display in the libya operation, where, as you know, the president acted only after building up support from nato allies and arab neighbors of libya, but actually by insisting

that france and britain take a lead role in the air campaign with the u.s. providing front end logistical support and not actually providing the ongoing air power. this was a model that was really very different than what we saw in iraq and afghanistan. it raises all sorts of questions. i suppose the most obvious one of which is, to what extent is this a model for u.s. involvement in creaturfuture co? host: it's not without its price tags. the vice president referred to it as $2 billion, but not a life lost. guest: one of the major targets for cost cutting in the deficit reduction exercise that is under

way now, of course, will be the pentagon budget. in the president's speech last april, he talked about reducing the pentagon budget by at least $400 billion over 10 years. it was that kind of austerity and cost-cutting in the pentagon's future -- it's hard to imagine how the pentagon could take part in the kind of open ended, massive commitment of troops that we saw in both afghanistan and iraq. there simply will not be the money for that. to the extent that this operation cost $2 billion -- and other people have said have1.10 -- have said $1.1 billion. i did think money played a role, but not a foremost role.

clearly, that was also an issue on the table. host: the politics of this. in a reelection campaign, foreign policy often the purview of republican candidates. when you listened to the president, how did you see him framing his foreign policy leadership skills? guest: he clearly said there was a link to the positive ending in libya and the raid that killed osama bin laden, as well as other rates and drone strikes that have killed al qaeda leaders. he says this was the case of seeing american leadership all across the world. he also pointed out, at the same time these successes are happening, the administration is transferring control for security to the afghan ans in afghanistan. he is setting out a record of

success that goes back to the early of this administration and is likely to contrast sharply with his handling of the economy, where there have been so many problems. on the foreign-policy front, he's running on a quite strong record. host: thank you for joining us on this friday morning. guest: thank you. host: we are going to get your calls, e-mails, and tweets. we have some statistics. the dollar figure $1.1 billion comes from the pentagon, but that does not include the state department, cia, and other agencies involved. $1.1 billion is the pentagon's aspect of this. "the national journal" is quoting vice-president joe

biden. other figures -- host: pat is a democrat. you are on the "washington journal." caller: good morning. i am not at all convinced that gaddafi is dead. all we have is local the video images and reports. if it were him, i think we would see some photos or a body. i suspect later we will hear he was buried at sea. this whole operation nato has done in libya was to prove to africa that nato -- that the

toughest country in africa was libya. gaddafi did not let corporations in to explore oil. educated americans and individuals who researched this will come to that conclusion. i do think this is a new protocol for war state-sponsored -- assassination. i would like to hear a lot of politicians talk about that, like ron paul. host: many of the newspapers and web sites have multiple pictures of gaddafi's body. here is one that is in "the wall street journal" we just showed you. some more graphic photographs on the pages of the new york tabloids. they were all over the news yesterday. "the new york post" has this.

this photograph, "a coward to the end." we're asking whether the nato operations in the u.s. participation in that creates a new model for war. john is a republican. good morning. caller: i seem to recall the hospital was blown up. mainstream media will have to forget that ever happened. how about the rocket launchers, the thousands of those? i have a feeling that a lot of israeli planes will have difficulty with those, if they do not make it over to the united states. the muslim brotherhood now is [inaudible]

that's all i will say. host: john from maryland. online, this tweet from fred bingham. let's take a look at the timeline of the u.s. involvement in libya. beginning in march, the senate first approved a nonbinding resolution urging the u.n. to impose a no-fly zone on march 17. the u.n. approved a resolution authorizing action to protect libyan civilians. the multistate coalition begins on march 19. the president addressed the nation on this on march 28. march 31, nato takes control over the no-fly zone. june 24, the house votes against u.s. military operations and rejects efforts to limit funding. next is a call from baltimore. jordan is an independent there. guest: thank you for the

opportunity. today is a great day for the people of libya, a country i'm from, liberia, a country gaddafi sent -- i am a victim of gaddafi. i lost my mother, my sister, and 250,000 die because of the 60 years of civil war gaddafi paid for. the amputation of babies and the rape of women and the killing of men. today is a great day for africa and we thank god for nato, president obama, nicolas sarkozy, and the president of great britain. you've done the country of never got a great deal. thank you very much. every day gaddafi was in power,

someone in africa was getting killed. every day. today, justice has been done. we are very happy. [speaking foreign language] god bless the continent of africa. host: to echo that -- this on twitter from monty labban. from "the wall street journal" this morning, here is a bit of what barnes writes.

"the americans took the initial lead, but mr obama's insistence quickly handed over the air strikes." host: the next call is from las vegas. denny, a republican. good morning. caller: good morning. have been a big non supporter of obama throughout his president. the strikes he has done on

pakistan and the nato strike on libya are probably the finest part of his presidency. it shows off our military might without one single troop on the ground. we're able to liberate a country. this type of technology, using these types of weapons to conduct war, instead of sending thousands of troops on the ground and coming back with a bunch of casualties'. host: thank you for your call. echoing that is the lead story in "the washington post" today. this is the paper's front page.

that is the "washington post" this morning. next is a comment from st. louis.

this is bill, a democrat. good morning. caller: i do not know how you call this a war. it is the same old thing of slaughtering civilians, killing their leader and stealing their resources. that is what we are getting out of libya. it is nothing but state- sponsored terrorism by the united states government. libya has not done anything to us, and neither did gaddafi. you people are cowart. anybody that stands for what we just did is nothing but a coward. host: and next comment comes from oregon, the town of roseland. this is ken. caller: gaddafi was staged based on what dr. steve buchanan, who worked with special forces and operations for 20 years and has hollywood connections -- and he said it was staged.

the green charter movement claims gaddafi is alive. the enemy is seeking to take advantage of his currently being out of communication. hillary clinton wants small- market dobbie dead or alive. -- want no more gaddafi dead or alive. -- once the muammar gaddafi dead or alive. it would have been very embarrassing to the u.s. to have him brought before the icc because he would have brought up that the overflow of libya was accomplished through al qaeda terrorist and british troops in iraq.

if he was such a terrorist, how come the president met with him? this would have saved a lot of embarrassment and i think this was staged. i was on the countdown show with this for 2 million listeners this morning and doug statin did not contradict a word i said after my presentation. host: ken from roseland organ. here is a column today.

that is john podhoretz this morning in the "new york post." we are asking if you saw what was happening in the libya involvement tornado. the next caller is from josh. caller: i have three points and i will make them as concise as possible. your guest at the beginning of the show, i would caution him to

avoid participating in presenceism when he describes -- presentism when he describes president obama as being multilateral. i would remind him that two of the largest force of this world has seen were fought in the 20th century, and for half of the 20th century we had a bipolar hegemony with the solar -- the soviet union and the u.s. on to my second point, the callers that have called in kayaleh suggesting that the people that support -- that have called in suggesting that the people that support the ouster of gaddafi, not necessarily his execution, but his ouster of these, the idea that we are cowards -- i would suggest to

his supporters that they take a hard look at themselves as individuals. how many people have to die at the hands of a dictator before it is justified to take this person out, no matter their iq. lastly, i would say indirect regards -- in direct regard to the question you posed today, we need to take a look at the definition of hardware for -- armed warfare and conflict in today's world because i think they have changed. obama's counterinsurgency methods and anti-terrorist methods, i believe, are just an evolution of the pentagon's anti-terrorist strategy, and i think it is working. it is a more intelligence base and a limited troop involvement

strategy -- intelligence-based and a limited-troop involvement strategy, and i think it is working. terrorism today is definitely not what it was in the 1970's, let's say. >> are you -- host: are you a military man yourself? caller: former marine, yes. host: thank you for your call. next is ritchie, independent. caller: the goal since world war ii has been to take over the middle east, and that is exactly what we are doing. next it will be syria and then it will be lebanon. it just goes on and on. we just love killing people and when we kill people, we are nice guys. we are killing them because those guys are bad. who are we to judge who is bad and was good -- and who is good? this is definitely about

business. this is just going to keep going. host: richie from mullen, massachusetts. joe, a twitter community member, asked this question -- in-line let's listen to more of the president yesterday about muammar gaddafi from the rose garden. >> the dark shadow of tierney has been lifted and with this enormous promise, the libyan people have a great responsibility, to build an inclusive, tolerant, and democratic libya that stand as the ultimate rebuke to gaddafi's dictatorship. we look forward to the announcement of the country's liberation, the quick formation of an interim government, and a stable transition to the villa's first free and fair elections.

-- libya's first free and fair elections. >> let's take a look -- host: let's take a look at u.s. operations in libya. back to your telephone calls. springfield, vt. is up next. maria, republican. you are on the air. caller: good morning. i do not approve of what is going on in libya with president obama. he is getting every credit he wants to be reelected, and i hope he does not succeed. that is all i need to say.

host: maria from vermont. some callers have called -- have talked about the arab spring. here is a look at the uprising.

next is a call from silver spring. good morning. caller: most people do not know what they are talking about. they just say what they have heard from other people or the media and have not done the research themselves. the u.s. has committed more murders and atrocities and international crimes, i believe, then gaddafi or any is, terrorist group -- or any islamic terrorist group in the world. and the other thing is that minister farrakhan told us that our government plan to go into the b i in 1989. this was in a press conference. -- into libya in 1989.

this was in a press conference. you can youtube it yourself. there are many people who are not happy with the americans, were not happy with the way that our representatives are representing us. take a look at what they have done to our firefighters and teachers and police officers. it do not get more basic than that. and we are spending billions of dollars in other countries when our country is falling apart. and yet, we are promoting the death and killing in other parts of the world. there is something wrong with that. host: he is rents -- referencing the vote in the senate last night, the bifurcated jobs bill. the democrats pushed one part of the plan.

one of the plan's key components, which would have provided $35 billion to local governments to teachers and first responders. next is bronx, new york, bill, democrat. bill, good morning. you are on. we're going to move on to britain to, florida, john, republican.

caller: i was wondering why the press has not covered the money that we have given to libya in the last 40 years. secondly, is the united states celebrating assassinations of leaders around the world? and thirdly, what is going to happen in libya now? gaddafi was a stabilizing force there. the people that are going to come in our or not, and what are we going to do now? host: for the caller that does not believe that mark mahdavi was killed in libya, but "washington post" says -- mooar gaddafi was killed in libya, the "washington post" says this -- allie

next caller. caller: many people repeat what they hear from the media, and from reports that are one-sided. what is going on in libya, thousands of libyans were massacred. in one town, 22,000 people were killed. and thousands of sub-saharan africans were killed in libya.

host: now that gaddafi is gone, what are the prospects for the future? caller: i do not know. host: are there elections in tunisia? caller: the last time another country invaded the villa was 1989. they massacred one-third of the people of libya. it has not been that long since the prince killed many people in

nigeria. many of the people do not understand what is going on. i wish them well. i would just like to say that so many people were killed because they are allowed. -- they are black. host: a question for you, again, do you support what nato did it in libya? caller: no, not at all. give me two seconds to save what i'm trying to say. americans, especially african- americans, i want them to investigate what is going on there and find out the crimes. and do whatever they can do. thanks for taking my call.

host: thanks for making it. the next call from ohio, katherine is watching us. good morning. caller: here in the u.s., if the firefighters or policemen or teachers want a job, they better sign up for the military because it appears that is all the republican party will fund. when they came from -- for the manufacturers of everybody said i am not a manufacturer, supplier will not stand up for them. when they came for other union employees, if they said, that is not me, will not stand up for them. now that firefighters, policemen, and teachers' jobs are on the line they want us to stand up for them, but there's no one left. they will have to go and enlist in the military to get a job. that is my statement. thank you very much. host: thanks for making it. clifton, new jersey, republican. good morning. caller: when we were attacked

ahman just from people i know from my home town -- when we were attacked, just from people i know from my home town, people did not like where we live. ordaz we all have to work -- we all have to work together and cut out the hate and hostility. we have to look for the 21st century and we have to stick together in unity, as a peaceful people. it will be a lot better for all of this was not happening we will all get together and like john lennon would say, imagine. thank you for taking my call. i am joseph caniglia from clifton, new jersey.

host: jodi on twitter rights this question -- writes a question. and here is another article.

, a callminneapolis calle from rhey who is watching us there. caller: i was listening to one of the callers a few minutes ago. even though we got rid of gaddafi, i will be voting democratic in 2012 because the republicans, nothing is being

done. here we are and we are getting rid of all of these dictators, these people that are killing everyone else in the world, and obama, even though we don't see what he is doing normally, but we are looking at actions. he has the problem of explaining what can be done. but if you look at actions, we are getting rid of -- what's his name? osama. we are getting rid of the dictator in libya. we just have to give this guy a chance, maybe. host: thanks for your call. about libya in the russian times this morning -- indeed "washington times" this morning

-- next up is kalamazoo, michigan. this is clinton. caller: i completely support what we did in libya, however, i question the reasons behind it. i think we are trying to go after the dictators. i think we are using these dictators as a means to achieve oil -- a lower oil prices in the u.s. and allied i do not -- in the u.s. and i do not think this is the way to do it. i do not think foreign powers should influence certain countries because if it were to

happen to us, we would not like it very much. why would we do it to other people? also, in the 1970's, we tried to influence the middle east and it blew up in our faces. i worry the same will happen now. host: let's check in with our facebook community and what they are saying. back to telephone calls. next up is bronx, joe, a democrat there. caller: i am joe the counselor

from the bronx, not joe the plumber. joe the counselor. it is the second time i have called, and it has been years. i appreciate the call this morning. i do not believe in tierney. my family -- i do not believe in killing. my family does not believe in it. that is number one. number two, i hope that our president is listening this morning so they can tell him what joe the counsellor said. i remember when 9/11 happened. the most wanted person on this planet was ahead of the holdinwe thing that mr. obama killed. we know that.

then there was a lieutenant to him. he killed a lieutenant. and he is never satisfied. now he says the next collection that will be coming will be decided not on foreign issues, but on domestic. mr. obama, i want to tell you, you have to be careful because the republicans are very vicious people. i understand you are doing the best for this country, but at the same time you can do all what you are doing the best. he is a second lieutenant.

there will be a third the tenant. the careful. he is a good brother we have in washington. he is a good man. he is a nice person. we have never had someone so respectable and nice to the whole world. host: thanks for your second call in 15 years. the secretary of state is in the region and has warned pakistan about being a haven for insurgents. waston's tougher tone reinforced by the "washington post" -- the next call as wrap up our

discussion is from oklahoma. coley, go ahead. -- lee, go ahead. caller: i am in the service. i will not say which branch. there was someone that called saying they would not back the government for the teachers' unions, autoworkers. i want to let her know, she talks about having to go in and enlisted in the military to have a job, i am 100% visibility now after almost 16 years of service. -- disability now after almost 16 years of service. we, as the personnel, -- you know, she talks about all of the money is piped into the military. it is going to protect the military. i just want to tell her, if she wants to enlist, go right ahead,

but it is not like working a corporate job 9:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m. it is a 16 hours or more, seven days a week job. but you are expected to always be ready. host: a couple more stories as rep here. the "wall street journal" says -- also from the paper on the debt panel -- and in the "new york times" -- and two more quick stories here.

harrisburg, pa., entering bankruptcy. the governor of the state moves to take physical control of that capital. and in the quarter * -- in the --shington times" our last call on whether or not libya present a new model for war, virginia. good morning to kevin, an independent there. caller: how are you doing today? host: great. you are a last caller -- our last caller. caller: we are in libya really

because of oil. and my main problem is that we a people here the united states protesting. how would it look if we were out there with guns and attacking our government? how come we are not allowed to do? -- to do that? i am really disappointed with barack obama. i am an african-american and i will not vote for this man again. we went into the cargo -- we ngo dyingle in the cond and we are not doing anything. there's a lot of stuff we do not know about. and about these dictators, i don't know that these guys are bad. everybody is saying these guys are bad.

i am really hurt. there is so much happening in this country that i'm really disappointed with. host: thank you for your call from virginia. on c-span2 recover nonfiction books. there is a nonfiction book the smarting -- this morning about steve jobs. host: we are going to take a

quick break. our next program we'll show you the book that will be the centerpiece of this. congressman frank wolf of virginia has written a book called "prisoner of conscience." he'll talk about his involvement in u.s. foreign policy issues. >> because i am a businessman of which incidentally i am very proud and formerly connected with a large company. the opposition have attempted to picture me as an opponent of liberalism but i was a liberal before many of the men heard

the word and i fought for thee door roosevelt and woodrow wilson before another roosevelt adopted and distorted the word liberal. >> he was a member of the democratic party for over 20 years switching in 1940. wendell willkie, although he lost the election, he left his mark in political history, speaking out for civil rights and becoming the ambassador for franklin roosevelt. wendell willkie is part of "the contenders," live from rushville, indiana, tonight at 8:00 p.m. this weekend, six republican candidates watch 7:00 p.m.

saturday on c-span's "road to the white house." every week on "american history tv," the people and events. only once has a u.s. sitting senator has been killed in action. this weekend the 150th anniversary of the battle of balls bluff. historian. on "american artifacts," little tokyo has been the center of japanese culture since the 1970's. on "lectures and history," bowling green professor on the history of opits in america. for schedules in your inbox click the c-span alert button. "washington journal" continues. host: on your screen right now is congressman frank wolf of virginia and he is representing virginia's 10th and he is here to talk to us about his new

book "prisoner of conscience." congressman wolf, i'd like to start with libya since it's in the news and you took a couple key votes on libya over the years. did you overall support what the u.s. was doing? guest: no, i did not. i felt the president should have had support of the congress. when the administration unilaterally does that i think it's not good. having said that, though, i congratulate the president. i'm pleesed that gaddafi is gone. i think we need to make sure that whoever takes place is good. i was in egypt in july and the muslim brotherhood may very well took over and i talked to the christians and they are concerned. i think we need to be careful now it's done. i think the administration deserves the credit and make sure we do to keep a good group in there.

some connected to the rebels have been connected to the mureb dean and al qaeda so -- muse dean and al qaeda so we need to be careful. host: what got you started on all this? guest: i joined a small bible study group. congressman tony hall who is probably my best friend from congress, a democratic from deyton, ohio, we got interested and one day in 1984 he called me on the phone and asked me to go to ethiopia. it was when the famine was going on. i took a plane and went out to ethiopia kind of naively. we got stuck in a camp. the plane was not able to come back. what i saw and experienced was

a life-changing experience. in 1985 a few of us went to romania and it was dark in romania. i mean, evil. people would come up and put notes in our hands saying my husband's in jail and those two trips, ethiopia during the famine where many died and the romania trip in 1985 were really life-changing trips. and so i -- this is an issue that i've gotten interested in. host: with the fall of the wall and the eastern european states opening up, the changes in soviet union, there's been so many changes in the 30 years you've been in congress. are you overall optimistic about the state of things in the world or not? guest: i don't -- i don't say i'm optimistic. we could be. ronald reagan said the words in

the constitution were covenant with the entire word. they were not just for the people of philadelphia in 1787 when they ratified the constitution. people know the words in the constitution. particularly they know the words of the declaration of independence. if we have an administration and a congress that is actively advocating for the persecuted standing up, you know, ronald reagan called the soviet union the evil empire. that 1983 speech but was criticized for but he was right. then he said, tear down the wall. you can do it that way and make changes. as you recall, gorbachev came to ronald reagan's funeral. i've seen that diminished. in congress we had giants like henry hyde and tom lantos who advocated that. scoop jackson. if we do that, push the freedom agenda, then i would be optimistic. but right now in china, the catholic church is going through great pressure.

the bishop of hong kong saw me three months ago. they're doing terrible things to the catholic church. they are percent indicating the uighurs. they're spying against us. we see in egypt the catholic christians now live in great fear particularly after the fall of mubarak. in sudan today as we speak right now they are there are probably bombers flying over the mountains bombing people. ethnic cleansing is taking place and nobody says a thing and so, yes, if america is exercising the moral leadership and we have a wonderful country and do it in a bipartisan way, both republicans and democrats and the president, then i would be optimistic. if we cease to be involved that way, and lastly, if we can't get control of the debt and deficit when we become economically weak, i mean, china's our banker.

china has protestant pastors, plundered tibet, they are our bankers. economically you can't pay our debt and we're borrowing from china, then i think that's not very good and that makes me a little pessimistic. my wife and i have 15 grandkids. i want to be optimistic but to be optimistic you have to do things and i think the model is really president reagan. host: staying with china. in your book you criticized at the time couldn't pleasea rice of not speaking out about china because of the debt situation. what constraints do you see of china holding debt, especially human rights? guest: i think it's an overwhelming constraint. it's a driving issue. president obama who was a 2009 nobel prize winner put on a dinner for tau while the 2010

nobel prize winner was in jail and his wife was under house arrest. the president didn't want to meet with the dalai lama. president bush met with the dalai lama publicly. so i think that debt is really stopping us from saying things and doing things and it ought not to be. we should be advocating for those who are being persecuted and that's why i made the comment. we got to get this debt and deficit down. we got to eliminate it and hopefully we can come together in a bipartisan way to do it so that we can remain not only militarily strong but economically strong because if you're strong economically, i want the 21st century -- the 20th century was the american century because of what probably your mom and dad and your listeners' moms and dads and grandmothers and grandfathers did. i want it to be the american century and not the chinese century. if it's the chinese century it

will be a very dangerous world. host: your chapter 13 begins, are america's best days behind her? guest: well, i don't think so because i think the american people are kind of ready to deal with these things. i think the war has been in washington. in independence hall there is a chair in the room across from where the signing of the declaration took place. george washington would preside over the constitutional convention. there's a story about -- there was a sun carved and graved and painted on the chair that washington sat on. when the constitution was signed, franklin said, i used to look at the chair and i didn't know if it was a rising sun or setting sun. now i believe it's a rising sun. every politician wants to say america's best days are yet ahead and i believe they are if we do what we have to do. if we fail, if we allow this debt and deficit to take over, if we don't advocate and stand up for our principles and we

continue to borrow from china, we're borrowing from saudi arabia. saudi arabia funded the radical s up on the pakistan-afghanistan border. head of the fall ban went to a saudi school. 15 grandkids. i want to be optimistic. i believe that america's best days are ahead. but in order to be there you just can't say it. you have to do it. i think we got to control the debt and deficit and i think the model really for speaking out and advocating for the persecuted, for the poor is really president, president reagan. i admire president reagan. he just had that ability and he could feel what was taking place and with president reagan and with pope john paul and margaret thatcher they changed the world and we can do it again. am i optimistic, for my grandkids i'm optimistic but

i'm optimistic knowing we have to do the right thing. host: you can send us a tweet. for those who don't often watch committee hearings, we pulled a clip one from august where congressman wolf gets involved in discussion about the issue of sudan. let's listen. guest: you have to remove bashir. you have to remove bashir. he has to be removed. government change. regime change. there's no other way. it's been going on for 21 years. 2.1 million people, mainly christians, but some muzz preliminaries, killed in the north-south battle. 200,000 to 400,000 killed in darfur. he just said the u.n. and i heard were turning people over to be taken away. that sounds like the nazis to me. that sounds like something out of a bad movie. the u.n. has failed.

they are war criminals. these are war criminals. host: congressman, how does that passion serve your causes? do you find it's useful or something you don't have control over? guest: i've been to sudan many, many times. i have been in the camps. i was the first member of the house with sam brownback from the senate to go to darfur. there's genocide there. we talked to young women who told us they were raped and as they were raped they were raped -- said they were going to make a lighter skin baby. these people are still in the camps. bashir is an indicted war criminal. osama bin laden lived in sudan for -- from 1991 to 1995. bashir is responsible. and right now it's his aircraft or bombing innocent civilians in the nubea mountains and just -- nuba mountains and just this

week the government of malawi invited bashir to come in for an economic conference. the world stood up to ma lows vitch -- melosivich. just seeing this and i saw the women in the camps and i saw the people and it just doesn't seem right and also the number one supporter of bashir is china. the largest embassy in khartoum is china. china is getting a large portion of its oil. china has blocked the u.n. peacekeepers from being active there. so when you see this and i had a lady in the camp, her name was rebecca, she said, you in the west seem to care about the what else. you don't care about us -- you

care about the whales. you don't care about us. it's being going on for 20 years. so -- host: question for you. how do the citizens of virginia react about your passion about foreign policy issues in foreign nations especially as our own economy is challenged? guest: well -- i'm grateful for the opportunity to serve having run for re-election. i'm very grateful to my constituents. jim cooper and i came up with the concept of this debt commission four, five years ago. we're adding a new -- we added a new lane on the t.r. bridge and just widened i-66 and fighting the ms-13 gangs. no, i think -- you know, i do. host: and you mentioned tony

hall was one of your great friends, a democrat from ohio. what do you think about the current state between the parties in congress? guest: it's not good. it's not good. host: and what caused it, do you know? guest: i don't know. i really don't know. i think tony hall, he may not want me to call a liberal democrat --, he's moderate liberal democrat. he's my friend. i'm a conservative republican. we became friends in 1982 and we still meet together. we're still friends. something has happened and i don't know that i can, you know, explain what it is but i think you can have differences. and ronald reagan was a model again. ronald reagan and tip o'neal, you hear the stories. i don't know how close they were but they cooperated and worked together. i think the country is in such

a difficult time. high unemployment, housing foreclosures and so i think it's time. i am a conservative republican. i believe in the values of my party. i think -- and tony and i found a number of issues that we can work on. host: tell me about the title of your book "prisoner of conscience." guest: well, it says my conscience tells me to do these things. host: and you can't escape it? guest: no. host: who was the biggest influence on you do you think in your life? you say ronald reagan. guest: my faith. my mom and dad. my faith. their being in a group with tony hall and dan coats and so many other. it's not the one. it's been kind of an evolving process. host: let's get our viewers involved.

beginning with a call from tammy, a democrat in rockford, illinois. please, go ahead, tammy. caller: yes. i'm just trying to say that i think that everybody should quit trying to down obama because he brought most of our children home. he's trying to stop the war. ok. host: congressman wolf. guest: well, i'm not sure what wars he's talking about but i have a bill, we passed the house, we're trying to get it passed in the senate, it sets up a study group to look at this afghanistan war. maybe what to do and what is appropriate. maybe what they're doing is not. maybe there's a better way. i don't have the answers but i was the author of the iraq study group. jim baker, republican. good guy. congressman hamilton, good person, to come together and

pennetta served on that panel. gates served on that panel and they came up with good ideas. i want to look at pakistan as part of it because if you can't be successful in pakistan you are not going to be successful in afghanistan. the administration opposes my bill. i can't get them to comment on it. now we're going to hopefully pass it in the senate but going to bring republicans and democrats. it's supported by crocker who is our ambassador in afghanistan. he supported it before he got appointed. so in fairness -- it's supported by jim dobbins. it's supported by a lot of people. the commandant of the marine corps. let's take it what i call fresh eyes on the target. let's take fresh eyes. if you had a health care problem you would want to get a second opinion, and i don't know the answer. i don't but i think there's people out there. let's let them look at it and see, is everything the president and the administration is doing appropriate or should there be

a change? but we can't get the administration to support that. host: here's a tweet from judy tom who writes -- how much does oil politics drive our foreign policy? guest: i think it drives it to a certain extent. there's a lot of interest in darfur. george clooney has done good work. mia farrow has done good work. rorger farrow who was in the bush administration. president bush did it. president bush appointed special envoy to give the north-south agreement. i give president bush credit. what he did on sudan he focused like a laser beam and because of president bush and having pointed -- appointed john and colin powell, they were able to bring about that north-south

agreement. i think americans care. it's just that darfur is so far away and it's very difficult for the media to get there and it's not on everybody's -- i don't think oil is a deciding factor whether we should be active in there egypt doesn't have any oil but we need to be active. we've given them $50 billion and millions of christians live in fear. caller: good morning. how are you doing, mr. wolf? guest: doing good. thank you. caller: look. i am not going to discuss foreign politics with you. i want to point out two quick points. first, i disagree with that china -- i think the federal reserve is digging this hole for us. there is only one candidate, and ron paul has been saying for decades about how genocidal these people are. i mean literally they are

destroying this country. the second point i want to make is about the mid eastern policy concerning the palestinians and the israelis. now, there's a gentleman named gid yen levi. and i think the israeli newspaper he writes for and he wrote a brilliant book, article after article in how difficult it is and case of the violations the palestinians on human rights and it's almost nonexistent in america because it's so top heavy with the israeli pro-zionist it's hard to get the information out there. there's more open debate -- in fact in israel than it is in america about the discrepancy i believe is between the israeli and the palestinians when it comes to the policies concerning that. those are the two key points,

if we want to try some of these problems internationally we have to first deal with the federal reserve and right on the heels of that deal with the discrepancy which i believe exists between our policies in the mideast between the israelis and the palestinians and i thank you for taking my question. bye-bye. guest: thank you. well, on the first -- on i preal, israel is our friend and i have not read the book and don't know what the gentleman said but israel is our friend in the middle eeflt. on the other issue you raised with regard to china, china is stealing secrets from us. there are two companies in america, those who subbing for cyberattacks to china and those cyberattacks and do not know it. my computer was stripped by the chinese government. i mean, here you have g.e. signing an avionics deal with china to develop their avionics

with china. we have to bring those companies back. china's spying against us, chinese is persecuting the catholic church, the protestant church, they've plundered tibet. and lastly, china is involved in activities from sudan to other places that are not good. we need to bring those american companies back. if you have an iphone it's made in china. if you have ani pad it's made in china -- if you have an ipad it's made in commeans. i believe commean is a direct threat to this country. both economically and that's why we need to get control of the debt and deficit and not borrow from china. host: you are on the topic of your cyberattack. you write in your book you contacted the f.b.i. to have them look in the situation you just described and they verified that the chinese had been behind the cyberattack on your office and you learned that computers in the offices

of 16 other members of congress, including chris smith, were similarly compromised. what year was this? guest: several years. host: what was the u.s. government or congressional response to this? guest: i raised it on the floor but there was not really much of a response. the f.b.i. comes before my committee on the appropriations committee. nobody wanted to say anything. when members of congress and administration people were going to china, if you take your blackberry to china or your laptop, 30 seconds after you enter the terminal, it's taken. it's stripped. you remember secretary gutierrez who was secretary of the commerce, they took his material when he was in commean and they backed in the computers in the department of commerce. so nobody wanted to say anything. so what we did we urged the house to tell members when you go to china, when you go to some other countries, don't take your blackberry, don't

take your cell phone, don't take your laptop because they are going to strip and take it. host: but this was in your own office? guest: it was. it was my office, chris smith's office, senator kirk's office, the house international relations committee. it was baffling and at times i met with the f.b.i. they initially didn't want to say anything. we pursued the issue and finally we got up and filed a certain motion and addressed it on the floor. it's now when members go, don't take your blackberry. every corporate executive, when they go to china, their blackberry, their cell phone, their laptop is stripped and most now know it but some do not know it. in fact, i believe the science advisor in the white house, we had a hearing when he went to china he took all this electronic equipment and i can guarantee that china stripped it. they're stripping stuff in the pentagon here so when you go and walk in their terminal

there they're taking everything. host: well you right on the same subject. u.s. counterintelligence officials reportedly stated that 140 different foreign intelligence organizations regularly attempt to lack in u.s. government agencies and u.s. companies. is this company sufficiently prepared for cyberattacks? guest: we are not. the administration is attempting and trying to do it but we are not. no, we are not. host: tyson's corner, virginia, independent. caller: one, could you name even one founding father who would have endorsed all of the meddling in foreign payments that you seem to advocate? as a constituent of yours, how do you -- how do you square calling yourself a fiscal conservative when you voted for tarp twice, schip which is obama health care for kids?

you voted for no child left behind. you voted to ban the incandescent light bulb which is goofy. and you voted for tons of local pork. i'll hang up and listen. guest: on the tarp we were facing economic collapse. both bernanke and the secretary paulsen came up and told us basically we may very well face an economic collapse. we could go into another not recession but depression. and i felt i had to do what was in the best interest and to the people that i represent and there are tough votes you take in congress. but now many people believe that had tarp not passed, and we can debate it for hours, that we we would have gone into a depression. had we gone into a depression people would have lost their homes. people would have lost their jobs. i remember my dad telling me, who has since passed away, what it was like to live during the depression. people could have lost all their wealth and so therefore based on that i did what i felt

was in the best interest of the country. with regard to the founding fathers, i think adams. i think a lot of them would have been. i mean, when people are being persecuted and there is a direct interest with regard to the united states. account united states stand by and allow and not speak out on the issue with regard to the persecution of the church in china or the genocide in sudan? ronald reagan articulated very much with regard to the soviet union what was taking place behind the iron curtain. i personally believe and as prayingan said, the words in the constitution and also the words in the declaration of independence is covenant. is deeper than a contract. it's a covenant with the entire world. again, not just for the people in philadelphia in 1776. all men are created equal.

endowed by their creator, by god. god-given rights. and so therefore there's also the passage in luke that says much is given much is required. we have been blessed in this country. i believe we have been blessed. and therefore to advocate for those being persecuted, living through genocide. we watched the world stand by and do nothing when the nazis were doing what they did in the late 1930's. if you recall and you go to the holocaust museum you'll see that the world was silent. we cannot be silent. host: our next segment we are going to be talking about politics and about voter participation. as i move into that theme i want to talk about domestic politics. i have been in pretty publicized argument i guess it would say with grover nor quist about his tax pledge with members of congress. why have you taken him on and what do you think about his criticism of you in response? guest: everyone has every right to criticize me. i don't have any comment about that. i saw he was connected to

groups which i made very clear in my statement and we can share that with everyone about groups he's been connected with and i think that's unfortunate. he's a keeper of the pledge and also been connected to lobbying for fanny mae. he was a -- fannie mae. he was a lobbyist for internet gambling and connected to jake abramoff. when i saw that i just felt the obligation -- he has every right to be whatever -- but the obligation to sort of say this was not a good thing. but he has every right to criticize me. that doesn't bother me. host: criticized of the messenger or do you not like the tax pledge? guest: i don't like raising taxes. i'm from lowering faxes. i support what senator coburn wanted to do. there are so many tax earmarks. tax earmark lives in perpetuity. g.e. payed taxes.

you and your listeners paid more faxes than g.e. paid. one was -- more taxes than g.e. paid. there are about $150 billion of tax earmarks where they get prominent big lobbyist law firms to get a certain tax earmark from. we can low -- i believe we should lower the tax rates for corporations, lower the tax rates for individuals similar to what they talked about in the simplessh simpson-bowles commission. you have to reform the entitlements and then close these tax loopholes. but for g.e. not to pay any faxes, that's just not right. host: last call for you is from minneapolis. go ahead. caller: hi. congressman wolf, thanks for your good work. i also supported you on tarp. i think the idea of protecting

the integrity of the united states financial institution is important. i am particularly calling about freedom of relidge only. i think that's an important component that the united nations doesn't address enough. and that freedom of religion also allows for freedom of thought and freedom of inquiry. and i think that that's one thing that has held back the middle east substantially along with the right to life. and i know you are very involved in those. i'd like to hear your opinion. guest: well, thank you. on the tarp to this -- let me say i am the only member of the congress who publishes my entire voting record. you can go on my webpage and you can see how i vote on every single issue. i made a pledge when i got elected i would make every vote available. i follow the edman burke theory i'll tell you how i voted it. sometimes my kids don't agree with me or my wife. i want everyone to know how i voted and what i voted on.

i appreciate your comment. on the other one, i believe that's who we are. i believe god has blessed this country. and when we advocate and speak out -- now, i am not talking about military force. ronald reagan didn't use military force against the soviet union. in 1983 he talked about the evil empire and it was a speech in orlando, florida. i thought it was a great speech. the media criticized him. then he said, tear down the wall. reagan was consistent. i remember -- i covered chris smith and tony hall and introduced a bill to take away most favored nation from romania. romania was doing bad things for a lot of people. reagan's administration supported most favored nation status but ronald reagan saw this and it's in his diary, he pulled it back. reagan had that understanding and he knew that when we

advocate, when we stand with solidarity, when we stands with those -- and we can do it by speaking out, by advocating, by writing your congressmen, senators, putting tough sanctions on, no law firm would have represented the soviet union during ronald reagan's time. now you have law firms representing china companies. obviously there will be differences of opinion and i respect that. host: congressman frank wolf of northern virginia suburbs, 10th district of virginia. in this book he talks about his journey to congress and also his work in human rights like ethiopia, iraq, sudan, romania and elsewhere. it's called "prisoner of conscience" and widely available. you've been at this congressional situation now for 30 years. 72 years old. still energized? guest: i am. it's -- i tell people, i stutter as a kid.

i still stutter. i always wanted to be a congressman. you can watch "60 minutes" on a sunday night and see something that makes you happy or sad and you can come in the next day and do something about it. and i live here. i live in the same house i lived in, you know, since 1974. my district is right here. so, yeah, as long as the lord gives me the energy and lastly the people that live in my district think that i should be here i'll stay for a while. host: thanks for being here this morning. "prisoner of conscience," his book. thanks for your comments. we are going to take a break. we'll talk about voting. the head of rock the vote will be at our table to talk about young people's involvement in the election.

>> because i am a businessman of which incidentally i am very proud and was formerly connected with a large company, the opposition have attempted to picture me as an opponent of liberalism but i was a liberal before many of those men heard the word and i fought for the reforms of the theodore roosevelt and woodrow wilson. >> he was a member of the democratic party for over 20 years switching in 1940. wendell willkie sought and tried to win for president. he spoke out about civil rights and became ambassador for his

opponent, theodore roosevelt. "the contenders" live from rushville, indiana, tonight at 8:00 p.m. eastern. this weekend on "book tv" on c-span2, live coverage from the texas book festival with juan williams on political correctness. sally jacobs on barack obama's father. alex on fresh water. dana priest on national security. and throughout the weekend panels on the debt, india and pakistan, mexican drug cartels, the art of nonfiction and the arab spring. look for the entire schedule online at booktv.org. >> it's just to me very obvious that with all the priorities we have and they're all worthy till further notice every decision the national government makes, every close call should be made in favor of economic growth.

every tide should be broken in favor of growth of the private sector. >> he worked as advisor in the reagan white house. o.m.b. director in george bush's administration. as governor of indiana, he had a budget surplus. mitch daniels on his new book, the economy and his decision to not run for president in 2012 at 8:00 eastern on c-span's "q&a." >> "washington journal" continues. host: and meet heather smith, president of rock the vote. we've been hearing discussion about an enthusiasm gap for young americans. what are you learning? guest: the elections are so very far off to young people right now and really they seem to be concerned about the issues of everyday life. whether that's making it through school, finding a job, worrying about primarily economic concerns.

but we're also seeing them as you're probably seeing around the country, taking to the streets and really being enthusiastic about finding solutions to the problems they're facing. the bigger question is whether that translates into participation at the polls. host: in addition to our democrats and republicans and independents, we have a special line 18 to 29. you can use that line. tell us about your interest in electoral politics and whether or not you're paying attention to the presidential races thus far and whether or not you are enthused about being involved this cycle. we'd like to hear what you're thinking for our guest, heather smith, who is, as i mentioned, president of rock the vote. you spent your whole life in political organizing. how did you come into it in the first place? guest: i started all of this work around issues related stuff. so as a college student i was very passionate about social justice issues and also the environment.

i ended up doing a grassroots organizing school called green corps and they taught me how to organize in communities and organize my peers to make change on issues that we cared about. and after doing that for a couple years, we'd win some, lose some, we'd win some, lose some, and i thought without the political power of my peers and actually participating in the voting process that we can flever really make change that is lasting on the issues that we cared about and so i started working to engage my friends, my peers and young people around the country, not just in the issues they cared about but also in taking that concern and that passion to the polls. host: how has the emerge hans of social media changed your ability to connect? guest: it's a very different world. yeah. i think back when we didn't have cell phones. one of the first tasks of my job is find a computer and sign up for your juno.com email address and we were able to go out and talk to people

one-on-one. today we're able to do that peer-to-peer communication and individual communication but at scale and at such a rapid pace. when rock the vote first started in the early 1990's we were registering concerts and festivals and bringing 10,000, 20,000 people in the process and had 1-800's and fax machines. now we have two million people just through our online program alone so really being able to scale that work, have conversations with people and engage them at a -- in a much larger way. host: rock the vote is funded how? guest: it's a nonprofit organization. our funding comes from foundations, from individual donors, from young people themselves and then from little things like tee shirts and con sert sales. the young people and the work

that we do. host: rock the vote calls itself nonpartisan and yet you've had criticism from republicans and conservativeses that you are focused in involving young people in progressive politics. what's your response to that? guest: well, nonpartisan is part of our core approach to this work and if you are a young person and your parent tells you what to do, you probably won't do it. what we try to do is bring together information and provide those tools and resources for young people to make up their own minds, for them to find the resources and information they need to get informed, to interact with candidates directly on all sides and ultimately information they need about voting. a lot of what we're seeing today is there's interest in participation but there's a lack of understanding about how

the process works. so where to register, when you have to do it by, what your ballot's going to look like and how the process will be executed. so making sure we can be a trusted source for information for young people and really never have any intention of telling them who to vote for. host: i want to show you a chart of the voter participation by younger americans in the last couple of cycles. of the 18 to 29-year-old vote in 2000 was 40%. by 2004 it had risen to 49%. 2008, where we heard so much about it, it increased by two percentage points. there has been a trend for greater involvement. guest: yeah. through the past three major election cycles we've seen turnout go up. both the percentage has increased and the population has also increased. this is the largest generation of young people that our country has ever seen. it's the most diverse generation as well. so the number i find most striking about the 2008

elections, the percentage was only -- you know, two percentage points higher, that was a couple million additional voters and there were more people that cast ballots under 30 compared to any previous plex. host: when we dig deeper in the demographics, how does that slape? guest: yeah, like the rest of the population, there's a couple factors that does indicate and are pretty good predictors of voter turnout, education level, income level and those who are in college or who have college education tend to be veiting at much higher -- voting at much higher levels. the thing i found striking about 2008 which isn't surprising but probably didn't get much coverage is a lot of the increase or the voters that entered that process, that was driven primarily by minority vote, minority young voters, african-american youth. host: enthuse yample gap

discussion starts. when you're talking to african-americans, people who voted in the last election who are young, are they telling you they are as interested in going to the polls this time around? guest: yeah. what they're telling us right now is that they -- you know, that they're struggling, that they absolutely care about the issues of concern and that they are looking for a path to participation. they are looking for a way. they are not interested in the finger-pointing and the bickering. i think they're quite turned off right now by politics. they still believe in the polling shows they have high famblt by government but they're turned off by politics. i -- favorability by government but they're turned off by politics. how to improve the politics in our country, then we'll see them get back engaged. but it can't just be a facebook page and a stop on a campus and

expect suddenly that the youth vote will be enthusiastic again. they are facing real problems. they are hungry to participate but i think they need a real path, an authentic one in order to get involved. host: these statistics from the economic policy institute report that the unemployment rate for 16 to 24-year-old workers average 18.4% compared with the 9.6% for u.s. workers overall and young high school graduates have been hardest hit. the unemployment rate for high school graduates under age 25 who are not enrolled in school was 22.5% compared with 9.3% for college graduates of the same age. what does this mean for electoral participation? guest: you know, it's hard to motivate and go to the polls when you're facing joblessness rates that are higher than this generation -- than young people has ever seen since the bureau of labor statistics has started

tracking this. and it's gotten worse. so four years ago let's say they got involved many of them at a 2-1 rate in the obama campaign. a lot of them, nonpartisan efforts like rock the vote, because they had hoped they can make their future better. and so you get that hope by knocking on doors and calling your friends and by participating in something that had a very positive message, that they can make their future better. and they engaged in that. four years later it's worse. the level of debt and the burden that they're carrying is greater. the level of joblessness has increased. and i think you're starting to see young people not just realize that they have to do something but also that this didn't happen by accident. they're starting to understand that they're getting the short end of the stick and that optimism is now has equally balanced with some frustration and anger.

why did this happen? why are we getting the larger, you know, share of the burden in this situation? so i any that frustration can be leveraged into participation , but i also think it can make them want to opt out and that's i believe a huge disaster that would happen in our country if we had a generation of people who felt, you know, disenfranchised and disempowered, like they were getting the short end of the stick and as a result we'd have a generation of nonvoters and what that would do to our democracy and the future is a scenario i don't like to think about. i think we have a lot of work in the next year. host: we want to get calls for heather smith. these are from "politico" and they used the census bureau for their source and they call it obama's young voter challenge. here are some numbers they gave. 20.9% of the population is currently between the ages of

15 and 29. 55% is the employment rate among those ages 16 to 29. 55% of them are employed and that's the lowest level since world war ii. next number, 48%, president obama's current approval rating among ages 18 to 29 which is a 26-point drop since 2009. and then finally 2/3, that's the number of college students who currently graduate with significant student loan debt. with that as the context, we are going to go to telephone calls beginning with bloomfield hills, michigan. democrat. good morning, terri, you're on the air. caller: i notice that a lot of the states now are trying to make voting very difficult and they're requiring photo i.d.'s and i'm wondering if you are working on that. it seems a shame that somebody that's born in alabama but now is living in illinois and

you're 75 years old, there's no way for you to get a copy of your birth certificate is gross injustice. another thing i want to ask you and that is there is -- excuse me -- i lived in florida and so rubio was our senator. now just on the news this morning it was brought to our attention, he was saying i guess he had his parents had suffered under castro but it came out that he left and they left in 1956 prior to castro even being in power there. do you have any facility where you challenge things like that? you know, it seems like if you tell a lie long enough people believe things and i as a young voter find that very disconcerting. i wish there was some place where we could go where we

could check out the erroneous facts and actually i think that c-span, you do such a wonderful job. i wish you have a little time every day where you could challenge the statements that people make. host: thank you for your call. the story is on the front page of "the washington post" this morning. host: she wants you to comment on where voters cr get the straight facts about politicses and history and voting record.

guest: terri, thank you for your questions and i'll talk to both of them. first -- on the second question on where to get good information and you know with so much with the campaign and all the money that's going to go into it over the next year or so, people need a place to go to find out the straight facts, get the truth and feel like there's somebody telling it to them who is on their side. c-span, of course, is a great place for that where you can see them take on the issues and take both sides. you can get a good answer. at rock the vote we try to do the same thing for young people. we have young reporters on the ground covering the campaigns from the youth perspective. we bring young people into direct contact with the candidates so they can ask the questions themselves and get to the bottom of some of these issues and concerned they might have. and so we hope to provide that for them so we can in fact get straight information, trusted information and hope help --

help these young people navigate this process for the first time. the thing making it harder is these laws being passed in states around the country. there are almost -- there are over 30, i believe the number is 36 states in the past year in 2011 that have contemplated or proposed legislation that will make it harder for people to vote. some of those would directly affect young people. in the state of florida, for example, there is a law that passed that will make it harder for organizations like rock the vote and the league of women voters to do our work. adding additional levels of bureaucracy, putting financial burdens and potential funds for our young volunteers and teachers who are in the classrooms or in their own communities to registering their peers and cliges. but in states like wisconsin or texas where they passed these very superrestrictive voter i.d. laws. and i want to be careful about this. this is only these laws we take

issue with where they're requiring identification that many people don't have in order to cast a ballot. and from the student perspective and the youth perspective, you know, we're very concerned. so for example in texas, they eliminated student i.d.'s as a form of identification that you can show at the polls. many out-of-state students who don't have driver's license from the state of texas because they're going to school there from somewhere else now have to have a different form of i.d. or get a texas i.d. and can no longer use their student identification card. same thing in wisconsin. they allow student i.d. but not a single i.d. that a university issues or meets the requirements of. so we are concerned that in a lot of these states there's going to be an additional hurdle for these young voters to be actually to go to the polls and cast a ballot. host: with all the work you've done in campuses, is it the propencity of the students to

vote in the state they go to college or at home? guest: they want to participate where they're living. the supreme court decided them the right to vote where they go to school or where their parents live. i think it's part of our culture and history that you want to participate and you want -- you stand in that line, you get a little bit nervous. it's the very first time you've done it. it's right there on campus. there's a table to ask questions at if you don't know what to do. the newspapers, printing the voter guides for you, you get to go there, you push the button, you pull the lever . there is a democratic experience, a u.s. experience i think that there's something appealing about. we find that most people choose to vote where they live, whether that's where they're renting an apartment, where they're going to school. and ultimately that's their choice and we should facilitate that process. and you will see -- we actually

did a scorecard. rock the vote did. it's under the research section on our website. but we looked at the policies that affect the polls. the states that have same-day voter registration or allows them greater choice is the states with the highest level of youth participation. host: john from alpena, michigan. you're on. caller: hi. recently zogby had a poll the legalization of marijuana is now polling at 50%, 46% against. especially from young people age 18 to 29, i believe it's 62%. even from 30 to 49 it was like at 55%. and then they broke it up by region. this has been shown if you have these on the ballot you get more of a young voter turnout

and i guess my question would be, with all the economic impact legalizing marijuana, with all the jobs for growers -- i mean, i live in michigan. you get a doctor it's ok. you can have your medical marijuana card. and i have one. anyway, do you think that the legalization of marijuana movement -- our politicians, in the senate and congress we have very few. people like barney frank, ron paul, they introduced legislation. but we don't see -- like if we have 50% of america supporting it, i guess under 65. the whole demographic doesn't support it -- host: i understand why you're going. whether or not this would bring more people out to the polls is the question. guest: it's a great question john.

i think a lot of young people -- when i got involved it was around issues and seeing the impact you could have if you participated in the electoral process on the issues thaw cared about. you -- young people today around the country when you look at that same polling, you know, some are democrats, some are identified as republicans. but the vast majority of people in between the ages of 18 to 29 are less driven by party identification and more driven by the candidates themselves as well as by the issues that are of top concern to them. i think leading with issues that are a concern to young people is a great way to engage them in the political debate. and in terms of putting initiatives on the ballot, we've seen a lot of that in particular social issues from both sides getting onto the ballot is a way to drive turnout. it's not something that rock the vote would do, per se. if you were so inclined to

start that movement, collect signatures to get that on the ballot, you know, that is something and i do think would support and help increase participation. but i also want to be careful that, you know, while that will motivate a set of people to show up, i think our political debate when we're talking about young voters really does have to be about the issues that, you know, such as education and jobs and economy and i don't want them to be isolated. i don't want you and your peers to be isolated into a conversation that is strictly about social issues. but i do agree leading with the issues is a great way to engage people. host: how much staff does rock the vote have and volunteers? guest: we're small in number so there's about 10 of us full time on staff. but we have street teams and volunteers all around the country that do the work. so a lot of volunteer-driven activity. plus a huge online presence which has allowed us to do our

work at scale. in the 2012 elections we'll register probably about somewhere close to two million young people to vote and will be the largest nonpartisan voting engagement in the country. host: are you mobilizing voter registration at the occupy protest? guest: we are not. we are supporting young people in their activism. so making sure they find people where these protests and things are happening. i find it inspiring. i think that, you know, personally -- we saw them engaged in the obama campaign at record levels and in the political process. in 2008. food we see them a little more cynical, little more frustrated in taking to the streets in this initiative to get money out of politics. i think that, you know, they

will come around and realize. the young people i talk to are pretty clear that money out of politics and then flood the polls will be a great way to take our country and put it back on the right direction for this generation. so i'm hopeful that will happen and, yes, we hope to occupy the ballot box in 2012. host: from the other slile -- side of the aisle, this c-span junky, ron paul's revolution of young people propelling him forward without banks and corporations? guest: great question. ron paul, he's authentic. you know where he stands. his kind of point of view has been clear and his answers have been informed by that. i think young people find that attractive. well clearly they do. they're joining his movement as well. we saw that in 2008. actually i was thinking back to iowa, the date for this cycle's

caucus gets set, you know, in the last election the presidential it was young people who propeled mike huckabee in the caucus as well. so i think it's not a partisan interest. it's a desire to see this country righted, to see politics to be more accountable to the voters as opposed to those who are the wealthiest few. and whatever candidate can really speak to that in an authentic way i think will win of the young people today. caller: good morning. i'm a republican. i fit your demographic in 2008 and i voted for senator obama and now president obama. the main reason i voted for president obama is i liked his

poise, very good speaker. unfortunately we haven't got a whole lot positive since. however, one thing i don't see out of the media that much -- on fox, you hear plenty of other things. my own party has basically been blocking him and anything he's trying to do, good, bad from the very beginning and i feel that they've had that plan in place ever since he was inaugurated to beat him so bad it will be hard to win the election. all that ticks off my age group

and with all that i don't see obama winning a second term. the only problem is there's really nobody on the republican side now that's really i could vote for. host: thank you, joe, from woodridge. guest: i think you share the same frustration that many of the people we talk to every day share. and it is that the political system is broken in a way where the concerns of the voters are getting trumped by the concerns of politics. and whether that's, you know, those that we've elected, whether they be republican or democrat, doing things to either further their re-election. so this frustration that the voices of people and the concerns of people are being trumped in the political process. i think that's why you see so many young people in particular

engaged in the occupied protests that are happening around the country. i guess around the world at this point. so, you know, it's frustrating. and it's not working but i think, you know, joe, as you were saying, the solution can't be to opt out and let that get worse but in fact call for reform of the political process, to get money out of politics and show up at those polls so that we have the political power and leverage to continue pushing those demands forward. host: a viewer who tweets as the 99% writes, occupy is a cross-generational movement, including those in our sixth and seventh decades, not just young. next is a call from allentown, pennsylvania. caller: hi. the first lady that called in kind of stole my question. i was going to ask about the voter suppression laws that are going on.

you're in pennsylvania -- here in pennsylvania tom will sign a bill either tomorrow or monday and it's about voter -- it's about voter i.d. and there's a lot of people like people that are handicapped and a lot of young people and even a lot of older people that don't have driver's licenses will kind of be kept out and, you know, the younger people have been voting democratic lately and a lot of -- that's the way they've been -- the reason that they've been passing those laws so suppress the -- keep them -- your own people in power and not let the young kids choose for themselves. that's the question i had.

guest: no, thank you, bill. on the rock the vote vote -- website which is rockthevote.com we have a concept that it should be easier people to participate, not harder. in we want full participation we can't put up additional barriers for them. of course a lot -- that is the impact that a lot of these voter i.d. laws are going to have. because they're so restrictive and what is being allowed under these new laws when people show up. and the statistics from the brennan center at n. yumplet have shown that about 10% to 11 -- n.y.u. have shown that 10% to 11% of the population don't have the i.d. required. which is low income, minority.

in total the most recent report showed five million voters will be affected in the 2012 elections. host: republican, good morning. caller: good morning. thank you so much for c-span. good morning, heather. guest: good morning. caller: i questioned your nonpartisanship but i just have a couple other items i want to run over real quick because i know your time is limited. i'd like to know -- i'm on there reviewing your website and i don't see any disbursement of the funds and whap your pay is individually. the other thing -- and what your pay is individually. the other thing is the staff. you mentioned about 10 people on staff. you're the only one that has somewhat logical biography. the other people are too cool to mention where they've been. and the fellow before me talked about voter suppression. do you as an organization see

voter responsibility as far as voter fraud, people coming in and either voting twice in the event that students can vote where their parents live as well as if they're down in texas, you had mentioned on the texas vote that vase -- says student i.d.'s are no longer required. just going through it over and over. i wonder how many christian organizations are gathering that you go to because i know you do rock concerts and festcals and i wonder where the balance is. are you truly -- i'll be happy to stay on the line and discuss anything. host: as you said, we're just about out of time. we'll let heather respond. thank you for your call. guest: yes, thank you for your call. on disbursement, our information is filed with the i.r.s. and the 990 is public. you can find it through that