after that remarks from michele bachmann in iowa. from the campus of purdue university, this week on "q&a," mitch daniels discusses keeping the republic. >> governor mitch daniels, on your book on page 229 somewhere the skeptics are snickering. they predicted that the government would fall prey to the very weaknesses we now display. consequences we now confront. they believe the ailments would prove fatal." that is near the end. who are the skeptics?

>> there is the long line of people beginning at the dawn of democracy in ancient greece. they said the government by the people might be a cute idea. it would break down because politicians will learn to pander and promise more than could be how afforded or the people character traits. he is a credibly admirable person who was a co-chair of the recent commission. he has made a very sound observation. we are facing the most predictable crisis in our history.

he is talking about the debt so we piled up in the fact that we cannot pay them and we need additional commitment letter on the book. they worry that this experiment would run aground. it comes from ben franklin's comment when the ink is barely dry. "what kind of government have you've given us?" "a republic, madam, if you can keep it."

all of our founders, adams, madison, they all worried about this. can we keep it together? the only thing i would say is that surely on the other side of that quote, i end on optimism. there is a person in this audience that has said to me with in this past month from this state that we're going down. what evidence do you have that it is not true. buck up. i would say they are paying close attention. every great leading nations eventually have gone down.

in every one of them, i am quite certain people were at the in denial or did not see a coming or said it cannot happen here. if we fall prey to that, we may suffer the consequences sooner than we need to. i think it is premature. we should never surrender to the fatalism about these things. this is based on faith. i admitted. it has been well said that democracy always was a leap of faith. there is time to deal with the daunting arithmetic.

it will not be easy. there is time to restore a growth rate that gives us a chance to put people back to work, rebuild the important optimism, the american dream that says we have been through tough times. they never doubted that tomorrow would be better someday. greece is going down. there are probably other countries in in europe after going down. at the united states need not go down but we better get busy. >> how much time do you have? >> i do not know. we'd better act fast. this is an amateurs book. i try to be pretentious about any at it. there are lots of books about

that already. there is a chapter on the history we just talked about. it is not long. do not worry. i start one chapter about how economic collapse and social collapse could come quickly. if you're doing what you're doing, we are borrowing 40 cents of every dollar. you really are at risk of somebody saying this is good money. we're not doing it any more.

>> was there a moment when you said you're not going to run for president? >> i will give you a more accurate answer. he saved america. in the superb professional way that nobody does better, he pointed out that i had said that read hires will give you four years of hard work every single day.

he said really? what do you going to say on the day you change your mind? how are you going to explain it? can i preface it by saying this? >> i think any casual observer of books read this and says it was written so it would come out at a time when you just announced for president. this is a serious book. it is not a cheesy autobiography. it to be a short book. >> let me say. this is the reverse. i finally decided in april or may. i told everybody. i can people waiting.

so and suggested two years ago. they have books in mind and did not think would be worth my time to write our people's time to read. i said if i was going to go there, i would write about what was bothering me about the country. we ought to re-validate our capacity for self governance. i rode up an outline. that is what people say you do.

i was really proud of the first sentence. i intended it to be the first sentence of the book. so many books are written because the author to wants to run for the president of the united states. i am writing this one because i am not. the agent who went to market this but said i want to help you out. he said there is one thing. what is the catch? he said you have to read the first sentence. it is not nearly as catty. -catchy. >> i have read very few books pastor present judging by the ones i read. they are written to justify the author's actions to settle

personal scores. >> that is the way they look to me. i wrote this in lieu of being a candidate. that was my clear point of view. it was mainly written on weekends in the fall and winter. it was basically done by the first of the year. i was ready to turn in my homework early. it was their decision. for anybody who should read the book, i do not think it reads much like the standard candidates books. it goes into more detail. it says things more plainly. if i decided to run, whoever was going to help me do it got a hold of that bid before it came out. they would have begged me not

to publish it. >> i have produce students are ready to ask something. if the country is in such bad shape and you have got the solution and you are about out of time as governor and you cannot run again, why not take a chance and throw your hat in and run? don't you owe that to the country? >> some say that. i tried to argue out of that. that is a hard question. you are so passionate about this. they say that a lot of people risked more than their reputations of in campaign. they risk their lives for the country. i do not have a good answer. i felt there was a collision of the two highest priorities in my life.

i pick the one that outranked all else. i do not try to argue with people who say that was a non- patriotic thing to do. i also agree with a man he said remember the cemeteries are full of indispensable men. i do not think in any great endeavor and re-establishing the hope and promise and strength of this nation will be the greatest of endeavours. any one person is indispensable. i've tried to make a contribution rather than running. >> ask the first question. >> i am president in political science. in recent years, we have seen a change in perception of higher education.

it is less of a public service and more of a private commodity. we see this will make it our billing statements. their increases in in tuition. i was hoping you could speak to the nature of that change and perception and the outlook for future students in terms of accessibility to higher education. >> i am not sure i agree with your characterization. the value of higher education has never been more apparent. the value in this school and the emphasis is has on the most economical valuable disciplines, i will speak for myself. there has never been a higher priority. i tried and came up short to undertake a transaction three or four years ago that would have been $1 billion of new cash in indiana higher education.

if i ever saw an opening to do such a thing again, i would. i do think keeping higher education affordable and accessible is important. to get over that under control in see the place runs more efficiently. there's a long way to go there in addition to things be felt taxpayers could do. there are things that higher education has to take responsibility for, too. >> next? >> i am a senior graduating may 2012. vice president of public communication.

my question concerns the capacity as self-government discussed in your book. why obligation do we have to provide affordable healthcare for the members of our state to cannot secure affordable health care for their families? >> it is important. we created such a program. i discuss it in the book. as recently as this morning, a lady came through the line and your little me how much it has meant to her daughter and her family to have the peace of mind when they did not before. not to take a long detour, but it is relevant to another theme of the book. we should trust the people more than some of our policies to

take control of their own lives. you see this very clearly in a plan for the low-income and uninsured. they're protected if there is an illness or injury that is very expensive. what they are proving is the same thing to of our state employees. and 90% are in a help a savings program. folks that say this is too complicated cannot be permitted to choose this. i think they're selling people short. we are being effective consumerists.

they are double digit below the cost to them and us. i believe we've got to find ways to give everybody this protection. as we do, i hope you will do it in a way that shows confidence in people's ability to look out for themselves. incidentally, it is the only effective way of getting costs under control for us all. we will never have cost control until all of us are costs controllers. >> thank you. >> next question please. >> i'm the vice president of public relations.

my question relates to the green week. do you think there's room in the budget for green projects? >> limited. i am a big proponent of investment in early stages. there is a very poor track record when government tries to go beyond that and be involved in commercialization. solyndra is only the latest in a lot of such failures. look at the errors of the 1970's. the businesses of today -- i do not know one that is not green or greener than it used to be.

it has been exposed as factually flawed. there are far fewer of them. clerical jobs tried to load up the numbers to make it look bigger. we are a leader in alternative fuels. where these programs have promise enough to be commercial like, bring them all. this is a very poor investment based on no good evidence. >> patrick, i am an undergraduate senior majoring in advertising.

i have heard that while the director and officer of president bush you were instrumental in trying to eliminate the national debt. due to 9/11, it cannot be put into action. the debt has swelled. could your plan still be implemented? >> there is a moment when a lot of people, it was not just me, everybody basically in washington believed the nation was on a trajectory to reduce or eliminate the national debt. we were all wrong.

i talk about it in the book. the plan that the president put forward from among those alternatives our group tried to craft would not have worked. all such plans are based on an economic forecast. everybody thought this was the base and it would go up some percentage in the future. that was wrong. it was based on the stock market bubble. it was based on rich people making an incredible amount of money from stock grants and dividends. the revenue just evaporated.

we would be in better shape of less money have been spent in the interim. there were big new ones taken on. i was in the press club november 2001. i gave a speech. i laid up a history of past conflicts. we have reduced spending on other things, sometimes drastically. go look at what harry truman did to the rest of government spending.

it is a republican congress that rejected any such a device. they kept spending going on all the activities we had. they have military spending on top. it'll take a new strategy now. we are in a much worse situation. the biggest deficit we ran was 1/3 the size of the ones we're running every year now. even after those in expenditures, by 2007 the federal deficit was 1.2% of gdp. it was minuscule compared to the day. we're in a different place now. i do not think it is useful in anyway to waste precious time talking about who is most to blame for how we got there. we better be talking about the common problem that each of us

has across income groups and age group. we are avoiding the disaster that is ahead. >> in your book, you say you have stayed in over 100 homes of hoosiers. can you tell us that one night for you said that was "this is a mistake?" >> there are 113 now. it has been a wonderful thing to do. i made a lot of great friends. i had a cookout this summer and invited everyone to put me up over night.

maybe they went a little too far. they invited in the family and neighborhood. that is ok. this whole notion started just as a way to save a little money. i do not like asking people for money. why would we spend this year's campaign money on a hotel room. quickly it became fun and very informative. i stayed in every type them as a book. i've seen it all in guest rooms and spare rooms and children's rooms. i wake up with little pink bunny rabbits all over and think "where am i?"

i've got lost running in the morning and had to have people out to buy me. what time i cannot get a shower to work they had some new device. i was too embarrassed to met i was dumb. probably some perdue engineer invented this thing. i did the first bath i've taken some of its eight years old. it is usually a full day of travel. >> you're welcome any time with us.

we have a clock goes off every hour. >> i am a senior in communications. i am the current president of the association for women in communications. as a student is looking to enter the job force, what do you see as the biggest obstacle to job growth in current economy? >> there are big forces. they are making growth hard. there is an overcapacity of the manufacturing capacity. there are huge slowdown's in other economies. globalization has brought many benefits. it has led to the immigration of many jobs. what i say does not say it is

all the fault of national policy. that is not right. i do believe the national policy is backward. the most important way can be, the question goes straight to its. faced with all the headwinds and looking at this incredible debt burden that will fall on all of us, it is very obvious that with all the priorities we have, and they are all worthy, until further notice, every decision the national government makes, every close call, every time should be broken in in favor of the growth of the private sector. that is the only place that jobs will come from.

it is the only place that the revenue we need and higher tax payments we need it to meet our debts and pay our bills can come from. i am sorry to say that it has been operating almost the other way. action after action. more taxes and the threat of more. more regulation and the threat of more. sometimes the disparity, it is as though the administration were out to make a more expensive and difficult to hire people. they would not think of it that way. it i finally decided to have a blind spot. but it's a harmful one. and this is going to be very difficult, i know for some people.

folks say, boy, i talk about and hear a lot about reshaping the safety net programs, at least starting prospectively and how politically this has all been and risky. but even harder maybe to say, listen, take the most obvious example, we have to celebrate the environmental improvements that have been made in this country. too many conservatives refuse to acknowledge that regulation has played a real role. you may know, but very few high school students that the water they drink and air they breathe is dramatically cleaner than when brian i were in school. we have to hit the pause button on a lot of this, because right now, nothing comes close as a national priority to getting the private sector growing again so there is opportunity for

people coming up and starting their lives so there is opportunity for those who have been displaced recently to perhaps get back in the work force. and so there is a fighting chance, as i said of meeting our public obligation. that's my take on things. and it's got to be central in the big national conversation we need. >> next question, while they are getting up, i want to ask you, when you said you weren't going to run for president, which candidate on the republican side did not call you asking for your support? >> a couple of them didn't. ms. bachmann didn't call. [laughter] >> well, let's see. >> did sarah palin call you? >> no. i don't know her, really. i'm disappointed that johnson didn't call because he is an interesting character.

some did and some didn't. but, you know, they are busy and i'm not sure it would help them much if i was for them or if it went the other way. >> i'm a sophomore majoring in political science and my question is what is your current question what is your current position on the george bush tax cuts that are set to expire in 2012? >> i wouldn't raise taxes on anybody. raising taxes on a staggering economy is risky. if you do what the president keeps saying and you raise taxes, that is you go back to the old rates for those above that cutoff line, 250, i guess, do you know what percentage of the debt problem you have just solved? four. and the question is -- and by the way, that assumes that it

doesn't hurt the economy at all, which nobody can know whether it would or wouldn't. so, if you cancel the whole thing all the way up and down the income scale, you are still a single digit, again, assuming that in that case i would doubt it hurts the economy at all. i would tell you, i think that a much better way forward and i'm hardly alone in this, the commission says the same thing, if you are looking for reasons for optimism, the person who said we're finished and i tried to cheer up a bit ago, and here's one, there is a bit of consensus across the spectrum that a useful step would be to weed the garden of the tax code as we did in 1986. and close or at least limit the use of all the exceptions, all

these preferences and these people like to say loopholes, book shelves and tax rules that nobody can understand and lower and flatten the rate so they are simpler and fairer, stop trying to engineer things either economically or socially. almost every economist i know says that would be good for growth. money would find its way not where the tax code wants it to go but where it has the most promise of profits and therefore, hiring people. and i think that would be a lot more productive way to go. let me say something that your question evokes. i agree with those who say to solve this incredibly desperate situation we're in, everybody has to pitch in. absolutely. even those including in the upper income brackets, but they are looking in the wrong place. they talk about turning the

thumb screws tighter on the wealthy. you get a small amount of money, if any, if you go the different route, the one i suggested, two things are absolutely sure. if you grow the economy faster, we will have more tax revenue, which we so badly need. and two, the wealthy will pay more and will pay a higher share than they do today. happens every time. in order to get participation from the well off, you have to do two things. one close those provisions in the tax code. two, stop sending benefits to them, social security and medicare to those who really need it. >> we have time left and anybody who wants to ask a question can just come to the center there and fire away. paul, do you have a question? >> i'm an alumus from purdue.

with your back ground and contact to ties locally, the folks came to you and said, we would like you as our new president of the university, would you be interested? [laughter] [cheers and applause] >> would you like to have a seat? [laughter] >> i would immediately recommend tim mcginley. he needs something to keep him busy over there. >> next question. [laughter] >> that was dangerous. lamb never gets me get away with that. >> this question is for the governor. i'm a senior in communication.

i'm looking at the fellowship as something -- an option after graduation. i'm wondering, why do you think it is important for students and professionals to stay to indiana as opposed to going to other cities and other states? >> i want them to live in the best place possible. a wonderful predecessor of mine was honored, i guess, by some folks who set up a great program in which top graduates, two years, as i recall, spend two years, businesses agree to give a business experience to such a person, so they get a really outstanding talent and that young person gets a really diverse and productive business experience for a couple of years. and there are seminar programs. i know they see other people in public life.

there is an educational component with a real business base. it's a great model and i recommend it to other states who may not have something like it. karen, let me give you a piece of news that is important to me. you know, in a reversal of historical pattern, more people with college degrees are moving into indiana than out. the margin is president big, but it's a big change. we have dug deeper and this confirms a suspicion that i had, on top of that, people moving in, versus people moving out, indiana enjoys a very large, i'm going to call it, balance of intellectual capital because of the great schools that we have by a margin of something like 13,000 or 14,000. more students from elsewhere are studying at purdue or i.u.

or many of our other college kids than hoosier kids studying out of state. we are working hard to build a state, a place of opportunity, a welcoming environment for people and businesses in the hope that we can capitalize on this and become a magnet for talent. and just walking from the pavement to here and stopping and asking student to student and i want to hug them and the best thing that happens to any state in this world is when talent moves in. and thanks to places like purdue, we are doing a little better. >> another student? i want to read you -- anybody wants to ask a question, step up to the mic. you used a series of quotes under your skeptics chapter and

you set up a dismal chapter. here is the "washington post" and i want to ask you why you put it in here. it says, the system can no longer make choices, especially unpleasant choices for the good of the nation as a wheel. despite of superficial support for deficit reduction or tax reform, few americans would surrender their own benefits, subsidies and tax breaks, a precondition for success. >> i put it in there because he is -- first of all, anyone who doesn't read him, don't skip one of his columns. he is unfailingly astute and scrupulously nonpartisan and balanced, robert samuelson.

i put it there. he is holding a commonly-held view and he is reporting accurately, if you ask people in a poll, they think you can fix this problem if you stop foreign aid or cut something remote from them when that is not the case or close to it. but it's also there because ultimately, i'm going to come to that conclusion that we talked about, sure we can, the american people do still have self-government and the elements that make it possible at the core of our character and address openly and honestly as free-born citizens, they can understand the facts of life we are looking at. they can understand that we cannot do everything we would like to do for absolutely everybody all at the same time when we're broke.

and they can support choices and maybe the postponement of things until a better day that we would like to do. i'm not equating the two at all. they're not close in size or complexity. and we have had that conversation for seven years. and you don't get everybody on board, but a broad majority of the citizens of indiana have said, we get it. we might wish it were different, but we are going to support policies that are in the interests of us all. and if it means something that i dearly believe in has to take a little less or wait a little while, ok. the fact that you said you aren't going to run for office again might allow me to do something that i wouldn't normally do, and that is correct you. >> would you be terribly upset if i correct you? i made the same mistake you

made, when i was at purdue, i studied a book by paul samuelson and anything i have said about him, i said he is the son. they are not related. >> he gets real tired of people saying are you the son of paul samuelson. >> i won't label in that way again. i'm sure i read it. >> i used to say it myself. >> i don't think i put it in the book, did i? >> yes -- no, you did not. [laughter] >> and by the way some of you democrats have a chance to confront your governor if you have a question. are you going to ask a question. come on. come on. editor of the paper.

studyingjunior anthropology and editor of the student newspaper. what is something that you think the next governor of indiana needs to make their priority? >> alicia it's a fair question, i will give an answer to you and say that first of all, certain priorities don't go away, because we didn't come close to finishing them, continuing to build the best possible climate of job growth has got to be job one. and we made a lot of headway and on top of everybody's list now but very frustrating to be highly rated as indiana is and at a time when national economy has basically stopped. i have said to people, you

know, getting on top of those ratings and the recession comes it's like being the prettiest girl in school and they called off the proposal. -- prom. [laughter] >> the constant effort to look for ways -- we have done a lot of ways and so much more can be done to make this an inviting and afford able place to do business. we have made huge strides in k- 12 education from a statutory standpoint. but it will be work of years to make those work well and implement these changes, pass -- passing a law is step one and i believe and i have gone to the front row of in terms of education reform. no student has improved its academic performance. we have to make it work and make it fair to all.

and i will go back to the first question, we have to make some big, i think moves in higher ed. i don't pretend to know all of them. but as the first question pointed out, it's extraordinarily important to the state and the nation's future and at the same time, the business model that we have been operating at in higher ed, i think is starting to look shaky to me. and -- and just as borders books just found out, at some stage, other competitors aided by technology or other efficiencies can undermine what look like a very, very solid enterprise very soon. >> this is american higher ed comment, but the next cover of this state and all states have to be working on this to make

sure our institutions of higher ed are as strong as they can be and also are affordable to those who want to attend them or we'll have a very different looking system in 10, 15 years, maybe with a lot of new players in it and fewer people in the schools we have known. >> megan? >> hi, governor daniels. i'm a junior in political science and communication here at purdue and i'm from the lafayette area. what you have been talking about education feeds into my question. i'm the granddaughter and daughter of public school teachers, so i have been affected by some of the changes you have made in education. and i know education is important to you, too and you stressed that. i'm wondering why have you recently in your term -- you

tend to go more towards funding charter schools and private schools. why do you find those are the places to invest our money as opposed to the public schools? >> first of all, charter schools are public schools. they are fully public schools, just public schools that choose to operate without the rules, some of the rules that are traditional public schools have used. you know the changes we have just made in indiana, it's always important for me start by saying have been championed by president obama and secretary of education. with someone who disagrees with what they have done, i stress what they have done and i have said this, we went further and you mentioned one way, but in germ, those things that we

recently did to we think bring more accountability to public education and more freedom to principals and superintendents to run their schools are exactly what secretary duncan and the president have very courageously argued for. charter schools is one of those things. no bigger proponent in charter schools than the president and the folks around him. and we are seeing some wonderful results now that we have got the wraps off of those in indiana. the last part you mentioned is that indiana has the nation's largest program that allows a parent, if it's their choice, a parent, not the state, to utilize taxpayer dollars at a non-government school. it is means tested. to me it's a social justice question first. i was hugged in forth wayne by a black mom whose child is now

at a school who she believes is much better for that child. and for the first time we said, it isn't that low or moderate income families are told there is only one school your kid can go to but your neighbors can move or pay tuition somewhere. i don't think it will be a large fen no, ma'amon in our state. 10 years from now we will have 90% of kids in public schools. but if they aren't called charter schools, they'll look like them. and they will be promoting and protecting the teachers who are doing the best job. every one of these things i promise you starts with the question, what is best for the children and we work back from there. >> we have five minutes left. did you write this book? >> every word. >> what time of day did you do

it? >> mainly weekends in the fall and in the winter of last year. and you know, holidays. >> what did you write it on? >> a p.c. >> we ask those questions all the time. nothing unusual for a governor. >> assist ant director of communications and president of the crazy monkeys group. looks like the income gap between the rich and the poor in america keeps growing and middle class keeps slimpinging, what can we as citizens do to protect the american middle class? >> logan, this is a question that i have been thinking a whole lot about. if that book hadn't been buttoned up, i would have felt

obliged to deal with this question than i did. without pretending, i got a firm answer. i do believe it starts with a no holes barred to grow the private sector and it has got to be the starting point to have the tide lifting every boat again. but there is no question there are structural issues right now that have begun to reduce the number of jobs at an income level that we've always associated with the middle class and what i think of as a stable, hopeful middle class is the single -- been the single most important adhesive in keeping american society together, keeping us from pitting against each other. so surely a strong pro-growth

policy. i'm willing to think about departures from pure economic rationality in our policy if it means that we do once again find a way to address this issue you are talking about. i'll give you an example. i'm not ready yet to see that there's a future in what we call protectionist policies. not yet, any way. but i realize in a way and i'm willing to make one exception. i talked about energy earlier. we ought to be paying americans for the energy we need, even if it means it costs more. let me give you an example one level down. we came to office and indiana state government was buying 40% or something like it of all its goods and services from out of state. that didn't make any sense.

we don't want to make a dumb business deal, but i want to pay the citizens of indiana and then they'll have more jobs in our state. i would do the same thing nationally with regards to energy. we should, in my opinion, break all the ties in favor of drilling and fracking and exploring for energy here and build pipelines and need people to build them and put people to work. i'm willing to see us require the use of biofuels in america. do they cost more? yeah. does the money stay here? do purdue graduates who produce them or represent out their acreage get the money as opposed to a dictator elsewhere? a lot of reasons to do that.

this is an important question. i don't pretend to have anything like a final answer for you, but i'm willing to hear new ideas because i share your concern. >> we have a minute and i want to get a quick question from this gentleman. >> i'm a junior in political science. i would like to ask what your thoughts on the other republican candidates. but what are your thoughts of ron paul? is he the one of the most honest candidates? >> he is and he is a principle the person. and i think -- i happen to think he is wrong on a lot of things but you have to have respect and from a distance, i do. >> my last question to you is a political question, are there any circumstances in which you would accept the vice presidential nomination from the party?

>> you are asking the wrong person. hypothetical and that is utterly improbable, if the call came, i would have to talk to the five women in the daniels' family again and i can't answer. >> there is a possibility? >> 10 seconds left? beings brian's show but governor has got to be good for something. brian, somebody has an idea -- >> is there money involved? [laughter] >> well, you can try ebay, i don't know. [laughter] >> i want you to have one. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2011] [captioning performed by national captioning institute ♪

>> 48 edt copy of this program, called 1-877-662-7726. to give us your comments and those of us at 2 in a duck or. programs are also available as cs -- contact us at q $a.org. programs are also available at c-span. >> upcoming guests include jill abramson discussing current events and her new book. pulitzer prize-winning author stacy schiff talks about her book. and former marine lieutenant karl marlantes on his new book.

>> next, david cameron at the house of commons. after that, remarks by republican presidential candidate michele bachmann in iowa. and then at a reporter's roundtable on the 2012 presidential campaign. tomorrow on "washington the journal" craig crawford discusses the president's reelection. mark pinsky talks about his companies plan to team up with starbucks. and nirvi shah looks at the debilitate -- disability education act. live at 7:00 a.m. eastern on c- span. this week, during prime minister question time, david cameron question time, david cameron discussed domestic