host: congress returns to washington this week. another continuing resolution. a short-term funding bill to keep the government running. the current bill runs out on monday. on the house side, the rules committee debates legislation allowing gun owners to carry concealed weapons and other --

in other states. we will begin with government regulations and their impact on jobs. do travel regulations really killed jobs? economists say the effect on employment is minimal. we have a separate line set aside for business owners. . here's the story. the mustang and river coal-fired plant in ohio is nearing the end of its life.

how do you think federal regulations impact on jobs, or does it at all? raymond, and you. are on you. caller: they protect people. i would rather have clean air and clean water. >> do you think that is the question, that people should be debating, whether regulation serves the public good, not whether or not we should have them? >> of course. regulations are in place for a reason. the last republican bill came came up and there was a bill

that will allow a little bit more cement dust in the air, kind of ridiculous. host: this is a piece of wood together by the heritage foundation in july. they say the regulatory burden has continued to increase during the first half of 2011 -- do you think we can afford the amount of regulations? caller: may be overlapping regulations keeping. anything from the heritage foundation and i take with a grain of salt because they are biased. host: that was raymond, a

democrat from arizona. next is joyce, an independent in memphis, tennessee. talking about federal regulations and how it impacts jobs. we also want to live from business owners this morning. we have set aside a special line. 202-628-0214. >> all i know it's president obama is doing everything he can to try to get the jobs situation solved. the republicans keep fighting him. mark my words, if the republicans get in, we will have poisoned food and water because they will deregulate everything

and nothing will get inspected and people are going to die. >> is there compromise on the issue of regulations between democrats and republicans? >> i think there can be. but as we see with the current paradigm, there is no compromise with this batch of republicans. host: here's the washington post on the white house. vance, a republican in oklahoma city.

caller: i really don't like all of this language about regulation. it depends on what you mean by regulation. if you mean top-down regulation where you have administrative agencies saying that this business can do this and this business cannot do this, then that kind of the regulation does destroys thed disorde market order and common law market that has enabled us to make use of rules that were no part of anyone's intentional invention. if you are talking about regulations by prices, regulation by price competition, by common law, by the consuming public and their elasticity of demand, then i am in favor of that kind of regulation. if republicans would start

talking about that kind of regulation, i think they could win over the public and do much better job of destroying the top-down corporates, fascist administrator state that has arisen since the early progressive era. >> some studies have been cited in this article. economists who have strutted say there's little evidence that regulation causes massive job loss in the economy --

caller: what i make a bad is it would take probably those top industries who are very-well situated and have captured the regulatory apparatus for their own benefit to snuff out market competition to pay those researchers to come up with something that would convince the public can handle politicians with the idea that raising costs on the small

businessman somehow creates jobs in this economy. host: federal regulations have more of an impact on smaller companies or companies trying to start out? caller: i think federal regulations help the big businesses like comcast and general electric and those at the very top. i think perhaps they want big regulations. the big corporations are against laissez-faire capitalism. that is what i think. host: let's hear from a business owner in kentucky. do federal regulations impact jobs, bruce? caller: i don't believe so. in 1982 i already had a business in consulting. why did 13 coal permits. -- i did. all 13 of those coal mines have

been completed and mined and reclaim dance you can hardly see the impact on the land today roughly 30 years later. i used the income from that to bootstrap the starting of a software company, which i maintain to this day all. 13 of those coal mines have probably employed economy hundred people on average in their time. in this timeframe under obama to my knowledge not one single new coal permit has been approved in kentucky or west virginia. therefore, you don't have the jobs from people like myself who were permitting w the mineswereho then used the money -- permitting the mines who used the money for other businesses. then you don't have good jobs for the coal mines themselves. regulations does not help jobs.

that is absurd. host: it sounded like you were talking more about the permitting process. does that deal with regulations? caller: the permitting process deals with regulations. i personally wrote 13 coal permits, of which 100 jobs on average were created at these 13 coal mines. we have a situation -- i am not making the argument that regulation creates jobs. it created one job for me at the time. now it is now there's not the one job doing permits, because you are not calling to get paid typically unless you're permit gets approved. there's not going to become a business unless the coal

companies see a permit for getting their permit approved. most importantly, there were so many jobs on the backside of the actual approval, which now apparently have been completely shut off by the obama administration, which is totally anti-coal. you cannot even see those coal mines today. it's been reclaimed. host: epa employees to roll out their 2012 agenda.

how closely do you follow the epa and what they do, bruce? caller: pretty closely. i was watching c-span a few days ago expanded was a hearing on these regulations where congressman dennis kucinich was growing -- grilling the attorney general of virginia. i was appalled to hear dennis kucinich refer to the only job created by the coal industry was being the job of undertakers. that is the analogy that he made. this is how lacerta the dialogue has become in this area. one of the main issues was mercury. i live within four miles of the two largest car plants. -- large power plants. they said something like tens of

thousands of people's lives will be saved by removing the mercury from the power plants. if trustee thousand lives would be saved, 1000 lives would be saved in kentucky, and probably doesn't in may is still, ky -- maysville, ky. i don't know of anyone who has ever gotten sick from mercury. but they do die from suicide and drugs. host: we will leave it there. that was a business owner in kentucky. we will keep getting your take on federal regulations and their impact on jobs. i want to give you some other headlines. a jobs plan to target the health care workforce.

here is the front page of the washington times, an issue that we will talk about coming up in about a half-hour. deadlocked the deficit plan all is weighing a plan b. november 23 the deadline to come up with some sort of deal. members may be willing to

consider a fallback plan. we will talk about that coming up. also on the front page, fund- raisers and show little cash for herman cain. a felon is raising money for herman cain and profiting for company that he owns. and the new york times has the story --

also, a story that we will follow this morning and if we get any news on it we will let you know. the supreme court and whether or not they will take up president obama's health-care law. asking where u.s. power stops is the question. let's go to san diego, mike, a

democrat. talking about federal regulations and the impact on jobs. do they have an impact? caller: i don't know, because i don't know what the regulations are and what they do. except for the last caller, there is very little information about " these regulations are asking-- what they are requiring. if they would simply detail what the regulations are and why they andburden on the companyies how much it costs and what the risks are, the public will not know what is going on. they will just hear politicians saying that the regulations are tough. they don't go into details on why the regulations need to be removed. host: you would like to see more

public debate? caller: the public debate goes on, just talking about generalities. it's not like anybody really knows what the regulations are. host: more of a debate within the american people so they are more aware of what it is and then can decide? caller: a want to see more detail. if they ever discuss regulations, they should say what the regulation is and what it imposes on the company. then republicans will hear this and say that does not sound so bad. if it is bad, a company representative can say this is why it is bad and this is why it is a burden. right now it just sounds to me that it's about money, the company just wants to make a profit, so they say get rid of the regulations. they do not say we don't really

know what the devil is in the details. we need to have a discussion about the details and not just the generality of regulation and not knowing what that is. host: that was my, a democrat in san diego. we are taking your phone calls on what the impact is of federal regulations. do they impact jobs? we want to get your thoughts for the next 25 minutes. we will also take your tweets on twitter. you can also send us an e-mail. from newe from sue jersey.

susan, and independents in brunswick, georgia. caller: we absolutely do need government regulations. i also feel we need unions as well. a thought on what bruce said, if we have regulations and also have unions as well, those people with the massey coal mine, there would still be alive. and also what happened with the people on the gulf coast, if we had unions, those accidents never would have happened -- with bp on the gulf coast. the unions would never have allowed their employees to work under those conditions. and we want the government to regulate the food that we need and are prescription drugs, from india and we want toys to be

regulated. let's not forget all the ones that come from china that are poisoned with lead. that has not gone away at all. one other comment, you read something this morning on something from the verdict foundation. the heritage foundation is run by ththe koch brothers. of course they don't want government regulation. if we have would have no government regulation, there would be no safety net in our country. we are already eating poisoned food. our water is already contaminated. we do have lead and mercury in the water. i encourage people to watch a documentary called "gaslight." it directly talks about what happened with the coal mining up their and how -- up there and how people turn on the process

and its fire comes out. we need regulation and we need unions. host: david is a republican in michigan. caller: my goodness, the last caller, maybe she should have the government and wrapped her in swaddling clothes and carried her to her grave. as far as regulations is concerned, a job killer is is a regulation on energy. drilling for oil and gas, it's making it almost impossible for people to drill, the regulations they have to meet and everything. up here the grocery store owner had to lay off four people to

keep its prices so that he can sell groceries. pretty soon he's not going to have any people to lay off. he has a small group of employees right now. gasoline is making things so much more expensive to deliver, to transport, to travel to and from. where i live, a person goes to work, he travels 40 or 50 miles sometimes to go to work. and the same thing to come home. gas is $4 a gallon sometimes. about $3.55 right now. you spend most of your check on going back and forth to work. host: front page of the houston chronicle this morning --

some democrats refused to support obama, in this article -- and a new poll, mitt romney and newt gingrich to get bumped. and the politics section says newt gingrich's tied his fortunes to north carolina. he was with his wife in south carolina. you might have heard about the cbs news poll that was released

on friday. it shows mitt romney is the most qualified and new gingrich is the best in a crisis. when asked which of the candidates you think is the most qualified to be commander in chief, mitt romney topped the list with 26% to, newt gingrich at 21%, herman cain at 11%. which candidate do you trust to handle international crisis, 31% for newt gingrich, mitt romney at 90%, rick perry at 9%, herman cain at 8%. and there's an article about the debate that was held on saturday night with the republican candidates. embarrassing covert actions in iran -- san diego, democratic caller, michael. we are talking about role of federal regulations and its impact on jobs. caller: [unintelligible]

you have seen the documentary " food inc," as an example of the type of food we are getting. and in transportation, without regulation, where would the highway is be? the cars without standards? it would be a complete mess. no one checking their airplanes to make sure they are safe to fly. -- safe to host: is there a compromise? 75 new major regulations costing the $38 billion annually have been imposed by the obama administration.

let's say the heritage foundation is correct, is there a compromise to decide which regulations we could do without in order to help the economy? >caller: i could not say, but i would not trust anything the heritage foundation said. they have no credibility. they only want to help their own circle of 1% who want to pollute the air and water and take away education for children and god knows what all. they have the money to get their message out. host: we want to hear from business owners as well this morning as part of this conversation. what is the impact of jobs for you as a business owner?

houston texans on the line. caller: i can see where business is against more regulation, because they say it ties their hands. at the same time i am a guy who waits tables, an average man. i got my first car in 1995 and gas was a dollar or $1.20 a gallon. they deregulated the petroleum industry at that time and all the gas companies began to emerge. i remember the argument was we should not let the companies merged because we would have $3 a gallon gas. that was the laughingstock argument of the day. now we have seen that has come to fruition. furthermore, i have never seen anybody go to war over a wind turbine or solar panel.

we are mining a finite resource like gas. like the gentleman said a couple calls ago, it affects the cost of everything. everything we come in contact with past be transported by something that uses gasoline. not only that, the solution to our planet. another lady earlier mentioned genetically modified foods that we are eating. currentdocumentary on tv where gentleman said of the public will demand natural foods, we would give them that. he said that almost with a tear in his eye. with deregulation, i can see where business as it hurts them. but there has to be some give- and-take. it is ironic that the last 10 years under the previous presidential administration this almost the regulation they seen in a long time, but the greatest prosperity from businesses, but the american people have been the ones to suffer the most financially.

the only way that we will find a balance we did no one will be completely happy. we need to revisit what negotiation is. negotiation means everybody gets something we ought but nobody leaves completely happy. that's the problem with not just business also that's the biggest problem with business that they have become -- catered to by the government. anything seen as negotiation is seen as capitulation. host: some updates in the papers. the yearly cost to keep captives at guantanamo, $800,000.

and on expansion of the pipeline from canada --

men still, ohio, ken is a republican. what the make of the issue of regulation impact and jobs? mansfield, ohio. caller: there are outdated laws on the books. they can be utilized in ways that do not fit any more. if we review and evaluate these regulations, then we can have an opportunity to possibly keep the cost of what they can possibly

cost to a minimum. seems like a we put something on the books and it seems like it takes a lot of money. in the long run you could save money by doing it that way. host: let's hear from john, a business owner in kansas city, kansas. what is your business? caller: can you hear me? as a business owner, i have a perspective that i think most business owners have. i am a consumer as well as a business owner. . don't want poor food i'm also father. i have a wife and two daughters and a grandchild.

want to protect them from dangerous situations. on the other hand, i oppose on reasonable regulation like those implemented by the current administration. you cited a study from 1991 or so. host: let me find that for you. keep talking. caller: i am not quite sure. anyway, the study said that there was very little impact on jobs. the steel jobs in america have evaporated. we claim that the regulations were not a substantial cause. the bureau of labor statistics says that all you had to do is hire people if there's more regulation. that's true of a governmental regulation like the bureau of labor statistics. but if you have a job in business, a company producing

parts and then you raise the price from $1 up to to dollars, -- $2, nobody's going divide that by and many more. -- nobody is going to purchase that item any mormore. the bls and all the units that these studies are funded by are funded by the taxpayers of the united states. the u.s. budget today has a loss of 42%. it other words, if you have a household with income after paying taxes of $50,000. let's say you have an income of

$29,000,, to do you have left if you have an income of 29th thousand dollars, you are down $21,000, you are losing $21,000, how long will your household be in existence without the bankruptcy without its federal bailout? you cannot operate a business at a loss and you cannot operate a home at a loss. these people in the government have no concept of what money is, because there. as you just have a loss and you print more money. host: the study was from 1979 through 1991. tonay has this tweet -- nelson headlines in the papers this morning from overseas about what is happening. the wall street journal, european risks are hitting banks

in the u.s., mounting concerns of the euro zone crisis prompting some of the world's largest banks including u.s. banks to release more defamation about their exposure. then this story in the washington post -- and obama pushes a pacific trade deal. it says it's meant to deal with issues including government procurement, the conduct of state-owned companies, but look toward convergence, and protection of intellectual property. going landed a record jet order deal -- boeing landed.

the order is worth $18 billion. although the order is worth that amount, the emirate's is expected to pay significantly less because airlines typically secure discounts on large deals. that the airline company that put in that order. cleveland, ohio, democratic caller. caller: good morning. regulations is a broad statement. if you want people to make that decision just based on that won broad statement, we need regulations, republicans talk that all the time and you cannot trust that. republicans control the congress from 1995 through 2006 and we had democrats in control. during that time they

deregulated. we had a financial disaster because of deregulation. that's why these people were able to rob us blind with impunity. host: francis, independence in lake charles, louisiana. caller: thank you for letting me speak this morning. i agree with the lady that just finished talking. regulations, every time i hear that word, there's always a republican and the heritage foundation and the other right- wingers, they blame everything on regulations. the only way we can get a job is if we deregulate, they say.

before we did not have jobs and we don't have any jobs now. when we had tax cuts we were supposed to have jobs. we still don't have any jobs. now with all the tax breaks and everything, we are back where we are. and the jobs are gone. host: let me get your reaction to this tweet from joanna. do you think federal regulations have any impact on jobs and the economy > caller: i don't think so. i think it's just a talking point for all the republicans. host: let's hear from barry

republican, john, atlanta, georgia. caller: i don't think it's a talking point. i am a former mayor of a city in georgia. we had a study done in the 1990's. 24% of our budget was to take care of federally mandated projects. we cannot afford that. sp when we instrumented the project we may have hired someone new, but we had to let people go because we were always on a balanced budget. it was very difficult. host: let me knothe house and se

will be back this week. they have to deal with continuing resolution that expires on friday, one of the short-term government funding bills to keep the government run in. that will be part of the debate this week. the house is taking up a gun rights legislation. the senate will deal with spending legislation, government spending bill for three parts of the federal government. we will have our coverage of the floor, the house and senate floor. at noon today we are also covering the chief executive officer of blue cross blue shield at the chamber of commerce. he will talk about transforming healthcare. and we will be covering house democrats examining voting laws changes across states and we will cover that on c-span3 at 2:00 p.m.. if you are interested in those topics, go to our web site.

there's a new look for our web site. you can easily see what we are covering and when if you scroll down through all the different boxes, c-span.org. last phone call on federal regulations impacting jobs. a business owner in california, kathy. caller: first, i am a business owner. i just started a business, really excited about it, making jewelry, myself. i went to a small business meeting and it was overwhelming, everything. i am in california, so there are quite a few things. if you have employees, especially. it stopped me in my tracks a little and was overwhelming. host: why? caller: all the different regulations and this and that. i thought it was going to vmi own little full-time job on the side, making sure i was ok with

all the laws and this license and that license, especially if you get bigger and have employees. i think that can be a problem. i don't know if it's true, but i've heard the library of congress has an entire wall covered from ceiling to floor and it just as the books that list regulations. it does not even have the details of the regulations, but that is how many we have in government, a whole wall with just the name of the regulation. that is overboard. it makes people lax in their own lives and they're not proactive. they kind of think government is taking care of it. i remember growing up, call the lunch ladies wore hair nets and gloves in the lunch line and everything was clean. i don't know if that was a regulation or not, but these days you go to the coffee house and they touch all the money and tax credit cards and then grab

your muffin or bagel. so it's the same hands the to all the dirty money. i have called spanned left messages to the owners saying that is not really clean. people use the bathroom and use their hands. so i think people get kinda numb in their brain and think government will take care of it. i don't trust the epa much. the government cannot be everywhere. you have to be pro-active in your life. host: have you reached out to the small business administration for a loan for your new company? caller: i have not done that yet. host: you might be interested to watch the last hour of the washington journal this morning because we will talk about small how they loans and aho work very next, jonathan allen of "politico" about the

deadline for the deposit reduction committee. they have 10 days to get a deal. we will be right package. -- right back. ->> c-span.org is now easier to use. the design and features 11 debt deal choices, making it easier to watch today's events live and recorded. there's a section on the homepage to access our most popular series and programs like washington journal, "book tv, american history tv, and the contenders. and you can quickly find where to watch our three c-span network on cable or satellite systems across the country at the all new c-span.org. >> want more videos of the

candidates at our web site for campaign 2012. from recent events to the earliest parts of their campaigns, read the latest comments from candidates and political reporters, from social media web sites, and links to c-span media partners in the early primary and caucus states. iowa, new hampshire, and south carolina c-span.org/ campaign2012. >> most people probably think of voa with total masses listening on the radio in europe and listening at the door for secret police. that is an outdated. exports of america director off on the changing face of voa. >> we are on facebook and twitter and satellite tv now. we are on fm radio and we have a lot of affiliate's around the world. radio and television stations that use us as sort of a washington news bureau for them. we are finding new ways to communicate with people.

the mission has pretty much stayed the same. >> tonight at 8:00 eastern on c- span t2. >> washington journal continues. >> senior congressional reporter with "politico," jonathan allen. the front page of your newspaper, deficit panel ponders the end game. guest: these guys have had a couple months now to come up with the $1.20 trillion deficit reduction plan and have shown no progress. as we have seen in the last couple weeks the progressive offers are getting farther and farther apart. we have seen people digging in ideologically. we have seen democrats and republicans breaking from their own side. jim cliburn from south carolina said yesterday on fox news that democrats have not coalesced around their own plan. republicans as well, the same is

true. if you have hopes for the depth as a panel, you are probably on this step as a panel -- if you have hoped for this deficit panel, you are probably on this panel. there's been a little overemphasis on how long it takes the congressional bean counters to come back and say this is how much money this policy costs or saves or raises in revenue. the cbo is familiar with all the policies they are looking at. think it takes that long. if it comes down to a situation where there will be a day off, you can probably expect congress to make some sort of provision for that. if not, i don't think you would expect to see an extension. , if: there's talk of plan b

not. >> if they don't find structural change, we will fail in our duty. we have a goal of reaching $1.50 trillion of deficit-reduction over 10 years. if an goal for some reason we fail in that goal, there is still a $1.20 trillion of deficit reduction that will take place under the law. >> lots of people are now saying it is too much, particularly on the defense side to do an across-the-board couple. >> it disproportionately impacts national defence and even the secretary of defense says it would haul out the national defence. what i'm going to do is be committed to ensuring backspin at least america gets a $1.20 trillion in deficit-reduction. congress would have 13 months.

-- would have 13 months to do it in a smarter fashion. we need to focus that we have entitlement funding programs that are some of tennessee entitlement funding programs that are doing a disservice to constituents. guest: he's talking about the failure of the super committee. over the next 13 months there is a trigger where there or be automatic cuts even domestic programs and defense programs if they don't come to agreement. the congressman said we may have to leave this to the congress to figure out over the next 13 months for windows automatic cuts go into effect what a smarter way to do the cuts is a cut across the board. then there are automatic

cuts of $1.20 trillion and there is also talk that the deficit- reduction committee writes in legislation that says now the tax committees in the house and senate should, with something to deal with medicare and medicaid, the big spending programs. guest: you would have a super committee would come up with a target for revenue and essentially they would give instructions to the ways and means committee in a house, commerce committee in the house, and the finance committee in the senate and they would come back with the actual policy that would add up to that. this is almost a reconciliation process where there is an expedited way not to get legislation done that reduces the deficit. it is not clear whether they

would have the ability to or would dare to try to put forth new expedited procedures. the super committee had card blanche.arte the super committee looks like it's handling kryptonite right now. host: would congress have to pass that? guest: the only thing in what is there would be $1.20 trillion of automatic cuts that would be split between defense and entitlements. host: will be $1.20 trillion at the end of the day in cuts? guest: as the law stands now, yes. but that starts january 2013. there is still some wiggle room to avert cuts. congress can always be right along -- congress can always

rewrite the law. it's difficult to say we know for sure what cuts will happen or if in fact the cuts will happen. host: we want to show what this person had to say about the prospects of the deficit- reduction committee. >> what are the realistic chances they will compromise within 10 days? >> i feel very confident that we will. i am not certain as i was 10 days ago. we have 10 days to do this and i really believe that all the ingredients for a good resolution are there. thejust need to develop a wil will. host: have they been working on the weekend and will they continue to meet every day? guest: certainly not meeting in

public. the one thing that's amazing about this process is none of it has been done in public, a public that has been frustrated enough about private negotiations that president obama said he would be the c- span president, i recall. and congress has said repeatedly that it wants to be more open and transparent. speaker john boehner has said that as well. they don't feel they can get anything done unless it is out of the view of the american public, unless they are meeting privately. some would argue they could get a sense of what the public thinks if they would publicize things. most of america has no idea what the super committee is doing at all. that has been an issue. in terms of whether they will continue to meet, they have been meeting having one-on-one meetings with various members of the super committee and also in small groups. i think that will continue.

you heard congressman cliburn say that they need to develop the will. a member of the committee does not feel good will is there to get it done, not just the ability to sit down and crunch numbers. host: why is that? guest: i think the two sides don't really trust each other. whether that is the members of the super committee themselves or the parties at large? at the end of the day this is something that is contrived by the leadership in large part and that means senate majority leader harry reid and house speaker john boehner. they have not been very far from this process and they will not be far from the process. anything that gets signed off on by the super committee will have their blessing. if this is a tool for the leadership and from the white house for cutting a deal, but this is not an independently functioning 12-member body. host: about the deficit-

reduction committee -- guest: his saying that he would not sign off on something that gives the automatic cuts with a trigger. if you come to a situation where the defense cuts are about to go into place, you have the 2012 election coming up, will the president wants to stake his ground on whether or not he cut the pentagon when his own defense secretary is saying that would weaken the country, we will back to see how that would play out. and there are other ways for things to become law than the president signing them,

including two thirds of congress voting for something without his signature. there's a little wiggle room. host: libya, independence in woodstock, new york. caller: caller: he is talking with these members. i've put together a letter to the editor and talking about campaign against globalization. he is -- the president's press secretary is pleading to congress to listen to your constituents. grover norquist -- they have no obligation to follow it. please investigate this process. host: referring to grover

norquist, a guest pass sunday. tosaid, i'm not losing sleep raise revenue. guest: the things we have seen or raised revenue in one place and cutting and elsewhere. this is the ionization of deductions and the offsetting decrease in tax rates. there is some disagreement as to whether that would raise revenue or cut revenue. it depends on a lot of issues. it is not surprising to me that he is not losing sleep. he has said if there is tax reform on the table and not raising new taxes, then he assisted in that.

host: you can watch the full interview with grover norquist on our website, c-span.org. there's an editorial in "usa today." hope for the super committee deal. there is an opposition view that there is no time to raise taxes. i'm wondering about the conservatives and about any deal that may come out from the committee. guest: i think some members might be willing to have taxes as part of the deficit reduction talks, not just in terms of raising taxes or cutting them, but increasing tax rates or creating new forms of taxation.

as long as they are talking about that, they will be less willing to go for it. they fear primaries and it is possible that by and large in the republican party that is the idea that you're not going to raise taxes that is powerful. i think the influence can be seen in other members and then being said to be less than pursuant to the party line of the republican party. host: democratic line in indiana, steve. caller: good morning. i cannot understand how grover norquist is a topic of conversation.

he has never been elected to anything. he evidently felt through a greate. all these hot dogs in the republican party. guest: i believe he is a harvard graduate. it is interesting that he has become a topic of conversation. this is all but just for c-span viewers. he continues to be influential and his name was brought in house republican conference meetings. one person answered, mailing lists. he is able to contact a lot of people in a short amount of time. he has been building a list of people who hate taxes.

that is inefficient way of influencing members of congress. "i will talk to people about what you're doing and what you should be doing." his group, they have spent money to defeat democrats, not the primary republicans. host: on the other side, the violence of aarp and groups to medicare cuts. guest: also very strong. "we are not going to raise taxes." that is the basic orthodox for republicans. these groups serve to back up those ideologies. in some cases, at the corner them.

the outside groups are powerful enough that members of congress cannot get out of their own orthodoxy. these are things date would want to be doing anyway. aarp is influential as an organization for elderly americans -- i guess 50 and over. also as a health insurer. they have lot of influence. host: we have a tweet. about we're talking across-the-board cuts. we're not talking about specifying those cuts. one suggested that instead of sticking to% for mayor and 2%

from there, we'll take 5% for mayor, 1% for mayor -- instead of taking 2% from here., we will take 5% from here, 1% from here. through a went trillion dollars. dick cheney said that did not matter. isn't it too late for y'all to hark on the debt? host: she is referring to congress. guest: if only trillions or thousands the solution would be much easier. if you look back 10 or 11 years,

debt.illion of even republicans would say president bush was somebody who wanted to lower taxes and to increase spending. that was a frustration with republicans. democrats retook the house. but the democratic congress came in with nancy pelosi and with harry reid. president obama cayman and spent a lot of money without raising taxes -- president obama came in. we had 9/11, two wars that were necessary.

some say we get to spend our way out of the repression. we have a $15 trillion debt. a tweet. have 8 twe what about the prospects for passing the house? if there was a deal? guest: there are strong indications they could pass the house. of the 100 members of the cannot in favor of a big deal -- of the 100 members that came out in favor of a big deal, you can expect see a lot of its members sign off on that letter. that was 60 democrats, 40 republicans.

enough people to show there would be enough support to pass the house. with a vote to cut deficits, that is a difficult thing for the house to say no. it is one thing to get to that stage. it is another thing for people to vote no on the deficit reduction. this is a small amount. it sounds like a lot of money. host: george, a republican from florida. caller: i think the super committee is looking at the nation when they should be looking at globalization and how we're going to fit into the new system of doing business internationally. like a jigsaw puzzle, everything has been disrupted. different countries are vying for their place in globalization. host: let me take your point.

how will global markets react if there will not be a deal? guest: earlier this summer when was going to abou downgrade the u.s. debt, - people did,-- s&p was less credible. at some point the debt problem will cause the u.s. and issue in international markets. whether that happens on november 23 or sometime in the future is not clear. host: we have another tweet. we will keep talking about what this deficit committee is doing. and what your take on the continuing resolution -- i want

your take. what are the prospects for a possible shutdown? guest: pretty small. you have heard some screaming and yelling from conservatives that were angry about this deal. this set spending for the year, or put a cap on it. conservatives are more interested on $1.09 trillion. some people are still upset about funding the government at those levels, and also some disaster funding they are not too thrilled with. it likely will see some yelling and screaming. that was the point of the debt limit deal, that you keep the government funding for the rest of the year and a stable level

-- at a stable level. i think house republicans do not want to be dealing with this all year long. i think they found last year they got back up with a lot of these budget issues and it had the result of a hamstring the agenda. host: november 23 is the day. this is what mark warner had to say, democrat from virginia. he was part of the gang of six. >> we have tried this congressional process. we want that super committee to be successful.

we think the simpson-bowles approach, that to get a vote as well -- that should get a vote as well. host: something from the gang of six proposal or the simpson- bowles approach getting a vote. guest: the chance is zero. in terms of parts of what they have suggested, they are on the table. there are part of what the deficit committee is looking at. they are looking at what the biden group did over the summer. there were three other sets of people. now you have the super committee trying to get something to done. this is exhibit a a for people

who think that congress is dysfunctional. caller: i did watch yesterdays program with grover norquist. i think he has too much influence on this process. he indicated a lot -- what he said it was very telling. he meets behind closed doors. he said he wanted transparency. i don't know your name. he was advocating to be open and transparent, but i think things need to change. host: she is referring to the last part of the interview. he was asked, do you talk to leadership, super committee members?

he indicated he was able to meet with them or call the mop and talk about what they are doing -- call them up. and just the influence of grover norquist and the process. it is not just grover norquist who gets to talk. guest: it is a limited set of people. it is not a one-man fit. through their stance and through other entities after the leadership of the party is, -- through their staffs. nobody has any idea what is going to go forward. they are still a place where they have no idea what their top lines are. what is it they are looking for in terms of revenue or spending reduction?

until i get there, they have no chance of getting specific policies together -- until they get their. grover norquist plays a role. if somebody wants to find out how he will interpret a certain revenue proposal, he may want to call and say, is this something you'll jump on me about or is this something you can support? it makes sense that these guys are talking to him. i'll give you another anecdote. grover norquist said that he called jon kyl right after jon kyl set republicans were going to increase the rates. that was interpreted by some

people to set republicans were open to another tax increase, does not a rate increase. grover norquist called up jon kyl -- "what did you say? what do mean?" "i said i was not going to raise rates." i think he likes to play both sides. to say he is a simple guy with a simple plan, but also at the same time he likes to talk about how influences the process. that makes a more influential -- that makes him more influential. host: we have a tweet. some cynicism there.

automatic cuts was the plan all along. guest: if it wanted to get this committee to work, the hammer would have been bigger. $35 million for domestic programs or whatever the amount is, maybe close to $50 million a year. some want the cuts to medicare -- they are capped at 2% for the automatic cuts. some wanted closer to 4%, which would have been more of an incentive for people in the medical industry to get on board. people up and working to prevent this from happening. host: tom from ohio, an independent.

caller: i am 56 years old and have been a factor work for all my life. you're being occupied right now. i am a 56-year-old man. this does have to do with reduction. we need to take all the ceo's, commerce and senators, -- congress and senators, take their pay, hedge fund managers, and take them to 1979 wages. guest: congress is not allowed to put a pay cut on the same congress. there is an amendment that prevents an increase unlike a

cut. this would happen in 2013. we would need a constitutional scholar to see if it would affect congressional pay or not. the question of whether congress might cut its own pay going forward, and never to change their pay is another one that is popular. poll ratings are at 9%. people will be less focused on their pay if they were doing a better job. there's a reason that the public has lost faith in the congress' ability to function. these guys are a best congenial to each other -- is guys are at

are at best congenial to each other. getting bills on time and in proper fashion -- not in 20 years. host: that leads us back to the short-term funding bill. the process in the senate has been to pass mini-buses. guest: that is a bastard position of the term on the bus -- that is a bastard i ization of the term omnibus. each of the appropriations bills on maybe three departments

of the government on its own. sometimes there were wrapped together in groups of eight, nine, 12. the minibus is a new strategy with a group two or three bills together into a single bill. there is one that has gone through and is in negotiations between the house and the senate. that will be to fund the government short-term. it might catch a ride. a second one is coming up this week. it was sent over from the state department. that is something that is a talking aboutpo-- the huge deficit reduction.

you have seen some reaction to this unesco vote. the palestinians were allowed into unesco. if they get membership status, the united states withdraw from unesco and stops funding anit. the state department bill, there is a lot going on. we have seen rick perry talked about possibly funding pakistan. i believe congresswoman michele bachmann said that was a bad idea. it will be interesting to see what happens with that state's department bill which is part of the minibus. and the energy bill. host: the senate returns today

at 2:00 p.m. and will take up the government spending for those three areas, the so-called mini bubus bill. look for our coverage tonight on c-span2. a republican from maryland. caller: looks to me that congress has abdicated their responsibility to govern. they're discussing any decisions with 12 people in charge. the only people that benefit are the special interests. instead of focusing on 535, now we have called people that can influence. congress is not subject to the same laws as everybody else. they are allowed to do insider trading tips.

everybody else goes to jail, except members of congress. host: we as part of it magazine segment focus on a piece in "the atlantic" about insider trading and studies to look at whether congress is guilty of that. you can go to c-span.org if you're interested and you can watch that interview. guest: when you are frustrated with congress, it is easy to assign bad motives. i do with members of congress on a daily basis -- i deal with members of congress on a daily basis. i think it is misguided. they are interested in with the special interests have to say.

they represent other interests, whether it is aarp or somebody else with a lot of money. there's an interest in hearing from all the different stakeholders. to that, the members of congress in the super committee, these are people that wanted to be on the -- they did not want to be on the super committee. to get something done, there would have run away from that. host: we have a tweet. you can send as a tweet you can send us a tweet by going to twitter.com/cspanwj.

caller: you do not live in the real world. social security did not create this deficit. when nasa policy came into office, there were a record number of filibusters -- went nancy pelosi came into office, there were a record number of filibusters. i'm so passionate about this. i have 17 grandchildren. i've lost my two part-time jobs. i have to do it bankruptcy when my husband was very sick. you're not listening to the people. these numbers are bought and paid for by the lobbyists. host: we will get a response from jonathan allen. guest: congratulations on all

those grandchildren. i did not say the social security was responsible for this debt. it is not. social security has run a surplus. congress has stolen from that surplus. there are low administrative costs. lots of people are paying in. there probably needs to be some tweaks, but at the moment, they're not as necessary. medicare is the big driver. as far as members being bought, if you have evidence of lobbyists giving members something in exchange for public policy -- this is something our

system has been to be legal. members of congress can legislate about things they care about. if you have specific evidence, bring it to me. we deal with these guys all the time. i talk to them as much as possible. i talk to their staffs. i understand the frustration. host: jonathan allen with "politico." thank you for being here. we will be talking about small business loans and how they work. our next topic -- more foreign students are studying in the united states and the economic boost tops $20 billion.

>> world markets are down this morning. italy and greece continue working on the debt problem. the new prime minister faces a confidence vote on wednesday. warren buffett says investors are losing confidence in the euro. europe does not have anyone with the authority to take the measures needed to defend their currency. the recent leadership changes in italy and greece should help. dow futures are down about 10 points. syrian president should step down. the leader should begin a political dialogue and make sure his success "has the ability to

change the status quo." the european union is adding more charges. the arab league has suspended syria. those are some of the headlines. >> most people think of it, listing for the door if the secret police might come. >> voice of america director david ensor. >> we are on fm radio. we have a lot of affiliate's. s. stations use us as kind of a washington news bureau for them. >> "the communicators," tonight

on c-span2. >> the cspan.org homepage is now easier to use. the new design features 11 video choices, making it easier for you to watch today's events, live and recorded. there's a section on the homepage to access our most popular series and programs like "washington journal," "book tv," "american history tv," and "the contenders." and we've added a handy channel finder so you can quickly find where to watch our three c-span networks on cable or satellite systems across the country, at the all-new c-span.org. >> "washington journal" continues. host: and we are backed. ann stock is the assistant secretary of state for educational and cultural affairs. allen goodman is with the institute of international education. more foreign students are studying here. allen goodman, let me start with

you. how did you figure in $20 billion? what is happening here? guest: it is very good for education and for the economy. most foreign students pay tuition and room and board and go to the local wal-mart and buy furnishings and books. that is economic development for our communities. we take out any grants to me have had. -- they may have had. host: this is a record high for 2010-2011.

host: this is where the students are coming from. host: why these countries -- why do these countries topped the list? guest: the president is speaking in asia. 60% of the students coming year, the from asia-- 16%. we expect to see that number and we expect to see it to grow. host: why is a good for education? guest: our future depends somewhat students discover. our future american work force depends on our kids in knowing how to work next to an indian or chinese or brazilian.

this prepares them for their future and ours. host: why is a good that the students are coming? guest: they globalize our campuses and make our student body more diverse. that is to they are going to be working with for the next 40, 50, 60 years. they are future global leaders in everything we do-- business, education, politics. they will work side-by-side with each other. they globalize our campuses and communities. host: university of southern california tops the list of were the students are going. guest: purdue university, mike alma matmy honor.

alma mater. we give them accurate and comprehensive information about our campuses and our colleges. we encourage them to come to the united states and answer any questions they have. we tried to make it easier for them to get here. host: how much does it cost? guest: $10 million, $12 billion. it is not a large number. host: why shouldn't this just be universities reaching out to the students? guest: we work in partnership with the universities and with the states to make sure we are expanding to get people here. indiana, ohio, michigan all have

foreign plants to get students to the united states. we worked side by side to figure out ways to get more students here -- we all have foreign plans. $21.3 billion last year. that was in an economy that was not the best. we worked side by side with states, schools, and with foreign governments through strategic dialogs for all this coming together. it is important that our work people work together in this global economy. we want to make sure our students are prepared to compete. one of the opportunities here is for our young people to study abroad. we have to wonder savvy

thousand-- 270,000 students studying abroad. there is more action for more people to study abroad, get a passport. our administrators have been asked to study abroad and find more ways to get more of our young people to study abroad. one% of our student body of the 21 billion students travel abroad to study abroad. we want to get more people to be " a competent and prepared for what is ahead. host: is this just higher education? guest: this is just higher education. this is not an immigration program. we consider this a higher

education program. we want to educate our young people. we have the best higher education system in the world. young people want to come study here. host: these are the majors that people are looking at. talk about what universities say about these programs. guest: universities are looking for diversity groups of students, domestic and foreign. they are looking for a wide range of fields. the colleges and universities -- it requires drawing students from all over the world, the best tunes you can possibly find. host: allen goodman, you did

this report. ann stock, why did you team up? guest: we started doing this together right after world war ii. we felt there was a public purpose to have a sense of international students. this goes back to 1919. we have had a great partnership with the state's department ever since. host: do you get money? guest: they support part of the study every year. about $300,000. we raise money on our own and from our own resources. host: we will get to phone calls. let me give you the phone

numbers. first up is mary from a virginia. caller: it is absurd to sit here and here this nonsense. when you sit here and educate foreign people instead of our own, which is why we criticize -- we're criticize to have people educated enough to do the jobs in this country. to do those jobs and to allow foreign students to take the call spots and grants -- to take the college spots and grants to bring up our knowledge base for citizens so they can compete with the world and do what has been in noted-- host: we will take your point on

the international students taking the spots of american students. guest: we have a huge capacity in the united states. we have 4800 colleges in the united states. there's lots of capacity. we do have the gold standard. and also community colleges. host: american students are going overseas as well and they are studying. guest: 270,000. we need them to go abroad. we need them to a passports. they should be totally prepared. international education works both ways.

guest: the numbers up or israel, india, brazil, malaysia, and egypt. host: what is the impact on the cultures and the site that they are going to? guest: everytime we travel aboard, we increase what we call people to people exchange. they learn about our culture. we learn about their culture, their society. it allows us to think more broadly in terms of the people that the will be dealing with in the next 50 years. host: you mentioned 270,000 people.

host: what about hotspots and getting students from hotspots to try to influence heart and mind. guest: the top five are the ones that we know. in the top 25, you're seeing a much more diverse area. they are studying in latin america, asia, and in africa. we have seen those numbers go up. students have a mind of their own. they want to go where they learn a lot. host: this is what they are learning about, the top fields. wayne, a to

democrat. caller: we have the smartest dunes in the world. -- we have the smartest students in the world. why do they say we don't have the smarts to deal with the jobs that are out there? we are smart. what is the reason behind that? guest: we have a real national deficit in terms of americans who are studying math and science. we don't have enough engineers, doctors, or nurses. it begins in high school with the absence of emphasis on science and math. people find it difficult and they move to other fields. you can do that in america. we don't have enough of the people of the sciences.

we're fortunate that for those education programs, which to recruit and attract students from all over the world. a few will stay in america. many will go back home. host: james is a republican. good morning. caller: thank you. i have a statement and a question. i don't believe the state department's should play a role in sending any child overseas. they have proven repeatedly their inability, inadequate ness, and working against parents of adopted children. i had a group of 7000 of parents

that the fat their children abducted overseas -- that have had their children abducted. the word needs to -to-- to not let your children overseas -- do not let your children overseas. guest: the fulbright program sends people from underserved areas abroad for a short period of time. we have several critical language programs. the programs are designed to prepare our young people to learn about cultures and come back home and be prepared to take jobs in the 21st century economy. host: who accounts for their safety? guest: the embassy. there are huge programs in place and safeguards that take care of young people when they

are a broad. we take this very seriously, the health, safety, and welfare of any student, whether they are coming here or whether our students are traveling abroad. host: green bay, wisconsin, paul, an independent. caller: i am concerned about paying for 40% of the cost of their tuition. if it's a state university, u.s. taxpayers pay for these people. this is outrageous. guest: most international students coming here pay their own way. they pay tuition and room and board and other fees. when a u.s. institution gives a student a fellowship, it is

because we don't have enough people in america who are going to be able to teach the science and math labs. so students from other countries are important to teach our own students. host: how much does the government pay? guest: less than 0.6%. those are typical researchers. host: 0.6%. can you give us a dollar figure/ ? guest: i don't have that figure. host: a democrat from los angeles. caller: i'm opposite from the caller. i was fortunate enough to travel around the world with the military.

it would be better if they would go to schools in the middle east now at this point in time. guest: about 35% of students this year did study in the middle east. there were in egypt and other countries that we did have to evacuate them from. they wanted to go back after they were evacuated, to learn the language, the culture, to continue in the relations that they started with the young people and to continue their schooling so they could bring that knowledge and that competitive knowledge back to the united states. host: when it comes to evacuate, what is the protocol from the state department? guest: all hands on deck, 24/7.

it took about eight days to get people out of egypt. all our partners the run the programs and many of the independent programs and the state department was on hand to evacuate people immediately. host: how much to those groups contribute to students in their coming here going abroad? fulbright is an b annual thing. the only federal program we have that somebody other government contributes to. it is great for public diplomacy and cost-effective. our own colleges and universities value having a fulbright students on campus. host: it is a scholarship program. guest: it has a scholarship attached to it.

these are people that will serve both countries and they will go back home and built the french ships. guest: take chile. six or seven other cabinet officers are fulbright scholars. they are working side by side solvent a host of reasons that are important to both of our country's -- they are working side by side to solve a host of problems. host: we have a tweet for you. mary is next, a republican. caller: good morning. i have two points to make.

i have a son who just completed college and a daughter who will be going in. we know many extremely gifted students who have been denied or waitlisted at some of the top universities. i think there are two reasons. a diversity issue. for you're talking about -- instance, and and they pay the full tuition. some students may needsom some aid. i would love to see a comparison done of credentials of some of the students who are admitted before our own students. i would love to see their test scores, gpa's, etc.

guest: you can see that in their reports that colleges and universities do. each college and university makes thrown determination for admissions purposes. i think the goal is to bring the best tunes they can to their state and to their campus. international student 10 years ago or about 3% of total enrollment in america. today it is not quite 4%. educates capacity to our own citizens has increase. there's tremendous capacity to take care of our own students and help internationals. host: you're saying that is 4%? guest: under 4%.

look at other countries that we compete with. they are at 80%, 20%, 25% -- they are at 18%. caller: i just wanted to thank you for having a forum for this discussion. i wanted to thank my personal benefit for being able to go to a high school and also a college. i would like to say that these students are making money in this economy. they are paying taxes on that money. they are buying computers and paying taxes on what they buy here. the students -- there are lots of positive things about this program. they're paying taxes.

they are paying for this program as much as we are. host: let me read from a story from "usa today" about your report. "nearly $20 billion was offset by u.s. support." can you respond to that? guest: colleges and universities offer teaching fellowships and graduate assistants to the scholars and students that they need. international students are among that. the wrong way to say that is that they pay so much intuition and that is the total number. we have to back out any tuition assistance that they get, and they do get some. but 2/3 pay their entire

freight and give their way in the united states and that's how we get to the nearly $22 billion they contribute to our economy. host: we have an e-mail. guest: they are coming year on an education program. host: do they need a student visa? guest: it is a non-immigrant student visa. the intent is that the student returns home. host: patrick. caller: do not leap a single word from that gentleman -- do not believe a single word from the gentleman.

look for the researchers are. he said they are teaching our children in the classroom or in colleges. how are our children supposed to inspire to those positions, when those positions are given away to foreign students that are not even american. host: let's take that point to allen goodman. guest: there are tremendous incentives to study in all fields. i have two doctors and dinners in my -- and a nurse in my family. we can do it. we are a world power. it will benefit our kids. we started right after world war i as part of an effort to help

americans is engaged with the world. we've been promoting exchange for americans and for people all over the world. we think it promotes mutual understanding and peace.host: td was released early this morning. can it be found on your web site? guest: yes. caller: what percentage of students that come to the united states return here to live? host: can you speak to that? guest: that is a great question. 10 years ago, we were concerned with brain drain.

because of globalization, many students return to their country. no one has comprehensive data on that. we are seeing more bring gain -- brain gain for many other countries after students have been here. host: this is the headline from "india times." guest: there was a small decrease in indians coming here. compared to the increase in china, india would note that in their press. what has increased is the number of indians getting optional practical training that our country also allows for a year after their studies here. i fully expect those students will return. i think the indian numbers next year will increase.

it could be an impact of the recession. every country has felt that. it could be to make sure they have a job next year. guest: a lot of students are choosing to study in their new institutions and get a job immediately. they may not be coming here in the numbers they were. several weeks ago, secretary clinton hosted their minister of human-resources at a huge education summit at georgetown university. there were approximately 300 business, higher education, and government leaders looking at innovative ways for the united states and our people to work with india and their people on innovations we might do.

one was to look at the community college model as a form of vocational training in india. that is one way to partner that we have not done before. our community college model is a model for the world. it is typically unique to the united states. we know a lot about two-year colleges and what they do for students. that was one idea that came out of that. there are a number of other ways that we are working. host: what are your responsibilities? guest: large and all over the place. the exchanges we do around the world and that come here. it is the cultural programs, academic programs, our youth, our sports programs. we have about 60% of the world's youth under age 30.

we are looking at more ways for our young people to work with young people of the world, including social media and virtual exchange to engage people of the world. it is a wide variety of things. it is basically running out of our exchanges worldwide. host: you are manager at the international arts program, deputy assistant to president clinton, social secretary in the white house from 1993 until 1997. the next call is on the independent line from -- i think i messed up the phone lines. that was my fault for pushing the wrong button. we will come back to claudia. allan goodman, you have done these reports for many years. what do you do with them.

guest: it is important for higher education to know how international is or is not. it is important to note how globally our citizens are engaged or not. this gives us a benchmark. what is impressive is that an international education is taking place in all states at community colleges and research institutions. understanding that is important to our future. it is producing knowledge for the economy. host: claudia, are you there? caller: i and this generation -- am fifth generation american. i mean euro-biologist, and euro- anatomist. i cannot get a job.

we have hundreds if not thousands of native-born scientists who cannot find a job. the rest have low wages. the last job i had in the scientists, and $15 an hour. as long as that goes on, we're ed as u.s.v scientists. they see what our lives are like and will not go into it. we're disincentive rising -- disincentivising it. host: michael is a democratic caller from philadelphia. go ahead. you are on the air in philadelphia. caller: i do believe is good to

have money coming into the country. as the previous caller just mentioned, i am an engineer with the masters. i have not been able to find work for three years. a lot of these children of wealthy from other countries. -- are wealthy from other countries. they are being sent here to find work. i believe they are driving down the pay curve for individuals in this country. host: allan goodman, let's take a point about the impact on the pay curve in the united states. guest: we want americans to have jobs. we want people to be able to

find work. we have to find a way in the economy to make the positions. our focus in higher education is how we focus on our kids and employees of the future and what they will need to get jobs in engineering or any other field. they will need to know something about the world. they will need to know something about working with people from other countries. international education is aimed at providing that. host: funding for international students is similar for students going abroad. the families pick of about 63. 4%. the caller said it is mostly wealthy students. -- the families pick up about 63.4%. guest: they have shortages in their own country.

they saved tremendous amounts of -- -- money to educate a few children. that is the phenomenon we're seeing, the value placed on education, the savings into it as opposed to a car or house or other things. the pattern of expenditure in other countries is different. education is right up there. education is at the top of list for the people coming here. they do save and chillesend ther children here. caller: my son is four years old and in a total immersion school because i realize the importance of the world going global and international education. what is being done in our public schools? i cannot send my son to a public school in our area and expect

him to compete with other students globally. i would like to know what types of programs you are coming up with so that our younger kids are prepared in the sciences, arts, and languages to make certain that our kids are the evil -- -- will be able to compete globally. he is studying spanish. mandarin is coming to his school. his school is called tabla rasa. in atlanta, they have an international school with several different language courses as well. guest: i think you are seeing a number of leaders, mayors, and governors recognizing the importance of training our kids

in languages so that they are ready to compete. mayor richard daley in chicago has put in place in mandarin program. he did that a number of years ago in the public schools. they are training young people to speak mandarin. you are seeing a number of leaders realizing what the global competencies' will be in the coming years. they are looking at how they are training young people. they are going back and evaluating what we are doing. the number of spanish and chinese a immersion courses in public schools are increasing across the united states. my guess is those will grow as we continue to work in a global society. guest: i am really proud of the

mother that called in who has put her child in a school that will get one or two languages. most americans are not studying language anymore. language learning is at the lowest level in our history. that will not change in the next year or two. it will change with mothers like that caller saying that this is really important for my son or daughter. school systems will change when they realize parents really think this is important for the next generation. host: michael is a democratic caller from minnesota. caller: my question is that everything is fine with bringing people into the country and having new ways of how the world is doing things. my concern is what happens to us

that live in the country. we have an epidemic of not enough students able to get quality education in our own institutions. we cannot have people coming into the country when the previous caller said that she has degrees from various universities and cannot find jobs. host: what do you make of that, repeated nature of the phone calls when it comes to taking spots from american kids in college as? guest: i would go back to the fact that the capacity is there. there are 4800 colleges. there is plenty of capacity. the united states has the capacity to educate

international students and our own citizens. we have numerous colleges. there may be a number of other issues that need to be addressed. host: the next caller is a republican from iowa. caller: good morning. the question that occurs is this. throughout the years, the best students in the world have come here for education. they planned on staying in the united states and getting positions here. universities and research labs actively recruited these students. they advertised for them. after being on committees to hire for our universities, typically these people are at the top of the list for hiring.

something happened. they could not get visas to come to the u.s. suddenly our students coming here and the applications dropped immensely from the other countries. guest: after 9/11, our country and others began to reassess these apologies -- visa policies. there was a small decrease for a couple of years in international students coming here. now america leads the way in the number of foreign students coming here, the openness and transparency of our visa process. i think colleges and universities will be able to take the best since they are seeing in applications.

i think the state department and homeland security have worked together to make the process much more open and transparent. guest: websites are easier to navigate. we're looking at a variety of ways to speed up the visa process for it to be open and transparent. host: the next call is from newmarket, virginia. caller: right now with the unemployment rate being what it is, in the health care industry, you have a lot of visas for nurses to come in from overseas. with unemployment, a lot of people are out of work and going back to school. the slots for nursing careers in the community colleges and universities are limited. what you are saying about capacity is at odds with what i

am seeing. i do not see it that there are that many slots for american students. allowing a foreign student to come in and put u.s. students of odds with how many can come -- get in. host: we showed earlier what international students are majoring in, the top fields and vice versa. how many have declared their major before they come to the united states? does that play a role in whether they get to be an international student? guest: the great thing about american higher education is that you are not on a track from the day you are born. you can enter a community college in one field and a side you are better in another region decide you are better in another and major in a third. what appeals to the students is

the flexibility of higher education and the ability to reinvent yourself. we also have to take the jobs calls seriously. higher education has to be connected to the job market. we have to make sure we have career planning and placement services for our students to give them the best shot at getting the jobs of the future. host: allan goodman and ann stock, thank you for being here to talk about international students with our viewers. coming up in the last hour, we will be taking a look at federal loans for small businesses. first, a news update from c-span radio. >> the department of transportation is finding an american airlines affiliate $900,000 for keeping passengers cooped up for hours on planes in chicago earlier this year. american eagle airlines had delays of more than three hours on 15 flights arriving at o'hare international airport on may 29.

a total of 608 passengers were on board the delayed flights. a russian spacecraft carrying an american anted russians blasted off earlier today heading to the international space station. the launch is easing anxiety about the future of the space programs. the launch had been delayed 14 months because of the crash of an unmanned cargo ship in august. president obama wraps up his stay in hawaii today and flies to australia tomorrow. vice-president joe biden is in washington meeting with advisers. later, he swears in john bryson as the new secretary of commerce. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. >> most people probably think of voa as shortwave, listening at

the door for if the secret police might come. that is an outdated image. we are now on facebook, twitter, satellite tv, fm radio. we have a lot of affiliates around the world. radio and tv stations use us as a washington news bureau for them. we're finding new ways to communicate with people. the mission has stay the same. >> that is tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span2. >> on wednesday, watch live streaming coverage of the book awards from new york city. this weekend, but tv is live from the miami book fair international. find a complete schedule online.

>> the c-span.org home page is easier to use. the new design features 11 video choices making it easier to watch today's events, live and recorded. there is a section to access our most popular series and programs. we have added a handy channel finder so you can quickly find where to walk across the country. that is that the all new c- span.org. "washington journal" continues. host: robb mandelbaum is a small business reporter for the "new york times" joining us to talk about federal loans to small businesses. what is the goal of the federal government's to give these small-business loans? guest: the goal is simple.

the idea began in the 1950's with the idea it was difficult for small businesses to get loans, much harder than for bigger businesses. the idea was to find a way to shore up lending by banks. the direct -- originally, it was a direct loan program. now the federal government guarantees loans made by banks. the idea is to encourage banks to do more lending than they would otherwise do. host: there are three sba loan programs. 7a, general business, capital investment, sba micro loans to small businesses. the sba says the 7a loans had a budget of about $19 billion.

can you please speak first to the 7a loan and what they're trying to do? guest: it is the flagship loan. is huge. they are providing capital to businesses on terms that are advantageous to smaller businesses. if you look at conventional loans, the terms might be three to five years. if you go to your bank and get a loan for working capital or to purchase new computers, you would pay the loan back in three to five years. sba loans are longer. they go seven years. you have smaller monthly payments. they're spread out over longer. you get more cash coming in and less going out. the idea is to provide capital to businesses for a variety of

business needs. you can use it to buy inventory, pay your accounts payable, use it for investments. you can buy a business with it. any legitimate business purpose. the 504 loans are different. they are designed for big capital-intensive purposes. they are 20-year loans. i hope we will talk more about those. they are really interesting. they are for capital equipment, real estate. they are $5 million loans. they also have a public policy purpose. you are supposed to create a certain number of jobs for every $100,000 that you get in loan money or contribute to other public policy goals with

business revitalization, exporting, stuff like that. host: why do you say they are really interesting? guest: they are not as well- known as the others. they provide capital to small businesses at big business rates. if you are a large company like general electric or microsoft and you need to borrow money, you go to the corporate bond market. your bonds are well-rated and you pay a low interest-rate. the way the 500 for loan is structured is that it is shared between a bank and a non-profit community development corporation. the community development corporation pools of mortgages from around the country.

they sell them on wall street as corporate bonds. the bond rate is tied to t- bills so it is a really good rate. in november, i was told the small business borrower was paying 4.5% on the portion of the loan arranged by these community development corporations. those are backed by the sba. the bank portion is not. 40% of the loan is ultimately guaranteed by the sba. host: robb mandelbaum is a small business reporter for the "new york times" talking about loans to small businesses. it is part of our weekly series where every monday we put up a spotlight on the federal program with a spotlight on its

mission and participants. we want to hear from small- business owners. we have a separate line for you. guest: special treatment for small business owners. host: what kind of criteria do small-business owners have to have to get special treatment? guest: they have to meet size standards. they cannot be too vague -- to bio big. you can be bigger now and still get a loan. you have to be legal. you cannot be engaged in illegal business. if i wanted to smuggle in pirated software from china.

i could not use an sba loan for that. virtually any business if they are sound but they will look at three years of business history. they will look at your projections going forward. they will underwrite the loan and decide whether you are credit-worthy. if you are credit-worthy, here legally, have a sound business purpose, and a legal business and not speculating, and you can normally get an sba loan. you cannot do real estate speculation with them. host: why do they need the sba loans customer why can they not go to the bank directly? -- why do they need the sba loans? why can they not go to the bank directly? guest: banks typically do not

like to make smaller loans. they do not like to make loans to smaller borrowers. if every bank had its druthers, they would loan to microsoft and general electric. it is harder to do small loans. it broughrequires the same amouf work. the bank is going to do the same amount of work underwriting the loans. there is much more money to be made in the $10 million loans. they do not want to make small ones if they do not have to. they would rather make larger loans. they do not want to make $200,000 loans. host: what is the incentive? guest: small businesses are riskier. the government takes on most of the risk. the loans are guaranteed by the sba.

in most cases, the guarantee is 75%. in some cases for small loans is 85%. if the loan goes south as a lot of small businesses and loans did in 2009 and 2010, the sba will come in and purchase the loan and pay the bank is guaranteed -- its guaranteed 74%. the government will eat that. the program is financed by the borrowers for the most part. it is not really like the tax payers are suffering a major loss because these businesses went under. host: the government will eat the cost. does the small business owner have to keep trying to pay the

small business to administration brought -- back? guest: they will take whatever assets were used to secure the loan. often, that is your house, by the way. they will look at your personal -- business assets first and in your personal. they will collect the value of that loan. whatever they do not collect, the bank will get its share of the guarantee. if the loan is $1 million and they collect $400,000 on the loan, the bank will get 75% of that. the sba will get $100,000 of the money they collected. host: we're talking about federal loans to small businesses. john from illinois is on the

line. caller: our daughter went through our local sba. everything was going great. they were doing a great job of helping her out. as a final step, she goes to the bank. the bank looks at her credit score and how much money her family makes and all of this. then it comes out that they want 100% collateral is asian -- collateralization and 10% on the loan. this was just a small startup loans with the idea of expanding in a year or so. i am sure this has more to do with the banking being tight on everything. i want to get your thoughts on that. guest: are you still there?

host: he hung up. guest: there is often frustration on the part of borrowers who get sba loans. it is hard to know where the frustration should be directed. there are so many moving parts. the one thing that struck me is that sba loans are capped. the interest rate is capped. if you are under $50,000, you will pay 4.75% plus the prime rate. the prime rate is 3.25%. you might pay 8%. that is the most you will pay for a very small loan.

for most loans, you would not pay more than 6% for an sba loan. i am not sure to make of it. i am not sure what kind of loan she ended up getting. it is complicated to do an sba loan, particularly the traditional 7a loans. it can be challenging for people who do not know that very well. host: 7a loans are for general business ventures. 504 loans are for capital investment. for 2011 loan lending, those

are the numbers. you talked about how difficult it is for banks. is it difficult for the small businesses to even get a loan from the sba? guest: i stand corrected. there is a variety of sba loans that are credit-score improved. they're usually approved quickly by the banks. they can charge in much higher interest rates. they can charge prime plus 6.5%. that gives you close to 10%. -- that gets you close to 10%. host: is it difficult for small businesses to get a loan from the sba? guest: that is tough to answer. if you did not get it, it is hard to get it. if you did, it is not. they are looking at the tier --

if the loan is credit-scored on a borrower with 700 or better, maybe the tier right below that would have no problem getting an sba loan. as you get lower on the spectrum, it gets harder. when you are a small business, you do not go in thinking you will get an sba loan. those are only available if you cannot get a loan at reasonable terms of where -- elsewhere. the bank will see if they can write a traditional loan first. it may never even come up that

you have an sba loan. if they cannot do a loan under their own auspices, then they will talk about sba loans. host: the independent caller from new mexico is on the air. good morning. i am going to put you on hold. you have to turn the television down. let's go to houston, texas. we're joined by a small business owner. go ahead. caller: are you speaking to me? i am a business owner in houston. i have been in business. two years. i have capital problems. i have poor credit personally, but my business is doing pretty well. i have grown 100% from the first

to second year. i am looking into options from a private investor or maybe from a bank. i have been thinking about the sba, but i have always heard the process is difficult and unlikely. how long does the business have to be in business to be considered? guest: that is a good question. theoretically loans are available to start ups. that is another difference between the sba and a conventional loan. many banks will not loan to a business that has not been in business for one year or two beers. the sba will. i would guess about 40% are

businesses that have been in business a year or less. small-business loans are available to start ups. the sba is not geared to rethink the way a bank does business. the bank looks at how it will get paid before they make a loan. if a borrower has poor credit, that does not necessarily mean they will not get an sba loan. it really depends on the fundamentals of the business. they are not going to think differently about whether they will get paid or not. it is not a way to provide venture funding to a business. if you have a strong business

that is growing and you can demonstrate that, a traditional sba loan might be something for you. those are generally underwritten by bankers. they're not as much credit- scored. they will take a close look at how your business is doing and what your projections are for the next year or so. host: we're talking about small business loans this morning. we have lines for democrats, republicans, and independents. we want to hear from small business owners. alan is a democrat from hawaii. go ahead. caller: i am calling because i

have a solar business in what you. they have these grants for rural development. they are connected to the sba. the biggest issue is that a lot of people want them to the complexity of the paperwork is insane. a lot of times, people have to try not to go for the loan part of it because it adds even more complexity. the grant is difficult enough. it is competitive with in the state. is also competitive between the states. i do not know if that is true. if they sign up for the sba component of it, they may be exploited. it is difficult to get accurate answers from the usda about the

sba component of it. guest: i cannot speak to the agriculture program. i do not know it well. the sba has its own rural lending program. it is a new pilot program. it is basically a 7a loan. i think the maximum loan size is $350,000. the terms of the same as an sba loan. the advantage program is designed to be a painless process. it is largely credit-scoring. the application is 1 or two pages. in many cases, banks are able to use their own applications, but i am not sure about that. it is a simplified burrowing procedure. it is not a complex thing. you are not submitting a mountain of paperwork to do the loans.

host: here is a tweet on the default rate. do you know the default rate for the sba? guest: a thing for all the loans issued for 2010, the default rate is 21%. i think it has gotten much higher in 2009 and 2010. 75,000 as the dark -- 75,000 s.p.a.-backed businesses have failed. that is a number i saw in march. the sba numbers will be slightly weaker than other businesses. there is no doubt about it felt a lot of businesses have failed in the last couple of years.

the actual loss rate for the sba is lower than that. people default. they are able to collect a fair share of the loan. the actual default rate for the loans -- the charge offering is 4%. host: we have about 15 minutes left. jim says the bottom line is the banks will determine who will pass and failed. mohammad in new jersey, independent, go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my call. my situation is a little different. i have had my own business from 1986 until 2007. i sold the business and went to work for some other firm. i got laid off about two years ago. i wish to restart my business.

i sold most of it, but i had some clients. i want to expand. sitting at home watching tv all day is not much fun. how can i get into this small business loan to start up? which one will qualify? i am not looking for a building. i am looking for working capital, capital to restart, by computers, hire one or to the people. -- hire one or two people. guest: you would want a 7a

lone i think. -- loan i think. you should find banks in your area or nationwide that loans.rate on it7a there are banks and lenders that focus on sba lending. if you qualify, they will be happy to do one. they will know how to do it. they will do it as quickly as it can be done. this is a non-bank lender in new jersey that does sba loans. community banks can be halfway across the country but do sba loans nationally. i am thinking of barego springs

bank in california. they will do a loan anywhere in the country. i think live oak. they are specialized. they only do funeral homes and dentists. there are these banks. i would call your local sba office. host: the next phone call is from jack in chicago. he advises small-business folks. what do you tell small-business owners? caller: we tell them to apply for an sba loan. we are in national organization to help people get in business. at times, we have clients that qualify for micro loans. we send them to an sba-approved breaank. the banks will not process the loan because it costs them too

much overhead and paperwork to process a $35,000 loan. it is not worth it. we have run into that problem. guest: the sba has created a pilot program designed to make it easier for banks to do $35,000 loans without all the overhead. it is simplified from the bank's point of view. it is easier for the bar were. it is like an express line. it is called a small loan advantage. it is something they introduced this year.

i am sure they are working to build it up as fast as they can. micro loans are another great thing that s.p.a. does that does not get a lot of press. does that does not get a lot of press. if you are a borrower, you go to a class on business basics before you get the loan. you learn how to write a business plan and do a balance sheet and how to think about sales and marketing. the default rate for those is fairly low considering you are dealing with usually disadvantaged and low income people. host: we have this tweet about why the government is insuring loans. the next call is from paul in wisconsin.

caller: in wisconsin, the legislature just passed a regulation changing alignments -- the elements -- the limits on small-business loans. they chase the number of employees from 50 to 100. -- they changed the number of employees from 50 to 100. how will they compete with businesses that have 500 or more employees? guest: that is an interesting question. wisconsin cannot change sba loan definitions or dollar sizes. it must be a state program in wisconsin for that. a similar process is going on at the sba right now. sba loans are bigger now than

they used to beat because of the jobs act. the requirements for being -- the definition of "small" has gotten larger. it used to be if you had a net income of $2.5 million, that is the maximum you could be for small. now is double that. sba noticed this year that they were making a lot fewer small- dollar loans. the average loan had gotten much bigger. it had doubled from $300,000 to $600,000. they do not know why they are not making as many smaller loans. i suspect it has to do with the fact that bigger loans are available to bigger businesses. the bank does not decide how many sba loans they're going to

make. they take a block of money and say this is how much we will expose to the sba program. if they can meet that goal with 10 instead of 100 loans, they will do that. it stands to reason that smaller borrowers may get squeezed. host: what is the difference between the sba and the starbucks lending program? guest: 1 is funded by the sba. micro loans are a small part of what the sba does. the figures are $20 million or $30 million in micro loans a year compared to an excess of

$10 billion. it was $20 billion in 2011. for the past few years, you could figure that the 7a loans are $15 billion. the micro loans are a small portion of that. advocates have fought to increase that. they have had some success in the last couple of years in increasing the amount of money available to micro loans. they have increased the size of the program in terms of the amount of money you can borrow. it is getting bigger. i think it could be much bigger. i think what starbucks is doing is a great thing. we need to see more of that. host: the next call is from a democrat in virginia. caller: what are the chances of being approved for a million- dollar business loan when you have a low credit score with no

cosigner or collateral? guest: not very good. i do not mean to be flip about that. there are two sources for repaying a bank loan. one is profits and cash flow from the business. in most cases, the bank will be making sure there is a backup source for repaying the loan. that is normally collateral. if you have a high credit score and not a lot of collateral, you can get a loan. if you have a low credit scored by a lot of collateral, you might still get a loan. if you have poor credit and not a lot of collateral, you really have to work to improve your credit score. host: you mentioned earlier that the biggest item people put on the list for collateral is the house.

guest: i do not know if it is most, but it happens a lot. they want to secure the business assets. inventory is not worth nearly as much as you think. i would suggest to the previous caller that she talk to some of the organizations that do micro lending. the treasury department has a great program called the cdfi program. small-business centers could refer you to a marker linder -- lender iner -- mikcro your area. caller: i have noticed in the

last few years in kansas that most of the arabs of the gas stations. the mexicans have new businesses started. i was wondering how come we don't get the same loans they get and why they don't have to pay taxes for five years. i will take my answers off the phone. guest: i cannot speak to the question of taxes or who is getting loans. i am making an assumption here. i will say loans to african- americans have fallen in the last couple of years. that had to do with a pilot program that the sba has replaced with a new program that

has not gone off the ground yet. african-americans a couple of years ago got probably 5% of the dollar volume of sba 7a loans. in 2011, i think it was 2%. hispanics held ground. asians have got a larger share of the loans. african-americans in the last couple of years have suffered. i think the agency is eager to find a way to redress that. host: here is an e-mail from bruce. he says the banks can adjust up or down.

guest: i think the bank rate is determined by the bank. the sba portion is a bond sold to investors on wall street. it is generally a fixed-rate security. the bondholders want to know they're going to be getting a certain amount of money. those are not adjustable. however, they are low. most real estate borrowers would be paying at least 5%. if you were going to the bank to get a loan for your building, you would pay at least 5%. you might pay as much as 6.5% to get a real estate loan. the sba share is 4.5%.

the share is 40% of the loan. the community development group does 40%. you do 10%. that is another real advantage of the 504 program. you put in 10%. the other advantage is it is spread out over 20 years. instead of having a loan that comes due in five years where you have to make a giant payment, it is spread out over 20 years. host: this is a tweet. guest: people have tried to measure that. it has been a couple of years since i have looked at this. since i have looked at this.