internet traffic in a manner that could lead to a more fragmented less interoperable global internet for all. for example, ideas related to -- while we find strong pause for concern about the agenda of the wicket meeting, there is no reason why it cannot produce thaul thoughtful worth while policy developments that encourage ongoing global communications without imposing unnecessary burdens on the internet. many i.t. member states, including the u.s., have shown they understand the value of the internet and its unique multistake holder model. they are able to advance an agenda at wicket that respects the internet and its global contributions while continuing to support the pro-competitive policies that have been so successful since the i.t.r.'s were first negotiated in 1988. .

the discussion of internet governance will not stop there. there are discussions within the u.n. framework and the commission for science and technology for development within the international telecommunications union and the giant general assembly that seek to take on these issues

with a great deal specificity. all of these discussions are things that we get the internet society are following carefully. we think that multistate colder engagement and discussion of these issues over the next several years will be important. >> you seem to be weighing in there with a nodding head. >> certainly in agreement. first of all, the itu is not the only element in the u.n. that is interested in internet matters. the point about the committee on science and technology is one example. there is a long list of players. they see the internet as a very fundamental part of the environment now. they would like very much to have some influence over it. i worry about the internet governance forum, which emerged.

the reason it has been successful up until now and tell -- is it started as a maltase to colder -- it started as a mutli-stakeholder deal. the question about who controls the agenda becomes a big issue. the process of involvement in the u.n. has one unfortunate property that it politicizes everything. all of the considerations that are made are taken and colored by national interest. as a longstanding but it is been in the internet architecture board and the internet engineering task force where we have technical discussions about how best to improve the operation of the internet, to color that with other national disputes, which are non-relevant to the technology, is a very dangerous precedent. that is one of the reasons i

worry about itu's intervention. >> there are some reports out of this hearing that would tend to say that the ambassador's comment does -- that there is a grave threat to the internet -- would you characterize that as true? or do you feel this is a very serious matter? >> i am very nervous about this process. i will make one observation. it is not just a matter of the voting question and one nation, one-vote. the substance of the changes and additions to the treaty are critical. here, we have more leverage. those are not necessarily just a matter of votes. it the negotiations for the actual language probably gives more leverage to us than the actual voting process does. i have to say that there is a

notion in what is called chaos theory called the butterfly effect. the butterfly away siblings in indonesia and we have a a tsunami somewhere else. i do worry the small changes can be used and interpreted in a way that can be quite deleterious to that internet. what strategies did you employer when you had a -- >> what strategies did you employer when you fended off international regulation of the internet? >> thank you. if i may, i would just like to echo exactly what was just said. the one of the keys here as we think about this is, this is not about a discussion about broad policy. that happens at conferences on a regular basis. something this chamber can particularly appreciate, the negotiations over our treaty

language -- language is important. language has impact. what will be a real test for our negotiators and for all of us is to be careful as to the language. the language does not come forward and mean something today and mean something very different. it will. morrison to something very difficult and something very dangerous. this is not an issue of the itu secretariat. with regard to the strategies, i think the strategies have been already adopted by the current group of. that is, it is very important to be clear. one of the problems you always have in international negotiations is to find fuzzy language to cover up. one of the keys because of the importance of the issue and because of the implications of the issue for the over 2 million users of the internet worldwide is to be very clear as to what

is the u.s. is interested in and willing to discuss and negotiate. of which there are many things. those areas which are red lines, those things for which we will not agree. it is not a question of finding the precise language. it is yes. it is no. it is very binding. . and the building of coalitions is obvious and important and i am confident we can do that. >> i appreciate your answers. we will not go to the gentleman from massachusetts. the >> thank you, mr. chairman. which countries are you most concerned about in terms of their agenda? >> as we heard earlier, the ones that are most visible right now in my view are russia and china, who have their names on a number of proposals. other some come forward. brazil, for example. they surprised me with their interest in obtaining further

control. the others are the ones you would normally expect. syria. other repressive regimes in saudi arabia, for example. those who are threatened by openness and freedom of expression are the ones that are most interested in gaining control through this means. there are other motivations that also drive this whole process. in the developing world has historic lead generated his dental revenue from telecommunications services, as i am sure you are well aware. the internet has become the alternative to much of what happened in the telecommunications environment. i see them looking for ways of adapting the earlier telecommunications arrangements. it as a way of recovering revenue they did not have. >> just give us one red line

subject we should never entertained. >> i think he'd of things, in particular. i would never want to see any of the itu standards being mandatory. second, i think we should be we should -- we should run away from forced into connection rules that would interfere with the open end of during private sector aspect of internet connectivity. today, it is a voluntary system. it grows biologically. it has benefited from that. >> is there an analogy here to the satellite system that allows governments to extract profits in countries all around the world there ran totally contrary to what should be the policy to ensure that every citizen has real access to a phone network? >> this is an economic question of an engineer.

i have this feeling you might deserve the answer that you get. to be honest, i think that we see a great desire to take it day and age of -- to take advantage of internet in ways that damage to the freedom and openness and permission with innovation which is allowing it to grow. to allow any rules that sequester this innovation and inhibit others would damage the future of the internet, grammatically -- dramatically. when you seek new applications coming along, they come from anywhere. they do not all come from the u.s. is the board we preserve the capability. >> i appreciate the global nature you bring to it. the butterfly effect. a tsunami. here in the u.s., we just say this is misses o'leary is cal.

's cow. we want to talk about the global internet system. that is who you are. that is what this panel is really all about. do you have -- give us your one red line. do you agree with the other gentleman? >> alloys agree with him. there are a number of red lines. >> give me one of them. >> i think the number 1 red line is that there should be no top gun control of the internet directly or indirectly associated with any international governmental institutions, including the itu. >> ok. do you have one? >> we would certainly agree with the comments of mr. cerf with respect to making voluntary standards mandatory. that would have considerable impact on the engineering and architecture that goes into the internet. we're also very focused on the destinations.

-- definitions. it will give you the scope and a number of the proposals to change definitions would clearly implicate the internet in the treaty. >> give us your 30 seconds. what do you want this committee to remember as we go forward over the next six months and over the next six years in terms of what we should be apprehensive about? >> this hearing is a wonderful beginning. the proposed legislation speaking to this problem is bipartisan. >> so rarely used. >> voicing your concerns to the executive branch, also extremely important, and making this visible around the world is also very important. i think you have started that process. i am deeply grateful for it. >> my time is expired. i apologize. >> i recognize myself or five

minutes. i really enjoyed this discussion. it is when free nations give up their decision making process to world organization that is not totally defined to be freed, then there should be credible concerns. i think we are raising those today. based upon -- i have to pull it up because it went to sleep. we debate this issue about the when we get asked by our constituents all the time about the role of the u.n.. should we be involved in the u.n.? should we fund the u.n.? i have tried to keep a balanced view where a half -- where i have not voted to leave the u.n., but i have been skeptical about the role it plays. keep current funding.

get reforms. here are some things the u.n. has done. cuba was vice-president of the united nations's human rights council in china, russia, saudi rebut serve on the council. -- saudi arabia serve on that council. north korea is head of the conference of disarmament. mugabe was named a u.n. leader for tourism by the u.n. world trade organization iran sits on the un commission on the status of women. formerly chaired a joint board of the window and programs in the u.n. population fund. saudi arabia is a member of the executive board of the u.n. women. i am not making this up. you cannot. i mean, that is a concern. there has been some international debate in discourse about having a world organization based upon shared values. democracy, freedom, rule of law.

things that would make this process a little bit easier. than trying to negotiate with do totalitarian regimes twho not have the best interest of free discourse and exchanges of views and ideas and the areas. i appreciate you raising this concern and making sure that we are all in. it and prepared to keep this great architecture. i took a picture of you all when we started. i tweet let a lot of people. you know, i did the headline of the hearing. thi said, if it is not broken, o not fix it. the system has worked. there is some tinkering that some of you agree that must be done. or, is there not? should we not touch it?

or, if there are tinkering to be done, what should we do? >> thank you very much. the answer is that there are always opportunities to improve anything. except for my wife, who is sitting behind me. instead, i think the key is, who does the tinkering? the genius of the internet has been, it is not only decentralize, but it has a multi-stickle the process to make decisions. bringing those with the best and brightest ideas to be able to have a say and to make those decisions. voluntary bottoms up approach. that approach is the key. as you have heard, there has been concerned about a top of government will set of ways of dealing with what are endowed to real issues for real people round the world. -- on dab of the real issues for

real people round the world. we know there are many issues that need to be addressed. who does the addressing? what those are? those are the key to deal with those issues. >> i want to get a different question. any tinkering, no matter how well-intentioned, could it be flexible enough to keep the process moving forward or will tinkering itself really mess up the stakeholder involvement in the system we have today? >> i think several observations are relevant here. the first is that we cannot run away from the un because it is too important. we have to produce a peak in its's -- participate in its process. we need to encourage more international involvement amongst the various nations

stake in the multi stickle the processes that are open and available to them. -- multi-steagall their process is better open and available to them. if we make those increasingly attractive and effective, this could be a counterbalance in our collective -- an alternative to the focus of attention that is leading in the direction of the u.n.-based activity. this reinforces that multi- stickle their processes work. they bring many points of view to the table and a result in better policy. >> thank you. i do that have time to ask a question but i apologize. thank you. i would like to recognize the ranking member, mr. waxman. >> thank you. earlier today, the ambassador stated that the u.s. is advocating for the wicket conference report to be made available to the public in addition to this proposal for

increased transparency. what other specific measures can be taken to shine more like into the process these? let us see the obvious possibility would be to open this process up to other stakeholders. that is not a typical conclusion. the transparency and openness produces much better results. whether anyone in the current intergovernmental world can be persuaded of that, i do not know. i am a great advocate of trying to include society and the technical world and the private sector in matters that will have a very direct impact on them. publication of the proposals and involvement of other stockholders would be very attractive. >> i would think it is critical for the u.s. and other countries

to highlight participants and other stakeholders, a potential negative consequence of the internet. what is the role for the private sector in this process? ? -- >> the private sector operates most of the internet. it probably exceed 90%. in some sense, no matter what we do, no matter what anybody says, it is the private sector that operates the internet. its actions determine what kind of internet we'll have. my belief is that we have an opportunity here to empower the private sector to engage in policy making, which does not reach it which it cannot do today. you could be sector member. i think miss wentworth might agree with me that even as a sector member, you do not always get duper to submit or even

have -- get to participate or even have current information. i think openness will be our friend here. we have to educate strongly and loudly for the. >> do you have any additional comments? >> the internet society has been opening up this process. internet policy related discussions within the united nations more broadly. we feel they can only benefit from more transparency. we can from the technical community. we think there is a lot that could be said about the technical implications of what is being proposed. how do networks actually work? would even be consistent with the architecture we're trying to keep in place?

the answer is no. that is not heard in the current process. we have very limited opportunities to engage. >> i think there are two directives. we should continue to advocate for other members to open up their domestic process to allow for great is part -- greater participation we want to continue to encourage that. that is the problem here. the idea is by definition an intergovernmental organization. ultimately, this issue is not a big issue with certain sets. we do a certain issue, there are 2 billion people with their access to information.

question whether a not what thethat is where a lot of the issues can get resolved. >> thank you very much. >> the chair recognizes you for 15 minutes. -- 5 minutes. >> thank you for answers. he stated that allowing governments to monitor this and the data traffic are of particular concern.

could you share with us your views regarding the international data traffic? >> those are critically important issues. there are a number of different pieces of that. it is not about the fact that it may change from a system in which there is voluntary market-driven decisions, contractual decisions made to engage, into ones which there are some proposals to have some regulatory regime akin to the old settlement. that should be a substantial concern to everyone. that should deal with the issue of innovation generally they're out the internet ecosystem. they are talking about changes

in this technology is coming from anywhere, from anyone and the ability for all of us to benefit. all of? often boils down to one of the great core issues for all of us. that is the flow of information. the flow of information will be able to flow seamlessly across the network in ways that benefit the global community. >> thank you. >> the wonder if i could amplify on this if you would permit. there is a non-trade barrier. what i worry about is the insidious fact of putting in detailed rules that amplify notions of rejecting those into

the internet, having the potential to destroy this permission with innovation and the possibility of destroying potential markets. this is not just an american issue. we care because i google we are a global operation. the converse is true. anyone should be able to reach anyone in the world with a new product in new service. countries that used to go away from that openness are actually harming themselves and their own opportunity to exploit the internet for gdp growth. i worried greatly about that. >> thank you. >> many countries struggled with bringing broadband access to that. we talked about this briefly earlier. hash a brief response to the legitimate concern?

-- how should we respond to the concern? >> this is a wonderful question. the development organization has contributed to the growth. i am a member of the broadband commission that seeks ways to expand. i google, we found many opportunities in the private sector to help expand access around the world. we don't need this to -- we donate this. the purpose that equipment. they deliver it to people especially in the southern hemisphere. then they train them and they set them up to actually build and operate east of the one.

there are endless opportunities here for the private sector to engage. anything that you can do to make that easier to do would be most helpful. legislation makes it easy for us to read purpose. training will be very helpful. just to advocate for that would be a good thing. >> thank you. i am out of time. >> we want to thank you for appearing. totalitarian regimes may not care if they have systems that work. as you have these involves in international negotiations, they may want a system that does not work across international lines. the record will remain open for 10 days. he may get additional questions. if you can reply to those.

if they come, we may appreciate that. we appreciate your time. this meeting is now adjourned. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2012] >> according to the report, cyber current account for 38% of economic crime the latest incidents. today, and house financial services subcommittee investigators threat to the financial industry. that is live at 5:30 a.m. eastern on c-span2. former florida governor, jeb bush, and henry waxman of california testify at the house budget committee looking at the

tax and regulatory portions of the rise in federal budget plan. live coverage starts today at 9:00 a.m. eastern on c-span3. >> thursday, the official portraits of former president george w. bush and laura bush were unveiled. at the ceremony, president obama said "we may have our differences, but the presidency transcends those differences." president obama and first lady michelle obama hosted a private lunch for the former president and first lady that included former president george h. w. bush and barbara bush. this is 30 minutes. ♪ >> ladies and gentlemen, the and mrs. obama accompanied by george w. bush and mrs. laura bush. ♪ [applause]

♪ ♪ >> ladies and gentleman, the president of the united states and first lady, michelle obama. the company by former president george w. bush and former first lady, or a bush. ♪ ♪

[applause] >> could f. been in. i am chairman of the board of afternoon. i am chairman of the board of the white house historical association. the association was founded 50 years ago with two specific missions, the first is to educate and inform the public about the history of the white house and the distinguished groups of americans who have the -- inhabited it. it is an exciting time for us. we marked our 50th anniversary.

to the north of the white house we have just launched the new national center for let us history. the next year, to the south, we will open a new white house this their center. it will give millions of visitors -- the visitor center. it will give millions of visitors a new understanding. if we acquire something on the east and west we will have the police surrounded. -- place surrounded. [laughter] are proud to have provided funds for financial support. -- the association is proud to provide $40 million for refurbishing and making important acquisitions for the white house. through the portraits of our presidents, it is a wonderful tradition that here, our country honors those who have honored us.

the tradition began with the acquisition of george washington's portrait in 1800. it was purchased by the united states government. it was viewed as such as an important national treasure it madison's concern we have been commissioned to complete the portraits of every first lady and president in the past 50 years. in our world, with so many images are flashes on the screen, these portraits by acclaimed artist are lasting tribute to our presidents and first ladies and will forever be part of the collection. today, the portrait of president george w. bush and laura bush will be added to the unique collection of those who have occupied this house. to those great presidential

portrait artists whose works include gilbert stuart, we now had john howard -- add john howard. at a great debate, strong arguments on both sides, not over issues, it is the debate as to whether of a portrait actually looks like the president and first lady. -- as to whether the portrait actually looks like theit is my distinct pleasure to united states. [applause] >> thank you. thank you so much. thank you. please, everybody, have a seat. good afternoon everybody. thank you for that introduction. to the president and barbara, to all of the members of the

bush family, it is a great privilege to have you here today. to president and mrs. bush, welcome back to the house that you called home for eight years. the white house is many things at once. it is a working office, it is a living museum, it is and in democracy. -- is an enduring symbol of our democracy. a few of us are blessed with the honor of living here. i think it is fair to say that every president is aware that we are temporary residence. we are renters. we are charged with the upkeep until our lease runs out. we also leave a piece of ourselves in this place. today, with the unveiling of the portraits next to me, president and mrs. bush will take their

place alongside men and women who built this country and those who worked to perfect it. it can be said that no one can understand what it is like being president until they sit behind the desk and feel the weight and responsibility for the first time, it is true. after three and a half years in office, i have a deeper to at understanding of the challenges faced by the presidents who came before me, including president bush. in this job, no decision that reaches your desk is easy. no choice you make is without cost. no matter how hard you try, you are not going to make everybody happy. that is something president bush and i both learned quickly. that is why, from time to time, those of us who have had the privilege to hold this office the feeling. politically, but the presidency

transcends those differences. we all love this country. we all want america to succeed. we all believe that when it comes to moving america forward, we have an obligation to pull together. we all follow the example of our first president, george washington, who knew that a true test of patriotism is the willingness to freely and graciously passed the reins of power on to somebody else. that has been true of president bush. the months before it took the oath of office were chaotic. we knew our economy was in trouble. our americans were in pain. we would not know until later how breathtaking the financial crisis had been. still, over those two and a half months, president bush, his cabinet, his staff, many of you who are here today, went out of your ways, george, you went out

of your way, to make sure the transition was as seamless as possible. president bush understood that rescuing our economy was not just a democratic or republican issue, it was an american priority. i will always be grateful for that. the same is true for our national security. none of us will forget where we were on that terrible september day when our country was attacked. all of us will remember the image of president bush standing on the pile of rubble bullhorn in hand, the, when the strength and resolve -- rubble, bullhorn in hand, and of the strength and resolve of the american people. my first call once american forces were out of harm's way was to president bush. protecting our country is knighted the work of one person

with the task of one time, it is an ongoing obligation we all share. finally, on a personal note, michele and i are grateful to the entire bush family for their guidance and example during our tradition. george, i will always remember the gathering you posted for all of the living former presidents. plus, you left me a really good tv sports package. [laughter] i use it. laura, you reminded us that the most rewarding thing about living in this house is not the

title or power but the chance to shine a spotlight on the issues that matter the most. the fact that you enjoyed raised two smart and beautiful daughters, as teenagers preparing to head out into the world, that gives us tremendous -- hope. we will never forget the advice you give our daughters as they began their lives in washington. they tell them to surround themselves with loyal friends. never stop doing what they love. slide down the banisters. place settings on the lawn. meet new people. enjoy all that. i can tell you that they took that advice to heart. it really meant a lot. one of the greatest strengths

of our democracy is our ability to peacefully and routinely go through transitions of power. we have always had the leaders who believe in america and everything it stands for. leaders and families who are willing to devote their lives to the country they love. this is what we will think about every time we pass these portraits, just as millions of others of visitors will do in the decades to come. i want to thank the artist behind these beautiful works. on behalf of the american people, i want to thank president and mrs. bush for their extraordinary service to our country. i would like to invite them on stage to take part in the presentation.

[applause] [applause] [applause] >> thank you, sit down. sit down.

behavior cells. -- behave yourselves. thank you so much for inviting our rowdy friends to my hanging. we are honored to be here. mr. vice president, thank you for coming. we are overwhelmed. thank you for feeding the bush family, all 14 members of us. i want to thank our girls for coming. i thank mom and dad, brother, sister, in laws, aunts and uncles. i know you were as excited to be able to come back and thank the people who helped make this house a home for us. the white house staff.

i want to thank fred ryan and the white house curator. i am pleased that my portrait brings an interesting symmetry to the white house collection. it now starts and ends with a george w. [laughter] [applause] when the british burned the white house in 1814, and dolly madison saved this portrait of the first door to the idea -- first george w. [laughter] if anything happens there is your man. [laughter] [applause] f four to -- i am pleased that when you are wondering these halls he would now be able to

the is that this portrait and ask "what would george do?" [laughter] i am honored to be hanging there with the man they gave me the greatest give possible, unconditional love, no. 41. i want to thank john howard for

agreeing to use his considerable talents to paint my likeness. you have done a fine job with a challenging subjects. [laughter] in the portrait there is a painting called "a charge to keep" that hung in the oval office for the eight years of my presidency. it reminds me of the wonderful people with whom i was privileged to serve. these men and women, many of whom who are here worked hard and served with honor. we had a charge to keep. it is my privilege to introduce the great as first lady ever, sorry mom. [laughter]

would you agree to a tie? [laughter] a woman who brought such grace and dignity and love in this house. [applause] >> thank you all. thank you. thank you everybody. thanks everyone. thank you very much. thank you president and mrs. obama. [applause] s enough. thank you, darling. thank you for your kindness and consideration. it was really gracious of you to invite us back to the white house to hang a few family pictures. [laughter] i am sure you know nothing makes

a house a home than its former occupants staring down from the walls. [laughter] this is not the first time i have had the opportunity to confront an artistic likeness of myself. a few years ago after the 2008 election, a friend sent me something he found in the gift shop of the national constitutional center in philadelphia. it was a laura bush bobblehead doll he said he found on the clearance shell. [laughter] i am grateful to know that this work as a permanent home and things to be masterful talent of john howard sandon. you are terrific to work with. -- john howard sanden. i like it better than the doll. you are terrific to work with. it is wonderful to know tha

[applause] of course, it is meaningful to me. it is wonderful to know that these portraits -- these portraits will be on view at the white house and walking down the hall from my mother in law and that george's portrait will hang very close to his dad's. it is meaningful to me as a citizen. this is my family's home for eight years. it was our home but not our house. this house belongs to the people whose portraits will never hang there, the ordinary people whose lives inspired us and his expectations guided us during the years we lived here.

in this room are many of the people who stood by us as we face the tragedy of september 11 and to work with us in the years after. thank you to each and everyone of you for your service to our country. [applause] i hope others will see what i see, a woman he was honored and humbled to live in the white house during a time of great challenge and to will never forget the countless american faces who make up the true portrait of that time. thanks so much. thank you, michele. [applause]

>> i do not think we have enough tissue to go round. jenna and barbara are a mess. [laughter] i want to thank you for joining us today. i would like to take this opportunity to thank laura for providing such a wonderful model of strength and grace for me to follow as first lady. it is an interesting job. it has been amazing to learn from your example not just as a first lady but as a mother of two wonderful daughters.

you are on the other side of where we hope to be in a couple of years, two daughters who sit up straight and cry and think lovingly of their mother and dad. [laughter] we are working toward that gold. -- goal. we cannot be more thankful for the warmth and graciousness that both of you showed our family. it is truly a privilege for us to occupy this house. the warmth is reflected in these portraits. i promise you, i am going straight for it.

i am sure it will be closer down the stairs. i will get right down to it. i am thrilled for the visitors who will have the chance to enjoy it. i am thrilled for both of you as you join these incredible americans whose portraits are already displayed here at the white house. congratulations again. congratulations on the work you have done in the example of what it means to be an american family. we are so happy and proud and honored to be a part. it is my pleasure to invite you all to join us for a reception right outside in the state room. now it is time to eat. [laughter] thank you also much. -- all so much. [applause]

♪ [indistinct conversations]

>> sunday take a walter cronkite, they see him as the friendly man, which he was to everybody. there is another side of him that want to be the best. he was upset with beating the report. he is the fiercest competitor i have ever written about. i have written about presidents and generals an. is desire to be the best was

pronounced. >> douglas brinkley on his biography of walter cronkite. sunday at 8 eastern and pacific on c-span. >> on c-span, the u.s. house returns at 9:00 a.m. eastern to debate energy and water spending. over on c-span2, politico hosts a forum on health exchanges. at 9:00 a.m. on3 on, the house budget committee hears from the former florida governor jeb bush and henry waxman on tax policy and entrepreneurship. >> also on "washington journal," we'll hear from representative john larson, a member of the ways and means committee. and at 8:20, congressman