businesses all across my state. these moms and dads worked hard for a living, for more than just a paycheck. they work for the same reason my wife and i do. we want our kids to have a better life. of what might sons to inherit an america at least as great as the america i grew up in. the good news is that we can still do something about it. we will have to make some tough choices but there is no doubt that it is worth it. let this be the mom in history where we can tell our children and grandchildren to do the moment in history where we can tell our children and grandchildren and we restored america's greatness again. i believe we can, because i believe in america. >> this week on prime minister's questions, david garrard talks about culture secretary jeremy hunt and his relationship with rupert murdoch and news corp.. the labour party -- labour party has called for full investigation over mr. hunt's

ministerial conduct. that is sunday 9:00 p.m. eastern and pacific on c-span. >> this week on the communicators, a look at the theft of data and intellectual property on the internet and efforts to improve cybersecurity call with robert holleyman. >> this week, a look at the software industry and we are pleased to have joining us robert holleyman, president and ceo of the business software alliance. if you would, start by giving us a brief overview of the software industry in the united states. >> and the business software alliance represents over 70 companies who are the world's leading innovators around software. we are as a trade association

based here in washington d.c. because the u.s. has had a unique role in building the global software market which is about $300 billion a year now. we have 13 foreign offices, and went off for companies look to those opportunities, they are really asking us to try to help get the right public policy in place, allow those companies to grow not only here at home, but internationally. >> how many people were employed by the software industry in the united states? >> it has over a million people who are both directly and indirectly employed. estimated that as much as 60 cents of every dollar spent on software around the world comes back to the u.s. based companies. this is a remarkable thing in terms of technology innovation for the globe but an era in

which the u.s. has been quite successful, we are not the only successful nation for software, but a high degree of success that we should be brought in this country. >> what are some of the country's represented by the business software alliance with mark critz innovative companies like apple, adobe, intel, companies at the heart of using software is a tool to facilitate both for consumers and businesses more productivity and also lots of great entertainment. >> does that include apps? >> absolutely. the software industry's erything that runs from a pc to a mainframe to a mobile device to an app. we probably know more about software today than ever before because we carry these devices around and it allows us to do

all sorts of things. >> we invited you want to talk about some of the legislative and regulatory issues that your industry faces. joining us also is jennifer martinez, a reporter for politico. >> thanks for helping me. there was a report released recently that found $63.4 billion worth of software was pirated in 2011. that is up from the prior year. why is that happening, and what can the government do about it? >> a great question, jennifer. that was really a hallmark report that shows what is happening on world markets in terms of software utilization, including piracy or theft of software. $63 billion value of pirated software last year, and 42% of

all the software that was put into use last year was unauthorized. but we find it is that two things are happening. there is piracy all over the world, including in the united states. although the u.s. has the lowest piracy rate of any country in the world at 19%, the fastest growing market for sales of new personal computers are outside the united states. brazil, russia, india, china are great examples. last year for the first time, china surpassed the united states as the largest new market for the sale of legal computers, but china has an extraordinarily high rate of software piracy, nearly 80%. so that growth of the market for selleck pc's, coupled with higher rates of piracy in those markets are what is driving the global value piracy.

>> and what can the government do about that, especially china? is there anything more the administration can do? i know the president has talked about it in economic talks, but is there anything the administration or congress can do? >> it has become a national priority, not just for the software industry but more broadly. that is because software is a tool of production. every business is using software in some form or fashion to enhance their productivity. we talk about software piracy, not necessarily something that is downloaded off the internet. we are talking about otherwise legal businesses in every sector using software as part of their production, and it high

piracy markets like china, most businesses are not using the illegal software, but they are getting the productivity benefits. so it hurts businesses in main street america who by and large are using the illegal software and paying for those prices. not only has a vice president raised this, but president obama has personally raised this with president hu jintao on multiple occasions. we are seeing bipartisan leadership in congress weighing in on this issue because it hurts the software industry and competitiveness across america and her american jobs. >> a couple of months ago you wrote a piece for the mercury news about a specific example of how china is abusing i.t. writes. can you tell us that story? >> that is a great example of court ordered action that we obtained in china, with some

cooperation from chinese authorities in allowing us to go into an enterprise and inspect their computers to determine whether or not part of its offer was being used. in fact be found pirated software being used within a company, and as part of the next steps, what happened is that the company -- law enforcement authorities were allowed in, they became very belligerent, essentially almost forcibly assured the law enforcement authorities out, and the next day, the woman who is our lawyer, a chinese woman was asked by the ceo of the company to meet to talk about a possible resolution of the case, and she was attacked in the facility where they were meeting. that is an example of the fact that there was initial action by

the government but the culture of this respect for intellectual property rights and for the rule of law was so extreme that we saw that type of activity, which had a chilling effect on the ability of many people to try to enforce their rights. the young woman who was our attorney is out of the hospital and is doing much better. hopefully we will get a resolution, but it is an example of the top or problems we face, not from hard-core counterfeiters, but from otherwise legal business operations in a country where the rule law is flaunted without any penalties. >> have you seen improvements, stricter regulations and enforcement from the chinese government? are you seeing the same flouting of the law? >> we are seeing certainly some

signs of progress as a result of the commitments that china has made to the united states government. the chinese government itself is taking actions to make sure that the chinese government uses only illegal software. not completed, but progress is made. the big opportunity in china now is to look at the state-owned enterprises which comprise such a huge part of the chinese economy. china has committed to the united states that they will take steps to ensure that state owned enterprises and other enterprises use only licensed, legal software. those commitments are firm, but we have not get seen proof in terms of increased legitimate sales by u.s. companies to believe that those promises have yet been fulfilled. >> it does not seem like much is going to get done in congress with the election coming up so

near. post-election, are you hoping that anti parsee legislation comes up again? that effort had failed earlier this year where there to build looking to crack down on foreign -- interests abroad that are infringing on the american i.t.. >> the discussion is a very important one. we are at the intersection of both an industry that suffers from an it -- substantial carsick problem, but an industry that is at the heart of innovation. we believe there always has to be a balance between the appropriate tools that allow actions to be taken to prevent softwa piracy, but ensuring that allows both the innovative technology to flourish and

innovative use of that technology. i think the important part of that discussion parks is looking to the future. new ways in which software will be distributed, new ways content will be distributed. that is why our efforts around the development of cloud computing are really at the heart of what we are focusing on now in that is issues we are talking about now. >> i wanted to follow-up on, bsa had reported pipa. you had sent out a statement when sopa was released, commending the chairman lamar smith for his efforts in crafting the bill but did not go all the way out and support the bill. some have interpreted that statement to be a statement of support, and then the bsa leader

published his own posting that there still needs to be some balance included in the bill and some work that needed to be done. but just wanted to see what happened there, and what were your concerns with sopa? >> we always believed that you have to balance, the underpinning for innovation that happens and software, with the type of use of internet that is critical to both users, customers, businesses, and to the public. we encourage the committee to continue to work on getting the balance right. the committee ultimately determined that this is not the year to pass any legislation, so we want to be part of that discussion going forward. it has to get the balance right

and we want to be at the table talking about that balance. we think reasonable approaches can be done that allow us to tackle the problem of piracy, but ensuring the kind of innovation needed. >> were you surprised by the outcry over sopa and pipa? >> i was not surprised by the fact that the citizens had become in power with the technology we develop that allows citizens to weigh in on a whole host of issues, citizens are powered by this and that is a great thing. what we have to understand is that there has to be a balance. voices need to be hurt and i am confident that in this process going forward, we will see an even better understanding of technology issues.

you have not only companies but individual users coming forward with their ideas. that is wary depend on elected officials and others to balance those things. >> you are watching the communicators, our weekly look at technology policy and the people behind uit. joining us is robert holleyman and jennifer hurd martinez. >> is there anything there anythingsopa where you thought it went too far, lynn congress returns to this issue of tackling piracy, that they should keep in mind? >> i think the important lesson from that discussion is getting this unbalanced right with innovation. the important lesson also is, what does this mean globally?

we do see several nations that are havens for piracy. that is something that is not in the u.s. economic interest or in the interest of users for that to happen. we need effective tools to do with that. i am also looking at a series of areas that countries are erecting right now that will make it difficult were u.s.- based technology companies to succeed in the global market, not only by fostering piracy but the top of barriers we are seeing that promote indigenous innovation create new barriers around standards that companies cut like china and india are trying to erect, to look to domestic standards rather than internationally set standards, to a series of computing that

would require companies to build data centers country by country, which breaks up the economic efficiency of pirated computing, or limits the flow of data across borders. we are in an incredibly important era, the future of american companies to be successful, for which the things likesopa and pipa matter. they are only one element of what the u.s. does. we need to take account of what is happening internationally and rate down barriers where we see them exist, but also find a balance. >> when it comes to cloud computing, is that the future of the software industry? where does cybersecurity and cybersecurity legislation play a role in the cloud computing industry? >> cloud computing is the biggest new innovation in the computing industry in over two

decades. it is estimated to be $73 billion value in just the next couple of years. we hear a lot about it, but it just means that software can be delivered as a service, and it can be delivered efficiently and in some cases less expensively in ways that enable individual consumers and small businesses to really gain the advantages of that software. it is a huge growth of interest and economic activity in the u.s. software industry. it is critical for that to be successful that we have the type of security protections that when data is stored not on one's personal computer but in the cloud, you have to make sure it is secure, but you have to also make sure that data can flow between borders, because it in

this sinless wall of the internet as a means of distribution, the economic efficiency occurs not just in the city, state, or country, but when you bring all of this together. you have to make sure the data is secure and we have to have tools to deal with the real threats of cyber security. >> is your industry and support of the cyber security legislation that is currently being promoted especially by a majority liberal leader reed? >> we are absolutely in support of the effort by the majority leader to bring up cybersecurity legislation after the or the july recess. as you know, the house has already acted to adopt three cybersecurity related bills. the ball is really in the court of the senate. there certainly are discussions that are continuing about what

form that final legislation would take, and we courage in these discussions to find an acceptable compromise and middle ground to occur, and we do think it is important for the senate to act and for the president to be able to sign a balanced cybersecurity bill before the end of this year. >> in a perfect world, the senate did bring up senator lieberman bill and it did pass, got signed into law, would you be supportive of that? >> we all know that the lieberman collins bill is likely to be modified further in conference with house. we do believe there is a balanced approach to cybersecurity that can deal with three critical issues and big one, making sure that the federal systems are more secure. federal agencies are storing

data, connected to the internet as they are, that that have not just security on paper but they have continual monitoring processes so that federal data is secure. secondly, we need more research and development around cybersecurity and the nature of the press. it is critical to everyone who looked at that we do not yet have enough trained professionals to work in the area of cybersecurity, particularly supporting government. pilot, we need a balanced approach to information sharing that allows cybersecurity threats and information to be shared between the private sector and the government and vice versa, so that we can track items as they emerge and build more secure nation. those are bedrock principles. other issues will be discussed including how we deal with critical infrastructure. it is too early to tell how

those will be resolved, but we think it will be resolved and it is important that this year it will be signed into law. >> right now on both critical infrastructure, several senators are trying to work on this compromise effort to bring the two sides together on what is the best way to secure critical infrastructure, power plants, telecommunications networks. there was a draft circulated of what that compromise looks like. at this point is still early, but it did come away with the framework of where they are going. the u.s. chief of commerce said they did not like what they saw. another trade group in the tech industry also voiced concerns about it. what are your thoughts on that? >> we were applauding the effort

by those senators to try to find a balanced approach to how you deal with the critical -- critical infrastructure in this country, insuring it is protected against the kind of cyber threats that we know exist. has to be balance. you have to make sure it is not overly regulatory and that the rights protections are there, and you have to ensure that technologies can be deployed. the change going forward, i cannot support that yet because we have to see what it looks like, but we absolutely support the process that those senators are working on to try to find a workable, balanced solution around critical infrastructure . >> one other aspect of the cyber security issue is information sharing. that raises the issue of privacy, and people have a real concern about cloud computing and sharing information between

private sources and the government. how do you address those concerns? >> it is hugely important. we are very big believer that any law should ensure that private information by individuals and businesses is kept private. at the same time, we know that there is a carefully defined and relatively narrow set of information around cyber threats, where more information sharing is essential for us to both identify and prevent those threats from occurring. there we believe that the house bill made a lot of progress in trying to address the privacy issues by putting the rights protections in place to ensure that there can be sharing of information between private sector and government, but it has to be limited.

the cyber threat information and there -- also additional protection there. it and that balance right again is critical and it is also critical to be assured that information because of what cannot do that, then everyone is at risk. i think we can recognize that can be done in a balanced way. >> going back to the compromise proposal, the issue that the chamber of commerce and i.t. i had with that was too heavy- handed and seemed like would regulate a bunch of industries, including i.t. cos. did you see those red flags when you saw the framework? >> we welcome the additional discussion that senators are trying to drive. i am sure since that first outlined was put out at has changed further. we are talking about balance. i look at critical infrastructure as an important thing to address few people care

about what happens to the threat to an individual computer that i have a home on my desk, but when those things become amalgamated, things like the electrical grid, people do care about it. it is appropriate to identify what is critical infrastructure, identify the kind of new, innovative technologies that can affect that that will be viable for a nation to feel secure. it is appropriate and important for that to be part of the discussion and we hope that is part of it. >> it was clear that the majority of the house did support that bill. there were protests from a lot of the same groups that rose up

during sopa and pip and turn to social media to try to get their voice out. there was worry that those protests could have derailed from passing, which it ultimately did not. now that concern is rising again now that the senate is getting ready to act. is that a concern or are you afraid that the concerns about privacy could impact the senate from moving forward on the bill? >> i am all for citizens being empowered. to raise issues directly with the government. we created the software technology that enables the attack but, and that is a great thing. the call is then for congress to figure out what the right balances, but i am confident that people who are weighing in also want to make sure that we have tools to deal with this

very real and escalating cyber threats that exist. and recognizing that people are four means of trying to tackle the problem, i think congress will be able to reach a balance on that. it is important that it be done is sure. we have seen an escalating number of threats. simply waiting for this for another 12 months or 18 months i think is far too risky for the u.s. to do, so i am encouraged by the efforts to see this issue be brought up after the for the july recess. >> unfortunately, we are out of time. we have been talking with robert holleyman endeavour martinez of politico. >> thank you -- and jennifer

hurd martinez of politico. >> georgia congressman tom price, a surgeon and chairman of the republican policy committee talks about the house gop perspective on the affordable health care act. the supreme court is expected to issue a decision on the challenges to that lawsuit. he also talks about tax and spending issues facing congress. newsmakers, sunday at 10:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. wisconsin governor scott walker was in washington d.c. thursday. he discussed a wide range of topics with the christian science monitor's dave cook and other political reporters. talking about the precedent for a race, he said mitt romney needs to establish a clear vision and bold economic plan to win votes. this is an hour. this is an hour.