day, follow the key races on c- span, c-span radio, and c- 2012.rg/campiagn >> live coverage for the iowa 4th district u.s. house seat. steve king is running for a sixth term. he is challenged by christie vilsack. aehihier debate is on iow public television. steve king -- and this special edition of live press, liv iowam carroll. wantis iiowa banks know you honest advice for your goals. if it is buying a new home or

funding retirement. iowabank.com. >> federal funding was provided banks. saving carroll county state banks. st. francis hospital. commercial savings bank. the bank that grows from a strong foundation. information is found at esbcarroll.com. >> for more than 40 years, iowa press has brought newsmakers from across iowa and beyond. we bring debates in each of iowa's four districts. from the santa marina winery, here is dean.

the shifting population creates the 4th district. urban cities join sioux city and the rurlal district steve king has represented for 10 years. he's been winning reelection by comfortable margins, getting a fifth term -- but redistricting, drawing in ames and the iowa state university may dillute the republican dominance. christie vilsack moved to ames to declare dcandidacy for his seat. she traveled the state during tom vilsack's years as

governor. welcome to iowa press. you are familiar with the format. with this audience and the iewers --on vewers, they will cheer at the beginning and end. the question in this debate edition come from sioux city journal writer bret heyward and kay henderson. >> mrs. vilsack, at an iowa fundraiser, you said, you were running to prove being a woman is not a barrier. do you ask for them to put aside their issues and vote on you

because you're a woman? will think the delegation be stronger and i am from one of two states who have neve relected a woman. being a small-time person. and being 62 years old is something i bring to this. this makes me a candidate that provides a different view, and i think that this shows my temperament and temperament is going to be important in this race. i think that there are times in our nation's history where you need people who are resolute and dig their heels in, but this is not that time. it was addressed by a man who approached me at the greene county fair. i am not a democrat or a republican, i am and american.

i want to go to congress as an american and not a partisan. i bring that lens as a woman and there are many issues i want to address that are very important. >> mr. king, when you were speaking with iowa republicans, you said that she is left of san francisco and you said that democrats and to create chaos and order to gain power. can you explain that? >> i said they profit from chaos with fiscal irresponsibility. you look at the groups supporting mrs. vilsack and spending hundreds of thousands -- they are left of thsan francisco. one is the anti-meat lobby. this is not a centrist running

against a conservative. if you look at the positions -- and with regard to the women issue, i got women voted to office, and i nominated kim reynolds. the last woman to run for congress was marianne miller- meeks. i campaigned for her and vilsack worked against her. >> why did you call attention to your age? >> there comes a time when you don't care what people think, but i need the votes of 700,000 people, but this is an aspect i bring to congress. i am someone already. i'v want to get things done.

>> the implication is that you are in congress to "be someone." >> if anyone wants to look at my record, they know i'm moving the iowa agenda. and you don't just go there and put up a vote that best represents iowans. i take that beyond those limits. it would be a relatively easy thing to vote the district and sit in your office and work to get reelected. to take it to another level -- you have to see ll iowa values. >> you know, congressman king has said that his agenda moved this country to the left. i want to represent the 750,000 people in the district and grow the economy.

we lost a congressperson. >> let's talk about the economy. >> looking at the economy -- what can you do to accelerate the economy? >> i said i am focused on the local and i start with the local. i see the world as this district -- with teachers. i see my job much as i would on the first day of school. i would look at these counties as 39 entities and would make sure that they all maximize their potential. i have laid out my plan for layers of economic opp ortunity. i carry a football with me to create another level of the bio- economy, within 10-15 miles of

small towns. >> many wonder about the football? >> it is made of soybeans. and most cars are from detroit and the seats are made of this. with plastic bottles or using this to create asphalt. we can make that within 10-15 miles. >> in 2013-2014, what will stimulate the economy? >> i introduced the first piece of legislation for biodiesel and represent the biggest renewable energy. out ofent has to ge tout oet the way so entrepreneurs can

have their way. what the government needs to do is have a low, stable, predictable tax rate. we have to lower our regulation burden. when i was in business, 43 agencies regulated my trade. there is not a single company that says -- we are proud to comply with federal regulations. eventually, they would be shut down. >> what year would you say the economy will be reocvered with acceptable employment. >> we don't know who will win. if i knew that, i would be more bold. if we win the majority. we'll hold it i nthn the house, win the senate and mitt romney

is president -- by the time he is up for reelection, unemployment will drop 1.5 points. >> what is an acceptable rate? >> 2%, which is a full employment economy. i would try to drive it down -- >> where would you put it nationally? >> we can get it around 4 %. >> one of the problems we have is gridlock in congress. congressman king has not done much in his 10 years. we need a farm bill to start with. that is the most important piece of legislation to people in this room -- >> is that going to effect

unemployment? >> i think it will. the farm bill, peopel arle feel insecure and are not investing. it is hard for farmers to go to the bank. it is hard for young farmers to know what the rules are. so there is the insecurity. it is not just the farm bill. >> let me interrupt. we will get into a deeper discussion. oft is an acceptiblable rate unemployment? >> it is 2% on the west and 5% on the other end of the district. if we can get this down -- >> and what year are we talking? >> you can't know unless you can say that congress will get something done.

nothing will happen without a jobs bill. >> let me ask one more thing. how long should unemployed men and women be entitled to unemployment. >> this helps protect people in the downturn, but you have to make sure people don't continue to depend on those. you have to make sure that we have a recovery. >> how long should the unemployment benefits be continued? >> i did not hear an answer from her, my answer is 26 weeks. this has been extended out to 99 weeks, and we need to understand that there is not a lot of return on that investment, there are people who are 63, and this is an early retirement.

and job skills atrophy because -- we have the five people -- we know when unemployment runs out and we're there to hire them. this is not a good return on the investment. the safety net has been 26 weeks. >> i am coming back to you to answer that question. >> i don't think we need to have a definite time on the. we have to take a look at the recovery and make sure that we take care of people who have been unemployed. the answer to this is to take care of the gridlock and actually get something done. nothing has begun -- been done in congress and many told the people there responsible. if we send the same people back this is not going to happen. we need a farm bill and immigration reform bill, and nothing has happened in

congress. this is the most ineffective congress in the history of congress and he is one of the most ineffective congress people in our delegation. >> mrs. vilsack, as a catholic, how has your view on abortion been shaped by religion? >> i am episcapalian. my husband is a cathlic, my children are catholics. we raise our children as catholics. i am happy to talk about my view on abortion. it is that it should be safe, legal, and rare. i've worked hard on the rare part, because i wanted to make sure this is not just something that divides us politically,

and that i would work to make sure we reduce the number of unintended pregnancies and helped unemployed men and women get a job. i work with an organization that does research and now has the beginning evidence to show that we have reduced the number of abortions in iowa by 26% and unintended pregnancies by 8%. i have been in washington talking about the results of this and we hope that this will be a model for the nation. we won't have to talk about abortion if we make sure that people have access to contraceptives. i would like congressman king to explain what his view is on that. he has said that -- i would like to know if he believes that women in this community have the

right to -- the legal right to go into the drugstore with a prescription for birth control pills, and get some of the long acting contraceptives at the local family planning clinic and i don't think he has made his position clear on this. >> it is brazen to make it such a misstatement here. this is manufactured from the other side of the aisle. this follows as far as the president of the united states with what they put out earlier today. there is a case called griswald vs. conn. this was 1965, when the supreme court said that there is a constitutional requirement, that prohibited the states from banning the sale of contraceptives. i accept that as

constitutional, and we tell people to go something they can be constructive with. but this is constructive and a difference between us that is not manufactured. we have babies in america and iowa that are aborted because they are baby girls and the mother wants a baby girl -- a baby boy in said of a girl. this is -- the people of by what did not care about this. i think it matters to a low girls that are being aborted. >> do you believe in the right to privacy which was put forward with griswold vs. connecticut? >> this is an important question for people to know -- >> i accept the decision of

griswald. >> i take that as a no. >> then you misunderstand it. >> do you support an amendment to the u.s. constitution, the person had amendment that was proposed in the state of mississippi and failed? >> i would look at the language of that, but generally speaking, if so inclined to be supportive of the finding -- defining life at the conception and the catholic church in the five basic positions of the church with embryonic stem cell research. i would want to see the language. >> if you years ago you showed a scale model of a wall that should be built on the southern border with mexico. do you still feel that this is the way to go? >> people said we cannot build a

wall. i said, i would get down to the tinker toys and show them. i put together a model and said, this is how we do it. we could build a mile of this per day. this puts aside the argument, that we have 5,500 miles of the great wall of china, but my position is that we do not need 200,000 miles of wall, we just do that until they start going around the end. >> is this a concrete barrier? or a brief explanation? >> when the president ridiculed the wall, he was 600 feet from the fences and the walls and the most down along the border. i would describe this as a kind of concrete system with the foundational trench, and the

concrete panels, and if you build the wall up you have to have routes on either side, with the chain-link fence by the border. we are spending $12 billion -- $6 billion per mile. >> talking about immigration is what we're talking about. president obama -- if you join congress which be supportive of this trend continuing? >> the most important thing is to secure the borders, and do whatever we need to do so that people are not crossing the border illegally, and drugs are not crossing illegally. i think we need to make sure that jobs are going to americans and we need immigration reform. we need to make sure that there

is a pathway to citizenship for the 13 million people who are here, in the shatters -- shadows. and the people who are here -- they have a chance to live the american dream because many of them have offered their lives for their country. congressman king talked about the terms of electricity and use the language of this reprehensible and embarrassing to the people of iowa, that says we can use cattle prods on animals so why not of electricity on people. >> that is a false statement and i will not respond to it. >> there are several communities within your district, that have a large influx of non-in list -- english speaking people, there are

several communities like that. do you think these people need federal assistance in the way that the military assists with the military base, and the influx of children into the school districts. do you think that communities should get special assistance when they are in that sort of mind? >> i graduated high school in denison, and those are the community's most likely to ask for that. i do know that we have glasses that are going on right now, -- classes going on right now and i don't know that there is a shortfall of that kind of service. i will not commit to anything intel i am sure that there is a

need. >> mrs. vilsack, you heard this -- special population groups? t thev. ray brough tth southeast asian families here and we had a good way to make them part o fthf the community. churches were working with the families. at the state level -- we created iowa centers that helped with these issues to fill the buffer. this is an interesting idea. i don't know exactly how you'd move it forward, but it is interesting to contemplate. >> mr. king, are you planning to sue -- you said you wanted to sue president obama over the tradchange in policy that young

people would not be deported. >> hte violated the constitution like gov. vilsack, he cannot do that with memorandum, and this was bogging people down. >> where do you stand on that? >> in the process? there are plaintiffs who won't come on until after the election. i will hold the suit up until after the election and we will get teh suihe suit filed. >> the answer is --w we wouldn't have this issue if congress had done therir job. one branch doesn't work well and another steps in. took ak the president htoot

necessary step. >> we will see a couple of commercials right now, the first campiagn.vilsack's >> i am christie vilsack and i approve this message. ♪ >> mr. king, mrs. vilsack has called you an embarassment to iowa. do some of the quotes embarrass you? >> i've said by the time i

eliminated the questions and dishonesty, the only thing left was "i'm christie vilsack and i approve this message." the one that is true, was about the vote on hurricane katrina. there will be all kinds of wasted funds. it is a principled vote and it will be easy to vote on. king was right -- tis ihis is te sioux city's response. the balance of that is false. i have had better votes since then. voting against obamacare, voting against cap and trade, dodd- frank, those were better

votes, but the rest of those allegations are false. >> he is one of 11 congressmen who took a vote against hurricane katrina relief. i think that everything i said in that ad is true. we have researched all of it. these are congressman' king's own words. >> and he is using one to define mrs. vilsack. >> what does it mean if mrs. vilsack calls for tax increases? increasing taxes on job creators and in this stagnant economy, christie effect --ck will

>> mr. king, you've seen the ad. >> that's the first time i've seen that, but am happy to respond. mrs. vilsack wants the tax increase to kick in on millionares, and many of them are job creators and small businesspeople. >> mrs. vilsack, you've asked for it to be pulled. >> i never said i wanted to raise taxes except on millionares. it is not about small businesses. one reason they run that ad is because i talk about how i wan ttt to rebuild the middle class. i want to make sure we have economic opportunities and -- with millionares raising more.

the proposal dave vilsack -- he talked about suspending the tax issues for small businesses -- would be something that is a good idea. >> another ad people and a photo of nancy pelosi. i wonder how you respond when people like congressman can accuse you of being a nancy pelosi clone. >> one of the things about this district -- i represented it for eight years. i see every small town in this district as my hometown, the town i grew up in. all the people in this district -- friends and neighbors -- that is why am. i am iowa.

>> you accused her of being to the left of saying francisco -- in response to her saying she represents iowa? >> i did not hear the answer to the question -- that was about nancy pelosi. this is what i know. i know that if christie vilsack is elected to the united states congress, the first boat she would put up with the vote for nancy pelosi. you have to stand up and you have to shout the name of the personnel you vote for for speaker of the house. that is the question -- i did not hear the answer. >> first of all, we have no idea whether nancy pelosi be a candidate for speaker of the house. there may be other people. i would never presume before i had a job to answer a question like that. i would take into consideration the other people who might be interested in the job. i'll make the decision at that time. there is no assurance that would vote for nancy pelosi or anybody

else until i get the job. >> one thing about ads are both running -- we to accuse the other of not being a person who embodies iowa values. i would like each of you to in one sentence to describe to me what iowa values are. >> iowa values are faith and family and freedom and smart hard work and free enterprise. all the wealth comes from the land. we value that as closely as we can, as many times this weekend. it is a work ethic and faith ethic. that is why i have gone into -- i live here and my roots are here. i did not move here to run this race. i will live here after november weber happens. >> i did a tour called the value of work and asked people around the district about bodies we had

in common. i knew this would be a race that was divisive. they said the value of work is important. the value of service to the country, the value of stewardship of the land, family , and education, actually. people who i talked to said education is central to who we are in iowa. those of some of the basic values. i think i heard congressman king say the same thing. i do not think we are that far apart on what we would agree on in terms of what our basic values are. >> he accuse you of being a carpetbagger. what is your response to that? >> all of these towns, i represent everything in this district for eight years. all of the towns and people in them feel -- >> as i was's first lady? >> yes. i travelled over the country traveling and representing

people in the whole state, certainly in this district. i represented everybody in the district. congressman king represented 40%. i represent the values of this district. rs. vilsack, db comfortable in some of the things portrayed in the ad -- you like to have them along your side campaigning for you? >> i am not sure what you are talking about. >> the humane society, their views on pork production, would you like to have been campaigning alongside you? >> i have not taken money from the humane society, if you are suggesting that. congressman king suggested that. i cannot and do not take money from anybody who does business -- the humane society, every

single town in iowa has a humane society and people are pointing there and helping to take care of animals. i think it depends on what you are talking about. >> congressman king -- some of these ads, the first woodstock was done by one of your campaign. are you concerned about how issues are being framed by ads by outside groups, particularly, how would you like the issues to be framed? >> i knew this would happen. that is why i said a year-and-a- half ago when the announcement came out that this would be a holy war. i said, i will learn things about myself i do not yet know. they will spend millions of dollars attacking my reputation -- that turned out to be true. i knew this would be the first super pac collection iowa has experienced in a congressional race. one of the reasons i did this many debates is because this is the way to penetrate through

that. i did not think we could offset all that spending. if you send back a $1,000 check , you do not get to wash your hands and say, they are nice people who are part of that community who made this ad. local people who take care of these lost animals are not affiliated with hsus. are people i've done it too. there is a big difference. .his is a stark gap i the humane society has a legislative agenda and spend 1% helping pac's, driving a legislative agenda that is anti- meat, that does not sell well in this district. >> nobody likes it or chart -- pork chop better than i do -- i want to say that. over these expenditures, we have no control. one of the things i was most proud to do and accomplish was

to change campaign finance law. something like the disclose act, which -- the system is broken. it is broken like a broken arm. it is not terminal, but we need to fix it and i would like to be part of that. there is way too much money in politics. when i see these ads on tv i am seeing them for the first time. these are not organizations that i am connected with. in terms of the advertising. >> mr. king, i have a question about taxes. let's say in 2013 you are appointed and to establish u.s. tax policy. what would you do? czars, butosed the it would be a tempting appointment -- the first thing i would do is make the bush tax

brackets permanent so there is long-term predictability. then i would go to work to sell to the public the idea that, as ronald reagan said, the federal government has the first lien on productivity and punishes production -- we do have all taxes off of production and put them on consumption. we can transform this policy. that is a piece i have gone around and talked about. i've talked about it each year i have been in congress. vilsack to. debate that with me, but i did not get an invitation. >> i would also like you to respond to that and outline what tax policy would implement w. >> it would not be the fair tax. i do not think there is anything fair for the middle-class about a fair tax. basically, when i went to the grocery store this morning i

bought milk for $3. three guards and 55 cents. if i had to pay 23% of every gallon of milk, 22% sales tax everytime i boughbought a car so take my baby home from the hospital or bought a new car, that is considerable. that is fine if you make more than $40,000 a year. but if you do not -- $200,000 a year. but if you do not, that is an incredible tax on in a class. that is a really bad idea. >> it would only be 275 -- $2.75 under my plan. you have talked years about the fair tax -- why has it not become active? >> in all my years of talking to round table advisers, all the times i have tested this out, i would give the argument over and over again, they would come back

and say, if it was a good idea we would have it by now. we are the most successful country in the history of the world, but we still do not have a logical thing -- there are political barriers in the way. the middle-class is not disadvantaged by this. we untax the poor. i have turned this around like a rubik's cuba, and every time it looks better and better. but we see people in power -- half of k street is funded by people advocating for tax exemptions. >> could it be enacted in 2013, 2014? >> we need to elect a president who has a mandate for that kind of change. if we find ourselves in an economic conditions so desperate we are looking for a change -- we have that circumstance, just the wrong president. >> mitt romney does not think is a good idea, either.

>> let's shift to horses and bayonets. when you are elected to --ngress, you will control t what sort of spending priorities when you have on the fence? would you have a spending priority for people or for weapons systems at the pentagon? >> let me start by saying a in the future, we are not going to be judged on a might as a country. it will not be disorder as we have or how many tanks we have, how many aircraft we have. we will be judged on our ability to compete in the world economically. i spent some time with people who had survived presidents and secretaries of state on the council of foreign relations, someone i have high regard for. this is not my original idea. it is basically his.

but i agree with him. i think we really need to focus strategically. >> what is strategic -- does that mean you would downsize the current military might of the united states? >> i think we need to be nimble. >> what does that mean? >> because we have to pay attention to terrorist outbreaks that come up often, we need to be nimble. we need to rely on technology. we need to be strategic in how we go about -- >> a smaller military then we have now? >> it might be a different military. it might be smaller, but the most important thing for us is to make sure we have a strong economy in the world. that means making sure that we actually get something done and congress can get the economy back on track. i think we need to be able to react very quickly situations around the world, because many of them are much smaller. what we have done in the past, and congressman king is

responsible for this, we have been involved in two wars that have taken a huge toll in human life and money as well. our debt is six trillion dollars when he went in -- it is 16 trillion dollars now. we put to wars on the credit card. we have to make sure that before we go into conflict, we are prepared to do that. >> let's ask about what you just said -- you can reply to that. then, if you explain your measurement of u.s. power in the world. >> i have been accused of starting two wars. [laughter] >> not paying for them. >> i did not restart those wars. that has been repeated a number of times through the campaign. those things were started first of all in september 11 -- we were attacked. our financial center was crushed. we went into a downward tailspin economically. we went into afghanistan -- you do not check the balance sheet and send troops into battle. make sure they have the training

and equipment in need and resources to win. i certainly have supported that. when nancy pelosi came in as speaker, the national debt was 8.67 doris trillion. when she teamed up with barack obama -- now is over $16 trillion. it looks like i have more power than nancy pelosi and barack obama combined to listen to my opponent. here's why think about military. i believe there is that in the military and the pentagon. i believe there is too much brass there. it will take people on the inside to reform it before we can get that right. we have partly to many civilian employees. we are not keeping the track of that. there are people better in the system to make as recommendations than me. some people i work with, i trust them substantially. john bolton is 1. >> he is the former u.s. ambassador? >> to the united nations. and a personal friend. i would add this -- we need to enhance our cia.

the intel i get in classified briefings is terrible. it is a shame. i cannot talk about what it is, but i will tell you why did political responses that are from the public sources and briefings that are supposed to be top secret. we have gone down a long way in our intel. that has to change, because that let us be more mobile. >> is there a circumstance in which you would see that you could vote for a resolution to enter a war in iran? >> could you repeat the question? >> is there a circumstance in which you could vote for a war on iran? >> we have to do everything we need to do to make sure that iran does not a nuclear weapon. israel is our best friend. we need to protect israel. yes, obviously i could if it were in the strategic best interest of the country and the strategic best interest of israel, which is often the strategic best interest of the country. we need to keep iran from a

nuclear weapon, but we need to do everything -- sanctions seem to be working now. when the best things is that we have involved other nations with an basically forcing iran to allow people to come and. >> just to clarify, i think i heard you say that under extreme circumstances you could a vote to support israel in going to war against iran. >> it would be extreme circumstances. we need to do everything we can, and there are lots of things we can do even apart from sanctions. this goes back to being nimble and strategic in terms of how we deal with this piece in question. >> i have supported israel for a long time. i will continue to support israel. our intel -- i have said, i have doubts about it. israel does not get to make a mistake. is a fatal mistake for the nation of israel if they except the idea i heard out of vice president joe biden that he thinks that is as much as four years away before iran has a nuclear.

we cannot tolerate that and let that happen. but i do not have my hands and the intel that tells us when it happens. here's what i said -- i would recommend to the president that -- thismr. ahmadinejad will be from good intel, when they will get there. that will send a message, we will work so that you can save face as an individual and nation, we will do it diplomatically, but we will deconstructs to nuclear endeavor. if not, when that day arrives in the calendar, it is over. we cannot let them get a nuclear weapon. >> mrs. vilsack, president obama has approved the use of unmanned droned to fight terrorists around the world -- that concerns some members of your party. are you concerned about that? >> not particularly. i think it is part of a strategy i am talking about -- there are a lot of different things that we need to be able to do.

there are people who will be able to decide when it is the best time to use drones or any of the other tools we have to be strategic and nimble and our response. so i do not have any particular problem. >> mr. king, libertarians in your party have a view of drones that is not terribly positive. what is your view? >> i think the utilization of them to take that leadership of al qaeda has been an effective means in that part of the world. it is a case by case basis. i would not say i would remove the authority from the president to protect us. he needs to have that authority as commander in chief. i am not critical of those. >> a kind of war -- a trade war possibly is spoken of as hypothetical with china, with currency manipulation and other trade policies. how aggressive should this country be in its trade policies

with china? >what specifically? >> more aggressive than they are. i have gone to china to go in there and engage with negotiations. i have pressed hard against the theft of u.s. intellectual property. it seems to be a pattern. they will sit around a table and say, okay, we will find these people and put some in prison. in reality it comes out of one pocket and into the other in china. i have introduced legislation that directs a u.s. trade representative to determine the value of the loss of u.s. intellectual property to the pirates of that from china. they would then levy a duty on products from china echo and to recover that loss and distributed to the people who of the right to the property. >> mrs. vilsack, do we have

a problem with trading with china? how should we modify? >> we need to continue to develop trade with china as we have our broader trade relationships around the world. i think we need to enforce our trade agreements with china. we need to be tough on them. they are -- there is a problem with intellectual property. they do not see that intellectual property -- i have also been there. >> do you agree with mr. king? >> probably. >> mr. king, earlier this month your colleague, with a republican congressman, said he was unhappy with the rules of engagement in afghanistan and would robert -- support bringing hundreds tomorrow. you sure that you? >> i would not look into that strategically to see what that really means in the aftermath, but i will say that advocacy is more open than it was a year ago.

at this point i would say that our commander-in-chief has not articulated a mission in afghanistan. it is awfully hard to keep troops in a place in the not have a mission articulate it. i had some of that discipline and with president bush and the middle of the iraq operation as well, but if the palau, what happens in the aftermath? i would rather read this point -- if we pull out, what happens in the aftermath? >> i would rather that mitt romney laid out the proposal for afghanistan, and have some proposals that would lay out what i think is a better result. >the proposals are strategic and dangerous to talk about on public and national television, but i will just say that i expect there would be a civil war in afghanistan if we pulled out immediately. there are ways to bring that together in such a way that people can be represented in governments in a more effective fashion than they are now. president karzai has been handed a constitution where he rules the whole country. a saint would use that power.

he has abused that power. i would like to look into a new constitution that would represent the people in afghanistan better than today. >> time for a new constitution in afghanistan? >> i think that we need to first of all make sure that everybody who has served there in this country, that we recognize they did everything that we asked them to do. in the and they have been asked to help train police forces. much like the national guard, they have been asked to help train them so they can take care of their own country. they need to do that. the sooner we can get out of afghanistan, the better. we need to invite these gentle back to the small communities of this district. we need to build here. we need to build infrastructure here. >> not that you are not saying something important, but i promised you earlier we would get to the farm bill. the prior farm bill has expired

for about a month. when congress will be addressing n-- the new farm bill, there'll be pressure to have limited spending. what could you do, mr. king, to perhaps persuade urban representatives to want to spend money for a nice plump farm bill that ahelps iowa farmers? >> i have been working on this bill for a year-and-a-half. people on staff, we can be inside the shop help induce -- shake that language. i passed it out of the agriculture committee. one thing i have done is make sure we have bipartisan support on the bill. there were only allowed in no votes coming out of committee. now it looks like there are two components. our producers have willingly give up direct payments. that is a big thing. they stepped up and said we are willing to except the elimination of direct payments. i said my job is to hold onto

crop insurance. i believe i am in a position to do that. so far i have done that. we have an impasse now between those who do not want to take a single dollar of of anybody's plate, the food stamp argument, at least 70% of this farm bill, and as to say they want no farm subsidies whatsoever. those refused to except a cut in food stamps are far greater than those who say they do not want any farm subsidies. >> we only have just a few seconds left -- i would like to have the last. >> there is no farm bill. a petition was put on the house floor to pass the farm bill. other congressmen supported it. nancy pelosi supported it. congressman king has not. he has not led on this issue, and as a result we do not have a farm bill, the most important legislation to people in this district.

he should be held accountable. >> 60 agriculture or groups support me. i do not know if there are any that support mrs. vilsack. >> i have traveled all around the world with members of the ag group. i've seen them in action. they know i can represent them because i have been doing a 48 year i was first lady -- for the eight years i was first lady. >> mr. king, name one thing you would do differently to make on -- congress function. >> i did not prepare myself for that answer. as a person in public life, i've had $7 million poured over my friend -- had attacking the four things i did not say. i will say this -- on the missouri river bill, which i've yet to hear a position from from any vilsack in this country -- we were done that for months. we were under water all summer. i introduced legislation.

i should have gone broader. >> suggested a few seconds left -- that will give you a chance to answer that. dysfunctional congress -- could you as a novice change anything? >> i think i can. i think i am the kind of person -- i want to expand the definition of being a congressperson to being a spokesperson for my state. i think i am the kind of person who, if you are going to hire someone to be a spokesperson, you would hire somebody who can speak to all the issues, who can bring different groups together and go around the country to explain what we do here. we do take care of our animals, but we are stewards of the land. i could explain why biofuels and wind are important to the economy the whole country. i can be a spokesperson in a way

congressman king cannot. >> the final seconds just to say thank you very much for spending time with us. a very much appreciated. thank you. >> thank you. >> we've completed our four weeks of special president -- debate additions. you will see the first district congressional candidates in their only televised debate this year. republic and ben langhe and democrat bruce braley. live from dubuque. we will show it at our usual press times and again on sunday. thanks for joining us today. [applause] 4 [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2012]

>> would you support military action in baran? ?ran >> as a last option, yes. >> under what conditions? >> if sanctions do not work. if they are close to and about to have the ability to develop a nuclear bomb, we use every option possible, as will israel. that will be the last option we have to use, but we would have it ready to use. >> i think we do not let iran develop a nuclear weapon. i think the military option should not be on the table. >> under what conditions would you recommend? >> i cannot believe that would be, but we had better exhaust everything else.

at the end of the day, if that is what is needed, i do not now what they need to give me, but we will have a honest discussion about what is needed." >> with less than two weeks to election day, follow the key races on c-span, c-span radio, and at c-span.org/campaign2012. >> new mexico senator is not running for reelection. the candidates -- the cook political report rates it as a leading democratic. the congressman has represented new mexico since 2009. ms. wilson represented the first sister, 1998 until 2009. live coverage is courtesy of klb tv.

-- kob-tv >> our sponsor is aarp. we are glad you are with us. this debate is being simulcast on 770 kkob am.

joining us on the stage is democratic candidate martin heinrich and republican candidate heather wilson. both candidates have agreed to the debate rules. each candidate will have one minute to make an opening statement. later, they will have one minute for a closing statement. the candidates will be given one minute to answer each question and then 45 seconds each for rebuttals. later, the candidates will be allowed to ask the other candidate a question, which is often very enjoyable. the answers will be limited to one minute each and answers will be -- and there will be 45 seconds for a revival. martin heinrich won the coin toss and has elected to go second. heather wilson, please go ahead with your opening statement. >> thank you. good evening. we still have to give kids at

home, one who is about to go to college, and one who is still the queen of her universe in high school. i worry about them. i worry about if there are going to be jobs for them when they finish school. there is nothing more important in america today than keeping the economy strong and job creation. that means keeping taxes low, reducing the red tape coming out of washington. it means and all of the above energy strategy. the fastest way to an american child is american energy. it means going forward with across-the-board spending cuts so we do not lose another 20,000 jobs next year. that is why i will do in the united states senate and i look forward to the discussion this evening. >> martin heinrich, your opening statement. >> growing up, my dad was an electrician. my mom worked in a factory. they worked hard and they stretched every dime, and

there were some tough times along the way. i know what it is like to struggle in the economy. i want your children in mind to inherit the kind of country we all believed in growing up, an america where you prosper if you work hard and played by the rules. i want you to know that my priorities are and in mexico's priories, protecting social security and medicare, tax -- are new mexico's priories, protecting social security and medicare, tax cuts for the middle class, creating jobs. i have always fought for the things that matter most to new mexicans, and i will continue to do that in the senate. >> with the u.s. deficit increasing by the second, threatening the economic recovery, what would you as a u.s. senator do about taxes and spending? we will begin with martin. >> i think what is critical here is that we take a balanced

approach. every single bipartisan group that has gotten together, whether it is simpson-bowles or others, has said it you can only tackle this problem if you look to both sides of the equation, and increase revenues and make cuts. we are going to have to weather some challenging cuts because spending is too high, but we are also going to have to increase revenue. i think it is fair to ask people in the upper income level to shoulder the same responsibilities that middle- class families shoulder today. it is not right that people like mitt romney who is worth hundreds of millions of dollars a year pays 13%-14% while small business people, teachers and firefighters, pay much more. with a balanced approach, we can meet this challenge. >> this is one of the areas where the congressmen and i flat out disagree. he is holding the entire state

hostage for a tax increase in january because he wants to increase taxes on the two upper brackets. half of the tax returns on those two abroad it's our small businesses, the engines of economic -- on those two upper brackets are small businesses, the engines of economic growth in america. ernst and young said that would cause us to lose 4300 jobs in new mexico. i think we need to go through a yearlong process of tax simplification. take almost all of the exemptions and special provisions, lower the rates, broaden the base, and give ourselves a tax code that is pro economic growth. then we have to control spending and have spending growth that is lower than the rate of our economy. we are also going to have to reform some big programs and i

believe we need a balanced budget amendment to the constitution. >> you have 45 seconds for rebuttal. >> we have a simple proposition. you can either embrace the kind of approach the congresswoman wilson has embraced. she pledged to sign the cut, a cap and balance program, 80 party approach to the budget. it is so draconian -- eight t - a tea party approach to the budget. it is so draconian, it would make deep cuts to medicare. we can go back to the tax rates of the clinton era. >> it is amazing to me that you can stand here, having voted for trillion dollar deficit for the last four years, the largest

debt increase in american history and say that we have to control spending. u.s. done nothing to control spending over the last quarter of the you have done nothing to control spending over the last four years. -- you have done nothing to control spending over the last four years. i think we should force congress to set priorities, stop funding things like so lender and prioritize social security come -- solyndra, and prioritize social security and medicare. >> with the fiscal cliffs looming and the president saying we need to cut defense spending, what would you do to save jobs at military bases and national laboratories. >> this is also an area where congressmen heinrich and i have strong disagreements. he was the only member of our

house delegation to vote for the prospect that would lead to across-the-board defense cuts starting in january. we have party lost 3000 jobs here in new mexico since he went to -- already lost 30,000 jobs here in new mexico since he went to congress and average take- home pay is bad. congressmen -- is down. i've read work to restore the defense cuts and avoid a devastating -- i would work to restore those defense cuts and avoid a devastating impact on our economy here in new mexico. >> i think it is important to remember whose seat we are seeking to fill. senator jeff bingaman said that version of what i voted for was a huge distortion, and it is. i voted to make sure as a country that we did not default on our obligations.

it was the tea party that forced us into the position of not passing clean legislation. i think what is incredibly important is that if we do not bring a balanced approach to this, we can completely erase the impact of sequestration. i have stood up to my party and fought for our bases and fought for our national labs. i opposed by president when he said we should put off funding the facility at los alamos. i wish heather wilson had stood to congressman ryan when he said we should cut it by 70%. >> you voted for the continuing resolution that zero out the funding for the national lab and the plutonium facility at los alamos. you did not offer a single amendment or lift a finger to

try to save it. i think the mexico needs the united states senator who understands new mexico's uni unique contribution to national security and who will fight for it. you lost the aircraft for the air guard here in new mexico and we now have the smallest air guard of any state except guam. i think we can do better and i intend to. >> there were onone of the people working at the air guard when i am joined the senate -- 1000 people working in the air guard when i joined the senate and there are 1000 people working there today. to me, it is not just about the airplanes. it is about the people. it is about the jobs. it is about the people who are

putting food on their family from those jobs. i will continue to fight for for rethinking, forward-looking emissions to make sure that both defense and energy are strong well into the future. >> nearly half of the people in new mexico are hispanic. in a study we reported just last week, it showed that the second most important issue to hispanics after jobs and the economy is immigration. what do you think about amnesty for some illegal immigrants and children who came here with them. martin. >> i do not think we need to embrace amnesty, but we need a comprehensive approach to immigration reform. our system is broken and has been broken for many years. congresswoman wilson had a chance for over a decade to do something about that. when i was elected to congress, not only did i sponsor comprehensive immigration

reform, but i made the dream act one of my central tenants in congress. we fought for the dream act because many of those kids do not know another country. they are willing to serve in the military, get an engineering degree or become a doctor and come back to the -- give back to the community. this is an issue that needs leadership. i have shown that leadership and we are going to continue to fight for forward thinking immigration policy in this country. >> i oppose amnesty because i do not think it is fair for people standing in line in embassies around the world waiting to come to this country and respect our laws. i support legal immigration and think we need to make changes so that immigration is based more on talent and skills, so that we have a pro-american immigration policy. with respect to children brought

here at a young age, i think we need a solution to the problem. would i have voted for the house version of that bill? yes. but the problem is the bill never made it to the senate. which is why we need bipartisan approaches. i look forward to working with senator marco rubio and others to make sure a lot passes, not just that a single faction can pass something through the house. with my respect to the work in the house when i was there, the primary objective was securing the border. that has now opened up opportunities to reform immigration. >> one of the first things i did after being elected to congress was vote to appropriate the funds to send 1000 new border patrol agents to that border and hundreds of customs agents. but that does not fix the underlying issue. we're very lucky in new mexico. we have a very active community.

various groups have come forward and said we need to embrace comprehensive immigration reform. we could not get the dream act through the united states senate because the tea party had taken it over to the point where republican u.s. senators were afraid they were going to be primaried for supporting a sensible policy. i think we need to stand up for common sense and get this done. >> actually, the problem in the mid-2000's was not that, congressman. it was that we had failed to secure the borders of immigration reform really could not be done until we took out first -- secure the border, so that immigration reform really could not be done until we took care of that. that opened up the possibility, i believe, going forward, for further immigration reform, not only to allow more people to

come to this country who are highly skilled, but also to have a guest worker program, which worked very well in new mexico. >> tell us what has been said about you in this campaign that has urged you the most -- irked you the most and why. >> i am not sure irked is the right word, but there is an advertisement congressman is running that implies i do not care about people who depend on social security and medicare. i find that not only personally offensive and untrue, but the reality is my family depended on social security when i was a kid. i know what it is like to be afraid, and i think preying on people's fears is a new low. i think it was reprehensible to try to make people afraid for something that was false. that bothered me a lot.

>> martin, is there anything that has irked you in this campaign. >> i have to say, i have gotten a pretty thick skin in the last few congressional races, and i have also learned to use netflix and some of these on demand television thing so my kids do not actually have to watch the commercials this time of year. but i do stand by my advertisements, and i will tell you that if you want to see the truth, type heather wilson cap and balance on youtube and see her indoors this radical plan. then see what the aarp -- endorsed this radical plan. then see what the aarp says about it. it would impact social security. it would impact medicare. it would impact education and health grants here in new mexico. i think we could take a better and more balanced approach. >> heather, 45 seconds for

rebuttal if you wanted. >> thank you. congressman, you are implying something that is not true and you have intentionally approve that. the cut, cut and balance pledge is something i completely support. i do not see any problem with cutting wasteful spending and prioritizing social security and medicare. it will force congress to set priorities just like all of us to around the family dinner table so that congress stops spending money we do not have. there is nothing radical about that. preying on people's fears, i think that is morally wrong. >> your response, martin. >> if you want to look, there are plenty of places we can make cuts in our programs. one place i am not going to make cuts in social security and medicare. social security has been

critical to many of our families. my parents are very reliant on that program despite the fact that they saved and invested. but i am not going to balance the budget on the back of our senior citizens. i do not think that is right. i think we take a balanced approach. they all say the same thing. you have got to work with both sides of this equation. it is the only reasonable and effective path forward. i think it is time that we actually produce some results for the american people. >> we are happy that aarp is cosponsoring this prime-time debate with us tonight. joining us on stage is leonele garza. he will present the next question. >> thank you.

on medicare, there have been recent discussions about having seniors buy insurance from private insurance plans with a fixed contribution from the government to pay for the premiums. this is commonly referred to as the premium support plan. would you favor this approach instead of traditional medicare? >> martin, you are a. >> absolutely not. i will not see medicare voucher ized. i know this plan is what paul ryan has bet his career on, but it would immediately have an impact on our seniors. i think protecting medicare is absolutely essential. it is why i cut subsidies to insurance companies so that we could put more money back into medicare. we took medicare savings from the insurance companies and plowed into filling the doughnut hole and preventative programs, extending the life of medicare. i will not see this program vouchered. my father has had a tough year.

unfortunately, he has used medicare a lot this year. it was there for him. it was there for my mother when she had to take over many of the family duties that he had previously filled. so, no, i will not support the plan. >> heather. >> medicare is important now and it is important in the future and we have to do things to save it. i actually do not like this part of congressman ryan's approach. i do support medicare advantage. that is a program in new mexico that four out of 10 seniors choose to have. i was talking to a gentleman who likes the fact that it is a wraparound program. he does not have to deal with a lot of different pieces. congressman heinrich is the only candidate on this stage who has voted to cut medicare by $700

billion in the health care act. he says it went to insurance companies. he means medicare advantage. that is what he's talking about. he is going to deny seniors that choice. about one-third of it also went to payments for hospitals. that is why between 15%-20% of our hospitals are going to go under, because of the health care act that he supported. it took $700 billion out of medicare. >> martin, your rebuttal. >> i have never cut a single benefit under the medicare program and i do not believe in cutting benefits under the medicare program. we added benefits that we pay for bite eliminating -- by eliminating subsidies to insurance companies that were pulling money out of medicare and into corporate profits. now, the ryan plan, when it came out, i fought back hard against that too. unlike my opponent, who was absolutely silent when the ryan budget plan came out. she was not there defending

medicare. she said she did not have to comment because she was not in the house of representatives. >> heather. >> well, i was not in the house of representatives, but when i was, i voted against deacongresn ryan's budget and his cuts to medicare. i have more concern about your approach saying we will not cut a single benefit. what you are cutting is the payment to your doctor or hospital. 40% of doctors now will not take new medicare patients. 15%-20% of our hospitals are going to go under because of the slash in payment rates that congress man heinrich was responsible for. so, we will all have benefits, but we will not have a doctor? this is the reason the health care act needs to be repealed and replaced. i will take that $700 billion and put it back in medicare.

>> your second question. >> on social security, i have heard politicians talk about i raising the income level subject to payroll tax or raising it the payroll -- or raising the payroll cap entirely. what are your thoughts? >> the most important thing for social security today is the check needs to be there on time and in full. there are three other principles that are important when we talk about how we save social security for future generations. one is that i think it needs to continue to be the safety net program. it is the defined benefit program. we do not want it to be invested in the stock market. it needs to be a safety net. second, the solution for social security should be bipartisan. there are a couple of models. simpson bowleses one. let's look at what ronald reagan

and patrick moynihan did back in 1983. the third thing is we have to start now. because the problem becomes worse as we go forward into the future. congressman heinrich as recently as june said we do not need to deal with this now and i disagree. >> social security did not create our federal budget deficit. when congresswoman wilson was elected to congress, she inherited a balanced budget. we got to be structural deficit we -- to the structural deficit we have today from very specific votes. congresswoman will send voted -- wilson voted to stop the pay-as- you-go rules. she got us into a war in iraq without paying for it, a war in afghanistan without pain for comment tax cuts to the wealthy without paying for it, -- afghanistan without paying for it, tax cuts to the wealthy without paying for it, medicare

without paying for it. we need to start paying for all of that before we use social security as the whipping boy for her bad behavior. >> it strikes me that congressman, i do not think you understand that social security is completely separate in the budget from all of the programs you just discussed. social security is a completely separate account. the problem with social security right now is that for the last two years we have been paying out more in benefits than we are taking in in payroll taxes. it is a separate line on your paycheck. it is completely separate. and it is in trouble. we are taking out more in benefits than we are taking in in taxes. under your approach, to do nothing, it means that seniors would open up their checks and find that instead of $1,000, it

is $750. that is your plan, to do nothing, and it would mean automatic cuts for every senior on social security. >> 45 seconds for a bottle. >> heather wilson has repeatedly said in this campaign that she plans to make changes to social security. i would ask you, don't you deserve to know what those changes would be? trust us is not a policy. trust us is an approach to get past the election and then you make policy. i think if we are going to make any changes to social security, that you deserve to know what those changes are going to be. i will continue to press congress woman wilson to know what plans he has, what specific changes she wants to make to social security. >> the third and final aarp question. >> do you support reducing the deficit without harming medicare and social security for current

and future generations? >> martin, why don't you begin? >> absolutely, and we can do that if we take a balanced approach, if we bring new revenues in and cut existing programs. i will not cut medicare's ability to produce results for seniors. i will not limit the things it can pay for. i will not -- what i will do is say we need to do a smarter job using every single medicare dollars. we can use electronic records to root out waste, fraud and abuse. we can pay our providers in a smarter way. today, medicare has a volume based system. the more you order, the more you get paid. doctors should get paid a salary and get a bonus if they produce high quality results. that would bring costs down, extending the life of the

program without cutting benefits. >> heather, your answer. >> i think it should continue to be completely separate as it is now. the principle to making sure it is solvent for the long term is no changes for those who are on or near social security today. it should continue to be a safety net and not invested in the stock market. we must start now. listen to what he said in his answer. he did not give one indication as to how he would approach saving social security. he said and has said as recently as june that it is fine for the next 20 years. 20 years for now -- from now, the trust fund will go broke.

everyone says we must address this now or else we will end up with social security recipients getting 25% less in their checks than they expect. that is irresponsible. >> your rebuttal. >> it will not take decades for cut, cap and balance to start hitting social security hard. that is the more serious threat in the short term than anything coming down the pipe several decades from now. the things driving our deficit re specific decisions buthat congresswoman wilson made. this tea party cut at an balance cuts only approach will be a disaster not only for social

security and medicare but for the entire federal budget and new mexico. >> congressman, this is important. the money that comes in from people's payroll checks can only be used for social security. challenge -- the challenge is demographic. we are much better off starting to deal with that today. all of the other things we have to do, we are going to have to deal with that too, but it is completely separate from social security, and we have to deal with that now.

there will be a 25% automatic cuts in benefits if we do not fix this. debate,rt of tonight's we also asked viewers to submit questions. here is stored bison with some of those questions. -- stewart dyson with some of those questions. >> describe a time when you voted against the majority of your party because you felt an issue was so critical to new mexicans that party loyalty took second place. >> i think there were a number of times when i demonstrated my independence. let me give you a couple of examples. when i was a freshman in the house of representatives, i

forced the speaker to pull a bill off the floor because it would be devastating to our national laboratories. i was the only republican to vote against the spending bill in 2004 because i did not think it treated education sufficiently. there were insufficient funds for title 1. the third is on health insurance. i was a handful of republicans that voted to override the veto of president bush because i felt children's health insurance was important. i have a pretty long history of standing up to my party and even being punished for it from time to time, but that is who i am. i think mexicans deserve an independent -- new mexicans deserve an independent leader. >> when president obama voted to cut funding for the laboratory in los alamos, most democrats supported the approach. i did not. i supported the program. i felt it was absolutely

necessary for us to meet our obligations under the new start treaty and i voted to refund that program. i also stood up when i was a freshman in congress, stood up to the speaker, stood up to the majority leader, and said enough with the congressional pay raises. in the midst of a recession, it is not right. we stopped congressional pay raises. heather wilson voted for pay raise after pay raise, $38,000 over the horse of her career. i have stood up to my party and will continue to do that. >> with respect to your vote in armed services, you voted to authorize the spending and then you voted to zero it out by creating a checking account for the new plutonium facility in los alamos and and not put any money in the account.

as a result, 700 people have lost their jobs and another thousand will not be hired next year because you did not effectively fight for them. with respect to pay raises, you know that has been debunked. i never voted to increase my own pay. here is the question for you. the very week you were sworn into congress, you got a $5,000 pay raise. did you cash the check? >> when it came up for the annual pay raise in congress, we stood up and said enough, it is not write any more. we sponsored legislation to get rid of the cost-of-living adjustments. you have to vote for each individual pay raise. the previous congress voted yes. our congress did not, not only that year, but the year after word and to this day. i want to return too to this issue of the laboratory. when we really needed congresswoman wilson to stand up

and fight for our national labs, when the vice presidential nominee was fighting for huge cuts, she was nowhere to be heard. she was silent. i think that speaks volumes. >> how do you plan to change education in america? i am talking about elementary, middle and high school. i am a teacher, and it seems as if it is getting worse, including teacher pay. >> let's start by repealing no child left behind. it is not working for new mexico schools. it is not working for new mexico student and it is not working for new mexico teachers. it was a top down washington prescribed approach the congresswoman wilson embraced when she was in congress, but it is not working. it is not working for my kids

who are here in school in central new mexico. we should not do testing that compares this year's fifth graders to last year's fifth graders. we should do testing at the beginning of the year that tells the teachers where each individual child is so they can tailor their instruction and then know what kind of progress they have made over the course of the year. >> heather, now i see you making a face. what is that about? >> it was a smile. >> the note child -- the no child left behind act is federal funding to aid education. i strongly support that funding, but i think the decisions about how that funding should be spent should be made at the local level. what no child left behind did was push decisions down to the local level and allow teachers and principals to move money

around. that is massive flexibility. in terms of the testing requirements, for a year now mexico has been exempt from those requirements and has its own grading system. i think those texts -- tests and requirements should have been tweaked and replaced five years ago, but what they did do was narrow the gap between the rich kids and poor kids, anglo and minority, with respect to achievement, and ultimately, that is what we want to do. >> i would urge you to go out and as kids in public school, asked them about the last decade of public service in the schools of new mexico. asked teachers what the impact of no job left behind was. did it really put the power in their hands? i have not met a single teacher that said that. they all said it put lists and

lists of requirements on us without any funding to do those things. and it took the creativity of one of the greatest jobs in the world. >> before no child left behind, you could not use money that was supposed to be for curriculum development in middle school math to help with reading instruction in elementary school. what they gave was a lot of flexibility for schools to move funding around. what we did say was we want schools to be accountable to their communities for results. how those results were reported and the whole issue of annual yearly progress was something that did not work. i think they were right to set that aside. we now have a difference in new

mexico. the important thing is to look at results. the kids who were first- generation americans and were being left behind under the previous system. >> our third and final question. >> dawn hall from rio rancho once to know where do you stand on -- wants to know where you stand on renewable energy and related tax incentives? >> i believe we need a balanced, long term energy plan for this country that increases american made energy and keeps the cost down. american energy is the fastest way to american jobs. here in new mexico, we have plenty of sun and wind in april. i am and all of the above energy gal. congressman heinrich voted for cash and trade. it would cost 11 belsen jobs in

new mexico and increase our electric bills. -- 11,000 jobs in mexico and increase our electric bills. he also said that coal is the fuel of the past. well, if that is the fuel of the past, then those are the jobs of the past. he spent the last four years in washington chasing a green dream, and that is going to cost us all. >> is not the dream for the thousands of people working in new mexico today because of those policies. in fact, today, despite the fact that we have been mining coal for hundreds of years, there are almost five times as many people working in renewals directly in the state of new mexico as in that industry. there is nothing wrong with mining for coal. my father was a minor. my grandfather was a minor. it is hard, hard work. but when it comes to setting

policy, we need to be looking to the future. we need to be investing in infrastructure. los alamos labs said if we had adequate infrastructure, we could grow 25,000 jobs in clean energy, which is affordable. producing an energy portfolio that over time it's ever more domestic and ever more clean. >> heather. >> the los alamos study did not say 25,000, it said 1200 jobs for 20 years. i am fine with that. i support renewable energy. the difference is he supports renewable energy and not coal, oil and natural gas. 70% of our electricity in this state comes from clean coal- fired generation. it is not only the jobs in the coal mines that are at stake. by increasing the price of

energy through all the green legislation that he wants to pursue, we are going to have fewer jobs here, because one of the big drivers of whether a manufacturing operation is going to locate here is low cost energy. the renewable he is pursuing cost two or three times what clean, coal-fired generation does. >> we have quadrupled the numbers of rigs produced in the continental united states and yet you are still paying through the nose at the pump. i do not think it is fair to support the kind of policies congresswoman wilson has supported year in and year out in her over a decade in congress. she supported tax subsidies for exxon and mobil and conoco- phillips, companies that made over $100 billion in cumulative

profits last year. it is time to take those subsidies and put them to work on the jobs of the future. yes, i will continue to invest in geothermal, wind, solar, and all the jobs of the future. >> clearly, the outcome of this year's election will have a big impact on young people as they look to the future, so we asked a student to ask a question. joining us on the stage is valeria. i understand your concern about how to pay for college. as a father of college students, i share that concern. >> it is my understanding that the government involvement in pell grants has caused universities to raise tuition. to you -- do you support any programs that will help offset

loan amounts for students? >> i do support pell grants and i think they have been critical in the state of new mexico for many of our students, especially students who do not come from a family that has already benefited from higher education. in fact, when the ryan budget sought to eliminate enormous amounts of funding for pell grants, i offered an amendment to put funding back. and we paid for by cutting of administrative costs at the department of education, and yet all the republicans still voted no. we also kept the banks out of government loans to students, absolutely critical, because it saved so much money that we could put back into individual's education, making sure those loans were as low cost as possible instead of that money being siphoned off to the banks and put to work on wall street instead of in education. >> i strongly support pell

grants and always have. i think you have made a good point. every time a pell grant comes up, it seems like the cost of college goes up that much or more. i think our universities, particularly our public universities, need to spend more time looking at how to control the escalating cost of college. when i applied to college or when congress banned heinrich -- congressmen heinrich applied to college, the inflation rate is two or three times more than how much household incomes have gone up or minimum wage or the average salary. it is bracing people out of higher education. i think we need to look at how to control the costs, particularly in our public universities. >> this is a breath of fresh air

because we agree on something. we do need to make sure our public universities are really thinking about the decisions that they may, the investments, the infrastructure investments, what they are charging in terms of tuition, and making sure they are focusing what they are doing on their core mission, not trying to be everything to everyone. when they do that, it drives up the cost of tuition within those institutions. we can do a better job of keeping those costs down. it should be our job at the federal level to partner with our great institutions here in new mexico to make sure that is possible. >> heather, i think i owe you a rebuttal. >> i do not think i have too much more to say. i do think it is worth pointing out that there have been times when i opposed my own party with respect to education. one of the things that is going to create another american

century and keep us ahead of our competitors is to have a well educated citizenry. that in my view is one of the roles of government and something i am willing to support in the united states senate. >> as i mentioned at the top of the debate, we made time for the candidates to ask each other one question. martin, what is your question for heather? >> well, we talked a little bit about this already. obviously much of this whole national election cycle has hands-on social security and medicare. i told you a little bit -- hinged on social security and medicare. i told you how important it was for my family to be able to utilize those programs despite the fact that my parents worked hard, saved and invested. they still rely on social security to have the kind of middle-class retirement that they enjoy. my question is that the urgency

is not an doing -- if the urgency is not an doing the things that really put this into a deficit, what specific kind of changes would you suggest to social security? at one time, you said you were open to private accounts. today you say you are not. rather than just say a process and say trust me, i will tell you after the election, are there specific things you would want to change. >> with respect to your comment about -- if you're going to quote the, i would appreciate if he would be accurate. i did not say privatization. i said personalization. one thing we were discussing was there being an account with your name on it so it could not be used for something else. that is what i meant by personalization. as i said before, there are

principles the drive how i look at this. one is that those who are on social security today and in return -- near retirement should have the checks on time and in full. second, it should be a benefit program not a defined contribution program. third, starr was some symbols as a framework and a road map. -- start with some symbols as a framework and a road map. -- simpson bulls as a free market and a road map. owles as a framework and a roadmap. >> whether you call a privatization or personalization, it does not change what it is. what i am saying is we need to address the very serious fiscal

situation we have now, and we need to address the issues that our most urgent and pressing us toward a budget deficit that is unsustainable. i think we can do better than that. >> what that tells me is he either does not understand the social security is separate from the rest of the budget or that he believes it is ok to let it go down to zero. i think that is irresponsible. some of the actuaries running social security, all of whom are president obama appointees, said we need to address this as soon as possible.

there will be an automatic cut in benefits and it is easier to address this now than it would be 20 years from now or 15 years 10 years from now. we have to move forward and save social security for those on it today and those out in the future. >> heather wilson gets to ask martin heinrich a question. >> marilyn anderson owns two talk nobels in farmington, new mexico. -- taco bells in farmington, new mexico. when the economy went soft, she told her 75 employees that they would stay on. she would just cut profit. she told me she now lays awake at night that she is going to

have to lay off 25 employees to get down to the magic 50 number where she does not have to provide health insurance. who would you tell her to lay off? should it be the kids who are working there to pay for college? should it be last hired, first fired? should it be single parents who are dependent on that job? how would you tell her to handle it because of the health care act you forced on her. >> i am not going to give business advice not knowing the situation, but we did exempt small business employees of to -- small businesses up to 50 employees. new mexico has one of the highest uninsured rates in the nation. a father came up to me and said when my daughter comes of age,

she is not going to be able to get health insurance because she has epilepsy, a previous existing condition. my opponent said we could just send her to a high risk pool in the state. the high-risk pool does not accept people with epilepsy. >> heather, your rebuttal. >> two things. the high-risk pool covers a whole lot of people that if you have to be denied insurance, that is how you move to the high-risk pool. i have had this happen to friends and family. the insurance companies in new mexico routinely refer you over to the high-risk pool. but you failed to answer the question. this is a woman with a small business who has 75 employees. she has to lay off 26 people or put them back to part-time because of the health care act

you passed because there is not enough profit in the $0.99 tacos. her competition are the small businesses below that cut off. she has to lay them off and you're not taking responsibility. >> i think small businesses are critical, but so is people's health care. people should have access to health care. if that means i have to pay $1.10 for a talk show instead of $0.99, i will pay $1 -- for a i will pay that. we need to stand up for things that are hurting our state. we of children without health care. we have working people without health care. they get their primary care in the emergency room and we all get hit in our taxes because they get charged $10,000 for something that could have cost two hundred dollars. i think we can do better than that. >> we have come to the end of

this debate. each candidate will have one minute for a closing statement. martin heinrich, you go first. >> thank you, and thank you to all of you. my priorities are new mexico's priories, protecting social security and medicare, tax cuts for the middle class, keeping our promises to our veterans and making college more affordable. heather wilson has had all the wrong priorities. she supported and voted for the wall street bailout. she voted for the bush tax cuts that exploded our deficit and now wants to give more tax breaks to millionaires. and she supports a radical plan called cut, cap and balance that would require deep cuts to social security and medicare. let me be clear. balance ourr bu budget on the backs of our senior citizens. i come home nearly every weekend to meet with our citizens, hold job fairs and raise my family.

i always fought for the things that matter most to the people of new mexico. if you will give me a chance to serve in the u.s. senate, i will continue that fight and i will be honored to have your vote. [applause] >> heather wilson -- go-ahead and applaud. all right, let's move on. heather wilson, you have one minute for a closing statement. >> over the last four years, we have lost 30,000 jobs here in new mexico. the cost of groceries is up. the cost of gasoline is up. the cost of college education is through the roof. our household income on average has gone down $4,000 per household. congress then heinrich wants to put in a cap and trade system that will increase the cost of electricity and cost us in other 11,000 jobs. he wants to raise taxes on small

businesses, which will cost us another 4300 jobs here in new mexico. and he voted for the across-the- board defense cuts that would cost us 20,000 more jobs here in new mexico. i think we need a united states senator that will stand up and fight for the small businesses struggling with the tough decisions they have to make because of the lousy policies you have put into place and force them into. we need to get back to strong economic growth and job creation, and that is what i am going to do in the united states senate. [applause] >> thank you, audience, for holding your applause until the end. and thank you, you come out there, for joining us tonight for our debate. in 12 days, make your voice is heard. please vote.

we will see tonight on the news at 10:00. good night. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2012] >> now through election day, coverage of the presidential candidates, plus debates from key house and senate races from around the country. in a moment, a prayer service for the elite presidential candidate george mcgovern. he died sunday at the age of 90. then, a look at how the political campaign is shaping up in nevada. later, a debate between the u.s. senate candidates in ohio. >> you're watching live, one of 10,000 homes they are trying to

get rid of. these are houses that are never coming back. >> one family every 20 minutes moving out. >> these houses are disappearing from the landscape. press just recently, 164 firefighters were laid off as part of the downsizing, as part of the effort for mayor being to get the finances under control. firefighters, which detroit needs because it must have the highest case of arson in the country, have got laid off. about two weeks later, miraculously, about 100 guys are rehired. when you look where that money came from, it is the department of homeland security. there is a fund for things like that. i cannot want to overstate, but that is something you want to

think about. the department of homeland security needed to step in to keep detroit as safe as it could be for the moment. it could be a lot safer. we have seen the auto industry bailout. we have seen the bank bailout. are we heading into an era of bailout the cities. is there such a thing as a failed city? >> more with director heidi ewing sunday on q&a. >> george mcgovern died at sunday. joe biden was among the attendees at the press conference. ♪

♪ ♪

♪ ♪ >> the lord is the light of my

salvation. the lord is the stronghold of my life. of whom shall i be afraid. blessed be the lord. the lord is my strength and shield and whom my heart trusts. we are gathered this evening to give thanks to god for the gift of the life of george mcgovern. we asked to bring god's peace to his family and to each one of us present in this time of grief and loss. we gathered to remember the faithful and committed live, who shared his life and friendships with god, serving his country, and touching people's lives around the world. give we gather to open ourselves to god's comfort through the gift of prayer, music, and the gift of story that combines our

community together. this time i invite james doyle to open with a prayer. >> let's pray. my brothers and sisters, we believe that all the ties of friendship and affection which need us together throughout our eath. do not unravel with das confident dog always years and remembers the good we have done -- confident that god always hears and remembers the good we have done and forgives offenses, in our grief, we turn to you. are you not the god of love who opens your years to all -- your

ears to all? listen to our prayers. leave him to your kingdom of peace and count him among the saints in glory. he willingly gave yourself up to death so we might be saved. we humbly ask you to comfort your servants and handmade in their grief and to receive george into the arms of your mercy. you are the holy one, and you are mercy itself. you unlock the days of life for those who believe in you irrigated -- who believe in you.

for give george and grant him happiness, live, and peace in the kingdom of your glory forever and ever. amen. ♪ ♪ we say goodbye ♪ ♪ the rivers lay wide and dry as far as i can see ♪ foundone said marcos was

-- my ghost was found laying her burden down ♪ ♪ taking the long way around underneath the moon ♪ ♪ somewhere on the prairie ♪ mine ♪tle cross is marker with atle plastic rose intwined ♪ while thewilight tumbleweeds and whined ♪

scorpionawling like a ♪ town ♪ss the melancholy tehra chasing -- while the birds chasing ♪ ♪ let them make their nests, put those dreams to rest ♪ ♪ spread across the golden west ♪ ♪ i was the fragrance in the wild fire on -- wild flower ♪

in the delicate hours ♪ 10,000 years from now ♪ ♪ you will put your hand in mine ♪ ♪ full of melancholy teimes ♪ ♪ we use to go where raven's fly ♪ ♪ our laughter made angels cryi ♪ to fly as free as you and i ♪

♪ somewhere on the prairie ♪ across a road, a shrine ♪ ♪standing for true love ♪gone before its time ♪ there goes your shadow down the highway ♪ ♪of the road i could not find ♪i crawl like a scorpion ♪slowly to the new world

♪ melancholy times ♪ ♪ [applause] ♪ >> tonight i accept your

nomination with a full and grateful heart. [applause] in the scripture and music of our children we are told to everything there is a season and a time to every purpose under heaven, and for america, the time has come at last. we are entering a new time of the important and hopeful change in america. we must show that peace and prosperity can exist side by side. each now depends on the existence of the other. national strength improves the credibility of our system in the eyes of our own people as well as the credibility in the eyes of others abroad.

national security include school for our children as well as silos for our missiles. it includes the health of our family as much as the size of our bombs, the safety of our city, and if we choke on the pollution of our error, there will be little confirmation. let us form a more perfect union at home, and now is the time. we do not rally for the support of policies and we deplore.

we do love this country, and we will continue to beckon it to a higher standard. i asked all of you tonight to stand with your conviction. i asked you not to despair of the political process of this country. the nation will be better because we never gave up the long battle to renew its oldest ideals and to redirect its current energy along more humane and hopeful perhaps, -- paths, so let's play familiar words i quoted so frequently. they that wait upon the lord shall renew their strength.

they shall not be weary. god bless you. [applause] >> thank you for acknowledging. this is one of george mcgovern 's favorite bands. he talked about these folks all the time. thank you all so much for your incredible gift of music to this ceremony.

mr. vice president, on behalf of the mcgovern family and on behalf of the broader family of south dakota, thank you for being here and showing your respect to our native son. [applause] about three weeks ago i had the privilege i have had routinely for the last three years to enjoy a meal with my friend george mcgovern, and i tell you this by way of an introduction and now to the next speaker.

i went to lunch with senator mcgovern, and we started talking about the liberator, the decoder queen, and of course, he flew 35 missions. the only reason he only threw 35 missions is because the war ended. he would have flown more, but he flew in a number of different planes, and he named them all the other co the queen. always they have the same name, and i said to him, i have an idea. let's buy the dakota clean, restore it, and put it in front of dozens mcgovern library. what an attraction it would be. he said, i have a story to tell you. he said at the end of the war he

had been instructed to catch the latest plane he had flown, the bullet holes, and fly it back in as pristine condition as he could manage, and so he did that, and then he went back to mitchell, and he started to teach and did not think much about the echo to a queen, and one time they sat in the fifth row. this newsreel was about what happened to the bombers in world war ii after they came back, specifically the be twenty- four's known as liberators, and they look at the screen as they watched and learned there is a place called of boneyard where these airplanes went after they had been crushed, and he looked

at the news real, and the nose of the dakota queen came up as it was being crushed, and he stopped and turned to me and said, i believe i can locate the queen, but she is not prepared for display. the president of george mcgovern costs, mulder, bob was at his bedside i think every time, boosting his spirits, giving him a reason to hope. bob is a great leader, not only for george mcgovern's institution but for all of south dakota. would you share your remembrances? [applause]

>> the city of mitchell, all of you in the state of south dakota lost a dear friend. george mcgovern died early sunday morning this past week. as a congressman and a senator and a democratic candidate for the presidency in 1972, he gained international fame. three talents all grounded in the soil of south dakota may account for his meteoric rise. george was a bright man. this was a gift of a birth, yet he developed this by reading and writing two habits that

sharpens intellect. what nature gave, and george developed. by his own admission, george was very shy, not the type of person attracted to debates or politics, yet through the one, he found the other. a teacher suggested this painfully shy boy joined the extroverted the great team. he flourished and became a nationally renowned college debater. later as a professor of history, he was our debate coach as well. love of history is his third

talent, and from my perspective, this was his best talent. it set him apart from almost every other politician. he knew anything surely that any contemporary problem or crisis had factors. george is no pacifist. he knew evil sometimes exists, and what is -- war is no way to counter it. he was against the war in vietnam because the vietnamese sought independence and autonomy. his study of history gave him

this inside. it was his religious faith that brought together these three talents. the methodist church of his father called people to personal faith and activated them to do something useful in the world. the useful part derived from the universal moral imperatives from the sunday school lessons and stories he learned as a youth like feed the hungry, " the naked, -- clothe the naked, learn war no more. he carried a reticence about personal faith, but he lifted

our moral vision and some in society to a higher ethical plane. some say george was the greatest humanitarian and peacemaker of our era. this is why we honor him by naming our library and a museum for him. it all began here in south dakota, yet his impact had a worldwide involvement. jesus's words may best be a fitting epithet for his life. blessed are the peacemakers.

they are the sons of god. [applause] >> i would like to thank the honor garnered, the south dakota highway patrol, the air national guard for the respect they paid to one of our beloved veterans of world war ii. the one thing we know is that george mcgovern always from his days wearing the

country's uniform to the early party building efforts, all the way through to just a few weeks ago at the south dakota and symphony orchestra, a george always knew it was not about him he regarded it was about the causes of the brought people together, people with a passion to commit themselves to making a difference, to improving the human condition, and he knew it expanded across many generations in the country. it did in mine. it did in a lot of the families i see this evening, and it was always such a blessing to feel you are part of this legacy, and

he made you feel that way. i see the vice president is joined by hunter biden, and when i see my contemporaries, like hunter, who is head of food organization, and the head of international development, and i am sure each of us will cherish the times we have had with george mcgovern in person and on the phone, and we got to share his sense of humor as he shared his experiences to inspire those us to seize opportunities to alleviate hunger and malnutrition, and from that 1972 campaign, this is brain power

that was drawn to be part of that campaign. each of whom had a chance to get to know the mcgovern family, to know what he stood for, and as my good friend and would say, the credentials to go out and to do good in the world, so whether it is directly for us to get the words of wisdom directly from george mcgovern for those who like marshall or the individual i am going to interview in just a moment, they were empowered through those experiences the understanding to share with the and georgeation common-l,

knows they have an obligation to keep doing the same, because that is the legacy of this great man that will endure. we are so pleased that someone who has made sure of legacy and the commitment to civil rights, standing up for social justice and doing it throughout the course of his lifetime could serve as the national finance director, doing through direct mail what we are now entering through youtube and the internet through communicating and fund raising but then taking that experience to make a difference, as an advocate for social justice.

i would invite the founder of share hisenter to sara remembrances. [applause] >> thank you so much for the kind words. in a big way. he is a spokesperson for the southern law party center for over 40 years. tonight and tomorrow, you'll hear a lot about senator mcgovern. i want to talk to you about what many spend one year working for him in 1972. the thing that will go down as

his legacy. it was his fight against the war in vietnam. george mcgovern spoke truth to power. he probably made one of the most courageous speeches and the united states senator, may be any politician ever made in 1970 in the well of the united states senate and i want to read you a couple words from that speech. every senator in this chamber is partially responsible for sending 50,000 americans to the grave. this chamber reeks of blood. every senator here is partially responsible for the human records at walter reed in bethesda and across our nation and our land, a young man

without legs or arms or genitals or faces or hope. after he made that speech, several senators approached him angrily and said, you personally offended us. and he said, "i intended to." george mcgovern was not a loser of that election. the american people or the loser -- were the loser because we did not heed his message. when barack obama was elected, the first thing since -- george mcgovern did was urge him to immediately end the war in iraq and afghanistan and he did not heed that message.

the last book that senator mcgovern wrote was, "what it means to be a democrat." i will always treasure that. -- the inscription in the book to my wife susan and i. 200 people gathered. we talked about his book. in a book that should be required reading and i see you nodding your head out there. this is the time for us to heal our nation and to deliver on her promises as we see it. the republic that is good to all. he said, it is not for nothing that i go to my grave believing that our country is one of the

greatest countries honors. he did something very unusual. he invited millions of americans to make small contributions to his campaign, the first time that had been done because no wealthy donors would support him. i had the honor of being his finance chairman, fundraiser, my dear friend jeff smith here and i worked hard getting those letters out. and on the first page it was the ending of that letter which he incorporated. he said any time -- the ancient words of ecclesiastes, to everything there is a season,

and to every purpose and to the heavens. i believe this is the time to heal, time to build up, a time to cast away the stones of four and gather the stones for building. a time to speak, not a time for peace. i got a call to come because they said george might not live much longer. we went down and he took is out to dinner and as we stood at the door going away, he said, boys, i'm going to live to be 100. i got 10 more years because i got a lot of things to do. well, joyce, it is a time for you to rest. because we will heed your

message. and to paraphrase shakespeare and romeo and juliet, bubba cannady did this also. at his children -- a eulogy for his brother. and i will paraphrase shakespeare and maybe he will forgive me. i pray that the angels shall take you, george mcgovern, and cut you up into little stars. so sprinkle you in heaven's that the world will be in love with the night. amen. [applause]

♪ i am a pilgrim and a stranger ♪ ♪ traveling through this wear isome land ♪

♪ i've got a home in that yonder city ♪ ♪and it's not made by hands father, sister, and a brother ♪ ♪ i'm returning to go and see them ♪ shore're on that distant ♪ ♪

♪ as i go down to that river of jordan ♪ [indiscernible]

would make me whole ♪ ♪ i am a pilgrim and a stranger ♪ ♪ traveling through this wearisome land ♪ made by hands ♪ [applause]

>> george mcgovern may have been the most modest and gracious human being that any of us have ever known. he and jim had an interest and politics and baseball. jim abner coached the team and george mcgovern love this in los crowells -- loved the st. louis cardinals. he lost two races, against richard nixon and the race for the u.s. senate. he is probably the most gracious and modest person any of us have ever known and that is true. he got a lot of attention. bob dole wrote a letter to the near times talking about the

fact that george mcgovern and attended panics and's funeral. no one was more surprised than richard nixon when george mcgovern showed up. what a lot of people do not know is george mcgovern of's passion for baseball also involved going to our minor league team. as matt mcgovern will tell you, when he would drive his grandpa to the canaries games, he would village.s go by t andhhe he picked up jim adler. the guy who beat him in the fourth race. this gracious, humble giant of a man insisted they pick him up and taken to the baseball game. not once but several times and it would sit there together and enjoy baseball. a common love, two giants of the

prairie. i would love to hear you tell that story. it is so wonderful. in politics of today, how does someone like that come to be? he set an example for other leaders in the prairie. leaders like tom daschle. hubert humphrey, a leader vice- president of the united states. all really mastered the art of leadership, of standing tall. it did not just extend to elected leaders. the vice president would be the first to attest to that. it is my privilege to introduce one of the real giants of that

trade. steve gillibrand was not only the 2000 i was chairman for the gore campaign but the deputy national campaign manager for the obama-bijan campaign. he is a giant in this profession and has been a stalwart for the mcgovern family for all this time. i ask hildy to come up and visit with us. >> i am so humbled to be here. this could be hard. i will never forget your invitation to join your family's hospital facility -- hospice facility to be with our hero. my family is like millions of

american families and probably millions of families all over the world. we do not even know who needed george mcgovern's advocacy to make it to the middle class. i groped the youngest of this nine kids. my father died when i was 7 -- when i was 5, leaving seven of us at home. he was never talked about around the dimon -- dinner table. we were democrats because the democrats fought for us. it was george mcgovern and his advocacy for programs like student loans and killed and several of my family to go to school. it was social security and medicare that helped my mother along the way. when i was 10, i remember my mom

taking us down in front of the corn palace for the mcgovern for president rally. i got to shake his hand. what was 18 rajoy from high school and heading into south dakota state, george was in the last race for the u.s. senate. and now loss is what has solidified it. i was never going to put my life on hold and not help candidates who are going to fight for people like my family. that was a tough race. it was a tough loss. but it made the decision for me to go advocate for people like george mcgovern. have had forhonor i 26 years working for tom daschle and al gore and bill

clinton, joe biden, barack obama. george mcgovern pave the way for this. there is a couple of us that once in awhile get in trouble in this room for speaking more than we probably should. one of them -- with george mcgovern taught me more than anything else was you speak your mind. were politicians of both sides should learn more from george mcgovern. he taught us that you work hard and you work together to get things done. his advocacy with bob dole and so many others that things accomplished in this country and

we're not there anymore. there is a song that i listened to constantly probably more than i should, i listened to it over and over again that there is a line in it about joye and renewal. that is what i get out of george mcgovern. i get a tremendous amount of joy and personal time together for stories. he never stopped advocating for main street and mitchell. he would come into my restaurant and there he was, he would say steve, we're going to do about mitchell? we have to fix up that main street. this is such a great time for renewal. we could look at things differently. by reflecting on his life and everything he advocated for an all day long today, people have come through this church, modest

people, famous people, it did not really matter. it would stop and tell their stories about george mcgovern. the sky and 90 never stopped. he never stopped helping advocating, writing, speaking. what an amazing person and i am so proud to be a friend of his and to have a chance to be so close friends with susan and and and other members of the family. thank you. >> george so loved eleanor. we all have been privileged to hear the stories that george would share over the years about eleanor.

so many of the stories he would leave in the wisdom, the care, the love that eleanor shared with him with their children, with their grandchildren. george mcgovern near the importance of having strong women on your side. when george was out there, a grassroots, building the democratic party in south dakota, articulating a vision about the importance of two parties putting ideas on the table for boaters to evaluate, he inspired so many but this dynamic group of women in south dakota who knew what it took to implement that vision, to build the foundation, the infrastructure to get that job done. and boy, to introduce our next

guest to share remembrancer, stories about her proceed her because of the type of anchor she is. someone who knows what needs to be done and officially goes about getting the job done in a caring, compassionate, reliable, understanding why. someone who is part of pioneering the party building that was so essential in our state. that worked side-by-side with george mcgovern and his family, continued to be such a close friend and part of that family and a confidant. someone we now that is a metric of the south dakota democratic party, particularly here in ssu falls -- sioux falls.

bernice mayer. could you come up here and share. [applause] >> i used to have to do this for eleanor. and susan. thank you for the honor of being part of this evening. as we remember your father, george mcgovern. there were times when we took your father way from new. sometimes we took her father and her mother. sometimes we needed to meld ourselves as unobtrusively as possible with your family.

to you, he was your father, your grandfather, and great- grandfather, and a sister-in- law. to the rest of the world, he was an inspirational, dedicated, and honest public official. there are more than 24 senate staff members and callous campaign staff gathered here tonight. most of us have worked as volunteers for the democrats before we became staff members. we did this because we believed in the senator's vision. we admired his courage, and most will, we cared about the same kind of people he did. we shared a common interest in public issues in expressing them to the public and in helping promote the candidacy of the person we respected and loved.

in november of 1963, i attended the convention of the national association of mental health in washington, d.c. our group met with the junior senator for south dakota, george mcgovern. he hosted us for lunch in the senate dining room. halfway through the mail, a signal was sent for all the senators to report to the floor. that date was november 22, 1963. the day that john kennedy was shot. shortly thereafter, i received a letter from local democrats inviting me to talk about issues and how to address them. i remember bill tell me about my to promote my issues i need to find a candidate to promote them. and then get the votes to elect

them. of course, bill was right. political activity began in 1964 with the secretary of the local county democratic party. in 1965, a gathering of local democrats were at the door. federal office holders were allowed to participate in partisan politics. the group included judge francis done, judge fred, both of whom had been appointed by president kennedy. none of another member was mike sherman who served as the first campaign chairman in 1956. he was later elected the mayor of ssu fallsioux falls. much of the heavy lifting was done by his chief of staff. his son christopher is here with us tonight. judy harrington arrived in

1973. she said of constituent field offices in six cities. one person per office. in those days, we shared an office with the staff. i went to work and the senate staff in 1975. i was privileged to be a member of the state staff and it was special and the senator was back in state. he enjoyed driving my buick regal, speeding down the road, smoking a cigar with the window down. a typical day was spent going to scotland to visit the consol plant. we then drove north on highway 37 10 miles south. he said he was short of cash. this was before picard's an atm

's. -- credit cards and atm's. he filled out a counter check and the banker gave him the money. we motored on to mitchell where his family was waiting at their lake home. at another time, ralph morse, the president of the local trade and labor assembly stopped at the office to arrange. ralph stop by often to drink coffee and chat. he looked out the window and he saw my car, a red honda. it was parked in the parking lot. he told me i could not bring the senator to the label -- the labor temple in a foreign car. i could not part in their parking lot. i assured him would not. we would park on fairfax avenue out on the street which we did. this year in august we had a

gathering to celebrate the senator's 90th birthday. i told the center, i came to his 90th party because he had come to my 80th party last year. his quick response was he would come to my 90th and he invited me to come to his 100th birthday. i was privileged to spend time with him and his family, the last five days of his life. the first morning, a man i am working close entered the visitor area. he introduced himself told us he was the man who handled his luggage at the airport. he came to pay his respects. i saw the flowers and letters that came. envelopes addressed to the hon. senator.

and others just plain to george. the postmarks were from vermilion, washington, d.c., ariz., colorado, iowa. some cards but mostly were handwritten letters. a special interest to me was the back of an envelope. someone drew a big red heart with the message, from your waitress. this was the face of those who call him their senator. these were his people, may he rest in peace. [applause] >> we're going to sing together

the song that ann said george thought should be the national anthem. please turn to page 696 and we will sing, "america the beautiful." ♪ o beautiful for spacious skies for amber waves of grain for purple mountain majesties above the fruited plain

america, america god shed his grace on thee and crown thy good with brother hood from sea to shining sea ♪

♪ o beautiful for heroes proved in liberating strife who more than self their country loved and mercy more than life america, america may god thy gold refine

till all success be nobleness and every gain divine for patriot dream that sees beyond the years mhine alabaster cities glea undimmed by human tears america, america god shed his grace on thee

and crown thy good with brotherhood from sea to shining sea ♪ >> the senator held the office in south dakota for 22 years against strong odds in the early races, and then gating the trust of his constituents to win by larger margins. we know in the middle of that career and elected office, one of the most tumultuous times of our country's history in the 70's.1960's and early 7 1970

the college campuses, the jungle of vietnam. they say -- they share stories to us about that time. the uncertainties they were experiencing as 18-year-olds. my father and stepfather came of age during that time. my husband came of age during that time. two other great public servants in the great state of south dakota came to age at that time. both of them follow senator mcgovern's footsteps it to serve

in elective office. senator johnson. both of them during their years of public life have made some of the same commitments to agriculture, to working families, to veterans. and we learned a lot from both of them. we benefited from their service. someone who came of age during that time and his own son served in our more modern wars, who i had the honor of learning from as an intern at his office.

a hero of mine, someone who has the same states men-like qualities as senator mcgovern, the key middle -- the humility that marks the type of leadership great people take. i would like to welcome senator johnston to share in remembrance. -- senator johnson to share in remembrance. [applause] >> thank you, stephanie.

tonight, we are here to celebrate the life of george mcgovern, a man many of us called friend, in a small -- and a small group calls grant but, dad, uncle, brother, or cousin. to all of the family members who loved him so deeply, thank you. no that you are all in the hearts and prayers -- in our hearts and prayers. when i think of george, i think of a man of uncompromising integrity who dedicated his life to serving our state and our country. as you read numerous prints this

is --ek, this since -- the south dakota symphony a few weeks ago. he was one of the last people to leave the auditorium at night as he took time to shake hands and talk with his many friends and supporters. physically frail, his love for people was as great as ever. like my brother, my mother, .eorge was a preacher's kid i recall from my mother's memory is that it was not always easy. george often talked about growing up not only as a methodist pk who could not

attend movies, but also a child of the depression, living in a small parsonage that shared all they had with those in the congregation who had even less. this background provided the foundation for his deep sense of morality and social justice. it was a force that led him to be an advocate for feeding the hungry. pursuing the cause of freedom as a world war ii fighter pilot, and after seeing the devastation of war, he returned rest of hisnd the wes life working for internet -- on international conflicts. you need faith.

people can make a region in order to make a good and moral decision. george had that faith. is life of moral and intellectual literature has made it easier. although he was one of the most prominent leaders of the democratic party, one of the features i most admired in george was his belief that good and moral decisions extended in both parties. it led to his lifelong friendships with statesman bob dole, with whom he formed a deep friendship, and with a conservative commentator, with whom he delighted in debating

the issues of the 90's -- the 1990's, whether they were in public, nationally televised, or over a drink. one of our -- in one of our last conversations, we talked about today's leaders who forgot to often the importance of respect, corporation, and compromise for the survival of democracy. with all of these accomplishments, perhaps is a racist -- his greatest is his marriage. i will never forget the opening of the library, which eleanor was too sick to attend.

he touched a statue of her with him as they sit together throughout their lives. they are now reunited and with two other children, they lived a life that a great methodist leader admonish temple when he said, -- admonish him, when he said, do all the good you can. by all means you can. and all the way you can. in all the places you can. at all the times you can. to all the people you can, as long as ever you can. i now have the honor to

introduce a leader i deeply respect. a man who also with drew inspiration from the life of his close friend, george mcgovern. our vice president, joe biden. [applause] >> thank you very much. thank you. thank you. dan and susie, and all the great grandchildren and grandchildren.

you all had such an intimate relationship with george for so many years. i have to tell you that my son and i are genuinely honored to be here. somebody said to me in the middle of a campaign, how can you be here? where i come from, the question is how can you not be here? how can you not be here for a man who did so much for some many people -- so many people? i am here with my colleagues, jim, you crazy son of a gun. [laughter] [applause] i love you. jim and i served together. we became friends right away.

we are both nouts. we say what is on our minds. all the years i worked in the united states senate, and tim, your courage, you have such incredible courage and character. [applause] stephanie, thank you for helping hunter get through georgetown. [laughter] you really screwed him up. he went to yale. it bothered me a lot. it is good to see you, old buddy. you are still punching. thank you for the help. 1980 was a tough year. a real tough year. in 1980, we lost gaylord

nelson, we lost george mcgovern, we lost the heart, soul, and spine of the united states senate i have joined. the speech you heard george giving, i remember like you do, but maybe from a different perspective. i was a 29-year-old kid. i was a senate nominee from the state of delaware. at my first convention. sitting there, men summarized -- mesmerized by the man who was speaking. much too late in the night, but speaking. i ran with your father in 1972. i was not old enough to serve. i got elected when i was 29.

i had to wait to be eligible to be sworn in. i not only served with your father in the senate from 1972 to 1980. i kept contact with your father and, to my great good fortune, he kept contact with me. i admired him from the day i became aware of him to the day he died. his face in his speech, we do love this country, i do not know anybody who love this country -- loved this country more than george mcgovern. i tried to get a nomination and i was not successful as he was in 1988. i used to end my speeches in the same style from the george

mcgovern speech in 1972 but with a different phrase. it is a him in the roman catholic church. he will raise you up on eagle's wings and make the sun to shine upon you. that was my notion of the country and the obligation we had that i had learned from george mcgovern. our function in public life was to raise people up on eagles' wings. and let the sun shine upon them. if we did, the one thing i shared from my family upbringing with george mcgovern was i had never had a doubt i am

more optimistic today than when we were elected, i am never optimistic than i was now to shed a little light in the dark corners of this country. the american people respond. they are capable of anything given half a chance. that is maybe what jeff and i -- i have not seen you in a while -- but we were attracted to george mcgovern for the same reason i got involved in public life in my state as a kid. my state was segregated by law in the state of delaware. i got involved in a civil rights movement. i was no congressman louis. i was picketing and marching to desegregate our movie theaters and working on the east side of my city. .t was the dog's

call toorge mcgovern justice to end the war in vietnam to help to shape my political sensibilities -- helped shape my political sensibilities. i will leave you with that and line. he said, i am fed up with my years -- to my ears with old man dreaming up wars for young men to die in. -- old men dreaming up wars for young men to die in. [applause] he not only spoke for our generation, he spoke for our

souls. i still feel the same way. i marvel at the courage. every time any event or historical footnote reminds you of that moment, that speech, i think, as tom and jim and anyone who served in the house of senate can tell you, particularly in the senate, what incredible political courage and gumption and it took to make that speech before the senate. the only thing i shared different with my friend who served is i suffered from having served their longer than all the 13 people in american history. [laughter] an't that a hell of indictment? [laughter] excuse me.

[laughter] [applause] the reason i mention it if i had been there for 36 years. you have no idea the institutional unintended but intended pressure that everything from the walls to the marble, this feeling preying upon those of us who served to -- the hardest thing to do is to actually confront the body of women and out of line. ouare it takes remarkable political courage. can you imagine anyone doing that?

i think to myself, and i remember as a kid, a young man, the phrase, this chamber reacts with blood -- reeks with blood. the only speech i ever heard that came close to that was a iowan, a speech onenan capital punishment which was similarly profound. i always thought to myself, if i ever got there, and i was not thinking at the time, but as i ran, i hope and pray i have that kind of courage. i tell you what courage i did draw from george mcgovern.

i come from a family not like most of you, i suspect. a typical middle-class family, three bedrooms, four kids. gramm redeyes, grandpa moves in, and it's and uncles -- aunts and uncles. it was great for the kids. probably hard for mom and dad. [laughter] i am the first united states senator i ever knew. [laughter] it was literally true until i ran. other than my opponent, i am the first united states senator i knew in my family. it is a typical american story. people say to me now and i wonder now, what ever gave you

the courage as a 29-year-old kid to announce to the united states senate against a man who had an 82% favorable rating, in the year where we knew it would be tough, senator mcgovern knew it would be tough, it was solidly red, overwhelmingly republican, but gave you the courage to run? some thought that made you so foolhardy. the answer is your father. i did not know him but i believed i could maybe go help him and the war. i honestly believed it.

what an incredible privilege it was to serve withi him. i remember what frank church, i was on the foreign relations committee, the young kid on it. serving with your dad. we got a notice that dr. kissinger was coming to an executive section, that meant the private section, before we have for 07 in the senate foreign relations with a big conference table. it looks like a table in the over all this, it to old office, excuse me, cabinet room. looked like a table in the

oval office, excuse me, cabinet room. he did not say anything and everybody thank them. -- thanked him. i said, he did not say anything. i said, we should have the president come up and tell us. [laughter] jack saicalledorget sai down and arranged that afternoon for us to go down in the president, gerald forward, kissinger, and the whole team. as we were walking in, your

father turned to me and said, i like you. [laughter] [applause] the irony is i am taking too much of your time. i apologize. the irony is the chair i sit in now as vice president is the chair directly across from the president. in the middle of the conference table, facing inward, and i face in the middle. based on seniority, you can see when you attend a cabinet meeting, it is not the cabinet itself. the most junior members sit with the price president sets. i was sitting there -- sits where the vice president sits. i was sitting there. it got to me and i will never

forget how nervous i was. i look at president ford and said, i beg the president's pardon, but i am sure if the president were in my position, the president would ask the president migh questiony. -- my question. [laughter] i said, with all due respect, you have not told us anything. with that, the president turned and said, henry, tell him. that was the first time it was decided we were not going to try to sustain our presence. it was five weeks later helicopters were taking off the roof. not because of me. that was the plan. the point was, i remember

walking out of their thinking, i was right -- there thinking, i was right. i got to go to washington and the with george mcgovern and play a little tiny part. people do not realize had your father not been there, had your father never been in the senate, so much more blood and some much more treasure would have been wasted. the war would have never ended when it did. it would never have ended how it did. your father gave courage to people who did not have the courage to speak up to finally stand up. your father stood there and took all of that beating. your father who was characterized by these right wing guys as a coward and unwilling to fight. your father was a genuine hero. the irony is to make the so

angry -- used to make me so angry at your father would never speak up and talk about his heroism. your father had more courage, physical courage, in his little finger, than 95% of those guys. they continue to fight a war we should not have fought in the first place. because he took such a miserable beating, even though he did not win that election, he won the end of the war. it would never have happened. the other thing your father did, which will not go on spoken -- unspoken. his instinct for decency

transformed my party. unrelated for the war. opened it to women, young people, minorities. he is the father of the modern democratic party. your father is the father of the modern democratic party. [applause] that is a fact. that is a fact. i am proud to be a member of it. [applause] i was determined not to become emotional about this. [laughter] i had more to say here but i will skip it. let me just end by saying this.

my dad had a great expression. he would say, you have got good blood, kid. just remember whenever you are down, think of literally hundreds of thousands of people who are alive today because of your father and the lesson he brought back. everybody brought back different lessons. but your father brought back the lesson of seeing the italian women and children searching through garbage pails and decided he was going to make part of his life to end hunger in the world. you said you hope that there is

a threat of connection that continues to tie us half -- thread of connection that continues to tie us. my son, hunter. kid,your dad when he was a a little boy when i got elected. he had the good fortune of knowing your dad and being able to work with your dad. today, hunter is the chairman of reorganization that exists only because of your father. to fight hunger, feeding hundreds of thousands of millions of people around the world and teaching them to feed themselves. the world food program usa is

your dad's. i cannot tell you how proud i am of my son. proud because that thread, the same thing that brought me into politics, and that's my son to your dad, and, in turn, my son to you. the idea your grandfather must have smiled knowing my son is holding a fund-raiser for you. [laughter] i know this sounds corny but i cannot tell you how much joy that gives me. it makes me believe -- we irish catholics believe there is that thread. it does run.

so, folks, george mcgovern did what probably no more than two hands full of men and women have ever done in the history of this country. he summoned the public life. he's inspired a whole generation, literally, of leaders to get engaged in the '60s -- in the 1960's. many people in the room tonight and so many in washington and capitals all over the country, people who served with passion, conscience, conviction, and they literally, not figuratively, got started because of george mcgovern and the courage to stand up and holler for jusitce.

-- justice. he summoned thousands of people who now summon new people. think about it. all kidding aside. think about it. maybe more than a handful of other women and men in american public life who had such a general right -- a generational impact. it was a great honor to serve with your dad. it was a great honor to know your dad. it was a great complement one that told me his grand pop watched my debate with paul ryan and said, i want to call joe. [laughter] [applause] i appreciate it. it means a lot.

maybe one of only two irish catholics in this church. i will have to rely on you to testify what i am about to say is true. the highest compliment irish catholics can give to another man or woman, literally, my grandpa used to say, a complement i paid to your dad, george mcgovern was a good and decent man. [applause]

>> thank you so much for honoring us with your presence. it is a privilege to introduce some of that good blood, my friend, matt mcgovern. [applause] >> i want to thank everyone for coming tonight. i will tell a couple stories. we all heard the great job titles we all -- he always had from the other speakers. we always called him grandpa george. i was out there earlier this week. someone asked me, what are your earliest memories of your grandfather? to me, when i was thinking back to being a tiny little kid, i think about that big smile on his face when we would come to the door to visit him at his

house and he would greet us with a big hug and a big smile and he would say, look who is here. he would make us feel great. i see everyone else laughing along in the front row because they know what i am talking about. this picture is one of my favorite pictures of my grandma and grandpa. they are looking down at my cousin, tim, when he was a little kid back in 1972. you could see the smile and warmth that came from the both of them. i would say i feel likely to be part of this family -- lucky to be part of this family. i feel very fortunate i was able to have him here for 90 years. i have friends in elementary school who did not have their grandparents at all. i was lucky to have grandparents 40. into my 20's, 30's, now

we miss him but i feel lucky to have happened -- had him around. we would go on christmas and he would visit us. a couple times during the years. there was a lot of fun. i remember a lot from the 1980-senate race. going to every campaign rally, fares, rodeos, -- fairs, rodeos, . it was a great year. a graded venture to be with my grandpa. a lot of times, it was just my grandpa and me. it seems now that i am older and ave worked on other s'

campaigns, a lot of times, it would just be he would be driving me somewhere off to a rally and he would point to something, and would say, do you see those trees? back in the dust bowl, farmers were going broke and franklin roosevelt came in and changed all that. that is the way he would talk to us about public policy. he would always have a story behind it and how it would help people. he once said, being in politics is the best profession because you can either do the most good or the most harm for people. it is obvious which one he chose to go to. for him, it was always about helping people and there was always a story behind it. in 1980, i was 8 years old, and we would go to help stuff envelopes and help in any way we could. one day, he came to the office

and he had a smile on his face like he was about to get away with something. he said, do you want to go on the airplane? i said, yes. of course. we drove down to the airport. we got a plane and flew off to somewhere in west river. i do not know where we were. it was me and him. a big adventure. he made it a lot of fun for us to see the look of horror on my mom's basface. [laughter] i remember another night, we would go to a dinner, made out of white fish. to kids, especially, i do not think it takes that great. [laughter] -- tastes that great. [laughter] he dropped us off at a amw with

a $20 bill. we loaded up on chili dogs, onion rings, and root beer floats. we spend every last penny we could at the vending machines for candy and toys. that was a lot of fun for us. probably not so much for everyone else on the campaign that night. but a lot for us. he tried to make things fun for us. as i got older, he took us to disney world a couple of times. i made an offhand remark about the space shuttle launching soon. he made it happen for us. he had a little bit of pole. he would use it to spoil his -- pull. he would use it to spoil his grandkids. he would continue to do that throughout our lives. he had the common sense that is hard to argue with and that great sense of humor he always had. one time, i guess i was about

28, and i was deciding whether or not to go to law school. he said i should go. and the grand warrant -- grandparent would tell their grandchild. i said, we are not done. i will be -- when i am done, i will be 32 years old. he said, you will turn 32 in a matter what. do you want to be 32 with a law degree or not? [laughter] he had the common sense it is hard to argue with. i went to law school. i was fortunate enough, when i finished law school, i came here to south dakota and it was great to spend more time with rapid george, both as an adult's -- grandpa george and, as an adult, you realize no one lives forever. some of my favorite things would be driving him places because he needed rides and i was always

happy to oblige, except some of those 5:00 and trips to the airport were not a lot of fun. i do not complain now. i remember one time, this is just maybe this summer, we were driving from mitscher to sioux falls, and it was late at night and dark out. he looked out the window and said, look out there. look at all the lights out .here whe when i was a kid, there weren't that many lights. " franklin roosevelt changed that. [laughter] again, he was talking about politics and bringing life to places where there were not any. it is hard to imagine today, but he remembered the day where there was not any electricity and he was not shy about having

public policy come in and fix that. one last story about driving, this is maybe two winters ago. a bitterly cold winter. he decided he wanted to go back. it was sometime in january. you know when you get out to the interstate in the winter, the wind blows your car to the side. my little car feels like it can blow into the ditch. the interstate was not close, but there was a travel advisory. do not to any non-essential travel. mike gravel of wanted to go -- my grandpa wanted to go. the car was blowing to the side. i said, this weather is terrible today. he was never one to brag about his service in world war ii. ever. except this one time. [laughter]

he was a great storyteller. it was one reason he was so successful in politics. sometimes he would slow it down a little bit to make a point. you had to listen. he started to talking really slowly. he said, matthew, when i was in the war, a lot of times, we had to fly in bad weather. you would get out there behind the cockpit and you would have 20,000 pounds of bombs in the plan and another -- plane and fuel. the weather was so bad, you could not see the end of the runway. you just had to go. that was the end of his story. [laughter] i thought, i guess i will not complain about the weather any more. he had been through much worse. i will wrap it up there. if anyone else from the family wants to tell more stories?

anyone else who is next? [applause] [laughter] >> thank you very much. before we have another song and a benediction, i want to announce the doors will open at the pavilion at 11:00 tomorrow morning. the service will be at 1:00 p.m. and then there will be refreshments on the second floor at 2:00 p.m. and you are all invited. we look forward to seeing you all there. one more song.

♪ your landland is this land is my land from california to the new york island from the west -- from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and me the ie shadow of

steeple by the relief office i saw my people as they stood hungry, i stood there wondering if this land was made for you and me as i went walking that ribbon of highway and saw above me that endless sky way and saw below me the holdrgolden valley this land was made for you and me ♪ please join us. ♪ this land is your land

this land is my land. from california to the new york island from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and me when the sun came shining, then i was strolling in wheat fields waving and dust clouds rolling the voice was chanting as the fog was lifting this land was made for you and me this land is your land this land is my land

from california to the new york island from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and me god bless america for me this land is your land this land is my land from california to the new york island from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you eneand me

this land was made for you any this land is your land this land is my land from california to the new york island from california to the redwood redwood foresthe to the gulf stream waters as land was made for you and me

on that sign, no trespassing on the other side, it did not say nothing that sign was made for you and me. this land is your land this land is my land from california to the new york island from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and me ♪ one more time. ♪ this land is your land this land is my land from california to the new york island from the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and me

this land was made for you and me this land was made for you and ♪ ♪ [applause] >> funeral services for 1972 democratic presidential nominee george mcgovern will be held tomorrow in sioux falls, south dakota. now through election day, watching our coverage of the presidential candidates, plus the dates from house, senate, a run the country. in a few moments, a look at how the political campaign is shaping up nevada. in about an hour and a half, the senate debate ohio, followed by the ohio -- the iowa fourth

house district debate. >> for live coverage of the 70 annual texas book festival. hear from douglis brinking, mark updegrove, michael gillette. the texas book festival, live on book tv. >> washington journal is focusing on key battleground states. up next, a discussion of this year's campaign in nevada.

votes in this election. demirjian according. i want to start with a few statistics. according to a recent report, between the end of 2006 and the end of 2011, says home values fell nearly 60%, higher than any other state. in 2011, home prices fell. that is on top of the state having the largest unemployment rate, about 11. % in september. talk about this election using those numbers as a backdrop.

it is about the economy. these numbers can matter very much. the nevada housing market continues to be bad. almost 70% of homes are under water at this stage. the unemployment rate has dipped below 12% for the first time since september. you are having a population contending with the worst brunt of the economic crisis. when the candidates come to town they hammer home their economic philosophy. there are anchors on the economy that will continue to weigh it down.

the housing sector got so bad and there is so much that equity in the economy now and in the housing market that is going to take a while to buy that out. host: are those numbers the difference for obama? in 2008, he won the state by 12.5%. guest: people are extremely frustrated because it has been so bad and so hard for so many of the residence.

you are seeing that gap, which was 12 points several years ago come down to something within the margin of error. obama has been holding a steady lead. the closest romney got was within a tie. democrats have a voter registration advantage in this state. host: going back to to thousand a, i want to talk about -- to 2008 statistics, from bloomberg

news says nevada has the largest swing state demographic shift since 2008. talk about how that is impacting this election. guest: 26% of the state is latino. this voting block has been shown to hear a lot about the economy, a lot about education.

immigration does not rank as the highest this year of interest to these voters. it is an underlying across the board thing. are you saying the right thing on these topics. it is 2/3 versus 1/3 that the voters are split on this. this is what candidates are fighting about. obama made a promise to address it in his first year in office and did not do that. he said he did not have time and did not have a cooperative congress. that has not stopped republicans who say, we can bring a comprehensive immigration reform, which is a term both parties defined differently. they are trying to make that a sales pitch. if you turn on spanish radio,

you hear nonstop commercials from both sides. this is a swing state for the president and it is also a swing state for the senate and one of the congressional races on here as well. host: if we are talking with karoun demirjian from the washington son. you can call in on the republican line. we have a special line set up for nevada residents. in talking about demographics out there, talk about the mormon vote in nevada. guest: you can count on the mormons to come out.

there has been a push to highlight how the democrats are making inroads with the community and how it is possible to turn out a mormon democratic vote as well. it is not going to be anything that will develop momentum or will really rock the boat lay here. it is not being despite any stretch of rock the vote here. in this election, it will probably still be a republican stronghold.

host: talk about early voted out there. what are the rules for early voting? guest: early voting started on saturday. early voting goes from october 20 to november 2. not every polling station is open for the entire period. we have entirely electric voting machines in nevada. this is a state that is over 80% urban. most people congregate around las vegas and reno and carson city. voter registration went online.

there have been more people turning out early in both parties than they did that on years ago because it has been drummed into them that this is a good way to go because it is the parties some peace of mind that people are turning out. you mentioned the recount, which is all is a scary word. there are at least 5% of precints in the counties that are thought to be suspect. in the larger counties, it takes a long time. nevada has not had issues with a recount recently.

there was an extended counts that happens with the republican party in february because there were ron paul supporters who contested the results. that was not the same process that will be employed for the general election. that was just the republican party. this is now the whole state. host: as goes the data, often so goes the country. here is the alleged as those nevada, often goes to the country. one of the big political reporters out there has put out a blog post on how nevada could

really mattered. this is from sunday. he gave hypothetical on what could happen on election night that could make nevada be deciding state. it involves president obama winning ohio and losing florida, colorado, and most other battleground states. when the polls are open in the west leading it to 67-265 00 267 to 265 for romney. i have callers waiting to ask you about nevada politics. jeffrey is a democrat from north las vegas.

good morning. caller: i am calling in reference to the hinchey candidates. -- two candidates. president obama -- i am calling in reference to the two candidates. president obama is considered to have when vanity. -- considered wind energy. he has every type of finance -- president obama is considered to have win energy he has. the price in everything a president can do -- wind energy. he has done practically everything a president can do for his constituencies. i have not seen anything from candidate romney. he is the one who stated, that

the people go into bankruptcy and then we can read their property out for the rich. host: here's your story from the las vegas son from yesterday. obama finds his old groove in the las vegas rally. what did he present talk about what he was out there yesterday? guest: he addressed many of the points jeffrey just brought up. he mentioned energy. that has been something obama has been pushing. there has been some push back from the republicans. there is a corridor of the data that is tapped into the california grid and there is a

-- there is a corridor of nevada that is tapped into the california grid. jeffrey also mentioned the housing market and the obama surrogates being in nevada all the time. there was an editorial board interview last year where romney said the housing market should be allowed to bottom out. you cannot say that in nevada. there are so many people who

need some sort of assistance. the parties cannot agree about whether it should take the fund -- if washington should be tried to force some principal reduction programs. -- washington should be trying to force some kind of principle reduction program. they are not sure the bank should be pushing -- the government should be pushing the banks around. people criticize romney about being callous about the particular problems of nevada and how severe the problems were when he made those comments. host: we have another caller from nevada. caller: i am looking at the bat out of 50 states -- nevada being 49th or 50th in education.

i just moved to nevada. i cannot see where they are on education. host: carrie brings up some of the personalities in nevada. guest: education is a huge issue in nevada. nevada has not qualify for a

race to the top funds. it is a turnaround school system. we will see where the education issue those. you mentioned the sheldon adelsons and steve wynns of this world. adelson has put a lot of money into this campaign against obama. that has been the new twists to this election.

it is the citizens united decision that allows this to happen. this is the full -- first full election cycle where that has played a role. you have ideological divisions and some people have enough money to put behind it and pushed the way this election conversation is going. host: a question from twitter. i heard the front hall supporters were so dissed by the gop that they may give from the some trouble in nevada. guest: many are disappoint -- disenchanted with the republican party. they want to stay part of the republican party.

they will more than likely turn out to vote for around the. -- romney. the question for the ron paul supporters is do they turn out at all. if they do, they were trying to make inroads into the republican party. if they do not, it will be because 2016 is not that far down the line. ron paul supporters seem to be more interested in waiting for his son, senator rand paul, to decide to throw his hat into the ring than they are to find somebody else in this election. the 2016 cycle start sooner than we want to think about. host: another question from twitter. has the population shifted out of las vegas from high unemployment and has that affected the core of the democratic vote? guest: that is an interesting

question. i cannot say with full authority one way or the other. the nevada population has risen over the last several years. it is why we got an extra seat in congress and why we have an extra electoral college vote. it seems to not be affecting the fervor with which people are turning out to vote. the early vote numbers are higher than they were before. you may have had flight at both ends of the political spectrum. host: we have special nevada line set up for residents in nevada. we will go to a caller on the democratic line from wisconsin. good morning.

caller: i have a problem with this whole election. you have one party who is only thinking of the middle class, only of the wealthy, only those that can benefit from the republicans being in office. what about those who were born into poverty, whose parents did not have the opportunity to go to school because they have to work? what about those forced to live paycheck to paycheck because of the economy or do to they are because they are a minority. who is thinking about the drugs that are killing our people? what about those who are not financially stable enough to go to school? no one cares. it is all about who can benefit from doing what. it is completely unfair. i think something should be done

about it. it should not be about who is going to benefit more or who is going to pay more taxes. it should become who is pointing prosper, who is one to make this country better? know what to make it better if everyone is thinking about themselves. host: a couple more statistics from bloomberg insider on nevada's makeup. the ethnicity in 2011 is 53.6% white, 8.6% black. the annual median household income in 2011 was $65,000. from go to larry stockbridge, ga.. you are -- let's go to larry from stockbridge, georgia. they have a question about the nevada election we can talk

about? caller: how do the latinos feel about that stuff. guest: what you've brought up are issues that everybody in the nation is talking about a little bit. i do not know if they are the number-one issue for the latino block. economic issues, family centered issues, immigration seem to be a much larger part of the conversation. and the caller before, she is right.

poverty is not getting a mention in this cycle. people are talking about the middle class and the upper class. there has not been a detailed conversation about the poor. both candidates will tell you they care about people on the lower end of the economic spectrum, but it has not come up much or as much at all in the conversation in 2012. host: someone writes on twitter, is there a information on the results of early voting? the democratic firewall in clark county is at 25,000 as a result of early voting. steal plea -- gop playing catch-up. guest: the early vote numbers are oneupsmanship from both parties. if you are a registered democrat, you are probably

going to go to a democratic and if you are a registered republican, you will probably vote republican. democrats have registered more voters than republicans. it ends up being a 90,000 voter advantage by the end of the registration season. they are trying to push that out. the more they can do that before election day, the more momentum they build behind these candidates. this is a swing state at various levels of this race. obama has had a pretty consistent holing his advantage

over running going back several -- polling advantage over romney going back several months. that is something hope their registration advantage can push her over the top. there are congressional races that depend on that turnover machin host:e. the republican candidate -- that turnover machine. heller's advantage is the northern part of the state.

she has to perform well. she does not have to be able to win them. obama performed well in that county that years ago. district 2 has always been in republican hands. we have another swing district given the redistricting.

obama has an advantage in the southern part of the state. the parties, when they go to these sorts of events, they are presenting a united front. obama makes sure he mentions everyone on the ticket. host: we have a caller on the republican line. caller: i live in colorado

springs and a lot of people that i know are out there getting food stamps or welfare. they laugh about it. they think the government owes it to them. nobody knows you nothing. nobody is talking about libya and nobody is talking about nothing like that. it is another thing that even spanish people -- i am spanish myself.

they are not saying anything about those fast and furious guns. remember, spanish people. if you mess up with any black people in your lifetime, obama is coming after you. he is the president and he cares about the black people and that is it. host: do you want to talk about fast and furious and policies play into nevada races? guest: people are listening to the sequestration, stations to a point. foreign policy does not seem to

be driving this election. fast and furious -- and has not come up to a large degree in this election at all. it ties into the cross border issues as a group package and is the other side of the immigration issue. nevada is next door to arizona. we had a lot of immigration issues. those issues have gone to the supreme court. that has been a pervasive concern. we are not talking about the fast and furious issue particularly. immigration laws have been a pervasive concern for people in the states. your caller mentioned race issues as well. that is an undercurrent that has been around that no one discusses very much. it is an issue if you look at the numbers. obama won with most minority categories in 2008. the same thing happened in 2010 when harry reid was running. the numbers are there which

sometimes can contribute to the tensions you heard from your caller. host: key counties on election night itself. guest: like i said before, much of this comes down to two pockets of the state. clark county i think has over 70% of the population. the northern part of the state with another 20% of the population. with the republicans are going to be making a huge push to turn people out from rural counties. those are counties that count and will matter for the congressional district 4 race which is the new district. i will be looking at different

sorts of groups of. people have been talking to blocks of voters whether it is women, seniors, or veterans. i am going to be looking to see how these messages are playing out, how this war on women message is affecting people to go to the polls. how is the medicare conversation actually affecting seniors? they are another block in nevada that did not go for obama in 2008. if you vote in republicans, goodbye to medicare as you know it. i will be looking to see how and whom these talking points are really selling at home with. host: one more call for you from now that at this morning on

the democratic line. caller: hi. listen, what they want to know is that senator from indiana said that rape was preordained by god. i was wondering how that would affect the vote in nevada and that is such an offensive statement for you to make. guest: i cannot predict exactly how that statement is going to affect nevada but the democratic candidates, especially shelley berkley, have been driving that point home saying because the republicans are not disavowing murdoch, they are supporting him. they are trying to build this connection between these comments that have not really

been very feminist. that has come out in the last few months. you have seen democratic candidates it just driving home this point bringing it up as much as they can. host: karoun demirjian, thank you for joining us this morning. host: we are back with nevada and democratic strategist andres ramirez to discuss president obama strategy for winning the silver state. andres ramirez, we spent a lot of time in the last segment talking about unemployment and under water mortgage rates. how much of a liability are those stats for president obama? guest: no doubt that nevada has been struggling to recover from the economic disaster that has happened both with unemployment and on the housing effect.

the area i live in is the highest foreclosed zip code in the country. the unemployment numbers in nevada have gone down. in the unemployment in. and las vegas have continued to decrease which is a positive sign. anticipated home values are beginning to rebound in las vegas. all of these things are happening at a crucial time in this election. nevada voters are going to the polls. they are positive signs for obama. obviously we would like unemployment numbers to be lower and the foreclosure crisis to be better, but the indicators we are seeing are showing positive momentum.

host: mitt romney and paul ryan were on the ground out there on tuesday. romney talked about what his time in all this would bring for the state. >> can you afford four more years with 23 million americans looking for a good job? can you afford four more years with housing prices going down? can you afford four more years of doubling of the gasoline prices if you are paying? how about this? would you like to have four years where we create 12 million new jobs? how about four more years of rising take-home pay again? how about four years getting now that unemployment down to 6% or lower.

host: your thoughts on some of his promises in that speech. guest: they certainly make for great tv sound bites but he has been on record saying he would prefer people to lose their homes and the foreclosure crisis to bottom out. mitt romney has a good record of creating jobs but not in the united states. most he created were offshore or overseas. voters looking at this will begin to really look at what mitt romney is offering and what he is really bringing to the table. i think voters are going to determine that the economy is improving and it has nothing to do with what mitt romney has done and has everything to do

with what the obama administration has put forward. host: we have the phones open for your call if you want to talk to andres ramirez, president of the ramirez group, and former harry reid staffer. the republican line -- the democratic line -- if you are in nevada resident, give us a call at -- can you give us a better picture of the nevada economy? most people realize party time is limited. what else goes on besides gambling and glitter? guest: one of the biggest industries we have is we have a

large mining industry. in the rural parts of nevada, they have been experiencing rapid growth over the past few years as prices have increased. we have been able to add new dimensions to stabilize the economy over the last several years. we have the hoover dam, red rock canyon. they are great avenues to create jobs and revenue in our state that are completely off the strip and have provided a diverse stream of revenue. host: zach is on the independent line. caller: good morning. i just muted my button as you started talking about tourism but that is an area that can be

expanded. people back east probably do not realize how big the county is. there are a lot of possibilities. there are a lot of other issues that are coming into play up here this year. i want to talk about mitt romney. i think everyone wants what he says. i think obama would like to see 22 million new jobs but you have to say how you are going to do that. that is all my comment was. it is good to hear from you this morning. host: we will go to wisconsin on the republican line. james, go ahead. did we lose you? caller: hello?

i am from louisiana. mitt romney makes and lot of promises. how is he going to prove what he is saying? i am going to turn down my tv. host: if you want to talk a little bit about how the obama campaign has gone after the mitt romney campaign on nevada issues. guest: mitt romney as a lot of great platitudes and sound bites with the media but if we look at his record, he constantly says what has obama done in the past four years? mitt romney's record is not a positive record of creating jobs and improving the economy in the united states. a record of creating jobs and improving economies here in the

united states, he does not have that record. where is he going to create 22 million jobs? what are they going to pay? his previous record does not have a great indicator of helping to improve salaries of american workers or the quality of life. let's judge people on their records. mitt romney's record is just a tragic example of what we would want in the white house to move our country forward. host: another nevada caller for you from las vegas. caller: i want to know why no one is talking about the oil company that mr. mitt romney owns in china and pumping out to iran. in illinois, he is closing down, sending jobs to china for

his other companies. this guy is a liar. he lies all the time. host: something you can speak to? guest: sure. again, mitt romney has raised hundreds of millions of dollars for his campaign and he thinks by spending that money on commercials and campaign propaganda people are going to forget that he has a record of shipping jobs overseas, hurting american communities and workers, and hurting our economy. we have 24-hour access to media and the internet and fabulous companies called google where we can access information independently.

all of the money mitt romney thinks he is going to spend about his record, it is going to come to light. we know you are spending money to ship jobs overseas. we are not going to fall for it. we need strong leadership in this country. host: let's talk about the tens of millions of dollars being spent on advertisements in nevada. here are the top state's overall. ohio is number one with $177 million spent in commercial advertisements this year. how effect of is that spending at this point? has nevada been saturated? guest: nevada is over saturated at this point. you cannot open your mailbox

without being inundated with political mail. nevada is a battleground state and it is notorious for being independent. we have ticket splitters, libertarian voters. these candidates are investing significant resources to ensure they will turn out there bases and persuade undecided voters. the democratic party has invested significant resources over the past year so we enjoy a 90,000 voter advantage statewide. we have been able to turn out our voters in significantly larger numbers than republicans.

these investments have continuing diminishing returns as more and more voters will vote early. host: for those of us not in nevada, i want to show some of the ads taking place right now on the air. this is a mitt romney advertisement. >> there is a soft spot in my heart in nevada. unemployment is probably double digits. i voted for barack obama. i really lost faith in him. i am supporting mitt romney. i think we have heard enough excuses. i do not think we can afford four more years. host: just to get your quick take on that ad. guest: it sounds like a very

compelling ad. it was surprising that he supported obama in the 2008 election. no surprise that he has left his roots and pushes the republican party agenda. host: i want to show you an obama ad that is being shown in nevada as well. >> so much is at stake. comprehensive immigration reform, education, making sure every young person in this country has access to good schools, and i could go on and on and on. that is why the vote is critical. host: mr. ramirez, a democratic

strategist, i want to get you on the phone with michael from wisconsin. michael, go ahead. caller: how are you guys doing today? i got some things i want to say. i am really heartbroken about that lady who said president obama is a racist. i am an independent and that offends me. another thing is i don't understand how many latino in their right mind could vote for mitt romney because of everything he says and what he does behind closed doors. they will not respond to accusations of millions of dollars in d.c. that is ridiculous. nobody wants to be poor or on food stamps.

we don't want this. if i am doing really well, i would not mind paying extra to help out my neighbor. host: could you talk about the importance of the latino vote in nevada this year? guest: the latino vote has been growing every election cycle. then senator obama received 76% of the latino vote in the state of nevada. in 2010, the election was also extremely decided by the latino electorate here in nevada. we are expecting latinos to continue to play an important

role. over the past year, spanish surname voters have registered at a higher rate than the general electorate. the general population only increased voter registration by 26%. it is extremely exciting to see latinos are engaged in this process. what we have been seeing for early voting so far has been very encouraging. a record number turnout for spanish voters for the first week so far. we are very excited about the role that latinos will play. we think they will exceed the numbers in 2008 and 2010. both candidates are investing resources to communicate to the voters in spanish and english. to use one of the most well- known figures in the spanish- speaking community bodes well for president obama.

host: a question for you on twitter. a viewer writes in -- guest: yeah, well, we are blessed that we have a competitive presidential race and senatorial race. it makes for a very exciting opportunity for us who are political junkies. it is the home state of harry reid and could help determine whether the democrats keep control of the united states senate. a lot of money is being

invested from outside groups, super pacs, independent expenditures. shelley berkley is running against dean heller. the democratic machine who helped deliver harry reid to victory is in full force to help president obama and shelley berkley. we are going to continue to see positive successes up and down the ticket this cycle. host: i have a caller on the republican line this morning. caller: thank you for c-span. as a republican, i know most of us are concerned about growing democracies and so forth because it anybody who works for the government does not contribute to revenue and it takes more money away, compounding the problem. which party would be contributing more to a bureaucracy and which party will try to cut down the bureaucracy

in nevada as well as the country? thank you. guest: that is a great question especially coming from a state like nevada which helped to grow las vegas and it billed ourselves economic determination several decades ago with the construction of the hoover dam. 85% of nevada land is owned by the federal government. the department of interior, the department of defense. we have the department of energy locations here. i take a negative reaction from people who say government employees do not contribute to the economy. i think most historians, republicans or democrats, would agree if not for the

construction of the hoover dam, we would not see las vegas as we do today. we have significant resources being invested here and so forth. all these employees of the federal government are buying homes and paying taxes when they buy their homes. they are buying groceries and shopping at these private industries and it visiting our casinos. for people to suggest because you are an employee of the government you do not contribute to the economy or our community, i think it is a false statement. host: let's go to emma from texas on the democratic line. caller: good morning. my comment was for the mexican lady who called in during the last segment talking about

president obama. president obama has done more for the mexicans than blacks. i am black. the mexican women have all the jobs here and are very disrespectful to black women. i don't know where she got her education. host: let's go to ohio on the republican line. caller: my husband happens to be mexican so i understand a little about the mexican community. they are hard-working, pro- life, religious people and are all the things the democrats are against. they are all about -- they took god out of their platform. they are all pro-choice. everything i see the mexican

people are not. the only other thing i want to say about that is there have been democracies before ours. it starts out people are in bondage. they go from spiritual faith to courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to great abundance, from great abundance to selfishness. host: we have about a minute left for you to get a response. guest: i am an american with latino descent. as a mexican american here in the united states, i like to have this conversation with my republican colleagues. rim is small business owner and go to church frequently -- i am a small business owner and go to church frequently. these statements are simply a fallacy and it is untrue that

the democrats removed god from their platform. i am a proud democrat and am proud of my religion and christianity. so far, i have not seen anything coming from the republican party that will make me feel they are better for the latino community then what the democratic party has to offer. that is why we have the same poll numbers of latino voters choosing to vote for democratic candidates. host: andres ramirez, thank you for joining us this morning. guest: thank you for having me. host: up next, former executive

we will be right back. a top political adviser predicted that mitt romney will lose the race in nevada this year. i think that obama will carry the date battery -- state between 1% and 3% and that dean heller win the senate race. i want to get your thoughts on this story and what you think will happen this year. guest: it could very well be. i still think that governor romney has a good chance. if we can keep democrats to 45% in las vegas of the total votes, and republicans around 35%, i think governor romney has a great shot. the last really competitive race here for presidential was 2000, where the democrats came out

with 51% in the clarke county yet george bush still won. there is still a good chance the governor romney can make it. host: has the race comes down to one or two issues out there in nevada? what you think we will focus on in the final 12 days here? guest: everybody is going after the last three people were not made up their mind. we have got such an ad war going on here. we have got both the democrats and republicans working like mad. people trying to make sure they get out the vote. the democrats of done much better job with that right now. they have -- to see that in our two major population areas. the early vote numbers. but what is not too bad about that is that republicans tend to vote later. you will see this gap closing, closing, the closer we get to election day. the plurality of