politics and policy debates. irving lachaow looks at the growing threat of cyber attacks in the u.s.. "washington journal" is next. a live fewmorning, of the u.s. capitol this morning. vice president biden heads to rome as part of the official dedication -- official delegation that marking the inauguration of inaugurati -- the inauguration of pope francis i. sunday, march 17. we will begin with a discussion of the cpac conference which wrapped up tonight.

we want to begin with a discussion on poverty and hunger in america. the front page story this morning on "the washington post," we are quite ask you to join the conversation. the headline -- extensive story that points out --

five the story also focusing on the larger issue of hunger in america. we want to use this article as a way to have you join the conversation on what is the government's role in hunger in america? our phone lines are open, 202 is the area code. 3880 for democrats. 585-3881 for republicans. 585-3882 for independents. you can send as a tweet @c spanwj. isour facebook page there this from jim murphy --

many of you already joining in on the conversation. there is a new documentary called " keep a place at that table." attention about the issue of honker. >> a lot of people are ashamed and it is very humiliating. >> this generation will live six or die younger -- live sick or die edgar. >> the problem is getting worse. >> the reason people are going hungry is not because it is shortage. it is because of the property. >> one out of every two kids in the united states will at some point be on food assistance. benefits wase food

$3 a day. >> you are going to spend it on the cheapest calories you can get, and that is processed food. >> i cannot tell my kids -- i am struggling to feed my kids every day. >> that was a bad idea. onmillions of americans rely charitable food programs. >> i have not received a pay raise in four years. what i used to spend on a month in groceries now this week two weeks. >> charity is a great thing. but it is not a good way to end hunger. weakening our country. >> a documentary in 1968 put hunker on the agenda. agenda.r on the >> it showed that public policy can work, political will can

work to make a difference in our country. helpingugh committed to solve the problem of child of the city and hundred. >> we will make sure that families have access to quality, affordable food. >> there is a lot of educationese to happen. we'll have a stake in this. >> it is about patriotism. it does not have to be that way. host: the documentary "a place at the table." the headline --

on our facebook page --

on twitter -- what iss for democrats, the government of possible when it comes to hunger in america? caller: [indiscernible] isneed to make sure nobody starving to death. that america has , and thatter or curse is the monster of extremes. they feel their mission is to get every dime that they can possibly get under any circumstances. then you have extreme poor, many of them who think the world owes them a lift. treatms like you cannot

it the curse of extremes is -- you have big business that feel they can just -- they need to get every profit that comes by. doesn't mean you have to destroy the working class to do it? has this point -- amy, a republican line, indianapolis. good morning. i believe that the re ason there are so many poor in our country and so many people unable to feed themselves is because our standard of living has been lowered by our

government. they have not balance our budget. i have had to take pay cuts of for the past couple of years because of autonomy on paying less taxes. there are less taxes going into the government. it is because the government cannot balance our budget, cannot act responsibly, cannot work together. host: paul on the air twitter p the " t " huffington post," -- sing on the elderly in theirr of americans 50s at risk of hunter grew by

40%. according to "the huffington post," rising gas prices as low as rising electricity is only exacerbating the trend among some of america's elderly. mike is on the phone in chicago. our question is what is the government's role when it comes to hunker in america? caller: i am a long time listener and a first-time caller. this kind of stuck in there with me. the problem with government is waste.ot watching the you have a lot -- you have an onslaught of people using link texting on iphones.

they are taking advantage of the system. if our government to find out who really need it and give it to them -- people who can work should work. host: thank you for the call. to not be a stranger. if you have access to the internet, "the washington post" has this story on their website. the focus is on one rhode island town. the can see this couple carrying a bag of groceries. this is available on the website. inside the publication is one grocery store and photographs of the merchandise being loaded. the essence of the story is how the first of the month is a boom town for this little town. a bust month as

programs begin to dry up. welcome to the program. caller: thank you for taking my call. to end thehe way hunger and control the hunger in electountry is we need to a democratic majority in to the house, do away with the filibuster in the senate, and also have a tighter control on food stamps and everything such as we get. there are people who need the food stamps. if we could have more regulation on it and see where the money is going -- host: we will go to nancy joining us from kentucky. caller: good morning. my opinion is we should be able to take our children and our

communities to grow their own food. not to be dependent on global corporations that control, by genetically modifying, foods and drinks. i attended a conference last saturday. i met a doctor from sri lanka. we brought about it. -- we were talking about it. we do not teach our children even in kindergarten. we do not need to depend on anybody. there are leaders everywhere. we can do this through the school system. most of us have forgotten. i know when i was a student we had our own school greenhouse. it got torn down and we sent the teacher to central office. this is about the thomas started hearing about the need of macro programs. we depend on others. we need it teach our children to grow our own foods.

thank you so much. this is a wonderful thing you are doing. host: monte has this point -- he is a former elected official in montana and he had this piece, "don't believe the mytho america." in he makes a couple of points -- "when we get close, the image fades. even the first lady sees that hunker is everywhere. she is remaking the lunch menu to fight of the city and

counters her home husband's efforts to expand --" the story is available online at greatfallstribune.com eric is joining us from texas. welcome to the program. saying that if the true form of christianity they will understand that jesus said the poor. the tour needs tending to and anybody who follows christianity understands that. it is at this third -- is absurd that people criticize the program that is helping people. fathom why someone thesebelieve that

programs are not helping people to improve their conditions. the scandals have devastated our economy. host: thank you very much for the call. this is a profile on the snap program in rhode island. it is an ackerman for the supplemental nutrition assistance program.

let us go to jason from britain, new jersey. caller: thank you for this great topic. i think it is one we can all relate to because everyone has to eat. it all starts with food. athink the first lady has set good example with the garden she is growing behind the white house. given to allwas americans to grow a garden. this could wipe out the hunger problem probably within one growing season. some type of tax incentive, some the of extra tax on corporations and oil companies that are getting subsidies. take a small fraction of that away. give that to citizens to grow

food. around in onethis season. this is an opportunity out of anniversary -- this is an opportunity. out of adversity comes opportunity. it is a travesty to see americans going hungry. these are programs i did not even get interested in. it is easy for us to blame government. let us look at ourselves in the mirror and say we can grow our own stocks. it has to start at the people and i hope everyone can grow a victory garden and help people out. the call.k you for another focus on the economy is an energy stored inside "new also looking at the

economic impact of the ethanol program. the president focusing on energy in his weekly address. >> over the past four years as a part of all of the above energy strategy we made steps to soften the blow by using -- by making sure cars use less gas. by the middle of the next decade our cars will go twice as far on a gallon of gas.

the average family will save over $8,000 at the pump. the only way we are going to break this cycle of spiking gas prices is to shift our cars and trucks off of oil for good. that is why at my state of the union address i called up for congress to set up an energy security trust to fund research into new technologies that will help us reach that goal. is drawn fromergy the lands and water that we as a public altogether. i propose to take some of our oil and gas revenues from public lands and put it towards research that will benefit the public so we can support american ingenuity without adding a dime to our deficit. we are designing new engines. cheaper batteries can go further on a single charge. drivers can when they go coast to coast without using a drop of

oil. built off of the proposal put forward by a non- partisan coalition of ceos and retired generals and admirals. let us take their advice and free our families and businesses from painful spikes in gas prices once and for all. host: the president's travel to illinois to focus on energy issues, using energy as a part of the weekly address. there is this from linda -- we will continue with your calls and comments on the issue of hunger in america. we also want to turn our attention to the other store getting a lot of attention, the

cpac conference. all the speeches are available on our website. potential 2016t candidates, coming in first is followed by paul, marco rubio. dr. ben carson who wrote he may seek elective office himself is coming in at 4%. the headline "rand paul edges rubio." james joyce's by the phone. any surprises?

guest: it is a beauty contest three years after the election. the stronghold is very close. it's sort of -- everyone expected that rand ould win the straw poll, especially come out of the filibuster last week. i think some people were surprised at how close it was. getting a quarter of the votes and rubio getting a quarter of the votes. it was quite a drop off. it really should be these two guys who spoke back-to-back on thursday. that is where the party is hanging their hopes. host: let me ask you about this story getting a lot of attention, a maryland doctor

says he is hinting at a possible run at elected office. too busy and how did he rise to the national stage like this? was the first surgeon to separate conjoined twins. he is a john hopkins hospital neurosurgeon. he is very successful in his field. he is going to retire in the next couple of months. he challenged the president and he is very good at dishing out the red meat and the crowd loved him. vibrant in his speech criticizing the president.

he got a better reception than maybe anyone else in terms of exciting everyone. in the strawe that poll he did as well as he did. the headline this morning from "to washington examiner," -- she's pictured around the country with the big gulp. caller: it was a great crop. she was criticizing michael bloomberg's so the ban in new york city. new york city. she has had a much lower profile since the election. she no longer has a tv contract. the crowd still loved her.

she really excited them. she had a lot of funny jokes for the audience. what is notable is that she is not seen among these conservative activists as a politician so much anymore as a thought leader in the movement. host: this is the headline from -- new york daily news," former more with the alaska governor and vice presidential nominee sarah palin. >> we are not here to re-brand the party. we are here to rebuild the country. [applause] we are not here to dedicate ourselves to new talking points coming from dc. we are not here to put a fresh

coat of rhetorical paint on our party. we're not here to abandon our principles in a contest of government giveaways. that is a game we will never win. we are skinner to restore america and the rest is just -- the rest is sound. it is just making noise. the headline of "the new york times seeking -- of "the new york times," -- caller: ted cruz really credits sarah palin in her key role in the senate primary last year. he was the keynote speaker of

the entire conference and pailin asked him to introduce her. favorabled gave a introduction of sarah palin, crediting her with really helping the conservative elected. host: where does this movement go next? it was pointed out that in the 1970's cpac consisted of 125 people. it became one of the favorite stops of ronald reagan both as a candidate and as the president later. what is next for the organization and the movement? caller: there is a divide. it is where the conversation is moving. the conservative movement is much bigger than it was in the 1970's. it is now the republican party. they are a window into the wings of the party.

the 3000 who voted in the straw poll are libertarians. many of them would have supported a ron paul in the past. more traditional conservatives are social conservatives. that is their primary issue. you have these wings of the party. issues there is going to be conflict in the next few years as the party tries to figure out how much change they need to make to win elections again. ont: james hohmann up early sunday morning with his thoughts on this story. his work is available at

politico.com. robert costa will be joining us later in the program to talk about cpac. will ber krystal ball joining us from new york. we are focusing on the issue of hunger in america. of front page this morning "the washington post is getting a lot of attention. government'sic is spending overall. this is an editorial

la donna is joining us from west virginia. domal for waiting. caller: the wall for taking my call. -- thank you for taking my call. people that you have aits, percentage that sell their food stamps. they trade them for drugs. i feel like of the government would make everyone that receives benefits take a drug , we would have to pay for it ourselves. in someone in your house does not pass a drug test you lose

your benefits. the government will take millions and millions of dollars. it would save billions of dollars. host: you are looking at some of the photographs from inside "the new york times." let me reiterate some of the figures in "the washignton post," one-third of the residents in a town in rhode island are part of the snap program. there is this chart, state residents who recieve state funding. it is especially high down south. fewlighter the color the residents.

of residents receive aid in rhode island. one-third of folks in windsock. staten island new york, a good morning. good morning. happy st. patrick's day. i appreciated the call before when the lady talked about teaching our children to grow food. when jimmy carter was in, a program i worked on here in a school for --

orphans and abandoned children were taught to do that. when they throw out statistics, please be careful. let me ask you a question because i ask a lot of people this -- how much do you think he would need a date to live on to eat? host: it depends, for me or my family? caller: as a single man. host: minimally you need about $20. caller: that is the average in my unofficial survey. that is what i usually get. i am on social security $800ility -- which is only per month. i get the maximum for a single adults, which most people do not understand. i get two hundred dollars a month which is an increase over

several years. that is $6.66 per day. host: how you do it? out of i take money what would normally go to other things. rich people like blumberg, i want to give one example because we are focusing on hunger and food. we are talking about descriptor whether you are a jew, christian, everyone knows someone around the world. we have to look at the system. let us take just one example, i will leave you with this. 's personal wealth went to over $20 billion. now he talks about soda pop. he should look at a

picturethehomeless.org, who found out and expose that bloomberg does not have a housing program but a warehouseing program. in thet 31 districts five boroughs in new york and found there are five vacancies withvery homeless person the city statistics. that is because bloomberg pays 3000 per month to warehouse somebody whereas if i have been , if they gave me my stipend for my housing, it averages the stipend which we called section 8, $750.

that would save 75% on housing and not only get people eating but you would have a roof over their head and they could be around the table as a family again. we have to look at our system and cut where people like bloomberg do not have a clue. host: thank you. we always appreciate hearing from you. caller: you too. host: from rabbi daniel isaacs who has this different point of view on hunger in america -- "our nation, indisputably the inlthiest and most powerful the world has ever known, lacks

the will to feed its own citizens. malnutrition and america must shock us when every american child will perceive food assistance at some time in his or her formative years. one oout of two of our children." you can check this out at the oregonian.com. next is marilyn joining us from florida. to be toodid not mean offensive but it is kind of hard to see who is really hungry and who isn't. i am at the grocery store four days per week. the people on these cards are buying 6 foot long subs. i see people loading up their cards with a 10 pound bags of

crab leg s. i am budgeting myself. out are giving these cards . it is insane. cashier's say one in five of them are using these cards. they aren't even for basic necessities. what i seeing is abuse. i see people selling them off the streets. of me has a front coach beg, coach wallets, and she is using food stamps. she is going into a brand new nissan suv. i have not seen anybody who really needs the food. isn't there a way they can monitor this?

host: thanks for he call. somellion americans are on sort of snap program. according to the survey the majority of americans also supported policies to improve the nutritional impact of the snap by incentivizing the purchase of healthy foods and restricting the purchase of sugary drinks. to debates expected the changes, including potential cuts to snap and other components of the federal nutrition program. congressman paul ryan taking in that budget cuts, as well. republicans put forth their own spending blueprint. response.e republican

>> president obama and senate democrats say they want a balanced approach to our fiscal issues but their budget is ever balance, ever. taxesd they want to raise to fuel more spending. we know where this path leads, straight into a debt crisis. what does look like? first lenders will demand a higher interest rate. higher interest rates across the country will skyrocket on credit cards, mortgages, car loans. if interest rates rise debt payments will overwhelm all other items in the budget. the debt will overwhelm our economy. our finances will collapse. the safety net will unravel. the most honorable will suffer. you think this cannot happen here? just look at europe. we do not accept that future, not for our children and country. today we invite president obama to do with president clinton

did, to work with republicans in congress to balance the budget. he can join in the efforts or he can choose the status quo. but he must choose. the american people deserve an honest account of our challenges. what is needed to confront them? we have an opportunity to face them with courage and resolve as we have always done history.ut history host host: this is on our twitter page. we are asking about hunger in america, you can join the conversation on our facebook page. many already have. greg says --

tom is joining us from annapolis, maryland. good morning. patrick's day.t. you are looking very dapper in your green tie. as far as hunger in the united states i think a lot of it is in the black communities and they are responsible for their own terrible situation there. children,s of these the black men do not support them. they live the woman to go in poverty while they are raising these children. they drop out of high school. they don't prepare themselves for any kind of good occupation and make some kind and decent money. as far as this rabbi isaaks, maybe he should call out and say we shoudl stop sending money to

israel. if the blacks want a role model they should look to the irish. the irish overcame some of the worst discrimination and vicious attacks. they embraced education, including building some of the greatest universities in this country. the blacks, all they do is get more violent and i am not sure what can be done. we have done everything and they will not show any gratitude at all. host: double for the call. -- thank you for the call. there are places you cannot get nutritious food. the president will be traveling to israel for his first visit since taking office four years ago. " the washington

post," -- front page story of " keep the new york times" looking at another aspect of poverty in america. he's point out that most lower income students --

joining us from ohio. good morning. caller: we don't think anyone should be hungry in the country and maybe the government should get involved. having grown up during the vietnam era we kind of looked at things differently or started that. i think i have said it myself or have certainly heard it, under communism no one starts. start the ukraine in 1938. i certainly wouldn't want anyone to have the power to do it, even if they do it only once. host: i just want to share with you a couple of headlines. this is from the arizona republic.

one of theherald," soldiers who was killed in a rock -- north dakota getting a lot of attention because of its new oil and new economy. what it means for their own economic lifestyle. that story, front page this morning of "the chicago tribune ." when we come back we're going to turn our focus to cpac. robert costa will be joinign us. is a formerl ball,

democratic candidates. nancy, good morning. >> good morning. on to the's network tv talk shows the topics include the u.s. economy, the nuclear threat from north korea, and pope francis. c-span radio or read errors the five programs beginning at noon eastern with "meet the press." key is the former president of the u.s. conference of catholic. -- of catholic bishops. madeleine albright and former national security adviser stephen hadley. at two o'clock p.m. it is " the fox news sunday." also the president and ceo of

freedom works will be there. mike rogers -- also kiki mclean and dr. ben carson. at 4:00 is "face the nation." we talk with congressman paul ryan. democratic senator amy and the chairman of the republican national committee -- this afternoon on c-span radio are brought to you by c-span as a public service. you can listen to them all on c- span radio on 91. fm. channel 119 at

nationwide on sirius satellite radio. >> elizabeth monroe refused to continue the tradition of making social calls to washington post political society. she gained a reputation of being queenly. we will explore her relationship with her husband and close relationship with her successor. we will see the important role she played in the campaign of her husband, john quincy adams, and the complicated relationship with her mother in law. we will include your comments and questions live monday night at 8:00 eastern on c-span eastern c-span3. "washington journal" continues.

host: we want to welcome robert costa. thank you for being with us. three days of the cpac conferen ce, a lot of focus on the future of the republican party. we heard from the chair of the rnc. what did you caller: learn i think i-- what did you learn? guest: rand paul won the straw poll. it is really early for 2016. but you're seeing marker rubio, paul ryan continues to be a force. it is a youthful movement for the leadership in the republican party. you saw a lot of that at this place. did you sense that the party is turning a page, that

the conservative movement is turning a page? paul buddy who can win in the republican election? guest: i am not sure they are ready to turn a page. it is almost as if they are looking at a book and prepared to turn the page but not sure about doing it yet. at the hotel in maryland. it seems the conservatives are eager to win again but not sure how did do it. rand paul is challenging the status quo. he stopped by the national review's offices to talk about his push for less interventionist foreign policy. the really excites libertarian flank of the republican party. that distention of that kind of perspective some -- the discussion of that kind of perception of foreign policy --

on domestic issues you still see the republican party focused on fiscal issues and the budget. paul ryan gave a well-received speech but it wasn't cheered in the way it was before. there is a concern that perhaps the party is focusing too much on budget and this austerity message i. host: we are glad to show some highlights of the speeches of the last three days. let us begin with brent bozell attention.a lot of [video clip] good man and you mean well and you have real courage in taking on medicare and have shown real courage in taking on the issue of obama care. proposed budget of 41

trillion dollars over the next 10 years with more and more and more spending every year, keeping the obama care taxes, is not conservatism. it is not what democrats do. aest: his comments reflect lot of the frustration i saw at cpac > one of the problems you hear among conservatives is that republicans only controlled house. they do not control the senate or the white house. it bunch of conservatives are eagerly pushing for a 10-year balanced budget. the political reality is much more complicated. when you risk -- when you speak to republicans on capitol hill they express frustration with conservative activists. they agree with what he was saying on principle. any chance of doing something that really appeals to conservatives in terms of cutting the budget is near

impossible in this current political climate in washington. republicans have this challenge with the right part of the republican party is asking for a lot of things. they are demanding big cuts, less taxes, to battle the president on each issue. when it comes to the negotiating table the republicans did not have a great hand. hohmann pointed out rand paul winnign the straw poll. santorum spoke on friday. should have chris christie been invited? >> i think he should have. the reasons for him not being invited i found that had deprived. not have ahe did great year as a conservative and that is the reason they did not invite him.

chris christie anchored some conservative activists with the way he worked president obama during hurricane center. i am surprised as someone who supports politics about this feature reaction against chris christie post hurricanes stand. remember that after the 2009 election he was a hero to many. he and bob macdonald or two republican success stories. he was on the cover of national review and many other magazines as a republican warrior and conservative hero. at a think his fall from grace in the problem -- in the conservative movement so near the election and after much height is surprising. host: we'll get to your calls and comments. you can give us a call. we welcome our listeners on c- 119.radio on xm channel

we will share with you the comments of senator rand paul, who won the straw poll with 25%. here is what the kentucky senator said on thursday. [video clip] >> the gop of gold has grown stale and moss-covered. we need to name any names, do we? [laughter] our party is encumbered by an inconsistent approach to freedom. the new gop will have to embrace liberty in both the economic and personal sphere. if we are gonna have a republican party that can win,

liberty needs to be the backbone of the gop. host: we saw a real division and senatortor paul mccain. never know for sure who he was referencing. that seems like an apt way of interpreting that remark. i think senator rand paul really reflects how libertarians are in the -- are standing republican party. lost two races for the presidency. here we are in 2013 and it is his son who continues to shape the movement and message. he is one of the key voices in

the party. one of the reasons rand paul is ascending is because he is in the senate and is a savvy legislative operator. make a the filibuster to broader case. very few national republican leaders are able to use the legislative bodies here on capitol hill to make a political case, to really connect with the country. i think he deserves a lot of credit for that. host: in other attention on dr. ben carson who delivered remarks before the national press. is driving the front page -- guest: twitter of the things that will always stick with me is that on the first floor of the hotel as they had a book signing area. when dr. carson came down to sign his book the line stretched the entire for peel -- the entire floor.

he has really captured the imagination of many conservatives. i doubt he will run for president. when you look at 2012 primary a lot dr. carson is a formidable speaker. you may see him as an outside shot of the 2016 nomination. never know. host: lutzker dejon and from florida. go to john in florida. caller: i believe the future of the republican party is dr. been carson. he can say the words that republicans need to say and have been saying. the uninformed voters will vote for because he is the other end of the scale from barack obama. guest: it is a fair point. one of the reasons why dr.

carson is so popular is that he has a doctor's manner, a gentle way of speaking, but his message has the force of a scalpel. it cuts at the administration and the president's message. he said yesterday, the president is trying to destroy the country. this was red meet that resonated with conservatives. an exemplaryad career at johns hopkins. the republicans look at 2016 field, there are so many riches available, when you look at marco rubio, paul ryan, but there is a sense that nobody has captured the nomination this early. they are open to names. sandy has this on twitter -- guest: one thing about chris christie, yes, he has entered

activists. he is running for reelection in a blue state. my retired in 2006, never ran for reelection in massachusetts. if chris christie can win reelection, i think he will re- emerge as a republican power player in the country. winning reelection in new jersey is something really tough in republican politics. describe mitt to romney's appearance on friday. wistful. guest: i sat down with them for an off the record meeting with him for an hour. he was removed by the moment. 2008romney ended his presidential campaign when he lost the primary to john mccain with the speech at cpac. i thought that was one of ann romney's best. 20 told, not so much. much.2, not so

he was never really a friend and ally of conservatives pretty he was always trying to appeal to them. coming back, he seemed visibly moved by his appearance. he has done a few scattered interviews since the election. poor man known as a corporate consultant, kind of cool in his emotions, to have a little bit of water in his eyes, to pause here and there, he misses the campaign trail all little bit. he did enjoy being in the moment. though he didn't connect with conservatives, he appreciated their efforts. the editort costas, for the national review magazine. a graduate from never came. he earned his master's from cambridge university. another moment getting attention, sarah palin taking aim at the big bold -- big gulp.

of course, bloomberg's decision was rescinded by a judge in the last week. guest: i'm not sure what her political future is. she has left her position at fox news as a commentator. she continues to write books. she supposedly coming out with the christmas book later this year. everybody there at the conference that she had a magic, the ability to appeal to the conservative base, to rally them, to get raucous applause. that was still there. anything else is an open question about what she wants to do next. when she came out with a soda, it was one of those memorable moments. she pulled it from under the podium, starts sipping it, mocking mayor bloomberg. ofn you have cpac full

reflections on the republican party, people are hearing a lot of analysis, talk about the future of the party. sarah palin it went beyond that, throwing out more one-liners than anybody. when you look at her future, she will always be popular within that crowd, the base of the republican party. they love her. they think she is great. run inou think she could 2016? guest: she might. she got closer to running in 2012 and many people recognize. pailin supporters were trying to push her to be on the ballot to start a grass-roots initiatives. the one thing in the republican party is that there is a tension between the establishment in washington, the political class, rove, andives, karl the more grassroots, conservative activists. sarah palin came out in her speech -- what i heard was for talking about the political

class and how they need to end their influence in republican politics. she does not want operatives driving the conversation. that was a real political message. she perhaps is keeping the door open to a potential run because she thinks she can emerge as an outsider. "ost: "the new york times called her speech are rousing pep talk. guest: sarah palin was a major force on the campaign trail. sometimes people played down her influence, but when she waltzes into senate races and gives her support to a certain candidate, she can really be a factor, just in drawing media attention to a tea party contender. i think sarah palin wants to be a force in her own way. that means writing books, giving speeches, and looking at a 2016 run. she is not the usual political player in this country, especially within the republican party, that will do trips to

iowa and new hampshire. she will do it in her own style. host: from our twitter page -- guest: cpac is not the be all, and all of republican politics. because they decided not to invite chris christie does not mean his career in the republican party is over. it does reflect the tension and frustration many feel on the conservative side about how he handled his relationship with a president. chris christie is somebody who is so ambitious, so energetic, such a great speaker, even those on the right who have had problems with what he has done still respect him as somebody who can go after the president and would be critical but also appeal to suburban independents. people whothere are are angry with christie, ahead of 2016, it is way too early to count him out because of his

record and charisma. host: let me ask you about jeb bush. he spoke on friday. there seems to be a real divide within the republican party about whether or not jeb bush should or will run for president in 2016. there is no doubt in a series of interviews including one with chuck todd that he has left the door pretty wide open. guest: this could be tough. he has not been on the ballot since 2002. he left office in 2007. he comes on the scene with a new book on immigration. he is hinting that his openness to his 2016 run -- many concerts -- conservatives and republicans have not heard from jeb bush for a while. real uphill challenge if he wants to win the hearts of conservatives. on friday night, i was in the room when he gave a dinner speech. in many ways, it came across as flat.

in reading his speech, it was a recommendation of policy changes, not being anti- everything. it did not have the red meet that conservatives love. it was partly a lecture. it was smartly written. it was not perfectly delivered. i think jeb bush is somebody or you have to pay attention to when you talk about 2016, but he is in no way the presumptive front-runner. host: he asked his name not be listed in the straw poll. early he said it was too to be in anything 2016 related. he is very close with mark rubio. he mentioned rubio. every political insider i speak to doubt that rubio and bush will run against each other in a primary. rubio seemed interested in running for president in 2016. if rubio runs, i doubt jeb bush well. host: more from friday evening

's cpac conference. [video clip] >> i wonder what what some would say if it brought all the computer power on the future of the political party -- a republican party. watson would note that republicans have lost the popular vote in five of the six last presidential elections. democratic candidates received over 6 million more votes than our republican candidates. that is a staggering number. how could it be? if watson were to read the blogs, the tweets, the pace a post that mention the republican party, it would find that all too often we are associated with being anti-everything. we too many people believe that republicans are anti women, anti science, and i worker, and the list goes on and on.

many voters are unwilling to choose our candidates, even though they share our core beliefs, because those voters seem unloved, unwanted, and on will come in our party. tonight, my thought is this -- if watson can learn from his past mistakes, so can we. this means we move beyond the divisive and extraneous issues that currently defined the public debate. never again and the republican party simply write off entire segments of our society because we assume our principles have limited appeal. they have broad appeal. [applause] appeal, and we need to be larger than that. host: robert costas, a quick take away. policyhe has some prescriptions. and he wants the party to listen to what he is saying on immigration and moderation of town, coming towards the center at least in how you talk to

certain demographic groups, but conservatives are skeptical about the bush. i respect his record in florida, but there have been so many stars emerging since he left office that he is an older name. let's go to weigh on the democrats' line. the democrats' line. caller: thank you for the opportunity to speak to you. having watched the conference, i think it is a perfect example of what the republican party will remain a minority party for some time to come. you do not invite kriski probably has the best chance in our party of running against hillary clinton right now, who looks like the odds on favorite in 2016. yet to talk about sarah palin as if she is some presidential candidate, a woman who knows nothing about everything. i cannot imagine sarah palin on the same stage debating hillary clinton. i think it would be a massacre.

then you have people like ted who slams chuck hagel, who is a decorated veteran, talking about how he might be taking money from north korea and hamas. most americans and most people in his own party do not like the guy. it seems to me that the demographics are moving away from the republican party, but they refuse to accept it. it seems like a shot themselves in the foot, and a turnaround and ask people why they are bleeding. guest: i think some of those points are fair. when you look at the conference and interpret what is happening in the conservative movement, it is not a monolith. in fact, when you look at cpac, jeb bush asking conservatives to rethink how they think about issues, bobby jindal reconsidering the budget, talking about tax reform, paul

ryan talking about being a gentler and kinder in their approach, there is a grappling for power in the party. as many people discussed different approaches and issues, there is no clear consensus on how to move forward. that is where the party is right now. that is what the conference was about, this fight for power and the message. rand paul and mark rubio right there in the stronghold, different kinds of perspectives on foreign policy, but both strong. host: an independent from new york. like the feel republican party is outdated. with gun control, i believe in the rights of the second amendment to have a gun. in the declaration of independence back in 1776. ok? i don't think they meant us to have guns but shoot 1000 bullets

a minute. come on. have some common sense. guest: one thing about gun control is that you do not see much progress on legislation in the house or the democratic controlled senate, because i think many senate democrats up for reelection in 2014 are quite hesitant to have large comprehensive gun control legislation coming to the floor. that is what i hear on capitol hill. when you look at gun control, you do see some bipartisan consensus on background checks. in the immediate future, i doubt anything beyond stricter background checks and perhaps a new rule will be part of the discussion. host: you can get more information about the work of robert costas from national review. we will listen to larry who joins us from western -- west virginia on our republican line. caller: of like to say at think republican party has to stick to

the conservative theme of cutting spending and reining in government. government is too big. with the budget, i always wondered why they just do not go back to the last legally passed and signed budget and say that is the money we are going to appropriate, the budget of four years ago or five years ago. they have to really get serious about cutting spending, not cutting the increase in spending. seymour, we per should be spending two% less than the year before -- 3% more, we should be spending two% less than a year before. as far as the candidates that are spoken about right now, i feel like chris christie would be good to have on the ticket, if not as president, as a vice president. i think they have a shot. they have to open up more -- i

agree with jeb bush, about not being the party of no to everything. i do not think bush would be good for the party because the name of bush will not go over well in 2016. host: thank you. guest: one thing about the budget message, this is an interesting point -- on capitol hill, republicans are wondering, how do we move forward? when it comes to a potential grand bargain on fiscal issues, republicans want to reform entitlements. they look at the ryan budget. it goes at medicare, talks about premium support. republicans are not willing to give on revenue or taxes. when you look at the senate democratic budget, senate democrats, the president, for the most part, are not willing to negotiate on entitlements. you have this real impasse in politics were democrats will not give anything or shall lead on

entitlements, but republicans are unwilling to talk about taxes. any grand bargain will have a combination of those two. where are you left? republicans are resigned to have incremental reform. that is why they're pushing the president to do something on chain cpi for social security. there is not much possible. host: there were reports that the house republican caucus were tweeting and on assault guns while the president was speaking. that is true to do, -- rude to do, despite the fact that he is a president. guest: that is a fair point to make. cathy mcmorris rodgers, she told the members to be serious, professional in this meeting with president obama in the capitol basement, to not ask for

pictures or autographs. if you look at all the media stories about house republicans being unruly, battling boehner, they are trying right now in this 2013 year to be a little more serious and repair their reputation. there may have been some scattered stories about tweeting and using cell phones. i think you see that everywhere in american life. host: chairman of the house budget committee, paul ryan, delivering remarks at the conference. focusing on his budget plan he unveiled the weekend. clip] >> president obama and senate democrats said they want a balanced budget -- a balanced approach to our fiscal issues. their budget does not balance. this will lead us right into a debt crisis. your opportunities, less security. what will this look like? lenders will demand higher interest rates, and when they

do, interest rates will skyrocket on credit cards, and mortgages, on car loans. if interest rates rise, debt payments will overwhelm all other items in the budget. that will overwhelm our economy. our finances will collapse. the safety net will unravel. the most vulnerable will suffer. do you think this cannot happen here? just look at europe. we do not accept that future, not for our children, not for our country. today, we invite president obama to do what president clinton did, to work with republicans in congress to balance the budget. he can join in the effort, or he can choose the status quo, but he must choose. the american people deserve an honest account of our challenges. and what is needed to confront them. we have an opportunity to place them with courage and resolve. as we have always done throughout history. host: congressman paul ryan from his weekly address.

how was he received at the conference? guest: relatively warm light. he remains a popular figure. if you look at the to comment on the ticket in 2012, romney has been in california at his beachfront mansion, semi- retired. he came back to the conference for his first speech. ryan is a fascinating story because he comes back to the house because speaker john boehner starts to craft a budget again. he remains a key figure in congressional politics. he is still the chairman of the budget committee. he came back to the conference not talking about 2016. ryan's speech was different because it talked about current issues right now in congress. it was an update of sorts for conservative activists about capitol hill. that is where ryan sees his future. he may run for president, but not everything he does is a

calculation towards that goal. he relishes being inside the house, being a player in congressional politics. being a budget committee chairman is something he is comfortable with. was the headline from politico -- the gavel for the house ways and means committee will come up in a few years. ryan has been focusing on the budget for salam. he likes the idea of coming back to congress, being weighs in means committee chairman in a few years. one thing that animates him is tax politics. this is a guy that grew up working for jack kemp. he knows how to articulate a message on taxes and tax cuts. he would like to reform the tax code. that is his next project. remember bob dole was on the ticket in the 1970's with gerald ford. he comes back 20 years later and is a republican nominee.

ryan, because he was on national ticket so early, he has a long career, decades ahead in congress, where he will continue to be a player. host: our next caller is from springfield, oregon, on our line for independents. good morning. caller: good morning. i hope the party follows senator ator cruz's dialogue about not telling americans on american soil. same big promises, we want smaller government, we do not want to do unnecessary wars and stuff. same with obama. he ran on shutting down guantanamo bay and closing down big brother. he made all worse. i guess that is what i want to say, not so much the speeches,

but the execution. host: thank you for the call. let me sherry what -- -- let me share with you what bill kristol writes this morning. he points out -- he points out americans being tired of the wars, wars that bill kristol and others have supported over the years, but the essence of his peace, loyal opposition, educating americans about what the gop represents. guest: that is the real divide. rand paul is on one side, towards a more libertarian, isolationist foreign policy. was american military presence. bill kristol is more forceful

in american policy, and he explains that very well in the weekly standard every week. what you see with rand paul is that he tried to capture the moment and recognize the politics of right now and use that for his own agenda and foreign policy. we have a long practice to talk about how he thinks corn policy is a way to revolutionize the republican party, to get some new voters, to appeal to people. i asked senator paul, in one or two sentences, what enables you to think that foreign policy, especially your perspective, can be the thing that changes the party? he said two words, the war weariness. bill kristol reference to that. call thinks the country is weary of war. he thinks finally the republican party is weary of war. this is the time, when his father was unable to connect with a national audience, he can use this moment to connect. from pennsylvania on

the republican line. caller: steve, you looked dapper as ever with a green tie. host: if you can wear green on st. patrick's day, we are all in trouble. caller: we have an irish household right here. we're getting ready to celebrate my son's birthday. host: how old? caller: 12 today. host: what's his name? caller: ronald. o'connor is my last name. i want to get going on the subject for the future of the committee -- the republican party. i think the future is bright. we've got a big fight ahead of us. i can tie it into the mitt romney 47% remark. your next subject with hunger in america. i think we got a lot of calls for that, there are a lot of

poor people out there. you go to africa, you see real hunger. hear, mrs. obama -- one thing i give her credit for -- is fighting for this -- fighting for this thing and nutrition. our kids are overweight. we have an obesity problem. wasad a caller earlier who describing gun control and having guns that fire 1000 bullets a minute. averagelike to see what american citizen owns a gun that fires 1000 bullets a minute. she is clueless. yet she gets to vote and it sounds good. we have another caller talk about sarah palin. ago, sarahter years palin called for missile defense in alaska. what did we find out this past week? obama is putting a missile

defense in alaska. sarah palin was onto something "for years ago. we've got these voters who are itaid of responsibility -- will be hard to educate them. take it all away, but we have to rein in this excessive spending on poor people who are hungry. host: but me ask you this. was there a speaker resonated with you over the past couple of days? yesterday included, i saw our davis -- artur davis and sarah palin. they all do. i like the young crew. i like rubio, paul ryan, cruz. i am their generation. i'm 47. i am right there.

i get young kids. they stand in the polling booth with me. they volunteer. there is an underpinning growing. we may not see it -- hopefully we see it, the sooner the better. you see the audience, you see the younger people coming up, and like mccain, i think mccain and when the gramm got slapped back this week. got slappedraham back this week. host: thank you for the call. happy 12th birthday to your son on the st. patrick's day. a shout out to liz. she is one of our more prolific tweeters. the callerink brought some interesting points. about the public health obesity

question, one thing about sarah palin's speech that really captured the moment was when she brought out the soda and talked about how conservatives disagree with mayor bloomberg on the so the band. they want individual liberty and freedom. -- the soda ban. they want individual liberty and freedom. as much as the party is having a confusing time in reestablishing itself, their core principles, core philosophy on individual liberty and freedom that will push the party forward and help it regain its footing. the excitement about the republican team ahead of 2014, 2016 israel. it surprised me walking around to see how negative people are about romney's campaign. looking ahead, they feel excited about what is ahead in republican primaries. they think some leaders who have

been floating around for a few years are maturing and becoming national stature type politicians. host: the caller mentioned senator ted crews -- ted cruz. andade some news this week in exchange with senator dianne feinstein on the issue of guns and high-powered magazines an assault rifle weapons. he also delivered remarks yesterday at the see pak conference.- cpac [video clips] we need to champion growth. get thet every stage to economy booming. we need to repeal obamacare. [applause] [applause]

we need to repeal dodd-frank. [applause] talk about a bill you do not have to read any further than the title. [laughter] need to eliminate corporate welfare. [applause] we need to build the keystone pipeline. [applause] .e need to rein in the epa [applause] in west texas, the epa is trying to use a lizard to shut down oil and gas production. of lizards, they make darn fine boots.

host: what you think? inst: what a rapid rise american politics. here he is three months into being the united states senator and he is already the keynote speaker at cpac. you can go on conservative blogs, this guy is as popular as rand paul, in part his intelligence. he knows how to articulate conservative issues. it is also charisma. watch and during that speech. you see him without a teleprompter, without notes, walking around a stage, almost as if he was a television host, in gauging the audience, and that really captures the imagination of all the attendees and conservatives watching on television. they think this is a guy who can go in a presidential election. host: there was what some in this town described as a slap down by barbara mikulski,

critical on the senate floor of and then the, exchange with senator feinstein. guest: he has irritated some of his senior colleagues who believe he is a little too blunt, rising a little too fast. he is getting cheers from the right for battling the left on capitol hill and for not backing down on his views. his dichotomy. part of his appeal is that he is doing these things, but also it is challenging his long-term .uccess in the senate to b i do not think he cares. he really believes he has a conservative agenda, he is a princeton-harvard educated lawyer. it is not thinking needs to sit on the sidelines for too long. he thinks he can dive right in

and be a jim demint type figure and push the party to the right. program is carried live on c-span radio. we welcome our listeners on xm or wcsp fm. we have this -- guest: he does have that cadence. you could interpret that as a compliment. scott walker, the governor of wisconsin, he is the son of a baptist preacher. have a similar style. they're able to walk around a stage, not just read lines off the page. that makes both of them compelling figures to watch. he is also hispanic, cuban heritage. he was born in canada. conservatives look at him as somebody represent -- represents a big state. he has an ivy league education. he is smart.

he does not sound like an elitist. he talks as a conservative. you cannot underestimate the power of that in american politics. many republican politicians, a few republican politicians really connect to the base on a visceral level. does that. regardless of what he does in the senate or how he annoys people, he will be a force. host: there is this -- guest: i think that is a little unfair. you could say most politicians sound like snake oil salesman. that is a common criticism -- criticism of all these people here. being smith.or he is somebody who has argued many tough legal cases, won many legal battles. he knows what he's talking about when it comes to the law. he has worked on the political campaigns.

that thisabout him is is somebody who did not serve an elective office in texas. he is in his 40's, ran for the senate against the odds, against the lieutenant governor in texas, and won. if somebody with his background wins a senate race, that says something. host: another point -- from san diego on the democrats line. caller: i wanted to make a comment on marco rubio. he always says that he does not for a special pathway immigrants, yet cubans have a special pathway. that pathway was made easy for them so republicans could control florida.

other republicans criticize the pathway because they think it is democratic. cubans already compromise 7% of the hispanic vote. mexican-american's compromise two-thirds of the hispanic vote in the united states. the rest are central americans, who are very pro-comprehensive immigration. then there are parker ricans. parker ricans are american citizens. -- puerto ricans are american citizens. they cannot relate. cubans cannot relate to mexican- americans and central americans. bringing mark rubio hispanic votes, it is not going to work. nuts.uz, that guy is if the republican party wants good advice from mexican american conservatives, maybe the conservative

columnist for the san diego union. i would like to have an answer on that. thank you very much. guest: i disagree on your point that cuban-americans cannot connect. there are many political refugees from coming out -- from cuba who escape communism, including mark rubio's parents. they were never able to return back because of castro. as a, i do not see him cuban american figure. i see him as a national figure, an american figure who has to appeal to all demographic groups, mostly because he is able to take political risks. was heican politics, willing to take a risk in the senate? whether you agree with this immigration position, when it comes to politics, he's able to stand out there and do something on immigration that is not want to be popular with every element of the party.

i sat down with rubio a few times and talked with -- talked with him about immigration, and he always says, it is not amnesty. that is the core argument. he wants to have a path, not necessarily to citizenship, but to legitimacy for illegal workers seek to have a better system. he wants to improve the system for undocumented workers. he wants to improve the security at the border. there is not much traction right now on it. if anything happens, rubio will be a key player. that is why he remains somebody to watch. host: our last call from california, mike is on the phone with robert costas. caller: good morning. three questions. why benghazi? why mali? on a terrorist attack natural gas facility in algeria? one answer. president obama's

unconstitutional ousting of more mark coffey. the deeper lesson -- muomar qaddafi. the deeper lesson or mccain and aretor graham is that they able to -- they are not able to link the interventions in with these disasters. their schemes backfire. the point goes to rand paul made. his viewsd paul and on foreign policy are becoming much more part of the conversation in republican politics, in a way they have not in previous years. rand paul understands this. he is able to challenge lindsey gramm and john mccain, they have been one chip in a conversation for years, and to have rand paul go right at them for calling hampshire -- calling him a wac

survive,and for him to it says something about all of these gentlemen in vault. -- involved. apologized, byin the way. how many people in attendance? guest: thousands. it was a much bigger facility. a few thousand more. the number was around 10,000. that depends on who was speaking. it was crowded. a lot of college republicans. a lot of conservative activists going back to the 1950's and 1960's. robert cost out of national review magazine. the mother much for stopping by. when we come back we will turn our attention to the cpac conference from krystal ball. now one of the host of

msnbc's "the cycle." then we will look at cyber security and hacking in this country and who is to blame. that is coming up on "washington journal." we are featuring history in the literary life of a community just outside of washington d.c., in alexandria, virginia. pi p.m. eastern on c-span at 3. the history program will feature a look at alexandria through the eyes of our press president george washington. -- our first president george washington. >> this is george washington's favorite tavern. he dined here frequently. there is a tavern on the side. the current building where the

museum is today was built circa 1785. the new addition on the corner was added in 1792. the new edition is over 200 years old too. people who died here included john adams, tom -- thomas jepsen, james madison, and james monroe. thomas dorson had his own -- his inaugural dinner here. -- jefferson had his inaugural dinner here. was well known all over the area. that is why presidents would come here. it was probably the best place to eat in this entire area. he left here to establish residence in baltimore and then in washington city. >> you think about george washington, you think about him winning the revolutionary war being busted character on your dollar bill. at this tavern, he was seen as a

human being. he was seen dining, drinking, dancing. he would tell stories, meet friends here, have conversations, you see him as a real person here in this tavern. not as a statue. on c-span2's booktv programming and c-span 3's american history programming, or local content vehicle traveling around the country to showcase the literary history around the country. you can check out our web site. or feature this week alexandria, virginia. joining us from new york is msnbc's krystal ball. as you look at the conference which racked up over the weekend, what is your take away? guest: i always want to be careful not to read too much into these things. especially since some of the

most popular republican figures in the country, bob macdonald, chris christie, were excluded. i would say the big takeaway past to be rand paul. not only did he win the straw poll, not only was he tremendously well received, but his views and the views of his daughter are becoming increasingly mainstream within the republican party. he has more political skill than his dad did. looking forward to 2016, i do not know that he is in a position to get republican nomination, but i do think he will be an important factor in the conversation. he will have a whole within the republican party in that nomination process. a looks like you'll probably want to run for president in 2016. to me, that was the big standout, was rand paul. if i can add one other piece, senator rob portman coming up in support of gay marriage, talking

about a personal evolution after his son came out of the closet to him, came out as gay. there was gary little discussion of cambridge adel and lgbt quality or traditional marriage marriage or lgbt "-- lgbt quality or traditional marriage gret think that was another bit interesting take away. can the republican party have the so-called big tent to bring in the so-called moderate and independent voters while also holding true to the principles that we heard from rand paul, jeb bush, eric cantor, mitch mcconnell, and others? can you do both?

guest: absolutely. i think the democratic party to my even though we tend to be a party that supports lgbt writes, tend to be a party that supports abortion rights, we have those factions within our party that not. they are allowed to be part of a party. they are not run out. people feel like it is a bit more inclusion mary. with the republican party, it is the same thing. stay true to your values, your core message, but where they have gone wrong is by enforcing this ideological purity through the primary process in particular, groups like the club for growth, and groups like the tea party that are enforcing this rigid ideology. at the speakers conference mentioned this, you cannot be a party that is opposed to the president. you cannot just be a party that is opposed to taxes. to ok,ve to be more open what are our solutions, and not

immediately dismiss things like anything labeled as amnesty, anything labeled as raising revenue or taxes out of hand. you have to be open-minded about what are good solutions and tied to evidence. i think if they can do that -- it seems to me, i'm optimistic there are those voices, who are striking that cord and wanting to come back to being a party of ideas -- then you start to see a more inclusive party. host: and coulter delivered remarks. and our twitter page -- [video clip] >> no wonder media matters' has called karl rove and republican voice of reason -- reason. in cenaclee arrogance arrived last month when karl rove and his professional consultants announced the formation of the

conservative victory project. they really thought they were going to get away with it. you can put lipstick on a pig, but it remains critical conservatives and at -- but a pig it remains. conservatives and that this thunderous a nationwide a broadside. in 24 hours, he was in full retreat. why? i love the t party, he now proclaims. why? some of my best friends are conservatives, he pleads. incredibly, he cites pat toomey and rand paul as people he has helped elect. he has even stated that he ran the state of texas for ronald reagan in 1980, which is interesting since he never worked for ronald reagan in 1980. his last thing the gop needs is for the anti-conservative, professional political class and

affecting its ranks. the last thing we need as conservatives is having them and treat hours. one: as you hear at least conservative voice, what does that tell you about where the party is going on at least from one strategist who has played a key role in a number of past campaigns? it is incredible how the mighty have fallen in that way. i think he would have been embraced at -- as a leader, as an architect. in a way, i do not disagree with him here. i do not think the problem for the republican party in terms are running candidates that are not todd akin or richard maurer dock or sharon engel is putting money behind other candidates. establishment candidates have money. what has changed is the todd money, grass-roots

support. i can understand how that is a frustrating feeling, trying to throw money at the problem and solving it that way. it highlights this divide between those who do want to broaden the party and those who say, you know what, our problem with john mccain, our problem with mitt romney was not that they were too far to the right, it was that they were not clear about their conservative principles. there were the mainstream candidates. they were the establishment candidates. they did not do so well. i would argue that mitt romney's problem, he had a number of them, but one of them was that got killed so far to the right and things like immigration that he could not come back to the center. it is a remarkable illustration of the divide in the party. host: michael has this on twitter -- working people call you on twitter? .uest: @krystalball

host: this is from michael on twitter -- guest: i think that is a fair question. one of the things i have said is that we need a dynamic republican party, because if the democratic party is the only one looking at things like economic inequality, looking at things like poverty and how to lift people out of it, then you are going to have stale ideas. you're not going to have competition and this beautiful war of ideas that we should have in our democracy. i think that is fair, that the democratic party has gotten a bit complacent because they are not being pushed. i take that as a critique. says another viewer republicans are eating each other. this is your calls it a wonderful thing to observe. [laughter] there is a civil war when it comes to a number of issues. we saw that between senators mccain and paul following his filibuster on the drone issue. guest: that is absolutely right.

you'll recall david brooks had a column awhile back calling for the republican party to split into two. i think this is a process that has to happen. i would not say they are eating each other alive, but certainly there is a lot of friction. ultimately, i hope that that is for the best of the party. it's got to get a little bit worse before it gets better in my view. on the rand paul issue specifically, i do think his views are becoming a libertarian, non-interventionist views, those are becoming more mainstream. it is hard to see the republican party going fully to that view. what is difficult is that there is no in-between. you have either the hard rock, like john mccain, and you have a total isolationist, like rand paul. maybe they can strike a more middle balance. we're talking about the

conservative conference which racked up over the weekend in washington, d.c.. our guest is crystal ball of msnbc. on thursday, remarks by gov. rick perry of texas to run for president in 2012. taken a lookso back at mitt romney and john mccain. [video clip] >> the popular media narrative' is that this country has shifted away from conservative ideals, as evidenced by the last two presidential elections. that is what they think. that is what they say. that might be true if republicans have actually nominated conservative candidates in 2008 and 2012. it might be peak -- it might be true. now we are told that our party must shift appeal to the growing hispanic demographic.

let me say something about what appeals to hispanics in states like texas. it is the free enterprise agenda that allows small businesses to prosper. free of government interference. it is the policies that value the family unit as the best and closest form of government. it is the belief in life, faith, and god. host: as you hear from governor rick perry of texas, you're reaction? is thei do not think it american public that has moved left. i think it is that the republican party has moved right. part of a quandary for the republican party is frankly the democratic party has embraced a lot of the ideas that were good ideas from the republican side. if you take an approach to climate change, cap and trade was a republican idea. it came out of right-wing think

tanks. it is a market-based reform, if you care about climate change. it is the logical reform. we adopted that. if you look at the senate budget that just came out, it is a one- to-one tax increase and spending cut. it is not some far left, big spending, big taxing document. in a lot of ways, i think the democratic party has consumed some of the good ideas that came out of the conservative movement, and in response, republicans have moved further to the right. in terms of economic ideas, i do not think the american public has moved. i think it is that the republican party has moved. on things like immigration and gay marriage, there there has been a shift to the left. i would argue with immigration, part of that comes from a weakened economy where we are seeing less and that immigration as a people are not feeling the stress as much. now that they are seeing hopes

for the economy, they are not as concerned with people potentially taking their jobs, lower wages, or paying jobs. that is an issue. on game marriage, as more people asve become -- gay marriage, more people have become more comfortable coming out, families are realizing that they have somebody they love is a. aire in my church, in my community. in myy are in my church, community. on economic principles, i do not really think so. host: a graduate of university of virginia, you ran for the house of representatives in 2010. any interest in seeking elected office again? guest: it sound like a very political answer. this is the truth -- my life has taken about four for 180 degree turn in my career path. i never expected to run for

congress. i never expected to be doing what i am doing now. i'm opened for the pact opens next. georgia onler from the democrats' line. go ahead. caller: good morning. i think you do a great job on a "the cycle." i heard paul ryan speak. reference to president obama, he said he should go back to doing what bill clinton did. my point is, why don't we go back to bill clinton taxes and his plan when everything was doing great? i do not understand why they are so stuck on and not raising taxes and doing this? thing.- this tax why not go back to the bill clinton time and see how the economy will rebound?

you.: thank i certainly agree with that. it is interesting because republicans had to set up this contrast with the president. i had to say, here, bill clinton, that was a reasonable democrat. it was not quite harmonious time that they like to recall. we had higher tax rates then, we had a booming economy. as our population ages we have to make choices about how we are going to connect to supporting them. there was a research the came out recently that asked people what you want to do about social security. he were willing to pay higher taxes in order to keep the promises that we have made, and even expand benefits. they want to expand social security. we have to adjust for the fact

that we do have an aging population. it is when the cost more. we have to have a higher revenue base to support that or else we are going to have to make some cuts that i do not think the population wants to make. commentother referring to rick perry and rick santorum -- in-line guest: they are going through an autopsy. i do not want to throw out names. that did come from bobby j. del. i think there needs to be more open mindedness. i do not think these are stupid individuals. i think they need to be willing to look at all the options that are on the table, looked at the evidence, and really be tied to that evidence. in a lot of ways i think conservatives and has gotten away from being research-based,

looking at what is going to work and going from there, to become much more of an ideology which it is guided by principle. i think that is the place where there needs to be a shift. host: there is this point -- another speaker over the rubio,, senator marco here is what he had to say -- [video clip] >> this because i believe states have the right to define marriage in a traditional way does not make me a bigot. just because we believe that all life is worthy of protection at every stage in its development does not making a chauvinist.

areact the peopel who actually closed minded are the people who love to preach about the certainty of a science with regards to our climate and ignore the absolute fact that science has proven that life begins at conception. [applause] and so our challenge is to create an agenda, our principles still work. applying our time test principles to the challenges of today. -- senatorr marco marco rubio. guest: he served of what it wants to hear. what i thought was most noteworthy was that he did not mention immigration at all.

that would be the place where he would be -- it is also the thing he is best known for right now. strategically he made the right call. i would have been impressed if he continued the courage he has shown on the issue of immigration by trying to make the conservative argument for why we do need immigration reform and why we can't go on having at broken immigration system with 12 million undocumented people living in the shadows of society. we have to, as conservatives, i think he can make the point as conservatives we need to take responsibility for the situation and face the hard facts of what to do with these individuals. host: michael says this --

is there a liberal alternative to cpac? there is nothing of the size of a cpac. a lot of the energy and the progressive left is with the net group community, the blo gging community. we have a number of high elected officials to speak there in the personalities. i have been a number of times and i always find it incredibly thought-provoking. there are always good to back- and-forth said. as our put that up there cause is alt. host: michael was joining us from pennsylvania on the democrats' line. msnbc and the media on -- i am aside

conservative. i am a christian and family oriented. hatred discerning anyone that disagrees with you. there is no way you will even take an idea from the other side and give it a chacne. you just want to bury the republicans. this country is made up of a lot of different ideas coming together. if you have a lot of different ideas you take the best possible solution. host: we will get a response.

guest: that is the point made a little while ago. we need a strong republican party. it is easy to poke fun at gaps that are made. rape comments that are off color -- i do believe strongly that we do need a vibrant public and party -- vibrant republican party. when asked earlier where the ideas from the democratic party are i think that it is a fair criticism. there isn't any the engagement on what we can do to combat income equality. there is no competition. the ideas are getting a little bit stale. feel hatreddid not in my heart for anyone. for there to be a vibrant, dynamic, thought leading republican party again. host: of the share with you a

piece of town from "the london telegraph," it was written by a former strategist of george w. bush -- he says once all the nobles were granted an audience of the kings. since last weekend he began writing that mr. and mrs. regular citizen have been denied that tour of the white house because of a clampdown of federal spending. he points out that president still has high donors come to the white house and the average citizen is unable to. those issues that seems to be resonating with

voters, with the american people, and certainly to the white house press secretary. of aest: it is a bit tempest in a teapot. we knew the sequestration cuts would have impact. there would be real noticeable changes. we were one of that. -- we were warned of that. choice they made. it is a hard trade-offs. it is not somebody that anybody wants but it is the decision they made. to me it is interesting how on the one hand republicans said the sequestration cuts are not going to matter, they are exaggerating the impact. but on the other hand any time there is a noticeable impact there is an outcry about that and why would that particular change be made when fact -- when in fact you're cutting

discretionary funds. that is going to have real noticeable impact. next call is from the independent line from alabama. goodr: she would make a spokesman for sodom and gomorrah. she has a good way of making evil good and good evil. host: 81 to respond? -- did you want to respond? guest: judge not, my friend. he begins by saying --

who are those leaders and to the youth think they're looking for? think they areou looking for? think marco rubio was well received. aftereminded of the time 2008 when there was another conservative republican soul- searching. maybe not quite as deeply as they are doing now. there was an inclination at that time to say we lost because john mccain was not conservative enough. samenow hearing the arguments being made particularly at cpac. i heard a lot of bashing of various people. there was some failed jabs at different parts of the republican party.

i did not hear a lot in the way of new ideas, new ways forward. i do not think that was the problem. i think american people heard the principles and solid republican party stands for clearly in the last election. taking aim bozell at republicans for possibly compromising too much. more from yesterday's conference. [video clip] eric cantor,er, you said all of the right things to conservatives to compel the gop back to majority control in used the leadership positions there. like every single republican elected to congress,

solemnly vowed to rid us of obama-care. which you can do by simply refusing to fund it. why haven't you done so? the red meat of the republican conservative party. guest: 8 it up. -- they ate it up. two very popular republican governors were not invited. chris christie may be the most republican -- maybe the most popular republican figure in the country. there is a big distinction between that and someone like chris christie and bob macdonald to have to run and make things work and have to reach out and how to figure out how to get things done. bob macdonald took a lot of heat in virginia. keep in mind that mcdonald and

christie are both very conservative. man but heservative made a compromise with democrats on va's troubling transportation infrastructure. virginia has one of the worst traffic situations in the entire country. he raised some taxes to fund inf -- to fund transportation infrastructure. it was done in the most conservative way possible and yet it is taking a lot of heat for that. there's testified for someone between -- there is this debate between brent bozell and someone like a governor who has to live and govern in the world. host: two states electing new governors, virginia and -- in lin

the race between the attorney general and former dnc chair. what is your read on this race? host: i was disappointed that bill did not get in because i think that would have been a lot of fun to watch. i have a lot of respect for him and i think he's been quite courageous. i would say that because of where virginia is, terry is -- they are pulling even. i think terry has a better shot because of the state has moved. the opposition is not going to moderate in any way to appeal. of also had a number republican business leaders in the state voicing deep concerns over can to nelly. ken.er

hurtbelieve it will virginia's image of a diverse and open business state. he is coming out and willing to publicly say we have issues there. but think that is a bad sign. terry is not a perfect candidate. but he is a very charismatic guy and very business savvy, something that virginia has respected. i think he could potentially reach at some of those more moderate independent or even right leading business people in northern virginia and gets their backing. i would give the edge to him. we should add that historic the va does not elect governors of the same party as the president who was just elected. we have that uphill climb in terms of history. host: terry has never held elected office.

he lost the primary four years ago. does that help or hurt him among the voters? guest: i think voters love that business experience. i think the business background he has is very helpful. in terms of the primary last time around, it did not end up hurting him in terms of further political career. there are people who got the nomination. i have a lot of respect for -- to lin . they're people who said we should have picked terry. go throughave to that divisive primary process. he can really set himself up to where he needs to be for the

state of virginia. host: we are talking with krystal ball who is an msnbc contributor. how you approach the cycle? what is your mission or goal for that hour? tackle our goal is to serious topics and to take on ideas that may be other people are not-about -- are not talking about. we tried have a little bit of fun every day while delving as deeply as the can into a lot of different ideas and topics. i feel incredibly blessed to be able to do it. i mentioned earlier that i never in my life thought i would end up in a career in media. fieldnot where i set my in any point. i feel incredibly blessed to get to do it, to bring great things to the table, articles that i of

red and books that i have read the i think are fascinating and that i think our audience would like to get into as well. one other thing we have on our show, we have to be relatively progressive people. my great friend who is very conservative -- and one of the things i am very proud of is the dialogue all four of us are able to have. we concerned -- we were concerned there would be a three on one dynamic but that hasn't been the case. and respectreelike each other, i think there is a list -- because we truly like and respect each other, i think there is a level of respect there. "the: why is this call cycle?" it is the reference to the four of us sidling around to the days we are leading the

show, cycling through the topics of the show. it references a few different things. host: st. louis, missouri, independent line. i watch a wide variety of shows. -- first, to put it in a nut shell of the republicans can do is criticize obama is because many of their -- they are support afraid they are going to get primaried. the real problem the democrats is tweetsddress

record to continue to lose millions more jobs and trillions in -- we are going to continue to lose millions more jobs and trillions in revenue. atyou went shopping christmas time, that was one that darn thing out there. we have to take his campaign money out of this and eliminate the negative this. eliminate the negative-ness. i do not have respect for any of you. socialism.ant we do not want all of this bridge money. we want real private sector jobs and you are all afraid of big business. be real. thank you so much for the call. guest: in terms of the republican party there are fundamental issues.

have more of a threat from the right in terms of a primary challenge then you do from the left in terms of the general challenge. we saw a sort of the rhetoric they are looking for from mitt romney to his campaign fund- raisers. in terms of campaign finance, it is an absolutely corrosive issue in a democracy. it is one where i am not sure what the solution is. given the supreme court ruling, given the fact we have had the station before, i do not think it has made things any better. my own view, which is a radical idea but one that people have argued for, is having some sort of incentive for voting so we expand the electorate.

those who go to the polls are the hard right and hard left. we need to work on increasing our voter turnout. there would be more incentive than to find these more centrist and middle of the road solutions. both sides have an incentive to play to the extremes. of a manufacturing, it is one of my passions and interest. i think we maybe on the cusp of a revelation. -- of a revolution. thingsting would make much more customizable. is a really exciting development. ball of msnbc, thank you for being with us. guest: it was my pleasure. host: coming up at the top of

the hour, our guest is republican congressman of louisiana steve scalise. the committee is going to look at its own possible budget if the committee is not satisfied with paul ryan's budget plan. turn our next we will attention to the issue of hacking and cyber security. will be joining us in a couple of minutes. nancy is keeping track of c-span radio. to pope and cpac seems dominate the conversation. >> two two topics are mentioned on the sunday talk show as well as the u.s. economy and negotiations on capitol hill and

nuclear threat from north korea. house budget committee ranking member chris van holland and republican whip kevin mccarthy. you can hear house speaker john boehner ad hoc year to sarah and former secretary of state madeleine albright stephen hadley. at two o'clock p.m. the re-eyre of fox news sunday. fox news sunday. re-airste of the union at 3pm dr. ben carson, pediatric their

of surgery at johns hopkins university -- -- and the chairman of the republican national committee. the sunday network talk shows this afternoon on c-span radio are brought to you as a public service by the networks and c- span. they begin at noon eastern with nbc's "meet the press." the:00, cnn state of union. at 4, face the nation. you can listen to them on 91. fm in tehe washington area. l" "washington journal continues.

host: we take a look at cyber security and the sources of the hacking situation. thank you for being with us. we heard from the chinese government over the weekend denying that china is in any way involved in the hacking of u.s. personals, both and business. do you believe them? guest: i do not. there is a long pattern of hacking emanating from china. it is systematic, it is patient, and it is targeting key industries in the united states, law firms, companies that are innovation.lot of where intellectual property is stolen it could be very valuable to china. it is hard to believe that is happening randomly.

it is at least acquiescence as from the state to allow it to occur. host: this is from "the new york daily news," -- this story points out that some of the information that comes from these computers -- consumers are being ripped off. there is a lot of cyber- crime occurring where hackers are going after people's identities. that is causing potentially billions of dollars of damage to citizens every year in the united states. we have that occurring as well more serious state- sponsored activity, which is

targeting businesses and stealing information. one of the reasons we wanted to invite on today is there is a test of vacation on 6 -- a test of the vacation -- he testified before the senate committee tuesday. here's a portion of what he says the threat is here in the u.s.. [video clip] actors ared on state using expertise. they achieve strategic objectives by gathering sensitive information from republican and private-sector entities. -- from public and private- sector entities. these capabilities but all sectors of our country at risk from government to private networks and critical infrastructures. terroriste organizations are interested in developing cyber capabilities. as separate criminals are using

a glowing black market to sell tools the fall in the hands of both state and on state actors. of things came from what he told the committee. first of all the u.s. is planning retaliation for these individuals for countries or terrorists involved in cyber threats. and also we could face a cyber 9/11 in the coming decade. guest: there has been a consistent pattern from administration officials over the last three or four months where they have made it clear that the united states reversed -- reserves the rights to respond to syria's cyber attacks. examples we can launch a pre attack. states ise united letting other people know we take this seriously and we are

going to defend ourselves. host: how can the person might prevent ourselves from being a victim of this? guest: protecting yourself from cyber security is in a lot of ways like your personal health. sooner or later you may get sick the matter what you do. cyber security is a lot like that. what you want to do is minimize the chances that you will get sick and get better as quickly as possible. the same thing is true with site security. but following practices of not clicking on attachments where you are not sure where they came from -- certainly not opening spam. you can lessen the chance that your computer will become infected. even following the best practices there is still a chance it can become affected. michelle obama, who i am sure has very good cyber security practices, she had her personal information stolen. it is about managing the risk rather than you thinking you can

protect yourself from big tax. hacks. big host: the president saying " we have made it clear to china and other state actors that we expect them to follow international norms and abide by international rules." that is something that james clapper echoed in his testimony. host: the united states is pushing very hard for a set of the international norms, which is basically the rules of the of what is acceptable and not acceptable. certain countries like china and russia believe that filtering internet content is a legitimate role of the state. -- theyieve certain believe the government should have a right to control that.

in the united states we disagree. we support free speech. that is an example of that kind of disagreement that is occurring right now. if you look at if -- host: if you look at the threats we facing in this country, is there anything we can do directly? guest: one has to look at the broader picture of the relations between u.s. and other countries. in the case of china, they are a huge trading partner. there are a lot of matters where we and china cooperate. one has to be the tensions created by raising this issue in the broader context of that relationship. i think obama has indicated the u.s. will push harder on that line. one has to wonder how far we can go in pushing that agenda. human rights, for example, in the broader context of our relationship with china.

that countries like iran, is a different situation. united states might be willing to do things to of iran that it would not be willing to do the china. host: the consensus in tweet or give us a phone call. -- you can send us a tweet or give us a phone call. we have a line set up for those of you in a third party. i know you were not part of those closed door sessions but if you could special chelate -- if you could speculate what they are telling members of the senate committee --

guest: i would guess the united states has good intelligence on what is happening in cyberspace, particularly on the attributions side. that information can be hard to come by. certainly in the open world it can be hard to trace back a cyber-attacks. there are ways of doing it but it can be difficult. my guess is the intelligence community has a lot more information on who is doing what. host: let this go to mark joining us from florida on the independent line. good morning. caller: good morning. how feasible is it for an attacker to alter data? for example, placing a technical flaw in military blueprints or sabotaging tie -- or sabotaging scientific research? guest: it is possible to do that. the answer, unfortunately, is it

depends. there are ways to protect against that. if one is always aware of that threat and trying to protect against it, there are ways to do tracks to make sure no one has tampered with the information. that way it could potentially be difficult for someone to do that. if you are not doing that and you are not prepared for this kind of attacks they are doable and they can cause a lot of harm. host: barry from california on the democrats' line. good morning. like ourt looks software is so advanced. the guard at generation 8 on software and yet our physical inrastructure is back generation 3. maybe that is our problem. so roads and bridges are old, maybe we need to update everything and change our routers and hubs and make things a little bit better. about anu talked

excellent point. there is a very close connection between hardware and software. that is true with even phones and computers. a lot of companies are working security to provide literally in the chip itself. after that they would integrate the software with the hardware. the infrastructure of the internet -- as new routers, online there is more focus on the hardware component as well as looking as the software component. you are correct that there are threats on the hardware side. our stories of counterfeit parts, for example, which are a big example -- which are a big -- that is absolutely a concern. host: we are talking about china.

former soviet union states saying they have been the likely source of credit attacking. how serious the problem is this? guest: that is a serious problem. this is where things get tricky. there are some many kinds of cyber threats. is what is generally called cyber crime or the goal is stealing or making money. either you're stealing money directly or stealing information that can be sold on the black market. the threat from china is more about espionage and the stealing of secrets. they are each serious. are a financial institution or a credit union, what kind of stake do they have to prevent this kind of cyber- stretched -- cyber-threat?

guest: they put a lot of safeguards in place and provide a lot of checks and balances along the way. said banks are losing money to cyber crime, both for and the banks. in thebeen in the news last week. there is a kind of attack called a denial of service attack. the attackers is tried to prevent the bank from being able to function as a business by overloading it with too much information coming in so the bank computers cannot handle our normal transactions. money by not being opened to customers. this kind of attacks are very serious. this issue came up to the white house. the white house, along

with the president and senior officials, warned business leaders that -- six banks hit by cyber threats just in the last couple of months. host: exactly. guest: cyber attacks have been occurring for years but the awareness of their severity, how widespread they are, the awareness of that is growing. people are now release starting to pay attention to cyber as a serious issue. i think that is a good thing. it is a problem we need to address. host: we are talking about cyber security and hacking here in the u.s.. our guest is irving lachow, he serves as a tack and u.s. national security program director. toependent line, welcome

"washington journal". everyone is concerned, especially about hits out of china part . we have a good military network but there is no cooperation with the europeans with private industry to say we are all going to get together and form one union in washington d.c. and work together on this as a team. excellent point. there are efforts going on along those lines. one could argue about how successful they are being. those are occurring on a lot of different tracks. there is a european convention on cyber crime, which provides rules of the road and says that certain kinds of activities are

illegal. united states is working with europe to get more countries to sign it. so far limited number have signed it. there are countries were hacking is still legal. that is a problem. the u.s. is also pursuing a bilateral negotiation with countries. one-on-one trying to reach an agreement with what we should do with that. that is a slow thinking process. is -- thecomplication future of the internet is at stake. the question of who governs the internet and who runs the internet and how cyprus' security is managed underneath in play.t is all there was a conference in dubai where a number of countries around the world proposed some new regulations for regulating the internet in a way that the united states and countries in

europe cannot support. that ties to this broader cyber security question. --t: matt has this point great question. i do not know the answer. i would guess that they are probably not involved in that. what we have seen over many years is a pattern of activity from china -- there have been a number of cases where there have been so clear espionage of chinese dissonance. chinesee areas that the government is concerned about one can not only trade -- not only trace those attacks back to china itself but was wondering if -- the line we're not seeing

that kind of thing tracing back to russia. more oftend to see is the criminal activity. this doesn't mean the russian government isn't doing some spying. i imagine they are. there isn't a lot of evidence that we can all accept that point that that kind of activity. host: budde is coded new jersey -- let us go to new jersey. caller: thank you for taking my call. what percentage do you think of a tax like right now are affecting hardware as opposed to software? good question. i think it is a small percentage, but growing. the vast majority of attacks are still focused on wed pages and attachments to e-mail's.

we're seeing more and more now where move to social media. the majority of the tax are still focused at that level but we are seeing a growth in attacks focused on hardware. there is a bit of an arms race. one could talk about cloud computing and for july's environments where potentially you are operating -- and wherelized environments --entially your operating you are operating -- there are a lot of changes occurring right now and it is interesting to see where things will go. next call is from wisconsin on the independent line. caller: thank you for taking my call. i have a couple of personal security questions.

protected?onal lines is that the only assurance i ofe that i have a good level security for identity theft? i see personal people getting robbed of their savings and investments in things. i do not know anyone who has -- i do not know if it is related or not but how honorable is our electrical grid -- how vulnerable is our electrical grid for disturbance? i would love to hear your comments in those areas. thank you very much. host: let us begin with the electrical grid issue. guest: we are obviously very dependent.

it is extremely worrisome to think about attacks on the grid. what we have is a situation where -- taking down an electric grid is not that easy. taking it down in a massive way and to keep it down -- so of the power goes out for an hour it is not that big a deal. it goes down a week is potentially a huge problem. doing that through cyber means is actually difficult. if you look at who is capable of doing that right now it is advanced nations face. nations-based. the people who might want to do that to us, the terrorist groups or maybe a country like north korea, they do not yet have the capability to be able to do that. what we are seeing is a mismatch between the people who have the

capability but not the intention and the people who have the intention but not yet the capability. the worry is when those two lines cross and most likely scenario is the people who have the intention to do this will at some point acquire the capability. that is where there is some concern. the likelihood of that is low for the next couple of years. looking out i think that becomes a serious concern. jamesin this report clapper talked about cyber attacks and cyber espionage. is there a difference? activity is criminal versus spying and there is a third category, causing destruction. if someone causes damage either through data loss -- one can imagine that that's coming in

and destroying bank data in a way that affects the financial infrastructure so that it causes billions of dollars in damage or causing power grids to go out and generators to malfunction -- those are cyber attacks that can really cause harm. host: let me just read you what he said -- in some cases the world supply distal technology faster than our ability to understand the security implications as well as to mitigate the potential risk. that is exactly the challenge we face. technologies are advancing much faster than our ability to understand how to respond to them. just looking at apps on president barack obama iphones

, there on mobile phones are fake ones out there. there are new hacks' been developed for mobile phones. computing andoud , technology is being driven very quickly by what customers and businesses want. security lags behind that. a product comes out and someone had set within eight hours. apple will come along and provide a package later. -- a patch later. some basic it buys from our twitter page -- advice from our twitter page --

guest: that latter point is a good one. i received an e-mail from someone i know with an attachment and it just did not sound like him. you get that intuition. i checked and he did not, in fact, send it. it was a phishing attempt. luckily i did not get caught. he may receive an e-mail from someone you know and if it is done you will cut on it. if there is something that is off you may not think of why they make -- he may think "why are they sending this?" host: my twitter page was hatched last week. what would people came from that? guest: they could send people messages from you. in the case of twitter, we send

blanlinks. someone may be more likely to click on infected links or download malware ont heir machine. host: good morning, republican line. i am a computer scientist. in the 1990's the u.s. had an export license to said computers to manufacturing communities. we should never have allowed the manufacturing of that technology outside of the united states.

now the cat is out of the bank what do you think we should do in changing the laws and not allowing that technology to be built outside of the united states guest? host: much of it made in china. guest: we are fighting globalization and market forces. i think it is just too difficult to do that. if you try to say that chip manufacturing in the u.s. is fighting this global trend and you're telling u.s. companies how to do business, which u.s. government is not want to do and do it.y should not one way we try to get around that is to be selective about certain things. there are certain chips that go into certain systems that are not made in the u.s.. that should continue to be the case. maybe you pick your battles and say in this case for this system

we will try to make sure that we have control over the supply of that chip. too hard.t is tw that is veryht difficult. host: lives makes this point -- guest: often what happens is we do not know when we have been infected. know which fraction of listeners have now we're on the computer and to not know it -- listeners now how malware on their computer and do not know it. they may have put on software that captures each keystroke we make. all passwords and information

are going to bad guys right now and we have no idea. it can be very difficult to know when you have been hacked. it is not just for individuals. a report came out recently from cyberany that response to incidents with companies. they found that the average company, when they go in to clean up a company that has been attacked, the average time a company that has been infected and does not know it has been over a year. it is a specific problem. is fromr next caller indiana. tin is on the phone on the republican line. good morning. believe there are growing separate security threats from communist china. there are over 3000 spies in the

u.s.. the you believe there are actually spies here from communist china? to what about cyber threats you as citizens from our own government? thank you. guest: i am sure there are chinese spies in the u.s.. it is a different opinion of what kind of activity is legitimate. our nation's spy on each other. they spy on us. the difference is the united states does not spy for economic gain. we do not go out and steal information about foreign companies and provided to u.s. companies to help them compete globally. that is something we do not do. that is something that china and other nations do. we disagree. we think that is an unfair procter -- an unfair practice.

that is what is happening between the u.s. and china right now. in terms of the u.s. government spying on its citizens, it is difficult for the u.s. to do that. it is just like wire-tapping. in order for the fbi to do that you need a court order. they need to have grounds for doing that. is it happening? i am sure. it has to happen through legal mechanisms. host: with 1 minutes left, george is on the phone from pennsylvania. caller: what type of information did they steal? why is thisstion is information on the internet and not on a hard drive? we have had out there and available?

the information actually is being stored -- what they do is they actually infiltrate an organization's system and then they spread through the organization. what they can do is access information that might be on a computer that is not even connected to the internet. if they can get to that computer -- a lot of times what they will do is deal luncheonette credentials. -- is still legitimate credentials. they'll take the information, copy it, and use the information to send it back. it.e are ways to get to to answer your first question, they are stealing everything. products,g positions, anything that can help them

compete economically in the world. of theirving lachow center for new american security. thank you for being with us. we will continue the conversation tomorrow at 7:00 a.m. eastern time. is here tohincapie talk about immigration issues. we will also check in with the president of americans for tax reform, grover norquist will be here at 8:30. and $9 billion is available for broadband connections in rural and in low income areas. is that money being well used? is following the story for "the new york times." thank you for being with us on this sunday, st. patrick's day, march 17. i hope you enjoy the rest of the weekend. have a great week ahead.