and what is next for the controversial site in nevada tomorrow morning on c-span's "washington journal." thank you for joining us on this sunday. hope you enjoyed the rest of your weekend. "newsmakers" is next. have a great weekend. ♪ >> today on c-span, the ceo of" with heritage for american action, michael needham. john mccainlls with a nancy pelosi. ourelcome to "newsmakers" guest is michael needham. the ceo of heritage action for america.

it was founded three years ago. thanks for being our guest. let me introduce our reporters. bob cusack is the managing editor of the hill. .> let's go right to obama care this is the issue that is facing the gop. why do you think republicans can do this? before republicans have funded obama care. the election did not fix much. --may have the democratic the only have democratic control. >> for the last three or four years republicans were all elected on the promise to get rid of obamacare and have relied on someone else coming in and saving the day. the supreme court will come in and rule it unconstitutional. the american people are going to get rid of president obama. the public and lawmakers who have all pledged that they will do everything they can to stop obamacare now have a time for

choosing. in october 1 sign up. startbefore the sign ups of the defund the government. this is the time for them to lay down a marker and say have told our constituents that we are against this. we're not going to find is. is a lot of stuff that conservatives have problems with any challenges to lay down the marker and say we are going to do what we promised we will do. >> and potentially shut down the government. to get there.eeks washington love to watch this -- setting thingsof sendin that can not beat him. and so saying we're going to try to inspire people and see what comes to it. if republicans went out there and united and say this is a beer that is falling apart, the

president has artie started delaying part of it. there is a report that came out today, krispy kreme doughnuts, 60% of employees are full-time. 80% of employees have been part- time since january. prams were going to be $2100 more than expected. we need a timeout from this law. let's go out and fight or that timeout and see where we stand at the end of september. normally when you go into a negotiation you try to preserve option value. you do not take it off the table. incident trying to figure out where we should he, we should fight for something. >> your group recently commissioned a poll regarding who might get blamed in the innt that there is a lapse the appropriations because there is no deal whether it is over

obamacare or anything else. i was looking at the questions. one of the questions was worded, they called it a temporary slowdown of nonessential federal government operations. can you explain a little bit about why that was worded the way? cr is washington speak. >> continuing resolution. when congress cannot do the job , normallyposed to do the house passes appropriations together they come and they come to an agreement on what the funding levels will be. >> when they cannot do that they passed a continuing resolution that say we will continue as was previously done. we have done that for the last

three or four years. with regard to the poll, we framed it that way because it is an accurate description of what happened. when they continue to go on and out the door, it is a slowdown of essential employees that they will still show up. troops will still get bullets and all the stuff that is important. there is a slowdown of other things. yellowstone will shut down. many parts of the federal government will shut down. it is a slowdown while something is being litigated. what would be litigated is whether or not to fund obamacare. >> i know your organization does not get into the political endorsement. he inc. it would be fair that the voters and activists you talk about should use their votes against republicans

that do not hold the line? >> vote in primaries and general elections they should hold people accountable to representing their views and doing in washington what they say they're doing in washington. choose whatn standard he votes. someone that represents the values you have and follows through a something that is critical to most. >> as far as republican leaders they have not committed to what they're going to do,, how they are going to stand. they have supported appropriations bills. mitch mcconnell pointed out even if crs has said you defund this there is still enough discretionary spending that it would continue. how do you ring republican

leaders are going to handle this? what is your response? a shut down,e obama does not stop. i agree completely. that socialreason security continues to go on is that it is entitlement spending and there is a lot of entitlement spending and obamacare. that that is separate from the funding. we are willing to see a cr being passed but we do not want to defund obamacare. the amendment since 1976 has said none of the money and used to fundbe abortion. in 1982 president reagan's relationship was defunded in appropriations. passed havehat has had changes in military programs.

and an appropriation bill it is common to defund things. what we are advocating for him both the senate and house of saying let's pass this and put this on. >> had few been in regular communication with john boehner and mcconnell? some have been frustrated that you are doing these more card thing. -- how muchation communication have you had? >> we are talking with leadership all the time. we have disagreements. we have agreements. the one a friend, get a dog. that is true for people who sometimes get frustrated with each other. to one ofuld shift the other items that will be on

the agenda when congress comes back. it is the farm bill. your group was one of the groups that led the effort against, including the snap funding which is also called food stamps, and the foreign bill the way it has been for a long time. that thereporting house will take up a measure that could reduce the spending over the next decade by something like $40 billion. is that a good approach that your organization can support or is there more that needs to be done? >> there is amendment i think is important. our whole point is that we have had for the years of this unholy alliance between supporters of food stamps and the welfare program. our goal was to separate the

thing so we could have an honest conversation and this country about what good would andfoodstamp policy looks like what are our obligations. what is a 21st-century farm program look like questio? we were happy to see the house passed that. not only was the bill the same programe welfare laden that we have seen for decades, but it made it law. we should be passing a foodstamp bill that shows what the values of conservative republicans are. cleaneed to start with a sheet of paper. part of what happens when you put the bills that show the values is a party is people can start to understand them. the republicans and the house passed this type of foodstamp bill and here are

the conservative values that they showed them what it means. different showed values. people can go to the voting booth and make that decision. house republicans basically said that we are going to split this bill. we are going to say we are not interested in food stamps and welfare for the poor and needy. we are also such a corporatist party that we will not get rid of the farm bill. that is a dicey position to be in. >> the way that it seems like it is likely to play out, it it seems that the house passes its standalone food bill, goes to conference with the senate on theyiece or the other and will have both of them back married together. do you agree with that russia might do you think the house republican leadership should g?/n entertain going t

>> that is a possibility. i hope that we have this opportunity. we have been trying to talk with frank lewis about what a modern farm bill would look like. we would love the opportunity to do that. that vote for a bill really shows our values. that is the last bill you would ever have to pass on fannie mae and freddie mac because it lines them down -- winds them down. opportunitye the to have a one-year extension on the farm bill and then work with the committee on really updating farm for solid -- farm policy from 1930 state is into what a 21st economy is. >> your economy does not

endorse candidates. mitch mcconnell is in a primary now. a some of the things he has done your group has criticized. do you inc. that mitch mcconnell is doing a good job? >> i think there is the job of the minority leader which is a very difficult job. we have been very critical of a lot of what he has done. there's also his job as a senator from hea kentucky. it is his job to explain to his constituents. heritage is about taking the information about what is really going on and explaining it to your constituents you. we want constituents to be able to ask tough questions of their member.

you can do it with any senator. onput it very transparently our scorecard. here's what we thought was important. so thathow they voted individuals can make determinations for themselves. >> quick pivot to immigration. the house has not acted on an immigration reform bill. there is talk of a republican version of the dream act. it seems by looking at your website that you do not support going into conference with the senate no matter what. would you keep vote any immigration bill that will lead to any conference? >> we have not announced any yet. in this environment right now it is very difficult to handle immigration the way we should be by saying we need to keep

the border secure. we also have a gigantic and balance. all of the questions do not require amnesty. you get all the economic benefits that people talk about without necessarily giving amnesty at this time. that is the position we support. this is dissipated over the last couple of weeks and months. towill be very difficult get away from the senate bill. >> it will be better for them not to act on immigration and this environment. the american people have a lot of concerns right now. unemployment is out of control. --re are some pretty areas serious issues that need to be taking care of, immigration being one of them. in the poll we released yesterday i think it was 1.5%

or so who said immigration was at the top of their list. we have some pretty important issues to deal with, most notably obamacare. we should not be distracting ourselves right now with an immigration bill. >> if i could continue with immigration. -- if it is preferable that there is no immigration conference as with the farm bill, it is the same procedural situation that might play out or that you might be concerned being played out. what is the better way to do all of this with a divided house and senate where one is controlled by republicans and one by democrats? inc. that the democrats in the senate are better at winning these battles right now? have the senate.

they have the presidency. when you look at issues like immigration, you really get an opportunity to really substantively moved the ball forward on immigration. tois rooted in -- prudent figure it out. a temporary worker program is a no-brainer. many on the left do not support it because they do not sign up for labor unions as much. thehouse passed one in hundred 12 congress last year that went nowhere in the senate. there are many small, common sense steps we should be able to do in a bipartisan fashion right now. immigrationa large bill, which if one passes this year or next year will really take the opportunity to modernize our immigration system field. playing no one will want to touch this again.

we need something that shows the conservative values that republicans would have. this is not the time to do immigration reform. same true of tax reform? dave camp and max baucus have been barnstorming the country, holding these event to reform tax -- to promote tax reform. is tax reform another issue that could fall and the same category as the immigration issue where -- developed the same way? >> it is worth having a conversation about tax reform. the house has signaled that they are done with tax increases. that is very important. lets you show what your conservative values with the.

when i think back to the fiscal cliff, it would have played out very differently if the house had passed and innovative program of tax reform, brought downgrade, did in a revenue neutral manager. these thinkers said we passed the tax cuts. we support that position. this reforms the tax code. it takes something nine times longer than the king james bible and makes it more progrowth and understandable. we put those options down. we have a deadline coming up on december 31. show them your values. i think we can do this with tax reform. i think on the corporate side there is perhaps opportunities for gathering in a bipartisan fashion.

i am more skeptical on the individual sites. i think he has been pretty clear that he wants tax increases. most americans feel they are taxed enough already. you have reference conservative values. at least twice you talked about obligations to the poor, sick, and elderly. where are conservative values as they apply to our obligations to others? >> conservatism is about making life better for everybody. the mistakes that republicans make is to start slicing and dicing americans in different , notthan the left does based on race or economic class. is a conservative policy. it is about making life better for people. having strong values is a conservative value. is about having

timeless principles that are written on all of our hearts and translating them into modern .olicy that makes how would you apply these principles? seven americans is on food stamps. this is a program that has grown tradition that might be targeted toward people who are really needy. if you wanted to have a program that is done through tax credits or empowering for oh, that is .lways fair game people access money they could use to go provide a better education for their child. there are all sorts of ways you can look at problems and do

this in a way that is empowering to people rather than having a one-size-fits-all all government. they launched the progressive movement at the very start. it was very emphatic that this was an attempt by people who we learned so much as research has gone on, as science has improved. gave a speech. he said the only problem with the declaration of independence as the preamble. we hold these truths to be self- evident that all men are .reated equal they created government to defend the rights. that is the problem. government job is not just to protect your natural rights. it is now to solve problems. had the declaration of independence just than a list of 17 grievances, that is cool. have grievances today. let's write them down and solve

them. conservatism is about something very different. the role of government is to protect the natural rights that given to us by god. >> john mccain has taken a leading role on importing the nuclear option on executive branch nominees. a bigting that he wants role. mccain will be on the table on the debt limit increase. are you concerned about senator john mccain? >> i am always concerned about dealmaking for the sake of dealmaking. if one party says here is what i stand for and another says here is what i stand for and in the process you have to say how do we get something done? that is different from saying it is really cool to get some people in the room and let's try to negotiate something. sometimes you look at what senator mccain has done. he has had great

accomplishments. he has had a heroic path for the country. other times there is an gangs for theut sake of gangs. ,> this is a little broad hypothetical. for those people who are watching, if someone out there and the audience happens to be a conservative who has substantial financial means to give money to some group in washington and they have not done so before, why would they get it to you incident the club for growth or americans for tax reform or some other organization? why is yours the one they should beginning their money too. >> there are a lot of good groups out there. they're also great groups and allies. when you look at washington dc right now the voice of the best

parts of the money is not representative. there is a ruling class in washington that is ultimately about favoring those who have access to lobbyists. one of the few groups willing to come into town and say we are not here on the site of the is side of biglabor -- business or big labor, we are on the side of the american people who want to hold their member of congress accountable. we have a proven track record of translating the nonsense that goes on in washington, food fights that are created to give second ads out. doing the best. this is about cocktail parties.

there are very few people and very few groups who will stand up to an entire wadden culture in this town and say this is not what we need. it is that thet republicans hold the house? >> they will if they are bold and inspired people. i had a washington insider to me that we are being unrealistic because it is impossible for the house to inspire the nation when their approval is a 12%. i said to him, and he looked at me like i just told him the world was round for the first time, maybe the reason the approvals 12% is you never try to inspire the american people. if the republicans want to control the house, even have to tell the american people what you stand for. why is it important? so we can have a corporatist farm bill past? i do not think so. we have certain values that the american people want. will beblican party best served at both the house and the senate and the

presidency in saying to a whole bunch of people who feel disempowered and might they have no advocates in washington, we are willing be that advocate. in 2005 i was working at heritage at the -- as the chief of staff. we hundred thousand jews paying members. ---paying members. if you look at earmarks and the bridge to nowhere, as you look , ourl of that escaping donor base grew to 700,000 people. people looking for leadership in washington. would berats party better served trying to inspire people rather than keeping a status quo. >> thank you very much for

being our guest. we appreciate it. >> thanks for having me. >> "newsmakers" is back with bob cusack annual post to see if -- and neil. senatorill remember jim dement joining the heritage foundation. what is the relationship between heritage action and heritage? >> they are in the same building. we have a conversation before we came in the air. they exist in the same building but the cuts of the legal actionon, heritage literally plays rent to the heritage foundation. they act somewhat autonomously from one another. the heritage edition being more additionally a thing tank while

heritage action is arranged as an advocacy arm that seems to be primarily focused on outreach to conservative groups throughout the country. >> they have to have separate lobbying arms. unlike the club for growth this, the endorse heritage action does not. they haveve shown, amassed a fair amount of power. you know that when republicans are complaining about them, they have done something that has attracted attention. >> are they making life challenging for speaker boehner? >> i think they are making life very difficult for speaker boehner.

the whole tea party movement is great for elections but as far as governing, they are very frustrated that as far as trying to move bills, whether it is the farm bill or other legislation, when you have a powerful group saying do not vote for this, certainly democrats for the most part are not going to give republicans any political cover. getting the boat to move bills ruby house is a lot more difficult. throughseen that -- the house is a lot more difficult. we have seen that. this was a major embarrassment for gop leaders. .hey do get upset at him >> what does this mean ultimately? ideology is though more important than leadership

and power? >> it sure sounded like that. one of the things that michael mentioned during the interview are interested in making the case to the voters that members of congress should be doing innings. for instance, they favor an extension of the armed bills so that they can rework it into separate pieces and have a vision for what the farm bill should look like. it is entirely willble that their vision not be the one that is the most popular in the contrary. it seems like heritage action is ok with that. >> what does this mean with politics as we go into an election cycle? >> you have so many issues that

have to be addressed. you have the debt limit. immigrationcked any bill. if you adjust it the conference, it is not comprehensive. i do not know that one is predicting they will win back the house. >> there is always a question when you are approaching a government shutdown and how it will actually affect people. certainly if you are in washington, dc the effect of a government shutdown will be , andbecause you will see the 596 case there were affect

locally. maybe people will not see as much elsewhere in the country. it was worded in such a way that it is trying to portray a certain view of how a government shutdown might be pro-trade -- for trade. governmentnto a shutdown, you might want to throw all the polls out of the window. >> we appreciate your time. >> thanks. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013] two town hall meetings. first, john mccain into some. then nancy pelosi in san francisco. hillary clinton speaking at the annual american bar association meeting. after theber so well march was over, after dr. king had delivered the speech, president kennedy invited us

back down to the white house. he stood in the door of the oval office greeting each one of us. he was like a beaming father. he was so glad that everything had gone so well. he said you did a good job. he said,ot to dr. king and you had a dream. >> to mark the 50th anniversary of the march on washington, the jfk library will look at what a conversation with congressman john lewis. after work on that your cod chae to call in and comment. >> next, john mccain was speaking to constituents at a town hall meeting in tucson. he talked about the immigration in the senate. this is one hour and 15 minutes. [applause]

>> christina's parents are here. withpe everything is well you. she will always be in our hearts and prayers. i know you have a message for me. if you will wait until i finish my two hours of comments -- [laughter] of opening remarks, i would be glad to hear from you and other members of the audience. can you hear me ok in the back? no, ok. we have a beloved friend that passed away, and our thoughts and prayers are with his family. i came to see you today, as a usually do, to listen to you and