-- studentr subject loans. $1 trillion of debt owed to the federal government, increasing default rates, the amount that we are putting in seems to be driving a huge increase in tuition. wishing is up four times the rate of inflation over the past decade. are we heading toward a student loan default bubble? >> i have not studied that, congressman. >> thank you very much. good morning and thank you for being here and thank you for all the work that went into the 2013 long-term budget outlook. very concerned with the economic damage being caused by the sequester. previously responded to ranking member van hollen. did you say if we keep the couldter in place that it

cost our country 600,000 jobs? >> yes. moving discretionary funding backed up to the original cast and not having the sequester take effect. >> and that would take a half a point away from gross to mustek product? >> by the end of 2014. florida, thein types of jobs we are talking about, we have seen some very harmful impact. our premier cancer research center in tampa, before the sequester, they had 120 researchers working to find a cure for cancer. they are down to 100. the air force base is one of our largest community economic drivers. they are furloughing mental health counselors among others. that part of the

budget is shrinking, but the sequester does not give us a lot of room to maneuver on where we want those cuts to take place. law enforcement, job losses from cuts to the court, very significant cut accident education. adopted republicans this cr last week, it became crystal clear that they intend to march forward with those sequester cuts. report and at your those kind of expenditures are not the drivers isthe long-term that. it what america is investing in right now in innovation or infrastructure or education.

are those the drivers of the debt and deficit? >> no. government spending, except spending a handful of large programs will be a smaller percentage of gdp by the end of this decade than it has been at any point since the 1930s. termss growing in dollar and relative to the size of the accounting -- the economy is social security and medicaid in particular. of nondefense discretionary spending, historically nearly half has been investment of some sort. about 20% has gone to physical capital, building highways, about 15% has gone to education and training, investment in human capital. add 10% has gone to research and development. half of this has been an investment of some sort sort.>> -- of some

>> we have a real mismatch here on what the republicans have set forth in debate. just last week on the cr, i watched the debt reduction strategy, you want to continue the sequester, meanwhile the cbo report says the long-term drivers and the aging population , we have proposed significant reforms in medicare. the health reform -- medicarerm act, taking to a system based on quality based on those models. we need to sit down and negotiate. the republicans refusal to negotiate on the budget for the past four months has led to this mismatch in policy. of myed to many republican colleagues who say yes, we want the sequester, we want these cuts, but i hope you study the cbo cost reports that's not the investment in

infrastructure driving the long- term. thank you for being here. let me just bounce a couple of different issues. on social security disability, ast is your report on that far as where it is headed in the coming days? >> the disability assure -- disability insurance trust fund exhausted in 2016. >> three years? what is done once it exhausted? canhen the payments presumably be only as large as the incoming receipts which are not enough to cover all the payments the government is committed to under current law. >> what has brought about that moment? did the date change?

it used to be 2020? of that datetion has moved around over time. the disability insurance rules have increased markedly over the past two decades. we've done a number of reports trying to show you what the sources of that increases are and give you policy reports to address it. by peoplen pushed up have lost their jobs and apply for disability insurance. >> are you aware of congress implementing any of those policies question were >> no. >> do you think it might be time to implement those? >> at some point, when we get to solve some of these issues, is tot the first entitlement reach the insolvency level is the disability? >> only a few of these benefit

programs have trust funds of this sort. >> if we implemented some of the policy options and we discussed some of those in the days ahead, how many years would it take to brings the -- to bring some stability to that? havelock is ticking and we three years before insolvent. would that buy us another year depending on what might be or would it take several years to get into the system and build it up? >> in principle, you could make very sharp changes overnight. >> we could at a lot of deficit dollars. benefits ad just cut lot for existing beneficiaries. but in practice, congress makes changes that are phased in over time. emphasizes the importance of deciding as soon as possible what changes you want to make. if you want to phase them in and you need to forestall the adjustment of the trust fund or get an increase in debt, it's

even more important to make the decisions and start the process right away. >> you made some pretty remarkable statements about the tax revenue going up. in real income and the interaction with inflation, it would push a greater proportion of income into higher tax rackets and certain tax increases before -- that would generate increasing revenues. is this what we faced with the amt for years because it wasn't inflation-adjusted? we had a growing number of people on that track customer >> is not as traumatic as the amt would have been. larger, got larger and the jump under current law got larger and larger. >> since it was in your

alternative fiscal scenario that there would be an extension of the amt, is there a discussion that congress will again not allow more and more people to be tracked in these higher taxes in the days ahead? >> our alternative scenario tries to extend policies congress has extended the past and not -- it might be hard to sustain. one of the things that scenario includes is holding tax revenue at a lower level indefinitely rather than rising. in the past, congress has ended to act to cut taxes when tax revenue got to be a larger share of gdp. >> you talk about how if the deficit comes down, there is real growth in income that goes up and you may statement about it that when sovereign debt is requiring more and more of those individual dollars to come out, less any goes into capital investment and that slows the

economy down. is the interesting to me assumption is private dollars going into investment has a greater increase on the economy than government dollars taking that and investing it into the economy. >> i think our view would be investment has done good things for the economy erie most investment occurs in the private sector. there can be government investments that pay large dividends over time. modeled that affect specifically in this analysis. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. chairman. it's always good to have an economist here. up on the screen because i want everybody to see it. it is one of your charts and in the fiscal commission we have lionized, bowles simpson, called for 400 billion

dollars in health-care care savings in their original proposals. hase that time, our cbo reduced medicare and medicaid rejections by roughly $1 trillion. more than twice as much as they suggested erie it is that correct? >> yes. 1.25lly about introduction. >> that means the chairman blaming our deficit on health care spending is not quite accurate. we are actually reducing it and it is questionable as to whether it's going to be a major cost of our deficit in the future, isn't it? >> our projections of growth have come down. as you know, in our current projections growth

is the largest factor leading to deficit spending over time. analysis a sensitivity to our health care spending growth to show even if it's a good deal lower than we expect, the debt would still rise relative to gdp. >> there are just too any people living too long? >> i would not say too many people but there are a lot of people living longer and that increases the numbers of beneficiaries of medicare and medicaid. a large share of the medicaid dollars go to older americans for longer-term care. >> so we cut off the spending at the federal government -- earl levels for people on the program. how will the terror be paid for or will they simply not have care? >> i think it depends on what you did, congressman. americans do not have substantial financial resources. if they suddenly face a larger burden, that would affect the

care they could buy or other necessities. >> or they turn to their children. >> yes. that is possible. 1964 in thisbefore country when old people didn't have health care insurance. that is what my grandmother did. she came and lived with us and we paid her bills. that's what went on before the program. what they are saying is we are going to cut what the government spends on old people and they can cut what ever they want after that erie they can go out and vague on the street or not have the care. >> i can't speak to what the they in your sentence wants to do great >> look at your chart on page 10. will blue sky here in about 75 years great i want to look at the chart and ask you a question

which is we are not making investments now. the civil war, during the civil war, abraham lincoln started the land grant colleges, did the homestead act and the national railways. that looked like reckless spending to me. have ald you do when you big spike and you come to the second world war and we have the and bill and we have fha bha and the federal highway system under eisenhower all reckless spending by our president at that time. why was it the country did not go into default and disappear from the face of the earth because of this reckless spending that had been done by these presidents? give us anwork? explanation. >> i must from -- i am less familiar with the post-civil war time but after the second world

war, the congress balance the budget and the economy grew rapidly. >> where were they getting the money to get these scholarships to every guy came back from the military? g.i. bill of the rights. where did that money come from? >> the federal government raised tax revenue equal to the spending it was doing. raised the tax revenue and did that? they were investing in the people? that is what created the greatest generation? >> darman investments laid some role but i don't know how important they were. >> where did they get the money taken from a highway system? >> thank you. thank you for joining us today. a couple of comments that came from the other side we need to correct that don't need to be hanging out there. the sequester was the president assad idea. she doesn't like it, i can give

her a phone number. >> he offered to replace a time. >> this is my time. i didn't interrupt you. >> the other comment was from mr. van hollen. he said we've done nothing about the sequester. unfortunately, he is incorrect. we have tried to replace the sequester more than once. >> will the gentleman yield on that. that is not what i said. i said we haven't taken action in this congress. >> the other thing i would like to say is they republicans talking about the republicans shedding of the government is incorrect. those are irresponsible and reckless comments. >> one of the things we have raise taxes.eed to increases in marginal tax rates would reduce out put relative to what would be the case with lower rates, all else being held

equal. rateher marginal tax increases the return on savings, weakening people's incentives to save. less saving implies less investment and lower output in income. you stand by those comments, don't you? i would like to remind the other side of the aisle that for all of this year about wanting to raise tax revenue that they could damage the economy. let's move to the real world for a minute and talk about this -- talked about taxes for a second. if the government has a law that increases health care premiums good orr 20% year, that bad for employment and economic growth? >> i think it depends on the policy. >> but me tell you what the answer is. they are telling me about what has happened to the past had counted what's going to happen

to future headcounts. what if we have a policy or law that causes employers to reduce full-time employees by reducing maximum weekly hours -- is that good or bad for employee gdp growth? books it does include some investors for moving toward part-time employment. districtployers in our say it's bad for employment. how about federal regulations that cause the price of energy to skyrocket? hire prices tend to slow the economy. >> i yield back. >> good to see you again, director. let me ask you a couple of questions. as we all know a mouse republicans cut $40 billion from

snap funding. many of us believe this is morally wrong and ably troubling. especially considering nearly one in five children in america suffer from food insecurity. means sixn in cuts million families will be cut off from this vital economic lifeline. at a time when so many are already struggling to stay afloat, this is mind-boggling and unconscionable and it's wrong. rationaleertainly no for throwing hungry children, families and seniors off of snap. compellingnk of any economic rationale either. it is $1.70 generated as an economic activity. you in termso ask of the economic benefits to snap

spending, does the cbo estimate the current economic impact of these types of cuts on the health care costs in the future? second, it has to do with the public option. cboink it was 2011, the public option would reduce the deficit by about 88 lien dollars between 2012 and 2021. given the affordable care act and itbout $140 billion would cost about $109 billion to repeal, what you think from a fiscal point of view a public option would achieve had we included them in the exchanges? what would be the downside or upside physically. your -- about snap, the

legislation that passed the house would reduce the number of people receiving step benefits by about 4 million in 2014. we have set a number of times in receivinghat people snap benefits or other benefits of this sort have a high propensity to spend the money it tends to bed a short term boost for the economy and taking money -- taking money away would be a short-term drag on the economy. and the second question about the public option, we have asked you report correctly from our and set of budget options including a public option in the insurance exchanges would ring down the federal spending. that was $90 billion over 10 years. we have no rean to think it would be markedly different today.

>> thank you very much. >> good to see you again. i want to go down the path of this idea that the sequester is hurting the economy and killing jobs and so forth. do government jobs better the economy? >> yes. if the government pays people earn money byhey -- >> where does the government get the money to pay that person? where does the government get the money to pay you? -- ny extra spending >> where does the government get the money to pay you, me, and

hundreds of thousands of other workers if we were laid off would hurt the economy? that moneys some of through tax revenue. >> it confiscates that money from people in the private sector, correct? >> it raises some of the money from tax revenue. >> it confiscate -- >> those we your words. >> we take money from the private sector to fund the jobs of the government like you and me. but she raised tax revenue. >> it is a tax on them. >> borrowed from people who send in the money and provide the cash. >> people who are not around when you and i are dead. >> it depends what policies. >> you probably run a lot more

in the morning than i do so maybe you will live longer. to run the government, to pay people who work these government jobs, we take from somewhere else. we take from the private sector. that is less property, less money that they have to grow the economy. you don't agree with me, obviously. how much does the economy grow by paying these people to be in government jobs? , you sayssman government jobs help the economy, to what extent? >> i am not sure what the policy experiment you have in mind is. >> i'm asking you questions. >> i can't say i understand the question. the economy grows with government jobs. how do you quantify that? >> it depends on the economic circumstances. in an economy where there is sufficient demand for goods and

services, all the demand is true. additional government job is likely to come out of the job and the private sector. if demand for goods and services is less than the path for the then additional government are owing that has been spent to government employees or to provide benefits put that ine and our area. >> why don't we tax everyone 100%. that would be a surefire way to increases.dp >> it's not true every tax rate. i'm speaking about the economic situation and the taxes we have in the country today. more rarely borrow temporarily.

>> no -- that yout believe actually grow the economy. we already have established you and i have a difference of opinion. you well know because of what he said that to grow the economy with all these government jobs, and am trying to quantify what you mean and understand why we should do more of this are owing, more of this conversation to better ourselves, to just get ourselves out of this hole. >> two thoughts. opinion, a group at the university should of ship -- whether leading economists across the country, whether the economy had made output higher than it otherwise would have been. 80% of respondents said yes and four percent said no. my opinion is widely shared.

>> by keynesians. >> this is economists across the country. the best quantification i can give you is in response to congressman then i'll imposter questions. >> i would simply say the sequester is not the problem. under eighties? >> years of the clinton administration, the so-called confiscation tax rate was 39.6%, is that right lester mark >> that is the tax racket. this confiscation rate, approximately 20 million jobs were created in america, is that correct question are >> i don't remember the number, but it was quite a few. it was a tremendous economic boom. >> during the eight years of the bush administration which immediately follow the clinton

administration, am i correct the so called top confiscation rate was dropped up to 35%? >> yes. lost 600,000 jobs during that customer >> i don't member the exact number. >> as it relates -- a statement made earlier by one of our colleagues suggested a number of people might look at this conclusion and be perplexed at our inability to move forward. we all agree there's a long-term deficit and that problem we need to confront. perhaps the problem is we've reached the integrity of the budget process that the house has passed a budget, the senate has passed a budget and the next step in that process is to move

forward with conference committees because the math we should be paying attention to is the electoral math. electoral math is a divided government contest and there are 54 democrats and independents in the senate which constitute a majority. brock obama did win reelection with the one percent of the vote , only the second president since eisenhower with two consecutive popular vote margins a exceed 51% trade we are in divided government context and should move forward with the integrity of the process. so we can work it out and perhaps try to find common ground to move things forward. you have stated in your testimony that the consequences of default on the debt would be long lasting and damaging. >> they could be long-lasting and very damaging and i think it's a interest humble to

default on that obligation. >> i think you said it was a risky strategy to stop paying with the united states government owes. >> yes. >> part of the problem with the faulting on the debt is that it would erode the confidence of investors in the belief that the united states has the ability to manage its economic affairs. is that right? >> yes. >> one of the reasons why some of the european countries are colleagues love to elude to is the reason they find themselves in the situation they are in right now is because there was an erosion in confidence of the ability for those countries like greece to manage their economic affairs. >> yes. part of the reason for that erosion of confidence is the rate on our debt moving forward would increase perhaps quite significantly. >> it could grade yes. >> an erosion of confidence leads to an increased quite possibly in our debt burden and the increase in the debt burden

worsens our long-term budget outlook. >> yes. reason it part of the would be irresponsible to simply attempt to hold hostage the full faith and credit of the united states of america in the context of us paying our bills as we confront the need to raise our debt ceiling and i hope this congress will come together and stop playing partisan politics as it relates to this very serious issue. one last question in this remaining time that i have. -- does the increase in minimum wage largely benefit low-end workers? and low-wage workers are more likely to immediately it -- medially spending increased income? >> that is right. people who work and receive a higher wage would have higher incomes they realize they could spend.

wage can alsoimum reduce the number of people who have jobs. >> an increase in spending and consumer demand would lead to economic growth, is that right? >> under current economic editions, the increase in demand for economic services would boost output and the number of jobs. >> i yield back. asked last time the government shutdown, this was a sign posted in the window of the smithsonian air and space museum in washington dc. it's the federal government shutdown, the smithsonian institution must be closed. we regret the inconvenience. this is him a "wall street journal" article that says for most presidents, shutdown is a rite of passage. shutdowns that range from one haveo three weeks -- there been 17 partial shutdowns in the past 37 years. you can read more at the "wall street journal."

the house amended the senate bill to extend government funding through mid-december. year.the law for some tweets for members of congress as the fiscal year comes to an end tomorrow night -- oregon democratic representative student but amici says a house passed bill linking the delay to health care law, how disappointing. we need to work together. a pennsylvania republican tweets five democratic senators to to repeallegislation medical device tax. this is their chance to get done. john boehner says the senate must act today to prevent a shutdown. to comed on the senate back into session and set of the senate stalls it would be an act of breathtaking arrogance by the leadership. says we are on it even of a shutdown. a cleanhouse to pass

resolution. we urge speaker boehner to reconvene house, last day -- pass a clean cr and move on. the house not scheduled to return until tomorrow morning at 10:00 eastern time. the republican leaders could have votes as early as 11:00 and the senate is set to return for general speeches and consider a pair of judicial nominations. aey are expected to take up bill to fund the federal government and fund the military in case of a government shutdown. the house live on c-span on our companion network, c-span2. >> who's to say what the cleveland clinic is doing has anything to do with obamacare? madame president, the answer to that is who's to say? the cleveland clinic is to say. a spokeswoman from the cleveland clinic said "to prepare for , cleveland reform

clinic is transforming the way care is delivered to patients. added three hundred $30 million would be cut from the clinic's annual budget. >> we know there are things we areng right now that going to be paid less by private and public affairs. medicare is paying less, sequestration, having effect on decreasing has had an impact on our research. we have to decrease our costs still further. all of this goes to change how health care is together. it's not one single thing that did it or one program that's done it, dale series of things starting back 5, 6, seven years when weminating in

decided those changes are so significant on whether we are going to pay and be even more stringent. >> the head of the cleveland clinic on the future of medical care in the united states, tonight at 8:00 on c-span's "q&a." >> next, part of the atlantic's women of washington series with democratic senator, patty murray of washington, chair of the budget committee. she talks about the problems of congress dealing with the federal budget, her work on behalf of women's issues and her experiences working in the senate. she's the first female chair of the senate budget committee. she says she backs president obama's no negotiation policy and any attachment on debt ceiling legislation will be sent right back to the house. this is one hour. >> it is hard to get a large audience of mostly women quiet, isn't it? i'm happy about that though.

welcome. thank you for being here. my name is elizabeth baker. i'm vice president of "the atlantic." welcome to washington. i also want to welcome the viewers that we have on our live stream, as well as c-span. we are welcome to have a larger audience outside. "the atlantic" covers women and family issues and women professional issues in the pages of the magazine with articles like -- on our website, there is a channel that covers a lot of these issues. i thought i would bring your attention to our latest issue, including one i thought particularly interesting as a mother of three, "my daughter's homework is killing me." [laughter] this is about a father who decides to do his daughter's homework. 3-4 hours of homework per night

and sleep six and half hours. not necessarily a good thing we're doing for our teens and tweens. we try to bring women's issues to life. this is the fourth program we have had this year so far following janet napolitano. we want to shine a spotlight on the careers of some women have done really well in washington to hear the personal stories and hear the career stories as well. we're very pleased to welcome senator patty murray as our guest, who is chairman of the senate budget committee. before i invite patty up to the

stage, i want to give a special thank you to exxon mobil. they have been partners on this program since the beginning. we came up with a get together to try to bring together a community of women leaders in washington. exxon mobil has supported the program since offset. our partner terry is vice president and is the leader of the washington office for mobile. she joined the firm in 2001. prior to that, deputy assistant at the department of energy. a few housekeeping notes -- we encourage you to be part of the conversation. you can tweet comments. the hash tag is #atlanticww.

we will also have an opportunity for q&a at the end. we are taping and live streaming. silencer cell phones please. i'm very happy to introduce senator patty murray. senator murray was born and raised in washington. she never imagined a career in politics. she got into it as a mom. she was advocating for one of her children. she miniature to washington and was told she couldn't make a difference. she turned around and made a grassroots organization that indeed made a difference. they were able to reverse cuts. she was selected to the washington state senate. in 1992, she went for the u.s. senate pursues a tenured

veteran. she was selected as a senator. she was reelected in 2004 and 2010. in addition of being the first female senator from washington state, she serves as a chair on a committee. serving as a member of the senate credit leadership since 2007, she has established herself as an effect if leader on education, transportation, security, and veterans issues. welcome. interviewing her will be karen. she is new to the seat. thank you for doing this. welcome. she has a full-time role at msnbc. it is on air saturdays and sundays.

she has had a long career in washington, in politics, working for presidential campaigns and at the white house and and in the new york senate race. she has been a commentator in the hill. again, many thanks to karen and senator patty murray. >> thank you. [applause] >> i thought were read would start is the story about the school is one. one of the things that i thought was so remarkable and by wanted to start their is when you look

at the hearings this year on military sexual assault, so many women there are asking questions and comparing that to that picture of anita hill being questioned by all of these men. it felt like we have come such a long way. >> it is a good place to start. >> absolutely. looking forward to hearing your thoughts and comments as well. i remember it like it was yesterday. i was a state legislator. we were working passionately on issues i cared about. preschool education got me into

politics to start with. issues around family and fighting for things that i cared about. i remembered hearing about a nomination back of the nation's capital. the entire nation keyed into what was happening in d.c. i turned on my television to watch the united states senate committee interrogate this poor woman named anita hill. i kept looking at this committee. god. all men. not saying but i would say. i felt disoriented. i went to a dinner where everyone was talking about that. i will have to run for the senate. i didn't hear anyone say what i am saying. [laughter]

it came from that. i felt passionately that you can sit home and complain about what is going on, but sometimes the only way to change it is to say, ok. i will do it. i went to the senate in 1992. no one gave me a chance. i was out 3-1. i was kind of the quotation at the end. no one believed me. no one at the time -- they felt they needed someone who would be their voice. i came in. i came in in the year of the women. it was a change or the country and the responsibility of being part of that.

fast forward to the hearings now where every single committee has a woman on it. i can see my voice being reflected time and time again. i think that is a great piece of progress for our country. it is one of the things that has really changed our country. this is a test i think it's one of the things that has changed our country. diane feinstein is chair of the intelligence committee. people always say women's issues. intelligence, agriculture.

barbara boxer with the it department of environmental works. we are not just a voice, but we are a player, making sure the passions we care about, the priorities we care about, the voice we care about is from the legislation. >> we are going to talk a little bit about the drama. everybody has got to have their moment. senator jill a brand -- senator jill a brand -- gillibrand is a friend of mine. sometimes we need to get away from the testosterone and get something done. i wonder if you can talk about how women's leadership has changed the weight wings are working.

-- has changed a way things are working. >> we all felt the weight of doing a good job, not for ourselves, but for other women so they would be in politics and do our job. we found we are our best supporters and could share things. our team leader brought us together for the first one, and we found this camaraderie to be able to say, where's the dry cleaners, or i'm trying to work on this legislation for women in rwanda, and i don't quite know how to do it, or i have got an issue going at home, and i need

to get is done. -- get this done. we were our best supporters. we have continued the tradition for 20 years. we welcomed new women from both parties. we really do go and then talk about everything from somebody's new grandchild or where the best place to get fast food is late at night or how we can focus on the budget crisis. we have every one of those discussions. i think it has been helpful for us, and our goal still remains the same. if we can help each other be successful, other women will be able to do the job. >> there is a lot of talk. when you hear stories from back

in the day, people knew each other. there was a personal relationship, and it seems like it is the weapon carrying on that tradition. >> you find kids in your school, and you find common ground. we do the same thing. >> there is a dinner you had with president obama, which we are curious to hear about. >> it was one of my favorite because he invited 20 women to the white house to have dinner with him. we were looking at the white house lawn, and we shared

everything. we talked about finding a solution. we talked about small issues and big issues. sort of towards the end of it barbara boxer said i am looking out the window, and i am thinking 100 years ago when women were fighting for the right to vote they stood out of that window and were arrested the coast they tried to get the right to vote. i am pretty sure that 20 women around this table would have been the 20 women protesting. it remind us of what we get so frustrated with the political process that a lot of progress has been made. our country has changed in a lot

of ways. we are a country with great change, and we need to embrace that. >> a little bit of drama on the hill. and a non-filibuster to slow down this process, maybe you can tell us where we go from here. >> he uses the time available, and that's fine. here's where we are. we all know that finding a solution to our nation's budget was probably the top priorityal.

we go without having any continuity. we wrote our budget last march, passed it in the senate, and normally you would go to a conference committee and work out the differences. surprisingly, the minute we did, they objected. everyone is going to be upset, and we will do something that keeps us running. here we are. it really is unfortunate. democrats and republicans have got to sit down at the same table and give.

that has to be done, and our nation deserves that. >> it strikes me that over the summer we saw this old up, and we had some are republicans -- this buildup, and we had some republicans saying it was never going to happen. now we seem to be at the testosterone filled movement, and it will go back to the house, and there is a ping-pong between house and senate, but you are already hearing about house members having a list of demands for increasing the debt ceiling.

how is that going to get us out of this crisis to crisis zone? we are talking about a continuing resolution. we aren't even talking about a budget. >> the house passes a bill that is completely unacceptable. we're not going to take away the progress we we have made for providing health care in the country. we are going to take it in the senate. it will be sent as a resolution. i think it's important to remember that we are talking about the government while we keep this issue. this is how we manage ourselves. they decided to make a temper tantrum about that. that's where we are. the debt ceiling, what are we going to do?

i cannot believe the republicans would use the debt ceiling to throw our country into economic turmoil when we know we are just getting to feel stable again, when we are all beginning to feel we can go to work and not get a pink slip, that wall street is not going to collapse, and they are going to throw the country into turmoil? i cannot believe they are going to do that. the rational thing to do if there were a group of women in charges we would keep the government running for the next several weeks, and we would say, we are going to pay our bills, and let's do what we have to do and pay our debts. that will take the leaders of both parties coming together and

giving. which is how democracy works. >> who are the leaders on the republican side who can make that happen? we have seen a lot of frustration with john boehner's ability to negotiate. it does seem mitch mcconnell has been less willing to be out there because he is worried he is being primary back in his home state of kentucky. we have all these. who do we negotiate with? >> i think the republican -- the problem is republicans are being controlled more by the tea party part of their group. they really don't want our democracy to function the way it is. harry reid uses the word

anarchy. i don't know if i would go that far, but they came here to vote no. how do you function? that is what speaker boehner is dealing with. you're right? who do we -- you're right. who do we bargain with? more republicans are saying to me they feel strongly their party has to stand up to that faction, and i agree. i am a democrat. i want democrats to be in the majority, but in order to be a good country, we need a republican party who can negotiate with us, and we don't have that functioning right now, but i predict we will have a better republican party. >> so by midnight on sunday.

>> you're going to get a continued resolution. i cannot imagine the republicans want the face of their party to be that they cannot come to an agreement on small things. i cannot believe that even with the faction that is hard to deal with a would want that for republicans. >> we have seen this idea that perhaps they will try to shift the conversation and get something done there but then really focus on the debt ceiling and the list of demands and other things they are going to insist upon, but shutting down the government is horrible. the debt limit is a very serious threat.

>> i think they are making a mistake if they are saying to the american public that they are going to put our entire economy at risk in order to get their projects, even if i agree with some of them. precedent that sets for the rest of our lives. every time someone is in the majority or the minority they use the debt ceiling or the economy to get what they want? we cannot run the economy that way. it's one thing if you have defenses about women's right to choose or differences about how much funding should the for education, but to put our entire economy at risk when we are at the global marketplace where other countries are competing for the same thing we are and we look like a third world country that cannot manage itself, i think that's very dangerous.

>> does it take leadership from the president to make that happen? >> the president is clear he will not negotiate over the debt ceiling. >> where do we end up if he is not willing to negotiate and they aren't willing to budge? >> they are apparently working on christmas tree filled demands to raise the debt ceiling. they haven't been able to get the vote for everything they said they wanted either. what they are saying is i know you will never vote for the debt ceiling, but if i put in a pipeline, will you vote for it? let's wait and see what they get together. we will send it back clean because that is the responsible

thing to do. they are going to have to live with their willingness to throw the economy -- i go back to the 1990's, when newt gingrich shut the government down. i got on a plane to go home, and people said, what are you doing here? i went in my office and answered the phone to people in tears who were not going to get their social security check. they were not able to pay their rent. if the republicans take us off that cliff and companies lay off

people and folks are not getting their social security check, they are going to sit there very long. i don't think they're very smart to put us in that place. they are going to sit there very long. >> what about the business community. it strikes me that the shutdown in the clinton white house it was -- i was nonessential. it strikes me that part of the dynamic was something everybody could understand, but the debt ceiling, for a lot of folks in ohio and pennsylvania, it's a harder conversation and an easier message from the republican side to say we are standing on our principles, and we aren't going to raise the debt ceiling. >> i think businesses in america are really concerned house republicans would but our economy into a crisis. first of all, many of them do business overseas. when they lose out because someone says your debt is no longer good or we don't trust

you, they are going to lose out to other countries. their business overnight can be flipped by this economic policy. i think businesses are putting a lot of rusher on republicans. -- a lot of pressure on republicans. they put themselves in a real bind, so they have to figure out how to get through that. i would hope the business community stands up. the last time we talked about not raising the debt ceiling, our credit was downgraded. >> there is a list of other stuff that needs to be done. we have got syria. there are so many other issues. how do we get through this and focus on those issues? >> everybody here knows the way

you get to a budget agreement is that we sit down and hammer it out. i am going to have to say, i will take that back to my caucus and get the vote on it. the republicans have to say the same on their side. i will tell you the 12 people on the supercommittee were really good people, and we spent a lot of time walking through details and talking about what we could put on the table. i had the ability to say i can't bring my caucus with me. what i didn't have was the republican chair who could say the same thing. he had to go back to boehner, who went back to the tea party.

we need the people in the room who are willing to stand up and be the leaders on the democratic and republican side, to say i am going to make the best eli can for my party, and then i am going to take it back and sell it because that's what our party needs. >> let's talk about the other issues. let's hope we get a settlement by midnight on monday. talk about veterans affairs. there has been a lot about the backlog issue, a lot about concern for mental health. that was raised again with the navy yard. talk about that. >> my own father was a veteran. he was injured.

seven kids in my family and my mom didn't know the extent of his injuries and what he went through, only that he was a veteran. when i was in college, it happened to be during the vietnam war, and most of my friends were protesting. i was trying to get through school, but i was in my senior year and had to pick somewhere to do my internship. i chose the veterans hospital to do it. i am taking an elevator to the seventh floor, going on to a locked ward to work with men and women my age suffering from posttraumatic stress disorder, although that word was not used

at the time. this to me was really vivid. i am dealing with these young men and women dealing with mental health aspects of serving our country. i just remember thinking, somebody has to be a voice for those people, never knowing later i would be elected to the united states senate and be there when we have thousands of men and women coming home serving not just one term but 4, 5, and six times with the health issues -- with mental health issues and being in a position to fight for them. the country wants to help. it's unlike the vietnam war. i think our country respect these people. i think our country feels that way today.

we want to stand up and provide services, but often the stigma of mental health -- you have to be the warrior saying you have challenges -- is not easy, and critically, it is fighting the culture of our military who don't want to accept that mental health is a challenge we have to deal with, so changing the culture of the military, changing the culture of us as a country, not saying i feel bad you have eds the, but i'm not going to hire you. that's a bad attitude. it's a complex problem to have the services available and to have us of the country doing everything we can, not just saying thanks but really being there.

>> it strikes me that the affordable care act is a place we could change the conversation given that it would provide services and treating it like any other illness. that could be a place where you have republicans fighting against the affordable care act, talking about the need to address mental health issues not just for our veterans that when you are looking at things like gun violence. >> mental health the person themselves have to ask for help. but there is somebody to answer the call when somebody asked for help.

this young man was not silent about it. the question we have to ask is did we give him the right things? >> do you think we are making progress on military sexual assault? >> i want that to be better. we stood up and held a three- star general. i think what's great is we have women in the senate who are not going to say, it's taken care of. i think the military recognizes it, and the military recognizes they need people to come into the military. if we say i don't want my son or daughter serving in the military, we aren't going to be a strong country. the military has to change.

this is not a topic where we say ok, we took care of that. >> in terms of the issue of do these get handled in the chain of command, what resources are available outside of the chain of command. where do we end up? >> the good he is we are actually about the solution. we are having a really good debate about that. we will figure that out, but the good news is we are having a debate about that. we didn't have a debate 20 years ago. we are saying it is not working. we want to get it right, and i

think we will. >> we are going to take questions in a few minutes. let's switch to education. let's start with early childhood education and the president's proposals regarding headstart. where do you see that going? >> i am the only preschool teacher in the united states senator here -- united states senate. i know how important it is for our young children to have the ability to be successful, and there is a huge difference between those who have some kind

of support in terms of the six feels we need as americans and being able to work in a group, and we have left the hind the vast majority of young kids today. we have left behind many competitors. we have decades of experience, and every country in the world has shown we need to invest in early childhood education, and we have not done it. a teacher told me 80% of her kindergartners come to school on the first day and don't know how to turn up page in a book. what were they doing? a lot of parents don't know to read to their kids, and a lot of parents do. we need to give them the skills to say, reading to your children is not just fun. it is important to their brain development.

i am 100% behind our country really focusing on those young kids. you know who is with me on this? police chief. they tell me the vast majority of people in their jails never had early education. for me this is a no-brainer that i am passionate about. >> is their support on the republican side of the aisle? >> i believe there is. we are looking at the overall budget. what are the priorities? we have spent so much time talking about the deficit that we haven't talked about education. we haven't talked about transportation infrastructure. we also have to deal with these other deficits and get that investment. >> there is talk about increases

in military spending. we know that the miniscule amount of waste, fraud, and abuse -- >> you cannot teach a child to come to class hungry. for our young people to be participants in the community, you have a group of 24-year- olds, and they have not had something to eat in a couple days, they aren't going to learn anything. i am mad about this. >> there is a level of

conversation we have been having. we are talking about $40 million, and we are not talking about investments in early childhood education. how do we shift and find partners on the other side to make those investments happen. >> first we give them courage to take on the tea party. there were a lot of republicans who worked with us. they really understood the need for early childhood education. right now those kinds of republican senators are so fearful of being eliminated in a

tea party primary all they think they should talk about is how they can cut back. we need to give republicans a way to work with us to lower the cost in our jails when we invest in early childhood education, to have a group that are healthy and well-educated. we need to get back to that topic. >> one of your roles has been working to recruit candidates to run in the senate. i wonder why we don't have more women running and what is the argument you make to them to have more run?

>> i think it is important we write more policies and repeat back to their constituents what it is. if you have all men creating legislation, women will turn them off. you need women explaining it as well. nordstrom's understands that. i have women and men who are sales people on purpose. having diverse body is important. why is it important for women to be in politics? we bring issues to the table, but we help america understand why we are fighting for what we are fighting for. i do think it's important, and it's great to see people. i would tell you i have chaired the democratic committee twice. you don't recruit people into politics.

you open the door for them. men the first thing they say is, to money have you raised? they can speak to them. i think they need to know that one enlisted to them while they speak. >> a question to the left? >> i want to thank your staff for their interest in looking at how we can capture savings from

budget processes, and i am wondering your thoughts on that and how we might move forward. >> that is a huge amount of affordable care, refocusing us from paying huge amounts for all the things that cost more. we have got a huge disconnect when we look at it. insurance companies cover you until you are 65. insurance companies have never been interested in doing prevention for those diseases you normally spend a lot of money on after you are 65. it is somebody else's problem. we need to make sure the health care system focuses on

prevention. it's what the affordable care act does by providing health care coverage for people so they do have mammograms on a regular basis. if you have knowledge and make the decisions about yourself, then you make the decisions about yourself. if you don't have the knowledge, you are going, if i had just eaten more vegetables, or whatever it is. we need to help people do that. a lot of businesses are looking at wellness. >> it's not just having information but having access. there isn't always this understanding that some people don't have the opportunity to make a good choice.

>> go back to those kids who come to school and don't know how to turn a page in a book. if they haven't been read to, have they ever had immunizations? have they ever had simple care when they were young that helps them be healthier? probably not. we have to make sure we work with those communities and provide them with the knowledge they need. parents want to do the right thing, but it is helping them get the knowledge. >> other questions? >> i work for government

services. you mentioned several times congressman boehner and other republicans need to go back to the tea party to get permission to get legislation passed, and i think it has been well established that the tea party is not a grassroots organization at all. it's basically funded by people like charles and david coke. how does the senate stop something like the tea party from holding the rest of america hostage? >> i hate to give advice to my republican counterparts, because i want to stay in the majority, and i want to win, but i would say, you need to stand up to the tea party. people will admire that and respect that.

people want their legislators to work from a point of courage, not the point of fear. that is were tea party members are winning. if you have republicans that look fearful versus a strong person who says they are going to go for it, you will lose, but if you say, i disagree with you, and this is what is important, they are going to start winning. >> i've had private conversations with republicans in this town. there were so many republicans who thought what rush limbaugh said was terrible. i said, why don't you say that? they said, we cannot speak out against rush. similarly, you hear the conversation about tea party people.

as much frustration as they have, it deems like a are -- like they are looking at their colleague. >> that's leading from the point of fear. people don't support fear. whether you are a ceo or a legislator, they need to be confident in their leaders. if you are confident in your self people will be confident in you. they need to take them on. >> i am peggy. i am a congressional report are for hispanic outlook.

i have to cover all sides and all issues. i have met a lot of republican women. very often everyone thinks the same. there are a lot of african american women who don't approve of gay marriage. i am worried about people becoming less tolerant. the press is making it hard to work with tea party people. how do you work with them? fax she and i have introduced legislation to gather. i have a tremendous -- together. i have a tremendous amount of respect for her. she was great speaking out.

she took on her own leadership. we need to reward that in america and in the press. often that gets lost. >> with the democratic women, there is diversity of opinion. >> i come from a big family. we recognize i will not agree with kelly on certain issues, but we don't have to debate that all the time. let's find out what we agree with. i think it's important to say, we have a budget in front of us. what can we do? that's how we come to compromise and how we are willing to do

that. i think the reward of encouraging people to do that is what we have lost and needs to come back. >> is that a function of how women lead? >> we chair the transportation committee. we both work closely together. i realize there are things she needs i may not agree with, but i am willing to put that in the bill so she has something she can bring forward.

we wrote the bill. we were told we would never get it out of subcommittee. i think i may be your only republican vote, and we ended up getting six or seven republican votes, and we brought it to the senate floor only because mitch mcconnell thought we weren't going to pass any appropriation bills. susan and i respect each other. she respects what my values are. we know what our common ground is. we know when we disagree. we don't need to focus on our disagreement. often we are moms. we have kids. we know we cannot give them what

they want always, but we listen to what we can give them. that is another trade. >> a good experience for working in the senate. >> i want to say thank you for all the leadership you have demonstrated for children with disabilities and our veterans. it has been a joy to work with you on making sure they get what they need. we come from the radical position that people need health care to live independent lives. one thing we have been proud of is market reforms, no pre- existing conditions for kids. we think all those things are good for the middle class and families. we are frustrated by 41 or 42 votes in the house.

we think that's silly, but what are the implications of all these votes from your perspective? >> we are very clear. if we want to keep government running we are supposed to repeal the affordable care act. are there parts we can make better? of course there is. but are we going to take maternity care for women in this country and go back to a place where pre-existing condition is being pregnant and you don't get health care? are we going to go to a place where kids reach their cap by a- year-old and are denied health care? a woman was saying to me -- they were lamenting the health care bills. i didn't have to say anything. a woman stood up and said, i have to tell you, my son is severely disabled. he has never been able to buy insurance

because of that. i am getting older. i am so scared. i could not sleep at night, but he can buy insurance. he is going to be ok. don't take that away. i think as more people see that we will get past the temper tantrum. they can say it didn't work. >> one more question. this woman on this site? -- side? >> i am the mother of a preschooler. i am really curious.

it strikes me how antiquated it is. i have to go to the fields and harvest them, and over the summer inner-city kids are not getting as much food. they are falling further behind. i wonder when we are going to have a conversation about basic fundamentals. let's teach art and things so kids have a way to learn and we can do our job. most of us are farmers. i wonder why we have a hard time tweaking a system that is so wrong. >> there are a lot of creative

things being done to deal with that. every woman who is a professional and has a child at home has two address that. we need to allow women to choose to do both. we need to allow women who want to stay home to stay home, and we need policies where women who want to focus on a professional life are supported by that. that's what we want. making sure our kids are ok is so critical for the nation. we do a better job when we know our kids are ok. when we have to pick them up at noon or we get charged twice as much, those things make a challenge to do our job. let me throw one thing out i am seeing happen as a result of

women speaking out, and that is the issue of daycare. it makes our stomach turn. there is a group of educators working with daycare folks to give them curriculum so they are actually giving them curriculum that will help them be a better daycare person. i don't care if you have three kids or 20. the daycare providers are ecstatic. they are being told their job is perfect -- important, and here is how you can do it better. helping those people feel they are a critical part of our country and giving them the skills to do it is going to help all of us in this country. there are some great skills. i wish we had done that.

>> take you. we are going to close our program. [applause] >> thank you very much. we know you have a lot going it was wonderful for you to share your thoughts and experiences. a very special thanks for supporting. keep an eye on our website for news of our other upcoming programs. thanks again, and enjoy the rest of the afternoon. [applause] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013]

him him him him him him the human general assemblies meeting continued saturday in new york city. one of the speakers was mobile saw me. he talked about building toward a democratic state and foreign- policy positions on issues including syria, the israeli- palestinian conflict, nuclear nonproliferation and counterterrorism. he spoke for about 15 minutes. >> ladies and gentlemen, a gives

me pleasure at the outset to congratulate you for assuming the presidency of the general assembly at the 68th session. it is important to express my .ppreciation to present he is try to realize the theoses and are choosing ,osts 2015 development agendas considering the high priority the united nations and the people of the world accorded to the achievement of the development. to follow the normal practices of the debate by opening my address with a message i care with me to your

people. also for the people of my country, the egyptians that have laid the foundation of human civilization and have recently inspired people worldwide. each holds a unique position past and present. it is essentially from its civilization. it would have been a historical the will ofy had the egyptians remain shackled. it is as natural to take to the streets to declare the determination in which their dignity can enjoy a, and social justice.

they insured the world that the will of the people cannot be broken. it can grant authority just as it can remove it from those who abuse it. egyptiansions -- have an ambitious vision for the future. if success is based on a society that is open to all political a ways, legalistic in that embraces the diversity of all its members, and inclusive with the duties of all citizens are insured with equality before justice. are consistent with the fundamental rules throughout the world, mainly respect for a peaceful dialogue.

they have the right to fulfill this vision. roadmap thatthe egypt is implementing since the third of july 2015. this includes a national agenda in a specific timeframe. all egyptians are invited to participate in all stages as long as they are committed to the renunciation of violence and terrorism. work is underway in line with the roadmap. it has so far succeeded in establishing the principles of justice, freedom, and democracy as a basis of providence. work is underway for the new constitution to be followed by so thatntary elections

the transition phase continues. this requires us to give ultimate priority to the preservation of security and enforcement of the law and to change any attempts aimed at hindering our efforts. hit by terrorist attacks among the victims. they were egyptians from all walks of life. terrorismous acts of aimed at undermining the democratic process and destroying our economy. i would like to emphasize form dutch firm that i have full confidence that the egyptian formerly that i have

full confidence of the egyptian people can do this. firmly stand by the egyptian people in the fight against violence. we do not accept any attempt to justify this. my deepe to convey condolences for the loss of innocent lives. the message i am carrying or those who are joining me here today in presenting their country and would not be complete without mentioning escalation to more democratic national elections and stronger ties of corporations between our people and the rest of the world. they should he chased on mutual i interfere in and in

and in this good all in. of the willflection of our people. it is formulated in line with nationalest in security with no regard to any other consideration. we fully recognize that egypt's national security is linked to the security and concern of our air of nations. given the location and identity, egypt is committed to continue defending the interests of its continent, addressed the issue of the world. egypt remains committed to tackle the challenges facing the south.

i would like not to briefly highlight egypt's position toward separate issues of high priority foreign-policy. ladies and gentlemen, in syria the tragedy has reached a point of resorting to chemical weapons. we strongly condemn the use. we support the agreement between russia and the united states as well as security council resolution 2118. while the unitarian crisis is unfolding, it is on the verge of disintegration. they will preserve the unity of the state. we hope this can be achieved through the holding of the geneva conference so that it can be put in place to end the civil

war as well as two and the ford interventions which we have so long warned against. the palestinian question remains the first in our region which is still suffering from the effect of the continued israeli .ccupation achieving a two state solution was on the verge of failing terrifically -- irrevocably. the commitment so far by both sides to engage in a process of negotiation whose a significant a significant development. we should all support the ongoing ago station so they lead which finest settlement

continues through the past century. egypt will continue to support the right of the palestinian people to the establishment of an independent and sovereign state with east jerusalem as its capital. this must be met. it is morally unacceptable. they have access to basic supplies. they will agree on appropriate legalement that guarantee and transparent ways.

they might agree with us that a new middle east will not come without ensuring the right to equal security in getting rid of the threat post by the existence of nuclear weapons and other weapons of mass distraction. the situation threatens the credibility of the nonproliferation regime for that reason. and to preserve this credibility i announced before you today an initiative from this um consisting for of the following steps. inviting all countries of the deposit with the secretary-general of the united nations, stating their support for the middle east region. free from weapons of mass destruction as well as nuclear

weapons. the countries of the region that all signed well -- on weapons of mass instruction should commit before the end of and will show thew yo relevant pensions. proof of that.w i invite the secretary-general of the united nations to so that they are carried out simultaneously in order to ensure their success. that israel exceeds to the non- peripheral us a nonnuclear state convention and science and ratifies the biological weapons convention. that's. ratifies the biological weapons convention and takes the remaining steps that have

pledged to the chemical weapons convention. egypt ratifies the biological weapons convention and signs and ratifies the chemical weapons convention provided that all countries of the middle east complete measures to the international conventions prohibiting the mass destruction. continued pursuit to ensure that the conference to establish a weapons of mass destruction in the middle east is sweetly held, preferably before the end of egypt roots are greatly ingrained in africa. we are proud of the numerous changes it has witnessed as well itit has taken -- the stride

has taken toward democracy. they had this to resolve the conflicts. accordingly, egypt will soon establish an agency for partnership for development. most of the future resources will be directed to african countries so that they can from egypt's technical expertise. democracytalk about and the rule of law at the international level and a substantial reform takes place. are better able to respond to challenges. the only logical and sound way to achieve this desired outcome

today is through the reform and expansion of the security council. accordingly, egypt renews the end the decision-making process to the council and to rectify the historical injustice inflicted on africa. it does not have a permanent seat in the council and is poorly represented with nonpermanent members. as i conclude, i would like to highlight once again our priority issues with in the united nations system. strengthening the international right framework, accelerating the achievement of development

pools, realizing nuclear disarmament and fighting corruption including recovering efforts stolen by key members recently brought down by our people. we are determined to continue internationally and nationally. will contribute to the vision for the world and for the future. i would like to take this for theity to welcome youth. it is also considered efforts at the international level. will coordinate these efforts and adjust the root causes. hope the message i was was seen by all of you

here today. i hope this is contained so that we achieve prosperity, peace, and development and that we come back to reap the fruits of our labor. thank you. >> this is the woodrow wilso [applause] >> on friday night, the un security council voted unanimously to adopt a draft resolution that calls for the destruction of serious chemical weapons. tomorrow the u n general assembly annual meeting continues in new york city. we will bring you live coverage of the deputy prime minister beginning at 9:45 a.m. eastern on c-span2. today on c-span, our first lady's influence and image a series focuses on the life and times of allen and edith wilson.

followed by newsmakers with "newsmakers" with ernest moniz. >> this is the woodrow wilson house in washington dc the home of our 20th president and first lady edith wilson. after they left the white house in 1921. you will be seeing more of it over the next two hours as we tell the story of the two wills and administrations first ladies, allen and edith. >> allen and woodrow met in their 20s and their love for each other was reflected in passionate letters. to help guide his career from academia to politics, he set an example for future first ladies, ellen wilson died just a year

and half into the president's term. the grieving president soon met washington businesswoman edith galt. they married after a secret courtship and edith wilson served as first lady for more than five years. her unprecedented role in managing the president's affairs after he suffered a stroke remains are the most controversial efforts of any first lady. tonight, the story of the wilson administrations to first ladies, ellen and edith. we have two traffic deaths here to tell you about these two interesting women and the times in which they lived. her book is allen and edith, woodrow wilson's first ladies. john mills cooper is woodrow wilson's biographer. thanks for being with us. we have been telling the stories chronologically, but everybody knows about edith wilson managing the white house as it is described after her husband suffers a stroke.

we will tell that story first because so many people really want to know what happened. john cooper, let me start with you. when in his it ministration did he suffered a stroke. >> more than halfway through the second term. it was october 1919. here just returned from a whirlwind speaking tour. he was tried to sell the country on ratifying the peace treaty and going into the league of nations. he had really worn himself out on that and his doctors actually aborted the tour and got him back to the white house. after about five days in the white house he suffered a massive stroke third >> the story of the stroke night itself is very dramatic or it can you tell us recently what happened that night? >> there are some conflicting reports about what happened, but i think that the most accurate portrayal is that he got up in the morning, edith had been going into check on him during the night and she found him slumped to the floor and couldn't move his left side.

she went out into the corridor and used a telephone that did not go through the switchboard. she did not want to have this universally known. she asked the chief usher to call the doctor from this other phone. the doctor came in and they helped him into bed, but he was paralyzed on his left side. >> a character that is going to be a big part of the story is kerry greeson. >> kerry greeson is the doctor. here been inside the white house first under the taft administration and then shortly, taft introduced him to his successor wilson and pretty soon after the inauguration, wilson sister fell down and grace and treated her and did a good job andgrayson treated her and did a good job. and he was a virginian which went a long way with the wilson's.

he was the white house physician. he was the one who treats him. they called in various consultant specialists, but grayson was the one who treated wilson. >> what was the extent of his condition? >> what was the extent of his condition? how badly had the stroke affected him? >> he had a blockage in an artery leading to his brain and this is usually not a fatal stroke, but it did immobilize him for a while. he probably would have recovered fairly rapidly had he not 10 days later suffered a second medical condition. he had prostate trouble and he had a urinary tract infection with a very high fever. of course they didn't have antibiotics at that time, they debated whether to operate, but

the specialist felt that to operate on a 52-year-old man with high blood pressure and a stroke would have been very unwise. so they just decided to let nature take its course and eventually he recovered, but it really sapped his vitality. this one-two punch really did him in for about a month. >> christie is free to agree or disagree, but i think the worst effect of the stroke on wilson was really on his emotional balance. his judgment also. his intellect wasn't impaired and his speech was an impaired. yes some he could function that way, but so much more goes into being a leader and the president then just being smart and being able to do these things. another thing is, partly because of that other illness that you just talked about, christie,

they isolated him. that is when you're supposed to keep away from stress. now they know it is exactly the wrong thing to do. what you want to do with the person who is had a stroke is get them into social interaction. with the best of intentions they were doing exactly the wrong thing. >> dr. grayson's letters are part of the collection at the woodrow wilson library at stanford about two hours from washington. in putting this program together, we will learn more about wilson threw grayson's letters. >> we have a letter in this box from henry morganthau who wanted to write about experiences. so he was asking grayson if he could use certain information. the information you gave me about president wilson and you're having come to the

conclusion that he should resign and how he was influenced by mrs. wilson to give up this plan. so mrs. wilson was very concerned that her husband would not get better if he did not have something to engage his mind, that he would just deteriorate if he was forced out of the presidency. while president wilson was ill, it has been speculated wildly among historians -- speculated widely among historians. we have one document here that sheds a little bit of light on that. it is a telegram from henry morgenthau who was the ambassador to turkey and he is writing to dr. carey grayson asking if the president has any objection to a citizens meeting to protest against turks being left in control of constantinople.

and morgan saw has been asked to speak at this meeting -- and morgenthau has been asked to speak at this meeting. at the bottom of this telegram is edith's handwriting. we are familiar enough with her handwriting to recognize it as such. at the bottom she writes, thinks it well to postpone speaking on such subjects. what we don't know is, did you just take this telegram into wilson, ask his opinion and then write that or did she just come to that conclusion herself. the public was very interested and curious to know the condition of wilson's health. rumors were rampant in the papers, even congressmen didn't know what was going on. they only knew what they read in the papers. after it was all over, carey grayson later wrote a summary of what happened from the time of

the stroke until wilson left the white house. on the last page -- the decision was made to announce that wilson was suffering from nervous exhaustion. there were no other details given as to what was wrong with him. really no one knew the extent of his illness. he really was not capable of doing anything. dr. grayson thought it wise to issue general statements only. further, mrs. wilson, the president's wife, was absolutely opposed to any other course. she did not want it to be known that he was really suffering. again, she was protecting her husband and she wanted him to be able to fulfill his duties as president. she was worried about his legacy. ultimately, she was concerned

about his health and she felt that if you left the presidency, left the white house, he would just waste away and die. >> >> so how did they react? >> a couple of different ways. robert lansing who was the secretary of state and would have been fired if wilson hadn't had the stroke, there had been a bad break, that is another story. but lansing tried to get the cabinet in on it and i think he even made some communications with the vice president, who stayed out of it completely. he simply said no. greeted in the constitution. this is before the 25th amendment actually is not as much of a protection as we think in cases of inability.

we won't talk about disability this is the inability of the president to do his duties. what does that mean? this means if he were dead the vice president succeeds. this is the one time that we really had a disabled president. how do you deal with it? edith was scared. this was a very scary thing. make it up as you go along. on facebook, david welsh says, what part of personality or intellect prepared mrs. wilson to take over during his recovery? what skills did she bring to this responsibility she was taking on? >> that is a very good question because she had exactly two years of formal schooling and her whole entire life. she came from a large family and had been chosen by her grandmother to take care of her, to be her caregiver. her grandmother was a very opinionated woman and taught edith, basically, that it was

good to have opinions and to make decisions. edith had been widowed relatively young and had inherited gault's jewelers which was like the tiffany's of washington. so she kept the jewelry store and had a manager who made a lot of the decisions, but she was used to having everything her way. so she brought this very decided personality. in addition, woodrow had courted her by showing her a lot of secret papers. henry kissinger used to say that power was the ultimate aphrodisiac. i think woodrow wilson would have agreed. so he was using this entr? to the secret papers as part of his court ship pier and she was susceptible to that and so he shared a great deal of what he was doing, really a great deal

of what he was doing, with her. i think john said that she probably knew as well as anyone what he was doing and what he was thinking because he was a real lone wolf when it came to being a president. he did not have a lot of close advisers. >> that is true. >> this is from edith wilson herself. they published her memoirs. in this big controversy about how much power she took upon herself. here's what she said or did "i myself met never made a single decision regarding the disposition of public affairs. today we know, the gatekeeper to the president is really the most important job heard >> he or she controls accent to the president is in some regards president. as she said, it is not just who got to see him, they pretty much embargoed well for well over a month.

no one got to see him. but also what the president gets to see. she would decide what was best for him to see and what not. to me, one of the raps on edith in this was that she was putting her husband's health ahead of the good of the country and that somehow the priorities were wrong there. well, i don't think that is entirely why she did what she did. she knew what he wanted. if he couldn't express himself, she knew he would not want to resign. he would want to hang onto this. as christy said, she knew his mind better than anybody else. if anybody was going to access a substitute -- if anyone was going to act as a substitute, she was the best. >> the secretary of state got lakhdar the cabinet members very thickly. wilson's secretary plus the loyalists like eaker and daniels in the cabinet but a kibosh on

that very quickly. >> there were two senators who were detailed to come in and assess the condition of wilson because it came out when lansing went up to capitol hill that he hadn't spoken to the president about a very volatile situation in mexico. they deputized one democrat and one republican and edith and dr. grayson really stage-managed that very well. accounts differ on exactly what they did, but whatever it was him it was enormously successful, including the republican who would have been most anxious to show that there was something wrong with wilson, set to the press afterwards that the president grasped his hand with both of his. but that was impossible because a president could not move his left hand. but he was so taken with his

apparent animation. he made a lot of jokes, because that part of his thinking came back for quickly. he loved to make puns and he loved to tell jokes and stories. that came back relatively quickly. but as john said, the judgment was really what took a hit. >> we have a timeline of the president's incapacitation. as john cooper told us it was september of 19 19. it was in march of 1920 when he left the house for the first time. by the way, we have to talk about all of the political intrigue and important decisions going on in the aftermath of world war i. his beloved league of nations was rejected by the senate at that time for the first time. in april of 1920 the president had his first cabinet meeting, eight months not meeting with the cabinet. it is almost unthinkable. how could the cabinet continue? >> i routine. and also, wilson was a great

delegator. except in foreign affairs. other than that, he gave his cabinet secretaries lots of leeway. so they were used to running things on their own. it is just very lucky and maybe something of a tribute to that that the government function as well as it did. not all that well, but it did keep going. >> there is a story about edith. all during that time, what really was her role? >> i think one aspect of her role that was overlooked is the extent to which she tried to make woodrow give way on some of his intransigence about the league of nations. in her memoir, which is fanciful in places, she says that she asked him leads to compromise with the republicans in congress to try to get the treaty passed with the league of nations. she said that he turned to her

and said, little girl, don't you desert me to. she was about five foot nine. she says in her book that she never try to change his mind again. but, we have evidence that there were at least two other occasions on which she did try to change his mind. she and his chief of staff had discussed some of the places where they hoped woodrow could give a little ground and where the republicans could give a little ground and they hoped to find some compromise. she took some notes very hurried, almost shorthand notes of what is obviously a speech that she was going to give to wilson that wound up saying and for the sake of the country and the peace of the world, please consider this. it didn't work, apparently, because he didn't change. she was not a woman to take

notes on something and not do something about it. a little bit later, she had some conversations with ray standard baker who is very close to wilson and later became his official biographer. he gave edith some suggestions, again, some talking points, to try to get wilson to change his mind. but he didn't and by the time he refused, by that time the republicans were also heartening their line. some of the hardliners were reeling in the republican leadership. >> so donald on facebook asks if edith ever spoke out publicly on the league of nations. >> she did not speak out on anything. this is again to correct a big misperception of edith. i do not think she was at all power-hungry for herself. she wanted what her husband wanted.

his agenda was her agenda. she used to say to people, i never make speeches. i think she made a few, years after woodrow died, but during the time he was in the white house, she was asked to present something innocuous like a bouquet of flowers to the girl scouts and she said i'd like to make a speech, but i never have and i won't. she did not even approve of voting for women. or women's suffrage. >> let's go back in time, but before we goes up the section to reviewers, we thought you'd all want to get this out because it is such an interesting aspect historically. what is the bottom line of this. in american history? how did it affect how we view the role of the president, the role of the first lady and the constitutional issues? >> the role of the president, i mean, woodrow follows theodore roosevelt and these two together acting one after the other, made the president the center of the government, the active part.

and even presidents later such as calvin coolidge, especially, who wanted to retreat to the sidelines, couldn't do it trade that is what really changed their. the first lady role probably in terms of -- i think ellen had more to do than edith did. >> that is a great segue because we are now moving into the ellen story. >> tonight is a special two-hour program because we have to first ladies to talk about. our lines will be open and you can reach us if you live in eastover central time zone. you can be part of the facebook

conversation, go to c-span on facebook and finally you can tweet us using at first ladies and be part of the conversation. we're going to roll back the clock and talk about the long marriage of woodrow wilson to his first wife ellen. to sit the stage for that we're going to visit the wilson house. it is available for you to visit if you come to the nations capital. inside right now in the drawing room is peter. >> we are here with law and home who is the executive director of the house. this is a house where president and edith wilson lift post- presidency. how did they acquire this house? >> they moved here literally the day they left the white house in 1921. this home cost $150,000 and they managed to scrape together the money i assembling both

president wilson's winnings as the nobel peace prize winner and also donations from canada's wealthy friends and political supporters. >> edith wilson lived here until her death in 1961. that is 40 years. also them expired in this home. >> in 1924 for president wilson. although it is edith wilson's house a mother is the presence of ellen wilson, isn't there? >> we try at the woodrow wilson house to remember the president's years which include both first ladies, both ellen wilson and edith wilson. it is important when you are considering figures in history to remember that they had childhoods and experiences that led them to the places that they were. >> so what are we looking at here? >> this is a painting painted by ellen wilson who was a painter of considerable talent. even as a young girl she knew that she was a good painter and enjoyed it. it is interesting that when president wilson proposed marriage to her she said yes, but i'd like to go to the art students league in new york,

which is where she went to school for a year before they were wed. it is interesting that president wilson at that point in his life accepted that and married this woman who was independent and really laid the groundwork for and understand during of the role of women in society. his last wishes included the wish that this painting hang over his casket before he was laid to rest at the national cemetery. >> we are about a mile from the white house. we will show you some more a little bit later. >> thanks so much. edith was born in georgia in 1860. tell us about her early life. >> her father was a presbyterian minister and he served in the civil war, but he had to leave because of some stress-related conditions. he died in a mental institution, possibly a suicide. allen was very close to her

mother, but her mother died in childbirth with her fourth child when she was 43. so ellen really had to take over the family, first after her mother's death she had to take care of her father and then after her father's death she had to take care of her brothers and sister. so she became a very competent manager. she was very well educated for a woman of her time and place. she would have gone to college if she had had the money. when her father died she had the money to go to the art students league in new york for one year. she was very unsure that she would ever meet a man who could be her intellectual equal which she felt was necessary for her marriage. in fact, she had plans to open up a boarding house for women and supported with her artwork

and people around town started calling her belly the manhater because she was so clearly not going to be satisfied with anyone in the town. but then woodrow wilson came to town. he was a lawyer at the time, he had a case, he went to church where her father was preaching and he met her there. >> how important was it that both alan axon and thomas woodrow wilson, with the children of ministers? >> in some ways that is the world they grew up in. not so much the u.s. of the south, but the presbyterian church which in many ways is a world unto itself. what it didn't make them though, either of them, and i think this is true of wilson as much as it is of ellen, it didn't make them religious zealots. it did not make them obsessed with religion. in some ways, religion was so central to them that in many ways they could take it for

granted. it is in the background. it is always there, it is important, but the two of them but of the two of them, he was more the good strong believer. she is the one who had the religious doubts. especially because with the various family troubles depression ran really ran in the axon family. probably one brother, eddie, who died in a tragic accident as a young man, was about the only one who wasn't touched with depression. ellen was -- in some ways metaphysically and philosophically she was more curious than wilson was. wilson was much more interested in the affairs of the world, but religion is a background. >> he was interested in the affairs of the world, but he is so easily smitten with women. he falls. and this is an important character of his personality. he knew instantly that he loved this woman. women have played an important

part throughout his biography. what do you understand about women and his psychology and the role that they play with him? >> i wish i could say that he was a man who -- of great enlightenment and forward- looking views. he wasn't. he wasn't bad though by the standards of that time, he really comes off pretty well as having, believing strongly that women are very bright and very capable. generally, i think he still likes the subordinate role. basically, he just liked women and more so than men of that time he enjoyed the company of men very much, but he just generally enjoy the company of women and he enjoyed their intellectual companionship heard >> but he is so passionate. he is very passionate and very eloquent and so when you marry those two traits and the letters that he wrote to ellen after they were engaged, they are just the most astonishing love

letters you will ever see. and she was quite eloquent, too. >> some of the love letters of woodrow wilson to ellen are preserved at princeton university's manuscript library. we are going to learn about them next. >> here on the shelves are the correspondence between woodrow and eleanor. they are love letters. it has to be the largest collection of love letters exchanged between any present and future first lady. these letters were sealed. when the woodrow wilson family moved, they were sealed. it is a time capsule shedding extraordinary life on the wilson's life together. woodrow is living in baltimore going to john thompson's. he wrote to ellen in 1894. when you come into my study, stitches me as i sit at my desk. it is odd how this attachment of viewers to me seems part of the

force of my mind. my darling, i trust it is not wrong to worship you as i do. you are the presiding genius of both my mind and heart. and in that fact, this the happiness and strength of your woodrow. i think we see the extent to which woodrow wilson not only loved ellen, but acknowledged in a very clear way his intellectual debt to her. in how many cases can you say that the first lady and her husband, that he is stepping forward and saying i acknowledge that you are the source not only of my happiness but of my intellectual development? you introduced me to literature, to wordsworth, to browning. they would sit together on the campus and read wordsworth together sitting in the grass. he acknowledged that profound role that ellen plays in his

life. he says how can i thank you dearest for the sweet things that you say in today's letter. how happy it makes me that you think such things as me, even when i feel with a heart ache how sadly unworthy i am of it all. i too trust it is not wrong to worship you as i do. i had as well question that it be wrong to breathe. for i am in every breath altogether your own ellen. often, she doesn't respond to them quite as passionately as he writes to her because she does tend to be a bit melancholy. but in this is an exuberance that is really delightful. allen was so devoted to him, you sense net l she puts herself second to his needs again and again throughout their life together. she is serving him and helping him. that was her conception of what her role was as woodrow wilson's wife.

as she is dying in the white house, that tragic summer, august 1914 with the world about to enter into great international convulsion with world war i about to break out, she is dying in the white house and she grabs the hand of dr. grayson and whispers to him, dr., if i go away, promise me that you will take good care of my husband. >> it might be hard to answer this question, but are listener on visitor ranks asked us where we would rank them on the loves of presidential couples. >> it seems to me it would be hard to come up to their level. as john cooper pointed out to me this very night, lying in arthur links collection of woodrow wilson's letters.

>> arthur linked was the greatest will surge -- was the greatest wilson scholar there ever was. in the volume that covers august 1914 and ellen's death, the editors, here it is, this is the introduction of this very stately monumental scholarly thing, with the editors bid a fond farewell to ellen wilson, whom we have all come to love. that is over the years that it had affected them so much. >> woodrow wilson asked her to marry him just five minutes after he met her. they got married when? >> they got married two years later. woodrow had a great strategy. he had had a girlfriend before and she had refused his offer of marriage and so i think he was once burned twice shy. so he had decided that he was going to propose to ellen just

before getting on the train to go to baltimore and attend johns hopkins in political science. so that if she refused him, there would be no awkward lingering as he later said. so they had met each other by chance in this town where neither of them lived. they were just passing through and he persuaded her to stay for a couple of extra days and meet his family. when she -- when he proposed to her, she was so startled that she blurted out yes. she had meant to, but she blurted this out and they had hardly known each other. but he was going off to study for two years, so they had a two-year engagement, since they didn't know each other very well, it was the marvelous letters through which they became intimate. >> mary kay is watching us in san rafael california. you are on the air. caller: thank you so much for the series.

i was wondering what the first lady and president thought of the pickets in front of the white house for suffrage in 1917. >> this would be back to edith. they were very indignant, especially edith was very indignant. she thought they were rude and at one point woodrow offered to send -- to have them come into the white house and get warm and have half -- and have hot coffee and they were -- and they refused. he did not believe -- she did not believe in suffrage for women and thought all this was quite foolish. there were two suffrage organizations and one of them was trying to go about amending the constitution in a state-by- state way, in other words have suffrage passed in the various states and then get more people in congress to support it.

woodrow receives the members of the national association of women suffrage -- national american woman suffrage association, and some people believe it was the extremism of the national women's party that allowed the more conservative group to make progress because they were seen as a lot less threatening. >> we are going to come back to his early years with ellen and his wife before politics. he is the only president who moved from the presidency of the university into politics and to the white house. how does he get to princeton and how does he get to the presidency? >> first of all he was a presbyterian minister son and princeton had sort of severed its official ties with the church, but it was still a very presbyterian school.

if you are a bright young man, princeton was a place to go. he wanted to step out from the south, to. he went to hopkins briefly, his first teaching job was at bryn mawr, a brand-new college for women. he actually like teaching there. he liked the women at bryn mawr better than ellen did. she objected to the modern woman that he did. he got back to princeton in 1890, became the most popular professor there. basically, he was one of two real stars of the faculty. there was some intrigue among the trustees and everything to get him to the presidency, that he got chosen president in 1902. then he tried to reform

princeton and succeeded a bit and failed quite a bit and really got stymied when the new jersey bosses came along and offered him the nomination for the governorship heard he took it from them and then turned on them immediately and became a reformer. a lot of things made him a front runner quite early, so he made a remarkable transition. in two years he went from being a university president to being president. the governorship was just a small interlude. wilson is one of those people with the exception of a lock, who succeeded in everything he did. he is one of the great lyrical scientists. he was a great scholar, a great university president. he was the best-known and most effective university president of his time. he is ranked among the best governors and he was one heck of an effective president, two. >> we love the interconnections here. grover cleveland after he left the white house went to princeton to practice law because it was difficult for a former president to do much

else. is it true that the families knew each other and that the children even played together? >> i don't know about the children playing together but i do know that they knew each other. >> we are going to show your prospect house which was the house at the wilson's lived in on the time that the presidents house. today is use for social functions. as we look at it we are going to learn about ellen and woodrow wilson's political partnership and how that develops. >> this is the study of prospect house and it looks very much as it did when woodrow and ellen wilson lived here. this would have been woodrow wilson's office. his desk would've been right here and here he would have met with students, faculty, university presidents, visiting people from across the world. it is here that he and ellen might've met to confer about university business. ellen wilson was highly involved with woodrow wilson's career. she gives him advice on what jobs he should take, what jobs he shouldn't take. when he was up for a post at

arkansas industrial university she suggested that was a bad career move. she was very involved and a tremendous help to him. behind-the-scenes him throughout his academic career. i find this room, this study so evocative because it is right here that we can see woodrow wilson making that transition from academic figure two political figure. ellen wilson helped with all of this. constantly advising woodrow, helping them out and then he decides to run for governor and the reporters descend on prospect. it reporters descend on his study. in the interview him right here in this room. they photograph him in the garden and ellen wilson is quite alarmed. she begins to sense that she is going to lose any privacy she might've had. she is going to lose that carefully constructed, very close-knit home life that she had valued so much with woodrow. that is going to slip away when they plunge into politics.

so they moved into prospect house, the young academic couple full of dreams, full of ambitions when she leaves prospect house. they are almost driven out by the trustees in 1910. when she leaves, she is better, she is exhausted and what awaits her is the political life's to check a tremendous toll on her, personally, in terms of her exhaustion, in terms of her energy, and psychologically. >> as his supportive spouse, how did her responsibilities change as she moved from university presidents wife to the first lady of new jersey and then ultimately into the white house? >> she was building on each of the things that she had done before. she had been involved in the small way with social outreach during the time that she was a private person. then when she became first lady

of new jersey, she became very interested in social welfare. she actually took woodrow on a tour to new jersey to look at state welfare institutions like the home for the insane were the prisons. she had an early record of activism among social welfare groups. she also had to do a great deal of entertaining during the dinner that was given after woodrow wilson's inauguration in 1902. she invited booker t. washington to the horror of her seven and of her southern aunt. she had a great deal of entertaining to do as the presidents wife, more of course when she moved into the governor's mansion. at one point they were down in the summer home, they didn't have a governor's mansion, but

the state of new jersey supplied a summer home. a little boy got lost and wandered into the house and came out afterwards and was asked if he met the governor. he said yes and she did me a piece of cake. >> what was her role in 1912? >> i don't think she did enough in the campaign. crexendo's interesting about the campaign was that she was, i believe, the first future first lady to go on a campaign before the convention. she and wilson went down to the south, especially in georgia where she was hailed as much as he was. unfortunately, they lost georgia. they didn't get the delegates from georgia. she had a hand in trying to get woodrow to patch up relations with williams jennings bryan to head three times in the democratic nominee. he was kind of the leader of the democratic party and he was very keen on helping woodrow get the nomination. >> she saw an opportunity.

wilson had come from a different wing of the party. he had said some things about bryant that some of his enemies had publicized to try to make trouble for it she saw a chance to mend fences. she brought them together and they hit it off very well. brian and wilson had a good relationship down to some things in world war i. she is playing the same kind of role that she played in his academic career heard a very shrewd tactician, a very good facilitator. not out in front or in public, she didn't particularly like that role, either. but she was awfully shrewd. >> theodore roosevelt's challenge to his own party by forming the bull moose party that split the republicans and helped bring woodrow wilson into the white house. if you have to capitalize his political philosophy, what would you say it is?

he called himself a protective a progressive democrat. he felt it was a government that made it possible for people to do things for themselves. he said i don't want a government that will take care of me, i want a government that will make sure that other people take their hands off me to that i can take care of myself. it is updated liberalism. is the individual's happiness, the individual self-realization. that is a great contrast with you to roosevelt. that campaign of 19 12 as the best we've ever had by far. what you get is really a debate of political philosophies between these two men. >> lee is watching us from durango, colorado. guest: thank you for taking my call. i have a question about the bill that was so important to ellen

wilson and did such a wonderful thing for the city of washington dc. i would like to comment on youth wilson. she was more of a hindrance than a help. joseph thomas c, a major advisor to the president wrote numerous letters during his illness and they were discovered unopened until after her death. >> thank you so much for your call. she asks about allen's alley bill. >> when they came to the white house, ellen felt that as long as she was in the white house, not a place for she particularly wanted to be, she would use her position to do as much good as she could. she connected with a group called the national civic federation that had been around for 10 years or so.

they were very interested in trying to clean up these little alleyways in between the bigger streets of washington where there were tumbledown shacks, great squalor heard they wanted to tear down all these buildings and do what we would now call urban renewal. ellen was so interested in this project that you took some of the congressman any white house car through the alleyways to show them the conditions of these houses that were right in the capital. she lobbied them to pass a bill that would enable this because at that time washington was run by congress. they didn't have their own government. she was i think the first lady to lobby for a cause that wasn't her husband's, outside of the white house. she was very effective at doing this. i don't know if you want to talk about all of what happens here

>> we will come back to the story because it is connected with her passing. wilson decides not to have an inaugural ball, why is that? >> it was partly because of ellen. ellen thought it would really be a commercialization, something frivolous. it should be a solemn occasion. she was a very thrifty woman. woodrow did not make a lot of money in his early days and she had a habit of frugality. somebody once said mrs. wilson looks sweeter every year in that brown dress -- and that brown dress she wears looks sweeter as well. she prided herself on being thrifty. she just thought the inauguration, the not real balls were frivolous. >> will you miss watching us in new york city. guest: in new york there is often mention of the wilson

girls in society. can you tell us a bit about their growing up and entering adulthood? >> he brought three daughters to the white house. >> yes and they were all roughly marriageable age when they get into the white house, so they go to balls and parties. allen is on record as saying that she doesn't approve of modern dances like the turkey trot. somebody else writes and says that ellen morris slaton who is a gossipy wife of a congressman. she kept a diary and said that they had been seen down at the military barracks turkey trotting with the rest -- with the best of them. she tried to keep a rein on her daughter's, and two of them did get married in the white house. considering that she was only in the white house for 17 months before she died, that is quite an accomplishment. she had a very big wedding for her first daughter, who was married in november. she had a very small, quiet waiting for her third daughter,

who got married in may very shortly before ellen was bedridden. >> chad is in baltimore. guest: i wanted to know, after eleanor passed away and before youth arrived. is it true that margaret became the de facto first lady? >> i think she became the hostess. there has to be an official hostess. one of wilson's cousins helped her out. margaret did not much want to be the official hostess. she wanted to be a singer. she preferred to go to new york which is where she thought there were more opportunities to be a singer. i think the two of them tried to cope with the social duties. the social season was curtailed

on the advice of ellen's social secretary ritchie felt that been a precedent stringy harrison administration when his wife had died they had curtailed the social season, so there wasn't too much entertaining that margaret had to do. >> despite her short tenure in the white house, ellen wilson also brought on the rose garden. we will learn more about that in our next video. >> we are in prospect garden here in princeton new jersey. this is the garden that ellen wilson originally designed when she was resident of prospect house from 1902 to 1910. i think that here we see the full expression of ellen's aesthetic vision. she is an oil painter, very competent. she knows a lot of the american impressionist painters of the day. she loves to paint landscapes, and as a corollary to that she laid out this extraordinary people garden at the prospect house.

she plans to cedar trees, she plans all sorts of flowers. infection loves his garden so much that she hates to leave it when wilson enters politics and he enters princeton. she brings the white house gardener back to this garden at prospect house and says to the white house gardener, thus re- create the rose section of this garden at the white house. ellen wilson could look out of her bedroom window in prospect mansion and look right down and see the flowers all day. similarly, she wanted the president of the united states to be able to see roses when he looked out of his window in the white house. this becomes a famous rose garden at the white house. ellen tragically doesn't live to see the rose garden completed, however. she is dying in the summer of 1914. she is wheeled out into the space outside in her wheelchair and she watches as a gardener works, but she doesn't live to see the completion of this

vision she had for roses blooming at the white house. that is a vision that really begins here at aspect of art and in princeton. -- that begins here at prospect garden in princeton. >> here is a photograph of what it looks like you're in the wilson administration and here's what the rose garden looks like today. >> we have for short tenure in the white house, she did during the 17 months. we talk about the alley clearance bill heard we talk about the rose garden and the fact that she was a professional artist, one of the first ladies who brought her own profession to the white house. how significant was that in setting the standard for future first lady zacher >> i don't think it really set a standard for future first ladies hurried ellen did earn money from selling her paintings that she donated to charity that she had

set up for her brother in memory of her brother who had died. i think the only first lady who earn money while she was in the white house was eleanor roosevelt. it did not become a first lady tradition and just as well. >> next is aaron in greenfield, california. guest: becky for taking my call. i have enjoyed your show very much. as is my second time calling. the last time i called was through your first season when you were talking about the two wives of john tyler. i very much enjoyed your show so far. my question is about woodrow wilson's first wife ellen. when she passed away, where was she buried and when her husband passed away he was an attorney in the washington d c area. was his first wife's body

reinterred to be buried next to him and also where was his second wife. when she passed away? >> thank you. >> the answer to that question about whether she was reinterred, the answer was no. she is buried in the family plot, the acts and plot in rome georgia. when woodrow died, edith was pretty determined that he was not going to be buried with ellen. then the choice was he had been a president of princeton and the presidents of princeton are buried in a very nice cemetery. there have been some ill feeling and still was, so that was out. in the meantime a very ambitious ship of washington, mr. friedman wanted to get famous people buried in the cathedral so you do have gotten admiral dewey.

this is when washington cathedral was still very new. he approached you to about this and she liked the idea. he wanted to make the cathedral washington's westminster abbey and i was told that william howard taft granddaughter told him that when taft heard about this he said don't let those bodysnatchers at the cathedral get me. i think this is wonderful. this presbyterian present -- president was buried in an episcopal cathedral. >> was she sick the entire time that she was in the white house for 13 months? >> as she was. you saw the pictures of her leaving princeton and even being in princeton. she had first developed kidney trouble in 1889 when her third child was born.

the wilsons decided at that time to have no more children. they used birth control. she probably had been suffering from kidney disease for some time before she got to the white house, would be my guess. >> she was diagnosed with something called braces disease. the >> that is an archaic term for kidney disease. i don't think they had a sophisticated tests as we have now. i was impressed that they were able to diagnose it as early as 1889. >> theodore roosevelt first wife also died of kidney disease as well. she died quite early in their marriage. woodrow and ellen had been married for quite a while. >> dennis mccarthy wants in on twitter, digg woodrow wilson become consumed with ellen's illness. to did affect his performance as president? >> not till the very end. by and large it was kept secret from him.

so, that was ellen's wish. she did not want to burden him. >> i think everyone was in denial. the doctors kept telling her she would get better. i think the doctors were in denial. i don't think woodrow knew she was dying until the day she died. >> in the last few days when he was at her sick bed every possible minute, the world has literally fallen apart with world war i, and he had to deal with that. it's terrible. >> connie wants to know about the new role. -- about the funeral. >> they had the funeral in rome at the church where woodrow met her. the townspeople were there, but there wasn't a state funeral in washington. there was a little ceremony and the white house. >> yes, there was, at the white house. >> we already finished

our first hour. here is our guest john cooper biography of woodrow wilson. what i wanted to do as we close out here, mr. cooper, is open it up and read this paragraph or you talk about her contributions to him. allen seth felt him a cold low. ellen had been his closest, wisest advisor. he exercised more influence over her than anyone else. he rarely let her severe depression affect him or her daughters. ellen had given him so much, and he was a far better man for her gifts. he had gone further and accomplished more in the world of scholarship, education, politics, and government than he could have without her, and he

knew it. is it fair to say without ellen there might not have been a president woodrow wilson? >> absolutely. this man blossomed. he met her as he was about to depart for johns hopkins. he had been playing around with the law, trying to write, trying to find himself. it's extraordinary. it's amazing. any academic would love to have ellen pao off life. it really is extraordinary.

>> we have quite a bit of detractors and some orders on our facebook age. nelson wilson's biggest -- ellen wilson's biggest contribution was getting him to the white house? >> absolutely. >> as she was dying, she tells the chief of staff to go to congress and says she will die more easily if they will pass a bill. the senate takes action before she loses consciousness for the last time.

the bill passes later, but it is never implemented the close of world war i breaking out. they didn't have the money. in 1933 there was a young woman whose has and was involved in the ad in the stray shin. -- whose husband was involved in the administration. it was said nobody could move in a light society unless they could talk out. she made this fashionable. the first week eleanor roosevelt was in the white house, she went back to the federation, and she began to lobby for a bill. she lobbied for a great many different things, but i firmly believe ellen set an example for

elinor, and ellen are set an example for many first ladies who came after her. >> there are so many questions to ask. one interesting debate on our facebook page is woodrow wilson's attitude towards african-americans. here was ellen wilson reaching out to the plight of poverty stricken african-americans in washington, d.c. did she influence woodrow wilson, and what allah sees were used on the race issue? -- what policies were used on the race issues? rex she was a southern woman, and i don't inc. you could say she believed in a quality of african impact -- i don't think you could say she believed in equality of african-americans. she was a wonderful woman, but i think she thought african- americans belonged in their place.

she wanted to beautify washington, not just to be -- that's not just to be -- not just to be helpful. his own views -- i think his having grown up in the south really has less to do with his views there. the wilson administration record on race is bad, simply bad. he allowed his southern cabinet secretaries to attempt to introduce segregation to the federal work place. they made stabs at it. the newly formed naacp protested it. they backed off. they did it informally. that's bad. there's also that very unfortunate incident of showing the birth of a nation, the movie in the white house, which blew way out of proportion of what happened there. >> that's the time for edith.

>> that is in his interregnum, shortly before he met edith. that's the worst time in wilson's life except for the stroke. because he was absolutely devastated by ellen's death. he was in bad, bad shape emotionally. >> when gary robinson asked on twitter, -- on twitter, did woodrow give -- get any political bump or political passes on bills or issues wasse of ellen's death, he thinking of the affairs of state or the month out there? >> he had to. yes, he was. that's what -- he said that's what held it together. he had do this, he had to be president. he had to pay attention to these things. otherwise, i think the man could have really deteriorated badly there. if he had just been on his own. the presidency is his crutch at this point. his attitude to me, he's like a white northerner. he wants the race go away.

oh, yeah, that's the problem down to the south. booker t. washington, we'll make progress, a bit of benign neglect. wilson's much more like that. the southerners are obsessed by it. sinsn's sins were more of omission than comission. >> before we leave, we want to tell you we have a well populated website. www.c-span.org/firstladies. it's filled with all of the video and the programs we've done so far in the series. each week, we have a special feature attached to the first lady we're looking at. and this week, it's on ellen's artwork. so, if you go to the website and you want to learn more about her work, her easel, one of her

paintings on display at the white house while she was there, this is the featured item this week on first lady, the c- span.org website. while i'm talking about research, i want to tell you about one other. our partners of this series, the white house historical association. they have for many years published the biography series -- or compendium of first ladies. it's a special version of it. we worked with them to publish it and make it available to you. that same website has the link. we are selling this hard cover book at $12.95, our cost, so you can learn about the women. there's a short biography and we'll get them to you so you can learn more about the women in the programs and the rest of the series. this is what it looks like on screen. as we look at it, we will listen to leighton in rome, george. -- georgia. is that her birthplace? >> and her burial place. >> hello, how are you? >> fine. >> i would like to say that rome, georgia is watching tonight.

and, of course, we are the hometown of ellen wilson and we're very excited that you're doing a program tonight especially on ellen. christie miller has graciously accepted our invitation to come to rome as we celebrate not only the life but also the art of ellen wilson beginning in august of 2014. and you know, it's kind of interesting that in 1914, rome, georgia raised $10,000 in 2014, we'll mark the anniversary of the homecoming that never occurred. >> thank you very much. good to have folks in rome, georgia, watching tonight. any final thoughts on ellen before we move on? no?

ok. so, let's do that. he was devastated. but we've talked about his connection with women and his love of having women in his life. he was a widowed president. so lots of women were probably interested in him. how did he approach this period of his life when he was a widower? >> i don't think there was a great rush of women to meet him. but his doctor was very concerned about it. and he thought that a friend of his is goal might be somebody edithriend of his, gault, might be somebody that might cheer him up. so he arranged for helen, the woman who was serving as his official hostess after ellen's death to go walking with edith because helen herself was having some health problems. he thought it would benefit her to go walking with this nice hearty 0-- nice, hearty, vigorous woman. they took a number of walks together. that led to a meeting in the white house between edith and woodrow. and they were immediately drawn to each other.

just like with ellen. he very quickly fell in love and quickly proposed to her. >> edith bowling goff was found -- was from virginia. there's a map of virginia. you can see where it is in the southwest part of the state. about 300 miles way from washington, d.c. we visited there in preparation for the series. you'll see that next. >> this is the birthplace and childhood home of edith bowling wilson. today it looks very much like it did when the bowlings lived here from 1866 to 1899. originally, in the 1840s, this was two houses, they were joined together, which connected the upstairs bolling home, the downstairs was used as retail space. the upstairs was the home of the bollings. this is the original front door to the bolling home. this is where the bolling family would have entered. let me take you inside.

this is the birth room. this was the bedroom of her parents. she was the 7th of 11 children born to the bollings and one of 20 family members who lived upstairs in the bolling home. two of the most interesting pieces we have are the bolling cradle, the cradle that the children would have slept in. the other piece is a child's chair that was up here in the bolling home. we can imagine the children sitting in the chairs. the cover is original and we're so pleased it hasn't been re-covered over the years. this is the bedroom of grandmother bolling. and we know that edith bolling, as a little girl, slept in the room with her grandmother. her grandmother was an invalid and had back problems.

and she was quite spoiled by her grandmother. she was her grandmother's favorite. but along with that came the responsibility of being her care giver. this is the back sleeping porch. this is where edith would gather with her family where they would enjoy evenings together. i think one of my favorite pictures is the picture of young edith at age 13. she's actually sitting on a stool in this corner, she has her books in her lap and very -- and we are very fortunate to have this picture of her. we see what she's dressed like, we see her books, we see how her hair is fixed. we see her in a place where she was very comfortable and spent a lot of time as a young girl. this is the library of her father, judge bolling. they sent her to washington, d.c. to keep her away from a gentleman who was courting her.

they sent her to her sister in washington, d.c. she met and married her first husband. it really changed her life. >> we learn more about the life of edith bolling wilson. on facebook, a question -- what did his daughter who served as hostess before the marriage think of his new wife and what did his other daughters think. i think the daughters were very -- >> i think the daughters were very happy to see their father married again. because as john said, he was in deep despair. they were very worried about him. they were happy. they were among the happiest people in washington about the marriage. >> what about the press? what about his cabinet? >> they tried to keep it out of press as long as they could. -- the press as long as they could. the reactions were mixed. we're getting the beyond the

old victorian convention that widowed people shouldn't marry. -- remarry. well, they shouldn't remarry soon. there is the old phrase "a decent interval of time." how do you define that? the longer, the better. and clearly for the president to be courting and want to marry again so quickly, a lot of them worried about it. several of them tried to hatch something to warn him off there. that backfired very badly. by the way, edith took an instant dislike to colonel house, this advisor of wilson's. and wilson patched it up or had them get together. but i don't think house realized what an enemy he made of edith wilson. he had something to do with this, too.

>> let's take a call from carl in carrollton, georgia. hi, carl. >> good evening. thank you for taking my call. i heard the gentleman say there was a bit of dissension between colonel house and edith. was this personal differences, colonel house had live-in quarters in the white house. was he commanding too much of the president's time as far as edith was concerned or were there political differences? >> well, actually house did not have living quarters in the white house. he spent a lot of time there. but he didn't have living quarters there. it's a bit of both. edith as christie pointed out very well, wilson courted the widow galt with the presidency and the secrets of state and she ate it up. there's no question about it. and she admits -- frankly admits in her memoir later that this was a good bit of her attraction to wilson. and attracted to him too personally.

this made him a more glamorous figure to her. so she's ok, she's going to be the advisor. a lot of it at the beginning is to resent house. resent house. there's just enough to get him out of the way. house was concerned -- house saw wilson as a very valuable property to manage and to keep, you know, to keep healthy and to keep in power. and i think he was worried about the effect on this. now, he very quickly backed off when he saw how determined wilson was to marry edith. he turned tail very quickly and then he tries to make up to her a lot. but she never -- no, she never -- she masked her dislike of house up until the time of the peace -- the peace conference. >> so he proposes very soon after. she says no, saying you hardly know me. there's a wonderful quote that most biographers refer to talking about how time is compressed in the white house. what did he say?

>> i don't remember the exact words. but he said time is much quicker here than it was on the outside. i hesitate to call it a ploy. that he pointed out to all three of the women he was involved with was that he needed them so much. and it was a real genuine need as john has pointed out. he often said he couldn't do his work unless he was assured of their love. so that was definitely one of the things that she said to edith. and she responded. to know you have need of me is very sweet. that was a successful courtship tactic. although she refused him the first time, two months later, he proposed again and she accepted. >> as i recall, the refusal, that's what they're supposed to -- what women were supposed to do the first time, anyway? >> ellen didn't refuse.

>> she got taken unawares really. that was the convention. >> i think it was. >> turn it down and, you know, of course the guy comes back and -- >> she had every right to turn him down convention or no convention. they've known each other about six weeks when he proposed the first time. >> i must say, we both read all of that correspondence there. i'm impressed that edith's refusal looked to be pretty pro forma. it was clear she's going to accept this guy. >> one of my favorite quotes is from the secret serviceman, colonel starling, who said the lady was retreating. but how fast and with what intention, we don't know. >> he would go over to her house, you know, he would spend the evening there. and he would sometimes break into a dance coming back to the white house.

m a time to take the president of today, -- presidentto take the of today, imagine him going to a woman's house -- a fanaticism about baseball in this town, the first public date was a baseball game. >> wilson was a great baseball fan. he played -- never played on a college -- he played on a college team at davidson. the first college he went to. that's something. he's a great fan of princeton and wesleyan and princeton, he's a tremendous baseball fan. go to that and that is the first public appearance together. her just beaming there. i think that is when she turns into a political asset. >> we have to move on, the time is going to evaporate. very quickly. on twitter, what did the general population think of wilson remarrying so quickly? >> fortunately, not as his advisors feared. the public loved it. they went on a tour about six weeks after they were married. to drum up interest and preparedness in case america got

in the war. she was seen as a great asset. the press loved her. the crowds loved her. they loved the idea of the two of them being on their honeymoon. it was a great public relations. >> throughout this program, we have been taking you to the wilson house, the place where the first couple lived after they left the white house. we're going to return there right now. >> we're currently in the dining room of the president wood row -- woodrow wilson house in -- woodrow wilson house in northwest d.c., about a mile from the white house. standing guard over the dining room is an official portrait of edith wilson painted and finished in 1920. 93 years old. bob inholm is the executive director of the house. what can you tell us about this dress she's wearing in this portrait? >> president wilson in his

second term presented a vision of the world of peace, a plan in this provision. he couldn't have found a better help mate, dynamic and strong, edith wilson. i think in this portrait you see this is not a 19th century portrait. she's wearing a dress that's fashion forward in the 1920s. at her waist is a broach, a gift to her from france. that was from the pairs -- paris peace conference in 1919. >> some of the other artifacts from the white house years set here at the table. you have the place setting? >> this is the wilson china. edith had a hand in designing this. so while some of the 19th century china relied on designs, -- on botanical designs, this has patriotic symbols consistent with the nation at war. there's a funny story. the historians can tell about this. when edith was learning how to ride a bicycle in the basement

of the white house, the china was stacked there. one of the reasons they created the china room was so she would have room to ride the bicycle without crashing into the china. >> this is lennox. you have an outfit she wore as first lady. >> we remember president wilson was the first president to go to europe as president but we need to remember as well edith wilson was the first lady to go to europe as the first lady. it was important for her to figure out how she should comport herself in meeting kings and queens of europe and heads of state. she bought this suit at the house of worth in paris. let me pull this back and show some of the detail. the lining is really spectacular. it gives you some sense of the level of detail and attention of the clothing that she purchased there. >> bob inholm, president wilson lived here three years after she left the white house. was there a purposeful effort to make this house like the white house? >> very much so. that's part of edith's doing as well. she realized the president would be more comfortable in a settle

in which he understand where things were. so when they put together this bedroom here, it emulated the white house bedroom he'd been in down to the detail of getting the lincoln bed that he had enjoyed and building a replica of the room here. -- building a replica of it for the room here. >> the next time you come back to us, susan will be in the library. >> thank you very much. a reminder, the wilson house is available for public tour. make it part of yourself when you do a history tour of washington, d.c. the wilson presidency, the two terms were very momentous years. for the country and for the world. it's hard to boil down important things that went on in a couple of pages but we're going try to do it. in the wilson presidency, the 17th amendment to the constitution which called for direct election for the senators was passed. major tariff bill that was so much an important debate in this country, the federal reserve act, i can tell you our facebook

community is talking a lot about the federal reserve. the role of the federal trade commission. its function was also created. then the war. the u.s. declaring war on germany after the sinking of the lusitania. after the war, woodrow wilson winning the nobel peace prize. the 18th amendment bringing prohibition. the 19th amendment calling finally for women suffrage in this country. what was edith's role in this important period of time, legislateively, public affairswise? how involved was she in the substance of what he was doing? >> very little. she didn't have ellen's acumen for understanding these things. he liked to show her the papers but mostly she would get fired up and would say you need to put this note to germany more strongly or put this note to the secretary of state william

jennings bryant to be stronger. he encouraged her to be fiery. she didn't have understanding. a lot of people thought she had influenced him to lobby as he finally did for woman's suffrage. that wasn't the case at all. she didn't approve. so i wouldn't say she had any effect on his legislative -- >> he did not support the 18th amendment. he did not like prohibition. he vetoed the act which passed -- the implementation legislation, which was then passed over his veto. >> how difficult was it for him to make a decision to bring the u.s. into world war i? >> very, very. we went to war after the sinking of the lusitania, almost two years after. is a great wake-up call on how we might be involved in the war. it's not comparable to pearl

harbor and 9/11. it was this shocking event. two years to struggle to try to get the germans not to sink ships and kill people on the seas. yet, not to get involved in the war. he got the germans to back down for a while. so the election of 1916 in the -- was during this lull in foreign affairs, and this notion he kept us out of war was this great cry. well, yeah. but it was -- he kept us out of war with mexico because the threat of war in europe had receded at that point. then the germans reopened and it -- reopened submarine where fair -- warfare and he met with a very difficult struggle. he actually unburdened himself confidentially to a newspaper editor, frank cobb of the new york world. and he predicted all of the terrible consequences that would happen in this country if we went to the war. it's the most eloquent case of -- case going against going to war from the man who decided to take us there.

>> how would you answer sheldon cooper when asked which wife provided political clout for woodrow? >> i think it was ellen. ellen was involved. she lobbied. you spoke with the tariff bill. she read it. she lobbied for having reduced duty on books and art supplies. and when it was actually passed, she celebrated. it meant a lot to her. and i don't think either of them had a great deal to do with it. but i think ellen had more than edith. >> david is in her hometown. nice to have you on the line. >> thank you for the segment. your viewers to visit and join us in our efforts to restore her -- in our efforts to restore her birthplace and childhood home.

but my question is when mrs. wilson visited during europe, how was she received by the royalty of europe and how can you tell us about her relationship to pocahontas and other families? >> she's a direct descendent to pocahontas. it was played up a great deal by newspapers even by the newspapers in europe when she went over there. i forgot, what was the other part of the question? >> how she was received in europe? >> they were received joyously when they went over there. they looked to wilson to be a savior. edith wrote home and said they -- she felt like cinderella. they stayed at buckingham palace. they were received by the king of italy. there were thousands and thousands of people reading them in paris. it was a magical time for her. >> here's a question of a similar ilk, between edith and ellen, which has the greatest influence on america today? >> i'd say ellen, although edith had the handle the country in

-- had to handle the country in this crisis of presidential disability. and i think she set a pattern of how not do it. it was a cover-up. it was one of the segments that edith'sgrayson said, on orders, we're not going to admit he had a stroke. they never -- the white house never admitted that, one of his consulting physicians let it slip out of the bag later. but they never admitted that. and in some ways this uncertainty about -- about what the president's condition was really contributed to the political downfall that comes. >> justin, plainfield, indiana, you're on. go ahead. >> hi, thank you for taking my call. thank you for doing this. my question is, how was edith received in the time leading up to her marriage to president wilson by the media? did she kind of get the princess diana reception or more from

-- of the rachael jackson reception? >> thanks so much. >> they really, as john said, tried to keep it very quiet. and the announcement was made at the beginning of october. they got married in the middle of december. so they really only had to endure the -- the attention of the press for about two months. and again it was a very, very different time and nobody was expected to get out there diana style and be fodder for the press. style and be fodder for the press. >> wouldn't you say there was a little bit of scandal -- the caller talked about rachael jackson. there was an undercurrent of a little bit of scandal or whatever that he was involved in this woman. >> there were several scandals, one of which and we haven't really addressed it. but woodrow wilson was involved with another woman during the

time he was married to ellen. he met mary allen holbert peck in 1907. by 1908, he had scribbled on a little note somewhere. my precious one, my beloved mary. i don't think he sent it to her. i think he was venting her -- his feelings. ellen was upset. she accused him of emotional love for this woman. but she tolerated mary and tried to protect woodrow from the scandal. theodore roosevelt was invited in the 1912 election to make use of this. somebody said that they had letters between woodrow and mary. and although they were never as ardent as his letters to ellen had been, they were simply -- certainly compromising. and roosevelt said, no, that would be wrong. and also that nobody would believe him. >> yeah. because that was -- that was very noble of theodore roosevelt. but you said -- you said, what -- i can't believe that somebody who looks like the

bethecary's clud could romeo. i don't believe that. >> doing his best t.r. impersonation. what happens in the white house in terms of their social, they're entertaining. what does she do to support the war effort. that's an important part of her story. would you talk about that? >> poor edith gets pitched into the white house in the middle of the war, in the middle of his term without any preparation whatsoever. and she was -- she really rose to the occasion. and she was, as i said, very pop -- popular with the press. because of ellen's ill health, the press had not been very taken with her. and edith had the doubly trying situation of having to have two receptions because she couldn't have all of the warring ambassadors with each other.

so she had to have a party for the outlies and the party for a party for and the central powers. she really was terrific and everybody was impressed with her good firm hand shake. and very impressed with her sense of style, no poor little brown dress for edith. >> she was a wealthy washington socialite and a business executive. >> i wouldn't say she was a socialite. her husband had been in trade, meaning he was a businessman. and that was not the creme de la creme of washington society. so there was a certain amount of dubiousness about that. but as john said, there were scandals also to the extent to which she and woodrow had been intimate. later on she makes a big protest, a big international scandal, really, out of refusing to accept the designated british ambassador because the assistant was telling naughty stories about him.

>> back to the wilson house on s street in washington, d.c. >> we are in the library at the wilson house with bob inholm, the executive director. you can see some of the artifacts in this room from the wilson's. there are a couple of things in here that are very related to edith and woodrow wilson. why don't you tell us what this is on the desk. >> we display the pen that was used to sign the declaration of war in 1917. what i think is interesting is that it's edith wilson's pen. we've been discussing on the program that it was very much with the president participated in his deliberations on a variety of issues. when the declaration of war was passed by congress, the when the declaration of war was made, use the pen of edith.

she offered one of hers to sign that document. we have that here. it is also known that edith was part of the president's regular routine in dealing with policy issues and the business of government. everyday after dinner, they would retire to the office within the white house, the president's office, and go through what he called his drawer, what you might think of as his inbox. you have a box like it here. this is a box that has a lock and key so the president's important papers could be delivered to him. the president and mrs. wilson would go through these papers together. it was her habit to put them in order while he was reviewing one. she would be reviewing the other. they would decipher together coded messages. i think it is interesting that this lays the groundwork for her role later as steward of the presidency and the president was disabled. our guests on the set have

been talking about edith and alan wilson. what do you think of the legacy of edith wilson? what is the legacy of edith wilson? >> i think the most important thing that edith wilson did was to bring the role of the first lady into the modern era in the sense that she supported the president and was aware of some of the issues that he was involved with. my take on her role and stewardship is a little different from some. theink her authority within government relied almost entirely on the president's affection for her, trust for her, respect for her. you would not expect that she would betray that trust in order to go to the cabinet or go to the vice president or someone else. i think she had that important role of being a helper to the president in a very modern way. >> we are at the wilson house in northwest d.c. this is where edith wilson lived post-presidency until 1960 when

one she died in this house. we've got one more visit here. it is kind of a special guest we are going to introduce you to in a little while. host: thanks, for bringing us into the wilson house tonight and showing some of it to our viewing public. we should say that when woodrow wilson makes a decision to go into the war, he goes all in. america about what could really contribute was manpower. guest: it was a stalemate. although russia collapsed. the bolsheviks, when they came lennon's policy was peace at any price. he paid a terrible price. this sense that the germans could finally fight the battle they wanted to fight, the war they wanted to fight, the franco-prussian war against the they could throw everything at france -- this is what they had the chance to do in the spring of 1918. it is a race against time for us

to get the doughboys there. the british and the french, bless their hearts, held on and blocked the german offensive. but they were able to do it because they knew the yanks were coming. material and money, it really bail them out. the allies were bankrupt. they were bankrupt by that time. we were able to bail them out. host: we provided the doughboys, the foot soldiers, and the dough. how many casualties, american casualties, in the war? guest: about 140,000. november 11, 1918. host: then wilson moves from war president to peacemaker? guest: peacemaker in chief. he decided very early he was going to paris and was going to be our chief negotiator. he wanted to shape the piece as best he could. he knew we had come into the war

later than the others and for different reasons. he knew there were real differences. host: edith travels with them on that trip. i want to take a call on that, and i wanted to come back and talk to us about what her role was and how important ultimately it was to the piece that was shipped. lewis in los angeles, you are on the air. waser: my question is, what or how was the league of nations -- was it a triumph for the president or a failure to president wilson, and how did mrs. wilson take it? she lasted little bit longer than president wilson. how was it on their legacy? thank you. well, it is both. it is both a triumph and a failure. the fact that there was a league of nations at all was because of

wilson. he was able to take the situation in paris, he was able to whip it together, get this put together in an astonishingly short period of time. it was terrific. his failure was to not get the senate to consent to it, this terrible stalemate, and eventually we never joined the league of nations. that is what happened. ii, there is a posthumous apotheosis of woodrow prohphet were is the did not heated. if we have listened to him, we would not have had this terrible second more. , think that is quite overdrawn but there is truth to that. it is hard to imagine that we would not have played at least some kind of more constructive role in world affairs if we had gone into the league of nations. after would was,

rose death, very active with the league of nations herself. not in a leadership way, but she used to go to geneva every year for her -- for their meetings. she would go to any country in the league that wanted to honor woodrow for his work. it iswe will note that united nations week as we do this. all the world leaders will be gathering in new york city. guest: if it had not been for edith, and ed -- and if woodrow had designed it, we would have joined the league. guest: he should have left. he should not have continued as president. he simply was not functioning. --in, this warped adjustment judgment of his, that we would not compromise -- if he had resigned, some kind of something to get him out of the way, we would have joined the league. we would have joined it on a very conditional basis with lots of hedging, but frankly, that simply would have been more

openly stating what all the other nations were doing anyways. it would have gotten us into a leadership role in world affairs a generation before we did. i think that was what was lost. host: we hope you saw the beginning of our program. it was edith wilson who made a critical decision with the advice of his doctors to keep him in the white house and to serve as the gatekeeper to him and keep the affairs of the state going during those years when he was very critically ill. guest: i don't think it was with the doctors' consent. not a bit. memo that, he wrote a should he be subpoenaed to congress, he wanted to have something on paper early on -- sayingt he did not

exactly what was wrong with the president. host: in her memoirs, i have read several citations were doctors -- of course she did. i have said to you that those memoirs were quite fanciful. guest: edward feinstein, a very distinguished neurologist, wrote a medical biography of wilson. he said in there, he takes it straight on -- the doctors said, no, keep him in office. he said no responsible physician would have said that. she was making that up. host: so, i asked about their as the greate peacemaker. they traveled by ocean liner to get there on a very specific day in december. was -- how were they received by the other heads of state? received,y were especially in england, on terms that would have been accorded to royalty.

everywhere they went, they were cheered by the populace. in the beginning, it was wonderful, but once the negotiations got underway, edith suddenly went from this very beingxistence to extremely concerned for wilson's high blood pressure. episodead some kind of when he was only 39 years old where he had a lot of numbness in his hands. he had very high blood pressure all his adult life or at least from the age of 39 onwards. very grayson had been insistent during that time he was president that he needed a lot of exercise and a lot of rest. heing those negotiations, could not either rest or exercise. edith was trying her best to get him to go for a walk. the woman who was with her, her secretary, said that she herself would never go out if there was a possibility that she might be able to take woodrow for a walk. it was not enough. host: when he came back, he

embarked on a multi city tour of the united states to try to sell the conflict -- sell the idea of the league of nations to the people of the you -- of the united states. left inonly 50 minutes our program. we are going to have to compress a lot of history in that time. we will return to the wilson house and introduce you to a member of the family. this is carrie fuller from westchester, new york. what is your relationship to edith wilson? >> edith was my great aunt. >> how much time did you spend in the wilson house growing up? >> a lot of time, really. coming over to visit with my great aunt, my grandfather, my great uncle, all of whom edith took care of here. >> there are only about three relatives of edith wilson still alive. >> yes. >> what was it like to get -- to visit with aunt edith? >> it was called playing cards. [laughter]

she came over, we would have a good meal, played cards, prompted by my mother to let her win every once in a while. she was a fierce person in terms of winning. >> canasta? >> canasta was the game. that was easy to let her win. >> there is a deck of cards here. is this the card box that you would use? >> the cards were always on the table. the table was over here. >> in the library. did she ever talk about being first lady, what it was like? >> no, it was very interesting. she very rarely refer to the past. if she did, she would refer to as the woodrow wilson president, but there were no past memories really. it was interesting. >> were there any special visitors while you were here? >> no, not while i was here. it was really family. she loved her family so much. she spent a lot of time with them. the post- the house, presidency house, she would also taken family, correct?

grandfather, her brother, and my sister all died here in the house. >> did she ever talk about ellen? >> never. that would not have come up. seeing ln wilson's picture in the house is sort of funny. it was just not a part of what we would have discussed. >> what about jackie kennedy? >> i was close to jackie kennedy . i was not here. i was waiting to pick them up afterwards. >> that is when she was first lady? >> she was first lady. edith, she was so excited about john kennedy moving to the presidency. carrie fuller, we are here on the main level of the house. up one staircase from the entrance. where would you sleep when you are visiting here? >> upstairs. only twice did i stay here for the night.

there is a little room in between her room and the president's room. was just two occasions. >> three of you left. are you active in and eat it will send -- an edith wilson family? >> not so much with the family, but definitely with the wilson house and also the birthplace. i'm involved with both of those, which is wonderful. cary fuller is with us at the wealth -- at the wilson house in upper northwest d.c. we want to thank the staff for allowing us to come in with the cameras and showing you a few the artifacts in the house. host: she made it to john kennedy's inauguration? >> yes, and she made it through 1961. she was supposed to dedicate the woodrow wilson bridge that all of us who live in washington know well. [laughter]

she was going to dedicate it on his 105th birthday, december 20, 1961. at 89, she contracted pneumonia. she could not make it. she died on his birthday. host: the woodrow center, which is so active in this town, when did that it started? guest: that got started in the 1960s -- actually, i think it was authorized under kennedy. guest: he authorized the commission. guest: right. -- the gets started first director was the late 1960s, a rich old smithsonian building. , oddlyow part of the enough, the reagan building. [laughter] i think that is a very fitting memorial to wilson. it really does bring together scholars and policymakers. wilson was no ivory tower

intellectual. he really believed that scholarship, that learning should be brought to bear in public affairs. that was himself. this man took the lessons that he had learned, the insights he had gotten from the study of politics, and put them into practice. this is a man who really got a chance to practice what he had been preaching all along. i have said this a number of time, and people think it is hyperbole, but i do not know of any other career in american history or in any other history i can think of that better justifies the study of politics as a preparation for the practice of politics than woodrow wilson's. host: john in virginia, you are on the air. caller: yes, i would like to make a comment. is anoman, edith wilson, appalachian woman, the first and

only appalachian woman to become first lady. i wonder if the experts would be interested in commenting on her appalachian role as caregiver and the fact that she was a caregiver for the president and on into his legacy. really, she might be responsible the emulation and legacy that president wilson has. i don't know that being an appalachian woman made her stand out at that time in america. , to a certain degree still today, are the principal caregivers of family members. also came from rome,

georgia, which i think might technically be called appalachia also. she was very interested in the appalachian mountain craft. she remodeled part of the white house, the president's room, with quilts and hangings and fabrics. she had set up a scholarship fund there in memory of her brother with the earnings she got from her paintings. i kind of feel she was the one who focused more on the appalachian nature or character event edith did. host: as we finish up, i really want to frame her life. she met woodrow wilson shortly after ellen died. he proposed very soon. she became first lady very quickly, without much preparation for the role. how soon after that did he become ill, and how long did she take care of him? she was first lady to a functioning president about

four and a half years, and she was nursemaid to a president another four and a half years. host: then he lived for how long incapacitated after the white house? guest: that would include the time -- guest: just under three years. host: he died when? guest: february 4, 1924. host: how is he memorialized at his death? -- it is really quite lovely. coolidgeesident offered the capital to have a state funeral. she declined. they had a service at the house, presided over by both the presbyterian clergymen and the washington bishop. edith was episcopalian. she did not change to be a presbyterian when she married him, and he made no push for her to do that. then there is a procession of massachusetts avenue to the cathedral. or is the internment there.

in those days, there was not too much to the cathedral. his tomb, his crypt was moved up and it in the centennial year of his birth, 1956, up to the finished principal part of the cathedral. it is a lovely ceremony. to me, one of the nicest touches when the funeral was at the end of its service, a bugler "taps," and they had a hookup to arlington so they knew the exact moment so the bugler at arlington also played the song. host: she lived how long after he died? guest: something like 37 years. it was an extraordinarily long time. he died in 1924. she died at the end of 1961. host: what was her lifelike? she spent the rest of her

life being woodrow wilson's widow. chose his first biographer. she controlled access to his papers very closely. she controlled how his image was portrayed. she wrote her own memoir. with her own spin on it. she collaborated with darrell's zenick, who made a movie about him. to me, the most important thing that she did, she supported something that he had supported during his lifetime, the woodrow wilson commission. guest: foundation. guest: foundation. they helped create the united nations. they also collect these papers so there are 69 volumes of woodrow wilson's letters and other significant papers. many letters from the first lady, even letters from mary p

eck. some videos with film of frances cleveland and edith at princeton university. can you tell us that story? guest: i don't know that story. the bicentennial of princeton, 200 years. they gathered all the living first ladies together. mrs. cleveland, who was much younger than grover cleveland, was there. edith was there. that's truman. i don't know if eleanor roosevelt was there. there is a picture of president truman with these three first ladies. guest: i know that alan wilson had to entertain theodore roosevelt at an army-navy game when woodrow was president of princeton. she did contact frances cleveland for advice on how to entertain ex-presidents. host: did she go back to the white house?

edith? guest: i don't know. guest: with the kennedys, yes. guest: i assume. probably with the roosevelts. one thing that i thought was very interesting was that when fdr went to congress on december 8, the day after the bombing at he invited edith wilson to come and sit in the gallery as she had set in the gallery when woodrow wilson called for war in the first world war. dan, omaha, nebraska, your question? coveringhen edith was the role, was she investigated for that, or was she committing a crime by doing this? guest: i don't know there was a crime. i think it was a big mistake. no, there was no congressional investigation.

sending senators up to check on him, that is about as far as they got with it. as we close out, james wants to know about edith wilson's funeral in 1961. what was that like? guest: i have no idea. guest: it was a quiet funeral. she was buried with him in the cathedral. host: we often talk about firsts. they were the first and only presidential couple to be buried in the national cathedral in washington dc -- and washington, d.c. those of you fortunate enough to go in -- go to europe, they try to emulate that. book -- ise of your want to show christie miller on ellen wilson and -- i;m going to open it as i did the last time,.

edith wilson undeniably had an impact on history. she took over after woodrow wilson stroke, enabling him to stay in office. if he had resigned, the united nations probably would have joined the league of nations. regarding us of whether edith wilson had an effect on international relations, or actions changed american constitutional law. her ascension to power during what -- during woodrow wilson's office -- illness -- this is the partner wanted to go to. edith wilson did not use the power of the presidential spouse as constructively as she might have. she made no effort to model better relations between the races. she might have encouraged her husband's racism. her personal style, however, did drow'sp would rose -- woo image in the public eye. so what should we think about

edith wilson's tenure in the white house? guest: i think as john suggested, unfortunately, her biggest contribution is what not to do. 1987, williams safire was writing to nancy reagan, writing a column that said to nancy reagan, ubl -- don't you be and edith wilson -- a an edith wilson. i'm afraid that is her greatest legacy as first lady. host: what an interesting story. thank you so much for being here. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013] ♪

nextan watch c-span's episode of "first ladies: " on mondaynd image when we will look at the life of florence harding. in 1920 was the first

presidential election in which women could vote. after her husband won, she reportedly asked him, well, warren harding, i got the presidency. now what are you going to do? the campaign had scandals too. theirst lady, she ordered white house open to the public, and after her husband's death in office, she was left to deal with revelations of corruption. meet political power broker and former first lady florence harding on "first ladies: influence and image" on monday on c-span and c-span 3. we are offering a special edition of the book "first ladies of the united states of america," with a biography portrait of each first lady, comments from noted historians, and thoughts from michelle obama on the role of first ladies. it is available for $12.95 less shipping at c-span.org/products. read more about the first ladies on our website, including a special section produced by our

partner the white house a struggle association, chronicling life in the executive mansion during the tenure of each of the first ladies. th is alat c-span.org/first ladies. >> the book tells a story. it tells the story of a nuclear in damascus,ent arkansas that occurred in 1980. i use that story, that narrative, as a way of looking at the management of our nuclear weapons since the first nuclear device was invented in 1945 read -- in 1945. i hope to remind readers that these weapons are out there, that they are still capable of being used. there is probably no more important thing that our government does than manage them. these are the most dangerous machines ever built. subject has fallen off the radar quite a bit since the end of the cold war. >> words you do not want to hear

together -- nuclear weapons and accidental detonation. investigative journalist eric controlr on command and tonight on "afterwords." >> today on "newsmakers" we have ernest moniz. two reporters to help us with questions. we have dina capiello, the national energy environment reporter for the "associated press," and coral davenport, an environmental reporter for "the national journal." >> on friday the intergovernmental panel on climate change came out with its newest report on the state of climate science. the scientists said they have maybe five percent certainty that human activities are contributing to global warming. they focused on this 15 year pause in the rate of global warning which is something that has got lots of attention from skeptics.