also, projecting forward, it seems like there is zero not

growth in -- not growth. what assumptions did you make on the regulatory side? what epa in terms of aght do, we do not have projection for that in the reference case because the reference case is based on existing law and regulation. so, we do look at side cases, and those will not be published until early next year. on the question of what was so , i have to look to see if there were weather affect. generally speaking, that was in

fairly-up of a -- we had decent economic growth from 2001 2 2005. .here was consumption howard? [indiscernible] >> 2005 in 2007 were virtually identical in terms of carbon emissions. reference point often used in the united states. i think some government mentioned 2005, so we figure it is a useful reference point, but 2000 seven, you get the same kind of result, and that is immediately before the economic downturn that occurred. i would not read too much into

that. >> thank you, howard. >> all the way in the back? >> i just want to follow-up on the question that was raised regarding ethanol. i appreciate your earlier clarifications because the 5% figure does not seem to align with the requirements, which are 36 billion gallons as of 2022, more than double what we are now, but large amounts of that growth is going to come under production growth, and i wonder if you could speak to the forecast. ox sure. -- >> sure. eia has been saying since 2007, 2008, it would be very difficult, if not impossible to

reach the number. i think prior adventures have done the same thing. is on oure looking at reference case forecast, what we think can practically be the combination of what can go into the gasoline and what can be produced in terms of cellulosic fuels. there will be more on that coming up. john maples is here. howard has looked at these issues in detail. i think either one of those would be happy to speak with you after the session here, but, basically, what we are saying is here is what we think is doable

, and weeference case are as eager as everybody else do with theepa will 2014 ruling coming up here it -- coming up. right.he back, far >> thank you. barclays research group. i wanted to summarize some of the things that you did today that are different from last year, and then pose a question about those trends. if i have the numbers right, you have about 20 -- >> we are leaving this not to take you to capitol hill to look at a hearing on violence in the central african republic where the death toll is rising.

would like to welcome my partner on the subcommittee, senator jeff flake. i look forward to working with him to promote lasting solutions to this complex crisis. i would like to welcome other members of the committee, as well as our witnesses, linda gast,-greenfield, earl rf -- alexislexis arieff and elizabeth list. i am grateful to have recently spoken with central african officials for a firsthand account. r leadersthat no ca could join us, but i would enter into a record a joint statement reverendbishop and the

, who are pictured here. i would also enter the statements from catholic release statements based on recent statements. car has a long history of instability and conflict and has been the focus of efforts to support peace and stability, sadly with lasting -- little lasting effect in the current crisis is different in terms of its scope. followed by a coup by a loose coalition of rebels, a little more than a façade of a transitional government now exists in c.a.r., and week security forces have disseminated. opportunists, many from chad and sudan, and seemingly motivated by green, and swelled the ranks of factions from 4000 to nearly

20,000 engaging in horrific violence. horrific attacks, local groups have retaliated, sparling a vicious cycle of murder. more than half a million people have been displaced, and at least half are in need of humanitarian assistance, but many are on -- beyond the reach of health -- help due to insecurity. civil society groups have provided chilling evidence of entire families/to death by perpetrators wielding machetes, babies with gunshot wounds, and villages burned to the ground. compounding the crisis is the growing into religious nature. selected rebels are primarily targetingt reportedly christians and christians are reportedly targeting muslims. while ethnic divisions are not new, open into religion --

interreligious attacks are unprecedented. they increase the risk of .egional spillover we look at how partners can engage in stopping the violence, prevent spillover, and start the process of sustainable governance. there are no easy solutions but we cannot stand aside as innocent civilians are targeted. the decision to impose an arms embargo, create commission to investigate human right was a necessary step. i mentioned to hear about what more the united states can do to efforts iltilateral look forward to working with the .dministration

i strongly support ongoing efforts by the administration to increase assistance to ms. contribute in countries and look forward to hear from witnesses, the next ups for the u.s., and support for a proposed peacekeeping operation. i would also like to say thank you to susan who has served ably as a brookings state department fellow, and who provided much of the labor for this c.a.r. hearing, who we will greatly miss. i would like to welcome senator flake for his opening statement. >> thank you. i appreciate the testimony we are going to receive. i know you are busy. there's a lot going on, not just in the region as well. i appreciate having the assistant secretary, thomas- greenfield, earl gast, and i want to ago what was said about

our effort here to prevent spillover in the region and affects that we will deal with for a long time to come. i applaud the united nations for moving expeditiously and for our representation therefore -- there for prodding the action that has been taken, and i look for to testimony and for all the witnesses in the second panel as well. >> thank you. i would like to have assisted secretary, thomas-greenfield, i know you have a pressing schedule, so we look forward to your testimony. >> thank you for the opportunity to testify before you on this urgent matter. i very much appreciate your interest in your raising the profile of this issue. i have submitted a full written testimony to the committee, and enteredask that it be into the record and i will

summarize briefly that testimony here today. we are deeply concerned about the horrific violence across the central african republic, increasingly the sectarian nature of the attacks on the civilians, as you describe. we are working closely with members of the international community to end the violence and restore security. we have publicly condemned selective seizure of power, and this campaign of rape, pillage and killings. we have warned that individuals responsible for fueling and engaging in violence and human rights violations will be held accountable. the ambassador deliver this message directly to the traditional president, michel djotodia, on a eloquent -- telephone conversation. a resolution was sponsored, as, establishing an arms embargo, a committee, a panel of experts, a commission of inquiry, and a increasing capacity.

we tested council resolution creating an independent expert position for c.a.r. to immediately stem the violence, we supported the authorization of a one-your theter seven mandate for african union-led international stabilization force in the central african republic, and for an extended french troop presence. we believe misca, working closely with french troop resources, provides the most resources for an end to balance we believe it is needed now to -- violence, we believe it is needed now to confront and disarm the armed groups. to give these forces their best chance of success on the ground, we are providing them criminally, strategic airlift, and pre-deployment training. on november 20, secretary kerry announced at the state department would provide $40 troopn in assistance to

intruders from existing resources. on december 10, the president delegated authority to direct the drawdown allowed to $60 million for existing department of defense resources to provide immediate military assistance for france, the eu, and .ountries intervening forces we have begun utilizing some of this funding to airlift 850 burundi troops into c.a.r. in an operation that is scheduled to be completed this week. because of the dangerous , wearian tension in c.a.r. are actively reached out to local radio stations and other media to encourage them to translate messages from christians as well as muslim leaders to urge peace and regulation -- reconciliation. president obama had a message translated in french and song go and was broadcasted repeatedly.

we have heard from people in c.a.r., that they appreciated hearing those messages and we're working hard to respond to the most urgent humanitarian needs. in 20 13, the u.s. provided more than $24 million in humanitarian millionce with 2.6 dollars in additional assistance announced in september. we continue to insist that the ther. government abide by constitution which calls for elections to take place no longer than february, 2015, and specifies that members of the transitional government are not eligible to run. we are deeply concerned that if the transitional president steps djotodia, has taken to consolidate his power by inserting fighters into the security forces, and by delaying the appointment of independent experts to the national electoral authority. situation, ande

the need to see the situation firsthand, i hope to travel there at some point soon. currently, our special advisor is in c.a.r.. senator kuhns, ranking member flake, members of the committee, let me assure you that we remain deeply engaged at the highest level with the situation. we are working closely with our international partners to address the crisis, and we look forward to keeping you and other members of the committee andrmed of our activities, look forward to additional support. i am glad to answer any questions you might have, and, i look forward, again, to briefing you on the situation as we continue to get information. much, andou very thank you for your personal, engaged leadership on this issue. earl gast? , and rankingoons member flake, keyword for the opportunity to be here. i appreciate you drawing

attention to the situation in the central african republic and look forward to a continued discussion. we have the map loaded. i would like you -- i would like to draw your attention to this map on the screen, the geography and the frequency of conflict in the c.a.r. i would like to introduce a copy of this map into the formal record. >> without objection. >> the areas in the northwest expands the greatest violence are -- and are in desperate need of humanitarian assistance. prior to the most recent attack, aid groups had a limited presence and targeted attacks against humanitarian workers have further limited our response capacity. overcoming the operational constraints in these areas will take a significant amount of time in human and financial resources. this is arguably the worst crisis in the c.a.r.'s history. as of this week, 680,000 central africans have fled their homes,

150,000 more than the u.n. december 9 estimate. moreover, an estimated 500 and nine persons have been killed in the last two weeks. if unaddressed, this conflict threatens further significant loss of life and continues political instability that threatens to destabilize the entire region, however we have a chance to stop it. the united states has been playing a critical role in shaping international response to the crisis, and we are ready to lead additional efforts that build our current unitarian platform. since 2011, we are provided more than $60 million in humanitarian assistance to the c.a.r. programs benefited 430,000 central africans in basic nutrition, health, protection, livelihood, water sanitation, hygiene, agricultural assistance, as well as funded, u.n.-let logistics

and coordination. our partners also continue to assist those affected in the southeast of the country. due to this scale of underdevelopment -- underdevelopment, the international community has not been able to meet all humanitarian needs. insecurity hinders full deployment of our teams, and some facilities have been looted or destroyed. in addition, the just ago constraints have -- logistical constraints have really increased the cost of intervention. the widespread violence has dispersed the majority of the population into hard to reach, rural areas. this complex and fluid situation requires creative programming options to reach this dispersed population and we are working with him lamenting partners to find a balance between expanding assistance into conflict areas and reducing the risks to

humanitarian actors and beneficiaries. we are also examining ways to prevent the emergence of new conflict. if french and the african union peacekeepers are able to improve the security situation, they hope to increase peace building efforts, amplify the peace messages of religious and community leaders, and support radio nations in areas suffering from a lack of communication. in the coming months, the international community will have an enormous role to play in the transition process, but for now our focus is to reach those in need and save lives. without the international community's urgent and committed intervention, this already alarming crisis threatens to continue its downward spiral, and expand the reach of devastation well beyond the borders of c.a.r. thank you, members of the subcommittee, forces -- experience. our i welcome any questions you might have. assistantou,

administrator earl gast, and thank you for your long, and effective engagement in relief work in central africa and around the world. let me start. with pacific actions can the united states government take next that will help to end the humanitarian suffering, restore some security, and move c.a.r. toward a sustainable path of democratic governance? what are the most important steps we should be taking, madam secretary? >> the most important steps to take are the steps we're taking right now to address the security issues is without addressing the security issues, we will not be able to move forward on addressing the more important human rights issues, as well as the humanitarian issues that we are all witnessing and horrified by. so, we are working to move as fast as we can to provide airlift and training to the troop-contributing countries, rindi, as i-- bu

mentioned, we provided that support, we are working with the countries thater have made an offer to contribute troops. once that is done, we can then focus on trying to find a political solution, working to make sure that there is this are meant -- disarmament as well as finding mechanisms to work with the various authorities to get them to prepare for the election which we hope will take place in 2015. >> a white area us -- thank you. assistant administrator, what is the critical next step? >> security is always first. with security, we will then be able to gain access. i think the u.n. has taken an important step in the last week, and that is announcing that it is upgrading the emergency attention on c.a.r. by declaring

it a level three response. u.n. can onlye manage three level three crises. ..a.r. would be the third syria and the philippines being the other two. what that means is they will have an experience person that the assistant secretary general to run thea.r. humanitarian operations, and it gives them the ability to tap into emergency response mechanisms, and will also get elevated attention to route the u.n. we fear -- feel this is critical. because the needs are growing, we will need additional resources. we, collectively, need international to support those people you need. >> let's focus on the u.n. role in terms of where he will go insecurity. what are the funding and policy incineration is the united analyzing --

considerations the united states are analyzing and other lessons learned that are relevant and potentially being applied to peacekeeping in c.a.r.? >> i think the most important lesson for us is that we have to act quickly, and it does not matter whether it is the initial phases, we think right now, getting this got up and running, building the capacity on the building the capacity of the ground is the fastest means of addressing the security concerns. onare focusing our attention getting the troop-contributing countries on the ground, aching sure they are well-trained, well-equipped, and then -- making sure they are well- trained, well he lived, and getting them outside -- well- equipped and getting them outside of the capital area our goal is to stop the fighting. if it is not successful, and we are not able to do it, and we

have to move to adp ko, and then upgrade to the number of troops that we have on the ground, but what we have on the ground now is what we have to work with. pko, it would a d take us months to get it on the ground, so the u.n. has the authority to start the planning, in the meantime we are working forward on addressing the security issues. might for both of you, two questions -- what are the repercussions for regional spillover in terms of interests? chad in particular appears to be playing a prominent role, but the president's intentions are not clear. my last question would be what role has the atrocities prevention board played with the u.s. government in terms of elevating the level of focus and priority being paid to the c.a.r. issues, and what does that tell us going forward?

>> it is clear that all of the regional neighbors of c.a.r. have some interest, and we do not know exactly what those interests are, and what roles they will be playing. chad, in particular, we understand that a number of select troops came out of chad. combatants,m wereex- not necessarily attached to the government. we believe the president can play a role in monitoring his border and controlling the activities of people crossing the border from chad. again, we have also seen that some of the selected troops came out of the sudan. many of them were some of the e x-no for rivals. -- dara for rebels. is really important regional

partners play a role in finding solutions. i think old chad, -- i think both chad as well as congo brazzaville have played a positive role in trying to address the issues as part of declarations,and you movingions, forward on what could be a long- term political solution. >> thank you. assistant administrator, regional interest? >> with regard to spillover effects, we are beginning to see an increase in the number of refugees. aose refugees could have destabilizing effect on other countries and their ability to provide services, even with u.n. support, to the people. so, right now, the number of refugees from c.a.r. is roughly than half in more the drc. with a growing displaced

population, the idp's within c.a.r., it could have further destabilizing effect on other countries. asked thesenator, question about the atrocities prevention board, perhaps my colleague will say something about that, but it is an or 11gency ss with 10 agencies that participate, and it is a very good way of sharing information and collectively coming up with a way of understanding the project, drawing on the strength of various agencies, whether it is analytical or programming. a number of recommendations have come up, and as we are trying to pursue gaining additional resources from some of the contingency funds, we are looking at some very good,

sound, peace building efforts at the community level, getting information out in communities to community radio as well as other peacekeeping committees, and that is from the knowledge and wealth of all of the agencies that have participated in the atrocity prevention board. >> thank you, madam secretary? >> if i could and briefly, i think he atrocity prevention board give us the tools to come together as an interagency, and gave us a lot of direction as we looked at the humanitarian needs, and the situation there. b has been particularly focused on developing communication strategies to that relatemessages to interreligious tolerance from the u.s., as well as from voices in c.a.r., as you noted in your video there, and religious

leaders are widely disseminated by radio. especially we have looked at all kinds of mechanisms. we have used text messaging to the extent that that works, and, certainly, the decision to have the president make a statement that is being widely heard in c.a.r. came about as a result of our actions on the atrocities prevention board. >> well, i am glad to hear that apb has addressed this. >> you mentioned that the first , to stemis security some of the humanitarian crisis. but our ability to help with security there, i would think, depends on what the players see in the future in the next year.

along those lines, some have raised the question of whether ifnot the interim president, he has any incentive to work democratization, in 2015, ifxt year he is not going to be a part of it. and let's face it, that has impacts on how willing he is to cooperate. some have said he was really forced into this agreement -- we know he was -- by regional powers and others, but can we move forward on that basis and that security arrangement? is it likely he will be willing, he and those around him, to step back at that time and to have a secure situation leading up to that time? can you address some of the political possibilities? >> i think we question his commitment to honoring the agreement, and some of the

actions he has taken most recently really give us reason to pause. his decision to put in selected troops into key locations, his decision not to name the members ,f the national election board his decision to fire ministers without insulting with the prime are all actions that raise for us concerns about his commitment. we are continuing to put pressure on him to honor the commitments made in the geneva accords, and he has penned told in no uncertain terms, both when he had this conversation with -- in hiso conversations with a french he will be held accountable if he does not move the process forward. >> what does that mean, be held accountable, to whom? >> to the international community for committing gross human rights by lights --

violations them a map leading to a process that will lead to peace. when we say that they get the message of what that means, and i think at some point we might have to question whether he continues in the role that he is playing. but i think that the international community, along partners, willal hold him accountable. >> thanks. my concern is being held accountable for someone who worries about being held accountable after this episode and after the democratic government comes in might be more inclined to try to consolidate his own power -- >> and i think that is what he's doing. >> that seems to be so, and i'm not saying we are pursuing that wrong policy at all. it makes it doubly difficult i think in the current situation. with regard to the weapons that

are there and the task of the peacekeepers now, how have weapons proliferated throughout coupountry since the last year and what challenges does that present coming forward? you mentioned that was one reason we needed to secure orders, but how much of a problem is that? >> a huge problem. we do not know where the weapons are coming in from. we hope the panel of experts will give us some insight into where these weapons are coming from. we know they're coming from across the border. who is funding the weapons purchases, it is unclear, and this is something we are all trying to get a handle on so that, again, under the u.n. resolution people can be held accountable for that. >> i know it is not this simple, but the forces have the most and the militias on the

other hand have the numbers. is that a rough estimation, or are there weapons -- i am sure there are a lot of weapons on each side -- but i'm sure there is a big difference in who has the weapons at this point? >> i think there are weapons on both sides. i do not know what the balance is. as the french have gone into disarmed, we are seeing that when they have disarmed that some of the anti-people are --have weapons. that is something that we need to investigate, and that is why it is so important for us to be on the ground were there to be security so we can address those issues. frenchdeath of two troops in the last couple of weeks, how has that affected the 'sench government ability to harden their resolve, or has it made those people more

skittish about involvement? >> it has harden their resolve. we regret the death of the french soldiers, as well as congolese soldiers who were killed, but it has hardened through theve t mission. >> there is a lot of agriculture being disrupted. can you address that? is that something that's with what is going on now, is there going to be a lag time because certain crops were not harvested , were not planted, that we are going to have a disaster in the future? how do you address that? it is a lot of subsistence agriculture. right,are absolutely senator. about 55% of gdp comes from agriculture, and it is the largest employer in the country of central africans.

so we are very concerned and we know that the violence has broken the traditional cycle of how people at inputs and how they provide your products to the market. we expect that that will be part of the assessment that takes place, but i have not seen any numbers come out on specifically the loss of productivity in agriculture. on the macro level, the gdp is expected to contract by 10% this year as a result of the conflict, but we know it is going to be primarily in the agricultural sector. >> thank you. >> thank you, senator flake, and madame secretary, we know you have other commitments, and if we might thank you for your testimony. we both look forward to being briefed with more details when you have them about the basis on which we can build stability in the transition toward a democratic state and deal with the humanitarian crisis. thank you very much. if you do not object, we will continue with the assistant administererator.

we are grateful that you were able to testify for us today. >> thank you. >> if i might follow up on some of the questions that senator flake was asking, are their community-based efforts underway violence,e cycle of and in the absence of stopping the violence, with the humanitarian crisis excelerator further in terms of food are weity, hunger, and at risk of the spiraling literature medically larger conflict within c.a.r. or regionally? >> we are at risk. it is spiraling out of control. senator, with your support, we have in the southeastern part of the country supported what we call our secure communities program that we are implementing with the organization crs. these amenities have been .r.a. over athe l

time of years, whether it that and reductions of children men living in communities, and it is an early warning system as well as provide an early warning system to them to communicate to other communities about threats as well as to the u.n. also it helps them draw up plans for the communities to stay safe. also, included in that is a community-based radio as well as -- so communities feel safe with one another. we think that is a good model and it is something we would like to expand on it support in other places. but as we talked about before, security is absolutely critical. there was, supported through other government programs in the country, a network of community- based radio stations, because of the violence that has been intercepted. many have been looted and are no

longer functioning. we hope to reinstate those, because they are critical about the security side as well as the humanitarian side. in in forming communities and humanitarian workers of where the problems lie. current government, transitional authorities, they are desperate for resources, for transitional -- but as long as there is no legitimate government, nature donors are aremajor donors skittish. how can we break this particular catch-22, and what path forward do you think for building some platform on which to develop a real state in c.a.r. where at this point there is barely a legitimate government or security function? >> in 2012, the government again to undertake some reforms for c.a.r. some other forms were, and led

to an increase in credibility to the imf. there was also other lending. the change in power of those programs has ended. they are feeling the squeeze in the central government level, not having resources. steps. there are three one is immediately address the humanitarian crisis, and that will continue, but it needs to be addressed. the infrastructure needs to be built, communities need to be stabilized. services need to be provided to those who need services. the second thing is supporting the political transition. and it is fated that the transition, meaning through elections, will have to occur by federative 2015, but that is going to be an enormous challenge. just looking at all the things that have to be done, from the development of a new constitution, new electrode law, creating a new institution, the national electoral administration, training a voter

registry, that is an arrest test, but i do not think the resources will come and until we see the transition, the political transition down the road. >> thank you. do you have any further questions? >> no, i'm good. >> assistant administrator, we are grateful both for your testimony today and for your intense interest in the region and in this particular area. if i might just in closing ask one last question. beyond the humanitarian relief and establishment of security, internationaled support. what support is usaid considering, and where do you see our key allies in terms of joining us in providing essential assistance, and what is the path toward that being sustained? >> good questions, senator.

we are looking at the resources we have available within the agency to support the political transition as well as the emergency crisis. with regard to other donors, there is a donors conference that is being set up in january, and so we see that as an opportunity to identify the needs and also to take stock of what commitments other donor countries can provide. >> one question. senator? andith regard to the mining mineral extraction, we have seen elsewhere in africa and other countries, china has made moves to get into that space. we have not seen that yet in c.a.r., is that correct? >> we have not in terms of exports to china or any investments on the part of the chinese in c.a.r. >> thank you. you are grateful for your testimony, for your service and your leadership. i would like to invite the second panel to enjoy yes, now,

if they might. >> we would like to welcome our

second panel for this hearing. arieff.hear from alexis list, and the mark schneider. ms. arieff? ranking member, thank you for inviting us to testify today. you have heard about the election -- the evolution of the crisis. in my remarks i would like to highlight five elements of the crisis. then conclude with a look ahead. first, c.a.r. has experienced governance and security crises. governments have rarely controlled areas. as you mentioned, the current situation in the country is not the norm. when i was there in 2011

thousand 11, the capital and much of the countryside was relatively stable. morepiece process just a intrusive model of governments was possible. over the past year, violence and humanitarian conditions have worsened. fabric of the diverse society has been badly damaged by recent brutal attacks along ethnic lines. and christianns militias do not have clearly defined memberships or clear chains of command. the terms in fact appear to refer to loosely branded franchises rather than clearly structured networks. some factions are likely also be manipulated by lyrical aspirants. -- by political aspirants. potentially affects the entire population and could easily spill over its borders. troubles in the turbulent region surrounding the country could

spill into the country. third, external actors have repeatedly intervened in the country in search of resources and leverage. an territory has long been area for raters and coaches. chad, sudan, libya, and other entries have thought to wield influence. foreign troops from france and a brief states have been present for decades in various roles. regional leaders'responses may therefore be driven by self interest. in turn, c.a.r. have appeal to regular outside forces for advancement of their interests. fourth, while selectica intersections cells to be brutal and opportunistic, the movement been set on feelings of persecution among the northeast population. the northeast is in contrast to the rest of the country, where muslims are a minority. it is culturally closer to chat and today. first president is the

reformed present in the first from the northeast. in this context, national identity is contested. the term foreigner is often used by non-awesome inhabitants of the country to describe northeastern ethnic communities with cross-border ties. policymakers may wish to be sensitive to this dynamic so to avoid creating a perception that the mandate disarmament and repatriation of selected combatants is equal to the condoning of violence against muslims. such perceptions could drive muslims into supporting militia groups or create a narrative of anti-muslim persecution that could reverberate. fifth, the planned transition as you heard today is likely to be very challenging. election preparations will be starting from year zero. the president appears likely to continue in power. between theof power

president and other figures is uncertain. factional violence is possible. commentary in the local press reveals sharp polarization. some have welcomed international intervention, while others are suspicious of regional troops, particularly those from chad with its complex history. and of french renovation. the crisis in the country touches on a number of issues where countries have demonstrated an interest in recent years, including stability and central africa, poaching, and an army that has been president since 2008. congress may determine the means and duration for any additional c.a.r.arian aid to and a future support for elections, border security, or accountability and national reconciliation. au peacekeeping operation would create new requirements and considerations.

in the new -- longer-term, c.a.r. conference entering challenges. added are questions of the future place of ex-combatants. repeated international efforts at military intervention, peace building, and reform in c.a.r. has had mixed effect. finally, an ongoing debate regarding the pros and cons of african-led forces you and- convective stabilization operations are at play. their militaries are frequently handicapped by lack of capacity and interoperability, and by political rivalries and competing interests. conducted operations are better funded than african operations, but can be more cautious with regard to operations and more costly. this debate is likely to continue as the united states continues to debate whether you andrt any future

peacekeeping operations. this concludes my statement. i will be happy to answer any questions that the subcommittee might have. >> thank you. for all thee crs work you do in providing background information for all of our hearings. >> thank you, chairman, and ranking member flake, for the opportunity. since been working there 1997 minus four i worked in the central african republic of as a medical coordinator. i worked in a town, responding to emergency situation there. i joined a team of more than 100 international and 1100 local staff working across the country. we are encouraged that the subcommittee is turning its attention to the country, and long-neglected country, despite a long going crisis. the situation is worsened by violence. cachedet to work port as

report as we did in the open literature the united nations that the humanitarian response has been wholly inadequate. mr. chairman, we have two fundamental concerns. first, the lack of assistance to populations displaced by the ongoing violence in different parts of the country, and, second, the failure to tackle issues that has long been part of c.a.r. and its people. it is characterized by a collapsed health system. these problems must be addressed. msf hasck overview, been working in the country since 1997, running seven medical projects. this year msf open for new projects, including one in which a team provided life- saving care into hospitals and are providing medical services to 70,000 displaced people.

sanitary conditions in these sites are in a word deplorable. many other needs remained unfulfilled, including food, shelter, and protection. 400,000 people are internally displaced throughout the country. roughly 10% of the country plus population. 150,000 are reportedly trapped without access to food or health care. the large geographic area where these civilians could be hiding, coupled with the overall lack of a government picks it difficult thessess, let alone meet needs. while assistance is required, the chronic crisis in the country also requires a long- term strategy. c.a.r. indicators rank among the worst of the world. it has one of the lowest life expectancies at 48 years. children die00 before the age of 5. in 2011, the year before the --lence, a servant required showed recalibrate -- showed

were telling rates above the threshold. editions on the ground were deemed not critical enough to warrant emergency assistance. households 60% of have been looted or destroyed them and 80% of health workers have fled their present. that it percent of the medical existent.is not msf operation goal was to support the ministry of health, but since recent events, the system has collapsed and now msf fulfills the ministry's function. c.a.r. every individual in the population is infected with malaria at least once a year. it is the main killer. people this place in the bush are at risk of greater exposures to malaria, and in 2013, we

observed an increase of children under five of 46%. c.a.r. has the highest prevalence of hiv in central africa. only 1/3 of people receive treatment, and at least 11,000 hiv-positive people have experienced treatment european and are now developing assistance to and tie retroviral spirit if we could allow the programs which has always been poor, particularly in rural areas. mr. chairman, me to illustrate the humanitarian situation to t -- my my streets experience there. roughly 40,000 are living in a topound, too terrified return home. individuals were provided with only 7.8 liters of water per day, below the 15 to 20 liter standards.

msf has demonstrated international staff deployment is feasible. it is often necessary. the lack of skilled medical personnel available in c.a.r. and the need to protect our national staff has prompted us to increase international staff without country -- in the country. evacuatednever fully arctic sites. on the contrary, we expanded our presence in six vulnerable areas. all the humanitarian organizations working there have experienced security incidents, including ms.f. f. -- msf. the levels of funding for humanitarian activities also reflect the lack of attention paid. twof december 6, 2013, the major donors, the european

commission and the united states government, were individually contributing less than msf's budget013 operational for the country, which amounts to $37 million. in conclusion, the chronic challenges facing c.a.r. cannot be overcome by humanitarian assistance alone. we wish to recommend the following >> first, humanitarian agencies us to scale up interventions in remote areas in response to increasing needs, including two displaced populations. agencies must increase back committees. support must be provided to the public health system. must berian funds raised and adapted to both the short and long-term needs of the country. thank you, mr. chairman.

i'm happy to take your questions. >> thank you very much. -- we will nowto t turn to mark schneider. >> thank you, mr. chairman. thank you for focusing attention on humanitarian and political disaster in the central african republic. crisis group analysts have reported readily on the sister and-- on the situation identify, corrupt government, distribution of public services, plundering of mineral wealth, brutal security forces as root causes of conflict. our analysts will return shortly. it is important to recognize this crisis has been building for decades. no one has been playing nice -- paying enough attention. the country's economic indicators are the worst in africa. of thegive you two

failures of the focus of the international community. you heard the life expectancy 49t year being last year years. in 1990, the life expectancy was 48 years. in 1980, tdp per capita was estimated at $963. in 2012, gdp per capita is estimated at $722. that reflect a failure of --elopment and he sensually and essentially the chronic management of governance. today the central african public is a collapsed state with more than 613,000 permanently displaced persons, including almost 1/4 of the capital city's population. while you have heard over recent months you have seen an additional 70,000 refugees going to neighboring countries, there is some 230,000 total refugees from the country in neighboring countries.

virtually all of the displaced in the country are in hiding or in makeshift camps, with little or no security, water, food, or shelter. they have fled sectarian atrocities and the potential for forming killing the man's what more can be done -- the man's what more can be done, and who can do it. we all can thank the french government for quickly the pulling the rescue force of 1600 troops in recent a's. at thelities international community was woefully slow to respond to this signs of rising insecurity, growing tensions between the christian and muslim communities, a stalled a little transition, and mounting armed groups under little control. has finished in the capital. stationstries, please -- police patience, and courts looted, you have heard the description of the should have, is the same disruption of every other ministry, or the buildings

in cells have been looted, the ministers and the public service have either fled or are in hiding them and they have no state functioning. days forces have gone on a door-to-door killing spree, spawning a cycle of retaliation in which civilian muslims suspected of being close to that group have been targeted for massacre. churches,have fled to mosques, and orphanages that are now saying traces -- are now sanctuary. personal and continuation of urban war and religious massacres, despite the presence of french troops of and a fully deployed -- second, a statement in which the bulk of the anti-forces remain outside the city and the major truck the city comes from forces, and we believe they will be rather quickly neutralized by the french.

third, probably the best scenario, would be a decision by the anti-forced to leave the city, return to the provinces, and a parallel decision by the those writers to return to the barracks and participate in a renewed program. willof these scenarios affect the prospects for ending the crisis. in any case, we believe the following three actions are immediately necessary. orst, restore law and order at least stability and order in the city, with riordan for disarming illegal armed troops and protecting centers and assuring humanitarian actions. second, reestablish law and order in the cities where clashes have already been reported, extending order bangui, and with the bride arias -- and with the prior tee -- priority of your ministry access. third, and national peace enforcement and peacekeeping tightly coordinated,

fully resource from rapidly deposed, and complemented and rapid installation of combined international and c.a.r. police. the use has asked the u.s. has begun to support the a.u. military deployment. what is critical is that the u.s. continue to cooperate to ensure peacekeeping missions, and if there is a you and peacekeeping mission -- a u.n. peacekeeping mission, reflect the right balance of skill sets. we also emphasize that we would urge the u.s. to encourage the n. to accelerate its timeline for assessing conditions on the ground and the adequacy of existing peacekeeping forces to make recommendations to the skirting security council. . maintain an

appropriate commitment to whatever comes next. even if the troops are blue, the. questions about you incapacitate. there've already been gso peacekeeping forces. mission,nt political with a recently expanded mandate, is under resourced. it has two people working on four people doing the documentation. there are five steps we believe in the midterm. the ddr process. second, interfaith reconciliation on the community level, social cohesion. third is to investigate and document and hold accountable those responsible for the atrocities that have taken place. fourth, undertake an inquiry which is called for in the

security council resolution into the illegal exploitation of diamonds, old, and minerals. the illegals forces, and it also gives you one way to begin to get state resources, revenues come back into the government. start theo kick economic recovery. the u.s. should help. you have heard the u.s. is considering additional humanitarian relief. we think the u.s. should consider what it would take to guin up the embassy in ban once again, what is the production the needs to write it? if the u.s. is to play a political role, it has to be underground. as part of the efforts to prepare for the upcoming donors thereg in february, needs to be an honest review of what is failed over the past

decade in development, security, in ddr, in order to begin to build a plan that will have some possibility of success. thank you, esther chairman. >> thank you. one of the things that has reveal, ashe broad you described in some detail, is the state, the entire mechanism. the health ministry is almost completely failed. you described how all the other ministries have largely ceased to exist. observers have suggested that the state is so completely broke them that external actors will ,ave to perform a trusteeship whether in the treasury functions or security functions or health functions, and that we are a long way from having anything like the basic framework of a state to build upon. how would you imagine that playing out? you mentioned the office is dramatically under resourced and it is supposed to have a role in

the political transition mandate. you reference to the french forces and their potential central role in providing basic security and policing functions. exactly how do you see us moving forward in rebuilding the essence of the state and in stabilizing the situation? what is the most important contribution they could make? is a single there most important function and that is to provide security. cannot begin to build the other elements until you have adequate security and begin the disarmament process of the fairies forces, both, and i think that the french are getting to do that, and hopefully together with -- which needs to grow from where it is supposed to -- as of two days from now, it will exist, it does not exist now, and they have committed 3600 of which i thousand should be police. they did not have them.

they've agreed to weeks ago in paris to go to 6000. they do not need them. you need to get those forces to get physical control over the major cities in the corner. that has to be done. parallel to it, it seems the international community as this international donors conference needs to look at what a transitional structure needs to be in terms of a system in a parallel way, and the provision of relief, and begin to build back in each sector a state capacity. i mean to begin to build back, because it does not exist. if you had security, some of those people would come back to each ministry, and if you would have to have a structure that i suspect the u.n. together with international owners will have to put together. there individuals, civil

society leaders, or other religious leaders that could promote reconciliation, that could move beyond this current crisis domestically in concert with the international forces that mr. schneider is speaking to? >> yes, i think there certainly are, and i think as you your self have identified at the state department, there are religious community leaders there who are already on their own initiative attempting to pass messages of reconciliation, trying to call him down interreligious tensions. the leaders with whom you yourself have spoken represent the main organized religious thenities in c.a.r., protestant, catholic, and muslim communities. that is an incredible start. is that enough? probably not enough to reach all the populations that are affected by the current violence. in fact, in the last few weeks, the violence has increased, and as it increased in early december, we saw a worrying

pattern in which mobs were threatening these religious leaders, and in one case, according to news reports of french troops had intervened to protect the muslim community leader of the country. that is worrying. more broadly civil society groups have been historically quite weak in terms of capacity and unity. that is also a larger challenge. anhink as we look forward to international policy makers may want to insure that any national level reconciliation and accountability efforts that may come in the medium to long-term are complemented by reconciliation with those populations at the local level. there are national level contests over state power and national identity and resources that are playing out, but as we have seen in other conflicts and in c.a.r. local level actors are using the national levels of

disorder to settle scores and act at a local level. there is that disconnect that may need to be addressed in the long run. ofyou describe a state chronic emergency where the underlying health indicators in the country are at the very bottom, some of the worst health conditions in the continent and the widescale infection with malaria, the hiv aids rates suggest that there is incident agreement already unmet medical need before the ministry of health largely collapsed. first, we need to scale up services to those areas, support the reestablishment of the public health ministry. what lessons can we learn from comparable crises, whether toalia, in terms of how rebuild the health services that at this would have gone to zero? >> one of the most important aspects is to engage people from conflict within the

and make sure that you have everybody on board with that common goal. be a trickyinue to situation as we move f urther along. before, we were trying to support the ministry of health, and now in the current situation, where basically substituting. at the moment, we need more action him a meaningful action, to substitute those services until we can help and support the ministries to get back to a proper or set a level of functioning where they can not only participate, but take on more and more responsibility. >> thank you. open letter to the and knighted nations -- to

the united nations. last week, the committee, as referenced by the assistant secretary, elevated the emergency level two 3,. well that trigger the kind of response you are lacking? ith that move u.n. agencies -- will that heightened focus on this enough in order to deliver the resources needed? >> i hope so. after this point, there has been some high-level people arriving, but what we have needed very quick, immediate action, and we ook at how weof rel do security analysis, because that has been one of the major hindrances for a lot of actors to be out funding, and active in rural areas and other towns. it has been very disproportionate to the reality.

so, yes, i hope so, but it needs to be quick and meaningful action. >> thank you. if i might briefly, -- >> very briefly, because i'm sure that they are more of an expert. humanitarian agencies have a presence on the ground. they recently released a new strategic land for c.a.r. while agencies are likely to bring greater resources and coordination capacity to bear in the coming months, u.n. and other workers face real challenges, including security threats in a very uncertain political environment. mention, thes government is basically incapable of providing coordination on the humanitarian response. that differs from other weak

states in africa. >> the amount that was requested did last friday is when that strategic plan was issued was to order $47 million. $247ly, that is -- was million. that was an increase in humanitarian support. i would have one cautionary note. i think that i would argue that everything that is done with respect to humanitarian assistance, if they are going to do it over a time of a year, fine. years the three- to five- program, there has to be a function of how to we assist government and national government so that the end of the process, there's something there that is sustainable. i would also add one other point, which is that i think of howe determination

you move from where we are to a functioning state is one that is going to require the continuing full engagement of the international community, anthe e.u., and the united states. >> thank you. you said in your testimony that the humanitarian response has been wholly inadequate. is it a matter of the amount of resources, the dollar figure, or is it the deployment in what we are doing that is more of a problem, or both? >> i say it is put. the deployment of people is a problem in that in this type of a crisis, you need experienced people who are familiar conflict afraid to who are not inout and go into the bush

areas that way. so it is not just the number of people deployed, but it is the memo -- it is the level of experience of people who are deployed. the funding has been low. for instance in both angola, we are working with very few other actors where we are finding then needs are completely overwhelming. lead inot taking a water and sanitation, but that has been one of our main activities as it has been so urgent to get that addressed. what is the level of doctors without borders, how many individuals do you have in the country? >> we have over a hundred international staff, and we are employing over 1100 national staff. 100 international staff spread out over seven projects, regular projects, and for new emergency

projects, it is a hefty number. still, the needs are still greater than what we can handle at the moment. >> i commend you and your organization for being there. that is a tough situation. thank you. -- mentioned that a force that they obviously have gone too far, but they have legitimate gripes. what are those legitimate gripes that they have had, and how will those need to be addressed with any future government? >> i think that goes to the heart of the matter of the conflict in c.a.r., is acknowledging there are underlying grievances among local populations that in some cases might have led them to support the group. whether the leaders are displaying any sense of leadership or political cohesion. certainly, when the group arose

as a movement in made 2012, it drew on long-standing division in the country between the mostly muslim partly arabic- speaking northeast, which is culturally distinct from the rest of the country, and the southern population, a sense that successive governments from the south and the west of the country had further entrenched the isolation and lack of development on a very comparative level, given the broader lack of development in the country, but a relative lack of development in the northeast, and relative lack of infrastructure, even by c.a.r. standards, and the well of the sith of many northerners that they are treated as foreigners within what they see as their own country. there are populations that move among the three countries, chad, c.a.r., and sudan, which makes it the focal to pin down nationalities in a western passport-carrying sense. that adds to our challenge

in looking at the crisis. there were broader grievances against the former government, that were widely shared, even beyond the northeast, that had to you with an increasingly authoritarian style of government, increasingly narrowly ethnic-based government and senior military ranks, and what was seen by many as c.a.r. as an abusive regime. a selective team over the overlapping of that north-south divide, plus just a broader sense of disenchantment with government on top of that, you had a disenchantment by neighboring states that might have acted accordingly in terms of their willingness or lack there of to stop the final seizure of power. >> thank you very much. let me carry on with a question i asked a previous panel. what incentive is there -- is there sufficient incentive for the interim president and the

people around him to create conditions conducive to democratic process in 2015? go ahead and answer that, and then i will follow up. >> i think that at first it will be very difficult to follow and implement the transition political road map that had been agreed to as a result of the recent outbreak of violence. you have a national transition council, which is essentially acting as a legislature. many of those have fled. you have got a -- the president has failed to name the electoral body that has to be put in place. it is going to take and this -- a substantially longer time. the effort needs to continue to press the president to carry out even and the slightly delayed all those steps. what are the incentives? it is both carrot and stick. the stick, you have heard from

the assistant secretary kim was to indicate that if he continues cooperative, at the very least failing to take action when forces carry out his atrocities him he will be held accountable. it is clear that with the french on the ground, with international forces on the ground, that that becomes a responsibility. there also has to be some carrot , and near the incentive is that he and those around him who do follow the roadmap will have a significant part of the next government in a fair way that they never had in the past. the northeast and muslim community were excluded. that is really the carrot available to him if he does in fact go along with the roadmap. one other point. elekas y of

military leadership previously had a role in chad. for that to be disregarded, when you look at what kind of military force and help move the process forward, and to be clear that that also has to be a diplomatic element to whatever we call ddr, so that those who nationalave a chad argent and were part of the chad military need to be repatriated, and the president in chad needs to cooperate with that effort. >> thank you. mr. chairman? >> thank you, senator fike. senator? >> thank you very much for having this hearing. i am sorry i missed the first panel. i appreciate the witnesses here. this circumstance is in the central african republic are dire. you pointed them out. 50% ofid first indicate

the population are internally displaced. around 1/4 our food insecure. is question. ngo's many have left. the first question i have a, is we want to do something. you have all acknowledged the challenge of getting help to the people who need it. there certainly the political issues that we have to deal with. in the meantime, people are in desperate circumstances. if you had to advise our committee as to what you would put on a short list that could effectively help people who were in dire need today, what would you make your type priorities -- your top priorities? >> i will start this. i think the top priority is ensuring protection and humanitarian access so those humanitarian agencies can reach the people in need. bangui, and to have

protection for every one of the 40 or so -- >> how do you provide those protections? >> you get the african union forces with the french on the ground, fully deployed, fully equipped, faster, and you also deploy them with a mandate in the other cities to protect those humanitarian centers. that seems to be number one. >> thank you. anyone else want to add to that list? >> i agree, security is important, and if you ask people there, that is what they wanted in security so they could get back to their life. >> added security for the people. we understand that. we're talking about get humanitarian aid effectively delivered. it raises a good point, but we know about ngo's that cannot operate because of security issues, getting a security force

that can protect those who deliver aid is important. protecting the domestic population as a deference -- is a different issue. that could be a more challenging solution. >> there you need more experienced people who have worked in such conflict situations. msf has never fully evacuated any of their teams before, during or after recent conflicts. that should not the a precondition to have ideal security for humanitarian aid to be delivered. we have managed that throughout the conflict and throughout this past year. , but you is important need experienced people, willing , and who understand conflict situations and funding at a quick pace so that these organizations can scale up. as an analyst, i hesitate to

list priorities for you, senators them a but i would note in addition to what has been said, you might consider in the medium run the fact that gaps in data collection in c.a.r. and poor infrastructure are going to be major challenges in providing humanitarian relief and also in the longer run. >> is there any policies that the united states is currently supporting that you believe is counterproductive to the helping a manager in needs -- helping the humanitarian needs? >> i think we are very reluctant appropriately to reopen the embassy until we are confident that we have security. but that can be defined.

the french haven't and to see that is open. the european union has an embassy that is open, and they have people on the ground. smallited nations has a political mission on the bed. i think we should have an embassy that gives us better information, better ability to assess where it is exactly that we can make a difference. ask one other question, if i might come about gender violence and concern for women and children. do any of you have direct information as to this that is -- the statusence of gender violence activities and the vulnerability of children? absoluteot have any statistics, but from the time i hadin both angola, we many stories, especially women, and gender violence. there were even several homes where there would be a mama taking care of 10, 15 women who

had been raped in a previous time. afraid to move out, and they never go alone. while we offer services, and there's treatment available immediately afterward, people are not always accessing that out of fear, or they do not know about it or they cannot reach it. it is our opinion that there is significant gender violence that is happening that we do not hear about. that, the lack of statistics we are confronting, but and eight only, there are reports of -- but anecdotally, there are reports of gender- based violence, particularly during the northern rebel in of 2005 2 2007. in violence of children, there is concern of child crude meant to do various insurgent glitches or self-defense groups. >> that underscores the point

made about having better >> all of that underscores the point that you made about having better information. there are so many issues around the world and when you do not have good information, sometimes you just -- just do not know and do not act. knowing what is happening on the ground would help us galvanize a more effective international policy that could provide not only safety for the community, but safety for the people in the country. thank you, again, mr. chairman. >> just a few more questions. instability affected the , andterm counter mission is it possible operations could either reinforce or conflict with the mission at the end of your last answer, you referenced child soldiers in the south and longeast portion of cars

suffered from aggressive actions. i would be interested in how you see this affecting the ongoing work. >> absolutely. there was a short term impact on u.s. supported regional operations. year, there was a cessation of ugandan operations and related u.s. support efforts for several months. a political uncertainty about the new government after the takeover and what their approach would be to the presence of foreign troops on soil. union, as i understood it, led in discussing with the new government how important this mission was, and fortually got a green light the u.s. supported operations to continue. certainly, from my understanding, the operations

are ongoing as we speak. on the other hand, we have seen indications from nongovernmental reporting that leaders may be located or maybe translate -- translating so it means a safe haven for them in some ways. we have also seen a new pattern where attacks have been reported further north and further west than they were traditionally operating, so whether that suggest lra may be becoming more comfortable operating beyond the bounds of where troops can operate and what that would meet in the long run, that is somewhat uncertain. in terms of coordination with other african union troops, you raise a very important point. there is now a attention being coordinate,need to which will not be operational until thursday. and theeen troops

african union regional task force, i.e. the ugandan led operation. that is something of a work in progress. certainly, international experts are looking at that question. recently float the idea he was somehow negotiating for his surrender? did that prove to have any substance? >> it is hard to evaluate what was exactly happening during that time. the state department publicly stated they could not or would not confirm connie was in communication. it seemed more likely a band of combatants had gotten into contact with others in the government and eventually with the u.n., but that they were not necessarily the group currently located with. aboutsed questions use thislements could

line of communication to negotiate greater space or resources that could allow them to prolong their existence or re-up their ranks, as they had done during previous peace talks during the process prior to 2008. i have not seen reports indicate that is the case. did, reportedly, receive some aid through that communication. at the same time, there was a that netted an number of defections and that is considered quite significant. with the relationship former security minister, and who has been widely implicated in running torture centers and engaging in murders and killings, is he a figure we should be particularly focused on an concerned about? or are there other strawmen or regional leaders who have the potential

to really accelerate the violence and motive i just mobilized. >> i think you're right to focus on him. he is one of the individuals that were mentioned to be associated with rebel groups and also, he served in the army at one point. -- in thea number transitional government. he is seen in the region as a strongman. reportedlyonsible for parallel to tension systems or other abuses associated with the transitional government. he is of concern. he is one of several linked involvedhat are likely in those kinds of activities. we can only hope future humans right -- human rights reporting by and monitoring by the new sanctioning's committee might shed greater light on the role

they are playing. >> you mentioned one of the real is the groups are loosely organized and have no chains of command and some of the background suggest the militia fighting groups are as pro-s portrayed forces. is the former president playing a role behind the scenes here with some groups, and how do you see the political trajectory in terms of pulling apart forces someontinuing with stabilization, as mr. schneider mentioned? we have three here and only one of them seems vaguely appealing and it requires all of these murky political figures to reduce engagement in accelerating violence. >> that is correct. emergedthe anti-groups monthsthe last several since mid-2013, seemingly initially as semi-spontaneous

and decentralized reaction. a reaction to among christian communities that commanders in the field were targeting christian communities disproportionately and perhaps reportedly or allegedly protecting muslim communities, as they did so. even though the origin of this loose network that individual groups may have very little to do with one another, at the same time, especially during the 5, it seemedcember from news reports and reports on the ground that some anti- factions that attacked the capital on december 5 were deploying relatively sophisticated armaments and were acting in a relatively strategically communicated fashion. that along with other developments has raised suspicions that some factions may be correlating with military elements who seek the return of

the president or even might be receiving support from outside among individuals seeking like -- leverage through other means. it is a very -- it is very unclear right now what the status of those chains of coordination are. it is always possible anti- groups are posturing support for the former president in the hopes that if he did return, he would reward them in some way, not necessarily because there is coordination. i say that solely because we do not know enough right now to make a determination. >> i think it goes beyond that. i think some groups clearly had leaders who were former military -- security forces with the president in the past that were identified. >> my time has come to an end.

i am grateful for the testimony of the three of you. it seems to me, you suggested there is a north and south divide here. there are several other countries that have also had , humanitariansues issues, in central and west africa, the same divide, the same long-standing grievances, ultimately led to a collapse of government or regional challenges. my hope is that there are lessons learned here by the board and by the united nations. i would like to thank you for really raising the issue and to thank tony for bringing to my personal attention and thank each of you for your hard work. >> just a couple of questions. the countries in the region, there are forces an extra governmental actors in play. governments themselves, are they

universally laying a role in the region, or -- have things broken down in the past year, have we seen certain governments wishing that we do not want? i will put it that way. is, severalroblem governments have conflicting interests, both political and economic very quest that is my question. figure theyme who benefit from ongoing chaos? >> i think we have identified that chad in particular has been engaged in different ways and has not fully been cooperative and constructive. that is why the effort has been to ensure that the government understand that they are going to be viewed over the next several months in terms of how currentpond to the crisis.

haveuld also mention they system had several other -- citizens in border classes in across the border. they are quite concerned, as well. similarly, sudan. >> i assume there is a great deal of concern about the events of the past couple of days. one last question. in terms of disarming some of a lot of the weapons used and a lot of these messengers -- massacres are machetes. how far does this go? are they disarming groups of machetes? or just rifles or what? >> i think initially, the effort men, ensure that groups of

armed groups, cannot move of cities, streets whether they are carrying ak-47s or machetes. and that whatever weapons they have to take away from them. after that, i think the effort to go after the guns stockpiled in different places. i suspect the last step will be the effort to try to ensure ,opulations, required weapons that they are given some incentive to give them up. let me make one point. one of the concerns we have is this would be the fifth process in central african republic. that whatuld argue is occurred in the past is the effort to say, ok, we go into and then we de-mobilize and transfer and become part of

the army. that would be a big mistake in this situation, to simply try and massrate forces into the future army of the central african republic. what has to happen is people need to think through what you will do with most of these young men who have no opportunities and to look for, in our view, start with something like immunity based labor-intensive construction and reconstruction efforts as a way to transition them into civilian life, as -- sed >> did you have anything to add? you are not in your head. >> i agree with the assessment in terms of some of the -- challenges. french officials have said our anyone inl disarm

public spaces who is not part of the african union force or police. it is a tall order. in a lot of areas of the country, we're talking about communities armed either for hunting or self protection or other activities or just out of a sense of security for generations, including with otherry and machetes and forms of weaponry that might not be obvious or easy to find. it is certainly an enormous challenge moving forward. >> thank you all. >> our second panel, i want to thank all of you for your hard work broadly making sure the committee understands the dynamics and i want to thank you particularly on the great testimony today. we will leave the record of this hearing open until tonight to it is part of the record

for tomorrow. i am grateful for your service and testimony here today. thank you. we would like to invite the panel of four nominees to now come forward. we will take a few minutes break while we transition to the next committee. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2013] [captioning performed by national captioning institute] actually save the u.s. government by doing thi >> we will go now live to the senate and take a live look where the chamber today voted to advance the bipartisan two-year budget agreement passed by the house last week. the vote of 67-33, which included a report of 12

republicans, helped clear a key procedural hurdle, setting up a vote on final passage today or tomorrow. speaking now on the floor live is senator bill nelson of florida. you can watch our live coverage of the senate race here on c- span2. >> there is never any intent. >> summertime in news coming out of capitol hill putting two seats up for grabs in the 2014 middle actions. says heeson of utah will not run for in a turn next year. a district he narrowly re-one reelection to in 2012 against the republican challenger. --o, for junior congressman virginia condos in announcing his eighth term will be his last. reports saying the republican's retirement put the district in place for democrats and mitt theey narrowly won for northern suburbs 50-49 in the 2012 presidential election.

in a statement, congressman wolf said, -- >> if you are a middle or high school student, c-span's student can video competition wants to know what the most important competition -- to win the grand prize of $5,000, with $100,000. the deadline is january 20. student can.org. now, a look at the evolution of identity theft. daylong part of a conference hosted by the national consumers league here in washington dc. panelists talk about the --lution and cyber crime cyber criminals and offer recommendations consumers can use to protect themselves.

this is over an hour and 10 minutes. >> thank you. >> i am a director of cyber security and public safety. verizon, we handle hundreds of data breaches for our clients around the world. we have a unique position where we get to see what happens when security fails. we travel around the world investigating crimes. andelt the need to share research that perspective with the rest of the world. we put out a data breach investigations report. you can get it from verizon.com. prior to that, i was with the secret service. been involved investigating and consulting

identity theft since 2001. i will be sharing some insights from the law enforcement component as well as my private sector time at verizon. >> hi, i'm abigail davenport. i'm with hart research and we're a public research and strategic research firm. i do research on a wide variety of topics, but have had the privilege of doing research for the family online safety institute for the past few years on issues related to parents and teens and their attitudes about privacy, security and online safety and identity theft, particularly most recently in the fall, we did a survey of teens looking more specifically about their attitudes regarding identity theft, what their

behaviors are and what they're doing to protect themselves, what they might be able to do more of. i can bring that perspective in terms of parents, teens and the way they approach this issue. >> my name's allan friedman, i'm at brookings. i used to be a computer scientist and i wasn't very good at it, so i got a degree in public policy which makes me a mediocre economist and a mediocre political scientist and a mediocre organizational behaviorist. when you're mediocre at that many things you sort of have to move to washington. [laughter] i have been here -- a few years ago i wrote a paper on identity fraud from a systemic risk perspective and i'm also here to plug a book coming out in january, "cybersecurity and cyber war," which actually ties together how these different issues are related to these broader international discussions at cybersecuritybook.com. >> my name is zach intrater. i am an assistant u.s. attorney in the district of new jersey. i work in the economic crimes unit and more specifically i am part of the computer hacking and intellectual property section in our office. our office is one of the first ones to start up a so-called chips unit, the coolest unit in the office, obviously. i work on these types of cases pretty much every day. >> let's go to the first question.

champlin strategy does a lot of research on identity theft and the latest stats, i was looking at them just now, the problem in financial terms peaked in 2005 at $32 billion and now it is down to only $20.9 billion in 2012. which is great except the percent of u.s. customers hit by identity fraud seems to have stayed around five percent for the last seven years. so is it just getting -- has the profit margin just gone out of this, but not enough? what is the overall dynamic we see here? >> certainly, i don't know the population statistics, so i apologize for not knowing. the population may have grown since.

but we see that the number of data breaches is certainly going up every year. we analyzed 47,000 incidents last year. 621 of them resulted in data breach. when you look at the evolution of the criminal and their desire to go after a central location of large amounts of data, it really pays a contributing factor.

>> building on the idea that a lot of the risks we are seeing is emerging from data breach is a study that came out of carnegie mellon a few years ago that found that data breach notification laws actually helped. the ftc collects state by state reporting data and looked at how states adopted data breach laws which happened over a period of time and found that on average about six percent reduction, which is a large number when you talk about the numbers we have been talking about, make a difference. the bigger question is how people are using this data. andy is completely right. these are criminal acts and the question is how are people

actually extracting value from the system. credit card numbers trade on the open market for dollars. certainly andy can tell you his group has done a lot of work on that. i interpret that fact to say that the real heavy lifting is not getting the data, it's using the data. if i have your credit card i can go on a nice spree, have a nice night on the town. if i have all of your credit cards, that doesn't scale. so the defenses have to focus on changing the economics, raising the cost to the attacker of efficiently and most importantly automatically extracting data. anytime you can remove the computer as a tool from a cyber criminal and make them do things

by hand, you have helped reduce crime. >> that is an excellent point. if you read up on malware, viruses, trojans and spam, the discussion is too focused on technology. it is a business. it is a stupid business and a criminal one, but there are economic motivations and if you can make it more expensive to try and make a living this way, realistically if criminals wanted to work hard they would get a real job. >> i hate to disagree right out of the box, but i think a lot of the criminals that we look at, especially the sophisticated ones, really do treat it like a job. i get up in the morning and go to work, these guys get up later than i do but they work just as

hard. it is remarkable when you're sitting across the table from someone who you have arrested and who you are now proffering, and you realize just how much work it is. just to build on what allan said, monetization is not a simple thing. especially if you are obtaining large amounts of data, oftentimes, you need a network of lower-level people, you need runners, you need people who you can sacrifice if things go wrong and it is much more difficult

than you would think to actually pull the dollars out of stolen identities. >> one of the bigger case that came out, you probably remember the name, but he was linked to compromising 30 million credit card numbers and the department of justice filing demonstrated that he had earned $200,000 over three or four years. that is not a lot of money for a smart guy in the tech industry. >> someone really needs to consider his life choices, there, i'm thinking. >> that being said, albert gonzalez had a million dollars buried in his backyard. what we're focused on here is infrastructure that the criminals are leveraging. over time, you will see as we go through the panel today, the evolution of the cyber criminal and the infrastructure that supports him has evolved. those that were committing the crimes that were impacting us 10 or 15 years ago are now the ones that are commercializing and industrializing the underground. the commoditization of malware, leveraging, bulletproof hosting and other types of infrastructure for making it much easier for most that wouldn't have programming background or computer science background to engage in cyber criminal activity. that is going to provide the anonymity. with zach and what his team does, i don't think the public truly understands how difficult it is to merge the online identity with the real- world identity. that is a very daunting task and it becomes quite cumbersome. the efforts that law enforcement around the world and secret service and those investigations do a really good job to merge that and it is very challenging. the results of that give us a bigger, broader picture that we will paint for you today. >> the second question may shed light on this. another stat from javelin, 2010 11.8% of notified data breach victims are victims of identity fraud.

in 2012 the number had climbed to 22.5%. it seems that we are talking about industrializing and getting a mechanism exploiting this. obviously if you can get a bunch of credit card numbers, other data points about someone all at once, it is easier to monetize that. to what extent can you drive up the cost of that. besides, if we assume that data breaches are still going to happen at some level, what is the next at to try to increase the cost of actually getting the money out of the data you have acquired? >> i'm going to speak for my law enforcement background here and not necessarily from the verizon brand. what is interesting about the evolution of the infrastructure is that it is built upon a certain mindset. that mindset has been embedded within that culture for well over a decade. in order to operate within that environment you have to have certain skills, you have to have a certain respect for the community, if you will. it polices itself. is that evolution and mindset has been permeated, it is not a large group of individuals. we are not fighting, at least that are affecting the payment system when we talk about identity theft, it is a very small number. it is not a large group of individuals. it is those that have honed their skills. >> can you give a number on that? >> i would like to not. because i don't want to give any kind of indication to the criminal. at the end of the day i would say it is less than a few thousand, if you will. but that is important to understand because i can his team and law enforcement are having successes every year, we

focus on -- but i think we understand the importance of that one or two arrests a year of that high-level criminal because we don't truly understand what it means. and we look at data breach statistics i could map from 2008 until now changes in the statistics and the methods of the bad guy and how they have to attack organizations and their shifts and the cat and mouse game every year in the data breach report that we produced. there are statistical changes of how bad guys are having to go after the data they want based upon those arrests. i think that is an important part. even though statistically there are things that are occurring year-over-year as far as security organizations, their weaknesses and vulnerabilities that exist, the bad guy still has to find different ways and we see this changes year-over- year in the statistics. >> so i just to sort of get back to the economic angle, i guess there's a certain amount of competition in the market. maybe that explains the cost -- >> they are about renewable process and return on their

investment just like any other business. if they find a vulnerability >> to jump in, one of the first talks i gave after my phd, i wanted to make the cleese that cyber crime wasn't a law enforcement issue. it did not go over very well. i got a good education shortly thereafter. there are some things that we can look at. we're seeing a change in, the data i have seen is to curbing losses. for payment card fraud, a lot more people are getting notifications because there are a lot more cards out there. when you talk to the card processors, a lot of them are test cases. they're trying to find out if it is a good card. that triggers an alert. you will say yes when they call you. we need to understand the data.