20 51 star reviews. even though it has not been out a week and is a 600 page book. i am sure many of them have not read the book. about goldmanas sachs and people have a lot of passion about that. this is in another realm. >> durham, north carolina is where? triangle. in the center of the state near raleigh and chapel hill. it is called the triangle because triangle park is there. very famous biotech and technology and research center and anchored by north carolina .tate, duke, and a unc a huge sports rivalry specially in basketball. >> how many students are there at the school? >> duke has about 6000 undergraduates. >> in the subtitle of your book,

the duke lacrosse scandal and the power of the lead in the corruption of our great university. why did you expand it beyond the scandal itself? amazed at a was couple of things as i did my research into this. number one, duke, an institution is not that much different than a wall street bank that i have written three other books about. it is a very secretive institution. they have their myths and ways of doing business. in theve a lot of power state of north carolina and a nationally. they have a huge source of wealth in their endowment which is approaching $9 billion in the midst of a $3 billion endowment campaign. certainly in the top 10. i think m.i.t. has $10 billion.

harvard has 33 billion, 30 $4 billion. they have an ambition to be in that wink. that is part of the story. ambition.ke's the school is only 75 years old. 350 eurosat the school that harvard is. part of the reason that duke has the new president is because he was the former dean of yale college and well-respected educator and to duke wanted to get into the top elite of academic institutions in this country and also athletic institutions. it is a very interesting balancing act that duke is trying to do. only stamford and northwest and try to do it. and northwest try to do it. duke has been successful. this incident, it is

unfortunately corruptive university. >> i want to go back. this is a clip from cnn. 2006 right back in after this happened just to show the intensity of this issue. it was like the 370 flight that went on and on. let us watch. [video clip] >> david miller, what is your reaction to the indictment? for many students that we are very concerned that two innocent people may have had their lives ruined. you said it is not possible. but i'm not saying it is not possible. a grand jury has heard evidence. >> we are saying -- >> never hear what the victim has to say -- >> i'm not saying i am not convinced. i said we are concerned it is possible that two innocent

people may have had their lives ruined. there are many inconsistencies. quickly do you have a sister? >> i do. >> your first concern is false -- me what my first concern is. >> what are you seeing there? >> passion. this story just generated a lot of rushes to judgment. a lot of passion. dog bites man quality to it. the idea that the three privilege elite, white lacrosse , singlehad raped a poor mother -- a black woman trying to put herself through north carolina central university by stripping. it got people who coop. -- cuckoo. >> how did you approach doing this? >> dispassionately.

>> when did you start working on this and why? >> i started working on it about three years ago. as a duke alum, i felt the whole story completely distorted, first as you saw was a nancy grace that if these kids are absolutely guilty right of the bat. and the prosecutor did not do himself any favors by spending the week on television regularly declaring the kids guilty. then the whole narrative changed . these kids had been railroaded and this woman is bipolar and knife on the is the word -- nifong is the worst things as the antichrist. the whole narrative got turned on its head. you have a resolution where these kids are paid $20 million each and the university spends $100 million to preserve the brand. i wanted to know what happened? i wanted to be able to look back

thanks to the lawsuits, one of which is still ongoing. there has been more evidence that has come to the light. i was able to talk to a number of people who had never spoken up before. i am an investigator reporter. i do not see that much a difference between goldman sachs and duke university. >> who did not speak to you? brodhead would not talk to me. i asked, a number of times. , was sure as the president knowing my reputation as a serious investigative journalism , he would have the courtesy to meet with me for the even maybe repeat what he said hundreds of times during the course of the event. he wouldn't not. >> let's show the audience a what president brodhead looks like. this from his apology he made during those times. [video clip]

>> duke university richard brodhead said there are many lessons that need to be learned from the lacrosse case speaking, he apologizes to the three players and their families about how the university handled the situation. >> we caused the families to feel abandoned when they were in need of support. this was a mistake. i take responsibility. >> of the three members were charged after an exotic dancer claimed she was raped. a year later, roy cooper declared victory innocent. what these cases are over. to the university, the lacrosse season was canceled. >> if there is one lesson the world should take from the case is the lesson of the danger of prejudgment and our need to defend against it at every turn. >> what could he have said in your opinion?

>> i think this prejudgment works both ways. people were prejudging these kids without the evidence being fully aired. it was never a trial here. and just as quickly as people prejudge these kids, they prejudge chrystal magnum, the victim who became known as the accuser. they prejudge mikan iphone -- mike nifong who had been an attorney for 28 years. overnight, he becomes an evil conspiratorial individual who's out to get these three duke students. unfortunately, the pendulum swung so quickly and it duke decided they needed to get it behind it and paid a $100 million a get behind it and move on. i know with interest, it showed the picture of the lacrosse

house where the party occurred. that house is the wife off the fake -- wiped off the face of the art. stateoy cooper, the attorney. when mike nifong was forced to recuse himself, he turned it over to roy cooper who did a four-month investigation before declaring the boys innocent in 2007. to me.per never talk he has a right. he is the attorney general of north carolina. if he is going to declare the students innocent, i would think he would spend time with a serious investigative reporter doing a fair and balanced or trail of what happened. he would not do it and he would not make his files available to me. >> go back to the date of the event.

march 13, 2006. >> the morning into the 14. >> where is the house? has two campuses. the great gothic spread that everybody associates with a duke. on the east campus, the neoclassical. many of the neoclassical buildings which was originally trinity college. it's about 1.5 miles away. beautiful, tree-lined road. offer that is in this neighborhood called trinity park. this gets to the problem of the fact that the drinking age is 21 and in this country. everybody knows any universities and colleges, everybody under 21 is drinking. the president before brodhead decided all freshman should be put on this east campus of the neoclassical campus with the

idea that perhaps drinking would be reduced. then she made rulings about who could drink at who could not intrude on the west campus. this had the fact of pushing the homes -- drinking in the of the neighborhood which is in upper-middle-class neighborhood. guys,f people, fraternity in houses and they rented and had big parties. it became a huge problem in this neighborhood. the neighbors were complaining repeatedly for years about public urination and loud noise .f all public drunkenness that became part of the perfect storm that occurred here in this neighborhood. the neighbors were complaining that in the dirt, police had to take notice. rham police had to take notice. but the three boys names. we saw david evans who lives in

this town. who are the other 2? , who grew upgmann in new york city. he went to a private school. collin finnerty host father was a senior executive at bear stearns right before it collapsed which was the subject of my second book "house of cards." >> let's look a footage of reade seligmann. in 2007 -- when were they found innocent >> april 2007. [video clip] >> came in and said, she picked you. and -- i mean my dad fell to the floor. and i just sat on the ground.

and i said my life is over. >> what do you see? >> very moving testimony that 'ss given during mike nifong state bar hearing where he was eventually disbarred from. and he thought he was fired as well as the durham district attorney. very moving obviously. very emotional. reade seligmann wasn't the only only onee 3 -- was the of the three indicted boys their reach out to me. i reached out to them and most of them said no. wanted to speak. we had e-mail correspondence which i include in the book. and the lawyers thought the better of having me speak to him was that never happened. he had -- you have to give him

-- he had a airtight alibi about where he was in variance point -- various points of the evening anduding calling a cab having his picture taken at an atm and taking money out and going to a restaurant and getting food. 0 in the evening and going back to his dorm. he had an affidavit from the cab driver who basically testified that reade seligmann was in his car during the time this supposedly incident occurred. about that. nifong what do you think about the alibi? he made his points where he thought it could very well be manufactured alibi. he had his doubts. he points to the fact that when reade seligmann asked for the cab to cmome pick him up at the go to ae had the cab

house around the corner which mike nifong six is strange behavior. why would you do that? obviously, he wanted to get away. i have a suspicion and mike nifong has a suspicion and crystal magnum has a suspicion that something torrid did happen in the bathroom. it may not have happened with richard brodhead or collin evans.y or david there are questions about evans and the other 2. one does get the sense that something happened. >> let's see some of david evans. [video clip] >> do you think if it does go to ,rial that if you are convicted you could face a lot of time in prison? would you?u --

forears, i could go to jail something based on a lie. >> what role he did he play? >> he was one of the cocaptains. there are 4. three of them lived in this house on buchanan. he was one of the people who are range for the party. he arranged for the strippers at the party. he handled the money paid to them. they thought it will be a good idea to join all day and have the strippers come. >> were they in season? >> and they were in the middle of the season. it was spring break. they had been practicing. everybody else was off the campus. it was a 15 year tradition of having the party during spring break. they thought it was a good idea, i do not know. they had submitted and no one questioned it. usually what they did is go to strip clubs.

they thought it would be better to have the strippers come to the house rather than go to a strip club. why they thought it was a good idea, i do not know. one of the interesting, crystal magnum, and owns -- an unanswered question in my mind, she said it was a struggle. she struggled for her life in the bathroom. she was wearing fake fingernails. she said during the struggle, the fingernails popped off. those fingernails were later found. on one of the fingernails was david evans' dna with 98% certainty. to me.eems pretty high sometimes dna experts said two percent probability means not related at all. his attorneys said it got there through transference and where cooper, the attorney general said a doctor there through transference. saying he picked up the fingernails and put them in the

trash which could have happened. matt picked them up and put them in the trash, not david evans. cocaptainser of the said he did that. if the police wondered why he picks them up and put them into the trash, why david evan'' dna was on the fingernail? >> is sounds like you think guilty?ans is >> i cannot say that because we will never know what happened. as donald ross felt sad, it --ld be one of the unknown as donald rumsfeld said, it could be one of the unknown unknowns. would likeuestions i answers to that we are never going to get answers to because roy cooper is not open up his files and david evans is not talking to me. >> were the three young men today? work for aans

private equity firm in new york. collin finnerty works as a broker at deutsche bank. reade seligmann went to law school at emory and works as a clerk for a federal judge in new jersey. >> can you conclude anything about the residual for the three boys based on what happened? it sounds like they have been successful. >> and they have gone on with their lives. they feel terribly wrong. 'su see reade seligmann emotion. emotion.ne david evans' that was six months before brett cooper declared them innocent. they have been able to go on with their lives. , he was and business school. i heard back from wharton saying i wish you would not contacted

him at wharton because i do not think his classmates realize he is the david evans from the duke lacrosse case. they have gone on with their lives as they should. unless they got away with something. i also tell the story in this book of brian mcfadden, the guy who wrote in the e-mail. ruined buts been not almost ruined by the e-mail he sent that night that he thought was a joke. he thought he was sending it to his fellow players. he had to change his name. about how hiserpt life has been changed forever because of what he did in the early morning hours of march 14. >> it seems like if i were the president of duke or any of these people, i would not talk to you. why would i want you to rehash all of this and reminded everybody about what happened?

>> nobody wants me to write about them. i am going to do it. i try to do aand fair and balanced job. if in fact you are interested in did not do anything -- innocent and it did not do anything, i would think you'd want to talk to me. getnd choice is i hope you hit by a bus. third choice, if you're going to do it, i want to make sure he understands i did not do anything remotely like i was accused of doing. , -- if i work over were a boy cooper, i will want to make sure nothing related to what crystal magnum said happened did not happen. alumwere brodhead, a duke is writing this book and i would think that will want that point of view to get across. bob siegel who was president of

the board of trustees to render this time -- during the visit paulson,king for hank duke told him not to talk to me, but he did it anyway. i have a lot to respect for help for doing that. he told her what he thought was going on and how this affected him. >> what did he say? >> he basically said it was like a fog of war. . start with a quote from morse amara has come out with this book about rumsfeld. he has investigated very thoroughly and thinks there are a lot of unanswered questions. the quote i use is basically the truth is out there and in principle we can find it.

that was my driving force. the truth is out there. i did the best i could. i do not know if what ever get to the bottom of this unless something people really knows what happened or not completely discredited, i do not think they are discredited, but everybody thinks crystal magnum is discredit. just now a convicted murderer in jail for murdering her boyfriend. anything mike nifong -- and they think mike nifong is the antichrist. >> where is he now? urham and livesd on a pension. he has health problems. he had cancer. he has had a heart attack. he was a very quiet, solitary life. he did spend the time to talk to a chance to tell his

story that has never been told. as you mentioned crystal magnum. let's take a look at her. this is after she was found guilty of murdering her boyfriend. [video clip] gail magnum. juryhe 12 members of the find her to be guilty of second-degree murder. a --e foreperson was foreperson. >> is this your verdict? if so, say you all? >> yay. [indiscernible] >> i will ask each of you a series of questions.

>> yes. >> would you please stand? believe she is in a prison in north carolina. i do not know which one. to march 13 of 2006 was not what role did she play in that evening? >> she was one of the two exotic dancers that the boys hired to dance for them for two hours. i cannot imagine what they were going to do in the two hours. the dance ended such as it was. it ended after five minutes. point, therethat were racial epithets thrown. the suggestion that perhaps a broom be used on the women. and that they were hoping the

women would get together and perform on each other for the guys. it quickly got under control. many of them were pretty drunk . the two women left and went to the other dancer's car. the guys went back out and apologize and ask them to come back in and finish the dance. some people said they reluctantly went back in and others said they decided that was more money to be made so they went inside. crystal found herself in the bathroom she claims with the of these guys who she said sexually assaulted and kidnapped her. they kept her there at her will. but here is kim roberts, the other woman. >> they had never met each other. --they both got $40 a piece?

$400 a piece? >> yes. quite how many boys were there? >> 45. of delaware lacrosse players. one of them was black. she said her symptoms were white so the one black player was never -- he never had to give his dna was never part of the whole potential being indicted situation. >> and originally the boys wanted white dancers? >> yes. >> why didn't they get what they wanted? >> they were given the option of black women and they said ok. >> let's watch kim roberts. >> she said three guys grabbed her. they separated us and masturbated on us.

matt took me to the bathroom. were you holding on teach other? is that true? >> no. >> did she give you any reason to believe she had been assaulted? >> no. >> dishy at any point say -- shey at any point -- did any point say that she was hurt? >> no, she was fine. but the whole body language from ms. roberts -- >> she first told the police that it was a crock. she changed her story as well. basically said i do not know what happened. i was not with her. it was quite positive a could have happened.

the defense says she changed her story because she entered to becausecy with nifong there was outstanding warrant for her arrest because of parole violation for sunday she had and shereduce the cost change her testimony. >> were issued today? -- where is she today? >> i have no idea. >> you suggest that without the record from the nifong file you would have not had a lot of the material. there was -- mike nifong's state bar hearing was in the spring of 2007. it went beyond the declaration of independence for roy cooper.

in addition to that, 2 of the players who the non-indicted players filed major lawsuits against the duke at a lot of depositions and a lot of second -- documentation came out as well. what was not made available was worried cooper'-- roy cooper's investigation where he declared them innocent. it was a 20 page report. he certainly would not let me or anybody else use the file. >> what are your suspicious about cooper? >> he is the attorney general for the state. i think is running for governor. he is running for governor in 2016. i would think that if you declare these kids benefit that he should make those files open.

-- if you declare these kids innocent that he should make these files open. i do not know what is in there. it makes me suspicious. it from a legal standpoint that he defined them not guilty? >> he found them innocent. it is not in the legal lexicon. you get the trial as somebody is given a guilty or not guilty. it does not exist in our justice system. he took away out of that. mike nifong told me on the morning he declared them innocent, he was told by his cooper's 2 investigators he was going to say they were not guilty. this idea of innocence. that was a complete shock to mike nifong as well as the other attorneys who -- it shocked everybody. using the word innocent is not usually used.

go back. why would the duke settle with these boys for $20 million a piece? >> that is one of the big mysteries. that would have been something i would have loved to get from dick brodhead. i totally -- i talked to trustee members. --n i asked about >> chairman of the board? >> he was not comment on why they settled. other members would in and off the record. basically, the reason he gave -- somebody dukethat administrators early on were not lawyers gave the kids bad legal advice which was do not tell your parents, do not go lawyers, cooperate with the police and this will go away. -- they thought

they had exposure because of that. there was this desire to make this go away, to protect the duke of brand. sure what it was decided that if these kids were innocent, what the duke wanted was not to litigate with them about what happened. that uses course of action is to give them $20 million. signing nondisclosure agreements which explained why they are not talking to me and have not talk to anybody. it is not exactly clear why duke fell to the need to pay these kids. convicted allngly the time. there are place at the innocent project that defense those kinds of people and try to reverse the

judgment that was made. the people wrongly convicted of -- it's been 18 years in prison and get a $20,000 payment a year as a result. these kids spent other than their arraignment, an hour to, no time in jail. back to your own experience at the duke. what did you major in? >> history major. >> what did you do after graduation? >> i was editor of "tobacco considered anas alternative, quarterly magazine. left of center. hardly what somebody would call flaming liberal. i was a reporter in upstate new york. and i went to columbia journalism school for a year. that would back to raleigh. and covered times"

public education for two years there. award.n investigative i went to columbia business school and worked on wall street for 17 years. >> were to work on wall street? which was thees subject of my first book. finally,ll lynch and the firm that became jpmorgan chase. >> any idea how much money the boys' families spent on legal fees? >> they spend upwards of $3 million a piece on the defense. active thise more point. it could have been more at the time. just a figure that has been thrown out. >> what kind of financial shape were the parents in?

s father wasnnerty' a banker at bear stearns. he didn't -- he then worked at various -- they had the resources to do this. was left welln for each ofbail these kids was $400,000. reade seligmann had to borrow the money from a friend. he had to appeal to a judge because the friend wanted it. evans' mother is a big lobbyist. his father works at a law firm. they clearly had the resources. by the way, their defense team

did an extraordinary job defending these kids. whether these kids got away with something or not, we would never go -- know. they explored every mistake that mike nifong. they got the state bar to attack mike nifong and file a complaint against him that forced him to recuse himself and turn it over to roy cooper. was aid evans' mother lobbyist for cbs for a long time? >> that is correct. is there a bigger lesson to learn? goes beyond duke to other colleges? the legal aspect of this? extent, andsome shows how the legal system can be corrupted. from both sides. it can be corrected by a

prosecutor who is too aggressive in making statements, even though he believes in his mind that he is bringing it to trial. aearly, the justices who was pervert here. there was no trial. how many times can you think that somebody has been indicted and there is no trial? >>, was there between the and i met the time they were found innocent -- how long was there between the indictment and the tie that were found innocent? 2006. "investigation." this is unprecedented. know the district attorney in manhattan. forink that had it not been

this case which proceeded that case.he dropped that dkks he was accused of raping a woman at a hotel room in new york and was a he said/she said. they pulled him off an airplane when he was going to france. he dropped the charges. i think a large part was because what of happened here. this is had ramifications, district attorneys all over the country and ramifications among athletic department's. the juxtaposition of trying to be an elite academic institution and athletic institution. duke tries it and stanford tries it. and by qwest bid to college -- anybody qwest bid to college or

who want their kids to go to college, this a cautionary tale about how something as simple as i think we'll have a party on a because wernoon, feel sorry for ourselves because we are the only people on campus. and invite strippers. >> here's the exit duke lacrosse coach, mike pressler. take."on espn's "first talking about this case. [video clip] >> mike pressler is tell his story in a book. now.joins us before we get into the book, the title, where did it come from? by thery famous phrase athletic director at the duke

when you try to tell me the season have to be canceled. i implored him he cannot counsel of the season. >> if it was not about the truth, what was it about? >> many layers. agendas,out peoples' faculty especially. a lot of prejudgment by so many people. not only duke university but the entire country. >> where is mike pressler today? coachis the head lacrosse at bryant university. >> how did he leave, under what circumstances? >> the athletic director, after mcfadden's e-mail was part of a search warrant and was unsealed. as soon as it was unsealed and

became public, that was when mike pressler was fired and the season was canceled. --y were willing to suspend let this play out until indictments came or not. what i'm excited -- was the mcfadden e-mail came out, he was fired. >> you open the job book about coach k. allegedly he guesstimated dollars. what was that story about? was able to figure he got $9 million. dick brodhead which have been the dean of yell college and highly respected was recruited by bob still. duke is a very ambitious school

and wanted to be among the elite academic institutions in the country. top three or four or five. they thought brodhead will be the latest in a line of great leaders at the duke who made the the schooluts of among the top elite in the country. he was supposed to start july 1. before he started, he was. and has office unpacking his bags. with theoe alleva stunning news that coach k had been offered $40 million the los to coach angeles lakers. even before brodhead started at the duke, coach k with threatening to leave. with a contract there was no way that duke could match. beforest real test even

he started his job was to figure out a way to get coach k to stay and he did. deciding he will rather be a college basketball coach their professional coach. inn he won another title 2010. kids become the winningest coach in division i. it was very clear example of where the power at the duke lies and that is with coach k. most powerful guy at duke university. he gets paid more than anybody else. he does on national tv whenever he wants full stop on -- whenever he wants. people recognize that. he was in for a very different lesson. that is why he got schooled again. it's at the end of your book,

you have a chapter called denoument. and you mentioned other places and the problems they have had and the scandals they have had. vanderbilt, u.s. naval academy,-- northwestern. >> it is everywhere. >> what did you learn or pass on to us? >> what i learned is underage drinking is an epidemic. binge drinking is an epidemic. there is bad behavior that results from too much drinking therepus and we all know is way too much drinking on campus. putident obama in january together a task forced of his cabinet to address the growing issue of rape on campus. situationt-of-control

. i am not sure how to address it. are people addressing this. i expect it starts with the 21 year old drinking a law. that law basically makes no sense. every college administrator across this country has to look the other way as a result of the drinking age being 21. >> it is in your book and i want to bring it back from a dartmouth student. it was written for the dartmouth newspaper in 2012. he is talk about fraternity. he said i was part of a fraternity that asked pledges

a little strong, but it is has something. if -- our fraternities that bad? >> anecdotally, we have these stories will do it is just one of any of stories i also tell the story of the pledge at cornell a couple of years ago who died as a result of too much drinking. duke has had any number of students die from too much drinking. >> what were you like when you are at the duke? >> the dripping age was 18. i did drink. i did not been to join. ok sure, i drink too much. -- i did not binge drink. >> ever heard of parties with strippers? >> never heard of that. i had friends in fraternities. did he knowssler,

about the drifting when he was coaching the boys? reports, it to the was clear he was aware there was a lot of drinking going on among his players. drinking among his basketball players. there are different rules. permissive. more it was more set in culture that the lacrosse players were the party players. they had women hang around called the lacrossetitutes. the evidence came out was that pressler knew it cannot do anything about it. he was not the only one. the administered some new as well. higher-ups he reported to and not do anything. but if you were meeting with president brodhead and he said ok look me and i it to me what i did wrong, what would you say?

>> i think -- i am not sure frankly that he didn't do anything wrong. he has been criticized for not coming out in support of the kids sooner. his in a very difficult position. he is a middleman. here's a fiduciary for the university. he even knew about it, it was already basically and the legal system. in the police system. the district attorney was getting ready to open an investigation. what could he do? i think he did what he could do. >> should they have paid the boys $20 million a piece? >> i do not understand that. >> where did they get the money? >> duke is a wealthy university. they have the insurance. ig was the insurance.

won.sued and aig duke has to pay it. >> you set the house was torn down. why and who owned it? >> a group of these houses and this trinity park neighborhood were owned by duke alum. two weeks before this party occurred in this one house that the players were renting, duke bodies homes from the -- bought these homes from the alum because of all the complaints. the fact that the a law was written to them. fact that a duke alum was rating them. towas going to be rented issue would, so the go away. before that the implement to

ents, the non-stud party occurred. a couple of years ago, they decide to tear it down. now it is an empty lot. who was theng, district attorney in durham, was he right or wrong the way he conducted himself? as much in the first week the clarendon guilty? >> i think he will be the first to say he regrets all of the public statements he made. he was the first to tell me why he did that. it was the first night he had a chance to talk about it and people could give him for speaking out as share his point of view. problem was he was the district attorney trying to -- where theo will suspects thought he did not have any suspects. his thoughts by going public and describing what he believed happened based on the police

investigation and what crystal magnum has said. somebodyould smoke out who would feel guilty about what they thought may have happened in the bathroom. unfortunately i'm a that did not work. within a weeks time, he gave it up. and then i talk to the media again. he was crucified for doing it. is "theame of the book price of silence: the duke lacrosse scandal, the power of the elite, and the corruption of our great universities." guest, author of our william cohan. thank you very much. >> thank you, brian. >> for free transcripts or to give us your comments about this program, visit us at qanda.org. "q&a" programs are also available at c-span podcasts.

[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] bbc review of major events in parliament. it then "washington post" editor bob woodward leads a discussion on media coverage of national security issues. at 11:00, another chance to see "q&a" with wi-- lliam cohen. on the next "washington previews michael green president obama's trip to asia this week. then kaiser health news correspondent jay hancock looks at how the help in this -- health insurance industry is responding to the national -- affordable care act.