solve the tuition fee problem and it will dramatically reduce the student loan debt crisis. there are many explanations for rising tuition fees and three are discussed in my written testimony that the most relevant here is the explosive growth in federal student financial aid of this has contributed to rising tuition fees. there will be no permanent solution to the debt crisis without reining in federal programs. there are many ways to downsize these programs to make them more progressive which liberal democrat should like that also smaller and cheaper which republicans should like. existing programs have failed miserably and provided greater access for lower income americans. the proportion of recent college graduates coming from the lowest quartile of the tradition is smaller than it was in 1970 before pell grants or student

programs. rising income inequality has been associated with more federal student financial aid assistance and i don't think that is coincidental. in my written testimony i shall concerns about several administration initiatives including the college rating system and gainful employment regulations but i want to briefly comment on the proposal of senator warren to lower interest rates on loans to pass borrowers. i think this is a bad idea for several reasons. beginning with the fact that it does utterly nothing to address college tuition inflation. conscientious payers and debt obligations end up getting punished relative to nonpayers who get lower interest rates, a bad message. it will also add tens of millions of dollars to the deficit and national debt. there are other objections as well. we may be a senator johnson hinted over investing in some ways in higher education. the advantages of getting a

degree are actually starting to decline not increase particularly for young graduates. we need to reduce our aid programs. probably doing away with tuition tax credits and plus loans in constraining other grants. there are no -- solutions that merely doing more the same lowering interest rates more loans will worsen the situation and probably enhance not reduce income inequality in america. thank you very much. >> thank you very much. i really appreciate all of our witnesses today. for your information there's a lot of attendance today. obviously a discussion of many people aren't just in. we do have a series of floor votes beginning in a half hour so i will be strict with the timeclock today and allowing vitamins to each senator and calling on people in order of arrival. with that ms. jones i wanted to start with you and thank you for

sharing your story and being here today to testify. her story really resonates with me. all of my brothers and sisters and i went to college on pell grants and student loans to finance their education and i taught children early on in my career which got me into politics to begin with. but the financial burden of student loan debt is considerably more than when i graduated so i share your understanding and appreciate you being here. in her testimony he said he paid over $600 a month to cover your federal student loans. how much was your monthly take-home pay at that time? >> at that time my monthly take-home was roughly $1500. >> you have any money saved? >> i do not. i've been using my savings to pay back the loans that i've taken out from my undergraduate degree. c. when you ran into difficulty repaying all difficulty repaying author loans did your service or offering the alternative payment plan like the income-based

repayment option? >> i didn't learn of the program until recently and had i been up for that program my would have been roughly $150 a month as opposed to $600 a month. >> you have been able to take advantage of the ipr you could have reduced that to 150? >> now much you would save if you were allowed to refinance? >> over 10 years i would have been able to save more than $4000. see how would that have impacted your life? >> we always have to buy materials for the classroom because funding is limited so having the extra funding available would have made life easier. definitely i would be able to savor the future and i'd be able to plan for retirement as opposed to wondering if it will be possible. >> i have to speculate that if you had known about ipr you'd be in a much better place today but nobody told you.

mr. chopra thank you for being here as well. you have forked directly with a lot of student loan borrowers and your reports have talked about some of macroeconomic consequences but let me ask you have you encountered a lot of stories like this? >> one of the top issues that are worse identifies difficulties repaying restructuring and rolling and loan modification programs and staying current. >> our services are not reaching out and helping young people or even adults learning what their options are today? >> we learned a very painful lesson in the years around the financial crisis in the mortgage servicing market. there are fundamental incentive misalignments where what may be good for the loan owner or the investor and good for the borrower is not actually the outcome and market forces do to

market structure finance can often cause terrible outcomes for everybody. >> i've heard from a lot of people today who are paying back loans that they don't know how much they owe. they are having trouble getting that information. they don't get yearly statements. is that something you hear a lot as well? >> i think it's not actually just not knowing about it. we hear from many borrowers and the seed and the data that a number of borrowers are reaching out and are seeking help but are often told to choose forbearance we have continued to hear complaints from servicemembers and military families that they call about their service relief benefits and are simply told well just do a military forbearance. that option will keep interest accruing. it will make the debt ridden harder but it's certainly easier for the servers are to accomplish rather than actually walking them through the steps

to enroll in their legal benefits. >> is hard for them to get good information personally. i have about 15 seconds left. tell me in the last 50 seconds on the larger implications for our economy. >> in our discussions with the banking industry in particular the housing industry whose general concern about increasing debt-to-income ratios so while the advantages of going to college the differential between college graduates and nongraduates is growing most of that is growing because noncollege graduates wages are slipping. if college graduates wages are higher when controlling for inflation the debt which is growing faster than tuition costs that dean's less ability to create new credit whether for mortgages or to use those funds for other productive purposes. >> thank you and my time is up.

senator johnson. >> ms. jones thank you for coming to testify to all the witnesses. did high school or college counselor ever go through the calculation of taking on student loan debt based on the type of profession you are looking at? >> they did not. actually when we started the conversations about college they simply let us know you can apply for millions of dollars in scholarships and grants. he does have to apply for them and you can talk to your financial aid counselor. >> did you talk to the financial aid counselor talking about the. >> in the initial stages they simply were saying you have this much of the balance in your subsidized unsubsidized loans and you can take them if you want. >> do you wish he would have like i had a finance professor? in other words if you could go back in time would you do the same thing over again and incur

this much debt or try to figure out a different solution? >> in my experience and for my profession a college degree was necessary. the options have not been available. i would do it because ultimately my goal is to become a teacher. >> have you heard of the college of the ozarks. they go by the moniker of a college university set up for all the students work as setup is so nobody incurs debt. does that sound like a good idea to you? against a college degree we are all talking about investment but the investment the loans up to match it so you ought to build a handle those when you get done. >> should and being able to refinance the loans that we have with the a great benefit for students like me because loans made it possible. there was no other funding available to go to school and of course we have to have our degrees to teach. we don't want an unqualified

person in the room and i don't see myself doing anything else so whatever it takes to get to the question that is what i will do. i think we need to look at what we can do to make it possible for everybody to get the degree they want and not the loan debt to go along with it. >> first of all god bless you from being willing to teach your kids. mr. chopra when you said student that is hampering a lot of that stuff how would shifting this debt from a select few to all of our kids and grandkids help our economy and entrepreneurship? you are shifting the debt burden from those that incurred the debt and there started deficit and we can afford it and this will be piling on our kids and grandkids correct? >> to read finance along and other product markets such as the mortgage market when broader interest rate environments change it is common not only for homeowners but also for the

corporate sector as well as the government to be able to match their debt to something that potentially reflects better their own broader interest rates their credit profile. >> are you supportive of i'm trying to think the 2007 at the forgive student loan debt after 10 years of working in the public sector. are you in favor of that? >> we do not know the results of that yet. nobody has actually received forgiveness from the program. >> again forgiveness will come on the backs of the american taxpayer correct? >> that is congress's decision. stan i'm just asking are you supportive of that program and how does that not hamper our economy and entrepreneurship if we shift from a select few to our kids and grandkids. i'm just trying to point out what is happening. >> the distribution of the debt

ridden will come in multiple different sectors but i think the marginal propensity to consume for young people who are prime ages of homeownership or durable goods is something that's a great worry to the financial there. >> our debt burden may be higher propensity in some sectors but let me ask you are you disturbed about the political on "wall street journal" stories i was reading about how schools are gaming the program? does that concern you because it sure concerns me. >> leading up to the financial crisis the incentive misalignment between those who broker or offer loans and lime mint with investors or others can lead to very disastrous consequences. i don't know the specifics of the schools that you mentioned that aligning incentives between schools between financial

service providers and others is critical to ensure market outcomes are efficient. >> thank you manager. >> senator whitehouse. >> thank you very much chairman. one of the noteworthy things about student loans and they stand out from virtually all other debt in this respect was that somebody wangled a provision into the bankruptcy reform act years ago. somebody who has left no fingerprints on the amendment. i think it was actually snuck in and conference and to this day nobody takes credit for it. but it's not ken and became the law of the land and it provides that student loan debt is not

dischargeable in bankruptcy. bankruptcy is provided for in the constitution. it's one of the elemental principles of american entrepreneurship and success is that you have the ability to fail and get tech in there and do it again. virtually every type of debt is dischargeable in bankruptcy except student loan debt. mr. chopra is there an economic justification for bankruptcy debt being treated differently than any other kind of debt in that respect or was that more than nature of an unexpected blessing to the then largely privately held student loan industry? >> are soon to a rep port that was required by congress for the department of education to publish we analyze data related to student loan originations particularly private student loans throughout the past 15

years or so and the 2005 change in the bankruptcy code one would anticipate an ordinary marketplace that prices would come down as bankruptcy codes become more strict but in fact we saw that prices actually went up and this suggests that broader capital markets conditions may be larger contributors to pricing in some of these markets and it also suggests that as a general matter the bankruptcy code is operating in a very different way in the student loan market as it compares to other consumer financial product markets. >> we have had representrepresent atives from the private student loan industry come in and testify that it would be wrong to unwind is still provision that was snuck in the darkened of this provision because it would upset

the settled expect patients of the loan industry which is, i mean congress as a whole it is particularly ruddock is particularly ruddock that it industry that snuck this then at midnight upsetting every settled expectation of our worst as to how their loans would be treated now try to defend themselves by the rule of settled expectations. i hope this is an issue that we can address because i don't believe there's any rational distinction between student loan debt or other kinds of debt. ms. jones thank you for your testimony. you have been a terrific witness and you have brought a real dose of virility to this hearing. how has your student loan debt

affected other personal decisions in your life like to own a home, to have a family? how has that burden of debt changed what you might do with your life? >> i had this conversation with my mother a lot because she now asks maybe 15 times why is it that i'm still pursuing the education field or it actually to pay for some of my college education she borrowed against her own retirement so i could in fact become a teacher i want to be. the decision to stick with education was driven because of the desire to want to see future generations have the same chance that we have. i will say the decisions to take out more student loans made going back to school a hard decision to make is referenced in my testimony. i couldn't justify using more of my mom's retirement. >> what is it i'm an likelihood

of owning your own home? >> considering i don't have the funds for down payment that has been put off for a few years but hopefully in the future i can work something out or we can work something out with a refinance bill so i can start saving again. >> thank you ms. jones. >> senator ayotte. >> i want to thank the chair. i wanted to just ask mr. chopra do we have an estimate by the administration yet as to how many student loan -- student loan are worse would take up a potential option to refinance their pre-july 2013 student loans and so do we have a sense of what numbers we are talking about and also do we have an estimate of what that will cost? it just seems important so we understand given the challenges we are facing is the nation as we look at this piece of

legislation. do we know what those numbers are yet? >> senator the cfpb is an independent agency and not part of the administration so i do not have that type of analysis available. what i can say is that we do know from our experience in various mortgage financing programs that the economic impact of individual mortgage refinancing according to a study by the department of urban development led to approximately 25 tausan dollars in economic impact per homeowner who was able to refinance. a mortgage is a much larger loan but then again a younger person with student debt may have a higher likelihood of being at the primates for certain purchases. again i cannot speak to that. >> what i'm trying to get at is the basics. how much more we going to add to the debt? how much more is this going to

cost and we ask asked for this important question about every piece of legislation because it's basic information. dr. vedder perhaps with your background, let's start with 100% of our worst and we don't know that 100% of our worst will adopt this and certainly there will be some ratio to that effect but if 100% of borrowers were to refinance their july 1, 2013 loans or a large percentage what kind of impact? do we have any numbers that we can think about here? >> i have not personally done in the estimation of that. however the math suggests the numbers can be very large. we have 40 million borrowers. not all of them prior to 2013 but most of them so you have close to 40 million borrowers borrowing on average 25 or $30,000 so you are talking over

chilean dollars. just say for the heck of it you lowered interest rates two to percentage points on a trillion dollars of debt that's $20 billion a year. that's real money. it's probably less than that. i have seen estimate of the deficit measured in the tens of billions of dollars over a long period of time. i think it's a consequential amount of money. >> i think it's an important piece of information that i hope we would have. mr. chopra i wanted to ask you about this issue that dr. vedder race because i think it's an important issue and in fact it's an issue that i hear from parents and students saying we are going to get to a point where if the rate of increase of what it cost to get a college education keeps going up at that rate, no matter what we invest

the federal government if we are thinking we are going to be able to help the debt girten of someone like ms. jones benefits going up higher than i don't know, it may not be going up higher than health care but this is a big issue in terms of high high -- how high it's going. how do we get it that issue and if we are going with our investment how did we get to more accountability for these institutions to actually have to really be market raised think innovatively and deliver quality education at a more reasonable price because to me this is a big issue that's going to hit us all know matter what we do here. >> senator ayotte i completely agree the rise in college costs is an american tragedy. we should do everything we can to make sure that those people who are going to college this fall the class of 2018, the class of 2019 that they don't incur a lot of debt that we cannot ignore the class of 2008

in the class of 2009 who graduated almost by no fault of their own when they were started as freshmen in 2004. they could not probably imagined that they would graduate into a financial crisis and that is something that we have to work on both ends and it nods just one of those issues that both. >> i appreciate that but obviously we are going to look back at all of pre-july 2013 loans has a large number of people. it seems to me, i would like to have you answer that question for the record. we are investing already regard us of what we do on legislation a lot to help students in this country get a good education. i would like to know what your thoughts are and how we hold these institutions more accountable and how we force them to. >> center and yet we have a lot of senators and boats coming so i will have them answer for the

record. >> thank you. i appreciate that. >> senator baldwin. >> i appreciate both of you for hosting this hearing on such a critical issue. the statistics are staggering nationally with $1.2 trillion in student debt. i look at the statistics for my home state of wisconsin. 70% of students in wisconsin are graduating with an average day of $28,000 in debt and these numbers i think starkly demonstrate that there is a student loan debt crisis facing our nation. again in wisconsin individuals with bachelor's degree report making average monthly payments of $350. a graduate or professional degrees are making average monthly payments on their student loans of $448 and

that's just an average figure obviously. it varies below and above. the length of student loan debt obligations was nearly 19 years for persons with bachelor's degrees and 22 years for persons with professional degrees and as we have heard through your testimony and the question so far, that this fact, these statistics are underscored by millions of personal stories and attic dotes and they affect personal decisions. as i have heard testimony and roundtables that i've held in wisconsin on this issue people literally deciding whether and when to start a family because of the impact of this debt. the career decisions that ms. jones has talked about. you know there are a lot of folks who are getting higher education because they want to teach or because they want to do public service for work for a nonprofit or a community-based

service organization and get the level of debt and strange their career decisions in their career choices and financial decisions. we have heard a little bit of discussion on that. you get out of college and started business and put that off? do you get out of college and do you rent? do you buy? do you move back home with their parents? i've heard a lot of people are facing those choices in their late 20s, early 30s. do you buy a used car? do you buy a new car? all of those have ripple effects throughout our entire economy. i'm glad ms. jones that you have been talking about it and sharing your own story. so many have stepped forward to do this because this is a crisis we need to confront. i have in my very limited time to questions i wanted to pose to

mr. chopra about a couple of realities in our current law on student aid. i have heard from a number of students who have to hold down part-time work ,-com,-com ma sometimes almost full-time work while studying and they are hit with something that is known commonly as the work penalty because their incomes may exceed the income protection allowance that is part of the eligibility calculation for federal financial aid under the higher education act. i am working on legislation that deals with this work penalty that would raise the income protection allowance but i wonder if you can speak to the importance of the availability of financial aid to working students? >> there is no question an enormous number of people return to higher education after being displaced from the labor force

in the great recession and have taken on part-time jobs to support their families. that something would be happy to discuss with you further. >> i certainly know that has been a reality in my home state and many factories that were closed. there weren't a supply of jobs without significant retraining. we have heard a lot about that. the other thing i wanted to follow up on is the work you have done regarding servicers. anything from simply failing to provide customer service to ignoring some of the legal obligations around notice and payment options and fees to certain borrowers. ..

>> >> in 2004 the city loan marketing association was privatized and operated as a private company over the past tenures it has restructured under a different entity. but despite the significant

public benefit and subsidies the successor corporation received, it was selling a that was ordered to stop breaking multiple laws. >> i will have to move on reid of nevada senators who are waiting to ask questions and they build be called a short they. so freaking get an answer in writing of appreciate that. senator warner okay. thank you for helping us and we still have senator murphy and the vote will be called shortly eddie members who want to go vote can come back and we will keep going. >> mr. chopra one of the

statistics that is interesting in comparison touche germany with the country's medium income here it is a 51% of the median income. how to set a fast -- affect the students of those two nations? >> the lack of affordability of college may not only impact the students themselves but that also might impact of a broader balance sheet. as a resaw the rise of student loan debt not only because college was increasing in cost but because students themselves are bearing a larger share of total college costs compared to the parents or other sources. that means because people have less equity, less savings, those costs scott shifted somewhat may impact not only the student but the

family aspirations' them so small they bled prosper long term. >> does this reflect not only benefits individual children but society as a whole? >> i am not a philosopher but i believe with your point the positive externalities' of the educated population benefits all of us there is empirical literature to suggest that but we need to make sure people are able to be paid the student debt and does not replace other productive spending. >> put another way, if colleagues of miss jones are looking at the challenge of debt to decide i cannot pursue a path with a debt

equal to the mortgage believe me down because of the constant struggle, it not only in packs the individual that the future prosperity of our entire society of folks in our own generation cannot reach the fullness of their potential back to the economy? >> behind all the facts and statistics is a broader question of the american and tradition of entrepreneurialism and risk-taking and that they feel they cannot take those risks are start it that small business out of their ride your start a family. >> is students are unable to purchase a home early in their life with the of major

builder of guelph doesn't that amplify the inequality of wealth in our society? >> as i noted, there is a large gap in certain situations what those final outcomes may be for the retirement balance. traditionally if they're saving for retirement or with the home down payment and without those contributions they'll lose those compounding effects the student loan ability to do invest doors save those could be real. >> i just want to make that point. what i am most concerned about is the impact on

aspirations i live in a working-class community. what i am hearing is the feeling among high-school students there is not a path in which they have an opportunity to thrive for pursue their potential as to whether or not or how hard day of the work to make that pass possible. my concern here is this is the heart of the american dream the full opportunity to thrive whether a child of a mechanic or a ceo given the huge hurdle of college debt is that compromising? >> the change of aspiration from the stories that we're constantly submitted to public record illustrate

many of the themes that we've just discussed. >> i do not want to interrupt but we do have the votes right now i will let you answer for the record. the senators next will be returning i will go vote and come back anybody at the end of the list come with me and come back. >> thank you for hosting this hearing and for working hard to stick in there to work hard and like most people most of us to that have the capacity to turn to parents to say can i borrow 20 or 30 or fifth -- $5,000? millstone not in that saturation but fortunately

for we in the '70s i would not have gone to college with my little 93 percent graduating class and i qualified for tuition free scholarship for four years in that got me to college. when i looked at the numbers the state of michigan is now one of the highest in the country to cut higher education over 32 percent universities and colleges and interestingly it has not increased. at about 19% is more than we would like to see but is a significant cut but what i find interesting is they

have increased their tuition and twice as much as public universities. twice as much. 57% of the for-profit school graduates coming out with 30,000 more adept so there is a lot of things that we need to look at but i don't think we should say in the meantime all the rest of us have had that is to get the lowest interest rates but the good news for this refinancing bill like the bank bailout or other things , this is paid for. this is not adding to a

deficit that we are proposing to ask a ready-to-eat chip in and pay your fair share to create a fair shot for everybody. it is fully paid for. but i just have to say i am so very surprised that your testimony. in terms to say we should reduce the federal role and we have too many graduates of our economy? while. but it did michigan it has said that at as a 1. 5 million jobs expected to be created alone 1 million of the 155 million will take education beyond high school where of the get the national association of manufacturers of there 600,000 jobs available right now that we cannot match

upscale's not all of those are for your baby to year in terms of community college but let's get the need with stem class's as were rigo as the economy i am amazed that you think we have too many graduates going into our economy and could you speak about that? >> certainly. if you look at the bureau of labor statistics data, a people who are working with college degrees in the united states today nearly half that the bls has characterized the jobs that do not require for your degrees. of pessimistic has to be taken with a grain of salt

and there are some judgment calls but the unemployment rate among college graduates between 21 and 24 right out of college last year was above the overall u.s. unemployment rate. and miss jones story riches compelling is one of someone who worked hard but she is making $10 and $30 an hour. this goes back to senator biden's bill that wants to bring more information to the students before they make the is wrong decisions there is a huge information's problem. we are out of time although i don't know who is running the hearing now. >> with vhs say that -- let me just say that we need

less education. but thank you again and we will do whatever we can and to give you a fair shot. >> thanks to the committee members and miss jones i appreciate your testimony. let me read for the record something you have read student loan debt has been the driving force of my decision for the last eight years of my life and according to my current repayment plan it is projected to be the next 35 years of my life that i would be planning for retirement. that is a powerful statement i would like to be listed in your class so somebody who wants to be a teacher as much as you to take on that much debt to achieve your dreams and somebody willing to move across the country to get a master's you will

be one fantastic teacher. thank you for your commitment but to focus all of the cost side, bringing down the cost of higher education eyes of for so many issues the ability to refinance but to focus of the cost issues we probably have done a disservice to students and their families to not lay out in a more clear fashion lower-cost ways with the kind of skills or degrees that you need to succeed. one type of skill is not a college degree but licensor professional credentials. the georgetown workforce center says 27 percent of young workers with licensor certificates earn more than those with bachelor's degrees. it is not the you don't get education after high school but sometimes it is the

american welding certificate and cisco systems administrator certificates. we coach and a council our young people but there's ways to get those credentials and not the same and most of our financial aid policies you cannot use military tuition assistance benefits $4,500 per year for active military you cannot use those benefits to pay a $300 certification exam? that is foolish. we have dual enrollment possibilities and more and more states embrace the notion that while in high school should be able to get dual enrollment credits he cannot use the pill grant credit not currently to pay for college credits the you can obtain for cheap costs and high school with dual enrollment. that is a cheaper way to get college credit i could graduate in three years because of dual enrollment

it was enormously helpful to my family they cannot afford the college's i got into when i first applied when everybody else was celebrating they say if you have to go talk yourself into another way because it is too expensive. also the ap credits. 2 + 2 programs miss jones a lot of people a lot of students today now are going for two years then going to the college than half the total cost shrinks but for them to do that somebody has to sit down as the path to get a for a year degree it is 25 or 30% cheaper if you start at the local community college so what this tells me i am most concerned about the college cost issue there

are a number of pathways for the credentials and certificates we have an obligation to give policies that don't discourage were treaty a second-class educational professionals or certifications. said lover like to ask in terms of the information in provision, dr. vedder you have questions about the grading system i think that obscures more than they reveal with quality but providing information earlier in their life to make decisions, what more can we do at the federal level using the leverage of the investment that we make? >> one of the things we have noted it is also very difficult to even compute what the true cost of

college is not only do a tune to which can change but also a challenge to project what your monthly payment will be when you take on a certain amount of debt this year. just like in the mortgage market where interest rates might preset people are holding the dice with tools to assist but of course, that can be more to be done. >> the time is expired kinder-care has come back. >> thank you. very good to testimony thanks to all three of you. is seen as one of the things we have talked about that there are programs with the account based repayment that

have the very low uptake rate. is in one of the things we should do regardless about interest rates or refinancing which make available to borrowers at the beginning and end of their schooling? senate that would have helped you to radically? >> definitely would have helped in the beginning to know what i was getting into with my promise every notes i think in the beginning you are told this is what you need to get through college and if you use this you can deal with it after words but right now you will not encourage take a subsidized loans then take the unsubsidized and leave talk about that more with your exit counseling.

but they're walking away from the profession because they cannot afford the education they need. >> but they may have options they don't know. >> there are seven different repayment options is in that one thing we ought to do? >> with the simplicity of how to repay your lungs is a very important goal and i am also struck an recently heard from a former employee from a student loan servicer they are evaluated on how quickly they can get someone off the phone that calls them for help so that could lead to a quick interaction to be transferred andy you may get the short cut answer

it is better for the owner and the borrower and the economy more broadly proposal directing those incentives. >> i enjoyed your testimony. in a former life i was the talk show host i interviewed a financial aid officer is and we talked about college tuition and he said for the past 40 years the cost of a good private college is about the same as a new ford. in the '40's it was 1,000 then it went up in the '60s at 3,000 but something happened because and you for today is $20,000 and the cost of private colleges approaching 60. queeney to explore why that

happened. have colleges, and and tell us why what they sell has increased tour three times the rate of inflation and what it is they are buying? because we talk about the financing costs but the real underlying problem is the cost of the product. if tuition had risen at the rate of inflation me but not be having this hearing. so we have got to be focusing on that but i am concerned with accountability but i want to be sure to talk about holding schools accountable reapply standards such as ski and full employment and graduation rates that we don't penalize those institutions taking higher risks with lower in, and not college experienced students. can you comment? >> we are not exploring that

specific regulation. what i can say is a lightning the incentives between the schools that would ever loan programs and financial institution services we want to examine how it can increase accountability so it is approved for everybody. >> we all want to increase accountability but we have to be careful how we do it to an unfriendly penalize the students that we want to get into the system by placing requirements that would be a disincentive that is not the word, that would punish schools that take the risks to give those students in education. >> fake you for your years

of passion and commitment with this is timely right now. but we're just getting smothered up to their eyeballs in debt and this has a huge effect on their ability to have a productive life that they want it takes a toll in the myriad of ways. recently making a tour of college campuses and a young woman came up to me and said i owe $50,000 what i want to do is have a family. but i am not convinced someone will marry me when i carry around that kind of debt. she tears up and we talked about options but that is

representative. this takes the enormous toll to put people is shackles and this seems there are two kinds of pieces to the puzzle behalf to help the students ever under water. i appreciate what you have to say about that whether refinancing, i bolted to a variety of different approaches. the second to is a different issue to make sure that not only do we get students in the door but more value for their education. senator rubio is senator warner and i have introduced -- introduced the legislation and so for the first time in would be possible for students to get this information in one place and have been forbidden and students and families find out about

schools doing a good job job, graduation rates rates, remedial education, if one is doing a good job did they better clean up the act or market forces would it can or a tour of france the school's other doing a good job. with maya understanding to get the data read that you need to do this right will take that piece of legislation rather the bill and by the way others have bills it is close to gaf. can we get the data that we need to set up this seamless opportunity?

>> first of all, i am very pleased you have introduced this legislation and i have written on several occasions it is ironic the universities in the knowledge business are sometimes reticent to provide knowledge about their own students, what they are learning, earning after college but the irs could provide enormously useful information on the earnings of graduates by major's comment institutions without violating privacy or anything. why don't we do that? the social security administration has the

capacity to provide information. if it is to give financial burden shouldn't they know what is the probability they will earn a certain amount of money? those bills are important important, low-cost, a consumer friendly, when there is more information and that efforts fail and others are making is one of the few positive developments right now. >> i want the senator to summarize because we will have the vote. i.m. something of a privacy talk with them nsa so we have tried very hard to have a significantly privacy protections and my last request we would like to

work with you and the other students we get this right to lock in the privacy of your generation deserves with repayment or whatever is necessary for those that are getting smothered because there is foot dragging and and they q i look forward to working with you. >> i appreciate you and all members here because this is an issue impacting so many it is one we have to address to work with all the views of they q for filling in today.

. is nextington journal" and then president obama holds a joint news conference with british prime minister. a senate hearing on the ukraineian elections and later, senior intelligence officials talk about the foreign intelligence surveillance act or fisa. minutes, we will talk about the deal with the taliban to secure the the release of bowe bergdahl. fightersiscuss foreign

on the growing phenomenon of children entering the u.s. without their parents. we will talk with a usa reporter. host: it's thursday, june 5. welcome to "washington journal." ago, former nsa contractor edward snowden leaked documents that disposed the range of government surveillance tactics used by the national security agency. today the senate intelligence committee is set to discuss legislation that will tackle that issue. we want to hear from you on how the congress should reform the nsa. the phone lines are open now.