dstock music festival with william greider. at 9:30, jennifer ortman and richard johnson on the join hands to to rebuild the trust that has been broken. literally, the eyes of the nation are on us. we need reconciliation to begin. that is why, today, i am announcing that the highway ting theill be direc team that provides security in ferguson. >> missouri governor jay nixon yesterday, after appointing the highway patrol to head up crowd control. brakes, a no violent change from the previous few

days. your thoughts this morning for the first 45 minutes on the best way forward in ferguson, missouri. especially with the investigation of the death of michael brown still going on. ly, when it comes to issues involving race relations. minutes,irst 45 ferguson, missouri the best way forward. here's how you can respond. dial the numbers on your screen. host: if you are from missouri and went to comment on events going on, we have a line for you. go to our facebook page or twitter. also reach out if you want to on e-mail.

here is the st. louis post-dispatch today. the state highway patrol is in charge of events there in ferguson. if you go down, there is a photo by a photographer -- not only showing events there, avenue in this is an ferguson, people raising their arms. no violence was reported. this was after the government's announcement yesterday. if you go to the front page, they talk about going forward so to speak. here are some of the thoughts from the editor. there is a change in command and tactics. there comes some hope that the process of healing will begin. that process is long and difficult and will require sitting down and interacting in a way that is rare in this area.

there is their own accident issues to resolve in st. louis county. the first 45 minutes, your thoughts on how to move forward. the line for republicans -- democrats -- independencts -- and missouri residents -- in martha's vineyard, president obama took two cameras to talk about events in ferguson. here are some of his comments. [video clip] >> when something like this happens, the local authorities have their spots ability to be open and transparent about how they are investigating the death and how they are protecting the people in the communities. there is never an excuse for violence against police or for those who would use this tragedy

as a cover for looting or vandalism. there's also no excuse for police to use excessive force or tot peaceful protests throw protesters in jail for exercising their first amendment rights. here in the united states of america, police should not arrests journalists who are trying to do their jobs. simply, we all need to hold ourselves to a high standard. especially those in positions of authority. from with the president yesterday, holding a news conference in washington -- martha's vineyard. senators are weighing in as well. senator clinton on her website -- says we need to demilitarize the situation. the response by police has been a problem, not the solution. i respect law-enforcement, but my constituents have peaceful protests.

today will be a new start, but we need and can do better. also, the republican from missouri is weighing in yesterday, sayin g this: i spoke with the attorney general and i continue to monitor the close coordination between county and federal authorities. it is important to remember that this began when a young man lost his life. open, transparent, and parallel investigations. michael brown's family is not served by more violence. paul, is first up this morning in consulting a. republican line, good morning. what do you think? caller: thank you for taking my call. ferguson is just one town across the nation that this problem exists. it is an ongoing problem and it is getting more serious every day. i think there has to be a committee of non-politicians put

together, and ad hoc committee. they should sit down and figure out what can be done. i thought i was looking at the 82nd airborne when i was looking at the police line there. that got way out of hand. there's so much excess of the military now. these towns and cities and police forces, that is not the answer. host: you're talking about the pictures we have seen? caller: yes. that was absolutely shocking to me. that concerns me. that brings on more trouble than it solves. for me, personally, if i am looking at that, i will get a little rowdy myself. they just got way out of hand. the governor should have been down there earlier. theink his fix on it was

right one. host: these photos are from a few days ago. the police were heading up the situation when a violent protests were in the works. tennessee, diane, democrats line. caller: good morning. i think that the governor took too long to get out there to talk about the situation. this is what has been going on here in america. now, everybody can see. good white police, some good black police. thate should understand when a person is walking around, minding their own business, you tell them to stop, they stop. to raise your hand up and stop and they shoot you? the number one thing -- the situation right here,

everybody sees what is going on in america. you talk about iraq. it was shown. host: the previous caller said some kind of commission to look into what happened in the way to go forward. do you have any thoughts on what should happen now? caller: everybody should get gather and talk about the situation. the first caller was right. republicans and democrats should get together, black, white, hispanic. get down and solve the problem. hating.to stop this we are all human beings. we are all americans. host: that is diane from tennessee. your thoughts. detroit, michigan is up next. caller: good morning fellow patriots. this problem has been going on for too long.

america has had its head in the sand about this problem. race has been a factor since the --of america,he really. the problems that we have in america cannot be solved unless we recognize there's a problem. there is an eye-opening picture where the snipers aimed at the crowd. i thought i was seeing a new story in iraq or afghanistan. this could not be america where we are supposed to be showing the world that we are living free and clear in america. free for democracy. it just does not look like it. we need to talk about this. host: who takes that lead in talking about these issues? caller: our leaders. we select our leaders to lead us. that has been missing in action. they have been mia in

washington, d.c. how can you solve this if you are not discussing anything? they have been alienating themselves from the president and any discussion at all. you cannot solve a problem unless you go to the table. america is afraid to come to the table and talk about it, the most pressing issue that separates america, and that is race. host: the president spoke about this yesterday, should he say more? caller: i believe he should. not only is it his responsibility, it is all of our legislators, even at the local level. that was a local problem. this situation will not get better, unless we talk about it on a local level. host: let's hear from leila in texas, democrats line. caller: good morning, can you hear me? host: i can, go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my

call. this is truly a national problem. we see national laws that deal with it. we have localized police departments throughout the united states. they do violate the rights of african-americans. this is going on at the time of slavery. by the time it stops, we need national laws from congress so that the justice department has some -- the justice department has a national outreach to all lease jurisdictions. nand, when they violate the rights of citizens and kill them when they are unarmed, they should be subjected to criminal and civic penalties. that includes prison. this truly has to stop. r, presidentholde obama, and the legislators will do something about it.

this has to stop. they have to stop killing our boys. and, we have no fathers and husbands. our population does not grow because they kill bees young boys. they do not get a chance to reproduce them of their lives. it has to stop. thank you. host: do not forget, we have set up a line for those in missouri to share their thoughts as well. (202) 585-3883. kentucky,nd paul of republican, penning an op-ed in the pages of "time." you can find it online as well. we must demilitarize the police, the headline says. tois possible for americans feel it their government is not targeting them -- it is impossible for

african-americans to not feel like their government is targeting them. this is part of the anguish we are seeing outside of st. louis, missouri. that is what they feel when there's a heartbreaking shooting like the incident with michael brown. anyone who does not feel like race is skewed is just not paying close enough attention. there are black and brown the men and women who are serving long and hard senses for nonviolent mistakes. you can read senator paul's thoughts on the time website. ferguson, missouri is the subject of our first question. beverly from chicago, illinois, democrats line. caller: how are you doing? i wish she would go on your archive the couple of months ago and see the difference. when those militias actually had guns -- laying on the ground, pointing guns towards police officials. and telling the officials that if they come closer, they would

shoot them. did you see any police on top of trucks? and cars, like they were? with guns trained on them? the police stepped back. these people were standing there with their arms raised high. what if they all were slaughtered and killed? these guys come out here with guns. stuff on president obama. show what they did with bundy and with these people out there. host: we have been showing photos. with that in mind, what is the best way forward? caller: to stop this -- whites got the rights, we got the rights. we have all got kids. stop making a difference. you have a black president in the white house -- he is sitting

there, but you will not let him be present. a man cannot even speak on things like this. who should speak out? not only the present. every elected official should speak out. you know? host: tyrone from a peach city, georgia. republican mine. caller: i think the way forward is to weed out to be agitators who comeace baiters in to exploit the situation. granted, it is a tremendous tragedy and there is a loss of life. but we are in america and we have to let the justice system work. people rush to judgment. now, i don't see what the correlation is between this tragedy and people coming in, stealing rims and tires, burning businesses. it is absolutely ridiculous. and, it is very indignant.

i just think that now it is time to sit down and discuss these problems. let's talk about the black on black crime in chicago. let's go to those areas as well. thank you for taking my call. host: up next, south carolina, republican line. caller: they need to shut up and let the investigation go on. give them facts, do the police department, and -- [indiscernible] most of that is supposed to be intimidation factors. nutso, they should think about what they're doing and leave. fact that president obama comes out -- republicans are the enemies. he did not say the whites. he said republicans were

enemies that needed to be defeated. that is pretty divisive. host: the financial times picks up on the investigation of the shooting itself. u.s. is thein the headline. they have decided not to release the name of the officer who shot around, -- brown, citing death threats. a local hairstylist was worried about people's reaction if the man was not held to account. don't charge him, there is going to be a war in st. louis, she said. a little historical context -- lacks moved to the suburbs to escape crime and poverty. there is a suburban town of 20,000 inhabitants. hundredew african-americans in 1970. wayne from washington dc, good morning. caller: good morning.

it seems like we really need to start loving this country a lot more. we all are americans. i mean, we worry about our children more than anything else. if you can turn that scenario around and see that -- it is more than color when you fire the bullet. it is how a mother or father feels when they lose their child. i think that america is forgetting one special thing. we are all a melting pot. we all are letting money control this country a little bit too much. that means morals are being changed. through? --o why will we even go through wars if we're going to have a war here? way tohat is one solid change the situation and start

turning things around there? in nationwide as well. caller: the only solid way is jobs. it is the only thing that most of these people -- they're not working. when you are losing a child, you're not working, thinkgs are not moving forward. this president is -- i am a republican. this president is, i do not want to say racist. he is not doing his job. he is not for anyone. that is the problem. he is not opening his mind for clarification for the whole country. he is opening his mind for businesses . host: walid from pennsylvania, good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call. that is the problem right there, the last caller.

you are talking about the president not being for everybody. where do you get the stuff from? you have divisiveness going on radio and on tv constantly. and also on msnbc. they are being divisive. you're going to have a divisive country. this is not a divided country just because of the president. it has always been divided. you know? people are tired. the caller stated that -- [indiscernible] people are looting. they need to do more than that. what are you going to do and people start shooting back? then they will act like we're crazy black people. i do not know what needs to happen. someone needs to speak on this. who is that somebody? to be honest with you -- regular people, man.

these politicians are scared they will not get elected. so, you have to get regular people -- it is hard to say. i speak out about it. then you have somebody in middle america. you're talking about white people. and you get a regular guy like me. man.'t know, it is hard to say. sharpton, theyal look at him as a race baiter. we don't have any leaders. you killed our leaders. malcolm x, martin luther king -- you killed them, or you imprison them. it is hard to say. host: there is a story in the washington post that show some of the pictures of things - a picture you have seen of the military gear. helmut sent flares and various

knives and some tropical -- tact ical weapons there. they talk about the federal program that arms localities. some of this equipment is written about by chauncey in the pages of the washington post. he writes that one program often credited as a source of military resources deployed by the police department -- is the excess property program. am,o known as the 1033 progr which gives weapons to the law enforcement agencies. programs have increased dramatically in recent years. thousands of made transfers to law enforcement agencies. the number grew to 51,779 transfers valued at $420 million. . theugh april of this year, agency made 15,000 transfers of

equipment. that is worth $206 million. at the defense department yesterday, press briefing in which some of the conversation dealt with this program. people from the department spoke about it. here are their comments. [video clip] law enforcement program that the defense department administers, which provides to law enforcement agencies surplus military equipment, gear, arms, ammunition, vehicles. this is a useful program that allows for the reuse of military equipment that otherwise would be disposed of, and can be used again by law enforcement agencies to serve their citizens. so, the program serves a purpose. that said, it is up to law enforcement agencies to speak to how and what they gain from the system.

i will not inject the pentagon into this discussion. how this equipment is used to serve local citizens is up for local law enforcement agencies to speak to. host: if you want to see that full briefing, or anything else that is coming out, go to our website, c-span.org. or you can watch that on our video library and other resources there as well. mike from cary, north carolina. we're talking about the best way forward and ferguson, missouri. caller: good morning, pedro. i am not sure exactly what the best way forward is. i think it will probably have to be german of the community level. i do not think, washington, d.c., i do not think the justice department, unless there are egregious civil rights violations. we are not sure what happened here. what i see happening here is a

confluence of factors. i am a child of the 60's. i watched the race riots in the vietnam protest. are, almost 50 years later, after trillions of dollars were spent on the war on poverty, and to deal with their blighted urban cities and to try to help the people of color. what are we? i am looking at the pictures and people are saying they are saying iraq or afghanistan. i am seeing detroit, cleveland, toledo. it is the same thing all over again. there's racial strife, yes. as a libertarian leaning conservative, i am upset like rand paul is, with dispensation of military gear to the local police forces. these local police forces -- they had weapons, automatic weapons, machine guns, trained on the people. i am not a fan of that.

thehey want to deploy weaponry and keep them in reserve, that is one thing. let's also keep in mind what instigated this. once again, just like kent state and the race riots and the vietnam protests of the 1960's, we have immediate reaction, and emotional reaction to a tragic event. the killing of a young man by a white police officer. a young black man. an immediate reaction was property damage, looting, and destruction. police have to respond to that. i watched kent state burned for three days. on the third day, those four kids got shot. that did not happen in a vacuum. that was a reaction to property damage. going forward, i am not sure. i hope we can do better. host: the tear from susan in ohio on the democrats line. good morning, go ahead, please.

ok, let's put her on hold. hello.in maine, caller: good morning, how are you? in maine, we elected the first lack president of the united states. the republican party said they would not work against him. what happened in missouri is just -- a reflection of the republican party. i plan on going to november in the polls and i will vote against every republican on the ticket. that is what i'm going to do about it. host: texas, republican mine, hello. caller: i am definitely opposed to the militarization of our local police, along with the other colors. i think they were making the largest mistake in evaluating this. they're calling it racism. it has nothing to do with race

and everything to do with culture. the color of your skin does not make you go lose and steal and destroy other peoples property because you're upset. that is a cultural thing. it is taught. from a very young age. so, let's stop this baloney about it being racism or race, somehow. it is culture. host: scott, you mentioned the police and the equipment they use. do you notice any of that in texas? caller: no, i haven't. but we have not had any rights. i don't know where they got the gear. but that is definitely wrong. these policemen going into people's yards and shooting their dogs because they are barking at them has to stop. that has got to stop. automatic weapons trained on the peaceful protests is one thing.

you absolutely have a right to that. i will be right there on the line with you. the minute you start breaking windows and burning and destroying people's property, that is wrong. take a black man or a white man or a hispanic or anything else -- it has nothing to do with race and everything to do with culture. host: that is scott from texas. the wall street journal has on its front page the picture of the iraqi prime minister announcing that he will resign. here's the story. mr. maliki's concession came after intense pressure from other shiites. "i say to iraq, i will not be the reason for the sheedidding of one drop of blood." this is a surprising reversal from a leader who said he would

not relax his grip on power and said he had ruled on his complaint. if you're just joining us, we're talking about ferguson, missouri and asking your thoughts on the best way forward. rowde overseeing the clou control -- that was announced by the governor yesterday. fort lauderdale, florida it's next on the democrats line. this is john. ,aller: i just want to say that when a lot of conservatives call in, the first thing out of their mouth is looting. you know, the kids on the first

night decide to do a little looting. ok. after that first night, there was not any more than that. every night after that, they would just protest this. you want to hear what the police had to say. want to see the story. why have they not release that information? it does not take eight days to tell the truth about that incident. the fact that they are not letting that information out shows you that they just want a story together that makes sense. and, this is why that delay -- m,ere is no problem with hi he is a public servant. he had to write a report that night. why doesn't he just released the report he wrote about a murder that took place? he is not going to do that because he knows it will look at. and now, you're trying to cover it up. the police, last night, they did

not have this right here. republican, democrat, it does not make a difference. to have those military uniforms and guy standing up there with guns and things like that -- we should all be outraged by that. we should come against this stuff about protesters having li them, guns pointed at saying we want that information. that is totally wrong. let's stay with the issue of why this young man was murdered. host: supporters of michael brown's family one information on the investigation. university howard for a meeting amongst college freshman there -- about 300 strong, with hands up, taking a photo. this is in the pages of the

washington post this morning. other types of similar demonstrations taking place across the country, new york among others. that is a story that you'll find in the washington post. gail,s byron georgia, independent line. caller: i just want to make a quick comment about how we need to look at this issue. it has got to come from inside. we have to look at what is coming up. to me, this is just something that has been progressing for at years, if not two years, ever since trayvon martin. they are all of her children. they belong to us. their american children. until we can see it and look at it and have compassion and understanding about how we would

feel if that was our child -- then, i do not know how we can go about solving it. from mesa, arizona, here is bob, republican line. caller: hi, pedro. i have seen a lot of misinformation. the other day especially. alex wagner referred to all this happening in st. louis. st. louis's independence from st. louis county. the city is a separate political entity. that is why in the county, you have all these municipal powers. od --eas like hazlewo by the way i am and ex-m issourian, and i transferred to mesa, arizona.

in st. louis, i was in the army national guard. we were artillery, change to military police -- but not in st. louis or st. louis county. we would have been poorly trained for any kind of riot control. it seems to me like the ferguson police and most police departments are not trained properly to take the actions that should be taken. what is happening now is great, too militarizing. out here in arizona, we have the biggest share in the midwest. we have some natural army tanks with high-powered guns. hesitatethink he was to pointed toward the border of mexico if he had the chance. typeve to stop giving me of weapons to police departments who are not properly trained. host: if they were properly trained, would you have issues with them holding the step of equipment? caller: yes.

on the street, at that time. we would never in st. louis called to the street with any kind of weapons. unless there would have been an action that would have required it. having certain weapons, of course they'll have that. do they need an army tank? i have a question about that. he will say i just haul it around for advertisement. what is he advertising? ,he problem i saw yesterday they said st. louis. that is st. louis county. completely different. like i said, st. louis is not in a county. it is an independent city. host: appreciate your call. the washington post, bill o'leary, the burial service for major general harold green, the two star general who was shot in afghanistan. you probably remember hearing about those ceremonies taking

place. the picture in the washington post, cameras capturing the event itself. it says that green was 55. he was deputy commanding general of the transition command in afghanistan. he was killed august 5 at a military academy near kabul. a man believed to be an afghan soldier, and inside attack. again, that ceremonies taking place at arlington -- go to our website, c-span.org, if you want to see that. back to our question this morning. for the remaining minutes, on ferguson, missouri. we are asking your thoughts on the best way forward in light of what is going on not only on the street, but the investigation of 12. well.

we hear from our resident in kansas city. democrats line, hi. caller: i wanted to bring up that here in kansas city -- my heart is just broken over michael brown. my heart goes out to his family. wee in kansas city, in june, had a latino man named anthony -- he was on house arrest for theft. the police went over -- over, and they shot his face often put him in critical condition, cuffed him with his face on the ground. his pregnant girlfriend is standing there. he is a peaceful, nonviolent person. they chased him out. just because he ran out the back door of the house. i don't think he passed away. it was insane what they did. it was over -- york.is guy in new

selling cigarettes and they give him the death penalty by choking him? and michael brown, this is just so out of hand. the way we have to go forward here is the police have got to just back off. in the 70's, if you were in a concert, you could just smoke marijuana. the police would totally leave you alone. they are going way overboard, ove r nonesense. they're way too aggressive. we have to get the police to just back off the citizens and let us have the freedom. we're supposed to be the land of the free. our freedoms have been so restricted. if they pull you over -- ayunethe most pick things --

they have to get this out. host: democrats line, hi. caller: i have two comments about how we can move forward. one, about looking backwards. first, going forward -- [indiscernible] host: you have to speak up, we cannot hear you. caller: can you hear me now? ok. looking forward, we need to our housing arrangements and school arrangements. happened from cities to the suburbs and public and private schools. that is where most of these problems -- there are several cities in the south, 11 black family moved in, up immediately and the whites fled to the suburbs.

they are complaining about what happens in the cities. they abandoned public schools. that has got a lot of problems. the second thing going for it is we need to rethink this fairness. because, the public airways belong to the public. and yet, they are dominated by hatred from right wing tv and radio broadcasts 24/7. and it is spews forth a constant bombardment of that. they blame obama for local things. get the government out of our affairs. and yet, they blame obama for something that happened in a small town in missouri? host: the washington post has a story looking at the makeup of police forces when it comes to race. some of the findings that they did -- says that the public outcry and federal pressure is prompting dramatic change in chicago.

it has an extended to places like ferguson, a suburb with 21,000 people and 53 commissioned police officers. we hear next from del in baton rouge, republican line. caller: yes, well -- all these riots are planned. first thing they do is send in the black panthers, to get the riots started. like they send in people al sharpton and jesse jackson.

and then, the media comes in. it is all planned, just like it was in florida. and you think that trayvon martin's father was just a plain, old citizen? you're wrong. secreta high person in a organization, like the masons. but you never hear the media say anything like that. host: one more call. here is dwight from st. louis, missouri. democrats line. caller: there's so much misinformation out there, it is amazing. a lot of people are upset. sure, of course. than there were a lot of people

looting and burning buildings, that had nothing to do with the protests. 90% of those who were arrested were outside the community. the guy from arizona had it right. st. louis county is totally different. in between that, you have a lot of different municipalities with trained police officers. i think 60% -- i used to be a reserve officer. 60% are trained. they cannot pass the test. maybe they're over policing the community, where they do not live. they need community -- that keeps everybody accountable. that is one of the ways forward. what we need to get away from its outside people generalizing what they think is going on. and media that is not really here speculating what is going on. haseful protests demonstrated last night for the first time -- standing there, letting people

show their frustration and reacting in an organized and civilized way is the way forward. we had no incidents, no proble ms. an african american -- along with a black attorney general. you had almosta, 100% white political structure, from police chief to city council to mayor. there's just so much -- people are not trained and are ill-equipped for their job or position. host: that is the last call we will take on the subject. joining us next, terry jeff rey, to discuss events of the day. later on, it is the 45th anniversary. we will discuss the political and social implications. william greider of "the nation."

it is the 100th anniversary of the opening of the panama canal. to give you a sense of what happened back then, our focus has pulled a little bit of footage from that time. it was packaged in the "real america" program which you can see on the weekends on c-span3. to give you a sense of what happened back then, here's a portion of this video as part of her "real america" program. [video clip] >> standing on the top of the dam, looking at the lake, you saw the peer, along which eastbound ships tied the first of the two locks. it is 85 feet, to the level of the atlantic. the camera swings in slow panorama. on the hill, the administration buildings come into view. in these buildings, all of the orders were formulated for the

dam and locks. this birdlike structure is one of the two emergency locks. should anything go wrong with the regular locks, one of these could be swung across and they would drop big, steel plates to form a supplementary gay. here's one of the pair of the locks. wide,eet long, 110 feet 83 feet deep. 2 million yards of concrete were used at this end of the canal. the work took from 1906 to 1911. now all of the locks shown in just two weeks prior to their completion. here's the other emergency locks. the regular lock gates can be closed in two minutes. although they way 400-700 tons each. to give you a better idea

of the size of these locks, here's a small figure of the man in the middle distance. there is the panama canal from the underside. when the greatest pieces of man-made construction ever known. thought of in 1825, when henry clay appointed a committee to look into the idea. on augustship passed 1, 1914. it opened august 15 of the same year. the panama canal, a tribute to the american people. >> "washington journal" continues. host: our first guest of the morning is terry jeffrey, thank you for coming on. what is cns news? caller: -- guest: it is an online news agency. we are part of the media research center. we have been asking folks

in the previous segment about ferguson, missouri, the best way forward. if you had to answer the same question, how would you do so? guest: i think that the governor did the right thing by moving the state police and there. believe that, i the president actually said some good things here. i agreed with some of the things he said. think there are serious questions about the way the police behaved in ferguson, missouri. there is no doubt that the police have a tough and dangerous job. they deserve people to respect what they're doing. people need to respect the rule of law. unarmed had an 18-year-old boy who was shot and killed by a police officer. and thele of missouri united states deserve a fair and thorough and transparent investigation into how the boy died. i can understand how some people in the community may have some

anxiety about whether an investigation was taking place. also, what he the videos yesterday of the police shooting tear gas at the camera crew and arresting a washington post reporter in mcdonald's. that is not appropriate behavior for the police. the job of the police is to maintain order so we can enjoy freedom and a civil society in the united states of america. to be anf the press is adversary against abuses of government power. here in washington, where we have this massive federal government, but also in local communities. so, i agree with the president. the police cannot bully reporters. the reporters were doing their job. and, like i said, the people in this country has a right to a fair and thorough and transparent investigation into what happens. and the police also deserves farirness.

make an issueple of the type of equipment we've seen in the past few days. what do you think about the program overall? is this an issue of training with this equipment? guest: i think this is an issue. i could see where if you had a right, you may want to send in the national guard or something to protect lives and property. i do believe that the local police should be the local police. there should be a sense of community. we do not want people racially polarizing. we are one nation under god. i kind of think that -- there is a tough situation there. i think the governor did the right thing. i do not think the police ought to be militarized. host: what about the conversation of race? guest: well - you know, one of your callers pointed out that race has been an issue for america since our beginning. we had the declaration of independence. we said all men are endowed with

certain unalienable rights. we are putting up that document saying that this is why we are rebelling from england. that is a direct violation of the founding principal, that all men are endowed by their creator. the 13th amendment eradicated slavery. after the civil war, we had segregation and jim crow in the american south. but, more than anything else, i agree with what martin luther king said. when he was leaving the sole rights movement and he was unjust and thrown in jail for the police force. he wrote his famous letter from the birmingham jail. in this letter, he quoted to catholic saints, aquinas and saint augustus. he said that an unjust law is not a just law at all.

the law is the law according to god. in a racially discriminatory are unjust because they violate god's law. in our society, we need to get away from looking at people -- judge them by their character, not the content of their skin. i believe the part of doing that is going back to restore our belief in god, our faith, our sense of family, our sense of community. it is a moral and cultural issue above all others. the answer is index read of the united states. jeffrey joining us to have a conversation about this and other issues. if you want to join the conversation, call us. you can share your thoughts on twitter and put your thoughts on facebook as well. send us an e-mail too.

the most recent column has the headline "america's question." this deals with money. what is the topic? guest: the congressional budget office in july that out there long-term budget analysis. it is alarming. there is a question of when the debt -- we are building every day. when will it precipitate a fiscal crisis? when you look at the debt, they say that by 2039, it will be 6.4% of gdp. that is faster than our economy is going to grow. it will be more than 100%. will beicly traded debt more than 100% of gdp. i did another piece just yesterday, to look at total government spending in the united states through the last month, using that online data tool that has historical and local finances. and, i calculated total

government spending, state and local spending, using that database. government in 2011, on record, 68115 trillion dollars. if you divide that by the senses, that works out to about -- per household. the government spend more per household than the median household income. it's the more per full-time worker in 2011 than the average worker made. we cannot have a government that is spending more money than the typical household worker. host: are there efforts they made by republicans to reverse those trends? guest: if you look at the cbo report, what is going to be the debt in the future? social security and the major government health programs,

medicare, medicaid, children's health insurance programs, and the new obamacare subsidy. if you take those things and add in net interest payments on the debt, that will be a big part of gdp by 2029. had a plannd others for reforming social security. the chief actuary said that would solve it. even george bush would not move ahead with paul ryan's plan. you're not talking about reforming medicare. their growing medicaid with obamacare. there's a new class of subsidies, the tax credits that people get for buying health insurance. i do not see republicans doing anything serious about this. host: they show a budget deficit figures.low

guest: they would have to cut the deficit in half. the deficit is the amount that the government spends in excess of revenue in a year. then you have to go out and get debt. when president obama was elected in november 2008, he had voted for the tarp, the troubled asset relief program. $700 billion for that plan. his first month in office, he did the stimulus. $831 billion for that plan. i believe the deficit that year was something like $1.6 trillion. so, no deficit like that since world war ii. when you have a deficit like that, it is not hard to cut it down. through july of this year, the federal government has spent more in tax revenue than in any year in history in the united states, through july.

yet we still have a huge deficit. we have two months more to go. they predict a $600 billion deficit. that is bigger than any deficit that the president has ran since world war ii through obama's election. host: here's the first call, from baltimore, maryland on the republican line. caller: my actual comment was for the ferguson issue. not necessarily a financial issue. just on the last few points on this ferguson issue. things that could move us forward -- it is wonderful that things are coming out after these events happen. the federal investigations, when every police involved shooting -- that is an issue. that would solve a lot of issues. federal investigation, not just a local investigation. police departments should investigate. but sent to the fbi and federal

government to get involved when each police involved shooting happened. that will change the culture of the police department. host: would you say? guest: i do not think i would like it to be a federal investigation. that would assume that they are bad, and they're not. they're good people working in his police department's print there needs to be an independent, transparent investigation of what happened to michael brown. we are going to have the justice department go in. fine. but i think that governor nixon might have wanted to step out a little bit early. i do not like to see the centralization of things in the federal government. in civil rights issues, sometimes it is unavoidable. host: let's hear from david in king george, virginia. go ahead. caller: good morning. can you hear me? the reason why a lot of people are upset about this issue is

you have a young black man being shot in the street. if that was a young white guy, in a black neighborhood, it would have been resolved that day. -- stun guns and all this other stuff. with clive and bundy, who robbed us of millions of dollars -- when cliven bundy, who robbed us of millions of dollars, was going to get arrested, he got a tv interview. it is unfair and not right, what is going on. thank you very much. have a nice day. host: what do you think of the cliven bundy issue?

guest: i think he was held up to represent something he didn't actually represent. but i don't think there is a comparison there now. host: there was a story in "the new york times" talking about immigration. immigration, gop starts to embrace tea party." do you see that happening? guest: no. it is similar to the debt issue. we've had a problem with illegal immigration. it is not controlling the border and not enforcing the immigration laws. the social security administration and the irs get the socialhere security number and the name don't match. they get many millions. i think the last year on record was 7 million unmatched w-2's. one employer filed something like 137,000. you have an american business, a very large business with a massive payroll, has built a business plan around exploiting

illegal, cheap labor for lower weighted -- wages than it can pay to americans. neither republicans nor democrats have cared about this endemic problem. social security has a roadmap that shows them every employer of illegal aliens in the country. they don't want to do anything about it. in fact, they claim it would be a violation of section 601, the privacy protection in the internal revenue code, to tell the homeland security that there is a company that has 30,000 bad w-2's. we have a federal government where both parties are not interested in enforcing the immigration laws, and there are all kinds of problems. one of the consequences of this is horrible violence on the mexico border. mostz is one of the violent cities in the world, right across the border from texas. why is that? you have drug cartels operating on the south side of the border because they know they can get drugs across the north side of the border.

one of the consequences of our government's unwillingness to secure our border is violence in mexico. no, i don't believe the republicans are serious about doing anything about immigration. host: if that's the case and if the president is reported to take some type of executive action, what -- guest: the constitution says the job of the president is to execute the laws. andakes an oath to do that uphold the constitution. the president needs to obey and enforce the law. if the president wants to enforce the law, he should secure the border. -- he andpresident john boehner want to do something, they ought to pass a simple law that says it is not a violation of the privacy of anybody for the iraq source social security administration to name for the department of -- social security or the irs to

name for the department of homeland security -- > cnsnews.ry jeffrey, com. from shreveport, louisiana, good morning. caller: i am a vietnam-era veteran. what i have paid into the system, i wasn't paying for war. i never understood that. make -- minickto from indiana. caller: i have listened quite a bit too different reasons why politicians want to cut benefits for taxpayers and people that need help, mostly for the middle class.

i would like to know why in the need does a representative nearly 100% of their pay when they retire as a benefit, plus insurance. i would like to see all elected politicians retire. if they are elected. no pensions whatsoever. this would decrease our deficit. thank you. i'm notot -- guest: sure exactly what the pension deal congress gets now. they should be on the same deal as people in the private sector. if they want to invest in the 401(k), that's fine with me. the public-sector pensions -- it is a major problem for states and communities all across the country. when you look at the employment and income statistics, if you take the $6.15 trillion the

government spent in fiscal 2011 and divided by the number of full-time, year-round workers, it ends up being about $60,000 full-time worker. the mean earnings of a full-time worker was about $57,000 that year. that's when you calculate with 100 million full-time workers. 16.6 million of those full-time workers work for government. when you take out the government workers who are on the taxpayers payroll,- taxpayers' you have millions of private sector workers who are the core force carrying all of this, including these very good pensions for public service -- servants, who ought to live like private citizens, i believe. host: from detroit, michigan. caller: good morning. i wanted to make a comment concerning the police and how they are, in fact, regular men

and women like us all. they get up in the morning, they go to do their duties at work, and when they get off work, they are off duty and home with their families. when they are in their home with their families or out about with their families, i guess we could say they are are dissipating in -- theyhe people zone are participating in the we the people zone. are they are on duty, they subject to an oath of office that they signed, correct? host: what's the question for our guest? caller: when that oath is violated, for example, a case that is investigated and found -- it is found out that something was done unjustly, is that a federal offense? guest: i don't think so. there are federal civil rights laws. police are subject to the same laws of anybody else.

if they commit a state offense, it is a state offense. if it is federal, it is federal. i don't know what typical offense by a law enforcement officer would be federal. host: why do we have to wait until there is a crisis to fix the fiscal issues? question.s a good personally, i believe most of the media is liberal. most of the media favors the welfare state and big government. one of the reasons the republicans are reluctant to really grapple with the fiscal problem which our country faces, which the cbo has explained, is because they fear being targeted negatively by the media for the sorts of things they have to do. benefitsns like giving to people. they don't like giving them away. there is a snowball effect to the welfare state. riordan roosevelt, we did not have one in the united states. the federal government was not involved in handing out benefits . with johnson, we got medicare and medicaid. george w. bush increased that

with the medicare prescription drug plan. it keeps rolling downhill and getting bigger. no one wants to push it back up the hill. byron.ouisiana, caller: thank you for taking my call. marine.-year-old ex i did not fight for our country to see it turned into tiananmen square. that's what we look that up there in missouri. stop thishas got to militarization of our police department. there is right and wrong on both sides, but it can be handled without all of this. it is very scary. by the way, on your guests there, do you still work for fox news? guest: i never -- i would never

work for fox news. caller: i appreciate that. host: why do you say that? guest: i have never worked for fox news. host: oxford, georgia. caller: hi. thanks, c-span, for everything y'all do. i wanted to comment on the militarization of the police. it is a microcosm of what's going on in the middle east. arms to supply all the these countries and they use it against their people. , where one black -- and we kid is dead .re out in the streets rioting

we are out in the streets rioting over one dedicated. you look at the middle east where we've supplied all these arms and all this weaponry and hundreds of thousands of dead. what it is doing to their citizenry. host: to the point about the middle east and a conversation going who do we assist and how, what are your thoughts on that? , given thatnk that we invaded iraq, overthrew saddam hussein, president bush wants this policy famously articulated in his second inaugural address, that we were inng to try to end tyranny the world, promote democracy

everywhere -- it didn't work. i do believe the united states has a moral responsibility to help, to protect minorities, religious minorities who are being persecuted, murdered, driven out of the country. i do not believe the president has constitutional authority to do that unilaterally. i think anybody who looks at when theyramers meant look at the war powers in the constitution -- look at the notes. insert declare, leading to the executive the power to repel sudden attacks. madison excel -- himself explained it. president obama or any other president cannot unilaterally take action without congressional action. given the urgency of the situation in iraq, i think it would have been appropriate for the president asked congress to come back. i think congress should have

come back. they should have voted and resolved to give the president limited authority to do certain things in iraq that would protect people there. if there need to be other things done, then congress could expand the mandate. but overall, i think america needs to step back and look at the foreign policy we've been conducting in recent years, in which, especially in the middle east, we are intervening in countries essentially with the desire to foment revolution. we in fact did foment revolution -- part of a consequence of what we did. what we get is islamists rising to power. henry hyde, formerly the chairman of the house foreign relations committee, in january, two thousand six, a year after bush gave that inauguration january, 2006, a year after bush gave that inauguration speech, he said

that it was like the sorcerer's apprentice. we tried to clean things up and we created more messes. he argued that the united states would not invest the time, money, and everything else in order to occupy these countries long enough for them to develop stable governments. isortunately, henry hyde right. now you have christians in the middle east paying the price. i think we need to protect them. host: there is a story in "the washington post." here is what obama had to say. [video clip] on the mountain has greatly improved and americans should be very proud of our efforts because of the skill and professionalism of our military and the generosity of our people, we brokenly isil -- of mt.e the isil seige helped save many

lives. we do not expect there to be additional operations to evacuate people off the mountain. it is likely we will need to continue humanitarian airdrops on the mountain. the majority of military personnel who conducted the assessment will be leaving iraq in the coming days. host: what do you think about that strategy? guest: i'm not sure the president understands the true historical gravity of what's taking place here. the middle east is where christianity began. jesus christ was born in bethlehem, lived in nazareth, was crucified in jerusalem and resurrected there. his apostles went out from israel. they went to egypt, they went to -- st. paul was converted on the road to damascus. iraq was one of the first christian places in the world. you have this area which, for 2000 years, we've had christians. now there is a threat of christianity being eradicated, of all the christians being driven out and killed. operating in both iraq

and syria. one of their rival groups, diff actual al qaeda affiliate, the facto al qaeda affiliate, captured a christian town in syria where they still speak aramaic, the language of christ. it may well have been converted by st. paul. you have al qaeda moving in and occupying one of the original christian villages in the middle east, and you have the existence of christianity threatened in the very place where it started. that is happening in our historical epoch. it is happening now. how many yazidis are on mt. sinjar and in iraq? that's not the question. the question is how does the united states help reestablish stability in the middle east so that christians and jews can live in peace and freedom, so

that israel is secure, so that muslim arabs can live in peace and freedom? that is a huge strategic question that we need to grapple with. texas.nil -- bill is in go ahead. caller: good morning. in connection with the last portion, it seems as though we've gotten off topic. i think there should have been a curfew and the demonstrations should be limited to the daytime. however, i think the topic at hand should be the budget question and i appreciate your programming. host: what question would you like to ask about the budget? the federal is government and the state and local governments going to face up to the music? host: terry jeffrey? say, ai regret to reasonable prediction would be that the federal government will only deal with the nation's

fiscal problem after a crisis hits, they won't do it before a crisis hits. cbo in their report said there were limited options the government would have in the face of the fiscal crisis. one of those would be inflating the currency. monetizing the debt. when you look at the gravity of the fiscal situation in the united states and the lack of seriousness on the part of congress and the president, people will look back after the fact -- you see these things when someone looks at it rationally, it was completely predictable. it is completely predictable. can grappleiticians with it. afterwards, people will look back and say how did they let that happen. people realize it is coming and they are letting it happen. host: when you take in sequestration and negotiations on the budget, what does it do to resolve the budget, if anything? guest: they didn't.

you are talking about a tiny little thing. it is the core benefit program. obamacare is really driving it. the republicans did, because some conservatives in the senate were saying, look, we can't do this. they did refuse to sign obamacare. the press accuse them of shutting down the government. the senate refused to pass a bill. the president was going -- was not going to sign one. it was the senate and harry reid that shut down the government. they are not talking about making the slightest change when this fiscal year expires on september 30. a filibuster-proof majority in the senate but a majority in the house and a president that is ready to sign legislation, the only way the house republicans could do something is if they use the -- is by putting legislative things

into a cr. it's clear they don't want to do that. it's not going to happen anytime soon. host: up next, luis from indiana, democrats line. -- louise from indiana, democrats line. caller: i want to ask terry, wire we letting all these people come over in the united states? -- why are we letting all these people come over in the united states? how are you going to take care of them when they come over here? that's what i want to know. guest: is she talking about illegal immigrants? host: i think so. guest: it's an interesting question. some people would argue that one of the reasons the u.s. hasn't grown -- it is lack of population growth. americans haven't had as many babies in the last generation as we had in the baby boom

generation. part of the fiscal problem is that all these baby boomers who are retiring are going on social security and medicare and there are fewer young people working to pay for it. some people argue letting these illegal aliens and, having them pay payroll taxes, that helps. they are paying taxes but they don't qualify for the benefits. oeste box, i don't believe in breaking the law to do that. amnesty,ive these guys they will retroactively get social security and medicare anyway. americans ought to think about what we think about children and family. the whole idea of family is going away in america. having a big family, raising kids, people staying married, raising kids to be good, hard-working, decent people is good for america. it used to be at the core of our country. that central thing, the institution of family, is going away.

it doesn't just have cultural consequences. host: lafayette, indiana. leo up next on the independent line. caller: i have a question. host: go ahead. is, one ofquestion your callers said earlier that topic.inue to skew off the topic of discussion should --what it is in america racism. --ism israel in america racism is real in america. the whole world sees it. host: keep going. you are listening to your self. just go ahead. caller: the whole world sees it. host: i think we will leave his father. -- his thought there. we had previous callers asking leaders, national, state, local,

even the president should take a look at the topic. guest: at? host: the topic of racism. guest: obviously, there is racism in america. because people are flawed, you are never going to eliminate racism in a society. but racism is evil. when you see racist acts by an individual or government, they should be condemned. like i said at the beginning of this, i believe the root of it is ultimately religious and moral. this nation needs to follow god's law. as martin with the king said, racism violates god's law -- as martin luther king said, racism violates god's law. in our schools and communities, let's raise kids to be good. let's raise them to get along with their fellow countrymen. we ultimately all believe in the same thing. quite frankly, that is one of the things that is going away

from america. some people are rejecting this fundamental idea that our rights come from god, that there is a god, that even the government has to obey god. as we move away from that, where is the authority going to be that protects our rights if we don't say they come from god. a court in bridge -- in virginia last week declared same-sex marriage a fundamental right. part of the opinion, they said, the plaintiffs in that case argued that the right to choose who one wants to marry is a fundamental right. the judge said if you take that principle, then someone can choose to marry -- you can have an incestuous marriage, a polygamist marriage. where does it end? if you take the original principle that our rights come from god, how can people advocating for same-sex marriage, sincerely argue that the right for one man to marry another is a god-given right question mark can they argue

that the right to kill an unborn child in the womb is a god-given right? i don't think they can. i think that modern liberals who argue it is a right to kill an unborn child or it is a right for two men to marry each other of a deprive the child right to a mother, which i believe is a god-given right, they can't argue that those are god-given rights. they have to create a new vision for america that is uprooted from numbers -- the vision that martin luther king talked about in his letter from birmingham jail. they can't argue that a just law is a law that comports with the law of god. they can't adopt martin luther king's argument. he is right. killing anrgue unborn child in the womb is a god-given right. who gives you that right? the judge, the state. in the process of trying to declare these things right, they empower the state beyond the sort of authority any state should have. now we have a government that is in forcing profound wrongs as rights.

host: mount laurel, new jersey. caller: thank you for taking my call. i want to make a comment regarding what the gentleman is using for solutions for solving the budget problem. the majority of the budget growth has been in defense. we do not need to be supplying arms to our -- to militarize our police forces and to be selling them to other countries around the world. i think the person needs to open up and realize what the real cause of the deficit is. second is that god-given rights -- if everything was based upon god-given rights, there would be no death penalties. there would be nothing along those lines. i think you are inconsistent in your thinking regarding that. i tell you, the

understanding of the law being rooted in god's law goes way beyond america. a roman senator in the first century before christ, who was murdered, wrote in his truce on the republic that there is only one law, it is not different in rome or athens. it applies to everybody through all time. god is it's promulgated and enforcer. russell kirk wrote a great book, "the roots of american order." i think everybody should read it to understand what the people in this country believe. readys cicero is more well than anybody else around the founding fathers. it was afferson says statement of the american mind, but he cited cicero as one of the things that inspired it. this idea that the laws of the nation must comport to the laws

of god is one that existed before christianity existed, before christ came to this earth, and persisted through western civilization. martin luther king, a baptist clergyman, quoted saint thomas principle.that same now we have in the united states of america people who reject that principle. that's a very profound thing. it is not just rejecting our own tradition going back to our founding, it is rejecting a tradition in western civilization that goes back to pre-christian times. simply argue it is just truth. we are turning our back on the truth. we turn our back on national law and god's law -- on natural law and god's law, we are turning our back on the truth. host: let's take one more call. this is from scranton, pennsylvania. caller: i apologize for backing us up a little bit, but i've been trying to get through for a while. i'm on the other subject of

missouri. it kind of blends in with a few of the things you were just saying. every time something happens in this country, they examine the bullets and everybody talks about the bullets and we completely forget about the finger that squeezed the trigger. we can't get to the root of the problem as long as we keep claiming racism on every single situation that takes place in this country. i'm so tired of hearing -- we are focusing on the wrong things is what we are doing. everyone calls in with their own personal agenda, but the reality of the situation is, in order to move forward with any incident and all of these incidents that have been going on across the country lately, is to move backward. the only way to move forward is to move backward. we have to go back to our roots where we had police officers walking a beat in the community, stopping and having a glass of iced tea with a lady sitting on the porch, getting to know the community that they police, living in the community they police him of being part of the

community they police. i have family in law enforcement . they tell me stories about how you give a badge to a young kid and he immediately thinks he is above the people, he is something up our. ofsomething of opoowe -- power. host: what would you specifically like our guest to address? caller: we have to take the power away from the police and make them public servants once again. guest: i think being part of the community is a good thing. people should remember this policeman, whose identity we don't know, he has rights, too. we don't know the facts. we really don't know what happened. people should back off and wait, but there needs to be a fair and transparent investigation to find out what really happened. people deserve the truth. that police officer deserves the truth. host: terry jeffrey is a columnist for "creators syndicate."

what call are you working on next? guest: it is due tuesday and i haven't decided yet. host: thank you for your time. coming up, woodstock is known as a music festival, but also held political and social importance as well. eider joinsder -- gr us next to discuss that topic. later on, a look at the aging population and the future of baby boomers. all that as "washington journal continues after this -- "washington journal" continues after this. ♪ >> here are some of the highlights for this weekend on c-span. tonight at 8:00 p.m., a history tour looking at the civil war. saturday, the communicators visit the technology fair on capitol hill. sunday, political commentator, author, and former presidential

candidate pat began in. tonight at 8:00 eastern -- candidate pat buchanan. tonight at 8:00 eastern, hillary -- at 8:00n3 tonight eastern, the negro league's kansas city monarchs. the depiction of slavery in movies. sunday, an interview with president herbert hoover. let us know what you think about the programs you are watching. call us. e-mail us at comments @cspan.org. join the conversation. like us on facebook. follow us on twitter. >> this month, c-span presents debates on what makes america great, evolution, and genetically modified foods. veteran looks at the

health care, campus sexual assault. new perspectives on issues including global warming, voting rights, fighting infectious disease, and food safety, and our history tour, showing sights and sounds from america's historic places. find our tv schedule one week in advance at c-span.org. let us know what you think about the programs you are watching. e-mail us. join the conversation. like us on facebook, follow us on twitter. ♪ host: jimi hendrix at woodstock, 45 years ago, playing to crowds there. it is known as a music festival. here to talk about the political and social implications is built greider.- is bill

think of woodstock as a music festival and not a political type of situation? guest: i don't know what young people think of woodstock. they may get us better than us old folks. formallys remembered as this crazy rock on certain in the muddy fields of woodstock, new york -- this crazy rock concert in the muddy fields of woodstock, new york. i was too old to be a woodstock kid. my wife and i were having babies at that age, but spiritually we were with it, you know? and i have a broader, more ,erious memory of that moment surrounded by lots of other crazy things happening to this country at that time, like the assassination of martin luther , like the convention in

chicago in 1968, where they basically had it police riot -- had a police riot. i could go on and on. as a kind woodstock of breaking through of all of that and saying, hey, we are here. it used to it. we are the kids. our anthem is sex, drugs, rock 'n roll. and that was literal. but there was a kind of rebuke in that. young people, teenagers, some wayts always seek to rebuke their parents, the authorities, and they then settle down and get over it. saying this isre more than just a tantrum.

of differenttement cultural values. it is also political in the sense that we don't think much of the political system that others call democracy. those are all big things that were never stated very directly, at least not in the music, but that was the message. host: as far as going forward, what was the result of woodstock as far as its influence on political and social situation? guest: i think the general understanding is not much. if you look at the political system, george mcgovern got trashed badly in 1972 against nixon. i was a reporter at "the washington post" covering the mcgovern campaign and felt great sorrow am a because he was a really new voice and a strong

liberal, etc. that was the beginning of the assent -- descent into generation of conservative government, ronald reagan, followed by others. my view is contrary. the cultural messages of woodstock and the surrounding events have actually triumphed over the last 40 years. not as squarely and as concretely as people can see, but i think that cultural shifts -- take some simple examples. the republicans ran against mcgovern in 1972 with a slogan, amnesty."rtion, and it was a devastating slogan. he was not against abortion. for those who had

fled the vietnam war and went to canada. today, there is a very different frame. a long time after. .tates are legalizing marijuana other sensibilities that i think are going to come back with new strength. that that message -- that cultural consciousness was the effect of politics of the last 30 years, the civil rights, most obviously. women and feminism. rules that govern different kinds of behavior, -- to me, this is the real energy of american democracy, and it is .ot about the white house

it is about changing people's minds, their ideas of themselves, their sense of what they want the country to be. host: we are discussing woodstock as a political and social influence. by age.ivided the lines you can probably see them on the screen. if you are under 30, (202) 585-3880. 9, (202)30 and 4 585-3881. if you want to give your thoughts and you attended woodstock, (202) 585-3883. do you get a sense of what washington thought of woodstock at the time it was taking place or if there was some political response? guest: not formally. .t was basically trash democrats for obvious reasons, especially if they were from california had a softer, more supportive yoview of both the

music and the other elements. even they kept their distance. this had the shock effect on the country. for some, including myself, it was exhilarating. but for the overwhelming majority, oh, my gosh, what are those kids doing now? and the pictures coming out of the festival did not help. there were kids rolling around in the mud. braless and shirtless girls. believe it or not, that wasn't a common view in those days. all kinds of other behavior. some of it was ugly. i think the message was liberation. the hippies were very much part of that. throw off those old parts who arts who don't

know what they are talking about and make yourself free. jimi we heard from hendrix, janis joplin, crosby stills and nash -- crosby, stills, nash, and young. were they political? guest: not in the sense of we want you to vote for joe or former governor or -- above some of them -- or for mcgovern. although some of them obviously did. the cultural message was broader than political parties or campaigns. they had low regard for all of that. , evenunny sort of way though i was a political reporter at the time, i could .ppreciate the meaning

it wasn't about winning or losing the 1972 election or the 1980 election. it was beyond that. one of the things i think that supports my view is if you take the course of party politics , more and more americans have decided it is a busted system. they have contempt for it, for the institutions of politics, and in washington dc, where we reside, that is often portrayed , a kindess, stupidity of craven cowardice. people are too in dirt to engage tomselves -- too inert engage themselves in the politics that matters. i read a rather dark message about the state of our democracy. if you walk around the country, i think you would find that is a majority opinion. host: bill greider, our guest to

talk about woodstock. caller: thank you. i have two comments. one being, what would be the difference between the generation of the baby boomers, having been born and growing up emergence -- with regards to the actions we did covertly or not so covertly against other countries and the effect on the conscious and psyche of those young people growing up in that time compared to previous generations and that leading to the rebellious nature of woodstock participants? a second question being, as

follow-up to that, i graduated from the class of 1999. i wanted to go to the woodstock in 1999. obviously a different experience. i was unable to go. drastically different compared to the original. i wanted to know if you have any comments on that. aller.thanks, color -- c guest: let me give you my butliar -- not peculiar, dwindling perspective. i was a child of world war ii. i was six years old, i think, when the war started, and it was resolved in four years, and we won. this puzzles people. but as a small boy, nobody in our family got killed. experience.rious i think that people my age would say something similar. it was overwhelming moments for the country, not just the

winning, but the solidarity the country automatically felt and pressed the government to do your share. there was a huge, continuing propaganda campaign to teach .hat solidarity at school, they gave us books and you could buy a stamp and put it in your savings bond. it was trivial in terms of covering the debt the government was running up to fight the war, but psychologically, it made you a contributor to the war effort in a very drastic -- if you went to the movies on saturday and you brought a trust -- crushed tin can and contributed to the scrap drive, you got in for free. i tell those stories because for atirit lived on least a generation after world war ii, and it explains why we

had things like the g.i. bill and all kinds of social programs , some of which no longer exist, but were part of that same spirit. we are all in this together. ,'m giving you my deepest wish that out of the woodstock , they could develop similar sensibilities and then sell it to the rest of the country. that is very wishful, as you know. but it is a different take on america and patriotism and what the government is or could be than what is now our current politics. all of those ambitious ideas have shrunk to kernels, which makes me sad. sandy from spring home, florida, attended woodstock. caller: i was at woodstock. your take on it is totally different than what us then attended it was.

was basically a protest for us against the vietnam war and the way our vietnam war veterans, when they were brought .ack, how they were treated they could not get their jobs back. they weren't given good medical care. people looked at them like they were less than local citizens. of these tin can drives or any of that to help any of the veterans that were from vietnam. if you look on the streets today, three or four of the homeless people -- three out of four homeless people that are on the streets are vietnam veterans who nothing was done for them and nothing is being done for them yet. that's basically what i have to say. guest: i agree completely with everything you said. that's part of what i'm lamenting about where the country is at now.

i'm being probably too wishful. but i think that is that feeling -- one of the things they are bitter about and scornful of government about is that it seems to be dead in politics. you have described some of the reasons. there are a good many more. let's not decide who is to blame, republicans or democrats or blah, blah, blah. they're all to blame in some sense. but it is true that we have lost that sense of cohesion. we could all name a lot of events that express that. the argument seems to me to be do you think that is still in us or don't you. i'm one of those old heads who believes, yeah, americans are perfectly capable of rallying .round those same goals

i've seen this happen. in some ways, it happens in politics -- as though the politicians are afraid to say those things for fear of sounding too mushy, too sentimental. host: james up next. caller: thank you. i would like to put a different color on woodstock. my brother, herb, went to school with the two on the front of the album cover. right behind them, walking up the hill with an army coat and a cowboy hat is my oldest brother, herb. my second oldest brother, john, he was one of the mudsliders in the movie for woodstock. i was only 11 years old.

my dad was giving the final, boys, be careful down there. i had hidden in one of the can -- utility compartments in my dad's truck. i was ready to go. it got quiet. he said, where's jimmy? then the door started opening and closing. i was caught. he yelled at me to get out of there. but what i remember from woodstock the most is the music. hendrix, santana, crosby, stills, and nash, and on and on and on. sly and the family stone. the music was incredible. yes, they were protesting the vietnam war. but i also believe that it was a build up from jfk to bobby to martin. it built up. guest: i think that is right. host: that last part, it builds up?

-- it built up? guest: absolutely. and that was heartbreaking. the resignation of richard nixon, the impeachment. what felt glorious or at least promising in 1969 turned to ashes and worse within just a couple of years, and there were reasons for that. it is partly political. i think it is largely economics. the core years after world war ii that i remember so fondly ran out of gas. some badicians made decisions that made things worse, it is true. and then i think the country as a whole went for ronald reagan and his conservative government, which in some ways is still in and what i'm hoping

for in politics is an awakening. share my hopeless optimism. if you look at what young people today, talking about the so-called millennial's, who came to maturity after the turn-of-the-century, into the 21st century, and they are somewhere between 18 and 30-ish, they have very different views of where the country is and what they want to see, and it is a really interesting mix of conservative and liberal ideas. they are for big government creating jobs for people. on the other and, they want government to let it alone -- on the other hand, they want government to let it alone and let local folks decide things. i find promise in that. it is a little different from woodstock. springsteen and

some other voices that are alive .oday they are not distant from what i'm describing. quite a contrast -- contrary. woodstock change -- guest: i think it was already president. some of it with politics is not pretty. it is disgusting. federal government, after african-americans pushed it for more than a generation, finally delegitimized racial segregation. and that is still stuck in people's craw in some places in america, as we've witnessed recently, i think. i'm going to say this and it is going to make a lot of people angry. i have sympathies for barack as a as president because, political reporter, i know that, to some extent, underneath everything else, there are a lot

of americans who really resent the idea that there is a black guy in the white house. harsh, but that's what i think is going on. ,bama has made his own mistakes which i'm perfectly willing to criticize and do criticize. i thought naïvely eight years ago, six years ago, the election of a black president would dissolve a lot of that. i think that is not the case. i think the republican party, al, decidedell et we are going to try to stop this guy on everything he does. , and thisome stuff may have not been conscious, but i think they were motivated by the knowledge that a lot of their constituents really don't like the idea of a black guy in the white house.

host: bill greider is currently "the nation," formerly with "rolling stone." we've divided the numbers on the screen by age. under 30, (202) 585-3880. between 30 and 50, (202) 585-3881. 50 and over, (202) 585-3882. and if you attended woodstock, (202) 585-3883. stephanie untended. she is from los alamitos, california. caller: woodstock was just wonderful. time. just the greatest i don't think people realize that a lot of people were to music, which was the social media of the time. if you listen to the lyrics of the people who were there, you understand there was a message that brought us all together. if you build it, they will come. we all did come. it was a wonderful time.

express the hope that people had that they could change things. being of that generation and having gone through -- feeling nixon resigned, that there was a chance for an actual process in the united states, having him hard and, it was such an abdication of any kind of justice. on top of that, we have seen what i would say is very little progress in the way of social justice. from martin luther king to today , even the immigrant thing, people have just not gotten it. the 1% is the worst kind of realization of everything we feared. of theporatization media, of everything in the united states is what we feared. the fact that we still do not have available health care is what we feared. what we did do for our has -- for our society at large is

bring to the forefront the ecological movement. we were the ones to watch them land on the moon and to bring back that incredible picture of the earth. we understood it was one planet and that we had to coexist, and yet we've been involved in wars and killing people overseas who have done really nothing to us. the thing that i resent more than anything -- i do have a sense of disappointment. we had possibilities. they were not allowed to flourish. i regret so much that hasn't changed. what i hope people realize is that these are systemic problems. one president cannot solve this. we have to work together as a that wend to understand are all human beings entitled to our rights, and yet we see them abrogated every single day by so many forces. host: thank you, i appreciate it. guest: brilliant. you have brilliantly summarized

that history. i would just again at a stroke that makes it a little less dark . this consciousness is the element i associate with woodstock and the rebellions of various kinds, both african-american and immigrants and all sorts of groups. that requires people to change their own idea of themselves. that is what consciousness is about. in that sense, i can make a case that the political, the fundamental political achievements of the last 30 are driven bys, identity politics that are disparaged in washington as, well, that's interesting, the

women want more power, but that is not the heart of politics. we do the money stuff. this was right to the current moment. , race, feminism, women, their role in society, latinosrsonal identity, trying to establish new immigrants -- latinos and other new immigrants trying to establish honest and respectable , and a fewur society other groups, lesbians, gays, i could go on -- all of that, i could trace back to that era and the events surrounding woodstock. that is probably a little too meet him a because it did at, because it ne did require some courageous leaders, and some of them got

killed, but what i'm trying to convey is a very old and very corny message. i heard it from an autoworker once when i was a young reporter in tungsten -- youngstown, ohio. there were some workers there trying to get something started. don't know, working for gm, i guess, a black man. he said, what the people don't understand is that the power is in their hands. and if they would just believe that, we could do something in that room where we are having this meeting. and i thought, yeah. it is not that simple, of course, but it is almost that simple. and it is within people. but it's not that simple. people are able to enlarge their ambitions for the country and themselves. thatis the politics

matters and to me that's the politics i associate with the hippies and all of the characters of that woodstock nation airs frank from florida. caller: it's a pleasure talking to you. i read your articles in rolling stone and i read at least one of your books in the past. what i wanted to ask you about -- i will get on different track about woodstock -- the two concerts that followed woodstock, one was all to monson iniforniaa --ltamont california and another which was more important was one in newport, rhode island which was the newport jazz festival in the early 1970's which got rated by a bunch of long-haired ists who ended up breaking up the festival. the us is the darker side but i asd to see some of the stuff

a dark scenario. have anknow why people tolerance toward jazz music. some of them want " their music" to be played. at that time, the newport festival was also hitting attacked by people on the uptight right in the area but did not want these outdoor festivals in the area anymore. then they get hammered from people who are more on the anarchist left who wanted some of their music to be played and it ended up destroying it for everyone else. especiallyaltamont - i know the attacks on newport when i grew up on jazz myself before rock 'n roll. altamont was dark and it was a

kind of warning bell of its own kind. there is some ugly stuff within us and sometimes, if people are careful, it will hit us in the face. host: for those who attended woodstock,, john from mount sinai, new york. former a couple of callers have stole my thunder but i'm glad to see bill greider on c-span. i was at woodstock and i was pictured on the cover of the "daily news" that sunday in a sea of mud. woodstock was definitely about the music. there is very little political backdrop to it at that point. stage andman got on he was literally clubbed by pete

townsend of the who for bearing -- for bringing up politics. the songs that had political content like country joe and the fish, it was a celebration. those three days, we put the vietnam war out of our minds. we were definitely antiwar. area,st in the new york baby boomers. i was at a festival one year later that reflected altamont where the promoters hired motorcycle gangs and security. at woodstock, there was no security maybe because of andaivete of the promoters the problem at woodstock as they had no sanitary facilities because it was overwhelmed and there was no water facilities. woodstock went out without a hitch. there was no sense of imposing a

security force but governor rockefeller had deployed a regiment of national guard that was stationed over the hill. if anything did go wrong, he was going to send them in. i don't know if that's true but i have heard that. host: woodstock was relatively peaceful? caller: absolutely peaceful. there was no presence of security that would give anybody any gruff. guest: i think that's right. the spirit was the music and the music was the spirit. it fits with what other people that you diding not have to give speeches about the agenda. it was shared by the woodstock driven by some of those events i have talked about. they did not have to interrupt the joy of the music.

they were in everybody's consciousness. host: this is from twitter -- there are parallels. it was a rebuke to authority and thats also an announcement the country can be different and we know this shock you. we get a kind of joy out of shocking you. i'm talking about hippies here. and just getusic over your fears and so forth. i think it is genuinely a disappointment of that hardly by the manipulation of voices, it became characterized as these

noisy kids who were spoiled and who wanted everything their way and are messing up our placid and smooth running society. young people the are entirely to blame for that but they contributed some good material for disappointed old people. , at that time,ss were not really included in that dialogue and neither were older people. failing that i think was the politicians who picked up on said these crazies in the mud don't vote anyway so let's play to the people who are resentful. as it happened and the developed, it became clear and 10 or 20 years after the war in rock 'nwas gone, that roll was the working class and still is.

shame -- because values,otism and other theseetnam war created splits which political forces could manipulate and exploit and, to some extent, they are still there. economic events in the last few years have wiped a lot of that away. host: john attended woodstock from fairfax station, virginia. caller: good morning, i want to thank c-span for giving me the opportunity to talk to mr. greider for whom i have a lot of respect as a writer having read his articles in "rolling stone." woodstock and i was in church sunday after woodstock. the priest asked the same question -- who was at woodstock and what to use he as a

sociological significance of woodstock? time, i thought it was just three days of good music and fun and a wonderful time. now i realize that we were in a bubble. we thought as soon as we got older and had influence and power, we would end racism and unnecessary wars and solve these problems that were plaguing us. see thatpect, i now was hugely optimistic. i did not realize there were so many different views across the u.s. that would oppose the directions we probably all 500,000 of us shared their. joan baez was there and there was some antiwar but it was largely just viewed as a real good time for people who share common beliefs. thank you. guest: that's very good.

let me ask you, where do you think things are today? you know i am a bleeding heart optimist and i try to find the good side. if you talk about ronald reagan, you show me a room full of my newer he will say where is the pony. .hat's where i am o caller: i'm not quite as optimistic as you. if the sea things like ferguson and when the iraq war came around, nobody questioned it, we just jumped in. the lessons that i thought would develop over time just did not develop. i'm not quite as optimistic perhaps as you but i'm not a complete pessimist either. from palm desert, california. 44 and i helpam very strongly that the whole

woodstock era marked the beginning of the complete breakdown in our family structure and morality. woodstock was the just and probably first social experiment far from being a protest to our government. i think it actually served to create a generation of passivity and hedonism. i live in an area where coachella is a big deal. it is filled with young people that completely don't contribute in any sort of way to our society or to our government and politics and whatnot. if anything, i feel like the baby boomers have been some of the most selfish, self-serving, and instructive parts and a huge part of why we are in the

situation we're in now. what they have brought about in this country is nothing good. i cannot have a conversation with people of that era who are informed and have a fair and balanced opinion about what's going on with our government. i feel very different about woodstock. guest: thank you. i agree with some of that. passivity is present especially in the baby boomers. i can say accurately that i am older than the baby boomers. don't blame me. i think all of us on both sides of the baby boomers correctly, let's blame them for a lot of weaknesses that exist in the society. -- thisn old-fashioned

is a lefty view of things -- but i think, of course the people are to blame and people are always to blame whether by their capacity for their stupidity or whatever. i think the big events of the last 30 years have been driven by power and i'm in corporate power, the big money, the one percent. there are lists -- there are lots of different ways of defining that. is a lefty magazine is making these very argument that people have made this morning. i am with them. and as i'm arguing roundabout way for that powered to yield to the force of organize people. that is where we are weak. it starts with individuals, not with labor unions or even reform groups and so forth,

environmental organizations. i am for all of them but it really starts in your own guts. i get a kick out of the conversations this morning because even though the number of folks don't agree with my analysis, i know they have that spirit in their guts which is enough for me. host: from cortland, new york, joseph attended woodstock. caller: how are you? i would like to say hi to c-span and mr. greider. i was there in august in 1969. the people at that time, what i hear is that they were living in somewhat of a bubble of peace. they were not dependent on so much of the welfare and the nation to help them out. they did not live day to day to abuse the system.

they were having fun and it was a good time. woodstock was a big organized group where people had so much fun. there is no problems and no trouble and i think one person died there or got hurt by the farmers tractor. by the same token, today try to do the same as what we did in 1969. it ain't going to happen. a big corporate america we call our young people held in the past. future,trol the corporate controls the future. the poor people, some are like that because they will get help from the federal government to live on. wars or't worry about iraq or iran. after two years, i went to

vietnam and i was not against vietnam or the wars. happen --ere low is will always happen and we will always have problems with political and economic problems, the future down the road. i think i'm going to argue against some of what you said. you got back to the corporate power. with the disagree fatalism of saying the corporations run everything and that's all there is to say. if you look back across the history of this country, the whole 200 + years, it has never been the situation that the people were in charge of the big agendas. that's just not the history. in fact, quite the opposite. african-americans can tell you about that in detail. it is the case, however, that

there are these moments that sometimes last for a generation or sometimes more or less when the people rise up and claim their powers and assert them and they prevail. books where i expressed the sense of things, i compared it to an underground river. it flows along pretty much unseen and that river is the people and their aspirations. which don't get prime time in the political debate or they get distorted or they get manipulated, all those things are true. events every once in a while give the people the impetus and they break through to the surface and the underground river suddenly becomes the new reality. hair am really going to make you roll your eyes -- is that we are on the

brink of such a moment. me, i have not felt this way for a long, long time. that theth, i believed 60's was going to generate big changes because they had all the right impulses and that was mistaken. all of the time through the conservative era of ronald reagan, i never bought into the notion of just winning the next election and everything will go back to where we want it to be. you can believe it but it did not happen and now for the first time, i feel differently. i don't say it is a guaranteed yield but i think the potential for that underground river to assert itself is here, right now. host: let's hear from greeley, kansas, hello. caller: i think this is a very timely topic.

my wife and i just saw santana in kansas city. the first words that were addressed to the crowd from carlos santana was how he could feel the love in the crowd. he has carried on for all these years since woodstock with this message. it was an incredible performance, of course. but something else that needs to be mentioned is the elephant in the room of 1969 was the draft. we don't have a current draft and people don't get sent up to fight wars. basically, his people at woodstock, dick cheney was not there but other people were very concerned about having to fight a rich man's war. this was one way for them to stand up and say no and it was also another way for them to say look at us, here we are, what are you going to do with us, how are you going to handle this? we know what they will do now with the patriot act and people being put under surveillance and

a lot of them would never have a because they profess these positions openly. they lose their jobs and get blacklisted and get a target put on them and it's a whole different system and society that we live under now to where i don't think woodstock could even occur now. even on private property. in ferguson, people had a piece vigil on private property. that just like the occupied movement, i don't think they would be given a stage the way we willingly gave them the stage in 1969. host: guest that's good. host: do you think that could occur today? describedo but he has one of the crucial to the points - pivot points.

nixon understood that and turned the switch that basically stopped the draft. there were complications on how he did that but basically, he knew that and i think that is a major, major withdrawal of the cohesive patriotism that americans have always felt. now we have these armchair warriors like dick cheney who sit in their offices and spew out propaganda with no threat to them or their families. they know their kids are not going to war. that has distorted and enormously. i have been among those -- i'm not for bringing back the draft because the draft feeds the bodies into the rich man's war machine to use your images. but there are ways to deal with war so that if we are go to

-- you will have to obey the constitution -- but once the decision is made, there are multiple ways in which the burden can be shared universally and taxes is one of them. there is a lot of work to do in this country. you can do it with rather low dy of arkers if everybo certain age were quality has to do their turn. many other countries have a system like that. i have never been enthusiastic and you can think of the ways politicians might abuse that but you have hit on a really important point. i obviously don't have complete answers either. more unpleasant thought -- i think we are in a really dangerous phase right now and it's not barack obama's fault

but his history telling us -- you better back out of this illusion that you are the world's policeman and you have to go everywhere with your guns and restore order in the world. we are seeing what that leads to. we got three or four of those things going now. we have to make a transition out of that. that is hard to do. one of the reasons is as you make the shift, the question -- ifrise again and again we did not need to fight all those wars, that means these kids who died in iraq and afghanistan and vietnam or wounded severely died for nothing. us, all of us.of that is why it is so hard for

the country to get back to its senses. is notablishment clearly going to lead to that. it's got to come -- this is a word to say for the veterans but people in service -- i have been running this for years and i have to admit that none of my left-wing readers picked up on it -- the military actually has qualities that are distinctive in this society. they are a model for what we could work on to restore our patriotic solidarity. commitment in uniform up and down. they say we take orders and we do what the system says we got a do whether we like it or not. but the system owes us. we are seeing this play out now.

the politicians have made some choices reticulated republicans supporting the iraq war and the democrats. they made some cheap commitments. now they've got thousands of kids with their legs blown off or their mind screwed up i wore -- screwed up by war. host: we have to leave it there. thanks so much for being with us. coming up, it's our regular america by the numbers installment. two guests are joining us to talk about caring for an 80 or -- an aging population and we will have that conversation after this. ♪ ♪ ♪

♪ >> here is a great read to at your summer reading list -- the latest c-span book, collection of stories from some of the nation's most influential people over the last 25 years. >> there is a risk in the bohemian lifestyle. andi decided to take it whether it's an illusion or not, i don't think it is, it helped my concentration. it stopped me being bored and stopped other people being boring to some extent. andould keep me awake prolonged the conversation. if i was asked what i would do it again, the answer is probably

yes. i would hope to get away with the whole thing. but noty for me to say nice for my children to hear. it sounds irresponsible. is, i did know, everyone knows. >> the soviet union and soviet system in eastern europe contains the seeds of its own destruction. many of the problems we saw at the end began at the very beginning. i spoke already about the attempt to control all institutions and control all parts of the economy and political life and social life. when you do that and try to you createrything, opposition and potential dissidents everywhere. beutel are all artists they have to pay the same when one artist , you have just made him into a political dissident. >> if you want to subsidize

housing in this country and we want to talk about it and the populace agrees that it is something we should subsidize, then put it on the ballot sheet -- on the balance sheet and make it clear and evident. make everybody aware of how much it is costing. when you deliver it through these third-party enterprises, fannie mae and freddie mac and you deliver the subsidy through a public company with private shareholders and executives who can extract a lot of that subsidy for themselves, that is not a very good way of subsidizing homeownership. >> christopher hitchens, and applebaum, and gretchen mortenson are a few of the engaging stories in "sundays at eight." "> "washington journal continues. host: it's our regular america by the number segment which we do on fridays. we are taking a look at an aging

nation and the future of baby boomers. froma result of new data the census department and here are two guests to talk about it. is with us asn well as richard johnson. welcome to both of you. one of the things i found from the findings is that the older population is projected to nearly double, going from 43 to over 802012 million in 2015. what does that mean for the u.s.? guest: we are projecting the older population will double and that we look at 2012-2030, as we see the baby boomers aging, they 2011, therning 65 in proportion of our population will shift in the older ages.

one in five americans by 2030 will be 65 and over. host: as far as how we prepare for it as a nation, what does that mean for us? guest: there is many potential policy and implications. i think richard can elaborate more. host: are we ready for that? crisisno, it's not the that some people say will be but it's a challenge. it will affect all dimensions of society. there will be changes in the workplace. we will see more people working. the workforce will be much older in 2030 than it is today and it will have impacts on government outlays and we will spend more in social security and medicare and medicaid than we do today. medicaid covers long-term care costs. will be more important that communities have features in place to allow people to age in place. easilyl have more accessible transportation and changes to housing so people can stay in their homes and not have

to go into nursing homes as they become frail. we will see changes in government outlays but also in government revenues. as more people retire, we have more people out of the workforce and we will have lower income tax revenues or payroll taxes. there will be a lot of impacts. the grosss not only population getting older but the makeup. this is one of your findings -- what does that mean? guest: we see the nation as a whole is getting more diverse over time in terms of the total population. we are projecting that the total population will become a majority-minority by 20 30. minority share will have 50% of the population. minority is all groups other

than white alone. we see an increase in the proportion of the population in a minority group. 50%,hat we see across that the older population is not quite as diverse but we see an increase in diversity for the older population as well. 39% of our older population is projected to be a minority by 2050. that is compared to 21% of the older population being a minority in 2012. host: what about men and women, what is the makeup as they get older? guest: it has been a long-term demographic trends. we see more women than men because they tend to outnumber men in the older population. we see lifeections, expectancy will continue to be a little bit longer than what we see now. as we see gains in life expectancy from earth and life expectancy at age 65, we see the share of the population in the older ages is projected to shift a little bit.

we womenof man are outnumbered men, we see that will not be as much the case in the future. host: when you look at factors like how many men and women will be part of the older society, minorities as part of that, are there special considerations for the united states to factor in? of the lifearrowing expectancy gap between men and women and the fact that men are starting to catch up to women a little bit in terms of life expectancy is good news for women. what we see today is a lot of women are widowed. we project the number of widows will climb dramatically over the next 20 or 30 years. widowed, theirme economic resources tend to shrink. widows and the fourth women have high rates of poverty at older ages so that's a good sign. one of the other things that is important with the older population is that in the

future, the older population will be better educated than they are today. help both their financial well-being and perhaps their health status. host: if you have questions about the aging population and you want to give us a call, we have divided the lines by age groups -- ultimately, this tells us people are living longer? guest: that is a lot of what is driving this. number of births between 1946-1964 is what's causing this shift to happened so rapidly. overall it has been driven by the fact that people are living longer. some people call it an aging crisis. it is good news that we are living much longer. host: anything to add as far as

the living longer part? guest: that is another finding that people are living longer which means the composition of the older population is projected to shift. i have a graphic if you want to show, looking at the distribution of the older population by age group. we are seeing about six -- 56% of the population 65 and older. and 74.en 65 the proportion and the younger segment of the older population is going down from 56% to 45%. we are seeing increases particularly in the proportion of the older population in the oldest categories. it is not just aging population but with people living longer, we will see even older old people living in the population. host: you look at the numbers that way and talk about quality of life being considered. guest: that's right and the fact that the older population is growing so rapidly, it creates challenges.

if we are just looking at people say maybe we can mitigate the problems created by an aging population, people could work longer, that does of people'sn terms well-being in retirement of people's ability to work a little bit longer and they will accumulate more retirement resources. or 90, it's unrealistic to think those people can continue working. is ate see at those ages 85, that's when the long-term care needs star to hit and people start moving into nursing homes. the good news is, nursing homes residents is much less common but we see people getting more in-home services which is expensive. and themily helpers kind of burdens that an aging parent create some families can be very real. host: richard johnson of the , the first call,

peter from sterling heights, michigan. on the line for 65 and older. caller: thank you for taking my call. related to the census bureau. a couple of years ago, i received a survey from the census bureau in the mail that had a cover letter attached where they were trying to determine the future infrastructure needs of my community. i found the questionnaire to be highly objectionable, very intrusive, and the census bureau followed it up because of my refusal to answer with people coming to my door, which i refused to talk to, and countless number of phone calls. what gives the government the right to go after us like this? it's worse than many telemarketing organizations. i expect an answer, thank you. guest: the census bureau feels a number of surveys -- any surveys are conducted to collect data

and provide statistics about demographic characteristics and sociocultural characteristics of the nation and the information is used by policymakers and others for the purpose of the currentg population and considering what the future population might look like. in terms of allocating resources as well across the country. if you have concerns or questions about the surveys you receive in the mail, i encourage you to contact the census bureau directly. the easiest way to do that is to go to census.gov. officesfind regional and we welcome your calls and are interested in hearing your concerns. . host: karen from rockville, maryland. caller: thank you for taking my call. i have a question for the census bureau. host: go ahead. caller: when i first tuned into the program, the branch chief

broke down the demographics for the aging population but she said something interesting -- she said the majority -- the thoughy -- it appears as there was a heavy emphasis on racial classification. this is an important topic about aging population and what it will look like. i am 32 but i am trying to figure out why does the u.s. census bureau care about racial classifications of the aging population? shouldn't the focus more or less and other-term care important things like health care that is offered to the aging population? doinge need to keep racial classifications? i feel like that takes away from the overall point and the things we need to focus on and it divides us. guest: thank you very much.

the census bureau produces estimates and projections of our population by age, sex, as well as race and origin. it's an porton to preside -- it's important to provide the data so under stand -- so people understand the shift in changes in our population. in terms of policy implications, if richard could elaborate -- race isooking at important because we see important differences in terms of economic outcomes for example and we see differences in terms of health status and differences in terms of long-term care needs. if we think that certain groups are going to have different levels of needs than other groups, i think it's important we see how the composition of the population is changing. it's not just the fact that the population is growing but it's how is it is changing. aree characteristics important for policymakers to understand so they can make the best possible decisions. host: i'm looking at it chart

showing the population of those ages 65 and over ending in 2050 and it shows the share -- the percentage of the total population. what is this chart showing us? guest: it is summing up what our recent report had been saying in terms of the aging population. what you see is the bars showing the size of the population and you can see the most market havee from 2012 where we 43 million americans age 65 and older all the way to 2030 where -- 220 30. it is being driven by the aging of the baby boomers and the older population. by 2030, the baby boomers will be safety five and older. in terms of our composition, it means that right now, 14% of our population of 65 and older and by 2030, 20% will be 65 and older, one in five americans. host: as ages go up, percentages

stay about the same. anything to add? >> we are going to see this dramatic change over the next 15-20 years. after that, it will stay at that level for a while. that is what we are seeing are the next 15, 20 years as the movement of the baby boomers in to their older years. host: i read somewhere $7,000 per day -- i read somewhere 7000 per day. guest: it might even be 12,000 per day. i have tood morning, say congratulations to c-span because they present some very important programs. i am over 65. i listen to the news and all and i find the problem is the degree in america. the rich corporations don't pay their fair share of taxes.

they have these welfare loopholes that would add to social security. we would not have this deficit projected in the future. do you understand the point? host: before you go, how prepared are you at 65 and older? do you have retirement savings? guest: i depend on my social security. host: do you have any retirement savings? caller: no, just my pension from a union. it is not much but it is social security. i would be in the shelters otherwise. host: he has social security but as far as retirement savings, none. is that a common thread? guest: that's very typical. if you look at 65 and older, half of them rely on social security for half or more of their income. 24% of them rely on social security for nearly all of their

income. social security is really important. if you look at other sources of income, it is predominantly pensions. very few people save substantially outside the pension system or outside of their employer-sponsored plan. housing is important. housing wealth can help in terms of income and security. many people do not tap into their housing wealth at all -- at older ages. they tend to stay in their homes and don't take out second mortgages so that is a potential source of resources for some people. host: and a statistical information you want to add? we do have additional statistics on the older population in terms of income occupation and educational attainment available on census.gov and we released a populationhe 65 plus that includes additional information about education and language use and characteristics.

host: you can go to the website to find that out and hear his neck enterprise, alabama, good morning. go ahead. one more time -- caller: my question was regarding the changing population. there is a question about millennial underemployment. affect them going forward? boomers were staying in the workforce longer than that is causing higher unemployment in the lower age brackets. how will that change how we view employment and how those younger replace those who are older? guest: that is a big concern. there is a lot of attention devoted to this issue.

retirees, the baby boomers are not retiring and taking jobs away from younger people. long-term, the data does not bear that out. when there is a deep recession like we just came out of when the labor market is very weak, there could be some of that displacement going on. longer-term, there is not. peopleue is what about who have been hit hard by the recession. is concerned that if they were unemployed, it will take them years to really get job and theyid will never make up the earnings they lost. they might be permanently on a lower trajectory. that is a real concern. hand, we see such slow growth in the size of the traditional working age population that i think the

employment prospects for younger people and older people are going to improve dramatically. even though in the short term we have a problem with this displacement, longer-term and the fact that older people are working longer is going to be good for the economy and boost productivity and will make everyone wealthier. host: one of the charts provided shows population under 18 years and 65 years and over starting in 2010 and ending it 20 16. guest: the blue line is the size of the population under 18 in the redline is the population 65 years and older. it's interesting to compare projections of the youngest and oldest segments of our population. were 40.5 million people age 65 and over while the population under 18 was just over 74 million. in the future, we can see there is a small amount of growth projected for the population under 18. can see due to

the substantial growth of the years,opulation next few the older population is projected to nearly double by 2050 and is projected to become larger than the population under 18 and 2056. host: which means -- guest: that is the question -- i think maybe richard could speak to that. i think what is really interesting here is the ratio of older people to workers. it's the old age dependency ratio as it is called. when we have too many retirees and your workers, that is when you get it to some economic problems. what is driving social security's problems is the fact that we are getting more workers -- fewer workers and more retirees. each worker has to support more retirees. int's where the imbalances social security which is scheduled to run out of money in 2033.

host: what happens to generations x, y and so on as they get older? are there futures questionable/ baby boomers will probably have better retirement outcomes than the generations that come behind them. in 1960 andorn later, some of those people are baby boomers but they are facing the higher retirement age of six securityand social versus 67 for retirees today. that means less social security benefits for them. we have had a long time of wage stagnation. the median wage in the country has been pretty flat since 1980 for men at least. women have seen some gains and that's a good sign. for men, we have had slow growth in wages and that means that people are not able to save as much. have of the boomers still

benefit pensions but it's rare for younger folks. is for people who come after the boomers. host: santa cruz, california, hello. caller: hi, i would like to speak with mr. johnson. i'm wondering if you could --ress the issue payment is not made into social security past $110,000 on income. is if theseread people did pay into social $110,000 and continued to pay no matter what their income was, that the social security system would be solvent in perpetuity. why is that not happening? guest: thanks for your question.

it's an important point. social security is facing financial problems. right now, more money is being paid out of social security than is coming in. 2033, the trust fund is built up over the years will be depleted. when that happens, social security will only be able to pay 75% of the benefits it has promised. solutions would be to raise thepayroll tax, cap on the payroll tax. it is now $117,000. if you make more than that, it your benefits are not subject to tax. they are also not subject to benefits either. the argument has been that if we were to raise that tax, beverly is right, a lot of social

security financial problems would disappear. is if we don't give any benefits on the additional taxes. it would dump to benefits on the additional taxes, it means high income people don't yet a very good deal from social security. you might say that is not so bad. the risk is we don't want social security to become a welfare system. social security has enjoyed broad support for 75 years. that is because everyone is getting something out of it. if you could do it for almost everyone. we need to think long and hard about -- to the extent that we change the system, will it erode support in certain quarters? this proposal that beverly mentioned gets a lot of attention and part of the reason is that because the wages have become more unequal overtime and salaries have become more

unequal, it used to be the case that social security covered 90% of all earnings and today it's only about 84%. if we could get back to that 90%, that would raise the cap upwards of $200,000. it's a serious proposal. host: here is bill from north carolina. caller: good morning. am six to seven years old and i'm in and -- and i'm a retired auto worker. and it tooksion social security at 62. i still work a part time job because i need something to do. i don't have any complaints. i often wonder -- when they first instituted social security , what makes a wonder is, was the government really concerned about older people and them having some kind of income that

they figured people don't live that long and we will have money to do whatever we want? think the reason for social security in 1935 was to older ages.verty at it was a problem back then and it continues to be much less of a problem today. right.ler is bill is right in that people did not live that long in 1935. not many people were living nearly as long as today and they were not collecting as much. on the other hand, the payroll taxes were lower. even though expected benefits were lower, you are paying less into it. beial security continues to and it's about long 70 insurance and it protects you to live to 80 or 90 so that you're not going to run out of money before you die. that is really what it is for.

it continue to do that and that's why it's important. comparedr organization aging population not only for the states but other countries and provided the chart. what are we looking at and why is it important? guest: aging is not something that just the united states is facing. aging is an issue that is happening in countries around the world. we look at this graphic, what we are showing is the percentage of the world in certain selected countries and the percent of their populations that are 65 and older in 2012 and on the right, the projected percent for 2050. overall, the world is projected to grow older. right now, a percent of the population of 65 and older and that is projected to increase to 17% by 2050. pulled the belt countries for comparison and right now, the united states is one of the youngest.

about 14% of our population is 65 and older. we are falling in the range of russia and ukraine and canada. as a look at the top, you can see japan, germany, and italy is where talk more than 20% of their population is 65 and older. that's where we project the u.s. to get to by 2030. the u.s. does remain of the countries we show here on the youngest developed countries. there are countries like japan and germany and italy and spain which are companies were 30% or more, more than 1/3 of their population is projected to be 65 and older. we are still going to remain one of the youngest developed countries in the world. host: as far as how these other countries handle their aging populations, can you talk about how they take care of them? it is a growing problem in europe as these numbers indicate.

many of these countries are older than the u.s. they are starting to have to now , many european countries are shifting the way they provide retirement benefits. what we see in germany in particular is an increase in the retirement age so you cannot start collecting until 67. but is about to go into effect in germany. a lot of the european countries are reacting to this aging by forcing people to work longer. host: from white plains, new york, this is dan. caller: i would like to thank c-span for this opportunity. my question is for jennifer. what is my legal responsibility to answer the census? how far will the law go to reef -- to enforce the response from me to the census? not get census, i could to answer it and i had an agent show up at my house three or

four times in the evening, during the day, wanting 20 minutes or half an hour of my time. after i told him i don't have time for this -- i am self-employed -- i get a letter from her supervisor saying how good of an agent she was and that i should respond to her. the census forms are mandatory and everyone is required to fill them out and send them back as well as you get an american survey form. the surveys provide us with very important information. the census bureau collects the data and provides it to the public as important for policymakers and turn of planning and allocating resources. it's important to make informed on thens based composition and characteristics of our population in knowing what those are. host: now that we have this

snapshot, what is next as far as your analysis? is there another survey similar in the near future? guest: in terms of projections, we produce our projections at the national level every two years. we will have a new series coming out in we hope december. we will continue to develop and analyze trends in fertility and international migration and update our projection to provide the most up-to-date information we can in terms of what the population might look like in the future. anticipate the aging of the population is something we will continue to see. there might be more additional details and clarity. host: was there anything of this report that startled you were surprised you? focus on really did the youngest and oldest segment in this report. aging is a trend we have seen for some time. but ias not surprising think seeing that shift for the younger ages are protected to be

slightly lower than our older population, that was a finding that was interesting. host: jennifer ortman with the senses bureau and richard johnson with the urban institute. thank you to both of you. that is it for our program today. another addition of "washington journal" comes your way tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m., see you then. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] ♪ >> the asian american journalists association is hosting its annual convention here in washington this week. coming up this morning at 11:00 eastern, we will take you there live