this country have full access to contraception. we need to make sure we stand up and respect the first amendment and there is an issue of freedom of speech there. that is why it is important we stand for women and ensure they have access to contraception. >> i would just step in and say what congressman daines just said in mentioning the first amendment is he is reminding us he supports the hobby lobby decision saying a corporation can make my health care decisions for me and as a woman senator, i absolutely disagree with that. >> next question is sanjay. >> representative curtis, you said you support the jobs coming from the coal industry and the development of the keystone xl pipeline. on the other hand, many of your supporters also have serious concerns about climate change

and global warming, which they say is caused by fossil fuel burning. are we going to have it both ways? saying to the environmental community that you are concerned about global warming? >> you asked a lot of questions. coal is an important part of the economy and i support the good jobs it produces. as far as the climate change part of that, i stepped up to the plate saying i am willing to work with both sides of the aisle and anyone who is willing to have the conversations about how we support all sectors of the economy and not just the largest corporation and wealthiest individuals. part of that is creating a long term plan for shifting to greener technologies, renewables like wind and solar. >> congressman daines? >> i support building the keystone xl pipeline. it took the canadian government

6 months to approve the pipeline. it has taken the president seven years. this president needs to stand with the people of montana who want the keystone xl pipeline built. we passed a bill in the house that approved the keystone pipeline. the united states senate refuse to today get up for a vote. on the issue of coal, 5,000 jobs and $125 million of revenue that supports schools, teachers, infrastructure and low-cost electricity. 51% of montana's electricity comes from coal that this president and the epa are declaring war on coal. a war on coal is a war on the people of montana and that is what the president is waging on the national resources in montana. >> amanda? >> congressman daines spent much of his time in the private sector building up jobs in china and he spent much of his time in

congress and sent advising corporations to ship their profits and our jobs to china. so it is no surprise he would fight hard to ship our oil and refinery jobs to china. we should be demanding the high-paying permanent jobs that , will come from building the infrastructure to refine it here. >> i am a bit confused about my opponents oppos's positioned -- my opponent's position. my opponent was against the keystone xl pipeline originally and now supports if it is made here. there is a law that prohibits the export of crude. all of the keystone oil is going to be refined in the united states. that was signed in 1975. so i am not sure why she but the condition on the keystone xl pipeline. it will all be refined here. we cannot export crude because of the law. >> if i can defend myself. my dad is a laborer and they

depend on temporary jobs like the keystone xl pipeline to feed, clothe, and insure their kids, so i understand better than anyone how important those temporary jobs are. >> you are watching the u.s. senate debate on the montana television debate. we will be back in one minute. >> welcome back to campaign 2014, the senate debate on mtn and montana pbs. we welcome you back to msu billings hall for tonight's u.s. senate debates between democrat amanda curtis and republicans steve daines. we are live with yellowstone public radio and c-span2. i will ask about your ads. amanda, we finally saw one of

your ads saying we need one of us in the senate. i have talked to people that say we need people a lot smarter than us. [laughter] are you suggesting we need to dumb down the senate or maybe you have explaining to do? >> that is such an interesting perspective. thank you for that. when our founding fathers wrote our founding documents they did not ever intend for corporations to be running the show here. they intended for teachers, e electricians, and plumbers to be doing the process. maybe people don't think they are smart enough or have the right background and the reason i stepped up to the plate is to

prove you don't have to be a silver spoon, career politician to represent working families and that the best person to represent workers in this state is one of us. >> getting to your experience, amanda, do you think you have the experience to represent the senate with one year in the house of representatives and your background as a high school teacher? >> absolutely. i am sure most folks have read about my background of growing up in poverty here in billings and the adversity i experienced. most people know i dedicated by life to education because it is the pathway of overcoming the adversity i experienced. the experiences i had in a working class family in the state of montana absolutely make be the best person to be our first in the united states senate.

>> congressman daines. >> i agree we need more men and women who have real world experiences and taking the skills learned in the private sector out of washington to help lead the country. mom and dad group in billing and in billings, and my grandmother lived on the same home for 45 years until she passed away a couple months ago. i started growing up seeing mom and dad start their own construction businesses, i worked over the summer and i think we need people who have experience growing jobs and businesses. we talk about jobs, but i am the only candidate on the stage who has been out there and created hundreds of high paying jobs in montana.

>> quick rebuttal. >> i have to apologize to all of the teachers out there because we know teachers are also very important job creators in our state and country. >> steve, i have a question about your ads. one of them talks about the balanced budget accountability act, but the fact is ever since introduced it has been sitting in committee but the ad makes it sound like everything is cool and we balanced the budget and congress won't get paid unless the budget is balanced. >> there is the problem in washington. when i talk about that idea with montana they loved the idea. let's not pay congress to get the budget balanced. you go back to washington, d.c. and that is how broken it is. members of congress don't want to get on board with that idea because that holds them accountable. but i think we have to reform the entire system we need an amendment that require as balanced budget.

in montana we balance the budget every legislative session because there is a requirement to balance the budget. they cannot leave home without it. 49 states have that requirement. but washington, d.c. doesn't. so that is the battle we face in that culture in washington. these career-politicians have been there too long and we need to change the house and senate by electing more men and women. >> isn't that bill just symbolic? there is really no teeth in it and in fact congress still gets paid if it passes because it only reduces a portion of the salary. so the ad is false in that respect. >> no, it would impact the current and future congress. that is why we have resistance from members of congress. we had discussions and they said that might mean i don't get paid. that is exactly the reason i in introduced that bill.

because if congress refuses to balance the budget they will not get paid. we need to hit members of congress in their pocket books because they are hitting us in their pocket book. >> amanda, a quick rebuttal. >> i don't know if you are familiar with the average earnings in congress, but i can guarantee you not a single one of them is worried about loosing their salary. and if all of congressman daines' ads were telling the truth i would not have to be standing in front of you. >> jackie yamanaka. >> congressman daines, i am asking for specific solutions to keep the health care program for senior citizens fiscally sol

solvent. >> we need to engage in an adult discussion on how we preserve medicare for the generations going forward. as i thought, reflected and looked at what is going on in washington, here is the problem. as soon as someone suggests a reform to save medicare for future generations immediately 30-second ads pop up and whoever suggests that idea is vilified in the political process. we have to start with two operating principles. number one, we are not going to touch the benefits of existing seniors today or those approaching retirement. but number two, we are going to have to move forward with reforms or our children and our grandchildren will not receive this important safety net. it will be gone in their generation. the trustees project it will run out in 2033. we don't have a lot of time. but it will require a bipartisan agreement between republicans and democrats sitting down and

agreeing that we are going to get this down. there was a tent for that. starting to shoot straight and got caught in the politics of washington and it died. >> amanda, your rebuttal. >> i will absolutely support the medicare protection act that protects the age. one where that we can help keep medicare solvent is by cutting down on improper payments and keep the solvent down. we need to support programs that keep montanans in their homes and communities. i will point to congressman daines' voting record. he voted to turn medicare into a voucher system that would cost montana seniors up to 50% more in their premiums. >> congressman daines? >> that is inaccurate -- i never voted for a voucher system. but i just introduced a bill about six weeks ago that looks at one of the problems in washington. the affordable care act is going

to impose a hardship on those businesses that provide in-home health care for medicare patients. my grandmother had that here in billings. when she was in her early 90's she preferred to stay in her home and have someone come to her home and care for her instead of being in an institution and assisted living. it was better for her and more cost effective. and the affordable care act is placing a burden, and the bill i introduced asked for a two-year reprieve on that. but here is another consequence of the affordable care act. >> amanda?

>> i would just like to remind everyone that congressman daines has a clear voting record that can not be ignored. he has a 10% rating with different senior organizations and i will support the older americans act that provides services like meals on wheels and the montana aging services that keep seniors in their home and in their communities. >> next question to mike. >> representative curtis, youive received an f-rating from the nra. if i am a gun owner and care about gun rights why should i vote for you? >> i am a staunch sporter of my second amendment right. my husband and i were out shooting the browning 12 gauge light that his grandfather who passed away left us. this is just another example of the other side not being able to talk about the issues we have outlined so they turn to making me look like something that i am not. >> congressman daines? >> i have been a lifelong member of the nra, and i grew up

accessing and hunting and fishing on public land, and enjoying shooting sports. i killed my first antelope with my grandfather and have great memories. but the second amendment is not about hunting. it is about freedom. it is about liberty. i received an a-plus rating from the nra. it is the highest score ever given in montana. my opponent received the lowest score every given in the state of montana. i think it represents her extreme views on this issue. >> amanda? >> the nra started out as a wonderful, educational group about gun safety and gun ownership has become another lobbying group for special interest and montanans should be more worried about accessing their public land and as long as we talk about accessing our

public land so we can use our firearm and talking about voting records let me just point out that congressman daines has the lowest rating on conversation of any congress of man to represent the state otat 4%. >> next question for sanjay. >> congressman daines, you called to a montana-made solution as to how we manage the national forest and restore or ailing timber industy. a bill has been pushed that mandates levels in three national forest. why not go for with an agreement that could get timber flowing and work forward to expand it to around the country as you said you would like to do.

>> we had 30 active saw mills growing up and now we are down to only 11. it isn't because of the housing industry. our current utilization of our timber product in miami -- in montana is 65% because they cannot get enough timber. so what john put together with his bill was a good start but it affected three national forest and hasn't gotten to the senate floor. we passed a bill in the house to restore healthy forests and communities and it will create thousands of timber jobs and it will be there in perpetuity. the bill john had sets in 15 years. so it is a good start. but we have to pass the house with bipartisan support. we have a bill moving forward

and have a chance to pass a bill that deals with timber reform and bring back the timber industy. -- industry . remember the libby loggers? i had dinner one night with a couple of them and they said you know how to describe lincoln county? poverty with a view. we need to change that. >> amanda, your response. >> when i was in the montana legislature, i saw hundreds of montanans show up and stay late into the night waiting to testify in favor of the forest jobs and recreational act. that bill was written by montana montanans and for montanans. and he took the made solution -- he completely forsook that

montana solution and favored a washington bill. he wanted to sell our public land to out of state developers. >> congressman daines? >> that last statement was false. we pushed to study all of the federal assets. for example, there is a federal building in washington, d.c. worth over a hundred million dollars that have been vacant for 12 years. it might make sense to sell that building. but we will not allow the sale of public land here. and i will fight for that. there is two billon acres of montana land that is not accessible and the bill i co-sponsored said we need to get to those two million acres so montanans have better access to

their public land. >> quick follow-up? >> sure. the bill he talked about was political grandstanding and i know that because he went back and turned around and voted against funding for access to public lands. and how many more timber jobs will we have once they are done clear cutting the forest. it is not a sustainable solution for timber management >> next question goes to jackie. >> representative curtis, immigration is raising serious concern about our national security, our economy, and now our public health. what do you think should be done to give america greater control over who enters the country while also satisfying the needs of the workforce for labor? >> i have a biology degree and i have spent hours working in biological labs and i absolutely trust the best doctors in the world. those who are working for the centers for disease control and the national institute of health. it is important to fund the

agencies that are responsible for protecting our country from biological threats. congressman daines voted for a shutdown that cost those agencies millions of dollars and made it harder for those specialist to do their jobs. he voted against ending the sequestration that would have restored funding to the cdc and national institute of health. >> congressman daines? >> the question is on border security. we need to secure our borders. representative poe from texas was along the rio grande talking to the brave men and women in the border patrol. he said from january 1 up until around early july the border patrol had arrested people from 144 different countries

including three ukraine ians the prior week. we must secure the border for isis threats and ebola threats and to maintain the security. >> i will support responsible immigration reform and both sides of the aisle have worked together and put forth the bills that would increase the number of worker visas so unskilled labors up to workers with master degrees in s.t.e.m. areas will be able to stay and work in the country and have a reasonable pathway to citizenship. that is the kind of working together that the i will represent as your next united states senator.

>> mike dennison? >> congressman daines, you have been talking about jump starting the economy and creating more jobs in montana. most of things you talked about were in clearing the decks for business, making it easier to less regulation and lower taxes, how is this not just warmed over trickle down economics? if i am mischaracterizing that tell me. how have you shown you will help the middle class? >> one is moving forward with an energy security strategy. one of the greatest challenges for the middle class and getting a high paying job but also high energy prices. we need to approve thekeystone xl pipeline. i was at an electric co-op in glascow and they told me if the keystone xl pipeline is approved

those few thousand montana co-op customers will see no rate increase for the next 10 years. if it isn't approved they will see a 40% increase. and that is because they securing the pump. that is how you help the people living month to month. we do that by creating jobs and making sure energy prices are low. why are gas prices dropping in the country? which is a big help to the middle class. because the saudi arabians see the united states is going to be the leading oil producer in the world surpassing russia and saudi arabia in oil production. and that is not because of obama that is in spite of obama. >> amanda curtis? >> you know, middle class

montana, ask yourself are you better off in the last two years you had congressman daines? we sent more of the same to washington, d.c. to vote for millionaires and billionaires and just heard it yourself. i rolled out a plan that emphasis small businesses as the backbone in the state and emphasizes agriculture, which is hampered at every part of the process by the corporate side. i will work with both side of the aisle to come up with solutions that work for all sectors of the economy. not just the biggest corporation corporations and the wealthiest individuals. >> rebuttal congressman daines? >> you take a trip out to the hundreds of people that depend on coal. the crow indian reservation has a 50% unemployment rate and without the development of coal resources their unemployment

rate would be 80% to 90%. how do you help the hard working taxpayers? you help them by making sure they have a job. that is county commissioners across montana support the timber bill. we get good, high paying jobs in our natural resources industy here in montana. timber, oil, natural gas, coal, hydro, and all of it. but we need to make sure we continue to support and expand our coal production in montana. >> amanda, quick rebuttal. >> i will support the indian coal tax credit and understand how important energy is to our economy. i have actually spoken with the workers in the yellowstone county refineries who are very concerned their refining jobs are going to be shipped down that pipeline. >> just a couple minutes to go and i will take the last question. here on the campus of msu billings.

and they had a poll out today that showed in this race 20-25 25% of the people have not yet made up their mind. so give us your pitch, amanda, for these people sitting on the fence. they might determine who wins this. >> medicare and social security need to be preserved and who is going to do that? one of us. someone that understand these programs are programs that workers in montana have paid into for decades and should be able to retire without worrying where their groceries or health care is going to come from. our access to public land needs to be preserved and who is going to do that? one of us. someone who understand that montanans are not able to take a

vacation without that access to our public lands. certainly not a congressman who voted to sell off land and the congressman who received the most amount of money from citizens united who think that corporations are people and money is speech. montanans disagree with that. steve that ttal, -- quick rebuttal, steve. >> montanans want to see someone who has the experience growing jobs up and has an a-plus rating from the nra. unlike my opponents, who has a f rating from the nra. a lot of montanans vote with their guns and that is an important issue. it shows the extreme positions my opponent has taken particularly relating to the second amendment. i stand for more jobs. when it someone who will stand

up for montana and who will stand up to obama. >> we have to go to our closing statement and you have the first. didn't didn't want you to use up your good information. >> i want to thank the moderators and the people of montana for giving me the privilege of serving as your congressman for the past two years. i love our state and it is an honor to serve as a congressman. i saw my mom and dad start up a home construction business, got a degree in engineering, and worked for 28 years creating good, high paying jobs. perhaps that engineering background allows me to take a look at a problem and find a solution. that is why in my first year of congress, i was ranked as the number one most effective member

of congress of 75. we were ranked number one because we moved legislation through and got things passed. we want more high paying jobs and less government. you know, we need washington, d.c. to look more like montana. we don't want montana to look more like washington, d.c. several months ago, i was at the yellowstone county fair and ran into a cowboy from eastern montana. he had leather hands and was over 90 years old and had hunched back and a cowboy hat on. he said steve, i fought in world war ii in europe. i fought for my country but frogrew up in eastern montana and i am glad to be here all my life. and he said with tears in his eyes i have never been so afraid for my country. we need a new washington and a new president and i will stand