>> is the criticism not a little unfair that most major corporations do outsourcing of some fashion? >> i think it is very clear when you read the deposition that david spent a career, you lived countries,fferent listed 16 countries where you created jobs. you were not talking -- you were talking about creating jobs in india and pakistan and mexico. as you say, that is a part of the american free enterprise system. absolutely. i just don't think it is a criteria people are looking for when they are electing a senator to washington. >> christina? mr. perdue brought up former new york city mayor michael bloomberg, a prominent gun-control advocate who has given to group supporting your

campaign. would you support senator feinstein's most recent version of an assault weapons ban? >> i believe, and we talk about this throughout the campaign, in the second amendment. i believe every law-abiding citizen should have access to guns. i have parents and grandparents and now a son who are hunters and gunowners. but i do believe in common sense measures as put forward by folks like senator manchin and senator toomey, bipartisan legislation that would put forward universal background checks to ensure that criminals, terrorists, and the mentally unstable do not have access to guns. i do not support any other form of legislation around guns right now. , one attack has to do with the notion that you want to get rid of the department of education. do you? 86, and my mom

and dad were schoolteachers. by -- my philosophy is this. one of my first jobs was teaching kids to read. the problem we have is we put billions of dollars in federal funding, and the results of gotten much worse. one out of three kids are not getting out of high school. 14-year-olds are in the middle of the pack in terms of math and science. by any measure, are federally controlled education system is not helping. it is getting in the way of good teachers with compliance requirements. i have said all along, the best decisions for education are made locally between parents, teachers, and local administrators. my mother taught me, the best decisions are made at the local level, in that is what i will go to washington to fight for. >> so get rid of the department? >> i never said get rid of the department. look at it like a business. we are not getting results out

of those teachers. instead of sequestration, what i want to look at is, what are we not getting in terms of results and where would that money be better spent? it would be much better spent at the local level, giving parents control of their children's education. >> women are key to the education -- the election. m to suggestem t ms. nunn' direction. the pillowtex commercials, or the dollar general manager who says she was not treated fairly because she was a woman. talk to those women, and women who may have been persuaded, mr. perdue. >> pillowtex has been in bankruptcy for years. it is a tragedy of national proportions. it was created by the federal government. it is a tragedy. those are the best workers i ever worked with, and yet because of bad government policy

, entire industries, apparel, textile, electronics, furniture, have been decimated. that's what i'm trying to bring into the dialogue in this entire race. i believe the way out of this is to get our economy growing again. it seems to me that if you look at dollar general as an example, there was no wrongdoing. that complaint was settled five years after. she knows that. 70,000 employees. but ask her about her employment termination complaints that she will not disclose to the public. all my record is public. she will not disclose. say womenn, your ads cannot trust david perdue -- >> so first of all, i think these women featured in the ads are employees that work for you,

so they are telling their own experience in their own words. and 2000 women, that seems like quite a lot to me, who say that they were discriminated against. federal investigators, public knowledge, found that was true. it was during your tenure. it was settled afterwards, but the suit was during your tenure. so i think that is very clear. , am happy to talk about what you try and create a equivalency. there has never been, and you know this as well, there has c findings any eo about any organization i ever ran. you.is very different from pillowtex, you say that was governmental policy. that was during george w. bush's presidency. are you saying he is responsible for your presiding over pillowtex? >> i need a response.

>> 15 seconds, please. >> she still did not answer the question, why won't she disclose the details of those complaints? >> there is nothing to disclose. and federalhe eoc investigators found nothing ever, and it is public and you know that. >> it is not public. >> it is public information if they had any findings. >> the details of the complaints are not public. this is the second time you told the voters of georgia it is public. >> it could be accessed publicly if there were any findings, and you know there was not. there is nothing to reveal. >> you are not telling us the details of that complaint. those people deserve to have this aired. >> david, trying to create a equivalency here is really a stretch. >> all right. thank you both. that is all the time we have for questions.

the candidates will now have 60 seconds for a closing statement. by random selection, michelle nunn makes the first closing statement. >> thank you. first of all, thank you very much for moderating and panelist questions and to the atlanta press club for this service you provide. amanda and david, thank you again. i look forward to meeting one more time. i got in this race to continue what i have tried to do for 26 years, to try to make a difference in people's lives by working together and solving problems, and i believe that is what we need more of an washington, a collaborative spirit looking for common ground and bipartisanship. i believe we can tackle important issues. raise the minimum wage. create an affordable pathway to college for students, and we can tackle long-term debt if we work together. so i bring a spirit of service to all georgians, and i hope you will bring with -- join with me

in working together to live out modern --a state motto values. wisdom, justice, and moderation. i ask for your vote. >> david perdue? >> during this campaign i traveled all over our great state talking to hard-working georgians and listening to their concerns. washington is broken. it has affected your lives and your family's lives. like you, i believe our country is heading in the wrong direction. i believe we have to turn that around right now. enough with dysfunction. enough with a lack of accountability. i am tired of going from one crisis to another. i want to be your voice in the senate, take your side in congress and get washington working for you and your families again. president obama wants michelle nunn to fight for him. i'm going to washington to fight

for you. i ask for your vote and your trust. >> amanda swafford, your turn. >> thank you to everyone at home taking the opportunity and time out of your evening to listen to these debates. i know politics sometimes is not the most enjoyable thing to listen to, but it is so important to get involved and be engaged. i have been called selfish or being in this race, but i am taking personal responsibility. i could be doing a lot of things this whole year instead of going tooss the state and trying embrace the true liberty ideas of individual responsibility. it is so important that we stayed engaged in the race and look at the power and responsibility of true liberty. that is where it lies, not with big government. if you are not connected to the right people and your industry does not have the right lobbyist, you are at a supreme disadvantage in this regulatory environment. i am standing up for you being

able to make your own decisions and not always look to big government to solve your problems. so i encourage you to please understand this power and responsibility is where it lies. >> thank you very much, and thanks to all three of you for being here tonight. i know i speak for everyone in the room and watching at home when i say we appreciate your willingness to serve our country. thank you for being here. that concludes our debate. we would like to remind all voters that the general election will be held tuesday, november 4 , and early voting is already underway in georgia. my thanks to the candidates and the panel of journalists as well. we would also like to thank the atlanta press club for arranging the debate. for all the debates they are hosting visit atlantapressclub .org. this'll be archived there, and will also be available on demand atgbp.org. the loudermilk-young series is made possible by a generous

nation from charles lo udermilk. thanks for joining us, and be sure to vote. [applause] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] pb originala gb production. >> more senate debates tonight at c-span. at 8:00 p.m. eastern, a debate in louisiana where democratic senator mary landrieu is running for a fourth term. she faces congressman bill cassidy and retired air force colonel rob maness. if no candidate wins a majority of votes, the two top finishers advance to a runoff.

and from portland, maine, republican senator susan cousins -- collins debates her democratic challenger. and john cornyn debates democrat david alameel. they met in dallas for their only debate. >> be part of c-span's campaign 2014 coverage. follow us on facebook and like us -- follow us on twitter and like us on facebook. to get previews from our politics team. c-span is bringing you over 100 senate, house, and governor debates, and you can share your reaction to what candidates are saying. stay engaged by following us on twitter and liking us on facebook. >> democrat al franken won the minnesota senate race by 312

votes. he is running for a second term, and polls show him beating republican challenger mike mcfadden by 10%. here is a look at tv ads in the race. rate withoting president obama loudermilk-young making -- with obama -- >> make no mistake, these policies are on the ballot. >> al franken, 97% obama. >> waiting for rain can make farming unpredictable, but waiting for congress to pass the farm bill? come on. >> i'm proud i worked with democrats and republicans to write and pass a five-year farm bill that is good for minnesota. one in every five jobs in our state is tied to agriculture. >> farmers did not know what to electedhen al franken -- was elected, but he worked his heart out for us. >> i'm proud to be working for minnesota. >> my dad, mike mcfadden, is

running for senate. he tries, but he is not good at this political stuff. problem is, he is super honest. he works hard, and he would rather help people than attack him. he does it all over minnesota, telling people about his plan. he is a good guy with a great heart, and he will give everything for minnesota. >> i am mike mcfadden, and i approve this message. >> i'm al franken, and i approve this message -- >> where do you go to avoid paying taxes? how about bermuda? that is where mike mcfadden's company benefits from a tax loophole to avoid paying taxes. his company made $11 million on a deal to help a company avoid taxes by moving to ireland. mcfadden supports tax breaks for companies that move jobs overseas. anywhere you go, mike mcfadden is not for us. >> the campaign ads in minnesota, one of the topics of

senator franken and mike mcfadden's debate over the weekend. you can see the debate in about an hour on c-span. after serving two years as mayor of denver, john hickenlooper was elected governor of colorado four years ago. he is running for reelection against former congressman beauprez. they debated on friday for an hour. >> cbs 4 and cpt 12 present the 2014 gubernatorial debate. >> thanks for joining us for this gubernatorial debate. >> i'm a political analyst. gentlemen, thank you both for being here for the final debate of this election season. >> democratic incumbent john hickenlooper is running for his second term. he ran after serving for two terms as denver mayor. he moved to colorado in 1981 as a geologist, but lost his job in the economic downturn.

in 1988, he opened his first brew pub. he is 62-year-old -- 62 years old and has one son. >> bob beauprez is a colorado native. he served as the first congressman for the seventh congressional district before running for governor in 2006. he has managed both a bank and his family's real estate. including a buffalo breeding ranch. he is 66 and has been married to his wife for 44 years. they have four children and four grandchildren. >> we want to begin on public safety. the subject of an explosive ad suggested that governor hickenlooper is partly to blame for the murder of the state prisons chief tom clements. we want to show the entire original ad. [video clip]

' >> with john hickenlooper as governor, is your family safe? >> that add prompted tom clements's widow to send a public statement to bob beauprez -- "on several occasions this year, you have attempted to use our family's tragic loss for your personal and political gain, and we respectfully ask you to please stop." you did change the line last night. why go there in the first place, and isn't it over the top to ask are coloradans safe with john , hickenlooper as governor? >> thanks to you and channel 4 for providing the forum, and thanks for the question. yes, i think public safety is a critical issue.

i think it ought to be part of any gubernatorial debate. that is exactly the question we were raising. my heart breaks for the family of tom clements and his widow. my intention was never to offend her or to politicize the event. my intention is to raise a serious question about john hickenlooper failed record of public safety. that was one crystallizing event in a whole series where he showed failure of leadership on his watch on public safety. i think that needs to be his first responsibility to protect and defend the safety of the citizens. on my watch, that will absolutely be a priority. i never intended to offend lisa. that is why we changed out the

traffic on the ad. there are plenty of other subjects to bring up. >> thank you. governor hickenlooper, your response. >> obviously tom clements was an , exemplary public servant and a close friend. his think that invoking death for political purposes is -- i'm still dumbfounded. i'm not sure how we could see that as a positive ad. we had an agreement that we would only do positive ads. obviously i look back at all he did. he came out here specifically to address the issues around people in solitary confinement and getting released directly to the general population. there were 1500 in solitary confinement when he first came.

he worked relentlessly and cut that number down to a couple people now. no one released directly to the public. the problem that was being raised has been solved. the whole thing is unfortunate and really dumbfounding. >> governor, let's talk about your record on public safety. i have watched as the democratically controlled legislature failed to pass penalties for dui and vehicular homicide while reducing penalties for drug offenses and allowing more to be released. your administration intimated a policy under which death row inmates get four hours a day of unsupervised leisure time. your opponent suggests you have done a good deal to help criminals, but little for victims. how do you respond to that? >> we will continue to work on trying to make the state safer.

the issues around sentencing and parole reform, there is a science in terms of how we look at keeping our prison save and making sure we rehabilitate prisoners so that when they are released, the goal is they can have a job, have more opportunity to create a life so they don't get in that revolving door of continuous recidivism. the truth in sentencing issue, which we have done for -- for violent criminals, we have major -- make sure at least 85% do their full terms. but often times, that four hours row or someone on death things that seem overly lenient are trying to goad people into better behavior within the prison. we do almost all of those changes through a state commission on punishment and juvenile justice.

it goes through these things and decides if this is a good idea, this is a bad idea. generally we support most of what comes through the commission. >> congressman beauprez? >> in colorado we have one of the worst rates of recidivism -- that means going back to prison -- of any state in the nation. we are on the bottom three. the governor says he has solved the problem of solitary confinement. all he did was return them back. guess what? prisoner on prisoner violence is up. our streets are not safer. 93% of sex offenders are paroled directly into our neighborhoods without receiving any therapeutic habilitation before they are turned back to our neighborhoods. that is not defending public safety and improving public safety. that is taking your eye off the ball and failing to lead.

>> thank you. let's change the subject. governor you appointed a task , force to set off contentious -- head off contentious anti-fracking ballot measures. it is a polarizing issue. the task force is made up of people on the fringes of the issue, who will have to reach a two thirds majority vote for the legislature. isn't the task force set up to fail? >> i don't think so. if you look at the failure we were looking at, to have those initiatives on the ballot. we were poised to lose tens of thousands of jobs and billions of dollars and capital investment in the state. some of them come from the oil and gas side and some are very strong advocates for local control. but the goal is to make sure all voices got heard and that they could come together, we could find compromises to find that balance. with horizontal drilling, we have exploration and production to becoming closer to people where they live. we want to make sure if there is activity close to where someone

lives, that they have -- that we are doing everything we can to mitigate that connection and provide elected officials the opportunity to talk about setbacks and make sure that we respect that private property that someone owns the it often -- who owns those mineral rights has. we forget that the person who owns those mineral rights often owned it long before the house was built appeared government -- and government shouldn't just come and take away that mineral right. this commission will be able to get to the point where electrical drilling, it can be quiet. when the well is built, we make sure that the water and air is clean and we could really guarantee that there are no harmful effects. >> thank you. congressman beauprez, you have criticized the task force and the governor's tendency toward

collaboration saying it is a , euphemism for kicking the can down the road. are you against working together? how do we get anything done? >> hardly my against collaboration trying to find the right solution. but this wasn't the right solution. this was a pity me of kicking epitome of kicking the can down the road. the reason the governor did this was a political reason. it is a solution in search of a problem. when he wanted to do is get these draconian extreme measures off the ballot so he and others didn't have to deal with them in their reelection campaigns. he was caving in and capitulating to special interest group contingencies. his favorite constituencies, i guess. i think what should have been done especially this year was to defeat these measures soundly so we could level the playing field and create some certainty in the marketplace. that is what is driving jobs out of here. jared polis has already said he

will be back and that this did not end anything. >> governor, we will give you some time for rebuttal. >> the commission, some of the most respected republicans in the state are on it. rest george, hank brown has spoken of in favor of it. i think there's a real chance to find, even though there is significant disagreement between the locals and people who see oil and gas is a crucial industry, i think they could find a collaborative place in the middle and mitigate that. >> he did not take my running mate or any other county commissioner from an energy producing county. who he picked was a lady from durango who is a member of environmental extremist group that want to ban drilling in colorado.

we ought to be celebrating the fact that never in human history have we been able to harvest our natural resources safer and more efficiently and cleaner than we can right now. that is something to celebrate. not to punish. create jobs in colorado and embrace opportunities and achieve that objective that we have all talked about of energy independence for north america and the united states. >> my turn to get in on the fun, gentlemen. if the governor of another state was contemplating legalizing recreational marijuana and contacted you, what advice would you give? congressman, you go first. >> i would advise them to be cautious. governors have asked me that question. i think we are in a learning phase in colorado. colorado supported amendment 64 by a significant majority. to -- whened my hand

i raise my hand to enforce the laws of colorado that will be , one of them. i think we need to enforce it as the law was passed. i think we need to be very objective and honest about what we learned about consequences of this new law relative to our children, young people, and to employees who are seeking jobs around the state of colorado. because the consequences are real. governors are very much looking at colorado. i think when i'm asked that question, i will tell them to be cautious as i think we are being cautious. >> governor, how would you feel -- field those phone calls? >> i get a lot of those calls. as you can imagine. last year i was the chair of the western governors association. this year i'm the chair of the national governors association. that is about two thirds of the sitting governors who are republicans. that is a large vote. they ask again and again -- are the tax revenues significant enough to make worth all of the challenges?

i tell everyone, just what the congressman said we need to , wait. i opposed the legislation but we --t passed 55%-40 5% we have an obligation to do everything we can to make a regulatory system that could work. we are in one of the great experiments of the 21st century. we will do everything we can to find a framework that makes it worth it. we know the high-thc pot has the ladies diminish activity in brain's they are still growing. the unemployment rate is 5.4%, but that is not the whole story. the median household income is down about $4000 since the recession started. in many counties the unemployment rate is as high as 9%, even 10%. what can you do to help those who have all but lost hope of finding a job? governor? >> i think the unemployment has come down significantly. if you go out onto the slopes,

it has dropped in the last few months. but still we have a lot of places where the recovery has not been as rapid as a has been. if you go to fort collins and denver it has been booming. if you go to pueblo and el paso county, it is struggling. you have got to find ways to provide incentives in places that still have lagging unemployment to generate new jobs. it can be done through entrepreneurs or what we call sometimes lone rangers. the young millennial's who don't really want to work for a company. they want to work project to project. we are trying to find one of the right incentives so that they do not just come into denver. they have made denver and north colorado their primary destination. we want to make sure they have other destinations and give them

incentives so they would go to pueblo or colorado springs or grand junction. >> you are right. the recovery has been spotty. we have had negative growth. last year in mesa county, grand junction. colorado springs, negative growth. pueblo barely stays stagnant last year. part of the reason is because there are so many opportunities that would historically come to colorado have gone to states around us. againstve anything those states, but i'm a fan of colorado opportunity. when i ask what is wrong, they say government. 85,000 pages of federal regulations every year. almost 15,000 pages coming out of his administration of regulation every year. 2000 new regulations implemented on his watch. i will do the opposite. on day one, i will suspend new regulations. if they aren't public safety related, let's stop and on the -- audit government and a but -- invite you to join us in the

audit. if it isn't pro-jobs, opportunity, individual liberty, we will get rid of it. >> talk about bipartisanship. something voters desperately want, and candidates promise it during the election season. could you tell us one idea from the other party's platform that you support? and in idea from your party's platform that you suppose -- propose? congressman? >> the democrat party has been right for a long time talking about education opportunity for children. unfortunately on this governors watch and the democrat party being in charge of the colorado legislature for the recent past, it hasn't materialized. alain berman is a democrat and member of the state board of education. used to be a member of another -- the gps board. she said based on the test scores that we got back on governor hickenlooper's watch, deteriorated, she said obviously

we need to be honest. what we are doing is not working, and we need to be willing to change. third-grade reading scores in colorado are shameful. when 30% of our children cannot read at grade level, we have got a problem that we need to address. you asked about my party's platform. some in my party has been strident on the question of illegal immigration. i think it is time we face the facts, that we are a better nation and a better state than this, and we need to find a solution to the long-standing problem. >> give an example of where you agree with the republican platform and disagree with the democratic platform. >> the congressman came and was talking about cutting regulations. we embrace that from the beginning. the state government had to be pro-business. the whole thing had to be pro-business. we had to find a way to cut it -- unnecessary regulations. modified00, and another 1500 to take the

friction out of business. you can be relentlessly pro-business but at the same time have high standards. when we supported oil and gas it , would be an example where many of my party feel the hydraulic fracturing or extraction is dangerous and should be banned. i think it is the state's obligation to make sure that we get to place where we can guarantee that the air and water will be clean for people live. but that natural gas is a transition fuel that will get us to a cleaner future. going against the party there. but in terms of the regulation and overall government approach to business, we have tried to stay positive. >> thank you. we've asked viewers to send in a question they wanted to ask each of you. >> thanks. we will give each of you 30 seconds to answer these questions.

we will start in jefferson county. it is a county that has decided statewide races in the past. it will very likely again this year. this fall, we saw a school district in turmoil as students walked out of class and teachers called in sick and were upset about a paper proposal and a plan to possibly change the college for design curriculum for ap u.s. history. that prompted questions from several viewers. randy arnold asks, what is your opinion of the action of the school board in jefferson county relative to the teaching of american history? >> if you're talking about ap tests, there will be standard test given the students all over our completed. -- students over the country are completing. we better make sure we're teaching all of american history. if we talk about one thing, we talk about another. a small number of people trying to change the way the individual parts of history are taught doesn't make sense.

if you change it significantly you put your kids trying to get a grade on an ap test that will allow them to qualify for college credit, you were putting them at a tremendous disadvantage. >> congressman? >> it is perfectly appropriate for an elected school board to debate the issues such as curriculum. but i think it needs to be open and transparent. certainly parents and teachers need to be involved. what offended me was that the kids were hurt, the students were hurt. we lost class time, instruction time. they're out to be a way to resolve these issues and disputes in a more grown-up and professional manner than to take kids out of classrooms as well as teachers out of classrooms. this is much more of a labor dispute than a curriculum dispute, and the tragedy was unfortunately the children. >> we had another school shooting in america, this time in washington state. the conversation is likely to

turn to guns again. scott lee wanted to talk about gun control. pointing to the new laws. his bottom line -- what is your stance on gun control moving forward? congressman? >> a very good question. an appropriate question given my opponent in this race. sheriffs tried to tell him that the gun bills he signed in 2013 would neither improve public safety or be enforced. he didn't even listen. the chief law enforcement officers in every county. sheriff's, said he did not talk to michael bloomberg. his own records that he did. -- said he did. i do not think the problem is that we need more laws. i think the problem is we need more mental health intervention.

frankly, that is an issue that has gone on wanting on his watch. i think we need to be proactive about solving problems before they happen. oftentimes it is mental health behind it. >> governor hickenlooper? >> we did add $30 million to the mental health budget two years ago. it is the largest increase in the history of the state. might've missed your attention. i do not see new gun regulations coming down the road, but i think that the universal background checks where we were trying to make sure that guns didn't get into the hands of dangerous people made a lot of sense. look at half the gun purchases in 2012 got universal. if you look at the purchases, the gun safety checks, 38 people who were guilty of homicide, try -- tried to buy a gun and we stop them. 133 people found guilty of sexual assault right to buy a gun and we stopped them. 420 people who had a judicial

restraining order not to see a box or a spouse. we stopped them. people have said, crooks aren't stupid good they will not get a background check when buying a gun. for the record 236 people when , they came to pick up the gun, we arrested them for an outstanding warrant. that legislation was not intended to take guns away from people, just keep them out of the hands of dangerous individuals. >> this is a scene we have seen too many times. all of us in colorado. as people had home to the mountains, stuck in traffic for hours at a time. congressman, paul asks what do , you feel is the best way to address the i-70 congestion? >> great question. there have been very few questions about transportation in this entire campaign. what i want to do let's renew , the trans bonds that are about to be paid off. if we did that, i talked to a

public finance expert on this. if we did it at exactly the same ratio we have been doing since 1999. that not only fixed i-25 the , t-rex project, but many other projects around the state. we could generate $3.5 billion and instead of band-aids and patchwork, let's get serious on improving the opportunities and do some serious public finance. our state doesn't even have a cfo. we had some good budget people. don't get me wrong. people who can add up the numbers. but we do not have a chief financial officer to tell us how to best utilize the resources we have available. on my watch we will change that and address are transportation challenges. >> governor hickenlooper? >> we do have a cfo. in terms of the treasurer. >> not in your office.

>> that's true. we have a publicly elected -- please let me answer. d, which the congressman opposed. if you did renew those trans bonds, there wouldn't be any big projects. we focus on the short-term on making sure that by spanning the twin tunnels, we could go forward and hard in the shoulders and during rush hour, we could let that become a third lane. friday afternoons and saturday mornings going westbound and the cutting back eastbound, there will be that extra lane. that is a short-term resolution. we would have to look at managing lanes with a new shoulder that will be used for buses and mass transit people could create a toll. -- people will be able to pay a toll if they want to use it.

the key to the future though is recognizing that the new vehicles and trucks that are coming are using less fuel. that means less revenue to pay for this. as a state we have to decide where are the new revenues going , to come from? >> i have got to have a rebuttal on that. [laughter] he does understand what the trans bonds are about. what we're talking about is the -- utilizing 50% of the federal gas tax that comes back to colorado anyway and using that to calculate how much we can finance. that's how they worked marvelously well for the last 15 years. public finance experts tell us that we could access $3.5 billion with a "b" money. that is not minor money. that is serious money. we have to be doing that. >> go ahead. is $135 million left on that.

you would need to get a vote of the people to get that then $3.5 billion, you'd be taking a diminishing revenue source because of the less amount of gasoline we would be selling to pay for this new amount of construction. you're going out on a very risky endeavor. if you did have a good cfo, i could guarantee they would recommend it. >> yes they would. >> gentlemen, we will move on. >> let's go back to shawn. moreu need to cbs 4 -- than $6 million was spent on advertising in this race. much of it from the democratic and republican governors association's. with claims that the not always hold up under scrutiny. we will give you each 45 seconds to respond to an ad. we begin with an ad by governor hickenlooper in which you tell your mediator skills. ♪ [video clip] >> if you want to know what it is like to be in the hot seat with the governor, work in a restaurant kitchen.

there's always someone to talk about something. if you listen, you could even the middle. >> you have taken heat for trying to straddle the middle on several issues, especially the death penalty, giving a mass murderer and indefinite reprieve , saying if you lose you might give him clemency. critics say this shows a lack of leadership. how do you respond? >> and terms of the death penalty -- i was not trying to straddle the middle. i looked at a situation, i have been consistent. i don't think government should be taking a life. we all have our own relationship with god. but i recognize people disagree and i did not want to pull the rug out from under the entire legal system. i wanted to have a conversation. i appreciate you asking the question. it is certainly a difficult one. i look at each one of these situations and in the end, when you come back to capital punishment, my feeling was, i

really believe that i don't think government should be taking a life. but the next governor might. >> you pledged not to run negative ads, yet you ran some negative ads. let's take a look at one of them. [video clip] >> john hickenlooper says he opposes negative ads, but that is hickenlooper hypocrisy. >> the negative ads you referred to were by the democratic governors association, not the hickenlooper campaign. it is true that he could have denounced them, but the republican governors association is running attacks on hickenlooper and you are not denouncing that. congressman, aren't you being hypocritical? >> no, because as you pointed out, the democratic association ran an ad that was false and misleading and untrue. a direct attack ad. the basis of that question that you put up, that gimmick that he told in the debate was a

question asking him if he wasn't being a bit hypocritical, thing -- being a member of the democratic governors association, former vice chairman of the democratic governors association and having to raise money for the association to not call that was blatantly obvious and he knows to be a false attacks against me. if it is true and based on a vote that somebody has taken or a bill or a statement, i don't think that is a negative attack ad. i think that is a contrast that needs to be drawn out in the course of a political debate. >> as i pointed out in the fact check, they cannot cordon eight with -- >> he has not lost his first amendment rights to speak out. that is what is really behind this. at least stand up and say that is false. call the fellow. -- foul. he could at least do that.

but he hasn't. maybe tonight. take downsaid again, all the negative ads. you have said i will only run positive ads. >> you broke the promise before we -- you start answering the questions. >> the campaign has never -- our campaign has never run anything but positive ads. i denounce all the negative ads. i'm happy to do it. >> you're also happy to let other people do your dirty work for you. you are very good at that. oh, please, take them down. the silence is deafening. >> they spent $2 million attacking me and you were mute. where was your voice? >> because they were based on facts that were documented. >> we will move along. the republican governors association invested heavily in the race, identifying u.s. one who lacks leadership. [video clip]

>> john hickenlooper is a fun guy to shoot pool with, but when it comes to making the tough decisions he will not step up to the table. he dropped the ball on a mass murderer, nathan dunlap, and flip-flopped on gun rights. >> let's take up gun control. you told a group of shares you do not have all of facts when signed the bill. should you have signed it? with regard to the high-capacity magazine ban, you said, "as you point out, how important really was it? how much difference will it make? how is this not a flip flop?" he is goingthan -- to die in prison one way or the other. in terms of high-capacity magazines, there are so many out there, it will take a long time. the point of the law is long-term you will move toward a safer future. i certainly said it will not have a large and immediate effect.

you are always trying to measure, how can i get things change more rapidly? i still stand behind that law that that is what made sense. we have a great many factors and have got more facts in you'd we -- it would not have changed things. i think we should've spent more time and have more of an open discussion over the entire gun law issue. >> why did you say how important really was it to the sheriff? >> i was trying to recognize that it would take years for that legislation or to have a significant, material affect. but high-capacity magazines of more than 15 rounds are not necessary to defend your home it -- and in most cases they are illegal for hunting. mass shootings, 31 out of 42 had magazines more than 15 rounds. 40% of police officers killed in the line of duty over the last 10 years, they all used magazines with more than 15 rounds. >> thank you, governor.

this ad addresses your position on abortion. [video clip] >> this is the race that matters. the one colorado women cannot afford to lose. theannot give bob beauprez power to be governor. beauprez threatened to ban abortion come even in cases of rape and incest. 006 that youin 2 would sign a bill banning abortion except in cases where the mother's life was at risk. you told me it is impossible what you say you would do until you saw the bill. you said you would also oppose tax dollars for planned parenthood. now you say you wouldn't oppose all tax dollars, just those for abortion. you are adamantly opposed to abortion, but you said he would not sign a bill banning abortion and wouldn't strip planned parenthood given the opportunity?

>> if i understand the state budget correctly, planned parenthood is not getting funding because they have not applied for it. that is taking care of already under the governor's watch. i will be clear on this. i'm not the candidate to infringe on anyone's rights. i know what the law is. i'm not going to have the opportunity to change that law. i'm here to bolster that the economy to protect and defend people's freedom, including women's right to birth control, the right to use the kind of birth control they want to choose. i do not think taxpayers ought to be pay for you to that is a big differentiation. i will defend your rights. i happen to have male principles -- my own principles and my own beliefs, but i will defend your freedom to choose as you see fit. >> governor, you run a couple of ads touting your experience as a restaurant owner, the suggestion being that you are pro-business.

>> we got rid of unnecessary 1200 regulations to focus on job creation. we are first in the nation for economic growth. >> the same website that ranked us first and economic growth ranked us middle of the pack for a company -- the economy overall. the state has gotten rid of 1200 regulations but added more than 2000 rules since he took office. governor, are you cherry picking numbers here? [laughter] >> no, we're not cherry picking numbers here. some regulations we did in concert with industry. we look at the methane regulations. colorado became the first state to regulate methane. natural gas producing wells, an inspector has to go out and make sure there are no leaks at every well every month. that regulation was formed by the industry working in partnership with environmental community and the government working as a mediator. of course we created more regulations to make that happen,

to make sure everyone played by the same level. but that does not mean all regulations are bad. we talk about how we are at the moment of having the cleanest air and cleanest water that produces hydrocarbon now that we ever have had. that is true -- because of regulation. the key is to have appropriate regulation. some oil and gas has gone to north dakota, but the price of oil is $80 a barrel instead of $100. a lot have jobs that come back. it is more expensive to produce in south dakota. >> thank you pete we want to -- thank you. we want to give you an opportunity to ask your opponent a question. you each have two questions. congressman beauprez? official website there is something called the colorado violation decision-making process users guide. i downloaded printed one right here. did you even know that according to your own standards that were

adopted in march of 2011, a sex offender could volunteer in child related locations? that is directly from the language of the document -- and not have their parole revoked? >> i don't have the document in front of me and i haven't read it. >> but you approved it. it has been approved on your watch. march 2011. >> i have to see with the details of it are, in what context. there are issues around sexual offenders. a 17-year-old is dating a young woman who is under-aged. and somebody files a case against that. he becomes a sex offender. i'm not sure if that is fair not fair. that is what sometimes happens. i don't know if that is what you are referring to or not. i know by law they are not allowed -- but maybe there is some way in the other they are allowed to do that. >> this is why public safety is an important issue.

>> i will take a look at that later. governor hickenlooper, your first question? >> in colorado, a handshake means something. when we shook hands we agreed to run positive ads. we didn't say that we were going ' to denounce the other sides as could we looked at each other and said that we would run positive ads. i have been in business most of my life i live by handshakes. every time i shook a hand, i was giving them my word. you said we will only run positive ads. what did you mean by we will only run positive ads? >> you must have forgotten the context of the question. the reporter asked you if you thought the democrat governors position at was not negative, and invited you to speak out against it. >> that is when you stepped across and said, let's run a

positive campaign. before he finished answering his question, you failed and he invited you and i invited you to denounce that ad as false and you wouldn't do it. you broke your own site. i have shook a lot of hands in my life, too. on ad a lot of cows handshake and made a lot of deals as a banker on a handshake. you violated the gimmick that you put forward and then you let other people do your dirty work. do not accuse me of doing what you did before you stopped answering the question. >> now to your second question. >> governor, you like to call it picking a fight with washington to take a position on the keystone pipeline. or try to keep the federal classroomsout of our for to stand up for the -- to the federal government on behalf of colorado natural resources.

or to oppose obamacare mandates. instead of standing up for rights in the interest of colorado residents, how come you are quick and willing to stand alongside barack obama in washington, d.c.? >> the bottom line is you are misstating the reality of the fact. quite a few were three years late getting to the table on that. >> i began co-chairing that committee in 2012. that is not three years late. >> that is not what they think a -- in northwest colorado. >> i beg to differ. depends on who you are talking to. >> i'm sure you would. >> would you let me answer? >> please. that with the republican governor overwhelming. we have looked at all the ways that colorado ranchers and farmers, innovation technology, fencing, improving the habitat.

we now look at this as a way that we are building republicans and democrats from all kinds of western states, from both parties, a framework where we could push back. lm and fish and wildlife and say we are doing a better , job than the government. that is one of many examples. >> thank you. you have the final question. >> you spent a good deal of the campaign criticizing me for what you call failed leadership. but when we asked a couple of weeks ago to identify a single bill that you have seen pass into law, you talked about the funding for the new va hospital. a delegation effort. not saying you did work on other pieces, but i will ask again i , will ask again what bill did

you author? that was passed into law? >> you just mischaracterized the truth. i'm offended by that. i served on the veterans administration committee, i represented colorado veterans and the request to get through the process and approval of that hospital now under construction. i've made sure that over the next four years that colorado kept a place at the table for one of only three hospitals that would be approved and built. and i made sure that i think it was my very last vote before i left congress, that the language for the original appropriations was in that appropriations bill that we got past to fund what is now coming out of the ground to serve our veterans in colorado. i'm very proud of having done that and brought transportation dollars back to colorado. frankly, something that you're benefiting from right now.

the continuation of the payment on fast tracks, that was largely responsible to our staff and my work on the transportation committee to his dollars came to colorado. please do not mischaracterize my character. >> we now have a series of speed round questions. you each have 30 questions to answer and no rebuttals in these rounds. if we had ebola in colorado, how would you keep it from spreading? congressman, you have first crack at this one. >> i'm confident in largely because i have visited with a doctor who is ahead of the emergency preparedness in the emergency room services at the university of colorado hospital. i have to commend our state department of health and the health care professionals. i think you have done a commendable job.

isolation is important. i recommend them and give it dip of the hat on the current administration on that one. >> i certainly agree. the doctor has done a good job preparing everyone. one of the issues as we have seen in ebola is why are you using technology better. -- why aren't we using technology better? in terms of making sure that people who might have been exposed, why aren't we using handheld devices to make sure we communicate to them on a daily basis as we understand the situation better? how are we not making sure that we have all manner of social media that helps us inform people so there isn't the uncertainty and anxiety that is spreading around the whole issue. >> given the news that more than 200 people received duplicate ballots, how confident can colorado voters be in the integrity of this incumbent election? >> unlike other foreign

countries, at least we catch it. we take it seriously. the secretary of state is opposite going to investigate and make sure that it gets taking care of. i feel very confident. no system is perfect. when you look at millions of votes being cast, the amount of voter missteps i think in colorado as any other state, we run clean, for elections. >> we hope we do. i think it is very troubling that we hear the stories of duplicate ballots. we have also heard this weekend media stories efforts to find ballots, dumpster dive come if you will, to fraudulent them. that is very disconcerting. it is an issue we will keep an eye on and address in future

elections whether or not we need to reform our laws. >> what steps would you take specifically to ensure that retirement security of coloradans? >> it is pretty important to zone whose 66 years old and has two older brothers. i think we have to be very vigilant on it. as a former anchor, protecting the public's funds and our publics moneys is crucially important to me. we need to make sure that we have the support of law enforcement to do just that. promises made our promises that need to be kept. the retirement is one of those that cannot be violated. >> in terms of state employees, there has been a lot of concern. we can adjust the cost of living. we need to make sure it remains solid.

we have a great many other workers and colorado were not part of it. we need to make sure -- do more to make sure we can guarantee they have something to retire on. they're building a large cap is on the south part of town. i talked to him a few weeks ago about if he would be willing to come and keynote a conference and look at how we can maintain retirement for everyone? >> if that is projected, the state budget starts running a surplus. should it be returned to taxpayers? or use it to restore services cut during the recession? >> i think it is amazing to look at the fact that despite many claims that the economy isn't doing as well -- if you told anyone we would be in this position, they would be incredulous. there are a lot of different

ways we could return money to the voters. we will follow the law. we will make sure that money gets back to the voters. >> that is a different answer than he gave in a previous debate. >> no. >> i think the money should be the -- return to the voters. >> the reality is you have waited a long time for this day to get some funds back. during the suppose it recovery, the average household income has declined about $4000. it would be nice if government could give you a break instead of the other way around. my watch, that is exactly what will happen. the money would be returned. >> if you each had a do over, what would it be? >> the biggest lesson i learned

when i was in congress was that you cannot always trust some of the people you are closest to you i trust the leadership. i don't regret giving pharmaceuticals to senior citizens. i learned the lesson of shame me once, and she menu, fully twice, shame on me p i wouldn't make that same mistake. >> when we had that tumultuous legislative session two years ago, we went to rapidly. for variety of reasons, the legislature pushed one meeting after another, and many people didn't feel that their voices were being heard. i take more time to listen and hear both sides. it helps keep momentum going

when dealing with consequences of missions. >> that concludes our speed round of the debate. >> we are to closing statements. we had a coin toss. governor hickenlooper won. he elected to go last. congressman beauprez, one minute for your closing statement. >> everybody on channel 4 and those with have tuned in tonight, thank you for this opportunity. a good friend of mine told me the other day governorship is a terrible thing to waste. the governor's can make a difference. they can make a difference for the states and their people. i want to provide an opportunity for this great state.

dreams i never even imagined dreaming up came true here in colorado. it saddens me to see that other state seem to be adding the opportunity now instead of colorado. that is simply wrong. the governor's primary job is less to govern the people and much more to govern the government. i do not want to run your life. i want you to have the freedom to run your own life. i don't want to run your family or small business. i want you to have their freedom and liberty to do that for yourself. that is what will guide me every day. >> thank you. governor, you get the final word. >> thank you for having us. colorado's future will be about innovation and collaboration and not about seeking pointless fights. four years ago we had a shortfall in the city budget. four years later, we have come back. we have a rainy day fund and 35 consecutive months of job growth.

that's the most since we achieve 1996. this with dealing -- while dealing with disasters. we did it by working together. my opponent seems to enjoy picking fights, at least with me, but whaling gas versus local control equating abortion -- we have more to do. we could be the healthiest a america. because of the most innovative public education in the country you to be can be the number one stay for job creation. together is the colorado way. the colorado way is always going to work. i would like to say mercy to all of you and ask for everyone's vote. thank you. >> that is all the time we have. thank you for joining us for this important setting to help viewers make informed choices in campaign 2014. >> if you would like to check out this debate again or make sure others see it, we will

re-air in tonight on channel 12 at 8 p.m. and again on sunday, november 2. >> we will have a special on the candidates and issues. our team is working together for complete coverage. we will be live on channel 12 on election night here and we will have race results and live coverage from the campaign headquarters to get reaction from the winners and the losers. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> more campaign debates coming up tonight on c-span. in less than an hour, a live debate from louisiana. center mary landrieu faces to republican challengers. 9:00, from portland maine, republican susan collins debates

shenna bellows. >> democrat al franken won the minnesota senate race in 2008 by 312 votes. he's running for a second term this year against republican mike mcfadden. next, a debate between the two candidates. >> now, from minnesota's most-watched station, this is the campaign 2014 senate debate. and thank youg for joining us for a very special sunday morning. >> were joined now for alive senate debate between them

aquatic senator al franken and republican challenger mike mcfadden. thanks for joining us. that want to let you know over the next hour it will be different than a traditional debate. there's no stage, no audience, no opening and closing statements and there will not be timed responses. pat and i will be keeping things moving so we can get to as much as possible over the next hour. >> flipped a coin to determine who would field the first question. esther mcfadden won that coin toss. we want to start with ebola. there is widespread anxiety in america about a possible outbreak of ebola. there are now three states which are enforcing mandatory quarantines of people in west africa. withad direct contact patients who have ebola. esther mcfadden, you want to go a lot further. you would like to have a travel ban from west african countries because you say that this is a

dangerous situation, but medical experts around the world say that is not effective. what we're seeing is another example of lack of leadership in washington. serious a very, very disease. people are really concerned in this country and in minnesota with safety and security. as i'm going around the state, i get asked about it all the time. people are really concerned about it. as i looked into it, we are not close to being prepared for an ebola outbreak in the united states. this only for state-of-the-art contamination centers in the country. one is in atlanta, one is in omaha am a one is in washington dc and the other is sent montana. if we have a severe outbreak that we are not ready to address -- >> but the medical experts say a travel ban is not effective. >> i think the travel ban is

common sense. that we have a way to prevent people who have potential to have ebola from coming into our country. i've called for a temporary travel ban for people traveling from west africa to the united states. you also support mandatory quarantines for health care workers? >> you raise a great point. when you see what happened in new york with this doctor who came back, it is scary. i guarantee you that hospital in dallas thought they were doing everything right, and then they contracted this disease. the cdc allow this nurse to get on a plane. let's go to senator franken, the travel ban. 45% of all these travelers out of west africa don't come straight to the united states. would you support it?

insufficientit is to have a travel ban from those west african countries to the the vastates because majority goes through third-party countries. let me take you what i have done. >> your opponent has been very clear. you have said it should be considered but you're concerned about getting aid workers in our and out. which is it? do you support the travel ban or not, and what about this mandatory quarantines and has gone into effect in these states? >> no matter whether you have it or not, it's actually a very small minority of flights directly to hear. the vast majority come through third countries. i agree the response was unacceptable and a lot of my work has been to see that in

that's not going to happen. i have been in regular contact with the minnesota hospital association. we actually do have four hospitals now that are set up to take ebola patients. ban?at about the travel it's very controversial. >> we want to do the most rational, effective thing to keep people safe in minnesota. and the to the governor commissioner from minnesota .epartment of health last night the commissioners having a meeting with experts today at the mostalk about what effective way is, and whether that means a mandatory quarantines.

>> we want to know where you stand on the travel ban? >> i have nothing against a travel ban from west africa. what i am saying is -- it is totally insufficient because what we need to do is be able to screen and i talked to the cdc and i pressed the cdc along with the governor, who makes minnesota msp, an airport where you screen and track people. all the people come in will be screened and tracked, so they have to take their temperature twice a day. that is the distinction now between mandatory quarantine. other governors have decided not to do it. i will be talking to the governor and the commissioner later today about how that meeting went. we want to do this in the most effective way possible.

>> mr. mcfadden, let's go back. we have a doctor in new york who was self testing and was taking his temperature but he was out of bowling and riding the subway. is he a hero or irresponsible doctor? >> when he talks about the cdc, there are a lot of mistakes and that was made. the administration does not seem to have a hold. >> he is a doctor with doctors without borders and he is a hero. i listen to both of you ask franken three times what his answer was and he did not answer. that's a problem with politics. people want straight talk. the reason people are so concerned about ebola is they see a theme in washington and there is no leadership whether isis or the economy.

people are feeling less secure and less safe and i know that because i am talking to people. >> are you satisfied with president obama's handling of the ebola crisis? >> the cdc, they apologized for what they did. right now, my number one focus is making sure that people in minnesota are safe and that is why i have worked -- i've been in constant contact with both the commissioner, the governor. >> are you satisfied with president obama? >> no, and i do not think he is. >> that's it for this segment that will be back in a couple of minutes with questions about the affordable care act. ♪ >> welcome back to the senate

debate. the affordable care act which is known as obamacare is now in place and a year old. americans are still navigating what it is and what it means. >> we want to start with senator franken, president obama said repeatedly if you like your doctor, you can keep him or her and if you like your policy, you can keep it. would you call it the lie of the year in 2012? have you been lying to the peak will of minnesota -- to the people of minnesota? >> i have not. i did not say those things. the president was engaged in wishful thinking. let's talk about what the affordable care act has done in minnesota. we have reduced by 40% the number of uninsured. 95% of minnesotans are insured, in the country.

mr. mcfadden wants to repeal the affordable care act, he has ran on that the whole time. he wants to repeal it. we have to fix the things that are wrong with it, but built of the things that are right. if you repeal, we would go back to square one and you would have people with pre-existing conditions being able to get coverage without paying a penalty. women would have to pay more for their health care just because they are a woman. people who have gone through their lifetime cap or annual cap would be thrown off their health care again. kate, a mom, whose daughter has cystic fibrosis said her daughter is alive because they got rid of the caps.

>> you have made it a big part of your campaign. you said you want to keep pre-existing conditions and keep 26-year-old on their parents' policies and no lifetime limits. you also say no mandate. it does not seem to work. on the health experts say that is obamacare, but for the mandate. >> we have a health care issue in this country. we have had for a long time. obamacare is not the right solution. it is a train wreck. but -- but, i have come with a plan and i want to talk about it. you started with the lie, the biggest lie of the year, if you like your doctor, you can keep it. the biggest lie was when the

president and al franken said it would make health care less expensive and that is not true. it's absolutely not true. i know that because i am talking to people. we know that it was preferred one, the low-cost provider and they came out with the new rates and they are going up 63%. when i was in rochester last week, a woman came up to me who works at mayo clinic and her deductible is going up and she had a look of fear and anger. >> he said it is a lie you are telling minnesotans. >> let's focus on the premiums going off. three weeks from tomorrow, thousands of minnesotans will go to the website and the estimates are all over the map ranging from 4% to 11%.

what did you say to people who are concerned not only by the increasing -- >> some people have seen their rates go up and some have seen them go down. i spoke to a manufacturer who employees 48 people. let's make it clear. let me make this clear. what he is talking about is repealing this and it goes back to square one with a congress that is -- where there is -- there is obstruction and gridlock. all of this disappears immediately. >> we have a health care issue in this country. obamacare is not the right solution. it is a disaster.

to say it is going to lower cost is patently wrong. it will raise costs. we cannot afford. the difference is i want the states to control and you want the federal government to control. >> that has been done. >> you do what you want -- >> when al franken and i were debating in front of the audience, al said there are many problems with obamacare. he has not come forth with one solution. >> experts have looked at your plan and said your plan will not keep costs low. you do not have the mandate. >> that is wrong. i said the states can decide if they want to implement. if minnesota said we want a mandate, we could do that. if arkansas does not want one, they do not have to. i believe the states are laboratories for experiment.

>> it does not matter. it is not going to be his plan. there are 435 members of the house and 100 members of the senate and everybody will have a plan and your plan does not get adopted because you are running for office. it immediately goes away. i have offered fixes. ok? i have bipartisan support on something called reinsurance which is the unions and businesses that sell for sure the republican of illinois is a cosponsor of my legislation. to say i have offered nothing -- >> that is a minute piece of it. what minnesotans want -- straight talk and obama care is

not working. there's a better way forward and i think the states are laboratories for experiment and it should be implemented. >> i am sorry gentlemen. that is all the time we have. >> ok. >> they are $1000 a year less per beneficiary than predicted in 2009. the cost of the kind of care we have incentivized as opposed to -- and what we do -- >> you mentioned -- >> medicare advantage that you want to do away. >> and that is not true. >> more americans on medicare advantage now than ever before. >> gentlemen -- i am sorry for that we want to go to a lot of topics. hang on a second. >> to say it will lower, it is a out right -- everybody getting the permits for next year are

seeing staggering rises. >> we will have to take a break. we will be back in a couple of minutes. >> welcome back to the senate to debate. we have been asking viewers what is on their mind. what do they want to know from the candidates. >> we have had a lot of questions from viewers and one is from rod, who is sick and tired of america being at work for a dozen years. he is wondering, what can be done about it?

he asks senator franken, what would you do about the isis threat? >> well, isis is a barbaric group. we need to degrade and destroy isis. i voted to train and arm the moderate rebels in syria with some trepidation about how successful it could be. i have supported the president's bombing as well as in iraq. isis does not observe those borders. i do not think -- when we go back to congress, we will debate and vote at the right to use military force to ok this bombing. it will be a much more narrowly defined authorization. >> do you support the president's actions and has he done enough? mr. mcfadden said you are missing in action and have not

done enough to stop recruiting right here in minnesota. what about that? >> as soon as i got to the senate in 2009, one of the first things i did was give briefings from the fbi, both in washington and st. paul on recruitment going on at the time in our community. i met with community leaders, an organization that tries to get youth to make better choices. i met with a law enforcement and i am on record as pressing the homeland security judiciary hearings on this. i am on record as pressing the director of the fbi on this and judiciary hearings. i have worked with the community and working with law enforcement. we got to the recruitment down.

when it was clear that isis had recruited dozens, i wrote a letter saying i want to double down on what we did to limit -- they started a new program. >> he has done a lot. this has been going on for a long time. the world has become a more dangerous place. i hear about safety and security from people all of the time. minnesota being the number one recruitment area for terrorism and that concerns me. there are things going on for a long time. al franken said since 2008. it was not until -- there are estimates that thousands of minnesotans are fighting with isis. two minnesotans were killed and i called for a revocation of

passports from people that go with terrorist organizations and i held a press conference. this was after talking with community leaders in east africa. al franken comes out and says -- he writes a letter to the department of justice. let me go back. when you talk about isis, i agree that they are barbarians. i cannot stress enough how disappointed i have been with president obama's foreign-policy or lack of it in your support of it. this leading from behind does not work. it was a president that said, i will sit down with the leaders of north korea and iran and work everything out. that is not been the case. the world is a more dangerous place today because will not show leadership. it is a president they came from vacation after there were 2 beheadings of journalists and said we do not have a strategy

and that is not acceptable. >> the president said in 2012, syria used chemical weapons and a red line would be crossed and it would be u.s. action in retaliation and that never happened. experts point to that in a series of missteps in syria and not leaving a force in iraq as being part of the reason that isis has grown so quickly. you have supported the president's foreign-policy. do you feel the president and yourself and those who have supported him are right to blame? >> in 2013 when assad used chemical weapons, i said i thought the president should use force. mr. mcfadden talks about leading from behind. in the first 10 months of his campaign, there was not a word about foreign-policy and terrorism.

then, when assad used chemical weapons, every republican candidate was asked by minnesota public radio what choices they would make, what would they do. everybody answered but mr. mcfadden. he ducked. the reason was it was a difficult political decisions. >> i did not duck. >> you did not answer the question. >> every -- >> all of the other candidates responding. >> we get asked questions all of the time. sometimes we answer and sometimes we do not. it made a situation i was at a kids -- i am in the game. as soon as you draw a redline in the sand and it's crossed, i would've had bombers immediately. done. and -- and -- >> this was a huge issue at the time.

this dominated the news. when you were asked about the issue facing the country and right then and there that was the issue and it was a difficult decision at that is the job -- >> al, al -- in benghazi, we had an ambassador murdered and the president did nothing and you supported and the world watched. then what happened is the president drew a redline and nothing happened. no wonder we have a situation that happened in the ukraine gaza or syria and the world is a much more dangerous place. you supporting for president 97% of the time. you are a rubber stamp for his policies. >> we will talk 97%. >> at the time, i was asked what

my policy was right away. >> what should we have done in benghazi? let me answer this. this is a job where you have to answer questions in real time i'm aware you have to make choices in real time. you can't take cheap shots from the bleachers. of his onnot a word foreign policy for the first 10 months. nothing on his website, no speeches on it, no press releases. >> let's talk about the burning questions in real time. i just watched him ask you three times whether you support a travel ban from west africa and you diverge it it time and time again. are seeing live across minnesota how you act, and not not acceptable.

of theill get to one most repeated attacks in this race, that 97%. stay right here. >> welcome back to the u.s. senate debate between democratic incumbent senator al franken and republican challenger might mcfadden. back to you, mr. mcfadden. the next question must something we've heard a lot and this campaign, and viewers have seen this in your political ads over and over again. you have repeatedly criticized senator franken in your ads for voting with president obama 97% of the time. are elected,if you if you vote 97% of the time with your party or any party for me you won't run again. what is the proper percentage? 96%? would you vote 95%? how about 88%?

>> i will go out there and i won't be a rubber stamp for any president. it's an issue because i believe this president is leading us in the wrong direction. al franken has been a rubber stamp for this president. he has voted with him 97% of the time. i haven't met anyone in minnesota who agrees with another person 97%. >> well, then what is a good percentage? >> al franken didn't think 87% was good in 2008. let me share something with you. congress is not working. it is hyper partisan, and i , youve that right now mentioned there are 100 senators the house ofrs in representatives. 500 35 people who have an

opportunity to vote in america. have produced from congress for decades is horrendous. but i can't believe what you are saying. were talking about percentages and you are using them over and over again. let me just show you. here is what democrats vote with their party, and it's above 97%. you have all the democrats at 90% or more. look at the republicans. here are republicans, everyone is voting above 90%. is meaningless. >> no, it is not meaningless. he has supported the president every step of the way and dennis odin stone believe this president is leading us in the right direction. ns don't believe the

president is leading us in the right direction. what they have produced over a decade is surrendered. what bothers me as a dad, as a businessman and as a coach is nobody takes responsibility for the outcome. >> we have to move on. we actually broke down the vote among the u.s. senate. we found there were no republican senators who voted with their party 97% of the time , while 37 democratic senators, including you, voted with the in thent 97% of the time 113th congress. doesn't that make the democratic party the party of gridlock? >> no. this has been written about extensively. a lot of these are just nominations. past 100 toetary

nothing. they score the things the president is for. vote 100% of the time for minnesota. i have worked across party lines . i've done legislation with lamar alexander, republican of tennessee. the first reform of our workforce training system since 1998. gotctually streamlined it, rid of 15 different programs. we are training people for jobs that exist. i worked with pat roberts on making drugs safer. -- had is from kansas. deb fischer, republican from rural broadband. >> you say you are working

across the aisle. 97% indicates that you do support president obama. has he been doing a really good job, good enough that you support him 97% of the time? >> i do support his job in office. i have voted in the interest of minnesota. , i had high obama hopes when he came in. i have been disappointed in his ability to deal with this gridlock. but i've also been disappointed in that gridlock that has been created, especially by the tea party. comment to al franken and party was the party of gridlock. my party has to take the blame for this, i can tell you as an whoider, as a businessman was taught to take responsibility for actions by my dad, what i don't understand is

that congress has been for written this in turn of its outcomes over decades, but nobody takes responsibility. not ourans say it's fault, we don't control the presidency. the democrats say we cannot work with the house. i believe that al franken is one of the most partisan senators in the u.s. senate by voting record. has the senator from mississippi worked with me to rein in the credit agencies on wall street? i see, ground when i can. when also stand my ground they come after the middle class. this is where mr. mcfadden and i fundamentally disagree.

i think the economy works from the middle out. i want to work with the middle class and those aspiring to the middle class. >> we have to move on here. >> we are talking about partisanship. senators were ranked in terms of their ability to cosponsor legislation across the aisle. himwere ranked last place 100 out of 100 senators. statistic,g to that ted cruz is one of the most bipartisan members of the senate. >> that is a political magazine. >> said crews voted with his party 87% of the time. >> is the guy who shut the government down. >> you are an outlier. >> when president obama was

elected, the first thing we heard from the republican minority leader, mitch mcconnell , with that they're going to do everything they can to not allow a second term and to stop everything he did in office. do you agree with that? >> i don't agree with that. i just gave you a very straight answer, unlike al franken, who is continuing to diverge from answering questions you have asked him. i think washington is so broken and so hyper partisan, nothing is getting done and nobody takes responsibility for these outcomes. this is america. we signed up for representative democracy over 200 years ago. that means we will never have one party rule. we have to work together to get things done. under any measurement, what has been produced by congress over the last decade is karen this, and you have been part of that, al, and you need to take responsibility for that. >> we will be right back. please join us.

>> welcome back. we are in a state that bleeds purple and gold. the vikings are very big draw and a new stadium is being built right now on the other side of town. we join larry jacobs who has been going over all of your questions. the next one has to do with football. >> we have john, who has written in. he is fed up with ilya narrow owners getting funded. the star with you, senator franken. john ask, is it time to revoke the nfl's tax exemption status? would you commit to sponsoring legislation to do this? from certainxempt laws that i think a shouldn't be.

the owner could hold a city hostage. i believe we should be able to go back to the green bay packers model, where the community can own the team. i will have to look into that, >> two other senators have bills that would do just that. they have legislation in congress saying they should revoke the tax-exempt status. >> i will support that. >> is something i will look into. i haven't been asked the question before. i thought maybe we were running for governor. i know they governors get asked that all the time. the nfl's looked into tax-exempt status. and i have never been asked the question before.

what i am asked all the time is about the direction of this country. >> this is a $10 billion institution here, and they have tax exempt status. your thoughts on that. i will look into it and get back to you. i have not been asked the question. surprised'm kind of that in an hour debate that we are talking about tax exempt status >> this is important to a -- of minnesota and its minnesotans. to many people, including native americans, they believed it is racist and offensive. should they change their name? >> that is a decision that the owners of that team can make. if it was my team, but i don't own the team.

>> do you think it is racist and offensive? >> yes, i do. >> you have written to the nfl state to force the washington redskins to change the name because they are guilty of using a racial slur. secrets.org,open you accepted a $2500 doctor bhushan this election season run the nfl. was that the right thing to do? -- a $2500 contribution. >> they have been widely turning a blind eye to domestic abuse. >> this is the first i've heard that they gave that. >> would you consider giving it back? >> i will consider it, yes. >> we will move on to the next segment. we'll talk about work the issues

you say you want to hear about. a lot of our viewers want to .ear about this, too >> you say you want to clues every -- close every loophole there is. 17,000 loopholes that have been put into the tax code system. >> i can't wait to hear which ones you want to close. >> i think that would be an exercise in futility to say which of the 17,000 are were going to get rid of. the right way to do it is with a blank sheet of a per in a nonpartisan way, sitting across the aisle from people in saying this is going to be revenue neutral. we need to dramatically change the tax code and be guided by two principles, simplicity and transparency. >> this is where we have a fundamental difference. i voted to get rid of tax loopholes for companies that

outsource jobs overseas. we use that to pay for 2800 teachers in minnesota. the was at the height of great recession. we were losing teachers right and left. vote, he criticized that vote. i have legislation to prevent inversions that i have cosponsored. his company has taken advantage of in versions. stock in the owns parent company that he is talking about. i am so disappointed, you have spent millions of dollars withking me on the air patently false ads. that's one of the issues that we have in this state right now. you ran the most negative attack oriented campaign in 2008

against norm coleman, and now you're doing it again. >> let's talk about this latest ad, mr. mcfadden. you're saying it's absolutely false that your company negotiated a deal that resulted in a mine closing in missoula, montana, that resulted in 400 plus layoffs. websiten your company's that they did that deal. , i didcompany that i run not do that deal. i was not involved in that transaction. >> i've got the website right here, and it has that deal right there. >> what i would encourage you to do is call lazard on monday and asked them if we were involved. run, we sellhat i businesses. >> you also talked about your

restructuring prowess on your website. >> this was a transaction that the business that i run did not touch. what al franken has said in that ad was that i was the ceo. that was bruce wasserstein. he was a big donor to your campaign. he says you're not telling the truth, senator franken. 400 people lost their jobs. >> you asked these unemployed >> please let me answer this. this is an ad about a plant in montana that closed, and it closed because of a deal that mr. mcfadden's company was advising on restructuring. can i answer?

>> go ahead, senator. >> mr. mcfadden's firm, during this entire campaign, advertised that it did the restructuring for smurfit. that's a company that laid off these 400 people, some that had worked there for 20 years. they had it on their website until the day we ran the ad. that seems pretty incriminating. >> this would be like me blaming you for something that general electric did when you were on saturday night live. it's not just this ad. >> are we embarrassed about what? >> about taking it off your website the day after my ad.

quick we will come back on the other side of this rate. quick stay tuned, much more of our debate after this. >> we are joined again by senator al franken and mike mcfadden. they both wanted to continue the conversation that we left with. >> minnesotans are so tired of negative advertising. you met my daughter. she is in my most recent ad. initially when i jumped into this race, your team, the democratic party put out an attack ad that had my daughter in it. don't roll your eyes. there was an attack ad that had my daughter molly in it. that is not appropriate. minnesotans are so tired of these attacks. you spent millions of dollars .ttacking my character

like negativeon't ads. >> and i have not run them. >> your ads have been very negative. >> the issue of the 400 jobs that were lost. >> they did the restructuring, they bragged about doing the structuring for the whole length of this campaign until we ran the ad. on, they knew his company did the restructuring on this. they are a wholly owned subsidiary of the company in bermuda. >> letthe whole point him finish. >> that is the whole point of having a company in bermuda. you can send the money there. bedently, it's intended to

confusing where your income is, so that middle-class americans end up paying the tax bill. we have a fundamental difference in the way we think the economy should work. it should work from the middle out. >> the mutual fund was called the social responsible fund. dodid you have something to with that? >> affirm that i run had nothing to do with that. with the inversion, you sat there with crack your company made $10 million on a diversion deal that sent a u.s. pharmaceutical company over to ireland. isn't it fair for you to be questioned about it and held accountable? >> that is false, we did not represent the company that did the inversion. >> the irish company made a lot of money.

>> he is saying he had no operational control. we heard that during the campaign. >> if your ceo and you don't take responsibility for what your company does, what are you going to do as a senator? company inll a ireland that's worth $5 million and you are representing it, there is a very cap -- low tax rate there in ireland. >> we have a minute left. >> we represent companies all over the world and we don't have operational control. , whenou sell your house you soldier apartment in new take your agent doesn't operational control of that.

but this is a fundamental difference. he doesn't just act as a real estate agent. he bragged in 2009 about when were is a their market, changed to doing restructuring. that's exactly what happened. sorry, that is going to have to be the last word. we want to thank this german mcfadden and senator franken. thank you so much -- thank mr. mcfadden. thank you for joining us. >> now to louisiana where voters this week will choose between democratic senator mary landrieu to republican opponents. louisiana has an open primary system which requires a runoff election if no candidate wins a majority on tuesday. current polls show that a runoff

is likely in this race. the candidates are meeting tonight on the campus of louisiana state university for the final debate of the campaign. this is live coverage from baton rouge. >> louisiana voters head to the polls in a race that will ultimately decide control of the united states senate. tonight, the major candidates face off in the race for the u.s. senate. , here is from lsu tonight's moderator. >> good evening. welcome to our debate tonight, sponsored by lsu.