just on the lr when the people snap back at the companies, and the companies shoot them, and then they attack the person, because, policy, and which your show has covered, no one is talking about, but, how the police are violating the constitutional rights of minorities and, that's part of the issue, and, when i put it, these people call in, and, i would like you to ask them, what do they know about stop and frisk, do they think it's right for the police to do this? you'll see why, if there's so much bias, if this country,.

host: paul is a democrat. caller: you know, i agree with fox, but, i have been switching around, between channels, and, they're right. i mean, this dude, he is not mother teresa, if he wasn't robbing, a store, he probably wouldn't have gotten shot. i mean, look at it, they have video of him, punching out that guy in the convenience store, he would not have gotten shot. they act like he's some sort of motherrer rea. and he probably wouldn't have been in that position, and you know, that cop, i don't blame him. he was a big brute. i -- i would have shot him myself. he's a big guy. host: the washington post, this

is an essay, and this is the jump unrest, zaps power, and, little bit from this, finally, what distinguishes ferguson on the catalog of street violence, is what has happened, in recent weeks, the unseemly build up, and no crime was committed in the shooting death of brown, and produce an expectation of ugliness, and it may continue is, rioting as planned event, and so prepared for, as to obscure the power and meaning of the protest. news media obsessed with predicting it, and put down any uprising and, a power structure, by predicting it have combined, an unprecedented sense of

inevitability, reducining a explosion of frustration. tom, republican, you're on the air. caller: good morning. there were three major lives that were proven to be lives, that browns said to the press and, they were accepted as truth and, questioned, lie number 1 the policeman tried to go in through the window of the police car. he wouldn't fit. and the other lie was, was that is brown was shot in the back. this was proven, without a doubt to be a lie. the other lie was that, brown was 20, 25 feet away when he was shot. well, the policeman's shelves were 18 feet, from his body.

that was a lie. here's as thing, they're instituting cameras, for policemen in florida, and a very good thing happens, less problems with the police, now, that i think that's because it puts the police on guard, and the people they're doing with on guard. without respect for the law, we can't have a nation, and, that's just the way things have to end up. the prosecutor, monday night spoke a little bit about the me yeah as well. most significant challenge, in this investigation has been the 24-hour news-cycle, and its appetite for anything to talk about. following closely hin with rumors on social media. i recognize, the lack of accurate detail, surrounding the

shooting, frustrates the media, and helps breed suspicion of those distrustful, those details, about the physical evidence, give law enforcement a yard stick. john, is in pennsylvania, here, what do you think of the media coverage of ferguson. caller: i think we could have twice the amount of media coverage. the difference would be that they get into the root of things and not the sensational stuff, and burning. if they got back to the real reasons, why this has flared up, and, it does all over the country, is that, yeah, i agree with that new york times frustration after years and years and years of driving while black, of being black and stop

and frisk. the media should concentrate, they could do twice as much coverage, if they covered the correct things. host: another john. caller: thank god for c-span we get to voice our opinion and this is a very important thing. i think it's been years in the making. the thing that happened, that we noticed last night, on television, was the coming together of our occupy protestors with our black fellow americans, there were just as many white people, in the streets, other than ferguson protesting. just as many white americans, protesting this. in my town, we had a homeless man, lit up by the police, and shot dead. we had protests and other incidents and what we think is

that we have a nationwide problem, with police going right to their gun, right off the bat, as soon as they lose their temper, and yes, the media does conspire. and we have right wing radio station, and the police officer had a broken bone in his face. yesterday, they announced that he had a broken bone in his face, just before the verdict. and i called them and let them know that was not true. and then the pictures came out. this is what we're up against. everyone has their own reality and facts in the case. the actual truth and facts and what happened. what we get into a thing of how much policing we need. do you think it's justified for a police officer, with an

unarmed suspect to go to his gun? they all wear cameras. they all carry tasers, and this is what is we're coming to. a situation where, that camera is for your protection. because not every police officer that you meet, is going to be 100%. it's just a sad fact of, we have a lot of soldiers coming back, and they don't know when they're going to have a good or bad day. and i know people that have it. move onto fred. republican line. caller: yes, good morning. i believe this whole responsibility lies with the citizens of ferguson and, they are the won his that are allowed to live unsuch a calamity, ferguson, 67% black town, and

mismanaged by a police department which is 95% white. they don't vote, and participate and, they allow to live unwhat i call apartheid. this is rampant all over, and not all over california. they need to go out and change the systems. if ferguson had 60% black police department this would have been different. host: edwin, if the media presence was not so prevalen, the demonstrations, would have been less violence. the media coverage of what's going on. do you see the numbers there on the screen. this is from the 'new york times', it's from an article, on the front page, raonthe racial ,

virginia, independent line. what do you think about the media coverage.

caller: good morning, in some cases they're not directing their cameras on everything. they do a little bit more and the people and everything like that. i would like to say this. this young man, i have a question, why he wasn't tasered. here's the other think this young man had just left a place where he right backed a man, and threaten he, to beat him up, if he said anything about it. with that attitudes probably would have the gotten killed by his own people. i think, they should hold responsibility. jim says, riots make good t.v.,

carol says juan williams, is right, in calling the media per vaiers of riots. bruce, wisconsin democrat. caller: good morning, exthank you so much for this opportunity, i'm the geeser calling, and i would like to make 3 brief points. i'm old enough to remember, the terrible spring of 1968 when we got to watch, the death of martin luther king and bobby kennedy. on the night of king's death, bobby was in front of a huge audience, black people, and to them he had had to make the announcement of the king assassination, it brought forth from him one of the most profound statements, i think.

the whole media at that time froze. the riot riot proceeded. and we watched the nation burn. i like the idea of the so-called riot porch, i think that's a good description. but, the media still stepped behind, is catching up with the people, who know, really moving with great progress. once again, with great cause, the nation brought people to the streets, from one end of the other. one low cal had a few fires, and i want to say lastly, how much i admire the parents of this young man and, as i did the parents of martin, the great courage that they have brought to the definition of what it is to be an american and the courage that

they have shown with their statements. host: bruce in wisconsin, here's the front-page of the journal. republican. caller: i would like to point out that i, no matter what, the decision of the officer in ferguson, wisconsin to defend himself was justified. no matter how it comes out. he has a right to defend himself. no matter what is happening. whether his decision to use lethal force was justified or not. that's not for us to judge. it's for him to judge, in that moment. in the end, everything else

that, the race relations go onto matter, however, in our society, it was his right, to defend himself from what he perceived to believe, a lethal attack on his personal person. we'll leave it there. kevin. independent line. media coverage in ferguson? caller: i would hate to see what would happen if they were around, 200 years ago, i think fox news would have been on the side of the british. that's all i got to say about the matter. host: steven democrat, what do you think? caller: i think that a lot of people are very much disturbed, by the verdict, and, in that

we're seeing, an expressing of that. i agree with the president, there has been a lot of peaceful protests that are bringing attention to some of the greater issues, in that the media is ignoring those, and sensational rising some of the riots, that are occurring within ferguson. i think if the greater problem, with the media, and many issues. that's something that we should have grown to good spec. i don't think they can be blamed. richie, on our republican line. caller: yes. that's me. yes, the, i'll calling in reference to the gentleman that talked about the stop and frisk, i would put a turn style on every corner because, that's the only way you stop it.

these people, are, they think, they're not going to. that's not going to stop it. let me tell you what is not nice, going to the cemetery on a saturday morning, you have a flower, and, drop it on a casket, and, got somebody in there that you won't see no more. these people that want to carry guns, they won't do it. background checks, they're not worried about no background checks. thank you. host: john is in milwaukee. independent. caller: good morning, i sit here, and i listen to all of this, there's a point to this, that is obvious, from the human history, that, nobody wants to talk about, nobody wants to realize, but history has proven it, white people are inclined,

to steal, lie and murder. now, in this particular instance, when is the last time you know of a black cop shooting a white kid or any kid without provocation? think about it. host: serena. caller: hi, how are you? my comment is, i think, i don't condone the violence, i understand the violence. and i don't understand how you says that the guy, he put his hands up, don't shoot, if you got a gun, i'm not going to run and charge you, something has to be done. until they get justice, it will keep on going. seems like we take one step ahead and, two steps back. host: have you been watching it closely? caller: yes. host: do you think the media is covering it well?

caller: i do. they stopped burning up the city, because they still have to live there. host: ed. independent, good morning. caller: before i make my same time, i grew up in camden, new jersey, in the late 1960s, and a white kid, and i was the relentless victim, of the martins, and the browns at that time. so, you don't have anybody fooled here. i watched the media, constantly, over and over, waiting for the verdict. waiting for the verdict. the media did an excellent job stirring it up. if it bleeds it leads. like i said -- host: why do you say that you

were the victim of the martins, and browns. caller: they knew that, i was a white kid in a black neighborhood, and they knew they could get away with this. host: jim, republican. jim. caller: yes, good morning. how are you. host: good. caller: i just have two comments on what' what's going on with te black exoonty. i black community, in this country, is responding, to nothing less than being a prisoner of the government program the last 40 years, we have spent 22 plus trillion dollars, on trying to get these people out of poverty. they have brought it on themselves. and the fact of the matter is, the black family has crumbled, there's no fathers around, to

teach them respect, and they don't understand and respect police authority, and they don't go to school. and all they want to do is be thugs and criminals. we have a white cop who shot a blackman, defending himself. that's ail he was doing. i saw the testimony, the officer on television. this morning. i'm sick and tired of the press and i don't include you in this, mainstream press promoting this violence. we have business owners, that lost their businesses and dreams and, millions of dollars, all because of black thugs, and pubs, decided to riot, and start fires. over what? a dead 18 -year-old? are you kidding me? this country is falling apart

and, it's because of black community doesn't get their act together and, they have no fathers. host: this is harold, right across the mississippi river. democrat. caller: good morning. my question is about the media, they never seem to want to ask the questions, of the history of what, for instance, the prosecutor, this man, has been -- he sat on the several trials, where unarmed black people were killed, two men were killed in the car, and the excuse was given, that the driver of the car was about to assault some officers and much why kill the passenger? would you shoot up a whole bus full of children if the driver was running over a cop?

he was on the case where, a cop was shooting at a black teenage girl, and this is a girl, who was sitting on her porch. why isn't this history brought up? in st. louis, if a blackman was tied to a tree and, set on fire, when he begged people to shoot him and, they laughed. why aren't these things never talked about. it's a history doing it way back, and that's what is bringing things up. that police officer was at another district, because of the way they treated black people. host: have there been protests in east st. louis? no, because there hasn't been anything really has gone on. but there was a riot, in east st. louis, back in the 1920s.

when black people were set on the fire, in their houses. there's a history to these things. host: brad i love the media coverage, i think it's terrible, and i love it, because it shows the mentality of the media. i think this just guaranteed the election of a republican governor, between this it, and the immigration order, mr. obama just nat democrats lose another 10% of the white vote, thank you. host: margaret, republican line. caller: yes, i would like to say, my nephew is a policeman,

and i think the police, do an awesome job of taking care of citizens in this area. and, i think that policeman was doing his job, to the best of his ability and police pull you over, and they say put your hands on the steering wheel or put your hands up, and that's what they mean. you don't question their authority because they are the authority. if you want law and order you have to stand behind the placement. host: what do you think about the media coverage. caller: of ferguson? i think the media did an awesome job, and honestly, i saw the policeman, when they spued him, that should have been done before. i understand that there's things involved, that he could not have

been interviewed before, and i watched t. that gave me the conclusion, that he did his job, he was doing his job. i'll tell you, people better get an understanding of what it is like to be a policeman. you don't want towns without t. host: that's margaret. a couple of callers have referenced the fact that darren did a spew with "a.b.c. news." push him back, why yell at him to get back and, he pushed the door and just stared at me. he threw the first punch. yeah, left side of my face. some of the witnesses have said, they saw you trying to pull him not a car. that would be against every training. i don't know how many hit me, i know it was a barrage of

swinging and grabbing and pulling for 10 seconds. and i reached out my window to grab onto his forearm. i was going to try to move him back, and i felt the immense power that he had, it's like a five-year old, holding on to hulk hogan. very large, very powerful man. you're a pretty big guy. you tried to grab him and you feel that force. and as i'm holding him, i see him coming around, with his left handled, and it comes through the window, and, just a solid punch. are you figuring how do i get out of this. how do i survive? i keep my gun on my right hip. and i said get back or i'm going to shoot you, and he grabbed the top of my gun, and said you're too much of a.

[bleep] to shoot me. i could feel his hand trying to shoot me with my own gun and that's when i pulled the trigger for the first time. host: from 'the new york times'. host: that's the lead ed today torre he will, and here's the lead ed today torre he will in the washington times.

just a little bit from the washington times, this morning, per six up in the bronx, democrat. caller: first of all, let me say, no one, are to encourage violence. i sympathize with the brown family, my heart griefs for michael brown, but, let me say this, from way observed, no black people, have any rights in this place. i want to say i sympathize, with president barak obama, i love him. let me say this, in conclusion, if the republicans have their way, they will treat president barak obama the same way, than how wilson treated motorcycle call brown, like a dog. shooting him, and leaving his body for four-and-a-half hours in the street, even worse than a

dog. individuals versus been jailed for treating dogs the same way. michael brown has been treated worse. have a nice day. host: stewart, in virginia. independent line. what's your view? caller: good morning, my view is this, this is a prime example of why, here's the problem, the inner cities, there's no jobs and, there's no business, the reason for that, why would anyone want to move their business into the inner city? here's my point, you talk about the media coverage, they don't cover that aspect. and also, the only one that's benefit from this are the race

baiters, like referenal sharpton, have you ever seen him, in chicago? i mean, this was as tragedy, no doubt about that. but every weekend in chicago, five or six young blacks are killed. has he been up there? i don't think so. i haven't seen coverage of it. media coverage. they taught us the only good news is bad news and,ky had a detective, he passed away, and he said, the worst thing that you get a call on, is go downtown richmond, and there's been a homicide, it happened every weekend. have a good day. host: dan is calling in from missouri. where is that? caller: southern missouri.

please go ahead with your comment, and your home state. caller: as far as media coverage and, ferguson and everything, in missouri, the drug war, is a huge waist of time and money for our system, for our court system, and it causes a lot of racial profiling, and it causes a lot of agreed and murder, and i think, you can't live by your own rules, and it's the truth. it's one side that takes all the heat for that. as far as i think, as long as that war is still going on, there's always going to be profiling, and always going to be people running from the police. there's no job and, they're turning it into something

racial. i think it's just a shame. i think -- host: we'll leave it there, thank you dan. from the hill newspaper.

host: ruth, democrat. you're on the washington journal. caller: thank you very much. i've been trying to call in for a long time. since president barak obama has been elected, he has not had any good things, from congress or the senate. he's not evening been called president barak obama. there's been disrespect since this man has been put in office and, it trickles right on down. it's the worse racism, and i'm 71, and i grew up in lancing michigan. a police officer, carried his gun to mow the lawn, and when they talked to me, they came out to investigate him in the beginning, for being caught between houses and the then his wife said, he was going to come down, and try out to be a police officer, and send him down.

we need every goodman, he was fired after two years of putting up with him, motion his lawn with his gun, and trick or treatters, coming to the door, with his gun. don't tell me, that there isn't officers, who have that feeling. they need to train better and, understand where black people come from. it hasn't been that far back, since they've been picking cotton, and been hung from trees. host: that's ruth and, this is thomas. you're on. caller: how are you doing? i just want to make everybody aware, this is not just in missouri, this is in ohio also. because there's been a lot of racial profiling, and then you go to the store, and come out, and a lot of people from korea, and, people of color, have

business, and it hasn't been established, and we a riot. you know, in the alley, and they acquitted the police officer down here. still going on. this is a world wide. this is not only in missouri, this is as problem. police officers, overwhelm themselves, and just kill at will. wore all targets for the police officers. i don't fault them because as soon as they can do that, they can shoot you, and it's nothing done. this is just, president barak obama said it's not his problem to worry about ferguson, what do a president do? what do we need him for in he would rather do things for china, and mexico, and people here, he lose it. i think, the republicans need to

take over, and get the, you know, get the country back on track, there's far too many people crying out for help and he's not answering half the things he needs do. host: helen, republican. caller: i just want to say, i don't believe that policeman, he had 3 months to make up that story. i have seen it happen over and over again. they don't have a gun, and they thought they add this or that. and they're all lies. for me, it's a killing. it's horrible, some young people, all blacks are not like that. like white people want to say, and i feel it, and i have experienced it, up in new york, and i feel it, and i think it's terrible for the people, that

say the things, that they are saying about the young blacks. they're like lost. to me, it's a modern lynching, you catch these things, and just give them a reason to do something to them. and then they try, like in new york, this guy was shot, walk to go his car, and accident? i want to know what kind of accident. i listened to that guy, the policeman. host: i'm going to -- we'll move onto gary. yes, sir. am i on. host: wore listening sir. caller: i like to follow along with that lady just on. this guy is a trained police officer. he had had to take thousands of

target shots, and they had to be in a certain way. there is testimony, is that this man, runs, 300 pounds and, he run, maybe 20 feet, and starts making these moves, and this trained police officer, didn't hit him center mass, or stop, i don't believe that. if that man, i got up, and marked off 20 feet. i could not miss from here. and he shot what he was doing, he was running with those first six shots, and a couple knicked him here and there. i have done this before. host: where -- what's your conclusion. caller: in the eye, and in the top of the head. he said he aimed at his head and took him out. that's what i want to say.

host: is ruth tweets in. host: sylvia.

caller: i really enjoy c-span, and i'm glad that i have been eligible to get through to a show. there are topics that lay on my heart. i really want to speak out. i have something to say, pertaining to it. our country has to heal, we are divided in so many area, here in oklahoma, if you -- no matter what color you are, if you break the law, you will be charged. the issue on the ferguson, that is spread like wildfire, as a trend setter, i stand up for our police department, because they are there to protect and to serve. and also, we have meetings and

our officers work with community leaders. homeowners' association meetings, and find out the new crime that comes into our areas. doesn't matter what state or country or city that you live in. but it is time, this is another wakeup call. i do believe, that it is time to heal. it's been just divided, and everything is weighed down on that officer. i have told individuals when i have been invited to meetings, doesn't matter where they're at, and i rallied with them about keeping their jobs. and so they can have better tools to work with the community, and what have you. and thee been planning, and, word has been thrown out there, oh, don't trust that officer or this person.

and this person. and this is so -- so wrong. i don't like it. host: thank you for calling it. canton, ohio. caller: hello, the media coverage, in ferguson has really been race baited. they have only highlighted the african-americans, tearing up the city, and overturning cars and, there are citizens who are in prayer, and trying to rebill their city. why isn't the media focused on those people. and i've been lucky enough, the epic story of race and the media. they will highlight on them doing those things and, that's be destructive. it puts police officers, in a horrible position, because they see this image of black people

tearing up things and, when they go someplace, they're going to be apprehensive. we do love police officers, and reach out to them. but we as a community, we have to rally around our police officers and, they have to reach out to the community as well. host: what was the name of that book? news for all the people, the epic story of race and the american media. it's a excellence book. host: thank you. gloria. caller: yes. i would like to say that, the way to solve the problem with the police, and the people is thatoversing a, when they the police walking the beat, it was so nice, you could see two police come down and,

stop and talk to everybody. and ask how they're doing and, also, that's a good way that you can find out about crime. if you're in the neighborhood. police are speeding through the neighborhood, and people just don't know each other, and not getting to know each other. put them back on the beat. thank you. host: ruth, that's the opening

of the column this morning, in the washington post. troy, is in nashville, michigan, on our independent line. caller: hi. i just want to say one thing, the root of the whole deal, you got to get down to it, 7 letters, respect. the media needs to respect. the people need to learn respect. that's all i got to the say. host: dan, in youngstown ohio, republican. caller: yes, i think people need to calm down, it's been widely reported that there were black witnesses that testified before the grand jury, they said, that this man, brown, rushed at the cop. what is the police supposed to

do? justice for michael brown, this cop has take right to defend himself. also, i question the people that the black community rallies around, this guy was a thug, and known on video, robbing a store. they protested, the other one, that was beaten, rodney king and, this guy had a long record, he took the cops off, in a police chase. and when the police pulled him over, pull over. if you follow their commands, you won't get killed. not to go out and demonstrate against a police action that was justified. thank you. host: very quickly a couple of news articles.

you can find that, and, withdraws her name for the top post. this is michele, she has withdrawn her name as has senator jack reed of rhode island, and tax deal is near, the president threatens veto negotiates with just a little

bit from that article. so, we have 3 segments coming up, we'll be talking with the former head of the ohio and safety and we'll fact the former deputy director of the national security agency, about privacy and the n.s.a., and finally, we're going to talk about mental health and the armed services. those 3 segments are coming up. yesterday, senate to the schumer spoke about the democrats and the mid term elections and here's his assessment. we must convince americans, that government can be on their side, and not just a tool of special interest. we must reenergize our vision

boy making a forceful case when democrats will govern again, not captive to the powerful. this message has an element of populism. democratic populism recognizes that the powerful have much more influence over government, and strong actions must be taken to curb that influence, that government can really represent the average person. second, and even more are important, we must illustrate that, government can provide solutions by delineating programs, would improve lives and incomes. they must resonate with the middle class, so voters believe they will be effective, which means, they must work

politically. and also be joined, by a theme, so that people don't see specific democratic programs as disjointed pieces but parts as a whole. and we must convince the middle class, that the only way, is embrace a strong and effective government. not running from it. so here should be our packet with the middle class. by using government, in a direct and focused way, we will provide a shield against large forces that, have worked against middle class families, so, they have a better job and, more money in their pockets. we'll have an act tough government that gives the middle class the tools, to make their lives better, we'll restore a strong, and stable economic foundation for middle class so they can stop worrying about getting by and, start thinking about getting ahead. our message must be, we will

help get you moving forward again so you'll be better off at any years from now, and your kids' liveses will be better than yours. now, this is more than just a political any, we have a strong policy, imperative to do this t. the nation is on the edge of a crisis. washington 4 nall continues.

unfortunately with increased travel days, we see increased crashes and increased numbers of people being hurt, and fatalities as well. it is always one of these things where nhtsa and state traffic enforcement agencies are taking sure people are driving safely, attentive, alert, aware, not being impaired, wearing your belts. get there safely. interact does nhtsa with the department of transportation? modal nhtsa is a operation within the department of transportation. there are times. nhtsa, the national highway

transportation safety administration is one of those modes. host: how much do we spend on infrastructure every year in the united states on a federal level? level,on a federal basically, it is reauthorized every six years if the process works and you are thinking about 50 billion dollars to $70 billion a year. gas taxnded by revenues, which is a user fee -- people using the roads should be the ones paying for upkeep. the one thing -- a highway --ffic safety works on national highway traffic safety efficiency. fuel the bad thing is if you are

taxing a user fee by gasoline, there is less revenue going into the highway trust fund, which means we have less funds to do it, so the trust fund is running a deficit. that means you have to fill it up with other taxpayer dollars. the one thing congress needs to do is address this issue so we can continue to build infrastructure. would you like to see congress address this issue? guest: there are a number of ways to do it. andof them have pluses minuses. gasoline is a logical thing, but you are using less gas. you have electric vehicles. another way is find a way to tax the miles traveled, or the vehicles miles traveled and that is more controversial because people would have to be tracked and people are careful about privacy. that is not a popular option.

there are other ways to do it. those are the most logical intersections. it is an issue we have to address one way or another. the rest of the world has modeled what we have done in terms of highway safety and infrastructure and other countries have surpassed us. in order for us to be an economic power, we have to address infrastructure. host: why does it take so long to build highway? guest: there are a number of issues, environmental issues, which are very important, and also making sure they are safe -- the materials will hold up and the design of the road comports to its usage. bottom line being we are a country that is very wealthy,

away also value safety and environmental protection. all of those things mean people weigh in and it takes time to do it. i know that the work done by the federal highway administration, another one of the parts of the department transportation, another mode, if you will, their leadership has done a really good job on a program called every day counts where you limit the bureaucracy that impacts the time it takes to build a road. host: i do not know how long you have been here in the washington area, but many of us have been here 10, 20 years, and nothing has changed on i-95. [laughter] it has just gotten worse. what is the solution? it is a multi variable -- to use another washington world -- word, it is a multi-variable

problem. there are a lot of reasons it takes time to improve a road. build your way out of traffic congestion. you cannot make roads wider and wider because you make roads better, people move into the area because the roads are better, and there are more people on the roads. it is kind of a constant hamster wheel. hamster we have to incentivize people to do different things to travel, which is using public transit, getting people to move into urban areas is one suggestion. livable communities, if you will. the more people that live further out, the more congested the road gets. to ultimately alleviate congestion, you have to get people off of the roads to a certain degree, and that is hard. more people are doing that, more people are moving closer in

because of that, but if you make i-95 30 lanes wide, -- lanes wide you will still get congestion. host: david strickland served with the national highway traffic safety administration. a tweet lso send @c-spanwj. has beene things nhtsa involved in recently is the recall of airbags. have the authority to recall and prohibit these from being installed into cars? yes, they do. one of the primary missions is defect investigation and recall authority, part of the national

transportation safety act passed in 1970. the issue is difficult. in the united states we allow the cars and build certify that they comply with all of the safety standards. they do that. nhtsa's job is to make sure they go out and test vehicles to make sure they comply with standards. that is the first way to meet the standards. second, even when you meet the standards, you could still have problems. the great thing about american cars, they are on the road for an average of 11 years, and things happen -- defects happen, problems happened. nhtsa's job is to investigate wendy's problems arise -- investigate when these problems arise and then fuel the recalls.

if the automaker refuses, nhtsa has the ability to force the automaker to recall a problem. host: would this be a situation where you would work with japanese counterparts since these are manufactured in japan? global system in terms of automotive manufacturing. nationally,reports arepe, all over the world, part of its data system. the decisions are independent, but investigations and things of that nature is shared between other countries. from thomas's calling in north carolina -- thomas is calling in from north carolina. please go ahead with your question and comment. caller: i was wondering about accountability -- once money is

collected for rebuilding a bridge, where does that go -- if it is federal money, where does it go, and who is accountable for it? how do they know after it is collected that it will be dispersed, and who does the job? put out to bid? question, and i am the triad area. nice to talk to you. there is federal and there is a state share. states have to contribute to the money that goes to building a road. the accountability is on the part of the federal government and the states to make sure the money is spent properly. you have auditors, things of peopleture to make sure

on a perpetuating waste, fraud, or abuse. let along with that, ultimately, it comes down to -- the road building is done by a contractor. the state and the federal government will select a particular contractor and the sub-contractors to execute the job of building the road in. you have folks from the state and federal government to make sure that that work is done properly. wear on highways is caused by corporate transportation -- do big businesses help pay for maintenance? guest: that goes to the question of a user fee. harder on roads than a passenger vehicle because they are heavier. you want to align the cost of people that use the road and contribute to its wear and tear. that is why i mentioned a gas tax being a user fee.

on thee impact you have road, the more you should pay to fix it. road users that have bigger trucks, longer distances have bigger impacts than others. host: how big is the fee that trucks have to pay? guest: it is based on the gas tax, which is three or four cents a gallon. each state has a gas tax as well. that varies. it is the reason why in some states you can see a wide variety of gasoline prices. states it is the fees and localities assess on gasoline. gasoline washington, d.c., is probably much more expensive than it is in montana. host: john is in brooklyn.

caller: good morning, and thank you for taking my call. i live in the new york city area and i travel through the holland, lincoln, the verizon a bridge tunnel, the new jersey turnpike to go to philadelphia and washington, and d.c., and i d.c.,iate -- washington, and i appreciate the project. my question is how does the toll system going through the roof complement or supplement the gas tax for construction projects moving forward in the future? guest: it is a wonderful isstion, and tolling controversial in the way the federal government would like to have more tolling be an option -building.ad as time goes on and the value of money increases or decreases because of inflation or

deflation, you will see, over time, tolls go up. because of the infrastructure of the state's road-building leadership in terms of how much is used for upkeep and do they use it for other purposes. that can change state to state. i am a person that has an easy pass and i use the i-5 core door a lot. iran the one i was in college in them -- i remember when i was in college in the mid-1980's, making that drive, and it has probably doubled and cost. it is frustrating about the pricing. -- in cost. it is frustrating about the pricing. host: i saw an article about the opening of the verrazano bridge,

it was expensive but the fees were supposed to go away. host: once you have -- guest: once you have a steady stream of revenue you are dependent on, it is hard to become an dependent on it. that promise was broken including -- for number of factors including the upkeep was more than anticipated. factors, a cost that while ultimately, people were upset about it, people got used to it and people pay for it. breaking the promise was painful in the beginning. people are angry for a short period of time, and then it becomes the cost of doing business. that is the unfortunate thing about the reality of politics in america. host: jeremy is right here in washington, d c,

-- washington, d.c. can you confirm my belief that diesel fuel taxes are significantly higher than gas taxes because it is designed trucks and how that greatly discourages the adoption of diesel fuel for passenger cars, like in europe. guest: diesel fuel is more expensive because of the connection. engines are more powerful. they are helping to correct that to make sure that truck traffic is paying their fair share. the differential in diesel fuel and diesel technology is one aspect is to why americans have been slow to adopt diesel

technologies. another aspect, the cost difference -- other than the cost difference, which has an impact, for those old enough remember old diesel engines that exhaust and out they smelled horrible and the engines ran loud and all of these things. if you go to a dealership of any of the manufacturers that offer diesel engines today, you will find it is a smooth, refined ride. it is great on gasoline. diesel engines go much further on fuel than regular gasoline. as a former head of auto safety and automotive technology, take a look at diesel. it is a great option. david strickland is former administrator of the national

highway traffic safety administration, and now he is working at reasonable, which is what? >> it is a law firm that works across a number of issues in washington dc and several issues around the country. of -- on automate automotive policy and security. the one thing about cars is they are getting smarter, and they are getting safer. they are collecting information about diagnostics, even some of the things you do within the vehicle and the services you use . a really important aspect of the future of automotive policy and safety is making sure automakers data.are of people's one of the things i was fortunate to work on, the association of global -- with

the association of global was to work on auto principles to make sure every auto company protects your data in the right way. we encourage people to get the safety technologies and make sure there is not an appropriate information collected by the car. if you happen to be traveling and would like to dial in, and have a hands-free device, please dial in to be traveling, let us know what it is like. you talked about the technical issues with cars, and they have techy become, kind of, a

device. with this become a privacy issue down the road such as we are phone with e-mail and records like with the nsa, which is our next topic this morning? say computers and cars are combined. the sensors is a mess. there is more code in your regular everyday vehicle on the and than there is in airplane now, which is a scary thought, but it is true. privacy is not a future issue. it is a now issue. it is a thing called telematics. when you have a satellite radio or an internet connection that allows you to get information about finding a local restaurant -- it gets you directions, or

something that allows you to make a movie reservations -- all of that is collecting information. one of the things you have to ,ake sure of is the information when collected, does not get looked at, breached, and the people collecting information does not use it inappropriately. they are not giving it to an , so if you go to starbucks every day you do not pete's get ads from coffee on your dashboard. at the sameost: time, what about the release of that information -- your car traveled to these 15 locations. will that information be available to law enforcement, the nsa, etc.? the principles the

automakers agreed to is they will not release information without a court order. this is not a situation where the car will be aware of what where you are up you have to follow the principles -- you are. you have to follow the principles of search and seizure. is,dy wants a car, which frankly, your second most endeared purchase beside your whereto be something people could easily access and figure out what you are doing. it is an important principle. a native of atlanta. law degree at harvard. jerry. you are on with david strickland. yes, i was calling about

the idea of a gas tax being a user fee, and people that drive should have to be paying for the roads and stuff, but in reality, everyone is using the roads. everyone that buys a loaf of bread is dependent on the road for the trucks to bring the groceries to the story, so people that do not drive are benefiting just as much as people that drive. you are absolutely right. when we talk about a user fee, part of the cost of the loaf of bread -- all of the materials, the flower, the seasoning, it has to be brought to the banker, shipped out, delivered to a distribution point, and then delivered to a store. that cost is built into

everything we buy -- i mean, everything we buy. you pass along that gas -- that tax or that fee throughout the system. when we talk about a user fee, the way you can figure it out is the actual vehicle riding on the road and how it impacts the road. you are absolutely right. everybody benefits from the road, and we all do pay for the road. from also great to hear someone in wheeling, west virginia. i worked with jay rockefeller in may last year -- in my last year. laura tweets and washington to philadelphia. likestill an individual, i this guy -- as you enter chicago, tolls everywhere, it costs my stepdaughter $12 to get to work.

tony. go ahead. caller: i have a question for mr. strickland and then i have a follow-up. the first question is how much is a barrel of oil? in fact, i will give you my follow-up. gas is a certain amount of money, a barrel of oil, why is it that city gas stations, each one has a different price for fuel? one might sell gas at $3.10. down the road, someone might sell gas for $2.99. what is the point, and the reasoning behind that. -- behind that? host: is that your area of expertise? it is. when i was a senate staffer and fuelnhtsa i worked on economy standards and figure not

how to improve fuel economy. a barrel of oil could be $60, depending onrrel world issues, geopolitical issues, wars. there is variation and all of that directly impacts the cost. your question is why do you have differences in prices in gas stations that might be right next to each other. the interesting thing about fuel, gasoline, pricing, you actually have to get enough money to buy your next gallon of fuel that you put into the big, underground tank. what happens is when gasoline stations have to bid or think about it, they price out not only for running the operation, more for what they think -- but for what they think the future cost is and that might very because of the refinery they get it from, the location, up to

profit differentiations between gas stations. you have gas station strickland down the street that charges $3.99, gas station peters that charges $4.02. peters might charge mode -- more because he's to get his next load and it cost him more. costs him more. that is the variation. host: dale in ohio. caller: good morning, mr. strickland, and c-span. guest: good morning. trip recently a tempe,eveland, ohio, to arizona. i drove into misery, the snowstorm -- missouri, the

snowstorm. there is not a truck driver on the road i would allow to have a drivers license because we were miles an hour30 for 100 miles and i guarantee you the trucks never slowed down. we ran into 25 accidents caused by semi's because they refused and drive at a safe speed. got into oklahoma city, the next morning, got up, started driving into the panhandle of texas, new mexico, and every vehicle that was wrecked on the side of the road was called by a semi- driver. this is a safety factor. there is no reason for them not to control themselves because of their urging to get there in a hurry -- i have to make the paycheck. nobody's life is worth the

dollar they put in their wallet. host: we got the point. mr. strickland? guest: truck safety is a huge issue. in the united states we lose approximately 33,000 people a year to traffic crashes. 33,000. frankly, losing anyone to a traffic crash is heartbreaking, and unfortunately, working in traffic safety for a number of years have met the families of those that have been impacted by a crash. truck safety is a very important issue, so important it has its own agency that deals with truck safety, andriver making sure the drivers are properly licensed to do the right thing. they work very hard in conjunction with state enforcement officials to make sure that trucks are inspected, following the rules of the road, and doing the right thing. road, folks that

should be doing the right thing every day, not speeding, making sure you are not drunk, and people make mistakes, bad decisions. truck drivers do, too, but truck safety has gotten much at her over the years. i am with it -- better over the years. i am with you. i have been on the long road with very aggressive driving by trucks and it is scary. we all have to make sure you do not see what you are seeing on the road. it has gotten better, but he could always be better. host: are the standards for letting a cdl pretty -- a cd pretty strict? guest: they are pretty strict, but getting the license and then

isping the standards different. when everyone was 16, you did everything right, and then you felt a little freer. lucy is in tennessee. caller: hi, there. host: good morning. please go ahead. caller: i am a few comments. man has taken god out of every issue. lucy, we appreciate your comment. we will let it stand. david strickland, a couple of tweets -- what is nhtsa's of driverless vehicles, and are taxpayer-funded infrastructure changes necessary for their broad use? guest: that is a fantastic question. , as an agency, and one of

the great things in my tenure with the agency, it was really the beginning of the driverless era in terms of people paying attention and the research to bring it to life. the agency is excited about the potential of driverless vehicles. one of the issues in reducing traffic crashes is driver error. in 90% of crashes there is an element of human error behind the crash. if we have a vehicle that could help intervene from preventing the crash from happening, think about the number of the thousands of lives we could save. is excited about the prospect of driverless vehicles, but we have a long way to go, and the manufacturers are working hard to make sure they will be safe, how they will be implemented, and making sure they operate properly. the research going on --nhtsa

and the state supports that research and the state of california is allowing testing on the roads and even some operation -- the day is coming when we will have the drive up i -95, where the vehicle will manage the drive for you. isis a great area and nhtsa excited. host: what it would take to implement -- will it take more taxes? guest: right now the vehicles being designed by manufacturers and even nontraditional manufacturers like google, they are presuming no changes in infrastructure. the vehicle can see the road through sensors and all of the radar. they will be able to read the road because road conditions change. if the infrastructure could something thee is

federal government is investing -- investing in -- vehicle to communication. have a car, regardless of make or model, could send a safety signal to each other. it would say hi, david ran a red light. do not approach the intersection. this is something nhtsa is working on and hopefully they will release rules. is one area where the government could help. if the infrastructure is embedded with comedic asian systems to support driverless vehicles, we have a wonderful -- infrastructurehe to support driverless vehicles, we have a wonderful opportunity. host: we want to finish with this tweet because we have a big trucker audience. cents contrary to the

ohio caller, i drove 120,000 miles a year in seven states 1994, and truckers were the best drivers on the road. want to get the different point of use. host: absolutely. --guest: absolutely. david strickland, former administrator of nhtsa, now with venable. you are. -- thank you. colonel cedric layton will talk about the national security aency and privacy issues in minute, and after that will talk about mental health and the armed services. we will be right back with our next guest. ♪

week,s thanksgiving c-span is featuring interviews with retiree members of congress. watch tonight through thursday at 8:00 p.m. eastern. back asnot want to look much look forward to the next couple of months and in the next couple of months are a couple of things i would like to do. one is to get my defense authorization bill passed. this is an annual effort, a major effort involving large amounts of staff. i also want to finish up some work on the permanent subcommittee on investigations looking at some gimmicks that are used to avoid taxes.

>> i have been a member of congress for 34 years, and to -- if i was aat manager for a baseball or a football team and i was 34-1, i would be in the hall of fame. it does not bother me. i was not set on going, but i 18 cochairman that were supporting me and wanted me to run. i did. >> on thursday, thanksgiving day, a tour of various native american tribes at 10:00 a.m. eastern following "washington journal. call then attend the groundbreaking of the new diplomacy center in washington. justicesreme court clarence thomas, samuel alito, sotomayor.

go to c-span.org for the complete schedule. host: now joining us is colonel cedric layton, former training deputy director of the national security agency. what is it that you did at the nsa? to run thelped military portion of training for the national security agency. i made sure the workforce on the military side was properly trained in all of the different disciplines nsa requires to carry out its mission -- including people like linguists, cyberonic specialists security specialists, and a gamut on the analytical side. it was interesting and rewarding. has been in the news for several years now, and it continues to be. what kind of collection -- what

kind of data collection can the nsa do today legally? legally, the basic job is to collect foreign intelligence. there are other agencies that collect foreign intelligence in the u.s. government, but the primary purpose of the nsa is to collect signals intelligence -- that means radio communications, a munitions in the electromagnetic spectrum, to put it in technical terms. it was born in the cold war and it was designed to collect intelligence information that appeared in radio waves, that appeared within the electromagnetic spectrum. with the advent of the computer age, that mission has wrought and into a cyber mission as well. broadenedmeans -- has into a cyber mission as well. it has gottens is

into the computer world, which means nsa has a multifaceted collection mission and a mission to secure the communications of andunited states government its affiliates, basically, in terms of providing typographic support, making the codes used to secure communications, and it also makes sure that our communications are not intercepted and broken by foreign powers. job.hat is basically nsa's ,ost: colonel cedric leighton if we were to pick up the phone and dial syria right now, with the nsa be aware of the call -- would be nsa be aware of the call? guest: not necessarily. usually they are looking for discrete numbers that have already been targeted. they will go through a specific

process not to waste their time with phone calls that do not matter. now, given the fact that it is syria, there might be a look at different aspects of that call, not by law they are not allowed to intercept u.s. persons and get into the content of that conversation. they might be collecting metadata at the far end -- what syrian phone number was called, what the phone number is intentionally connected to -- that kind of analysis. but, that usually requires a court order to do that. it also is one of those areas where the way in which the collection apparatus works, you are looking at very specific entities in syria. if somebody is calling their grandmother, no big deal. if somebody is calling the presidential palace in damascus, different story. that is the kind of thing that they look at.

there are certain areas that are targeted, certain areas that are not. host: but they would be aware of it, correct? guest: not necessarily. host: ok. if we were to take this computer and search for al qaeda, jihad, type it into the computer in a search engine, with the nsa be aware of that? guest: no. generally speaking, not. the reason is anyone could type it -- the sheer volume of people typing in the phrase isis -- i have done it number of times myself. the fact that you are looking at isis or other terrorist organizations does not necessarily mean you are going to be a member of that group. what they are looking for requires a degree of intent, and mission should not be

confused with the mission of law enforcement entities like the fbi. the fbi has a domestic surveillance program that is generally covered under section 215 of the patriot act, and what it a sickly does is -- what it basically does is it allows the fbi to look at the foreign connections of domestic people who may, possibly, have the intent to do harm to the united states. so, that is basically the difference. if somebody is expecting a knock on the door, it is going to come nsa an fbi person, not an person if they are doing something that leads to a connection, such as financing terrorism, a terrorist organization, or something like that. that, buty help with there is a long process they have to go through in order for that to work properly. they are not going to be doing something that is a rogue collection effort.

everything they do has been vetted by the folks on capitol hill, by the white house, and it has been, basically, decided based on law and precedent before they conduct those operations. law enforcement, that is the fbi's area. nsa is an intelligence entity. metadata much of the that is collected by the nsa -- how much is helpful? guest: there have been estimates. there was an estimate where a fairly sizable percentage of the debtor was somewhat useful in datang people -- of the was somewhat useful in helping people attain knowledge of what the terrorists were up to. it is almost like a cop on the beat. the virtual worlds and the real

,orld's, the physical worlds they are becoming very intertwined. in order for us to have an understanding of what is going on, we, as the u.s. government or the u.s. nation, we need to have an understanding of what the internet is actually doing -- what is actually being said out there. when that happens, it is similar doingt a cop on a beat is in a town where they are walking down the street. ,hey are not going after anyone per se, but they are making sure public safety is assured and that is generally accepted in american law-enforcement. it is somewhat analogous to an intelligence perspective -- find what is normal to determine what is abnormal. that is how these structures work and what they are designed to do. ofterms of the percentage what has been effective, my personal view is the vacuum cleaner approach is not

necessarily the most effective. there is a part of the collection that is required so that you know what is actually normal, but there is another part that has to be targeted specifically against those entities that mean to do you harm. if you are looking for someone that is going to be dangerous to you or is going to coordinate an attack, potentially, or do something like that -- there is a different set of signatures associated with a target like that compared to a person who is engaged in more or less normal commercial transactions or social conversations. the normal ones are the ones the nsa, in essence, puts to the wayside, does not prosecute in terms of looking inside the debtor or the nature of the phone call. the metadata is usefully -- inside the data or the nature of the phone call. the metadata is useful in that it allows you to get to the state of affairs and determine

what is normal and abnormal. host: how much consideration is given to privacy -- individuals privacy? guest: an extensive amount of consideration, and having worked the26 years, i can tell you training for nsa civilians and military personnel has always been very expensive when it comes to not only the privacy act, but also the rights of americans under the fourth amendment of the constitution. everyone has to undergo training that is done not an annual basis, and sometimes it is even more frequent than that of those people that are engaged in programs that have been talked about after the snowden revelations, the prism program, for example, go under training for what they can and cannot do with things that they could possibly say. the rules have changed.

in the old days, you could not keep anything longer than six months. now it is a five-year period, and there is a debate to be had on how long is necessary to keep data of this kind, but the old rules apply basically to radio communications. as new rules apply to radio well as internet data. that is where the difference comes in, and sometimes it takes longer to establish connections than the initial six-month period. host: can you share with us a success story of nsa data collection? share a direct success story, but there have talked aboutances in congressional testimony that point to certain elements -- there were several terrorist plots that took place in the u.s.. wasof them that was cited where the person was trying to set off a bomb in times square.

a lot of people say it was actually a person that thatcally saw the van called the tape into the police. would it really means is there tip intocations tip -- the police. what it really means is there were indications. it shows that every single facet of american society, including government, and people on the street, need to work together to prevent terrorist attacks. but, having said that, that type sometimesst action will not show up in normal intelligence traffic because you are talking about the so-called lone wolf. in this particular situation, there were some indications within the intelligence community that something might potentially be happening, also within the law enforcement community, but there were not

sufficient indications to say that is the van, that is the person, go get him. there are other cases where they have had much more concrete evidence where they would say ok, that is the person, we are going to arrest that individual. there have been several situations like that. there have been several where you have had a much more robust indications system between the intelligent -- intelligence world and law enforcement world and many of those cases are in the process of being adjudicated or coming to trial. there are a lot of different aspects. it has been somewhat effective, but not as efficient as i would like from an intelligence-gathering perspective. host: colonel cedric leighton former deputy training director of the national security agency. the numbers are on the screen.

let's take some calls. richard is in philadelphia. caller: the question that comes to mind is the technology ,evelopment that the nsa has how the dataering -- how is the data collection infrastructure for the nsa compared to commercial, if the commercial at the same level? host: thank you, richard. guest: question. i guess that is an excellent question. -- that is an excellent question. intelligence capabilities, that is eclipsed by social media companies that

at collecting data. an accurate it is very robust individuals from a series -- from him to is a psychotherapist that safeguard individuals from seizures that safeguard. this is the -- , so to him not have

requirement. the lions have a record of it because technology -- the lines are blurring quite a bit. itause of that, i would say is very important for the technological developments to be done in such a way that they are done with the idea that americans privacy needs to be protected at every stage. it is very easy to engage in identity theft right now. one of the key things that could help protect us against that is the very idea that people who are using personal data, whether they belong to private industry or the government, need to have, by law, in my opinion, extensive

training in this area. developers areal such that it requires a change in the legal framework and further safeguards for americans of every stripe in this case. russ is calling in from san diego. .aller: good morning, colonel my question is where you are in terms of the executive branch -- you have all of this power to ,iew all of the communications but you fall underneath the president, no matter who it is. for instance, there were some issues with monitoring of the senate and the congress, and i am sure the supreme court -- i never read that, though. with that type of power, who watches over you, and if you were to see the executive branch do something -- making a deal with terrorists -- if we are fighting isis, and then they are giving them arms -- i am not

saying that is happening -- it seems to me the nsa should be independent. it gives the president way too much power, whoever that might be, republican, democrat, green party, communist, whatever. we got the point. thank you. guest: that is an interesting point. let me tell you where nsa lies within the executive branch, you are right, it is ultimately responsible to the president. it is part of the department of defense. it it is designed to support troops engaged in combat operations or in preparation for combat operations. the nsa that means is is actually a department of defense agency. it does belong to the dod, but it is also a member of the intelligence community. it does give the executive branch a lot of power. what you were referring to when

it comes to the senate and the alleged collection of e-mail data on the senate select committee on intelligence, that was done, allegedly, by the central intelligence agency, and apparently that is something that goes way beyond what the and what the is cia should have lawfully been doing. so, they're clearly need to be watchdogs over the intelligence agencies to make sure that abuses of any type do not happen. the way it should work is that congress is supposed to exercise that function -- that oversight function. now, in point of fact, when you see things like that happening, where senator feinstein from california made specific efforts about the cia's against one of her committees, that really borders on a transgression of the separation of powers between the

legislative and executive branch. that, in essence, is unacceptable conduct. certainly in her view it is, and i would share that view. the way it needs to be done is the type of oversight you are looking for needs to be exercised by the legislative branch. the legislative branch has not always exercised the type of oversight that you would expect it to do, sometimes because they feel very comfortable with the people they are working with at these agencies, but also because, in many cases, as a trend, they have generally seated a lot of their authority to the executive branch, and that is a process that has gone . ifor, basically, decades we wanted to change that as a nation, we have to make sure our representatives understand that is what we want, and that is what we need, and also the court system is supposed to exercise authority. to fisa courts were designed

serve a watchdog function over the higher-level law enforcement agencies. int is the kind of mechanism place. sometimes the mechanisms to not work to the extent that they were intended to, and that is where oversight and all of the different controlling factors that the constitution envisions should be brought to bear, and that is where we, as a people need to take a look at how we do this and make sure intelligence agencies protect us but do not overstepped their bounds. it is congress actively involved in overseeing the nsa --is congress actively involved in overseeing the nsa? at what level -- would you respond? guest: absolutely. there is nothing more important than responding to a congressional request. usually it would come through

committee on intelligence. anytime there is a congressional inquiry of whatever type. mundanes it involves issues, sometimes serious issues, but anytime there is a congressional request, there is a whole office at nsa that deals with nothing but congressional issues. it other part of it is extends not only to nsa itself, but also into the military services. so, any time the air force, the army, the marine corps, the navy, get any type of congressional inquiry, they have a specific division within their services that handles those inquiries. if it is a dod level, the pentagon has that function as well as. congressional requests, interests, they are taken seriously at the working level, and it is one of the most important things we have. as the air force

liaison for intelligence matters to congress within the air force's intelligence directorate. i did work with congress and any time a staffer called, we basically jumped. host: the next call for colonel cedric leighton comes from california. caller: i serve 10 years in the with therps and worked government. in the summer of 2001 i read a lot of articles and basically nine/11 -- 9/11 and i >> anything you want to respond to? >> i think 9/11 was such a tragic incident that i don't think from what i have seen and having lived through that

,rocess within the military that is not something that was done by the administration. i don't think any american administration would do that and in the country created the patriot act through the representatives and others that offer that they were responding to a threat that they felt was real. ofterms of the invasion afghanistan where it was seen as for al qaedarnment and the connection between the al qaeda was one of a symbiotic relationship and as result of that i think the united states felt justified in fact members of old major political parties felt the need to go in and do something. we went into that country in 2001 as a response.

iraq is a bit of the more complicated arena and the basic theory was again supported by major relevance from both , and saddam hussein was not as far as we can tell connected to al qaeda directly but there were a lot of suspicions that he was so a lot of that had to be investigated. should it have been done the way that it was? probably not but we had a situation where we went in there because we felt the need to do so and there were indications that he was developing some things in a way that would have adversely affected the godel -- gulf states such as saudi arabia and the united arab emirates so there was a feeling that saddam hussein was a pariah that needed to go. of that is once you eliminate some me like that you and up getting rid of what amounted to a bizarre

stabilizing force in the region so we are now living with the consequences of that and that is where we have to make sure that when we go into places like this we do so as efficiently as we can with the best information that is out there. >> frank is in new york. you cannot tell everybody the truth because we have to protect ourselves and that's the way it is. we have democracy that leads everybody in this world. the world is a big place but when something goes down it is a small place because you find that person, you did not know five people before. you guys do it right all the time, you are just doing your best. there's only so much you can do. you know the bad guys are out

there and you're not going to let the same thing like world war two go on. , a enough genocide in enough with the bad people. i think we are doing well and i have friends in the military and i what to a military school when i was a kid and i was going go to rotc but went to construction and a lot of my friends went right to rotc and they jumped into the stuff that you are doing and they are doing well. there paid well and they're smart urine -- smart. you guys are no different than me, i am a worker and i work for myself. else, i working for myself but i do contracting and work in restaurants. a lot of the restaurants i am doing now, 80% of them are immigrants. people from another country running a restaurant trying to be nice to the white person and hoping that their life here

becomes fluent. -- see it in a restaurant you're getting a little off-topic there we are talking that the data collection process, anything you want to respond to? i appreciate his comments about the quality of the work that a lot of people do and some of my former colleagues are truly the best of the best and you are pointing to a very important area in that the quality of the personnel in the nsa is extraordinarily high, some of the highest percentages of computer scientists in the nation that are actually working at one particular area. some of the most talented people in many other areas to include languages and of course in the cyber realm. it is a national treasure and a

national resource so whatever we do with the intelligence community and with the national security agency has to keep one factor in mind and frank was right on about that, the world is a very dangerous place and there are many entities and people that do mean us harm and we have to have the protection out there to keep us safe and that includes having a robust and meaningful intelligence service. important and is a very critical factor. , white is is a tweet a facility like bluff dale needed if nsa is only collecting metadata? what is bluff dale? guest: the facility in utah designed to take reams and reams of data from many different sources and put it together in a way that it can be accessed.

here is the quandary that you rules when buff planned,luff dale was you go after what you can find. in this case the idea of bluffdale and any storage facility like that is basically that i need to store it so i can access it in case it becomes important later on. have you know it will become important? how do you know that that meaningless conversation five months ago all the sudden is the center of a big investigation and the answer is you don't. data andt of big predictive analysis and analytic tools, all of that necessitates a robust data analytic capability. so you need facilities in order to do that, should they be as extensive as bluff dale --

bluffdale, i will leave that to the experts to answer in detail the base on the technology at the time when that was planned it was judged to be necessary to do that. what i've spent as much money to build at the way it was? maybe not but i would have to see the detailed plans. i've seen some plants but not in great detail. the idea is how are you going to really make the intelligence agencies -- how will you enable them to collect the data they need to provide that instantaneous answer and you need a bit of a backbone in order to do that. that backbone is a data act upon, that is what we are talking about here is creating the environment that you can get it when you need it and discard it when you don't and that requires a great 2-d -- degree

of smart collection -- a great degree of smart collection that all entities need to grapple with because there is a lot of data and there is also a lot of useless data. >> ron is calling from kentucky. caller: how are you? guest: i'm good how are you? caller: i'm fine, i am a conservative republican and they say that power corrupts quitetely and i don't and the fact that they scour the country in the world with planes and drones picking up information today at one point ever decide that a

number is no longer needed? >> it happens all the time and what they're looking at as they are searching for what they call targets of interest there looking for very specific things, very specific indicators so if your phone number came up , in all likelihood they would probably quickly discarded because there is no connection to anybody worthwhile. chances are they would not but if they did there are procedures in place to discard that kind of information. what we're dealing with here is a situation where the country as a whole and we grew up from a revolutionary origin and we really wanted to be isolated from the world. your member warned us against foreign entanglements. 200 years later

there are lots of foreign entanglements and we in essence have no choice because we ended up being the superpower in the world. it is required to do certain things on the foreign scene so we need to be very careful with how we balance the needs of a superpower with our own idea of individual liberty, freedom and our ability to maintain that freedom within the confines of our borders and hopefully to propagate that kind of freedom around the world . we are looking at doing many different things and some of them are definitely not what the founding fathers envisioned just because the world was a different place and our role as a nation has become a different role. that is the issue we are grappling with, how do you have an intelligence agency in an era that requires a lot of data

collection to be effective? how do you also safeguard liberties at every stage of the way? that is the national discussion we are beginning to have. host: james is in florida, high james. s. hi, jame caller: a comment and then his of --tary on the question are listening, please listen to your phone another tv, will is right here in washington. caller: first of all thank you totally service you a

thankless job and people don't always appreciate everything you guys do and we take it for granted every day that the streets are safe. we live in one of the safest places on earth and that does not just happen. host: -- guest: thank you well. caller: people should take it in perspective that we have a bill other countries do not have a bill of rights and i do a lot more collection on citizens and we do here and all are on the world countries are collecting way more information than we collect. guest: would you do for living? a bank butork for not in collections or anything like that, but i think one of the biggest misleading numbers is that the a court approves 95% of the quest -- requests to

collect, but the reason that approval rating is so high because it goes through so many boundaries before it gets a that level. guest: that is absolutely right. it's not blanket approval but because there are so money checks in place and even after he gets that -- so many checks in place and even after it gets to that point -- appreciate the comments when people do look at those numbers in terms of the fisa approval rates, the court is not a rubberstamp and every now and then you get little snippets were they very displeased with something that had a stay -- say that the other agency has done or a couple things in the public with a said go back and try again. these are theens, checks and balances that are operational.

is notu have to look at necessarily the approval percentages the that can be an indicator but it is the relevant fact that these mechanisms exist and these mechanisms are put in place in order to provide those checks and balances that we seek. point thatery valid will raise because percentages don't always tell the whole story and there is a lot of work that goes into putting something in front of a report or any and itourt in the land is a matter of crossing the t -- crossing the t's and dotting the i's. guest: -- butler tweets and thank you for your service, can nsa records be used as a political weapon? or to silence opposition? any safeguards? i think a lot of the

issues have come up with the watergate era where there was an attempt by the next and to use the nsa in a way that was politically expedient. richard is right to point out that there have been attempts to do that and there is always a risk that you get into a situation where an agency has -- is misuse by its political masters in this case the executive branch. there are safeguards ever since the church committee in the post-watergate. you have the watergate hearings on both sides of the house and clear, you had a very line of procedure and policy put in place so that things would not be abused by people in power at that moment and time. there are safeguards and whistleblower protections and

there are things that are in place so that if somebody from the executive branch called up and said, director of nsa i gave you to do x y and z and involved going after somebody who was a political opponent, that would be blatantly illegal. to my knowledge none of that has happened during my time with the national security agency or within the intelligence community. people something where are certainly attempting to follow the law and follow the procedures in this case. is it a risk? yes, it is always a risk and you to make sure it never happens. caller: james we are listening, go ahead. thank you for your service, ira member you made a comment before that saddam hussein did not have any weapons of mass destruction but i remember your frontline program from the early 1980's

when saddam was in developing his super gun i believe they call it a railgun that certainly come up with its capabilities and range could be considered a weapon of mass destruction just wondering if you had comments on that. what i will say is this that some of the reports in the press , i wanted which specific parts of some of them are corroborated by a fence that i personally witnessed during the shock and all phase of iraqi freedom. one aspect of that is there was a lot of traffic from iraq into syria over the border crossing. a lot speculation existed at the time that it had to do with saddam hussein getting rid of his artwork or his treasures of various types. my suspicion is that was not the case, it may have been part of what he was sending to syria but

there is pretty good evidence pieces of were sonmme weaponry, what we call the nbc, nude -- no, biological and chemical. they probably crossed the border into syria. given that press report and those kinds of pieces of information that are starting to bit out, i think it is a too early to say he did not have -- it is not too early to say conclusively whether or not he had weapons of mass destruction. if he did,acted as he had weapon systems, not just the gun that you mentioned but others that were in very us stages of development that indicated he wanted a mechanism to disperse chemical agents

across a wide area. with that kind of information it is no wonder that a lot of people were in the , looking toward a way to mitigate the threat that he posed and that became something that was very important to do from a national security perspective. essence part of the reason why we ended up getting involved in iraq and as they say the rest is history. >> tweet, and your opinion is snowden a hero or villain? guest: it is a very competent in question because you have somebody who clearly violated the rules when it came to safeguarding classified information so he became what amounts to the classic insider threat, the other side of that the discussion he has engendered is one that is probably

necessary for the country to have. i do think he should come back and stand trial and the rule here with the courts say in this particular case, but i do think that he certainly took a great personal risk and i am not convinced that he acted alone. that is another factor in any discussion on the future of edward snowden. host: has the conversation been good for the country? think it has, when you're in the intelligence business you want to keep as many secrets as you can do that is the nature of the business but having said that in a democracy you need to make sure that you are always working for that youof the people represent and even know the nsa is not elected by anybody we are appointed people and that becomes an important factor that we represent the country in that

way. host: please come back and thank you for being on " "washington journal." one more segment this morning with a look at the military and some of the mental health issues that it faces. first up, a news update from c-span radio. in andess numbers are they show the numbers of people seeking benefits jumped last week pushing total applications the first timeor in nearly three months. the labor department says weekly applications rose to a seasonally adjusted 313,000, highest level since the first week of september. consumers picked up spending in october and the commerce department says consumer spending rose .2% last month despite improvement after no gain at all. spending is closely watched because it accounts for 70% of economic activity. noller saysrom mark

this morning that today at the white house one of the silliest ceremonies to which a u.s. president is subjected will take place. president reagan did it as did president bush and even no-nonsense harry truman, the annual thanksgiving turkey pardon which in the words of "the national journal" spares two birds from becoming dinner. obama will pardon both for crimes they have not committed. you can watch the ceremony life on c-span. those are some of the latest headlines on c-span radio. week c-spanksgiving is featuring interviews from retired members of congress. as much as we've accomplished and 36 years i do want to look act at that as much as to look couple of the next

months and there was a couple things i would like to do, one is to get my defense authorization bill passed this is a major effort involving large amounts of staff and i want to finish up some work on the subcommittee on investigations, looking at some gimmicks which are used to avoid taxes. of congress for 34 years and to finally get beat , if i was a manager for baseball team and i had 34-1 i would be in the hall of fame. it doesn't bother me. ongoing, i hadet 18 cochairmen who were chairman of my 18 counties that were supporting me and wanted me to run and i did. dayhursday on thanksgiving

we will take an american history tour of various native american tribes, that is at 10:00 a.m. eastern. at 1:30, attend the groundbreaking ceremony of the diplomacy center in washington. justices clarence thomas, alito and sonja sotomayor on c-span this week. for complete schedule go to c-span.org. >> "washington journal" continues. again isg us once cameron ritchie the former special assistant from mental health at the officer of the surgeon general and among other things the chief medical officer at the d.c. department of behavioral health and clinical press -- professor of psychiatry at georgetown university and others, why is suicide one of the leading

causes of death? siri --ve a lot of theories about why suicide has climbed so much since 2004 and now it is happening a little bit in the off-duty population but it is still extraordinarily high in the reserves and national guard. there are a lot of theories that because the military has been deploying so quickly and so often -- most suicides happen when people don't deploy but when they don't. which is counterintuitive. another theory is that at a time when the conflict was thick we lower the standards and brought more people in with prior psychiatric issues and maybe that contributed to the increase in suicide. we also know that people do not have time to take care of each other as much as they should and especially for the guard and reserve when i come back they disperse all over to the don't

have time. i want to add one other piece which is very important. we can do think about everyone who goes over as being in combat or being a hero that there is a nontraditional deployer include some who have worked in the tinny operations aren't guantanamo and when they come back it is often difficult for them to talk about their experiences with other people. there looked at as being dumb even though they did a good job. we are looking specifically at the rate of suicide in nontraditional deployer's as well. the -- where does ptsd fall? guest: it is certainly a contributor to some suicides along with depression and substance abuse -- abuse and those who deploy, the most common figures are between 15% and 30% who have it. but there is another concept

would like to talk about which a think is important and that is the concept of moral injury which is related to ptsd, but is not quite the same thing. who have caused the death or seen one of their friends die if they are survivor they feel guilt or shame and i think those with complete suicides many have suffered this moral injury. host: we are set aside our fourth line for active in military personnel and we would like to get your experience particularly if you have been -- if you have used mental health armed services that have been sponsored. otherwise we will put up the other names as well. according to a recent report almost 2500 of nearly 5500

active duty, nondeployed army soldiers tested positive for a mental disorder of some kind. 11% tested positive for more than one illness. that is almost 50% for this, this is from psychiatry. there have been many studies looking at mental health symptoms among soldiers and mental -- service members of the numbers very a little depending how the question is asked what it is in question -- unquestionably to that combat takes a whole on mental health and what we have seen as the more times you deploy the higher your chances are of developing posttraumatic stress. another point that is really important is that military members like to seek health and when i been looking at are the barriers to kurt -- care.

sometimes it is just inconvenience to get to the mental health treatment or you don't like sitting in the waiting room were you feeling inryone can look at you but other cases often the military members don't believe that treatment works and they don't want the treatment. one of the things i want to come back to later is some of the new and innovative treatments we are doing to help. host: i have a couple of those in,ed but vivian tweets three vets a day killing themselves and you think it is because you enlisted more mentally ill people? really? it is a couple can it set of questions and there are a number of theories about why and the official figure is 22 veterans a day are killing , that is all veterans including vietnam veterans and a wide range.

military it has been as high as one per day so it is still unacceptably high. when you look at the completed suicides the participants are usually getting in trouble at work or with relationship difficulties or a combination and increasingly we also seeing disability and pain. battlefield injuries were injuries from having training accidents that also contributes. it is easy to say that person just broke up with her girlfriend and therefore they committed suicide, but it is a lot more complicated than that. military has been so stretched over the course of two wars and applying for africa and beenring for ebola, it has so stretched that they don't have the same time to take care of each other. the veteran affairs budget request for fiscal year 2015,

163.9 billion dollars, seven point $2 billion to mental health services. what in your view does that number represent and how much should it be? good question that is a little beyond my capacity to opine on as to what it should be but while we have seen is a lot of money going to the v.a., not all of that is going to mental health but a lot of different things and what we need to do besides the v.a. is have more civilian military partnerships. there are some good ones out there and i am part of a team who looks at what we're doing in washington dc and that's together with the academics with the v.a. and with the university and the criminal justice system, what can we all do together? >> about half of recent veterans go to the v.a. and the other half go to their civilian

providers of the don't seek care at all. it is not just the v.a. or the military it has to be something that providers and the general public are part of the solution. dr. cameron ritchie is our guest, when did you serve? guest: i started in 1982 when i was a medical student at george washington and the army paid for medical school which was wonderful and i came on full-time active-duty at walter reed 1986 and retired 2010. host: 22 veterans a day, that seems like a whole lot. guest: it is a lot. host: is it more than the non-veteran population? guest: it depends which segment you look at but in general, yes. one of those gaps in our knowledge is we don't know much about which veterans are suicide in and why. active-dutyt about

populations because we do a report on each one but nobody can really tell you other than this very a sick i love veterans who are suicide in and again , it is really important that we get a handle on which guard and reserves are killing themselves. when they are not on active duty we don't have the same report done about them and that is a real gap in the knowledge. why people arew killing themselves we can't put into place effective suicide prevention programs. michael you're on the air. caller: high dr. ritchie it is mike little, i wanted to call because i'm really glad that you spoke about operations at the beginning there, this is something that means a lot to me because our sailors are deploying multiple times to detainee operations and i think

the navy has taken it upon themselves to realize that this is causing injuries in the long run so they are changed some of their policies as opposed to deploying and their only there for 90 days now and i am wondering if we have overlooked the aspect of the sailors who have already done these multiple deployments in the combat zones and i'm wondering how we can actually pull forward to help identify some of the sailors so we can help them get the assistance they need and deserve from the veterans affairs. host: would you do in a military? >> i am in aviation boatswain , but i deploy 900 days boots in the ground with kenny operations in my career. ptsd,did you suffer from or use the services the military offers? caller: i still suffer from

ptsd, and a lot of the suffering is that i have lost 10 friends to suicide since we of been home from art appointment to detainee operations and the lack of knowledge from the department of veteran affairs and mild command who were not aware of what i went through while in my deployments, nor what it was like when i returned home because of a lack of knowledge of what they had. host: can you share what experience? or would you prefer not to? i catch her the exact experience but i can give you a sense of it. on an everyday basis i was not in combat fighting the war but every day i went to work and i faced the enemy. ands mentally harassed physically assaulted with things from these detainees and we have to maintain a sense of professionalism and that is something that is overlooked a

lot, what type of restraint we have to hold ourselves to when we are in the situations and not react and that breaks down on us over the timeframe. caller: -- guest: if i could add to that you said you are assaulted with things but what that means is having urine and feces thrown at you are being spent on is at the kind of thing talking about? caller: absolutely in that and juice boxes i don't know how may times i went home with fruit punch on me or bananas, but feces was one of the most a demoralizing things i ever had to go through was to go home on a weekly basis with human feces on me. host of veryise a important issues michael let me them, hadke one of you identify people who have gone through this experience? to do that the navy or department of defense needs to proactively outreach and say we

will recognize that you are in a unique subset and that the probe limbs -- programs we've created may or may not be appropriate for you. another strategy is to do a study, the army has been very good at doing studies and mental health advisory teams and con, but they epi are focused on active duty and again there should be a studied done specifically on people that work into teen a -- detainee operations. what does jamas tand for? the journal of the american medical association, it says the rate of depression is five times as high among soldiers as civilians. gemma has published a lot coming out ofly

the stars program and their finding higher rates of mental illness that are pre-existing with people coming in at also fairly high. one of the challenges we have is when you clear the military by the -- from the population this is not normal. everyone is coming in and has a job and is helpful enough in most cases and that it has access to health care, there is not really a good civilian comparison group of whatever the numbers are there are certainly two high in the military. i would like to come back to the issue i mentioned before which is looking at the newest treatments because most members do not like conventional treatment. is medication and psychotherapy and particularly the inhibitors,

medications that you've heard like zoloft and paxil which are the trade names sertraline and celexa dean, those are good medications for ptsd and depression but they cause side effects and often cause sexual side effects and most of the military is young men and they don't like medication with sexual side effects so they stop taking the medication. the other type of therapy, toking involves talking somebody who wasn't there about the trauma and what happened and people don't like talking to a civilian who has not experienced it. there is a variation called virtual reality and that is doing it with a computer and very exciting and a lot of people who don't like talking to a human are more likely to try to reexperience our work with an avatar i'm told skip riso has been a leader in that area then there are newer theories such as

a technique that has been used for paying for a long time which is injecting lidocaine, and and for someege or reason it seems to decrease ptsd symptoms and a lot of people including those who were long-standing. is yoga and acupuncture and mindfulness or meditation and there are a lot of other techniques that do not have the same research base and do not have the same body of scientific evidence behind them but anecdotally service members are loving them and finding them useful. one of my major pitches his sleeve to do more research and of these of roaches. the military is a leader in this .rea some places are doing innovative research on these techniques but there needs to be more done.

host: thank for holding. morning, i am a , people whold nurse i've spoken to that of been in the service starting from the vietnam war they resent very much the situations they have been put in, things they were prisoners.o do to when we look now at the things they were put through it is very demanding on the concience of these young people. i would like to know the comparison between the second andand now from vietnam

what is happening in the countries we have invaded uncessessarily. leadersey resent the who put them in this situatiosn and their conscience demanding of them --. let me pick up a couple of things you alluded to prisoners to them and their conscience, i mentioned the moral cost some of that has to do with killing civilians but it also has to do with work that you may not become cruel with that you don't know whether it was right or wrong, maybe it is legal does not feel right but at the time who are you to object?

i think this concept needs to be understood and therapist need to talk to potential patients about the gray areas. a lot of times they don't want to talk because maybe it was a war crime and if they talk they will be reported. that is pretty rough. aboutr question you raise the evolution of a soldier in war from world war ii to vietnam to now, i would add the korean war which i spent a lot of time trueing and it is totally that the way the american public and views the soldier has a lot to do with how well they will reintegrate, so world war ii and the great war a lot of people went and one of the things was they went for three years in the mirror back rather than back and forth. forkorean war another topic another time but there was a question about collaborators and brainwashing and chinese

communists. people faded into the woodwork and did not want to be identified. soldiers as at on returned, tremendously difficult. one of the various set of concerns is there has been such of those marines by the when peopleple, think about whether we should go to war a not there is support for the military member. does doctor-patient confidentiality carry over to the armed services? guest: good question, there are mixed messages because of the if you are an officer and you suspect someone of committing a war crime you are supposed to inform authorities, on the other hand if you have a patient in your office was troubled and talking about this you want to encourage them to share.

remaintice doctors will confidentiality but often the service member doesn't quite know. there is another resource important to talk about which of the chaplains were very important and by and large they have confidentiality with their patients. there are alternative routes to go through but again the conversation that you need to flesh out -- one more point before another question would like to get onto the table question about female service members. mill service a fee and i'm a book called woman at war that will be coming out in the spring that we often don't think enough about the special needs of female service members and there is not much in the literature. host: what about on the suicide issue? how many are female? guest: we know for active duty military, we have the numbers -- veterans here the 22 a day they

are no longer on active duty, the suicide rate among active duty -- active-duty females is low but it has gone up and part of the reason is that there are more guns and weapons they are familiar with and if you try to kill yourself with a weapon, chances are pretty good you will end up dead. but female veterans we don't know. host: go ahead with your question or comment. caller: thank you for taking my the, i've a question on suicide rate for gays in the huge militarys a city and is a former news tip or found that several suicides were related because they were gay. even with don't ask don't tell, it is still out there and we did not report the cause even though we knew. i think that is an issue we have not talked to much about on

suicide among gay soldiers. question, weent aret know how many suicides because the sailor or soldier or marine was gay and was in the closet and feared being outed or was harassed and bullied. we don't record that information on the suicide at that report. i was part of the work group that helped revoke don't ask don't tell and one of the points will beade was that it so much better for the mental health of our soldiers -- sailors and soldiers if they don't have to conceal that they are gay. of the arguments that prevailed but we don't have good information to answer your question. either fears of being thought gay or fear of being outed was a major issue. host: joy, good morning.

like tofirst i would thank the doctor for sharing her knowledge on the subject. i think that the moral of the story and one of the callers mentioned it earlier is that some leaders whether they are republican, they really have to take into account these suicides and what war can do to a young man or woman. my oldest brother committed suicide and was not in the military he just had a lot of problems. explaine no words to what a tragedy it was for my family and his friends and the community.

22can throw numbers like service people committing suicide a day and it is easy to forget that. for every one person that takes their lives the ripple effect is devastating. is that inand prayer the days and years ahead is that our leaders take a very hard look of the tragedies of war. guest: first my condolence for your loss. you mentioned the ripple effect and that is so important for people to realize. when somebody kills themselves there is such a devastating loss to their family not just for days or months but for years. i think people who are contemplating suicide often don't think about that. they think my family would be better off if i were dead it is

not true. , spouses orchildren parents they're left with such incredible guilt, what more could i have done? this effect lasts for generations. andympathies for your loss it is also important to remember that suicide is not just an it is an the soldiers, enormous issue in the general population as well. host: active and retired military can call in on this line. barbara in massachusetts you're on. interview, i called c-span several years ago to offer an idea i had for dealing with this problem which was to create a community response in our local fire department and i thought it would be great for the returning vets to have the support of

firemen who were in fire stations waiting for a call they gotrly if professional advice from people like you about how to interact with veterans. i called it put out the fire ,ecause of the double entendre in the wake of ferguson i think it might be great to expand it to police departments because working with returning vets might be a humanizing thing for the policeman as well as very supportive for the vets. it might be a real interesting thing to do. great idea which is actually already being done. for the police there something called crisis intervention officer training. department ofhe behavioral health teach the police on working with mentally

ill individuals and specifically i have developed a module of working with them around veterans talking not just about procedure medic stress but to medical brain injuries or blast theya have hearing loss, may have problems following because of tremendous rain injury. with fireo working and emergency medical personnel and amplifying your thoughts, a lot of personnel in the police and fire are veterans themselves in the last thing they would do is engaged in an altercation , they don't what to have anybody dead but especially not a veteran. the police are extremely receptive to the idea of learning more about mental illness in general and about veterans and ptsd. great idea of yours and i would keep working at it. host: you're on the air.

caller: sorry if i come in rough i'm currently on speakerphone traveling. i'm not saying this applies to everyone but the kids that are joining nowadays, they are joining at the end of the war and they're not prepared for it. i am one of the people that did not joined to fight but because of the occupation i chose i was thrown into that with marine corps infantry. accepted theup and choice i was given but a lot of people have got orders in benin for so much time and they are not prepared for this and are not ready for the pilots yet they joined a military branch. i think it is a culture of kids

nowadays that is leading more into it. host: thank you sir. guest: there has been a lot of discussion as you know about kids growing up that they are on their cell phone or the videogame and whether that makes them more violent or more out of touch with reality. i'm not sure a have the right answer and i do think there have been changes over time and i have joined well before 9/11 and i've joined as i mentioned before that the army paid for medical school. now anybody who joined since 9/11 knows that they are going to war and in many cases they are a little disappointed that they are not able to deploy because that is why they joined more than half of all suicides now are people that never deployed. part of the question is are they now disappointed because they

didn't get to go? i think it is a complicated question is a good thing for the is that lots of people want to join the military right now and it is hard to get in. there is a preconception that is easy to get in and most people cannot do it for physical or mental health reasons. i think i in that have read articles mentioning the study of marijuana to treat ptsd, is this true? guest: the v.a. does not use marijuana to treat ptsd, it is a very controversial area because in some cases marijuana does relieve the symptoms for post-traumatic stress disorder for from my perspective i worry because there are so many drugs that are synthetic marijuana in what is called k to or scooby-doo or spice that can make people's chris -- psychotic

and out of touch with reality and i see that all the time. i think with be very cautious and the direction i would like to take is to find out which are the ingredients in marijuana that actually work to refine those and have them be given as medicine rather than this uncontrolled use of what could be quickly the synthetics and could be something else. to of the things i did want mention that is in a dorm is problem is a question about people have started on haveription painkillers, a to getskeletal pain prescription painkillers and addicted to them in some cases the lake can i more than they turn to think like caroline. auditing is awith

reviewinge, and is fine marine shot up and up and put on painkillers and had ptsd to up dying probably related the heroine and legal drug toxicity. this is something true and the civilian world but we have to be much better at treating pain than we are. host: last call, scott from los angeles, former military. thing that is hard for people to talk about -- i have been in groups where i talked about my sexual trauma and the way it was treated at -- that i was blamed for it.

it doesn't get enough attention i feel. male sexual trauma has such a stigma attached to it that no one likes a talk or hear sometimesxcept that when i talk about people will , i could never admitted until i heard you. guest: thank you for calling and talking about it, you are right it is a dreadfully taboo subject and there is often an assumption of the perpetrators are all mail and the victims are female but i worked a lot in this area and it is very rare for a male to come forward because they're worried that they will be thought gay or that they brought it on themselves or there is something on masculine about it, so thank you for calling in and raising that and that takes courage.

us, thank you for being with , as always we appreciate it. guest: it was a real pleasure, my only regret is that that's time seemed so short. we could talk for much longer so please invite me back i bet there are a lot more questions out there. host: yes ma'am. it is a long weekend for both book tv and american history tv. 48 hours of nonfiction books and authors usually but this weekend with a holiday, 96 hours beginning tomorrow morning at two.a.m. on c-span then a tour of simon & schuster and the national book awards some of the people you will see this weekend on book tv and then on c-span3 usually 48 hours of is 96an history but it

hours of american history beginning at 8:00 a.m. tomorrow those are some options to tune into this holiday weekend we'll see you tomorrow morning. >> this thanksgiving week, c-span is featuring interviews from retiring members of congress. watch the interview tonight through thursday at 8:00 eastern. >> i want to look back at that so much as to look forward to the next couple of months.