whatsoever. afterschool academic enrichment, arts, schools, language, culture, classes for parents, these are amazing resources our communities do have and we need to fully utilizes them. i will reach out and see if they can do more. funding is always a challenge. . the idea of the schools being the heart of communities and community centers, not just the academic piece but more holistically open 12, 13, 14 hours a day for six or seven days a week. that is the right vision. to help that,n do we need that desperately. >> thank you. we have the final question, comment. >> i am the youth ambassador from the confederated tribes. i attend boarding school in salem, oregon.

i know one of the things we need is extracurricular activities for more advanced accelerated students because right now all we really have is activities such as tutoring or mentorships for students who are studying -- struggling in school. i brought this up yesterday but i did not get an answer. [laughter] [applause] they said something about j.o.n. but i am really scared. [laughter] >> you are doing great. you are doing great. >> ok.

>> [indiscernible] [applause] >> [crying] >> you can do it. m., i am not allowed to use it. i think it is weird because when i go home, i can't do certain activities. that is what i have to say. >> thank you. [applause] >> i will try to give you an answer you did not get yesterday and appreciate you having the courage to speak up and continue to challenge us to do better.

we have to do academic enrichment for kids who are behind and who are struggling. we need to give more opportunities for children to learn native languages, all of our young people. we also need to make sure students accelerating have opportunities to do that as well. that is not the first time i have heard the question or complaint that young people who are high achievers don't have opportunities to expand. not that it is the magic solution for everything, but i think the idea of having access to technology can be a game changer. are inber of people who high school who are starting to take college-level classes, who are taking languages, learning oceanography when they live thousands of miles from the ocean is extraordinary and powerful. technology can be a great equalizer or will exacerbate the disconnect between the haves and have-nots.

we desperately want technology to be that equalizer. we want young people to be able to learn anything they want anywhere. the faster we can increase access, the more young people who want to learn more and challenge themselves will be empowered to do that. we are not there yet. we are hopeful in the next couple of years, a fundamental change and shift is going to happen. >> rodney? make another comment? i am mic'ed. thank you for your courage in speaking up. i think many of us are flecked on our youth -- reflect on our youth and it was the activities that made a difference. young people have a natural curiosity. i see it with the youngest people i meet. the best hugs i get are from the five-year-olds and six-year-olds. i got enough hugs to last me for six months.

it was fantastic. the little kids set the tone. they were enthusiastic and had amazing questions. as kids get older, some of that curiosity gets stomped on for a variety of reasons. some of those are clear here. how do we nurture that curiosity in kids so they continue to yearn to learn? that is what we are all about here. opportunities to engage in culture and language and engage with elders within your community is one type of extracurricular activity that was a gift that will keep on giving for generations to come. in one of the earlier sessions, one of our youth ambassadors asked, what can we do as youth? was you cananswer go back to the elders and your

parents who said i said this is so because i said it, just because, and keep pushing them until they give you that answer. i think for young people, extracurricular activities are not always left up to adults to do. some of it is your responsibility to ask. but there are things we can do as adults to make a difference. met the young people building the solar car to race across australia, that is one heck of an extracurricular activity. it were competing and winning against some of the most elite schools in the united states. that is tribal leadership trade tribal control of schools. it is caring teachers. this is not a school in an urban area. it is a school in a rural area. it can be done. [applause] thank you for what you're

doing with your school and for showing us the bright light and the way. it is up to all of us, not just us on the podium, but u.s. tribal leaders, to say, what can we do to make sure after school, what are we doing to engage our young people so they feel connected to us and feel challenged? that is what we are all collectively going to need to do to take the curiosity we see in every young person. the young people don't know yet how the deck is stacked against them. that is a scary thought. it is up to all of us to make sure the odds are in their favor as opposed to against them. you must tell because we cannot do it without your help. >> thank you. [applause] >> in conclusion, chief anderson

has been such a tremendous leader in indian country. [applause] particular on these educational issues. she was the original moderator for this panel. it was my honor to fill in for you. thank you for participating and being true partners with indian country. we appreciate this. this is the last time we are on stage with this many leaders in the conference. recognition for sally jewell and all she has done for indian country. she has been a tremendous advocate for indian country and the department of the interior. [applause] thank you.

>> "q and a" is 10 years old. to mark a decade, we are featuring one interview from each decade. you can see that interview at 7:00 eastern on c-span. right after that, scientists and activists discuss the latest trends in energy technology and problems created by climate change. mikeso heard comments from phillips who explains how using more renewable energy sources can help address the extinction of species around the world. here is more. >> what are we to make of the crisis before us? it is most important to note it is not a speeding asteroid. but rather, it is us marching in this direction in a most

powerful way to do one thing. domesticate the planet. that is what is driving this crisis as we speak today. what does this have to do with renewable energy? i think the extinction crisis above all else is a clarion call for changing our relationship with one another and the planet earth. extinction crisis the clarion call? because it is loud and clear, as all clarion calls must be. it is a loud problem for those willing to listen. it is almost deafening. i imagine with each passing, there is a celestial bell that rings marking the passage of yet another miracle. it is certainly clear. it provides clear evidence that something is amiss. sweep of billion

years of multicellular life, there have been five events that rival the extinction process we are in today. if that is not evidence something is amiss, then i don't know what amiss means. we understand the cause of the extension crisis. it is human induced habitat degradation, habitat loss, habitat modification, embassy species, overexploitation. and over the last few decades, climate change. >> that was a portion of event held at the renewable energy institute in aspen, colorado. you can see the entire event tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span. tonight on c-span2, it is book tv with authors and books on african american leaders. looks at his book, "death of the king." "stokely, a life."

examines his book "black prophetic fire." on "washington year-end strategies in preparing for 2014 federal taxes. after that, steve berkowitz discusses issues affecting college education programs and what changes collegiate policymakers are aiming to make such as the movement to unionize players. plus vocals, facebook comments, and tweets -- plus your phone calls, facebook comments, and tweets. >> here are some of our featured programs you will find this holiday weekend on the c-span networks. supreme night at 8:00, court justice elena kagan at princeton university.

sunday night at 8:00, his end of the year biggest pinocchios of 2014 awards. the senior editor on the long-standing battle of supreme court activism and judicial restraint. the book critic who recently retired after 33 years with the "washington post." saturday, historians and authors discuss president lincoln's 1864 reelection campaign. sunday afternoon, a 19 city five film the chronicles the 84th afantry division ring the -- 1965 film that chronicles the 84th infantry division during the battle of the bulge. lettuce know what you think of the programs you are watching. call us, e-mail us, or send us a tweet.

join the conversation. like us on facebook. follow us on twitter. >> next, president obama awards the presidential medal of freedom to 18 individuals, including tom brokaw, congressman john dingell, ethel kennedy, stevie wonder, and meryl streep. this is the u.s.' highest civilian honor. it is 45 minutes. [applause] >> thank you, everybody. have a seat, everybody. thank you so much. everybody have a seat. welcome to the white house. this is one of my favorite events. once a year we set aside this event to celebrate people who have made america stronger and wiser and more humane and more beautiful with our highest civilian honor, the presidential medal of freedom.

this year we honor 18. unfortunately, steven sondheim could not be with us today. i'm going to be presenting him with this award at our 2015 ceremony. we give thanks to public servants who've devoted their lives to their fellow citizens. when edward roybal told speaker tip o'neil that he was starting a congressional hispanic caucus, there were so few hispanics in congress that he joked they could fit the caucus in a phone booth. but he saw the on the times. he fought for bilingual education and proceedings in our judicial system and to make sure that spanish americans counted, literally. thanks to him, the census was revised to more accurately count latinos. although his roots in america went back hundreds of years, he championed the cause of immigrants. and spoke up for vulnerable

communities. and was one of the few in the early 1980's calling for more aids research. he left us nearly a decade ago , but edward roybal was and remains a hero to so many not just latinos but all americans. every girl in little league, every woman playing college sports and every parent, including michelle and myself, who watches their daughter on a field or in a classroom is forever grateful to the late patsy takemoto mink. i'm particularly grateful because she was my congresswoman for a long time. denied admission to medical school because she was a woman, patsy went on to law school and co-authored title ix, banning gender discrimination in our schools. she was one of many firsts including the first woman of

color in congress and to those of us in hawaii, she represented the best in service and aloha spirit. she dedicated her life to making sure she would not be the last, from championing civil rights to fighting against gender discrimination, patsy was a passionate advocate for opportunity and equality and realizing the full promise of the american dream. when john dingell's father, a new deal democrat, passed away in 1955, john stepped up and over the course of six decades, a congressional career longer than any in history, john built a peerless record of his own. he gaveled in the vote for medicare, helped lead the fight for the civil rights act. for more than half a century in every single congress, john introduced a bill for comprehensive healthcare, that is, until he didn't have to do it anymore.

[laughter] [applause] and i could not have been prouder to have john by my side when i signed the affordable care act into law. john will retire at the end of this session, but at 88 he's still going strong. his life reminds us that change takes time, it takes courage and persistence. but if we push hard enough and long enough, change is possible. as a university of chicago student, abner mikva stopped by the local democratic headquarters and asked to volunteer. i love this story. committeeman asked, who sent you? and ab said, nobody. and the committee man said, we don't want nobody nobody sent. [laughter] that's chicago for you. [laughter] despite that abrupt dismissal,

ab went on to devote his life to public service, reformed the illinois criminal code, defended free speech and consumer rights, and in 1993 struck down the pentagon's ban on gays in the military. that one,rturned on but history proved him right and he inspired the next generation, including me. after i graduated from law school, he offered me the chance to be a law clerk. i declined but was extraordinarily grateful. and he for gave me for which i , was also grateful. ab transcends any single moment in political history but had a hand in shaping some of the best of it. so we've got some extraordinary public servants on this stage. we also give thanks for innovators who've changed our world. mildred dresselhaus's high

school year book contained commentary from her classmates. they printed a mathematical tribute. mildred equals brains plus fun. [laughter] in math and science, she's second to none. growing up in new york during the great depression, this daughter of polish immigrants had three clear paths open to her -- teaching, nursing and secretarial school. somehow she had something else in mind. she became an electrical engineer and a physicist and rose in m.i.t.'s ranks, performed ground breaking experiments on carbon, became one of the world's most celebrated scientists and her influence is all around us in the cars we drive, the energy we generate, the electronic devices that power our lives. when she arrived at m.i.t. in 1960, only 4% of students were women. today, almost half are.

a new generation walking the path that millie blazed. robert solow's father was a businessman who handled a lot of documents and when robert became an economist, his dad joked, we do the same thing, deliver papers. [laughter] but bob's influence extends far beyond the page, more than any living economist he has shaped economic policy and lives of people everywhere. his insights into how technological progress drives growth transformed our thinking about how to build prosperity, leading to more investments in research and education. in other words, more investments in people. when we won the nobel prize, a colleague wrote, "economists ' faces lit up all over the world." and this isn't exactly an irrationally exuberant group, economists. [laughter] they don't usually get real fired up. bob is not just mired by his. .

--bob is not just admired by his peers bob is adored and is a , leading voice on the economic challenges of our time especially when it comes to reversing economic inequality and growing our economy for everybody, always pushing our nation to do better for everybody, for all. we give thanks to public servants, we give thanks to innovators, and we give thanks to performers who've captivated our hearts and our minds. "the onion" once ran this headline -- "court rules meryl streep unable to be tried by jury as she has no peers." [laughter] [applause] i think that's like the third or fourth award meryl has gotten since i have been in office and i've said it publicly, i love meryl streep. i love her. her husband knows i love her. michelle knows i love her. there's nothing either of them can do about it. [laughter]

but she's done it all for her craft. she's sung abba, which, you know, that's something. [laughter] she learned violin, wore a nun's habit, faced down a charging lion, mastered every accent under the sun. she inhabits her characters so fully and compassionately saying it's the greatest gift of human beings that we have, the power of empathy. and off the screen as an advocate for women and girls, she uses that gift to help others write the life stories of their choosing and encourage greater empathy in the rest of us so meryl is truly one of the greatest leading ladies. then there's stevie. don't get michelle talking about stevie wonder now. [laughter] early copies of stevie wonder's classic album, "talking book" had a simple message written in braille.

"here is my music, it is all i have to tell you how i feel. know that your love keeps my love strong." this is, by the way, the first album i ever bought with my own money. i was 10 years old. maybe 11. with my own cash. [laughter] i didn't have a lot of it and i listened to that -- that thing got so worn out, had all scratches. young people, you won't remember this but you'd have albums. [laughter] and they'd get scratched. for more than 50 years, stevie has channeled his inner visions into messages of hope and healing and becoming one of the most influential musicians in american history. a musical prodigy with an electrifying voice, stevie's blend of r&b and jazz and funk and blues and soul and whatever else you've got speaks of love and loss, justice and equality, war and peace.

but what really defines stevie's music is the warmth and humanity that resonates in every note. some of his songs helped us to fall in love, others mended our hearts, some motivated us on the campaign trail. and thanks to stevie, all of us have been moved to higher ground. alvin ailey was born during the depression in small town texas . and by the time he was 27 he founded a dance company of his own in new york city. it became a place where artists of all races had a home. all that mattered was talent. the dances he choreographed were a blend of ballet, modern and jazz and they used the blues and spirituals, as well, and through him african american history was told in a way it had never been told before, with passionate, virtuoso dance performances that transfixed audiences worldwide. alvin said that dance came from the people and that it should always be delivered back to the people. alvin ailey delivered both

through his life and through the dance company that will forever bear his name. when isabel allende learned that her grandfather was dying, she started writing him a letter. night after night, she returned to it until she realized she was writing her first novel. she never really stopped. her novels tell of families, magic, romance, oppression, violence, redemption -- all the big stuff. but in her hands, the big became graspable and familiar and human and exiled from chile by a military junta, she made the u.s. her home. today, the foundation she created to honor her late daughter helps families worldwide. she begins all her books on january 8, the day she began that letter to her grandfather years ago. write to register history, she

says, write what should not be forgotten. on the night that the berlin wall fell, only one american network anchor was there reporting live. a reporter remembers ben bradlee standing in the newsroom watching tom brokaw at the brandenburg gate and wondering aloud, how do we beat that? [laughter] brokaw's got this. [laughter] at pivotal moments, tom got it. he reported on watergate, snuck a camera into tiananmen square, sat down for the first one-on-one with mikhail gorbachev by an american tv reporter. he's covered every election since 1968. we've welcomed him into our home, at dinner time, on sunday mornings, have trusted him to tell us what we needed to know and ask questions that needed asking. i know because i've been on the receiving end of some of those questions. [laughter] many know him as the chronicler of the greatest generation and

today we celebrate him as one of our nation's greatest journalists. and we give thanks to trail blazers who bent the arc of our nation towards justice. in the 1950's, golfer charlie sifford won the negro national open five times in a row. by the time he became first african american to earn a pga tour card, most of his best golf was behind him. on the tour, charlie was banned from clubhouse restaurants. folks threatened him, shouted slurs from the gallery, kicked his ball into the rough. charlie's laughing about that. my ball's always in the rough. [laughter] because golf can be a solitary sport, charlie didn't have teammates to lean on but he did have his lovely wife, rose, and he had plenty of guts and grit and that trademark cigar and

charlie won on the tour twice, both after the age of 45. but it was never just about the wins. as charlie says, i wasn't just trying to do this for me. i was trying to do it for the world. speaking of trail blazers, to some, marlo thomas will always be that girl who followed her dreams to new york city and kind of was running around manhattan having fun on her own terms. to others, she's the creative mind behind "free to be you and me" whose songs taught a generation of kids that they were strong and beautiful just the way they were. as a founder of the ms foundation, marlo helped turn women's hopes and aspirations into concrete social and economic progress and she helped build the hospital her father founded, st. jude's, into one of the premier pediatric hospitals in the world. she recalls her dad saying there

are two types of people in the world, the givers and the takers. the takers sometimes eat better , but the givers always sleep better. i love that saying. marlo thomas sleeps very well because she's given so much. raised on an oklahoma reservation by a cheyenne mother and hodulgee muscogee father, suzan harjo became an effective advocate for native american rights and through her work in government and as the head of the national congress for american indians she's helped preserve a million acres of indian land, helped develop laws preserving tribal sovereignty, repatriated cultural items to tribes. while expanding museums celebrate native life. because of suzan, more young native americans are growing up with pride in their heritage and faith in their future and she's taught all of us that native values make americans stronger.

on june 21, 1964, three young men -- two white and one black -- set out to learn more about the burning of a church in neshoba county, mississippi. james earl cheney, 21 years old. andrew goodman, 20 years old. michael henry schwerner, 24 years old. young men. and in that freedom summer, these three americans refused to sit on the sidelines. their brutal murder by a gang of ku klux klan members shook the conscience of our nation. took 44 days to find their bodies. 41 years to bring the lead perpetrator to justice. and while they're often remembered for how they died, we honor them today for how they lived, with the idealism and courage of youth.

james, andrew, and michael could not have known the impact they would have on the civil rights movement or on future generations. and here today, inspired by their sacrifice, we continue to fight for the ideals of equality and justice for which they gave their lives. today, we are honored to be joined by james' daughter, angela, andrew's brother, david, and michael's wife, rita. and finally, we give thanks to a person whose love for her family is matched by her devotion to her nation. to most americans, ethel kennedy is known as a wife, mother and grandma. and in many ways it's through these roles that she's made her mark on history. as bobby kennedy's partner in life, she shared his commitment to justice. after his death, she continued their work through the center she created in his name celebrating activists and journalists and educating people around the world about threats to human liberty. on urgent human rights issues of

our time, from juvenile justice to environmental destruction, ethel has been a force for change in her quiet, unflashy, unstoppable way. as her family will tell you and they basically occupy this half of the room -- [laughter] you don't mess with ethel. she's gone to extraordinary lengths to build support for causes close to her heart including helping raise money for a.l.s. research this summer by pouring a bucket of ice water over her head. [laughter] as you may know she nominated me , to do it, as well, and as you may know, i chose to write a check, instead. [laughter] i grew up in hawaii, i don't like pouring ice water on top of my head. [laughter] that is probably the only time i've said no to ethel, by the way. ethel is the matriarch of a patriotic family and many of her children and grandchildren are carrying on the kennedy

traditional public service. she is an emblem of enduring faith and enduring hope even in the face of unimaginable loss and grief. she has touched the lives of countless people around the world with her generosity and her grace. it gives me great pleasure to present this award, which her brother-in-law, president kennedy, re-established more than 50 years ago. ladies and gentlemen, these are the recipients of the 2014 medal of freedom. let's give them a big round of applause. [applause]

you don't just get applause, you actually get a medal. [laughter] let's read the citations. >> robert battle, receiving on behalf of alvin ailey. a visionary choreographer and dancer, alvin ailey transformed american dance through his ground breaking exploration of the african american experience, weaving traditional songs and stories with ballet, jazz and modern dance to create something entirely new. he founded and served as artistic director of the alvin ailey dance theater.

renowned worldwide for its virtuoso performances including the beloved american masterpiece "revelation." an advocate for the importance of art to the soul of our nation, alvin ailey's life and pioneering legacy remind us of our limitless potential for creative self expression. [applause] isabel allende. a beloved daughter of chile and the united states, isabel allende has transfixed readers worldwide with extraordinary storytelling. forced to flee chile, he spent -- she spent years abroad filling her books with the stories, rhythms and flavors of home. she is now one of the most

widely read and cherished spanish language authors in history. she writes and speaks forcefully about the human rights of women and children and her foundation supports vulnerable families in chile and california. with creativity and conviction, isabel allende continues to move and delight the world. [applause] thomas j. brokaw. [applause] one of our nation's most admired journalists, thomas j. brokaw has helped americans better understand the world and each other. from "today" to "nbc nightly

news" to "meet the press," americans have relied on his authoritative reporting and keen analysis for decades. at moments of great consequence from the fall of the berlin wall , to the terrorist attacks of 9/11, he was the eyes and ears at the scene. he has lent his voice to our nation's heroes from the greatest generations the latest generation of servicemembers and their families. thomas j. brokaw's work remains the model of responsible journalism and his insights continue to enrich our public discourse. [applause] angela lewis receiving on behalf of her father, james earl cheney.

david goodman receiving on behalf of his brother, andrew goodman, and rita schwerner bender receiving on behalf of her husband, michael henry schwerner. [applause] in 1964, three young men sought to right one of the many wrongs of the jim crow era by joining hundreds of others to register black voters in mississippi during freedom summer. their work was fraught with danger yet their commitment to justice was so strong, they were willing to risk their lives for it. their deaths shocked the nation and their courage has never been forgotten.

james earl cheney, andrew goodman, and michael henry schwerner still inspire us. their ideals have been written into the moral fabric of our nation from the landmark civil rights legislation enacted days after their deaths to our continued pursuit of a more perfect union. [applause]

the honorable john d. dingell, jr. tenure surpasses that of any member of congress american history. a child of the house, he became its dean. his legacy is all around us in cleaner water and greater respectful the civil rights of all americans. he summoned his grit and determination for legislative battles over health care. thanks to his efforts, millions more families across our nation now have the peace of mind that comes with access to quality, affordable care. a grateful nation honors john d. jr., for his lifetime of service from world war ii to decades of service in congress. [applause]

mildred s. streselhaus. she has helped uncover the mysteries of our world. wishedthe most estate

physicists, material scientists, and electrical engineers of her generation, her experiments transformed our understanding of materials leading to right screws in modern electronics. her pioneering research has had implications across the economy from electronics to energy storage to automotive parts. she hasder and mentor, inspired countless women to pursue opportunities in civics and engineering. her example is a testament to what we can achieve when we summon the courage to follow our curiosity and our dreams. [applause]

suzan harjo. poet, writer, curator, and advocate dedicated to the dignity of all people. a citizen of the cheyenne and arapahoe tribes, she has fought all her life for the human, civil, and treaty rights of native people. as the head of the national congress of american indians, president of the morningstar institute, and a founding trustee of the national museum of the american indian, her tireless efforts have protected native culture, returned native land, and improved native lives. resolve, she pushes us to always seek justice in our time. [applause]

at ethel kennedy -- ethel kennedy. [applause] life is a story of perseverance and generosity. a tireless advocate for the causes she holds dear, she founded the robert f kennedy center for justice and human rights were she advances her husband's vision for the world as it should be. whether on gun control, environmental protection, human rights, or public health, she tackles difficult issues with a relentless drive and inspires others to do the same. in ethel kennedy, we find the strength and passion that are at the heart of the american spirit. [applause]

the honorable abner mikva. [applause] one of the greatest jurists of his time, he built his career on reverence for the law, commitment to public service, and love for chicago. as a congressman, federal judge, and counsel to president clinton, he helped shape the national debate on some of the most challenging issues of the

always insisting government led up to its responsibility is to citizens. he has imparted his sense of civic duty to a new generation from shaping legal minds as a law professor to challenging and people to give back through public service. our laws abner mikva, and nation are more fair and equal. [applause] wendy mink, receiving on behalf of her mother, the honorable patsy takamoto mink. she was ahead of her time. the first woman of color elected to congress, she and her office

determined to all she could to ensure equal treatment for every american regardless of race or sex. she co-authored title ix of the education amendment of 1972 guarantee equal educational opportunities for women. she was a forceful advocate for civil rights legislation and a sensible end to the vietnam war. she served her beloved hawaii with integrity and grace all of her life. an american trailblazer, she helped build a nation that lives up to its promise and her example challenges us to make progress in our time. [applause] the honorable lucile allard receiving on behalf of robert.

[applause] roybal lived to serve. he served in the army in world war ii and on the los angeles city council. in 19 62, he became the first hispanic american elected to congress from california in almost a century and he served there for 30 years. he stood up for people who needed a champion, including veterans, the mentally ill, the elderly, and people living with hiv-aids. he founded the congressional hispanic caucus to ensure the voices of hispanic americans would always be heard. believes ourbal nation is strongest when we harness the talents of all people. that belief and his legacy will always live on. [applause]

charles sifford. charles sifford just wanted to play golf at a time when the pga at a caucasians only rule, you risk everything to effect change. death threats, he challenged the discrimination that plagued his beloved sport while demonstrating his extraordinary skills on the course winning six national negro opens for receiving his pga tour card. he went on to win pga events, was inducted into the world golf hall of fame, and received an honorary doctorate from saint andrews university. leveled theord fairway for generations of athletes of all races and inspired a community the on the sport he loves -- beyond the sport he loves. [applause]

robert m. solo. [applause] a brilliant economist, he transformed our fundamental understanding of how to build broad-based asperity -- prosperity. his groundbreaking research illustrated the importance of technological advancement too long grown -- long-term growth earning him a nobel prize. his conclusions in to cite the importance of investing in education and research. millions of americans have benefited from what he helped to spark. his contributions have molded public opinion and policy and he

continues to engage with the most pressing economic questions of the day with his incisive commentary on income inequality and economic mobility. [applause] meryl streep. [applause] one of our nation's greatest actors, meryl streep has an unmatched ability to bring a character to life. her performances have earned her the most academy award nominations of any actor in history and have given her audiences the chance to see the world through someone else's

eyes. whether portraying a famous chef, a fashion editor, a holocaust survivor, or a prime minister, she conveys her characters' stories with empathy and dignity. offscreen, she brings that same humanity to her advocacy for women, education, and the arts. with joy and discipline, meryl streep invites us to explore the full range of the human experience, one story at a time. [applause] marlo thomas. [applause]

for over half a century, marlo thomas has been challenging conventions and defying expectations. televisionarriers in and lifted the voices of women as cofounder of the ms. foundation for women. she reminds children we are all free to be human and her work with st. jude's children's research hospital has helped her become -- it become one of the top children's cancer hospitals in the nation. marlo thomas has taught us to be true to ourselves and lead our lives with confidence and compassion. [applause]

stevie wonder. [applause] world's most gifted singer-songwriter's, stevie wonder aircraft's songs about joy and loss, love and loneliness, with a musical style entirely his own. he is celebrated for his exuberant creativity, his virtuosity on multiple instruments, and his mastery of a wide range of genre's. the results and gave him millions of fans and 25 grammy awards. beyond his music, stevie wonder has impacted the world through his philanthropy and advocacy, especially his championing of people with disabilities..

creating music in the key of life, steamvie wonder has brought greater harmony to our nation. [applause] >> what an extraordinary group. let's give them all a big round of applause. [applause]

we thank all of them for the gifts they have given to us, the incredible performances, the incredible innovations, incredible ideas, the incredible expressions of the human spirit. not only have they made the world better, but by following their example, they make us a little bit better every day. we are truly grateful to them. on behalf of michelle and myself, please enjoy the reception and god bless you all. thank you. [applause]

[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2014] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> ♪

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discuss the influence of faith and religion on the way justices review and decide cases. the high court currently has six catholics and three jews. this is an hour and a half. >> let's see if this is going. it is going. good. good evening, everyone. welcome to the night conference center at the newseum. we are very pleased to see everyone out tonight. either you don't like football or you are very interested in this topic, one of the two. i am glad you are here. i only heard about this myself last minute. that is how far out of it i am, but there are probably some fans you want to have this discussion, so thank you for being here. if you are not on our invite

list and happened in here some other way and did not get an invitation to our programs, let us know, because we would be happy to put you on that list for future programs. i am charles haynes, and i direct this program. we are so happy to be partnering once again with "moment" magazine, which is a wonderful publication, as many of you know, part of great programs here, and we are, together, sponsoring a discussion that is about a contentious, murky, but always fascinating topic, which is the u.s. supreme court, and we have an outstanding panel. i would just note that on this panel, we have over 100 years of experience covering the u.s. supreme court, and that is just lyle denniston. [laughter] not quite, but you are going to

get there soon. we are very, very fortunate to have this outstanding panel. i'm going to turn things over to amy schwartz, who is the opinion editor over at "moment" magazine, and i will turn it over to her. [applause] >> good evening, everyone. welcome to tonight's discussion . my name is amy schwartz, and i am the opinion editor of "moment" magazine, and this -- magazine. the editor and chief is here but toiling away on a deadline, so making an appearance, and our wonderful partners, charles

haynes and the freedom center of the newseum institute. we are looking forward to a wonderful evening. thank you also to the staff of both our magazine and the institute, who have done so much work to bring this evening together. our topic tonight is one that as recently as a couple of decades ago would have been widely considered taboo. our supreme court justices, are they influenced in their decision-making by the religious convictions they bring to the bench? most casual observers and even most legal observers would argue back then that they should not be bringing religious conviction to the bench, if they had them, but as a supreme court justice, they would have said, and as john roberts contended at his confirmation hearing in 2005, far from applying his own beliefs, he simply calls them as he see's them.

but much has changed since that earlier consensus and even since that confirmation hearing almost 10 years ago. the traditional makeup of the court has changed dramatically, and we know more about the views then we knew before, because the times are more wired and interactive, or simply because the justices are more vocally devout. does it matter? do their religious beliefs have more of an impact than they once did, and if so, what impact? where will we see the difference? in church-state separation? gay rights? abortion? or things we cannot even envision? we have organized a panel. we have two professors of constitutional law, and in the middle we have marshall breger at the school of law at catholic university.

he was a senior fellow at the heritage foundation, and during the george h.w. bush administration, he was chief lawyer of the labor department. from 1985 to 1991, he was chairman of the administrative conference of the united states, and from 1987 until 1989, he served as an alternate delegate at the u.n. in geneva. he has also been a liaison to the jewish community under president reagan. stephen wermiel is a professor of constitutional law. he teaches constitutional law first amendment and a course on the supreme court. he is also part of the american bar association on individual rights, and he writes a blog about explaining the supreme court to law students. he is a co-author of the definitive graffiti of william j brennan, who i am sure we will discuss, -- definitive author on

william j brennan. we have three reporters who cover the court, as charles said, and bob barr and has been a washington post reporter ever since 1987 and has covered the supreme court since november 2006, including the nominations of sonia sotomayor or and elena kagan, and return to the court. lyle denniston is the senior news reporter covering the supreme court, which he has been doing from 1958, mostly with newspapers, including the star. for the fast -- past 10 years, he has been running for an online clearinghouse about the supreme court. he has received numerous awards,

including the prize for legal journalism, and he has taught at colleges and universities. tony mauro has covered the court for 34 years for usa today and more, and since 2004, the legal times, the national law journal, and the supreme court brief, a subscription newsletter. he is an author of a book published in 2005 by congressional quarterly press. he is a longtime member of the steering committee, and in 2010 was inducted into the freedom of information hall of fame. and other institutions. so we are very grateful to all of these very knowledgeable supreme court followers for giving us their expertise, and i am going to ask each one to begin by speaking briefly on the

general question of whether the changing makeup of the supreme court has had an effect on its jurisprudence. for the first time ever, there are no protestants on the board. -- court. three jews and six catholics, of varying political flavors. does this matter, and if so, how does it matter? how is it illustrated? we would just go from this side to that side. we will start with bob barnes. the headline on this story was, high court with vocally devout justices set to hear religious objections to health care law. >> well, thank you for having me. it is a pleasure to be here. the reason i wrote that story is because i was talking to a former supreme court clerk, now

a prominent law professor who pays a lot of attention to these issues, and he told me that when he was clerking at the supreme court, if anyone had asked him if any of the justices were religious, he would have said no, that none of them talk about it. he saw no real evidence of them being religious, and he thought that this court was very different. these justices have talked about their faith, much more, probably certainly justice scalia. he is the most outspoken about it. he said that intellectuals have to be what he calls fools for christ, and to be in to say that some things are about-face, and -- about faith, and when you think about the justices, they all have an interesting connection to religion, i think. justices sotomayor and thomas talk about how parochial schools

really were what lifted them out of poverty and in situations, neighborhoods in which education was not terribly valued. sometimes, justice kagan, who probably would she -- say she is not that religious nonetheless said she had religious instruction three times a week. she was the first girl to be bat mitzvahed at her synagogue. she said it was good, not great, being justice kagan, and all of the justices, i think, have this connection, and i do not know if any of us can say how that affects the way they do cases, but i do think it has a big impact on those going to them.

i thought, for instance, that the obama administration and the recent hobby lobby case about whether private business owners had a right to say that their religious objections keep them from offering certain kinds of contraception was a very very sort of respectful of religion deliberate from the government. all of those briefs talked over and over again about how it was not at issue what these challengers to the law believed or how valued their believes should be, and so i think that the difference has come in the way people approach issues to the court, and maybe some of the cases that the court takes itself.

we could talk about the town of greece case about prayers before a town council meeting. that is one that the court did not have to take but decided to take, and it really divided the court, so i think one thing to think about is how with the justices have said about religion affects the way people approach the court. >> i think i would have mentioned to some of the same things that bob just has about the justices, although i think there is one quote from the justice scalia, that we must be fools for christ sake, and i wrote to him and said, are you sure there wasn't a, -- a comma in there, and he liked that. [laughter] they are more principled about -- outspoken about their religious faith, in general. i think it could be partly because so many people --

whatever they say, anything, people are watching much more than they used to. it is not uncommon for justices to talk about their faith, but people weren't listening maybe 20 years ago. maybe it is also the case, and this may be stereotyping, that they did not speak as outwardly about their faith as some catholics and some jews. what i would say is that i think it does have an effect on how they look at cases and look at life in the same way, coming from harvard or being born in the south has an impact on their perspectives. it is just one of many cultural elements in their backgrounds, and even justice scalia has said we come to the court.

we are who we are. we come to the court with our upbringing and the elements that our parents brought to us in raising us, and we cannot avoid that. but he has said, and they all have said that they keep that separate from our professional lives, so i think it is just something that is of interest, and i think that they recognize also that this change is making up six catholics and three jews. -- in the makeup, six catholics and three jews. justice sotomayor or -- at law school was recalling that she was talking about the types of

diversity that the supreme court ought to have. it ought to have more people from different areas, a civil rights attorney or two instead of a corporate lawyer, and then she said plus we all believe in god. and that was kind of striking to hear that, do think that there is nobody on the court who is an atheist. i think you could argue -- we could talk about this later, but it would be interesting to think about whether a devout atheist could ever be confirmed to the supreme court. i kind of doubt it. >> has there ever been an atheist on the supreme court? >> i sure don't think so, and there are not many devout atheists in congress either, for that matter. >> i think when justice said he was agnostic, so that is part way there. i suspect others, as well, but i

will wait until it is my turn. >> go ahead. >> in some ways, i have to say i am kind of a dissenter, because i am not sure being a catholic or a jew or even a protestant -- that does not tell you much about how they're going to make decisions, probably because there are so many ways of being a catholic, so many ways of being a jew, so many ways of being a protestant. i do think that what you bring to the court, your experiences, your background tells you something about how you're going to approach cases, and not to open up a controversy again, but i think justice sotomayor or, a latina, brings some sense to that. that is what she was bringing. thurgood marshall brought in special experience to the court. even if he was outvoted, it was

something the justices were sensitive to. we should not overdetermine the notion of the effect of religion. it is one of many things that are part of the influence on justices. having said that, i think the topic is very interesting, because it has to do with the selection process. there is a sensitivity. i think it was eisenhower who talked about the qualified catholic. it has to do with notions of representation. i mean, the notion that there be a woman on the court was important, and i guess protestants are upset that they do not have a protestant on the court, and it also raises a lot of interesting theoretical issues, because it goes directly to this question of can you

bleach out, to be a professional, do you have to bleach out your personal distinctions, your personal characteristics, and i think that was a notion of what it was to be a professional in the 1940's and 1950's and before, so you had this view that you're supposed to remove your jewishness from being a lawyer. remove your protestant this, and i think we have a different view of the world now, and that raises some interesting questions and solve some other ones, but i think we should be aware that we are living in a world where it is not just justices, but all politicians are talking about their faith.

i mean, probably, when i was working for george h.w. bush, one of my jobs was to sort of take him around the jewish community a bit. he could not stand wearing a yarmulke. i am just an umpire. there is a terrific quote. i did not memorize it, by a law professor. and he says much harm is done by the myth, but by merely putting on a black robe and taken the oath of office as a judge, a man ceases to be human and ceases of all predilections.

i think that was in his second circuit opinion, but the point is as much as justices say that is what they are doing, we have to have a question mark around that. >> when was that? >> in the 1940's, when he was in the second circuit. >> you want to talk partly about how things have changed. i know you're an expert. >> ok. i apologize first for my voice. this is the voice i was born with, and that is why i am not a broadcaster. [laughter] when i was in high school, i did sing in the choir, but every now and again, mrs. peterson would say, let's try it again without lyle. thank you for having this event and charles for sponsoring it.

this is a fascinating topic. i have recently been reading a book on the ratification process of the constitution, which is a fabulous work, and it is interesting how often in the ratifying conventions the questions of a religious test for public office came up as an issue, and as you know, the constitution itself insists that there not be a religious test for holding office in the national government. so to a degree for a traditionalist like me, or at least a traditional journalist, this makes me a little uncomfortable, because i tend to think that religion is a matter of private choice and private exercise and that we should not, in fact, have our public officials in terms of how well they serve their faith.

i must tell you that i am married to a baptist, who is a seminary graduate, who is about as rigid a separationist as you can find, and a lot of that has rubbed off on me, though i tend to be somewhat wary of this topic. however, there are a few areas where i do believe that the religious preferences of the justices or the religious identities, if you will, do have an impact, and i think the steady movement towards expanding the sphere of religion in the public square is in considerable part a product of the comfort with which certain fates, particularly the roman catholic faith, has him, if you will, co-opting the government in order to advance the principles of that faith.

and i think -- i think that is a very important influence in this court, sometimes precipitously moving religion more to the center of public affairs, and it is very different now. i do also think that the abortion question is now driven in considerable part by the roman catholic perspective on abortion, and, of course, when you talk about abortion, in this court, you have to talk about anthony kennedy, who probably holds a decisive vote on that subject. one cannot read his opinion in the gonzalez case, upholding the partial birth abortion act without seeing how he was, if

you will, take it into camp by some pretty junky science about the way women react to questions about their reproductive health and how they suffer interminably in a good deal of agony after they have undergone this particular procedure, so i think justice kennedy is acting out of his faith in that area. it is always difficult, to know where a kennedy is going to wind up, liberty, interest, because so much of his jurisprudence is driven by the whole constitution structure and history is devoted towards the service of liberty interests, but when it comes to women's liberty interests, i

think justice kennedy is pretty close to tone deaf. having said nothing controversial -- [laughter] >> but i apologize. i miss spoke. you are the author of a book about justice brennan. >> and i want to talk a little bit as lyle did. justice brennan, i think, it is to say the most ardent separationist in the modern history of the court, and i think he was that precisely he was catholic. that is where his catholicism took him. he believed deeply in religion, but he believed that it was private and personal and that having religion in the public square and in public life was divisive.

for history's sake, justice brennan was on the court from 1956 until 1990. he participated in decisions prohibiting school prayer and was vilified by the catholic church for doing so. he felt strongly enough about his views in those cases to write a separate 50-page concurring opinion in the second school prayer decision in 1963, a case called abington school district versus shep, and i was looking over that again today, about whether or not we could ever have an atheist on the court. justice brennan in his opinion in 1963 talks about the establishment clause embodied the framers conclusion that government and religion have discrete interests, which are mutually best served when each

avoids too close proximity to the other. it is not only the nonbeliever who fears the injection of sectarian doctrines and controversies into the civil policy, but in a high degree, it is a devout believer who fears the secularization of the creed, which becomes too deeply involved with and dependent upon the government. i think that was the essence of justice brennan's separation, the believer, sort of having government involved in your religion demeans your religious beliefs. and i think that was his view, and i think that view is gone. i am not even sure there is anybody on the court that would share that belief. virtually all at this time on the court, he paid personally for it.

a few months after writing that opinion in 1963, he went to a mass in which the bishop was a visiting bishop from richmond, virginia, and railed against the court with justice brennan sitting in the front row, recognizable to the bishop. at the end of the mass, justice brennan's wife kissed the bishop's ring and then said to the bishop, you are not really fit to have us kiss your ring, and they did not go back to mass for three years after that. when they went back to mass, they went to mass in virginia where they had a saturday night mass, where he thought nobody would recognize him, and nobody did for a little while, but i think things have just changed dramatically. >> well, that leads to the question about whether the same -- several people have mentioned the same religion or the same religious beliefs can lead to

different outcomes in terms of one's -- the decisions that one is taken to. we have different politics. i wanted to go back and ask people, how would you draw a distinction between what a couple of people have mentioned about their religious beliefs against simply their life experiences. tony, you mentioned justice scalia and justice sotomayor have experiences in parochial school. >> and justice thomas. >> and justice thomas, as well. how does that affect their belief in school voucher cases? is there a suggestion that they are more open to that sort of thing?

>> maybe i have drunk the kool-aid at the court, but i do not think so. i think the justices really do make an effort to separate their own, their personal views on things like that from their decision-making. so i think if they have experience at parochial school, it does not mean they're going to be in favor of vouchers. unfortunately, i mean, that is my perception, but there is another perception out there, which is the opposite, that the justices kind of fuel this one. for example, you know, the late term abortion case. this was when there were only

five catholics on the court, and all five of them voted in favor of this law that prohibited late-term abortions, so that feeds the stereotype that catholics might be monolithically to advance the church's agenda, but, again, that is very much like, i think, the decisions where all of the republican appointed justices vote one way, and all of the democrat-appointed justices vote to the other way. i do not think it is materially different from other types of influences in the justices' space -- lives. >> i think the question of identity, and identity factor in selecting justices leads to

questions that are asked, for instance, at their confirmations about either their religious views or their willingness to separate their religious views from the court. i think, marshall, you brought up the question what can be asked. >> well, you have to be -- ought to be -- you cannot come right out and say, do you believe in this, so, presumably, you have to crawl your way around it. but, invariably, the justices say that i am an umpire, or my job is to apply the rules. i am not sure if this was at a confirmation or afterwards. listen.

i just apply the constitution. now, in my private morals, you cannot take me out of my skin, and my catholic, and i listen to the catholic doctrine. he can easily say that because he is an originalist. he interprets the text of the constitution as it was believed or understood at the founding. many of the moral values at that time were also conservative values, so they would be in -- impregnated, you might say, into the original understanding, if you believe in a living constitution, then, in a way, his morality views, they become more relevant, i think, so he can do it somewhat more easily than someone who believes in a living constitution or almost for the purposes of a constitution, where the moral view is in bedded.

-- embedded. now, whether one can actually live up to that is another story, but that, i think, is the general approach created even with brennan, at his confirmation -- his nomination hearings, and he had to say very clearly, i separate -- i made my peace. the constitution, in my public life i follow the constitution, and in my private life, i am a good catholic. so people want to know. it is what it means you being a catholic. that is why i said there are so many ways of being a catholic, just as there are so many ways of being a jew that it is more the social identity that you have or that social background that you have that affects how you vote much more than just a label.

>> i think it is important to note also that there is not a catholic seat on the board. there is not that there is a jewish seat on the board. justice ginsburg has said some of the justices that preceded us were jewish justices, and justice breyer and i are justices who happened to be jews, and, certainly, president george w. bush did not set out to put two catholics on the court. in fact, remember, he nominated an evangelical protestant, harriet miers, who did not make it, so i think it is much more that they look at the ideology of the person and their background then religion. >> i think there is an irony in that. for brennan, his catholicism was the main issue at his confirmation hearing.

as marshall described, they asked him, if it comes to loyalty to the pope or loyalty to the constitution, what are you going to choose, and he basically said, senator, i take the same oath to uphold the constitution that you did, but there was a controversy over whether to ask him that. there was a controversy over what he might say, and then the irony is he arguably voted less consistently with what one might consider to be catholic views. i mean, he voted in right in favor of abortion and contraception. he voted against school prayer. he voted against various forms of financial aid to religious schools. he is about as kind of anti-catholic in his voting as

imaginable. now, we do not ask the question, and there is no controversy about it, and yet, we are here discussing asking whether or not their religious views influence them more than 50 years ago when we did ask the question and it was controversial. >> you have to be fair. people really do not think of justice ginsburg when she was nominated as a woman judge. that was more important to her identity, it was believed, and with the jewish justices, in spite of being jewish. cardozo was nominated in spite of being jewish, so it was not only until frankfurt or when they thought he is replacing a jewish justice that we got into this notion of jewish representation. and what you have when you have three. now there is no need for a jewish seat. >> you brought up a little bit about this question of whether talking about the religion of a

justice or a perspective justice is really about talking about their politics. and could we talk about how that has actually played out in recent cases? or instance, how is the catholicism of the various, now that there is so many, how has it played out in terms of the gay marriage decision, or even the health care laws, which you might have thought religion would play a part. did it? >> i would say in the hobby lobby case, which is the case having to do with the right of a private business with the religious freedom act to refuse to provide contraceptive health coverage for their female employees. i would say that justice alito's opinion in that case very much was influenced by his religious

preferences, because to exact the notion that a corporation, which is an artificial entity, can have, based on a manner of a religious police system, -- belief system transferred to it by its owners. aside from being pretty close to ludicrous, it is highly debatable in terms of a social philosophy. i do think that justice alito probably went into that case believing that corporations, because they are in some sense people -- even george romney believed that, because they are in some sense people, you probably are capable of absorbing the religious preferences and value system of their owners.

i think that is probably a pretty good example of that. in gay marriage, one of the reasons that you have to read the gay marriage decisions differently, i think, is that the lead opinion was written by kennedy, but it was driven by his liberty perceptions rather than by his catholic value system, and so when you get into that with justice kennedy, it is harder to trace religious sources of his jurisprudence when he is talking about liberty interests. i do think -- i wanted to bring up another example of where i think a jewish justice's value system influences his jurisprudence, and this has to do with justice breyer, but before he was a justice, when he was a law clerk to a jewish justice, justice goldberg, what

they remember, if you read the papers at the library of congress, they had law clerks, stephen breyer. he wrote an opinion, a contrary opinion, for goldberg, in a case on access to birth control measures, and he wrote a separate opinion which articulated the concept of a liberty interest as an emanation from the 14th amendment, which, i think, is where that concept began inserting itself into constitutional jurisprudence, and i do think that steve is probably driven by his kind of social justice instincts as a jew and believing that probably he shared those views, and that is why i think he was allowed to

lay out that opinion, and i think it is not directly traceable to his religious faith, but i think it was certainly influenced by it. >> an interesting fact about justice breyer, just to show in modern times how these things can get sort of mixed up, he is a jew who was married in an anglican ceremony in which they omitted references to jesus, and he has a daughter who raises her children as jews, and a daughter who is added to skip alien priest, so he really has everything covered. >> i would also add in relation to breyer, i think one reason for the strength of his dissent in the school voucher case was a kind of historical sense that

mixing religion and politics in the state, in the school arena will -- brings up all of the old battles of religion, and i think the protestants would view this strongly related to it, and the jews would have strong things. >> marshall, you said to me in a conversation before this that there were aspects to alito's hobby lobby decision about contraception that had to do with catholic doctrine on who is responsible. >> i do not know about catholic doctrine, but the different

notions of what makes you complicit in an action, from what i understand is a lot of catholic doctrine, if you take a wide view of what makes you -- what action or not action makes you complicit in an immoral act, and it may be -- i think it is, but it is wider than ordinary notions of complicity, which you could have indirect interventions that would make you not complicit, so would not say as some authority, because i am not, i suspect that some of these notions about what led to complicity may come from his knowledge of catholic doctrine. >> it is almost time to go to questions, but before that, i wanted to return at least briefly to this question up appearances, and, tony, i think you are an expert on something called the red mass? can you explain about that?

>> i would just mention it briefly. it is an extraordinary event held each year with the catholic archdiocese of washington. it is a red mass. it occurs on the sunday before the first monday in october, which is when the supreme court term begins, and it has become such a regularized ritual that it is like being celebratory kickoff of the supreme court term. this goes to the point, to a degree, that lyle was making earlier, that the catholic church may be more than other churches has made a project of trying to impose its doctrine on the judiciary and other parts of the government, and it is -- looking at it cynically, this is an opportunity for the roman catholic church to have a catholic audience that includes almost always six out of the

nine justices for proselytizing or not proselytizing but sermonizing issues that concern it, and it is really -- i cannot think of any other institution that has that type of access to the supreme court. and for many years -- i have been covering it as a news event for probably 25 years or so. and in the earlier years, like in the 1980's, the sermons were very politicized. they would rail against abortion as a form of murder, that any law that advances abortion is immoral, but that kind of rubbed certain justices the wrong way.

in fact, justice ginsburg -- that is the thing that not only catholic justices attend, but jewish justices a few weeks ago, justices kagan and another attended, along with, let's see, four of the catholic justices, but, anyway, justice ginsburg was so annoyed about one of the sermons, it was so antiabortion, that she vowed she would never go again, and she said that even scalia -- she is close friends with the scalia family, even they were embarrassed iv -- at the stridency of the sermon. since then, it has gotten much more toned down, although there is still quite a bit of talk in

the sermons about the separation of church and state and how it is appropriate for people of faith to bring their faith to work with them. and i think to have that annual opportunity, to make that plight , i think it is an interesting thought, and it is special to the supreme court. whether the justices then go home and put into practice, i don't know. >> i mean, to me, the very existence of this event, and i recognize it has been going on for a long time, suggest its own

impropriety, and regardless of what is said at the sermon, one of the core issues now in the town of greece, in the legislative prayer case 30 years ago, the argument that the prayer is not religious, it just has a solemnizing effect on that is what the catholic church is claiming it is doing here. putting its own solemnizing spin on the supreme court term. to go to the mass is to accept the validity of that argument. i think that is inappropriate. >> i think that is a little unfair. whatever they are, they are autonomous beings. they are not going to be proselytized or overwhelmed. i don't know if the town of greece has anything to do with it. that is where there was an official state or government event. this is a voluntary activity.

i called breyer the first year he went. he said, it is unifying. it is a good way to start. >> blessing the supreme court term. >> we don't get upset when a priest or rabbi blesses the yachting ring. some communities depend on the fishing season, the priest blesses the boasts. -- boats. if you have ever attended the national prayer breakfast, most of the congress and cabinet, including jewish congressman, they are all there getting a religious message.

we have this. also, a kind of feature in american society which is less focused on the separating or do nominal emotional -- denominational aspect of religion but religion. the way if angelical's used to think catholics were the -- the way evangelicals used to think catholics were the whore of babylon. can i said it -- can i say that on tv? i think it is extreme to say it is proselytizing. >> there has never been a president inaugurated without a prayer. >> let me being extremist.

they are two places in washington from which supreme court justices should stay away religiously. one is the state of the union. a message of which is not low comedy, it is high comedy. it is a demeaning experience for a self-respecting judge to go and sit there. pretend to be interested in what is going on. pretend to be detached from it. the other place they should not be seen is the red mass. the red mass -- when i grew up in nebraska, we used to talk about the fox in the chicken coop. going to the red masses putting yourself in the chicken coop. when the priest gets up, he is the fox. he is very interested in consuming those who sit in the audience.

[laughter] just to be a little bit moderate about that, there are two bank places where justices should make up their minds that that is inappropriate to their job. >> maybe we should stop on that note. there are two microphones. we are asking you to go to one of them. and speak. you can maybe identify yourself before you do so. >> i was wondering about -- we have to justices who are involved with opus dei. i was wondering if you thought that was appropriate? >> is a religious view. unless you want to go back to the 1915 notion that catholic

people in government follow whatever rome says, whatever the pope says, that is their religious view. they have the right to do that, like a jew -- joins the chabad movement. >> there are no jews that are part of the chabad movement -- >> unless you are saying that an orthodox jew could never be on the supreme court, that is a contingency. generally it could happen. they could have their religious views. >> i'm not saying they should be on the court or not. i'm wondering how that might impact someone on the court. >> we can ask if there are any kind of activity that should rise to the level of disqualifying or recusing a justice from serving or serving on a case? >> justice scalia recused

himself from a really important case over the phrase, under god, in the pledge of allegiance. he had attended an event at which his son, a priest, appeared. justice scalia undertook to opine on the issue. he did thereafter take himself out of the case, did not participate. which i thought was entirely appropriate for him to do so. the inappropriate thing for him was for him to go out in public and take a position on something he knew was coming before the court. this is another case that i have noticed. this crop of justices loves to sit on public forums and opine

on what they are doing in their judicial business. if you want to know why the supreme court is not yet hearing the gay marriage cases, just follow ruth ginsburg around to various public forums. she will tell you inside stories about what is going on at the court. if they are only granting and deciding 75 cases a year, it seems to me they could grant a few more if they would cut out some of their public appearances. >> anybody else on that? another question? >> i'm hoping the supreme court will weigh in on releasing withheld records regarding the jfk assassination. it brings to point an interesting statement made by --

the wife of the founder of the cia, that the cia stood for catholics and action. we are a bit -- very roman catholic culture. i would like to draw a question to you from a very important book, entitled "rulers of evil." it traces the influence in western history of the jesuit order, the military order of the roman church. it points out that the jesuits, in history, they are a military order. they report to a general. >> question? >> roman catholics participate in confession. jesuit priests are among the confessors to the most powerful in the world, including supreme court justices.

it can work as a two-way process. the reform church does not have confession. is the jesuit confessional process a factor in how roman catholicism and government officials who are roman catholic can be influenced from rome? >> i would say that is an exclusively a private matter. i have various people to whom i go and make confessions about my inadequacies. i'm not about to pray that before you tonight. it seems to me to ask a justice to reveal how they practice their faith is to go way beyond the pale of proper public discourse. >> i am the legal director of the center for inquiry