this digit revolution. that's why we're now the leader of the world with the leading economy. but if we're going to continue to be the leader of the world we need to be the most innovative entrepreneurial nation. and that's also trying on a policy level to get things like immigration reform past so we can win a global battle for tenant. i think it's really important that we all do whatever we can to embrace the next generation of entrepreneurs wherever they might be and provide the capital, make it easier for them to track the talent so we have a more broadly dispersed innovation economy and it maximizes our chaps of being the -- our chances of being the leader of the world. it's important. >> that was really good. good ending. >> thanks. [applause] >> also at the recent sixth annual washington ideas forum, a conversation with chad dickerson. he offers an outline on his company's business model and

overall innovations in the tech industry. this is about 20 minutes. >> thanks very much, steve. you may refer to me as his holiness from now on. it's okay. it's a real delight to be here with chad. here's the transition of what i hope we'll hear in the next 19 minutes. we've heard very intelligent discussions of why things are difficult to do in national politics combined with assertions that in general the united states still has resilience. we're going to hear illustrations of that actual resilience, what it means, the kinds of things we're doing. so let's start. how many people here actually have shopped with etsy? how many people have sold for etsy? a mauler number. maybe that -- a smaller number. tell us, for people who haven't sold on ets etsy yet, what is it and why does it matter?

>> etsy is a marketplace for unique goods, vintage items and craft supplies. we've been around since 2005. there are a million sellers around the world. selling in 200 countries. last year, there was 1.35 million dollars sold on etsy. we're a 600-person company based in brooklyn. we really see etsy has this leading indicator for a new kind of economy that's about making things. it's about self-determination, self-reliance. i think it is really an anecdote to what you're seeing in politics. it's about people in local communities doing what americans and others have always done. that's making beautiful things. >> and i'll spend just ten seconds saying this is just the kind of thing that my wife deb and i have been seeing around the country, traveling for the american future series, studies of where people are starting up businesses. we're meeting in d.c. with a

largely policy-oriented crowd. we're used to thinking of job creation of economic trends, in the largest scale a giant factory that opens or closes or whatever. why does the sort of small enterprise that you are ect canning and represent -- that you are connecting and representing, why should we care about it? >> sure. number one, we're seeing a large number of people making a living on etsy, so 18% of sellers on etsy work full time. we're also seeing this reemergence of manufacturing in a way you may not think about. i should tell some stories. >> really interesting. >> we'll go to the slides. so these cuff links are from the shop brass and chain, based in ohio. i'm actually wearing soming right now. they make customized cuff links from vintage maps. on my left i have berkeley,

which is appropriate for the left. [laughter] i moved to brooklyn from berkeley. on my right, i have brooklyn. they built a very successful business creating these custom cuff links. so this -- i think an important theme here is that there are so many new markets that you may not think about. this is little capes a shop that makes superhero capes for kids which is really amazing. i have one for my son. the really amazing story -- i think there's hope for america -- allison was working 18 hours a day, and she noticed there was a factory across town in massachusetts, and she went to the factory literally knocked on the door, talked to the owner of the to factory. the factory had been a huge employer in the area in the 80's but was really not going very well. she talked to jimmy, the owner,

and he started helping her make these superhero capes and scale up her business. so he started hiring people her salesmen, and this is happening in the united states here in america. when you think about the apple revolution, and the iphone revolution you need a place to put your iphone, for charging and such. t andand so there's an entire economy onest of handmade iphone cases and charges. so the shop here is mal magzilla. this is a really amazing business. i have one of these items on my desk. policy. ha ha! a lot of things intersect here. this is a shop called milk and honey luxuries. sarah, the proprietor, makes silverware with stamped messages on them.

we actually reached out to our sellers. we're very pro-net neutrality. we asked them to make goods to show congress and policy makers that we really believe in an open internet. so sarah was in nursing school and starting doing this on the side as kind of stress relief. her business grew so much that she quit nursing school, got a wholesale deal with nordstrom. and her husband, who works in finance, quit to help her do her job. so i think we're building a beautiful world when women making things are pulling their husbands out of finance jobs to -- [laughter] [applause] yes. that's the world i want to live in. it's the world i am living in. and finally, this is a shop, urban wood goods. the proprietor, in chicago starting making these desks from reclaimed wood, which you can see here. and the baskets here, which you might recognize from high school lockers and that sort of thing, they were sourcing them from

second-hand stores. the demand got so high that they couldn't source enough of these baskets, so they called up the original manufacturer in chicago and asked them to make a run of these baskets and spin out more production. so, you know in chicago, we're seeing something that started out as a hobby and it's actually contributing to manufacturing jobs and supporting in this case a manufacturing outfit that was 100 years old and needed more business. this is really the economy we see. when we look at the internet or look at the political challenges in the united states and all the issues and all the sniping, what we see is, when people self-organize, they use the internet to connect with each other, and they work with each other, then the economy works. >> great. so i think people can envision transformation when it affects them and they have a hard time when it doesn't. people in d.c. understand the transforming political effect of being able to raise money online, when the recent conference here we had travis from uber, people in washington

can understand uber because they take it often. the maker movement, many people in big service sector cities have a hard time taking it seriously. what is the maker movement and why should it be taken seriously? >> how many of you have heard of the home brew computer club? great. it was a group that met in the bay area in the 70's. it was a group of people who traded supplies and tips and they were basically making computers, home brew computer club. people who went to that meeting included people like steve jobs and steve wozniak. i know it's kind of a subculture. if you were outside of that subculture, you would look at it and think it was somewhat trivial. they were doing phone freaking, all kinds of hacker stuff. but that was really the seed of the personal computing revolution. what we're seeing today is that there are literally tens of

thousands of home brew computer clubs called etsy teams. these are self-organized groups of sellers who meet together in communities all around the world. and they do things very 34u67 like the -- very much like the home brew computer club. from the outside, it may look like a hobby, but when you look at the stories we're seeing its emerging as a real vocation and a real way for people to make money. so anything that looks like a hobby in the beginning often turns into a bigger movement. i think that's what we're seeing. >> and there's a craft brew movement literally the home brewing movement, which is a genuine business. if things go the way you hope and think they should over the next five or ten years, what would the etsy economy look like and mean? >> yeah. so our mission is to reimagine commerce in ways that build a more fulfilling and lasting world. and so it's not just about the buying and selling of things. it's about bringing that

personal connection back to commerce. when you look at the broader landscape, it's all about price and convenience and next day delivery. and many of the companies who are successful in that ecosystem are all about squeezing suppliers, going to the lowest cost labor, that sort of thing. the etsy economy that we see is really about cathying an economy -- creating an economy where everyone wins. the way etsy works, we're obviously an internet platform. but when you sell something on etsy, etsy's cut is 3.5%. the artist's cut is 96.5%. all the money is going back to communities everywhere. there's not like a great sucking sound to bentonville, arkansas for example, not to name names. [laughter] and we really see this, you know -- our 3.5% as etsy has become more successful we haven't -- that fee has not been raised.

really since the company started. so the etsy economy is a really fair economy. it's also getting into offline retail. i mentioned milk and honey luxuries. we've also built a wholesale program. boutiques are now buying from etsy sellers. again, 3.5%. the etsy economy is really about, instead of looking at the economy in sort of a zero sum way, like how can i win? how can etsy win? it's how can etsy do well, how can ourly our suppliers do well, and how can everyone do well? >> it's a different view. >> you've also written about how the virtual connections with facilitate real human connections with people. tell us how that works. >> i mentioned etsy teams. and the thing to understand about etsy is it's real people on the ground. you know, in new york, there are

dozens of these etsy teams who meet. to give you a visual sense of kind of how pervasive etsy sellers are, there are actually more etsy sellers in the five boroughs in new york than there are yellow cans. a lot, a lot of people. and we've done things -- you know, i think a lot of internet companies out there are kind of fighting regulation, fighting the government. it's very adversarial. we really look at government as another opportunity to partner. qen,again, that fulfilling and lasting world. we worked with local civic organizations, local government, in a program that we call craft entrepreneurship where we're working with our etsy teams, again, the etsy sellers on the ground to teach disadvantaged communities how to start businesses on etsy. and those classes, again, being taught by the sellers in our community, not by etsy. they're meeting in places like the dallas public library chattanooga public library. we're an internet company that cares about libraries.

and civic institutions. and i think to the earlier question about the etsy economy, that's really what we envision and what we're seeing happen. and we think it's possible and it's a great alternative to things like cable news and politics. >> so i have to ask you one other policy question before some more transcendental ones. when businesses are growing like yours, they are viewed to the government is either they want the government somehow to support them somehow to stop oppressing or hindering them or to get out of their way. what is your view towards government in general, of those three? >> so we're not -- it's a little bit of each. i think it's more -- i'll add a fourth option. i think it's more a plea for understanding. we want government and the media and everyone to understand that the work that these largely women are doing 88% of sellers on etsy are women, that the work is legitimate. it's not just a hobby.

these are real businesses. everything from how you support business with internet taxation, and like free trade. you know we have sellers shipping all over the world. i think it's, in our minds, it's less about thinking, you know, how can we lure a thousand-person factories to the united states. it's about how do we support these small entrepreneurs and help them be successful in all of these policy areas? so it's more about shifting the sort of understanding. >> so let's talk about culture. you've worked, you say a lot in the bay area during the sort of glory days of the dot-coms. you're working in brooklyn, a famously creative area. how would you both compare the new york and california start-up cultures and derive lessons from the two of them to other parts of the country, even d.c.? >> this is more my personal point of view. you heard i was an english lit major. i focused on shakespeare. i went to work at the raleigh

news observer in 1993 which was the first daily newspaper on the web in the united states. there i got interested in the internet and taught myself how to code. just on a personal lel, i think -- level, i think coding is really important but also liberal arts. when i think about sort of lasting ideas in the world the programming languages that people were learning in 1993 are mostly forgotten. mcbeth is still remembered. so -- [applause] >> ha ha! >> so i think that -- [applause] >> thank you. so, you know what does this have to do with new york, silicon valley culture? i personally enjoy new york because i think it's more of a balanced culture. i don't believe that technology and software is going to solve all of the world's problems. i think it can solve a lot of problems and it's very much an enabler. so, you know, working in a creative company like etsy that serves creative people, i think

working in a place where you have everything from theater to art to the opera to, you know, amazing authors, i think the cultural environment in new york is really second to none. and for that reason, i really prefer building a company like etsy in a place like new york. i think, you know, obviously -- silicon valley is a one-industry town. but it's a big, big industry. >> sort of like d.c. >> yes. on a personal level, i think a really creative diverse company it's better to build in new york. >> just to ask the underside of that, both for all their strengths, both new york, especially brooklyn and the bay area, they're seen as fostering and rewarding a certain class of people at the expense of many others. hour will your economy -- how will your company build an embracing thick middle class economy? how does that factor into your concerns? >> sure. yeah. i think we look at etsy, the

platform is really all about bringing opportunity to a diverse group of people. so i think really the proof is in the pudding. you know we're seeing, in the cities that i mentioned, craft entrepreneurship program, we have our local teams supporting people in those communities with urban wood goods, for example, we have our sellers as they scale up. they're making more money and doing well but also submitting orders to smaller manufacturers in their area, which is creating jobs. i really think everything we do is -- because it is based on that principal of fairness that i talked about, everything we do is intended to build a really healthy economy. and, again, the mission about more fulfilling and lasting world, we're not saying, you know etsy is the place to sell more stuff. we want all of the mechanisms in the company to make the world better, not in the trite silicon valley make the world better sense, because i think that can can be overused, but making things,

selling things, promoting community. those are things that really do make the world better. >> in the work you do and the technology you put together, what is the part of it that's difficult that nobody from the outside fully appreciates? every job has something that's harder than somebody on the outside knows. what is it for you? >> i think talent. there's so much happening. a new app launches every day like dozens, hundreds of apps. and there are people building those things. and so assembling a company when everybody is looking for the same talent and running that company is really difficult. i think because my background was in technology, and i know how the internet works and all that kind of thing, there are some days i wake up and i'm surprised that the internet actually works. [laughter] because in some ways, it's very patched together. so i think the hard part of the job is just every day 24/7, making the company work, technology-wise and talent-wise.

>> we have one minute left. again, we're here in d.c. we've heard about all the things that are difficult here. if you were plummeted into some governmental organization now and could apply what you've learned to making things function better here, what would it be? >> i have to pause for a moment. i think it's really to -- it's -- for me, it's really about creasing fear. i -- addressing fear. i think that there's a fear of technology in washington, what i've seen. there's kind of a superstructure of government contractors and all this sort of thing. what i would do is really change the way software is built in the government, to be more like what we're doing in new york, more like silicon valley. and i think it's notable to me that, you know -- i hate to bring up healthcare.gov, but when you look at healthcare.gov, it took a group of silicon valley people, top technologists to come in and fix it.

let's build things the right way so somebody doesn't have to come in and fix it. >> with those encouraging words please join me in thanking chad. >> next, a conversation with energy secretary ernest moniz. then a capitol hill portrait unveiling ceremony for michigan congressman john cohniers. after that some of those that spoke at this year's washington ideas forum. >> on this weekend's newsmakers, congressman chris van hollen will talk about the democratic agenda in the new congress. as the top one on the budget committee, he'll also discuss the upcoming budget debate and the potential efforts by the g.o.p. to change or repeal the health care law. you can watch that interview live sunday at 10 a.m. eastern here on c-span. bhobdmonday night, on the

communicators, the efforts by federal agencies to provide for the growing needs of mobile phone service providers. >> the ultimate, in the spectrum of efficient technology, let's call it dynamic spectrum access. that includes rail and i know you've heard a lot about that. and it includes some new technology that's just starting to become laboratory available, where we can use satellites to actually create a model of the world so that when somebody transmits, they will know whether they are going to interfere with somebody else. you put all these things together i hesitate to hell you how --hesitate to tell you how much more efficient you would be, because you would laugh me out of this room. we're talking not about tebz tens of

times of improvement or hundreds or thousands but millions of times improvement. that's not as crazy as it sounds. we are a trillion times more spectrally efficient than we were in long ago times. so the thought of being a million times more efficient in the next 20 or 30 years is not as crazy as it sounds. >> monday night at 8 eastern on the communicators on c-span 2. >> energy secretary ernest moniz and southern energy company c.e.o. thomas fanning. secretary moniz outlines the energy department's agenda. and mr. fanning discusses nuclear energy production in the u.s. this is about 25 minutes. [applause] >> welcome mr. secretary. a tough act to follow but i'm sure we can do it. >> and the introduction as well. >> and margaret and steve

clemmons. let me start with a question that i this i you probably -- i think you probably get a lot which is, what's the harm in doing keystone? >> ha ha! as secretary kerry has said, as the responsible official, he is hoping to decide that question soon. >> fair enough. something else i want to get into with you a little bit is the question of corporate tax reform. i know that's something you probably don't think about whole lot, but there are a lot of incentives in the energy market, the energy world, that are affected by that question of whether corporate tax rates should come down, and benefits, targeted breaks, should be given up. what's the cost? is there a the cost to not using tax credits, the tax policy as an incentive for behavior? >> well, let me broaden it a little bit from tax policy to in general incentives that we have

to accelerate the transformation to a low carbon future. and we make no mistake about it. the president has made it very clear that we are committed to that -- to going into that direction. let me give you a couple of examples. first of all, this is not in the tax world but the department of energy has rather enormous loan guarantee authorities. we have $40 billion left in play. we intend to continue the great success with that portfolio over the last years across the energy spectrum. on the tax side -- senator widen, for example is really hoping to advance significant tax reform but specifically in the energy arena. let me give you a good example. limited partnerships are an area where there is an enormous amount of equity in the market.

but for historical reasons, it's restricted to fossil energy. if we could just broaden that out to across the board including renewables, for example, these would provide excellent new vehicles for attracting more private capital into a clean energy future. >> so would you opens getting rid of the tax incentives that exist for renewable energy? >> we clearly support the extension of the current tax credits. we especially support having predictable incentives. as you know, for example, in the -- with winds, with the production tax credit, it's oscillations over time, directly impacts the ability of firms and customers, for that matter, to make investments. so we need -- i do believe we need to extend those renewable tax credits. we need to do