"hold on to your dreams. believe in love and that love be the light to show you the way. because life is going to be hard and sometimes it is even going to feel unfair. except for those who really care . who were there rain and shine sharing your dreams, your heart and your mind. the graduations." ♪ [applause] >> more commencement addresses this weekend on c-span. tomorrow at noon eastern judge susan webber wright speaks to graduates at the university of arkansas. we will hear from dreamworks executive melody house and the wrist of southern california. romney speaks in new hampshire.

george w. bush at southern methodist university. commencement addresses begin at noon eastern here on c-span. george bush: when i mention the speech through some of my pals they were surprised i was going to give it. i have not given a commencement speech since leaving office. my decision is quite practical. i got a phone call from my landlord. [laughter] gerald turner. rather than reasoning -- raising the rent or holding the security deposit, i was surprised to hear him ask if i believe in free speech. [laughter]

i said, yes. he said, perfect, this is your chance to get one. i am truly honored to be here. >> you can see all of george w. bush plus commencement speech -- bush's commencement speech tomorrow noon. sunday night at midnight some provisions of the patriot act require. mitch mcconnell wants to extend all of the act, but ran call -- rand paul opposes. to try to come up with a legislative compromise, mitch mcconnell has called senate back in one day early on sunday at 4:00 p.m.

when the senate is back, live coverage as always on a companion network, c-span 2. >> this sunday night at 8:00 eastern -- "first ladies." we will look into the first li -- the private lives of three first ladies. margaret taylor was opposed to her husband's nomination for president. as a teacher abigail was the first wife to have a profession and establish efforts to create the first presidential library. this sunday night at 8:00 eastern on c-span's original series "first ladies: influence an image."

from martha washington to michelle obama. sundays at 8:00 eastern on american history tv on c-span3. as a complement to the series, c-span's new book "first ladies : presidential historians on the iconic lies." it is available through your favorite book store or book seller. now my kathryn sullivan is a former astronaut and currently serves as administrator of the national is yannick and atmospheric demonstration. she talked to graduates about how being in space major think about how people are interconnected. [applause] ms. sullivan: president students and faculty friends and family and of course

graduates of the class of 2015 i am honored to join you today for this joyous occasion. graduations always remind me of the first time i sat on the launchpad of the kennedy space center. you didn't expect that, did you? [laughter] ms. sullivan: like all of you, i was just up that day in an uncomfortable for an outfit -- foreign outfit and forced to listen to people in an elaborate ritual that just would not end. like you, the anticipation about -- of what was about to happen to be was a bit overwhelming. preparing to be thrust into uncharted territories exhilarated, yet mildly terrified for what was to come. like a lot of you, i suspect, i question if i was really ready for what was ahead. sure, i knew every detail of the countdown procedure that was unfolding around us.

of course, i was well-versed in all of the scientific experiments that i was responsible for, not imagine how thoroughly i understood every detail of these base to i would protect me as i floated outside of the shuttle. i still could not help but wonder if all of my hard work and trading had truly repaired before my next up. as the first american woman to lunch to space. ok, before i start drawing on. let's turn to you. american university has prepared each of you. today, you are united by a common experience. the real strength you take with you today comes from the diversity of the prospectus amongst you. as a lookout, i see student leaders eager to create solutions for the problems of

today and take on the challenge of tomorrow. for each of you, today is a day undoubtedly filled with joy and a tremendous amount of satisfaction. it is the nomination of four, or in some cases, five years of dedication. for some of you, this journey has taken a lot longer. steve gamble studied buddhism in nepal, got married answered and numeral -- innumerable questions and never shied away from asking the hard questions. when asked what it means for him to walk across the stage, steve does not hesitate. he says that his au education and stilled and him a more vivid appreciation of life itself. for a handful of parents grandparents, aunts and uncles this is a very special day filled with great pride.

as you watch the very first member of your family receive a college degree, what a fabulous moment and tremendous achievement. [applause] ms. sullivan: i suggest that today is not simply a day to celebrate what you have in common as the class of 2015, but also a day to revel in your differences. to celebrate the environment that the american university provided. to foster learning about and learning through the explanation of those differences. on this day, we celebrate more than just your journey to this moment. we celebrate the capacity that this journey has instilled in you for the road ahead. a capacity and a hunger to continue exploring new perspectives. i is why i'm so excited to be sticking with you today. at d-31 seconds, the elaborate

countdown wrapped up and we got a final go for lunch. before we could link, the shuttle left off the pad and we were off to infinity and beyond. any worries or hesitations i had before, it is seriously too late now. [laughter] ms. sullivan: within minutes, we were over england. i got my first glimpse of this little blue marble called earth. i was overwhelmed by the beauty of art planet. and transmute -- entranced. from that vantage point, one can hardly make out anything other than c water land. that cosmic adventure introduced me to an entirely new perspective combo on the dramatically shaped to i am today. during your time at american university, you have been blessed with an environment that encouraged similar exploration albeit with rather more gravity and much better food.

au challenge you to dissenting viewpoints, ones that prodded you to consider the world and a different way. in doing so, this university shielded you from the danger of complacency. today, this institution will have each of you a diploma to organize your achievement. you will be told that this document a test -- attests to your ms. and will prove to people, potential employers, for example, that you are ready to contribute to society. that is not quite right. your diploma, after all, is just a piece of paper. it does confirm that you completed a course assistant -- course of study with some degree of success, but that alone does not say anything about the value of what you gain at american university. there is one thing on your diploma that does speak to that. the only thing. it is your name on that

certificate. your name represents who you became and reaching for this recognition. it represents to us -- the some of the investments that you made growing towards this day. and embodies those late nights cramming for the next days exam the hours you spent at a job were interning on capital hill. and the late nights that you spent mastering the concepts not because it was on a test but because it had captured your imagination and interest. also, your willingness to allow the difference is that you encountered to unite you with your colleagues and with other people, rather than divide you and join you in the exploration of a new point of view. your name on that diploma is

also a reminder of the hard work and sacrifice invested on your behalf by the people who supported you to this moment. for just like a rocket launch, college graduation is much more than a moment of individual achievement. in both instances, not in the spotlight are many people who helped us reach these coma dating moments. many who stayed up late, and put our quest before their own concerns. remember and think those people today. carry the lesson of their sacrifice with you on the next leg of life bus journey. pay their get forward to others who are on grand or difficult journeys. as of tomorrow, american university will no longer provide you with his wonderful space for intellectual exploration, this protection. you are about to be injected into a climate of global

transformation. it is a time of strident and violent schisms. all of this is happening in a systemic erosion of trust. so, next generation, how will you continue to grow through diversity? to expand your horizons and refine your from -- perspective? how will you develop the understanding that you leave this campus went into a force for good? are you ready? for me, the experience of being in space led me to understand that the most pressing challenges of my world were in fact those that facebook collectively -- face as collectively. circling the world led me to see that we are all connected. there is no "i" or them.

we are one. our existence is all depend on the little blue marble that i could hold in my hand. i came to believe that i owed it to myself and those in space that i needed to make good on that point of view. it was this newfound perspective that led me to the to my next national -- leap to my next professional venture. when i returned to earth, i build a career focused on achieving that outcome. my work at noaa has allowed me to make good on this. to work on the problems that do not generate -- discriminate. these great challenges can only be addressed by coming together and thinking of the generations yet to come. this will take listening to each other, learning and reaching for

new perspectives. perhaps leave those of learning that your experiences at american university have instilled in you. as a community, you have already proven your ability to check personal agendas at the door and work towards solutions as a collective fear you have been subjected to more diverse backgrounds, ideas experiences than many people will ever come to know. i hope that you have realized through this that it was only by taking the time to stop and listen that you were able to grow and learn. your experience at au has also provided you with much more than an academic credential. you head off into this world with ideas ideals, passion, and purpose. with a strong sense of what it means to create community and how vital community is the life. i am quite sure that the answer to my earlier question about your readiness for the next step is yes. you are well prepared for what

lies ahead. in due time, you will forget the name of monet's most famous painting, but you will not forget the habits that american university has instilled in you, nor lose the hunger to broaden your lens. we must always strive to never become complacent and always seek out a more developed understanding of how our world works, and perspective is what allows us to find happiness and as importantly, true meaning in our lives. your journey to new perspectives actually begins today. i encourage you to search for controversy. for contrast is both revealing and catalytic. user years more than your mouth. for learning can only happen when we paused to listen. to take the challenging path always. and to not be afraid of change.

like gravity, it is just sort of everywhere and forever. resistance is futile. always be a better neighbor. not because it is expected of you but because it makes you a better person. you do know that it is the right thing to do. the habit of education have prepared you to be leaders in your careers, your communities and your families. cherish this and make it count. communities made up of people who listen keenly think deeply, and act wisely are those that are most able and perhaps only able to create progress and peace. we go this to ourselves. we go this to each other -- owe this to each other, and we owe this to those little blue marble called earth. know that each of you has my full confidence as you take this next step.

i congratulate you and wish you the very best of luck. [applause] >> more commencement addresses this week and on c-span. tomorrow at new eastern, george susan webber wright speaks to graduates at the mercy of arkansas. and, we will hear from dreamworks executive, melanie hopkin at the university of south carolina. mitt romney speaks in new hampshire. and george w. bush at southern methodist university, the school the houses his presidential library. commencement addresses starting at noon eastern here on c-span. george bush: when i mentioned the speech to some of my pals they were surprised i was going to give it. i have not given a commencement

speech since leaving office. you know, my decision was quite practical. i got a phone call from my landlord. [laughter] gerald turner. rather than raising the rent or threatening security deposit, i was relieved to hear the president to ask if i believed in free speech. [laughter] i said yes. he said, prevent, here is your chance to get one. as a proud member of the smu community, i am honored to be here. truly honored.

>> sunday night at midnight, some provisions of the pgi expire. -- patriot act expire. mitch mcconnell once to extend the whole patriot act, but rand paul opposed extending it even one day. to try to come up with a legislative compromise, senator mcconnell has called the senate in one day early on sunday at 4:00. when live coverage is back, live coverage as always on c-span 2. >> this week on "q&a," our guest is to time told surprised when her david macola. he share stories about his new book "the wright brothers." >> they did not graduate from

high school. his father said, if they had some interesting project, stay home. wilbur, without any question, was a genius. oracle -- orville was very inventive, but he did not have the reach of mind that wilbur had. they loved music. they loved books. nathaniel hawthorne was or ville's favorite writer. catherine loved sir walter scott. in fact, for one of her birthdays, they gave her a bust. think of these people living in a small house, and giving a bust of a great english literary giant to their sister for a birthday present. there is a lot of hope in that.

i think what i would like to get to know even more about is the sense of purpose that they had. it sounds like a bad pun but high purpose. big ideas. nothing was going to stop them. >> sunday night on c-span's "q&a." >> jason kilar in 2007 founded the online service hulu. this year, he returned to his on the matter -- , matter to give the commencement address. [applause] mr. kilar: how is everybody doing deco before i begin, i

have to capture this with a selfie. holler and we will catch a selfie. [applause] [applause] mr. kilar: ok. i will tweet that under #uncselfie. thank you chancellor fulton. thank you members of the faculty and members of the board of trustees. thank you for the kind welcome.

it is an honor to address you today and to congratulate the graduating class of 2015. [applause] mr. kilar: that's right. as was covered earlier, today is mother's day. none of this would be happening today if not for your mother's love and the estimated 51,392 hours of labor that was required collectively of your mother's to bring your graduating classes smiling faces into this world. [applause] mr. kilar: thank you, mothers. this is a spectacular day in your lives. one that will prove to be among the most memorable of life's mileposts. i'm excited to be here given that i too went to the

university of north carolina at chapel hill. [applause] mr. kilar: my freshman year, i lived in the architectural triumph that is hidden james dormitory. [applause] mr. kilar: i am a product of the kenan flagler undergraduate business school. in addition, i am also a product of unc ps school of journalism and mass communications. which is soon to be rebranded, unc's school of media and journalism which i think is a fantastic moment of change for the school. it has been a pleasure to be back on campus this weekend and to be welcomed by chancellor full with a hospitality that we found nowhere else on earth.

y'all have been mighty kind. [laughter] mr. kilar: it must be said that this year, rather than choosing from any number of nobel prize laureates or political luminaries to be your commencement speaker, you have chosen me, but guide -- the guy best known for making it easier to watch recent episodes of south park and family guy. [laughter] mr. kilar: assuming there were no jedi mind tricks involved, it is clear to me that you have moxie. i would like to share my story with you this morning. i share it in the hope that you may find some benefits. it is a story of dreams, failure and loss. perseverance and one unfortunate run-in with the authorities in southern california. in any event, my story goes like

this. in 1993, i sat in the same bleachers you currently find yourselves in. excited to graduate. my mother and father were there, enjoying the glorious pageantry. that day, my parents got to meet the girl i started dating months earlier. perhaps you are experiencing similar moments on campuses morning. life was pretty good. in the months prior to my graduation, i did everything i could to land a job in the machinery of hollywood. my dream, dating back to when i was a kid, was to follow in the footsteps of walt disney. i had always been fascinated by stories well told and how disney leveraged technology in the

interest of making them better. for most of my senior year here, i wrote to every executive i could in hollywood, the sum total of five months of letter writing, phone calling was a cavalcade of no's if i was lucky enough to get a reply. and one informational interview to be conducted at universal studios a few days after my graduation. i was not off to a great start but i was hopeful that things would improve. soon after my graduation ceremony ended at kenan stadium that sunday, i kiss my girlfriend goodbye and gave big hugs to my mother and father. i made the cross-country drive in my 1982 subaru hatchback in record time. trying to make an impact in los angeles doing something that i

loved. this is where the story veers from the expected. it is the first i've shared it. a day after arriving in los angeles and on the heels of my informational interview at universal studios, my mother tearfully but bravely shared the news over the phone that my dad had taken his life. he was 47. kind, loving husband of 27 years. proud and wonderful father to six children. accomplished professional, having put himself through school. the man i admired most, who taught me so much was gone from this world afte, three days after i saw him in this very stadium. that movie production job did not work out the way i hoped.

i was hired but soon let go. this was also the time that i learned, with the help of the northridge california police department that the cal state northridge parking deck was not looking to welcome recent college graduates living out of their subaru hatchback's each night. i soon found myself working for a temp agency back on the east coast installing shelving at a tj maxx that was undergoing renovation. i was personally lost and professionally about as far from my dreams as one could be. i mention this part of my story because i want all of you, the graduating class of 2015, to know that in your moment of personal and professional adversity that are sure to come, you will not be alone.

[applause] mr. kilar: everyone in this stadium, everyone it turns out in this world, has struggled and will struggle with personal loss and professional failure. adversity is a necessary and important part of life. adversity strengthens us in -- believing it is your journey through the valleys that will to find you -- define you. back when my dad died, i took a cue from how my mom had always persevered through adversity. for 30 years she helped my dad

successfully battle manic-depressive disorder. in that noble and successful fight, she chose to face adversity with courage, with kindness, and with optimism. i picked myself up eventually in the summer of 1993, making an important observation along the way. when things get tough i believe that we as a species surprise ourselves with how much strength we have deep within. strength that we may never have previously known or been aware of. in the most trying times in unimaginable circumstances, that well of strength can be drawn upon. we find that we can persevere. you can persevere. this leads me to the second part of my story and this is a story about doing what you love, about

taking risks, and never . i got my first real job at the walt disney company by drawing myself into a comic strip rather than sending a resume. upon graduating from business school in 1997, with the debt level that approximated slovenia's gross domestic product. [laughter] mr. kilar: it is true. i jumped into a small private company in the pacific northwest that was trying to sell stuff over the internet. about that internet company, my friends and family thought i was insane to go there given the uncertainty and the traditional

opportunities that i would be foregoing. i was intoxicated by a very simple thing that this company offered. [laughter] mr. kilar: bad choice of words huh? believe it or not after college , the word "intoxicated" has different meaning. [laughter] mr. kilar: this was a mission, not a job. yes, there was risk and yes the company could have ended up belly up. but it did not. the small company i joined was called amazon that i was able to

learn for nine years from one of the finest leaders of our time in jeff bezos. i took a risk to do something i loved and passionately believed in and i am very glad i did. doing what you love, pursuing your own path, is often the most unsettling option of the outset. the path that others have traveled before you, those are the paths that have better visibility. they play better with your neighbors, but do not fall for it. you are better than that and you have the strength to go your own way. remember, i know that each of you has moxie by the bucket loads. i made the decision in 2007 to jump into a new chapter. this time to build a team from

day one and to help build a company with a mission to reimagine how television programming was delivered. we decided to call the company hulu. in the early days ahead of the launch, my decision to leave the company were considered truly horrible, terrible ideas. we were called "clownco" by the people of silicon valley. a digital counter ran on a website to truck just how many days it was going to take for the company to implode. it is true. the early days of hulu were among the toughest of my career. i kept reminding myself of that phrase attributed to winston churchill. "when you are going through hell, keep going." [laughter] [laughter] mr. kilar: here is the thing i

cannot emphasize enough you here today. most people you run into in life, including the smart ones they will be averse to new things. they certainly were in my experience at hulu and amazon. the typical human response in the face of the new is to ignore, or dismiss it. new is scary. new is the unknown. most everyone does not believe that the new will work until it does. if you think the world is broken in a certain way, and you have a great idea to fix it, do yourself a favor and follow your convictions relentlessly. the path i described will be an uncertain one. but, do not let the fear of uncertainty, of not having all the answers, be the thing that hold you back from pursuing your dreams. at your age it is very natural

to have somebody questions. who will i be? what do i want to do? where should i live? what makes me happy? it easy to feel alone in this uncertainty. to feel bad that you do not have all the answers and all the details figured out, even know -- even though it seems like your friends do. as you get older you realize that no one has all the answers. it turns out that life is an exercise in living with the certainty of uncertainty. hulu ended up working out. consumers were ready for a new way to enjoy their favorite tv programs. but none of this would've happened in my career had a not chosen to ignore the conventional wisdom and pursue what i loved, taking considered risk along the way.

and when i found myself going through hell, to keep going. before i finish and let you get back to watching family guy on hulu, i would like to bring things. back to hear to the stadium. the girl from carolina, the one for my own graduation that i mentioned at the start, she is actually here in the stadium again today. and she has four small humans in her wake they keep referring to me as their father. [laughter] [applause] mr. kilar: i love you jamie more than you can know. i better get some brownie points for that.

[laughter] mr. kilar: my mother also happens to be here today in this special stadium. [applause] mr. kilar: my mother is taking in the glorious pageantry once more and inspiring me each day with her choices of courage, of kindness, and optimism. and so, now, graduating class of 2015 - [applause] mr. kilar: this is when your adventure begins. my wish is that you make it the most epic adventure possible.

dream. dream big. take risks. fail. take -- pick yourself back up again and always, always remember this -- there is no adversity capable of stopping you once the choice to persevere is made. it has been a true honor and the highest of privileges to address you this morning. i am rooting for each and everyone of you. thank you and congratulations. [applause]

>> sunday night at the night some provisions of the patriot act expire. senate majority leader mitch mcconnell wants to extend all of the patriot act, but rand paul objected for extending it even one day. without actions of congress, some of it will stop functioning sunday night. in order to find eight congressional compromise, mitch mcconnell has called the senate in for a rare sunday session. when the senate is back in, live

coverage as always on c-span two. >> this sunday on "first ladies ," we will look at the lives of three first ladies. sara pulled had a very strong belief in politics and often helped her husband, james, make political decisions. margaret taylor was opposed to her husband's nomination for president. as a teacher, abigail seymour was the first residential wife to have a profession. sarah polk, margaret taylor, and abigail fillmore. this sunday on c-span's original series, "first ladies." for martha washington to mitchell -- michelle obama sundays on c-span 3.

as a complement to the series, c-span's "first ladies," it is available as a hardcover or e-book through your favorite bookstore or online bookseller. >> lee zeldin was elected to congress last november. he defeated the democratic incumbent by 4%. as part of the congressional profiles of freshmen representatives, c-span recently sat down with representatives of zeldin. host: what got you interested in public office in the first place? rep. lee zeldin: transitioning into the reserves, i wanted to continue to serve. i came back home, moved about half a mile from where i grew up

and i started running for , congress. host: where is that? rep. lee zeldin: long island. a lot of people know the hamptons. this is the district of the hamptons. there are a lot of vineyards agriculture out there, and i live in a small town just west of the hamptons called for caven -- called brookhaven. that is where i live. host: you got out of the reserves and ran for local office? rep. lee zeldin: i ran for congress. i was 27 years old. we got our clock cleaned in that race. i was elected to the state senate, was reelected, elected to congress in 2014. host: what is behind your motivation for running? coming out of the military, why do you want to serve? rep. lee zeldin: we are confronting huge issues. the foreign affairs committee, transportation infrastructure

committee, veterans affairs. my home county has the second-highest veteran population than any county in america. the foreign affairs issues as far as evoking passion, when you talk about the need to defeat isis, to ensure that we are not entering into a bad deal with iran, protecting our military to make sure we keeping america safe and free, when you deal with some of the issues that we deal with on a daily basis again, here at home and abroad it evokes the huge passion, and i am just privileged to be a part of it. host: you said you get elected in 2014 and come to office in 2015. what was that transition like for you? rep. lee zeldin: i came down with about 200 of our supporters at the beginning of january. i served four years in the state senate and got some experience with regards to how hills become -- bills become law how the

, process works, how conference works, and how to do constituent services, and how to be a good family man, be a good husband and father. so, coming down here in january, it was not really too new, even though it was a new setting here in congress. we just tried to have the staff fully operational as quickly as possible, and we know each other's strengths and weaknesses, set our priorities not just on national issues but also on important, local issues, so we hit the ground running and fortunately, we were able to. host: did you bring some of the staff with you? rep. lee zeldin: i did. my district office is almost entirely the people that were with me in the state senate, and my office downtown is new staff. each were exciting for different reasons, but good chemistry, and constituent services is a key part of the job, and having a good team here in d.c. to make sure we are doing our due

diligence is important, as well. host: what is a typical day like for you in washington, when congress is in session? rep. lee zeldin: very busy. there was one day when i have 31 things on my calendar. you might have a five-minute meeting followed by a 10 minute meeting followed by a 10 minute meeting. i get up early, i try to exercise as close to every morning as i can. the evenings usually ends late. i like to -- there are other people out there who have vices. you know, they might go out drinking or whatnot. for me i like to empty my e-mail , box. that is my vice. staying on top of stuff. for me, we might be out -- there might be an event going on. local groups from the district here, for good causes, but i like to get back to work, and i

usually go to sleep around 12:00 or 1:00 and am back up around 5:00 or 6:00. host: when you are in washington, where do you stay? rep. lee zeldin: i am one of 80 staying in my office, 1517 longworth. it works out well for me. it is a big closet. great, roddy -- roddycamaraderie. host: is that because it is expensive? rep. lee zeldin: when i visited here, chris gibson was one of my officers. i remember in 2010, i member thinking then, if i was elected as part of that class, there are a lot of different factors to it. it might still just be the army in me, but i have an air mattress put down, and it is all good.

host: outside of entering -- emptying the e-mail box thing. what are your favorite parts of being a member? rep. lee zeldin: i have honestly enjoyed every minute of every day. while i am here, i don't spend my time wishing i was at home, and when i am home i do not , spend my time trying to wish i was in these the it is a privilege to serve. a two-year term goes by quickly. i think you should stop being a member when you are stepping on the house floor or walking in the capital where it loses that feeling, and you lose the appreciation for the history of the institution, and for me, i really do enjoy that part of it, being able to walk into the united states capital. host: you mentioned the agenda on the list. three committee hearings to attend to. does it ever feel like, i cannot devote my all to this issue, this one committee meeting that i wish i could?

rep. lee zeldin: there are so many issues, and there will never be enough time in the day to get as neck deep in all of them. i will have a constituent come in with one issue, but until they walk in the office mentoring -- mentioning that idea i have never even heard of , that proposal, and then there is a next meeting, somebody pitching a proposal, which is the first time since being an in office. you may be here for a few months and a few years, and you are encountering an issue for the first time. you try to prioritize your time as to what is important, delivering for your district and your country, and there is just not enough bandwidth to spend all of the attention on everything. i wish we could. host: who keeps an eye on that schedule? rep. lee zeldin: we have a scheduler.

we have one person who handles everything, both in the district and in d.c. she is based here in d.c., and we have a chief of staff, and a deputy chief of staff who also serves as a legislative director. we have a good team. you make adjustments over the course of months and years, and responsibilities. people come and go, with life events, and that is the best way to stay organized, is having a good team. host: how do you interact with republican leadership on a daily basis? rep. lee zeldin: i would say i interact with my colleagues most on the floor, when we are there for votes. that is when it happens most often. there may be events in the evening, where you're able to cross paths with a particular member. at times, you might be sitting

at a dinner for two hours next to a colleague. it might be the first time you get to have a conversation with them. i would say over the course of a routine, you must frequently interact with the rank and file members when you're on the floor. when you are not on the floor, everyone is busy with meetings. host: is there a best way to communicate with you? a text message where they say, hey, we really want to get your support for this? rep. lee zeldin: the whip team will go around with names on a card. there will be a heads-up up given to staff in advance. maybe it is monday, and we are told on thursday, there will be a whip check, and a person will come find you, and sometimes you're able to tell them, yes, absolutely i'm voting for something, or no, i am absolutely not.

sometimes you have a really important question, and you need that answered. it mostly happens on the floor . host: so there is not a lot of arm twisting going on on the floor? rep. lee zeldin: there are bills, and i might be opposed to something, that i would vote no for, and maybe they would what like me to vote yes, and you have to have a good, honest dialogue. they appreciate and honest no a lot better than a dishonest yes, so when they ask me how i would like to vote on a particular bill that i am not with them the best thing for a legislator to do is just tell the whip team, i am not with you. that is just not good for the process to not do that. host: have you seen opportunities for you to be approached by democrats to support their legislation?

rep. lee zeldin: sure, that has happened on the floor. i have interacted a bunch with the colleagues on both sides of the aisle. sometimes it might be in the hallway, on the shuttle ride back to new york, and you happen to be with your colleagues from the other side of the aisle, and you start talking about something they are working on, and they might put and ask. sometimes you are not, but it is important to find common ground. that is the best way to serve our common districts. host: as far as your priorities what are they? rep. lee zeldin: the first congressional district in new york is almost completely surrounded by water. there is only a small 13 mile or so stretch that is connected to land. there is a lot of sandy recovery. aircraft noise is an issue. there is a national research facility there.

so education is a big issue, with the implementation of federally mandated state-mandated, as well as local school district created testing. so those are some of the very local issues that we are working on, and it gets even more specific when some business contacts you, or some individual contacts you. and they have been waiting for a few years for their appeal. that really becomes very high on the priority list as far as that staffer. some of the more national issues that are important to the district, i would say certainly fighting for veterans, trying to create more good-paying, private-sector jobs, making our policy more can did, improving our health care. we will see how the supreme court and congress reacts with changes as 2015 moves along.

those are some of the national issues that are of importance to our district, and there are many others, as well. host: you are a fairly young member of congress. what is the average age for people in the first district? rep. lee zeldin: i am 35 years old. a lot of people don't realize that in congress, there are 31 members under the age of 40. there are 20 in the house republican conference. 11 in the democratic house conference. i am in favor of term limits personally. there has been such a huge changeover. two thirds of the republican conference was not even here five years ago. the average age of the house republican conference is about six years younger than our colleagues on the opposite side of the aisle, and there is just a lot of changeover that has happened over the course of the last few years, all across america.

so as far as my district, about a decade older on average, but we have people who are 18 years old, and they want to know how they can afford to go to college, and then you have seniors, trying to figure out how to pay for their prescription drugs or put oil in their tank, so there is certainly quite the range as far as interest around the district. host: you are also the only jewish republican member of the house. is that significant, in your opinion, and how? rep. lee zeldin: there are issues that i care very deeply about. you speak up, and you talk about who are america's friends, and who our enemies are, what our foreign policy should be as relates to defeating isis. isis happens to be about 18 miles from the syrian border with israel. how is our approach with syria and iraq and afghanistan, and,

of course, the nuclear talks the rising tide of anti-semitism around the world, including right here in the united states, and this is starting to become more prevalent on college campuses, and around the world where cemeteries, some cemeteries are being converted to all muslim cemeteries without even any indication as to what they will do with jewish remains. if being the only jewish republican member in congress gives me a chance to fight what i believe very strongly about maybe having a person listening that day to help spread the word, i embrace that. host: how did your experience in the military, particularly your experience in iraq, influence, or does it, your views on foreign policy? rep. lee zeldin: i have been

able to encounter all sorts of issues affecting active-duty service members, their family, mental health needs, providing occupational and vocational needs, especially when you're coming off of active duty, ensuring you are getting the health care that you need v.a.. making sure the v.a. has the resources they need to win. making sure that their hands are not side, that the leaders, that the commanders are giving them the flexibility they need to succeed in the mission. and even going back to rotc, just studying war, human philosophy, how human nature works. what the best approach is. you have to make assumptions.

i would say over the course of my time in the military, there are a lot of lessons that have informed my desire to be part of the decision-making process here. host: what do you like to read? rep. zeldin: anything, really. i am fascinated when i can read -- when i can read aristotle talking about how important it is to know the difference between right and wrong. it will be the right thing. just that development of leadership, reading about henry fifth, trying to give the sink crispin's day speech -- the sink crispin's day speech up against tens of thousands of french, and

motivating those men at that moment, despite not just being outmanned, but just to inspire and the significance of the relationships. this is militarily, the diplomatically between the british and the french in that example. i do not limit the story to any one particular piece of time. i enjoyed reading all of it. usually you can find something in every one of these stories. bill: going back to the election you beat tim bishop in 2014. how did you do that? rep. zeldin: we had a primary. that was a june primary, so we had a few months --

for me, it is going to festivals. about a quarter of my district there was a good base of support from people i knew going into the race, but it was a lot of hard work, a good team using social media, e-mails, just having a good message, talking to people about issues they care about so you can make that connection where they realize that you share common values. you're running to be the representative. it's important for them to know where you stand. bill: how important was the house republican committee getting you elected there? rep. zeldin: they helped. they spent a couple million dollars on the race in multiple ways. and i think they brought not

just with the tv ad, but also on the media front making an introduction. there are many different ways they are able to assist, which is great but ultimately, it is important for a candidate to do as much as they can on a campaign from the grassroots up. it is helpful. it is nice to have that air support show up, but you can't just rely on it. you will lose touch with your district. bill: you have mentioned a couple times what your district is like and people asking your office for things very just a short brief story on someone who may have come to your office for help that typifies a constituent you serve. rep. zeldin: i was thinking of

the veterans story, the appeal we were able to satisfy someone trying to get an appointment with the federal agency to do something so they were able to move up. someone with an immigration concern, they have a family member overseas, trying to get home, and for whatever reason, they are unable to get back home. we have had several hundred people come back to our office. i had 17,000 people -- pieces come in that were resolved. the state legislature in new york is different than the legislature around the rest of the country. we probably had 50 different staffers at the legislature. we were able to deal with a lot of these pieces. this is very similar except the federal issues, you try to move something up a priority list when they are having a lot of difficulty cutting through.

bill: do those stories seem more satisfying than a vote that goes in your favor? rep. zeldin: when you read those stories, the significance to help someone, for them, that issue is more important than any vote we have down here. that's very rewarding. i remember my time on active duty in the military. you can help someone through a divorce or trying to get out of a bad contract. they bought a car they should not have. with some of those challenges -- you might be overseas. a serviceman or back home, the girlfriend just went out with the power of attorney that they probably should not have signed, the girlfriend went out and bought a nice fancy sports car. they see their bank account emptying out. it's nice to help these individuals because sometimes they are very desperate. bill: lastly, you are still

serving in the reserves? rep. zeldin: still serving in the reserves. recently i met a 90-year-old world war ii veteran, the last living medal of honor recipient from the battle of the bulge. it was such a nice reminder. just surrounded by great people who believe in a cause greater than themselves and it really helps. bill: congressman lee zeldin, first district of new york thanks for being with us. rep. zeldin: thanks for having me. >> sunday, provisions of the patriot act expire. senate majority leader mitch mcconnell wants to extend the patriot act, but senator rand paul of poses for even one day. senator mcconnell has called the senate back into session a day early on sunday at 4:00 p.m.

in the senate is back in session, live coverage is always on our companion network c-span2. the new congressional directory is a handy guide to the 114th congress with color photos of every senator and house member, plus bios, contact information and twitter handles. a foldout map of capitol hill, a look at congressional committees, the president's cabinet, federal agencies. order your copy today. if you are the dollars $.95, plus shipping and handling at c-span.org -- it is $13.95 plus shipping and handling at c-span.org. >> tonight, we will hear from former treasury secretaries -- tim geithner, henry paulson and paul rubin about their time in office. here is a brief look. tim geithner: it is worth noting

that none of us really know anything about the future. we certainly don't know anything about how economies perform in the short term or even the long run. we live in a messy, dark, scary, uncertain world. but i think the economy is -- [laughter] >> but that said. what was that, a scary, dark uncertain world? tim geithner: that is the normal state of mankind. it's said to admit it, but it's true. in that context, the u.s. is gradually getting -- >> slightly less dark, slightly less scary? tim geithner: we are a very resilient country. i think a much stronger country than any other major economy. you look at the challenges we face, they are pretty stark challenges and our politics are

terrible, but i think you would rather have our challenges than the challenges of certainly any developed economy and any emerging economy around the world. >> former treasury secretary tim geithner, henry paulson, and robert ruben on the state of the u.s. economy tonight at 8:00 eastern here on c-span. bill: congresswoman bonnie watson coleman of new jersey what you think of your time in washington so far? rep. coleman: it has been exciting. it has been exhilarating. it has been a great learning curve for me. it is wonderful -- in the midst of all of this activity and all of the important activity, the discussions taking place.

bill: you come from a background of having served in the new jersey legislature, so was it easy to transition staff and issues from that setting to capitol hill? rep. zeldin: -- rep. coleman: to the extent that i knew i would need certain kinds of staff people and what they would be. in that sense it was an easy transition. in state government, you had a predictable committee schedule you had a predictable schedule -- everyone was on the floor when you were voting. everyone was on the floor when you are debating issues. it's very different here. you were never called out of a committee meeting into a meeting and then go vote like you do down here and then go back to your meeting. so, the rhythm is very different. bill: is that rhythm hard to get used to? rep. coleman: no, it's kind of exciting because you really do not know what is going to come next. so, your senses are heightened. you are ready to move quickly

and you know that you have to be prepared in a shorter time, so you were always in the midst of finding out what are you going to do next? what it is, what it means, what your approach is going to be, all of that. it's really quite exciting and interesting. bill: we are taping this conversation in a studio in the capitol and you came over here by the tunnel. before we started, you said your experience working here has been like one constant tunnel. explain that a bit. rep. coleman: a lot of friends who moved from our office buildings over to the office building -- we come underground we go through the tunnel. everything around you is about the work you are doing down here. i mentioned to you, i feel like when i am not going through the,, i am feeling that i am in a tunnel, because my whole existence is about being here as a legislator in congress dealing with people on the issues, dealing on the floor

with our issues, looking at legislation, becoming part of a caucus, raising our issues, things of that nature. everything i am doing that surrounds me, it is about being here. bill: has it been hard for you to make the transition personally after going home after a session as opposed to staying in washington? rep. coleman: i am fortunate in that my husband is principally retired. he is with me a lot. when i come home at the end of the evening to our little, tiny apartment, he is there. i do get a chance to have that consistency in my life and it's very nice. rep. coleman: -- bill: you also brought from your office a picture that hangs in your opposite. we honestly did not do this recording from your office. who is in this picture? rep. coleman: my father.

i am one of four. i was a daddy's girl. my father served in the legislature for a number of years and i ended up taking his heat. bill: how long did he serve? rep. coleman: he served for 12 years. bill: what does it say to you when you see your dad's picture every day? rep. coleman: it says i was raised to be a public servant and my father and my mother always thought all of us -- it is do what you have to do, do it to the best of your ability and be honest in all things. bill: i saw a very brief profile of you that said you were an activist legislator. what does that mean in washington? rep. coleman: i believe very strongly in the woman's right to choose, the civil rights movement, the access to affordable health care i recognize the importance of immigration to the economy here. i'm supportive of and recognize

the right -- we have to concentrate on middle-class values and working class values. i have always been sort of outspoken, and i have found issues and i have addressed issues that did not necessarily have strong support, and i have taken those issues on. giving people alternatives to incarceration, focusing on this massive incarceration we having gauge den or the last couple of decades. those issues are perceived as activism issues. i guess that makes me an activist. bill: you have just introduced your first bill into congress, dealing with online ammunition sales. take us through this, why the issue, how did that develop and

how did you move that forward? bill: first of all, it is not my first piece of legislation, but the bill basically makes it difficult or impossible actually -- to purchase ammunition online. you will have to go and secure it with a licensed dealer and you will have to show identification. in addition to that, if someone is purchasing more than 1000 rounds of ammunition, within a short time, five days, then the dealer the licensed dealer -- it gives you a chance to look into these issues before it becomes another tragedy. i worked on gun legislation when i was in the legislature. i think it's very importantly reduce the access to guns and ammunition that is not necessary for sportsmanlike activities or

hunters. i come from a family of hunters. i know, don't mess with their rifles. but we are in a society now that is so dangerous because ammunition and guns get into the hands of the wrong people. so, looking at areas i could move into, extend what i did in new jersey, it's kind of a natural evolution of who i am. bill: how do you and your staff move this forward? what is that like? rep. coleman: we have about 20 cosponsors. we had a press conference in the district yesterday. we have reached out to organizations that are interested. the million mom's march. people mission. as well as community activists so they can reach out to their various networks and they will be asked to reach out to their

legislators across the country and get them on board. so, we have to build up a sense of willingness that this is an important piece of legislation that we can approach it from a bipartisan perspective. the tragedies that have happened with the mass killings, they do not care if you are in an urban environment or a democratic environment or a republican environment or a rural environment. so, this is something that i think we can all coalesce around and recognize there is a value in limiting the access -- anonymously -- two people who want to purchase ammunition. bill: what is a typical day like for you here in the house? rep. coleman: there is no typical day. he could start with a caucus meeting or a with meeting or a reception in the morning or a meeting at 8:00 in the morning that is off-site. it would involve a series of

meetings in your office. you will be called to your committee meeting or your subcommittee meeting. at some point you will be interrupted during that period, and you will come over to the house floor and vote and you will be there for a series of votes and then you will go back and either resume committee meeting or a subcommittee meeting or meetings in your office and you will go back again into the -- over to the floor to vote again and from there, it you will either go to a caucus meeting or a reception or some sort of after our meeting. bill: briefly, how late is your day going? rep. coleman: i get home at 9:00, 10:00 maybe. it's a pretty full day. bill: what keeps you on schedule? rep. coleman: i've got some incredible staff. i have a scheduler. i have the chief of staff, and of got my legislative director people i work very, very closely

with. i'm working with my communications director, who always finds an opportunity for me to reach out. so, i've got a really great staff. bill: how was your relationship and your communications with the democratic leadership? rep. coleman: i think of got a pretty good relationship and good communications with them. i am new. i'm not necessarily their priority. but i certainly embrace our desire to work for working-class families and to elevate and protect those who are most vulnerable. i think that is who we are as democrats. that is what we stand for. and i'm very comfortable with the direction in which we are being led. bill: a different scenario though for the new jersey legislature. how well do you get along with members across the aisle? rep. coleman: when i went into the new jersey legislature, i was in the minority, and when i

was in the majority, i was the majority leader in the legislature, i had to work with republicans. so, i think i have old friends here. i have not have the opportunity to meet a lot of the new legislators on the republican conference, because we do not get to interact much except for the committees we work on. bill: ok. does it helps to have the new jersey delegation -- republican or democratic -- helping you doing you some of the ins and outs of the house? rep. coleman: i have relied on my colleagues. they have been very good to me introduced me to places and people in between these various buildings. and in general i look to other colleagues. they may not know me as well.

they are very open and very supportive of new members. bill: you are the first african-american woman to represent the state of new jersey. what does that mean for you personally and for the broader community of new jersey you represent? rep. coleman: to me it means i am the congress representative for women who feel we do not -- we have not had a congress representative for a very long time. in my district, going to women's organization meetings and is the same thing with african-americans. for chili, new jersey has three. -- fortunately, new jersey has three. so, we have a responsibility to uphold the cause and the issues for people like us all over the state of new jersey, as well as representing everybody within our district. for me i get calls to come to

bergen county or suffolk county or i have to go to cumberland county to meet with an african-american group in addition to doing things in my district that i do. bill: your district, the 12th district, is generally the trenton area? rep. coleman: it is. it's a pretty decent sized district. bill: you mentioned your dad's service in the state legislature . when an where and why did you get involved in public service? how did that start? rep. coleman: i was always involved in public service. i was a career state employee in the executive branch before i decided to run for my father's heat -- father's seat. my father died. my father always when my brothers and me to take on his position and we always told him, no you came from anonymity. we are not went to do this. and we did, it was a way of honoring him in the work he had done.

we used to tell my father that was his ministry. when he died, his seat became available -- he had already retired, but the person in the seat was moving up to the senate, so it just seemed to be the right time. and i decided i would do it and i did it and i had a wonderful experience serving the 16th legislative district. i learned so much and i consider it a blessing. bill: how long did you serve in the state house? rep. coleman: 16 years. bill: back to your district for a second -- you explain geographically where it is. what is it like? what is the typical constituent like in the area? bill: i probably have the most diverse district in the state of new jersey, maybe in the country. predominately white, nonminority. strong agent population, black

population, -- strong asian population, black population, latino population. it is basically an educated district and a working-class district. so, i go from trenton to princeton to plainfield, two old bridge and south brunswick. bill: what are some of the typical request issues that come up for your constituents that are addressed here on the hill or back your district office? rep. coleman: i have a large senior population, concentrated in the communities that have been built. so protect my social security and do not mess with medicare. higher education, access to good public education affordable education. jobs, jobs, jobs, training and jobs. and in the urban community it is

about all those things and the public service and public safety on top of it. rep. coleman: -- bill: since you have been in congress, tell us about a constituent who had an issue addressed where you thought i am glad to have been in a position to do something about this. rep. coleman: we have had constituents who have problems with immigration. we have been able to pull it out of the system and do something for them. we have a very large population. that is something my father would have been very proud of. we have a very strong caseload back in the district for people who have questions and concerns. bill: long-term what would you like to accomplish in the house? rep. coleman: i would like the house to be majority controlled by democrats so we can continue to working for working families

and ensuring the safety net for our elderly, our poor, or our children. i would like us to be the progressive nation that we have been, protecting a woman's right to choose, and ensuring unfettered access to voting. that is what i would like to accomplish. bill: how long would you like to serve and do you believe in term limits? rep. coleman: i believe your terms are limited by the people voting for you and not voting for you. as far as how long i will serve, what god has for me and what the constituents of the congressional district cap for me. bill: you mentioned that you are here in washington at least during the workweek. what is it like when you're back in the district, even just back on the weekend? rep. coleman: i go to a lot of events. i have a lot of meeting with

constituents who cannot make it down to washington. i meet with groups. i just try to make sure im being in the community and of accessible to those supporting me and are looking for me to support them down here in washington. bill: is the work that you do exponentially harder than the work you were doing in the legislature in new jersey? rep. coleman: it is different in the sense that it has a national and international focus. i was not involved in homeland security when i was in the state legislature, but that is a committee i am on a here. so, obviously i am looking broadly to what is happening around the world and how it affects our homeland security. but basically, the issues are -- the issues may be the same, but they may be looked at differently and the role of government, federal government may be different.

the state accomplishing these things as opposed to the state supporting the municipalities and the counties. there are environmental issues. it is employment, civil rights all those things. it is access to health care, affordability of health care, higher education. bill: what surprised you the most at your swearing-in in january? rep. coleman: my republican colleagues refusing to let go of issues that have been decided in the courts such as the woman's right to choose, acting myopically with immigration on the southern border. things of that nature and a refusal to look beyond those issues. bill: before we wrap up, i wanted to ask you, your data tape routine on capitol hill --

your day-to-day routine on capitol hill, what you like the most and what do you like the least? bill: -- rep. coleman: i like the movement. i like moving from one thing to the next. i like the excitement. i probably like the least being taken away from a committee meeting or something and then having the committee come back and get that momentum back. bill: after a vote or something? rep. coleman: after a vote, yeah. sometimes i am frustrated, and having to push back on these issues that have already been addressed. every day, looking at a woman's right to choose. every day there is some negative immigration -- or every other day, we are fighting to make sure that people have greater access to affordable health care. so, probably dealing with those issues over and over and over

again is probably that which i like the least. bill: congresswoman bonnie watson coleman of new jersey thank you for being with us. rep. coleman: thank you for having me. >> sunday night at midnight some provisions of the patriot act expire. senate majority leader mitch mcconnell was to extend all provisions, but kentucky senator rand paul last week objected to extending the patriot act for even one day. without action by congress, some government surveillance programs will cease operating by sunday night. to come up with a legislative copper mice before that happens senator mcconnell and has called the senate back into session a day early on sunday at 4:00 p.m. when the senate is back, life coverage is always on our companion network c-span2. >> the new congressional directory is a handy guide to the 114th congress with photos

of every congress member plus biographical information, and twitter handles. plus maps, a foldout map of capitol hill, a look at congressional committees, the presidents, state governors. order your copy today. it is $13.95 plus shipping and handling through the c-span online store at c-span.org. >> tonight, former treasury secretaries. we will hear from tim geithner, henry paulson, and robert ruben about their time in office. here is a brief look. >> if you could make one change in u.s. policy unilaterally, what would it be? hank paulson: save our future. >> he did it. one change? tim geithner: i would try to get

more americans to -- for the country. >> when will the fed first raise rates? tim geithner: mmm -- >> you can pass. tim geithner: when they think it makes sense. [laughter] hank paulson: early next year. robert ruben: i will do another version of what tim said. i do not think it matters when. >> who is our biggest global economic competitor? >> ourselves. hank paulson: i agree. >> i concur. >> all right, look at that. >> treasury secretaries tim geithner, hank paulson, and robert ruben on the state of the economy tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span. up next on c-span, a discussion

on court cases about religion. among those we will hear from the head of the beckett fund for religious liberty and an attorney for the separation of church and state. this is about 50 minutes. ms. chertoff: the first amendment to the u.s. constitution states that congress shall make no law respecting an establishment to -- of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. they do not signal the end but rather the beginning of a spirited debate over the proper relationship between religion and the american state. in the early years of the united states, some interpreted the first amendment to mean that congress could not establish an official religion. but cities and states could.

by contrast, thomas jefferson described the first amendment as a wall of separation between church and state. in everson versus the board of education, the supreme court urged that the wall must be high and impregnable. in lemmon against kurtzman, the court recognized some relations between church and government relations is inevitable. arguing that the separation is a blurred, indistinct, and variable barrier depending on all the circumstances of a particular relationship. the first president, george washington, articulated an additional approach in his famed letter to the synagogue, which has been cited as the basis for the concept of religious pluralism. a definition that is more inclusive and perhaps more appropriate in today's united states than the term "tolerant." washington said it is no more

than toleration that's spoken of, as if it was one class of people who enjoy the exercise of their natural rights happily. the government of the united states gives no sanction to persecution requires only those who live under it protections should deem themselves good citizens, and giving it on all occasions their effectual support. our speakers have dedicated their careers to considering issues of the appropriate interaction between religious liberty and u.s. lost. -- our u.s. laws. greg lipper is council on key cases in the u.s. supreme court. michael gersten writes about the intersection of religious beliefs in politics. greg is with the americans

united for separation of church and state. for that #acenergy he worked at the covington and burlington #acenergy #acenergy law firm. christina arriaga is with the beckett fund. she has been in the case of hobby lobby versus burwell. she tells me she has quite an eclectic collection of pets at home. we learned that in the green room. michael gersten is a columnist with “the washington post” and worked with the one foundation to defeat disease and poverty globally. there are two categories we are going to talk about today. the first are the more traditional types of cases with the religion field. the accommodation cases. they often involve minority religion in the place of accommodation of minority religion in a majority society. there is another category in the news, which is what i would call religious accommodation 2.0.

those include hobby lobby. in the case is now growing out of -- i know since that is in the news, it is on everybody's mind. since we have counsel on both sides of the case here with us today, we will ask them to start off by telling us about what has happened in the area since hobby lobby against burwell. i'll start off with christina. ms. arriaga: you may wonder why my hair is messy. greg and i already got at it in the green room. [laughter] i have been asked to talk about areas of agreement. i'm working hard on that. i am sure you hear my accent. i have not been drinking. i am cuban-american, so i feel passionate about these issues. i am the executive director at the beckett fund.

one area of disagreement we have is the hobby lobby case. as you may have heard, americans united mischaracterized it as crazy evangelicals denying health care to women. that was not actually the case. i'm kidding. greg, i know. you never said crazy. [laughter] the greene family of hobby lobby are an evangelical family. they started their business in a garage with a $600 loan. they paid their kids seven cents each for making frames. as devout christians, when they opened their stores, and they eventually opened their stores in 46 states, employing 26,000 employees, they closed on sundays. their trucks only take merchandise into stores. they do not allow the trucks to bring in alcohol.

and they provided very generous health care benefit to their employee. the paper every medication, every drug, everything the affordable care act required, but they had absolutely no objection to 16 out of 20 drugs the government mandated. the only objected to four, and those for drugs were drugs the government itself -- the science was never argued in the case. and for the greene family, that was a form of early abortion. they could not govern these four drugs. they covered everything else. they had free health benefits. they also paid more than twice the minimum wage. and they found themselves facing this order by the government. the government while forcing

the owners of hobby lobby to provide these drugs, exempted millions of americans from having to comply with this mandate. the case became incredibly politicized. you may have heard about it. indeed when the government landed before the supreme court, the supreme court decided their case was very weak, because they lacked -- their arguments were not strong enough, and we won that case, and in that case, the government said that corporations have a relight -- a right to religious liberty. this was all very politicized, again. since then any court decision that has come down has largely benefited individuals who want to exercise their right to religious liberty. does that answer your question?

>> greg probably has a slightly different version of the facts -- so -- mr. lipper: before i start, she mentioned thomas jefferson. in sure that he is very proud. so, let me take a step back before we get into this particular hobby lobby case. although it is often per trade as a case brought under the first amendment, it was actually brought under a statute, the religious freedom act, which was enacted in 19 me three in one of -- 1993, in one of these great religious come by -- kum by

religious moments. cosponsored by edward kennedy and orrin hatch. it's a question about people's religious practice. even if the law on his face did not discriminate, there are some cases were greater exemptions should be provided. for instance -- the freedom to wear a beard, notwithstanding a dress code. or the requirement for autopsies when that violates religious beliefs. what has happened though in cases like hobby lobby in places like indiana and arkansas is the religious freedom restoration act has been used as a toll for some people to impose their religious briefs on -- beliefs on others and deprive others. that was something that it not

happen before. there are many situations in which accommodation is appropriate, but they have never been, as the hobby lobby case allowed to oppress someone else's rights. what happened in the hobby lobby case, a for-profit, commercial employer is permitted to withhold what is otherwise required health care. some employers refuse to cover any contraception. in the case of hobby lobby though -- i take christina at her word that nobody has died as a result of it, but tens of thousands of hobby lobby employees are deprived certain forms of contraception including the iud, which most medical professionals agree far and away is the most effective form of birth control and is also the most expensive and virtually all modern science agrees is not aboard a facet at

all. there were places where people had raised objection to social security taxes are paying women the same as men or minimum wage. those claims it always been reject because individuals or companies have never been allowed to use the religious beliefs of their owners to harm third parties, including employees. that consensus is broken down in this deeply fractured hobby lobby decision in a think it will have profound consequences in the way that we understand religious liberty and for the balance in our country between the right of religious worship on one hand and the secular law that protects everyone on the other. >> i want to get back to this argument about weaponize -- i think there is an argument about weaponization. i did want to ask you, christina -- in the case that said this did not apply to the states was the 1997 case.

it is been 17, 18 years since the decision of that case, and we are only now starting to see a focus on state level -- and there is a disturbing correlation between that and the passage of gay marriage, for example. does that have to do with factors other than those being articulated? ms. arriaga: that's pretty -- >> being articulated by the proponents of rifra's? ms. arriaga: we have 21 states with religious freedom act versions of it and they have protections that were r

ifra-like. many felt like they did not have to have rifra protection interstate. we are so nerdy. we are talking with all these acronyms. so we were also protected, but to your point greg, for who benefits, one of our clients is a native american in texas and in 2006, the department of interior sent covert agents that went into his family powwow because they hurt -- they heard he had eagle feathers and there is an act that prohibited native americans who are not fully recognized tribes to have these feathers. it was thanks to the federal

religious freedom restoration act that he was able -- the government had to return these feathers recently. it is true the original rifra was meant to protect minority religions and most of our clients are minority religions. what rifra never ever said or alluded to was anything having to do with what we are going to discuss later, which was sexual orientation or gender identity. so, i think the state did as well as they could given the 97 decision. >> so, these rifra's in the state -- how do you see controversies over florists, cake baking? how does this play out and what accommodations should be made? not just for minority religions, but people who have arrived at once that may not be as easily accommodated as evangelicals or

people certain religious beliefs? >> it is strange. i am a noncombatant in this legal battle and given where i am sitting, i am likely to be a casualty. it is a hard test about compelling governmental goals and the least intrusive means. that was a cause championed by the aclu for many years and was a fact for decades. it was really justice scalia who was the bad guy in this scenario , who wrote the smith decision that overturned this and caused the congress to react and reinstate this test.

when it was in the house, it was chuck schumer who took leadership on this. it passed the senate 97 to three . it really was a point of agreement. it is a shame, a terrible shame when issues this important get sucked into the vortex of the culture war. because what we're talking about is not just one issue among many . we are talking about one of the great achievements of the american tradition, which is the protection of a kind of religious liberalism that is actually good for the country. it is motivated over the years people to do good, religion has when it comes to hospitals and homeless shelters and catholic charities and a variety of religious groups and it has motivated the search for justice -- prison reform and other

things. religious freedom is not some problem to be solved, some controversy to be engaged in, when you hear george washington's statement from earlier, that is a thrilling moment in the history of the world. in which, a power like america came to the defense of a genuine pluralism in which people could pursue their own visions of good with respect for one another. so, i hate to see when rifra laws are used in a way that are suspect, because i think it brings to credit -- discredit to that cause, but i think the standard we had four decades has never really come up against these public accommodation laws.

that has not been a problem for decades. all of this, that standard does is say there should be a balancing test. not guarantee any outcome, but accommodating deeply held religious beliefs. so, i think you can question people's motives in bringing up rifra laws in states, but this balancing test is a well tested pretty good method to accommodate the normal rules of the majority and a handful of exceptions of people who feel that their beliefs are being heard and and it is the courts who make this decision and they have generally been wise and its application. -- in its application. >> let's talk about her will versus hobby lobby. they seem more traditional in the sense that these are religiously all owned

affiliated organizations that are refusing to provide particular categories of benefits. mike, do you see a distinction between that and the green family? mr. gerson: i think that there is some divide on behalf of the advocates of religious liberty. those who put a great emphasis on the autonomy and identity of religious institutions and those who extended to for-profit institutions. i think that divides some of the coalition on these issues area -- on these issues. the indiana law, as i understand it ensures that it is applied. i think that people may be more mixed on that. but i guess i would defer to the

experts -- greg? mr. lipper: i think there are two important this -- distinctions. the first one you mentioned -- they will be able to look at -- on the other hand, these entities of already received significant accommodation and refuse to take yes for an answer, because for two years now, the administration has said fine, you do not have to exclude any form -- include any form of contraception. all you have to do is provide a form that says no.

that was not good enough. the administration granted even a further accommodation. ok you do not even have to fill out the form. just send it to your insurance companies. just fill out a form to the government saying, i object, send it to the government. it again, these entities refused to take yes for an answer. the basis of what the supreme court ultimately said in hobby lobby is there is a risk -- a less restrictive alternative because the government created these accommodations for these nonprofits. these nonprofits are arguing that even filling out the form so somebody else will provide coverage for their employees is objectionable. basically saying, we will not rest until our employees are unable to get contraception from anyone. and i think that is -- you know, i think another example of the

weaponization of religious liberty, but i think it also contributes to something michael talked about. when religious liberty gets associated with denying women vital health care, denying them control over their bodies, refusing to sign paperwork, that is deeply troubling to -- that is deeply troubling to the cause of religious liberty as able. you saw this in arkansas where religious liberty is associated with discrimination, denying people service and accommodation. that is deeply troubling. the religious freedom restoration act may become toxic because they have been used in these ways. when governor pence is saying, no, no, this is not about discrimination. it is actually about depriving people of contraception -- that is deeply -- that has eroded what was a great consensus in

favor of religious liberty and i think it will do long-term damage to the cause. >> how do you feel about this your clients not saying yes for an answer? ms. arriaga: they devote their lives to serving the elderly poor. they take care of 13,000 elderly poor people. they hold their hands when they are ill, they help them die. they are committed to life, at the beginning, at the middle and at the end. and they just said, hell no, we won't go. mother lorraine would be really upset if i said that. the government has exhibited millions of americans from having to comply with this mandate for commercial reasons, for secular reasons, because they were the government's friends, because they felt like it. they created this paper game. sign a paper, sign here, s

ign there. it's a money game. it does not take a law your or a mathematician to understand someone has to pay for it and when they signed that visa paper it triggers a contract. someone else has to pay for it and they consider that to be an illicit thing. they consider that to be an offense and the government is running the business of telling people what they can or cannot believe or what they believe is reasonable. i have three teenagers. who has teenagers? i think it's completely reasonable to advocate for churches that have human sacrifice for teenagers question mark you would agree with me right? the state has the right to and and say it is not reasonable to have human sacrifice. it does not take a lawyer to understand that a gay musician or a gay photographer should not be forced by the government or

anyone else to go and photograph any event at the westborough baptist church. and just last week, the aclu and americans united just said indeed the gay photographer's should be forced to participate. no one in america ever supported that claim. freda levy, who we all know and love, who advocates for the legal exemption of marijuana -- if my children are watching, i never inhale -- because people disagree over religion and sex all the time in america and the answer is not to bring in government regulation and the answer is not to exaggerate claims. has it been weaponize? absolutely. that does not mean you wipe an entire body of law simply because someone's view you consider to be unreasonable.

>> what about this notion that the government is going to take over providing the contraception if the family does not provide it? how is that different than the case of the conscientious objector? the the objector does not get their service, someone else will have to give their services and certainly would say conscientious objectors are fine. >> it is very different. that is different from someone taking it. they cannot pay for it. the government provides millions of dollars in funding through title 10 to planned parenthood clerk -- clinics that provide drugs to women who want them something by showing up for free at no cost to the woman. this is taxpayer money. the government figured out a way to put a $