next, q and day with filmmakers robert neville -- robert morgan. >> this week on cue and day filmmakers morgan neville and robert gordon -- robert morgan brian: robert gordon, why did you do this documentary? robert: because it was

exhilarating to watch them have dialogue back and forth and though it was 45 years ago, it spoke very much to the present tense. brian: and to your partner in crime? morgan: robert called me and said he had come across a bootleg tape of some of these debate between william buckley and corbett all. -- gore the doll. -- gore vidal. i was very interested in him as a character. buckley was someone we all knew from being such a tv presence, when i saw the debates i saw something that was really speaking to today as much as it was to 1968. we got excited and decided to make a film about it. brian: when did they start?

and what was the point of your documentary? robert: they had their first confrontation in print in 1960 or 62. bill on the right, gore on the left. three columns, i think it was associated press that they did. it really became more personal when gore went on it the david celestine -- david suskine show and dismissed bill buckley as kind of a -- categorize it like the right had been categorized prior to his emergence. a crackpot, very far rates magazine -- very far right magazine and he had come along

in the mid-50's and change those characters. he sort of made the right a respectable place to think and be. gore dismissed it and demanded equal time. brian: union gore vidal, did you know bill buckley at all? morgan: i did not. he was the revelation to me, i was familiar with gore, but i was familiar with buckley the man, and buckley the tv personality. buckley's apartment in new york with his wife patricia was full of liberal writers and some of

her gay friends and people in the art world. not what i would've thought of. robert: one of the things we learned was that he had this -- was very interested in clinical debates on television -- political debates on television. but all camera he was interested in the arts and play the harpsichord and painted. he found its -- he perceived that in his all-time. brian: we have a bit of video from the trailer which talks about your documentary area and -- documentary. >> he represented everything that was going to moral hell. >> these were two visions of america. >> each thought the other was

quite dangerous. >> all of the security makes me nervous. >> his ideas would take down the nation. >> it's almost as if they were matter and antimatter. >> freedom breeds and equality. >> he's always to the right, and almost always in the wrong. >> anything complicated it confuses mr. but all -- confuses mr. vidal. >> they really do despise one another. >> you will stay plastered. >> this is william f buckley junior from new york. perfect. brian: how big a deal was that

confrontation back when it happened? morgan: i think it was a big deal at the time. it was certainly something that people wrote about. there were riots in the streets in chicago. it was not the headline, but it was the way the rest of america was taking the san, sitting around the television watching. -- taking this in, sitting around the television watching. it was this flash moments that people could not believe happened, and then it disappeared. you could not go rewatch it. it became this thing up floor. -- this thing of lore. robert: this did not happen on tv. now, you go to college and you and major in we are studies. the work we are, at the time was

a real heavy weapon. it brought higher upon the network from angry viewers. you can't talk like that on tv then. that was part of -- to digress for a second, one of the things we have to do was if that's the big moment, we have to contextualize it. make someone majoring in queer studies now realize the weight that were carried at the time. brian: how do you split your document -- your responsibilities on a documentary? morgan: i documentary is such a labor of love it's sort of who can grab what first? in terms of the massive amounts of research, it took us five years to make it. there was no clear delineation of tasks, can you do this? can i do this? brian: where do you to live?

robert: i'm in memphis tennessee. morgan: i'm in los angeles. brian: i want to run a little longer clip of that exchange in your documentary. it's about a minute and 12 seconds. before i show it, how many debates today have? robert: one of the amazing things about the series is, these were 10 debates that occurred during the conventions of 1968. they met in miami, and then a few weeks later they met again in chicago. they were there to comment on what had gone on in the course of the day. commentary because abc was not covering the conventions. as we got into the flow of this thing, it was as if it had been

scripted in the sense that in the penultimate debate, is this huge explosion. this groundbreaking moments on tv, and then they have to come back for a tense. -- 40 -- for a tenth. morgan: this is the night of the rioting in the streets. they had just watched news footage of cops beating kids over the head and street. then they cut back to gore and buckley. brian: here it is. >> you must realize what some of the political issues are here. people in the united states happen to believe that the united states policy is wrong in

vietnam and the viet cong are correct. this happens to be the opinion of western europe. it is a novelty in chicago that is too bad. >> you can express any point of view you want. >> shut up a minute. >> know i won't. -- no, i won't. >> the only cryptonazi i can think of is yourself. >> stop calling me that. i will punch you in the god dam a and he will stay plastered. [indiscernible]

brian: so the, shut up a minute. did he really mean that? morgan: absolutely. what's interesting about the relationship between these two men, politically they could not have been more different. they absolutely were coming from -- completely polar opposites. personally, they saw the other person as a bete noir. a person who could recognize their own insecurities and expose them to the outside world. it seems almost by accident that they became such polar opposites. in a way, it was deeply personal as much as it was political. brian: we did not see the moderator, but you can hear have a little bit. he did not seem very happy with this. did you talk to anyone at abc

that was there at the time? robert: we did. we talked to people who were there, and i think the people who were in the control room were shocked. i think we have in the film, one of the guys in the control room says can they say that? it had already gone all -- gone out. it was so shocking that they withheld it from the west coast broadcast area -- broadcast. brian: you never go on the west coast? morgan: no. brian: here's some more of your documentary. >> buckley expected this to be an opportunity to debate the issues. to have some fun, he was not prepared for mr. but all -- mr.

vidal. >> he wanted to take the national review as being racist if he could area >> i don't think he was really interested in conducting a debate about the issues, or about the parties, or about the policies. what he wanted to do was expose buckley. >> their confrontation is about lifestyle. what kind of people should we be? their real arguments in front of the public -- their real argument in front of the public is who is the better person? brian: did you find out whether or not when they were getting their makeup in those black-and-white shots? did they talk? morgan: i think they try to not

speak to one another as much as possible. one of the many things we came across an redoing the film was we went through gores papers at harvard. it included pages of pre-scripted insults. he had statistics. he had done a lot of research on buckley. he came in to try and eviscerate him on tv, and buckley was not there. he had -- was not prepared. he had gotten by on his substantive with honesty -- tv show. he did not single or who from the beginning was going for the jugular. brian: abc back in those days did not have a full day of television. what impact did this have? robert: it was a shocked to

everybody. as someone in the film says, abc was third of three networks. if there were four, it would have been forth. they had begun later as a network. they were less capitalized than the other two. they needed the income from batman and the flying nine to run during prime time so they could -- the flying nine to run during prime time. -- the flying nun to run during prime time. they would come on during the day and given our and-a-half summation of the highlights. the other networks accuse them of forsaking their journalistic responsibility.

however, the idea of putting these two heavyweights on to go head-to-head and give them 15 uninterrupted minutes on national network was -- became captivating. people loved to see this dance this ballet, this tango. it was a boxing match. we took to calling it verbal one sport. they were after each other's jugular. the weaponry was words. that developed an audience. commentators were covering it, by the end there was a headline that said -- at the 1972 convention, cbs is going to imitate abc? the idea of two heavyweights going back and forth and precipitating fights

on tv became increasingly the norm. brian: when did you start with documentaries? morgan: 22 years ago. i was a journalist, were both journalists. we're both big believers in the power of media. i think that's one thing that attracted us to the story area -- story. it's a cautionary tale and an absurdist comedy. brian: where were you as a journalist? morgan: i started my career at the nation magazine. that's where worked for gore. i worked in the bay area for a number of places. robert has been a writer. he has written six books. i found documentary early on. i fell in love with it. i love telling stories brian:

where did you start as a journalist? robert: i started as a freelance writer after college in philadelphia. i got on a weekly and began to string at the philadelphia inquirer. i had always dabbled in film and tv. i made a documentary -- i cannot honestly recall if it was an hour or half an hour in 1989. brian: what was it about? robert: it was about bb king and rufus thomas and their start from the streets in memphis called beale street. how they became national players. it was picked up by pbs. that brought me back to memphis to work on it. when i was there, i began to get magazine assignments which led to my first book.

i was back into print and was making using videos, but it kind of what documentary acai -- it kind of puts documentary aside. they were making a documentary about sam phillips, the founder of sun records. we were out to dinner and i was working on a book about muddy waters area and -- muddy waters. i try to find as much film and video of muddy as i could to get to know the character better. i told them i was try to make a documentary, but i think i'm about to -- morgan said documentary on muddy waters? not too much later, we were in the car driving through the back roads of mississippi making a film. robert: -- morgan: microsecond

entry is called shotgun freeway. it was kind of a mondello -- armando -- a mond o l.a. history. i set out to prove that l.a. did have a history. at the time, it was interesting. we had people in the film talking about it. it was a success. i kind of never looked back. brian: more from one of the debates. this was debate number one. let's watch this and continue talking about vidal and mr.

buckley. >> you get these crocodile tears for the poor people. i don't think they are going to vote for any of your candidates unless by some terrible accident the democrats get split in chicago. in which case, i think richard nixon might very well become the next president. and i shall make my occasional trips to europe longer. >> i think a lot of people will. i remind you of your promise to renounce your american citizenship unless you get a satisfactory outcome in november. >> that is not what i said. i said it would be morally correct. i can behave as in morley as the republicans. brian: how much of this was spiked by a producer saying we need audience go for each other?

morgan: i think abc wanted something that was going to have a little spark. something that was a little bit of the stocks. they got buckley to be a commentator and 68. they said who do you want to debate. he said anybody except gore vidal question -- gore vidal or a communist. abc hired him, neither of them wanted to go on with the other but the lore of the nationals. light on prime tv was too great. and they were well paid. robert: about a grand tonight. morgan: in $1968. brian: today that would be a great deal. morgan: i don't think the producers had to do any prodding.

once it was established, they brought more heat than they expected. robert: it's very clear from watching that, there is not someone in their year. very -- someone in their ear. someone today talking about -- talk about hot salacious topic number two. i don't think that was the norm in tv at the time, and i don't think these guys need it. morgan: and the moderator was a distinguished news man who i think was really kind of embarrassed by this. he disappears for sometimes five or more minutes at a time. today he would not have a moderator not jumping in every 30 seconds. i think really, everybody at abc just a back and let the fire burn. brian: they talk about vietnam.

here is a minute clip from debate number two. >> now we're going to win in vietnam. >> i said we could win. >> could we, or should we? >> we should. >> that's all we needed to know. take a good look at the leading warmonger in the united states. >> at find the leading moral -- leading warmonger then i am to be with you in the sense that a majority of the people of the including the leadership of both parties, while you go to rome -- want you to go to rome and expatriate yourself.

>> i don't expatriate myself, i have in apartments and i go there for two to three months every year. brian: did either one of these men serve in any military service? morgan: neither of them saw action in world war two, but they both serve during world war ii. robert: funny story. we went to go interview gore. he was alive when we began this. gore had written his first novel about his experiences in the military on a ship. he had served in the aleutian islands. we were interviewing him about a year and a half before he passed away. he was in a lot of back pain and uncomfortable.

word had gotten out that he was not at his prime and kind of paranoid and conspiracy minded. he is wheeled into the room, he's is in a wheelchair and he's brought in and he is not making eye contact with anyone on the crew. very forcibly looking down. one of the guys on the crew said my uncle served in the aleutian islands at the same time you did. he said he could never get warm. gore raised his eyes and these machine guns came out and he said i had my rage to keep me warm. brian: how would you define each individual, politically, personally? morgan: they are both complex characters. one thing that is so refreshing about these characters is though they were the left and the right, they were such

individualistic anchors, you could never quite predict with a with a. it was refreshing -- predict what they would say. it was refreshing. gore was very much an intellectual revolutionary. he was of the last, but he never belonged. even though he ran for office, it was never realistic. then he would be able to represent people, he did not have it -- the common touch that way. he was more of a classical figure. he was at very happy in ancient rome. that's where he thought he belonged, as a senator in rome. buckley, it's interesting because he started as a surgeon. from the right, starting the national review, starting firing line.

leading us far right movements that brought the republican party to him. i think bill really successfully purged the fringe elements of the far right. he brought the republican party into his way of thinking. that beached his ascendancy in the reagan years. buckley was somebody who was interested in being at the center of things. brian: we have a clip of christopher hitchens appearing on bill buckley's public television show firing line. let's watch this and learn from you the impact of firing line. ♪ >> i don't doubt mr. hitchens

that you do not like the american system. i don't think you say conveniently that that which you dislike is exclusively with the republicans. >> we are discussing liberalism. i mentioned george mcgovern. he is not lyndon johnson. say lyndon johnson is a liberal is to stretch it even further. >> anybody who voted for henry wallace and refuses to apologize for it is saying that he was perfectly comfortable with his policies and with his affiliation with stalinism. george mcgovern was a friend of mine who simply declined to apologize for the equivalent of voting for hitler. brian: that was 1984.

robert: young christopher hitchens. brian: probably right around 30 at that time. you have them in your documentary. why? robert: he was one of the earliest falls we made because he had switched sides in a way. after 9/11, he appeared much more to the right -- he veered much more to the right. we knew he knew each guy personally. in fact, when we were beginning this movie you embark on the youth and you are never quite sure if it's a good idea. is what we are seeing in it what other people are seeing? when christopher hitchens answer yes come soon come quick.

and then especially after the interview when he waxed poetically and philosophically about so much -- so many of these things, he's a great character in the film. we left that interview saying there is definitely a movie to make here. morgan: the one thing i will say is part of what the film is is a lamentation for the loss of a public space on television where people can come together and talk. christopher hitchens said c-span is what's left of that. i will give c-span its props. brian: i have to say it does not look a whole lot different from what we are doing right now. robert: firing line was on tv for 33 years. i think that it wrought people from across the political spectrum and from the arts into a discussion with time like you do to allow people to develop

ideas. that does not happen anymore. it happens between commercials and you have to hit the salacious stuff. using that, i'm reminded of his technique which is to hammer here and if the opponent begins to give an answer that he doesn't like, hammer over there. it's tough. i do like a more open dialogue. morgan: bill was a master debater. i think that was his first love. he did not want to spend his re-time talking about politics. i think he loves the sport. brian: his first guest on to firing line was norman thomas. a socialist. i'm going to make an abrupt change here. you have been involved and other documentaries that have had some social impact area will come

back to some of this. but first you did a documentary called johnny cash costs america. -- johnny cash's america. morgan: he's the right and the left revere. he was deeply religious, he was a family man. at the same time he was an outlaw and an addict. he was so many different things and everybody could see in him some element of what they wanted to see. that was fascinating. in a way, he was one of those public figures that we can all rounds together. those are the stories that gather us. brian: you are in memphis, where you involved in this one? robert: yes.

we made this one together. and i think this new film is an outgrowth of that one. initially, i was a little dubious of the cash one. there has been a lot of movies made about johnny cash. as we got into it, it was a revelation to me that such an icon -- that there were so many layers to this icon. i began to reconsider the dimensions of the icons. when we came upon the the doll -- thevidal-buckley footage it was good. brian: i think almost everything can be purchased on amazon. let's watch a little bit of johnny cash's america.

>> hello, i'm johnny cash. ♪ >> ♪ i hear the train a common area -- train a cming. it's rolling in. ♪ >> his america was not red white, or blue. it was black. >> he appeal to everyone. he went across all the lines. >> i look at the footage of him performing for the president and how the -- for the prison. and how the inmates did not want to kill him. he showed love and compassion. ♪ >> you could almost project onto

that big black frame whatever you wanted to. >> cash navigated that some of the most contentious issues of our time. >> what did he reflect on to the country? how can one speak his mind without losing his voice? ♪ brian: why did you ask chris cooper to do the narration? morgan: great actor. had the great southern voice. had the kind of gravitas we wanted. just watching that clip and being reminded, you have al gore and lamar alexander throwing -- throw in snoop dogg. robert: that was one of the great things about that show. everyone could see themselves reflected in johnny cash. brian: when did he die?

2003? robert: not that early i don't think. brian: did you get to talk to him? morgan: never did. robert: we talked to his best friend. brian: what's the background on getting lamar alexander and al gore together? morgan: they both have personal connections. tennessee. and al gore, when he first ran for congress johnny get a campaign event for him. johnny was friends with al's father. brian: there's another documentary. a couple more here. this one goes back to 2003. the muddy waters. this is a clip, it's not from your documentary. what is the impact of muddy waters on the country? robert: i think it his story, you see the entire -- and the

entire -- a fact of the 20th century told. here's a guy, a black man born in extreme poverty in the mississippi delta, one of the most impoverished parts of the nation. he goes from a house with no electricity to -- makes the great migration from the south to chicago. there he picks up an electric guitar and creates a new sounds. -- i knew sound. a blend of the electric -- creates with his band the template for a rock 'n roll band and becomes soon revered by the british explosion people and becomes an icon to the world.

i think that we get a whole sense of the possibility of america. brian: i love his real name. mckinley morganfield. how did he get muddy waters? morgan: his grandmother. robert: the delta is a very muddy area. it's at the foot of a levee. it was a very wet place, and he would play in the mind and his grandmother called him muddy. brian: let's watch a little this is from 2003. ♪ >> ♪ got my mojo. ♪

♪ i want to love you so bad. ♪ ♪ got my mojo. ♪ ♪ i'm going to have all of you women. ♪ got my mojo. ♪ ♪ got my mojo. ♪ ♪ got my mojo. ♪ ♪

brian: what a want to ask is one of the obvious things, you had whites and blacks in that band. didn't he died in 1970? robert: 1983. brian: i got that date wrong. when he started out, what was the relationship to him from the white society and from the black society? robert: across the south at that time, they were more than

denigrated, the african-americans. they were more than denigrated they were totally ignored. no birth records, no death records, no marriage records. very few of those kind of things because these people were considered of a culture not worth recording. that's part of the power of the blues and rock 'n roll. this voice of the disenfranchised became the voice of america. brian: when you look back on that, what year did you do it? morgan: 2003. brian: what was the hardest part? morgan: they're all hard in their own ways. that was such a great experience. part of what you just asked about, the white and the black audience is finding him. it's really that, muddy being afforded to the world.

recording to a black blues label and then places like england and bands like the rolling stone discovering this. and finally elevating people like muddy waters who were forgotten in their home countries. and then spotting a whole generation of blues fans. right there, you see muddy integrating his band and kind of broadening the whole exposure to the blues. it was just a pleasure. robert: i remember the good things. we were in a field in mississippi shooting stuff and graphs. it was about chest top -- shooting stuff in grass. it was chest high. it was morgan's introduction to chiggars which are a deeply

penetrating bug that itches. brian: what is the impact of documentaries on the political system? morgan: they do have an impact. sometimes they have a very concrete impact. you look at films like the invisible war about rape in the military area that 1 -- rate in the military. that would lead to specific changes in policy. they can have a general effect or specific effect. hopefully best of enemies will have a broader cultural impact of talking about how we argue. i think documentary is 3-d journalism. it has never been more revered and watched them right now. there is so much great work being done. people are seeing it more than before. robert: it's exciting because

documentaries have gone into -- have liberated themselves from the dry a format that they held for so long with the voiceover telling you what to think. to become really much more dramatic and better storytelling. brian: how would you describe where documentaries are seen? besides the movie theater television. morgan: i think the big revolution is that place. netflix -- has had a huge impact on documentary because they had such a wide array of documentaries and everybody has that service. brian: what do you know about viewership? morgan: they don't disclose this things, but i know anecdotally

that when they are streaming on netflix, the kind of feedback you get shows up exponentially. -- goes up exponentially. people who never knew where to find documentaries suddenly find themselves watching them on places like netflix. that and now expanding into itunes and hulu and on and on area -- on and on. robert: you also have festivals that focus on documentary. this gives people a place to see how the stories are being told. what innovations are being done. brian: back to some of the buck ley-vidal thing. this was 1989. when they are talking about a

month other things ronald reagan. >> he comes out of hollywood. he is an actor. he was hired by the various wealthy entities that control the united states. he was elected to impersonate a president. he was hired to cut the taxes of the rich and keep the money going to the defense department and every now and then to say the russians are coming. now, we all have been around hollywood, not as long as reagan. he was always a very charming guy, but he was a chatterbox. he could not stop talking. he was one of the most boring men that ever lived. very good at you -- very good at reading creek are -- reading cue cards. brian: you work for him?

morgan: right at that time. brian: what did you see? morgan: that the charming gore. i think that was very much his public persona. i know he had many very close friends. he had an open door for many people. he had a very difference side -- a very different side of gore. i think he only wanted to show that face the people he considered equals. brian: what was he like working for? morgan: incredibly difficult. mainly because my job as a spectator was to tell him he had gotten all facts slightly wrong. my job was to question him and his authority, and he hated anything that was to be questioned area -- questioned.

brian: how would he react? morgan: i would hold the phone away for my year as he would greet me. i would knowledge and try to press my point. he was known to be tough on fact checkers and people like that. i would not recommend working for him, but i think being a dinner party guests at his house would've been different. brian: what did you learn about buckley behind-the-scenes? robert: that he was very interested in a wide range of the art and he likes to hang around with liberals off camera. he was very interested -- i think it was about sharpening his own with. he likes to beer -- his own wit. he liked to be around people who thought differently area it was a way for him to keep sharp.

this is the guy who founded the mainstream right-wing. brian: here's a clip from the second debate. the subject matter is something very similar to what we are hearing today area federal spending. >> wimp must get private enterprise -- i would love to see the american virtue saying this alone can help us in the ghettos with the negroes. they are there to make money. >> the making of money is a way of helping people because it is a way of making good available to people. he made a lot of money, but he also reduce the price of the car.

>> i would say offhand i'll do it in one line. it has been a great pleasure to observe. >> that was a long line. we must break it off there. brian: that was not from your documentary. what about the -- how much of either one of them had their speech affected on purpose. morgan: the roots of their mid-atlantic attrition accents are interesting. most of buckley's siblings did not have an accident. buckley did attend school in england for a time as the young boy area -- young boy. robert: he spoke spanish is his first language.

morgan: it's not an accent to be found in nature. brian: what about gore? morgan: i think he founded at exeter where he went to high school. there's footage of him at age 10 speaking and he does not have that accent. by this time he emerges as an author in his late teens, he does have it. brian: in 1982, there was a program -- i'm going to run a clip of this because it's one of the messages you get in watching your documentary area which is how long? robert: hour and a half. brian: this was the beginning of television that was confrontational. here is 1982, john maclachlan. >> don't you think we have to break the bonds policy establishment which came in to

be because of world war i, world war ii and the korean war? >> your actions -- you are exactly right. a lot of these international institutions are going to go if the soviet union threat diminishes. it's going to go naturally. the united states will compete internationally, we will be more competitive with the germans and the japanese get up and defend their own country. >> you lower the defense budget and you spend it on a r&d and infrastructure area and you can use some of it -- infrastructure. you can use some of it to help other countries so they can trade with us. the best way to help poor country is to cut off foreign aid so the socialist governments will collapse. >> the son of george wallace talking about the stripes. brian: that was a 1990 clip, but

it started in 1982. how much influence to the 68 debates have on the change in television? robert: prior to the debates there was a brodsky -- agronski. five people sitting around the table without at the interchange like that. one would speak at a time. much less confrontational, much more sedate. kind of boring. here, i'm not sure -- we did not see nothing gauge the content. there's a lot of back-and-forth sort of like they do in the wwf when they throw everybody in the rain. it feels kind of like that. morgan: i think the debates

between buckley and that all definitely open doors for those things. i don't want to put all the credit or blame at their doorstep. it was actually one of those moments that led to this landscape we have today. robert: it cannot be emphasized enough that when they were doing it, the fire that burns was rich old one. they brought a command of history and philosophy and politics and language to bear on the dialogue. i think the flames may reach the same height today, but it's flash paper. you don't learn the same thing. you just see the fireworks. brian: i want to run one more clip. this is from the best of enemies. before we do that, what surprised you about the coverage you got? morgan: it's one of the stories that we felt mattered and when

we were making the film, the comment we got the most was does anyone care anymore? is this relevant? now the comment we get more than any other comment is i can't believe how relevant this is. that's music to our ears. brian: what's the surprising reaction you got? robert: the surprise was how long it took people to get on board. as we were trying to get it made. once it's been made, it's been very well received. morgan: by the left and the right. robert: we try to, not necessarily -- just strike a balance but not stateside. brian: last click. let's watch. >> my brother bill, and he was a conservative right wing libertarian christian. that's what he was. but most of all, bill was a

revolutionary. >> when the people at abc first approached bill, they asked him what he be willing to be the conservative debater? he said yes he would. they asked him is there anyone you would not go on with and he said a communist and apart from that the only one i can think of is gore vidal. >> men and women who are sexually repressed regard all sexual pleasure as dirty, evil the devil's work. yet we are all prostitutes in one sense or another, ethically if not sexually area >> for buckley, the doll with the devil. -- for buckley vidal was the devil. brian: his brother is not nearly as well-known as jim buckley the senator.

did you ask him to do this? morgan: we interviewed him. very knowledgeable and sweet man. but oddly, was very different than bill. he and his other brother were very similar. james was almost from a different family, which is probably why he was a successful politician. brian: before we run completely out of time, what's next? robert: might be next documentary, might be next book. someone is interested in my stacks record book. it might turn into something. brian: you did an oscar-winning 20 feet from starting on? was that just you -- 20 feet from stardom.

with that issue? morgan: i have a feature coming out with yo-yo ma area we will premiere in the fall. brian: our guests have been morgan neville who lives in los angeles and has done a lot of documentaries with our other guest who lives in memphis. we thank you for bringing us the best of enemies. ♪ >> for free transcripts, or to give us your comments about this program, visit us at q&a.org. >> if you like tonight's