tried to remedy this in the law, one generation ago. two separate from the true history of this to separate from the true history, these are the united states of amnesia. we are not willing to do with the true history that got us to where we are. >> thank you for there are a couple of things. the point you are making, the point where we see the break with frederick douglass, with liberal whites in the north, it is precisely over this issue where white women in particular say we want the vote. if we do not have the vote, certainly black men cannot have the vote. i think it is very important.

to reiterate the point, the default has always been white. you are moving out of that position. black life matters is problematic in some ways because we still have to say that. because the default position fundamentally is still light. bruce: i need you guys to look at this here. people are doing better, i me would not have this problem of, i am losing so you must be winning pair take a look at unemployment numbers. we just need a reference point. the black unemployment rate has gone down. for hispanics, the numbers almost 7% today and has gotten better pay her for whites, the

unemployment rate is 4.6% compared to 7% in 2009. the point being, it has gotten better for the economy -- and the economy has gone better. i want to come back to you, chris. when you're talking on the phone, you're talking about a group of white men out there who feel as though, who are we talking about? chris: in terms of white privilege -- >> we will talk about what privilege later we want to talk about employment. chris: a lot of blue-collar folks in world areas in particular, they do not like when they have any real privilege. if i did hard to get a job anywhere event jobs going overseas. bruce coney think other people should be taking their jobs. chris: it is unfortunate. the fact that we have a black president, playing into some anxiety. folks feel like, my position has not improved. meanwhile, those people are over there.

there is a bit of dissonance there. whenever you have a situation where the economy, people feel like they are left out of the economy, people will find people to blame. the people coming across the border, -- bruce: moving on coming into doubt have seen the images on television benefit captured on cell phones. mostly african-american males who ended up dead. ferguson, cleveland, the university of cincinnati police officer, north charleston, and more and more and more. you have seen. take a look from baltimore.

>> these officers did nothing wrong. >> black lives matter! >> west baltimore is also referred to the other baltimore. people feel left out. >> excuse my french, asked the leaders. >> they do not like baltimore police here. >> we have to characterize them as a whole. >> even he for freddie gray died in police custody. >> a high crime area could you know what happened? they were not able to stop anybody for any reason. >> it will not be solved in one day. it is something that involves a

lot of work and a lot of good people. policing our own police. >> if you have not been to west baltimore, you do not know that part of west baltimore. watch the wire to get a better sense of what is going on there. i was there covering. michael would again, a former baltimore city police officer. what is zero tolerance? i understand that is what police in baltimore were operating under. there is this zero-tolerance belief. what does it mean? >> i had zero-tolerance under martin o'malley. you do not have that system anymore, at least not officially. what you have with freddie gray is an instance where you're going after somebody walking the streets and supposedly have a knife. the cost stop him and go into

the pocket, and up arresting him throwing him into a metal box, and he ended up on the steps to your they were on tv and they will say, we did nothing wrong. it is the academy of white privilege because there is not a chance any of your kids -- >> tell us your experience? baltimore gives us another story. >> cost to it we want because we have over criminalization or what does that mean? we have sandra bland, where no matter what happens, the police can justify detaining you for a time. with that enables you to do is not necessarily look for the crime but look for your chosen suspect. everyone is criminal when you have lost that make everyone do things that are illegal. we have a false ideology that is

who the people are who commit crimes. that is because that is who we are looking at. we arrested them previously. bruce: most of the crime is committed by the young african-americans, how would you respond to that? >> it is mostly committed by them when we look at them. when we go out, we know all the races carry drugs, if you were to stop anybody to look for drugs, you would prima find drugs at the same rate. when we find pre-much anywhere, that is what we're looking for. it is a false narrative when someone says we're looking for crime. i would call them a liar. bruce: how do you begin to reform the police departments that might be similar? >> i am focused on getting money out of politics. i do not think we can get politicians who will do with the people want. i do not know how we can get that when we are supported by donors.

>> i have represented defendants on both sides. the reality is, whether it is baltimore or urban police departments, we have got to get rid of the us versus them mentality. i agree with the officer over here, but it goes down that. us versus them is the thin blue line. that is, where you are seen a shooting and the other officer says, i have got your back. he says, do not say anything, he has body cameras. inuoye called black and brown defendants on the halls on the right out? perks, animals. dogs.

regularly. if you go patrol the streets externally, i've got to tell you, you will think of those individuals the same way. secondly, who are the police officers we have been choosing? in the last months where the shootings have taken place, my gracious. we have got to do better assessing who we are giving a gun and a batch two. it is a great way to begin in this to police department. -- in this police department. bruce: he says he wanted to work in the black neighborhoods. that is where the fun was. to go back to your point, you can make your own rules there. >> we do not know what biases and prejudices people are bringing to the street with regard to law enforcement

officers. what we're talking about his leadership. that is a big way, a great way you begin to clean of these police department. bruce: i do not know if you read the interview that the officer involved in the ferguson shooting, michael brown, has done with newspaper magazine. he said he won it to work in the black neighborhoods, that is where the fun was collected to go back to his point. >> we do not know what they are bringing in the streets with

regard to law enforcement officers, so what we're talking about his leadership. last night we had a republican presidential candidate debate, and there was more time spent on the "nwa" movie commercial after a 30-second segment and is issue of race relations was not discussed. that is the problem. we have a cancer. organisms are killed from the inside out, and that is what is taking place in our country. bruce: young man right here in front. >> hello. i attend morehouse college. i believe that we cannot wait for white people to fix our communities. our church and our politicians need to work together so that 30, 40 years now, we will have stronger relations within our community because that is the only way that black people will advance, and i do not think it is something we can truly wait for another race or another culture to ask for us. bruce: young lady right here. >> hi. i am olivia brand, and i'm from baltimore city, attending the university of maryland, and i would like to completely agree because when i thought would happen in baltimore, i did not do that as, you know -- i saw that as someone being killed in my home, a family member, someone from baltimore. everyone was so focused on the cvs burning that people were not focused on a life taken. white silence is the killer. i believe that wholeheartedly. bruce: an interesting poll in the criminal justice system, half of americans holds that the criminal justice system in the u.s. is biased against blacks. that is up 35% from two years

ago. gentleman in the corner. greg: hi, greg from montgomery county. i think you are absolutely right, there is a serious problem with the administration of justice, and it comes back to the war on justice and the inexplicable reason that as a society we think we can legislate individual voluntary behavior, and if we change that, i think we will see a lot of these problems go away. bruce: let's go to facebook. anthony duncan says he let because it away at civil rights and soon no one will have civil rights. marie brown says -- the discussion needs to take place on how to comply with law enforcement, it is not about

equal rights these days. there is a distinct problem with how people are behaving when they encounter a police officer. anybody want to weigh in on that? >> we can focus on law enforcement, but that is just the most toxic tip of his iceberg because when you go and go for a job and you are discriminated against, it is the same poison happening in a far more subtle form. when you look to rent an apartment or buy a home and discrimination takes place come it is the same poison, it is just more subtle than when there is a gun involved. this is part of a larger systemic and institutional problem that we have to address. if we only focus on law enforcement, then shame on us for not focusing on all of the

other issues that we have to deal with, but we have to focus on law enforcement because lives -- black lives -- do matter. bruce: and police officers are in a unique category. they are the only ones with a badge and a gun to take someone's life. most of the times we will try to say it is justified. it is an important right that i have. i have a lot of cop friends. if i need help, i will call them. but i think of them, clean it up, if you have a bad apple, clean it out. she has got bad cops that she cannot get rid of. go ahead. dana: it is incredibly problematic that we are not looking at the officer, particularly in the sandra bland influence. snark is a part of what we do. it is not that you have the angry black woman stereotype in the jezebel stereotype, but literally what she said -- the officer said, you have got a problem, is something wrong, you seem like you have an attitude. she does have an attitude because you pull me over for not using a signal. that officer could not figure out how to get out of that situation. he got deeper and deeper into it and what not retreat. bruce: then his training should

have kicked in. absolutely. dana: yes, or his humanity. >> that if that -- that gets back to the point that supremacy rules what we are talking about. the way the system is set up in the country, going back to trying to cats and slaves on the streets that people have presumed had escaped. if you think about how much negative into our mentality that he was doing right and wrong, it is interesting to hear your point about you are at the fact that people were not talking about black life matters amongst people running for president, but you had a problem with the "nwa" commercial. i learned a whole lot more from the nwa that i will ever learn from any politician, and to me, that was as important. what they are not talking about is not as big of a deal, which is part of that supremacy problem we run into. bruce: hold on a second. let's go to charleston here take a look at this.

>> why did you do it? reporter: according to authorities, 21-year-old dylann roof sat with his soon-to-be victims for an hour in a bible study class listening to them pray, watching them worship before gunning them down. >> it is hard to explain to your children. >> i am mad, i'm hurt, i am angry. reporter: roof's friends that he had recently reconnected with roof. >> he told me black people were taking over the country and he wanted it to be segregation. reporter: roof is also facing 37 federal accounts, among them hate crimes for the june massacre. >> this is an unspeakable act. >> we woke up today and the heart and soul of south carolina was broken. bruce: reverend lamar of the ame church in washington, the sister of mother emanuel in washington, reverend, what have you seen since this? reverend lamar: you cannot take the thought of historical context. trying to have an insurrection against the slave owners, the white people in charleston at

the time were concerned because there were more african and white, and they were brutal to the africans and were trying to keep the africans suppressed. what i want to say currently is that we continue to give people asking us questions, but they do not want to have a real dialogue. how is the church protecting itself? they do not want to talk about how dylann roof came into that space with the ideas that animated what it is that he did. my friend here from the republican party, the current republican party, i am not a big fan of democrats, either, but the southern strategy engineered by richard nixon was used to blow racial dog whistles to rally white people to roll back the very -- that came forth after the civil rights movement, and they continue to trade on that continuously. america needs and must be willing to have difficult conversations. stop with the smokescreens and the shields. we know that the narrative that is animating these spaces that

continue to control black bodies, that narrative is old and has not been broken, nor has it been challenged. it just re-creates itself generation after generation. bruce: everybody is surprised. the gentlemen here. cj: i am an intern at the white house initiative for asian-pacific islanders. the part of the discussion that was truly inspirational is that racial relations is not a black and white issue, and there are other folks out there, other ethnic minorities i do take part in this discussion, and being an asian american, being one of the few in the studio today, i think that is very important for us to remember. the indian temple shooting for years go resonates with me as much as it resonates with the troll stench shooting that happened a couple of months ago. there is a discussion amongst

asian americans law enforcement. danny chen died from hazing. it is important to remember being inclusive of other voices, having besides of race discussions. it goes back to the sentiment of the gentleman that spoke before, that all lives matter. i believe in the black life matter movement, but we need to be inclusive of ethnic minorities and i would like to take a step back and ask every in this room to bring other voices who are not often heard on television or mass media. bruce: very well said. can we get a mic back there? just stand up. hold on a second. identify yourself quickly for us. trish: hi. i am the immediate secretary of the d.c. -- party, and i do not mean to be disrespectful, but people of african american dissent have had to live through -- descent have had to live through 400 years of

discrimination. we do not know where we come from, we do not know our names, however, those who have had the ability to come here by choice -- they have a option. you can find out where you come from, you know what country of origin you come from. the vast majority of us in this room have to take a dna test and hope that we can find out who we are and where we belong in the diaspora of african american, so please do not ask us to be little, do not ask us to stop, do not ask us to include because if it had not been for our blood, sweat, and tears, this country would not he where it is right now. bruce: anybody else want to respond to that? while we are back here, the lady in the back, no, right here in the front.

your name, please? gail: my name is gail schnell, i am the president and ceo of schnell tech solutions. i just want to say that i respect each and every person here and each and every race, and we have all suffered some sort of injustice if you look at the past, speaking from the asian-americans like a minor for the japanese, they have gone through concentration camps, and these are all of our ancestors. the only way we will move forward is learning from her past, learning from our mistakes and moving forward together as a whole. i have a child, and with his classmates asked him -- are you filipino? and he said -- what is that? and he said -- are you from the philippines? he said, "i am american." i want one day for us to not see a color, not see a race. so many interracial couples, i am hoping that after a while we will stop the hatred and try to find all the ways that we can help each other out and be a better country by working together, just like in the army. we are made up of women, different races, and i have

faced racism, i have faced discrimination being a woman, but i choose not to dwell on the negative and focus on the positive. i put myself out there to try to help where i can come in and hope others will follow. bruce: thank you very much. i want to get as many people as possible. let's move this way. this gentleman right here. >> i am from baltimore leaders of a beautiful struggle. black people are afraid to talk about race. -- not in terms of people feeling about a particular race, but we are talking that institutions that benefit financially, politically, by undermining humanity, people of african american descent. there are industries profiting off the suffering of our people, and that is the impetus behind what we saw in baltimore in terms of use of the institutionalized oppression of the people in those communities. until we get what that, we will not deal with the problem in front of us.

bruce: point well taken. the gentleman with his glasses on. >> [indiscernible] bruce: hold on a second here and i cannot hear his mic. and him another mic, please. go ahead. >> i just wanted to say some front from the white house initiative, as a fellow asian-american, i think you really needed to hear what she said because i think a lot of the way asian-american issues are framed is hey, we experience this, too, without ever saying not on the same scope and magnitude, right? but i also wanted to speak to the second point about reforming police and law. i mean, i think when we talk about reform, we need to talk about fundamental reforms, not just a reform here, reform

there, because i think we are in a political system that gives us black versus white, and these are not useful categories cheered when he to be thinking bottom versus top. bruce: but go to this woman who has had her hand up for quite some time. samantha: i just wanted to say really quickly i think going back to the issues with dylann roof and the conversation that has brought up, i think one of the problems that i see with conversation and discourse that has come from that is it is sort of derailed the conversation on a personal level because it has given people something to point to and say no, that is racism. that allows us to ignore the systematic and institutionalized racism that is really eroding very deeply the demographics of this country that are affected. bruce: it reminds me of the lesson that president obama gave. just because you do not use the word. good point. let's take a look at this piece. reporter: august 1, marysville, virginia, that is ben jones,

former democratic congressman in georgia, probably better known as cooter. he has built a cottage industry off the character he portrayed in the early 1980's popular sitcom "the dukes of hazzard." he is the owner of a major attraction, but he is also leading a charge to save the confederate flag. >> we are not ashamed of our ancestors, we are not ashamed of the symbols of their courage or valor. reporter: defenders of the flag came out on a saturday. >> when this flag has been used for hateful purposes, it is a desecration of that flag, and it has in the past, it has been misused, we know that, but so have the american flag, so has the christian cross. reporter: they feel outnumbered, maybe even betrayed by

mainstream southerners who are now openly reconsidering the legacy of slavery and its symbols. >> so many people die because of that flag, and just to remove it and pretend history did not happen is wrong. >> do not take my flag. it is important to who i am and where i came from. >> the men who fought under this flag -- it was not about defending slavery. slavery was not something they had -- slavery was something they inherited. it was an evil, but it was the national sin, not the southern sin. reporter: a young white man pictured brandishing the flag, and the flag had to go said south carolina's governor. governor: that flag, while an integral part of our past, does not present the future of our great state. my hope is that by removing a symbol that divides us what we can move forward as a state in

harmony, and we can honor the nine blessed souls who are now in heaven. >> we love those people that were in the church and died. >> why crucify everybody because of what one or two or maybe four people do? it doesn't make no sense. reporter: some here seem resigned to the flag coming down over the statehouse, others say if only will stop there. taking the "dukes of hazzard" off tv -- >> it is cultural poisoning. that is what it is. there is no other word for it. bruce: congressman ben jones in the studio. take it from there. you know a lot of people here want that flag removed from public space. you don't have a problem with that. ben: well, it depends on the public space. i think that it is cultural cleansing. you have got your member a few

things here. 70 million to 80 million americans are descended from the confederacy. no one here got to fill out an application form one we came into this place. we did not get to decide what color we were going to be, who our ancestors were, and in studying the turmoil of american history, i understand that indeed, slavery, which is a lot longer than america, started in 1619, white and black bondsmen came into jamestown under the english flag from 1619 until 1776. under the american flag from 1776 until 1865. those men thought they were doing the right thing, and lincoln in his first inaugural address said he has no problem with slavery. now, that is a tough thing for people to get around, but if we really study history, we have to understand, first of all, the debt that we owe to the african-americans, and i think that is clear. they did not, after 1865, have the same starting line as everybody else, but if we're going to move ahead, we have to go by things that dr. king said.

he had a dream that somehow on the red hills of georgia, the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slaveholders will dine together at the table of brotherhood. we cannot do these divisive things, making these broad brushed characterizations of all of us without a reaction. bruce: let's say statehouse taxpayer funded structures. ben: those are different argument. there had been -- removed it from the capitol dome, where it had not been, put it at a confederate monument. that deal is done. yes, i think folks he understand what i'm saying. every confederate monument, every confederate statue, every confederate flag, every cemetery is now on a list, and throughout this country, every day, it may not show up on the media, but our flags are being threatened, our heritage is being threatened, and we did not --

bruce: we will get into that. i want to split this up a bit. let's talk about the confederate flag flying over public -- and when i say public, i mean taxpayer funded buildings. >> it is our heritage, and we are proud of it, we are not proud of what happened as far as slavery. i do believe it is completely wrong and should have never happened. but attacking our personal property -- bruce: get him another mic because we need to hear this. >> i do not believe that slavery was a good thing, now, attacking our private property and it is on our vehicles, which is happening right now, and there was a gentleman on a street bike in georgia, and there was a gentleman flying the flag on the back of his pickup truck. the gentleman on the street bike

was african-american, and he jumped off of his street bike and pulled his fight off this drug and ended up dying. now, i do not want to see this happen. this is very of setting to me, and the fact that they're coming to our private property to take what is ours down that we, that is our heritage -- bruce: in everyday agree that if he wants to fly the confederate flag on his private property, that is his business? >> no, no. bruce: marjorie, you disagree. marjorie: first of all, i want to know, what is the heritage that this flag represents? what is the southern heritage dissing from the american heritage when you separate out the issue of slavery? what did the confederacy do that was so distinct if it was not a

slave state? ben: slavery existed in every state in this country. it existed in every colony before that. slavery, you will come to understand, it built the american economy. it built wall street. read the book by the editors of the "hartford current" that established that it was a northern enterprise. what it was with a bunch of people who went out in their time to defend their rights, what they felt were being threatened in that system. if you want to fight be civil war here, if you want to fight the civil war here, no. >> i am not saying stupid things, i am expressing an opinion. >> ben, if you read the documents of secession, the states as they seceded, they were clear that it was about nothing other than slavery. it was clearly about slavery, and it was their determination,

they wrote it themselves, that their culture was contingent upon slavery and the eradication of slavery was the eradication of their culture and their property and -- bruce: let's go to noelle back here. noelle: we also have to understand the confederate flag was not and did the civil war, it was used decades and decades as a symbol of hate. "birth of a nation," one of our first feature-length film that celebrated the klan. i am not saying we need to get rid of it completely, but i think it belongs in the museums because as a historian, it is important to keep. >> when i hear my new friend, ben jones -- [laughter] my new friend here, um, you

cannot have it both ways, right? i hear my new friend say it is about southern heritage and he does not support slavery and he quotes martin luther king, junior, ok, he is talking out of both sides of his mouth. the reality is that this is a symbol of hatred and death, and you know what, it should not be on federal or state government buildings or locations. you want to put on a museum or your house, that is fine. bruce: let me hear from lenny, then we have to move on. lenny: here is what i cannot understand what i hear the phrase "southern heritage" -- that suggests that the south is simply white. it is not. the south is multicultural. if we were to talk about southern heritage, wanted it make more sense to talk about rosa parks, to talk about the abolitionists in the south of fight against slavery? why is the confederate flag,

which symbolized a nation that tried to continue and perpetuate slavery, the symbol of southern heritage? that is not make any sense to me. clinton: i think there is more to be said here, though, which is a basic historical lesson, which is a confederacy is not some part of america -- it was time to leave america. that is to be understood here. when you assume one into another, that is a historical, that is faulty or when you talk about atonement, i believe there are a lot of people that do believe that some concept of cultural heritage around the show that the one you were on, shows like i watched as a kid, but if you are going to go with atonement, as for people who were most affected are you do not get to just make the rules of your own atonement if you really actually care. you go to germany, you not see symbols like that. from a symbolism standpoint, that is what i am saying. ben: no, no.

clinton: i am not disagreeing with that, but -- >> let me say this quickly. first -- bruce: we are past the flag. we are moving on. >> it goes back the white privilege thing. when you are showing the thing about dylann roof, it was white privilege when they took him to get a sandwich after they arrested entered when your essay like person, they are being handcuffed, hogtied and everything, so white privilege exists, so when we talk with his idea, until white people, been say reparations for black people in america because everybody who has been wronged in america has reparations, and the white privilege that have, when you

locked of our people -- bruce: we have not heard from the gentleman right here with the hat on. >> white privilege -- here is the thing, louis ck said you can get in a time machine and go anywhere. today, i can go anywhere in the planet, i am walking down a street and a hoodie, i know i will be fine. other people cannot do that. that is what is important to understand, that people who are black in this country, latino in this country, if you are not white, if you're not a man in this country, crazy things can happen to you. that is white privilege, that i can do what i want, and i'm going to be ok, and that can always be set if you are not white. bruce: erin, one of our really talented producers here, told me when we were rehearsing about a conversation she had with a black female colleague. erin, tell us about that conversation. erin: i was shopping and telling the story to a black coworker, and i was kind of puzzled as to why i was in a fancy, upscale bethesda store, and know what that high me, no one greeted me,

and my black coworker's response was, well, they do not think you are going to steal. if i walk into the same sort, they will be like hi, how are you doing, let me help you with this. they kind of tail them. it never occurred to me that would happen. i just thought it was bad customer service and not someone profiling shoppers. bruce: a show of hands here, how many people are followed going into a store? ok, let's see. well, whatever, if you are followed, you are followed. ok, show of hands. the white gentleman in the back here has been followed.

talk to me. stand up. i need to get a mic over to you. why do you think they were following you? >> well, it was christmas time, and i was going to a toys for tots party, and i wanted to get a toy, and probably because i was a man walking around a toy store and i do not have a wedding ring on her any kids with me, i was going through the toy aisle, and one of the guys came up to me is that excuse me, sir, can i help you, and give me a dirty look. bruce: young lady right here, right here. what about my colleague here? do you want to talk? go ahead. erin: i think that is the point, though, he was followed in the toy store because he looked out of place in the toy store, and we see people of color get followed in stores because people inherently assume that they are out of place, they should not be shopping in here, they must be stealing, and that is racism. bruce: i have to ask you because we're running out of time.

solutions -- where do we go from here? we have to leave here. let me start with you, what do you think? dana: a conversation -- it dovetails well with the part of become a station we were just having. one solution is if you think about it in the hong kong -- in the context of what the comedian said, no matter what i go, wherever i go, that is absolutely not true. it is not true. if you go back far enough, you do not exist. so if you begin to help us to recover what it was or what life looks like before race became an issue, and you stop the cultural cleansing, and we get historical

accuracy, and we do not teach the beginning with avery in the u.s., and we begin to think about the world in terms of the world and not the white world, then it is a very different conversation. our point of perception is different. bruce: i'm looking for solutions. hurry up. >> lots to talk about here. bruce: no, no, you do not have the time. >> bruce, i think you have lost your viewers because this has been a liberal program. however, if you want to shut down conservatives emma talk about white supremacy -- conservatives, talk about white supremacy, and so on. a lot of conservative whites out there do not even think that racism even exists. you have to go with baby steps here. that is a big problem. you want people to listen, you want to have a conversation with them, and -- >> what are you saying to your colleagues in the republican party? >> it is a big problem because right now donald trump is topping -- tapping into a situation here, they do not want to hear what you are saying to them. they do not want to hear a lot of it. it is a difficult thing for a lot of them to hear. bruce: ok, we have run out of time, curate incredible conversation, we will continue it online. i want to take all of you, and we certainly would like to thank all of you out there. thanks for joining us. have a good night.

[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2015] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] "newsmakers" tim pawlenty is our guest. he shares his thoughts on the republican party and the 2016 presidential race. there is a long way to go between now and the iowa caucus next year. owans are notorious for deciding late. it is a more conservative state than many other places. not that many people show up. and i want, only a few hundred

thousand participate. it is a subgroup of a subgroup of a subgroup. they tend to be pretty conservative. iowa favors more conservative and populist candidates. donald trump is in the lead with about 20% but that means there is 80% of the vote not for trump. if someone can succeed in consolidating the other 80% that is a win. but the field may need to shrink and that may not happen by iowa. so 20% could be the winner. >> is it time to start talking about donald trump as a potential winner? >> if you had asked me a month ago i would've said no. seeing the surprising resilience of his appeal, and the rawness, and he can say almost anything and it does not affect polling numbers, he may have more staying power than most -- most people first realized. i don't think he will get the

nomination but he will be around longer at a more competitive level in some believe. having come from a state where jesse ventura got elected governor, in a world where the kardashians seem to be so popular for mysterious reasons, you never really know. especially politics. >> you can hear the former minnesota governor plenty talk -- governor pawlenty talk more about the presidential race on newsmakers. later will be live from the campaign trail with republican presidential candidate ben carson's. speaking at the candidate's soapbox at around 5:00 p.m. et. shortly after that you will hear from another presidential candidate, george pataki. both speeches will be live here on c-span. reverend john richard bryant is

senior bishop at charleston south carolina's ame church. recently at the national press club in washington dc where he spoke about race relations and gun violence. this is an hour. monthsas been almost two since the mass shooting. nine worshipers including the pastor were killed during a inside thee study historic mother emanuel african methodist it piscopo -- episcopal church. the bishop called the nation to prayer and barely 24 hours later there was a vigil in a packed and sweltering morris brown ame church just blocks away from where the shooting occurred.

bishop bryant discussed the the daysf gun that that followed saw a massive outpouring of sympathy and a ,lobal dialogue on forgiveness faith, race and guns. since the early days after charleston much has happened. the confederate flag was removed from the grounds of the south carolina state capital and other public places. continuing struggle has continued to play out in the streets of ferguson missouri. incidents ofen new gun violence and lafayette,

louisiana and chattanooga, tennessee and the reports of gun violence continued daily in washington dc, chicago and other cities and towns across america. the reverend dr. martin luther king who once spoke in this very room at about where i am -- in a 1967 essay, where do we go from here? chaos or community? perhaps our guest today can try to answer that question. please give a warm welcome to the presiding pre-late and senior bishop of the african methodist episcopal church, john richard bryant. [applause]

>> let me acknowledge the presence of my wife, my partner and marriage and ministry for 46 years. [applause] patriarch to have the of our family here, mr. charles robinson who will turn 90 later this month. happy to have my sister here. god bless you. [laughter] -- [applause] my son, harrison ryan. kons.y godson, michael wil

i have a host of sons and daughters in the ministry here so they may have five would not get an amen in this crowd. [laughter] they came to give me some backup. share in the next 20 what all of us experienced june 17, wednesday june 17, wednesday night in the ground floor of mother emmanuel african methodist episcopal church. the young stranger comes in that he is treated like a fellow program. he sits amongst the people who

are studying the word of god and praying. a half hour later, gets up and with a loaded gun, he begins tempted that gun -- to empty that gun to human flesh. floors, walls, ceilings. then reloads, empties it, then reloads, and empties it. until nine people, none of whom whose name he probably knows, dead in the pull of their own blood -- in a pool of their own blood.

what a horrible night, what a horrible experience, but after it, believe it or not, some good stuff happened. it is almost like easter that comes after good friday. some good stuff. amir of the southern city comes and spins -- spends the night amongst the people. when i arrived the next day, this is how he was described to me by a layperson, he loves us. that is the mayor, he loves us. while reporters, tv anchors were searching for motives, he said clearly, this is a hate crime. some good stuff happened. the governor showed up and both the governor and the mayor

participated in what we as a church call the ministry of presence. when it is not so much what you say, it is what your presence

communicates. so the governor of this southern state comes and she stays and says, we will bring the perpetrators to justice. some good stuff. the nation was able to get a closer view of a real church and a description of a real pastor. they were murdered while studying the word of god. pastored by a man who loved jesus, loved his family, loved

his flock, loved his community. he was on the floor because he was a state representative and an important vote was coming up. his seatmate said, you are going to stay with this boat -- this

vote? he said, no, i'm going to a prayer meeting. i have been elected here but i have been selected there and i have made it there that my first priority is the church, so he rushed to death. mother emmanuel demonstrated the christian gospel better then any theologian in any seminary. love those who despitefully use you, and in the face of what real christianity looks like, it got the attention of the nation and so much of the world. some good stuff happened.

mother emmanuel had security cameras, and on the security camera, a captured the image of this young man. law enforcement was there and they announced they would use everything at their disposal to bring the perpetrator to justice and in quick order, he was arrested. some good stuff happened. i have received communication from around the world and from around the country. a mosque in oakland sent

$10,000. i lifelong soulmates -- are lifelong soulmates, the quicker church, who first befriended us when we started over 200 years ago sent word to me that we want to do something. we have a retreat center if there are those in the community who just need to get away or need to have someone to help them process, please, contact us. we would like to welcome those persons to the retreat center for your charge. the letters, the calls, and the various nominations -- denominations from other nations all wishing to share our grief.

some good things happened. in the city of charleston, s.c., services held in the heart of the black community. white folks showed up and acted as if they were not afraid. went to a restaurant and while eating, the patrons kept coming to the table to share the condolences. the owner said don't try to pay for this meal. we just feel so bad as the city that this has happened. they acted as it to them, black lives matter. -- they acted as if to them black lives matter. the governor of the southern state said it is time for the flag to come down. when pastor pinckney was

elected, such a young man elected, france said to him, you will finally be able to bring that flag off of that tax paid land. and he said it will not happen in my lifetime.

and he was right, but it happened. that is some good stuff, isn't it? but what is the bad stuff? the bad stuff, for me, is the guns. the love affair this nation has with the guns.