illegal narcotics, stolen weapons, fenced property. and what also goes along with this is the organized nature in which gangs operate and they operate like gangs operated in the 1930's. they are people specifically enumerated within these groups as shooters of the there are people that carry out the intimidation of witnesses, the effort to take the lives of those that maybe invading on turf. there is an organized element to the violence that's occurring in many american cities. now here's what's true. what's true is that there are only a handful of police departments in the country with the sophisticated tools, resources, and mechanisms to infiltrate some of these illegal groups of really

domestic terrorists. p because they're preying on citizens in our communities. so you all have to think about how we can build a stronger partnership with a.t.f., d.e.a., all that. and the other thing you have to recognize is that 70%, 80% of all shootings in most cities are never reported. they are never reported. so you've got to look at new mechanisms to report those shootings. the final thing i want to say on police-community issues, i established when i was mayor a protocol, whafere police officer was involved in a shooting. and it involved a -- an automatic and immediate investigation by the office of municipal investigations. it involved a press protocol where there would be no opinionating by any, with all due respect, police public

information officers, anyone who worked for me, about what, quote, their sense of the incident was. because i learned very easterly that -- very early that communities are inflamed when there is a rush to judgment and that all too of when you find with these cents you don't know instantaneously all of the facts. and your job is to ensure that there is a levelness and fairness. now, that's not easy because sometimes usm police organizations and unions that want to get out there and offer an opinion about something. but here's the point. you need, if the police department is under your jurisdiction and control, you need a protocol. how will we respond in the hent -- event of one of our officers being involved in shooting a citizen or shooting at a citizen? what is our protocol?

and you've got to have a protocol. and you can be a bit transparent with members of the city council, police unions and others about what this is. i just wanted to get that in because you also have to think about the very escalating public relations dynamics that occur because of the body cams and dash cams and things of this sort that didn't exist 20 or even 10 years ago. >> mayor emanuel? >> i want to take up a little we have mayor said the gangs in all our stifments the truth is there are a few individuals in those gangs that are creating a disproportionate amount of violence. we have 22 police districts. in the sixth district, south side of the city of chicago, we

have embedded d.e.a., f.b.i., the u.s. attorney and they're not allowed after the end of the day, they don't know -- don't go to their own office. they are housed in the sict -- sixth be district and they have their own office. they're targeting the individuals with the highest ind of heat number in terms of causing violence so it's focused on the individuals with the greatest propensity and we're using all the resources in a coordinated way. we're trying that out. the serksd i don't know about other places but there are a few guns where the disproportionate gun violence on our streets we've traced to happen. in the past chicago we've considered pretty top of the line and modern gun legislation burr -- but we're not an island and there's three gun shops right over the city's border that play a big role in the

guns on our city streets. we would like to see the city of chicago become a statewide model so you can torg the tars -- stores where the disproportionate amount of the guns come from and the individuals. in one way the federal government can be helpful, they have entities, in a very coordinated, localides way of going after the few individuals that are creating a disproportionate amount of the violence and targeting them with state, federal and local resources in a concentrated way. >> i certainly agree the embeding of federal officers is helpful the we've done that in baltimore and we have that collaboration between all levels of the government and the prosecutors and it's been very help envelope trabbing down -- we had one seller of illegal guns that was coming in every weekend from i think it

was -- outside of the state, somewhere in tennessee i think -- every weekend at least 20 guns. every weekend without fail and we were able to through that partnership to track that down. and this is one of the issues that we brought up in our meeting with the attorney general that this is not about cutting us a check. this is about using the federal resources and our federal partnerships in ways that affect -- he feblingt real change in our community. >> that's the number one challenge that law enforcement is one challenge law enforcement is having around resources. the drug cartels we're seeing now are organizations, they'll deliver heroin to st. louis, methamphetamine to new orleans, that's where we need the resources to focus to disrupt

the cycle. heroin is ep democrat nick all our cities, you can still get crack, you can still get marijuana where it's not legal. >> i want to add something, this is a reflection. i remember sitting here about 16, 17 years ago when the issue of gun violence was gripping and ripping american cities. and like so many of you, we had a us from tration about the inability to really move any meaningful, you will, gun safety legislation through the congress. now this was just after the brady bill had been passed. it was actually in place then. the anti-assault weapon ban. of course, we were so, if you will, frustrated by what we were facing that 30 of us actually filed class action lawsuits against the gun industry. some of you all may remember that. now we were not that successful.

and we learned about the power of the organized interests that support guns in this country. but i'm proud that we had, you will, the courage and the guts, 0 of us, to stand up and say something certainly needed to be done. if all we can do now is talk about a strong, airtight background check system for all purchases of guns in this country and number two, a ban on assault weapons. james madison, alexander hamilton, thomas jefferson, and those fellows that wrote the bill of rights and the second amendment, i do not think they were thinking about an ak-47 or a glock. i don't think that's what they were -- what they had in mind.

the duck hunters and deer hunters and all the sportsmen of the world, i don't think they use those type of weapons either to do in fact what they do. we've got to confront and not be frustrated that there's strong interest in this country. we've got to define the issue, that it's about safety, it's about military-style assault weapons. it's about a strong, airtight background check system. and i really urge, i urge the mayors to lend their voice to that. because this police community -- police-community relations, drugs, it all goes hand in hand. it's a vicious circle and a psych until our communities and you can't have a voice on one without having a voice on the other and mayors can integrate and bring all these issues together. >> thank you. [applause] >> i'm going to spring until one of the questions from one of the mayors. from mayor yady and i don't know

what part of new jersey you're from. that and writing is -- what part of new jersey? central. got it. ok. i just couldn't read it. >> we're not going to answer until you tell us what exit you are on the highway. [laughter] >> on the turnpike. >> new york media market, right? >> so the question, where in the conversation regarding police -community relations is a specific topic regarding personal responsibility? >> i'll take it. in every discussion i have with faith-based community, the not for profit community, whether it's in the african-american community or the others, everybody always starts with personal responsibility.

there's discussion that takes place, and this is a misnomer as if people don't talk about this and engage in this discussion, every mayor that i've been in meetings with says, essentially everybody is responsible for themselves. you have to -- there's only so much the government can do, even on our best day, when we're performing perfectly, you can't replace a father or mother. you can't ever really replace a church or a coach. essentially the community has got to make sure that they're all in or none of this can be done. but, that doesn't -- so this is the or, is it personal responsibility or something else, it's everything. rahm alluded to this, in terms of getting after the small number of people creating most of the crimes in certain neighborhoods which is essentially what you have, it's a three-prong strategy. i'm looking at my friend michael, together we started cities united. the multiagency gang strategy, rahm just identified it for you.

in one neighborhood in his city, in a police precinct, it isn't just the local police officers. they're the ones leading it but you've got a.t.f., d.e.a., guess what they're doing? they're targeting individuals that they know through intelligence that are part of gangs and they've gone after them in something called the group violence reduction strategy where they have the eyes and ears on the best intelligence that we can find and we need more resources to do it. once they identify who those folks are, they actually need to get either the u.s. attorney or the district attorney to identify which one of them has the best chance at prosecuting the most of them all at once. now it used to be in the old days that if one person shot and killed somebody, you'd arrest them and indict them and convict them for one murder. that's not the strategy anymore. this is starting to happen. this works. where the u.s. attorney and district attorney are starting to arrest these guys with conspiracy theories like they use with the rico statutes and in new orleans, we've indicted

and convicted over 119 gang members in two years and reduced the level of violence in those neighborhoods fairly significantly. now, there's still way too much of it. but this is a tried and true practice that in my opinion once it's been done needs to have the resources of the community. at the end of the day, the part of the group violence reduction strategy is calling the young men in who you know into court and saying to them, we know who you are. we know who you hang out with. we know what you do. we're going to give you a choice today. we want you to be ok and if you choose well, we'll put you in front, give you mental health services, substance abuse treatment, but if you don't choose well and exercise your responsibility the way you're supposed to, we'll have to do what's necessary in a constitutional, thoughtful way to protect you from each other and to protect everybody else from you. that strategy is working but you need the resources. you need the boots on the ground. this is the only discussion we're having where people will leave, you know, folks that need to fight the fight on the ground without the resources to make it

happen. we don't do that in national security. we don't leave folks on the field. we give them the resources they need. this is a national problem. in some neighborhoods it's an epidemic. and we need to treat it like that in the united states of america. we're not doing that. >> i do want to take on two points. there's a place where we collectively in the public's eye can reenforce personal responsibility. and our public transportation system we now have the largest reentry, second chance program in the united states. i believe the best way to make sure that an ex-quict is not -- ex-offender is not a reoffender is a job. i can provide the opportunity but you have to make a choice. if you don't make that choice, then there's nothing else i can do. but we have to, what i can do and what i as mayor or all of nuss public life, we have to provide that opportunity. in the same way with after school summer jobs. there has to be that alternative but you have to make a personal

choice to have a different life and lead a different life. and sometimes we don't tie, i'll give you one example. we were now as i said, 26,000 summer jobs. four years ago we were at 14,000. we now make the kids sign a pledge to go on to college. they participate in the summer job program, you've got to show some initiative that you're not going to just have a summer job but do something else with your life. it's a subtle thing. small. not going to be a game changer but it reinforces that personal choices, decisions you make have an imfact on -- an impact on your life. we have a role to play to help reinforce the positive choices you make. we have a role to play to make sure there are consequences to the wrong choices. but then to also always reinforce that you don't get a pass when it comes to the decisions you make. in the same way, i know all of us in one way or another touched on this, parents don't get a pass on being parents. you have a role to play in

making sure your children know right from wrodge, good from bad. we can co-everything we need to do on the public side to support parenting, but not to supplant it. and that's important that we reinsert that value system. [applause] >> these are all important questions but mayors, here's how you can operationalize that. visit one school every week. methodically and in a determined way. and go talk to kids. go talk to them about responsibilities, hopes, aspirations, and dreams. the power of your image, going into a classroom and i like to visit schools and go to a classroom, not just a large auditorium, to talk to kids on a methodical basis, to talk to them about obligations, responsibilities, these young people today, particularly when they become 10, 11, 12, are paying much closer attention to

issues that go on in the community and also it's a great way to find out what's going on and put your ear to the ground to get a sense of what's happening. it's one thing to say, let's talk about personal responsibility. it's another thing for all of us to use the pulpit, to use the platform, to use your voice, to use your collective will to talk to young people on an everyday, all the time basis. so i'm going to issue that as a challenge to all of you. many of you do it. and many of you visit schools. if you could do it one per week, spend one hour each week at a school in your community, you'll have an impact on how these young people think and what they do and how they live. >> personal accountability. really quickly, it's a two-sided equation. let's talk about the law enforcement accountability into that equation. we have to have policing agencies that look like the communities we serve. it can't be a long-term promise.

we have to take immediate steps toward that. and that's what i push to the officers. your experiences will be different than your experiences. as we recruit people, i want to -- i want a diverse police agency that has young people, young african-americans teaching older whites, older african-americans teaching younger whites what the community is about. we heard from david kennedy that communities who have stronger relationships see crime reductions. if we can start to have the accountability side on the law enforcement, what can we do? we have to look like the communities we serve and be committed to it. it's a small number of people that commit the crimes, focus on the people who commit the crimes, not the race. >> the biggest thing we're trying to do in chicago and i always reinforce this, we can either patrol a community or be part of a community. and if we're patrolling it, you're going to have a limited impact. if you're part of a community you'll build trust and cooperation that's essential for safety and legitimacy of the police department.

>> so this brings us, we're -- we could be here all day talking about this and i'm sure some of us could talk all day. ut i do want to exercise the prerogative as the moderator to give us think last question. we'll start with you, chief. a lot of what this boils down to is trust. we know the issues that we face across our cities, we know that there's no switch we cab flip to end racism. there's no button we can push to end income inequality. but there has to be things that we can do to improve trust. as a chief, what would you tell mayors to do to help build trust between the community and the men and women that you lead? >> i think we first started, and they're doing this in st. louis

a public commitment to diversify the police department. st. louis is 56% african-american, we're at 36% in the police department. that shows a commitment to understanding the problem. we take all our officers through implicit biases to understand those differences and that differences aren't bad. mayors need to invest in their police departments, make a long-term commitment to diversity and give them the tools and training because every encounter and we have over 300,000 911 calls we respond to every year. every one of those has the potential tore a michael brown or an eric gardner. we have to make sure we have quality police officers that look like the community and are open and transparent. >> president morial? >> i agree with all that he said because if you walk the streets communities, they wail say, and mayor landrieu in new orleans, there was a time when

the community, the police department didn't look like the community. that may not be the case today because you've got a predominantly african-american police department. and you can still have issues with a predominantly black police department. right? diversity alone will help but doesn't do the trick. secondly, and this was an issue in new orleans. the sense that most of the police officers live outside of the city. and by virtue of that, their kids didn't go to school they didn't worship they were not part of the fabric of the community. these are barriers to overcome. i fought and enforced a strong domicile ordinance. it isn't the case that one exists today in a city like new orleans. but you have to hear what people are saying. thirdly and importantly, you've got to embrace and understand that the philosophy of the tact

-- the philosophy of, the tactics and strategies of, community policing are not a cliche. it's about commanders having relationships with community leaders, it's about officers understanding that they're not evaluated on simply racking up arrest numbers. that what we are thinking about, what we want to focus on is overall reduction in violence. and that means understanding that the police department is just one part of the system and that there are other parts of the system like prosecutors in courts that are part of it. to build trust, i also think the mayors, again, must use their leadership to indicate that they're going to put their credibility on the line to build that trust between officers, the police department and institution and communities. it isn't an easy challenge. as i said if you don't own the problem, you'll never own the solution. >> thank you.

>> i want to just -- i want to echo that with a bunch of exclamation points. do not be afraid of this. you have to run to it. this notion that somehow the community, in this instance the african-american community, does not want to work with or partner with the police departments is wrong. that is not correct. what they don't want is an oppress i have police department that is making arrests based on race and not behavior. a lot of crime is taking place in neighborhoods where people want to be protected. the police department has to be of the community. you have to earn this. the mayor makes an excellent point in the city of new orleans this epolice department is majority african-american. in the last five years, everybody on that department has had to earn it back. community policing is the way you do it. you don't drive through the neighborhood you stop and talk. somebody needs help, give them help. if someone needs to be arrested, the consequences have to be meeted out but they have to be fair and have to be transparent. when there's a police-involved

shooting in new orleans now, after five years of working through the consent decree, stoons that happens, p.i.b., which is your old m.o.i. shows up on the scene. the independent police monitor shows up. all of a sudden there's a thorough and transparent investigation so the public knows that what's happening is fair. now, the outcome isn't always predetermined. in some instances, right, the police officer did the wrong thing. in that instance that officer gets indite and/or convicted. the police department and unions have to say, under those circumstances, when the officer did the wrong thing, we're not going to stand there and try to justify that behavior. on the other hand when the officer did the right thing, when his life was in danger, when he was protecting other people and the prosecution and investigation work the right way, the community more often than not will back it up. but this only happens when they're part of the process, when they feel like there's a relationship between the two, and there's trust. and the only way to do this is

he hard way. you've got to earn it every day. and you've got to prove it over and over again because it's a trust but verify situation. we are in the circumstances that have occurred in our nation across all of our cities should nonstrait that we do not have this right in america right now. there's upset on the streets. there's miscommunications, there's lack of trust. you've got to get it back. the point is, it's gettable. the public wants to be one with the plt and the police department has to understand how they have to be one with the community as well. we're going to have to work through this painful time. there is success on the other side of this. but you have to focus on it as though not just a law enforcement issue but it's a public health threat too. it's all the other stuff we talked about because you've got to be good on the law enforcement side and the preventive side too. it teals with early childhood education, summer jobs and opportunities for folks. >> i start and have always believed in community policing that every encounter between law

enforcement and a resident is a teachable moment. if they walk away positive, you got something you're going to draw on when you need it which is essential to safety. the trust factor is not just a goal. it's a key ingredient to effective community policing, which is what you need for safety. second, people, the public has to know there's a legitimate oversight. it's certain. it's not biased. and the truth is we're working on that. our city, other cities, because there's a lot of judgment that the oversight has been lax and there's not an accounting system. third, and i think the most mportant thing, is helping folks in where community see beyond the badge. there's a father, mother, coach, parent, there's people that are more complex in their lives, not just a uniform and a badge. in the same way the kids they encounter are not just a kid with tattoos or a hoodie.

they too are siblings, or parents themselves. nd get beyond the stereotypes. i've been facilitating these meetings across the city, i bring the local community police officers, commund leaders, aldermen. the communities most affected by distrust, begging to host them out in the community, not in the precinct. we're to be the to put out a memo, we want to, with some regularity, the roll call you do in the department, out there. in the community system of it's visible because they want to see you. second if you support the police department, go in tell them, you're doing a good job. they too need to here -- to hear periodically. one of the things we're doing, about a third of our department in short order will have body cams. that gives people trust. there's another set of eyes.

this came from a resident a woman about two summers ago. we have officers on bike, mainly in the central business district, etc., but we started a pilot. we opened up a playground and this woman, about 40 feet away, started walking. when somebody -- when a resident has that, ok, what's this. and we were cutting the ribbon on a playground. ok, here we go. she said, i've got something to say oto you. i said, ok. she said, i want to say thunk. i said oh. you don't get that often. i said what's that? ever since you put police officers on bikes they're stopping more frequently at the playground at the park, now i let my older son walk my will younger son to the playground at the park. so we're up to 400 police officers patrolling on bikes. they'll stop at the front stoop, at the playground. they'll be at the street corner when kids are leaving school.

that pays dividends. we're expecting to -- we're thinking of expanding it further. all those pieces of accountability, discipline, all these things reinforcing, driving toward a trust factor that gives the cooperation for community policing and the essential legitimacy and effectiveness of community policing. >> i cannot thank you enough. one of the things i tried to focus on as president is tackling the tough issues head on. i think you've done that today. i know i'm grateful for this conversation and i hope all of you who are here are as well. please give our panelists a round of applause. [applause]

[captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national able satellite corp. 2016]

>> testifying at a senate hearing on president obama's executive actions on guns, attorney general told the committee the president's orders are constitutional and legal. this is two-and-a-half hours. this hearing will come to order. attorney general we thank you for joining us today to discuss the president's recent actions. as chairman of the subcommittee i believe it is my duty to the american people to properly the department of justice and ensure that any funding provided by this

is used as congress boundsd and within the of the constitution. it is clear to me that the american people are fearful that eager to obama is strip them of their second amendment rights. be clear the second amendment is not a suggestion. rightan individual protected in the bill of rights that has been recognized by the supreme court. with that in mind, this morning i'm very concerned with the thent executive actions by president for two main reasons: 1) president obama is far too willing to run congress through executive action. the president has said he believes that when congress doesn't act the way he wants us to then he must act alone. our constitution won't allow for unilateral action and the american people will not for it. where through executive amnesty with thousands of illegal immigrants or increased gun

measures, the president has unwisely, i believe, acted alone. however what the president fails to remember is that we have a balances.checks and a system that was created to ensure that power was not concentrated in a single branch of the federal government. haspresident, i believe, ignored the founder's system and the use to alarming new levels. executivenone of the actions that president obama has proposed would have prevented the recent tragic events in our nation. whether it is a terrorist attack single gun crime, i firmly believe that those responsible should be held accountable. and that we must work to prevent it from having again. we have seen time and again, this president used tragic push his political agenda. i believe that he's more interested in grand standing and

engaging in anti-gun theatrics than actually doing the work protect this country. in the wake of the terrorist bernardino,anta president obama did not address our law enforcement's failures terroristsed those to live among us. he also did not look at making immigrationhe system after it clearly failed us by allowing an individual who known to be aen violent extremist to enter our country. the president's immediate response was to additional gun control measures. criminals and terrorists -- let's be clear -- criminals and terrorists are not buying their guns from gun shows, gun stores, or collectors. by definition do not follow the law. madame attorney general, we live world, as you know. the american people are looking for us to do everything in our keep them safe. the next time a terrorist attack nation, innocent

law-abiding americans must have the ability, i believe, to protect themselves and their ones from harm if they so choose. it is our responsibility, i to preserve a right and not limit them. i think most of us know that this president has made no secret of his desire to restrict rights to amendment law-abiding american citizens. deserve, andpeople i believe they expect more, from their president. they also expect more from their congress. i intend to live up to their expectations. general, theey department is on notice. the subcommittee will no v no part in undermining the constitution and the rights it protects. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. open a session. ins and their accessibility

our society. this hearing does tackle the role of the pressing issue of guns and gun violence. 2americans are shot every day. many of them will die. almost a third. we need to change our nation's culture of violence. to stop guns getting in to the wrong hands of with mentald those onness without infringing the rights of law-abiding firearms.o purchase do know we support the measure on guns. it is within the constitutional to act.y many of the activities like fbi and atv has struggled by the committee. think last year really showed our commitment to enforcing the the staff to and do it. the look forward to hearing

lynch,y general, loretta and her testimony today and the will have from the and will itders help the american people within boundaries weonal do respect the constitution. also the justice department and the ability to deal with this. we all listen to the testimony of outside witnesses in the panel. these are excellent people who seasoned, well experienced, and also a father who will talk about the things point.ppened at sandy aboutno one wants to hear gun violence. gifford or are gabby your children go to elementary school in a suburban community

called sandy hook, whether you are just simply going to movies or a community college, or charleston church of the an iconic civil right the lord's study words and welcome in a stranger to end at such a terrible tragedy. mr. president says we have to do something. we'll go forward to this. we look forward to what the president's proposals will be in the budgetary recommendations that he puts we are all appropriators. we look forward to the president's recommendation. particularly interested in the criminal background checks, technology glitches, people who go by the law who are frustrated. fbi'se to enhance the

capacity to run background checks while asking them to do a checks.ther background are there new ways to do this and to train local law enforcement? this is not only a justice department problem. hearing where they are holding the hearing on mental illness. are rippingle who through gun violence and volatile with mental illness and access to guns are dangerous. i look forward not to me talk but listening to the attorney general and listening to the wonderful panel of which you've invited to participate today. let's solve the problem. involved in constitutional rights. let's help our american people be safe and secure in their neighbors, and house of worship. >> ma some attorney general,

welcome again. that youten system made prior to the hearing recommend. would oppress? thank you. good morning to the distinguished members of the subcommittee. i greatly appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today to discuss the steps the department of justice is taking to reduce gun violence and to ensure smart and effective enforcement of our nation's gun laws. now, of course, the subcommittee guns our nation faces violence that's taken a def devastating toll around the country. each year millions are americans are killed. armed robbery, domestic suicide, and acts of violence. law enforcement officers shot down for defending their communities to children killed in tragic accidents, our friends

family members are being taken from us day after day after day. of tragedies involving firearms was going to force the american people to leave, we must do more to stem the tie of gun violence. is committedration to doing our part. the executive actions that the weeksent announced two ago, including the measures that i recommended to him, are essential components. they are important steps within the executive power to clarify existing provisions and focus enforcement efforts and to spur innovation. thate complete confidence the common sense steps are now why the president is lawful. with theconsistent constitution as interpreted by the supreme court and the laws by congress. for example, the gun control act lists the people who would not allowed to have firearms, such as felons, domestic abusers, and others. congress has also required that background checks be conducted

of sales made by federally licensed firearm dealers to make sure that guns stay out of the wrong hands. they've announced by the which focus on background checks are fully consistent with the laws passed congress. taken together, the new actions willses bring progress by clarifying means to be engaged in the business. we raise the awareness of and with lawsmpliance already on the books. by making sure that licensed report weapons lost or stolen in transit, and those acquire some of the most dangerous weapons undergo checks.ground by enhancing the national system of background checks, we will be keep guns outd to of the fronting hands in the first place, by increasing access to mental health care

with a proposed $500 theion investment to department of health and human department of health and human services, also referred to as hhs. we will not only be helping in need, we will be the majorityeaths, of which result from suicide. by supporting research on gun safety technology, we will be laying the ground work for a safer future and drawing on our as the most technologically advanced nation on earth. and thes are outlined actions that president obama has described are all well reasoned within existing legal authority and done work that is already underway. they clarify law that is are already in the books. because clear notice will help laws are followed. they direct important resources agents.aw enforcement because these men and women deserve to have the support they jobsto do their difficult effectively. they law the ground work for

mores and governments to easily provide information to the background checks system and for helping people with mental illness gain access to care. because in addition to helping the truth they need, they must make sure we keep guns out of the hands of those who prohibited by law from having them. in researchl invest and promising technology that will make weapons safer because solving through innovation has always been one country's greatest strengths. mr. chairman, i'm confident that make actions will help to our people safer, our more secure, and our law enforcement more effective. i have no illusions that these measures by themselves will end gun violence in america. at a time when there's so much so muchbe done and capacity for progress, there many areas where only congress can act. we would welcome the opportunity to work with you to further these goals.

i am so grateful to have this opportunity to speak with you today about how we can work together to reduce gun violence in this country. i look forward to continuing daysconversation in the ahead as we discuss how to keep our promise to protect and defend every american's right to safety and security and to life and liberty. at this time, i look forward to answering any questions that you may have. thank you. >> thank you. madame attorney general, as i earlier, the constitution is not a suggestion. you agree with that, would you not? that the constitution of the united states is not a suggestion? the law of thes land and the law that we're all to uphold. conveyed are it not recommendations? >> i agree with you on that as well as your previous proposition. and the constitution obviously the -- the second

amendment is part of the constitution. rights; right? >> it is an important part of the first set of elements, the bill of rights. >> do you believe the rights granted by the second amendment equally important as those granted by the first, fourth, amendment and so forth? all an intiy it is gal part? >> i believe they are an thegral part as well as laws to interpret them. >> madame attorney general, you said you worked closely with the president to craft the executive actions to go as far as the president can go without overstepping. may disagree about whether or not the president has overstepped, i'm sure we would, i'm concerned that the president is slowly, slowly -- slowly chipping away at our second amendment rights. us, madamerantee

attorney general, that there's legal authority for the president to take the actions he taken and can you provide us the specific laws and the court -- cases that the position? >> with respect to the positions that i made to the president, i believe they are consistent with the constitution and existing case law that interprets the constitution, specifically the heller case hand down by the theeme court that defined clarifiedndment and arms as wellbear as the guidance as well and i'm sure they are consistent with the land and within the president's authority. enforcing the existing laws and strengthen the congress hast taken the oath to keep the american people safe such as the background system.

protections enhance for those who have mental illness providing greater for them. i know the subcommittee supports. each time there's a mass shooting, the issue of expanded theground checks ring in as public debate. i think we must look at the facts. of those are that most actions are carried out by individuals that would not have by obtaining a firearm. the sandy hook crimes were a young man who shot his mother and stole their guns. now, madame attorney general, would a background check have tragedy? that horrible the virginia tech shooter passed a background check to get his guns. much like those that committed similar crimes at fort hood, chattanooga, and the list would go on and on. terroristsly, the responsible for the attacks in theirrnardino obtained

guns through a straw purchase which means a background check would not have helped them either. coming back to the issue. madame attorney general, would these examplesh and tell us having -- tell us federal firearms licensees where they are altered the outcomes of those events. >> as i indicated, i don't look back're able to and find a specific measure to prevent a specific crime. mean we must not seek to prevent future tragedies. with respect to strengthening background system, sadly the system is overwhelmed at this point in time. we saw with the tragic shooting in charleston individual's information was submitted. through a series of glitches, the information needed was not discovered in time to prevent that. the license firearm dealers who

submit the information deserve the best and most efficient systems we can provide them. the individuals who submit their wait for thend that response also deserve the most efficient system that we we can provide them. certainly the measures that we are discussing today, for example increasing the number of examiners for the next system directly related to the appropriations seek with the end. with respect to other tragedies again, because as i look through criminal laws which give us a way to protect people and rights of those who have been the victims of a way to haven't found erase the human condition that leads to crime. we're committed to doing everything that we can look forward to making sure our gun enforced and our american people are kept as safe as possible. >> madame attorney general, as on some of these tragedies and their real tragedies, which of these

individuals bought their gun from a gun show and which of criminals purchased their gun illegally online. you? i don't believe they did. >> i'm not able to give you that information now. what i can indicate is with respect to the clarifications on is required to seek a license as a firearms dealer to inquiriessponse on athe fbi receives regular basis as they operation within gun shows to provide guidance.n and they also receive telephonic inquiries for people seeking to want toith the law who know the standards and whether or not they need to apply far license. >> the area of standards for gun dealers. times" article states the president's plan on gun control would require

officials from the federal to begin investigation contacting gun sellers to let tom know of new standards clarify who would be considered a regulated dealer. goes on to suggest that the changes are onlinelarly meant for gun merchants to avoid conducting background checks of making quote high volume gun control through sites. web the law requires that anyone selling guns for profits, which high volumeuld be gun sales, to have a federal firearms license. you are quoting in the article as saying the article in "new now your wordsht it is really an internet loophole. a loophole in the law or failure of enforcement? >> i typically do not comment on articles. i would prefer to provide you my

particulare to that issue. with respect to internet sales, they are increasing. an increasewe see in sales at the typical commercial level in which the fact,e consumer may, in appropriately buy a number of commodities, including firearms, saleso see firearm growing on what is called the dark net. that's the particular part of not accessible to the average consumer of where elicit transactions are primarily held. transactions where an average citizens are seeking lawfullye a firearm and through the traditional process. these are sales where criminals require firearms to harm our american citizens. this is not a loophole. area of enforcement atf has been focused on. with respect to the individuals shows, flea at gun markets, and the like, there will be an educational

component. the information to be provided to them. they will be allowed to ask questions. will increases lessen compliance and confusion. the individuals that operate on the dark net, it will also put them on a notice. that enforcement actions need to be taken, there will be no discussions they simply were not particulare provision. >> adam attorney general, i believe what we really should be talks not just here today is how guns out of the hands of criminals and violence offenders. an uphill battle, i believe, if the president continues to focus on eroding amendment rights while firearms.ces for the we will debate the mandatory

sentences. ofse individuals conflicted illegally possessing a firearm is disturbing. know, madame attorney needal, why he feels they shorter sentences. i know this: this sends a you commit a crime with the gun the administration will not be hard on you. perhaps go easy on you. that's the wrong message. the president's actions sending message to americans. one day he issues new executive actions to change gun regulations. then he pardons criminals in gun-related convictions the next day. how can the president and you the attorney general representing this administration, say he's committed to using every tool at the administration's disposal to when his ownolence administer is not following through with the sentences of

gun-relatedth convictions? does that trouble you? >> well, mr. chairman, i don't cases to whichic -- >> we'll give you a list of them. can tell you is with respect to pardons, individuals who applied for those who carefully reviewed and carefully vetted. only after consideration of a factors, in particular again there's been recent about connotations of known violent drug offenders and whether or not they have convictions, i would need to know the specific case. president's to the project, for example, it is a individualsking at who today would not necessarily have received the lengthy sentences they receive and who also otherwise qualify as non-violent with a particular type of record. i'm happy to provide information that it is helpful on specific cases if you could

me to them. i think with respect to want issues that we're discussing however again providing clarification of existing case law, gathering the case law so that individualing seeking to comply with the law have in one easy-to-read, comprehensive preference to what law says qualifies as engaged in a business of firearms so they know what they have to apply for a license or questions can be more informed helping the american people in clarifying the important issue. the issue of who needs to report a firearm when stolen in transit allows atf to begin stolen firearms much more quickly than to know.le we uncover the average of 1,300 guns a year from crime scenes that turn out to be lost or stolen. we don't know that information

until they are recovered in the course of a criminal investigation. learning that information will help us to start the investigation earlier and shipmentsfind those before they fall in to the hands of criminals, which is, of usrse, the goal of all of here. >> madame attorney general, i won't go through the record here but i've beginning, been handed by staff here a people who were convicted of possession of firearms during a -- committing a criminal act or using a actarm during the criminal and have been let out of prison and back with the people. danger. intelligence.your ?enator >> thank you.

we thank the justice department of their help doing their recent challenges in related to the uprising we had after the death of freddie gray for which is now through the judicial system and we're examining the for justice reform within our police department. over 350 baltimorians were year. last 350 dead. were little children who were killed as innocent bystanders where there's a question about the killings. this is criminal work. of drugs,g amount guns, violence, murder. my question to you, when i look what can they do

plain english to keep the guns out of the hands of the criminals? talking about second amendment rights and numbers of enormous gun traditions. baltimoreadition in city shouldn't be that the drug dealer is the one who how could we, can we, with either the president proposals have an aggressive effort on this issue of guns and criminals? >> one of the most important things we can do is make sure andbureau of tobacco firearms is fully resourced.

we do intend to send information. the law enforcement priorities are to focus on the violent crime issue you just described to read individuals who terrorize neighborhoods. essentially, through the unlawful possession of firearms, presen a danger to law abiding citizens. we are targeting not just the gun traffickers, but as my atf director calls it, the trigger pullers. places where we have seen an increase in violent crime. we are looking at ways to target our resources to focus on those individuals who are causing the most harm to our communities. sen. mikulski: do you feel this rising gun violence -- not to interrupt -- is related to the growing heroin epidemic?

what is happening in my city, which is just awful with these over 350 dead, not only the injured, but this is in every major city that this is going on . it's not just a baltimore bubble. this seems to me like an epidemic that has hit our big urban areas. ms. lynch: indeed. i believe the phrase epidemic accurately captures the problem in heroin and opioid abuse we are currently seeing. this is a problem in many of our urban areas but it has sadly spread across this country. there are many counties with various densities, even rural areas that are in the grip of an opioid and heroin epidemics.

they are forced on pairing atf agents with dea agents to target criminal organizations bringing narcotics in and are protecting the drug trade with their firearms. sen. mikulski: thank you very much, madam attorney general. my time is up. i was just put on a panel for mental illness and it was an excellent panel with excellent witnesses and i know we are going to talk about this issue of mental illness. people who are mentally ill getting drugs. this whole issue of privacy rights, the virginia tech situation comes to mind and we could go through other cases, but in virginia tech, that young

man had been in and out of institutions. when can we help? when can we intervene? we also had a shooting at a columbia mall. we all have shootings, that is what is so terrible. we all have shootings. i look forward to hearing your comments on the mental illness aspect. i know we have excellent other senators here and i want to get to their questions and hear your answers. sen. shelby: senator lankford. senator langford: let me bounce a couple of questions off of you as well. previously there was a committee where we went to the subpoena process to ask your predecessor for the documents on the fast and furious documents on guns. those were delayed and privilege was announced. the court told the attorney

general's office that that had to be turned over. will those documents he released to the oversight and government reform committee as part of the judge's order? ms. lynch: we did receive that yesterday and we are still reviewing the ruling. we want to determine what appropriate steps to take and the timeliness of them, but i can assure you we will be responding to the committee or court at the appropriate time. senator langford: so you are not saying whether those documents will be turned over in time? ms. lynch: we have not made that decision. if we had, i would let you know, but since we have not, i cannot give you the decision at this time. we will let you know within the time you have mentioned. senator langford: one of the conversations i had was on process issues with the atf and fbi.

those can be combined to make sure we have clear processes across doj. do you know any process that has been made with how they do investigations? ms. lynch: we need to know the context of the processes you were referring to. if you would provide that -- senator langford: there is a process moving on that. let me ask about some of the guidances you mentioned several times with the federal firearms licenses. the guidance that has come out seems to be as before, if you are in the business of dealing firearms, then yes, you have to be licensed. that is nothing new. we are trying to get what is the new definition? it seemed to change during the clinton administration, to say

people who are kitchen table dealers selling to their neighbors or selling a firearm out of their own collection, they are not a licensed dealer. we are trying to get a clarification on who is a licensed dealer. will it be a regulatory change or guidance document? ms. lynch: the guidance document that has been promulgated answers the question you have raised. it collects information from all the cases on this issue and provides a series of clear examples a definition for when someone is engaged in a business and when they are not. the definition has not changed because the statute has not changed. we are simply gathering the case law, the legal definitions, promulgated by court in situations where people have been found to take place in the business and with the hobbyist and collector.

those are also part of the law. hobbyists and collectors are not required to obtain a license to transfer firearms. this information has been scattered in a number of cases throughout the country. atf still anticipates receiving inquiries seeking to comply with the law, asking if -- senator langford: is it how many firearms you sell it over a lifetime or the number in your collection? is it based on the income you receive? ms. lynch: the courts have determined a number of factors whether one engages in the business. it has specifically said there is not a specific number that makes one meet the test. it is a totality of circumstances. if one is repetitively selling firearms, if you do intend to make a profit, all of these things go into that calculation.

the statute does not contain the order. senator langford: i will walk back through some of the details. one final question i find very important -- they gathering of information going into the background checks -- the interstate identification index, is that used for the background information as well or only what is going into national terminal -- criminal background checks? are both of them used? ms. lynch: i would have to get clarification. this focuses on strengthening the system. senator langford: this has been an issue. i don't find anyone here who says we shouldn't do background checks and the database

shouldn't be effective. but if i can have the pleasure of the chairman for a moment, let me run through a couple of our states in the states that submit information into the system, federally, if there is a federal conviction for a felony, that's going into the system right away. if it is a state felony, alabama has zero felonies. california has 4032. delaware has zero. maryland has 12. my fine state of oklahoma has one, very law-abiding state. rhode island has zero and wisconsin has 106. that's not very many coming from our state into the system. the question i have is what is happening between the states that they are not submitting the

information into the federal system or is the federal system so complicated that states of all stripes are not submitting that information? ms. lynch: i think you have raise a very important issue. after the virginia tech tragedy, the government did reach out to the states and requesting greater influx of information into the system. federal agencies are required to report information into the system. states do it on a voluntary basis. in the years since the virginia tech shooting, the amount of information coming from all of our states has increased by 70%. i would not be able to break that out for you. what i did is sent a letter to the governors of every state asking them to essentially look at their systems and processes and make sure they were in fact

setting up the most efficient systems to provide information to us. the department of justice does provide support for states to receive assistance in categorizing the types of offenses that need to provided and possibly making their own systems consistent and we will continue to do that. senator langford: i know i have indulged the chairman's time going long on this, but this is an area of common ground where we could actually work together and i look forward to that. sen. shelby: senator kaine's -- >> thank you for appearing before the appropriations committee. i was encouraged in your testimony earlier that you want to focus on the smart and effective enforcement of our existing gun laws.

the elements of the executive order you have covered are strong attempts to do exactly that. i was proud to hear you as you review the well-settled constitutionality of the actions proposed in the executive order and in the budget. rather than debating that further, i am going to move forward to what you view as the most valuable part of the budget request, something where this committee will be taking action. a portion of the presidents announcement was new fbi and atf personnel. i have seen tragically firsthand in my hometown what a dramatic fight in gun violence can do to disrupt a town and community, to wreak destruction and pain on families and neighborhoods. i am grateful for how the

department of justice has provided additional resources, but i have also seen how access to better quality background checks and an increased federal law enforcement presence can make a significant difference. can you explain why these new atf and fbi agents are really necessary and how they can help reduce gun violence not just in my hometown but in rural areas all over the country? ms. lynch: with respect to our request for increased resources for atf, we have discussed requesting resources that would allow us to hire 200 agents and investigators. some of those would work on the increased paperwork resulting in background checks, but the agents will be focusing on the violent crime problems we find to be so troubling in so many of our cities, towns and neighborhoods.

focusing on the hotspots of particular areas would allow us to increase the amount of enforcement we provide over the internet sales, as i mentioned, but to really focus on the violent crime problems plaguing so many of our cities. the resources we are requesting and would begin using this year would go toward strengthening a law enforcement initiatives that traces guns found at crime scenes as well as casings, essentially all firearms related evidence and shares that information on a nationwide basis from law enforcement entities and allows us to make connections and find connections between firearms, those using the firearms, and we are opening a national center for that in

november. this is a tool our law enforcement agencies depend on greatly. the ability to track firearms is of grave importance. the ability to track stolen firearms can protect our communities. stolen firearms and even those that are lost do not end up in the hands of law-abiding americans. they end up in the hands of criminals and are recovered during criminal investigations. sadly, they are recovered at the rate of 1300 year over the last five years once the crime has already been committed. one of the things these regulations would do is allow us to begin those investigations earlier and hopefully intercept those before they fall into the hands of criminals. sen. coonz: thank you for the good work your team has been doing in cooperation with the

wilmington police department. i've gotten to see firsthand how better access to ballistics tools has improved our homicide case clearing rate from 10% two years ago to 50% this year. that makes a real difference and having access to world-class and timely analysis has significantly improve the investigatory and prosecutorial programs in my town. i am excited about this work and it is my hope we can invest resources to tackle gun violence around our country. it is a shame that americans literally in their going to church to worship, going to see movies, going to college classrooms, going to elementary schools have been victims of gun

violence and we must do more to tackle this problem facing our nation. >> thank you, attorney general, for being here with us today. very appreciative. i want to begin by echoing what we have heard across the board and that is the tragedy we all feel when gun tragedies occur. it hurts us all and our prayers and thoughts are with those most deeply affected. but i do think acknowledging there's a great deal of frustration by the unilateral actions the administration has chosen to take to curb this gun violence. part of the actions seem ambiguous and provide confusion for gun owners and seem a little at more about political messaging. that is not to say we should not take action.

i would like to focus where our common ground is. much of the work we have talked about today is conducted in west virginia. the atf facility is in martinsburg, west virginia. they have each proven their worth helping to track weapons and perpetrators of gun violence when crimes are committed. i've visited these facilities and have seen the professionalism and deep commitment they have to getting it right. you did mention that they are overstressed and overloaded and hopefully, through the appropriations process, we are able to increase the budget to make sure we are able to employ more to make sure they can successfully complete in a timely fashion to background check.

i wanted to get an understanding from you -- i understand in your statement -- i'm sorry you were not here, but you are going to a 24 hour system -- is that your goal? ms. lynch: the goal is to increase the capacity of the current system so that it can be responsive on a 24 hour, 70 a week basis. currently, we are limited by staffing and we are able to operate 17 hours a day and i am not sure if it is seven days a week at this time. we also have an electronic platform that allows dealers to get information quickly and we hope to improve that platform greatly and are working with u.s. digital services and gathering information into how to make that is the more efficient so that can be up 24 hours a day. there are times when it must be

down for maintenance or to get information uploaded to it. that will help with the backlog we are seeing and we anticipate that will continue. sen. capito: have you begun the hiring on that? ms. lynch: we do hope to begin hiring with that using this fiscal year's appropriation and the 2017 request would allow us to maintain that because we need to move as quickly as possible. we will likely begin hiring on a contractor basis first. the goal is to have full-time employees on board. for government employees, there is time required for background checks and like. so it will likely be several months before we have that full component on board. this is a matter of great concern for us because it is becoming increasingly difficult to process the applications

within the three day time frame. sen. capito: let me ask you this -- senator langford ronna been excellent point. your ability to trace and perform an adequate background check is only as good as the information coming in. as we saw in the charleston, south carolina incident, it was unable to be traced to that individual. is that training at the local level? is it the examiner? what happened there? ms. lynch: i think you know that the examiners are dedicated and do their jobs with great commitment. in the charleston case, my understanding is the arrest was located in one particular

jurisdiction but the query was made of another jurisdiction. and because there was not a conviction yet, it prevented it from being the courts system, so the examiner followed all the queries as per normal and the information was literally sitting in an adjoining counties docket and was not pulled in to that. it was heartbreaking to all of us who work on this matter from the fbi and throughout the department of justice. one of the reasons why even then we began looking at the ways to improve the system and the fbi director commissioned a report, being able to modernize the electronic database will be helpful in making sure all the relevant jurisdictions are able able to be queried. if that could happen on an electronic basis, that would ease the situation. it is impossible to say what could have prevented this

glitch, but it is one thing we are looking to do. in terms of the examiners, making sure they have the time to conduct these examinations and provide a response to the dealers who come in. most of the is still done over the phone. most responses are handled quickly. often the dealer will get an answer in the first phone call, but the ones where you do have to search and make sure this individual was not prohibited, those often do take time. still, it is a system of which we are incredibly proud. over 200 people have been prevented from buying a handgun and we think that has been a benefit to the country and public safety. we are incredibly proud of the system but we want to make it the best system we can. sen. capito: i want to make sure

the fine folks doing this work have the best technology, have enough staff to help them. it is a very stressful position for many of them. i hope we can with this additional hiring, eliminate some of these loopholes people are able to fall into and prevent those people who shouldn't from getting a firearm. senator feinstein: madam attorney general, you certainly look well and as if you were not worn out by the job. i have not seen you since your confirmation, so it is very good to see you again. i am glad you stressed that the president's executive order largely clarifies existing laws, which should make enforcement easier. enforcement is what people seem to want of existing law. however, you do have to have people to enforce existing laws. as you have said twice in your

remarks and once in your written remarks, the atf is requesting $35.6 million for an additional 200 special agents and industry operation investigations through atf. my understanding is atf is going to have the retirement of 544 special agents this year that are eligible to retire. i can't say how many are going to retire but it appears to me with atf being an enforcement agency, that you are going to lose people and that is going to have an unfortunate effect. do you have any comment on that? lynch: yes, and thank you for raising that important issue. atf is facing a situation were so many talented agents are soon

able to retire. we hope that they will not but we know we will lose some. it is important to know the request that would bring an additional 200 agents and investigators on board still would not increase the size of the agency. it's not a request for additional fte but the budget to hire existing slots that are vacant now and will soon be vacant. senator feinstein: i speak for a state that is over 40 million people. we want the enforcement of existing law. we want to see the atf is staffed and able to do it. this is the subcommittee that is responsible to see atf is funded sufficiently to enforce every

day laws. i'm going to do everything i can on this committee to see that that amount is raised so you get a sufficient number. i would appreciate all the data that you can provide me with. the second thing are machine guns and other fully automatic weapons as well as weapons like short barreled shotguns. these are regulated under the national firearms act and it has been reported that individuals have been able to avoid regulation by applying to acquire these dangerous guns through trusts or corporations rather than as individuals. the number of applications for such transfers has increased from fewer than 900 applications

in 2000 to more than 90,000 applications in 2015. the trusts are obviously being used not to have register them or not to have a background check or not to have to buy them through a licensed firearm dealer. how has atf managed to keep up with this massive increase despite flat manpower levels? ms. lynch: the reality is it is difficult to keep up with those applications. for national firearms weapons like short barreled shotguns and machine guns, there's an application process similar to a background check which typically requires a law enforcement officer's certification. one of the regulations

promulgated after going through the notice time is requiring individuals seeking to purchase these weapons to undergo a background check whether they are using a trust or any other legal entity or a standalone person. right now, if an individual seeks to purchase a silencer or short barreled weapon, they have to undergo an application process. when they use a trust, they do not. current regulation being promulgated as a final rule closes that loophole and says individuals using a trust or entity stand in the same position as individuals standing alone. it also removes the law enforcement officer certification requirement because that has been obviated by the background check. that was an additional delay. with the information from the

background checks, individuals using a trust, a legal entity or applying as individuals will have the same requirements and undergo the same level of scrutiny before buying a national firearms act weapon. that was one of the rules promulgated in this past week as well. senator feinstein: thank you very much. i'm glad you are on top of this. of the 25 attacks of more than four people killed in the last 10 years, california has six of them. watching machine guns and those things that can be used to attack others is really important and i thank you very much and will do everything i can to be of help in seeing that you get more atf agents. senator bozeman: thank you for being here today. i have a number of concerns with the way the president continually overreaches his authority.

something that really concerns me is the executive actions this upcoming rule proposal by the social security administration to include folks who have into the program. this is not clarifying existing law. this would prohibit them from their second amendment right not based on due process, but only on the fact that they request a family member or friend to assist them with their finances. i am concerned with your department's final ruling with the adjudication of those being a mental defective to more broadly cover folks who seek treatment. i am concerned because these were not changed through congress and you cover that with the upcoming social security rule, what are we going to have? please tell me what your

department's plans are, what is the social security administration planning to do and who will be entered in based solely on social security records? ms. lynch: thank you. the current gun control act is prohibited individuals who have been adjudicated in certain ways regarding mental health of possessing firearms. federal agencies are required to submit information about individuals who fall into those categories -- the social security administration is beginning a process of seeking comment through a rulemaking process in order to clarify who within the social security administration the unification system should fall under that as well. they are currently not providing the information, so the questions you raise are real and salient ones. the social security

administration's process which is just beginning is designed to solicit comment and get input as to which types of adjudication should be provided and which should not. the issue of mental illness is not one that some checks every individual trying to obtain a firearm, so it is important we clarify which types of adjudication and which types of issues would require those records. if the social security administration's beginning that process and we look forward to providing whatever input and guidance they suggest as well. one of the things that will be part of that is our the a -- our va already provides records. one of the things that we part of that process is making sure any individual who finds themselves in that situation

receives notice that is a possibility. that would be consistent with existing law and second amendment. also that there is a way for an individual to have their rights restored. anything that might be a collateral consequence. i cannot predict what types of adjudication the social security administration would decide to be provided to the system. sen. boozman: thank you because that is a real concern. i have heard from a number of departments in arkansas who have had accounts removed due to justice's mismanagement of the budget. in a letter regarding asset forfeiture, the program has already begun implementing

cost-reduction measures. what are the measures and when do you envision the equitable sharing program to be reinstated? can you explain the benefits to the american people? we are so concerned about violent crime, this is one of the tools we are using very effectively in order to fight that battle. ms. lynch: thank you for the question because i share your concern and our regard for the strong working relationship the federal government has with our state and local counterpart. i was the direct beneficiary of their talent and expertise and now as attorney general, i do all i can to keep those relationships strong and vital. with respect to the equitable sharing issue that you raise, there have been budget issues there.

i don't know the exact time, but that essentially limited our ability to provide funds of equitable sharing. we are looking forward to providing those as soon as the asset forfeiture would allow. i know there is a great deal of discussion about asset forfeiture in general and we have been working with congress to make sure we retain this important aspect of it while addressing those concerns as well. senator baldwin: thank you, mr. chairman and senator mikulski for holding this important and timely hearing. violence continues to plague our communities. in my home state of wisconsin, gun homicides reached their highest point in a decade last year in the city of the walkie. milwaulkee

while we finally saw a notorious gun dealer, i once called the number one seller of crime guns in america start to clean up its act and be held liable for selling firearms used to injure cops, other gun dealers have rushed in to take its place. i hope all my colleagues can agree that we can and must do more to address this critical issue and keep our communities safe. i am a gun owner and i support and respect the second amendment. at the same time, i'm very frustrated the senate has been unable to advance common sense and bipartisan measures to bolster the enforcement of our

existing gun laws and to pass additional safety provisions. in the absence of leadership on this important issue in a congress of the united states, i applaud the president for taking small steps to strengthen the enforcement of existing federal gun laws. in our limited time, i want to call your attention to wisconsin matters. one i noted in my process which is milwaukee was home for years to a notorious rogue gun shop, badger guns, which in one two-year timeframe was the source of weapons used to shore -- used to shoot and wound six milwaukee police officers. in 2005, it was the top seller of crime guns in the entire country according to sources i have seen. but the shop had been found in

violation by the atf as early as 1989 and subsequent inspections uncovered additional violations. a 2006 recommendation by federal investigators said that its license should be repealed and was unheeded. it was not until 2011 at the shop lost its ability to sell guns. despite an active role by the atf in monitoring this facility it was allowed to put guns into the hands of dangerous criminals again and again. you made it clear the president's actions are not wholesale solutions and we understand that. i would like to hear how the steps we are discussing today might have helped stop a bad actor like badger guns and what

more congress can do to prevent stores like this from contribute to gun violence? ms. lynch: thank you. separate and apart from the recommendations i made to the president, it is a crime to knowingly sell a gun to a person who is prohibited. where there are gun dealers, and it is a small category in the category you discussed, atf does take enforcement actions there. we have learned from investigations that the shooting of law enforcement officers and civilians where the guns tend to come from, and that supports us. it is important to create an investigative trail and say what could or should have been done

in that situation. as part of the enforcement of existing laws, the atf takes these situations very seriously. it's a very small minority of them, but where we find a situation where a gunshot has that type of record, it is something that would be subject to enforcement action. senator baldwin: i think the action seems like significant concerns. obviously, we want to see more swift action in cases like this moving forward. i have run out of time but hope to submit for the record an additional question regarding an atf operation in milwaukee that raised significant concerns in

the last couple of years. >> thank you with your chairman and thank you madam attorney general for your testimony this morning. one of the benefits of coming in late is getting to listen to the probing questions of my colleagues and one was senator feinstein's questions about the trusts and corporations that have had more active in acquiring weapons. just a few questions. the proposal by the president would require the individuals who obtain these weapons to run a background check, correct? ms. lynch: that is correct. senator reed: they are applying just with handguns and what we would consider to be personalized weapons?

ms. lynch: typically, we see trusts purchasing weapons that are not handguns, that typically one can go to a dealer that are under the national firearms act. they are usually short barreled shotguns, certain types of machine guns as well as silencers. sen. reed: it strikes me ironically because the second amendment is seen as the individual rights americans have and to create corporations and trusts. it is not alone in this era. corporations and trusts are often created to evade something that can be directly done. i think this is a sensible step and reflects the thoughtful way you and the president seek to do

these sensible improvements to background checks. the issue of being engaged in business. from your answer, you rejected a categorical arbitrary number of weapons and reflected the interpretation of the constitution. i'm sure that is the rationale, to ensure this is constitutionally correct. ms. lynch: we have crafted the guidance to reflect what the courts have said who is in the business of dealing firearms and the court has says there is no set number. there can be large numbers of firearms transferred but if someone has a collection and is simply selling that, that would not make them subject to the licensure requirement. if they sell them repetitively or hold themselves out of the dealer, that's a different

scenario. it is not limited to where one operates, but what one does. we have collected the guidance based on information around the country and hopefully that will be understandable to people who have those questions. sen. reed: this is not an arbitrary decision, it's a reflection of the courts view on the second amendment rights of the individual americans. one other general issue is the effect of these regulations overall clearly in a very gross sense, people who are exercising their right to self-defense, for recreation, and people who are trying to obtain a weapon for illicit purposes, the effect of the president's regulations on

both groups, my hope is no impediment to those who seek legitimate use of firearms or the right to do so and the reasonable constraints and those people have illicit motives. thank you very much, mr. chairman and thank you , attorney general, for being with us today. i want to get into a question or two about the guidance to continue on this line of questioning about resources. we talked a lot about atf resources but i want to explore resources within the next system itself. as we start to game out our budget for the 2016 appropriations year, what should we be looking at in terms of the appropriations necessary for the department of justice to be able

to do all of the things to keep up with the increasing number of applications and make sure we have all the records uploaded on to that system? ms. lynch: that question is a very timely one as we look to invest in a system that is one of our first lines of defense against keeping guns out of the hands of those who should not have them. for fiscal year 15, nick's performed over 23 million background checks. that number is increasing. just this december alone, they received 3 million requests. that's a highest number of requests since after the sandy hook shooting. our estimates are we would need $121 million to run it. that would allow us to maintain the additional positions we hope

to add this year. we may not be able to add all of them right away. it would help us improve the electronic platform and have an operational on a 24 hour basis by the end of this year that will require a great deal of information technology, investment, and support. that is our goal. senator murphy: those who are focused on the laws, you would need that to enforce that? ms. lynch: in order to provide for the accurate implementation of the system that has been set forth by congress to process the

application in a timely fashion and provide the information, that is the basis for this request. senator murphy: i hope we can enter into the record the actual guidance that is the subject of this hearing if there is no objection. i would hope those that have an opinion, especially those who have a strong opinion on this guidance would take the time to read it because our second panel will include individuals who are going to call it an unwarranted assault on the second amendment and an effort to intentionally intimidate and harass law-abiding citizens. there will be those who call it patently unconstitutional. i hope people will read through what this guidance actually says. in summary, it is five points -- one, that federal law requires a person be licensed by the atf.

that's a simple recitation of existing law. second, you can be engaged in the business regardless of the location in which the firearms transaction is conduct that. i'm not sure anyone would dispute that fact. third, determining whether you are engaged in the business requires you to look at specific act and circumstances of your activities. that seems patently clear. four, as a general rule, you need a license if you buy and sell firearms with the principal motive of making a profit. a clear restatement of existing law. and fifth, a simple explanation about what existing courts have already said to interpret the law. to the extent a lot of the objections may be over this fifth point, let me ask you to state for the record, this fifth point on your page of key points is simply a recitation of

existing court interpretations of underlying law. there is nothing in there that is a new statement of law that simply summarizes what existing courts have found relative to who is required to have a license. ms. lynch: that is correct, senator. senator murphy: there have been different interpretations by different courts as to the interpretation of that law. ms. lynch: that is also correct. senator murphy: for those trying to determine whether they fall under the law or not, the existing precedent may be confusing or hard to track down. ms. lynch: it is hard to track down and it is a lot to ask every citizen to do a search and determine what the courts have said about how they are operating. what often happens is

individuals operating at gun shows or smaller sales will reach out to the atf and they have questions. they say this is what i'm doing and i don't know if it means i need to apply for a license or not. they asked those questions in person when they see investigators at gun shows, they call in and so our hope is this guidance along with the educational program the atf will be beginning providing the information to people will allow people to have clarity about this issue. we don't assume everyone is a lawyer or even wants to be, but they do have this requirement if they are engaged in the dealing of firearms and we hope this will ease compliance for those individuals seeking to comply with the law. for those individuals who have no intention of complying with the law, this will put them on notice and remove the sense that this is too confusing or i had no idea i was falling in this

category. it also allows people who are hobbyists and collectors to gain clarity about their collection and they need not apply. sen. shelby: we have reached the conclusion of our first panel. any subcommittee members have additional questions for the attorney general, they submit them for the official hearing record and we would request madam attorney general provide responses within 30 days. you generally do. thank you for your appearance today and for your time. sen. mikulski: i must excuse myself from the second panel. i have several maryland constituents i scheduled to meet on the issue of hate crimes for which they are being targeted and i need to participate in that. i want to welcome the witnesses to the second panel. i have read their testimony,

particularly their acknowledgment from barton and what he brings to the table as well as the practitioners of law. we look forward to moving forward on this agenda, to resource the agencies and to enforce the laws we have on the books and find common ground on the president's executive orders. ms. lynch: as the attorney general departs, i invite our second panel of witnesses to join us at the table. sen. mikulski: senator murphy will sit in my stead at the meeting. sen. shelby: i would like to make some brief introductions of the next witnesses. first, i welcome the attorney general for my state of alabama. attorney general strange is recognized as a national leader in advancing because as of federalism and a limited government by fighting the

increasing unconstitutional overreach of the federal government and its assault on individuals. he serves on the republican attorney general's association and is the chairman of the southern region of the national association of attorneys general. next, we will be joined by the former attorney general of virginia. he challenged many of the federal government's attempt to overreach its constitutional powers. today as a private attorney with 20 years experience as a litigator, he serves as a founding partner for the self-defense law.

after tragically losing his son daniel, mr. barton has dedicated himself to bringing people together to find sensible solutions to spare other families in pain of losing a child to gun violence. finally, we have dr. joyce lee malcolm joining us from george mason university school of law where she works as the patrick henry professor of constitutional law and the second amendment. dr. malcolm is a constitutional scholar active in the area of constitutional history, focusing on individual rights in britain and america. she has written numerous books and articles on gun control, the second amendment, and individual rights. professor malcolm taught at princeton university, boston university, northeastern university and cambridge university. i want to thank all of you for

joining us here today and we will start with attorney general strange. welcome to the committee. mr. strange: thank you. i thank vice-chairman mikulski for inviting me. i'm honored to accept your invitation to speak on an issue of importance to all americans -- reducing gun violence while ensuring the fundamental right of citizens to bear arms is not infringed. i wish to commend your centrally for convening this panel because these goals are not mutually exclusive. my duty is to enforce the law and i am here today as the chief law enforcement officer to deliver the law enforcement officers on the streets perspective on this issue. for the last five years, i have witnessed the challenge of safeguarding the gun rights of law-abiding citizens also working to deny lawbreakers the

ability to use firearms to commit crimes. i've learned an important lesson -- further limiting the ability of responsible citizens to buy guns will not keep criminals from getting one. in fact, i reached out to local police chiefs soliciting their advice on what is working and what is not working in stopping gun violence on the street. i wanted to be able to carry their message based on decades of experience on the front lines of this fight. these are the men and women who are the first line of defense, the first on the scene of a terrorist attack or a violent event, an active shooter situation. again and again, i heard the same thing -- enforce laws already on the books. number two, prosecute criminals for gun related crimes. number three, stop releasing violent criminals from jail