million undocumented people in this country; many of them being exploited and living in fear. the latino community and i want a path toward citizenship, to a comprehensive immigration reform. [cheers and applause] this campaign is listening to our brothers and sisters in the african-american areunity. and what they asking me it happen that we have trillions of dollars to spend in a war in iraq we should have never gotten into but we do not rebuildilable fines to

inner cities like flint, michigan? [applause] sen. sanders: in inner-city city, including milwaukee, wisconsin. are high,nt rates health care access is very poor. schools, disgraceful. inner going to rebuild cities in america and when we do that we are going to create millions of decent paying jobs. [applause] sen. sanders: this campaign is listening to our brothers and sisters in the native american community. [cheers and applause] sen. sanders: everybody knows

that from day one, we have the native american people having been lied to, cheated, into their treaties have been abrogated. we are the native american people more than we can ever repay. [applause] sen. sanders: they have given us so much in our culture. they have given us and taught us about how we respect the environment. ] pplause sen. sanders: they have taught us that we have got to live with nature, not destroy nature. [applause] sen. sanders: i am on the senate

committee on the environment and it me tell you unequivocally have talked to scientists all over the world. climate change is real. [cheers and applause] sen. sanders: it is caused by it is alreadyand causing massive problems in our country and around the world. we have the moral responsibility to leave this planet in a way that is healthy and inhabitable for future generations. [applause] sanders: we can and we must take on the fossil fuel industry .

transform our energy system away from fossil fuel to energy efficiency and sustainable energies. and we are going to tell the fossil fuel industry their short-term profits are not more important than the future of this planet. applause] sen. sanders: there are republicans running around this country talking about family values. and let us all be clear as to what they mean by family values. no woman mean is that in this arena, the state, this country, should have the right to control her own body. i disagree. applause]

sanders: what they mean is that our gay brothers and sisters should not have the right to get married. i disagree. applause] onetor sanders: there is country in the industrialized world that does not guarantee health care to all people and you are living in it. ] ooing sen. sanders: so let me repeat you what i have said many times and have been criticized for saying many times. and that is, in my view health care is a right of all people, not a privilege. applause]

sen. sanders: the affordable care act, and i am on the committee, has done a lot of good things but we have got to go further. today in america, 29 million people have no health insurance. many of you are underinsured. deductibles, copayments, every day at many of us are getting ripped off by the drug companies that are charging us the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs. but after all of that, we end up spending far more per capita on health care than do the people of any other nation. what i believe is now is the time for us to pass a medicare for all single-payer program.

[cheers and applause] sen. sanders: when we do that, we guarantee health care for every american and at the same time we save the average middle-class family thousands of dollars a year on their health care cost. every person here understands that real change in this country has never taken place from the top on down. it has always been from the bottom on up. [cheers and applause] sen. sanders: whether it is workers 100 years ago coming together and say, we're not animals. we will not be exploited. say on oure some jobs. we are going to negotiate contracts. we will form unions.

whether it is the civil rights movement, where for hundreds of years african-americans and their allies said, no , racism in, bigotry america is not acceptable. [applause] sen. sanders: whether it is the women's movement. people forget, 100 years ago women did not have the right to vote. the right to get the education they wanted. the right to do the work they wanted. but women stood up. they fought back. they went to jail. some of them died. and they and their male allies said, women will not be second-class citizens and this country. [applause]

sen. sanders: if we were in this room 10 years ago, not a long time. in summary jumped up and said, you know bernie i think gay marriage will be legal in 50 states in this country, the person next to them would've said, you are crazy. that cannot happen. that will never happen. and yet, in 2015 at happened. -- itt happened it happened because the gay community and their straight allies stood up, fought back, and said that people in this country should have the the right to love whoever they wanted regardless of gender. [applause] sen. sanders: and here is a more contemporary example of how real

change takes place and how you can defeat the status quo. ago, were here five years no time at all, somebody jumps up and says, you know bernie, i think this seven dollar and 25's $7.25 rate5 -- this is unlivable and it should be $15 an hour. the person next to them would've said, that is nuts. you want to more than double the minimum wage? you are radical. you are crazy. you're thinking too big. maybe eight dollars, $10 an hour . $15 an hour, that can happen. stop thinking that big. then what happened? this is extraordinary. workers in the fast food industry, but donald's, workers

at burger king at wendy's, you know what they did? they went out on strike. they started demonstrating. [applause] they showed: tremendous courage and they told the world, we cannot make it on $7.25 an hour or eight dollars an hour. and you know it happened a few years ago? seattle, $15 an hour. angeles --co, los $15 an hour. california, $15 an hour. new york state, $15 an hour. words, what was thought to be impossible, what was thought to be extraordinarily radical, has happened. and it happened because people stood up and fought back.

[applause] sen. sanders: and i believe -- i believe that today we are onto a moment in history when all across this country millions of people are looking at the status quo in this country. they are looking at massive levels of income and wealth inequality. they are looking at a situation where we have a proliferation of millionaires while we have the highest rate of child poverty of any country in earth. what they are looking at families where people are working two or three jobs to survive. they are looking at a country which is the only major country to to guarantee health key all or have paid family and medical leave. they are looking at a country where young people are leaving

the school deeply in debt while others cannot even afford to get a higher education. they are looking at a country where we're not doing everything we should to combat the planetary crisis of planet -- climate change. they're looking at a country where it's intentional racism and a broken criminal justice system continues unabated. we are looking at a country where women are still not getting a fair shake in the marketplace. and all over this country people are sent, you know what? the status quo is not working. it is not good enough. it has got to change. [applause] and we can dos: it. we can do it. [applause] sen. sanders: as linda said when

she introduced me, we do not have to accept the status quo. we can change it. and that is where we are right now. at the only way we change it is when millions of people come together. when we do not allow the donald trump's of the world to divide us up. when we stand together. [applause] sen. sanders: when we stand together as black and white and latino and asian americans and native americans. stand together as gay and straight men and women. people born in this country, people who have immigrated into this country. and at the end of the day, these guys may have unlimited sums of money, they may control the

media, they may control the economy, they may control the political system. but when millions of people stand up to gather united and demand change, we will not be stopped. [applause] "bernie"]anting sen. sanders: and that is what political revolution is about. it is not just burning. bernie cannot do it alone. we need to do it together. on thursday, in two days, there is going to be a very important

democratic primary election here. we have 16 out of the last seven caucuses and primaries. applause] sen. sanders: we have one those primaries and caucuses by landslide victories. according to a recent cnn poll, we are 20 points nationally ahead of donald trump. [applause] and here in: wisconsin a came out a few days ago, had us 19 points ahead of donald trump. [applause] sanders: now, donald will not become president. let me assure you of that.

donald trump will not become president because the american people will not elect a candidate who insults mexicans and latinos, who insults muslims, who insults women, who insults african-americans, who notlts everybody who is quite like him. and, fortunately, most of us are not quite like him. [applause] sen. sanders: net donald trump will not become president because in america we understand that bringing a our people together is always more powerful and significant thin dividing us up.

and, the american people understand that supporting each other -- when your family is in trouble i have got to be there for you -- you have got to be there for my family -- that's when we support each other where much stronger they end up when we are selfish and only concerned about ourselves. [applause] and mosters: importantly donald trump will not become president because the whatcan people understand every major religion on earth has taught us, whether it is christianity, judaism, islam, buddhism, whatever. that is that at the end of the day, love trumps hatred. applause]

sen. sanders: on tuesday there is a very important primary election. what i have learned so far in this campaign is that if there is a large motor turnout, we will win. voter turnoutlow we will likely lose. so i ask you this tuesday, please come out and vote. bring your friends, your answer, your uncles, your friends, your coworkers. let us have the largest turnout on a primary day in wisconsin history. thank you all very much. [cheers and applause]

♪ [clapping and whistling] >> ♪ this land is your land this land is my land from california -- to the newland york island

this land was made for you and me was walking none and a weight i saw above me that endless skyway this land was made for you and me all around me a voice was sounding this land was made for you and me the sign was painted private property but on the backside made for you and

me this land was made for you and me this land is your land his land is my land from california to the new york island to the redwood forest to the gulf stream waters this land was made for you and e this land was made for you and me you andd was made for ♪

applause] ♪ there's a starman waiting in the sky he'd like to come and meet us ourhe thinks he'd blow minds ♪ > ♪

announcer: campaign 2016 continues today with the wisconsin primary. live coverage begins at 9:00 p.m. eastern. tune in for candidate speeches and viewer reaction and election results. on c-span, c-span radio, and c-span.org. washington and journal, a preview of today's wisconsin primary with john "lie" sylvester. then, fred barnes, weekly standard cofounder and co-author of jack kemp, the bleeding heart conservative who changed america. to discuss campaign 2016 and the latest on the nominating process for the republican party.

washington journalists live every morning at 7:00 a.m. on c-span. you can join us with your comments and questions on facebook and twitter. announcer: nsa director admiral michael rogers testifies today on the nations cyber structure before the senate armed services committee. we will bring you his testimony 9:30 a.m. starting at eastern on c-span three. announcer: net democratic candidate hillary clinton campaigned in new york. she was joined by a congressman and senator. her visit comes two weeks ahead of the new york state primary. this is 50 minutes. announcer: please welcome to the stage your team in washington.

congressman paul tonko. gillibrand.sten and, the next president of the united states, hillary clinton. this is my fight song take back my rights song i will play my fight song else else, nobody believes that i still have a fight left in me everybody is worth something

♪ >> hi, everybody. wow. are we excited about hillary clinton being the next president? anlike you, have been awesome supporter of the best of the leaders of this country. hillary rodham clinton for the next president of the united states. hillary is an awesome leader who personifies great intellect and great empathy that equals phenomenal results. she has been there throughout her career, fighting for america's families. let me tell you about the intellect. when i first had real working issues with this wonderful

person, it was over the energy issues. a complex issue. i was energy chair of the new york state assembly, the most thoughtful, provoking question coming from hillary rodham clinton about clean energy. about strengthening our grid. and, about producing energy independence. is that the kind of leader we want? has been a big proponent, we worked with her in congress, because of her concern about infrastructure including clean drinking water. she has been there fighting for our infrastructure. is billions of gallons of water lost and it is not just water through those leaking pipes. it is tax dollars because it is treated water. is about doing it wisely, effectively, and efficiently. that is the kind of leadership we require.

let me tell you about the empathy. went into flint, michigan, and met with the families and children and said, we need to do something now. and it is not just election-year amity and empathy with her. in myrs ago she was region in the assembly speaking to those communities and families that were impacted by floods. where she looked them in the ion said, we will do something. and she delivered. that was 10 years ago. visited with ae gold star mom. charlene is with us today and she is still filled. her broken heart was mended by the grace hillary clinton shared with her and expressing her concerns, compassion, and love. that's why hillary rodham

clinton. excellence, intellect, that's the leadership we need. what does that produce? that combination of keen intellect and great empathy has resulted in a great listener that then promotes and encourages an outspoken determined voice that lends to a relentless advocate for america and her family. that's why we're supporting hillary rodham clinton for president. our former secretary of state. she is a true champion. speaking of true champions, i've had the honor of serving in the house of representatives with the person i will introduce. senator gillibrand. it was there that we saw great

leadership on behalf of upstate new york. i have some that old district that was once doing so well and wonderfully by senator gillibrand. with that partnerships i got to see her leadership skills. her ability to work with colleagues across the aisle. as did senator clinton when he was our representative. it's that kind of determination that senator gillibrand brings to office. to be there, to make certain our campuses are a great place by which to learn, grow and live. she's going to headache a difference. -- she's going to make a difference. she's fighting for economic justice.

i am proud to serve or the other senator in the house. i introduce to you -- the person who came from the capital district region. we have senator kirsten gillibrand. thank you, kirsten. >> thank you bob tonka. give it up for paul. i am so happy and so honored to be here today. i grew up just a stone throw from here. my whole life since i was a little girl in albany. i've been lucky to have so many mentors and role models who also happen to be strong and brilliant women. i want to tell you about three of those mentors that were most important to me. the first one was my grandmother. my grandmother was a secretary in our state legislature. she didn't have a college degree. she didn't have a fancy title. but she was never afraid to raise her voice about the issues that mattered to her and to this

community. she also wanted to make her community a better place. she learned that if she wanted to make it better while her voice might be important, the voice of many women was even more important. she and other women created an organization with all of the women in the capital region joining her to elect leaders that shared their values. they learned how to run campaigns. they knocked on doors. they made phone calls. they put bumper stickers on cars. they did everything they could and eventually, you couldn't get elected in albany without the blessing of my grandmother and lady friend. my grandmother taught me that women's voices matter. that what to do with your time matters. she taught me that fighting to make a difference matters.

my next one is my mother. my mother was one of three women in her law school class. by the time she was my age, she earned a second degree black belt in karate. i asked her why she didn't want to play tennis. she was one of the only professional women my friends i knew. every single one of us wanted to be like her. my mother taught me three lessons. dare to be different. she taught me to own your own ambition. she taught me to never, ever give up. then there's my third and greatest mentor. her name is hillary clinton. [applause] i was just a young lawyer in new york city when hillary made her

famous speech in beijing where she said women's rights are human rights once and for all. now, that was a life-changing moment for me. i always cared about making the world a better place. but it wasn't until hillary stood on that stage in beijing and it wasn't until i watched her give that speech that i knew i had to follow hillary and get off the sidelines. i decided to join a women's group just like my grandmother and before long, i was in a room watching hillary speak again. she was speaking to a packed room. she was looking out into the room, she said, decisions are being made everyday in washington. if you're not part of those decisions and you don't like what they decide, you have no one to blame but yourself. i'm in the back of the room, i start to sweat, i start to

thinking, oh my goodness, she's telling me i have to run for office now. well, it took about ten years to run for office. she has always inspired me my entire life to make a difference. not surprisingly, she gets all of this from her own mother. hillary's mother was only eight years old when she was sent away. she was 14 when she started to work at the housekeeper for $3 a week. these life experiences and skills instilled a rel sense of grit and recognition that kindness that one another always mattered. these are the values she passed down to her daughter hillary. look at what hillary has done with her life.

look at where she has come from. when she finished law school, she could have gone anywhere. she would have worked for the fancy law firm in the country. no, she went to work for the children's defense fund and fought for children with disabilities. as first lady of the united states, she fought for millions of americans who were sick and had no access to health insurance. as senator, she fought for our first responders. those men and women who raise up those towers when everyone was coming down. she fought to make sure they would have healthcare. as secretary of state, hillary never stopped fighting for human rights and equal rights at every corner of this globe. hillary has been spent her entire life fighting for everyone else. so now let's fight for her!

let's keep raising our voices to support her. make those phone calls, knock on those doors. go to every one you know and tell them how you feel. tell them it's time to get off the sidelines. why this election matters to you. convince them why hillary will be the best president of the united states. convince them to vote for her. hillary has never stopped fighting for us and we will never stop fighting for her. it is my honor now to introduce to you my mentor, my role model my friend the first woman president of the united states of america, hillary clinton! ♪

mrs. clinton: thank you so much. oh my gosh, it is so great to be in new york and to be up here in the capital region. i am so proud to be standing on this stage with two friends and former colleagues. i'm grateful for their service, their leadership and their support. i was listening to paul as he was talking about the work we did together. it's absolutely the case that he has tackled some of the most difficult challenges facing our state and our country. now he is taking on another difficult challenge. he is focused on fixing the infrastructure of our water system here in new york and across america.

he's trying to get support from the congress and i will do everything i can if i'm fortunate enough to be your president to make sure you do, paul. when you think about all of the challenges we face here in america and around the world, although it may not be in the headlines, water is one of them. that's why we've got to protect our resources. i was proud to work with so many to clean up the hudson. we also have to make sure that water system across this state are clean and pure so that we can take absolute confidence in the water we drink and use. new york is in such a critical position because so much of the rest of the country doesn't have enough water. we have to be good stewards of

our water. so paul, i look forward to working with you. i have to tell you, it was a really hard decision for me to leave the senate. i adored being your senator. i loved representing new york. it was the greatest honor imaginable. that the people of new york took a chance on me and the 2000 election. let me serve you and then reelected me in 2006. when president-elect obama asked me to be secretary of state, i said i'm so honored, i'm so flattered mr. president elect, but i love representing new york in the senate. he said, well, with all the problems we're inheriting from the bush administration, he

said, i trust you to be my secretary of state. i told him not once but twice that although, i understood the importance of the job, i wanted to represent all of you in the senate. he said to me, i don't want to talk to you again until you say yes. i said to my husband, i said you know, i'm still flattered president-elect asked me and i told him no twice, he keeps telling me he doesn't want to talk to me until i say yes. bill looked at me and goes, well, i asked you to marry me twice, you said no and i said let me know when you're ready. he said so maybe there's a pattern here. eventually, of course, i did say yes and it was such an incredible experience working so

closely with the president to frankly try to undo a lot of the damage that has been done the prior eight years. i have to tell you, i felt so much better about making this decision when kirsten was asked to succeed me and to fill this senate seat. seat. i had known her since 2000. this bright young lawyer from albany. i saw her in action. she supported me. she raised money. she made speeches. she made phone calls. she just did everything she could to get me elected to the senate. when she decided to run for the house some years later, i was helping her speaking for her

because i knew what a great representative she would be. then of course, she has been a superb senator along with chuck schumer for new york. i know what good hands new york is in. i want to just take a few minutes to tell you what you probably all ready are thinking. this election is one of the most serious, consequently believes we've had in a long time. it is for a number of reasons. the differences between the two parties are stark. i believe the facts prove that our economy does better when we have a democrat in the white house. [applause]

we saw that in the 1990's when my husband was president and 23 million new jobs and incomes went up for everybody. then what happened? we reversed course. the republicans came back with their failed economic policy of trickle down economics. it deserves a lot of boos. when i was in the senate, i was arguing and voting against these policies. because i believe then, it would reverse the economic progress we were making. we had a lot of work still to do here in upstate and other places. but, they got their way. slashed taxes on the wealthy. take their eyes off the financial markets and the mortgage market. we know what happened. when president-elect obama called to ask me to come to chicago to talk about becoming

secretary of state. before we talked about the world and our challenges, he just looked at me and said, it is so much worse than they told us. we were losing 800,000 jobs a month. 9 million americans lost their jobs. 5 million homes were lost and $13 trillion in family wealth was wiped out. why am i telling you this? because i want you to remember it. i want you to know what the real difference choices are. we have people running for president on the republican side led by donald trump who are -- he's not the only one. he may be the most flamboyant. they all want to take us back to trickle down economics. we cannot allow that to happen.

the most important economic issue in this campaign will be ensuring that we have a democrat in the white house come next january. here is what i have been advocating. it's not just enough to keep going along and making progress. i want to really have broad based inclusive prosperity again. more good jobs rising income. that's why i laid out plans to get more infrastructure jobs including creation of a national infrastructure bank to fund what we need to do with roads, bridge, tunnels and airports. it's not just what we see, we also have to fix our water systems. our sewer system.

leaking pipelines under the ground. we have work to do. these are good jobs. these are mostly union jobs where people can make a good living. then, i was in syracuse a few days ago. announcing my manufacturing agenda because i want us to make it in america. i know we can do that. we see what's happening right here in the capital region. with nanotechnology and biotechnology and chip and other things being made in america right here in new york. i remember when i first worked on nanotechnology, i was telling people in the senate, i wanted to get some funds to really begin to invest in nanotechnology right here in the capital region.

it seem like a long time ago. but look at the progress we've made. that's what we need to do across upstate. across america but the reason i emphasize upstate is because we have the skills. we have the hard working people. we have the infrastructure. i will be the president who brings manufacturing back to upstate new york and america. another way we're going to create a lot of new jobs is by combating climate change. i care deeply about this issue. i worked on it. i thought we were making progress when i was in the senate. there were republicans who would actually make a speech about it. take a trip. i took trips with people like john mccain. we went to some of the northern most places in america. in the world to look at what was

happening. up in alaska, northern most inhabited island in the world. i thought we were making progress. all of a sudden, between extreme partisans and the koch brothers, you can't get republican anymore to say the word climate change. when they're asked, those running for president, they all say the same thing. i don't know, i'm not a scientist. i keep saying, well go talk to a scientist and listen to a scientist. i bet they can talk to a teacher right here at the high school and get a good lesson about climate change. you know, they're afraid to even face it. back in 2009, when i became secretary of state, i immediately began working with the president.

to try to lay the ground work. we had to get fast growing countries like china and india and others to sign on to cutting their emissions. it took years but we finally got it done. i was really proud that thanks to american leadership, we got that agreement signed in paris. that commits the rest of the world to taking steps to deal with climate change. now we have to figure out not only how we continue to lead but how we can be the leader. some nation is going to be the 21st century clean energy super power. right now if i were guessing, you'd say it's germany, china or us. i want it to be us. i intend for it to be. because it's not only the right thing to do to protect our environment to protect our people's health, to protect our planet but it's also smart. there will be millions of new

jobs and businesses coming out of the efforts to combat climate change. i set two big goals. i want us to deploy a half billion more solar panels by the end of my first term. and enough clean energy to power every home in america by the end of my second term. you know, my friends, it is easy to tell somebody what you're against. i want you to know what i'm for. i want you to know what my plans are. we can do this together. we do more for small businesses. would create about 75% of the new jobs. i want to have a much more supportive environment for that. i especially want to focus on

young people who want to start jobs, new businesses and job creation and entrepreneurialism. i have to say, i was very proud to stand with governor cuomo today in new york city as he signed the increase of minimum wage. which i think is important. first and foremost to lift people who work full time out of poverty. here's what i want you to understand, we are a 70% consumption economy. you know what that means? people don't have money in their pockets to spend, we don't grow. so the more money we get back into the most pocket, instead of the most money going to the fewest pocket of people at the top, the faster our economy will grow and more jobs with rising incomes will be good for everybody.

you know what one of the best ways to quickly raise incomes? is to finally guarantee equal pay for women's work. again, to me this is about growth and fairness. is a woman's issue? of course it is. but it's alsoal family issue -- but it's also a family issue. any family who has a woman working who is not being paid fairly is penalized. when you go to the store and you check out with what you're buying, they don't say okay, you only make 78 cents on the dollar. that's not the way it works. we've got to think.

we need to grow the economy and we need to be sure the economy is fair. one of the ways we have to do that too is to penalize those companies that want to ship jobs overseas. there is less and less reason for them to do that. here's what i'm proposing. if any company ever got one penny of taxpayer help from a local county, state or federal government, then they have to pay it all back. because they got that help to keep jobs right here in new york and america. if any company wants to move abroad and some of them do what's called an inversion, which i call a perversion. they move their headquarters, they pretend to move so they can avoid paying taxes. anybody who does that, we're going to slap the biggest exit

tax on them to make them think twice about leaving our country. we going to enforce trade agreements like i did when i was in the senate. i pushed hard to enforce trade agreement. i voted against the multinational one that came before us. i said i'm against the transpacific partnership because i don't think it will raise incomes and produce jobs for new yorkers and americans. everything just about i've said, the republicans disagree with. that's going to be a real choice. we can go back to the old ways, the old snake oil. or we can do what works. we got a pretty good idea of what that is. it's also true for education. we need to start with early childhood education.

universal prekindergarten, then in elementary school and secondary school, i want to be a good partner to our teachers. i want to support our teachers. i am tired of all of the scapegoating of our educators. what we need to be doing is helping to support our teachers and our educators to get the resources they need to do the job we ask them to do. i also have plan to make college affordable again. i share that goal with senator sanders.

we have a different way of doing it. i want you to understand the difference because i think it's important. i said, look, we need to have debt free tuition. you don't have to borrow a penny. if you're wealthy, you have to pay. i believe that is a great fairer and more affordable way to get to get to affordable college. what i have said is, i'm going to work to make sure everybody who needs it, gets to go to a public college or university without borrowing a penny. i want to work to get the cost down. i am asked units to work ten 10 hours a to work

week. if they do work at the college or university, that would help lower the cost. we can get the cost down for more people and that will help us send more to college. i pay for it by taxing the we'll. -- the wealthy. i can afford to do that. senator sanders has the same goal. he advocates free college. that means free for everybody including donald trump's kids. i don't think we need to do that. i think we need to focus on where the problem is. middle class families, work families and poor families. senator sanders plan depends upon governors shipping in about quarter the cost. think about that. about 30 of our governors are republicans.

they are working as hard as they can to take money away from higher education. i spent time this last week in wisconsin, where their government scott walker, cut $250 million from higher education. he would expect to contribute $300 million. i am not the all counting on scott walker having a change of heart. i don't want to make a promise i can't peep. -- i can't keep. i can make and keep the promise of debt free tuition so that more of our young people can get to college. then, we are going to make it easier for you to pay down and end your student debt. how many people here currently have student debt?

we have an interest rate higher than 8%. anybody higher than 10%? feel like i'm in an auction. i want everybody in the audience to hear this. we have new england people who are paying six, eight, 12% interest. nothing has that kind of interest. credit card debt. you can finance your refines our mortgage and refinance your car. we are going to make it absolutely clear. we will save -- then we're going to move people into programs like i have.

when i got out of law school, i did work with the children's defense fund. i was making $14 a year. -- $14,000 a year. but got it paid off. we're going to have people pay back as a percentage of their income. then we're going to end your obligation after 20 years you're done. i'm not going to keep this going. we are going to stop our government from making a profit on landing money to young people to get an education. the other part of whether or not you can produce results for people, is whether we get everybody access to quality affordable healthcare.

something i care deeply will. -- care deeply about. before there was something called obamacare, there was something called hillarycare. we had quite the ballly with the drug companies and insurance companies. they really won that time. but then i got back up and i said okay, what can i get done. that's when i. helped create the children's health insurance program which provides health insurance to kids. that's why i was so thrilled when prohm -- we've been trying -- when president obama signed the affordable care act. we have been trying to do this since harry truman. now we've got it done and 90% of americans are cover. i want to get the costs down. i want to get the choices up.

i want to go right after the drug companies to rein in. we're going to start by by requiring them to negotiate with for lower prices with medicare. that will ripple through the entire healthcare system. these are some of the issues that i've been talking about and setting forth ideas and plans about how to address it. i think the first test that you should hold anybody running for

president is to see whether or not they meet. can they actually make your life better. can you -- i want to tell you what i want to do. i also want you to know where i stand on rights. because the republicans want to strip away, under mine, erode, every single one of our rights. civil rights, gay rights and rights for people with disabilities. >> i will stand to make a of -- i will depend planned parenthood from these partisan political attacks. i will defend marriage equality and work to end discrimination against the lgbt community. i will defend voting right and work to end citizens united and

i -- i will defend the veterans administration, make it better but prevent the republicans from tearing it apart. i will keep working for comprehensive immigration reform with a path to citizenship. i had work to give more opportunities to people who disabilities when it comes to education and training and housing. i will continue to fight for common sense gun safety reforms. that will save lives in our country. we have a big agenda here at home.

but the second test, should hold any candidate too. can -- can this person lead us. ly do my best to make sure all the experience that i've had starting as your senator, after 9/11 and going all the way through my secretary of state years, it's put to good use to keep our country safe. sign make sure we work with our friends and allies. as some of you remember, after 9/11, we were not sure what was going to happen next. we knew we had to be prepared. i give great credit to the nypd and to everybody working to keep us safe. we learned a lot of lessons. we learned that everybody had to

be part of our defense. if they saw something suspicious, they should report it. thousands of people did. it proved to be a really smart strategy. when i hear donald trump or ted cruz with those offensive comments they make about muslims, it's not only wrong. it's dangerous. what we've got to do is make sure everybody feels comfortable and welled to pick up that phone or to go on to their computer to report something. people on front line will hear more and see more. very often in our american muslim communities. we also have to have coalition with many nations in order to defeat isis.

something that i have experience in doing because i put together a coalition that brought iran to negotiating table and imposing stricter sanctions. when donald trump talked about pulling out of nato or keeping muslims out of the united states or even abandoning our alleys in -- abandoning our allies in the pacific. that does not make him sound strong. it makes him sound like he's in over his head. finally, the third test. can you unify our country? we have too much deviciveness. -- divisiveness. there are so many people who are worried. even fearful. sometimes angry about what's

happening in our country. i understand that. especially what i told you about the great recession. some of them haven't recovered yet at all. i know that there's a lot of concern. but to play to that in a way that brings out anger and prejudice and paranoia, doesn't help us solve our problems. it's ok to get angry. we got to figure out what we'll do about it. what's our plan? what's our strategy? we are at our best. so much of american history came out of new york. we are at our best. remember what our great former governor and president roosevelt said. all we have to fear is fear itself.

i will go anywhere any time to meet with any one to find common ground. i know how important it is to keep driving -- trying to solve problems together p a lot of the work that paul has done in the has done inrsten the senate. you work with a lot of people you don't agree with maybe 90% of the issues up. try to find that ten percent. that's what i want to do as your president. i will get up every single day and work for the result that will make a difference in your lives to keep us safe and to unify our country. i want to end on what kirsten said about people who inspired

her and mentored her. i'm honored to be listed with her grandmother and mother. she mentioned my mother. you know, i often wonder at how my mother came out of what was a very neglectful and terrible childhood. literally being sent away not wanted by her parents and grandparents who didn't want her either. ending up working as a house maid at the age of 14. looking for something that would be meaningful to her. she was fortunate because a woman who's home she worked in, realized my mother wanted to go to high school. she would get up early in morning and do the chores and run to high school, go to high school and then run back and finish the chores. she did that for four years.

i considered her one time when -- i asked her one time. how did you survive this. she said, you know, at critical moments in my life, somebody showed me kindness. kind word, a kind gesture. it made all the difference to her. in this campaign, i've been talking about how we need more love and kindness toward each other in our country. how we have to try again to see the world through other's eyes then figure out what we can do to make it better. then finally, i'm inspired everyday by my granddaughter. having an 18-month-old granddaughter with another on the way this summer is just -- it's personally the most

wonderful thing that has ever happened. it is like falling in love all over again. here's what i want you to know. of course, bill and i will do everything we can to make sure that our granddaughter has every opportunity in life. but that is not enough. it really matters what kind of country she and all of our other kids will become adults in. is a country that is still believing in and realizing the promise of america for everyone or just a few? it really matters what kind of world is out there waiting for her and every other child in our country. is a safe world? is a prosperous and peaceful world?

is a world we're able to deal with climate change and all the other changes we face. here's what i want you to know. i don't think it's enough that my granddaughter has opportunities in life. i want your children and grandchildren to have exactly the same opportunities. to live up to their dream. to fulfill their own potential. that will be the mission of my presidency. i need your help on april 19th. please come out and let's vote for a future that we will make together. thank you all so much. ♪

[captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2016] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] ♪ >> on the wall street journal website, this headline -- donald trump's path to clinching the gop nomination narrows. joining us is read epstein. thank you for being with us.

what is this mean for trumps path to the nomination? regardless of how trump does in wisconsin on tuesday, he is going to have to fight all the way through june 7 to have any chance to get the 12037 delegates. he would not get to 1237 until california, new jersey and three other states vote on june 7. no matter what, but trump's path, if he does not do well gets pretty narrow. john kasich could win three if he wins the congressional.

that does not include some of those like pennsylvania, colorado and wyoming. it doesn't include delegates that are bound to candidates that dropped out of the race .ike marco rubio the sort ofbecome undisputed nominee of the party, which is about what trump needs, given a lot of the turmoil over his candidacy and a lot of the angst we have seen from delegates about supporting him, for trump to be the nominee, he needs to win the bound delegates. wisconsin, he is going to have to win seven out of 10 delegates left. a majority from pennsylvania and also from north dakota, colorado and wyoming.

why do the states have unbound delegates and who does that favor is part of the labyrinthine system that republicans have set up. each state gets to set its own rules on how delegates get elected. that did not hold a primary or caucus, they held a republican state convention. where they elected 25 delegates thewill all be unbound at convention. they can change their allegiance at any point between now and cleveland. and during the convention they can change their allegiance. ted cruz campaign believes that 18 out of 25 delegates are loyal to him. but there is nothing necessarily that keeps those delegates to stick with cruz. host: if the path is narrow

for donald trump, it is safe to say that it is safe for them to get close to the first ballot in cleveland? it is impossible for john kasich. some of his campaign openly says that he is goingcore, -- for ms to win the nomination outright and get the delegates. he talked to his advisers privately, they will acknowledge that is essentially impossible for him to do. there are not enough left for him to get the 1237. all or ae to collect most all of the remaining bound delegates and win some of the unbound delegates and win delegates that are right now credited to marco rubio and some of the other withdrawn candidates, that is a bit of a stretch for ted cruz, given that

we know he will have trouble in the northeast, particularly new york. thecruise campaign is -- ted cruz campaign is banking on a repeat of what happened in he has hadhere effectively a one-on-one battle with donald trump and is winning . if ted cruz wins, it will be the first primary state that he has one in more than a month. it is really a situation that does not necessarily lend itself to be repeated elsewhere. in wisconsin you have a united republican organization, including the conservative talk radio host, all allied against donald trump. you also have an electorate that is well informed and turned out smaller leaving a much unit or -- universe of first

voters for a donald trump to activate. >> based on what you see on the ground in wisconsin, can you give us a sense of the mood of republican voters? >> the ted cruz voters are very excited about putting a stop to the donald trump momentum. there is a lot of -- wisconsin republicans -- what constitutes the establishment republicans are anxious to show the rest of the country that they can stop ted cruz -- stop donald trump, excuse me. you see politicians saying they are not necessarily fans of ted cruz, i spoke to alberta darling who initially a scott walker supporter and then a jeb bush supporter and then a marco rubio supporter, and now she said she is voting for ted cruz the cut she does not want tom trump --

donald trump to be the nominee. there is a lot of that in wisconsin. it is a united republican party, the activists, the conservatives here want to stop donald trump and they are using ted cruz as the vessel to do so even though they are not in love with him. online,ork is available thank you for being with us. campaign 2016 continues today with the wisconsin primary. live coverage begins tonight at 9:00 eastern. tune in for election results. taking you on the road to the white house on c-span, c-span radio, and www.c-span.org. onthomas shannon testifies recent missile test by iran and

the nuclear agreement. you can see his testimony starting at 10:00 eastern here on c-span. defense secretary ashton carter makes remarks on defense policy, national security today at the senate for strategic and international studies. you can see it here on c-span starting at 1:00 p.m. eastern. next, an inside look in the evolution of presidential campaigns. the george w. bush presidential center hosted residential campaign managers, white house political advisers, and one of the creators of showtime's "the circus."

>> ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> now is the time for all good americans to come to the aid -- >> ladies and gentlemen, welcome kevin sullivan.

>> good evening and welcome. let me offer our sincere apologies for embedding that ike for president. it will be in your head for two or three days. that clip was one of the first presidential tv ads ever recorded and a nice way to set the tone for our conversation tonight, which is being recorded by c-span which is airing later. inc. you for being here for another sold-out engaged event at the george w. bush presidential center here on the beautiful smu campus. this house is the bush institute, a robust and energetic policy center.

fostering policy, and taking -- improve include the quality of people's lives here at home and all around the world. the bush institute focuses on the policy areas that were most important to the president and mrs. bush. it is one way they continue their service to our nation. it is honored to have the president and mrs. bush with us here tonight. [applause] before we continue, i want to call your attention to our path to the presidency special exhibit which explores the history of campaigns and elections. there are lots of interactive things in their. if you did not have a chance to see it, check it out after the event. i am really excited about the program tonight, you are in for a treat. we will begin with the conversation about residential

campaign advertising, we have two escorts -- two experts. , he is a utguy. mark has been the chief media advisers on a number of successful campaigns, including both of president bush's white house runs. president bush won said i was impressed with mark's creativity and particularly impressed with his honesty. mark's most famous as the cocreator of and the star strategist on the runaway hit political documentary series "the circus." which chronicles the current campaign action every night -- every sunday night on showtime. let's take a look at a short clip. this is a story about john

kennedy his father said, you snowing heavily, it is your daughter's birthday the next morning, and you are supposed to be at a soup kitchen at 6:00 in the morning. the question is not what you do, but would you want to go? the show is incredible, if you have not seen it, use the showtime anytime apt to get caught up. really fascinating. dr. merrick, have a former journalist who heads up at amu.tical center expert on presidential campaign advertising. the second half of our program, mckinnon will moderate and elite panel of campaign veterans from both parties. we are pleased to have sarah

fagan, among other things she was senior strategist for president bush. we also have rush shri for, rnc better in and showed us on governor romney's campaign on 2012. as senior adviser in the white house. let's welcome our three panelists for the second show. [applause] sincereant to offer thanks for karl rove who could not be here tonight but was inordinately helpful in putting together tonight's program. as a non-profit, the bush center does not participate in politics . that does not mean we cannot have fun with some of today's best-known political insiders. join me in welcoming mark mckinnon and dr. pat merrick. [applause] >> we are going to kick this

right off. you just saw one of the first political ads, the eisenhower ad. when i got the great honor of running advertising for the 2000 campaign, one of the first things i did was study the history of advertising in presidential campaigns. it was fascinating because what you see is it really evolves created the reason it evolves is because voters, get used to seeing something and it is not as effective, so you do something differently. you see these different phases, we only have 30 minutes so we will not eat much but the first phase was like selling soap. >> running that first eisenhower campaign, you saw the jingle. that some things change, other things stay the same and there are a number of themes that run consistently through political advertising through today >>.

let's see some of the standard introduction short of -- sort of ads. >> these are ads, if you have humble roots, if you can tie yourself to the american dream, you have to do it. we are going to start with -- should we just play both of them? >> out of the heartland of man dwight d.a eisenhower. he brought us through the triumvirate piece of ve day. >> therefore comes, is this country really ready? >> it is not. the administration has spent many millions of dollars, yet today we have enough change for the fighting in korea.

it is time for a change. eisenhower knows how to deal with the russians, the leaders have them working with us. select the number one man for the number one job of all time. vote for peace, vote for eisenhower. a paid film. --i was born in a little tom town called hope arkansas. i remember that old, two story house where i lived with my grandfather. in 1963 that i went to washington and met president kennedy at the boys nation program. i remember thinking, what an incredible country this was and somebody like me that had no money or anything would be given the opportunity to be president. that is when i decided i could do public service.

i worked my way through law school and after i graduated i did not care about making a lot of money. i wanted to go home and see if i could make a difference. before carter, education and health care made real progress. it is exhilarating to think that as presidents i can help change everybody's lives for the better. >> first impressions are important in life and in politics, these were introductions and i want to tell a quick story about when we introduced president bush at the convention and rush refer put we were shooting it and we interviewed mrs. bush and president bush and there was an exchange in the delivery room and when your daughters were born and you completely scrambled it up and we laughed and we reshot it a couple of times until we got it right. we went into the edit room and

we started to fix it and said, it is great, it is so human. you can imagine the response we got at the campaign, they said get that out, you cannot put that in there. but people hunger for authenticity and it was a human moment. we did not want to raise the bar of expectation. [laughter] the ads that are really powerful are often those that are a play on what people fear, their insecurity. that can be economic security or international security. the next ad is the most famous ad. they would say which ad? the daisy ad, exactly. is reason this is brilliant

creative -- strategically it was powerful. the johnson campaign was smart enough to realize that was a problem. the problem is all of our voters got the impression this thing is over so why come out and vote, we have to raise the stakes. the last line says the stakes are too high for you tuesday home. >> this is picking up on a statement that goldwater had made, talking about the popular use of nuclear weapons in vietnam. this was a fear they wanted to pick up on. , six, 8, 9 4, 5, 6

7, 6, 5, 3, 2, one. >> these are the stakes, to make a world in which all of god's children can live. othert either love each or we must die. >> vote for president johnson on november 3, the stakes are too high for you to stay home. >> vote or die, that is pretty compelling. >> visually, it is stunning. the impact was -- story.t campaigns tell a

this is been argued the second greatest ad in american history. in 28 seconds it does a perfect narrative architecture which is, it talks about a threat or opportunity. it establishes a victim of a threat, a villain -- a villain that is imposing a threat, a resolution of the threat, and a hero. this is ronald reagan, it is called the bear in the woods. >> there is a bear in the woods. for some people, the bear is easy to see. others do not see it at all. they say it is vicious, and dangerous. since no one can be sure who is right, isn't it smart to be as strong as the bear? if there is a bear. is so great, not a

wasted breath. it is part of my exercise to study the history so i went and talked to the guy who made that ad, a famous ad guy. he did the narration too. i understood where it come from, he smoked a pack of cigarettes and had three double bourbons had lunch. [laughter] the campaign manager for that campaign, i talked about this ad and he said, we had to rent that bear and it cost $10,000. he said if you look at it carefully, that was a trained bear. we taught him to back up, so that was a good investment. that -- they are often considered negative ads but you never hear a name mentioned.

it is all implicit. that is pretty rare. in your kind of updating of the bear ad, we do not want to leave anything to the imagination. we want to know exactly who we are talking about. also, ineffective advertising, we do what we call stealing. [laughter] the great idea is we borrow from the best, so we did a version of the bear in the woods at which we call wolves, very much the same idea. his set of russia it was the terrorist threat. the intriguing about this ad, we cut this together very early in the campaign and tested it. it was so effective, it was so good, we decided to wait until a critical moment in the campaign to deploy that at.

another thing we learned, the power of imagination. there are some wolves in this, in some earlier iterations we had the wolves attacking a carcass or something that was pretty on the nose and we discovered that actually if we let the wolves in the woods better., that worked sort of like a horror film if you leave a little to the imagination. this is the wolves ad. >> in an increasingly dangerous world, even after the first ands attack, john kerry congress voted to slash american intelligence operations by $6 billion. they were effectively weakened america's defensive -- defenses. i am george w. bush and i approve this message. [laughter]

>> do you want to set up the next one? >> i think we can move onto talking more about some kind of strategies in negative ads and there is sometimes a sense that negative ads -- that negativity in campaigns is a brand-new thing that only started in say 1988 or something like that. this next ad goes to show that is not necessarily the case. in the 1952 campaign, mr. eisenhower said this about , that must be changed, america wants no more union busters, and no -- and neither do i. that was one more promise mr.

eisenhower did not keep. the general did absolutely nothing about changing the unionbusting features of -- anothery, but he thing, under the republicans, general motors profits are up 113%. it through, let's get an administration that means prosperity for everyone. vote democratic. >> he was a natural. the early days of presidential politics on television, the notion of being .elegenic was a new idea i think bernie sanders would really like that graph. ahead toing to move 1972 at the next couple of ads a kind of adshow

that deals with the flip-flop. this was one that was attacking macguffin. this is a classic kind of campaign ad where you show your opponent saying something differently than what he had, flip-flopping. this is a great ad called the wind sharper -- windsurfer ad. we had video that john kerry had been windsurfing, first of all we thought not a lot of people windsurf and he is wearing these kind of outrageous purple shorts doing this out near some yachts. with thisout brilliant ad with music and score and it is called "the windsurfer ad." >> in 1967, senator george

he would notd advocate a unilateral withdrawal of troops. last year, the senator suggested regulating marijuana along the alcohol, now he is against legalizing it and says he always has been. he suggested a welfare plan that would give $1000 bill to every man, woman, and child. now he says maybe the thousand dollar figure is not right. throughout the year he has proposed unconditional amnesty, now he is running claims he proposed no such thing. in florida, he was pro-busing did --. , this year. the question is, what about next year? [laughter]

>> i am george w. bush and i approve this message. >> in which direction would john kerry lead? he voted for education reform and bow opposes it. he claims he is against medicare premiums, but voted five times to do so. [laughter] [applause] i want to just spend a second on that one because there is an interesting strategic set up. we had completely strategic challenges in both elections. in 1999 we were in a. of economic -- were in a period of economic prosperity. a status quoe

election, people agreed without gore, it was a good environment for a democrat to run. thanks to a great candidate with a clear vision we changed the context of the election and overcame that strategic challenge. we were arguing for change in 2004 weus quo and in were arguing in a time when people were not happy about our foreign engagement. this was a status quo election and we were arguing to keep it the same when people wanted change. 2000 people were arguing for change and we were arguing with status quo, but we were blessed by our opposition in john kerry. part of the reason that ad was effective was there was a albertl time where he -- -- after pledging earlier that she -- we were able to take

advantage of the ad. even if people agreed more with john kerry on the issues, they like president bush because he was clear and compelling core andictions and was steady consistent, which was the opposite of john kerry. that was the big power in how the election turned out. >> i think that is one of the advantages of the flip-flop approach is that you have an attack on the policy and whichever side someone is on the policy, by pointing out that your candidate has been on either side, you arrange everybody and then you also point out there is a lack of consistency whichever way the wind lows. >> one of the differences in campaigns in the last recent years is the evolution of pacs and separate committees that run

advertising on your behalf, supposedly. there is supposed to be legal a lottion and it creates of dissonance with the campaign because sometimes these organizations are doing things that are counter to what you really want to be saying, but you legally cannot control them. sometimes they are helpful, in 2000 four there was an effort on our behalf in an ad that ran in ohio in the myths of a lot -- in of a lot of midst negative campaigning. this ad tells a story, there is narrative -- a architecture. it got into the frame of who is going to keep you safe. mile wife was -- my wife was murdered by terrorists on september 11. bushpresident george w.

came to ohio, she went to see him. -- hewalked by and said turned around and came back and said, i know that is hard, are you all right? >> our president took ashley in his arms and just embraced her and it was at that moment that we saw ashley's eyes fill up with tears. >> he is the most powerful man in the world and all he wants to do is make sure i am a and ok. >> what i saw is what i wanted to see in the heart and soul of the man who sits in the highest elected office in our country. [applause] >> i would feel terrified through that.

other evolution of advertising is we lose control now, we have these pacs that are running ads and we lose control of our message. the other thing is that because of the online capabilities and social media, not just committees, anybody out there can make an ad on your behalf and if it is good enough it will power up. one of my favorite ads is the great apple ad that was produced on behalf of barack obama, but not by the campaign. technically not an ad at all, it never aired on television to my knowledge, it was a viral video. we stretched the definition of political ad when we start including these, but they are clearly persuasive. >> i think it was pretty early #--that set that damage

that dynamic up. very powerful, let's run that. >> i remember to keep telling you exactly where i stand on all of the issues. >> hope you and other people who are hard-working like you and i have been impressed by how serious people are, because we all need to be at the heart of the discussion if we are all going to be part of the solution. honest, serious, hard-working, patriotic people who want to be part of a team, the american team. i hope you have learned a little bit more about what i am andeving and trying to do really helped this conversation about our country get started.

november 2008. >> before the primaries even began. that is brilliant. great stuff. another example is in campaigns now we'll ask their supporters to do a competition to put together an ad. bernie sanders has had some great ads and this is an example of just a supporter who made an ad and it is fantastic. our job is not to divide, our job is to bring people together. if we do not allow them to divide us up by race, sexual orientation, gender, by not

allowing them to divide us up by whether or not we were born in america are whether we are together., we stand white, black, hispanic, day, and .traight, woman, and a man when we stand together and demand that this country work for all of us rather than the americawill transform and that is what this campaign is about. rigging people together. -- bringing people together. [applause] so, they have had a series of ads from supporters and there are great examples in other campaigns but a great power in the community. you can come up with great ads like this.

the one consistent thing about political advertising is great is great. there is sort of evolutions and phases but great advertising is great advertising and the greatest advertising are those that have vision and hope. hope is such a powerful motivator, we talk about hope and fear, with the great candidates really communicate a vision, a hopeful sign that things are going to be better. you have a message of change, how you are going to improve society. at the end of the day, there are lots of different approaches, different concepts, but the powerful and great political ads in campaigns have inspirational messages. i want to close out this section by showing a couple examples. book on how to

build a campaign is, you start with the introductory ad, then you moved to platform adds, then you moved to attack ads but you do not want to leave a bad taste in people's mouth by going negative through the entire election, so you close with vision ads. these technically may not have come in that phase of the election. for instance, the obama ad we are going to see aired in 2000 seven. this is one of the first ads that aired for obama. it laid out his vision by way of introducing himself and defining himself. i am not sure when "morning in aerica" aired, but it is textbook example of laying out a vision. >> when i saw this obama ad, you see that he had a clear and compelling message and was going .o be a contender the last line of the ad may be

my favorite political line -- political advertising line of all time. >> every time i think about my hope for america, the city of washington rolls their eyes. they do not believe we can change politics, they do not ,elieve we can limit the power but if we can trust the american people with the truth. my experience tells me something very different. in 20 years of public service, i have brought democrats and republicans together to solve problems that touch the lives of everyday people. i do find the politics of the moments and opposed the roar -- the war in iraq before it again. this is barack obama,, i approve this message to ask you to believe, not just in my ability

to bring real change to washington, i am asking you to believe in yours. >> that became the slogan that was on their website. asking you to believe not in my power to change, but in your power to change. there is nothing fancy about that ad, talking head with a little bit of walking and talking, but a very powerful message and a real rationale. the bottom of any campaign is clear rationale. let's close this out with the great "morning in america." ronald reagan, the great communicator. this may be midnight in america, this campaign. it is morning again in america. today, more men and women will go to work than ever before in our countries history. with interest rates at about

half the record highs, nearly 2000 families today will buy new homes, more than at any time in the past four years. this afternoon, 6500 young men and women will be married and with inflation at less than half what it was just four years ago, they can look forward with confidence to the future. this -- it is morning again in america, and under the leadership of president reagan, our country is prouder and stronger and better. why would we ever want to return to where we were just four short years ago? >> great stuff. i think we'll talk about our next panel, but, one thing we want to focus on, you look at

this election, right now, and the return on paid advertising has been limited to say the least. and so, the power of effectiveness of advertising in general is really evolved and changed. again, i think that gets to the notion of voters have become very skeptical and know that it therefore, and so the power of free media and somebody like donald trump comes along and has a very different approach. and has spent almost semi-advertising. >> i read that donald trump laid out a vision for a campaign that was run almost exclusively on free media. and the people he was talking to said, you cannot do that in effect, watch me. he said, watch me. so far, he has received almost $2 billion in free media. which is astonishing. >> yes. [laughter] >> put me out of business. they can roll me out to talk about the old days.