steep. our concern has been we have employers a log of about complexity of the determinations. they have not been able to get answers in the way with the speed that they need to get them. but is a new initiative think this is where transparency and engaging with the population is going to be penalized. it should have happened a long time ago. it needs to happen now, it needs to heed them. what their concerns are. >> do you see any efforts towards that direction? >> i think people are trying. i think it is not as open as i would like. i also think some of it is that the irs is not only involved in this. they're getting information from other areas. the law is very complex and there are lots of government agencies involved. it's getting better but we want to see more engagement. we want to see more guidance even if it is put out there in a

temporary format. >> another area with aca. the work week. 30 hours. , the report has failed to issue formal guidance about calculating full-time employers for the employer shared responsibility act. has irs offer ad reason they won't help employers especially when they can't use website and information on the website as a defense for failure to do it the way the irs then says it should? >> right. >> is there a reason why they won't won't help employers understand their obligation? ms. olson: i have not heard a reason. we focused in on the 30-hour calculation because that's what we heard a great deal from employers. they need to have some certainty.

in a way they will accept an answer as long as they have an answer so then they can do their own programing. there is a whole domino effect to this guidance. once you get it out there, people have to program their own systems and do their assurance processes things like that. people are doing the best they can. they are worried they will be penalized and penalties won't be abated if they show food faith effort. we're trying to -- good-faith effort. we're trying to identify issues and raise them with the irs and get them to engage community. >> certainly guidelines ought to be a defense if you attempted to follow it. olson: if you followed what was generic on the website. that goes to the penalty abatement. again, why would you want to ask employer to ask for penalty abatement if they had the guidance. you have indicated in 2014, approximately 412,000

taxpayers overpaid the penalty associated with a failure to comply. the average you stated was $123 per return. what percentage of taxpayers had to make the individual shared responsibility payment. what percentage of taxpayers? olson: i don't know the answer to that. it is in my testimony. i can get you that. mr. walberg 412,000 taxpayers, : what percentage -- olson: i don't know the answer to th but i could give you that. those overpayments were, a lot of them were driven by software, not asking tax payers to identify their exemptions. and so they were actually exempt from having health insurance but they didn't ask, and so, the software didn't ask, and so they didn't tell anybody. and that is also true that some of the preparers didn't ask.

we were able to work with the software companies to get some of those programs changed for this filing season. we'll be looking very carefully at those overpayments to make sure that it doesn't happen again. mr. walberg: thanks for looking. i yield back. >> i thank the gentleman. so, miss olson, one quick follow-up question. is it the guidance ambiguous enough that the irs should consider a waiver of penalties until we get the guidance more specific. ms. olson: my personal opinion is that this law is so complex that for the first year we should be very, very lenient and only apply a penalty where there is truly egregious, in your face ignoring of basic requirements. that this is a learning process and we have to have a partnership with the tax, with the employer population so that

we can identify the issues, get clear guidance out there, use this filing season as a dry run. that is how i would have approached it. >> all right. thank you, miss olson. the chair recognizes the gentleman from massachusetts, mr. lynch, for a series of questions. mr. lynch: thank you, mr. chairman. and i want to thank both of the panelists for your willingness to help the committee with this work. i did have a question that was raised earlier about the affordable care act. part of, a big part of the funding mechanism for the affordable care act was so-called cadillac tax. now the cadillac tax applies to generous health care plans. a lot of union health care plans, i'm a former union president myself. so i have served as a trustee of a health care plan. the tax is about a 40% tax. it applies both to the employer and the employee. congress in its wisdom delayed

the implementation of the cadillac tax until 2020, however the limit stays the same. so thousands and thousands, probably millions of more people will be in that cadillac tax category when 2020 rolls around. on top of that, so, for every dollar over the limit, you will pay a 40% tax. so 40 cents for every dollar you put into your health care over the limit. and it is prorated for employer and employee. so the employee will have to pay more on the tax, this cadillac tax, and employer. and then, i read it more closely. the tax itself, the penalty is tax. so really comes out to like a 58 or 59% penalty on every dollar spent over that limit. i'm just wondering, do employees

and employers know that? do the health care plans -- ms. olson: that is some of the problem with the affordable care act. there are so many moving pieces in it that getting education out about all of these issues is very difficult. i have not looked at the statute specifically to see whether it is indexed for inflation. >> it's not. >> then that would be something we seriously need to look at. mr. lynch: we asked mr. gruber, jonathan gruber, who was one of the architects of this plan, and he explained that it was not adjusted for the rate of inflation because they wanted more and more people over time to be captured by that tax. and you know, i am a former, i will confess i'm a former union attorney and union president. i deal, my history i have dealt with a lot of union plans not only for the iron workers but the teamsters and wardrobe workers.

so all of these plans are going to be -- and a lot of these big companies like gillette and raytheon and all -- funny the people who sat down with their employees and worked out a plan for their health care plan, the people who did the right thing, they're the ones that will be hit with this tax. it's a huge, huge problem. and it's, it's multiplied because of the, because of the amount of the tax. now we have delayed it. so more and more people will be captured. i'm wondering from the irs position, we, are we educating consumers about that? because when it hits, it is going to be like a tidal wave and wipe out a lost health care plans? i'm wondering if we have plans, contingency plans for that event? olson: i think this is something because it so far off it is not something the irs is thinking about messaging. >> yeah.

ofthe dilemma is the cost health care keeps going up. you are telling them because of the tax you want to spend less on health care. it is tough to reconcile. >> from the taxpayer's perspective not indexing it and i understand the policy reasons why you wouldn't, it is like the alternative minimum tax. it is so irrational when the taxpayer sees that number coming up. you can have all the policy reasons in the world but it feels profoundly unfair. >> i could echo what nina says.

the aca has so much complexity to it. the irs is about what insurgents now. -- is urgent now. maybe irs should employ some of their administrative abatement to give taxpayers some relief. caught upare getting on this but not voluntarily. they are just a victim of not knowing the rules. in order to promote voluntary compliance by all means i think you should give them a waiver that first year. >> thank you both. mr. carter: this is obviously very important all of us.

in your 2015 taxpayer advocate to at, you list the right fair and just tax system. you agree that a fair and just the taxem ensures that credits only go to those that are qualified to get them? nina: absolutely. taxpayers need to know that everyone is paying the writer amount of tax. that includes not getting credits that they're not eligible for. carter: the report stated that the improper payments constitute 27% of the 67 billion dollars that were handed out annually through the earned income tax credit.

to $17.7 billion in improper payments. how do taxpayers obtain improper payments? nina: it happens when taxpayers fill out their tax return and claim the earned income tax credit. for manynts can occur reasons. it should be that they are incorrectly stating their income, they could be claiming a child's that they are not eligible to claim because that is where most of the eligibility , the law is very complex and it is easy to fall afoul of it. there are a percentage of those that are attributable to out and out fraud.

mr. carter: has your research indicated that the illegal immigrants have received these improper payments? nina: it should not be possible. the irs does not see that is a carter:sue because mr. not as a major issue, but is it an issue? nina: i don't think it is. you have to have a social security number and use that on your return. mr. carter: the we are not naive enough to believe that there are not fraudulent social security numbers out there. if an undocumented person files to return with some the else's number that is identity theft. i don't know that we

are necessarily going to agree on this. is it possible for an illegal immigrant who was granted , protected status, under president obama's executive action, can they claim the earned income tax credit? nina: if they have a social security number and are , i don'td for work know about that program, but if claim the they could earned income tax credit under the law. mr. carter: so the answer to my question is yes. have a social security number authorized for work.

your spouse has to have a social security number authorized for work. and your child's has to have a social security number authorized to work. carter: i understand the overpayments have increased since 2005. nina: there may have been an increase. mr. carter: is it possible that increase could be attributed to illegal immigrants? nina: my personal opinion is not. carter: do any of the studies indicate that? nina: none of the irs studies indicate that. error for the the earned income tax credit, it is attributable to overstated

income. mr. carter: i am specifically interested in the illegal immigrants who are getting this. is, is theestion administration addressing this at all? nina: the irs is certainly looking at undocumented persons who don't have social security numbers getting credits that they shouldn't be getting. atare certainly looking that. mr. carter: i certainly hope so. about this conversation talking about a fair and just tax system. i yield back the balance of my time. with theman: electronic filing, that being your expertise, do you see the

electronic filing as increasing the likelihood of identity theft at the irs? mr. butler: i think it is one of the elements that enable it. it offers the opportunity for tax id thefts to beat the irs to the refund. if an electronic filing has increased the likelihood of going moreeft, digital as you mentioned, with that exacerbates chances of identity theft? mr. butler: it could.

it very well could. if you adopt industry standards of authentication, it may work in the opposite direction. in one thing we don't have our system is we don't verify taxpayers before they file. anyone can come and go. offering the opportunity for identity thefts to take someone's identity and go with it. if we could authenticate taxpayers before they file we would know who they are. chairman: you make your living with people being able to file electronically your group does. mr. butler: original goal was to get the irs from the 15% e-filing rate to 80%. and we have gone past that.

the chairman: you have private stakeholders that are making a profit taste on that and the potential danger is that because that we aremodel getting additional taxpayer identity theft, the hard orstion is what liability what protection does the private sector have versus the federal government. questionhe fundamental we have to have. is this all the irs is preparerility or the /authenticator as you have mentioned. mr. butler: it is definitely a shared effort. find whereg to software companies can go ahead and put in those additional authentications and they have done that. but understand that the protection on the back end of it is still ultimately prevention.

prevention would be a better method. the chairman: what impediments are you finding that would stop the private stakeholders from assisting the irs with that authentication process? butler: the irs's willingness to do so. the irs is clearly the tax administrator. them dealing with private industry, they are doing it more and more. the chairman: we are trying to go to a virtual customer service representative. so you are saying they are not willing to help the stakeholders authenticate?

is a pretty bold statement. if it is true we need to address it. that is a bold statement. butler: the irs needs to view us as a partner. at definitely need to look the best technology out there. i'm not sure that looking inside the irs to understand it is the best place. chairman: how can mr. lynch and i assist you with the irs to make sure that it is a hand in glove approach versus a contentious approach? esther butler: it is tenuous. mr. butler: i said tenuous.

by encouraging the irs to work with private industry. there needs to be a partnership, a true partnership, between the industry and the irs when it comes to all things related to technology. the irs can't be expected to be a technology leader. there are many other people out there who are technology leaders. the chairman: they are still programming in cobol. so i understand. lynch: we have recounted some of the weaknesses in the irs system. the lack of personnel. lack of communication between taxpayers and the irs. the risk of id theft through

filings. do we have any idea how many false tax returns get filed every year? nina: there are millions. mr. lynch: the health care information component that is come in. the infrastructure weaknesses well. i understand some of the programs they are using date back to the kennedy administration which is sad. about theed presumption of compliance by the american people. i think most people pay their taxes and try to do the right thing. i know other countries were that is not the norm. greece. very low compliance with tax laws. very few people pay the taxes. wondering with all these

obstructions that i'm listing here are we going to see a lower rate of tax compliance? you should get off the grid. is that something that might result because of these problems? nina: i think that last year's filing season when we had shut such a low percentage of the phone calls answered by the irs, when you take a payment at a walk insight. this is sending a message that we can't deal with you. the taxpayer will say that if you can't deal with me i will deal with you. the irs will eventually find you and i will be very important .npleasant when that happens my concern is about the future. we have this bright picture of the future of our technology is

so far behind today and we're just talking about a customer account. but the data into that customer account has to come from about 200 different case management systems. tryingre employees today to talk to somebody on the phone and you have to talk to somebody else to get the answer to that. i don't know how this is going to merge in an online account. you also have a percentage of don't or won't use these accounts. for very good reasons. as we try to protect the security of the taxpayer? , and we can't have one week. if we said hi we will have people drop out.

irs right now is testing a version of the online accounts with senior management and nonbargaining unit employees. so these are people that are fairly sophisticated financially. those long tears could not get through the online account the first time. mr. lynch: thank you for answering my question. chairman: ms. olson, i want to come back to a few things that have been mentioned here. we have a greater need for personal contact. even with the online tools that when there is a letter that comes in the irs that there is a desire to have not just a personal contact but someone who can manage the system and the frustration that

i heard the room was about hours of holding, just trying to get a real person somewhere to answer the questions. when they call back, they don't leave enough detail and is actually leaves this feeling that they passed the football back but they are not sure who are getting the past from. input different from what you have heard in your other panels across the country? olson: we've heard this consistently. we have heard it from taxpayers and practitioners. they want to talk to the irs. the taxpayer doesn't understand the notice that they have received.

the practitioners said they would find the online account very helpful because they can look at the background and they can go online to their account but then they would want to call the irs. they would also use the accounts to monitor what happened after they talked to the irs and they said we will do ask. so it could get rid of some phone calls. it might give you to phone calls and of every transaction. critical, let me hear from you, they want that interaction. the chairman: part of that is a resource issue. but there is also a commitment issue. having to schedule an appointment for walk up centers.

we all love the fact that we need an appointment but the other part of that is what is perplexing to me is you have a willing taxpayer willing to give some of their hard-earned dollars to the irs and show up and they are saying we can't take the payments because you don't have an appointment. is that correct? is that not insane? i have worked in collections. ms. olson: i agree, it is insane. i don't understand the policy. there.taxpayer standing the chairman: we heard a little bit about a corrective memo that would suggest that as people comply and they say here's my down payment. if they are not up to speed on

all their tax returns, we have taken that money and held it and said you need to get caught up. we will be able to agree to this. when someone comes in with a check and the compromise that if they are not caught up that we are sending the check back to the taxpayer? ms. olson: we had a memo this we said we are sending the money back to you and sending the offer back and getting compliance. the chairman: is that not insane? ms. olson: yes it is insane. chairman: we have americans willing to pay their taxes and we have the irs giving the money or refusing to take the

money because they don't have an appointment. that should be headlines. do toan mr. lynch and i help him see the error of their olson: i think raising this in this hearing has done a lot. but the irs needs to do a better job what makes these decisions and analyzing the consequences of these decisions. not just looking at we are saving money because we are not handling these in person contacts for $60. the chairman: would you be willing to give this committee in the next 45 days or so your

recommendations on what do?slative fixes we could do is tould like to make sure in a bipartisan way we address this. .here are a number of others i'm about to recognize the gentleman from ohio. thank you for being here. we had earlier this week the gao hearing talking about the 300 and $5 billion tax gap that exists? would you agree that is a pretty accurate figure, 385 billion?

olson: it is as correct as it could be. there is an unknown tax gap. >> all the americans who pay their taxes would hope that the revenue would be generated and they would get the type of service that they expect from their government. .hat is not happening ms. olson: we've seen it as a surtax on the taxpayers who are paying their taxes. gao had 112 recommendations for the irs that would help deal with the significant tax gap. are understanding is that the to 53 ofstly limited those 112 recommendations.

that seems to be not reflective of what is best for taxpayers. the chairman was just talking about this appointment issue. which is crazy. insane. did any of the 112 recommendations deal with that issue? so there should be 113 recommendations. the one thing i'm concerned about is an irs that won't recommendations that make sense. that will help taxpayers and treat them with the respect that they deserve. this is something that could harm taxpayers. this whole stingray operation. are you familiar with what stingray technology does?

olson: i understand what you're talking about. >> the witness who was here earlier this week said he 37 times this technology which without a probable cause warrants was used on american taxpayers. by the irs. good point, there are other agencies using it to. irs is currently in the process of purchasing an of thenal stingray unit cost of $700,000. that is in the

best interest of taxpayers? ms. olson: i don't know that i have enough information to answer that question. i would need to know who was going to use it and what other protections for using it. if it were available to anyone tothe civil side of the irs do process protections and court of those 112 , do any of those to purchase anrs additional stingray technology unit? ms. olson: not that i know of.

so it infringes on those very taxpayers you are supposed to advocating for. their most fundamental liberties. ms. olson: i share your concerns. chairman: the chair recognizes the gentleman from new york. maloney: the irs is developing the taxpayer experience of the future. a virtual taxpayer assistance through online accounts will replace the personal interaction for digital savvy taxpayers. bythis plan has been driven the lack of appropriate funding and continual cutbacks in the operations of the irs. opinion, does the plan have the potential for making

the agency more efficient in saving money for the future? ms. olson: i personally don't think so. ms. maloney: if you were to move is itd with this program, necessary for congress to make a lot of contributions to the cost of it? olson: it will require some significant upfront costs. i couldn't give you an estimate right now. parts of it are in the president's budget proposal. because we have systems that are we're just very archaic in our systems, to pull off something like this and haven't really integrated will cost a lot of money. the total reengineering of the

of the irs. made --bservation is future challenges require digital transformation at the irs and you state that the irs needs to transform its taxpayer services and compliance capabilities for the efficiency through digital tools. it has been reported that some of the irs systems date back to the kennedy administration. support theystems transformation you are talking about? but this will not happen overnight. theyrs needs to build if want to have an online presence, and online taxpayer service, they need to start iterating on that now which means give us a solid line of what the details are and start improving on each iteration. the irs develops its capabilities, those systems that support those capabilities will need to be upgraded. maloney: the irs

commissioner acknowledges the responsibility to serve all taxpayers including those who prefer personal over digital interaction. i guess i will ask this question to both of you -- is there anything that you have not seen in this plan that you believe should have been included to improve taxpayer services? >> my disagreement with the irs we all agree that an online account is vitally important. my disagreement is the online account is not going to orstitute for in person telephone assistance, that personal contact. it will supplement it. the federal reserve has borne that out in its survey over the last five years that people who are mobile banking users visit their branches on average three times in the month before the survey.

about 87%, it's an extraordinary percentage. people want multiple choices. they will use the online account. they will also use the phone and they will also do face-to-face. we should provide that to them and i don't see that in the plan. i agree with those statements. this is not a replacement. this is absolutely not a replacement. we need to go online. the irs needs to go online and serve taxpayers where they want to be served. there are increasing preferences as millennials come online. fire 50%ssionals who of the returns want to interact with the irs for basic information digitally. when he gets to more company at of texan ministration like of taxnce, -- administration, like compliance, people want to talk to the irs but they should be able to interact with them online as well. ey: i agree with you, it's the way of the future.

>> your state is a great example of that. maloney: everything is online, they are not even reading normal newspapers. we have to go towards this. is the irs moving toward going online or not? >> that is definitely the view of the future. ney: can you interact online now? >> no, you cannot. the irs last october took off the only service it had where you could e-mail a question and have someone answered back to you. even as it's moving forward, it's moving backward. >> i thank the gentlewoman. i thank both of you for your testimony and they have called both and with only got a few minutes left. i think we're both going to skipper closing remarks and say thank you so much for being here today. if there is no further business for the committee, the committee stands adjourned. [captions copyright national

cable satellite corp. 2016] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org]

>> hillary clinton is setting aside the turnstiles of the new york state -- the new york of losand the freeways angeles today after's big medicament committee college, she will attend a fundraiser hosted by george clooney and his wife. the los angeles times reports some of the tickets cost more than $33,000. to dine with the former secretary of state. california's primary is on june 7. hillary clinton is heading back to new york tomorrow ahead of tuesday's primary. senator bernie sanders is also in new york sunday. speakers at his rally in brooklyn's prospect park include

congressman tulsi gabbard and actor danny devito and we will have that live for you on c-span tomorrow. joining us now from new york is the survey research baruch college in new york. she was the manager of polling operations at nbc news. thank you so much for joining us. guest: thank you. host: you are here to discuss the state of the new york presidential campaign with the primaries on tuesday. it looks like donald trump and hillary clinton are in the lead in their respective primaries. how solid are they? guest: at the moment, they are both very solid. donald trump is really running away with it. he may not get the enormous margin we have been seeing in

the poll but he is certainly winning by a substantial amount. he is winning among every single demographic group and all across the state. host: what about hillary clinton? guest: hillary clinton also has a solid lead. it is not as large as donald trump's lead over his rivals but it's also a double-digit lead in every poll. even if that were to tighten up somewhat, she still looks like a pretty safe bet for winning. and also winning across the state. host: have you seen their support change or evolve? has it changed over the past few weeks? did the debate thursday night make a difference at all? guest: i have not seen numbers since anything done since the debate. i don't know if it has had an

effect. my guess is it probably did not. it may have solidified people on one side or the other. i don't think it probably changed a lot of mines. -- minds of. what we have seen all through the campaign and it's certainly true now is that among the democrats, the very young, the under 30's, are very solidly for bernie sanders. older voters are very solidly for hillary clinton. that is not really changed. we also see other differences which have not changed much. bernie sanders had been trying to make inroads into the black community. also african-american voters and hillary clinton really has a very solid lead among african-americans. host: tell us a little about new york primaries.

how does it work? guest: it is definitely a closed system. new york is a very closed system. not only do you have to be registered in the party, you have to have done that a long time ago. if you are going to change your party registration, you had to do that in 2015. you had to do that more than six months ago. if you are a new registrant and this is your first time, you can register a month ahead. there is no same day registration. you must be registered in the party you're going to vote in that primary. we only have voting on primary day. we don't have early voting. host: we will open up the phone lines to our callers as well.

if you want to call in with your question or comment, you can call on these numbers -- we have a special phone line voters from new york. you can also find us on social media. we are talking with mickey blum. you mentioned the new york system is a closed primary, one that requires early registration to vote. how does that affect the out come of the race on tuesday, do you think? guest: it certainly might affect the democratic outcome. many of the young voters, if they did not know to register a month ahead, if this was their first time, maybe they are for

bernie sanders but wilma be able -- but will not be able to vote for him. in other states, independents have been able to influence the vote on one side or the other what they really cannot in this election. they would have had two of figure that out and changed registration many months ago. that usually helps hillary clinton when it is a closed primary. on the republican side, i don't know that it will make a huge difference. as i said, it's a landslide for donald trump. i don't think he will win by the same and arbors -- enormous margins we see in the polls. when people see there's a norm is margin, they don't feel quite as compelled to come out.

nevertheless, he will win by a lot and it won't matter that it's a closed system. it might have mattered if there were independents that chose to come in and vote against trump but they will not be able to. host: our first caller is from new york. henry is on the democratic line. who do you support? caller: good morning, my question is two parts. my comment is that it appears that your data is predebate. that's an interesting thought, am i correct? guest: that's right. caller: my question is, what percentage of new york democratic voters inhabit the southern tier of new york state?

of those democratic voters, what do you project of those voting in this election? what is the percentage of u.s. registered them accredit voters voting and what percentage of them inhabit the southern tier? that's a simple question for a pollster. guest: it's not really ever terribly simple any primary to know how many will turn out. the democratic registration in new york is heavily weighted to the southern tier of new york. it is mostly the southern tier of new york. it's new york city and the suburbs. how many will turn out -- i think this will be a very large turnout for a democratic primary. it's been a long time since we have had one in new york. we have not had a presidential

democratic primary in new york since 2008. i think the turnout will probably be even heavier. hillary clinton beat barack obama at the time in the new york primaries. i think she is probably again set to beat bernie sanders. what percentage will turn out in that sector, i would be hesitant to say. i think it will be larger than what we usually see. primaries usually don't have very large roles of people. people vote in the general election and don't often vote in primaries. this is a much less common thing ies have gotten so much more attention.

i think there will be a good turnout on both sides. host: our next caller is from miami beach, florida on the independent line. go ahead. are you there? caller: yes. host: turn down your television of its on. caller: good morning. [indiscernible] i have a question. [indiscernible] after new york votes, who gets the delegates? [indiscernible] i want to know if new york

[indiscernible] host: all right. guest: new york has an interesting system, a delegate system on the republican side. every state is somewhat different in how the delegates are given out at least on the republican side. in new york, in order r donald trump to win all of the ella in newof the delegates york which, by the way, mitt romney did in 2012, he would have to win more than 50% of the popular vote across the state. but he also would have to win more than 50% in each of the congressional districts. that is a lot harder because some of those are very large and some of those have really very few republicans. some are heavily democratic. donald trump would have to win

the republicans in each of those districts in that heavily democratic southern tier where there are small groups. that is where i think ted cruz and john kasich campaigns have targeted specific district to pick up a few delegates. he should certainly when the overwhelming number of delegates even if he doesn't win all of them. he certainly has a chance to win all of them. on the democratic side, is proportional -- it is proportional. it's the same way all across the country in primaries. it's whatever the proportion is of the vote, that's how the delegates are given out. they don't have to -- there is

not a winner take all system. host: from kentucky, our next caller on the republican line. go ahead. caller: good morning. i am amazed at how uneducated and out of touch the american people are about their politics. if they inc. their vote matters -- if they think their vote matters in these things, it they are absolute crazy. the democrats and republicans act like they are enemies. they go back and forth in front of the tv but once they are off tv, they are colluding together to full the american people into thinking their vote really matters. the powers that be already know who the next president will be. people around the world are absolutely laughing at the american people and how obtuse they are an uneducated about

their politics. guest: i want to make a comment on that. i don't think it's uneducated to believe that your vote counts. i think your vote does count. i think people should get out and express their opinions and their votes. i strongly believe in our system that people should vote and their votes to count. that is how we elect. i don't think it is being done behind closed doors by someone. host: hillary clinton has an ad targeting new york voters. here is a little bit of that. [video clip] >> he says we should punish women who have abortions. >> there has to be some form of

punishment. >> he says mexicans of come to america are rapists. and that we should ban muslims from coming here at all. >> donald trump says we can solve america's problems by turning against each other. it's wrong and it goes against everything new york and america stands for. >> with so much at stake, she is the one tough enough to stop trump. hillary clinton. host: our guest is mickey blum from baruch college. what you think about this ad? guest: it's interesting because it is already targeting donald trump and targeting the general election and speaking about her as a general election candidate. one of the things in the polls that we see is that even though in many polls bernie sanders does slightly better in match ups, most voters actually think she has a better chance to win.

people who are trying on the democratic side, for whom picking a candidate who can win in november are actually more likely to choose hillary clinton. that seems to be a part of what she is saying. plus, the very issues she is highlighting are truly important to democratic voters. they are likely to motivate voters. the abortion issue is much more important in new york state. it's more important to democratic voters and republican voters. it is also true that the people who care most about abortion are more likely to be voting for hillary clinton. it matters a great deal to women and women are pretty solidly supporting hillary clinton. she also pointed out the issues

about immigration and about muslims. those are issues in which new yorkers have perhaps different feelings from people in some other parts of the country. new york is filled with immigrants and new yorkers are unhappy with what they think are anti-immigrant statements. they are not in favor at least new york democrats, of surveillance of muslims. she is hitting on the issues that we see in the polls which favor democrats and are strongly important specifically to her voters. she is helping to get out her own vote.

host: next caller is from trenton, new jersey on the democratic line. caller: yes, thank you, good morning. i was curious about the way that you count newly registered voters in the state? i understand they were maybe 45,000 new voters signing up for the new york primary. i'm wondering whether or not your estimates include those newly registered voters. can you say something about the methodology you use for counting voter preferences? guest: sure, thank you for asking. when we do our sampling, we doubt get it from earlier voter registration lists. we do random sampling so we can get everybody and anybody across the state.

this is through land lines and cell phones and we do with live interviewers, no robo calling. we ask people about their registration and ask them about their intention to vote. we ask some questions also about past voting. we do some weighting to determine who we think will be the most likely voters. we give everybody a chance to be in it and we ask people if this is their first vote for they were too young to vote in the past and if there is a reason why they are registering or voting this time and have not in the past so we don't exclude them from the likely voters. we know there are people for whom this may be their first vote.

it may be very important. we believe there is a reason they just shut up to register. -- just showed up to register to vote. that's because they really do intend to come out. host: our next caller also come from new york on the republican line. caller: hello. there are still republicans in new york state. unlike elizabeth warren, i am a native american. the democrats have turned my state into a cesspool. you have people fleeing and then you go on this abortion issue. i am pro-life. to me, democrats are pro-death. it's just horrible. people do not let the democrats get any holding your state or

you will ruin it like they ruined my state. host: who do you support in this election cycle? caller: i actually support john kasich area i would not vote for donald trump, he is a democrat. host: that's linda from new york. new york is a very strong sense of identity, a state identity. is there something special in the way that candidates need to approach campaigning in new york? does new york wettability matter? guest: -- credibility matter? guest: i don't think i can remember a time when primaries were being dominated by people who don't have some connection to new york which both democratic candidates and a donald trump certainly have. i think that matters.

i think it mattered that ted cruz made the comment he did about new york values. i think that hurt him among new yorkers and new york voters on both sides. the last voter was a john kasich voter and john kasich is second in new york. he is a gifted second but he is coming in -- he is a distant second but he is coming in second and all of the polls. ted cruz is the one not getting support. host: we have a clip of the ad that ted cruz played in iowa in january about new york values. [video clip] >> i lived in new york city and manhattan all my life area my views are a little bit different than if i lived in

iowa. >> they are different like on abortion. >> what president trump ban abortion? >> i am pro-choice never respect. >> what does he think about iowa? >> how stupid are the people of iowa? >> new york values, not ours. >> my views are a little the different than i lived in iowa. mickey bare talking to college.baruch was this a blunder by ted cruz? yes, it helped and in iowa at the time. i think perhaps he was trying to show the contrast with donald on variousrtain ways issues. but pointing it out as new york values, now that he is running in new york, he may not have ought at the time he was going

to need support in new york. at this point, it is hurting him because i think a lot of new yorkers perceive that as an insult to the state, to the city, and to its voters. even among republicans come i think we saw that the other night when there was that dinner. it was a gop dinner and he was largely ignored. host: next caller is coming from new jersey, kevin on the independent line. good morning to you. caller: hi there. my question is this -- the unbound delegates and the superdelegates in 2016, all of firstwere before even the debate for either party started.

>> to me, i would rather see donald trump or bernie sanders rather than the others because they are taking away the votes from the people. john kasich come a to me, is the worst as he has no chance of winning print he said at one of his town halls, we will see how democracy works. that is not how democracy works. my question is, could this be a supreme court issue if the party is disenfranchising voters? guest: that is an interesting question. i don't think so. i think the parties have a right to make their rules the way they are making them. this is not the general

election. -- parties decide for themselves what the rules are and how the delegates are selected. i will say, while there are unbound delegates and there are -- on the republican side, and there are superdelegates on the democratic side, they are certainly not be majority of delegates. -- not the majority of delegates. the -- they are the minority. , fornk at this point example on the democratic side, give the superdelegates hillary clinton a big boost and her lead over senator sanders, she is still leading senator sanders, even just among the actual elected delegates, not the superdelegates. the superdelegates have a right

to shift, which is one of the things that has happened in the past, and did happen in 2008, for example when some of the superdelegates changed over to the barack obama. with unbound delegates, they are unbound, and they can be persuaded to go one way or the other, but it is clearly up to the parties to decide they want .o have some percentage the parties and how they run primaries and-- caucuses, those things are decided state-by-state. there may be some rules, especially on the democratic -- we have think seen on the republican side, there are very different rules going state to state about how delegates are selected. that is a state issue. it is how we run the election.

they are run by the state. the fact that you have to register by party or not by party, or register early, or when you get to vote, is there early voting. when is the early voting, if there is? that kind of thing, again, those our state decisions. areur state decisions -- state decisions. that is the system. even in the general, we go state-by-state. elect what are called our electors. we don't just go by the popular vote, which is why in the year 2000 george w. bush won the outdoor wonn though wonpopular vote -- al gore the popular vote.

each of us has a voice and our state and party to try to change things if we do not like it, but that is the system. that is the way it has been for a while. host: will take another call on the republican line. : i would like to say, i am actually from below, new york, the other place -- buffalo new york, he other place in new york. i live in texas. what's direct impacts the delegate count of the primary election in new york will be? micheline: it is really keyed on all sides. for donald trump, if he runs the table and actually get all of those delegates, it really gives

him a much better chance of getting to the 1237 that he needs to secure a nomination avoid the convention, to an open convention, obviously. on the flipside, it matters to cruise -- ted cruz and john kasich that they tried to keep him from getting -- from doing that. from getting the -- all of the delegates in new york. every delegate matters. it could turn out to be quite close. on the democratic side, a lot of this has a huge number of the delegates. delegates do matter, but i think a lot of what matters in new york on the democratic side probably has to do even more with a perception and momentum and whether or not bernie

sanders can do better than expected here, or whether lead, andlds onto her takes the state. i couple of comments from twitter. new york requiring people to register several months ago is a huge form of voter suppression. so hypocritical. this one says independent voting sites can be made a nightmare. it says people are racing to the polls because they expect many bernie sanders voters will show up who cannot vote. -- democratsics and republicans are allowed to cast ballots tuesday. was october 9 come a long presidential election was on their radar. the story goes on to say that election workers have been advised not to argue with insistent independents whose names are not in the poll books.

what do respect to happen on tuesday? micheline: i think that is true. ideank most people had no that if they wanted to change the registration, they had to do that last fall. i cannot imagine why anyone would think they had to do it in the previous year. i completely agree that it is a form of voter suppression. whatever the reason was for instituting in the first place, whether it was so that people would not start changing at the last minute to somehow play ores with the other parties for whatever reason, it may have been put in, i think it is a really bad idea. i absolutely believe that we should -- i am a strong believer in voting.

i do believe that everyone should get out and vote. that is what our democracy is all about. i would like to see a much more open system in new york and everywhere. host: let's get to another caller from new york. mrs. joe. -- this is joe. joe: good morning. you still there? host: we are still here. joe: i am listening to the comments being made, so far, what i do not hear is a level of common sense. it is like, the one you're just talking about didn't realize you needed to change it in october. it was a non-issue then. it still should be a nonissue now because it is a condition that existed then, not now. if it is something that is a problem now, then any future you should turn around and try to take care of. -- care of it.

it is not a suppression. it was already in existence before. that would be one. i think that it is not as though the party decided to suppress the vote right now and to this -- and did this, or did this this year. these are not new rules. york systemhat new is unusual and it is not just closed, but in many ways more closed than other systems because it is harder to make a shift should you want to. since there are more people who , they may notts realize, especially if they came from other states that that means they would not be able to the -- to vote in either primary. host: betty from texas is on the

republican line. betty: yes. you are wanting me to -- host: go ahead, betty, turned on your tv. -- turn down your tv. betty: i am calling in in reference to donald trump. you know, i love my country. most people love their country, 99% of them. we have a free country. -- ouro not cast service vote, therefore we have no right to complain about who or what party is in charge. trump is if donald ,ailroaded by the coalition there is going to be a swell of thiscans rising up against

-- we are going to have a protest from the american people that has not been seen in decades. donald trump may not have the experience as a politician, but you know, that is exactly what you need -- we need at this time. all right, that is betty, from l campo, texas. i think there are many voters this year that believe it is good to have somebody from outside the system. poll was we saw in the that people who were for donald trump feel that if he does not get the nomination at this point, that a majority of new who were voting for donald trump want him to then run as a third-party candidate. that they suddenly

have a second choice, most of them did not want any of the other candidates as a second choice, and would like to see him run as a third-party candidate if they feel that he is being denied that nomination. i think what you're hearing as -- is there are a lot of donald trump supporters that are concerned that an open convention will try to take away the nomination. host: let's try to get in a few more colors -- callers. let's start with maria on the independent line. maria: yes. host: go ahead, maria. turn down your tv. maria: can i talk? host: you can talk.

maria: i am 78. i am 78 years old i was democrat all my life. i want to seerson -- a woman president. this time i cannot vote for clinton. if we vote for clinton, we have a world war iii. ok. that is where we are. the system is rigged. they should have had elizabeth warren run. i am for bernie sanders right now. i know they will not let him be president. host: all right, that is maria from new jersey. let's hear from our final caller. john, from glenview, illinois, is calling on the democrat

applied -- line. john: good morning. a couple of points. the comment is both on the show and a lot of previous c-span shows that i have watched on the topic, there seems to be some confusion that maybe you can help clear up. people have asked -- a previous caller asked about going to the supreme court about it being a unfair system. in any given state. i have never seen anybody respond to the callers to that it ist just done on a state-by-state level, but the parties are private organizations. very similar to a private business or any other private entity. they are not part of the cup government -- heart of the government. -- part of the government. most people do not understand that they are not part of the

government. right.ne: you are quite that is exactly true. if you are not happy with what a party does, you're not required to vote for that party or be a member of that party. you can be a member of a different party, whether it is the two major parties or of minor parties or starting a new party. you are quite right. the government does not run the parties. howgovernment does not run primaries or caucuses are run. they are run by the parties. it is your choice to affiliate yourself with a party if you wish to come or not. -- two, or not. voting in the general election is different. that will be run by the government. it is run state-by-state, but that will be run by the government.

you will be able to vote and it if youare -- and it's are registered as a voter, whether or not you are a member of any party. , you cannot participate in a party's election if you are and is inf that party that state that party chooses to have it is a closed system. you are quite right, these are private organization. this is not -- the parties are not run by the government. host: that is all the time we have for this segment. talking with nikki blonde -- blunt. thank you for taking the time. theur live coverage of presidential race continues tuesday night with the new york

state primary. join us at 9:00 eastern. to theyou on the road white house on c-span, c-span radio, and c-span.org. ♪ >> madam secretary, we proudly toe 72 of our delegate votes the next president of the united states, ♪ [cheering crowd] ♪ >> c-span's washington journal,

live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. bunk --orning, filled sam banker, correspondent from the national journal will preview an oral arguments challenging president obama's executive action on immigration. the new bookor of about the people who reshapes the founding fathers vision for america. be sure to watch c-span's washington journal on sunday morning. join the discussion. >> in his weekly address, the president explains his support for allowing consumers alternatives to traditional cable set-top boxes. senator tom cotton of arkansas livers the republican response. -- delivers the republican response. he gives his reaction to the iran nuclear agreement. efforts for sanctions on

iran. president obama: hello everyone, one of our strengths is the free market. it is the lifeblood of our economy, it is how we at -- create jobs, expand opportunity, and give everyone success. it is what made america the strongest country on earth. the most essential ingredient is called edition. -- competition. right now too many companies are engaging in behaviors that stifle competition like blocking competitors, or limiting options to give consumers real choice. the rest ofnce is us pay higher prices for lower quality -- workers receive lower wages. small businesses and offer newer is can be squeezed out of the market. none of that is fair or good for the economy. the deck should not be stacked in favor of the wealthiest individuals and the biggest corporations against working americans. that is why my administration is doing everything we can to

reverse the trend and promote more competition in the marketplace. in addition to enforcing the rules in the books, i have directed federal agencies to identify and time competitive figure in -- competitive behavior in industries. one industry is cable tv. of cable and satellite tv customers rent set-top boxes from their providers. according to one survey this cost households an average of more than $230 per year. we spent some $20 billion to rent these devices. while we have almost unlimited choice in what we watch on television, from traditional programming to online content, there is next to no opposition to build a better, yusor finley products that allows you to easily access all of the content in one place. most consumers rent whatever the cable company offers, because we have to. that means countries have little incentive to innovate.