republicans talk to the media about their final report. ♪ >> c-span's washington journal, live every day with news of the issues that impact you. coming up wednesday morning, with the release of the benghazi report, we want to open the conversation to you for your phone calls, e-mails and tweets. we will move the conversation to immigration policy in the u.s., including the decision on president obama's immigration order. our recent visit to laredo, texas we talked to officials and others in the border town about immigration. focus the immigration debate around the brexit campaign. watch washington journal on c-span. join the discussion. >> president obama travels to canada for a visit.

the three leaders hold a joint news conference wednesday, live at 3:00 p.m. eastern in ottawa. you can see it here on c-span. later our coverage continues as president obama i just as the canadian parliament. that is at 5:45 eastern here on c-span. >> this weekend on c-span city's tour, along with our comcast cable partners. we will explore the history of utah. -- who has we will been collecting rare books for the past 30 years, showcases many of his great finds including brigham young's copy of the book of mormon. >> thomas payne went to robert bell and wanted to have this printed. buyanted to proceeds to soldiers mittens.

after it went through three periods, they had a falling out. thomas payne allowed anybody to printed. -- to print it. that is why the book is so well known. >> the author of a peculiar people talks about anti-mormonism in america since its founding in the 1830's through its current troubles and the origins of the animosity. >> kind of properly in that because not only are they a minority, but they are a religious minority who have figured in disproportionately visible ways in the debates about religion. x american history tv take a tour of brigham young university school -- university museum of paleontology. he talks about how the fossils were gathered in utah and how dr. jensen changed the way fossils are displayed.

>> you can find armature and the steel supports, the animal looks more alive in a sense you get the feeling that these are bones, but it brings life to these bones. >> j spencer bloom encumber -- insion of history 1847, they begin setting up families -- and mormon -- in 1849 this weekend, watch on c-span2 store must be as book tv and sunday afternoon on american history to the on c-span3. the c-span cities tour, working with our cable affiliates and visiting cities across the country. >> now, a hearing on the fight against isis. the special presidential envoy brett mcgurk testified before the senate for relations --

senate foreign relations committee for an hour and 45 minutes. before the committee for an hour and 45 minutes.

>> we will come to order. mr.mcgurk with most of you ortify,, whether classified public, we leave more informed, -- livefully you will a up to that today. after he began military operations, isis has lost territory. lettor in iraq, and 20% -- me use my glasses here, brett, just one second. to yourording territory. unfortunately, that progress on creates new threats to our special interest, as our cia director said this, as you continue to make gains, isis will likely intensify its global terror campaign and that the administration's efforts have not reduce the root of austria's terrorism give ability and

global reach. "the new york times" reported 1200 people outside of iraq and -- have not reduce the roots of terrorism and give the ability of global reach. in the wake of the recent terrorist attack in orlando, we expect you provide and hope you will provide an honest assessment of where the global fight against isis is going and address some of the fundament of questions we all have. in particular, i would like to to your take on the actions address the terror threat by isis, and in spite of their losses in iraq and syria, again, which we herald, and how the coalition plans to defeat isis militarily. some of the other questions i do theseanswer include syria democratic forces, and i think there is a lot of confusion about the various coalitions that are countering

ad and also countering isis which is mainly made up of kurds , have enough people to clear them from the northern syria area, and even if we continue to take back territory from isis, are those gains backed by a little process necessary to sustain them? there are rubs between that group and others and between that group and turkey fell, and as we leave it to its own accord, if you will, with these groups taking on isis in their own ways and taking on ways, will it own take us down the road to a settlement, or is the success of the battleground leading to the same vacuum it created isis in the first place. finally, what about the glaring disparity and a failing to matter process dependent upon a .ransition from assad

i do not see how the isis coalition can be successful while the syrian civil war continues. this a ministration has declared that assad must go, but it certainly appears at that position is changing or has changed. i do not see how what is left of the political process possibly leads to a thought's -- to assad's departure. home and our at military response to isis does not reflect the threat to the united states. i think many of us grow frustrated with the administration's optimistic rhetoric that does not often match results. having proxies to the fighting is creating a range of diplomatic problems that will have ramifications for years to come. with that, a gimp, i want to thank you for your service to our country. i want to thank you for the way suchalk with all of us in

a direct manner, and we look forward to your testimony, and with that, our distinguished ranking manner -- member, mr. carter. mr. carter: i agree, anytime you have appeared before the committee, we have a great deal of confidence, so thank you again for the manner with which you have conducted this office. is a global, isis threat, both to the physical safety and the democratic values we hold clear. it destabilizes our already weak inspiresd radicalization of individuals to perpetuate terrorism with known countries as we, and our allies, have experienced. as we see every day across the middle east, europe, and elsewhere, isis attacks

propaganda, design not only to kill but to turn communities against one another. sunnis against shia. muslim against christian. immigrants against citizens. to defeat isis, we are mobilizing the international --munity military l.a. militarily and economically and politically to fight extremism in our owns political discourse. due to the efforts of the administration, the united states leads a 66 participant coalition against terrorism. in the military sphere, we are shrinking the isis safe havens .n places like falluja their flow of foreign fighters has been cut, and they have lost millions in revenues. our witness sure will agree, there is a lot more that needs to be done. there are no quick answers to this challenge.

these efforts have not been without serious costs. we stand in solidarity with countries such as jordan, which suffered another terror attack in recent days. i commit our witness for his heent visit to jordan, where gave our unwavering support to the jordanian people. efforts to global buy isis will not be easy. as cia director john brennan experiencess isis have your losses, it will intensify its global campaign. we have to be careful about that. we might be able to contain them on the ground, but then what happens with global terrorism is to mark we have to redouble our efforts, especially in the areas liberated that were held by isis. tens of thousands of people who have been freed from isis captivity are now living in displacement camps in horrible conditions under intense summer desert heat. administration's

recent pledge to provide $20 million of the military in a to the united nations committee on refugees, a right response, but more needs to be done. i call on our partner nations to assist falluja residents meeting border food and more. we cannot let them suffer even more. on july 20, the united states would join with canada, germany, and japan at a conference in washington. this is a critical opportunity for the international community to continue to support stabilization efforts in iraq. in addition to the military and efforts, our coalition must work harder on long-term reconstruction and reconciliation efforts. some fear political participation. this would only lead to another. the real threat against isis and their ilk comes not just from thebarrel of a gun but from ballot box, the courthouse, and

a growing economy. the prime minister needs international aid now, and he needs international support to keep spoilers, such as iran, from its interference in politics. let me conclude with this. as i stated earlier, isis challenge is not only our physical well-being but are both of pluralism and openness. -- notnot commit to only only defeating isis on the battlefield but their poisonous narrative of division. together, in it regardless of our nationality. we must fight the forces of divisiveness at home and abroad. mr. chairman, i look forward to hearing from our witness. senator corker: your business card must be very large. the thank you for being here today. we know that you realize you can

summarize your comments, if you wish. testimony, without objection, will be entered into the record, and with that, thank you for being here. you, chairmanank corker, ranking member cardin, and members. orlando, we wish a full recovery to the wounded. the attacks underscore the imperative need to the heat -- to defeat isil across its global networks. i just returned from a visit to iraq, jordan, israel, and jordan, as senator cardin

dayioned, i met just one after a suicide bomber killed seven guarding their board. in egypt, egyptian forces are isilggling against an branch, and we are offering assistance. in israel, they are looking to compensate for losses of manpower and territory, and we must not let them succeed, and in iraq, but our support and assistance, they are rooting out isil strongholds one by one, most recently in falluja, where they held a population hostage for 30 months. my statement today will highlight the progress we are making against iphone -- isil but it will not diminish the challenge that now confronts much of the world. we analyze them in three ways, the core, the network, propaganda networks, and financial networks.

and there are their affiliates that seek to expand their reach. we have our coalitions that seek to defeat them in three areas. my written notes have indicators which are many now trending in the right direction. many are now sharing information to identify those who are still traveling. outside financing has been severed, and internal financing has taken a hit through painstaking intelligence work and precision targeting by military forces in iraq and syria. s propaganda is now being challenged 24/7 with private companies and individuals. their leaders are either in hiding or are being killed now at a rate of one every three days, including one of the main deputies. some terrorists killed by u.s. military forces. territory is

shrinking, losing nearly 50% of territory once controlled in iraq and 20% in syria over the last 18 months. -- what makesl isil different is what it proclaims as a phony caliphate, a notion that has been a primary driver and recruitment for the tens of thousands of foreign fighters that have joined them in syria and iraq. extractallows them to vast resources from the territory, and most important way, to launch sophisticated attacks. the attacks we have seen in brussels and paris, for example, we believe stems from their network, and it has sent operatives through a pocket. take their we must territory away from them, and just as important, stabilize areas after. as you mentioned, mr. chairman. highlightke to

briefly how we're doing so, pointing to three areas on the map that i have attached to my written testimony. number one is a pocket. the military council, and these are local people seeking to liberate their own territory launched anhey attack across the phrase river. approximately 3500 strong and is made up primarily of arabs, with kurds in along with our special forces. putting together this coalition took painstaking work, military and diplomatic, but the real results thus far are promising. 1000 squareiberated kilometers, and they are beginning to push him, neighborhood by neighborhood. as they move, they are providing vital information on the network. we believe providing them support to liberate their own areas is a model to future operations. from the other end of the pocket, modern operation groups

are beginning to push against them. has ordered a fight to the death, but now that we are moving onto w fronts, they are beginning to degrade. to help to take this territory away from them entirely. ul.ber five on the map is mos this is coordinated from a joint base where he tragically lost a u.s. marine last month. these operations, one of which is just south of mosul, ongoing at this hour, are setting up for the operation. that will be a significant alitary challenge that also humanitarian challenge. the planning is now underway. in the iraqi kurdistan region, i was invited with ambassador with to attend a meeting the a national security advisor to address the difficult challenges in the campaign.

this is one of the more positive meetings i have attended in iraq. focusing on the coming liberation of mosul and west must be done, including for the diverse communities to work together. to iraqi government agreed pay and equip thousand for that campaign, representing arabs, kurds, christians, ucd yazidis, and others. this is building on a model that has worked in to create -- tikrit, to return with significant backing and support from our coalition. number sevennbar, and eight on the map, iraqi forces with tribal fighters have over the past few months alone liberated ramadi, falluja, moore, and broke a two-year

siege in the city of hadifa. not lost a battle now in more than a year, and key decisions by the prime minister to empower the local people in their own liberation. this is not to overshadow the serious problems that have occurred, including reports of , but there, abuses the iraqi government has taken immediate efforts. there is much work to do, particularly in falluja, where they overwhelm the capacity of local responders. thanks to quick responses, tens of millions of dollars in aid is now flowing to these refugee camps, and the u.n. is helpful when they get returns next month. as senator cardin mentioned, we will also have a very important pledging conference in washington to generate the resources needed to care for these people. returning people to their homes

is a key priority for our coalition, and today in a rat, 95% of the population of tikrit and more have gone back. accordingly, as we look to accelerate the defeat of isil in these areas, we are focused on what comes after, as you mentioned, mr. chairman, and to assure that their defeat is lasting. in sum, we had progress, but there is a lot left to do here at home and around the world against this unprecedented grateful areas i am for this opportunity to appear before you, and i am happy to address your questions. sen. corker: and i will reserve my time in turn to the ranking member. cardin: we have had military success in the past. can we hold that military

success? are we able to develop functioning governments? iraq, as we are starting to get more territory, falluja having fallen, the sunni civilian population is justifiably concerned as to their safety as relates to the shia militia. what steps are we taking to protect the civilian population in these areas that we have been -- militarilyry reclaim? senator, thank you. this has been a primary focus of ours from day one. no areas have been taken from them that they have been able to retake, and that is fairly significant, given how difficult the situation is in iraq. what we have done from day one, and this goes back to the fall of 2014. we are not in the business of reconstructing iraq or repeating

mistakes we have made in the past. we're trying to revolutionize how we do that. we have a partner who believes in decentralizing power as much as possible and empowering local people, so the financial example of this was in to treat -- in tikrit. it was entirely depopulated by isil in 2014, a site of massive atrocities and mass killing's. was it was liberated, through the coalition, we were able to flood resources there are a stabilization fund that we established through the coalition, and this is focused on getting people back to their homes, and returning people back to their homes, it is important to recognize, we have looked at this historically. ever, ande years, if thereby empowering their local leaders and making sure their theurces are there,

returnees reach a tipping point, and now we have almost the entire city back on the streets of tikrit. senator cardin: has you deal with the militias? mr. mcgurk: great question. they have to work with the iraqi state. that is a principle. we think most of these popular mobilization forces do operate under the control of the iraqi dote, that about 15% or 20% not, in those groups are a fundamental problem. another thing we want to do is make sure they stay out of sunni areas, where they can cause real and this is one thing that gave the population the confidence to return. when wea principle support iraqi forces in the military campaign, we only support forces on the ground operating strictly under command and control. that means going through an iraqi chain of command were we

are working with iraqi commanders. if there is a unit that is not operating under that structure -- senator cardin: are you confident they will be able to maintain the safety of the sunni civilians? they just completed the liberation of the last neighborhood this weekend. we have 80,000 displaced people. there is one of the u.n. programs later this week. they are hopeful that all of these will be under shelter by the middle of this week and will begin returns next month. what is also somewhat encouraging about falluja is that the destruction in the city looks to be fairly minimal compared to other operations, so we are hopeful we can return the people of falluja to the streets as soon as possible. government can lead that, and, of course, the shia militia groups that operate outside the law have to be out of the city. otherwise, the people will not return, and we have a plan with local falluja police, policeman

there who have been trained really for the last year, waiting to go back to guard their streets. tikrit,what we did in and that is what we hope to do with falluja. senator cardin: let me laugh -- ask a question. they were defining it by territory. they are now losing territory. will they be defining it through thernational terrorism, by sensational attacks that we see all too often? can we expect that that may accelerate? what can we do to counter that if that appears to be their game plan? isilcgurk: so, senator, has always talked about external attacks, and i think i talked about this in 2013.

senator cardin: but as they start to lose territory, is it likely they will accelerate that part of their campaign? mr. mcgurk: their core banner has been the caliphate, maintaining and expanding their caliphate, and as i mentioned in my written testimony, he said, we may lose all of our territory, including most of -- including mosul. this is what director brennan testified to last week. this is extraordinarily difficult to stop. we have to remain vigilant. this is why we have a global coalition not just for iraq and we areut to make sure working with interval so that as these people try to travel, they can be picked up, and we are doing better at that now, but we have a ways to go, and we cannot it was al qaeda in iraq, and they split in two directions, one about a state like caliphate entity, and another one in syria, which does not really have the notion of

establishing a caliphate, but they are both al qaeda. kill anyonent to who does not agree with them, and israel will continue -- we are not just taking back territory. we are correct -- collecting s oftantial amount information, and that helps us root it out, not only in syria but in the branches were it exists in syria and other places. senator: thank you. they have not reduce the terrorism capability in global reach, and they remain a

resilient and largely cohesive energy -- entity. do you disagree with that assessment? i agree with the director, of course, and i think you see in my testimony that i am the last one working on this complicated issue every day to diminish this significant threat. you know, let me just put a number on it. 40,000 foreign fighters have traveled in the last four or five years, indoctrinated with this jihad ideology. that is almost twice as many from the numbers we saw that went to afghanistan in the 1980's, and we know what that eventually led to, so this is something we have not seen before, and you add to it social media and the speed of travel now, everything, it is an unprecedented challenge, and it is going to be with us for years. senator johnson: do you agree with director brendan cash brennan?

-- do you agree with the director? the attack but brussels and paris are what they clan from their sanctuaries, so we believe those were organized in raqqa. it is harder to do when you are pressing on their territory. the kinds of attacks that are very difficult to stop. senator johnson: my point is, until we actually defeat them, we can nibble around the edges, we can make some progress, we can push them out of iraq, and, i mean, i have yet to hear how this administration has a game plan for actually defeating them. i mean, i hear the game plan for making progress, it actually the feeding them, and the best point i'm trying to make, if we do not defeat them, if we do not deny them territory, if we do not deny them the caliphate, if we do not take away those safe havens, they are incredibly sophisticated.

what we have seen in san bernardino and in orlando, tragically. there was, by the way, a foiled plot against a masonic temple in wisconsin. also isis inspired. we have to defeat them. where is our strategy for that? we are planning to defeat them. mosul, we -- in haven't focused on key moments, cutting them off, and another is about isolating raqqa. johnson: when did the three-your clock start? present obama declared 22 months. starts tickingck on a three-year plan? togetherk: week this -- we put this together in 2014.

senator johnson: deny them the safe havens in syria in, basically, 14 months, if it is a three-your game plan? three-year game plan? i was there last week, and we want to do it as soon as possible. the force that has to move on primarily arab a force. qa. then the plan is raq so we are moving at a temper that i believe will lead to their defeat. senator johnson: we are not going to defeat them in 14 months, are we? that is my point. we are not doing this fast enough. it becomes more dangerous.

we have not reduced their terrorism capability or their global reach. when are we going to have a game plan from this a ministration to actually accomplish the goal question or it is not what to happen in the three-year timeframe. what is it going to take? mr. speed upe want to their defeat in mosul. we are using helicopters and advisers. there is an operation going on right now to the south that is readable to isolating them. another operation is ongoing right now that is hard fighting. once that is done, that sets the conditions for raqqa. it is a step-by-step process to andto raqqa ande mo -- mosul. senator johnson: look. i appreciate your efforts, but i agree with you. we are not moving fast enough.

senator: thank you. senator: i am not going to repeat questioning that we had in earlier hearings, but i share senator johnson's -- some of his critiques, but we are not moving fast enough. i think congress has been in a position that we want to criticize the administration, but we are 22 months in on something we have not debated and voted on. i compare this to the level of detail that we just undertook to have their eight narrow reforms in the department of defense, and the amount of discussion, about an ongoing war were 17 people have been killed, and others have been injured -- it's done for me, but let me pass that bought, because i am well on the record on that. let me get to some particulars. congratulate our troops and the efforts they have made on the battlefield to shrink the isil holds, and

that is notable, but when we talk about the battlefield where i have concerns. let's start with libya. libya has been losing its center of gravity. that has been a positive, but where does the coalition believe the next front will open up in north africa? there are about 5000 fighters in libya. where are they located, and what is being done to target them? i think north africa, not only to the dangers in africa but also the presence to -- proximity to europe is a concern. mr. mcgurk: thank you, senator. i was there to discuss this. libya is a good example. it highlights how complicated this is. most foreign fighters that have joined isil have come out of tunisia, what is seen as some of the bright spot of the arab

spring, and it shows what is indoctrinating the young people, some of it is sectarianism, but some of it is something else. 6000 tunisians, many of whom have gone to libya, and this is a real problem. tunisia is a coalition partner, and we are working closely with them. and with egypt and the situation in libya, but also, the bright spot in libya is that the libyans are rejecting the presence of daish. there is this hockey like stick growth. are they matching what they tried to do in iraq and syria, and it turns out that that has not been the case. they have kind of plateaued at about 5000 fighters, 6000 fighters. that is our assessment. and the forces aligned with the new national court have made more progress, more progress than we have anticipated, so now we are looking at how do we accelerate that is being made,

so i am purely confident now that we have a strategy in place in libya they can at least begin to degrade that presence. libya has other problems. the concern we have about the accelerated growth of isil is something that appears to be mitigated, but we have to keep at it. been ankaine: there has aggressive recruitment efforts in the philippines, working on the leadership there of one man, and there has even been recruiting efforts in countries like malaysia to get foreign fighters to go not to just syria and iraq but to go to the philippines. il and others in southeast asia. mr. mcgurk: another great question. i was, i year ago, in singapore and malaysia. of these are pre-existing terror groups that have pledged and allegiance, and the question

we ask, what is the, denominated all around the world as to why these groups are flying the flag -- what is the reason around the world why they are flying the flag of isil? so i saw the announcement in the philippines recently, and, again, and i mentioned this in my written testimony, we cannot get too distracted anytime a pre-existing terror group flies the flag of isil, because we are already dealing with this in a number of ways. in iraq, they are sending some of their best into libya. one we targeted and killed. -- leadersn leapers try to transfer. that is where we are concerned. we have not seen that in southeast asia. we have to work with our partners around the world and

particularly in southeast asia to make sure these remain contained, but we are not seeing that libya like transfer of resources from iail central all of the way out -- from isil central. senator kaine: thank you. my time is up. senator: like the state worksment that mr. mcgurk for an like the white house, we agree that this administration has all legal authority necessary to combat isis, so i just want that to be stated. certainly, we have had multiple hearings on how to deal with this, and i personally am pushed back against efforts to limit his ability to conduct the operations, which much of the discussions around the map has that about, so i just want to say again, i support the efforts that are underway. i would like to see it happen in

a much more expeditious manner. i know it is creating threats to our homeland, which we have got do support the i administration's statement that they have the legal basis to do dot they are doing, and i what i do, everything i can, to keep up this body from limiting their ability to do that. with that, i will turn to the senator. mr.tor: thank you, chairman. thank you for the testimony. turning to your statement about being able to deny them territory and impact their ability to foment terrorism elsewhere or direct activities, are we seeing a difference in in that their main syria,rters in raqqa, has not really been impacted? with the areas we have taken that? excellent.

so their ability to move qqa hass across raq been significantly degraded. we have cut off the main roads mosul, andqa and on thee first -- forced roads. we have degraded their ability to move fighters around, but most important for our homeland security, and this is why this manbij is so important. we have worked with turkey to close up that border on their side, and the turks have done an awful lot, and we commend them for that, but until we take the is able toway, isil

move, so that is why this operation in manbij is critical. and what they have put out, they are saying, hey, do not come to syria anymore. do an attack at home, or go to libya. that is because it is much harder for them to get into syria. what we see every morning in terms of their ability to get people in, and once they are in, it is very hard to get out, and we want to make sure they do not get people in syria, and once they're in syria, that they never get out. senator: you mentioned that we are killing their leadership at a rate of one every three days. what impact has that had on their planning abilities? or abilitiesocus they have, whether caliphate's or others? i testified about a fell, and whatul

we're seeing is a military like organization with command and control, the ability to move around and take entire cities. they cannot do that anymore, and their leaders are having a very hard time communicating. there are having a very hard time organizing where to put their resources, so we have really degraded their ability to command and control, one of the principles of defeating them, so taking out their leader is not a sufficient condition, but it is a necessary condition in order to degrade the overall network. senator flake: since the deal was struck, we hoped that some of the posture in the region would change. has there posture changed? and in syria, have we seen a change in terms of iran's behavior or their willingness to work with other groups in a positive way? or is it all still negative? i, in my role, have

not seen a significant change in iranian behavior. isil is a threat. il frome fighting is time to time, but they are ,ealing with the assad regime and going to senator cardin's question, some are operating outside of the legal authority of the iraqis that, which is a threat to iraq's own sovereignty, supported by iran, and that is a huge problem, and we have not seen that diminished since the nuclear deal, certainly. senator flake: thank you. i share senator kaine's view. not to question whether or not we have the authority or the executive branch has the and even putting that aside, i think it is valuable for our adversaries and our allies to know that we speak with one voice here.

as you mentioned, this is going to go on for a long, long time. and i think we would all benefit if congress weighed in more heavily. thank you. sen. corker: and: thank you. senator? you are awareure there was a widely reported story this week about weapons being stolen in jordan. to what extent do we think any of those weapons are going to isis? senator, i have seen those reports. i just cannot address the roots to that story. i might be able to address it in a different setting. to what extent does a story like that and the ability to steal under our noses and under the noses of the jordanians, who are one of our most important allies, are they ind as propaganda for isis attracting new fighters again

and promoting their cause? mr. mcgurk: what i will say, having just been in jordan, i met the national security team, one of our close allies. are on the very front line of this fight, and i think they would be just as concerned as anyone here with stories like that. senator sheehan: i certainly agree that jordan has been a terrific ally, which is even more reason why we need to get to the bottom of what is going on there and address it in a way that does not allow it to continue there. let me ask, because it is there easy and canively create to be able to track what is happening on the battlefield with isis, to be able to talk about what the efforts are to address them, to be able to talk about who in their leadership we have taken out. i think it is much more difficult to talk and to address

the underlying governance issues that have allowed isis to much harder to address the messaging that isis does to attract new fighters. can you talk about the extent to which this effort is engaged with both of those more difficult challenges? it is externally difficult, and that is why there is a balance between speed and sustainability. it is true. maybe there are some things we could do to speed it up, but then we would not have gains sustained. who is going to govern the city? it is the military and -- extraordinarily difficult. so what we try to do, particularly in iraq, and i think we have had some success here, is to make sure these conditions are in place before fromved to clear out isil populated areas, and the

philosophy led by the prime minister is more decentralization, more federalism, more empowering local people to control their affairs, and that is very important and something that we very much support. we have seen the success into t.ete -- in tikri and this is shortly after isil was pushed out of remodel, but 100 were tragically killed, because as they leave, they put booby-traps in people's closets and refrigerators, and that is this organization is, and we raised $15 million initially, and we have people on the ground clearing blocked by block, and that is really going really well, but it is also an indicator of how difficult this is. we cannot just defeat isil. we have to have a lasting defeat. all of these things have to come together.

it is one of the hardest things to do imaginable, but if you look at what we are trying to do and at the mobilization of the tribes, we never would have been able to clear all of this onritory in anbar province the jordanian border without the support of the local tribes. that took a lot of work. it took a lot of great work from our special forces that are out there working, even at the air base way out in had defect -- in hadifa but you have to have these, pieces together. senator sheehan: i think they have talked to making gains on the battlefield against isis that there is a greater likelihood that we will see s in the westack and other parts of the world to try to drive attention away from what is happening on the battlefield. do you share that assessment? mr. mcgurk: isil has talked

about attacking us for years, so that is nothing new. the brussels and paris attacks were organized years ago, even before we started to take their territory away. one thing i think they will do, as they are losing this central narrative of the caliphate, this state, they will try to inspire through the internet these lone walk types of attacks, and any deranged individual can suddenly and getbanner of isil attention, and they recognize this and are trying to encourage it. we will push them out of mosul. we will push them out of raqqa. thethis underpinning of ideology, where anyone who disagrees with them deserves to god. that is what they believe. it is crazy. that will be with us for a while. we have to defeat them, but we also the our partners in the

gulf and saudi arabia to fight , andideological battle they are doing so. senator sheehan: thank you. senator corker: if i may, we continue to hear, like from qatar, how they went to more fully and to the battle on the ground, if you will, and, of course, we hear lots of things. unless we see something, it is not real. they then talk about how the u.s. -- they have concerns about the united states' committment. us come withwith saudi arabia and others joining us more fully on the ground? mr. mcgurk: so i have been in the gulf a lot in the last year, and the saudi's are very focused on the conflict in yemen, and as we hope, the peace process would begin, and the conflict will begin to wind down.

there will be an increasing daish.on ofhave heard these requests a possibility of troops on the ground, things like that. it is very important that all of this is organized under our coalition effort. we, of course, have planners of all of these countries at centcom about what we going to do, but i was there in saudi arabia at this summit about six weeks ago, and the saudi's make a very compelling case. is a threathat isil to them. they have plots inside saudi arabia. all must every few weeks, they are breaking up a plot, so it is an ideological struggle that has to be led by the saudi's and the egyptians and the leaders in the muslim world, where i do think they can take a leading role. you are working with them on that.

not want toer: i do take up too much time, but actually participating. they fight in closed doors with us. -- they cite behind closed unknown,d it is not their unwillingness to really get engaged. away from the ideological, but back to what is actually happening on the ground, especially in syria. do you believe that the comments they are making are real? mr. mcgurk: i think -- we work very hard to match capabilities and capacity with needs, and i think i could go through in a very detailed way in a different setting height of what we are doing with each coalition partner. we would like to see those countries participate in the air campaign. the jordanians are per dissipating in the air campaign, and we really need more assets in the skies as we develop more intelligence and more targets, but in terms of ground

capabilities, our focus on empowering local actors to the break their own territory is the most sustainable solution for feeding isil, and that will remain our fundamental approach. sen. corker: and senator isakson. senator isakson. in the sand not to cross, is that right? this should teach it bombing in syria at one point -- are we drawing lines -- in the sand not to cross, is that right, and about bombing syria at one point. we pretty much backed away from it. we'd drew a couple more lines in the sand, and then we had the 22-month game plan in going against ifo. there has not really been much mention of assad.

where does he fit in this plan -- out isilisil right now? is mcgurk: as long as assad leading the government in damascus, this war will never and. that is something we stated very clearly to the russians and to the backers of the assad regime. it is a question about the best way to set the incentives for a sustainable transition. , regimemilitarily change is something we have seen before and is extremely risky with consequences. the russians have said that they support a transition in damascus. claimed thathave they will support a cessation of hostilities on the ground. peoplent putin went his

saying he would support it. white frankly, the russians have not done in this regard with a promised, and this remains a very serious problem. senator isakson: are they the assad right now? of mcgurk: the level influence is something we look at. the russians were seen as the , and moreencer recently, we have started to see the armenians eclipse them a little bit, and both of them are backing the assad regime, and we say to the russians, look at this. you guys are in bed with the assad regime, with hezbollah, with the quds force. you guys, what is your long-term strategy here, and, friendly, i do not think they have one, so they came in to try to bolster up the assad regime, and i

thought they would find a path out of syria, but that is not the case. the only way to have a sustainable solution is where our forces can organize against these extremist threats. myator isakson: and that is point. given the fact that there is not one, given the fact that syria has been decimated with a civil war over four or five years, given that the armenians are backing assad pretty steadily all of the way through, there assad's to be no end on ability to stay in place. am i correct? i think you have hit the nail on the head with a very difficult situation in syria. hostilities, of trying to do you escalate the violence, trying to mobilize isil, and where this really comes to a head is in a aleppo.

there is one thing led by al qaeda. not part of the cessation of hostilities, and the russians know they have every right to go aleppo, butend instead, the regime is launching an attack against the opposition, so it is a very andous situation, senator, it is requiring a lot of our attention and focus, and the russians will either live up to their promise or not, but right now, putin is either proving unable to do what he promised his people he would do, or -- : maybe that in should not say or ask, but it d andrs that given assa what he has endured, and the matrix of what is going on in that part of the world, isl, which we're trying to eradicate, like senator johnson in his questioning, as long as assad is

there, it will be hard to take benefit, because they by them being there, is that right? where the civil war starts to deescalate, and we saw the south of damascus, it frees up operation groups. the civil war is escalating. opposition groups are obviously fighting the regime, and that sil more space to grow, so dealing with the civil war, in order for a long-term solution, including with al qaeda in syria, we have to address. senator isakson: thank you for your service. we appreciate it very much. sen. corker:: before we go to senator mendez, you are learning about the relationships in other

places. and you tell us where the central nervous system is relative to the inspiration to get people here in the united states and other places to conduct operations against westerners? where is that central nervous system housed? itit in the caliphate, or is outside? i will give you an example of how difficult this is. i believe it is in raqqa. to instigate these attacks, there was jihadi john, the brutal murderer, but he was also a computer hacker, and he would raqqa all day, trying to inspire attacks. he would just sit there in the apartment, with hundreds of civilians in the apartment building, and it creates a real dilemma. you have to take out jihadi

john, we know where he is, being do not one to take out an apartment complex, and we had to wait for him to come outside. he was the number one guy on the computer all day, trying to inspire attacks, sitting there all day in the heart of a crowded apartment building, and that is why after manbij, we are to move down and isolate raqq. -- raqqa. mendezrker: with senator . senator mendez: we appreciate your work and wish you the best of luck. but i is some real concerns as i read the testimony and listened to some of your responses, so let me try and see if you can -- help mewage them with them. i want to return to the cia director's remarks, where he said against them on the battlefield and in the financial realm, our efforts have not

reduce the group's terrorism and global reach and goes on to say the group would have to suffer even heavier losses, territory, for its terror capacity to decline significantly, and, in fact, we judge it will intensify its global terror campaign to maintain its dominance on the global terrorism agenda. and then i heard your response to senator cardin, when he asked, for example, in iraq, after we take territory back? and it begs the question, aren't we repeating past mistakes? these are places where our men and women gave their lives.

midst of engaging in those same locations again as it relates to isil. how is this different? how is this suggestion and terms of holding territory after we and spent anit enormous amount of lives, we are this now for a second time, how is this not a repeat of past mistakes? >> thank you. we spent $60 billion on reconstruction in iraq and i do one that the record is is for reconstruction. we would identify big projects without the by edna of local people. funde have a stabilization

that requires local people to identify immediate needs for their communities. but above the water back on, lights back on immediately. you mentioned the funds. but what are we doing to we , mozve the iraqi forces oh, to crete, will have the .bility to sustain and hold so we are not there for a third time? is at your view and that of the administration? ask as i mentioned, all of the areas have been taken by isil that have been taken from isil have not been retaken. organizing the people who know the streets to hold the

territory after. so your answer is, yes. we believe the iraqis, once cleared, will be able to maintain territories on their own and be able to make sure isil does not recapture dominance. craigslist is not mean iraq will not have a host of problems for many years to come. and organize genocidal terrorist organization did something i do not think they will be able to do. >> let me turn to syria. i assume the administration view is the peace talks are our best avenue towards a solution. a fair statement? >> that remains a.m. international consensus. that to lead to a sustainable solution. and that is the administration's hope.

the political transition in which is now enshrined in a un security council resolution. >> here is my problem. the united nations special envoy to syria has said he hoped syrian peace talks would resume in july. but only if it showed improvement. he said political talks could not proceed while talks were escalating. so on the one hand we place our hopes in the united nations process and encouraging the coalition to do the same, on the other hand the united nations does not have a way forward because the security and humanitarian on the ground is not an improvement. remains, thatn russia and iran have the same goals we do as a relates to syria and the syrian people. don't we need to be an engaging

and trying to improve the security and humanitarian situation on the ground so that the aspirational political talks can move forward? shouldn't we be looking at safe zones? no fly zones? other elements of china to for thehe asus aspirational peace talk? >> there's no question that the amount of violence without the of hostilities, the conditions for meaningful process are extremely difficult. so you are right, on the humanitarian side, we have managed to reach almost at 10 times the amount of people that noteen met before but it is enough. the assad regime continues to attack areas after humanitarian areas. the real thing is aleppo.

to tryworking very hard to deescalate that. but without asus station of -- of hostility, the political process in geneva really remains at a standstill. >> if i could before turning to sen. perdue:, there were a group of 51 people who dissented on u.s. policy, whi i think is a in --hing that the state ust sites to let that take place. very highsense that leadership within the state putrtment has urged that we price on militarily. that the humanitarian aid is delivered, the next day a

barrel bottom killing the very people he aid was given to. sense ofive us any whether there is a debate assadve to how to handle and the factored with gnosis nation occurring, that may be an enhanced military pressure from the united states may be around this is worth taking? looking very closely at how to have an forcible of hostilities they hand that is something very much under way. we have also looked very closely at the assad regime. statistics.n source about 100,000 fighters on the side of the assad regime have been killed. ofse are the types assumptions that four years ago i think many people assumed would lead to the positions that would set a political transition but it has not. what we need to is a.m. and

forcible cessation of hostilities. >> which do not have been without pressure we are not going to get and i think everyone including you understands the circular situation we are in. that is not going to happen. we met with secretary kerry in munich. therer purdue and others felt the cessation issue was not real. it has not been real. see anything at present to that is going to change that dynamic. i look forward to questioning you further. i am going to go vote senator purdue and i hope i'll come back in time for you. senator markey is next and your now chairman. >> thank you. your testimony is always candid and to the point. i know you are the messenger. i am concerned about the 14

months now at the end of the three years and i am not putting words in your mouth. i am very concerned about that. i wanted on the record. i am concerned about syria. it seems to me we have had witnesses giving us testimony that the best option is a coalition fighting sunni force. not an american force. not an outside force. but a sunni fighting force. in iraq we have issues with shia after it is town liberated and so forth. some of the major players have given us information that they and saudito stand up arabia has potentially 30,000 fighting troops were fighting isis in syria. that not a lack of u.s. leadership and resolve. they are waiting on the united states. can you speak about that in a little more detail? we get into syria and it is a

much more confused battle space than what we see in iraq. we are seeing today and afghanistan, when the troops liberate a city and turn it over to the pleas, that is where the taliban comes back. the question is a different one. i'm trying to get in syria relative to what kind of fighting force will be able to sustain a long-term effort to not only take the ground but hold at once it is liberated in syria. premise here of what we need are local people to liberate and hold their own territory. and so in the sunni area of iraq , we need sunnis from local areas. tribes of mume bar province. we have a coalition led by italians trained by local police. to we have police leaders mobilize local people and that

effort has been successful. we agree we need sunni arabs to be the ones to liberate and hold their own territory but oftentimes they need help. i so, and many of the cities and towns of health for years, they defended like in army. you cannot just take out a bunch of sunni tribesmen and train them for a couple weeks and put a city likeiberate falluja. it won't work. i've met with leaders exiled from iraq and syria and they claim to tens of thousands of people ready to fight and we say, give us the names and we will at them in the fight. it is a very complex dynamic. what we found in on bar which is critical is having presence. we have two sites in anbar province. one between falluja and ramada at the airbase. that is where our fighters are located in and that has given us the ability to figure out who is who, localize sunni fighters and

toe them the capacity succeed. in syria, we have special security advisers a up to 300. we recognize -- >> i'm sorry. are those 300 forces training? >> training and advising. is main mission there, after organizing the forces that will push out. >> a follow-up question. training015, the program was initiated. we spent about $45 million in 2015 under the testimony. and mitigated disaster. as we sit here today, the numbers have been reported in spent0 range and we somewhere close to 500 million dollars that was authorized i think. can you talk about the training

program we have initiated? how many forces are really going back into fight? are they trigger-pullers or enablers or supporters or spotters or support people? tothe effort that was tried kind of organize and train these brigade-like units is something that did not work. there are a lot of fighters on the ground fighting isil every single day. them alley hand taking out and training them in a six-week course, what we're doing now is identifying those groups that are vetted. they get supplies from us and then we take out a couple of their leaders are people they identify to learn how to call in airstrikes. to learn how to do more sophisticated things which is a force multiplier for that unit. we have a system that is very well structured and terms of a force we were both on the ground being able to: rescission

airstrikes. but it takes training. as set of trying to organize these larger units to maneuver around, we are identifying units actually on the ground that know the actual area, know how to fight. we are giving them the skills to enhance their efforts on the ground. >> i appreciate that but we are not adding additional fighters through that training mechanism in any significant amount, zephyr to say? effort, no. that we're trying to organize and grow the force that will move down. >> i notice the ranking members -- you and me right now until they get back from voting -- >> i like the numbers here. i have another question. i would like to talk about the second level of the fight. committee onthe the ground and the air. i see that is a messy fight in syria with all the different dates.

about theke to talk hybrid war underway. you related to it earlier. the administrators shouldn't -- the administration was trying to counselor at on the social media and other platforms. how is that working? have we been able to draft outside forces to counter isis? the question overall is, what are we doing today to try to message in isil propaganda and cyberspace in social media? >> great question. gec,ve established the global engagement center. this cannot just be done out of washington. we have a global network to go after with online messaging. two years ago when this started, they had free reign on facebook, twitter, youtube. their message was one of,, join

us in the caliphate. we have reversed that trend. twitter is one data point. for every single pro-isil twitter handle, there is now six anti-a isil to combat them 24-7 and cyberspace. >> where are they? the united states question my >> all over the place. some are from the region. there they coordinated but best or the non-coordinated, organic counter messaging. working withso those companies. twitter has taken off about 100 25,000 pro-isil sites. and others facebook on that site. the internet is in organic thing. >> we just stood up to army brigades of cyber warfare.

>> we do. we have centers. to lead the effort. we do some here. we have an organization in the you we. young, smart, and dynamic comic engaged young people. they want to fight isil on the ground. malaysia has been leading it in the u.k. and different parts of the world it is different. in the gulf, it is more religiously inspired focus. in europe, often it is the bring yournd come family, kids eating ice cream, a total lie. in europe they are working to counter that. this network of voices on the internet is starting to turn the tide against their message. >> let me rescue mike calling. or is no time for the boat on the floor. even though we are not voting the same way i want to make sure he can get over and cast his

vote. since i have the committee right now, let me -- members are coming back, they just went to vote. i started on the floor so we can continue the hearing. let me ask you, we have talked about territorial gains. what happens. ofsyria, there is a lot confidence in that area of being able to block the routes to turkey. what does assad do, what does russia do, it in regards of the territorial gains in syria? what will be their strategy? know, we do not corn eight at all with the russians. we talked to them 2-d conflict airspace and we also, when we are running an operation we kind of make sure there is no interference. so far, in most cases, that has been the case. the forces we have worked with

that have retaken territory we have found have been able to govern that territory fairly effectively. one problem we have in syria we the not had in iraq is that ability to get a humanitarian assistance, humanitarian supplies in these areas is limited. this gets to the issue with turkey and the syrian kurds and that conflict and the border being closed. in my bench, for example, once it is liberated, we have identified the ngos and resources to get aid of flowing in. we have to work with the border post with turkey to make sure it can get in. i would say so far with not had any interference from the regime or the russians in terms of particularly in the north where we have taken territory away from isil. >> as far as the assad loyal courses conflict in with the syrian democratic forces, is that likely to occur?

complicated and northwest syria where you have syrian regime forces. you have syrian democratic forces. you have syrian opposition forces. none of them coordinate and many disagree with each other at a local level. this morning i was working on this with colleagues. working to get the lawyers are -- the leaders of those groups together, not of course the syrian forces. locally-based. what is happening in this town, what is happening in that town, to quiet things down between groups. they all share the threat of isil. this is the most complicated thing from a strategic level with them not agreeing with each other to say the least and that the local tactical level. we have to work it and all dimensions. in the northwest syria order, is to get the leaders of different

groups together with us to talk about how we can better work aidther to get humanitarian flowing and direct forces against isil. >> sen. rubio:. senator rubio: you talked earlier, as isis begins to lose control over territories you will see them increasingly rely on the ability to inspire attacks abroad. deranged individuals who can commit mass of atrocities or whatever and flying, doing it under the banner of isis. this seems to describe what we saw on my home state of florida, in orlando. you're saying as isis continues to lose territory and creates this caliphate and at attacks like the one we saw in orlando with individuals with that sort of profile. not just in the u.s. but in other parts of the world. >> senator i can't say it is

-- commonplace. isis has always called for attacks in our homeland. territory, as they stopped calling for people to come to syria, now they are saying stay at home. they have been saying this for a couple years. it is a problem. we have to be candid in assessment. candid in the assessment. will be witht that us for years. if 40,000 of these foreign fighters come into syria, fortunately we're killing them and they can't get out at taking away their territory, taking away the notion of a caliphate which is a fundamental drive will diminish the appeal. it does not mean they cannot fly another banner. nusra or something else. by isis,ubio: directed inspired by isis, they are no

distinction. they are committed to get in the name of isis, people to terrorize. there is no distinction. inspiration is a way of directing these attacks as we saw tragically a few weeks ago. you talk also, even if you were to wipe them out on the battlefield, the ideology than underpants as a radical jihadist ideology remains. this has been touched upon, syria will remain a fertile ground for an isis-like group. it will be there for somebody else to step up and fill that vacuum. as long as assad is in power he is an irritant. it does not mean everyone against assad is a radical jihadist but his presence creates enough of an irritant especially among groups like isis, to take advantage of that to further their ideology.

in essence, take up arms. isn't that correct? >> the assad regime remains and incubator for the conflict and extremist groups on both sides of the sectarian divide. the sectarian divide in the region supercharges the extremists. we see young shia from afghanistan coming in, young sunnis from all of the world coming into to fight syria. it is something that, to destabilize syria, can spawn attacks outside of syria. getting a handle on the syria where he is a fundamental precondition to mitigating the risk of isil and allows the nusra -- al nusra. senator rubio: to that point, the process in place has been described to me as something

circling the drain. it is not going well. the press -- it has given russia a cover to do some of things have done like the russian military engagement in syria. not targeted at isis. an open source report last week that they specifically attacked u.s.-based rebels. is it not true much of russia's action has been geared toward non-isis rebels to wipe them out and turn to the world and say you have two choices in syria, isis or a sod. in, 70 russia first came or 80% of their attacks were against moderate opposition troops. after the secession of hostilities, we saw that flip. they were focused on palm iraq and other areas. in the last few weeks, this situation, particularly in aleppo, has elevated. particularly in the corridor

where we believe the moderate opposition is based. that is a total violation of the secession of hostilities. there are two problems. launching offensives and the regime air force. the regime air force, as far as we can tell is basically a criminal enterprise dropping barrel bombs and attacking civilians under the pretext of attacking new strip. -- nusra. it is a petri dish for extremist organization. i am concerned place on reliance we our alliance with the why pg. with our means both relationship to the turks and the stated goal of uniting across northern syria. perhaps isategy that

viewed as necessary given the realities on the battlefield but i think in the long-term creates significant complications in the area with a number of groups including the kurds in iraq. >> thank you mr. chairman. fewmcgurk, in the last weeks, both the ambassador and jonathan weiner, the special they testified before committee. tacticalious that against isis weather in iraq or thea will not bring about strategic defeat unless tactical operations are done in ways that not only avoid harming pot relations of civilians by protect them from -- civilian populations but protect them from harm. to bring back the armed groups under unified government said represent and protect all the people.

you'd testified that they sunnited abuses against civilians fleeing for their lives. it is apparent that adequate advanced operations were not made to receive the transport and provide relief to tens of thousands of people who fled the fighting in illusion. i understand after the fact the iraqi government says they will hold the defenders accountable. sidethat the humanitarian is stepping up relief efforts. i am concerned it might not be enough to convince city people the iraqi government as on their side. my question is, what is the iraqi government actions? what are the armed forces doing before and during military operations to identify and mitigate foreseeable risks that

shia militia will engage in sectarian attacks on civilians? there are specific things people who work with iraqis are doing or should be doing to ensure that plans include proactive measures to prevent such attacks from happening. thise politicians on panel. that is one thing we are experts on. people will not forget if they were not protected even if there individualk on an in city. >> thank you. of my discussions, especially with the iraqi security leaders, it is important to remember most of the atrocities are committed by isil. held populations hostage. committing incredible atrocities against sunnis. wheret retook on

province, it massacred hundreds of people from a tribe in the valley. we have to make sure that when security operations come to liberate areas from my soul that these lawless groups of the operation. as we mentioned, in the early days of the falluja we had serious problems. bey turned out to not credible but some do appear to be credible. a special representative to the u.n. testified last week, particularly about the measures now in place to mitigate the risks. one thing that happens when you liberate a territory and civilians come out is to screen to make sure i sold have not population.the there is a local official part of that process every step of the way and that is something the local leaders of anbar

insisted on. on how to do the muscle campaign, we have to make sure these types of events do not occur in most soul and that all the forces that take part in the muscle campaign are operating strictly on the part of the security. the government of iraq is a real partner in this. atrocities were a tarnish on the government, the iraqi security forces, and that is something the prime minister recognizes. >> did they agree falluja was a mistake? >> certainly. in the first 24 hours of the offensive movement into the city in which we had the reports, it was top to bottom voices in iraq. people to the government, the minister of defense and announced the arrest

of some of the members of the iraqi army involved in the abuse. they have to remain vigilant. when you have a lot of young people out on the streets with guns, it is impossible to mitigate the risk of anything happening. when you see something like you saw in the early days of falluja -- >> how may people of been punished for what happened in falluja? >> i think about four or five members of the iraqi army have been detained and some members of the -- has notnvestigation been concluded. we are saying repeatedly people have to be accountable when reports of found to be credible. so, what is the answer to why were the shia militia allowed to be put in those positions where they can commit those kinds of atrocities? when answered you get from the government?

mr. mcgurk: there is one unit of the mobilization forces on the shia side operating totally outside the law in some of the suburbs of falluja. i can't say specifically why soi can't say specifically why , that unit was there that the government has taken measures to make sure it is addressed. senator markey: i know my time is going to run out, but i guess what i was going to say was if those five individuals and more are not punished in a way that is public and clear, then there will be no discouragement in the other cities. i think that is sure could -- i think that is your key political job. is to make sure that punishment happens so that other militias will not do it. on the just get a slap

wrist, at the end of the day they just create a political control and conundrum. at the end of the day, in the years of the head we do not want to have to revisit this thing. is that a goal that you have? mr. mcgurk: accountability is fundamental. senator markey: accountability can be just saying don't do it again. mr. mcgurk: they have to have a process and a have to be punished when violations occur. senator murphy: i know we consider mr. mcgurk to be a global citizen, but he's a graduate of connecticut and is -- has overcome the rivalry. let me try to recover from that. thank you for being here, mr. mcgurk, and thank you for taking

on what is frankly a nightmare of a job trying to manage this crisis and coalition and we are lucky to have you at the helm. in response to a question from senator corker earlier, you were talking about some of our coalition partners not being as involved as we would like, especially with the air campaign. i want to ask you a question relative to the reason members of the coalition are not participating at the level we would expect. when i was in abu dhabi at the and of last year, i went to get relief from the ministry of defense and i was there to oversee our counter isis campaign. knowing i was there to talk about the coalition fight against isil was the threat from iran and the entire brief was about the work the uae and other

coalition members are doing to counter the expansion of iranian influence and, from what i understand, their focus on yemen has been one of the primary reasons why they have been less participatory in the campaign against isil. speak to the worry some of us have that this concentration of focus we have has quite frankly distracted resources from members of the coalition that we would like to be used in the fight against isil. many of us, it appears we have facilitated that withdrawal by assisting their air campaign, so talk about the intersection of those two conflicts and how we get our partners to focus first on isil. >> there's no question the conflict in yemen has pulled resources away from what was a real focus on the counter isil campaign. that's one of the reasons we've tried to establish a particle process to end the conflict in yemen.

when the saudi's ca threat on the board, they have to act, and a been one of our closest partners militarily and have maintained a strong participation in the counter isil campaign. we believe the primary focus is on isil and is a threat not only to us but to the kingdom of saudi arabia. where we are right now, in the war in yemen, to focus on the counter isil campaign. as these multiple conflicts have been going on, it has reduced the resources we have been able to focus over the skies of syria. we have had coalition partners extend their strikes into syria. as was the most kinetic phase of the campaign to date. 70% of the planes are dropping their munitions. we have more partners on the ground fighting and that rings us to the key point we are raising. we need more key points in the sky as we consider you -- as we continue to accelerate. senator murphy: there's been several reports of groups within the rebel coalition fighting each other and some of this is relative to groups that are backed covertly by the united states and i understand the limitations on how much you can talk about that. for many of us, our reluctance to arm and train groups inside the fight is because we been -- we have a belief that we are in the second order of fighting. the second order is the part of the war in which isis has joined but there are third, fourth, fifth orders that may involve

groups that may have been funded by the united states funding each other as the battlefield shrinks and perhaps we make progress against some of the groups that provide a buffer between organizations funded by the united states. we need more resources in the skies. i am hopeful that as the yemen political moves forward, and we all hope and does, we will have

more capacity to bear against isil. >> second question, a number of reports over the last month or so about groups within the rebel coalition fighting each other and some of this is relative to groups that are backed covertly by the united states. talk about that. recent reports about conflicts between the fsa and the white pg. -- white pg. for many of us, the reluctance to harm a and train groups is because we have a believe we are in the second order of fighting today. the first order was the fight between the rebels and a sod. the second is the war in which isis has joined that then there are third and fourth and fifth orders which may involve groups funded by the united states funding each other as the bountiful drinks and we make progress against some of the against those that fund

against the united states. spring to the fear that ultimately groups armed today by the united states to maybe fighting the same enemy may ultimately be fighting each other. if we are successful to downgrade the power of some of these existing groups. tracks a senator, we are successful at tamping down the locally based conflicts where we have relationships and a presence on the ground. in iraq, we have had problems. the different groups in anbar province and soon i. where we have -- and sunni. where we have relations, we can tamp it down. nothe serious side, we do have anybody on the ground. sometimes it is difficult to tell them what is happening. we rely on people telling us what they think is happening.

our ability to temp down localized x escalation is not what i wish it was. in eastern syria, where we do have platforms, we are developing a relationship based that has been very effective and we hope we can build upon in this northwest part of the country where we have these localized competitions between different groups we support that we can work locally to deescalate that. i have to be honest, without people on the ground working the problems it is very hard. remoteard to do it by control. and iraq, we have people on the ground. onean work to tamp down thing's flareup. we have close relationships. we recognize we need and the air force to move in iraq and not just the kurds. we are recruiting arabs by the thousands now. and northwest syria, it is

incredibly difficult and it is one of my frustrations. >> you have identified the gordian knot we all have to deal with. you are same without war, without presence on the ground of americans, we risk local conflicts becoming more heated and problematic and of course many of us know the risks with theing more u.s. forces on ground. this is a tough one to figure our way out of the hand part of the reason the im glad you have taken up this assignment. thank you mr. chairman. >> i will be very brief. about therlier talks foundation of what we were doing. i know you talked with senator rubio about what needs to happen. do we feel that forces can be assimilated to deal with rocker in the near term -- with rocca in the near term?

>> we realize we have to have an arab forced to move into the arabic areas. in february this was just getting off the ground. i was there to talk about this operation which at the time was the biggest operation in syria in an arab town. we organized a force of about 6000 or so. 2500 were arab. the first time we had in inclusive mix. that was one of the things that gave president obama the strength to organize the forces. what is so important is the ratio is reversed. it is mostly and arab force moving. a much more limited force for the kurds. force we would use. the americans working this on the ground every day in northern .yria, they are encouraged

more and more arab leaders are coming to join the force. they want to be part of the push . the timeline is good but i would not underestimate how hard it is to pull these forces together to organize them and make them an organized force. however, i think we have hit on something that can work. -- don't want >> you don't want to lay out a them, we thought last june was going to be the time we went into mozilla but obviously it is this june and we are still not ready. i look forward to that off-line conversation. i know you are going to the white house and i don't know who the audience is there but i know --od is still killing people

assad issod -- still killing people. what kind of forces going to be needed to stop the civil war? it is evident russia and iran have not had the effect on assad that was contemplated when the cessation began in i hope you're able to talk to me after to their little bit more about the thinking. we thank you for your service to our country. the record will be open until the close of business on thursday. if you can answer promptly the follow.question we will we thank you for your service and appreciate you being here and with that, the meeting is adjourned. >> thank you mr. chairman.

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coming up this morning on c-span, michael froman on nafta and the ttp trade agreements. is showne final report to the media on the benghazi committee. >> c-span's "washington journal," live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. coming up this morning, with the release of the benghazi report, we want to open up the report to you. and then we move the conversation to immigration policy in the u.s., including

the recent decision on president obama's immigration order. and then we will week with the u.s. customs order -- and then discuss the immigration debate surrounding the brexit campaign in the united kingdom. cspanre to watch th 's "washington journal." >> this morning we are back for the weekly prime minister's question time. this comes less than a week after the european referendum. the resignation of david cameron and one day after jeremy corbyn launched a no-confidence vote. live at 7:00 a.m. eastern on c-span. vice president joe biden speaks to a cancer summit today at howard university in washington.

this is part of president obama's cancer initiative. carol burnett lost her daughter to cancer in 2002. see that live, beginning at 9:00 3.m. eastern on c-span >> this weekend on c-span's cities tour, along with our comcast cable partners, we discussed the history and literary life of many novelists. this showcases many of his great finds, including brigham young's copy of the "book of mormon" and an original copy of thomas payne's "common sense." >> he wanted to have this printed. he wanted the proceeds to buy the soldiers mittens. after it went through three printings, they had a falling out. so, thomas payne allowed anybody

to print it. you lower the price and said -- he lowered the price and said anybody could purchase it. >> and, anti-mormonism in america, since its founding in the 1930's and the current struggles with the animosity. >> they are a religious minority ho overtime, have had debates over religion. >> and tickets for the brigham museum ofersity paleontology. talksrator of the museum about how the fossils were gathered from utah and surrounding states and how dr. jetson changed the way fossils and bones are displayed. >> the animal looks more alive in the sense that you get the

feeling that these are bones, but if brings life oto these bones. >> and the professor of history saysigham university, mormons began setting up satellite communities. and they established the satellite of provo. noontch this on saturday at eastern and sunday on c-span3. the c-span cities tour, working with our cable affiliates and visiting cities across the country. now, a discussion on u.s. trade policy and the impact of the transpacific partnership agreement. u.s. trade representative michael froman spoke at the bretton woods committee annual meeting. the portion of this event is two hours.

>> it is a great pleasure to have michael froman here with us today. he has a lot of things going, tpp in asia, trying to get approval for that. also, ttip in europe. eufact, he as an negotiator coming here tomorrow to talk with him. as we speak he is trying to work on an investment treaty with china. mike has done a great job, as i said, in his present role, but he was also in the white house during the first obama term, working on international economic affairs, advising the

president. i have a good chance to work with him, on the free trade agreement, as well as negotiations with brazil. so, we are very fortunate that he is with us here today. so, mike, would you please come up? then, we will have some questions afterwards. [applause] froman: thanks very much, bill. it is an honor to be here and talk about the importance of u.s. leadership with this prestigious group. the title of the previous session seems to be particularly timely at the moment. in many parts of global economy, growth is uneven and weak. in china, progress on reform seems uncertain. russia and brazil continue to face headwins. the myope, between

greek crisis, the rise of zero skepticism -- between the brexit prices, the rise of euro skepticism, this has been a very trying time. trade is growing at a slower pace than the economy as a whole. if full employment is to be achieved in a peaceful world and with the standards of living that will permit for man's reasonable hopes. those are not my words. but they continue to resonate today. here at home, we have been going for the longest uninterrupted period in recorded history and we are doing so at the high-end of the spectrum among industrialized economies. over the last six years we have added 14 million new jobs and cut employment. manufacturing output ais at an

all-time high. this is the longest interrupted streak since the 1960's, adding 0,000 manufacturing jobs to the u.s. economy. and wages have managed to pick up, 2.5% last year. we seem to be on the same track this year. slowly,oo little, too but at least it is a positive trend. there is still a great amount of anxiety out there. and some of that is certainly rooted in economics. between the changing wageetition, 15 years of confusion, there is a concern that the system might be working for a few, but not the many, that the game is rigged. and other countries don't follow the same rules we do, but

instead, act unfairly. the economic recovery has not found its way too many americans. it is important we do not ignore these concerns. they are real and legitimate. the question is, what do we do about them? most economists will tell you that automation has to do more with the changing of the workforce than globalization. the problem is, we do not get to vote on automation. nobody votes on the next generation of computers. nobody votes on what the next generation of robots should he deployed. nor do we get to vote o itemization. the economies that have been close to the rest of the world are now integrated with the rest of the global economy. globalization is a force you cannot wish away. well, what we do get to vote on are trade agreements. so, they become the vessel into rhich people pour thei

anxieties regarding income inequality. they become the magnets of concern for a much broader and largely unrelated set of facts. but trade agreement are not the cause of thebut trade agreemen'e cause of the problems. they can be the solution to them , along with policies such as investment in infrastructure, education, and training. trade agreement of alastair shape globalization to our advantage. they help write the rules of the global trading system. we start from the fact that the u.s. has one of the most open economies in the world, in large part because of decisions made decades ago and supported by 12 presidents since. applied tariff is less than 1.5% and we don't use regulations as a disguised barrier for trade.