billions of dollars in this fund in their disputing the $300,000 that we took in matching funds. it is political. it is democrats and republicans and they do everything they can to discourage a third party. we are opting out of this matching funds because of our experience the last cycle were literally we're being questioned the i'd thought it andy t'd crossed. that was with a relationship with the federal elections commission's that kind of went like this. and guest: an indication theseup and now, all of questions after the entire time, we were engaged with them. so really we're going to stick clear that. >> just a quick follow-up. what does your fundraising look like in the third quarter? in other words july 1 and , onward? gov. johnson: i think that it is perhaps safe to say that we

might be at 10 times the level we were in the whole cycle of 2012. so, i think you are going to see some robust numbers relative to democrats and republicans. no, it is still a long ways back but enough funds for us to actually be able to play in this game. >> much has been written about the relationship, the friendship between governor weld and mitt romney. will mitt romney be endorsing you and your running mate? gov. johnson: well, i think it would really be difficult for someone who is a prior elected republican to endorse -- certainly it is harder if you are an elected republican or democrat to cross over the line, but we are seeing that. regardless of whether it's mitt romney or not, there are those that are crossing the line. i am really heartened by all of

it. >> do you want his endorsement? gov. johnson: it would be terrific to have it. but i'm not expecting it. i'm not expecting anybody understanding the realities of being a former elected official or an elected official. you know, that is really a tough one for those that are in the position. >> let me go back to ginger gibson and the poll numbers from reuters, donald trump now at 35%. does that surprise you, that low number for the republican nominee? gov. johnson: no i've always , maintained that donald trump alienates more than half of republicans and a republican for me has always meant smaller government and that is what bill weld and i are in spades, is smaller government. on the civil liberties side, and the side of marriage equality, a woman's right to choose, legalizing marijuana, really question our military interventions. i think that also draws from

democrats. is smaller government. so i think we draw equally from , both sides. no, no surprise. donald trump alienates republicans. ms. gibson: governor, what about the ted cruz republicans who say they can't vote for donald trump? maybe you have encountered some who have said they can't get behind legalizing marijuana and marriage equality and any of the other social issues. when you interact with those voters, what do you tell them? and what is your pitch to say they can vote for you despite their differences? gov. johnson: well, look it , doesn't matter what you are socially as long as you don't force it on others. to come down on the side of choice on all of these issues, that is the libertarian position. the libertarian position is also -- bill weld and i are promising in the first 100 days to submit a balanced budget on how you do that. well, to do that, you have to address medicaid and medicare,

to do that, reform needs to take place with regard to social security, and that is not cutting social security but it is certainly reform, and it is military spending also. when the pentagon itself says we could reduce u.s. bases by 20% and that has not happened, where is the common sense here? >> governor i wanted to pick up , on that, talk to you about how you envision your first hundred days agenda. just to get a feel your style of libertarianism. mr. drucker: when, i think, a lot of voters, people who don't pay as much attention as we do, think about libertarians they think about the political party that doesn't believe the government should run stoplights. let a private company police the streets, right? gov. johnson: you know you are libertarian when you come to the intersection at 2:00 a.m., the light is red, you sit there for a few seconds, and there is just nobody coming from any direction whatsoever, so you go through the intersection.

that is kind of a libertarian trait, i think. mr. drucker: when a lot of people think of you, they think primarily or at least about your first, stance on marijuana which is becoming more in vogue across the country. walk us through both domestically and internationally, foreign policywise, how you envision your presidency? what you would do in your first 100 days? for instance, we have seen both clinton and trump to some degree talk about less foreign intervention. although, in some ways, trump is a lot less hawkish than clinton. trump has gone so far as to say he would pull the u.s. out of long-standing post-world war ii alliances. what you look back as a commander-in-chief as it relates to the traditional u.s. foreign-policy and domestically, what you try to do first? before you have lost your alliances. what you look back as a political capital? gov. johnson: well we honor all , treaties and obligations. that would be wrong to come to

the office and not honor everything it is that we are obligated to do. with regard to foreign policy, i think we need to get congress involved in a declaration of war. we need to have an invincible national defense, but when we get involved in regime change , that is when things really get messy. not on purpose, but clinton and obama backed both the opposition in libya and syria, and this was not intentional, but they backed the opposition. they armed the opposition, and the opposition was aligned with isis. the opposition gets wiped out and isis ends up with all the arms. that is what we are dealing with right now, afghanistan. i supported going into afghanistan to begin with because we were attacked. make no bones about it. if we are attacked, we will attack back. with regard to afghanistan, we went into afghanistan to get osama bin laden and al qaeda.

after seven months, we wiped out al qaeda. no osama bin laden, but we could have left afghanistan after seven months and kept our options open for osama bin laden. but look, getting out of afghanistan tomorrow, as bad as that situation might be, we are going to face the same consequences 20 years from now if that is when we decide to get out or forever, according to some. look have we not learned the , lessons of history? it does not work when it comes to, in this case afghanistan. ,mr. drucker: do you agree or disagree with donald trump when he calls the president the founder of isis and also tied hillary clinton, calling her the m.v.p.? gov. johnson: well unintentional. , founder of isis, that somehow has this connotation that they support isis. no, they didn't support isis. but the end result has been that unintended consequence of seeing that happen.

but it isn't just obama and clinton. you know, it was going into iraq. it was getting rid of saddam hussein, which was a check when it came to the iran regime change. we get involved in regime change. we end up with all these new consequences that continue us in the state of what seems to be endless war. >> one quick follow up. obviously, going back in time, there were mistakes that we could look at, and if this was not done, we may not be facing this problem or that problem. what we are facing today is a threat from the islamic state and both republicans and democrats and people unaffiliated seem to recognize that. there have been two isis- inspired terrorist attacks on our soil in the past it year, , -- past year,r less than a year, we have seen what is been going on europe. what is your plan? do you think it requires a

us-led plan to combat the threat of isis and defeat it? gov. johnson: i really do think that isis you can look at it as sand through an hourglass. you point out that there were terrorist actions carried out in this country that were isis -inspired. certainly not directly linked with isis, but we will see that isis threat through to its conclusion. i also think it is significant that a couple weeks ago, there was a poll among active military personnel on whom they supported for president of the united states. myself and bill weld were on top of that poll with donald trump second and clinton third. ms. gibson: governor, donald trump raised a lot of eyebrows last month when he said that he would require some checks before moving to defend a nato ally if the russians were to attack, or another country here to attack

-- another country were to attack one of those nations. do you share his opinion that nato need to be reevaluated and that the treaty is outdated or do you think that the current situation where we as a nation would move very quickly to protect a nato ally should remain in place? gov. johnson: we need to honor all existing treaties and obligations. make no bones about that. but the world is dynamic. government is dynamic. re-examining these treaties, do we really want to go to war over countries that were in the former soviet union? communism is dead. you know that was russia that , led that revolution. the new world moving forward, look, the whole intention of a johnson-weld administration will be to make the world a safer place, not a less safe place. in that context, i really think the biggest threat is north korea, and the fact that at some

point, these intercontinental ballistic missiles are going to work. so from the standpoint of diplomacy, i think we should really join with china here to address this because they understand this better than anyone. we have got 40,000 troops in south korea. there is no chance that north korea invades south korea conventionally, but they do have those nuclear weapons. we have got them covered with our umbrella, but that is the scary part of all this. are we going to go to nuclear war with north korea? that, in my opinion, is something that has to get addressed, and we can do that with china and potentially have the opportunity to withdraw 40,000 troops from south korea. imagine china with 40,000 troops in central america? >> one of the words we have been hearing a lot is temperament with regards to donald trump. do you think donald trump is the temperament to be

that has -- donald trump has the temperament to be commander-in-chief? gov. johnson: no. i base that on all these things that he has said starting with the deportation of 11 million illegal immigrants. that has the basis in total misunderstanding, building a fence across the border and am i am speaking now as a border state governor. when he calls mexican immigrants murderers and rapists, when in fact, statistically, they are more law-abiding than u.s. citizens. they are not taking job that u.s. citizens want. we should be embracing immigration. we should make it as easy as possible for somebody that wants to come into this country and work to be able to get a work visa. a working visa should entail a background check and a social security card and applicable taxes. with regard to being inflammatory and divisive and isolationist, these are the words that donald trump seems to be uttering every single day.

i think he said 150 things that would disqualify anyone else from being president of the united states and all you have to do is wait until tomorrow and it will be 153. >> speaking of domestic politics, governor, talk to me, talk to us about your position on nafta, transpacific partnership. mr. drucker: the polling still shows, at least some new polling shows, there is somewhat of majority support for free trade agreements. politically, there has become a bipartisan sense difficult to muster support for tdd and -- for the tpp, and even talking about renegotiating or walking away from nafta. it gets you a good, loud cheer. the two major candidates, the republican and democrat, are in somewhat of agreement on trade, at least rhetorically. what would you do as president just, if i could throw this out there as well, when you talk

about reducing the size and scope of government, what does that mean? gov. johnson: is there any part of government that couldn't be more efficient? i don't think any of us would suggest that government can't be more efficient and that everybody could do with less. but you can't do with less if you are not going to actually address medicaid and medicare. those are the 800 pound gorillas in the room, and we are the free trade candidates. i think that crony capitalism is alive and well in the world. crony capitalism, very simply, that is when government gets involved in these deals that really unfairly give advantages to those that ultimately pay for that advantage. free trade -- i'm afraid in this country, we have come to associate free-trade and crony capitalism as one and the same when in fact they are opposites. free trade is what it implies.

without government interference. now government regulation, if it , comes to health and safety, that is one thing. but if it comes to actually unfair advantage, meaning those that have money and influence, they pay for it. i'm speaking now as the former governor of new mexico seeing this legislation passed and vetoing it whenever i saw unfair advantage. i don't think we can achieve income equality in this country, but we can achieve an opportunity quality. that is what everybody, i think that that is what people genuinely want. and make no mistake, i think that right now is an issue that there is no opportunity equality. but there can be. ms. gibson: governor, there is one place in the polls where you are doing better than donald trump and that is among millennials. one might joke that it would be

your marijuana position, but other than that, why do you think young people are more interested in your campaign and than they are in the republican opponent? gov. johnson: i'm leading trump when it comes to millennials. if you take the 18-24 age group, actually leading among that age group. so, draw your own conclusions. [laughter] gov. johnson: we have blown it. my generation has blown it. these are issues that should have been resolved long ago. they have not been. and the issues, that there would be health care going forward, and there would be a safety net for all of us, that there would be retirement going forward, i think young people recognize that unless something is done, it is just not going to happen and i think young people recognize the fallacy of going to war, supporting regime change. >> one state you have the possibility of picking up his

is utah, were donald trump did poorly in the primary. he even admitted in the past week that it has been a tough state for him. just use that has one example. how do you win the state of utah? gov. johnson: i think the majority of republicans are about smaller government. that is what drew me to the republican party, but there is the social dogma that the republicans have of late, and i'm now talking about the last 20 years that social conservatives, you either on board or you are not. libertarians, look, libertarians could care less whether you are socially conservative or socially liberal. just don't force it on anybody else. i think the republican party is carrying that on their back. i think when it comes to all replicas, utah for example, look, it is first and foremost -- when it comes to all

republicans, utah for example, look, it is first and foremost about smaller government and then there is one unforgivable in life and that is hypocrisy. that is saying one thing and doing another. and i think politicians are really poor in that category, meaning saying one thing and in fact doing another. i prided myself on telling the truth. if you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything. it makes things a lot simpler. host: david drucker? mr. drucker: in terms of where you go next, and we touched on this earlier in the conversation, is it the mountain states? is that where you can do the most damage in terms of your opponents? and how much of what you are doing in this campaign do you think could have a lasting effect versus the fact that you have got a chance at attention here because americans think so poorly historically poorly of , the two major nominees? gov. johnson: where is the representation for 43% of

america that are registered as independent? i happen to think that bill weld and myself occupy the middle of what has become extreme on both sides. republicans and democrats. look, the scenario here is that you vote for clinton, you vote for trump, congress -- things are going to be more polarized than ever, and let's not kid ourselves, they are going to be. either side winning. what about the scenario of a couple of, well, libertarians winning, a couple of former republican governors serving and heavily blue states hiring libertarians, republicans, democrats, a real bipartisan administration and calling out both sides to come to the middle to deal with the issues facing this country? under those three scenarios, i think you can make a case that the third scenario might make some sense.

mr. drucker: finally, if you do not participate in the debates next month, then what? gov. johnson: we will keep after it, but i don't think there's any chance of winning. can't win if you are not the super bowl, and the super bowl is to see who the next president of the united states is. i'm optimistic that it is going to happen. anchor: -->> just to be clear, if you are not in the debates, you don't think you can win? gov. johnson: there is no way you can win the race. that would just, in my opinion, defy reality. >> gary johnson is the libertarian nominee. the former governor of new mexico. he is joining us from las vegas. thank you for being with us here on c-span. we appreciate it. gov. johnson: thank you all. thank you so much. >> we continue the conversation. david drucker of the washington and miss gibson avoiders.

david, let's talk more about the race. you wrote a piece this week. the polls are not lying, donald trump is losing. >> if you look at all the data and look at the historical record of the data, we can be pretty confident that what the polls are telling us today are correct for what is happening today. and what does that mean? it means trump is losing to clinton. we have seen a spade of national polls in front of a saw a battleground poll. he is losing, and in some cases, losing badly. that does not mean he can turn it around. one of the biggest misconceptions the voters have, maybe because they want to believe so badly that the side can win is that somehow the -- the whole truth on purpose or accidentally bring if we look back at elections, whether midterm elections or in particular talking about a presidential election, 2012, 2008, 2004, we have found that the national polls tend to tell us what is happening and they tend to, the very last polls before election day tells us who will win.

>> ginger gibson, the reuters poll shows that donald trump is struggling and yet it is only mid-august and we have seen historically that things can change pretty quickly. ms. gibson: i think gary johnson made a excellent point when he said that the debates are the super bowl. they can change. that is going to be the next inflection point. if david said, at 20 lines. and right now, the trendlines are very bad for donald trump. it is going to take big movement for those trendlines to be altered. right now, we are not seeing that happen on the campaign trail. frankly, most americans are not paying attention. they are more excited about michael phelps winning a gold medal than they are about watching a campaign speech. i think it is good to be those -- i think it is going to be those debates, those moments, so if donald trump opts not to participate, that could be detriment to mental to his campaign. estates inve those the opposite direction.

host: david, is gary johnson ready for this moment? he has been getting a lot of media attention. we have been covering him. you are writing about him. he is on all the national networks. yet, if you maximizing this opportunity? mr. drucker: only time will tell. i'm not sure there's anything more he can do to maximize the moment. the one thing about politics is i think we can to overthink this stuff. if they like things, they send you money. johnson is a competent third choice in this race. he has a record of being a businessman and a governor of a real, actual state for two terms. he is not some gadfly. but at the end of the day, if you don't have a lot of american voters being inspired by a libertarian philosophy of governing, even johnson and wells, sort of, not harsh libertarianism, it will not be enough.

than iore out of him actually expected him to based on what i have seen in the past. at the end of the day, it is about anybody to turn out for you. in the modern era of campaigning, one of the things that hurt any third party candidate who does not have a real apparatus is all of the troops on the ground and the data analytics. the voting, i agree with what ginger said, the voting starts next month. in a few weeks, absentee ballots of north carolina are being mailed out. october 12, ohio, early voting starts. by the time he gets to december 26 in the next debate, voting is well underway. this is not like 30-40 years ago when you waiting for the final -- when you waited for the final 72 hours to start moving forward in the polls and you have a late surge or an october surprise that could blow things out. i mean, things really can get set in stone. we saw it in 2012. yeah lot of people aren't paying , attention the summer but barack obama blew mitt romney

out of the water. host: you are on the campaign trail this week with donald trump. what you looking for? ms. gibson: i'm looking to see if he is going to connect with voters. he is holding the rallies. he knows those people will be voting for him. what is his campaigning to reach the undecided? what is he doing to reach the people who he could win over? from a gary johnson or from an undecided position? that is the most important thing between now and this election for him. host: ginger gibson with reuters. and david drucker, senior correspondent for the washington examiner and the examining politics podcast. available on websites. to both of you, thank you so much for being with us. have a good weekend. >> thank you. three years after supreme court ruling overturned part of the voting rights act, courts across the country have struck down a number of state laws saying they disseminate against specific groups of voters.

saturday night, c-span' issue spotlight looks at voting rights and the impact on the 2016 election. we will feature part of the 2013 supreme court oral argument in shelby versus holder. there was a congress look at whether to restore the voting onhts act plus a discussion whether the voting rights act is necessary. here's what the presidential candidates have to say. >> a lot of places are not going to have voter id. what does that mean? what does that mean question might you keep walking in and voting? what is happening is a sweeping effort to disempower and this in franchise people of , poor people, and young people from one end of our country to the other. >> or watch our issue spotlight on voting rights saturday night at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span and www.c-span.org.

>> now, a look at behind-the-scenes white house transitions from one has it into another. participants include former white house chief of staff josh bolten and mack mclarty. this is one hour 20 minutes. >> one of the most striking features of presidential transition today is the bipartisanship that prevailed among government officials in , writes the transition laws. the president and the white house staff that that the planning and the agencies that carry out the policies. it was not always the case. when in 1952, president truman wanted to bring into the white house both the republican and the democratic presidential nominees, to meet with his cabinet and white house staff members, he met with a partisan divide. ms. kumar: he had wanted them to come in because when he he came

into office, he was unprepared. he came in in january of 1945, roosevelt died in april and two minute new of the atomic bomb. and so, sealed by that experience, he wanted to bring people in so that they were going to understand what was ahead of them. general eisenhower turned down truman's imitation a large part because he said he was running against the administration's programs and he thought the public would not understand why he was becoming -- he was coming into the white house when he was running against it. truman was very upset. he send a handwritten note that she sent -- he sent a handwritten note that this is by commenting on his own way

of looking at the turn down by the general. he wrote "i am extremely sorry that you allowed a bunch of screwballs to come between us. you have made a bad mistake and not injure it will this great republic. the strong partisan nature of that transition no longer distinguishes the handoff of power from one president to his successor. our five analysts today -- our five panelists today are in a position to discuss. additionally, they are all involved in current efforts to fortify the transition process and find areas of agreement and that will ensure presidential transition in a bipartisan setting, which is the theme of our conference.

our conference is one of three that we are going to hold at texas presidential library. the other two are going to be at the lbj library september 22 and september 23, dealing with national security, and then on october 18 at the george w bush -- george h.w. bush library. a national security crisis. in all, our theme of the importance of bipartisanship in transition. staff going to chief of who know the beginnings and ends of administrations, mack mclarty, he came in at the beginning of the clinton administration as chief of staff and josh bolten was at the end of the bush administration. his chief of staff. and aber 11 attacks, transition out of office