neil: i think the staff is going to be coming around with microphones. >> three questions. re there any pictures of the city -- town? i can't imagine what it looks like when you land in a town? any slides? retel: no. >> ok. no worries. you can go online. are people emigrating in large numbers? gretel: they are just going south. >> neil, can i listen to your show on the internet? it there an app for your station? neil: go on to hawaii public radio. it is especially good if you sleep in late.

>> ok. i do actually. >> catch the morning edition. i am on tuesday, wednesday, and thursday with the pacific news minute. >> thank you. >> fascinating talk and so good to have both of you. i was wondering if the greenland government is trying to -- obviously they can change all of global warming but if they tried to say we will try to maintain some of the hunting, etc., supporting it in a way because it is such a precious and unique culture? gretel: they would not need to because it is the greenlanders themselves who dictate how things are going to be. hey rule themselves. they don't have a lot of people like us telling them what to do. yence is in charge of maintaining tradition.

you can't do it without ice. it is not there. people like yence and his family will stay until the bitter end. it is the younger people who are leaving. neil: the greenland government is leasing areas to search for oil and there is quite a bit of extractive industries on land in terms of iron ore. >> the name greenland has always sounded like marketing or a euphemism and now -- i wonder if the inuit refer to the territory as a name or some variant on that name and if it is going to get greener? gretel: it is getting greener. i'm thinking of moving to south greenland and growing hay and raising sheep.

the word for greenland means green island -- big island. it is a translation from a viking name. >> iceland didn't work out so well. gretel:eric the red was trying to lure people to live there. silly guy. >> thank you very much your time. i do enjoy it. a question about the happier imes 20 years ago. a question about, how is it like being a child and adolescent growing up in the village? gretel: fantastic. it is the childhood anyone would have wanted. there are six months of 24 hour a day light.

there are no cars in the village. children can wander anywhere. there is nothing that will hurt them. the polar bear might come but they know how to behave. during the summer, there are no restrictions on when they have to go to bed. they are just out and when they get tired they go home. if they get hungry, they go home and eat. i have never heard a child complain. even 30 below on a dog sled. a five-year-old sitting on yence's lap, one time he was cold. his grandmother was next to me nd put the boots over his feet nd then he smiled. they were taught how to do everything so by the time they were seven they could handle a

hip. the dogs weren't whipped. it was an auditory signal. they could throw a harpoon or fire a gun. if the fish were caught, they knew how to prepare them to it. -- eat. they knew how to do everything. >> could you touch on how romance is happened or relationships are formed? gretel: well, it is a village. it is interesting. in a slightly larger town, they had a house which was just for teenagers. no adults were allowed there. the teenagers could go there any time. they went to school and stuff. on the weekends they would go there and they were allowed to do whatever they did it it was a wonderful society.

you are alone out there so there were not too many bad things hat could come in. children and young adults were eally respected. >> my question is what do you cook with. how do you cook it and in what? what do you burn? i'm assuming that is oil or something. gretel: these old-fashioned swedish stoves, camp stoves with single flame. they carried a spaghetti pot. his is modern. odern hunting society. and they brought gas imported rom denmark.

to get water, the old ice, the multi-year ice out on top of the and ce, we would buy piece with that, take off chunks and put them on the sled. we would cut them up smaller. the first thing you do when you make camp is but a chunk of ice in the pot to melt. first you drink because strangely you get very thirsty out there. more was put in for cooking. everything was boiled. >> so what did they do before all these modern conveniences? >> eat it raw. they still do. you know, two women on the beach until about 3:00 in the morning, where i saw them

butchering a seal and they took out the liver like that and were holding it up and beckning me to take a bite. it was still steaming. >> what did they do for water before that? >> that's a good question. yes. will you ber lamp. thank you -- blubber lamp. i've been traveling for about a month. >> there's almost no wood. wood is very precious. there is in alaska. >> they had some but it was very precious. >> anyway. yes, blubber lamps. so it's how they kept warm and how -- it just gives off a little bit of a flame. but in arctic canada, there are people who still -- women who

till tend blubber lamps out of camp. somehow that was lost in greenland. but they had vikings to help them, whereas the innewt people had slightly different influences. >> did you say that greenland is going to be drilling for oil? >> they have let out leases to explore for oil. last i heard, as of the last i heard they have not found any. but, yes, they have let out leases to explore for oil. >> many of us thought this was a terrible idea. but, you know. tough rule. they can do what they want. >> ok. i was wondering about the wood, the sleds were made by wood. >> brought in by ship from

denmark. when i was there there's a once a year ship. i spent one summer with the man and his daughter and son and little kids and he had built his own little shack. he had been a danish guy but had sort of dropped out. and he said, well, i was halfway through building my house and the supply ship couldn't get here because it was too cold. it iced up too early. so we had no nails in the entire village for the entire year. it teaches patience. uits that , the in cross the north are they in communication with each other? >> yes. there's the conference that happens every four years in some arctic nation. and it's just like they let me go -- i came with the greenland

contingent. it's not really open to other people but it operates just like the u.n. everyone has on head phones because the dial ects are so extreme. and there's the russians who speak russian. so it extends. but it's very dynamic. in 're very much involved things. >> i would like to thank both of you and congratulations for the excellent presentation. i have a question. according to the mayas, men have taken advantage and -- of all of the resources that they thought the world would end in the year 2000. but not exactly 2000. after 2000. ow, according to the

graphologist, is there an east mat about how long the world will be able to survive if we still try to make it right? thank you. >> if there is, they haven't told me. but i would be the last to know. don't think so. >> one more. the pressure i'm sorry, everybody. did you find the cultures were in any way superstitious or anything that sort of -- i guess were a little outside of the normal? well, i mean, >> tell the story about the shamen, about the polar bear. > so yens is a special person.

he has some special -- he is a natural leader. he would never call himself a shamen. he thinks that's not appropriate for the 21st century but he one time when we were hold up in weathered in somewhere, he began telling a story. and when he talks everybody falls silent. and so he said, well, i was in my tent and -- normally we live in tents that are put up over two shreds put together. this old battered canvas tent. i was in my tent and the dog started barking and i went outside. i saw there was a polar bear up on this piece of ice. so i grabbed my rifle and i went running towards the bear. and suddenly -- and the bear was at the top. and suddenly the bear turned around and i saw that it had a human face. and he said, and so i went

away. and he said several times that bear has becknd to me to come with it. but he said i'm a modern man and i couldn't leave my family and i couldn't leave my society so much -- we're trying so hard to survive in the modern world. it just wouldn't be right. so i couldn't do it. >> so instead of going over the hill with the bear, he became the -- >> he is sorted of the equivalent of a senator. he as politician, but a good one. yeah. so he goes to conferences all over europe. but he loves nothing more than being out with his dogs. he still has all his dogs. nd that to him is nur vanna.

>> thank you all for coming. we appreciate it. [applause]

>> sunday night on q&a. >> there was an average, imagine, of one racial lynching a week in the south and it was a brilliant psychological device to hold down a race. because if you were black you were afraid that this could happen to you. the trial following the 1981 killing of 19-year-old michael donald by the kkk in mobile, alabama. >> michael is a teenager, he's trained to become a brick

layer, the youngest of seven children. he's home with his mother in his house and his aunt asks him to go get a pack of cigarette. goes owled. this old buick pulls out behind him, ordered him into the back seat of the car. he knows when he gets in that car what happens. lack man in alabama, you know. >> local government and public safety officials discuss the costs and benefits of community policing efforts. we'll hear from former tampa orida police chief james caster. this event is hosted by the research group cna.

>> hello. this is being broadcast live by c-span. number one, there is a

reception after this session this afternoon. we encourage all you to join us and continue the conversation. and you will receive, if you don't have in their package, you will receive a feedback form. we intend to continue this series. we're very interested in your thoughts and suggestions about how we should do this and how we should be doing when we have these sessions. as i said when we went to break, we're now about to hear primarily from what the people on the other side of the street have to say about this whole reform issue. probably not surprisingly, several of our city management representatives on the panel actually have law enforcement backgrounds. so i think that's actually kind of a good mix and way to transition into the next discussion. but we're going to start out with rebecca, who just recently joined the bureau institute of justice's center for policing. she's a directer of policing there. just prior to that she was the

directer of research and policy and planning for the new york city police department. and if you look through her bio, you whether see that she has a number of other research credentials in her background and some actually some local government work through the new york city office of management and budget. i have had the pleasure to work with her on a couple projects with the city police department and have always found her to be very helpful. so bear with me, i'm going to introduce the other panelists and then turn it over to you. ck herd, mayer of kansas city, we're very pleased to have him here. we had joel mchale. great to have somebody from the other side of the street. mayer james was elected to his position in 2011. his focus and his passion for the work that he does has to do

with education employment efficiency and employment. i was with him in kansas city on police community and collaboration where he presented. and as most of sour speakers, he is very passionate about this work. llowing sly is going to be thoron bowman. we know him as t. he is now deputy city manager in arlington, texas. t is actually involved in several of our projects here and a valued and respected colleague. again, he brings a wonderful perspective of city management from his experience as a police officer and a police chief. and then we have my new friend leonard, the directer of research and project development at the center for

public safety. the thing i like most about him is when i was an undergraduate, he was an undergraduate in political science at the same campus. so we went to school together a long time ago. he has actually been very helpful to us through his role as a chief consultant, chief adviser for the international city and county management association, icma, on issues regarding public safety and policing and law enforcement. nd so he and i have been talking and we through our conversations, i think the idea for this session bubbled up. so very glad to have him. now, let's turn over to rebecca to start us off, please. >> thank you so much for that introduction. i'm delighted to be here with my esteemed panelists and really happy to be with all of you here in the audience as well as those participating with us virtually.

as the other panelists and our opening key speaker mentioned, there's really a crisis in policing today. and i think that rod described it just as perfectly as anybody could, that it's a crisis in confidence. in the 1909s we had another type of crisis in policing. a crisis that involved violence and disorder in our communities. thankfully we've moved beyond that at least a bit in many of our u.s. cities, but the police and the community are at an all-time sort of odds. the confidence is really very lacking in both directions. we talk a lot about how the confidence of community members and police is lacking, but i think it's also important to note that police officers are not very confident in the communities that they're serving, either. and that they're scared every single day that they go to work. and many of the problems that we see today have to do with

fears of trust, anxiety, and just overall fear for safety and well being. we also know now that no community is immune to the problems that we've seen. it's happening all around us. i'm from new york city and we think about our community-based organizations and the police have a very long history of working with our communities. but we've had the same problems and many similar circumstances to what we've seen in ferguson as well as all across the country. so it's clear that we need reform. but what kind of reform and how do we reform? and this panel is designed to discuss the costs and benefits. and so i want to focus a little bit on the sort of research aspect of this work and the costs and benefits at this moment in time are more profound than they have been at any point in my lifetime, inway. so we must think about and discuss the status quo in a really empirical and thoughtful

way as possible. our anecdotes and feelings are important but we need to be able to measure and quantify what the values of the reform side are as well. so in the next few minutes i will describe the approach to police reform. since i don't have much time i'll talk quickly. i'm a new yorker so i apologize if i talk too quickly but i will be conscious of the time. but i also just want to note before i begin that their works with units of local government and community leaders all across the country. so if anything that i say today resonates with you please feel free to reach out to me. we would love to figure out ways to explore collaboration with other units of government that we've not worked with in the past. so i think i have a power point. today i will briefly provide an overview of the institute of justice as well as our description on historical work

on police reform and our emerging strategy to develop models that will develop law enforcement as well as the communities that they serve. we work with others who share our vision to tackle the most pressing injustices from our ay from the causes and consequences to the unmet needs of the vulnerable, the margelized and those harmed by crime and violence. we have to think about the criminal justice system a in the context of a changing and dynamic society. in less than three decades it's projected that there's going to be a minority majority in this country. so thinking about things about language access and due process is really important as the climate and the environment of our country is changing rapidly.

the centers and programs bring together staff with different perspectives who work on shared subject areas. overincarceration, communities of color, to improving government systems that affect the lives of immigrants and developing responses to the mental health needs of people involved with the justice system. we bring together researchers, technical assistance experts and providers of direct service in a way that amplifies our expertise and encourages the exchange of new ideas and creative problem solving. so our capacity to manage programs and conduct rigorous research includes performing cost benefit analyses which are often the key component of our projects. our cost benefit knowledge bank was initially fund bid the bureau of justice assistance and seeks to inform practitioners and policy makers about the budgetary impacts of policy choices and provide researchers and decisionmakers with tools helping to

incorporate cost benefit analysis into their policy development. we developed this knowledge bank in response to growing need for cost benefit analysis capacity in the criminal justice field. as a part of this work, vera has the capacity to conduct cba work and other cost related studies to provide assistance to local jurisdictions conducting their own studies and to carry out reach to advance the knowledge -- research. a little history on the vera institute of justice. so vera began doing criminal justice research over 55 years ago. the way the organization works is we identify an area within the criminal justice system in which we feel like there's a needed reform. we develop a sort of policy lever or set of solutions in order to address that problem. and then we rigorously test that solution in a pilot. often in what we call

demonstration projects, that work will involve a cost benefit analysis, include an impact analysis, qualitative interviews with stakeholders and community members. and the very first project began in manhattan in 1961 known as the manhattan bail project. this was a ground breaking reform and was so revolutionary and effective in its benefits that it was not only taken the scale of new york city and now continues to serve as new york city's pretrial services agency but it also continues to serve as best practices for pretrial and bail decision making all across the world. building off this success, vera began its first project in the policing field. in 1964, vera began working with police officials and the project was called the manhattan sumance project. as the title suggests, the idea was that police officers would use an acted waral tool, a risk assessment of sort so police officers could determine on the

spot who was most likely to fail to appear for arraignment and then dedicate the resources to putting in custody those individuals. individuals who were likely to show up for arraignment would instead be issued a sumance and not be escorted by a patrol officer throughout the entire arraignment process. this was a huge cost saver for new york city. and it was soon expanded across the city and has also served as a national model for the issuance of sumances all across the country. since that time, vera has worked extensively with law enforcement community partners throughout the country to promote efficient policing and strengthen relationships through our research demonstration projects and technical assistance. while vera's policing projects span a broad range of issues they have historicically fallen into five different categories. police management practices.

an example of this work is the develop the d to crime mapping system in the 1990s. that has everyone here probably has heard if not participated in the comstock process some of veras early work helped design comstock from inception. police use resorses, the sumance product that i just described. police oversight. in 2001 the vera institute developed the police assessment resource center which serves as the center to assist monitors and share lessons of reform process as well as just for innovation. e focus on police community. in the 1980s worked with the nyp and other police departmentments to develop models which served as the backbone for community policing

nationwide. finally policing in democratic societies worldwide. more recently, our work has focused on building police immigrant relations particularly post september 11th. this was in response to the policing community concerns and the desire to improve relations between law enforcement and in immigrants. in 2003 we focused a series of for yums designed to create channels of communication. we also published a series of guide books on best practices for policing in immigrant communities. and otherwise diverse communities including engaging police in immigrant communities and uniting communities post 9/11. most recently we released a series of publicications written for and by police officers to help guide building trust in a diverse nation. copies of these publicications you can find them in the back of this room and for those of you who are participating

remotely you can access the reports on vera's website. recently with an eye towards emerging issues in the field and the president's 21 century task force vera has dedicated resources to help scale up our policing work with a renewed focus on incubating and testing models and developping an action plan to achieve both community and officer satisfaction. this is something that was discussed quite a bit in the prior panel. enabling police to be effective problem solvers, policing has always been a complex profession with a serious impact on society. however, never has this profession been at the center of political and social debates as it is now. we're asking police officers to solve all of our social problems but yet we don't understand whether or not that's even an appropriate role for police officers to play. so we need to have an honest conversation that's impirkly

guided through research and in a very frank understanding of the resource that is we have available to us within our localities to figure out which problems police can most successfully solve and what falls outside of this. we're working to promote internal and externlt. there are recommendations to infuse community policing practices throughout police culture and operations including by tracking and measuring changes in public trust of police over time engaging community members and identifying problems and managing public safety, and collaborating with community members to design crime reduction strategies. additionally, action items include evaluating officers on community policing efforts as part of the performance evaluation process. in my prior role at the nypd and my primary assignment was to help them redesign the police officer performance

process. while there are a number of sort of best standards and sort guide posts to help departments figure out how to measure the performance of officers, it's so easy to establish a quota even without a quota think about the pharmaceutical industry or any sort of field and you have benchmarks. it makes it sort of easy and straightforward. so you can't really blame police departments for setting their standards in a way that you're asking officers to come up with numerical progress towards their efforts. but the problem is that has per verse consequences. if you're saying write this number of tickets or stop this many cars, there's no sort of qualityive component of that. so as a field i think that we really need to spend a lot of time to figure how do we measure quantity.

quantity's easy but measuring quality and defining quality is a much more difficult thing to do. ensuring access for disengaged vulnerable and emerging communities is the final area that we're focusing on. and the recommendations issues by the 21st century task force include guidance on how law enforcement should engage vulnerable populations including youth, people with physical and mental disabilities, people with limited english proficiency, the death and hard of hearing populations, lgbq populations a immigrants and others. several emerging issues that we're focused on include promoting accountability. like i mentioned before. with a focus on redesigning how officers performance is evaluated as well as developing and evaluating best practices for oversight entities. ensuring equal access to policing services a and reforms

and determining the roles of policing in the 21st century and right sizing their role and impact. our current efforts are managed by a small team including susan shaw, who is the directer of programs and strategy. myself, the directer of policing. retired chief liaison serving viser. 's senior ad we would love to learn more about the interests and the opportunities in the field that you all are pursuing so please contact me at any point if you have ideas that you'd like to explore in regards to cost benefit analysis or other types of research. and please feel free to ask any questions of me later on. we would love to learn more about what you're doing in your work with local jurisdictions. thanks so much. and speaking of local

jurisdictions. >> i guess that would be me. well, thanks for having me. i'm very honored to be here and to appear with major mchale. i'm an old trial lawyer. as i sat and listened to him talk, i had this flashback to my cousin vinny. and the opening statement. i just wanted to stand up and yell, "everything that i just said! " but i didn't because i like joe too much. but i also want to give a shoutout to police chief. when i was elected and by virtue of being elected became a member of the board of police commissioners, the first real duty that we had within the first few months was to select a new police chief. and we laboriously went through the process, did a national search even though there were -- it's really funny.

you talk about distrust and you talk about the issues. but i'm going to -- you're going to find that i'm going to be kind of real. when we did that and we were looking at several candidates, the african american community was upset with us because they thought that the only time that we had done a national search is when we had a viable african american candidate. now, that was obviously not true and we were able to say that. but it does go to show some of the depth and the level of distrust that exists between the civilian community and the police department. i am not going to be as informed by research as rebecca. i am not going to be as informed on matters of police policy as people who have been chiefs of police. my sole contact with actually doing police work was four years as a military policeman in the karen corps during the

vietnam era which i assure you was a different era. i comes from kansas city. it's a broad and beautiful city. more blfleds than paris more fountains than rome, some of the nicest people you would ever want to meet but totally racially divided and done so by the person who developed the plaza in kansas city. when it was a big economic senser with where the folks who had money lived and shopped. as they began to migrate further south into the city in order to keep the jews and african americans and other undesirables from moving with them, real estate covenents were put into real estate deeds of trust et cetera that forbid selling to them. so truce became that line on the east of which african americans and jews lived and on

the west side of which white folks lived. that line is still there. and although we are doing a lot to obliterate the physical line, the emotional psychological lines still exist. and if you can imagine the city that deliberatively divided itself along racial and religious lines, and if you can imagine who controlled the power structure including police, then you can understand how things have grown up in kansas city over a period of time. i am happy to report, however, that they're significantly better than they used to be. kansas city is 318 square miles. and i give you this information because we're going to talk about costs, then we have to talk about costs in the context of a city budget. it's 318 square miles. and if you want a little bit of an understanding as to what that means, san francisco would fit into kansas city eight

times. it has a population of 470,000 which is a density of about 1460 people were square mile. and when you do that what you really need to be thinking is every person is a dollar of taxes, or every person is a dollar for infrastructure. now, compare that of course to san francisco which is a much smaller city about 40 square miles. has a density of about 17,000 per square mile, 820,000 people. or new york city, 27,000 per square mile. or manhattan, 22 square miles, 69,000 people per square mile. now, when you look at that and you understand the connection between density population, dollars for taxes, et cetera, without of course factoring in the various levels of tax schemes, whether it's more property tax related or in the place of san francisco tourism and shipping and those types of

things related, you understand the constraints that we have. now, the reason i bring that up is because of the divided city situation it has created and exacerbated some of those underlying factors, poverty, lack of access to quality educational institutions over the long term, et cetera. and created an area of town that is undereducated, free and reduced lunch at 95% or so, underemployed, incomplete homes. i don't say broken because -- just because there's not a particular party there doesn't mean the family is broken but it's an incomplete home in that all the normal parts may not be present. and high crime. most of our violent crime sits in an area of 18 square miles, joe, or 13? 13 square miles in the city.

and if you overlay poverty information educational information, it's pretty easy to see why it's in that 13 square miles. that's where all of these factors have come home to roost and they've been present for a long, long time. all right. so getting to the issue of cost. our budget in the city is about 1.2, 1.25 billion. that's divided into three basic parts. on the one hand we have enterprise areas. one of those enterprise areas is the airport, federal money goes in stays in doesn't come out we can't use it to do streets roads bridges or schools. the water department. it goes in, they generate their own funds use their own funds to replenish the ridiculous amount of underground infrastructure. when we put in the street car and we decided that if we were oing to lay track for one --

one $100 million street car it would be good if the lines didn't blow up so we replaced the infrastructure at the same time. in the process of doing so we were pulling mains out of the ground that were stamp dated 1879. when we did the light district immediately adjacent there were civil war wooden sewerers that we pulled up. yada, yada, yada. that's not uncommon in large american cities to have that kind of infrastructure. it's like we treat our houses. you want to sell the house, slap some paint on that puppy put a new roof on this hang some shingles up there and hope like heck they don't check the pipes. well, we've done that in cities for a long time, deferred maintenance. so the airport is locked in, the water department is locked in, which leaves the part that we get to play with. by ave taxes -- sales taxes

the bunch. but sales taxes are always earmarked. we have a sales tax for the o, we have a sales tax for fire safety, we have a sales tax for capital improvements. we have sales taxes. but every one of those sales taxes goes to a specific thing. and the only one that goes really to the city -- and it's not a sales tax, it's an income tax -- is an earnings tax, 1% of all the profits and earnings of people who live and work in the city. it generates about 230, 240 million of our 500 general fund. it's very important. it's under attack by the legislature. we had to go down and if i've had those three extra sets of hand cuffs that guy said you had i guarantee i would be dragging some legislators around with me. but this is actually being

televised my name is joe mchale. all right. but anyway. so of that $540 million fund, 72% is allocated to fire police and ambulance. the rest is used for streets curbs sidewalks trees, yada yada yada. anything else. and it's beginning to be an issue. and it's beginching to be an issue because, as we do our five-year projections, the percentage keeps going up and up and up and up. and as it goes further and further up, the pressure on us to do the thing that is the public wants to do as exemplified by our satisfaction survey, which are streets, roads, particularly sidewalks and curbs, is becoming greater and greater and we have less and less money to do it. so we are going to try to do an $800 million bond initiative in april to try to take some of

that pressure off and address those problems. that still does not release the pressure on the budget providing police services. should we provide police services? absolutely. definitely should. definitely should provide them as effectively as we possibly can because our ridiculously high homicide rate is unacceptable, our high assault with deadly weapon rated is unacceptable. i guess, from a relative layperson position, my question is, do you solve that problem by more police officers, or do you solve it in other ways? and i'm not sure i have the answer. but one thing i do know is that as we're talking about reform, as we're talking about new methods of training, new modalities of training, new things that need to be done, and the costs associated with those, i'm wondering how that's going to happen from a city standpoint because 90% of the police department's budget is spent on personnel. 90% is on personnel.

so the other 10%, uniforms, cars, other stuff that they need, where's the money going to actually come from? ow, i believe that i have this attitude of if it's going to solve our problems and it costs us a little more, let's find a way to do it. i guess what i'm wondering is, can somebody show me that having -- paying a little more is going to solve the problem? and there have been times when the police department's ranks have been higher than they are now. and the homicide rate has been higher than it is now. so i'm not sure i see the direct causal link and correlation between numbers of police on the street and numbers of homicides, or the reduction in the number of homicides. that's problematic for somebody eight, nine months of a year on budget with the city

manager. because as you're trying to figure out how to pay for everything, one of the thing that is we always have to do is we have to look at what are the -- what's the data on success, what's the data on return on investment. now, if we didn't believe there was significant return on investment, police fire and ambulance, then it wouldn't be at 72% of our general budget. but at some point that's got to have to level off and stop or we'll simply have no money to do anything else. it's creeping up. in the five years since i've been in office it's gone from 69% to 72%. so it's been a rise every year there's more but every year when we get the budget from the police department they tell us that we're underfunding them. now, here's a real twist. it's an anomaly that exists in kansas city and in the stay of missouri that i would doubt exists anyplace else in the

country. and that is until recently kansas city and st. louis were -- the cities -- did not control their police departments. they're not our police departments. state operates the police department, or at least the statute. the state doesn't actually do anything. the governor appoints a board of police commissioners, some of whom he might actually know, and the board of police commissioners is supposed to govern the police department. but the board of police commissioners is selected based on whether they're republican or democrat, so that we have a balance, whether they're north of the river, south of the river, east, or west sorks that we have a balance. and every one of them is a good person. ut not necessarily coming from a place of knowledge about how to do policing work. none of us walked in there with any background in policing. we learned on the job. we went through the learning curve. all right? and that's good, that's cool.

the good news is when we selected darrell, we select add great partner to work with and we worked very well together. and we were conscious of what we were looking for. we wanted someone who would change the direction of the police department as it existed. and believe me, from my perspective, it needed to be changed. because of the fact that the police department was not responsible to the political structure of the city, they were really not accountable to anybody. and they kind of grew up a little arrogant. and in the process of doing that they became very distrustful of the city. they thought we were incompetent, we thought they were arrogant. and now we talk about things and solve problems by working together a lot more than we used to. that's a good thing. and joe, you know how i love you, man, but i always keep it real. and that's the way it is. our police department for the most part is extremely well

trained, highly qualified, and highly competent. they do things in the way that i'm proud of them for doing. when we had our marches and protests, our protesters marched down the street with police and when they got to the end and they were tired chief called the bus and had them picked up by a bus and take back to the cars. it's kind of hard to get mad about that if you're a protester. those who wanted their time on cnn were deciding to upgrade their level of protest were thwarted very effectively. when donald trump came to town and brought his traveling show the protesters out there, anti-trump protesters were contained. some got very disorb edynt but knob got hurt. they got pepper sprayed. and they did not like that. but when you look at the entire film you can see what happened

and why. it was like the police kept saying you need to stay here, get back inside the barricades, and when they continued to surge outside of them they pepper sprayed them and solved it and that was tend of it. although they were very unhappy. they came to board of police commissioners and made their position known. recently, we had another group of activists who came to the board of police commissioners with some very interesting demands, had to do with a shooting incident. that is currently involved in litigation. but they wanted to know about -- they wanted us to dwudge all of our military gear, which we don't have. they wanted to know why we use horses in crowds because horses can hurt people. my question to the young lady was, are you complaining about a specific incident or are you just concerned about horses in general? she was concerned about horses in general because nothing had really happened. and other things like that. so they left was a long list of questions. which we have gathered together

as a board and answered and will get them written responses. so that's the atmosphere that we're dealing with and the atmosphere that we're all dealing with and why the attention to the civilian population is both reasonable and necessary at this time. so in the process of dealing with all of this one of the ings that we do know is that as we continue to need to look at how we provide police services, one of the thing that is we've learned from my work novi, kansas city no violence, which i think is a nderful collaboration with various organizations, all together and all the heads of

those various departments are the ones who are members of the board and we show up for our board meetings. but what we've learned is that we can do some things that we haven't been very effective by enhancing our intelligence capabilities and how we structure and organize our department. and i think -- i will give some credit to joe because joe was the very first guy who put together this with the chief and everyone else. i remember standing out on the street a couple of functions with joe, how's it going? you know we need to do this we need to do that. something needs to change over here. ok, what can we do to help? we need to get it done inside the police department. so we talked to the chief. stuff gets done. he got a promotion out of it against our recommendations but he got a promotion. by the way, you still owe me 10%. but we found out that there was more impact by how we used various people, information,

shared information, disseminating information, brought more people into the fold, into the mission than there was by just simply throwing bodies at it. so you have to wonder, from a cost benefit analysis, what's the best thing that we can do in order to make the life job situation of our police officers better and more productive while doing it at a cost that allows us to perform the other functions that we have as a city? you know, for example, we have 6300 lane miles of road. every time it snows in kansas city we plow the equivalent of boston to san diego and back. when you have those types of things and you don't even know when they're coming, it puts real pressure on us to be efficient with our budget. now, we don't want to be so

efficient with our budget that we're cutting our own throats by not providing the level of police enforcement that we need. and we also know from our citizen satisfaction surveys a couple of things. number one priority for citizens, streets, roads, sidewalks. what's the orlingization in the city? they're happiest with? the police department. they love the police. so we have to satisfy both of those tremendous needs with the budget. what's the benefit? the benefit of what's happened in the five years that i've been in office -- and that's all i'll speak to except for some of the other stuff that happened before. but the five years i've been in office the benefit is we have a police chief who is focused on transforming the department in a number of ways. who is very focused on the issue of inclusion in the ranks. who is looking forward down the road to say if all of the

minority officers leave who are in the command staff leave, there's really not much there behind them to step in so we get back to a mono chrome atic commands staff situation again. so how do we address and change that? a collaborative police chief and people like joe mchale who are willing to drop all the nonsense about whose territory, whose jurisdiction and figure out that it doesn't matter because if somebody gets shot and killed in kansas city everybody is going to suffer. and put down all of that stuff and find a way to work together. how do we do that at a cost that we can afford? the benefit of course is we have not had the things break out like in other cities. although you would be absolutely naive, i would be absolutely naive to think that i couldn't get a phone call right now that said something horrible had happened and there are people marching in the street and burning stuff.

because it can happen anywhere. but we know that we have done some things to try to stop that. we know that our police chief and others are out there -- thank you. are out there meeting the public in churches, in community centers, on a periodic and scheduled basis. we know that darrell forte gets on his motorcycle and rides around the community. we know that joe mchale gets out into the community. and those things pay dividends because it's a change from what used to happen. and i'm not just talking sitting in a car. they're out talking with people engaging with people and creating those relationships that are necessary. so the benefit of having a police department that is aware of the current environment and making adjustments to fit into that environment and adjust to it, absolutely priceless. the cost of doing that not necessarily always the money. maybe we need to be thinking of

how do we deploy technology, how do we reorganize organizations? how do we tear down the walls and the silos inside departments so that information flows easier and people collaborate. so that there's a much more cohesive focused approach to the problem. and if we can do that we can afford the costs and reap the benefit. thank you. [applause] >> i think i have a presentation loaded up here somewhere. i'm not sure how to get to it. again, my name is t bowman. i go by t. i'm fortunate to follow the mayer because he was so artclat then in discussing the various demands ton city's budget.

so because he was so articulate that will allow me to kind of cut to the chase a little bit and maybe save a few minutes of time as well. while i talk about the costs and benefits of police reform. in the city of arlington just the many other cities, budget is impacted by the fiscal environment. the fiscal environment as well as the political environment. and in my city like so many others here recently we've seen very much improved local economy. we're seeing the tax revenues, but at the same time the political environment is forcing us to make decisions to actually lower the tax rate. so we have the pressure to lower the tax rate although we're seeing higher revenues which then results in increasing competition for

limited funding. the police are always the highest priority department. and just like every other city that we've heard from up today, the police department and the fire department represents about two thirds of the overall city budget. but the police and what they do isn't the only important department and the only important contribution. i like to think of our librarians as crime fighters. and they're crime fighters because what they do with literacy enhancing long-term literacy in the community places downward pressures on long-term crime. i like to think of the parks and recreation folks as being crime fighters because of the structured programming they provide for the young people in the community especially keeps them off of the street during those hours where they could be engaged in a lot of mischief. so while the police department

places a high amount of demand on city resources, so do other departments. and so we have to make decisions to balance the budget based on the bigger whole, based on the whole and not just an individual department. and you throw into that employee pay raises, employee health insurance costs, also places pressure on our city budget. so when it comes to the costs that we're looking at and meeting out, we see direct costs and indirect costs. when we look at the reforms that are recommended in the 21st century policing report, we see from implementing those reforms some direct costs, some direct benefit as well as some indirect costs as well. so let me give you one quick example looking at body worn cameras.

when -- and we're presently looking at full implementation of body cameras in our city. we've gone through a 90-day pilot project. but just the cost of the cameras alone is a very small piece of the overall costs of the program. we have equipment costs and installation costs and software and hard ware costs. we have storage requirements and whether they're going to be in the cloud or on local servers. we have rms and data collection issues and somebody earlier talked about the sexatibility with legacy systems. we have to look at that. and so what could be a 4500 body camera could easily turn into a $20,000 piece of equipment when you throw all of the other cost ace sosheyated with that a quiment into the puzzle. and that's not all. but when we implement these new

technologies and inevitably the business processes change. we have to make sure that the work flow is synchronized with the new technology and the old technology and with the people and training and et cetera, et cetera. and so to make a long story short, we have a lot of work that goes into adopting new technology, new policies, new discussions, new debate, new support, new publicity, new documentation. the analysis on the front end and the back end as well as the data interpretation. so when we look at local governments -- and i want to right quick borrow a little piece from emergency management and consequence management. local governments provide for the health and safety and welfare of our people and more than anything else, we want to be prepared for the critical

incidents that occur. for my city and any other city, the critical incidents could be weather events, it could be a terrorism event, it could be a catastrophic fire or some other catastrophe. but we want to be prepared for these traumatic events. when i look at what body-worn cameras provide to us, i see that it's pretty much analogous, or they are analogous to the weather radar. they don't stop the events from occurring but they do help us to see that something out there is happening and it's on the way and it helps to make sure that we know what's happening. critical incidents do happen in every city. the mayer said it. it's not a matter of whether or not they will. it's a matter of when they're going to happen. and so when they happen, we want to make sure that we're prepared for those incidents.

and so that bridges me to the sillyensy. you see the definition of the community resiliency. when we think of resiliency, normally we think of resiliency in terms of consequence management of a major event or incident. the aftermath of a major incident. since we know that these incidents are going to occur, then why don't we be more proactive? why don't we place the police in the position of being responsible for being prepared for these incidents so that the community, when they do occur, have the ability to bounce back , they're able to return to their original form, after these events happen? well, to me procedural justice, community policing and citizen

engagement strategies are another way of strengthening community resiliency against these unanticipated critical disasters. and so if we're spending part of our budget on being prepared for the natural disasters, the hurricanes and earth quakes and so on and so forth, to me as a manager it makes sense that we also prepare for these other police disasters that will inevitably occur. but when they do, we're able to avoid some of the civil disturbances and disruptions that communities often face because of the investments made through community policing procedural justice. and citizen engagement.

>> thank you. [applause] >> i'm leonard with the washington-based center for public safety management. we are the exclusive provider of public safety technical services to the international city county management association, icma, which, as most of you know is the worldwide association of public administers, a 101-year-old organization whose annual conference is going to be in kansas city next month. i thought that i would spend a few minutes talking to you today about some of the human resource challenges presented by the 21st century policing recommendations. to give you a sense that this is not just a financial issue to implement the program but it is much deeper than that. it's a bureaucratic organizational labor issue that you have to address to achieve many of the recommendations in the task force report.

so i want to start by looking at the diversity issue. recommendation 1.8 talks about that law enforcement agency should strive to create a workforce with a broad range of diversity including race and gender. and also language. life experience and cultural background and i would add to that age. but i need to remind everybody here that we still have not fully achieved fully integrated police departments nationwide both on a racial basis and on a gender basis. and that's despite the fact that we have been involved in almost three decades worth of litigation, court orders, consent decrees, bargaining with collective bargaining agreements, we still haven't achieved that for race and gender, which are the protected classes. how much more difficult -- and i know this sounds like debbie downer. but how much more difficult is it going to be to expand the

workforce to include the other issues that i think that we all think are critically important, language and life experience and cultural backgrounds? it's an enormous challenge. and one of the reasons why it is such an enormous challenge is because there are significant impediments to accomplish it. the first is that most police agencies we opt rate under strict civil service system. in some communities they are developed the rules and policies and procedures are developed locally. in other places they're developed regionly. in many states they're governed by state statute. so we have implemented a system in this country from the early part of the last century to try to ensure some fairness in a selection process and to hire the best individual based upon i think what we all understand is not a very accurate assessment too long. and that was a check, off, fill in the blanks or check the box written examination, a pen and paper examination, which in

this cases do not stand up to detailed scrutiny as to whether or not they are accurately measuring the skillsets needed to become a police office anywhere this case. so if language and background and life experience do not fall under that protected class environment, which would get you into the court system as happened with race and gender, how then are we going to move these different type of individuals into the selection process? that's number one. the second part of that is that right now having looked at -- we've completed about 250 public safety studies around the country in cities around 6,000 population and 800,000 population. so we've seen a lot of different systems. right now we are screening out of the applicant pool people that in my opinion should be police officers because we abide by a somewhat antiquated

set of screening instruments. i will give an example. one is that we are doing credit reporting. some police departments do a credit report on a 21-year-old individual whose applying to be a police officer. if they're below a certain score they're knocked out of conversation. yet no one has ever shown any correlation between the ability to have a higher credit score and the ability to do police work successfully. we screen out people who have miner drug use. that has changed a little bit in this country but we're still pushing away people who have miner experiences with marijuana in particular and preventing them from being -- becoming police officers. people who have miner encounters with the police. miner arrest records either as juveniles or young adults. they're typically screened out of the process. and i would suggest to you that if we get to that going back to that initial discussion about we want people who have broader life experiences, aren't those in many case it is kinds of people who we want to be part of the police force because

they do represent in many ways the community that they are going to be policing. so we are in many cases effectively taking out of the pool of candidates those very people that could contribute dramatically to the success of the police department and improve the relationship between the police and the community. because in many cases these folks come particularly in the inster city come from the inster city community. they're the ambassadors that you would be looking for. they're the people that rod said might be recommended by their local paster or the local basketball coach or the local teacher and yet they get screened out of the process. another area that we have dramatically screened out, good candidates in my opinion, is the educational requirement that we have imposed on a lot of police agencies around the country. some departments have a four-year college requirement. many police departments have a 60 college credit requirement. 60 college credits in any subject matter whatsoever.

it could be sociology, it could be phys ed. it could be hisry, could be mathematics. no requirement whatsoever to be in any way related to the job you're trying to get and yet we force people to -- we force those people away from conversation because they don't have the 60 college credits. actually and i've done working for our city done a lot of research in this, no one has ever demonstrated a correlation between having 60 college credits in any subject matter and being a successful police officer. but even worse, nobody has really identified what a successful police officer is. they make a lot of arrests? they avoid suits, litigation? do they write a lot of tickets? no one has really identified what is success in being a police officer. do they stay out of trouble? or are they aggressive? do they have complaints filed against them or standing on the

sidelines? so we are using this to eliminate some solid candidates. if you role that back up to the issues that were identified in the task force report about wanting to bring in people even more diverse than were already screening out you get a sense of how difficult this challenge is going to be. that challenge even gets worse when you start thinking about promotional examinations within the department. within the agency there's been an awful lot of litigation and the obvious one is the rickive case in new haven thain volved promotional examinations that took into account racial outcomes in the candidate list. and the supreme court decision now makes that process, which has been used successfully in the past to change the racial makeup of police departments and fire departments, it makes that in most cases illegal. another area that we've screened people out is residency requirements. this is one of those areas that is -- has pros and cons.

the pro is of course that if you have a residency requirement for people to apply for the job you're giving greater opportunities to the people in the community that these police officers are going to police. however, when you do that, you are reducing the candidate pool because you're prohibiting people who don't live in the city from applying for the job. again, that works against the recommendations in a task force report. prop change to occur lir is going to require significant different ways to approach this. it's going to involve of necessity changes in civil service rules, whether it's local or state. it's going to involve a very active marketing campaign. and one that i would refer you to is the cops office hiring in the spirit of service program that was identified some years ago. i use that as a human resources commissioner to do significant

recruiting effort in the city that was under court order by the way and we use some of the guidelines in the hss bro shrs and programs and it was very successful. we were able to attract a different kind of candidate to the job. and the way the hiring in the spirit of service program described is, we want to hire people who want to be police officers because of service, not for adventure. and that really gets us to the guardian issue. and i actually, the other word i like to use to describe police officers is peace keeper. i think that's even a better way to describe than guardian. peace keeper between people who are maybe going to be warring with each other if the police don't interact. one area that i think we have the best chance to be successful in in increasing the diversity in the agency is on female police officers. as rod talked to you about, there's a lot of research that shows that women bring a

different skillset in many cases a better skillset to being a police officer. they are a protected class of course. and there are i believe a lot of women who if we did a boater job marketing and reaching out to them would enter the police force the same way that has happened with the military. in some of my career paths i had a lot of work with the coast guard. they've been enormously successful in attracting women to the coast guard both as officers and as enlisted. so that could be an area that we need to really take a look at. now, this requires money. if you're going to do a marketing campaign, you have to hire marketing people. you can't just ask somebody in the h.r. department to come one a successful marketing campaign that includes television and radio and print advertising and direct mail and now social media. so that's a cost that if we are going to implement this particular recommendation, and if we are going to do a

successfully, is not only going to face bureaucratic hurdles but also fiscal hurdles as well. and that is a dollar cost. but i do think that it's a tremendous opportunity for us to reach out to females to become police officers. i had the opportunity when i first started in law enforcement to work with some of the first police female police officers in patrol down in the miami-dade county. and they sent these poor young ladies out in a-line skirts and heels working in liberty city. that changed eventually they by the way were not allowed to be police sergeants. they could only take the test to become police women ii. but we now know there's significant opportunities for us to change the direction of police departments by hiring females. more females. one quick other area i want to talk about is implementation. a lot of the thing that is are in the task force report and i'll talk about body cameras.

in many places implementation of body cameras is a manned torl negotiable subject for labor. and right now we're seeing some cities, cincinnati for example this past week sent a cease and desist letter to the city to stop them from implementing body cameras until they negotiated the impact of that. i was reading that boston had negotiated a short-term program that 100 police officers are going to go into the body camera test, they were going to be paid $500 extra for completing the test. not a single police officer has volunteered to be part of the test as of two days ago. so if we're going to continue with a lot of these changes, even things like mandatory vest wearing, maybe manned torly negotiable in some states. so as we try to implement officer safety wellness and diversity we are going to have to think about what the implications are both

financially from a bureaucratic standpoint and also from a labe rear lations standpoint. i guess my best recommendation is when you get involved in taking about internally doing any of these things you need to have the city attorney involved in the discussion right at the beginning because inevitably these are going to end up either as collective bargaining issues or litigation or both. i would like to close by reading you a couple of paragraphs from a report that you heard about earlier. we have cited deep hostility between police and minority communities as the cause of the disorders we surveyed. practically, every city that experienced disruption abusive relationships between the police and community members have been a major source of grievance, tension, and ultimately disorder. in a fundamental sense, however, it's wrong to define the problems solely as hostility to the police. in many ways the police officer only symbolizes much deeper

problems. the police officer is a symbol not only of law but the entire system of law enforcement and criminal justice. if such they become the tangible target against injustice, in lower courts, widespread disparingts in sentences, antiquated correctional facilities, basic inequities imposed by the system on the poor to whom for example the option of bail really only means jail. the police officer in the city is a symbol of increasingly bitter social debate on law enforcement on one side who are disturbed and perplexed by sharp rises in the black lives movement and so forth. and crime and violence. they exert a pressure on the police for tougher law enforcement. another group inflamed against police as agents of repression tends towards defipeance in what it regards as ordered maintenance in trms of injustice. a society in which many minorities are increasingly

alienated. at the same time, police responsibilities have grown as other institutions have lost much of their authority. schools because so many are segregated old and infearier, religions which is becoming irrelt to those who have lost faith as they have lost hope, career aspirations for which many minorities are totally lacking. the family because its bonds stress no longer supportive. and as a result, the officer who must fill these institutional vacuums is then resented for his or her involvement. and yet precisely because the police officer in the city is a symbol and symbolizes so much it is of critical importance of the police and society to take every possible step to allow grievances to flow from a sense of injustice and increased tension and turmoil. that is a quote from the president's commission on riots, the kerner commission report that was written 50 years ago. i've had this book since you

and i were in college because he and i went to school several blocks away from springfield avenue that was burned to the ground in the newark riots. if you are in law enforcement or if you are watching this on c-span you need to get a copy of this book and read it and look at the pictures which are incredibly heartbreaking. it talks about negros and ghettos but talks about the kinds of problems they were facing 50 years agent you can get this on e bay for about $5. please take the time to do that because it puts everything we're talking about today into perspective and how badly we have done as a country with the numerous commission reports and numerous studies and we still are facing essentially the same issues today 50 years later. there are recommendations in here that essentially mirror the president's task force report almost word for word the similar language that we still haven't implemented.

thank you. [applause] >> wow. >> they did teach you something in school. >> a hard dose of reality when you come and start asking for stuff. but i appreciate the comments today. we're a little over time but i'm not going to let you get away without a question or two. oes anybody have a question? >> good afternoon. thank you for your comments. i'm a lieutenant with arlington texas police department. currently serving as a nch cet fellow here in the d.c. area. just a couple of comments really probably more projected at dr. bowman and mayer james. talked about 21st century policing particular task force recommendations.

we've also been involved talking to the national league of cities. many chiefs of police have really talked about trying to adopt a 21st century police doctrine and modeling it through their police department. since we've been having these conversations, i've learned dramatically that policing is different across the country and how people operate and how they view serving the public. a lot of police chiefs are -- or some police chiefs are having to draw back from dealing with city management to the point to where they probably have even written a white paper on their own and giving it to their city management. so if you could comment as people are watching and paying attention, why is it important for city leaders, particularly those of city management, mayors and city government, to really take a look at this task force report and adopt it as we continue to see police involved

in the future? >> ok. good question. and from the city management side, that touches on what i just talked about. the city manager and the mayer as well has to have the overall well being of the entire city at heart. and that's our responsibility. and to the extent that we go through the report, we fully understand what the tenants and the recommendation of the report say. then we can also integrate and what i have found we can integrate a lot of those tenets into other aspects of running the city as well. procedural justice is just as critical in the courts. t's just as critical for the cocompliance people.

it's just as critical for any other area of the city that comes into contact with citizens. and so the recommendations, while the task force is focused on 21st century policing, the recommendations help us to have just a better government generally. and so i think every city manager should be very familiar. people ask me quite often about my transition from policing to city management and the difficulties. and i tell them that it hasn't been difficult at all. i think any community-minded police chief going into city management will find that the opportunities are greater with ore departments to implement recommendations like this for the benefit of the city. so i can't agree more that it is just critical that a city managers do.

>> from my perspective, if i'm not aware of what's going on in policing, i'm going to be at a very critical disadvantage when day day after day people walk up to me and say what are you doing about the homicides in this city? and i don't know is not an acceptable answer. it is also important, particularly considering the structure of our city, and our police department, to be able to have a conversation with the police chief whose responsible for setting the tactics and strategy of the police department without being totally oblivious to what the options are. if we don't have direct city control, we at least need to know what the options are and have discussions about that. the kerner report that you're talking about, the update on it, the commissioner's warn of

ominous consequences if nothing changed. i think we've seen the ominous consequences and we're going to continue to see them if nothing changes. it is important to be able to be in a political position between the citizenry and the police department in order to talk about options and what's available in order to make the lives of the policemen safer and better and the lives of the citizens safer and better. you have to know your stuff. that's why it's important to be p to date. >> and i would see this as risk management. because if we don't change things dramatically it's going to cost the cities even more not just in human loss but in financial loss as well. so that's one thing the managers do understand as risk manager. and it's important to reduce

exposure. >> this is about a cost benefit and political environment which is almost an oxymoron. but my question to all of you, what is it that you need in terms of analysis or something to make the argument that it's worth the investment to do the reform? or is there anything that can do that? because leonard brought up a lot of things about there this struct trull obstacles that have been around for 55, maybe 100 years that prevent a lot of these things to happen. so what is it that you need? >> well, i think that you're right. there are obstacles. and i think that we're experiencing some of those right now when we talk about who is going to replace the command staff in three, four, five years when they retire and how do you do that? because the policy certainly is not going to shepherd that in. there's going to be that replacement. then there has to be a change.

what do u you have to see? you have to see something that says we did this and therefore that. and that's hard to do. but we do know, we do know that if we make some adjustments internally that we're going to get better outcomes on certain things. for example, one of the things -- joe wanted was more gangs and what was it, joe? exactly. so that the two areas or the areas of the police department were sharing information between the two, which then do it easier for nova to its job. i think, if we can look at thing that is restructure not necessarily having to put new people in. i think that's absolutely critical. but with the people that we have. restructure it so that it's not this quasi military 1950s version of how police departments work.

you've got your department over here, section over there, and they don't talk to each other. that doesn't work any more. information is the currency of everything right now. and that's true in policing as well i would bet. >> i guess i would add to that, one concern that i have -- and i've heard it mention, the term mentioned here, police culture. and while there's a lot of talk about police reform, i'm not seeing a lot of really detailed research-based information on how to actually change the police culture without making the police feel like they're being picked on. and so i think it will be helpful to have some significant research and some tta on what changing the police culture entails and how to do that in a logical, methodical

way that's not offensive but yet effective to and for police officers. i think that would go a long ways in helping them to understand who they are and that a lot of them -- we talked about this 50-year-old report. a lot of what police officers do today are relics from 50 to 100 years ago. they do it and don't understand why. and i think this focus on culture will help us all understand why it is we do what we do and help us to understand how to get beyond it. >> and the police culture issue is a big barrier to inclusion. it's easier to recruit somebody than it is to retain them. you can get them in there with promises of glory and you get to wear a uniform and do all this great policing. but when you get there, if the culture is such that you don't feel welcome and that you're an outsider and that you're somehow different than the others, then you don't stay

long. plus the reality also is if you are really good and you have an opportunity after a few years, somebody's going to come up and snatch you up and want to make you a major or something. oh, i'm sorry. or police chief in a smaller town or something. you get opportunities. because there's not the critical mass and the pipeline's not full. culture is everything. and it is even when i was in the marine corps, the culture in the military police company was different. it was really were are the good guys? everybody else is a suspect when it was time to go out and eat we went out and ate together. when it was time to go out and drink, we went out and drank together. when we got together for a picnic we got together as a , group. that's the culture and the culture that excludes the very people we are now saying needs to be a part of it.

>> i think there's real scarcity of research in the field. one of the panelists on the prior panel mentioned police institutions traditionally have been very silent. there is an opportunity in the 21st century task force recommendations embrace this idea of working with third party partners as partners and not somebody that is there to sort of gotcha and until some sort of terrible thing that's going on. it's a collaborative work together to forget what works. i think we have a feeling about what works and what doesn't but we don't have a lot of empirical evidence to back that up. >> there are some things very easily quantifiable. the attorney general eric holder had a commission on officer safety and wellness. i was pleased to be invited to be part of that. they found that if all police officers were there for us and whether seatbelts come in when you look at it would've cut deaths by half. half just by putting your best on and by putting a seat belt on.

so you could put real numbers to that in figure how much does it cost to buy these that's been a much does it cost for people follow the rules and wear them. and then how much do you save by not only inhuman laws but in financial loss. >> please forgive me but we have to move this along. let's thank our panelists again. [applause] >> as jane comes up i'm going to just set a couple things. speaking of culture, the culture at the sienna is that we did not go beyond time last night so i am in violation of like a like is sacrosanct part of our culture but i'm going to give jane her 20 minutes and we've given are probably the most difficult task today, to sit and listen over and then come up and say something inclusion. just a few brief words. you probably figured out that we like nicknames around you.

so i'm james chip. well, i think jane should have indignity i think the name should be first. jane first castor. first theme president of fbi academy class. first woman to be named chief of the kappa police department. she has a reputation that probably most of us know about the being such a strong advocate of community policing, and really working hard to integrate all aspects opportunity in the work that she does. she, too, is very doubtful contribute to some of our projects. so jane, just please take your time and, >> and hurry up. take your time and hurry up, jane. thank you very much. i appreciate. i thought this would be the best place to be against of the opening and closing and benefit from what everybody else had to say but now i'm not so sure that that's the good place to and also as chip said before, the whole presentation was going to be framed on the beginning and the end by different aspects, or

different viewpoints. i don't think that's true either because then what i could pretty much say what he said and we could be done with it. but i want to start out by talking about public perceptions of policing. has been you know there are a number of surveys done on different professions nationwide nationwide. if you like a law-enforcement, the perception goes up and down. if you look at something like decision can everybody thinks positions, they hold them in high esteem. if a doctor tells a patient of people and still hold positions in high esteem. this guy just brushing your doctor. if you look law-enforcement we look like an ekg chart. an offer to do something inappropriate and we are all the bad guys. so that's something we'll have to live with as a profession. it doesn't take a rocket scientist to be got what the current perception nationwide is

of law enforcement. it is probably at an all time low. so let's start out with some realities about policing. we are the most visible arm of government. what we are talking about today is that, the relationship between police reforms and law enforcement and the municipalities. officers have to have citizen trusts in order to be effective. we basically exists to serve the community but if the community doesn't trust what we are doing we in essence are powerless. and a safe community i think we all can agree is beneficial for all. as my friend david brown from dallas said in one of his press conferences, he said that we are asking the police to do too much these days. and i think we could all agree with that.

as a nation we can't cut budgets for education and mental illness and expect the police to deal with the fallout of that. and the answers are not as simple as they sound. some of the things i've been brought up before. just hire the right people. what does that mean? that's very difficult for a number of reasons. educational background. what are you looking for an educational background? are looking for a minimum? i always tell people when they asked me what should i major in? criminal justice? that's fine. she did major in theater as well. if you came into law enforcement you might be great as an undercover officer if you had that type of background. so it's difficult on the educational area. something else another area that came up is testing our law

enforcement. how do we test individuals to see if they're going to be successful police officers? i can tell you what we've done in the past as in the past is we've looked at didn't have the the skill to be a police officer? i like now that there's more of a change to say do they have the characteristics to be successful police officer? and then we will give them the skill once we bring them in. as opposed to finding people with the right skills, bring them in only to learn down the road that they don't have the right temperament. so that's very i think encouraging going down the road. and then past performance. what are the tasks they perform? this difficult to make a benchmark on the. i literally have gone from

changing the spotlight for a widow on midnights can who thought she was on the back yard, to high speed pursuits to investigating shooting where four or five homicides occurred. so what is it? what are you looking for in that task performance? as they field training officer, i that officers sitting beside me in the car and that could investigate their way out of a paper bag, but they have some serious street sense. you could take him on any cut in in the call and they could read what was going on in the street and what was about to happen. i will, -other officers and trained in that were incredible investigators but you didn't want it anywhere near a domestic violence incident or something where there was going to be used the force because they would freeze up. so which skill is more important, and can we find those individuals that have all of those skills in one? another answer, let's just give all the officers cameras, that will fix it all. as we heard before that's an incredible expense, just the storage of that video footage. and then as we all know in law-enforcement we always have murphy's law. is not going to be on when it should have been on in the there's the cover-up. so that i know has already happened.

and also what we know in law-enforcement is that physical violence is not pretty. the general public is not used to seeing that. this isn't the nfl figure not going down the playback for we've got 10 different angles that are going to show you everything. it's going to be the cameras are moving. they would not get the right angle, not the right shot. those things are going to happen. and also we are still learning about this. the policies, public records issues that we have. and then just look at the prosecution of it. i was in a city last week talking to them here to implement body-worn cameras for the entire department and they had a homicide and they shoot over 100 hours of video to the state attorney's office for them to review. so how do you deal with that has as well? so there's a positive and the negative one of the cameras.

when we implement them in a test phase in my department, a tampa police department. when he predicted is that it would improve officer behaved a little bit. it would improve the public's behavior dramatically and it would be a whole new reality show for the rest of the community. because people don't really know on a day-to-day basis what we do in law-enforcement. the next thing, train the police. i love that. every time something goes wrong nationwide, the answer is always we need more training. think if we trained with us today seven days a week it would never be enough training for officers. i'll give you an example that in litigation right now with our department with an officer pulled an individual over that wasn't diabetic shock. there was an altercation that ensued and eventually the individual died, passed away.

unrepresented called me and he said in light of that incident i want to pass legislation that officers will have training in how to deal with individuals with diabetes. i said that's accredited, but the officer that was on scene is trained in how to deal with diabetes. but again i think that's a good idea. let's train officers in how to recognize and deal with individuals with diabetes. the training that we are going about now is wonderful training, and, in my eyes. crisis intervention training, i was in a deficit in one day. the attorney asked me how much time do you all bad for crisis intervention for officers? and i said that would be an individual basis because every second that an officer works, they're doing crisis intervention. that by definition pretty much defined the job of a law-enforcement officer. that's what we do. we intervene in most those people's crises. de-escalation, that is great training. when you first become a police officer, every insult, everything else is personal to

you and takes you just probably about a month to get over that. but learning the art of de-escalation i believe is very, very, very important. i tell the kids and the great american teach-ins i said what's the most important tool in officer has? of course it's always a gun or the taste and i tell them no, it's your mouth. it should really to talk your way into or out of a situation is the most important tool for an officer and who's best at that? women. definitely is great to have more women in law-enforcement i would say the most, the biggest knock down drag out fight i was in as a police officer were usually caused by male police officer that everything was fine until the tests often showed up and the next thing you know you're

on the ground. reality-based training is excellent for police officers. it is excellent and is one of the panelists pointed out, you can actually measure the officers physical, the heartbeat, heart rate. you can learn so much from reality-based training for officers but it's just as important for the cities. we have to citizens academies the year. the best idea is to use of force not because would make the citizens police officers and they shoot everybody. immediately there's no, doesn't matter who it is, they shoot everybody. we had a woman who did a traffic stop. she told the individual who was a police officer, acting as a bad guy, she said get out of the car. he said no to his own again. he said no. she shut them. she said i told him twice. i said you have to tell them three times. i said everybody knows that. it really is an eye opener for the citizens because they get a dose of reality and they get to understand that law enforcement is assaulting a crime in 20 minutes with commercial breaks, that there's a little bit more to it. clearly procedural justice was discussed in fair and impartial policing them very, very important.

and that fact should be mandatory in every law-enforcement organization. and as stated earlier you can provide the training, you can change policy and procedure, but if you don't get the officers to buy into that change, it's going to fail. as we say in policing, culture deeds policy for breakfast. and my other favorite thing about law enforcement is there's only two things cops don't like and that's the way things are, and change. so changing the culture in a police department is by far the most difficult undertaking that any law enforcement leader will ever be involved in. and if you endeavor to institute change, you have to personally believe in it. officers were always coming up with the caused issuer, here's what we're going to do. the officers sit back and to tell the younger ones given a month and they will come up with something new. you have to believe in it and just to make sure that it's intimated a properly.

a lot of good ideas die on the vine because they are not implemented appropriately. another answer is develop solid community relationships. who is the community? we all live in very diverse areas a who is that community? how to define a solid relationship with isn't no civil unrest? is a lower complaints on the officers or is it a reduced crime rate? what is the matrix for the solid community relationship that you're looking at? and speaking of less crime, there always has to be a measurement that there has to be some type of a standard when you're looking at reducing crime in the area which quite often is turned into a quota. officers, you need to do traffic enforcement in your energy. how many tickets do i have to write?

i don't know how many tickets you have to write. you have to enforce the traffic laws in order to reduce crashes, injuries and property damage. and the responses, how many tickets you want me to write? >> we are often in law-enforcement any at a moving target. and again it's no secret as i just said before, the law-enforcement as a profession is viewed negatively in our

nation at this time. when i retired, a lot of people, i know robbie, we retired about the same time and got the same response, you're getting out right at the right time. i see just the opposite i see this as an opportunity, although it's a difficult time for the officers out on the street. this is an opportunity to change law enforcement for the better. and opportunity that i have not seen in my entire career at the police department. and as a profession we have got to change. most people in our communities really never cared about law enforcement in the past. the majority of citizens, unless they're pulled over by a police officer, never had contact with the police over a victim of a crime to a burglary. never had contact. frankly, i don't think that they cared what we did or how we did it. they just wanted us to keep the bad guys away from them. they didn't want to be victims of crime. that another positive outcome of his current view on law enforcement is the average citizen is going to pay more attention to their police force and get more involved, which i

see as very positive. but as i said as a professional got to change and change in number of areas. one, we've got to all of our past but we have to say the things that we've done in the past were not right. in the '60s, the '70s, the '80s, we could pick things in every single decade leading up to this current day. but we've got to go back past. next, we have to communicate with the public. because of their perception is their reality. i'll give you an example of search warrants. whenever our organization would execute a search warrant in the neighborhood, they come in, do what they needed to do and then they would leave and they would never talk to the neighbors and the neighbors, god help them if they didn't own a dog and to think about and walk the dog around to try to be nosy to figure out what's going on. so we had the sergeant response for going around the neighborhood and telling everybody what they were doing

because it's usually with someone in the neighborhood who had called about the problem, usually drug sales they had called. so giunta because they called, go around and tell them what we are doing. it really does a lot for the negative perception. citations. when people get pulled over, there is not a police officer that has walked up to the car and the driver said, you pulled me over because of, blank -- i'm black, i'm a woman, i'm white -- their perception is they were pulled over because of their inclusion in a certain group. that, we have to deal with because that is the reality of the citizen. one of the things that the

community believes is that law enforcement makes a lot of money off of citations. that is not the truth in our community. if someone pays a ticket straight out, no courts, no nothing, the city makes about $12 off that and that doesn't come near covering any of the costs. write told officers, righ people's warnings. the warning has the same effect as a citation does, it would affect an individual driving for up to a year. we can track the warnings if they make another violation and then you write them a citation and have made that negative impact with the citizen so it doesn't make the city real happy and i'm sure the city managers are back and making a note , tell my department not to do this. another one is a collaboration with the citizens. you have to have a citizen review groups and advisory groups because again, we exist to serve the community so they should be looking at what we are doing and then they can take that back to their neighborhoo