economy to do the business to make the economy work and run, but they are looking at us and they are saying for all of you, in particular those of you that serve on the financial services committee, you are letting us down, you are not protecting us. with that, mr. chairman, i am going to be talking with you and the members of this committee who show their outrage and it move forward to break up wells fargo. may i respond to that? >> we will give the witness a chance to respond. said before, i'm sorry we did not get this right. we will fix this. we will do a lot of things really great. california is our home state. we have been there for 164 years, and major employer, and major philanthropic and we are privileged to serve as many customers as we can't the best way possible.

>> time for the gentleman from washington has expired. the gentleman of arkansas, mr. hill, will be recognized for an additional five minutes on the occlusion of the time allotted to him under the five-minute rule. the gentleman from arkansas. >> think you, mr. chairman and the ranking member to hold this hearing. i appreciate your forthright testimony. i have been a customer of your company and have admired your company and i have used your of goalas an example setting for retail bankers. of what haseriod happened recently, i have recommended your company is a company to do business with and to stockholders. that comes with a pretty heavy

burden to me. i have the same not in my stomach that you probably have. former persona that is worked in finance on and off for 35 years, this just is not a one-off situation down in the los angeles basement that wells fargo is struggling with. it is a systemic compliance principallyde the retail section of the bank. i know it is a huge frustration for us on the committee and your management team. it is very hurtful for the customers that have been damaged potentially,it, including the 933 people in arkansas that have been affected by this. it resulted in four people that apparently works for you in because that were fired

sweep across your company. you spoke of the many layers between area managers, branch managers the report to harry toasted that has been mr. stumpf: mentioned it. there is a new leader in the retail banking business. she is now in charge of that organization. did she report to you> ? mr. stumpf: she reported to me about a year ago but has reported to mr. sloan a year after that. >> does it for report to the consumer lending executive. mr. stumpf: there is a relationship but in someplace else.

>> it is through the lindy channel for credit cards? mr. stumpf: i would describe it this way, the retail bank would talk to customers and then they would send the request over to the credit card group where they would do the underwriting and fulfillment. >> all of those people i named off, the seven operating management team, how often does that team meet? is a teleconference or face to face? mr. stumpf: every monday. >> every monday. ok, unrelated to the board, 2015 you had nine meetings of the board. arctic 14 meetings, the committee to hearing 2014 according to your proxy. meetserating committee every monday, so one question i have is, do you remember this being talked about at the operating level when managers

bring their concerns to you, and was it in the same timeframe? it was not until two years after this was manifesting itself in los angeles. mr. stumpf: it was managed within the business in 2011. each business has their own salesance, their own advocacy, so was brought out of the sales part into the control 2012,on, and that by reducing goals and by 2013 it was when we brought in corporate resources and investigations and so forth. >> now your lead director, steve sanger who is the former ceo of general mills is conducting an independent investigation that he is hired independent of the corporation. that has commenced recently. is that correct?

mr. stumpf: as i understand it, steve sanger is our lead director along with the other independent directors with hired counsel and they are doing their investigation. >> when do you expect they will finish their work? a part of: i am not that process but i know they will do a full, comprehensive review. >> i hope that is released to the public once the board has seen it and reviewed it and they can be posted on your website, because i think that is where it over new conference in the corporate government system, and i would encourage that to be done. when i was in the treasury department in 1990-1991, we had problem with government securities injure largest shareholder mr. buffett became the ceo in the midst of the crisis and was found guilty of manipulating the u.s. treasury market. have you spoke to mr. buffett

about his advice on the matter you are facing? mr. stumpf: i have not talked to a lot of our investors. i have not had one conversation with warren buffett. >> because warren buffett in 1991, probably did the best job on behalf of corporate america. do you remember what he said at that time? mr. stumpf: i have read a lot of his things. i figure it is something about, i would rather make less money and something about integrity, but go ahead and read it to me. i do not remember the testimony. >> i will paraphrase it. he said, he wanted every employee to be his or her own compliance officer, and he wanted every employee when they came to work to think about the actions they took on behalf of customers that they could read in their own home town newspaper written by critical journalist. he summarized, and i think you need to summarize this if you're going to be successful in this endeavor.

he made this quote which i think people have quoted forced 25 years, lose money for the firm and i will be understanding. lose a shred of reputation for the firm, and i will be ruthless. mr. stumpf: that is what i was trying to refer to. i agree with that. >> well, that is where we are. i agree with my colleagues. this is hurting the ability of the banking industry to console. something we pride ourselves on a financial services and we speak to understand the needs of our customers and try to meet them. this damage, what is happened with wells fargo is going to hurt the effort on behalf of -- on behalf of committee banks across the country. because of investigations into , reallye sales programs what we're talking about, i hope that we will also ask our regulators where they were at this time. the occ clearly has a needs to improve ratings for you and compliance in the intensive work

you were doing over the two years, but i see no evidence so sbc was taking action. the last thing i will ask you about, mr. heinz talked about materiality. in any one quarter, accountants, lawyers, being counters, finance officers will tell you what is material or not. tosometimes see the trees the force, and you have the ability and report has the ability to address that. in the chairman's letter, you do not need a lawyer to tell you what to write in your chairman's letter. spend 50% in fines and penalties over a three or four it is a video.me no better how many small fights it comes with, and i hope in your 2016 letter to shareholders, that you and your

lead director will address what i think is a systemic failure in a few areas of wells fargo that is tarnished this beautiful, almost to century reputation of your company. with that, i yield the balance of my time to the gentleman from new hampshire. >> thank you the derailment from arkansas. i want to follow up on the regulators. occ, how many offsites that they have the time? mr. stumpf: i did not hear the question. >> how many examiners did occ have at the time and wells fargo? mr. stumpf: i think it is around 80. >> how many do they have today question mark mr. stumpf: i do not have that number. i think it is the same number. >> how about the federal reserve? mr. stumpf: i do not know. the cfp bene at instructed you or your team not to advise you to share those

numbers with congress? mr. stumpf: i have not spoken to them on that. >> anyone on your team? mr. stumpf: nobody on my team has said anything to me about sharing numbers. i ask that because you seem reluctant to share that information on how many were working or were currently at wells fargo. mr. stumpf: i want to make sure that i'm clear about this. i do not know the other ones. >> the time from the general medical arkansas has expired. now did general went from colorado, mr. tipton is recognized. >> thank you, mr. chairman. letter from someone that has never had an account with wells fargo, and the account fraudulently opened and was sent back from your compliance department a wells fargo financial crimes manager

telling someone that was not jerk client that he needed to be able to provide complete signed notarized return affidavits about identity theft, provide documentation, collection letters you may have received, a letter of verification with social security and a copy of a police report stating he was a victim of identity fraud and a copy of his drivers license, proof of address and a copy of previous bills, statements, invoices during the timeframe of the front. he did not even have an account with you. isn't that a little bit burdensome? what are you doing in response to people that have no connection with wells fargo but are swept up in the challenges that your organization has created? issue, if: on that would like to see our people take a look at it. i do not know of that issue specifically. that sounds to me a lot like identity theft from someone

else, and most of what we saw, and i cannot say exclusively, but the 2 million accounts that could not be excluded, those were accounts people already had at the bank, and one of our bankers improperly opened a second account that our system this sounds a lot like identity theft, but i do not know that situation. i would like to look at it. >> i would like to get personal assessment. would you label yourself as aware and engaged? mr. stumpf: i believe i am. i love this company. i have been here a long time. i spend most my waking hours thinking about this company. >> you know, i would like to be able to follow up a little bit on a question in regards to the board. you said you think about it a lot, all of your waking hours. when did you make the board aware of the issue? mr. stumpf: the board was made

aware of the issues in inmittees at high levels 2011, 2012 and by 2013, we had talked about, i cannot remember what committee and was, surely by 2014, and when we finally connected the dots, the board was very active. >> you discovered in 2013, you were aware it engaged and we are now in 2016 and you are now radically starting to respond. there seems to be a little bit of a disconnect in terms of her response mechanism. mr. hill, brought it up, you get a response saying you had a sense of urgency. who have you fired? mr. stumpf: as i mentioned, we fired managers, managers am a manager managers and another manager and we are doing a full review of anybody that was responsible for any behavior of any kind that was not putting

customers first. >> are you trying to say these were lone wolves acting independently or were the following policy that came from the engage, urgent manager who is the ceo and chairman of wells fargo? mr. stumpf: they were doing exactly the opposite of what the ceo wanted them to do. everything i talked about, everything we train -- >> do you have a problem with monitoring? mr. stumpf: we should have done more. it was our monitoring that found this behavior. we should have done more sooner. i give you that, congressman. >> you have an infrastructure that is set up, i chain of command in terms of your organizational chart. someone that was overseeing the manager, would you want to describe that in the consequences at that level? mr. stumpf: the fax will stay where they are and people will be held accountable. i am praying for them.

want to foreclose anything we do to make sure we do it light -- right and that people are held accountable. >> there was a report that came out in the wall street journal that says a person in charge of goaling the yearly sales did not know the numbers were exaggerated. can you identify exactly when you were looking at this where the breakdown first started questio? mr. stumpf: i did not read that article. i know a lot of the should have done this earlier. >> my time is up and i yield back. >> the gentleman yields back. thank you, mr. chairman. and chairman of the board of wells fargo, is that correct? mr. stumpf: that is correct. >> how long have you had that position? mr. stumpf: december 2007. >> ok.

mr. stumpf: beginning of 2010. >> how long have you been with the bank? mr. stumpf: it will be 35 years. >> you have been at the bank in a long -- for a long time. i would conclude you know the bank pretty well. mr. stumpf: i love this company. >> q what really bothers me among other things? i am looking at this pattern of you folks ripping off your customers, getting caught, paying a fine and doing the thing all over again. had 13 instances of this in the last six years. billion a total of $11 in severance finds. used as your before us and told us several times, you know the difference between right and

wrong. you are the had banana over there. i look at you, i look at wells fargo. i know it is a big organization. 268,000 employees, to a 68,000 jobs. thank you for that, sir. you know what? i do not know if management knows the difference between right and wrong. i tell you who does, people who either percent in maine. i represent the most honest, hard-working people you can ever find anywhere. they know the difference between right and wrong. one thing i want to go out with right now, i do not know where this is going, but i will not support in any way shape or form, any kind of bail out using taxpayer money for wells fargo. you have to get through me and a lot of other people on this committee. now, here is what i worry about. i do not worry about wells fargo. you have 260,000 employees.

how many attorneys? mr. stumpf: i do not have the number. >> you have more than 10, 1000? i do not worry about you. you are goingway to make your way through this. you know who i worry about? or 31 community banks, local banks in the district i represent. 31 community banks, 500 branches, 9200 employees, good paychecks, good jobs, good benefits. we also have 58 credit units -- unions. these folks are relied upon in their communities. they take their paychecks and they trust the bank manager, but do you know what happens? when this happens, it flows downhill. that is exactly what happened in

the financial meltdown seven or eight years ago. all of a sudden because of a handful, a small handful of big money banks that took too much risk with the problems of regulators, and i understand this, but all of a sudden we have this very smartly set of financial regulations that are choking off home loans, mortgages for folks in my district. they cannot get a small business loan. now you come along. i do not know where this is going to go, but i what to you this, the probability will be high that your organization and the actions of you in your organization's systemic pattern of misbehavior and mismanagement, and it looks like fraud is going to find his way and community banks and the folks that rely on them in will ural maine.l

you want to be ashamed of yourself. what do you tell a family, what do you tell a family that is looking to add their fourth child and the need to put a new bathroom on their house and they cannot get a loan because of regulations and how it is going to get worse? what do you tell them? mr. stumpf: senator. >> congressman. you are asleep over that. mr. stumpf: i am so sorry, congressman. our people also live and work in these communities and we're trying to do the right thing. >> you should have been trying to stope right thing these 13 settlements, fines, call them what you want come over six years totaling $11 billion. that is a pattern that i see. mr. stumpf: there is no question that we have had a lot of settlements, and everyone we

have learned from and we are try to do a better job. >> type of the gentleman has expired. there are no other members. i wish to thank our witness for his testimony today. without objection, all members will have five legislative days in which to address additional questions which will be forwarded to the witness for his response. we will expect you and your organization to respond promptly and to fully cooperate with our ongoing investigation. without objection, all members will have five legislative days to submit extraneous materials to the chair for inclusion in the record. his hearing stands adjourned. mr. stumpf: thank you.

>> the next president making appointments to the supreme court of the united states will be president, donald trump. >> with hillary clinton in the white house, the rest of the world will never forget why they have always looked up to the united states of america. 2016ncer: c-span's campaign continues on the road to the white house with the presidential debate between mike pence and senator tim kaine tuesday night live from long will it university -- longwood university in farmville, virginia. at 8:30, the predebate briefing for the audience. at 9:00, live coverage of the debate followed by viewer reaction. the 2016 vice president to the bank, watch live on c-span, watch live in anytime on-demand c-span.org and at listen live on

the free c-span radio >> our guest on newsmakers this week is the president of the service employees international union, mary kay henry. seiu has been involved in many issues such as the minimum wage of $15. mary kay henry, welcome to c-span. mary kay: glad to be with you. pedro: joining us is ben geman and marianne levine, with political. miss levine, first question is for you. marianne: my first question to you is, how dear efforts this year compare dear efforts in 2008 and 2012 for president barack obama? mary kay: we have had more