said social security is a ponzi scheme and privatization would begin for all of us. when congressman pence was an congress, he was the chief cheerleader for the privatization of social security, even after president bush stopped pushing for it, congressman pence kept pushing for it. we are going to stand up against that push to privatize social security and look for ways to keep it solvent going forward, focusing on the payroll tax. gov. pence: thank you, you lane there they go again. [laughter] we are going to meet obligations to our seniors. theaid we are going to meet obligations to medicare. this is what this campaign is really about, senator. this is the scare tactic that they roll out -- sen. kaine: you have a voting record, governor. gov. pence: look, there is a question that you asked -- sen. kaine: you want defender on voting record. gov. pence: you are running with

-- defend your own voting record. gov. pence: you are running with hillary clinton. you say you are going to keep the promises of social security. donald trump and i are going to cut taxes. sen. kaine: you are going to raise taxes on the middle class. gov. pence: we will meet the obligations of social security and medicare. path that youthe have is on, we are going to be in a mountain range of that. -- of that. -- of debt. elaine: all right, let me move on. the issue of law enforcement and race relations. law enforcement and race relations. after the dallas police shooting, police chief david brown said "we are asking cops to do too much in this country. every societal failure, we put it off on the cops. not enough mental health funding, drug addiction funding, and schools fail. do we ask too much of police

officers in this country? how would you specifically address the chief's concerns. sen. kaine: that is a very fair comment. we put all that on police's shoulders. a city councilman and mayor in richmond. when i came in, we had one of the highest severance rates in the states. we fought very hard with our police department and reduce our homicide rate nearly in half. when i was governor of regina, we worked hard. virginia,governor of we worked very hard. we worked together. here is what i learned as a mayor and governor. immunities make favor and the way you make police saver is through community policing. you build the bonds between amenity and the police force, bonds of understanding, that's between the community and the police force, bonds of

understanding. when that gap narrows, it is safer for communities, and for the police. that model works across our country. there are other models that do not work, and overly aggressive more militarized model. donald trump recently said we need to do more stop and frisk around the country. that would be a big mistake because it polarizes the relationship tween the police and the community. here is what we will do, focus on community policing. we'll focus on a comprehensive mental health reform package that hillary clinton worked on with law enforcement professionals, and fight the scourge of gun violence in the united states. i am a gun owner. i am a strong second amendment supporter. when i was governor of virginia, there was a horrible shooting at i am a gun owner. virginia tech, and we learned through that painful situation backgroundn the record check system should have been closed and could have prevented that crime. we are going to work to do things i close background record

checks. if we do, we will not have the tragedy we did. one of those killed it at virginia tech was a 70 plus-year-old romanian holocaust survivor who had survived the holocaust, survived the soviet union takeover of his country, but then, he was a visiting professor at virginia tech, and could not survive the scourge of gun violence. we can support the second amendment and do things like that ground check to make us safer and police safer, too. gov. pence: my uncle was a cop, career cop. on the beach in downtown chicago. he was my hero when i grew up. my three brothers and i would marvel at my uncle when he would come out in his uniform, sidearm at his side. police officers are the best of us, and men and women, white, african-american, asian, latino, hispanic, they put their lives on the line every single day.

of me say, at the risk agreeing with you, community policing is a great idea. it has worked in the hoosier state. we fully support that. donald trump and i want to make sure law enforcement has the resources and tools to be able to really restore law and order, and for the cities and communities in this nation. it is probably why the 330,000 members of the police endorse donald trump as the next president of the united states of america because they see his commitment to him, to law -- to them, to law and order. they hear the bad mouthing that eizes from people that s upon tragedy as a reason to use a broad brush to accuse law bias orent of implicit

institutional racism. that really has got to stop. when an african-american police officer in charlotte, and all-star football player who university,rty followed his dad into law enforcement, joined the force in was involved2014, in a police action shooting that claimed the life of keith lamont scott, it was a tragedy. mourn,n with those who we grieve with those who grieve, and we are saddened at the loss of life. hillary clinton actually referred to that moment as an example of implicit bias in the police force, where she was asked a week ago, whether there was implicit bias in law enforcement, should correctly answer was that there is implicit bias and everyone in the united states i just think what we ought to do is stop seizing on these moments of tragedy. we assure the public we have a

full and complete and transparent investigation whenever there is a loss of life because of police action, but senator, please, enough of this seeking every opportunity to demean law enforcement probably by making accusation of implicit bias every time tragedy occurs. sen. kaine: people should not be afraid to bring up issues of bias in law enforcement. gov. pence: i am not afraid to bring that up. sen. kaine: if you are afraid to have the discussion, you will never solve it. this is a heartbreaking example. philando castile, who was killed in st. paul, who was a worker, a valued worker in a local school, he was killed for no other reason, in an incident that will be discussed and investigated. when folks went and explored this situation, what they found was that philando castile, they called him mr. rogers with dreadlocks. kids love him. he had been stopped by police 40

or 50 times before that fatal incident. if you look at unstinting in this -- at sentencing in this country, african americans get sentenced for crimes that very different rates. i just want to say, those who say we should not be able to bring up and talk about bias in the system will never solve the problem. gov. pence: when african-american police officers involved in a police action shooting involving an african-american, why would hillary clinton accuse that african-american -- sen. kaine: i cannot believe you're defending the position there is no bias -- elaine: i have a question on that point. your fellow republican governor, senator tim scott, who is african-american, recently spoke on the senate floor. he said he was tops seven times by law enforcement in one year. felt the anger, frustration, sadness, and the humiliation that comes with

feeling like you are being targeted for nothing more than being just yourself." what would you say to senator scott about his experience. gov. pence: i have the deepest respect for senator scott. he is a friend. i would say that we need to adopt criminal justice reform nationally. i had signed criminal justice reform in the state of indiana senate, and very proud about it. i worked in congress on the second chance act. we have got to do a better job recognizing and correcting the errors in the system that do reflect institutional bias in criminal justice. but what donald trump and i are saying is "let us not have the reflex of assuming the worst of men and women in law enforcement." we believe that law enforcement is not -- elaine: what would you say -- gov. pence: law enforcement in this country is a force for good.

they are people who put their lives on the line everything will day. i would suggest to you, what we need to do is assert a stronger leadership with the national level to use the -- to support law enforcement. you heard senator kaine want to stop stop and frisk. sen. kaine: let me -- if i could just -- i have heard senator scott make that eloquent plea. there is a fundamental respect issue here. i want to talk about the tone. donald trump has called mexicans rapistsis and promote -- and criminals. he is called women dogs, pigs, disgusting. wasaid the judge unqualified to. federal lawsuit because his parents were mexican. he went after tom mccain, a pow,

and said he -- john mccain, and a pow, and said he was not a hero because he had been captured. if you want to have a society where people are respected and respect laws, you cannot have someone at the top who demeans every groupie talks about. i cannot believe that governor insultould defend the driven campaign that donald trump has run. elaine: immigration. mate have both said that undocumented immigrants who have committed violent crimes should be deported. what would you tell the millions of undocumented immigrants who have not committed violent crimes. governor pence. gov. pence: donald trump has made a plan to end illegal immigration once and for all in this country. we have been talking it to death for 20 years. hillary clinton want to continue the policy of open borders,

amnesty, catch and release, sanctuary cities, all of the things driving wages down in this country, senator, and also too often, with criminal aliens in the country, it is bringing heartbreak. donald trump has a plan that he laid out in arizona that will deal systematically with illegal immigration, and it is probably why for the first time in history in immigration and customs enforcement, their union endorsed donald trump as the next president of the united states because they know they need help to enforce the laws of this country. all trump has -- donald trump had laid out a plan. that,have a congress all which will strengthen our economy, strengthen the rule of law in our economy and make our country safer, then, we will deal with those that remain. i have to tell you.

i was listening to the avalanche of insult coming out of senator kaine a minute ago. he says -- i apologize. it is your two minutes. said it is an insult driven campaign. did you all just hear that question marks ours is an insult driven campaign? that? you all just hear ours is an insult driven campaign? hillary clinton said that half of our supporters were a basket of deplorables. she said they were irredeemable, not american. it is extraordinary. "isnailed one after another m" on millions of americans, who believe we can and illegal them -- end illegal immigration

once and for all. that is small potatoes compared to hillary clinton. she called half of donald trump supporters a basket of deplorables. sen. kaine: she said, i should not have said that. elaine: this is senator kaine's two minutes. sen. kaine: now, we are even. did donald trump apologize to senator john mccain for calling him -- did donald trump apologize for taking after somebody in a porter war and making fun of her weight -- twitter war and making fun of her weight? did he apologize for saying that president obama was not a citizen of the united states. for donaldok in vain trump apologizing. donald trump believes in

deportation nation. you have got to pick your choice. hillary and i want a bipartisan reform that will keep families together, second, that will help focus enforcement efforts on those were violent, third, that will do more border control, and third, write a path to citizenship for those who play criminalles and take background checks. that is our proposal. donald trump proposes to deport 16 million people, 11 million of whom are here without documents. rid ofnt to get birthright citizenship. if you are born here, they want that isnate that, another 4.5 million people. they want to go house to house, school to school, business to business, and kick out 16 million people. i cannot believe that governor pence would sit here and defend his running mate's plan that we

should create a deportation force so that they will all be gone. gov. pence: we have a deportation force. it is called immigrations and customs enforcement. for the first time in their history, they endorsed donald trump to be the next president of the united states. sen. kaine: you like the 16 million deportation? gov. pence: senator, that is nonsense. they have a plan for open borders, amnesty. sen. kaine: our plan is like ronald reagan's plan from 1986. gov. pence: we know the routine. it is amnesty. you heard one of the last things he mentioned is border security. that is how washington always plays it. elaine: senator -- sen. kaine: governor pence was against it. gov. pence: a nation without borders is not a nation. donald trump is committed to restoring the borders of this nation. elaine: how would these millions of undocumented immigrants leave? would they be forcibly removed?

gov. pence: it begins with border security. after we secure the border, not only build a wall, but beneath the ground and in the air, we do internal enforcement. the focus has to be on criminal aliens. we just had a conversation about law enforcement, a conversation about the violence that is the setting our cities. the reality is, there is heartbreaking tragedy that has struck american families because people who came into this country illegally are now involved in criminal and reprise and activity, and we do not have the resources or the will to deport them systematically. donald trump said we are going to move those people out. people have overstayed their visas. we are going to enforce the law of this country and strengthen immigration and customs enforcement with more resources and personnel to be able to do that, and then donald trump has made it clear. once we have done all of those things, then we are going to reform the immigration system that we have in this country.

sen. kaine: i have to -- gov. pence: that is the order you should do it. border security, removing criminal aliens, upholding the law, and then, senator, i will work with you. we will work to reform the immigration -- sen. kaine: i look forward to working together in whatever capacity as we serve him. i want to make it clear that he is trying to change with donald trump has said. areld trump that we building a wall and we are deporting everybody. he said "they will all be gone." this is one of these ones where you can go to the tape on it and see what donald trump has said. it, we are a nation of immigrants. mike pence and i are both dissented from immigrant families. worth a readmaybe about the irish when we came in, but we absorbed, and made our

nation stronger. when donald trump said mexicans criminals, hed said the judge was unqualified to hear a case because his parents were mexican. i cannot imagine how you could defend that. elaine: gentlemen, i would like to shift to the threat of terrorism. today isink the will a safer and more dangerous place than it was eight years ago? has the terrorist threat increased or decreased. sen. kaine: it has decreased in some ways because bin laden is dead, because an iranian nuclear weapons program hasn't stopped, -- has been stopped. there is not 175,000 in a dangerous part of the world, only 15,000, that there are other parts of the world that are challenging. is onlyterrorism, there one candidate who can do it, and it is hillary clinton. she was a senator from new york

on 9/11, at the world trade center when they were searching for victims and survivors. need --red onto her the she was part of the national security team that wiped out bin laden. here is her plan to defeat isil. they have to take out their leaders on the battlefield. she will lead the team that will get the head of isis. theave got to disrupt financing networks. third, disrupt their ability to recruit on the internet, in their state havens. fourth, we also have to work with allies to share intelligence. that is the hillary clinton plan. she has got the -- donald trump cannot start a twitter war with miss universe without shooting himself in the foot. he does not have a plan. he said "i have a secret plan," and then he said "i know more than all the generals about isil," and finally he said "i am

going to fire all the generals." he does not have a plan. he trash talk military, john mccain is no hero, the generals need to be fired, i know more than them. he wants to their appliances. nato is obsolete and third, he loves dictators. he has a personal mount rushmore jong-un,ir putin, kim and saddam hussein. , donald trump believes that the world will be safer if more nations have nuclear weapons. he said saudi arabia should get them, japan should get them, and corporate jet should get them. when he was confronted with this, and told -- and korea should get them. when he was confronted with this , he said "go ahead, folks, enjoy yourselves." i would like governor pence atomic what is so enjoyable work

comical about nuclear war. gov. pence: that had a lot of creative lines in it. sen. kaine: see if you can defend any of it? gov. pence: i can make it clear to the american people, after traveling millions of miles as our secretary of state after being the architect of the foreign policy of this administration, america is less safe today that it was the day that barack obama became president of the united states. it is absolutely inarguable. weakened america's place in the world. it is a lack of leadership. i will give you that. i was in washington, d.c. on 9/11. i saw the clouds of smoke rise from the pentagon. sen. kaine: i was in virginia. gov. pence: i know you were. we lived through that day as a nation. it was heartbreaking. i want to give this president, for bringing osama bin laden to justice, but the truth is, he led al qaeda.

the primary threat today is isis. because hillary clinton failed to renegotiate a forces agreement that would have allowed some american combat troops to remain in iraq and secure the hard-fought gains of the -- that the american soldier has won, isis was able to be literally conjured up out of the desert and it has overrun vast areas. my heart breaks for the likes of liberal -- corporal lebowski. he fought hard, threw some of the most difficult days of operation iraqi freedom, and paid the ultimate sacrifice to secure the nation. that nation was secured in 2009. because hillary clinton and barack obama failed to provide a status of forces agreement and leave sufficient forces, we are

back at war. we are back at war in iraq and -- i tell her we're never going to forget her son. the sacrifices the american soldier made squandered in iraq because this administration created a vacuum in which isis was able to grow. initiated,at clinton $150 billion -- sen. kaine: without firing a shot. gov. pence: it did not stop the -- sen. kaine: yes, it did. gov. pence: it guaranteed that someday, iran would become a power. elaine: mr. trump has proposed extreme vetting, but that does not address many of the recent terrorist attacks in the united states such as the orlando nightclub mexic massacre.

those were homegrown. what specific tools would you use to prevent those kinds of attacks? gov. pence: i think it is a great question, elaine. usreally does begin with reforming our immigration system and putting the interest, particularly in the safety and security of the american people, first. donald trump once extreme vetting for people coming -- wants extreme vetting for people coming in. donald trump and i are committed to suspending the syrian refugee program and programs in around the world that have been copper mice by terrorism. hillary clinton want to increase it. compromised by terrorism.

expandlinton wants to it. sen. kaine: as opposed to violating the constitution by blocking people from coming in based on their -- we have different views on refugee issues and immigration. hillary and i want to do enforcement based on "our people dangerous?" these guys say "all mexicans are bad." with regard to refugees, we want to keep people out of they are dangerous. donald trump said "keep them out if they are muslim." an appellate court with three public and judges struck down a pence plan and said it was this majority. was discriminatory. gov. pence: there is not evidence that isis had infiltrated the united states. germany just arrested three syrian refugees. sen. kaine: they told you there

is a right way and a wrong way to do it. gov. pence: if you're going to be critical of me, that is fair game. after two syrian refugees were involved in the attack in paris 9/11," called "paris' you bet i suspended that program. i stand by that decision. if i am vice president, we're going to put the safety of the american people first. sen. kaine: hillary and i will do immigration enforcement and refugees based on whether they are dangerous or not, not discriminating based on which country you are from. the director of the fbi said we cannot know for certain who these people coming are. sen. kaine: if we do not know, we do not let them in. gov. pence: if the fbi and

homeland security said we cannot know for certain, you have got of the safetyside of the american people. sen. kaine: by trashing all muslims? elaine: we have got to talk about the intelligence surge. what would that look like and how would that help identify terrorists with no operational connection to a foreign terrorist organization? it is your mike lee expanding our intelligence positives by hiring professionals, but also, we have got some of the best intel and cyber employees. it involves increasing our own force, but striking great partnerships with some of our cyber and intel experts in the private sector so that we can be consistent with constitutional principles, gather more intelligence.

it means making stronger alliances. you share intelligence back and forth with allies, and that is how you find out who may be trying to recruit, who may be trying to come from one country to the next. alliances are critical. that is white donald trump's claim that made up -- that is why donald trump claim that nato is obsolete -- look, if you push aside your alliances, who are you going to share intelligence with? hillary clinton knows how to build alliances. that is what an intelligence surge means, better skill and prosody, but a better alliance. elaine: i would like to talk about syria. gov. pence: i would like to talk about the issue. elaine: 30 seconds. donald trump just spoke about the issue this week. we have got to bring together the best resources in this country to understand that cyber

warfare is the new warfare of the asymmetrical enemies we face in this country, and i look forward if i am privileged to be in this role of working with you in the senate, to make sure we resource that effort. we have an intelligence surge. i will also tell you that it's important in this moment to remember that hillary clinton had a private server in her home that had classified information on it about drone strikes, e-mails from the president of the united states of america were on there, her private server was subject to being hacked by foreign -- elaine: i would like to ask you about syria. you have had a minute. sen. kaine: the investigation concluded that not one reasonable prosecutor would take any additional steps. you do not get to decide that the rights and wrongs of this. we have a justice system that does that. a republican fbi director director did an investigation and concluded -- elaine: we are moving on now.

100,000 children -- governor. gov. pence: that is absolutely false. sen. kaine: they did an investigation. they concluded there was no reasonable prosecutor who would take it further. elaine: senator kaine, governor pence, please. i want to turn now to syria. 100,000 children are under siege in aleppo, syria. munitions,ter incendiary weapons are being dropped on them by russian and syrian military's. does the u.s. have a responsibility to protect civilians and prevent mass casualties on this scale? governor pence. gov. pence: the united states of america needs to begin to torcise strong leadership protect the vulnerable citizens in over 100,000 children in aleppo. hillary clinton's top priority when she became secretary of state was the russian reset.

after the russian reset, the russians invaded ukraine and took over crimea. the small and bullying the leader of russia is now dictating terms to the united states to the point where all ,he united states of america the greatest nation on earth, just withdraws from talk about a cease-fire while that a mere putin puts a missile defense in syria while he marshaled the forces and begins -- look, we have got to lean into this with strong, broad shouldered american leadership that begins by rebuilding our military. the russians and chinese have been making enormous investments in the military. we have the smallest maybe since 1916. we have the lowest number of troops since the second world war. we have got to work with the congress and donald trump to rebuild our military and project american strength in the world. about aleppo and syria, i truly

do believe that what america ought to do is immediately establish safe zones so that families with children can move out of those areas, work with our arab partners real-time, right now to make that happen. the provocations by russia need to be met by american strength. if russia continues to be involved in this barbaric attack on civilians in aleppo, the u.s. needs to be prepared to strike military targets of the assad regime, to prevent them from this humanitarian crisis taking place in aleppo. there is a broad range of other things we ought to do as well. we should deploy a missile defense shield to the czech republic and poland, which had hillary clinton and barack obama

pulled back on. we have to have american strength on the world stage. when donald trump becomes president, the russians and other countries in the world will know they are dealing with a strong american president. elaine: senator? consistent with the u.n. security council resolution passed would be a good idea. hillary clinton has the way to stand up to russia. donald trump again and again has praised vladimir putin. it is clear she has business dealings with russia and is very connected to putin. the trump campaign management team had to be fired a month or so ago because of those shadowy connections. governor pence made the odd claim, he said, and arguably, vladimir putin is a better leader than president obama. vladimir putin has run his economy into the ground and he persecutors lgbt folks. if you don't of the difference

between dictatorship and leadership, then you got to go back to a fifth grade civics class. that offends me. gov. pence: that offended me. sen. kaine: governor pence just said donald trump will rebuild the military. no he won't. avoiding paying taxes. the "new york times" story suggested he did not pay taxes for 18 years, starting in 1995. those years included the year of 9/11. on on 11, hillary clinton and donald trump -- on 9/11, hillary clinton's and donald trump's hometown was attacked. young men and women signed up to fight terrorism. hillary clinton went to washington to get funds to rebuild her city and protect first responders, but donald trump was fighting a different fight, a fight to avoid paying taxes so he would not support the fight against terror, he

would not support troops. this is important, elaine. when a guy running for president will not support the troops, not support veterans, not support teachers, that is really important. and i said about aleppo, we do agree to a humanitarian zone in northern syria. elaine: governor pence, you had mentioned a no fly zone. specifically, how would you keep this safe zone safe? gov. pence: first of all, donald trump supports troops and our veterans. sen. kaine: he will not pay taxes. elaine: gentlemen -- sen. kaine: this is about our troops. i understand why you want to change the subject and let me be clear on this russians thing. what we are dealing with is -- there is an old proverb that

says the russian bear never dies, but hibernates. his foreign policy from hillary clinton and barack obama has awakened a russian aggression that first appeared a few years ago with their move into georgia and crimea and into the wider middle east. full of ourw is arms and say, "we are not having talks anymore." we need to marshal the resources of our allies in the region and we need toediate -- act and act now to get people out of harm's way. elaine: exactly how would those safe zones work? gov. pence: the safe zones would have to be, as the senator said, there is a framework that has been recognized by the international community, but the united states needs to be prepared to work with others in the region to create a route for safe passage, and to protect

people in those areas, including with a no fly zone. i served on the foreign affairs committee ofor a decade. weak and feckless leadership that hillary clinton was the architect of. sen. kaine: let me come back to talk about -- acknowledgewant to that we stop the iranian nuclear weapons program. he does not want to acknowledge that taylor was part of the team that got osama bin laden. -- big knowledge that hillary was part of the team that -- he does not want to mako a cknowledge that hillary was part of the team that got osama bin laden. ronald reagan said something interesting about proliferation in the 1980's.

he said the problem with nuclear proliferation is some maniac could trigger a catastrophic event and i think that is who governor pence's running mate is. gov. pence: senator, that was even beneath you and hillary clinton. that was pretty low. ronald reagan also said nuclear wars should never be fought because it could never be won, and the united states of america needs to make advancements in modernizing. but let me go back to this iran thing. hillary saying that clinton started the deal with the iranians, prevented them from getting a nuclear weapon. that is not what israel thinks.

sen. kaine: you can go check. boycotted: i know you netanyahu'ser speech. when i was in congress, i fought hard on a bipartisan basis with republican and democrat members to move forward the topic sanctions literally in the history of the united states. sen. kaine: and hillary clinton used them. gov. pence: other goal was always that we would only lift the sanctions if iran terminally renounced their nuclear ambitions. they have not done so. and when the deal's period runs out, there is no limitation on weapons. a.7 billion was used in ransom payment. sen. kaine: six times tonight i have said to governor pence, i

cannot defend how you would defend your running mate's position. and in all six cases, he has refused to defend. and yet, he is asking everybody to vote for somebody he cannot defend. elaine: senator. i will give you an opportunity to do that. sen. kaine: more nations should get nuclear weapons, try to defend that. gov. pence: he never said that. elaine: gentlemen, russia. russian president vladimir putin invaded ukraine and crimea and provided crucial motel or military support to the assad regime. senator kaine? sen. kaine: let's start with not praising vladimir putin as a great leader. donald trump and mike pence has said he is a great leader. he has business dealings with

russia that he refuses to disclose. hillary clinton has gone toe to toe with russia. she did so as secretary of state with the new start agreement to reduce russia's nuclear stockpile. she went toe to toe with russia and launched protests when they went into georgia. and we have done the same thing with ukraine, but we put punishing economic sanctions on russia that we need to continue. donald trump on the other hand, did not know russia had invaded crimea. he was on a television show a couple months back and said, "i guarantee you this, russia is not going into the ukraine." he had to be reminded that they had gone into crimea a few years before. hillary clinton has gone toe to toe with russia and got them engaged in a meaningful way to cap iran's nuclear weapons program and yet, she stood up to them on issues such as syria and

the invasion of georgia. you have got to have the ability to do that and hillary does. on the other hand, in donald trump you have somebody who praises vladimir putin all the time. america should really wonder about donald trump, who to vladimired tie ties putin, who had to be fired for that reason. when donald trump sits down with vladimir putin, is it going to be america's bottom line or donald trump's bottom line with his business dealings. this could be solved if donald trump was willing to release his tax returns. and i know he is laughing at this. gov. pence: what has that got to do with russia? sen. kaine: every president since nixon has done it. elaine: senator, your time is up. governor. gov. pence: well, thanks. i'm just trying to keep up with

the insult driven campaign on the other side. sen. kaine: i am just saying facts about your running mate. gov. pence: don't put words in my mouth. most of what you said is completely false and the american people know that. elaine: senator, please, this is governor pence's time. gov. pence: this is the alternative universe of versuston d.c. reality. hillary clinton her number one priority was a reset of russia. that resulted in the infiltration of ukraine. they moved all the way into crimea and took over the crimean peninsula. donald trump was basically said, it is not going to happen again. the truth of the matter is, what you have in the rise of aggressive russia, which has

increased its influence in iran, it is not because of this deal, is on a pathway in the feature to obtain a nuclear -- the leading state sponsor of terror has a world in iran now closer working relationship with russia because of hillary clinton and barack obama's foreign policy and $150 billion and sanctions being lifted and then of course, syria. it is extraordinary. syria is imploding. you just asked about the disaster in aleppo. isis is headquartered from raqqa. from there, they have overwhelmed vast areas. yet, senator kaine still sits the foreigns that policy of hillary clinton and barack obama somehow made the world more secure. it really is astonishing. fouray iran released

americans we delivered $400 million in cash as a ransom payment for americans held in tehran. elaine: "putin has no respect for hillary clinton and no respect for obama." what he think he will respect a trump-pence administration? -- why the you think he will respect a trump-pence administration? gov. pence: strength. we are going to rebuild our military. look,hole putin thing, america is stronger than russia. our economy is 16 times larger than the russian economy. our political system is superior to the corrupt capital system in russia it every way.

and i observedmp in syria and iran and ukraine that the bullying leader of russia has been stronger on the world stage than this administration is stating facts. that is not an endorsement of putin. this is one where we can go to the table on. governor pence said, and arguably, vladimir putin is a better leader than president obama. gov. pence: that is absolutely inaccurate. he has been stronger on the world stage. elaine: no, you said leader. and i will say this, governor. if you mistake leadership for dictatorship and can't tell a difference -- gov. pence: this is the grade school thing again. sen. kaine: if you can't tell the difference, you should not be commander in chief. ond donald trump's s

says they have all these business dealings with russia. america needs to worry about whether donald trump will be worrying about his own bottom line. elaine: what went on with the russian reset? sen. kaine: vladimir putin is a dictator. he is not a leader. anyone who thinks otherwise does not know russian history and they don't know vladimir putin. hillary clinton knows exactly who this guy is. john mccain, i look at that guy and i see kgb. so, how do you deal with him? we do have to deal with russia in many different ways. there are areas where we can cooperate. it was hillary clinton who worked with russia on the treaty to reduce their nuclear weapons stockpile. it was hillary clinton who worked with russia to get them engaged in a community of nations to stop the iranian nuclear weapons program without firing a shot. she is not going around praising vladimir putin as a great guy,

but she knows how to sit down at a table and negotiate tough deals. this is a very challenging part of the world and we should have a commander in chief that is prepared, rather than somebody who goes around praising vladimir putin. elaine: i would like to ask about north korea and the threat of nuclear weapons. north korea just conducted its fifth and most powerful nuclear weapon test. how would you stop them from developing a nuclear weapon powerful enough from reaching the united states? modernize: we need to our nuclear forces and we need an effective american diplomacy that will marshal the resources of nations in the asian-pacific rim to put pressure on north korea, to abandon the nuclear ambitions. it has to remain the policy of

the notice states of america, the demilitarization of the korean peninsula. when donald trump's president, we are not going to have the kind of posture in the world that has russia invading crimea and ukraine, that has the chinese building new islands in the south china sea, that has literally the world, including north korea, floating american power. we will go back to the days of peace through strength. but i have to tell you, all of this talk about tax returns, and i get it, you want to keep but, hillaryp, clinton and her husband set up a private foundation called the clinton foundation. while she was secretary of state, the foundation accepted tens of millions of dollars from foreign governments and foreign donors now, you will need to know out there, this is basic stuff.

for a donors and certainly, foreign governments cannot participate in the american political process. they cannot make financial contributions, but the clintons figure out a way to create a foundation where foreign governments and for donors can donate millions of dollars. and then we found, thanks to the good work of the associated half ofhat more than her private meetings when she was secretary of state were given to major donors of the clinton foundation. you talk about all these baseless rumors about russia and the half rest, hillary clinton,u asked the trustworthy question at the very beginning. elaine: senator. gov. pence: they are looking at the pay to play politics she operated within the clinton foundation. they are saying, enough is enough. elaine: senator kaine. sen. kaine: i want to talk about the foundation and then north korea. i am glad to talk about the foundation. it is one of the highest rated charities in the world.

it provides aids drugs to about 11.5 million people. it helps america deal with opioid overdoses and it gets higher rankings for its charity than the american red cross does. it does a lot of good work. oflary clinton as secretary state took no action to benefit the foundation. the state department did an investigation and concluded that everything hillary clinton did as secretary of state was in the interest of the united states. so, the foundation does good work and hillary clinton as secretary of state acted in the interest of the nuts states. -- the interest of the united states. now, let's compare that with the trump organization. the conflict of interest could only be known if donald trump would release his tax returns and he has refused to do it. his son has said the organization has a lot of business dealings in russia. remember, the trump organization

is not a nonprofit. it is putting money into his pocket and the pockets of his children, where the clinton foundation is a nonprofit and no clinton foundation draws any salary. in addition, donald trump has a foundation that was just fined for illegally contributing foundation dollars to a political ca campaign. they made an illegal contribution and try to hide it. the person they donated it to was the person whose office was donating to committin trump university. clinton is doing work in the american interest. elaine: governor, i will give you 30 seconds to respond because i know you want to, but i will remind you both, this is about north korea. [laughter] gov. pence: thank you.

the trump foundation is a private family foundation and they give virtually every cent to charitable causes. portraite: a $20,000 of donald trump? gov. pence: it has been a platform for the clintons to travel the world. senator, we would know a lot more about it if hillary clinton would turn over that 33,000 e-mails. elaine: senator kaine. senator kaine, if you had intelligence that north korea was about to launch a nuclear armed missile capable of states, the united would you take preemptive action? sen. kaine: a president should take action to defend the united states against th imminent threats. now, you would have to determine

what your intelligence was, how certain you were about that intelligence, but you would have to take question. you asked the question of how we deal with north korea. on the foreign relations committee we just did an extensive sanctions package against north korea and interestingly enough, the u.n. did virtually the same package. often china will use their veto on the security council for that. they are starting to get worried about north korea as well. supported be sanctions passage, even when many of the sanctions are against chinese financial institutions. so, we are working together with china and we need to. it is competitive and also challenging and we have to be against northate korea. hillary understands that. she went famously to china and stood up at a human rights meeting and said, against north korea. "women's rights are human rights."

she worked on many important diplomatic deal with china and that is what it will take. the thing i would worry about a little bit is donald trump owes about $650 million to banks, including the bank of china. i am not sure he could stand up so tough to the people who have loaned him money. elaine: i would like to turn to our next segment and focus on a social issue. you have both been open about the role that states have played in your lives. can you express in detail a time that you have struggled to balance your personal faith and the public policy decision. senator kaine. sen. kaine: that is an easy one for me. i grew up with a great irish catholic council. i was educated by jesuits. i worked with jesuit hondurasries in o now nearly 35 years ago and they

were the heroes of my life. i tried it to practice my religion in a very devout way. but i don't believe in this nation, a first amendment nation, where we don't raise any religion over the other, that the doctrines of any one religion should be mandated for everyone. faith a struggle in my life was that the catholic church is against the death penalty and so am i. but i was the governor of the state, and the state says there was a death penalty. so, i had to grapple with that when i was running for governor and i was attacked pretty strongly because of my position. but, i looked the voters of e, and said,the ey i am not going to change my religious practice to get one vote, but it will uphold the law. and i was elected and i did.

it was very difficult to allow executions to go forth, but in certain situations where i did not believe there was a case for clemens the, i toency, i told virginia voters i would uphold the law and i did. it is difficult for those of us who have these faith lives, we don't feel we can just substitute our views. elaine: governor pence. gov. pence: well, it is a wonderful question in my christian faith is at the very heart of who i am. i was also raised in a wonderful family of faith. it was church on sunday morning and grace before dinner. becamechristian faith real for me when i made a personal decision for christ when i was a freshman in college. i have tried to live that out, however imperfectly, every day of my life since. with my wife by my side we followed a calling into public service, where we tried to keep the faith with our values that

we cherish. and, which regard to when i struggled, i appreciate and i have a great deal of respect for senator kaine's sincere faith. that is shared. but for me, i would tell you for of life entity o the sanctity proceeds out of the believe thft ncient principle of god. ancientto stand for the principle of the sanctity of life. pleased thaty indiana became the most state.io-adoption

but what i cannot u understand is hillary clinton, how she can support a process like partial-birth abortion. i know you hold pro-life views personal. at the very idea that a child almost born into the world could still have their life taken from conscience at party that supports that. i know you have historically opposed taxpayer funding for abortion, but hillary clinton wants to repeal the long-standing provision when we said we would not use taxpayer dollars to fund abortion. for me, my faith informs my life. for me, it all begins with cherishing the dignity, the worth, the value of all human life. sen. kaine: elaine, this

is a fundamental question. hillary and i are both from religious backgrounds. her methodist church experience was very informative for her as a public servant. but we both feel you should live fully and withi enthusiasm your faith. but, let's talk about abortion and choice. ws. wade.t roe ve we support the constitutional right of american women to andult their own conscience make their own decision about pregnancy. that is something we trust american women to do. and we don't think that women should be punished, as donald trump they showed, for making the decision to have an abortion. governor pence wants to repeal roe vs. wade. he says he wants to put it on h heap of

history. statesroe vs. wade, could punish women if they made the choice to aboard a pregnancy. i think you should live your moral values, but the last thing governments should do is to have laws that would punish women who make reproductive choices. that is the fundamental difference between the clinton-kaine ticket and the trump-pence ticket. gov. pence: it is really not. donald trump and i would never support legislation that would punish women who made the heartbreaking choice. sen. kaine: then, why did he say that? gov. pence: look, he is not a polished politician like you and hillary clinton. there is a great line from the gospel. a promise from the heart now

speaks. when donald trump says hillary clinton should be punished, for that mexicans are rapists and criminals, he is showing you who he is. gov. pence: senator, with that mexican thing again. whoe are criminal aliens have come into this country illegally, who are perpetrating violence. he also said, and many of them are good people. sen. kaine: you keep leaving them out of your quote. but there is a choice here, and it is a choice on life. i could not be more proud to be standing with donald trump, who is standing with the right to life. it is a principle that under can, and i very generous about this because it is a principle that you embrace. i have appreciated the fact that you support the amendment that bans the use for taxpayer funding in the past.

but that is not hillary clinton's view. we can come together as a nation. we know we are better for it. like mother teresa said at that name is prayer breakfast. there's so many families around the country who cannot have children. so people whoove cannot have children can. to'sekend encourage people -- we can encourage people to support women. why doesn't it donald trump trust women to make this choice for the themselves? of faith withes enthusiasm, convincing each other, dialoguing each other about important issues.

fundamental issues of morality, we should let women make their own choice. >> society can be judged by how it deals with its most vulnerable. the aged, the infirm. i cannot say it how happy i am to be standing with a pro-life candidate, and donald trump. kaine, if your ticket wins, what are you going to do to unified the country? that may be the $64,000 question. a campaignrunning bout "stronger together." and donald trump, this man except he cannot defend donald trump. we have to bring the country together. here's what we will do. clinton was secretary of

senate. served in the i talked to republican senator is a hand i'm surprised by how well they respect hillary clinton. she was on the armed services committee. she worked across the aisle would you as first lady to get the chip program past. across the aisle on 9/11 to get help benefits for the first responders who ran into the towers and pentagon. she the you care for national guard members including four hoosiers in the national guard. she has a record of working across the aisle. togovernor of virginia what goodlican houses, i have relations across the eye. it is fine to be a democrat, republican, or independent. after election day, the goal is to work together.

hillary clinton has a record of working across the aisle. >> governor, how will you unify the country if you win? gov. pence: thank you. this is a family -- very challenging time in the life of our country. weekend our place in the world since the leadership of barack obama and hillary clinton and it is followed i an economy that is stifled by an avalanche of taxes, regulation, obamacare, the war on coal, and trade dealers -- trade deals which have put americans in the back seat. the best way we can bring people together is to change in washington d c. i served with many republicans and democrats. men in women of good will. the potential is there to change

the direction of this country but it is going to take leadership to do it. seeamerican people want to our nation standing tall on the world stage again. they want to see it supporting our military, rebuilding the military, command the respect of the world and they want to see the american economy off to the races. a comeback. has -- donaldff trump square has been about through coming hardship, finding a way through smarts and ingenuity and get through. when he becomes president the united states will have a stronger america. when you hear him say he wants to make america great again, when he does that i truly believe the american people will be standing tall. they will see that real change can happen after years of talking about it. decades. they will stand tall, stand

together, and we will have the kind of unity that has been missing for so long. gentlemen, thank you so much. my thanks to the candidates, the commission, interv tuna and sunday for the second presidential debate at washington university in st. louis and the final debate at the university of las vegas -- nevada las vegas. good night. applause]

critics and that is wide tim kaine won the debate. donald trump was nowhere to be seen. mike pence refused to defend him. he refused to defend donald trump on his racist, sexist remarks and refused to defend them on any number of thing. so, you know, to win this debate mike pence had to stand up for donald trump, had to defend the things he has said over the last week and he had to change the dynamics of this race and he did not do that. >> what is the strategy, you think that he came into hot on the debate? is that the senator that she picked and you all know and like? >> absolutely.

he stood up for the ticket and the platform. he defended secretary clinton's record against relentless attacks from mike pence. that's what they said they would do. what you saw mike pence do is whither in the face of any question or criticism of the things that donald trump has said. >> was it withering or was it just not taking the bait? >> he just wouldn't stand up for his ticket mate. when confronted with a racist things donald trump has said and the things he has said about women in particular asked about donald trump's positions on russia he changed the platform and came up with his own miss of policies and refused to stand up. that's why the person that lost this debate was donald trump because mike pence refused to defend him. >> after tonight, what is the strategy moving toward sunday? >> we are going to continue on the same strategy we had both secretary clinton and senator kaine will be talking about their platform and about the specific policies they have two -- to make a real difference in

peoples lives and to create jobs and help families afford health care and education. but again, the problem tonight was we either heard no defense of donald trump's position or actions. i don't know if mike pence was thinking about his future ambitions or if he simply had nothing to say in response to very legitimate questions about donald trump's positions. >> were you surprised at all by his demeanor? >> well, i think he was very clever about to mirroring and again, refusing to -- d nearing -- deferring and again, refusing to confront or provide solid answers against the things that donald trump has said and done, and i think that senator kaine won this debate in particular because he had to interject constantly.

the one thing that mike pence stood up for donald trump on was the fact that he has not paid taxes for almost 20 years. that was the one thing he defended him on. >> last week, you are saying were ae interjection's sign of weakness for trump. why were they a strength for tim kaine. >> mike pence continued to change the positions in the playbook. he refused to defend donald trump on issues and senator kaine was trying to push him to provide concrete answers as to whether he supported in hand -- and believed in the things donald trump has said and done and then with russia in particular, he made up a new position. >> were you satisfied with senator kaine's answer on trustworthiness for quentin? >> absolutely. -- for clinton? >> absolutely. he talked about how hillary has spent three decades or more of her life fighting for kids with families and that americans can trust her to do that. i think donald trump is very

frustrated right now. because i think senator kaine did a great job challenging his statements, challenging his record, challenging his policy positions and mike pence let them all breeze past them. >> are you worried that people who just tuned in may have seen a republican in both of them come across as more polished than perhaps in the next hour for both events? >> like i said, success in this debate for the trunk campaign mikeump campaign was for pence to successfully defend donald trump's and physicians -- actions and positions and to change the dynamics in the race. he could do neither. if mike pence was running his own race with completely new positions, he did that job. but tim kaine did what a running is supposed to do. he defended secretary clinton's record and policies. he stood with her and he challenged donald trump.

mike pence was awol on everyone of those questions. >> do you think he interrupted too much? they kept interrupting each other back and forth. do you think senator kaine did too much of that? >> welcome i think there was a lively debate back and forth. as i said earlier, governor pence would make up new policy positions. came up with a policy different from what trump in the past, and on russia, he had nothing to say at all on controversial remarks. and he would make assertions that were not true so senator kaine was correcting those statements. we could not understand how governor pence could support some of the really reprehensible statements donald trump has

said, and he could not do that. >> you have argued that donald trump does not have the temperament to be president. do you think mike pence's temperament was a contrast to donald trump or not? >> i think both senator kaine and governor pence came into this with most americans believing they are qualified to do the job of vice president. they both have extensive experience. it again, what was troubling is that governor pence was not able, whether it was his temperament, his beliefs, his values, or whatever it was, he was simply unable to defend donald trump. >> do you think mike pence has temperament to serve as president? >> i think they have the qualifications to serve in this capacity. the candidates run together and what is troubling here is mike pence was suggesting completely different policies than his

running mate and refused to defend him. so i think the real loser in this debate was donald trump. nobody had his back. and tim kaine was there at every turn supporting secretary clinton's position, speaking coherently and consistently, and mike pence had an entirely new policy proposal. >> for the immigration exchange -- [indiscernible conversation]

>> it is true that hillary clinton's positions are totally far to the left on that issue so many people know it, and that is why she has lost a lot of support. >> do you feel like he defended trumps positions or was he trying to wriggle out of those questions? >> i have to say, i like tim kaine but tim kaine rattling off one example after another of some statement he says donald trump made were often a inaccurate. every time virtually distorted. they have the list, haven't you seen it? things about putin, things about women. >> that these are all donald trump's words. >> no, they are distortions of his words. >> a lot of the reaction on

twitter is that tim kaine came off as erratic and unhinged. why do you think he was acting that way? >> i don't know. he was well coached. he had a series of attack lines. he hammered the opponent with so many things you cannot possibly answer him. i think many ways distorting the the positions of mr. pence and donald trump. >> do you think that his interrupting came off as rude instead of attacking him? >> yes, i think so. i think pink -- i think pence showed him much more respect than tim kaine showed him. i think mr. pence was more accurate consistently and he was more respectful of the american public. >> do you think his behavior will affect hillary clinton? >> i think it is a good event here for the trump campaign. i think it showed solidity and

confidence going forward. >> what do you think of the moderator tonight? >> i think as good as possible under the circumstances. and i really just don't know. i will have to look at that later and hear some of the other comments on it. it looks to me like under the circumstances, the moderator could have perhaps allowed a little more time and protection. protection from being interrupted as often as he was. >> does donald trump agree that vladimir putin is a bullying leader? i do not think there is any

doubt that vladimir putin has acted very recklessly in recent months. actually, several years now. and the entire reset that hillary clinton started has been a failure and we have got to get this back on track. i believe we can have a better relationship with russia. we should have a better relationship with russia. but it is going to take a strong president. >> senator, how do you reconcile the statement tonight of a -- for the voter, how do they reconcile mike pence saying donald trump never praised vladimir putin and never said he was a strong leader, had a high approval rating and was doing things that made him a good leader? how do you reconcile that? at one point, tim kaine said the plan was like the 1986 act by ronald reagan. any thoughts on that?

>> i don't know exactly what he meant by that. i didn't hear that clearly as you stated. the 1986 plan was flawed because it gave amnesty with a promise of enforcement in the future. donald trump is absolutely clear that he will not make that mistake again. the first thing that you should do is end the laws on immigrationss in and then work with people that have been here a long time. [inaudible conversations]

>> i think the vast majority of second amendment supporters and gunowners actually do support reasonable gun restrictions such as having background checks, such as making sure terrorists don't fly, that people who can't fly can't purchase firearms. and i think whether you are an nra member or a gun owner, as i am, i think those are reasonable things. i would simply go back to the data that gunowners and nra members, by overwhelming numbers, support reasonable background checks. sometimes facts do matter. >> was there anything about the performance that struck you as different, new, more aggressive?

>> i think what he was trying to get to, was governor pence willing to defend some of the more outrageous comments that donald trump made. not just the comments about women. comments about nuclear proliferation. finally, the governor would not come back and defend him. and i think in a way when tim asked the second to last question and basically said, from your heart is what comes out of your mouth, i think some of that may have been as good as any exchange in the debate because it is hard for governor pence to say it, to defend some of the indefensible comments that donald trump has made throughout the campaign. [inaudible conversations] [speaking foreign language]

>> the last question tonight was, how do you bring people together after bitter election? do you think there is any lesson from virginia? >> i think it starts with a willingness to listen. i think that neither side has a monopoly on truth or virtue or patriotism. i think you have to recognize that a lot of that is built on building relationships and real realizing that

[indiscernible] it amazes me their people that are in politics and never get to a solution. >> i am here to talk about governor pence's performance. i did not hear that exact line so i would have to look at it. if you give me your phone number -- >> he said that he would be willing to use military force is -- against assad. is that something that mr. trump agrees with? >> i would have to talk to mr.

trump about that. i do not know the answer. >> donald trump said he would do that, has something changed? >> not in the last 15 minutes. >> what about syria. >> i am not familiar with that, i cannot speak on that. >> do you think mr. trump learned anything from governor mike pence? he never lost his cool after he was constantly on the attack. to think he learned anything? >> i think he learned what a great choice he made and showed the american people what he was talking about which is i'm going to bring the best and brightest. >> thank you. [inaudible conversations]

>> you heard things coming out of tim kaine's mouth that had nothing to do with the question asked. and people will know that, they will say, well why didn't they answer the question onbringing of how he will create jobs or bring prosperity to the country. why won't he answer those questions? if her stock, mike pence is asked every single day to defend -- first of all, mike pence is asked every single day to defend donald trump, and he does that.

tonight we saw what ronald reagan said for many years, which is the very first exercise of leadership was his selection of mike pence as his running mate. [inaudible conversations] >> i know because governor pence did so well tonight, maybe the it won't really matter, the vice presidential debates don't really move anything. but that will not be true. >> they didn't talk about it. . was surprised , asposition is well known you know. they have come out against the tpp.

they have a standard, and they don't believe the tpp met that standard. they want to create jobs and protect our country. i don't know where the gop stands anymore. i know mike pence was a big free-trade advocate. we read just this week that while trump talks a big game on trade, he makes all of his products overseas. he imports labor, sometimes legally, sometimes it illegally. >> were you frustrated by a the shifting on topics over and

over? of an odd format because it was supposed to be an exchange. but she had a hard job to do i think she did that job. >> governor pence called the clinton campaign insult driven several times during the campaign. what did you think of that? >> i thought it was laughable. donald trump has one after another offended groups, offended mexicans, muslims, he attacked the integrity of a judge born in indiana serving on the federal bench and said he could not fairly hear a case has his parents came from mexico. i think he has run an insult driven campaign, and i think

tonight wasne did to try to challenge and defend , theateful campaign attacks on women, calling them pigs and dogs. he got into a twitter war with a former miss universe, insulting her weight. again, time and time kaine challenged mike pence to defend donald trump, and time and time again, mike pence could not do it. i think he was smooth, but he had a job to do which was to reassure people that donald trump was fit to be president, and he never really did that.

>> i thought the female moderator could handle herself. i think she did a good job. kind of different debate than people expected. it was meant to be a discussion, a conversation. people interrupt each other sometimes. pence interrupted kaine. kane and are up did pence. i don't know who interrupted the pence. kaine interrupted i don't know who interrupted the most. she had a tough job and i commend her for the job she did. >> the issue of pro-choice came up very late. both have interesting positions on that.

yes, and given what we see going on in north carolina, same thing in indiana with businesses pulling out because of anti-gay discrimination. that was not part of the discussion, but what was, and i , isght it was very moving their faith. there is a prayer breakfast every week and tim kaine cochairs that. but when they got to the issue of contraception and a woman's right to choose, tim kaine was focused in explaining how the trump view and pensive you of -- overturning roe the way, what would that really mean in this country? what about some of the

criticisms that tim kaine and are much? >> this was a different kind of debate. it was a discussion. in conversations, people interrupt each other. they both interrupted each other in the first two minutes. that wasn't supposed to happen. but for the most part, they were conversing back-and-forth. sometimes you interrupt, sometimes you don't. moderator was strong. she followed up with questions. she was able to go from topic to topic. it was a more is substantive debate, may be because of the candidates in the debate. >> in the end, did it move the needle? >> welcome here's the deal. after this last week where donald trump's performance at the debate was not good, where he spent the week tweeting at , where ahe morning

story comes out that he had nearly a billion dollars in debt one year and then didn't pay his taxes, pence had a high bar and that was to change the trajectory of the election. he was not able to do it because like many of my colleagues in the republican party, it is very difficult to defend donald trump's positions. >> some people are saying that arekaine's interruptions just like donald trump's and her options. >> it was a different kind of debate. this was a conversation format. they both in her up did each both interrupted each other. >> did tim kaine win the debate? >> i believe he did.

>> again, how tragic it is for americans to wake up and find 's leading russia and obama and clinton are retreating. it's not to say putin is good. it's that unfortunately, we have feckless leadership in washington. how tragic it is that these we have thisgly -- feckless leadership in washington that has america on the defense again. point.s the whole a senior republican from texas and as an establishment republican from texas -- >> i am not sure i would agree with that. >> well, you're a senior member

in the house and chairman of the financial services committee. you are down here supporting the trump-pence ticket. >> mike pence is my good friend. and i think donald trump made an choosing himice in as a vp. unlike hillary clinton, who only thought of herself, donald trump chose somebody with a heart who comes from the heartland. somebody committed to helping the plight of working families. he and donald trump will get this economy working again. i think what they heard is them.dy who understands and what they see on the other kaine flailing and trying to defend hillary

clinton's reset on russia that resulted in russia going into crimea and creating one of the worst humanitarian tragedies in the syrian civil war. a huge there was contrast there. just reaffirms that donald trump is going to surround himself with good people. as it relates to the vice presidential debate, do you think this will boost the campaign and anyway? >> i think it does give a boost to the campaign. obviously, trump could have done better, but he is not a professional politician like hillary clinton. what pence was able to do was refocus the campaign on the issues and the success that donald trump has had. get the economy working for working americans. tim kaine is left to defend

hillary clinton's tax increases and the worst economic recovery in the history of the republic. was able to point out that under the obama-clinton doctrine, we have china on the move, russia on the move, iran has had their nuclear program legitimized. and the clinton administration was to claim credit for that, giving millions of dollars to the largest state sponsors of terrorism. it's mind-boggling. pence focused on import questions. is the economy working for my family? we need to change. a saferng to bed in america? we are really not. there are two sets of rules, one for washington insiders, and the other for real