read in our spotlight, max will talk about the recent piece on fake news. you can join the conversation on facebook and twitter. ♪ the house democratic caucus hosts their leadership election today. nancy pelosi is expected to retain her position despite a challenge why tim ryan -- challenge by tim ryan. stay close to c-span for those results. it is the "washington journal." november 30. statistics from the election shows a significant number of support came from the rural areas of the united states. a recent story featuring tom bill sack reported about his

concerns about not doing enough to reach out to rural voters in days before the election. in our first 45 minutes. we want to hear from those of you who consider yourselves in a rural community. you tell us what your message to washington might be in light of this last election. here's how you can give us a call -- you can tell us where you are and post on our twitter page. you can do the same on our facebook page. to begin, how do you find "rural?" a couple of definitions saying that are 15. rural areas are anyplace with fewer than 50,000

inhabitants not located adjacent to an urban area. anyplace outside of the urban cluster with more than 2500 residents. those are working definitions. you can use them as a guide. if you live in those communities outside of urban areas, you are in a rural area, and you want to tell us a message to washington -- you can post on our twitter page and our facebook page. npr took a poll of some of those voters and how they voted in this past election. they showed that amongst support in this election, 62% of those who would list themselves and those areas supported donald trump. 34% hillary clinton. that number goes down to 59% in the previous election with 39%

obama.ith barack if you take another look of is listening of polls when it comes to those who voted by popularity , and the urban areas, more support for hillary clinton. as you go to the rural areas, a by for going to donald trump a significant amount listed in these red bars. this was inspired by a story by tom vilsack. he is the former governor of iowa. in the days before the election, his pleas to democratic leadership. it says --

one more bit of information from the associated press about those who voted in a rural areas. 17% of voters in campaign 2016, according to exit polls were from small cities. 62% of them said they voted for donald trump. if you find yourself in that area and you want to give your thoughts to washington, in light of the election -- let's start with kingston, illinois. tell us about kingston for those who have never been. caller: it is a rural area. i know a lot of people in rural areas all over. there is a bias against the rural voter that they don't know

what is going on. it is not true. they are not stupid people. they vote and vote hoping they will be -- there will be a change. really hard on half of the country compared to the richer half. it is people trying to vote their interests. i'd say 50% of the rural voters i know, they were all obama voters. rural voters, prejudice and all that is just not true. it makes the race card that is played is really making people mad, because i am not sure if donald trump is a biased person or not, but that is not the draw that people have. it wasn't the draw they had in voting. it is all economic. 50% of the people have it

harder. they are just looking for a change. i know of a lot of obama voters. it doesn't matter if you're a distinguish what your voting habit is, it kind of characterizes the things that people vote on. a lot of varied on what they vote on. the main connection is the economy. the politicians play the same game all the time. get the hope and they trust that something is going to happen. a lot of people trusted bernie sanders and got letdown. the same old politician -- they are all liars. there.e will let it sit let's go to amsterdam, ohio. joshua, where is amsterdam in relation to a city that is --

that our viewers may know about? caller: sifting miles west of pittsburgh. -- 16 miles west of pittsburgh. host: what do you think of the medical system? -- reacheach up to the out to the political voter? i live 25 miles from any big town. it hits us first. our pocketbooks, we have to start cutting back. from everything i see, nobody in -- it grows and grows and grows. that is some of the biggest frustration is us tightening our pocketbooks up, come back, thinking where we can cut back, save money. it doesn't seem like money, the federal government cares at all. that is the thing that scares me.

the reckless spending and the abandonment of money. i seen something the other day where they spent $2 million -- i cannot remember. it is the money. when we cut back, they don't cut back. that is one of the biggest issues. i hope that changes with trump. i know he spent a whole lot less money on the election. that should prove a point that you don't need the money in the elections. host: i know you'll speak to everybody -- speak for everybody in your town but were they largely supporting donald trump? caller: when you look back at 2012, 20 -- 2008, there were signs of wear for obama. i saw two signs for clinton. a lot of the industry around here is coal and steel. we know what hillary said about the coal industry and what they have done as far as the steel

industry. my father and grandfather worked in retired out of their. it was something i only had -- out of there. it was something i only had a dream of doing. host: tom, thanks for calling in. tell us about where you live? i live close to lima. your last caller, i went to the museum. this trailer goes in -- polls in. read oak ridge national laboratory on it. -- it had oak ridge national laboratory's on it. bringingad a plan for ohio and appalachia into the 21st century. it is going to happen. -- heginal comment was

effort to not lose support so bad in this country. i did not see that this time. i don't know what the strategy was behind it. you did not see that kind of outreach coming from democrats? caller: there were no hillary officers. obama had his own office. host: donald trump, what was the outreach like? attention.paid ice to work in a factory. -- i used to work in a factory. he paid attention. year 20 make $52,000 a years ago. now people are making $14.95 with no benefits. host: in case you're joining us,

rural voters, we are interested in hearing from. you may have heard the last three. you can talk about the election and tell us how your town went and why. janet in sandy, oregon. go ahead. caller: i don't know if anyone ever noticed this, or would be concerned, but on another donald last night, i saw trump and mitt romney having dinner. like a wine glass with wine in it by their place setting and donald trump says he does not drink. i wondered if anybody else noticed that, those wineglasses?

host: i don't know if that is wine or water. there's a picture we are shown you -- we are showing you. one would assume the secretary of state position that is yet to be filled. who did your town go for generally when it came to the two candidates? well, i talked to a lot of the residents here. i live in a retirement home. residentso a lot of that said they did not like either candidate. tell.t i never heard it announced how our little city went. host: how did you vote? caller: i voted for mr. trump. host: what convinced you to vote for him over someone else?

caller: i thought that since he is a businessman, he might be the one that could do something about our national debt. that was the only thing that really attracted me to him, because i did not care for either mr. trump or hillary clinton. host: that is janice in sandy, oregon. a series of recent tweets this morning considering the future if you go to donald's twitter page, it highlights that he is going to make an announcement that withew york city his children on december 15 to discuss the fact he is leaving the business that he is in to focus on running the country in order to make america great again, he said. while i am not mandated to do this

again that is a series of tweets from donald trump. in northto jack carolina. good morning. tell us about where you live. caller: good morning and thanks for c-span. rural north carolina provides a lot of farming, peanuts, cotton, tobacco, but there is a bigger thing that they use from charlotte, larger cities. they send in tax assessors. this is rural north carolina, not charlotte. --t is part of hopefully you're on a fixed income and you are disabled.

hopefully trump is going to do something for us. monthtump and dollars a -- $1450 a month is tough. host: did you move there? tell us about your history. caller: i moved here but i was on the outskirts of charlotte. i watched it grow. it is a monster now. older. like my wife says, the more we go back, the less i like the traffic and the hustle and bustle. when you are forced into early retirement being disabled and on a fixed income, that 1004 to $50 a month put a hurting on you -- -- taxes, when0

you are disabled, that fixed income does not move. the inflation is like pac-man draining the swamp. he needs to kill the pac-man. [laughter] it eats money. host: pennsylvania is where ellen lives. thanks for calling. tells about where you live. mansfieldlive outside , a small town about 5000 people. i am not from around here. i am from an urban area, and urban area,cago -- indiana and chicago. i observed the politics of the area for a long time. host: give us a sense of those politics. caller: it is a primarily republican area. it is like indiana where i came from, even though it was urban, it was quite republican. very conservative.

people who will vote for a republican whether they like the person or not. i think a lot of people are not theironald trump, that sense was he was a republican so they voted for him. -- if you wanted to tell us who you voted for and why? caller: i voted for hillary clinton. i think she was much more experienced. she has the background to be president. i liked her policies better. she talked some about the needs of rural areas. i don't know how much that came out on a national level. in the literature about her positions in our area, there were comments about the needs for improved educational thattunities and jobs, so the young people would not have to leave the area.

, allvement of medical care of those are problems in the rural areas. because they are such a low tax base, the areas themselves do not have a whole lot of money to spend on things like education, mental health initiatives. area such a low tax base that the kind of things trump is talking about in terms of tax credits for medical savings, it doesn't make much sense in an area where people don't make enough money to pay taxes and therefore do not get tax credit. i am not sure how much thought has gone into that. i think because the tax base is so low, education in rural areas, medical care is always going to be less than it needs to be.

mansfield cannot improve its schools on the basis of the taxpayers, because the tax base is too small. i think the federal government needs to pay more attention to the needs of rural areas in those terms. .ost: mansfield, pennsylvania thanks for the assessment of your town and the message to washington. that is what we are asking. here are some thoughts on twitter. a viewer who identifies himself as orange fidel castro says -- dan in new york. good morning. what is the message to

washington? caller: i know you are asking about how we vote out here in our area. my address is lansing. it is a very liberal area. we are so close to cornell university. if you go out farther north, out in the country, where it is really the sticks. i saw a lot of trump signs out there. the biggest message, we had our assessment raised here in lexington. i said -- raised here in lansing . i said why did my assessment go up. i do not sell any property. they said because your neighbors have sold or bought property which raised your assessment and made improvements. i said, if i go out and rob a bank, should all my neighbors go to prison with me? they kind of laughed about that.

why should people be punished because land is sold and it is more valuable? it is about how i feel. host: as far as political parties, how do you think the outreach is to rural areas where you live? caller: it is fair, but they do forget some of the people that struggle in this area. farmers, theyairy seem to favor more than than the small family farms. they've got all sorts of grant money for them. they've got grant writers working for them to look for --ey, because they had a because we had a drop in our area. . found out about this help some of the farmers said i never heard anything about it. i want all across the

countryside telling people about this so they could help themselves. a lot of them are suffering with low milk prices. beef prices are pretty low. everybody is having a tough time. host: thank you very much for calling us. he lives in a rural part of new york, giving thoughts on his message to washington. you can do the same from where you live. for those of you on the line, stay for a few minutes. today, house and democratic caucus holds leadership elections. here to give us a sense of what might happen is mike lillis. he is a reporter for the hill. tell us about nancy pelosi. what is the likelihood that she will retain her position? guest: it is very likely she will retain her position.

she has been there for 14 years. tactician.ster she is a wonderful fundraiser, almost unmatched on capitol hill . she has all of these things going for her. when you are seen with this challenge, there is a lot of unrest that has bubbled up, not only after the most recent election and the trump victory, but this goes back a number of years. they lost the speaker's gavel in 20 team -- in 2010. there was a challenge then. every election cycle that they have failed to win back the minority since then, has been this grumbling. it has been behind close doors -- closed doors because no one wants to challenge lucy's authority. -- challenge pelosi's authority.

there was nobody else who would step up and line and can do all of the things she can do. for all of those reasons, we have heard some grumblings but it has always been off the record. this time with trump's victory, with a disappointment, it was different. tim ryan of ohio said enough is enough. somebody has to challenge her. we have to try and broaden the democratic base. that is what we are facing today. the meeting is at 9:00. host: what kind of support is tim ryan getting? little.ublicly, very there are 12 lawmakers that came out publicly that said they would vote for tim ryan. three different groups of people. one is the conservative leaning democrats. jim cooper of tennessee.

if you look at the speaker votes over the years, they never voted for pelosi. i come from conservative districts where pelosi is radioactive. they disagree with some of her fiscal policies. there is a handful of them. there are regional concerns, and a couple of ohio democrats have come out in support of tim ryan, just because he is a local boy. of themer head congressional black caucus supports tim ryan. the final group and this is the group that scares pelosi the most. there are a lot of younger democrats who have arrived recently on capitol hill. they are eager and anxious. they are hard-working. they are ambitious. they want to climb the leadership ladder. they have not been in to do so, because -- pelosi's employer is

jim clyburn. pelosi has been there 14 years. there is nowhere for these people to go. the agitation among them has been growing. it grows with each cycle as newer members come in. tim ryan is representing them. that is the third group. the question is how big is that group? nobody knows the answer. it is a secret ballot. you can vote anonymously. favoroes in tim ryan's because you don't have to come out publicly. you can go behind closed doors. that number is expected to rise well above 12. seconds.have about 30 if nancy pelosi wins, has he made any structural changes to help appease this uncertainty amongst immigrants? -- amongst democrats?

guest: she has proposed structural changes. ist they are trying to do empower these younger democrats. proposing to reserve some of these new posts, carve out new leadership and reserve them for younger members. one example, jim clyburn is the third ranking democrat. right now his post is appointed. she will grandfather him in. once he is gone, she proposes the next person who will fill that spot has to have been there for three terms are less. -- three terms or less. that will be appointed, not elected. mike lillis telling us about the house them accredit leadership -- house democratic leadership elections. mike, thank you.

calls. your if you want to send a call to washington -- this is need for. neva.s is a -- i'm in a small town. we are 40% hispanic. we are being railroaded and having to build more schools. schools.uilt three new we need to more schools -- two more schools. we are seniors. we don't have the capability to all and work. i worked in the rv industry for 30 years. .inus zero degree weather we have been told health -- how wonderful these schools would be. our teachers are not doing a good job. we are in an area where it is

mostly farming. people in salem do not listen to us. oregon --nd eugene eugene, oregon, have the majority vote. after driving 30 miles going to washington to go into a jcpenney. nobody is listening to us and we have had it. i have been to one meeting to get away from the big city because they don't listen to us. we have had it. the reason trump did so good is because the democratic party is not listening to the people. i hope they do put losey in desperate pelosi in. -- put pelosi in. they put all their money on jeb bush and jeb bush is another bush. i worked for the bushes to get elected. i worked for mccain to get

elected. i'm now telling myself i am not even a republican. you don't work for me. we have lost our insurance. after scrambled to get insurance -- to get insurance. there is not enough money. i have a daughter who's husband has excellent insurance. their insurance is so bad. are over $3000 out-of-pocket for surgery on her eyes. over $3000 out-of-pocket for surgery on her eyes. they have forgotten the people. they're looking at more money. host: thank you so much forgiveness to call. alabama, hi there. what is the closest city to where you live? caller: probably tuscaloosa. host: tell us about the

political makeup of your town. caller: i live in a very small town center in west alabama. -- centered in west alabama. the population is around 500. theoutlook here in terms of vote in the presidential election, it went along the party lines. the democrats went to the corner and the republicans went to their corner. mr. trump probably did when the the independent vote here. host: did you vote for donald trump? caller: no i did not. host: as far as outreach, who did better where you live? state, this is a republican state.

it just depends on the county. we have some counties that would be favorable for mrs. clinton. there were others who work for mr. trump. host: appreciate the call. rural voters, we want to get your thoughts to washington. we've heard from several. you can be a part of that. the wall street journal highlights the selection of stephen mceachin as treasury in astary -- stephen mnuch treasury secretary. that is an the wall street journal. the washington post highlights

donald trump's election as the desire the story goes on to say that indiana generally scores low and most measures of public health. in 2006, farmer began work on the next -- verma began work on

the program. more on that profile of her in the washington post. the wall street journal takes a be donaldlbur ross to trump's pick to be the head of the commerce secretary. talks about his wealth and how he made it.

patricia from colorado. you are on the line. good morning. caller: thank you for c-span. i'm calling -- i don't know what is going on. i am an old lady. i have been here a long time in seen a lot. i have never seen nothing like this. this man have it showed his taxes. he is putting all the fox people in the government. what are you thinking about? he is getting ready to turn our social security and medicaid into a pouch. -- into a vouch. let's think about this.

i know things are pretty bad but we should of done before we put this man into the white house was to think about, take a deep breath, and think about what is going on? people, wake up and make this man show his income tax so we can get him out of this place before he has fox running. host: tell us about colorado. what city is it close to? what is the environment when it comes to the economy? everybody here is in service. airports, army, air force base. they are doing good as far as that, because they want our kids in the service. the business overseas is going pretty good. i have to thank the lord for my son in a position where he does

not have to go overseas. i am half white and i know i wasn't stupid enough to vote for no-trump. trump is a businessman which means he is a con man. you put his wife and their. -- wife in their who is a stripper. host: eddie, good morning. we are in western county. -- worchester county. it is one of those ghetto cities. politicians get elected when they said that's when they say they have low income housing. there are no mills anymore. they turned all the mills into senior citizens. low and behold, what they are doing now, building a large amount of low income housing.

they are going to have a methadone clinic. they are going to ruin our town, the government with their waste. host: the message to washington would be what? caller: don't waste our money. why bring the trash from ghettos to military. -- two mill barry. i am sorry i feel that way but it is true. i left new york city because of that. i could not raise my children there. it is happening here. from st.id is up next bernard parish in louisiana. what is the message to washington you elect to send? washington you would like to send? the prices of han solo from the import trip gas prices

have went solo from the import shrimp, the people can barely make it. affordable health care act in the beginning. the prices went up 100% and 150%. down here we live on $25,000 a year. that is a lot of money for us. we keep hearing about this middle-class, $80,000. we don't have that here. we are fishermen. it doesn't seem like many people live on the land anymore. it is all a big city and big business. people have got to learn this is what made america. this is what we are. they have forgotten this. host: michael is up next. conway, massachusetts. caller: good morning. thank you for giving the democrats voices.

problems these callers talk about our problems that we see here in massachusetts. the property is going up because people who are making money are buying up properties and that is their right. , the attitudee that the problem is not that -- the industrial added -- industrialist attitude is that american workers make too much. they are going to come back in, because american workers will now take any kind of job. -- i have worked in factories to get myself through school and come out.

i worked in dry cleaning and other factories. i have worked in social work. one of the few jobs that are available. together.p it people scrape together to try and help other people. i teach school as an adjunct contract worker. give workingis to kids there one shot into the american economy. it is tough. i work with students trying really hard. i know the jobs are few. my message to the government is -- [indiscernible] government was the last shot of the american worker.

express our voices and now that has been busted up. host: appreciate the call. tom price, the republican presented out of georgia. donald trump because the head of the health and human services department. he appears today in washington talking about a lot of things. i suspect this newly offered job from donald trump. he will be at the brookings institution this afternoon, 3:00 is where you can see him. c-span3.iew that on also go to c-span.org for more information and listen to it on our c-span radio app. steve from indiana. you are next up. hello. caller: hello. i want to talk to the federal government and people of the united states. the people need to look up the

federal reserve act. they need to look at why our money is becoming worthless. they are fighting deflation. they are asking for inflation. it is a hidden tax to take our money. the constitution provides for gold and silver to be the american -- to be the money and limited government because the government is completely out of control. the reason for bringing all of these people and is to bolster the promises made in the past, so that they can rescue the economy by having more taxpayers. the other thing is, my message to the federal government is to go back to the rule of law. you cannot continue to break the law and expect the people to abide by the law with the crony capitalists banana republic we

are currently into. it is common sense. it is about the money. stand up on the federal reserve so you educate yourself about the money and the reason for the deflation, the inflation and the hyperinflation. .ost: that is steve farewell ceremonies in cuba in light of the death of adele castro. -- the death of fidel castro. a story in the washington post says --

there was a farewell ceremony that took place in cuba. washington post highlights the activities also adding that president resident -- told the crowd that castro would live on in all of them one more call. this is james in pennsylvania. go ahead and tell us about where you live. caller: i live in a rural area in pennsylvania, the poconos. i have lived here for 53 years. we moved here from queens, new york. it was a farm community. now there is no farms. a lot of people coming in from new york, new jersey and philadelphia. my statement to washington and i am kind of annoyed. it seems like it is business as

usual, particularly with the case of romney being secretary of state. i hope it works out. i hope the country doesn't turn around. i hope some sticks to his word. -- i hope the country does turn around. i hope some six to his word. host: who would you like to see in the position? caller: romp -- not romney. --ill see general betray us petraeus even though he does have some skeletons in his closet. i see so much stuff. i am a retired state employee and they are attacking me. they are trying to change my benefit package. i took social security at an early age because i need it. it just seems like anytime the congress and senate and the president, they do stuff, it

doesn't -- it isn't good for the general good of the whole nation. i hope trump does not go back on his word. is he going to build the wall? let's hope so. let's control the illegal aliens coming to this country. the defense department needs to work with that. host: james, thank you very much. we are out of time. we have to guess joining us -- us.ave two guests joining eric swalwell, his view of the .pcoming trump administration it will take a look at the foreign-policy challenges that face the team. chris stewart of utah. washington journal continues after this. ♪

>> every weekend, tv brings you 48 hours of nonfiction books and authors. he was a look at some of our programs. on saturday night at 8:45, m.i.t. in media professor, author of open to debate. look for how mr. buckley used his television program, firing line, to open arguments outside of his conservative circles. wicks as our level -- >> as our level -- it seemed like an important time to be talking about a show that really valued civil discourse between people who disagreed. >> sunday on in depth, the 75th anniversary on the attack of pearl harbor featuring three

authors. we'll be taking your questions live from noon to 3:00 p.m. eastern. at 9:00 p.m. eastern on afterwards, george mitchell. he looks at the israeli-palestinian conflict in his book, a path to peace. interviewed by the president and ceo of the woodrow wilson center. >> palestinian authorities have long since renounced violence and accepted israel's existence and have opted for peaceful negotiations to achieve a state. expletive book tv.org for the complete schedule. -- >> go to book tv.org for the complete schedule. >> i decided to spend more time on the grant. i spent a week at west point

trying to understand how this man could finish 21st out of 39 at west point. sometimes viewed by these biographers as a historical intellectual lightweight and yet he said of himself, i must apologize, i spent all of my time reading novels. >> sunday night onto a day, ronald c white talks about the life and career of the 18th u.s. book,ent in his latest american ulysses. >> in his presidency, he convened a meeting of african american leaders and he said, i look forward to the day when you can write on a railroad car, when you can eat in a restaurant alongside every other person regardless of their race. that they must come. it took 90 years for that day. grant was the last american president to hold those kind of views.

easterny night at 8:00 on c-span's q and a. >> washington journal continues. host: our first guest is eric swalwell. matter --as a writing member for the committee. he serves as the vice chair. good morning. guest: thanks for having me on. host: what are you expecting among the democratic leadership elections? guest: earn the trust of colleagues. they will lead us into the fight ahead. there is a lot to fight for. progress has been made over the last 10 years for the affordable care act, climate change, standing up for wall street reforms. we are going to have to defend those in shape a vision for the future. -- defend those and shape a vision for the future. host: we saw this election

delayed. reports of concerns among democrats about the future of the party. do you think those are founded? over the last few weeks, our caucus has taken some time to talk about what we need to do to go forward. opening up more positions to more members, make sure that more hands that can help shape. that was productive. leader pelosi is a terrific listener. my experience is i came to congress in my early 30's. i was the first in my family to go to college. i had about $100,000 in student debt pizza came to me and said i and you to take your story find other members and start a group. listen to other people like you and stand up for them with legislation that addresses college affordability. she has given similar opportunities to younger leaders in the house. host: she said she was confident

about a large gain for large desk for house democrats. what happened? guest: we picked up 60. if you look at the last 14 elections, only one time did the top of the tickets already in seatsss lost and got more than nancy pelosi did. that was in 1992. , thet every other time party whose candidate loses also loses seats in congress. she defied recent history. host: as far as going forward, should she win? how do you change what happened last time from happening again? guest: all of us come together in shape the message we don't have a president in the white house anymore. it is going to be a very different posture. what we should do is use that as an opportunity. we can really defined what is next. policy and those with her, we

will be the guest pelosi and those with her -- pelosi and those with her, we will be the voice. a third term member, matt cartwright will also be a third term member. host: if you want to talk to our guest, you can do so. our previous segment, we talked about rural voters and the reach. we saw that play out in the election. do you think democrats need to do a better job? guest: we need to listen and stand up for those voters. i was born and raised in iowa. -- you drive through some of those role american heart land. companies continue to leave. folks are wondering what is next

? what is the future going to mean? democrats have an opportunity to not falsely promised like donald trump that old jobs are going to come back, but that we should invest in america's workforce and make sure the new jobs are going to all parts of america. that donaldyou say trump did a good job in -- especially in light of what happened in indiana with the carrier negotiations. guest: donald trump is good at creating the strawman. he has shown himself to be able to take credit for things he has had nothing to do with. invest in the future economy. that is going to mean that workers in every part of our country are going to prepare for. host: the announcement of recent

mnuchin, wilbur ross. what do you think of those selections overall? guest: it tells me that donald trump is somebody who operates with little to no core set of principles. he told the country during his campaign that he was going to "drain the swamp." what does he do? putting together his transition , he is refilling it with recycled water. cabinet are people who have served in washington before. we will see how long he can get away with saying one thing and doing another. now, he is going to be under a much hotter lamp. our guest, eric swalwell of california here to talk about, not only leadership concerns that the incoming trump

administration. mary is where we will start. houston, texas. democrats line. go ahead. caller: listen, for the congressman, you all should realize that hillary got the popular vote. donald trump only was elected by the electoral vote. you all have a mandate to stand up and support bills that are good for the country. those that are not, stand strong. show the weakness. that is what the republicans did with president obama. you all should do the same thing. you all have a mandate. guest: you are absolutely right. donald trump got fewer votes than what -- that mitt romney did.

actually, i don't think we need to beat ourselves up to much as democrats. when you look at ohio, michigan, pennsylvania and wisconsin, those four states were pivotal. it was about 100,000 voters between michigan, pennsylvania and wisconsin that made the difference. we need to understand the needs of those voters and make sure we are standing up for working-class folks in all parts of the country. i agree with you. that doesn't mean we rollover and on -- and are on our heels. host: republican line, livingston, alabama. caller: a couple of comments i like to make. one is regarding the previous caller, regarding the electoral system and how the democrats should hold to whatever their mandate is, i think that is why -- that is why the republicans are in there now. i used to be a democrat and now

i have turned republican. the democrat leadership is beyond the gauge -- beyond the age of 70. that is a shame. they continue to go down the path of not bringing in more younger people and giving up that power and leadership. the last comment i would like to make is highly represented by the states of california, new york, massachusetts, more majority, large estates that seem to be represented desk larger states that seem to be represented. i think you are about controlling. she will not give it up for that very reason. thank you. the: when you look at leadership of our caucus, we are majority, majority -- majority-minority caucus. and majority of our members are ethnic minorities or women. i'm very proud that is what our caucus looks like. when you look at leadership, james clyburn was the number

three on our team from south carolina. we are geographically diverse, as well as our leader is from me, i take umbrage to anyone that says our leadership is too old. i am 36 and i was just nominated to be the youngest person in leadership and also the youngest theon who would hold position of steering cochair policy. i see opportunities being given to young people and the future is bright, not just for what i been given the opportunity to do , but many other hands who will be on deck in the fights ahead. of a what do you think challenged him is posing against nancy pelosi? guest: i think nancy pelosi will come out of it stronger. she has gone out and asked for every vote. hopinghe is sincere in

to bring new energy to our caucus and after the vote occurs that he stays engaged. host: i want to play you a little bit of the argument that he is making to be in the position. i think there's an appetite for change within our caucus, people are saying, maybe if there is a third of the voters in our caucus, it is probably the third in the closest elections of anybody in our entire caucus. i think that says something. the question is, how bad does it have to get? we lost 68 sits since 2010, the the lowestrity -- number in our caucus since 1929. the question is how bad does it have to get before we recognize there needs to be a change? there are a lot of working-class people in congressional districts like mine that are brown, gay,,

straight, and they need economic opportunity. made minority leader, what kind of changes would you bring that she does not have on the table right now? >> we talk about minimum wage, but people don't want a minimum wage job. i am for increasing the minimum wage, but people want a middle-class job, have a solid pension, be in the to go on vacation, and also have the work-life balance where they are not working 80 hours a week to make ends meet. we are not tapping into the talent we have in our caucus, people feel bottlenecked. and we need to raise the profile of these young democrats and give them a platform to be rock stars in our party. host: representatives while well, what do you think? guest: we picked up six seats, despite a top of the ticket losing. well,presentative swal

what do you think? guest: you don't blame the person who won seats despite the top of the ticket losing. we need to make sure we are more agile going forward, that we have more energy behind the leader but i don't accept the argument that the top of the ticket lost and our message was off point. i also want to say, our message as house democrats throughout the 2016 campaign was a stronger america, one that would secure our economy, our democracy, and our country, and that was a line with the clinton campaign. we did well with that message in light of losing at the top of the ticket. let's hear from caroline in troy, missouri. on our line for democrats. caller: good morning, how are

you? host: good morning. how are you? caller: i am blessed. i am calling because of the washington problem, because of how they handle the housing mortgage. .his has not went away it is still going on. people are losing their land, their homes through fraudulent mortgages. i did not understand how eric holder took it and gave it to the lawyers to unravel. these people are still hurting, i am hurting. i was hit with a foreclosure, never missed my mortgage, and i was hit with a foreclosure unexpectedly, and my property sold, and i'm still living here. guest: i'm sorry to hear you are

going through that now. that is why i think it's critically important in the new administration that we protect the dodd frank wall street reforms put in place after the 2008 economic collapse that was caused by recklessness on wall street. loans that were made that never should have been backed. i also think it's important to keep the consumer financial protection bureau, created by president obama, which has gone after banks, like wells fargo recently. fpb was be was able -- c after ito after them was found that they were creating fake accounts. if we rolled back those protections, it is people like you, my friends and family in areeast bay area, who affected. that is why we will have to stand up and defend all the work

we did to make sure that we don't go backwards from 2008 and that we protect all americans. host: steve from ridgeway, pennsylvania. republican line. caller: good morning. i live in very rural pennsylvania, overwhelmingly democrat. overwhelmingly conservative of -- supportive of conservative measures and donald trump. trump over the top to be the clinton machine. my, to you is, you made the comment about the popular vote. the popular vote difference makes no difference. it is the electoral vote that gets the president elected. the difference could just be the state of california or new york. so essentially there is a great big country between new york and california, and i just wanted to

point that out. i like listening to your views, you seem like you have a very sound knowledge of what is going on, and i appreciate it. it's encouraging that you are such a young guy. i wish you all the luck. guest: thank you. as i said, as someone born in the middle of the country, my wife's family is from indiana, i will be there in a couple of weeks. i appreciate those concerns. i think house democrats have to go into every congressional district over the next two years and contrast our uplifting economic message with the false promises donald trump has made, and we need to earn every vote, not just on the coast. host: you mention the popular vote, electoral college. what do you think on this recount of select states? going intoll knew the 2016 election you had to win the electoral college.

i guess it is comforting that we won the popular vote, that it was not a complete shellacking, i guess you could say. if we want to be in the white house, we need to learn how to win those dates back, especially those that had not gone republican in decades, like wisconsin and michigan. the request by dr. stein and the clinton campaign for the recount is a constitutionally allowed request in those states. donald trump spent about a year saying the elections were going to be rigged. he saider he won, millions of people voted illegally. if he also has an interest in making sure the elections are credible, he should welcome the recount. host: glendale, arizona. independent line. matt, good morning. that, itpeaking about was reported that there were 18

million illegal votes. do you think it should go back to just a piece of paper, you go in and vote on a piece of paper, you show your id. i think these electronic machines are just hogwash. guest: there is no evidence there were 18 million or even 18 illegal votes in this election. for donald trump to say that, again, it shows a pattern of willing deception. that should concern americans, and i think it will catch up with him. it may have served him well as candidate trump, but as president of the greatest country in this world, i think it will catch up to you. a leopard never changes its spots. i think we are in for some interesting times ahead but it is really incumbent on members of congress to hold him accountable. i plan on being a part of the heat that is put on donald trump

as he continues to tell these outrageous lies. host: so when it comes to his efforts he wants to make on infrastructure, that is not something you would align yourself with? guest: all of us want to see our bridges and tunnels and rapid transit and high-speed rail improve. right now sound like corporate giveaways, dramatically reduce the tax code for the biggest companies in this country. i think the way you do it is investing federal dollars into these projects, increasing the fuel tax to make sure we have enough money. we have not done that in over 20 years. right now, most cities and counties are left on their own. if you want to think big, invest the way that eisenhower did with the highway system. he did not give a lower tax code to all the companies that were going to benefit from it.

he took american taxpayer dollars and said you are trusting me with your taxpayer dollars, i will make america move around in a more efficient way by investing in our bridges and tunnels. host: have there been discussions amongst the democratic leadership about what possible changes could happen to the affordable care act and how democrats would respond? guest: we know that donald trump campaigned on repealing the affordable care act. he has not talked about what he would replace it with. after talking with president obama, he said he would like to keep all the popular parts. here is why it is so dangerous to have somebody so unprepared to be president. all of these pieces work together. you cannot say i'm going to keep the pre-existing conditions part because i know that is popular, and it actually helps people, but i will get rid of the mandate part. the reason the pre-existing conditions part works is because everyone is required to get health care. when you have more people in the

system, you allow insurers to take on more risk for people with pre-existing conditions. he will find out relatively quick being candidate trump is a lot different than the person actually in charge. host: what is your thoughts on the strategy being worked on by democrats? guest: the affordable care act has given millions of people insurance which had never had it before. we have seen governors who have received money under the affordable care act take care of their medicaid population. they are starting to think twice about whether they want to give back this money. , on its ownhink success, it will be able to put the pressure on donald trump. like most of the positions he has taken, i suspect he will tiptoe backwards. even on the announcement of the premium hikes, the number of young people enrolling, you think that is a selling point? guest: i hope that he tiptoes

backwards to a point where we can work to improve the affordable care act. if there has been any travesty over the last six years, it has been that many republicans, most republicans did not want to do anything other than repeal it. many of the reforms that could have brought more competition into the marketplace to keep the premiums lower were never given a chance because republicans only offered review or nothing. -- repeal or nothing. now i hope we can have a sensible conversation. i believe reforms are needed. medicalto reform the device tax because i knew it was hurting jobs. i am open-minded. but if you are just going to repeal it without any alternative, that is a nonstarter. host: our guest serves on the select intelligence committee, also the science, faith, and technology committee. clean, texas, on the democrat line. i don't know if you are

hearing me or not. i have the volume down. ok. wanted to tell you, nancy pelosi really has to go. when we voted obama in in 2008, we wanted universal health care. we had power back then. she could not even bring the democrats to agree with the single player system. the other thing is, i'm constantly listening to political people and none of them have said, in order to fix obamacare, you have to go after , theealth care systems insurance companies, pharmaceuticals. i have not heard any of this. in 2008, when we had the power, the democrats forgot about the democrat to voted them in. they were just worried about the tea party and all of the

screaming they did. guest: appreciate the concerns. actually, the tea party came about after the affordable care act that was passed, that was really when they became powerful. i was not in congress at the time but i do remember that fight. working with president obama and harry reid in the senate, stitched together a coalition that got the best health care reform that the country has seen since medicare, and she did it having a diverse incus that was being pulled many different directions. the affordable care act, i think , was the consensus idea of the caucus. i believe it should be open to reform today but i think that was one of her greatest feats, not a weakness, and how she brought members together for the affordable care act. many members paid a price.

over a few dozen lost their seats in the next election because of the courageous vote to step forward for the affordable care act. host: independent line, harold, you are next. are so many red herrings out here i have to complain. hillary had 240 electoral college votes to start with. she just needed 30 more and could not do it. the popular vote, this is crazy. california has 40 million people in it. the lower 27 states have 39 million in it. there is a reason for that. trump only campaigned in 15 states. if he had campaigned in all of them, the popular vote would have been absolutely crazy. he deflects everything you ask him. it has got to quit. this falsehood has got to quit.

destroyed two dynasties, the bush and clinton dynasty. he owes nobody nothing. let's give him a chance. guest: the fact that hillary clinton won the popular vote and that more people voted for congressional democrats than republicans says to me that there is no overwhelming mandate for president trump and that he should see that as a reason to congress,democrats in not as a reason to try to plow through them, believing that he was sent here with a tremendous win. he won the electoral college, he will be the next president, work with him where we can, but i will firmly defend the progress we have made because i don't believe he was sent here with a real landslide mandate. host: sault ste. marie, michigan. democrat line.

you seem like you are doing a pretty good job in california, you got a lot of us this past election, but the rest of the country, not so good. if you look to the message of bernie sanders, what he stood for, what he voted for, what he far as our study move toward oligarchy, the top 1% having more wealth than the rest of us put together just about, corporations controlling the government, income and wealth inequality, that is the driving force in the boat -- vote this election. i will let you take it from there. guest: what is ahead for house democrats is going to be a priority of going to every state in this country and making sure

that every person has the freedom to dream. meaning, where you live does not define where you can go. we have opportunities for save to to buy a home, send their kids to college or a trade school, and to be able to enjoy a secure retirement. suremeans we must make every community across the country is prepared for this new economy, and that means investing in transportation and infrastructure, and that means affordable college, no student loan debt for anyone going to a public university, and workforce retraining. there are still many people who have many years ahead and want to contribute to their community and family but are seeing jobs go away. we want to see that businesses for investing in their communities. host: our guest serves as the ranking member on the

intelligence committee. talk about the selection of mike pompeo. what does that say about the message donald trump is sending? mocon pompeo he and i went to iraq last easter. i do not agree with him on benghazi, but i do think he is a person of character. think we will need him to be a check against donald trump's desire to go back to our days of torture, something that john mccain said we cannot allow our country to do again. he will need to be a check, director pompeo against donald trump's full embrace of russia, a very dangerous adversary. i think donald trump has been co-opted by vladimir putin. he has been playing right into putin's hand, and that concerns me. russia is wreaking havoc in the

middle east. it support of the dictator assad in syria is killing and thousands of people. it is making it very hard for us to see stability in iraq, threatens our greatest ally israel, and of course, putin is responsible for bringing down an airliner over ukraine. threatenns in crimea stability in that region. for all those reasons, we need director pompeo to stand up where donald trump wants it takes us to places we had never been before. host: i wanted to ask you about this attack at ohio state university, isis now saying he was a soldier. do you believe that, what do you make of the claim? guest: god bless the officer who took that terrorist down. isis, when they say somebody is a soldier after the fact, that

usually means it was not a direct attack by isis. from what they have gathered from the attack, it is an attack that they endorsed or support. i am waiting to hear from the intelligence community whether this individual was on any watchlist, had been contacted by the fbi, had been in communication with isis. we certainly know that they have publicly said, if you cannot get your hands on a gun, use a knife , also using vehicles as weapons, as we saw in nice, is a to cause mass casualty. again, really thankful for that police officer being there. jacksonville,n florida. republican line. theer: regarding representative here, he is a typical democrat who is just

trying to oppose everything trump is trying to do. , anpport the earlier caller independent, who said trump destroyed the clinton and bush dynasty. that is a tremendous accomplishment. these are entrenched people that should be dislodged and allow the reality to reflect in our culture. in this case, with the terrorist guy at school, obama has .mported 50,000 somali why would we want to import people killing us? it doesn't make any sense.

then the democrats are crying tears over islamists. yourself terrorist or islamist, why can't we just say the thing? guest: people who believe in islam are not terrorists. when you say why can we work with donald trump, it is very hard to work with somebody who has people on his team who have proposed having a muslim registry, or who have compared the way that we need to address interninglam by faith,of faith, islamic just as we did with the japanese internment camps during world war ii. i reject that. that is not who america is doing but i think we need to get smarter about how we fight

terrorism. we need to make sure our fbi and local law-enforcement agents have the tools they need. trumpyou mentioned donald brought down the bush and clinton dynasty. this is not about a single person, this is not about the bushes, the clintons, certainly not about donald trump. it is about people like you, people like carolyn who called in, worried about what would happen with her home. who we elect matters in people's everyday lives. wants ave somebody who fair economy, who believes in equality for all people and opportunity for all people, we all end up doing better. host: texas is next, winston, democrat line. caller: good morning. i am jumping back to what you were talking about earlier with how the democrats have kind of lost the old working-class venues to be the bolster of the

democratic base. what i would like to talk about is long-term strategy, the republican party right wing has had a long-term strategy since 1970 with roger ailes controlling, conglomeration of media, controlling the message. the best thing for democrats to do is get on the ground here in rural america. the heartland is the entirety of america, not just the rust belt. , grew up in northeast texas steel town, and it no longer exists. it died under reagan. what i want to say is, back when i was a kid, people understood where democrats stood and where republicans stood. those lines have been blurred by roger ailes' plan to control the media, control the message. i am in wood county, texas. there is no democratic party.

the attorney general refused to fund -- i think it is supposed to be 2400 a year -- for local party activities. so the republicans get a headquarters because they are rich and the democrats don't have any representation in rural america. me as a kid, told 80% of life is showing up. that is a lesson i had taken away here. the clinton campaign did not go to wisconsin, for whatever reason. if you do not ask for someone's support, you risk them believing that you are taking them for granted. we need to go back to texas, every state in this country, and show working-class folks that we have an economic message that wants to work for everyone, not just those at the top, or those that would benefit from wall street reforms that would benefit the wealthiest 1%. host: another intel question,

political reporting donald trump has received a third intelligence briefing as president-elect, highlighting the fact that mike pence have received more briefings than donald trump. guest: i'm very concerned that donald trump has been skipping his intelligence briefings. the american people need a leader who goes through the presidential daily brief, on a daily basis. his is not something that you can just farm out to the vice president. we need a president who makes decisions to be ready. this just goes to somebody who does not really seem to be up to the job, not prepared for the job. that concerns me. we are going to see a candidate trump is a lot different than president trump. we will wait to see what is next, but for somebody that is

so worried about the classified briefings that secretary clinton was receiving, believing that she should not be receiving, he should show up for one and be prepared to do the job. host: our first guest this morning is eric swalwell, democrat from california. he serves on the democratic steering policy committee. coming up, we will hear from another member of the house intelligence committee, chris stewart, he will discuss national security issues, what he things about donald trump's picks for security positions. and then our spotlight on magazine segments. we look at the piece in new york magazine that deals with the topic of fake news. those topics are coming up as "washington journal" continues. >> sunday, on booktv, we are

hosting a discussion on the december 1941 attack on pearl harbor on the eve of the 75th anniversary. on the program, teeth to me, -- steve toomey. greg nelson and his book "pearl harbor, from infamy to greatness." we are taking your phone calls, tweets, and email questions live from noon until 3:00 eastern. for theoktv.org complete we can schedule. >> follow the tradition of government on c-span as donald trump becomes the 45th president of the united states and republicans maintain control of the u.s. house and senate. we will take you to key events as they happen without

interruption. watch live on c-span, on-demand on c-span.org, or listen free on our c-span radio app. >> we have a special webpage at c-span.org to help you follow the supreme court. go to c-span.org and select supreme court near the right-hand top of the page. once on the page, you will see four of the most recent oral arguments heard by the court this term, and click on the view all link to see all the oral arguments covered by c-span. in addition, you can find appearances by many of the import justices, or watch the justices in their own words, including one-on-one interviews severalast months with justices. there is a list of current justices with links to quickly see all of their appearances on c-span, as well as many other

supreme court videos available on demand. follow the supreme court at c-span.org. >> washington journal continues. next guest is chris stewart, the republican from utah, serves on the select intelligence committee. good morning. can we start by the selection donald trump has made so far with national security and intelligence and what you think of them? we heard from the previous guest about mike pompeo serving as the head of the cia. what kind of message does that send? and i served together on the intelligence committee and i agree, mike is an excellent choice. he is one of the smartest people i know. he graduated first in his class in west point, a business leader , but the work that he has done in congress has been exemplary. i was talking to him over the i will beying, dude, praying for you because it's an

enormous responsibility, but i think he's an outstanding choice. express any concerns about taking the job? guest: i think anybody would express concerns about taking on that kind of responsibility. if you have any sense of history, i don't know how you could not approach it with a bit of humility. i think that he did but i think he is also confident he has the background and the skills and the ability to be successful in that area. but if you talk about some of the concerns, it will not surprise you, nor any of our viewers this morning, there are enormous concerns right now. the cia is an interesting organization. they have a very diverse mission, maybe too diverse in ways because we may have scattered them in areas that are not areas of expertise. some of us believe they should be focused back on human intelligence, being the best

intelligence organization in the world. we have kind of diversified their responsibilities. interesting world we live in, but mike is a great choice for that. pompeoo you think mike would make it a goal to focus those efforts on the cia, especially when it comes to intelligence? speak towill let jim that, i will not sit here and tell you what the goals should be, but there is a bipartisan agreement, that is one of the things the cia should do. be more focused on their core competencies, the things that we have relied upon them in the past, the things that they are good at. mike flynn, being tapped as the national security advisor, is that a good move? guest: great move. i have met with general flynn, i think he brings the right attitude, the warrior attitude, if you will. he has the management experience. he has diverse national security experience. mcfarland as deputy

advisor? guest: she has been in this position for generations. she seems to be more willing to do the work in the background and not be as public as a figure, but the background that she has -- host: is a general policymaking or public affairs? some of the things i have read it is because of the more public affairs and the time she has spent on fox news commenting. guest: i think it is a little of both. you cannot be in that position without being able to speak to the public, advocate for the president's goals and objectives, especially when there is controversy about our national security and the best way forward, securing the national interest around the world. i did not mean that she was not good at that, but i was just indicating that she did not seem to be someone who creates the spotlight. that is good. you want to keep the focus on

the principles and the president and the president ideas. our guests stewart is talking about national intelligence and other matters. you have mentioned a couple different times about the interesting world we live in. a story about this ohio state university incident, isis saying the person involved was a soldier. do you believe this was a direct isis coordinated attack? we don't haveow, any information that would lead us to believe that he was in communications with isis. i don't think he was emailing or texting them saying i am going to do this on tuesday morning, what do you think? but they clearly influence it. you have to be wildly optimistic to not think that their influence and propaganda and philosophies that they have been putting out there for a long time were at least the genesis of this.

if you cannot get a bomb, use a car. if you cannot get a gun, use a knife, and do it in a public way , as public as you can, and kill as many as you can. thank heaven that the police officer was there and happen to be in the area. it is a difficult situation for law enforcement officers, to confront a situation where you have people's lives in danger. apparently, he responded appropriately in the case. we will learn more. it has got to be something where we look at it and say, isis' inf luence may have been felt here again in the u.s. host: what is the best way for the truck administration to respond? guest: it is a challenge. i'm not deferring the question, but it is. we have to give our national security experts credit in the sense that we have not had an

episode like 9/11 again. we have had others that are us, butconcerning for nothing on that scale. it's very difficult to monitor every person, keeping our eye on it. it is difficult if not impossible to keep an eye on all of them. there were no warning signs about this individual. it is a challenge, no doubt about it. the next president will have to confront it. said, and thisi is not new -- i've been saying it for a couple of years -- you have to be more willing to go to the root of the problem. we cannot have isis viewed as being successful, like they have been for two and half years. they built a caliphate. fight for us. we will establish this territory. we will be this power in the world. willing,d until we are

in a more aggressive and definitive manner, to counter isis and a narrative they have, then this will be a problem. i think we had to be willing to confront isis overseas, not just stopped their influence here in the united states. host: our guest is chris stewart, he serves on the republican intelligence committee. first call from tuscaloosa, alabama. democrat line. larry, go ahead. caller: good morning. sir, i like to ask you, know you probably would not, but if possible, could you get with your gop party and do away with this electoral college? it is a joke. we have people here that are suffering, people who are tired, who have been working overtime and getting less pay. we have people losing their jobs and houses and cars. when they go and vote for the

we have a look toward college members who are telling the public that they are not going to support these candidates. they even warned the states, they will not support them. it is a shame. some of them would even say i would take a fine instead of voting for hillary. i want to thank everyone who went out and voted. this battle is not over. i want everyone to stay focused. a couple ofings up points. it is not the first time we have had this conversation about the elect or college. in this sense, i think the founding fathers got it right. there was a purpose they establish the electoral college. our elections would be very different if it were not for the elect or college. let me use my own state of utah. we rarely have presidential candidates spend time in my state. and a lot of the rural states, that is true for them as well.

for the electoral college, they would not spend any time in the states. they would be in texas, massachusetts, california, and new york, and maybe a few others. you can nearly win the electoral college with four or five states. the founding fathers wanted to say that every state was important. look at those living in the rural communities, they need a voice as well. the second thing i would say, for those advocating this, it is nearly impossible to do. you would need a constitutional amendment, two thirds of the states would need to be involved in ratifying that, and the small states would not give up that power that they have, and they shouldn't. it is a bit of a distraction. i understand some people are frustrated that their candidate won the popular vote but not the electoral vote, but if that was the rules, and everyone knew that that was the rules, and had

it been done differently, then everybody else would have operated under those rules as well. i understand people's frustration. the last thing i would respond to, he talks about people suffering, they are not having jobs, they lost health care, the list is long. but that is not changed by the electoral college, that is changed at putting the right person in office. i think we have done that. let's give mr. trump a little time to implement some of his policies. he seems truly committed to helping those people that have been forgotten. let's give him sometime and see how he responds. host: were you always and donald trump supporter? rubio's was marco campaign chair, but when donald trump became the nominee, i said we need to get behind him, so here we are. host: did you say at one time,

he would be our mussolini? guest: yes, that was early on, when i was working for marco, and that was in jest. i think we have all said some things about the candidates that we are reminded of from time to time. host: call from pittsburgh, republican line. caller: representative stewart, thank you for your service. i wanted to ask you about the threat of isis. i'm calling from pittsburgh, pennsylvania, and they are not selling the -- assimilating. we have some somalis here and they are not assimilating. how come nobody is enforcing them -- they have to learn english and is similar to our values. if not, there is a disaster coming. you express a concern that many of us have, and that

is, in our history, the united states has done an extraordinary job of assimilating immigrants, new people and cultures. it was not done perfectly, obviously, you can look back at different people who came here, and it took time. but the expectation was that they would assimilate. we wanted them to and provided them tools to assimilate. that absolutely needs to be the ,ase and the path going forward regardless of where they come from. it is easierhat for some of these individuals to stay in neighborhoods and areas that are not quite as integrated as we may want to be. the language,eak that's obviously a barrier for them, their children, one of the things that is not only required but encouraged. this is more than that. i have been in some

neighborhoods where sharia law is sometimes preferred over our own laws. that is obviously not a sustainable model that is going to work. again, i think the united states has been a model for this, for nations around the world, for generations. i think we will continue to be. but we need to recognize that we need to encourage and provide the tools or they can assimilate, and provide expectation that they will. that doesn't mean they give of their religion. that doesn't mean they give up their culture and traditions important to them. but that they identify themselves as americans, as much as the rest of us do. oakton, virginia. democrats line. caller: my question for representative stewart is, do you feel other republicans are going to be able to act as a container?

some of the rhetoric that comes was donald trump -- i thinking this morning about the fact that we are sending troops into norway because of russia emboldenedow feels and there is some concern about what may even have into norway. the wilder rhetoric that came out during the campaign is not good for a president. what is going to happen to nato? we rely on nato. what will happen to western europe and what will happen to us when we need them to be with us? guest: it's a great point. the problems we have in europe, especially regarding nato, the seeds of that have gone back several years now. sitting on the intelligence committee, i had the opportunity to travel the world and meet with the world leaders and national security principles. the thing i hear again and again , and i have heard it for so long, is where is the united states? we don't know if we can rely on

you. in ways that we have in the past. i think that is the primary challenge from a national policy perspective, how we operate in the world, to reassure those allies that we will honor those commitments. i have never heard mr. trump say that he would not honor our nato can its. what he has asked is that they do contribute more to the national defense. i think that is a reasonable thing for us to ask them. very few of the nato countries are contributing the 2% of their gdp that they are supposed to. him him courage and then to do that, even prodding them in a more aggressive way, is an appropriate response to the situation we are facing. the caller talked about norway. states, evenltic poland, they are nervous, and understandable why they would be. nato is one of the key is to defending them, but nato will fail without the u.s. interest.

they need to contribute. i think this president will do that. host: there is a story this morning in politico about the president-elect getting a third intelligence briefing. what comes to mind when you hear about the number of briefings he has taken? guest: i don't know how that would be compared historically. i would have to go back to see how many mr. obama had at this point or other previous president elects. national security is important to him, he has indicated that. thanps a different policy this president has, more aggressive policy, but again, it doesn't necessarily trouble me. i don't know what would be the precedent or expectation. host: richmond, virginia. republican line. anthony, you are next. iller: i just wanted to say, am somebody who lost my health care plan under the affordable care act, my premiums doubled,

my deductible went from $500 to $5,000. it is imperative that we repeal this law in full. it is worth revoking the filibuster in the senate, if you could get with your fellow republicans and get them to do that. everything we can to repeal the law. it's been a complete disaster. i just want to urge you. i know you are already discussing that. years that webeen have been discussing that. i can tie you how many conversations i have had with people in my district or state of people just like that. i have lost my insurance. look how much i'm paying for insurance. people who used to work full-time who now work 29 hours a week because they were required to cut back on their hours. there are some things that we all want to do. by the way, these were republican ideas. keeping children on

people's health insurance until they were 26, i support that. i don't know anyone who does not support that. providing for those that have pre-existing conditions, helping them have insurance. that is one of the most frightening things people can face. if you have a health condition in your family that makes it impossible for you to get insurance. there is bipartisan agreement to help an extended a way forward for those folks. but we have paid a terrible price with obamacare. again, callers like this, which i have heard hundreds of times, and there is a better way to do it. we did not need to rip the heart out of what was the best insurance provider in the world, and do that through obamacare. we could have accomplish those goals without doing that. host: sandra is next in potomac, maryland. democrat line. caller: good morning. i have a general question having

to do with national security and the intelligence community, as well as the budget. people always mention that we need more cooperation, maybe from the fbi, intel community, partners, however, how would that affect the budget? are you going to recommend that maybe you increase the staffing within the intelligence community in order to be a ittle more aggressive when comes to protecting the national security of our country? ideas are good, but they are not cheap. that was just a question i had. guest: i guess the question as i understand it is should we be spending more on our intelligence or national security? when you look at the department of defense, the answer is yes in my mind.

sequester has been devastating for the department of defense. i am wearing my air force wings, my father was an air force pilot. when i was in the air force, we had 157 fighter squadrons. we have about 54 today. half of them are not, capable. in other words, they don't have the munitions, the parts, fuel, maintainers to go out to do what they are supposed to do, defend national security around the world. 157 down torkable, something in the 50's. i am certainly one that thecates saying that sequester and the things that we have imposed on our military has to be reversed. as to whether we are spending enough on the intelligence community, i'm not sure the same argument applies. there may be some tweaks we need to make them a but i don't think we need to broadly read up their budgets are, like we may be have

to do on the dod. host: our guest serves on the select intelligence committee, chris stewart of utah. spent 14 years as a pilot in the air force, holds three world speed records, including the fastest nonstop flight around the world. guest: 36 hours, 13 minutes. it was a lot of fun, more fun than being in congress. host: stacy in mclean, virginia. for yourhank you service, i appreciate everything you have done for our country. my question is as far as national security is concerned, gregg and bought 3 million -- brought -- ronald reagan brought 3 million iranians to this country and we also have people here in simulated that have committed terrorist attacks. lostia a couple years ago track of about 49 freedom fighters that they had trained and they are spread sporadically

across the u.s., and nobody is talking about that. my concern is that he saidt-elect trump -- himself that he did not trust our intelligence. my question is, who's intelligence is he trusting? it seems our foreign policy is similar to putin's foreign policy. the biggest concern that i have is having foreign countries interfere in our government and policies. onlyaid that russia not hacked hillary clinton and the dnc, but also our elections, and cyber attacks are an act of war, just as if it were land, air, or sea. what are you doing to protect the people as far as cyber attacks are concerned? the best hackers are in russia.

there is no question, ciber is an enormous challenge for us, and enormous threat. -- cyber is an enormous challenge for us, an enormous threat. china is not really attacking us but they are more stealing stuff, to the tune of billions per year. i don't think we have any evidence that russia was involved in hacking the elections this past fall, although other countries have been in the past. i was in moscow this summer. when i came home, i said, we should be concerned that this is something that they could potentially do. we don't have evidence they were involved in this. after elections, these kinds of conversations take lace. it is too bad that it is not unusual that people say there was a miscount, there was voter fraud. no questionhappens, about it, but i don't think we have direct evidence that russia was involved in hacking our

election results. i just don't think that's true. , cheryl,t guest olympia, washington republican line. i am a republican who voted for obama twice and i largely to trump because of the supreme court issue and immigration reforms. i was stunned to find out a paul ryan had been pushing immigration crazily, which i think has diluted the wage earning ability of the average american. i want to see paul ryan back trump's immigration proposals. guest: by and large i think he has. i know they have had different ideas over the years and i will let each of them address that, but perhaps they came at this from a different approach. right now, there is great unity in the republican party. we have a president-elect, we have the leader of our party.

that will require us to take some of the things that we thought was maybe a different way forward and maybe put some of those things aside and find those things that we agree on. speaker ride has done a masterful job of that. i know they communicate nearly every day, if not every day. the party has been united around these plans. i am just excited. i am surprisingly optimistic of the opportunities we have over the first 100 days, to actually fix some of these problems that have been languishing for a long time. one other thing the caller addressed which i think is so important, the supreme court justice. if mr. trump does nothing but nominate and get confirmed a justice in the mold of antonin scalia, my heavens, he is a successful resident, if for no other reason, because that is such a pivotal moment in our court, to have an original constitutional supreme court

nominee. that is one of the opportunities the president-elect will have in the first 100 days or so or shortly thereafter. host: do you sense there will be a change in spending, especially in light of mr. trump's ideas in terms of reducing taxes and spending on infrastructure? guest: i don't know what direction we will take on that. i know there is a latitude that will be given to him to give some ideas that may be another have done.ould hanot it would be nice if we could find areas where democrats would work with us as well. let's wait to see what he proposes. again, i'm optimistic. host: call, -- next phone call, maine. democrat line. caller: why can't they put term

limits on all the congress members in washington, d.c.? they are supposed to be public servants. a public servant is there to help the people. if they put term limits on them, they could only be there for, say, two years, and then they we need to get out of office. there would be no retirement and no benefits for them, because they could not afford that. the public servants, if they really wanted the job, they would do it without having all of these free benefits. guest: it's interesting you use the word public servant. coincidentally, i said that yesterday on the floor of the house. i am uncomfortable when people call me a public servant. i will tell you who the public servants are in our country,

those that are serving in the military. those are true public servants. i don't feel comfortable applying that description to me and others like me. it is not the same type of sacrifice. that to be able to send the states. i wish that would have happened, ut it didn't and although i support it, not everyone does. one other thing that is note, i see to something more than 60% of since s has been there 2010 or less. it actually has a pretty turnaround. i've been there for four years,

'm not an old guy, but it is interesting, a lot of people have been there less time than came in my class, that is a good thing. dynamic, a ifferent different interest. people that came in 2012, are like me, we don't there. to spend 20 years we'd like to do what we can to help and move on to other well., as host: north port, florida, republican line. hello, bob. stewart, i have a question with michael flynn, all you work with him at regarding certain people in the united states, for example, gulon, from pennsylvania. anything, didding isause michael flynn said he considered worse than osama bin laden. that, i put say "trump igns up that say

gulon," g for fatulah and i grew up in pennsylvania. doing any investigation or will you be doing anything regarding fatulah gulon? u.s. policy the will investigate anyone they believe is national security risk or risk to individuals in the united states and they are obviously doing that as they can.ly as it is a real challenge and some dvantages, like perhapses this ohio state attacker is someone that we just weren't aware of. is difficult to become aware of everyone, but if level is rising to the we think there is, they will be try to deal with that and i'm familiar, i'm a little bit familiar with this individual he mentioned and law enforcement do what they think is appropriate. host: alexander, virginia,

line, dan, go ahead, you're on. caller: good morning, question sir.you, the republican party has had six ears to craft and present a comprehensive plan for obamacare. think the issue not being address friday my standpoint and forward, how put does the republican party intend to keep cost down, it's been a obamacare as flawed as it has been, significant healthcare cost, how does the republican party plan to keep costs manageable for the average american? >> such a great point and good question. couple things worth addressing there. plan.publicans have a one frustration i have, i have people say, you will repeal it, you going to do? look, we've dpot a plan we've been talking about for a long is difficult to cut through the clutter and make american people aware of that. the es deal with one thing caller mentioned and that is we have to be able to control the

cost. of the i think keys, couple ways to do that, one, we allow health hasing of insurance across state lines. when i got out of the air force, state, had an insurance policy, we moved three the border to another state and that policy was no longer available to me. it was provided by a national carrier. you know, why can't we allow tou national level, rather than in your own state, it is a to bring cost down. look at tort reform. a doctor and i from his and other experiences that the defensive medicine and the way they are forced to ask for tests and procedures, not necessarily ecause it is in the patient's interest, they feel they have to to protect themselves from awsuit, no question that increase costs. drivinger got it right,

the cost down is important consideration, but the problem exactly acare tis done the opposite and we have an earlier caller who indicated experience.s people, by the way, i'm off obamacare. realize, people don't as a member of congress, vito be on obamacare. premiums and u my deductible. you will say, that is an expensive plan and you don't get much benefit for it. that is what far too many people eel like that are forced into the option. about, amongst other things, donald trump's incoming administration, national to rity challenges, i want throw the recent tweet about donald trump about flag burning. what do you think about the does it suggest about how donald trump uses twitter? engaged in more twitter than other candidates have been in the past. was asked about this yesterday, i hospital heard the tweet yet. f course i'm familiar with it

nobody. the reality of the supreme court ruleod that, including justices, justice scalia is a model we should try to follow. a case of expression of free speech. but the thing about mr. trump, expressing a view many feel, i don't believe we should we someone, but i believe should honor the flag. i believe we should hold it in me regard and it troubles when some people don't. for those who served in our and the sacrifice many of them have provided and the and fice to their families i know how it hurts them to see people desecrate the flag the do, although i don't think we should jail someone for doing that, we should encourage of behavior and discourage that type of expression. front people who sacrificed so much for our it is painful to see that in some cases. this, do tweets like

distraction for the incoming administration, do you think it helps as they try to build a ready to take office for next year? guest: i don't know if it is changes the it conversation in some ways, he's expressing views a lot of and some feel americans go, i honor the flag, i'm glad he's willing to stand flag n. that case, i appreciate what he's trying to say. ost: lee in salt lake city, utah, democrats line. caller: hello. host: you're on. okay.: yeah. i'm really concerned about other eople coming from other countries and the deal, fighting for our country, the thing i'm they have gay , ties, mafia ties, might have terror ties. wonder if trump administration will do something about that, something to know. thank you. you.t: thank lee, that is a common concern many of us have. he year and a half ago, i came out and said, we should be very

allowing people from certain parts of the world into our country, pause we can't vet them. religion they at represent, what ethnicity they are, i simply care, do we know are?they when we allow immigrants from some parts of the world, for have no idea , we who the individuals are, can't go back and check background, their social, see what they do for a living, see their members, because isis doesn't just forge documents, the official government trade documents. president has indicated willingness to be more situations.those again, it's not just coming from that part of the world, the caller indicated, we have some gang ties from foreign and others,erprises just something we need to look at broadly. information, the intelligence community, is there a better job sharing information

to detect who might be in this country of concern, ommunications with other countries, especially countries you are most concerned about. guest: no question about that. gotten better over the last year or year and a half with european partners, because honestly weren't doing a good job of vetting and knowing who was in their country. was allowed into the european union, they could travel to the united states and tried to problem we've address in a couple different ways. ut i think the partnership has been strengthened over the last year or year and a half, we have go, something to we need to keep working out. we are better than a while ago. huntsville, tennessee, john, good morning. caller: good morning. for you, first let me state this, i'm a veteran presently on the va healthcare system. i am not service connected. i joined the military, or

when i joined the military, there was a draft, you had no choice, you joined the or went to jail. i didn't wait to be drafted, i joined. i joined and volunteered vietnam. go to y reason i didn't vietnam was because my brother was already there. military family. my question to you, you being a republican, is the fact for the or for a al years while, back in the '80s when reagan was president, you took our nonservice connected benefits and when clinton became gave them back. tried s have constantly to take them away again. now that you have control of the have athe senate and you republican president, are you going to go ahead and kick of the va me out healthcare system? that is my question, i'll get

let you answer. guest: thank you for your service and you come from a family, as i do. my father served in the military, private in world war of my brothers are military officers, as well. thank you for your service. is not the republican's intention to reduce benefits for any veterans, quite the opposite. we want to take care of our veterans. i was running the other day here in washington and someone passed me, which isn't unusual, i've 10 year old girls pass me when i am out running. unusual, this young man didn't have any legs. i thought, he has to be a soldier. up with him and said, can i talk to you, will you tell me your story? and told me about losing his legs in afghanistan. e owe veterans everything we can to improve and to protect them in their lives and give opportunity to live successful lives, that is my intention and the intention of

and the dent-elect congress. again, we haven't done a very of taking care of some veterans over the last few years, no question about that. years ago, the summer, we were hearing stories waiting ns dying while for care. how can you know that and say, yeah, we've done everything we veterans.he we can't. we have done a little better job over the last years. funding to the va, which was necessary. va.have to do reform in the we can't hold employees there, ho are not providing care necessary, we can't hold them accountable, or fire them, that is nuts. businessowner, if i had to operate my business under hose rules, i would have failed. bring common sense approach to va administration rules and how interact with employees. once again, i think there is a consensus that veterans are special individuals,

families have sacrificed, as owe them and i don't know very many people who don't feel that way. here is joseph, soccer creek, georgia, independent line, last call. go ahead. caller: good morning. i was wondering, is the giving any consideration that the wildfires in the southeast are being terrorists?e i'd like your comment on that, please, sir. thank you. well, i don't know that anyone has shown there is evidence of that. we saw in israel, there was apparently arson nvolved with fires that had devastating impact necessary israel, it is something we should be aware of. i don't know there is evidence that is the case. is : our guest chris, talking about intelligence and other matters. thank you for your time. coming up on the program, we're to look at the topic of fake news, you have probably heard that term over the last

years, especially in light of the election. our guest joining us to talk max read, whol be wrote a piece for "new york magazine" and we'll come and just a ut that in moment. don't forget that today in the house of representatives, the caucus makes elections for leadership special what they'll do is decide about he future of the current minority leader, nancy pelosi. you heard throughout the course expected to g, remain in that position with other changes, as well. you are to go on capitol hill, house democratic eadership elections, the longworth house office building. that is where the elections will take place. you will see legislators coming out, and we'll show you activities going on and then go to the next guest.

host: that is the scene outside the longworth house office building takes place. is where the house democratic caucus elections will take place. for more to c-span information on how the elections go, just to give you a feel what going on before the elections take place. max ng us from new york is read, he is a senior editor for "new york magazine" "select all," section of the website.

here to talk about topic of fake news. good morning. morning.ood host: could you talk to us, you wrote a recent piece looking at idea, the title saying maybe the internet is not a fantastic tool for democracy afterall. you give us a sense of what led you on your writings about news?opic of fake guest: sure. you know, for the last three decades, it's been sort of a internet is a tool for democracy, for civil ights, for freedom of speech, for freedom generally, and that as been true in a lot of situations. you look at the beginnings of the arab and judgment revolution social media allowed mass protests to flourish in public people to owed organize and talk to each other, but in the last six or seven we've seen enormous rise

f popularism around the world of autocratic, auch racist genophobic leaders, not just russia, but western europe, asia, and one thing that seems to be clear across he world is leaders view the internet to whether intentionally or because their supporters are on them to target critics, harass journalists, to their own pob -- populous revolt. is a moment to look at the intern sxet say maybe this myth the internet is a tool for democracy isn't true. component powerful labeled broadly ake news, highly misleading, untrue stories put out by hyper sites that m news

circulate widely on social media nd there doesn't seem to be a lot of control over how and why the stories get debunked or allowed on social media. one infamous example, an article before the election claiming the pope had endorsed donald trump, which of course, shared by that was hundreds of thousands and probably seen by millions of eople across facebook and twitter. host: when it comes to looking cited one s, you example, is this a partisan thing? is it equal opportunity when it people put tisan thanksgiving type of information out there? know, everybodyu likes to share and read news hat confirms their own biases, it is a human thing. it is true there are fake news sites, facebook pages toward the wouldl side of things. i perpetuate fake news if i didn't tends to go right.

hyper partisan conservative ages have more false or untrue information on them. you even look at the reporting talk to the you entrepreneurs who are fake news sites, they said, they tried to put together sites around hillary around bernie sanders and it is donald trump, trump in particular, that traffic the kind of that allows them to make big profits. host: we have a listing of professor what one mc elissa zimdar, mary college, compiled list of websites classified as fake amongst other things. give us examples, who are the websites you are familiar with comes to this type of new? guest: well, one interesting happy to t this, i'm list the names, there are a lot of them outlets you never heard before. places were set up on the fly within the last year or year and a half. people in not even by the u.s. there was a recent

buzzfeed about the country of macedonia, one city, bunch of college students and teenagers are setting up ebsites to make money to buy themselves music equipment. one thing facebook has done, facebook and google made it easier to put together a or official-looking sounding news website. website like ending the fed dot com, most people would not recognize or understand as news ource, is turning over unbelievable traffic, traffic any legitimate institutional love to nization would have by posting fake news like, endorsing donald trump. the broader definition of fake that might include incredibly hyper partisan sites for example, rt, is you know, that would include the left or bright

bart on the right and those kind f sites, they would hate to be put in this category, a lot of what they writes in fact true, ust taken from extremely partisan viewpoint. host: max read joining us to has about fake news, written for "new york magazine," joining us to talk to you about it. questions, 202-748-8000 for democrats. republicans. for 202-748-8002 for independents. max read, tell us about the of "new york tion magazine," what is it? guest: we like to cover echnology from a cultural perspective, to look at how it is being used by people on day-to-day way. this election has been a ascinating example of how the internet transformed our ability to have conversations online organize tics, to political move sxment this is something we're particularly in.inated and interested we post funny videos and silly stories about the stuff going on too.ne, the internet has changed the

world and i think we're still eckoning with the ways our lives are different because of it. host: max read, is there a say fake news to influenced the election for donald trump? guest: no, i'm not sure there is. i imagine there are a number of studies being undertaken right now. what i can tell you, i know stan are studies recent ford study released last week youngtrated sophisticated people, have trouble distinguishing fake news from news, have trouble distinguishing advertiseing from genuine journalism. and you can look at raw numbers, number of people who have seen headlines, in the millions, and that is hard for me to believe there is no n. fact, facebook itself is business model relies news feed, when you click through facebook, that influences you f. fake news

doesn't influence the election, you see is not influencing you to think one way or the other then facebook's entire model is broken. seeing something in your feed as you are scrolling through, the act of almost like , repeating the news yourself, important way to form your sense true and not true influence the way you think about it sdchlt it mean you or ch from hillary clinton donald trump because of the fake news? help t think so, it will shore your briefs or help you decide not to vote at all. behavior in ting subtle and important ways and in an election as close as this worth looking at. host: do you think it changes the behavior of someone looking news story itself to check other sources to see if it was true or not? no, i think if you -- performthe word, if you basic media hygiene, you don't

trust single sources, you try to wide variety of sources, if you are immersing yourself in areerent ideas, i think you probably safe from the skurj of fake news. that what facebook has news.one-serving spot for 40% of adults get news from facebook. north lion people in america, use it, more than voted everyday in the election. to get news,cebook what you are getting, news from sources like "wall street ournal," "new york times," places that have long histories of smart and rigorous side and in long fact looking identical to news from places like ending the fed com. and i think if you are a busy person and we all are, you are stuff in your gh news feed in line one day, you might not know or recognize that these stories, one story you see, without reading is from from mes and one story is ending the fed.

and it is easy to have that catch in the back of your mind way of formulating your opinion about things. i think people who have, you sense of media literacy, who are interested in tcan still news affect their perception of the candidates. host: calls lined up for you. keith from chicago, illinois, democrats line. keith, you are on with our max read. go ahead with your question or comment. good : great topic and morning, max. ey, you know, we're going to look at fake news, we really ave to start at the granddaddy f them all and print digital media, drudge report. model, so to the speak. drudge, of ut of course. and bannon came out of drudge. of course that is supported

of course radio and fox news. that is trium verate of is siege tion and it and siege and builds and builds, the gene seout of the bottle, no will be rebottled. we have to have a better population, that simple. host: thanks, keith mrchlt max read. is importantinuing to look at the history of how we got here and part of that is talking about assaults on the legitimacy of the media, over the lastight 20 years. important figure in this. i would be cautious putting in the fake category, drudge links to a lot of sources.e he does link to a lot of correct and legitimate sources. a strongly partisan

slant, that doesn't make him a lies.er of i think the big difference drudgu was internet operating in in the '90s and the distribution s power around facebook there is a difference between having a site drudge, even if you hate it and think it is the worst peddler of misinformation that other options de for you, each of which has own signalling ability to is and what hat it it is about. what worries me, when that stuff single nched into serving squares in a facebook difficult to it distinguish one sort of news from another that empsighs the sharing it over the place they knew it was from.g i think that cable new system just as important as the forming in terms of public opinion in the u.s. cable news and the internet other, they feed off each other, no reason to

top attention to fox news or drudge just because we have a ew front to be worried about legitimacy of the information. it is important to pay attention holistically. caller: good morning, gentlemen. max, great to have you here. grazed across and touched upon the issue, the question i had for you. to ask you for your opinion from your how much if at all ould you attribute the sudden and it wasnd success the presidential election, of e has been a lot reporting on voters who relied the coming through the

ources that were later proved to be straight, how much, if at all, do you attribute that to the sort of vacuum left blind by formerly legitimate news divisions having been either or both eviscerated of their needed news gathering personnel and budgets and transform into celebrity, sex and scandal and corporate press eleases, that is kind of marketing/news. hat is role of legit nat journalism here? host: thanks, eric. that is a really complicated question and i don't have a simple answer. internet has in fact viscerated the journalism model. it means organizations that were nce all powerful, newspapers like the "new york times," newspaper necessary any major forced to n area are

compete on different terms. you know, no news organization one way or the like to t i think we think of as frivolous news, sex, celebrity gossip and crosswords, cooking, even sports. that doesn't bother me as a that stuff, ilove read that stuff n. many cases that stuff is more important for. we give it credit what is happening now, every news organization is required in that it reach audience need in order to survive as a be ness, it needs to immediately receptive to whatever the audience wants at a given moment, a lot of week, over thehis last couple weeks about the extent to which journalists are to respond to tweets that donald trump is sending out. nd this is difficult question, in part, because obviously the president, his statements are newsworthy, but oftentimes based in complete, in his imagination,

no relationship to the truth and sometimes they are sort of vin dickative and weird and not fruitful or productive. o, you know, one strategy in 1960 might have been pretending we had newspapers and twitter, other internet, you put utranss on 818, report them they are important and diminish their importance. is its y single article own unit that can be shared on facebook or twitter. editors to ult for make judgment about news worthiness. i've gotten off track here. the journalism as institution or the change that t is undergoing means there is enormous base for hoaxes and lies. is important to acknowledge journalism has not served readers in the way it the last 20 ver years. talk to almost anyone about the "new york times," i think the greatest newspaper in like rld and enormous

old-school, smart, rigorous eporting, also had a number of essentially false reports about the iraq war in 2003. trust, the as f trust gets eroded in that way, it make its easier for the feeder of facebook to seize that space and take those readers. host: mindon, louisiana, republican line. jeff, good morning. morning.ood yeah, i am 70 years old and been watching the news for a long time and to me it's pretty much or distorted to give you a prime example, to watch all the different channels and outlets, kind of curious when came out with findings on clinton and the cnn, ines that flash on james comey claims hillary careless. there is a world of

difference between extremely careless.nd of how just one example they're distorting it. i don't know if it is -- not a great student of history, but i think that is how the communists used to do it. 65,000 e-mails come out and no nbc and cnn.c, kind of american, i'm concerned because i grew up, years ago, ii'm 70 grew up when you got the truth, nothing, bututh and the truth, far from what is happening now. caller.anks, guest: yeah, i think that obviously every journalistic comes from a specific place. nstitutional biases, and they don't need to be political biases, they can be business-based biases. they don't want to cover or it would turn off advertisers. they know they can bring

particularly valuable audience in. literacy education would need to include that, no is on to imagine that cnn the gospel truth. what i would caution anybody the current media environment is that power is a reasingly concentrated in small handful of countries. the healthiest free press in any one that has wide outlets and allows people to choose between them, to assemble a space where we can all agree on what the truth is and what reality is. that is the only way to have a peaceful, liberal democracy, if can ople across the aisle look at each other and agree that this thing is true and this is not true. even regarding clinton's e-mails, obviously other end of the spectrum who claim the media covered them too much there is between extremely careless and careless. i will say in cnn's defense they did accurately

report he said the word careless starting point from which we can have a discussion about that. fields several football away from the pope endorsing onald trump or an f.b.i. agent attached to hillary clinton killing himself, another item of the denvereported by guardian, didn't exist until a year ago. louise in san antonio, democrats line. max, i was wondering if information onus alex -wars put out by jones, president-elect seems to fascinated with him and i hear from senior citizens in making statements

that come from drudge and these rs on c-span and people -- i know c-span doesn't like to correct people, but some the things i hear from callers is just so far out there like if they really do need to be corrected. anyway, i wish you would give that, thank you. guest: sure. info-wars is probably the most famous site that belongs in the fake news.ition of mongering spiracy tin foil treme right hat kind of place. i hate , i don't -- coming on here. a x jones is a character, hell of a character, for a long ime he was that, a crazy conspiracy theorist with a weird

radio show that existed in a way allowed you to enjoy his entertainment without having to fear it as a source of news. the rise of social platforms as ews distribution meant alex jones is not just a guy in texas with a local radio show ranting government, he is somebody, as you say, has audience of voters and concerned citizens who seem to believe what he says. you know, i don't have a solution to figuring out ensure that the stuff that alex -- conspiracy theories about one world government or hatever else alex jones is peddling. e claimed that without evidence, claiming three million in the oted illegally most recent election appeared out of the mouth of the president-elect in the form of twitter feed.

and that to me is really i worry that d we're not thinking hard enough bout how we can ensure that that kind of totally baseless adequately rebutted and responded to. facebook has twit sxer responded then in light of this and what technology have they place? how does it work? guest: well, so facebook a couple different swings about this. c.e.o. came out after the election and insisted idea ught it was a crazy that news influenced anybody one way or the other. about as we talked earlier, i think -- i don't think that is true and i facebook y don't think institutionally believes that. have advertising-based

business model there is reporting group of facebook employees formed a secret working group attempting to come up out of the eyes of the executives, attempting to come solutions. zuckerburg said they would consult with fact checking attach labels to news organizations, i actually skeptical about the direction. on ink focusing too much giving facebook the power to make editorial decision over appears on the site is the kind of quick fix that is hurt us.come back and facebook, the problem at the facebook has too uch power and asking it to yield power in ways we like versus ways we don't like is a short-term solution. long-term solution, ensure facebook doesn't have power over the media conversation generally. twitter is a smaller part, but near influential, journalists politicians use it.

our president-elect uses it. the big, it has less of a a blem with fake news for certain number of design reasons. it has a problem with and abuse, especially against journalists, color, women, people of against huge antisemitism problem on it, few days after announced n, twitter anti-harrassment tools that can e put to use to stem some of the problem. it remains to be seen whether fix the actually situation. host: our guest, max read of "new york magazine," he's the take a look at the topic of the internet, news across it, topic of fake news overall. hi.e, republican line, caller: hi. thanks for taking my call. a republican, going to vote for trump, i think fake news contributed to the rise of him. personally, i've seen

things on facebook that just even as republican. you, k my question for what role does the mainstream media have in all this? why are they not reporting on the fake news the way they the public ducating about these fake stories that i the ubt think influence election? guest: well, a couple answers to question. the first is, it is like whack-a-mole, hundreds of day with no basic and fact. it is difficult to figure out to be rebutted, how you go about rebutting them them.t amplifying further, there is a problem with widespread problem with trust in period.a, people who just don't think the media has their best interest in sensationalizing or lying or too biassed. people who think that

are likely to believe the so-called fake news stories. and then, there's finally the media problem that the just beholden to the facebook news sites the fake are. this isn't a situation where facebook and fake news sites and the institutional media and two separate groups the institutional media should use power to stand up and fight facebook. facebook subsumed the media. the media requires facebook it spends took f. much time railing against facebook or worrying about the fake news on the opulation, it is going to let power wane even more. host: katie from apex, north carolina, good morning. caller: good morning. max, i hope you would address my phone call in your own professional the

standards of journalism, which ave definitely been drifted away from in that now the onversation is in regard to "fake news," where viewers were seeking information and the were gettinghat we was that a lot of these different news sites were biassed.y a lot of interviews when people were confronted with things that released tunately through wikileaks were flat-out be ed and later proven to true. when you have someone that you're hopefully receiving truth from and then you repeatedly have evidence that is case, there needs to be a commitment first to professional journalism before a 're going to have conversation about fake news. going to f you're discuss fake news, then what was the real news. constantly give an example of those foundational you're sayingthat

and referring to as "we," or zuckerburg saying facebook influence, what is fake? was it all fake? you know, honestly, i agree with you, i think big part is decliningm here thet in the media thanks to needs and concerns of people reading it. worry that -- as a country we have to sit down and say this, is true, this is not true. he way we do that, accepting collective media ecosystem and and we agree ngs things are true and we

trust this particular, not one particular institution, but in aggregate number of different media institutions as they circle around something. what worries me, what used to be that sort of establishment group organizations that allowed for some sense of common truth hasn't been -- the right thing to do would be to expand way that allows it to still exist and allows views that were outside of it used as political, racial, sexual who are kept ople out of the news, whose ideas and justice ind of social issues were kept out of the news. that stuff expands thanks to the expansion of media and the audience. e accelerated all the way into complete extremes, especially on one side and partly on another side. that initial group of media, gatekeepers has disappeared. say what you will about the failure and number of failures political and journalistic failures of the media, but they macedonia g, like the

teenagers, they are not interested in giving you eality, they are interested in buying guitars and they are going to sell you whatever you it.t to hear in order to get so, you know, like some point, is not perfect solution to say, okay, let's go back to the wall street jury room and new "washington post" and abc and nbc. of course not. but i don't think that it is replacing institutions with ending the fed dot comand denver gardener. host: democrat line, jane, hello there. hi.er: thank you for c-span. i appreciate you. comments.couple first, i was very, very unhappy with the framing of this political election by the mainstream broadcast media, where they gave hours and hours meanwhile, have, the 16 other candidates and traily clinton out on the

and coverage of their rallies ould say hillary didn't have a platform, she didn't have any did, but they were not covered. they would have debates, people another ue with one with no moderation and then just disturbing that places msnbc, 6:00 on the est coast covering things like why my husband, why people marry in body who they meet prison, are t.v., russian debateson, have evolved about what is go og in syria or fghanistan and it is very slanted from russian point of going on. it is so disturbing that we don't have actually broadcast reporting news that affects the world, affects the disturbing to me

because people on the left and on the right take nothing fake news. i have people, i'm a liberal democrat. have friends telling me pizza gate is a real thing, that involved in on child trafficing and they believe these things. jane, thank you. we'll let the guest respond. guest: you know, i agree. really have anything else to say. it is absolutely true that we figuring out in that ountry how to ensure intelligent and sort of evel-headed coverage of presidential elections, for xample, doesn't devolve into feeding the beast with whatever most attention-grabbing thing going on. a big reason e, donald trump won, it is not just, sounds simple as though whomever gave free media, he is particularly attention. grabbing e is particularly talented at

grabbing attention in ways he wants to do it. in a world where your success as media organization is measured by how much attention is being paid to you, that is how you advertising, that candidate who grabs attention and frankly candidate whoys a and president who was able to direct attention toward himself has been doing now, those candidates get more coverage than the opposition. know, i think i'm not going to come up with a solution to this, because the answer -- russian day, the television station is not the answer. funded, i don't want to say propaganda outlet, independent media. a way to ensure independent media is given the space it needs to bring important and voters, nt coverage to we need to find that.

i wish i had a better one answer to it. it will take a lot of thinking and thought and some degree of outcry before it changes. line bob on the republican from pennsylvania. caller: good morning. wondering, max, you are talking about fake news and i challenge you, i challenge you or ome up with one article sound bite where mr. trump says -- your three million words, three million people who voted illegally. you do that, mr. fake news? mean, he tweeted it like a few days ago. tweeted that he -- they were trying to do recount and he ould have won the popular vote anyway if three million people, maybe two million people hadn't illegally.

newt gingrich gave an interview about it yesterday saying he didn't think, he thought that damaging thing to say and trump should not be tweeting so much. ost: independent line, jennifer, hello. caller: hi. thanks for taking my question. young person, trained in science and something that is how fake eeply to distrust of science and especially the information that contributes to climate change skepticism. my question is, with climate being such an immediate future especially to my and also bernie sanders said our ingle greatest threat to national security and with complete lack of acknowledgment party in the republican that it is even a serious threat at all. how we might eas immediately begin to reverse the that proliferates from the fake new? thanks. host: thanks, caller. boy, i wish.

i don't. i think the climate change issue it is rest nothing part, a really good example of how the time we havea long accepted agreed upon truth based impure cism, n scientific method and science and climate change is good sort of f how that acceptable that public sphere of acceptable opinion has been eroded away. skepticism change, about climate change is not result of fake news. fake new system riding the train. skepticism comes from business interests that are don't want to e regulated in ways that would help stop climate change, create turning it into tribal issue for what fake newsnd does, finds tribal issues, finds that signal belief in particular ideology or tribeship in a particular and because social media the way media innews on social

certain ways a way to perform our own identity and belonging when you , remember share article on facebook, it becomes attached to your you, about whole, you are when you share something. you start to share change, yourclimate attitude tells people something about who you are as a person, american, as a voter. you know, climate change in particular, i don't think there to fix that issue versus fixing the whole broken sort of system by which we distribute information. host: this is john, herndon, on with our are guest, max read. caller: good morning. taking my call.king my max, this is what just happened, there is a call from pennsylvania and ask question, did donald trump ever lie? that, trump, when he say muslims were celebrating during that isat is fake news, a lie.

the problem that we have here, news, e a place like fox who lie listeners day in and day out and never have any consequence and i know this, politician day, lying about something and they don't stop it. what you are say suggest not fact f. we don't when nge the politicians they lie and put them on the spot, nothing can be done about this. have to blame them facebook or anything, reporters nbc or whether t is fox news or cnn, we have seen people come on live elevision, lie to the american people and no one challenge them and that is ridiculous, no ever.quences whatso tlt host: john, thank you. guest: yeah. interesting you say, you know, mention the celebrating muslim system an news.e of fake

one particularly interesting and component of the ew dynamic set up, the president-elect and every president from now on, i her ne, will have his or own twitter account, no different from the twitter account of the "new york times" personal twitter account or yours, if you have way, which means in a weird donald trump is himself a news spreading and disseminating fake news, or has he ability to, just like i know. the sharing is able to occur on that stuff , means that you tweet or say can be a scale ke wildfire at and speed we've never seen before. there is very difficult to out how to debunk. i agree with you, it is the state, for journalism to stand up for whatf and for some idea of truth and reality is, but it

voters, to be people, viewers, readers who stand up ensure that outlets aren't allowing t away with lives to spread. that means complaining to neighborsd talking to and friends who watch fox news guardian.e denver you know, bringing people back to some sphere of shared reality is most important thing to create one. host: mobile, alabama, you are n line, bill, on, go on, please. ekt caller: i watched fake news 50 years ago. in tuscaloosa. at the public library and across the street marchers, ivil rights bill connor up on top, it was raining. the library were looking out, they said, don't go out there, so i did. on the porch, on my

side of the street, the library news man, was a camera man and the guy who was the organizer, a black guy. was saying to the black guy, you got to get me something, this is nothing. what do you want me to do? get the marchers over there where the dogs are. to go over there where the dogs are, they might bite us. me something, or we're going back to new york, wife got nothing. marchers near the dogs, the dogs start doing what leash.o when on a host: your point is -- we're running out of time, what is the point? been faking have news since time began. i mean, i can't speak to that particular example. i don't think you need to invent instances where the police and civil th were abusing rights protesters. maybe we can bring it back to example,and more famous

spanish you know, american war, you supply me pictures, i'll supply you the war. the media has at times in history, broadly, the 150 years is point, worth of tabloids and news channel, you can name dozens or hundreds of examples of information, ake the big difference that has changed in the lasts 10 years, speed at which that information can move around. no longer spaces in which false, ake, incorrect hoax, lies, misinformation can be debunked, discourse making worse. host: max read, moving forward, going into a new administration, is the warning? what are you looking for as far as this type of news dissemination? guest: i think the first and most important thing we can do demand action from facebook,

which they seem to be taking. broader, the he long-term goal has to be to concentrated power that companies like facebook, and sort of itter conglomerates have merat over the landscape. anti-trust action should be termstely on the table in of talking about how facebook bundled huge number of services together, effectively monopoly line.l over news on about eeds to be action this. this approach is not working. host: max read with "new york magazine." thanks for being on c-span. guest: thanks for having me. host: we now take you live to the house of representative. mi for morning hour debate. the chair will alternate recognition