that is the interesting thing about country music. it is the music of poor white people. people who are privileged to be white. and i will talk about that in a second. but also people who are underprivileged, in terms of their identity and economic opportunities. the emerging definitions of whiteness and blackness in colonial america and how it impacted the origins of country music. then, sunday afternoon at 4:00 on railamerica -- >> budget cutbacks and a tingle ,f administrative problems created evidence that this crusade against society's greatest enemies may be slow or may level off and fade. this was the climate, the land and the unfinished task that faced lyndon johnson on the first of december, 1966. >> the film documents the final

moments of the year of president lyndon b. johnson, his meeting with mexico's president on a cooperative dam project, awarding the medal of honor to a marine who fought in vietnam and celebrating the holidays with his family at his texas ranch. and at 8:00, on the presidency. ,he author of madam president the secret presidency of edith wilson, resident woodrow wilson's second wife. she buffered access to president from a massive stroke in 1919. for our complete tv schedule, go to c-span.org. >> on wednesday's washington junior -- journal. journal": "washington continues. host: our guest is carol anderson at emory university in

atlanta, correct? professor anderson is author of this book, entitled "white rage: the unspoken truth of our racial divide." and the book in a part stems from an op-ed you wrote a couple of years ago at the time of ferguson and the headline of that piece, we will show it to our audience. you said ferguson is not about black rage against cops, it is white rage against progress. take those terms, black rage and white rage and put those in context. guest: it was during ferguson win -- win of the protests are happening, fire industry and all of that and all the pundits, regardless what ideological msnbc, fox, they're all talking about black rage.

lack people being so angry, anti-violence and blowing things up. why are they burning of where they live? why are they burning up where they live? everybody was talking about black rage and i was shaking my head, this is white rage. i have lived in missouri for 13 years and i saw the way public policies worked to undermine african americans' axis to citizenship -- access to citizenship. ,hite rage is cool, calculated out of the courts, out of legislatures. not what you see in the streets. it is lethal. went back a couple of years, the book is a history book and goals back more than 100 years. -- goes back more than 100 years. tell us about the history. guest: what i did was charge when african-americans made significant progress, access to the citizenship rights, you saw

a wave of policies rolled out to undermine those citizenship rights. i start with right after the civil war with reconstruction. this is the moment were african-americans move from being legal property to being human beings to then being citizens. and that was such a seismic shift that you saw this movement come up from the white house, from state legislatures, from the supreme court to gut the 13th and 14th and 15th amendments. again, i tracked it through the great migration where african-americans are leaving the south in droves looking for the schools, good jobs and the right not to be lynched. instead, they face a number of barriers and tracker to the brown decision of 1954 and 1955 and civil rights. and then the election of barack

obama. host: phone numbers on the bottom of the screen for our guests, carol anderson. we will take your calls in a moment. a little bit from the book, white rage is not about visible violence but it works his way through the courts, the legislatures in a rage of government bureaucracy and wreak havoc. it does not have to wear sheets or burn crosses or take to the streets. tell us more. guest: yes, one of the things we have is a narrative in the society that only if black people would, if only they would value schools.

if only they would work hard. if only they would fill in the blank. when you look back historically, african-americans have done that. , the responseng has been a wave of policies to undermine that. i will take a recent one. you saw in the 2008 election and the 2012 election, african-americans came out in record numbers to vote. election,2 african-americans'participation exceeded that of whites. what you had following that, we should be saying we value democracy and want people to vote and we want people to participate and it is democracy and feel like they have a stake in it. what you say mentally after that high participation rate was first the supreme court counting the holder decision. that we can severely though

voting rights act of 1965. as then a wave of voter suppression loss -- laws that were designed that targeted african-americans with a nearly surgical precision to find a way to stop them from voting. host: one more question about present day, what are you expecting during a donald trump administration? guest: i am expecting that wide range will be in is full glory. through the be courts, through the legislature will embed a whole series of laws and policies that undermine african american access to citizenship rights. the progress was made during the obama administration with sentencing reform. i'm expecting that to go by the wayside. understanding that the

war on drugs and mass incarceration is not the way to go. i expect that to double down on so-called law and order. host: to the phones for professor carol anderson. herman is calling from louisiana . democratic caller. caller: good morning. i have a question. can you be a citizen of two countries? citizenon why, i am a of the united states of america but i am african-american and the united states. what i am getting at is why are we labeled african-american? the white people are just white americans? host: why don't you answer your own question and then we will hear from the professor?

caller: ok. [laughter] can you be a citizen of two countries? host: i was hoping he would elaborate. guest: first, africa is a continent. the description of african-americans as part of a move for black people in the united states to define themselves. to go from the n-word to colored to negro as an negro with a capital "n" to african-american. -- the part of a way to definition of self because again, when you realize that for many blacks in the united states legacy.y is the

that legacy of property and we have been fighting against that 1619. of property since and then waits 1865, again, it has been that battle against the definition that black people are less than. recent polls and surveys in fact 2016, blackday in people are seen as being less than american. erasedttle will not be if black people just simply say, we are just americans. i will take the example of brazil. in brazil, they do not identify by race, but what you see is that black brazilians, in fact, have greater poverty, lower , the greater

criminalization. what that does then is when it's a organized to fight against that, the government says we do not have statistics by race so that cannot be happening. part of what you are seeing here is this push for identity and to the push to have the data to make sure that it is very clear what these kinds of systemic policies, the systemic inequality is meant for black people in the united states. host: let's hear from paul, an independent caller. caller: good morning. professor anderson, i have been looking at this problem since i retired a few years ago. i have come to the conclusion that the real root of the problem, that we all have to face, is not so much slavery but in the rise of scientific racism starting with the predecessors of darwinism.

the whole idea that it is proclaimed heavily in the late 19th century that there was a ranking of human beings that the english want top and then the rest of the europeans and then the asians and then the africans . , it whole idea which gained received science from all of the universities. you look at woodrow, probably one of the worst racist in kindca, he talked to this of thing. the misuse of darwin's teachings to bf a heart of this problem -- to be active the heart at it has gotten embedded in our thinking. until we root out the idea of raising that science is proving to be illogical and without basis, what cannot really get it there. slavery does not seem to explain it. slavery was practice more widely in africa than it was enzyme the new world. for more people who owned slaves

than in the united states. that yourably true ancestors are more likely to own slaves than mine. , i just wanted have you looked at it from the point of view of the misuse of what i will call social darwinism. host: thank you. a lot. guest: i sure will. it is not just the science. of understand his is understand the way, for instant, that religion works and the power of religion. you had in thing being ordained by god and want to slap god on top of stash once you slept got on top of something horrific, it gives power and meaning to it in ways. thinghole person of hame to explain why africans could be

enslaved. i also want to deal with the way that slavery was done in the united states was so fundamentally different than the way it was done in africa and african kingdoms. slavery and united states was multigenerational. slavery that the status of the enslaved carry through to the child, carry through to the the child'sd in child child. that's a fundamentally different. if we try to raise the role of slavery, what we erase then is by the time of the civil war, gdp washe united states attached to slavery. we erase the economic power of the united states that was built on the backs of the enslaved. and then we erase the kind of

and thes fervor religious rationale behind it. az and then you merge that with the science. it has not been as you said, still embedded in the academies. what the academy has done have to talk about how race is a social construct. what is also clear is that the policies and the systems that have come up because of the construct are real. and the way that people face those constructs so that we know there are differential in the way policing happen in the way that employment happens. that construct in fact of facts less chances. host: more about what you write in "white rage."

guest: yes. white rage really, probably until this election, swaddled particularly after the civil rights movement. protecting the integrity of the ballot box sounds just -- who could be against this? what you see are these schemes, for instance, i will take north carolina again. ,here they said, the gop said let's get the racial data on voting and looked at how do black people vote? we see they use early voting instead of most of them comment out on the tuesday election day. many of the vote early.

we will constrict the number of early voting days. that should cut down the number of black voters. we see their certain type of ids they do not have. those of ids we will require. then call will we will make a more difficult to gain those ideals. that's that kind of surgical targeting of african-americans. let me back up for doing exactly what they are supposed to be doing -- voting. that's the way white rage works. host: the headlines said the gop attack on voting rights was the most undercover story of 2016. 25 debates and not a single question about the attack on voting rights even though this was the first residential election in 50 years without the full protection of the voting rights act. they go on to write that is the first -- biggest underwritten scandal. why undercover? guest: i am still trying to

figure it out. it is huge. i did a piece where after the break the vote, there were several here who were writing we saw the rise a white nationalist and the brexit vote but that will not happen here because we have this firewall, this demographic firewall of blacks and latinos. i wrote their firewall is breached. it is under attack. we are seeing it in wisconsin. you had gop legislators who were absolutely giddy, it is the quote, "giddy" about slicing and dicing the votes so that particularly vote -- blacks in milwaukee would have a harder time voting. they were pleased about that. we see it in texas where the naacp and the legal defense fund both found to their joint report that up to 1.6 million blacks and latinos what not have access

to certain type of id that the state was now requiring. why this is underreported, not taken into account? i have to say maybe it is because of what it did was to target blacks and latinos and you do not want to a certain race into-- a certain the election debates. it needed to be there. when were denying american citizens the right to vote, where trampling on democracy and we need to understand that. host: democrat, latoya, good morning. caller: good morning. good morning professor anderson. i hear you. , asme being a black woman long as they have been knowing about the ids and voter suppression in everything, why we wait until the last minute to

fight it in court? behind the eight ball. it does not make any sense. when we say they are trying to put all of these laws in our way, we knew it before the election started. sometimes, we cannot be -- we always act after-the-fact the fact. we have to be proactive. truth is truth. yeah, they did all of that that you said. sogeorgia, they are doing much in every red state that you have a republican leader. have suppressed the vote in some kind of way. where theyichigan, have the water problem, i did analysis, they do not go out and vote. it is so hurtful that now -- the , yeah, they had us in slate, if it were not for laws, that was still have was an

slavery. that's a sad part. the stores in because they have to. everything they do is because they have to. they always thing they are right about everything. i've never seen a group of people something think they are god's gift to this world and not we. everybody makes of the world. it is one race that is coming down on everybody. and we standing around watching them do it. is an accident. republicans, what they have planned for him, is on purpose. watch how it believes back to the senate leader on these emails trash they have been doing. we have all been duped. we have been duped. and the last -- we have to be proactive and not always subtracting. host: thank you for college. it is i would say part of

the moment that the supreme rightstarted the voting act, you saw mobilization across the nation. part of what you do not see is it does not get big media attention. .e hear about there were series of lawsuits, early on a by the aclu, naacp, .he legal defense fund use activism. it was not like people were waiting until 2016 to file the suit. -- you saw activism. they started early. i will push back on the sense that black people were waiting until the last minute. no, they were not. part of what you are seeing is you had a group called volta riders who were -- vote riders trying to help people to get those ids and running to all kinds of all kind of crazy barriers.

gowisconsin, a man had to stateisconsin to another to get his original birth certificate. then they said, no, one letter was wrong on their birth certificate. kinds of shenanigans that were happening. this was no last minute thing. host: don, democratic caller. thank you forgetting got to talk with us. caller: good morning, mrs. anderson. you are ansure educator and you know everything like that. but now, i am wondering have you tor, you know, decided to go the bible, the word of god in order to find out what our histories about? black people in america are cursed. and occurs is from god. and our oppressor is the white men which is the oppressor of

the world. the bible says of the earth is given into the hands of the wicked. ok. and so therefore, everything is done by him because he has covered the faces of the real judges which is jesus christ, which was a black man and gave us this white to jesus we have now. and we are following their ways and ways of life as opposed to the way we were which were the jews of antiquity. we are the real jews of america and we are not americans. where not africans. where not none of that. judites.ws died -- you need to listen to the israelites. everyone in america, all you blacks, hispanics and native americans, you need to turn to the israelites and listen to their program and listen to what they are trying to say.

everything they say comes from the bible. host: comments from don. guest: as i mentioned earlier, the bible has actually been used to provide cover for the subjugation of black people in the united states. i think that's absolutely miss reading and misuse of the bible. one of the things we saw in the civil rights movement, in fact, you had ministers, black ministers, who had been preaching from it is supposed to be bad done here for black people. that's what the bible says. you have to take it and you will get yours and i'll by and by, the hereafter. and then are another way led by reverend verna jones and then dr. martin luther king came up as saying, they were reading from another side. that's what we have to understand about the bible.

it is open to interpretation. uses foro open to the those who have various pernicious, very pernicious intent. we really have to think about what is ab bible is saying in terms of basic humanity and basic decency. that is where we need to be really reading and not about issues of subjugation and oppression. host: al. caller: good morning. one, i think in every race and every religion, two or 3% of people are evil. we do not fight a war does the evil people. also, black lives matter's started under president obama. if you look, it seems like the left is always on the side of evil. you have young african-americans who are arrested and charged

with transporting drugs across state lines. what he told the judge is you did not know who was transporting drugs is a he ballroom the car from -- he borrowed the car from a friend and and i know. the judge told him he was the one driving the car across state lines with the drugs and ignorance of the lot was not a defense and sentenced him to 20 years in prison. if the same judge were to prosecute somebody like hillary clinton, he would say that she sat and received classified in mouth and downloaded them onto a private server and gave it to her attorneys and had them delete classified. the rich is not being prosecuted. also, an african-american and hispanic is arrested. african-american -- they both go

through due process. african-american is found guilty. he spent 10 years in prison. we have enough money to incorporate -- incarceration. without legal documents a but we cannot support him. we do not have enough money. after the mega lives do not matter. it is the left and not the right . african-americans, you talk about the bible. you look at what african-americans support. god says, do not allow a man to lie with another man. all of the democratic support gay rights. everton american support gay rights. host: we will let you go. you said a lot.

-- he has an armed group that fends off the federal officers. he lived to tell the tale. then we had a full end of philando castile, pulled over because the police officer thinks he has a broad nose, just like the robber they are looking for. and he has a concealed permit. car. gunned down in the that is the disparate treatment that we are talking about. when black lives matter -- and i want to say, when black lives matter talks about black lives matter, what they mean is that black lights really do matter. and as long as we treat black

lives matter crandon fodder -- cannon fodder, disposable, irrelevant, we have not grown as a society. book in 1999,he in a new york city episode that is very well-known. you refer to events like that and other events as kindling. kindling for what is going on today. tell us more. mann that, he was a black who stepped out on his front porch to go get something to eat after a long day's work. this is regular. four officers from the new york police department pulled up in front of them, came out guns blazing and fired fully -- 41 bullets at him. and he went down. 19 bullets hit. he was unarmed, he had no criminal record, he had nothing but being a black man in new york city. at the time, when you have

broken window policing theory governing the way the nypd works, which means you had hyper policing in the black community. killing, rudye giuliani, who was mayor at the time, was on nightline. rudy said my policies are working. new york is a safer city. and he has his flowchart tend the -- that show crime going down, and i am thinking, your policies are working? you have an unarmed dead man on a porch hit 19 times with 41 bullets shot at him. your policies are working? that is when i began to start thinking through the ways that -- work in order to undermine african americans access to their civil rights. the german nation of white rage came in that moment. windowsuse that broken

theory policing which led to stop and frisk, stop and frisk. at the time, 50% of new york's population were made of black and latinos. they accounted for 84% of all stops. but, the handful of whites who were stopped accounted for twice as many of the illegal drugs and illegal weapons. if this was really about law turn yourt, you would police force to look where the illegal drugs and illegal weapons were. this was turned towards the black and latino community. where the drugs and the weapons were not. i mean about the ways these policies work. what that did is lead to a hyper criminalization in those communities. it led to this. >> let's hear from kathleen in south florida, on with carol anderson, author of white rage.

>> good morning. i am sitting here listening and we askwant to say, hebrew israelites -- we as hebrew israelites need to teach our kids what were black people before slavery. you are always talking slavery. what were we doing before slavery? what were we doing on the west coast of africa? what were we doing when our ancestors ran out of jerusalem into west africa? ok? what were we doing? and like the guy said, we need to go by god. god gave the hebrew israelites laws. when we broke the laws, we were accursed.

becauseus into slavery israel broke the laws. we need to go back to god's laws. i think we are losing kathleen, but we understand the point. how about a response. -- i talk about slavery because that is where the book starts. but there are many scholars who fully document what was happening in west africa. that is just not the focus of this conversation. but one of the things you do see , and i don't want us to also think of slavery as -- oh god, because that is the enslaved thought. -- the enslaved phot. -- enslaved fought. they put rocks in the bags

instead of cottons. they ran away. they resisted. they fought for their freedom. i also want to deal with the kind of we broke god's law and we are cursed. thee really are looking at bible, everyone has broken god's law. that should mean everyone would be cursed. we really need to be much more judicious and we need to be more humane about the way we think about religion and the bible. doug, from monrovia california is calling in on the republican line. anderson mention wisconsin, the state legislation dy over voter suppression. i have heard they offered free state ids to people for the purpose of voting.

i believe actual voter suppression was on the university of pittsburg, was destroyed. that strikes me as more voter suppression. here when theyle say your rights are being taken away, what they here is you are a victim. you will be nothing more than a victim and never realize their full potential. and that is a real disturbance and it is propaganda. that's all i wanted to say. its only propaganda if its not true. in wisconsin, for instance. one of the things that governor scott walker did was to decrease of department of motor vehicles in democratic areas. particularly in milwaukee. hours foreasing the

the department of motor vehicles in republican areas of the state . texas, when they passed the soap -- voter suppression law in texas, that the state legislature knew that in over 200 counties, they had the department of motor vehicles in 80 some of those counties. people would drive have -- have to drive 250 miles in order to get a government issued photo id. but since they couldn't -- it isn't that they had to drive, but somebody had to drive them. sb2he original bill for was a provision that dealt with reimbursing people that had to drive a long distance to get a government issued photo id. and the republican legislature drew a line through that reimbursable.

what we have is a poll tax. when you have the state systematically identifying various people by race and by class, that is not victimization. that is exactly what the government is doing. and what people need to understand is that is what is going on. it doesn't make them of it them, it makes them understand that me -- they need to stand up and resist. >> our guest is carol anderson, professor of african american studies in atlanta and author of rage: thewhite unspoken truth of our racial divide." she got her phd at ohio state university. other books she has written, bourgeoise prize, and radicals. you can watch other events with our guest, the miami book fair

that she just attended, at our website. type in the name carol anderson and that should come up for you. you write about president obama, of course. part of what you write is obama's centrist solutions and shouldack of radicalism have made him a hero to the republicans. just the opposite happened, you write. he ended with 80 -- 85% disapproval among the geo p. -- gop. >> we hear of obama being a socialist, for instance, as the reason he is so vilified. thept when you look at demonized affordable care act, obamacare. heritageeated by the foundation and then adopted by

mitt romney in massachusetts. it has private industries, private insurance companies providing the insurance. tois a centrist solution deal with the fact that we have millions, as one of the leading industrialized nations, we have millions who did not have health insurance. and could not get health insurance because of being fishing -- pre-existing conditions. for example. did not win him any favors. the fact that he really tried to not dois fine line did anything. instead, what you saw immediately coming out were the kinds of vilification's. he is muslim, he is muslim. making him not american, making him foreign. making him some kind of a manchurian candidate kind of deal.

so when you are looking at his policies and, as i say, he took over when the nation was on the preps of this -- precipice of a massive financial abyss. the courseight against a congress whose first line was, we oppose everything that he does. everything that he wants. we are going to try to make them, as mitch mcconnell said, a one term president. when you have that kind of resistance, in the face of that resistance -- right now the unemployment rate is less than 5%. income has risen. increasedprofits have , and the man is hated in a way when you remove all other variables, all you can come up with his race. his blackness.

is very blackness. ofcreated this kind of sense this domain of the white house, pinnacle of power, was now -- as i by someone ind, the penultimate aspiration and achievement, and you have little black boys and girls thinking, i too could be president of the united states. that is terrifying. theseis is why you see levels of policies come up, beginning with voter suppression. >> we have about 15 minutes with our guest. democratic collar, high helen. .> good morning good morning, professor anderson. of victims and

victimization as per that last i think of the war on drugs as in the 90's. against african-americans, targeted as the -- and demonized compared to the $1 billion, the recent bill passed and pushed by the senate to help the victims of the latest opioid epidemic in a lot of states, and a lot of the people who are victims of the opioid epidemic are white. this is being pushed by the senate. they have approved it, and they are waiting for the funding i believe. but, can you compare and people whoe way that

are addicted to these opioids are not demonized and criminalized the way that blacks were during the 90's with the whereal "crack epidemic" all blacks were demonized and criminalized. >> thanks for calling. >> absolutely. there was a study done by a princeton professor, where she looked at the difference between how crack was identified and discussed and the way methamphetamines work. what she found was that crack was criminalized, as were the people. blacks were seen as crackheads and they needed to be incarcerated. methamphetamine in the discourse was seen as a public health crisis. and because meth was seen as a white drug that was affecting

poor whites in rural america. it is the same thing we are seeing with the opioid crisis right now. one of the things i detail in 1982, rage" is that in when president ronald reagan first started talking about the drug crisis in the united states, even before there was a drug crisis in the united states about we are not going after drug traffickers. what we are going to do is set up treatment centers. you have a kind of treatment but when the crack eepdepemic hit, then you saw him come out in 1984 with his speech on the war of drugs and you saw a wave of legislation coming through that criminalized crack and made disparate sentencing where

you needed to have 100 times more powder cocaine that you needed for crack in order to get the same sentence. so that's where we see that understanding te about who really is a victim and we begin to see how race plays out in terms of the way that the society looks at the issues. from patrick, asks about the media here. the media have always been racism by in misinformation and selective information. what do you think? guest: yes. host: what examples do you see? guest:gu yes. i remember -- for instance, yes. dillon roof, the young white

man whowent into emmanual cme church during african american bible study was never defined as a terrorist in the media, even though he wanted to start a race war, even though he had a list in his car of other black churches where he was planning to commit these additional killings. never a terrorist, but as a troubled youth, as someone who might have some mental illness, and you never saw a discussion about what kind of people could raise him. es, in the killing of tamire rice, the 12-year-old boy up in cleveland where the police, he was playing with a toy gun in a park and the police rolled up on him and he was shot within three seconds. when the videotape came out to show the police officers account was highly inaccurate, in fact, they lied, what the media

focused in on was that there were like, what kind of child would be playing with a toy gun in a park? what kind of parents does he have? you started seeing headlines about rice's parents. that's that kind of example of the kind of disparate framing that we get in the media. host: brent calling from colinwood, tennessee. hi. caller: hello. been a while since i called c-span. i called when you had your 50th anniversary for the voting rights bill. anyhow, the question i had for the professor, professor anderson, i know i've seen her on c-span book t.v., she's -- her discussions about her book she's had on there. i'd like to

find out if she account elaborate on lynching specifically, i know i've been research, what little research that i've done that lynching, the term lynch or lynching actually comes from revolutionary war, a colonial judge, i think in virginia, ast name of lynch, who had this policy to be used against loyalists to lynch loyalists and take their prpt property. is that true? are many of the cities in this country like lynchburg, is that where the name comes from, is that related? and also -- ost: brent, let me let you go, you brought up a couple of points, we want other calls in. fair enough to brent, got a couple points in. go ahead. rol anderson guest: i don't know if the

roots of lynchburg, virginia, are because of lynching. i have read where lynching, in fact, does come from the colonialist in virginia. but one of the things that has happened is that while black people were property, killing them was not profitable. but once the civil war was over and you had emancipation, then part of what you see is a wave of lynching that happens in order to reign in this quest for freedom that black people had. one of the things, i talk about in "white rage," the key point is that is policy. it is not bad enough that the lynchings happened, but it is that they were sanctioned by policy, sanctioned by the court, allowed -- the killers were allowed to to that with absolutely no consequences, which made it normative. host: joyce from houston. welcome to the program, calling on the republican program for

carol anderson. hi. caller: hi. yes, first let me say that i am almost 84-year-old black senior citizen grandmother. you are talking about voter suppression. you know, it should be insulting to every black person that said we don't have, like we don't have sense enough to get a picture i.d. and the reason we don't want picture i.d. is because of voter fraud. i've worked in voting for years, witnessed so much fraud, i have reported it and nothing was done about it. that let me know there were peep nel high office that knew that this was going on and you know, you have to have a voter i.d. i went to get said we don't have, like we don't have sense enough to get a picture i.d. and the reason we a library card, i had to have picture i.d. to get a library card. when it come to voting, ki walk in there and vote and i

don't have to have picture i.d. this thing about the diva white man. the white man is not our problem. we are our problem and one of the main problems is break-up of that black family. when that black father was the head of the home, the jail house was not young black men and women and that is what we need to come to the realization that we are our own worst enemy. we kill more of each other than any other group, we are not dealing with that, we are dealing with it is the white man's fault or slavery. slavery is not our problem, the white man is not our problem, we are our problem. and you notice every time it is time for voting, you come up with this race stuff. if that is how the liberal democrats keep us under control is by our anger and emotion and once we come to the realization they are using us and we have been used for our vote for 50, 60, 70, 80 years and still complaining about what we do not have. we -- i didn't teach my children

to say we are victims. i taught my children they were victorious and as long as we say, you can't get this or can't do that, you are teaching them they are victims and that is what we need to stop doing. host: thank you for calling, we do understand the point. guest: yes. let me move through that. a law taught my children hey were victorious and as long as we say, you can't professor in california, in fact, looked at voter i.d. fraud, the kind of voter fraud he i.d.'s are supposed to stop and found 34 cases out of 1 billion votes from 2000 to 2014, that kind of voter fraud is not the issue. the kind of voter fraud that has sieged g.o.p. legislators is not the issue. and in for instance, in milwaukee, in wisconsin, up until march or april of this

year, they weren't even allowing military i.d.'s as acceptable government i.d.'s. it is a type of i.d., that is part of the shell game being played. and again, i mean, this -- what research is clear on or instance is that if you have a white man with a felony conviction and a college degree, has a better chance of getting a job than a black man with no felony conviction and a college degree. and when you're doing those kind of comparison, telling you something is at work. this isn't about victimization, it is about nowing what you are up against. i got to deal with this piece, too. one piece that came through for me in working on white rage was that black

people are fighting for education. we're doing what we're supposed to do and when we fight for education, these policies come up to undermine them. like when virginia shut down the public school system or prince edward county, we're voting. the fact that we actually voted, i mean really voted in 2008 and 2012, the response has been wave of massive voter suppression laws, that in fact were designed to reduce that vote. also, in terms of trug use, black people use drugs either less than or equal amounts, but are arrested at 10 times the amount. we need to understand how that works because that's real in this society. host: anna from desoto, texas, democratic caller. last call for this segment. hi, anna. caller: mrs. anderson, thank you so much for bringing forth

what a lot of the last caller from houston, texas, people forget we were republicans and eisenhower was the last one that we really truly voted for. there is a holiday called june 19th, and june-teen th, in texas, a lot of people that move into the state do people forget we were republicans and isenhower was the last one that we really not know what that means. we were the last one and parts of arkansas and louisiana to get freedom. slavery had been over two years before we were ever freed. sometimes we still have that mentality with us, education, mr. chavez, before us, i graduated from a segregated school. i look at school districts now, some of, for minority children, i got a better education under a segregated system, where black teachers told us what we needed to do, that you will always be

behind the eight-ball. you got to study harder. you got to work harder. and that is what is still going on today. and the people call in and talk about the bible and we're under a curse. i'm not under a curse and i will never teach my children or grandchildren that -- i have one great granddaughter that they are under a curse. texas state supreme court judge harriet murphy was my government teacher. she taught us how that we need to not think about the presidency, but about congress and the senate and that is where we're losing out and have you voter suppression, because congressmen and senators who are not doing their job are still in office and another thing when you talk about the media, we don't have ebony and essence magazine that talk

about, mr. johnson, if you wanted to know anything, emmett teal, 13 years old, he was killed, brutalized, mr. johnson put it in ebone magazine. we don't have that, we're talking about booty calls and all that now. that is the problem. host: thank you for calling, couple points, anything you want to respond to? guest: yes, one thing that happened with the brown decision decision. when the states finally, after about a decade or more of fighting brown, one first thing they did was fire the black teachers. and they were like, we will not have black teachers teaching white children. this becomes part of the policies that we're talking about that undermines african american access. host: moving forward, we've talked a lot about problems, history, episodes, moving forward, is there one thing this country can do to create better conditions for african americans, more equality?

guest: yes. one of the big things that needs to happen are that whites need to talk to whites about racism. because it is one thing to have a black person sitting up here talking, but usually it is like, okay, here we go again, right? but one thing we saw happening in this election, for instance, was that you had families divided. some were trump supporters, some weren't. one thing we saw was a lot of trump supporters, at that tima is really clear. issues of racism are strongly embedded in alliance with trump in support for trump. having that conversation about the real history of this nation, that is how we begin to move forward. understanding the cost that racism has placed on the united states in terms of our democracy, in terms of our economic strength. host: carol anderson, professor

of african american studies at emorwhereuniversity and author of "white rage, the unspoken truth of our racial divide," thank you for being on c-span. it. guest: thank you so much. [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2016]