creating personal tax simpleication and making u.s. businesses competitive, ok, where we have a very high business tax rate and worldwide income. you know, we're able to take the tax code and redesign things. >> on pharmaceutical costs. >> no one is dwrusing our meds sns the exchanges. i to think we need to reform the health care is the way it's delivered and the consequences will be with patients. >> there's some exciting things going on with resfect to clean coal technology across the globe. there's exciting things going on in the nuclear space. but not here. most of that is happening in europe because of the disincentives that we put into play in this country. if you really care about some of these environmental concerns nuclear ought to be in the mix.

>> i was sorry i never had a chance to reply which would have they had decided this was

someone i needed to meet. me in life.d help any e time, i myself by means was not looking that way, others were. ens,

eddie today and what did he do in his life. received a card from him on my birthday. than i am. older he went on to become one of the deans of the colleges. retired living in a very nice area, so it was quite surprise.t have life really could been very different had i not been introduced to him, and i have been introduced to him except members of my family were older and saw this was y that someone who could be helpful to me. he and i never lived within a and er mile of each other, he was a year older, so i would never have been in the same school, but hein was able to tell me things that didn't know, for example, he library for public life and atme in my

the time, i didn't know what a public library was and i didn't one of money to buy them. and he patiently explained it me, and somewhat reluctantly, took out a library card and bought a couple of books. and that was important to me because i had began to acquire on my own, reading years before i ever would have acquired it in the normal course events. >> what kind of books were you nterested in in those early days? >> oh, heavens. i remember reading the editions of dr. wonderland,alice and things like that, but i got into the habit of reading. other kids in the same neighborhood where i grew up, odds were against meeting that, as they were

for me, except others saw the introducing it. >> how long did you live in harlem? -- oh, i was 20 years old the first time i moved out of harlem, and then i came couple of years. up there from the age of 9 years old. >> besides eddie, what impact harlem and your family have on you other than the library? >> oh, i think a tremendous effect. i didn't realize it at the time. or example, when i was much older, and had a son of my own, first-time parents, i wanted to know when he was supposed to do these various asked one of the surviving members of the family: first begani when i to walk?

nd she said, oh, tommy, nobody knows when you could walk. somebody was always carrying you. an only child in a family of four adults. when i got to be too much for them, she could always hand me off to somebody else. one episode in particular that was recounted that ames in many years, member of the family took me to everything went fine. it was in a different part of town. it was only when we got back and the house where we lived, i picked up some rocks and throwing them at birdie. at the ave 4 years old most. and later on, she would tell that story and just laugh, you a little angel until i got back there. and in much later years i thought, you know, you could attitude when there's one child and four adults. way around, ther

one mother and four children, it as dn't have been nearly funny. >> you know, we talked about, and you always mentioned that liked to think things book h before you write a or a column and you're not in any hurry to have it published. final column. how long did you think that through and what kind of message did you leave at the end? i had two final ones. i don't think i took any longer ones.he other i had thoughts of not renewing my contract in previous years, wife always told me, you know, at the very least, you can off steam when things happened in the world that you don't like. but at this particular time, i yosemite g pictures at

with buddies of mine for four and i had not watched a television program or read a newspaper. thought this was the way to live. only way to live this way was to i p writing the column so don't have to be up-to-date on all the news and that's the biggest benefit. a television ing and silly programs come air, i can switch the program or turner classics, i it off because i feel no obligation to keep track of and those that things certainly don't do my blood pressure any good. on the : i know sitting alto, do campus in you remember having your first political thought or idea? mr.sowell: oh, heavens, yes.

i was 10 years old. really my idea but i ad heard that one was for the the poor.dr was i went around tearing down wilke harlem.in fortunately, there wasn't very i didn't waste much time on that. mr.sowell: did you consider a democrat? i was a registered democrat in the spring of 1972 last time and since then, i've never been a party red member of any and at that particular time, i wide both ust candidates i didn't vote at all and neither of those candidates as bad in e retrospect as the two candidates we had last year. go back to the

column and ask buthis paragraph. presidents.ng you're talking about could any that ent do anything like today, meaning it was john f. kennedy you'd been writing about and the soviet union and the trust people had in the after nt but you say richard lying, democrat nixon, lyndon johnson, especially destroyed not only their own credibility, but the which the office itself once conferred. the loss of credibility was a country.he why did you consider the johnson as lying presidencies presidencies? mr.sowell: nixon is obviously one.asy he lied about watergate. but in retrospect, the fact that nixon was so obviously lying i regard as a virtue. when you saw him on television, that turned out proved to be false, you could

see him sweating and so forth. take any great insight to know he was lying even before the evidence came out. lyndon inches, -- lyndon josh, there were so many things. into something completely overblown in order to give him power to go to war. but at the crucial time in that war after the offensive in 1968, the media all said this was the guerrillas communist ge isist in vietnam in 1961, and by communist leaders themselves after they had vietnam, was that the the cans had wiped out

guerrillas andviate kong. what came through the media viet kong guerrillas were succeeded against the and the war was unwinnable. if the public thinks the war is will make it unwinnable and lyndon johnson came on the air, perhaps told truth, a rare thing for him, and yet he was not believed and were ose in the media putting forth what turned out to false stories were believed and, therefore, all lost americans who had their lives in vietnam, winning victory after victory, all of tube because the the president didn't have credibility when he needed it. what's been the impact and watergate all of these years on the country? question, great cynicism by the public.

to kennedy in k 1962 and the missile crisis. fan of ver a big president kennedy, and he won very narrowly in 1960. air and he came on the told us that the russians were missiles, ut nuclear 90 miles from the united states, and he was taking us to the stop of nuclear war to them, i thought, you know, he's president. he's got to do what he's got to do. it was a very tense time. i was teaching at the time and i remember i was giving out the in gnment to the students class, i said, you know, the are next week and i my tongue to keep from saying there was a next week. and i as that confidence don't recall anybody raising any fuss for this man for taking this step that could have been death for millions, as he

well knew. oday, i don't think any president of the united states in the last 30-40 years, could and do that and have the public behind them. and that's not a problem for him. that's a problem for the country, if you have a president, he has to have the support, not for his sake.but for the public's mr. lamb: do you remember how you felt about watergate in the in. le of it all mr. sowell: yes. someone was trying to get me to accept a presidential appointment in the nixon asked meation and they -- send in my vita. you, i'm verytell disturbed about what's coming out about watergate and at some it necessary ind to criticize the president of guy nited states, and the at the white house said to me, om, if we let that stop us, we never will get these jobs

filled. resume. your mr. lamb: and what'd you do? mr. sowell: no, i decided i the job anyway. mr. lamb: while you're on that, back got some video of you 2005, talking about an offer you had in the ford administration. listen to this, they have to keep in mind when the story that there was a democratic senate at that time. let's listen to this, and you'll in 2005.you said back you the sident offered federal trade commissioner's job. president ford. mr. lamb: what were the circumstances? vacancy.ll: had a it was 1976 when they offered it to me and i agreed to take it on condition if there was any opposition that arises, i don't washington play games and i kept poll thering

and asking and the guys at the i don't hear anything, what's going on. h, no, it's taking time and eventually, i was in washington so i went up to the hill and staffer, this committee that handled this, and he said, going over your record fine-toothed comb. we could find nothing to object to, and therefore, we're not hearing.hold a this is an election year, and our guys will be elected and man. and i said did you tell the white house this? aid we told the white house this months ago. mr. lamb: and would you have cleared t job had they you in the senate? mr. sowell: you mean after learning this? mr. lamb: well, no. if the process had moved you agreed to go to the federal trade commission? mr. lamb: yes, i would have -- the first time it

no, ffered to me, i said and in the meantime, someone i new said, tom, you're always criticizing the federal trade commission. here's your chance to be a commissioner. i really should then. so i would have taken it. so it's not something i looked forward to. meant moving. any increase in in but it meant an increase the cost of living so it downsized me personally. to what i was just saying, i would have are gone and tried it. mr. lamb: your first job in was nment though considerably early than that, and what was it? gs2 sowell: oh, i was a clerk in the general accounting office back in 1950, and that step upward for me at the time. mr. lamb: that means that you gs2.a at gs1 and go up

to gs18. do in the u government and what impact did that have on your thinking today in. r. sowell: you mean the years before or afterwards? mr. lamb: afterwards. after you'd had the experience government? n the mr. sowell: it was not habit forming. here was a lot of double dealing and stuff going on. but by the time -- this is drafted and went into the marine corps. i came out, i went ack eventually to that job and now, i realize i had the gi bill back me up and i would now try to go to college. as a ever regarded that career thing. it was just something i would do. and it gave me a great deal of reedom because for one thing, there was a great example of freedom. the attorney days, general office had a unit that

was is shally all essentially all black and it was presided over a white woman from georgia and they had rules, another unit, if you were late, you signed a t or tardy, but in the unit that i was in, if you were late, they an hour's annual it.ve, and you signed for but i was planning to leave when the time was right and i was going to turn in my annual leave for money. i was not about to sign for that frankly, them, quite not only was i not going to sign but if they took the leave my signing, i would take my case up to the civil service commission. they immediately -- they knew they were but they egin with ealized if they did that, all hell would break loose and it was a political compromise. t rybody else had to sign a for tardy and i had to sign for

political leave. others, but many didn't believe me, that i must some secret in or know somebody. but that was the way it was. was, the thing it other people were career civil servants, so they knew not to waves. i really didn't care because i idn't plan to be there that long. mr. lamb: did you ever ask anybody why in the world they separate ideas about why somebody was late, why would do one with the whites and one with the black? mr. sowell: no. i think if you put a white woman from georgia in the 1950s in of a black unit, that's what you would expect to happen. mr. lamb: talking about your that you wrote at least in your columns for -- was services?

mr. sowell: creative syndicate. mr. lamb: syndicate. first column you wrote 30 years ago, at the end column i ever st wrote, 39 years ago, was titled doom.rofits of this was long before al gore made millions of dollars romoting global warming hysteria, back in 1970, the prevailing hysteria was the ice age. a new i tried to find that column on the internet. it's not there that i could find. is it available for any of us to read? mr. sowell: yes. published in the old "washington star" which as you know went out of business years ago, which i hope was not result of my column. and 's a book called "pink brown people" which is the first collection of my column that was published by the hoofer back in the early 1980s, and it's in there. print, i t's still in don't know.

mr. lamb: when you wrote your last column, did you go back and read it? mr. sowell: i did not. but i remember it because it was and i did t comment not know i would be writing it regularly. star" had a ton feature where ordinary readers ould write in and send in a column and that was the first time i ever tried it and they it, so d it as i wrote that was the beginning. mr. lamb: your undergraduate school? as from what mr. sowell: harvard. mr. lamb: you started at howard harvard? ent to mr. sowell: that's right. mr. lamb: your masters degree was from columbia? mr. sowell: yes. and your ph.d. at chicago. what was your dissertation about? mr. sowell: it was called hays law, a statistical analysis. wrote it as a book published university press. mr. lamb: i got on amazon and

counted the number of pportunities to buy something with your name on it, and i at 57. stopped but i know those are all kinds essays, butincluding how many actual books have you completed since you started them? mr. sowell: oh, my goodness. i've been asked that question. i've never actually counted them. partly because it depends on what you mean there, books that are original books. books that are collections of previous writings and so on and mono graphed and so forth. i've never really tried to few dozen.but it's a mr. lamb: at this point, which one of all of those books sold most? mr. sowell: basic economics. not only sells the most but in english, and translated into seven or eight languages. say amb: what would you would be the most important thing or things that people who will learn? k

mr. sowell: oh, my gosh. that is tough. i guess they'll learn what economics is all about, which is topics,n the sum of the and in the first chapter i point -- i at economics really from ate on a definition the london school of economics. economics is the study of scarce resources which have alternative uses. in other words, there was no den omics in the garden of e availableerything was in unlimited quantities. but i think in thinking enerally, economics or otherwise, too many people do not begin by saying, what are constraints of the situation we're talking about, and they act as if they're god creation andday of can follow whatever policy that are best.m

when each of us enters the orld, it is already completely elaborative and complex before we ever got here. so you make your decisions context.at and if you don't think of it way, you can have all sorts of utopian notions. one example, from time to time, people complain, you now, that george washington, condoned ferson, slavery. slavery was there for centuries george washington and thomas jefferson was born and many people thought the office presidency had any power to do something about it. lincoln was able to do something it. he did so not only as president but as commander in and did it in war rebellion ho were in against the united states. terms of 't think in the things confronting people

who made decisions, nothing this in a day to say oh, this should have been done, hat should have have been done and that's not taking the past as it was. it's treating the past as if present, taking place in earlier times, and that is not the case. when yale university ook the name john calhoun off one of their buildings, what was your reaction? my gosh, by this time, i had given up all hope or the academic world, and so practically nothing surprised me anymore. again, look g to, retrospectively, whatever reason it name was put on there, was there and i don't know anything that has happened since any that's made calhoun better or worse than he was when that decision was made. go back, going to first, you're so desperate for rievances that you have to go back into history to find them,

that really says something. about the e talked impact of vietnam and watergate on the country. what about the impact of slavery country? mr. sowell: great in any number of ways. the question is -- the thing that always gets me is that the past, whatever the, good, bad, terrible, it's irrevocable, and the only thing we have any the present r are and the future. and nothing that we do -- i was pained to learn that, merkel in angela germany felt a need to take in in order to help germany live down the terrible record of hitler. ever going to change what hitler did, nothing. all you can do is do things that will have an effect on the president in the future and the policies in the

present and the future has been disastrous and there's no reason believe they're going to be any less disastrous in the future. mr. lamb: i want to go back and video of you in before the ing united states senate judiciary committee about robert bourque. 30 seconds. >> this may be the most important supreme court omination of our time, not simply because the present court is so closely divided or even judge bourque is the most highly qualified nominee of because ration, but this is an historic crossroad as expanding power of judges, which is to say the rosion of people's rights to govern themselves democratically. mr. lamb: why did you testify here, and what impact did the rejection of robert bourque have on the rest of the judiciary years? e i testified because

the gross distortions that were out.g i was listening to the congressional hearing of the day how bourque was at the very least racially opposed ve or actually to civil rights and so forth, and then i would go to the law library and check out judge bourque's record and record before he became a judge, and i discovered in those curae papers on the civil rights organizations. i learned that no civil rights dvocates had ever lost a case in judge bourque's court, and i as already familiar with bourque's record before i even looked into the law because i and i ching economics often read things he wrote about antitrust law, which were things.t

o enormously intelligent man, enormously decent man, and all sorts of other filth was brought up. example, he had worked for big corporations, you see, because money was more important to him. bourque was academy -- which was a big buck enterprise to get rich quick -- and a government of which the same could be said. at the particular time he went to work at a high salary in business, his wife was dying of cancer, and he wanted to have her last days ke as comfortable as he possibly could. for that to be turned into some kind of cheap, political was truly despicable. ore than that, the difference of one man on the supreme court is divided is enormous. an opinionime i read by justice anthony kennedy, that washy and incoherent in

ome cases, i think that that's the price of defeating judge bourque, because he was a replaceme replacement. mr. lamb: what else? what is your take on the supreme court today just as an institution after all these years? very dicey.oh, it's and what's dicey are the freedoms that depend upon courts enforce the constitution or whether they go ff on their own social adventures. i think the greatest with this court as chief justice roberts disregarding the 10th amendment and finding some terribly clever it and declaring obamacare constitutional. 10th amendment says that the government has only such powers -- the federal government such powers as are specifically designated to it. either other powers belong to state governments or

belong to people themselves. here is no power for the federal government to tell people what kind of medical insurance they have to buy, even prefer something else. ut because i have no idea what terribly clever reasons the chief justice might have had, knock down the 10th amendment, there's really nothing the government can't to do.s mr. lamb: here's another clip talked out in pallo alto in 2005. brief, only 20 seconds.o alto in 2005. it's very brief, only 20 seconds. your want you to give us reaction of what you said then, 9/11 on this country and the world. mr. sowell: oh, my gosh. again. never be the same i'm disappointed in people who seem to realize it's not anymore. as usual that it's really -- there are things we have to do that we don't want to do, but the is far worse.

that was actually 2005, and here we are 12 years later. what would you say today if the asked? stion was mr. sowell: i think i'd combiv the same answer, and i'd be more pprehensive today, because the previous administration has now iven iran the go ahead to develop nuclear weapons, and ran is testing intra continental missiles. now, the thing they're supposed to do is attack israel. srael is closer to iran than boston is to denver, all right. don't need intercontinental missiles.o attack intercontinental missiles who are on another question and it's no who would be the target if they

decided to go that route and i done we're doing what was in the western powers of the 1930s as hitler was building up his war machine. you're going day-to-day, taking the easy path, avoiding the hard on the assumption that somehow or another, you will came through, and they very close to not muddling through. france, was, was conquered world war ii. and one of my columns recently, ay have been one of the last ones, i suggested that people who want to understand what's today ng in the world should read a book called "the gathering storm" which is not today. it's about the 1930s. see this kind of rifting in the face of fatal dangers, you understand what kind of thinking is going on or on of thinking is going today in the way we're

approaching the kinds of dangers which are far w, worse. most people don't understand that for the first three years the western ii, powers never won a single literally, either in europe or asia. they were beaten time and again viivists in the had gotten their way preventing an adequate build up because the orces men had lost their lives in world war ii. point, the , at some west learned their lesson. the united states entered with remendous productive capacity and was able to supply itself, britain, and the soviet union with the power and the weapons defeat the nazis and later, the japanese. going to have that kind of time in a nuclear war. you're not going to have three around and get beaten and then come back. we'll be lucky if we have a year beaten and still come

back. mr. lamb: the gathering storm as in said in that late column december was written by winston churchill. is there anybody today in your opinion besides what you just aid that is suggesting that we have got to worry about the gathering storm in public life? r. sowell: oh, there are people -- you mean holding some official position? mr. lamb: yeah, people that you respect? i've well: not that noticed. and winstonet too -- one century.o in ronald reagan would be the closest analogy and of course gone. one of the inherent constraints what ch you're operating, can do you within those constraints? i think of reagan, the thought f building up nuclear weapons in eastern europe and pointing at western europe and reagan responded by sending in american nuclear weapons in western

europe pointing at eastern europe. eople were horrified saying this man is going to get us into a war. we'll be annihilated. disregarded them completely and instead of getting us into a war, he war to an end.d people who lived through the cold war with the fear of annihilation hanging over us all that time have no idea what a feat that was, and did it without firing a single shot at the soviet union. know, he -- you was -- i don't think he was ever considered for a peace prize. nobel w, you don't get a peace prize for having produced peace. a nobel peace prize for saying the kinds of things that committee he nobel think are going to prove out to peace. such asugh those things the qualities of chamberlain, in prime minister of britain to the0s, said which led

war. mr. lamb: you've been retired from writing your column. have you paid attention to what's going on in this country and the world? r. sowell: oh, not nearly as closely as before. none of it is truly encouraging, however. well, i won't say that. administration in washington has some very good better than i think most recent administrations have had and in the top positions. whether thestion is president listens to them, and until, you 't know know, a lot more time has passed. mr. lamb: i want to completely we're talking about to something that you seem to enjoy and it's important to you you mentioned when you took your four days off and went toiostoi yosemite with your friends and did your photography. we'll show some of it in a but how long have you been doing photography?

mr. sowell: i took my first picture in 1950. and then when the results came back from the drug store, i was point on.d from that previously, i had been thinking of becoming an artist. used to do a lot of sketching and so forth. o i had a sense of, you know, design and, you know, art and so on. nd then when i was in the marine corps, the marines sent to naval photography school at the naval air station and i got professional training. went away got out and to harvard, i worked for the office as a ws photographer in order to help pay the bill. the perfect job because it was something i could time.never i had the not just the taking of pictures, but when the photographer in always had more

negatives than he had time to print them. awake at ppened to be 2:00 a.m. for some reason, wasn't going back to sleep, i to the news office, let myself in, and print the negatives he had on his desk for hime it on the desk and tell him my time so i'd be aid but it was just a great job. mr. lamb: for the audience, i can see you, you can't see me, nd you're not going to be able to see these photographs, but i ant to throw one up on the screen. i know we have a list you're oing to look at and the first one i think is yosemite. is that el cap tan? that's el capitan. 5 lindhoff 4 by 75 millimeter lens on it. mr. lamb: when did you take that. mr. sowell: that, i don't remember. i went digital so

it was towards the end of the 1900s. and the next photo is a water fall. mr. sowell: yes. mr. lamb: do you remember that. oh, i think it's -- i think it's yellowstone lower falls in yellowstone national park. mr. lamb: this appears it's and white. mr. sowell: oh, black and white, then it was not yellow stone. i know. in would be yosemite falls i believe, because i think there was snow on the ground. your mb: how much of photography is black and white or color? and white or ack color when you're doing photography? mr. sowell: i like both, but most of s doing film, it was black and white. and now that i'm digital, most of it is color. color film can be very delicate so when i traveled with olor film, i had to take along a cooler i could plug into the

car to keep it cool. i was traveling and then i'd into a hotel t room or outlet when i got there, because the colors will change film sit the color out in the warm weather. but fortunately, with digital, difference. ke any mr. lamb: the third photo is a on the chair.ting mr. sowell: yes, yes. mr. lamb: she's about 3 or 4 years old. who that is? mr. sowell: i know, but i'm not going to mention the name. she is now a retired lady. mr. lamb: when did you take this picture? mr. sowell: oh, back in the 1950s. i believe -- in fact, i'm almost oh, it it was before -- was probably after i went into the marine corps. because i know what camera i with.t it was a bush preslin, and i and so on.ns that would have been still in the early 1950s. r. lamb: is there any way of calculating how much you

ad -- i mean i don't need to know the dollar amount, if you spent a lot of extra money that ou had on photography over the years and has it been an expensive hobby? r. sowell: it's really my only extravagance. 'm not big on clothes or other luxuries. my wife doesn't wear jewelry and stuff. this is my only thing. i will say when i finally decided to go completely digital and sold all my photographic to a local camera over $10,000aid me usedhat was, at that time, equipment and some of it obsolete. so i must have spent an awful more than that when i bought it originally. mr. lamb: here's a photograph of playing on the beach in the water. mr. sowell: oh, yes. mr. lamb: where's that? santa ell: that's the monica beach in southern california. camera was a quinnsland

mira 330.led a la i was probably on the boardwalk, santa monica boardwalk looking down at them and i saw the picture and just took it. what have you done with all of your photographs? all? you cataloged them are you going to give them to somebody? mr. sowell: no. negatives.e i have a few that are prints. of them, the t ones i really like, i have home.g on the walls in my negative print. my first negative in my file was people 1948 of picketing the white house when truman was president. the years, d over how many different kinds of cameras have you used? my gosh.l: oh, at one time, i had a dozen simultaneously, and

there's obviously been turnover. struggle along with just six. mr. lamb: what kind of cameras now? of my pictures with d3x's.on sony have a couple of cameras. and a couple of other miscellaneous. photograph of's a a gentleman painting with a cigar in his mouth. mr. sowell: oh, yes. that's greenwich village in 1952 was a rolo cord. mr. lamb: when you take a icture of somebody like this, do you have to get permission to use it? mr. sowell: i hope not because i his permission. [laughter] mr. lamb: here's an aerial shot falls, andike niagara my first question is how did you

get this picture. a helicopter.om now, at some times, i've helicopter for this purpose but in this case there was already an existing got on er service so i for the heck of it, explored around niagara falls and simply window. picture out the r. lamb: have you sold any of your photographs? mr. sowell: not really. some had been published -- there a picture i took of a lady who was an academic and somebody did some kind of feature about her and requested a copy of this photograph. to the lady in question and when they were interviewing, asked if they go d use it, and said sure, ahead. i put one on the cover of a book of mine. fortunately, that book was out a year. inside of a lamb: i want to show

photograph of the golden state bridge and the cars coming and from what angle. how did you get this photograph? an sowell: there's observation area near the golden nikon bridge and i had my and had a 500 to 900 mill that photo and i was using for that picture. mr. lamb: what are you looking for when do you photography. i'm looking for somebody that makes an interesting scene and i see it go take it. sometimes i preplan. in looking through old pictures yellowstone national park, before i ever went there, i saw lower yellowstone alls and thought, my gosh, i'm sure i could take a picture better than that and i went i ere, set it up, and i think did take a better picture than that. told me i was there for

two hours. she brought along a large book she does on these occasions. i was amazed she told me i'd there from two hours. i took the picture from every with every position conceivable camera and lens combination. mr. lamb: how long have you been arried and where did you meet your wife? i've been married 36 years, and i like to say i got my wife because of affirmative action, that i had written an article about affirmative which she read in palo complained to a mutual friend that she really i had said and thought i was wrong. he said, well, you know, he's right here in palo alto. of you get e two together for lunch and work out your differences? lunch.we got together for we have not worked out our differences to this day. [laughter] a turn in other

directions mr. lamb: does she agree with all? litically at mr. sowell: on a lot of things but, of course, no wives and things. agree on all mr. lamb: what would be your advice after all these years of marriage where you've married that didn't have the exact political views? how do you deal with it? heavens, i'm not one of those people that think baze rk because differently than someone else. my heavens, it's pathetic that that the adays think fact that they disagree with somebody is a reason to go riot and destroying virtually, just recently, the latest among any number of similar incidents the country. mr. lamb: we have one last photograph, and that is an stanfordew you took of university, right where you are now. from what angle were you when picture? his mr. sowell: i was in a

helicopter that i chartered, and the campus ew over and took the pictures. mr. lamb: and after all these -- mr. sowell: obviously, a camera. mr. lamb: the tower that we see is the hoover institution. is. sowell: yes, it mr. lamb: now, you've been there how long? 1980, which since would be -- oh, my heavens, gosh. my mr. lamb: it's about 36 years, 37 years. stanford changed since you've been on that campus? r. sowell: you know, i had one of the least informed persons you could have found on what stanford campus. i took the job at the hoover institution rather than another me back was offered to east mainly, because by this time, i was thoroughly disgusted academic world. teach again.ed to

and the hoover institution was the perfect place for me because a place i low me could do the work i wanted to do, research and writing and so on. and have absolutely nothing to do with the rest of their campus that's been the policy the entire time i've been here and and most the happiest productive part of my career. mr. lamb: there is something -- i wondered if you this, something on twitter called thomassowell. aware of that. mr. sowell: someone told me that. i'm not sure i looked at it. i'm not he said, thomas sowell, but i own all his books. back to you a couple of quotes he has tweeted out to followers. you have over 70 to 80,000 followers reading your work. who reade: most people

the communist manifesto probably are no idea it was written by a young men who had never worked a day in their lives and who nevertheless spoke boldly in the name of the workers. similar off spring of inherited repeatedly provided the leadership of radical movements, with similar retenses of speaking for the people. marx? t your book on mr. sowell: no, it was -- no, i have put k i would things like that in that particular book, which was really a study of the history of ideas. were you ever a marxist? r. sowell: oh, yes, during my 20s. fortunately, unlike today's i never felt that i had to avoid seeing what people with different views thought. a ing all my years as marxist, i'd read everything across the political spectrum. have to this day a book on burke that i first read when i

was an undergraduate at harvard, book.treasure that i could tell even then. so i understood that there were reasons why people had different see today. it's not just the -- it's not just a question of being on the of the angels against the forces of evil. mr. lamb: here's another tweet. words.are your racism is not dead but it is on ife support kept alive by politicians, race hustlers, and people who get a sense of othersrity by denouncing as racist. mr. sowell: yes. suspect that there are millions of americans who would whole ified if the subject of race simply vanished into thin air because they're it, but earing about there are people for whom this is a very lucrative business. amazed at how little attention was paid to the fact al sharpton owes the

federal government millions of taxes. in you don't owe millions of dollars in taxes unless you've dollars in s of income. nd the question is, how does this man, you know, ever get into a position to make millions race lars other than by hustling? mr. lamb: one more tweet, you ill never understand bureaucracies until you understand that for bureaucrats, rocedure is everything and outcomes are nothing. if you have living in a world here outcomes are everything, you may have a very hard time understanding bureaucrat or practices. mr. sowell: yes, yes. i know from time to time, my amazed at some of the foolish things that are done by the government. ut if you understand bureaucracy, it makes perfect that -- i'll give you an example. a tripars ago, i went on in which i turned my expenses

ver to the university for reimbursement, and no one at the university questioned any of the expenditures, but someone decided that i should not be reimbursed for the collision of renting a car from one of the agencies, because clause that it covers that, and so on. and i was so outraged that i hoover the head of the institution, and he had better things to do than this. mid-year raise collision nt of the damages. so he could get this thing off back. but those people who did that why was id, you know, there four days for this event? and the answer was a lot of things. there's no need to even say that. so as long as they have paper, happy, you know. and so

they seize upon these little utterly at are inconsequential and let everything else go by. that far you're not away from your 87th birthday. -- and you intend to do this sounds like a crazy question but for the rest of what do you want to accomplish? what's your so-called bucket list for the rest of your life? mr. sowell: i'd be happy if i could finish up all the things i have currently going, which a project.ite right now, i've already finished the third edition of my book on politics. months ago, my assistants were so busy they haven't had a to work on that and put print. mr. lamb: so you've got a book coming out soon? soon.well: not and i don't even have a time table, because i find the way for me to work is to

tell no one, not even my agent, what i'm working on. and when it's all finished and i then send the finished my agent and leave it with her. he knows to call me back when she has an offer. mr. lamb: our guest for the last sowell. been dr. thomas he's sitting on the stanford ampus where he has an office but he writes a lot out of his home. people a lot to read, if are interested in reading your books. thank you very much for joining us. mr. sowell: thank you for having [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. . sit ncicap.org] >> for free transcripts or to thisus your comments about

program, visit us at q-and-a.org. also available at c span podcasts. week's ou enjoyed this q&a interview with thomas sowell, here are other programs like.ght our 2005 interview with mr. sowell on politics, his books a conservative african-american. george mason university walter s professor williams talking about his life and libertarian views. talk showvative radio host mark levin discussing his his books and politics. you can watch these anytime or entire video library c-span.org. next, live, your calls and comments on "washington journal." live at noon, the house

gavels in for general speeches business at 2:00 p.m. eastern. >> tonight on "the ommunicators" we visit the state of the net conference and peak with matt li ra, senior majority lead tore kevin ccarthy and the ceo and cofounder of cyberreason and see how they're answering questions and security. >> technology is so fundamentally challenging to our entire economy and the overnment has no choice but to perfect that reality and it will. i don't think we've ever been this much but we have been through it in democracy in an e quarian and it survived and thrived and, in fact, i would improved lot of ways upon itself in an industrial are at that same

flexion point between an industrial economy, however onal economy, you want to phrase it, that creates an amazing opportunity as a st to survive democracy but to create a more perfect union. i believe that the cyber a urity agenda in general is super important agenda that eeds to be pushed and the reason is that cyber security is ot a problem that it was in technology and it will be gone. cyber security is a problem that to stay. >> watch the communicators eastern on c-span 2. > this morning, washington examiner correspondent gabby mo lewis preview ke with the hill and white house and congress. mihm from christopher the government accountability about programs to

waste, fraud and abuse. as always, we'll take your calls and you can join the conversation at facebook and twitter. "washington journal" is next. host: a foggy morning on capitol hill, as the new week for congress. judge neil divorce up will face a path to his defeat. the a vote on his noam nation will be later today. we'll talk about it this morning on the "washington journal," but we begin our program today where the house left off ated end of last week orkt topic of healthcare. in the wake of that highly charged debate over the failed effort to repeal and replace the affordable care act, we have a broader question about your view on healthcare. should healthcare in this country be considered a right that should be guaranteed for all americans?