left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right. on wednesday, angela day -- angela j davis, poison the black man. cliff stearns with his book life in the marble palace. praise of folly. 29,, on friday, december digital world war, islamist, extremist and the play for cyber supremacy. then on saturday, december 30th, jessica brewer with her book, no mental and, surviving america in the 21st century. on sunday, december 31, chris whipple with the gatekeepers, how the white house chief of staff defined every presidency. authorton journal's series all this week at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span, c-span.org and c-span radio. c-span, where history unfolds daily. in 1979, c-span was created as a

public service by america's cable television companies and is brought to you today by your cable or satellite provider. >> this week on q&a, the heritage foundation distinguished fellow, lee edwards. that is followed by washington journal, live at 7:00 with your -- >> this week on "q&a," heritage foundation distinguished fellow, lee edwards. he discusses his memoir "just right: a life in pursuit of liberty." ♪ host: lee edwards, your new book "just right." what do want somebody to take away? mr. edwards: i want them to realize that barry goldwater was far more than just somebody who voted against the civil rights act of 1964. that he was, in fact, the most consequential loser in american politics. i want them to come away, hopefully, with an idea that ronald reagan was not amiable dunce. but actually an intellectual who is very comfortable with ideas.

i would like them to come away with an appreciation of bill buckley. sometimes we get caught up in his style, but he was also a very serious man who could have been the playboy of the western world, but chose, as a put it in the book, to be the st. paul of the conservative movement. to evangelize on behalf of conservatives and throughout his life, some 60 years. host: you say in the book you are now designated as the longest living conservative and -- conservative in a country who has been active in politics. what year did it start for you that you were active in politics? mr. edwards: it would have started in 1960 with the republican national convention, which i attended. i was an editor of "the young republican national" newspaper.

that was the first of some 11 or 12 national conventions i attended. that is when i got into it. that same year is when we founded young americans for freedom. that had a profound effect on politics in this country. host: let's go down the list quickly, everything you have done, without explanation. then we can come back to some of these things. besides helping to found young americans for freedom, what is next? mr. edwards: i was also there at the founding of the american conservative union, which was 1964, which occurred after the goldwater. host: mr. edwards: --host: next. mr. edwards: then i would say that i founded my own public affairs firm in 1965 because i had been in the barry goldwater presidential campaign starting in 1963 when i was working with the draft goldwater committee,

then the goldwater for president committee. host: how long did you have your own firm? mr. edwards: 20 years. host: what did you do other than that firm during those 20 years? mr. edwards: from time to time i was writing. i was writing a weekly column, which i syndicated myself. i did write a couple of books, a good one called "you can make a difference" with my wife. it was the first political handbook for conservatives. i also wrote a little book called "rebel peddler," which was about a young millionaire salesman down in north carolina, and how he was motivated by positive latitude to become a billionaire and try to get the people working for him to become billionaires as well. host: after those 20 years in pr, your own firm, what was next? mr. edwards: in 1984, 1985, frankly, brian, i was burned out. i had been working hard and enjoying it very much. working for political people like bob dole, the white house,

republican national committee, then a whole bunch of conservative organizations. the american conservative union and so forth. i was just tired. i had been thinking and really wanting to go back to school and teach. i wanted to be a teacher at the college level. to do that, i had to go back to school. so, i enlisted at the catholic university of america, and it took me five years, but i got a phd in world politics. so that was what enabled me to begin teaching at a catholic university. i will be starting my 31st year of teaching at catholic university in january of 2018. host: i want to put on the screen a photograph of something located very near where we are sitting right now and ask you about it, because you write a lot about it. this is a photograph of what?

mr. edwards: this is a bronze replica of the goddess of democracy statue, which was first corrected in the papier-mache formed by pro-democracy chinese students in june of 1989. it became a symbol of freedom, the desire for freedom, and a part of those young chinese. it also became a symbol of what a totalitarian regime would do to stamp out freedom, liberty and calls for democracy. no sooner was that statue erected, the original one in 1989, then when was that takes an troops killed under maybe thousands of students. therefore, when we decided to build a memorial, a memorial to all the victims of communism, and that is 100 million people. that is probably a conservative estimate. we take that estimate from the black book of communism. it was published by harvard university.

we decided we would do this. but to do it, we had to overcome a really wide, wide variety of obstacles. host: where did it start, what year and was it your idea? mr. edwards: as a matter of fact, it was not my idea. it was january of 1990. it was some two months after the berlin wall had come down. i was having brunch with my wife and our daughter, elizabeth. i was fretting already that people were forgetting about why we had fought the cold war. people were forgetting about the victims of communism and the crimes of communism under the soviets and the chinese, and many other countries and regimes. so i said, we have to do something. ann said, you know what we need, we need a memorial to the victims of communism. it was her idea. i merely picked up a paper napkin and wrote on it, memorial

victims of communism. the next day, i called an old comrade in arms and said, would you join me in this great adventure to build a memorial for the victims of communism? that was 1990. it took us some 17 years. we had to negotiate the 24 steps, which are called for by public law if you want to build a memorial in washington d.c. host: who sets those 24 standards? mr. edwards: that was done by the national park service with congressional approval. host: if you go by your statue

and stand in one particular location, you can see the capital of the united states. what makes you think anybody pays any attention to this when they drive by? mr. edwards: we know that they do because they stop, they will pause, there is a lot a foot traffic. this is mass avenue, new jersey avenue, two blocks from union station and four blocks from the u.s. capitol. by the way, on the top of the capital is the statue of freedom. that was a deliberate choice on our part to put our democracy of freedom there, so you can also see the statue of freedom on top of the u.s. capitol. we know also that national leaders from all over the world, the baltics, eastern and central europe, taiwan and many other countries come to that place. they lay a wreath, they say it -- they say a prayer.

not only that, but every year in june, on the anniversary of ronald reagan's famous mr. gorbachev tear down this wall speech, we have a public event. this past june, some 22 embassies came with representatives, laid a wreath and were joined by some 25 ethnic groups, chinese, korean, cambodian, laos and so forth, cuban and also laid wreaths. this has become, for foreign leaders, our memorial port of call. they will go to the state department and very often they will come to our statue. host: where was len from? mr. edwards: he was born in america but his parents were ukrainian. we worked with the national cap diggnation -- national captive nations committee for a number of years. it was very natural but i would go to him.

he would help and made a significant contribution. host: right after john adams book by david mccullough was written, he led a group to find a place to put a john adams memorial somewhere near the mall. it is not happening, it is not there, so, there are hundreds of statues around washington -- how much did it cost? mr. edwards: it cost about $1 million to build it, to lay the -- to do the bronze replica, to lay the marble for the space there and so forth. it does not sound like very much, but believe me, trying to raise $1 million for a memorial to the victims of communism is no easy task. the government, by congressional resolution, gave us the land.

about one third of it. about a third of an acre. host: who led that in the congress? mr. edwards: it was bipartisan, it was jesse helms in the senate, dana rohrabacher in the house, bob torricelli, who was a liberal democrat in the house. dana rohrabacher furry -- very conservative republican. jesse helms was held off by liberal democrats. it was bipartisan from the very beginning. that was something we always insisted upon. host: what was the first step? mr. edwards: the first step was to get a congressional resolution saying that this should be built. we had to go to that, drawing upon the support and the help of someone like tom lantos, a marvelous liberal democrat from california, holocaust survivor, the only one ever to serve in congress, and later chairman of

the house foreign affairs committee. having his support was important. there we had dana rohrabacher and tom lantos together for this project. that helped us to get it approved. it was approved unanimously by the u.s. congress. host: by that time had you raised money? mr. edwards: we had begun raising money. host: where did the first money come from? mr. edwards: the first money came from ethnic americans, vietnamese americans, lithuanian americans, hungarian americans. host: how did you get them to

give you money? mr. edwards: we went to them through the contacts that we had made through the national captive nations committee. we knew foundations, we knew individuals who would be interested in our project. frankly, also, we went through various lists which were accumulated over the years of conservatives, who were not only conservative, but anti-communist. step-by-step, year by year, we were able to do it. we had to get, for example, our design approved by three different commissions. host: three different commissions under what -- mr. edwards: these were three federal commissions dealing with monuments in washington d.c. host: three federal commissions. mr. edwards: yes, they had to sign off on the fact of the design and the existence of it. we had to convince them that this was really an american, as well as an international and global memorial. we had to point out to them that we fought the cold war against communism for 47 years. coming out of that were all kinds of victims. we had to point out to them how many people had died under mao, under stalin, under fidel

castro. all of these facts and figures had to be brought together to convince these commissions that there was a reason to have a memorial to the victims of communism. host: how did you decide, or try to decide where your spot would be? mr. edwards: we had several different places. finally, glen with the national park service joined us by massachusetts avenue and new jersey right on the corner from the georgetown law center. he said, this is something, what about this? love it, because there were thousands of cars going by. there was not a lot of residential people there around. therefore, we had to worry about getting people who lived in an apartment to approve the site. finally, we discovered it was not good enough. all of these various commissions had signed off. we had to get the approval of a

neighborhood commission. 6c. i said, how do we do that? the key guy is mr. thomas. we have got to get him. he is directly responsible for this plot of land. i said, where is he? in a nursing home. we called up, made an appointment on a sunday afternoon. we visited mr. thomas. he came in this wheelchair and he was african-american. we did not know that before we arrived. i am thinking, how can i convince an african-american politician to sign off on this? we began talking. host: why were you suspicious that he would not sign off? mr. edwards: just that, what was

his background? did he even know what communism was? did he know who stalin was or mao was? it was a sure thing he knew who dr. martin luther king was, but did he know who joseph stalin was? host: did he? mr. edwards: for two and a half hours we sat there, we stood and he sat, talking. we developed he had marched with martin luther king, a critical ally of mary m barry here in washington dc. at the end of two and a half hours, we are just about exhausted. he looked up and said, i just want to tell you one thing, i don't like communism. host: could he have stopped it? mr. edwards: yes, he could have. two days later, this was sunday, tuesday, he introduced a resolution at that neighborhood commission approving the building of a memorial at that spot. host: was he there the day you -- mr. edwards: he was there and personally introduced the resolution. he made a commitment that i will never, never forget his contribution. host: is he alive? mr. edwards: no. not anymore. host: what are the other major steps in this process? when did you -- i know from reading your book that you

thought you would get 500,000, you had one million. when did you realize it would cost more? mr. edwards: i would say -- we started incorporating the victims of communism memorial foundation, because you have to have an organization to be responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of the memorial. host: who pays for that? mr. edwards: we did and we still are in perpetuity. the parks service is -- they're looking on, but the direct responsibility for it is ours. the foundation. host: but you had to give money to the national park service, which has no responsibility? mr. edwards: this is for if something major occurs, like an earthquake or a bolt of lightning, then they will step in. the day to day, week to week thing, making sure things are clean, polished and so forth, all of that is done by us. it came down to -- we thought we had raised enough, then all of a sudden another hundred thousand. it came down to the fact that we had to raise $75,000 more. this was in 2006. we founded and dedicated it in 2007. i thought, where will we get the

money? i remembered that jesse helms chief of staff was a man named carl anderson, and that carl had become the supreme knight of the knights of columbus. host: catholic organization. mr. edwards: the largest catholic organization in america. worked for jesse helms, a hardshell baptist. i thought, maybe we could get jesse to write to carl to send us a check for $25,000, which we had asked for. contacted the office, and it turned out that senator helms had fallen on bad times in terms of his health, and he was in a nursing home and was in taking -- and wasn't taking visitors

anymore. his daughter said ok, draft me a letter and i will see what i can do. she called a couple of days later, he approved it, mailed it to carl anderson. we heard nothing for a week. after two weeks, i was getting very, very apprehensive about what was going to happen here. in the mail came a letter, wonderful letter from carl anderson and a check for $25,000. i would like to say that divine providence brought together a hardshell baptist and the most prominent catholic person in -- catholic lay person in america to make this coming. to me that proves that this is something that is really part of what ronald reagan used to call, "the divine plan." the dp. host: was there anybody that opposed the idea of doing this in the congress? mr. edwards: there were a couple

of people who, in the debate said, well, do we really need another memorial? somebody even said, should we have memorials to the victims of capitalism? there was a little bit of kick back like that. when the final vote came, it was unanimous. even those who raised, very small number of people, and by the way, this was a democratic congress. this was 1993, so it was a democratic congress and it was signed into law by bill clinton. both a democratic congress dominated, and a democratic president approved it and enabled it to move ahead. host: how much time do you think you spent on this? mr. edwards: i think in years, probably about 14 years, which we found out was about the average time that it takes to build a memorial. that is the average, about 14 years host: are there other memorials in this town that have the same kind of situation as yours? mr. edwards: they are all built by private money. that is part of the law. no federal funds. the holocaust memorial museum was built with private funds. the land was ceded to them by congress, by the government.

but to build the incredible structure was done by private funds. host: their other ukrainian monuments around town that you cite in the book. the one down at 22nd and p, why so much of that and does the average american coming here to visit ever pay attention to this stuff? mr. edwards: i think the average american would not, but we did some polling and we found out there are about 30 million americans of an ethnic background from eastern and central europe, even from china, from cuba, and that represents a sizable percentage of the american population. when they come to washington d.c, whether in high school, college or whatever, they're interested in visiting these kinds of memorials. this also represents what america is about. it is a nation of immigrants. it is a nation of many different backgrounds. many different social kinds of approaches to life. it seems to me that having memorial to the victims of communism, the 100 million victims, may be the most appropriate memorial that there is in washington, outside of the american ones like the washington monument, jefferson and so forth.

host: i want to show you video from opening day ceremony, this is president george w. bush. former president bush: the men and women could chosen an image of repression for the it a replica of a wall that once to divided berlin, or a field littered with skulls. instead they chose in image of hope. a woman holding a lamp of liberty. she reminds us of the victims of communism and also of the power that overcame communism. host: what is the story of how you got the president to do this? mr. edwards: it was a piece of cake. [laughter] something a little more challenging than that. in about 2002 or 2003, we contacted carl, who was a top political aide to president bush. we said, is there any chance mr. -- any chance of mr. bush becoming our honorary chairman? very unusual for a sitting president to become the honorary chairman of an organization, even a nonprofit organization like ours. he said, that is interesting, let me look into it. it so happened that president bush did agree to do that. we established that relationship with him. we kept him informed with what we're doing and moving ahead with building the memorial. finally came the day or the month when we were going to dedicate it, and we said, perhaps we can get the president to come and dedicate it and accept it for the american

people. that was an incredible day when i got the phone call from the white house. then she said, this is an outside event. i said yes. she says, well, it is going to be expensive, and that is all she said.

when we met with the secret service, we found out that what that meant was, a special platform with an escape hatch for the president in case there was an emergency. that cost $25,000. a special tent, reinforced tent so that when the presidential limo came up we could come in and could be concealed from people. that was a quick $5,000.

and other security measures, special palms and flora in back of him to block anybody from taking a look at him. plus extra police and so forth, even though there was secret service there. all of that cost about $75,000. but it was worth it. it was worth every single dollar. host: did you let anybody who wanted to spend as much money as they wanted to on this? mr. edwards: no, we did not want to be accused of being the lapdog of any foreign government, foreign entity, corporation, or somebody here at home as well. some prominent anti-communist. didn't want that, so we kept that nobody could give more than $75,000. host: how did you get the pew money? mr. edwards: it turned out that mr. j howard pew was one of the great anti-communist of his day

and died in the 1970's. it so happened that he was very close to the city college. i was there. i had written a biography of the history of the college. i met there the president of the pew charitable trust. rebecca and i got along just fine. i said rebecca, i am doing this project right now, the victims of communism. she said, very interesting. mr. pugh would have supported that. from that we managed to establish a relationship and to hopefully persuade them to support us. host: at one point did you think you would get a museum, and what happened in the end? i know there is a museum but it is virtual. mr. edwards: right. from the beginning, going back to 1993, 1994, 1995, we were talking a lot about a museum. we were impressed and inspired by the holocaust memorial museum. we wanted to do the same for the victims of communism. people who came on board say, yes, the victims of communism deserve a museum just as much as the jews suffered under nazism. that was not $1 million, $2 million, or $5 million. that was a $100 million project at the most. we kept waiting for a millionaire to walk through the door and senate because that

check. we realized it would not happen. we reversed our goals and said we will do the memorial first, then we will do a virtual museum, which we have various exhibits. people can visit. host: how do they do that? mr. edwards: we have constructed one electronically, and they can tap into it and visit it, and go into a barracks. we have dogs barking, we have guards coming through there. you can walk through this barracks and see what it was like to be in the gulags in the soviet union. host: how do you find it on the web? mr. edwards: go to victimsofcommunism.org.

host: you will see a woman named ann appelbaum, who was a writer for "the washington post," a columnist. why did she participate in it? mr. edwards: it was very important, at the beginning of

our project to get outstanding academics. we were able to persuade robert and richard, the three great experts on soviet union and communism to join us and be on our advisory board. years later, we could see this marvelous book called by ann applebaum and it struck us as being in the tradition of where alexander had written so many years before. we went to her and explained what we would like to do to have her write an essay for us. she agreed to do so, and that was a reinforcing of the fact that we are not just some fly-by-night organization. we are serious about our research and our remembrance of the victims of communism. host: here is video from an interview in 1999. i want you to put him in context. >> i had been in the war from 1944 in bulgaria, then later in the british political. four years, nearly. i saw what happened when the communist regime took over.

the chamber and the suppression and ruin of the country. host: how did he fit in? -- that terror and the suppression and ruin of the country. host: how did he fit in? mr. edwards: robert conquest was a fellow, did not have a phd like professor pipes or dr. brzezinski, but had early on been impressed and horrified by the communist suppression, as he explained there. he undertook to write a history of the so-called "great terror" that stalin initiated in the soviet union and 1936, 1937 and 1938.

something like one million people were executed at stalin's direct order. they were challengers to his power, to his regime, to his ability to do whatever he wanted to do with the soviet union. using only secondary sources, because you couldn't go into the kremlin at that point, this is back in the 1970's. bob conquest wrote this book, "the great terror." it was dismissed by academics, which was hailed, quietly, in the soviet union by dissidents who knew he was speaking the truth. that there was this great terror initiated and carried out by stalin. he was so important to us, he subsequently wrote a history about holodomor, which was the forced famine in ukraine in the 1930's. a famine initiated by joseph stalin, a monster if there ever was one, because what he did was to collectivize the farms of ukraine and russia, the soviet union. everybody had to take whatever

they grew and give it to the collectives. not leaving anything for those little farmers, and stalin did not care because he wanted to wipe out what he called the kulaks, the more prosperous farmers. we do not know how many died, at least 5 million to 6 million people died. mothers were reduced to cannibalism. it is a terrible thing. robert conquest wrote about this. it was dismissed by many, many

academics and he has been proven by history with regard to the great terror that these things did happen. to me, if you need justification by themselves as to why there should be not only a memorial, but also a museum about the victims of communism. host: here's some video, part of your political pass, july 16, 1964. anybody that follows politics remembers this. i want you to give us the back story on how this happened. this is barry goldwater. >> i will remind you that it is -- that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. [cheers and applause] >> thank you. thank you.

let me remind you also, that moderation and the pursuit of justice is no virtue. [applause] host: why is it over the years just the first part of that is usually shown? mr. edwards: people focus on the extremism line. it is understandable that the media would do that. but the second part, about the importance of pursuing justice is pretty important. and liberty. barry goldwater, for whom i worked starting in 1963 when i

was with the draft committee, and then subsequently with the presidential campaign that fall, was a man who was a straight shooter. did not believe in holding back, was going to give you a black and white answer. because of certain things which he said, recommended, for example, on social security who said we need a voluntary option. people immediately said, he wants to do away with social security. he said nuclear weapons could be used, but i do not think they would be, or should be. that was translated into

goldwater recommends use of nuclear weapons. he was seen as an extremist throughout the presidential campaign leading up to this period we are talking about ray -- about right here. what would be his response? is he just going to sit back and try to say, well, i am not really an extremist. i'm really a good guy, i am not really going to do away with social security or use nuclear arms. or is he going to turn it around, flip it around, and directly challenge people and say, extremism and the defense of liberty is no vice. that was so typical of goldwater. now, having said that, should that have been all that happened?

no. today, we would have called spin centers, so that after someone makes a speech like that, the media goes to this large room and there are spokesman for the candidate or the person, the politician, and they will explain what he said, why he said it, put it into context. there it was no such thing in 1964. we did not explain that, for example, that dr. martin luther king and a letter from birmingham jail talked about extremism, did not talk about patrick henry give me liberty or give me death. how much more extreme could you be?

you know, jesus christ on the cross giving up his life, how much more extreme could you be? we didn't do that. it was not done in those days. the media and the opposition was within the party and among the democrats to say that goldwater -- democrats had the opportunity to say that goldwater was an extremist. host: where were you in that speech was given? mr. edwards: i was back at the hotel where we had our headquarters, because i had given my ticket that night to somebody who worked very hard in the campaign. i wanted her to have that opportunity. i was watching it on television. i did not see that speech ahead of time, nor did other people. cliff white was a delegate hunter for the senator. one of the most experienced and knowledgeable, and effective political strategists in the country.

he was the one who had obtained a nomination for us through a delegate hunt and search, which he had been attempting for a couple of years leading up to the convention. cliff had not seen it, i had not seen it and others did not see it. as soon as the senator said that, and i recorded this in my diary, which i quoted in the book "just right," i knew it was a mistake. host: who wrote that speech? mr. edwards: before the convention began, the gentleman who was challenging us, a governor named william scranton sent out a letter to all the delegates at the convention saying, goldwater is extremism, it is right-wingism and so forth. he was furious. we took the speech and put it aside. said i want something stronger.

harry, who was a professor at ohio state university, had given some testimony at a platform committee meeting talking about extremism. the senator looked over at harry in this meeting and said, i want you to write my acceptance speech. harry, who had never written a political speech in his life, said, ok. so he and warren nutter crafted that speech. they all loved it, including the senator. he relished the idea of taking the word extremism and pushing it into the face of nelson rockefeller, bill scranton and the other liberal republicans of

the day. host: this is out of context, but it is in your book and i wanted to ask you about it. let's go to some video of a man named martin agronski. he had an impact on your life. used to have a program. let's watch him. i think he worked for all three others in the lives in the is the networks at one point. let's watch. >> they were talking about mccarthy calling reporters communist. it was the usual gimmick with mccarthy. i merely said something like, to mr. hunt, i think you are mistaken when you equate criticism with disloyalty or treason. reporters are good americans like other americans. it is a great mistake to

denounce us as traitors. if you're looking for traders -- four -- for traitiors and people doing damage to our country. he took us on capitol hill and there is senator mccarthy doing an anonymous damage to the country. host: what impact did he have on your life? mr. edwards: in 1969, nixon had been elected. his vice president was spiro agnew. they decided they would go after the media, that the media had been overly critical and unfairly critical of mr. nixon during the campaign. so they unleashed spiro agnew, who went around talking about negativeism. coming out of that was, it was possible for conservatives to enter into the mass media, which we had been denied before. radio, television and so forth. coming out of that, bill rusher became well known through a thing called the advocates. he became a radio commentator, i think with cbs and npr.

locally, channel nine, i approached them and said i would like to be a commentator. host: was that owned by the post at that time? mr. edwards: i don't recall if it was or not. i had met some people there who were in the news department. they knew me, and i have just -- i had just recently done a rather big rally at the washington monument with some 25,000 people who came out in support of the war of vietnam veterans day rally. i guess i was fairly well known here in washington d.c. so i did become a commentator for wlpt, for channel nine for several weeks. all of a sudden i heard it is off the air, you are done, it's through. i said, what happened? i was told, i was never approached directly, that he said, it is either me or edwards, one of us has to go.

they gave me my walking papers. host: quick take on your opinion of joseph mccarthy all these years later. mr. edwards: i think stan evans did a very marvelous book called "blacklisted by history." he looked at the various charges which joe mccarthy had made about whether there were communist in our government or not. stan evans was a very careful reporter. using fbi files was able to prove that joe mccarthy was wrong. he was wrong that there were more communist in the u.s.

government than joe mccarthy said. stan evans proves that in "blacklisted by history." i met joe mccarthy through my father, who was something of a confidant to him. he liked to party and liked a drink or two. as long as you didn't talk about communism, he was fun. he was also someone who did not take advice very well. he consequently said things and even did things that hurt the cause of anti-communism for some time. i would certainly not pick him a -- pick a mess someone -- pick him as someone to lead the movement, but he made a contribution in challenging the

idea that, were there, and is in the government, there certainly were. host: a long time "chicago tribune" reporter, your father. i want to read back to what you wrote and get you to explain this. why is it that liberals insist that a conservative historian cannot write an object to book about conservatism, but never question whether a liberal historian can write an objective book about liberalism? mr. edwards: i have wrestled with this. i have written 26 books now, number of histories, number of biographies, almost all of them about conservative individuals or institutions. i would be challenged by this. people would say, i would love to review your book, but you are

a conservative writing about conservatism. i thought to myself, that just does not seem fair. i thought about it, and i finally came up with this formulation. i said, i am no more partisan or subjective or unfactual in what i write about ronald reagan than arthur was when he wrote about fdr, or when william wrote about john f. kennedy. we all bring, to a writing project or to life, prejudices and biases. you try to control them as much as possible. if you can challenge my works,

you cannot successfully do so when it comes to the facts, quotes, interviews. i have always been very, very careful in being a strict observer of the truth. i try to be as balanced as possible, but i make no pretense of saying that i am not sympathetic of admiring ronald reagan or barry goldwater or bill buckley. host: this goes back to 1962, a man named robert welsh. let's watch him for 40 seconds, and i'll ask you to put him in context and what relationship you had with him. >> we are striving to set an example by dedication, integrity and purpose, which our children's children may follow without hesitation. it is this character, quality and caliber of our membership,

which amazes everybody on first learning the truth, after having heard about us from distorted reports in so much of the press and over the air. senator barry goldwater, although he frequently criticizes me, has repeatedly stated that the finest people he knows in his state are members of the john burke society. host: what did robert welsh have to do with the society? mr. edwards: he was the founder, chairman, president, ceo, coo, and everything else. the john birch society is made up of good, good americans, terribly frustrated by what they saw as the direction of the country, too much of a soft approach to communism and a feeling that the government was getting too big. mr. welsh came along and capitalized upon those fears and apprehensions, and wonderings to

form the society. however, in trying to come up with a bottom line, for example, in a book called "the politician," he said that, like dwight d. eisenhower was either an absolute willing captive of the communist or he was a communist himself. russell kirk, a conservative historian, intellectual said, ike is not a communist, he is a golfer. later in a publication called "american opinion," which became the monthly journal of the john birch society, mr. welsh decided to start having a monthly scoreboard as to how much the

communists were controlling america. month by month, that percentage went up year-by-year until finally, towards one of the last publications that i have looked at, we were allegedly 80% controlled by the communists, which is absurd, just nonsense. anybody with any kind of logic would know that. that is why bill buckley said that we must throw out right wing extremists out of the movement without any hesitation. he went after mr. welsh, said, please, walk away. we do not need you, we don't want you, you don't represent what conservatism is all about. host: i want to ask you something personal. you talk in your book about being a catholic. i assume 31 years at a catholic university, you are still catholic? mr. edwards: yes.

i try to be a good catholic. host: i want you, as a catholic, to put this in context. we have some video of someone i think played a role in your life. there is just 14 seconds. i had not seen this and i remembered him and he was still in the house. i want you to translate how it fits into your personal life. >> you read my biography, there is no reference to the fact that i am a former politician, that i am an attorney, or that i served in the u.s. house of representatives for eight years. three strikes and you're out. right? host: i assume he was your best man? mr. edwards: he was my best man, and i was his best man. host: are you still in touch with him today?

mr. edwards: not as much as i would like to be, but i stay in touch. host: the big surprise was he ended up writing a book, conscience of a conservative. he was your best man, and your wife is catholic. put that into context for folks today about how do you deal with this, and how do you as a catholic do with this? mr. edwards: i think you have to deal with charity, with love, with forgiveness. we did not know that bob -- many a night we were at his home where he was at our home listening to records of old jazz and popular music, talking about politics, talking about goldwater, we had no idea that coupled with the homosexuality was a serious drinking problem as well. those two combined. we have a saying in the catholic church, and i am sure it is not just only in our church. that is to hate the sin but not the sinner. yes, we don't accept. we don't believe that homosexuality is a natural thing, but at the same time, we are not going to cast out into the darkness the person who may engage in that. i still admire bob and the things he accomplished. i'm proud to say he was there at

our marriage and still kind of a friend. host: what would be the possibility today, given the change in environment, that he would have survived this? mr. edwards: i think he would have survived. today there is much more acceptance of this kind of sexual preference. i think that the fact that he was gay would make not as much difference. perhaps, when the final vote was taken as to whether or not in the house of representatives, whether he should be speaker, there might be some members of the house that might step back and say, do we really want to

have a gay person as our speaker? based upon his knowledge of the rules, his oratory, his intelligence, i think he might very well would be accepted as speaker of the house. host: how long have you been married to ann stevens? mr. edwards: 52 years. she has been not only a marvelous wife and mother, but also editor of mine. i make her read all of my stuff whether she wants to or not and she does a marvelous job. host: where are your two daughters? mr. edwards: both of them are very close by. elizabeth, with her two kids, is just around the corner in

arlington. catherine, who has nine children, is down in spotsylvania. we are looking forward -- we see them several times -- actually a month, not just a year. a month. we have a wonderful family. the kids love each other, we love them, and i am a very fortunate and blessed man. host: will you write another book? mr. edwards: i have a book in mind called "the other 60's." i think it might be a very needed book to get some balance. host: last question. a man who has lived on this earth since 1932. i don't see any change in you, what is the secret? mr. edwards: i think the secret is genes, being careful what you eat and drink. it might also be getting on the treadmill as often as you can. also being responsive to god's i think plan for you. -- i think also being responsive to god's plan for you. i really think god has a plan for all of us. host: the name of the book is "just right: a life in pursuit of liberty." our guest has been lee edwards. thank you very much. mr. edwards: thank you, brian. ♪

>> for free scram scripts visit us at q&a.org. q&a.anscripts visit us at board. -- qme.org. tonight on c-span, harvard professors debate the israel palestinian conflict. then, from great written, the clean's christmas message. after that, author henry olson on ronald reagan and conservatism. later, a discussion about american morality and public opinion on the news media. professors cornell west and alan dershowitz debate whether the boycott and divestment and sanctions movement will help bring about in and to the conflict. the bds