they set their babies in front of the television and i have seen it over and over again across the country. sleepild quietly goes to inside their mind. government regulation. >> think about it as the starship enterprise goal. there is a computer that is ambient. it exists in the starship. you can have a conversation with it and it knows everything. this is what they are gunning for. all this week, washington journal features key authors of 2017. his book.stern on

it is just under one hour. "washington journal" continues. stern tells us to talk about his expense writing his book "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right," and you chatted with us in the fall about the time this book was being published. what the impetus was for writing this book -- you going out, a lifelong democrat, decided to live life as a republican. guest: like a lot of people, i have been concerned about the polarization in this country -- how much the left hates the right, how much the right hates the left, and i decided to do something about it. we are all increasing -- increasingly interacting with people that agree with us. the book is built around my journey.

understand to someone, you have to see things from his point of view. i spent a year traveling the country, talking to folks i would not ordinarily talk to, consuming media from what i thought was the other side, and the book is about that journey. host: you changed your party registration when you did that. why? guest: if you're going to commit to seeing things from another point of view, you are going to commit. for me, then that changing my media mix, changing who i talked to, and it also meant being a republican for a year, and that meant walking down to the voter registration office in washington, d.c., leading my 94% democratic ward, and registering for a year as a republican. was: one of the statements "deep down i love suspected i would not like many republicans

if i mixed with them on a regular basis." is that true? guest: let me put that in context. it sounds awful. there are 70 million republicans in the country -- maybe i would not like him. today storypost" where they asked democrats to pick a word or two that describe republicans, and republicans the same to describe democrats, and they put it up in a word cloud, and they are all negative on both sides. for democrats describing republicans it was greedy, bigoted, a selection of life -- bad words. i reacted negatively to these words, but month that -- like most people, i thought those were the right words to characterize them. at the end of the year, you get out, you spend a lot of time with a lot of different people. it will change your view of how you view the other side. i mean, a lot of our views of the other side is really from

the fact that we are divided -- physically and demographically divided more than we have ever been. getting to know your -- the other side will change a point of view and it changed my point of view after a year. host: let's talk about the issues of energy and the environment -- what you do to get the perspective you were looking for when it came to those issues? guest: so, a lot of the book is built around diving into a bunch of issues i was sure i was right on -- i was not in a, but i was sure i was right nonetheless. guns, energy. i spent a lot of time with conservative experts, try to understand their perspective, but i also spent time in places like pikeville, kentucky, eastern kentucky coal country, trying to understand the issue of climate change, the issue of -- let's describe it as they ,ould -- obama's war on coal and try to see things from their point of view. when you are sitting in pikesville, kentucky, and you

see the economic guts of the region ripped apart, it really does give you a different perspective on lots of different issues, including the environment, climate change, and government regulation. host: let me get the phone numbers so viewers can join as well. host: plenty of time with ken stern this morning. he will be with us until 9:00 a.m. i want to hear from you to get your reactions as well. ken stern, who did you meet in pikeville, kentucky? it is really interesting when you go out and try to see the world. how do you do that? i ended up getting the name of a guy named roger ford, who was a local entrepreneur, newspaper

columnist, and he decided to be my tour guide. a lovely guy. a wonderful guide. introducing me to people around town -- former coal miners, current coal miners, people that lived in pikeville their entire lives. --drove out to fort branch ford branch, named after his family, and i spent time with his father, a retired pastor -- just a lot of different people who come from -- who i would not ordinarily get to know living in washington, d.c., where i have grown up, and spent most of my life. host: you talk about growing up in washington, d c bubble,"the "liberal as it was, and how you are brought into it. guest: we're all increasingly living in a bubble. it is called the big sort. we are choosing to live in neighborhoods that are homogenous politically. we increasingly have media that

supports our own point of view. it is the confirmation bias. for me, a lifelong democrat, as i mentioned, i live in a 94% democratic war -- 100% democratic household, spent time in democratic politics, ran and pr for a number of you -- npr for a number of years. in my view it is a typical life in that i am surrounded by people that are like-minded. host: we want to start on the line for republicans this money. joe is calling on that line. joe, good morning. where are you calling in from? joe, are you with us this morning? trevor in we'll go to seattle, washington, line for democrats. go ahead. caller: hi, there. i wanted to ask -- i have a lot of conservative family members and such, and i co-mingle quite

a bit, and it is hard getting past a point where we can't agree on facts, numbers, the resultson of words, from government entities and trusted sources. so, that is where i always have a problem to break through. i wanted to ask how he -- you know, what is the best way to get people out of that bubble, you know, if they are just going to deny the reasons for you, or deny the reasons you are giving to justify your position? host: trevor, thanks for the call. ken stern, go ahead. guest: trevor, it is a really interesting question, and to a certain extent, i would say your expenses a little bit unusual in the fact that more and more we actually don't have close friends or relatives that are on the other side.

"the washington post" -- it sounds like i spent all my time with "the washington post" -- they did a poll and they asked trump members if they had any close friends and personal family members voting for clinton and vice versa for clinton supporters, and this is virginia, a purple state that went for the dubai couple of points, and by and large 65% of people did not know anyone from the other side. that is the challenge, we are increasingly in a world where we're only talking to people that agree with ourselves. it is really interesting. i spent -- my trip was not about trying to convince people who was right, who was wrong. it was about listening, trying to understand. when you spend a lot of time listening, it was easy for me to find points of agreement. i think of the hundreds of people i met along the way, it was almost always possible to find points of common ground. it did not mean we agreed on

everything, but there was always places where we would come together. trevor said something really interesting, which is the lack of trusted sources, i think that was his phrase. that is a real problem in this country -- we are increasingly skeptical of the facts from the other side, the news from the other side, and that is increasingly dividing us. when i talk to my friends who are still in the mainstream media -- i am still part of that community -- half the country thinks the media engages in fact news -- fake news. only about 30% trust the mainstream media anymore. that is about the same trust numbers that donald trump has. in a world in which we cannot find common sources, it is going to be increasingly hard to find common ground. that is a real challenge we all have. that is what really worries me about the environment we live in now. the caller talking about

not being able to agree on basic facts. was there a fact you went into this where you are certain you are right on, you ended up changing your opinion on? there were lots of things. part of the truth is -- we all have opinions, but most of us do not live in the political world all the time, the policy world all the time. under 10% of americans ever go to a political rally or contribute to a campaign, and it is very difficult to be expert on lots of sus -- subject. -- subjects. the one that led for me was gun control, gun rights. i'm from washington, d.c., in a world or people with uniform have guns, people without uniforms should not have guns. that was my view go in. i spent a lot of time with conservative columnist john locke, went to gun shows in texas, and delve into the complexity of the issue,

different perspectives, and a really did come away with a different point of view on gun control and gun rights, not that i necessarily disagree with every thing i thought of before, but the difficulty of changing situation, and recognizing the fact that we have actually reduced gun homicides in this country by about 50% over the last 20 years, and it is relatively to do with gun rules. we spend on -- our time arguing about the wrong issues. we all hooked into these, sort of, whirlwind trench lines -- you are for it or against it. that is not the way the real world works. host: did you enjoy pig hunting? well, i discovered i am a terrible shot. when i said some people have guns in some shouldn't, i am one who shouldn't. but i had an incredible time talking to folks. i spent the morning with a

three-generation family of georgians that drove all night long to go paid hunting in texas, and my tutor was isaac, and eight-year-old boy who had grown up in -- with guns, and gave me lessons with a diverse group of uniform salesman. and hispanic former soldier, a serbianmily man, a gettingt -- we were diverse perspectives from people i would not ordinarily no. it meant a lot to me. it meant i had an extraordinary experience. host: did you hit anything? guest: well, it is a really good question. it is a matter of some debate a year and a half later. they gave me credit for a kill i am skeptical about. whether i did anything more than give a good fright to that pigs

they were nice enough to give me a kill for that day. host: steve. democrat. go ahead. caller: my comment is -- actually, two comments. number one, i began working as an adult in my profession -- i had just turned 21 or 22 when ronald reagan was elected, and i felt like anyone who did not vote republican was profiled. democrat, and i consider myself a progressive, but i have never asked for a -- i have handout probably worked about 60 hours a week for most of my life, like most people my age. i don't want to turn the world to socialism. i don't want to take god out of our schools, and i feel like we were profiled. people that voted democrat for to reason were profiled you

work -- into what the reagan administration started, and what the talk radio shows like rush limbaugh started and continued into the 1990's, what they call the liberal underclass. rush limbaugh, and coulter, and all of those -- ann coulter and all of those. i feel like the generation after me -- i hate to use this term -- but the millenniums coming up, i feel this political partisanship will go away. maybe there is more partisanship that might come, but all the things that made us politically partisan and may does not trust the other side, -- made us not trust the other side, and just for parity, i have a brother that is a staunch conservative, he is not a racist, and he would give you the shirt off his back no matter who you are. i feel the next generation will outlive all of this. host: got you. thanks for the call.

ken stern. i hope steve is right, but all the data suggests the trends are going in the wrong way. it is interesting the way he puts it -- we are profiling the side. i think that is a pretty apt phrase where we are assuming a lot about the other side. republicans do it to democrats in terms of, you know, they hate hard work, or they are snowflakes, or a bunch of other phrases, and democrats are doing it with the other side that are a bunch of deplorables, they hate minorities -- those trends, all the data -- what is called a heat index, how much we dislike the other side, are all going up, even though we do not disagree on all the issues. one of the things that drove me around this book was the data that shows on the issues we are not more divided than we were 25 years ago, but we dislike the

other side and that is because we are increasingly isolated from the other side, and when you don't know them -- when you don't have a conservative brother like steve does, it is easier and easier to demagogue them, and this notion of deplorables -- for me -- and it goes both ways. there is a liberal bubble, there is a conservative bubble. for me, it was about getting outside the liberal bubble and challenging my preconceptions about conservatives. one thing i did -- you cannot understand conservatives in this country without understanding evangelicals who potentially republican% for candidates. i spent time in churches and i went to something called her banner, a gathering -- urbana, a youth,ng of evangelical about 15,000 of them. from washington,

d.c., a stranger in a strange land there. it was about fighting cancer care about refugees -- not want kids it was about finding who care about refugees, not want to keep them out. it was a different conception than what i got from my meeting -- my world him washington, d.c. host: you met a man named sam adams. who is he? guest: he now works in washington, d.c., but he was a man of history, the first openly city, in oregon. distrustingery much the evangelical community because of their position on gay rights, and he had a lot of reasons to be mistrusting of them, but he forged a partnership.

sam forged a partnership with one of the leading evangelical churches in portland led by a man who wanted to show what the evangelical community was for, not what they are against, and they forged what they called city serve, and invested a lot of resources in helping portland, helping the schools, public service programs. when i talked to sam, one of the things i -- he said to me that has lived with me throughout the process was his preconception going into that partnership was they wouldn't have a lot of points of agreement, but what he said to me was on any 10 issues i was going to agree with the other side on eight issues. we're never going to agree on abortion, gay rights, but we agreed on so much. why do we spent time focusing on the two when we have the eight to talk about. host: fort washington, maryland.

joe is a republican. go ahead. go ahead. caller: how are you doing host: doing well. caller: good to hear your voice. this is a direct question to you. we have, as republicans, done what we needed to do to win, but we need to look at what we and how we have accomplished what we have accomplished. your this experience of being on the right, but we have to ask ourselves at the end of the day, claim to be us to morally upright? is it how can we do that and support the administration in there?

we have allowed so much to be said and done that has not be done the -- >> what is the question, joe? caller: the question is how morally sound are we as republicans to allow what has happened? host: got your question, joe. ken stern? guest: that is a complicated question -- or it allows for a complicated answer. so just to give a little context, when i say that i love to learn the right, it does not mean that i agree with everything the conservative world says. now, i think of myself as independent. the republican ted a great deal of success -- had a great deal of success in elector lee, the white house, the senate and the house, two thirds of state legislatures and governorships

but donald trump a product of polarization. he did not cause polarization in the country. i think he is leading us down a path of greater and greater disharmony, and i do not think it is working particularly well for him, i do not think it is working for the republican party and i think we will see the , results of that in the next couple of years. host: william is an independent. tennessee. go ahead. caller: my question is you left the democrats and go to republicans because they have the right ideas or the right view. when you look at donald trump, roy moore, sean hannity -- when they preach their views to someone like me, i want america to work together. i work two jobs. i am single. i pay a lot of money.

what they are doing is not helpful to me. i want america to come together and work so that people like me, instead of working two jobs, i can work one job. celebrating,ket is but i will be working two jobs for a lifetime. -- and a lot of overtime. but they are going to celebrate they're going to create jobs, but -- >> i think we got your point, william. ken stern, i will let you respond. guest: i agree with that. i think history actually shows we do better when we work together, and, you know, on the local level, you actually see that a lot. you see a lot more democrats and republicans finding ways to work together. not always. i mean there are plenty of counterexamples. but you find it when people are

face-to-face, when they are forced to find common ground, they often do, and things tend to work better. i think we are being poorly served by both political parties who are, i think, practicing the politics of division, and i think the result of that is more and more anger, more dysfunction in washington, more and more anger in washington -- i was going to say a virtuous circle, n-virtuousf an u circle. we have a lot of reasons to be angry at the leaders of our political parties, and i think they are causing a lot more division, and that is in the political parties, also in the media. i think we are going down the wrong path as william suggests. host: you mentioned the media -- you mentioned you were previously the ceo of national public radio. how much hannity, how much ann coulter, how much rush limbaugh

did you end up watching during the course of the year? was that your only media diet? guest: no, too much -- too much for my sanity. i spent a lot of time with the right mark, with steve bannon before he became famous. i was interested in the phenomenon. let's take breitbart for example. it really is about driving discord. if you spend time looking at how bannon and others choose stories narrative, it is about encouraging negative toward the other side. it does not mean the mainstream media has been perfect about it.

i wrote an article for "vanity fair" on just before the last where i made a slice of life story, and i found what he one articles on donald trump. section, in the front the sports page for gods sake, metro, and all of them were negative. i amnk when that happens, not a fan of donald trump, but when the narrative is so and people and up feeling disenfranchised, patronized, and i hear a lot of that. host: shreveport. republican. caller: hi, john. nice to talk to you this month. ken, how do we get to where we can learn about both sides? all i hear with the media is biased. and i want to learn more about what i want or my children.

they are pushing john kasich now, and i do not necessarily know anything about him. i would like a suggestion on where people can get good information and wait things out because i think the media is biased. host: before you go, before ken stern does that, what are two or three sources you look at on a daily basis? i look at drudge, npr, and i cannot watch cnn or fox news. guest: it is a good question. i go back to lack of trust. i have been somewhat critical of what i think of the group think, sort of the pet journalism of mainstream media, but i also don't think it is an equivalency as some would have it between left and right media.

they have different constitutional roles, as far as i'm concerned. my media diet before i started this was fairly typical mainstream media -- "new york times," "washington post," npr, as you might expect given my background, and it still largely is, but i love it. the way to get a sense of country as a whole is to toggle between different sources, and i still rely on "the times," and "the washington post" for my information. i think they have reporters that do real journalism, but i also read "the weekly standard," i look at fox on the left, i scroll through mark levin and even breitbart to understand the perspective. not that i necessarily going to -- not that i unnecessarily going to agree, but it is important in this increasingly divided country to try to

understand people's perspectives, and i think that means looking at a wide variety of informational sources. host: just after 8:30 a.m. on the east coast -- ken stern is joining us from philadelphia, pennsylvania. he is the author of "republican like me: how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right," taking your phone calls this morning. republicans can join in. (202) 737-0001. host: ken stern, we spent the first hour of the program asking viewers if they thought there had been progress in the opioid epidemic in 2017. can you talk about what you saw in your time going around the country specifically on that issue? guest: i caught the tail end of that conversation. you know, the way in for me was try to understand what you might call the white working class,

which is such a large percentage of the conservative base in this country, and certainly a large percentage of the trump base, and the populist national base that donald trump represents, that steve bannon represent. -- represents. i spent time in youngstown, ohio, pikeville, kentucky, as i mentioned, and my perspective on this, sitting in people's homes, taking meals with them, jerking -- drinking in bars, going to places of work, the white working class is on a 30-year losing streak, really. it is hard to say. income is down. life expectancy is down. opioid addiction is up. when i was in pikeville i asked about opioid addiction, and everyone i talked to knew someone that had died from opioid dependency, died young, and they pointed out the pain clinic across street, or the one across the border in virginia, where you could easily get a

cache of opioids easily, and forgive me, painlessly. it is clear being part of the story, the whole decline of the white working class, the sense of hopelessness for their future and their family, it is a big part of the story of american politics and the rise of donald trump, and people of that political ilk. host: alice in detroit, michigan. republican. go ahead. caller: i want to say that if a person is wrong, they are wrong. that should be stressed. my question for your guest is how do you feel about the fact , youthese tax breaks

always talk about how we are against the deficits, why are you doing it, and i want to ask about what you think about the fact that there were you mouse -- emails. how do you feel about that? host: alex, thank you for the call. guest: as an american citizen, i hate what is going on in congress. i hate that it is one party completely driving the agenda and there is no sense of compromise. you can take your pick on who you want to blame. i have my own personal biases in that direction, but i hit the -- i hate the fact that it is one party driving the agenda, and i think when that happens, you get legislation like the tax bill that does not make much sense. it is driven through very quickly without people knowing what is in it. that does not reflect the view of the american people, including republicans. i think one of the interesting and distressing parts of the tax

bill is it is very unpopular with the people who sent conservatives to congress, or put donald trump in the white house. and we have gotten to a place where our politics are so destructive that those things make sense in the halls of congress, even if they don't make sense in communities around the country. i think that is about one side has to win while the other side has to lose. that is what it is about. one side did this legislation because it had to do something, whether it made sense or not. i think there is all totally what prevailed and reflects some of the negative aspects of our current politics. host: did you have conversations about tax reform with people you met going around the country, and everything was not passed at the time, but a sense of what they wanted from tax reform? guest: people were pretty straightforward.

being in conversations, i was there to listen. that meant they chose the agenda. and it was almost always about jobs. it wasn't about, you know taxes -- i pay too much taxes, health care, or other issues came up, but it all started with i want a good wage, a good job, i want security from a family, i want hope for my future, and always about jobs in the state of the economy. so sure, people want to talk about taxes, but let's be realistic. nobody wants to talk about the nuances of a specific bill comes to congress peopl. people felt overtaxed, they did not feel they were getting the return. mostly, people wanted to say i

want a job, certainty in my life, a career, to put food on the table for my family. i want someone who offers me hope in that regard. it goes all the way back to the clinton war room, which is it is the economy, stupid. that has not changed in 35 years since bill clinton ran for and won election to office. host: randy in iowa. line for democrats. good morning. i'm not sure if randy is there. sean is in baltimore, maryland, though. line for independents. go ahead. caller: good morning. host: go ahead, sean. caller: you mentioned that political polarization probably won't get any better. i agree with that. i think that is because of donald trump coming into office. my question is, do you think we are headed for a second civil war? i want to explain why i am

asking this question. me as a black man, watching donald trump come into office, the way he influences the white supremacy movement it is just , unbelievable. my parents, they grew up in the civil rights era. and so, my grandparents were around in the 1920's, when all of these confederate statues were being built. they are from north carolina. i remember my grandfather telling me that white supremacists would put up those , constantlysay remind them, that one day, we will put you back in chains. we will make you slaves again. you, we willget get your descendents. and that's me. so he always told me about that, and i said, yeah right. when i see donald trump and all of the crazy stuff going on, i

am like, wow. i'll tell you what, if white supremacists and they are going to put me back in chains, they have another thing coming. they're going to have to kill me. host: got your point. ken stern. 10: i actually do worry about the division here. nasty, violent piece of all of this. i spent the weekend getting trolled by neo-nazis on twitter, so i have some personal experience with this. i think the truth of the matter is, most people still remain in the middle. social media narratives are controlled by a relatively small portion of the public.

is trend that gives me hope that there are more and more people identifying as independent. there are now far more people that self identify as independents than self identify as democrats or republicans. that was not true 15 years ago. and it is not because those people are less partisan. they still largely vote democrat or republican. but, they are rejecting the anger of the parties. and i think the trend towards more and more independence reflects that there are more people saying, wait a minute, there is something wrong with our political addiction. i self identify with that. people arere repulsed with the atmosphere, and there will be a movement to say, listen, we do not have to agree on everything in a democracy. but, we should have good faith on this. that is necessary for the future of our country, and i hope more

people rather take toward that point of view. host: talk about martinsville, virginia. ken: if you want to find different points of view, where do you look? some of them are in churches. down inille, virginia, south corner of the state, is home to a famous nascar race. i went down and spent a couple of days talking to folks around nascar. understanding and see martinsville, which is like so many smaller towns saved by nascar, but hollowed out by the decline of industry. it was based once upon a time on tobacco. that was taken out. then it was based on textiles, and that was taken out by global trade.

seeing another american town sort of, having its guts ripped out, if i can put it that way i think is part of the , narrative of change and, i think, lack of optimism in this country. you saw in martinsville, people gathered for the nascar races. host: randall. springfield, missouri. line for republicans. go ahead. caller: i consider myself a constitutionalist. i want to much i think polarization in the united states is a situation of people wanting to turn the country from a republic to a socialist state. i think the democrats are the new socialist, communist party, and they are screaming about tax reform and the things trump is doing because they do not want to lose control. socialism is about government control. the democrats do not want to give up their control.

the democrats want control so much, they would deprive the citizen, the normal, everyday working citizen, a tax break just to keep the rich from getting a tax break. and i want to see if you agree with a little bit of my assessment with people and outside forces. host: got your point, randall. ken stern? guest: i think one of the great divides that you here as you travel the country between right and left his faith in government leftlve issues, with the largely believing in the effectiveness of government solutions, and in my personal view, maybe have two great faith in the likely effectiveness of

government solutions. we have big challenges. some of them we talked about. poverty, a lot of opportunity, and the opioid crisis. we talked about gun violence, which principally plagues part of our cities. there is a belief among democrats in the effectiveness of government to solve those problems, and i think a lot of conservatives, constitutional or not, have grown skeptical over time about the effectiveness of government and think those things are better solved at the community level or among market forces. it is a reasonable debate to have. my concern, hearing from a constitutional conservative, is not that debate. i think that is a legitimate debate we have had throughout history. my concern is more those who are from both sides undermining the pillars of government. we talked about donald trump, his attacks on the press, law

enforcement, the judiciary, at least the fbi, and i think those attacks come from both sides. that tends to undercut the pillars of democracy, and that is what worries me. it is not really about the policies of donald trump. we could argue about those or whether we should have bigger or smaller government. reasonable minds can disagree on that. it is but the things that have worked to corrode the essence of our government, things that have worked for 240 years. host: ken stern is our guest. the book, "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right." i want to get to as many calls as we can, but i also want to paulou, ken stern, about ville.

ken: it is about how we are geographically dividing ourselves. it is about how we are dividing themselves. how liberals are choosing to live in blue areas, conservatives are choosing to live in red areas. and that sort of self-segregation, political segregation, we had 1100 landside countries. in this election we had 2500 of those. i wrote about paulville, an idea about a developer to create a town that was entirely libertarian in honor of the paul family from kentucky, and a plan to build that outside of houston and attract a libertarian community. that was the essence of the

type of geographic polarization. we want to build communities that are entirely politically compatible with ourselves. host: how did that community work out? ken: it did not, unfortunately. not enough people want to live in paulville. they still want to live in communities with divergent views and ideas and people. the diversity is part of out the me of america. failed, know, paul bill and that was supposed to be a symbol for the country. caller: i would like to inject a little polarity. the reason being republicans are habitual liars. and they have no sense of the consequences of what they have done since george bush took over with the debt and the

outsourcing of jobs, and the taxpayers paying to outsource almost 20 million jobs. and 6 million of those were skilled jobs with health care and retirement plans. these are problems they create. here is the new line. last week on c-span i listen to pete sessions and congressman cole from oklahoma rail on how the obama economy was so terrible, and how after seven years of republican austerity against obama, to deny him the economic growth after he stopped the drain of jobs and saved the economy, but not quite, because here we are with more banking deregulation, and more free trade, and more of these things that created this $20 trillion

debt. host: i want to give ken stern a chance to jump in the but a question for you, do you have any family members or friends that are republicans? caller: all of them. i am union. my dad taught me a trade when i was a tyke. i started to go to work with him when i was five years old, and i kept that all my life. and i finally got to join a union that had retirement, health care, and things that are part of what i call the american dream, the chance to live within your society with dignity, and you earn enough rather than go out and beg and work three jobs wage, and scratch. you kind of got me off the point, but thank you for asking. host: that is randy in iowa. mr. stern, jump in.

guest: i think that is the debate, who are the biggest liars. i will just tell you about my experience. experience, and nothing more, nothing less. people who, i think the people i met most and talked to just as a sort of experiential fact, or people who agree with randy, but not always. that both democrats and republicans were liars, and had sold out to vested interests. they felt betrayed by the political establishment on both sides. probably the biggest tenor of conversation that i had was, people were angry at how democrats and republicans had left them behind.

and there was a lot of truth and unfairness about people's real feelings. it surprised me at the beginning, and people said they were going to vote for donald trump or bernie sanders because they felt either of them work rejected thene who political establishment, and would fight differently. i do not think they were actually right, but that was the tenor of a lot of people's believes about how government in general deserted them. i come from here. i come from washington. my mother and father both worked for the government. my wife works for the government. i have great faith in the people who i know work for the government, but i think there is a huge disconnect. , they are alls to wires, they are all in it for themselves. i think that is a profound disconnect, and i heard it

endlessly. host: time for a few more colors. kerry in akron, ohio. independent in ohio. caller: thank you for c-span, and mr. stern. i would like his opinion, or views on how the religious right or evangelicals just caved into trump, didn't take a stance. i think they lost all credibility from franklin graham, whatever. when they did not take a stand against the man who did what he did in charlottesville, and supporting roy moore, it is unbelievable that we have gone to this point, and i will hang up and listen to your comments, thank you. host: ken stern.

ken: it is something i struggle with trying to understand. i spent time with evangelical leaders, went to liberty university. dozent time, about a half visits to the assembly of god church in virginia headed by pastor steve, who i really like and admire i guess what i would say is i think a lot of people on both sides, my understanding -- i -- viewed their vote not as a misunderstanding, but that the issues they cared about, perhaps abortion, was best effectuated by donald trump rather than hillary clinton, and it was not a moral statement about the quality of the leadership, but a tactical choice. i think a lot of people

explained -- they wrote to me in that regard. i disagree with this, but i think many of them say the church is a moral leader, the white house is not. that is caesar's world, and we should be concerned about how they make policy choices, but if you want to look moral guidance, you look to the church. i did not agree with that. i think the president needs to be a moral leader, but that is how it was explained to me in the evangelical community across the year. host: is anyone you still keep in touch with from this year as a republican? guest: sure. i just mentioned pastor steve. there are many people i grew to like and admire. conservative intellectuals like peter winter in washington, d c, pastor steve, i mentioned the

conference of evangelical youth. i was invited by a guy who was a professor at washington university law school and a prominent evangelical, going up there to give a talk in march. this book is about policy and the people that i met. the sheen for this book was -- i don't want to hang a book on one comment, but it was hillary clinton's comments about the baskets of deplorables. 62 million people voted for donald trump. i met a tiny fraction of the. but the people in that in youngstown, pastor steve, on and on, they are part of my life. host: have you been hunting

since your trip to the texas ranch? guest: no. i think i learned the limits of my skill set. it is not that i wouldn't go, but i have to do a lot of practicing before i go again. host: let's see if i can get in ken, vermont, texas. go ahead. caller: think is so much for c-span, and i'm listening this morning, and i find it amazing we are being polarized by the need of the parties to survive. we are saying rifts inside each one of them playing against ethnicity to try to get votes and stir up dissension. it is amazing to watch x president obama with eric holder running their deep state organization to play the role they are doing.

as i am looking at this, i am an older person. i have worked hard all my life, and a lot of other folks have. when you start draining the swamp, the top of the letter -- water looks smooth and calm. you find nasty things you do not like exposed. there is a lot of that running around washington, d c, and americans are tired of it. that is why trump won. i am convinced of that and i will get off my soapbox and listen to your comments. host: ken stern, i'll give you the finest minute -- final minute and a half here. guest: i think ken is right. i think donald trump is an artifact of the anger at washington government. i will defend my home and a lot of people in it. say there are a lot of people are dedicated to the common

good. the parties are more and more control by people who want to pursue the policy division and as to become more and more homogenous, it becomes easier and easier for people -- for people on the extreme to control it. one of the things i wrote about in my book is about abortion. we have a fantastic data set over the last 45 years since roe v. wade, and americans views on abortion have not changed. we are amazingly consistent people in that regard, but what is interesting to me is how both parties have moved toward the extreme, and each of them bragged in 2016 how their political platforms on abortion where the most -- they would not use the word extreme, but aggressive on one side. the most pro-life on the

republican side, the most pro-choice on the democratic side. it strikes me as extraordinary at a time when the public's view hasn't changed. it gravitates toward the middle as it does on many issues. the political parties have seen profit and political gain around the extreme, and that is part of the story of polarization, which is political parties who win by attracting the edges, and trying to make as much distinction as possible, often angry distinction between themselves and their side when most of the americans are in the middle. i agree with in that regard -- ken in that regard. host: the book is "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right -- ken stern, we appreciate the time this money. -- we appreciate the time this morning. happy new year to you. guest: happy new year to you and your viewers.

host: thanks so much. announcer: c-span's washington journal live every day. wednesday morning, american university law professor angela davis talks about race and criminal justice reform. and a discussion on politics and the media with the washington examiner. be sure to watch c-span's washington journal, live at 7:00 eastern wednesday morning. join the discussion. the second session of the 115th next week.arts the senate is back on the third, the house a few days later on the eighth area some of the issues, government funding. also, the state of the union address. house speaker invited president trump to adjust a joint session of congress on the 30th. you can watch the house live on c-span and the senate on c-span2.

i've been attacked by everybody. i've been packed by the right-wing, the russians, the trump campaign, the sanders campaign. now i can add the clinton campaign to the list. q&a, donnasunday on brazil talks about her life and politics enter memoir. >> i was here in washington dc. hillary was very excited. a youngit -- she was state senator who is running. , we weremy good friend on the third floor and my friend said you have to meet barack obama. i do not know barack obama. i knew a lot of people in chicago politics but i had not heard of barack obama.

ofwe met him that spring 2003 and let me say the rest is history. night on: q&a, sunday c-span. announcer: next, a look at american food culture. chefs join the washington post for a discussion on cooking and cuisine philosophies and integrating food in the school curricula. this is just over one hour. announcer: please welcome marybeth albright and today's guest