carolina when our guest is north carolina attorney general, josh stein. >> all this week, washington journal features key authors of 2017. book.can't stern and his it is just under an hour. "washington journal" continues. stern tells us to talk about his expense writing his book "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right," and you chatted with us in the fall about the time this book was being published. what the impetus was for writing this book -- you going out, a lifelong democrat, decided to live life as a republican. guest: like a lot of people, i have been concerned about the

polarization in this country -- how much the left hates the right, how much the right hates the left, and i decided to do something about it. we are all increasing -- increasingly interacting with people that agree with us. the book is built around my journey. understand to someone, you have to see things from his point of view. i spent a year traveling the country, talking to folks i would not ordinarily talk to, consuming media from what i thought was the other side, and the book is about that journey. host: you changed your party registration when you did that. why? guest: if you're going to commit to seeing things from another point of view, you are going to commit. for me, then that changing my media mix, changing who i talked to, and it also meant being a republican for a year, and that meant walking down to the voter

registration office in washington, d.c., leading my 94% democratic ward, and registering for a year as a republican. was: one of the statements "deep down i love suspected i would not like many republicans if i mixed with them on a regular basis." is that true? guest: let me put that in context. it sounds awful. there are 70 million republicans in the country -- maybe i would not like him. today storypost" where they asked democrats to pick a word or two that describe republicans, and republicans the same to describe democrats, and they put it up in a word cloud, and they are all negative on both sides. for democrats describing republicans it was greedy, bigoted, a selection of life -- bad words. i reacted negatively to these words, but month that -- like

most people, i thought those were the right words to characterize them. at the end of the year, you get out, you spend a lot of time with a lot of different people. it will change your view of how you view the other side. i mean, a lot of our views of the other side is really from the fact that we are divided -- physically and demographically divided more than we have ever been. getting to know your -- the other side will change a point of view and it changed my point of view after a year. host: let's talk about the issues of energy and the environment -- what you do to get the perspective you were looking for when it came to those issues? guest: so, a lot of the book is built around diving into a bunch of issues i was sure i was right on -- i was not in a, but i was sure i was right nonetheless. guns, energy. i spent a lot of time with conservative experts, try to understand their perspective, but i also spent time in places

like pikeville, kentucky, eastern kentucky coal country, trying to understand the issue of climate change, the issue of -- let's describe it as they ,ould -- obama's war on coal and try to see things from their point of view. when you are sitting in pikesville, kentucky, and you see the economic guts of the region ripped apart, it really does give you a different perspective on lots of different issues, including the environment, climate change, and government regulation. host: let me get the phone numbers so viewers can join as well. host: plenty of time with ken stern this morning. he will be with us until 9:00 a.m. i want to hear from you to get your reactions as well. ken stern, who did you meet in

pikeville, kentucky? it is really interesting when you go out and try to see the world. how do you do that? i ended up getting the name of a guy named roger ford, who was a local entrepreneur, newspaper columnist, and he decided to be my tour guide. a lovely guy. a wonderful guide. introducing me to people around town -- former coal miners, current coal miners, people that lived in pikeville their entire lives. --drove out to fort branch ford branch, named after his family, and i spent time with his father, a retired pastor -- just a lot of different people who come from -- who i would not ordinarily get to know living in washington, d.c., where i have grown up, and spent most of my life. host: you talk about growing up in washington, d c bubble,"the "liberal

as it was, and how you are brought into it. guest: we're all increasingly living in a bubble. it is called the big sort. we are choosing to live in neighborhoods that are homogenous politically. we increasingly have media that supports our own point of view. it is the confirmation bias. for me, a lifelong democrat, as i mentioned, i live in a 94% democratic war -- 100% democratic household, spent time in democratic politics, ran and pr for a number of you -- npr for a number of years. in my view it is a typical life in that i am surrounded by people that are like-minded. host: we want to start on the line for republicans this money. joe is calling on that line. joe, good morning. where are you calling in from? joe, are you with us this morning?

trevor in we'll go to seattle, washington, line for democrats. go ahead. caller: hi, there. i wanted to ask -- i have a lot of conservative family members and such, and i co-mingle quite a bit, and it is hard getting past a point where we can't agree on facts, numbers, the resultson of words, from government entities and trusted sources. so, that is where i always have a problem to break through. i wanted to ask how he -- you know, what is the best way to get people out of that bubble, you know, if they are just going to deny the reasons for you, or deny the reasons you are giving to justify your position? host: trevor, thanks for the

call. ken stern, go ahead. guest: trevor, it is a really interesting question, and to a certain extent, i would say your expenses a little bit unusual in the fact that more and more we actually don't have close friends or relatives that are on the other side. "the washington post" -- it sounds like i spent all my time with "the washington post" -- they did a poll and they asked trump members if they had any close friends and personal family members voting for clinton and vice versa for clinton supporters, and this is virginia, a purple state that went for the dubai couple of points, and by and large 65% of people did not know anyone from the other side. that is the challenge, we are increasingly in a world where we're only talking to people that agree with ourselves. it is really interesting. i spent -- my trip was not about trying to convince people who was right, who was wrong. it was about listening, trying

to understand. when you spend a lot of time listening, it was easy for me to find points of agreement. i think of the hundreds of people i met along the way, it was almost always possible to find points of common ground. it did not mean we agreed on everything, but there was always places where we would come together. trevor said something really interesting, which is the lack of trusted sources, i think that was his phrase. that is a real problem in this country -- we are increasingly skeptical of the facts from the other side, the news from the other side, and that is increasingly dividing us. when i talk to my friends who are still in the mainstream media -- i am still part of that community -- half the country thinks the media engages in fact news -- fake news. only about 30% trust the mainstream media anymore. that is about the same trust

numbers that donald trump has. in a world in which we cannot find common sources, it is going to be increasingly hard to find common ground. that is a real challenge we all have. that is what really worries me about the environment we live in now. the caller talking about not being able to agree on basic facts. was there a fact you went into this where you are certain you are right on, you ended up changing your opinion on? there were lots of things. part of the truth is -- we all have opinions, but most of us do not live in the political world all the time, the policy world all the time. under 10% of americans ever go to a political rally or contribute to a campaign, and it is very difficult to be expert on lots of sus -- subject. -- subjects. the one that led for me was gun control, gun rights. i'm from washington, d.c., in a

world or people with uniform have guns, people without uniforms should not have guns. that was my view go in. i spent a lot of time with conservative columnist john locke, went to gun shows in texas, and delve into the complexity of the issue, different perspectives, and a really did come away with a different point of view on gun control and gun rights, not that i necessarily disagree with every thing i thought of before, but the difficulty of changing situation, and recognizing the fact that we have actually reduced gun homicides in this country by about 50% over the last 20 years, and it is relatively to do with gun rules. we spend on -- our time arguing about the wrong issues. we all hooked into these, sort of, whirlwind trench lines -- you are for it or against it. that is not the way the real world works. host: did you enjoy pig hunting?

well, i discovered i am a terrible shot. when i said some people have guns in some shouldn't, i am one who shouldn't. but i had an incredible time talking to folks. i spent the morning with a three-generation family of georgians that drove all night long to go paid hunting in texas, and my tutor was isaac, and eight-year-old boy who had grown up in -- with guns, and gave me lessons with a diverse group of uniform salesman. and hispanic former soldier, a serbianmily man, a gettingt -- we were diverse perspectives from people i would not ordinarily no. it meant a lot to me. it meant i had an extraordinary experience. host: did you hit anything?

guest: well, it is a really good question. it is a matter of some debate a year and a half later. they gave me credit for a kill i am skeptical about. whether i did anything more than give a good fright to that pigs they were nice enough to give me a kill for that day. host: steve. democrat. go ahead. caller: my comment is -- actually, two comments. number one, i began working as an adult in my profession -- i had just turned 21 or 22 when ronald reagan was elected, and i felt like anyone who did not vote republican was profiled. democrat, and i consider myself a progressive, but i have never asked for a -- i have handout probably worked about 60 hours a

week for most of my life, like most people my age. i don't want to turn the world to socialism. i don't want to take god out of our schools, and i feel like we were profiled. people that voted democrat for to reason were profiled you work -- into what the reagan administration started, and what the talk radio shows like rush limbaugh started and continued into the 1990's, what they call the liberal underclass. rush limbaugh, and coulter, and all of those -- ann coulter and all of those. i feel like the generation after me -- i hate to use this term -- but the millenniums coming up, i feel this political partisanship will go away. maybe there is more partisanship that might come, but all the things that made us politically partisan and may does not trust the other side, -- made us not

trust the other side, and just for parity, i have a brother that is a staunch conservative, he is not a racist, and he would give you the shirt off his back no matter who you are. i feel the next generation will outlive all of this. host: got you. thanks for the call. ken stern. i hope steve is right, but all the data suggests the trends are going in the wrong way. it is interesting the way he puts it -- we are profiling the side. i think that is a pretty apt phrase where we are assuming a lot about the other side. republicans do it to democrats in terms of, you know, they hate hard work, or they are snowflakes, or a bunch of other phrases, and democrats are doing it with the other side that are a bunch of deplorables, they hate minorities -- those trends,

all the data -- what is called a heat index, how much we dislike the other side, are all going up, even though we do not disagree on all the issues. one of the things that drove me around this book was the data that shows on the issues we are not more divided than we were 25 years ago, but we dislike the other side and that is because we are increasingly isolated from the other side, and when you don't know them -- when you don't have a conservative brother like steve does, it is easier and easier to demagogue them, and this notion of deplorables -- for me -- and it goes both ways. there is a liberal bubble, there is a conservative bubble. for me, it was about getting outside the liberal bubble and challenging my preconceptions about conservatives. one thing i did -- you cannot understand conservatives in this country without understanding evangelicals who potentially republican% for candidates. i spent time in churches and i

went to something called her banner, a gathering -- urbana, a youth,ng of evangelical about 15,000 of them. from washington, d.c., a stranger in a strange land there. it was about fighting cancer care about refugees -- not want kids it was about finding who care about refugees, not want to keep them out. it was a different conception than what i got from my meeting -- my world him washington, d.c. host: you met a man named sam adams. who is he? guest: he now works in washington, d.c., but he was a man of history, the first openly city, in oregon.

distrustingery much the evangelical community because of their position on gay rights, and he had a lot of reasons to be mistrusting of them, but he forged a partnership. sam forged a partnership with one of the leading evangelical churches in portland led by a man who wanted to show what the evangelical community was for, not what they are against, and they forged what they called city serve, and invested a lot of resources in helping portland, helping the schools, public service programs. when i talked to sam, one of the things i -- he said to me that has lived with me throughout the process was his preconception going into that partnership was they wouldn't have a lot of points of agreement, but what he said to me was on any 10 issues

i was going to agree with the other side on eight issues. we're never going to agree on abortion, gay rights, but we agreed on so much. why do we spent time focusing on the two when we have the eight to talk about. host: fort washington, maryland. joe is a republican. go ahead. caller: how are you doing question mark host: -- doing? host: doing well. caller: good to hear your voice. i want to ask the gentleman -- i'm a republican. this is a direct question to you or me. we have, as republicans, done what we needed to do to win, but we need to look at what we and how we have a compassed what we accomplished. have accomplished what we

accomplished. ourselves is it sustain our christianity, but support the man is in their -- that is in the? -- in their [indiscernible] host: you are going in and out. what is the question, joe? caller: the question is how morally sound are we as republicans to allow what has happened. host: got your question, joe. ken stern? guest: that is a complicated question -- or it allows for a complicated answer. when i say i love to learn the right, does it mean i learned to agree with everything the conservative world says,

certainly not everything the republican world says. now i think of myself as independent. the republican ted a great deal of success -- had a great deal of success elector lee -- the white house, the senate and the house, two thirds of state legislatures and governorships -- i think that is -- they are running up against the fact that donald trump a product of polarization. he did not cause polarization in the country. i think he is leading us down a path of greater and greater disharmony, and i do not think it is working particularly well for him, for the second party, and i think we will see the results of that in the next couple of years. independent. is an tennessee. go ahead. caller: my question is you left the democrats and go to republicans because they have the right ideas or the right of the -- view. when you look at donald trump,

hannity -- when they preach their views to someone like me -- i want america to work together. i work two jobs. i am single. i pay a lot of money. togethererica to come and work so that people like me, instead of working two jobs, i -- can work one job. -- theyk market celebrated, but i will be working two jobs or overtime. jobs,e going to create but they are going to be [indiscernible] host: i think we got your point, william. ken stern, i will let you respond. guest: i agree with that. i think history actually shows

we do better when we work together, and, you know, on the local level, though -- level, you actually see that a lot. you see a lot more democrats and republicans finding ways to work together. not always. there are plenty of counterexamples. you find one people are face-to-face, when they are forced to find common ground, they often do, and things tend to work better. i think we are being poorly served by both political parties who are, i think, practicing the politics of division, and i think the result of that is more and more anger, more dysfunction in washington, more and more anger in washington -- i was going to say a virtuous circle, on virtuousan circle. we have a lot of reasons to be angry at the leaders of our political party, who i do think our reflecting the views of most americans, and i think are causing a lot more division, and

that is in the political parties, also in the media. i think we are going down the wrong path as william suggests. host: you mentioned the media -- you mentioned you were previously the ceo of national public radio. annmuch hannity, how much coulter, how much rush limbaugh did you end up watching during the course of the year? so media dietre -- soul media diet? guest: no, too much -- too much for my sanity, my media diet. i spent a lot of time with the bright parts, with steve bannon breitbart,ecame -- steve bannon, before he became famous. let's take breitbart for example. it really is about driving discord. if you spent time looking at how

dan and, alex -- steve bannon, chooservel and others stories and drive the negative, it is about encouraging negative toward the other side. it does not mean the mainstream media has been -- about it. i wore -- wrote an article for "vanity fair" on one day, a foundof life story, and i 21 articles on donald trump in the sports section, style, metro, and all of them were negative. i think when that happens -- i trump,a fan of donald but when the narrative is so one-sided, people feel disenfranchised, patronized, and i hear a lot of that during my year on the road. host: shreveport. republican. caller: hi, john.

nice to talk to you this month. en, how do we get to where we can learn about both sides? all i hear with a media is a bias, and i want to learn more about what i want foren, how doy children. i want to -- they are pushing john kasich now, and i do not necessarily know anything about him. onould like a suggestion where people can get good information and wait things out because i think the media is biased. host: before you go, before ken orrn does the, what are two three sources you look at on a daily basis? drudge, -- iok at look at drudge, npr, and i fox anymore.cnn or

guest: it is a good question. i have been somewhat critical of what i think of fox anymore. think,oup but i also don't think it is an equivalency of, as some would have it, between left and right media. they have different roles -- roles, as far as i'm concerned, and different social roles. you know, my media diet before i started this was fairly typical mainstream media -- "new york social roles. npr,now, my mediatimes," "wash" as you might expect given my background, and it still largely is, but i love and it. -- 11 it. the way to get a sense of country as a whole is to toggle different sources, and i still rely on "the times," and " the washington post" for my information.

you had the reporters, they do real journalism. i also read "the weekly standard," i look at fox on the left, i scroll through mark toin and even breitbart understand the perspective. not that i necessarily going to agree, but it is important in this increasingly divided country to try to understand people's perspectives, and i think that means looking at a wide variety of informational sources. a.m. onst after 8:30 the east coast -- ken stern is joining us from philadelphia, pennsylvania. he is the author of "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right," taking your phone calls this morning. the government can join in ken stern, we spent the first hour of the program asking

viewers if they thought there had been progress in the opioid epidemic in 2017. can you talk about what you saw in your time going around the country specifically on that issue? guest: i caught the tail end of that conversation. for me washe way in try to understand what you might call the white working class, which is such a large percentage of the conservative base in this country, and certainly a large percentage of the trump base, and the populace national base that donald trump represents, that steve bannon represent. i spent time in youngstown, ohio, pikeville, as i mentioned, and my perspective on this, sitting in people's homes, taking meals with them, jerking and bars, going to places of work, the white working class is on a 30-year losing streak, really. it is hard to say. income is down. life expectancy is down.

opioid addiction is up. when i was in pikeville i asked about opioid addiction, and everyone i talked to knew someone that had died from opioid dependency, died young, and they pointed out the pain clinic across street, or the one across the border in virginia, where you could easily get a whole cash of opioids easily, and forgive me, painlessly. it is clear being part of the story, the whole decline of the white working class, the sense of hopelessness for their future and their family, it is a big part of the story of american politics and the rise of donald trump, and people of that political ilk. host: alice in detroit, michigan. republican. go ahead. caller: i want to say that if a person is wrong, they are wrong.

that should be stressed. my question for your guest is how do you feel about the fact that these tax breaks -- when -- you always are talk about how we are against the deficits, why are you doing about whatant to ask you think about the fact that there were you mouse it's that we must do what the donors tell that sayo -- emails they must do what the donors tell them to do? host: alex, thank you for the call. citizen, in american hate what is going on in congress. i hate that it is one party completely driving the agenda and there is no sense of compromise. you can take your pick on who you want to blame. i have my own personal biases in that direction, but i hit the fact that it is one party

driving the agenda, and i think when that happens, you get legislation like the tax bill that does not make much sense. it is driven through very quickly without people knowing what is in it. it does not reflect the view of the american people, including republicans. one of the interesting and distressing parts of the tax bill is it is very unpopular with the people who sent conservatives to congress, or put donald trump in the white house. wheree gotten to a place our politics are so destructive things make sense in the halls of congress, even if they don't make sense in communities around the country. about one side has two win, the other side has to lose. that is what it is about. one side did this legislation because it had to do something, whether it made sense or not.

i think there is all totally what prevailed and reflects some of the negative aspects of our current politics. did you have conversations about tax reform with folks you meant -- met going around the country -- and everything was not passed at the time, but a sense of what they wanted from tax reform? guest: people were pretty straightforward. conversations,in i was there to listen. that meant they chose the agenda. it was almost always about jobs. it wasn't about, you know taxes -- i pay too much taxes, health care, or other issues came up, but it all started with i want a good wage, a good job, security for my family -- hope for my always about jobs in the state of the economy. every thing else with subsidiary to that. when people want to talk about taxes, let's be realistic, no

one to talk about the nuances of a tax bill before a specific bill comes to congress. most people felt, when they talked about it, that they were over-taxed. they did not feel they were .etting the return most of people wanted to say i want a job, certainty in my life, a career, to put food on the table for my family -- someone who offers me hope in that regard. it goes all the way back to the clinton war room, which is it is the economy, stupid, and that has not changed in 35 years since bill clinton ran for and won election to office. host: iowa. line for democrats. good morning. i'm not sure if randy is there. sean is in baltimore, maryland, though. line for independents. go ahead. caller: good morning. host: go ahead, sean.

caller: you mentioned that political polarization probably won't get any better. i agree with that. that i think -- i think that is because of donald trump coming into office. my question is do you think we're headed for a several -- second civil war? i want to explain why i am asking this question. me as a black man, watching donald trump come into office, the way he influences the white supremacist, white supremacy -- it is just unbelievable. my parents, they grew up in the civil rights era. my grandparents were around in the 1920's, when all of these confederate statues were being built, and i'm number my grandfather telling me -- i remember my grandfather telling me that white supremacists would say to him, friends, they would also -- always remind him.

put you back in chains, mccue slaves again. -- we will make you slaves again, and if we don't get you, we will get your descendents. that,ays told me about and i said that won't happen, but when i see donald trump, the crazy stuff going on, i am like , and i tell you what, if what promises think they're going to put me back in chains, they have another thing coming. they're going to have to kill me. host: got your point. guest: i do worry about how divided there. a nasty,hink there is violent peace. i spent the weekend getting trolled by neo-nazis on twitter, so i have some personal expense with this.

-- expense with this. i think most people remain in the middle. think it is controlled, and something that gives me hope is more more people are identified as independent. there are now far more people that self identify as than self identify as democrats or republicans. that was not true 15 years ago. it is not because those people less partisan. , but they are rejecting the anger of the party here -- parties. that is reflecting people saying there is something wrong with our political addiction. i suffer than if i was less thad i have hope is more and more

people are repulsed by the negative political atmosphere and say we do not have to agree on everything. that is negative for the future of our country. i hope more more people can gravitate toward the point of view. host: talk about martinsville, virginia. guest: one of the same challenges is where do you find it. some of them are the churches. martinsville, virginia, i think it is some twice a year to a famous race.

understanding and see martinsville, which is like so many smaller towns saved by nascar, but hollowed out by the decline of industry. it was based once upon a time on tobacco. that was taken out. it was based on textiles, and that was taken up by global trade. seeing another american town sort of, having its guts without, if i can put it that way, i forces beyond its control, i think is part of the narrative of change and, i think, lack of optimism in this country. you saw in martinsville, people gathered for the nascar races. randall. springfield, missouri. for republicans. line forlicans -- republicans. caller: i want to much i think polarization in the united states is a situation of people running to turn the country from a republic to a socialist

states. i think the democrats are the ,ew socialist, communist party and they are screaming about tax reform and the thing trump is doing because they do not want to lose control. socialism is about government control. the democrats do not want to give up their control. democrats want control so much, they would deprive the citizen, the normal, everyday working citizen, a tax break just to keep the rich from , and i wantx break to see if you agree with a little bit of my assessment that with people and outside forces. host: got your point, randall. ken stern? guest: i think one of the great divide you here as you travel the country between right and left his faith in government to

solve -- is faith in government to solve issues, with the left, i think largely believing in the effectiveness of government solutions, and in my personal view, maybe have two great of faith in the likely effectiveness of government solutions, but belief -- believing that many of the challenges we have -- we have big challenges. some of them we talked about. opportunity, of and opioid crisis. we talked at the edge about gun violence, which principally plagued part of our cities. there is a belief among democrats in the effectiveness among government to solve those problems, and i think a lot of conservatives, constitutional or not, have grown skeptical over time about the effectiveness of government and think those things are better solved at the committee level abroad market forces. that is a great divide, a reasonable debate to have.

my concern, hearing from a constitutional conservative, is not that debate. i think that is a legitimate debate we have had throughout history. my concern is more those who are from both sides undermining the pillars of government. we talked about donald trump, his attacks on the press, law enforcement, at least the fbi, and i think those attacks come from the book -- both sides, and that tends to undercut the pillars of democracy, and that is what worries me. we can argue about whether we have bigger or smaller government. reasonable minds can disagree on that. it is but the things that have worked that -- four 200 and 40 years, or whatever it is now. host: ken stern is our guest. the book, "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to love the right." i want to get to as many calls

as the camp that i want to ask you, ken stern, about paul bill. lle? was paul bill -- paulvi caller: you really read through to the very end. there was a book written called "the big sort." dividingut how we are themselves. how liberals are choosing to live in blue areas, conservatives are choosing to live in red areas. that self-segregation, political segregation israel. we had 1100 landside countries. in this election we had 2500 of those. paulte about paul bill, --

ville, an idea to create a town that was entirely libertarian in honor of the paul family from kentucky, implant to build that outside of houston and attract a libertarian community. essence of the isolation. communitydid that work out? guest: he did not, unfortunately. not enough people want to live in paulville. live inll want to divergent committees. lville sailed, and that was supposed to be a symbol for the country. --t: i would like to

caller: i would like to inject a little polarity. the reason being republicans are habitual liars. they have no sense of the consequences of what they have oversince george bush took with the debt and the outsourcing of jobs, and the taxpayers paying to outsource almost 20 million jobs. and 6 million of those were skilled jobs with health care and retirement plans. these are problems they create. here is the new live. last week on c-span i listen to pete sessions and commerce nicole from oklahoma -- congressman cole from oklahoma rail on how the obama economy was so terrible, and how after seven years of republican to denyy against obama,

him the economic growth after he andped the drain of jobs saved the economy, but not quite, because here we are with more banking regulation -- deregulation, free trade, more that created the debt. give -- host: i want to give ken stern a chance to jump in the but a question for you, do you have any family members or friends that are republicans? all of them. i am union. dad taught me a trade when i was a tyke. i started to go to work with him when i was five years old, and i kept that all my life. i finally got to join a union that had retirement, health care, and things that are part of what i call the american dream -- the chance to live within your society with

dignity, and you earn enough rather than go out and died and work three jobs at minimum wage, --beg, and-- bag work three jobs admin wage and scratch. thank you for asking. host: that is randy in iowa. mr. stern, jump in. guest: i think that is the host:debate, who is the biggest liars, and i will tell you my experience -- in my book is about my expense, nothing more, nothing less. i met -- experience, nothing more, nothing less. i met a lot of people -- the people i've met most and talks agree withple that randy, and agree with republicans and democrats. and felt were liars,

on both sides. tenor weregest and there wasgry truth and unfairness, but that was real feelings. beginninged me at the , and what surprised me is people said they were going to vote for donald trump or bernie sanders because they felt either of them work someone who theyted the political -- would fight differently. i do not think they were necessarily right. i come from washington. my mother and father both worked for the government.

i have great faith in the people i know who work for the government, but i think there is a huge disconnect, and that translated to they are a bunch of liars, they are all in for themselves, and i heard it mostly in my travels. host: time for a few more colors. terry, independent in ohio. caller: thank you for c-span, and mr. stern. i would like his opinion, or views on how the religious right just caved into trump, didn't take a stance. i think they lost all credibility from franklin graham, whatever.

not take a stand against the man who did what he did in charlottesville, and supporting roy moore, it is that we have gone to this point, and i will hang up and listen to your comments, thank you. host: ken stern. guest: it is so extensive that i struggle with two explained. it is complicated and something that i struggle to explain. i spent time with evangelical leaders, spent time in church headed by pastor steve, who i grew to really like and admire, and yet struggled with their support for donald trump. is iss what i would say think a lot of people on both sides, my understanding -- i --

viewed their vote not as a misunderstanding, but that the issues they cared about, perhaps abortion, was best effectuated by donald trump rather than hillary clinton, and it was not a moral statement about the quality of the leadership, but a tactical choice. i think a lot of people explained -- they wrote to me in that regard. i disagree with this, but i think many of them say the church is a moral leader, the white house is not. world, and we's should be concerned about how they make policy choices, but if you want to look moral guidance, you look to the church. i did not agree with that. i think the president needs to a immoral -- needs to be moral leader, but that is how it was explained to me in the evangelical community across the year. host: is anyone you still keep

in touch with from this year as a republican? guest: sure. i just mentioned pastor steve. there are many people i grew to like and admire. conservative intellectuals like peter winter in washington, d c, pastor steve, i mentioned the conference of evangelical youth. i was invited by a guy who was a professor at washington university law school and a , going upevangelical there to give a talk in march. this book is about policy and the people that i met. the sheen for this book was -- i don't want to hang a book on one comment, but it was hillary clinton's comments about the baskets of deplorables. 62 million people voted for

delta. i met a tiny fraction -- voted for donald trump. i met a tiny fraction of the. the people i met in no caps on, pastor steve, on and on, they are part of my life, -- in youngstown, pastor steve, on and on, they are part of my life. host: have you been hunting since your trip to the texas ranch? guest: no. i think i learned the limits of my skill set. it is not that i wouldn't go, but i have to do a lot of practicing before i go again. host: let's see if i can get in ken, vermont, texas. go ahead. caller: think is so much for c-span, and i'm listening this amazing and i find it we are being polarized by the need of the parties to survive. we are saying rifts inside each one of them playing against ethnicity to try to get votes

and stir up dissension. it is amazing to watch x president obama with eric holder running their deep state organization to play the role they are doing. this, i am ang at older person. i have worked hard all my life, and a lot of other folks have. when you start draining the swamp, the top of the letter looks smooth and calm. you find nasty things you do not like exposed. there is a lot of that running around washington, d c, and americans are tired of it. that is why trump won. i am convinced of that and i will get off my soapbox and listen to your comments. host: ken stern, i'll give you the finest minute -- final minute and a half here.

guest: i think ken is right. i will defend my home and a lot of people in it. say there are a lot of people defended -- that are committed to the common good. the parties are more and more control by people who want to andue the policy division as to become more and more , it becomes easier and easier for people -- for people on the extreme to control it. one of the things i wrote about in my book is about abortion. we have a fantastic data set over the last 45 years since roe v. wade, and americans views on abortion have not changed. consistentingly

people in that regard, but what is interesting to me is how both parties have moved toward the extreme, and each of them bragged in 2016 how their medical platforms on abortion where the most -- political platforms on abortion where the most -- they would not use the word extreme, but aggressive on one side. on thet pro-life republican side, the most pro-choice on the democratic side. it strikes me as extraordinary at a time when the public's view hasn't changed. it gravitates toward the on the republican side, the most middle as it does on many issues. the political parties have seen profit and political gain around the extreme, and that is part of the story of polarization, which is political parties who win by attracting the edges, and trying to make as much distinction as possible, often angry distinction between themselves and their side when most of the americans are in the middle.

i agree with in that regard -- ken in that regard. host: the book is "republican like me -- how i left the liberal bubble and learned to ken stern, we -- >> c-span's "washington journal" live every day. with news and policy issues that impact you. wednesday morning, american university law professor angela davis talks about race and criminal justice reform. and a discussion on politics and the media with the washington examiner. be sure to watch c-span's "washington journal," live at 7:00 eastern wednesday morning. join the discussion. >> wednesday book tv features books about education. at 8:00 p.m. founder and ceo of charter schools talks about her work in education.

radio host on her book, " where are your kids?' challenges facing high school students pursuing higher " whenon in her book, grit isn't enough. " books on education, wednesday at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span two. c-span, where history unfolds daily. in 1979, c-span was created as a public service by america's cable television companies, and is brought to you today by your cable or satellite provider. >> next, a look at american food

culture. chefs join "the washington post" for a discussion on cooking and cuisine philosophies and integrating food in the school curricula. this is just over one hour. this is just over one hour. announcer: please welcome marybeth albright and today's guests. [applause] welcome. what a great day. and a packed room. not surpring